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galacticlamps · 3 years

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im sorry im sorry im sorry i know it’s been well over a year but i accidentally thought about Short Trips: Deleted Scenes (again) and it’s killing me (again) so i think im just gonna go ahead and post all these stupid thoughts that have been plaguing me about it since i first heard it & maybe that’ll help clear up some space in my head for like, real life things.

Spoilers I guess? It’s like a year and a half old but also high key the most recent 2nd doctor content i believe we’ve gotten which is like, the only negative thing I can say about it

The TLDR version is this:

I literally cant believe how sweet it is? Painful, but sweet. Like. I don’t honestly know what’s more likely - did they set out to write Jamie a nice little straight love interest and just fail miserably at it by constantly likening her to the Doctor AND paralleling the Doctor’s perspective with her ex’s AND putting Jamie’s relationships with both of them in direct tension with each other while constantly letting his with the Doctor win out?

OR - did they do a very 1960s thing and say hey we’re gonna write what’s essentially a story about how much Jamie and the Doctor love each other and release it on Valentine’s Day thinly disguised as a one-off romance with a french lady?

Now, as a general rule, my attitude toward questions like that is usually “don’t know, don’t care, doesn’t matter” - and while I 100% stand by that, I also have to admit that this particular audio seems to pay enough attention to detail that I’d kind of think I was selling it short if I assumed too many of these things were just meaningless coincidences, you know?

Anyway, that’s the most coherent/overarching thought. And here’s a disorganized list of things I absolutely cannot get over about it (they don’t form any kind of argument, mind, they just all happen to live rent free in my head):

- Celine is first taken in by Jamie being an idiot (specifically him claiming not to speak French, in perfect French); likewise, her entrance in the scene where they actually kiss is marked with a little anecdote about her hat getting stuck on a doornail and her scolding it as she attempts to fix her un-tameable appearance, and the narration says Celine “would often clown for Jamie like this” - all of which, while undeniably adorable, don’t exactly strike me as entirely original traits to have been assigned to Jamie’s love-interest (but also Celine is so cool and her perspective on film/media/time is an excellent addition to the long list of dr who characters)

- When they’re in the present, describing Jamie’s relationship with Celine in 1908, they call him her “companion” and highlight his going nearly everywhere with her, which earns a laugh from the 4th doctor (and me as well, though probably for slightly different reasons - but like, is that really all it takes to have a fling with someone in 60′s era who? bc if so...)

- Celine’s ex-fiance is still in love with her and is jealously watching when she kisses Jamie ... and then the Doctor appears beside him, evidently doing the exact. same. thing. They have the following conversation:

“You know, it’s not prudent to spy on people. But then, people in pain can’t be expected to act prudently.”

“Pain, monsieur? You mistake me.”

“Ah, do I? Good, because I rather thought you’d lost something.”

“What would you know about loss monsieur?”

- I’m sorry doc but who do you think you are, saying stuff like that and smiling sadly at the floor to boot? I 100% had to pause it here the first time I listened, just to not throw my laptop across the room.

- Then when I recovered continued, the Doctor closes the door so they can’t watch anymore and explains “Possessing things comes so terribly easily to some men that losing them can feel cruel, intolerably cruel. In my experience, only the very best of men cannot be tempted to answer that cruelty with more - I do sincerely hope that you are the best of men.” (guess who gets described as the best of men by the end of the audio?)

- Jamie and the Doctor apparently develop a habit of walking along the river in Paris in silence

- During one such walk, Jamie suggests Celine come with them since she already figured out about the Tardis - and when the Doctor’s worried by this, he says he only allowed Jamie & Celine to grow closer “because of Victoria.” Jamie takes offense at the ‘allowing it’ comment and also refuses to admit he knows what the Doctor means about Victoria, which leads the Doctor to say that he knows how fond Jamie was of her - he was too, of course, but with him, “it was different, wasn’t it?” Jamie only says maybe that’s true and maybe that’s not, but his voice catches until he changes the subject

- Jamie doesn’t see Celine for days both times that she’s recovering from the shock and depression of her work being destroyed. In contrast, when the Doctor’s not well, Jamie’s "afraid” and “guilty” and hardly seems to leave his side at all, if his being there “rushing to embrace him” the second he wakes up - after a period Jamie describes as “at least a week” - is anything to go by, anyway. so either bf writers need to learn how to write a committed straight relationship or admit that’s not what they ever intended in the first place

- Oh yeah, and the Doctor spends that week "asleep” in Jamie’s bedroom - no, there’s no explanation as to if that’s where he was when he first collapsed or if it’s where Jamie decided to take him bc why would they feel the need to explain him being there? why was it even relevant to tell us it was Jamie’s room in the first place?

- The Doctor somehow manages to control the Tardis enough to take Celine on one trip to an alien planet and then return to the correct time & place for her to use the footage she recorded there in her new film - and while the audio doesn’t do very much to explain how that was possible, it does treat this as A Pretty Big Deal, and immediately afterward the Doctor has to spend a week communing with his past self (and/or the Tardis?) debating how likely it is that the Time Lords could use this to trace him. When he decides it’s not worth the risk and they have to stop the film from ever being shown to the public, Jamie asks why he agreed to it in the first place, and all he can say is “Because, Jamie, you asked me to!” earning awkward stares from the crowd.

- Oh, but, lest we forget, that little outburst is also immediately followed by him putting his arm around Jamie’s shoulders, and, shockingly, apparently beginning to actually explain the truth about the danger from the Time Lords - until they’re interrupted, of course idk why exactly but the idea of a 60s dr wanting to come clean with a companion but not being allowed to bc the show demands the war games be something of a reveal hurts me in a very good way

- The mental image of “the Doctor and Jamie, resplendent in borrowed evening wear”

- The audio admitting that Jamie’s not very good at subterfuge, and the Doctor asking if he’s going to be alright with them having to steal the film back from Celine - and Jamie’s little “Aye, Doctor” as he feels a ‘glass arrow piercing his chest’ glad to see bf is reading all my letters about exactly how i feel any time something sad happens to james robert mccrimmon

- The Doctor’s anxious to get out of there for obvious reasons, but he hangs around bc Jamie wants to see Celine again - which doesn’t happen, because of her aforementioned shock & depression, but she does leave Jamie a note that ends “you and that Doctor of yours - look after him Jamie, he loves you dearly, as do I.” yeah, if you didn’t want people to draw a parallel there, you could’ve picked, like, any other wording in the world.

- In case you weren’t fully convinced I’ve been reading too much into this whole audio already, consider this: Celine dies in Long Island in 1968, three days before her birthday - 1968 is when this story would’ve taken place in the show’s history (between Fury & Wheel), and dying three days before/after a birthday in America seems a bit... well I had some deja vu from it, anyway

- Four of all people being the one to bring back the film - I know he does it bc Sarah Jane makes him, but personally, I often feel like despite the length of his run, 4 is the Doctor with which we might’ve gotten the fewest glimpses into his interiority, so the fact that it’s him and not one of the more overtly sentimental Doctors makes it feel like it carries even more weight somehow, to me anyway. I think I wrote a post saying roughly the same thing about 4 & Fate of Krelos/Return to Telos but maybe I only did that inside my own head lol. Still, I’m all for any opportunities for Jamie to be one of the few characters to draw some noticeable emotion out of Four, but in fairness I haven’t touched too much of his EU stuff to really be able to compare the frequency with which this happens with other past companions

- Is Four referring to Two or Jamie when he says he got the film from “an old family friend”? Two did the actual stealing, but he probably means Jamie’s involvement - either way, it’s an interesting way of describing old companions - or selves?

- When Jemima goes to call Jamie a thief, Four is “roused” to defend him: “he really was the very best of men” again, any time four freely shows he cares about someone, im over the moon about it

- Oh ha ha, there’s an audio called “Deleted Scenes” featuring the Doctor who’s most affected by junked episodes. And at the end of it, a character who’s spent her life researching and lecturing about a lost film gets to watch it be ‘rediscovered’ after it’s gone unseen for decades. I feel marginally less stupid for reading into the other details of a story like this when it ends up deciding to be to be clever & slightly meta like that

But yeah

all in all, it’s kind of amazing to me that this genuinely reads like they sat down and said okay boys it’s valentines day, let’s write an audio where jamie kisses a girl, since that hasn’t happened except as a plot device in one story in 1967 - but then when they got down to business they accidentally(?) wrote a story all about how important his bond with the Doctor is and how easily that can be compared to a legitimate love interest (even if the love interest in question is a one off character & the extent of the relationship appears to be like one kiss & then having Jamie spend most of his time around the Doctor instead)

I realize there’s something slightly illogical about writing the words “shipping aside” after a post like this but seriously - no matter how many categories you’re able to see two & jamie’s relationship fitting into, this is 40 minutes of big finish just hitting you over the head with how powerful/special/important that relationship is, and with them being two of my favorite characters, i really haven’t been able to stop thinking about it since

#jamie mccrimmon #second doctor #big finish #Short Trips: Deleted Scenes #yes i am gonna tag this #two/jamie #i think it earned it with the line from celine's letter if nothing else #and quite possibly the doctor's so-called imprudent & pain-driven spying #but i'll leave it at that #in case anyone's looking at the tags to decide if they should actually read this rambling monster of a post #also if you for some reason read this but haven't listened to the audio -#a) that's kind of you to care what i have to say but #b) you could probably have listened to half of it by now lol #did i mention it's a stand-alone audio that only costs $3?#and it's more of a traditional audio book format with one narrator who voices all the characters?#sorry i wasn't ready to do a bf pitch in the tags here #i genuinely dont know why someone who hasn't already heard it would bother to read all this #but if anyone has - thanks?#i'll shut up now so you can get on w ur day :)

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itsclydebitches · 3 years

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hello! loved your tbb meta posts (10/10 analyses of the batch and their respective characterizations), but since it wasn't explicitly mentioned -- did you catch the post-s1 interview with jennifer corbett (head writer) and brad rau (exec producer)? their answers about crosshair's chip being out were Interesting (tm) but fairly definitive-sounding, so I'm wondering what your thoughts on it might've been.

Hey there, anon! Thank you—I’m so glad you’ve enjoyed them :D

I’ve heard this info second-hand and ran into one written interview on the topic (idk if it’s the same one you’re thinking of), but my first response is… arguably a reach lol. Not to start off with a tin hat on, but it’s always possible that the writers are lying. Which yes, yes, we have a knee-jerk reaction against the idea of anyone lying for any reason, but in this case, it would be in service of both the writer’s plans and the audience’s enjoyment. Let’s say for the sake of argument that Crosshair’s chip is definitely still in and the entire point of this setup is a double twist: first the reveal that his chip is gone, then the real reveal that it’s actually still in and Crosshair was lied to (among other possibilities). How can the writers discuss him during hiatus without revealing that twist? By playing the current knowledge straight, despite the fact that they know otherwise. Yup, Crosshair’s chip is out. Yup, he chose this 100% willingly. Nothing else to see here, folks! To do otherwise would be to reveal the twist way too early. Even refusing to answer the question, dodging it, would give it all away. Imagine if during a season finale we’re meant to believe that a character is dead and then during hiatus an interviewer asks how the cast will mourn them. If the writer refuses to answer, every fan will realize that Something Is Up and what’s the main possibility here? That they’re not actually dead! Twist spoiled… unless the writer pretends that what the audience currently knows is definitely the truth here.

Taking my tin hat off now, these interviews are one of the main reasons why I’m worried about the writing moving forward. Because despite the paragraph above, I’m by no means convinced that the writers are skillfully keeping up a lie to avoid spoilers. It’s not outside the realm of possibility, but it’s not necessarily likely either. Which leaves us taking their words at face value and that’s… a problem. Because as so many fans have already pointed out, the writing is setting up a twist that, according to these interviews, doesn’t exist. That doesn’t say good things about their intentions for the show vs. what actually ends up on screen and that kind of disconnect becomes frustrating for viewers very quickly. Take the headaches, for example. I’ve seen a couple of fans explain Crosshair’s away using the engine accident: “His face got burned up, of course his head still hurts. You’re reading too much into this.” But imagine for a moment if I’d tried to do the same thing for Wrecker prior to “Battle Scars”: “He gets thrown around and hits his head nearly every episode, of course it hurts. You’re reading too much into this.” Other fans would have—quite rightfully—explained to me how television works and that this repetitive problem is functioning as foreshadowing of a larger problem. With a side of the fact that this is an action show where the characters consistently shrug off their injuries. We’re not supposed to take Wrecker getting thrown around seriously. He’s the brawn of the group, meant to withstand a lot of damage, with any injuries being presented as either #cool (Wrecker shrugs off Fennec’s hits to go after Omega, yeah!) or #funny (Wrecker treats Crosshair shooting him like a badge of honor lol), not something he’s going to have to grapple with in a serious manner. So the audience recognizes the question, what’s more likely? That Wrecker’s headaches are a deliberate visual cue on the part of the writers to tell us that something important is happening, or that suddenly how the genre treats injuries has drastically changed?

It's precisely the same with Crosshair. He’s not the brawn like Wrecker is, but he’s still the action (anti)hero who shrugs off injuries because this is a show interested in more fun, explosive plot, not a deep dive into recovery. (See also: the story doing nothing with Echo’s trauma.) When Crosshair is injured, he’s immediately fighting to get back into a ship and when we next see him he’s passed the recovery stage entirely. There’s only a scar to show that this happened at all. We don’t watch him getting bacta skin grafts, or worrying about his eyesight, or struggling to eat, etc. The point is that he was injured for the purposes of that episode and now he’s not. So why would we think his headaches are a long-term symptom when the show is otherwise not at all interested in writing long-term symptoms? What’s more likely, that this familiar visual cue is being repeated to tell us that this is the chip, just like it was with Wrecker, or that the story is randomly interested in something it never was interested in before?

The audience is right to think that there’s more going on because the show has been written to say, "Something more is going on." The headaches, Crosshair’s refusal to give concrete information, the group conveniently not using Tech’s scanner, the burn scar hiding where the chip’s scar would be, a lack of motivation for the Empire removing the chip, not seeing its removal when the show did include its power being amplified… all of these are deliberate writing choices to set up another reveal. But, if we take the interview at face value and learn that these weren’t deliberate details… then what? The writers are making mistakes? Throwing in “clues” for the hell of it that they never intend to cache in on? Unless there’s some amazing answer here that allows for both these inconsistencies' explanations and the writers’ hard stance—something I personally can’t think up—then we’re left with is a pretty serious flaw in the show. A flaw that’s going to undermine the audience’s trust in everything we get from here on out. The next time we see something that feels like a cool setup/reveal, half the fandom will be going, “Yes! It totally means that ___ is going to happen!!” while the other half will be going, “… does it? Because we thought things were happening with Crosshair and that went nowhere.” Writers have to tackle the implications of what they’ve put on screen. Otherwise, the story falls apart.

So yeah, I’m aware of those hard “His chip is out and this is his choice” statements and, frankly, they make me nervous for season two. Because what the show needs is to engage with what we actually got in the finale: an ambiguous state of Crosshair’s chip, a number of hints that it might still be in there, and an ethical dilemma that, so far, hasn’t acknowledged how much of an influence the group’s decisions have had on Crosshair’s. I tackled most of this in the first analysis, but something I didn’t unpack there was the “choice” of not leaving with them. I mean yes, by all exact definitions—and if we accept that the chip really isn’t there—then Crosshair absolutely had free will in that moment to do as he pleased. But life is way more complicated than that. Imagine for a moment that I put two candy bars in front of you. “You can have whichever one you’d like,” I say. You reach for the one on the left and I glare, hard. I scoff at you. I mutter about your choices, your personality, your flaws, and your mistakes. So you reach for the one on the right instead and I’m… neutral. Okay then. Right candy bar it is. “They could have chosen the one on the left” someone watching claims. “Nothing was stopping them. No one put a gun to their head!” And yeah, the concept of “stopping them” was never that extreme… but the more compassionate, nuanced look acknowledge that some measure of “stopping them” did exist. Insults. Cruelty. A clear indication that one choice was wrong and the other was right. That’s one hell of an influence, even if it's not as formidable as a gun or a chip.

And that’s what Crosshair is dealing with. Yes, joining the Empire is clearly wrong and yes, a non-chipped Crosshair has free will to walk away from it… but walking towards TBB was never presented as a real option for him. He saw that through their inaction when they never came back for him. Then in Hunter’s refusal to admit that they’d made a mistake in leaving him behind. Wrecker putting all responsibility on his shoulders, despite knowing what the chip does to someone. Tech backing him up and framing this situation as stemming solely from Crosshair’s base personality—“severe and unyielding.” It’s seen in the always-loving Omega walking away from him in the barracks, in Crosshair’s hesitation to follow them to safer ground (and boy oh boy, do I have sad headcanons about that), and most especially, in their reactions to him saving Omega. What Crosshair learns in that moment is that they honestly believe that he, not the Empire's chip, but he would shoot Hunter and that saving their little sister is not a point in his favor. It's met only with glares and a need to disarm himself. They don’t trust him and actions that should produce trust are outright ignored, so… where can they go from here? Nowhere, according to TBB’s actions. They’re not giving Crosshair any wiggle room, any hope that these relationships can be repaired, or any acknowledgement that they had a hand in things getting this bad. So when they offer to let Crosshair come with them—which is very significantly presented as an obligation, not something they want—he knows that offer is BS. Whatever their real feelings might be (because the found family show obviously wants us to believe that everyone loves each other), their actions have said loud and clear that they don’t want him. That yes, he could technically walk onto that ship… but that it would be the “wrong” decision accompanied by more insults, scoffs, and pressure to do otherwise. That once he's there, he'll be treated only as a threat with any good deeds ignored. It's an awful offer outside of it being the morally correct decision when it comes to leaving the Empire... so Crosshair reaches for the right candy bar instead.

That very long tangent out of the way, THIS is what season two has to grapple with, along with all that ambiguity and the existence of these "The chip is still here" hints. But the interviews don’t seem to acknowledge that all of this exists, instead framing things as if we’d ended the finale knowing for sure that the chip is out and had watched a season where Crosshair is 100% responsible for everything that’s happened, no Empire or TBB influence involved. The way the interviews frame things doesn’t match up with the text, so I can only hope this is an example of bad communication, or the writers keeping a spoiler under wraps, because otherwise… season two might be frustrating to watch, with fans continually going, “Why are you ignoring that this happened? Why are you pretending that all of this is simpler than it actually is?”

#TBB #The Bad Batch #Crosshair #Star Wars #SW #mymetas

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generallypo · 4 years

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[ Constellation ’Director of the False Last Act’ is looking at you. ]

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dark academia!hsy, yeeee! the white coat is fantastic, but unlike kdj and yjh, she doesn’t really switch up the color scheme. no, her bum-aesthetic purple hoodie does not count. i think she’s super hot. i yell about how much i love her under the cut.

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yo han sooyoung is actually amazing, incredible, powerful, witty, drop-dead sexy... what makes her so irresistible? let me explain

1) yeah, kdj takes the kdj company to end of the scenarios, but please. how many times does he have to kill himself to get there? not to mention his intentional (and unintentional) kill count?

sure, he does the job, but damn is he kind of inefficient about it. say what you like about hsy’s methods or personality, but the 1863rd round far surpasses the 1864th in terms of the lives preserved while still managing to take the team to the end.

without the benefit of cheat-like knowledge, skills, and resurrections, hsy almost single-handedly orchestrates the events of the 1863rd round to a satisfying finale. kmw, problematic as he is, survives and becomes an admittedly better person, yjh finds a timeline where he can rest in peace, and the rest of the cast have their eyes set on the hopeful end of all scenarios. all this, while only being HALF of a person (hsy originally split off into two after misusing her avatar ability). do her actions lead to the happiest ending? no. but it’s the one that sacrifices the least and saves the most. for the greater good, in other words.

hsy may be an intrinsically selfish person, but unlike kdj, she has the ability to grasp the entire picture and avoid tunnel-visioning into a crappier, more convoluted and self-sacrificial solution. ironically, it ends up saving more lives. perks of being a talented writer, i guess.

and the 1864th hsy emerges as a leader in her own right as well. the epilogue arc shows her assuming roughly the same role as her 1863rd self in kdj’s absence: yjh breaks off from the main group (AND BECOMES A TERRORIST AKFDJDSLKSL HAHAHA) to assume a similarly antagonistic role to the remaining members of kdj company. as a result, she’s the most powerful lawful incarnation remaining, and once more the incarnations circle around her for direction.

2) independent, confident, competent (hot and kinda shameless about it). this woman has the most delightfully unrepentant attitude towards life -- how to defeat the man with the strongest defensive ability without dealing a single blow? summon a horde of your naked dancing clones to terrify his innocent sensibilities, and then cackle at his helplessness. the fact that her sponsor is literally the chuuni-est cringefest in the entire galaxy and she gives no fucks about him is just additional comedic gold. her undisguised disgust for what should otherwise be a highly respected/feared entity is a clear indicator of her supremely dominant position over everyone else, and i admire her consistent irreverence of everyone and everything.

hsy is the only character who can consistently bully kdj, brush off his deflections, and bully him again. 1863rd round hsy gives kdj about 50 migraines in the span of 5 minutes of conversation before confirming her superior wit. jhw comes close, but unfortunately, she actually respects the rat bastard. i wish i could mention yjh, but let’s be real: he -- and just about every existing version of him -- has been whipped for the guy for at least 250+ chapters now.

hsy, on the other hand, has no regard for anything except herself... man, i respect that so much. what a queen.

and i won’t lie! i didn’t like her in the first fifty or so chapters. plagiarism? homicide? kind-of-in-general-just-being-an-obstacle-to-kdj’s-plans? yeah, i almost fell into the trap of disliking her purely because she didn’t cave immediately in the grand scheme of kdj’s plotting -- thereby denying me the power rush that came with seeing kdj bulldoze his way through the puny attempts of small fry characters. she’s neither a friend nor a despicable foe, but rather someone who acts independently and in her own self-interest, WITH the ability to thwart major players if need be. aka, the one who frustrated kdj’s plans -- and me -- the most.

going by my previous isekai/power-fantasy trope experience, i figured she’d get pegged into the sexy-but-sassy harem candidate, or get killed off if that didn’t work out. in hindsight, i’m just pretty fucking dumb, but honestly, i can accept that with gratitude --

-- because in fact. the whole ‘she-gets-in-my-way-so-she-either-goes-into-the-harem-or-dies’ trope in light novels/webnovels and the like, is, frankly, misogynistic and boring as hell. i had some admittedly low expectations for ORV, which consequently blasted my ass to the moon and left me there sobbing for 42 years as i mourned my stupidity and paid my respects to its incredible ending and character development. hsy is a particular delight, especially in her meta awareness of these tropes -- blatantly stating she isn’t obligated to kdj for saving her life and declaring the damsel-in-distress cliche as ridiculous, for example.

and it really is, because suspension bridge effect aside, you’re not gonna want to bang a total shady stranger in the middle of the apocalypse. it’s the little statements of self-awareness, self-worth, and frankness that build up hsy’s charm. as ORV progresses, these little windows of her personality bloom as her presence takes stage center -- and then BAM! you really get to know how strong she is, how hugely capable of love she is, how subtly but wonderfully she expresses it, how she leads and protects those close to her, and how damn good she is at it. hsy is amazing. we stan an iconic queen -- no, black flameS EMPRESS. *kneeling*.

3) writes an entire EPIC, just to keep one lonely, broken fifteen-year-old alive. like. at that point in ORV, i knew. i knew. hsy is the fucking GOAT. seeing her spend the rest of her life on WOS, making sure it reaches completion because it’s the only thing that will sustain kdj until the advent of the scenarios... that hits too hard. inadvertently, it also damns the rest of the world to the terror and tragedy that the star stream brings.. but that’s the call she makes in order to save kdj’s life.

obviously, there’s no precise beginning to the timelines -- ORV is so neatly crafted in its cycle of writer, protagonist, and reader -- but i’d have to argue that hsy holds the greatest power in the trinity. creating the existence known as ‘yoo joonghyuk’ and granting life-changing hope to an otherwise forgotten boy.. is pretty powerful. yjh, for the most part, is a slave to the scenarios (until he breaks free in the 1863rd and 1864th rounds, in particular), while kdj (unwittingly) admits it himself: he’s truly the most powerless god in existence. i forget exactly where he mentions it, but it’s in response to lgy’s reverent commentary that, with all his knowledge and presumed confidence, kdj seems like the protagonist of story or a god to him. kdj’s inner monologue, of course, is appropriately self-deprecating and scarily accurate.

in a lot of ways, WOS -- and ORV itself, really -- is a love letter to readers. it’s a two-way connection, writer and reader, between someone who creates with all their passions and someone who consumes and responds with equally sincere feelings. Ways Of Survival -- the story of a man who defied death and grief and great powers far beyond his being -- is a fictional guide to surviving in a ruined world. but to a battered, bullied, and ostracized boy, it’s not just escapism, or wish fulfilment anymore. WOS is the map to navigating the hell of his reality. there’s a certain power in the right words being spoken -- or in this case, written -- at the right time, even if it’s only for the temporary burst of endorphins upon reading an especially delightful chapter. even if it’s forgotten the next day, you’ve managed to connect. you’ve touched another person’s heart. you made them think about questions they’ve never considered before; maybe, you made them smile.

what can i say but the honest truth? ORV, without a shadow of doubt, has most certainly reached me. i’m a goner for this story and its excellent characters -- long, long gone. something has changed, something that wasn’t there the previous day.

the mark has been made on the reader -- small as it is, it’s irrevocable. behold, in all of its little magnificence: the power of a writer, and their story.

#omniscient reader's viewpoint #omniscient reader #orv #han sooyoung #dark acadamia aesthetic #fanart #long ass emotional screeching #wow these are the nights i wish i had someone to yell about orv with #otherwise i stay up at ass-o-clock uncontrollably writing and groaning and writing #anyways hsy is best girl and sexy as fuck

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onewomancitadel · 2 years

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"Jaune and Weiss don't really have much to say to each other and it doesn't carry the same romantic relief Blake and Yang do!" Literally like Jaune and Weiss have NOTHING stringing them together meaningfully to the point that it completely blindsides me how ANYONE in this fandom thinks that they have a real shot at being endgame... it's unfathomable. Like it's beyond my distaste even, it just DOESN'T make sense. What? What??! What are you talking about, FNDM??! Drives me up the WALL. What meaningful interaction have Jaune and Weiss had in recent volumes, and I mean like, an actual interpersonal one, not just "helping you limp away from our enemy who's trying to blow us off a bridge," which is just standard hero etiquette that any of the main cast would do for each other, uhhhh.... they went to the movies with Oscar once. They have such little development together in the show it simply doesn't make sense to me!!!! But also, It's SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO boring! Bang-my-head-on-a-desk, open-a-whiskey, shoot-myself-dead BORING!! Emotional complexity? Sorry, we're fresh out! Whiteknight is like looking at the most eclectic assortment of characters you could pair and choosing the one duo that has the emotional texture of watching paint dry as your hill to die on. Sorry. I just really remembered how much this whole whiteknight truthing silliness puts a stick in my craw...

I want you to know that you made me giggle joyfully, so thank you, I really appreciate it and you unironically made my afternoon.

(Also sorry if this turns up in the White/knight tag, scroll on).

To be quite frank, it's honestly good to hear from someone else who sees it the same way I do. I sort of feel like I'm watching a different show. I've read so much serious analysis from other meta writers in the fandom that aren't shippers, but who take Jaune/Weiss as a foregone conclusion, and I'm like, what?

It makes me feel irrational, because ofc I'm just the silly shipper invested in Jaune/Cinder. I'm also not targeting any particular writer here, I just wonder if partly what's motivating it is like... cynicism? Or trying to appear reasonable - I don't ship this thing, but I can see it's canon, which legitimises my own ship?

I wondered if I came off that way about Ruby/Oscar since I'm not an active shipper, but to be quite honest, half the reason I post my sincere opinion that it's probably going to be canon is because I've seen competely benign RG fans get such a bad rap, and as a longtime Reylo I feel protective. I think the age discourse is nonsense, the bad wizard stuff - whilst worth discussing - also should acknowledge Oz and Oscar won't merge, and then like, well a lot of people try to say it's 'problematic' because wielding false concern to delegitimise a rival ship is pretty common nowadays.

On that note of Jaune helping Weiss to safety, honestly I think you could probably argue it's a red herring, that's why I mentioned Cinder being involved throughout that sequence and being jealous?????????????? is significant. I'd go so far to say that Jaune/Weiss isn't romantic but Cinder's jealous it might be. Lol!

In terms of blandness... yeah, I mean, even Ren/Nora which is arguably 'bland' gets its own complexity, and by the time V8 swung around I was a big fan of where it was going. Jaune and Weiss have no tension, they have no angst, they have no chemistry, they have no intersecting character arcs beyond Jaune's personal identity and the issues he wrestles with, Weiss' character arc is not set up for a romance with a character like him. To be quite frank, as the heiress of the Schnee family, I really doubt they would give her a romantic interest like Jaune to outshine the inheritance of her own name.

I also think Weiss might not even get a romance. Her possible romantic interest is fulfilled by her own Summoning, so her own family legacy. Whilst it might be arguable having children should be part of her character arc, the really overt themes of her own independence, and her own path, don't seem to indicate motherhood in her future. She wants to reform the name, and the harm and oppression her family has inflicted on the Faunus. In this case, it might even be argued she has a romance with Ilia, but that might read poorly to some.

So basically, Jaune/Weiss inserts Weiss into a really bad role. Diminishes her own family arc, makes her beholden to him, is boring, does nothing for their evolution. Wrestling with a hard decision - a mercy-kill - and telling Ruby, I can see that being a thing they go through considering Jaune and Weiss are two of Ruby's closest friends. But that's more of a Tai and Qrow thing, lol.

But yeah, I want to go so far to say that the 'nice guy waiting patiently for girl' is very gross, and Jaune/Weiss is just soooo bad. Ignore my Jaune/Cinder wishes - it's not good for Weiss. It puts Jaune into the wrong masculine role, too.

Like, the thing with Cinder, is that if you want to talk about all of this - someone needing saving (Weiss rescues herself! She's a Salem/Ozma in one) - the way it would happen with Jaune is a recontextualised Maiden and Knight romance.

Weiss rejects being a princess. Jaune and Weiss are not knight and princess. Cinder is the one who wants to be a Maiden. Cinder's the one who's never had any family, who had to take a name for herself, who's killed things. I don't think motherhood makes sense in Weiss' arc, but if it did in anybody's it would be Cinder's, for the regenerative aspect of it, the family. The thing with the Jaune/Cinder pairing, is that you get a recontextualised traditional gender dynamic and it's really good.

And their arcs have been related to each other. For so long.

Oh just looking at this makes me so happy. Oh! Oh!

But yeah, idk. Jaune/Weiss has no set-up. I've gone back and watched all of the scenes, the biggest thing it is is a red herring to the Jaune/Cinder romance that's soooo obvious in retrospect. It's like when Blake/Yang went canon in V6, suddenly I was like omg we weren't getting it wrong! It really was meant to be that intense!

From what I've read, taking Jaune/Weiss as canon fulfills pairing the spares, and ignores Cinder (and ignores Cindemption), and also ignores Jaune to some degree and Weiss too. It's what you assume if you don't want to think too hard and don't like the characters as much, and like, if you can recognise another ship that's not your own is canon, then yours is more likely, right?

Also I mean, Jaune helping Weiss is chivalry, but I don't think he's helping her with the intent of getting with her. That's sort of the beauty of their (few) interactions beyond Beacon, and to me a romance would kind of... ruin that. Like, if they turned around and said, 'Okay, good boy's waited enough, now the mean girl can finally notice you,' it would diminish his character, especially building up to Jaune helping Cinder.

Okay, the mean girl WILL notice you, but she is really really mean, and all bite, but it's alright, she was looking before you even were. *dreamy sigh*

Hope you are having a fab evening. (: Thank you for your ask, pure joy. <3

#seraphina's asks #me talking shit about jaune/weiss #knightfall #user: anomalous-fox

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scentedflowersong · 3 years

Text

Between The Pages

Hi guys, it’s me again ;)

Judging by your response to 12 Days of Swan-Mills Saga Christmas, you are quite interested in some ‘bonus’ material to The Swan-Mills Saga, so here it is - the complete (for the time being) list of Between the Pages one-shots/deleted scenes.

A big thank you to the ever so sensational @swanqueeneverafter!

Merry Christmas

Rating: T Summary: The Swan-Mills extended family shop for the perfect Christmas tree. Set between 'The Story of Us' and 'After The Sunset'

Distance Is Overrated

Rating: M Summary: Having killed for the first time since becoming a mother, Regina is keeping Emma at arms length. Confused by her behaviour, Emma is nevertheless determined to do her job as Deputy and find out the truth behind Graham’s death. Set between ‘The Heart Is A Lonely Hunter’ and 'True North’.

Consider This

Rating: M Summary: With the vision of her death still haunting her, Emma is visited at the station by the Evil Queen. Although initially reluctant to listen, Emma soon finds the Queen’s words making a lot of sense to her. But what will Henry and Regina think? Set between ‘A Bitter Case’ and 'I’ll Be Your Mirror’.

Guardian Dragon Part 1 and Part 2

Rating: M Summary Part 1: Just where did Regina go that Saturday? We know for certain it wasn’t to a city council meeting. Catching up with an old friend, Regina reflects on the events leading up to casting the Dark Curse and her mixed feelings about Emma Swan. Set during the events of ‘The Price of Gold’. Summary Part 2: While Regina is undercover with the Queens of Darkness, Emma is desperate to make sure she’s all right. During a private rendezvous, can Regina and Emma keep their relationship a secret, or will they be discovered by prying eyes? Set during Season 4 and the events of ‘Best Laid Plans’.

I’m Glad You Came

Rating: M Summary: After that bittersweet kiss outside the diner, Regina walked home alone. Or did she? What follows are the events that took place directly after Mary Margaret & Emma’s welcome home party. Set During ‘The Cricket Game’.

Seduced by Darkness

Rating: M Summary: Finding themselves back in Storybrooke with the Dark Swan up to no good, Emma’s friends and family want answers. Bound and determined to be the one to find those answers, Regina resolves to confront the Dark One for a third time.Will she be successful, or does the Darkness have something planned for Regina that she’ll never see coming? Set during ‘Swan Song’.

The Long Way Back

Rating: T Summary: Having returned to the Enchanted Forest along with the people she once cursed, Regina must face a life without the ones she loves most. Her heart aching with the loss of Henry and her mind filled with memories of Emma Swan, the former Evil Queen must soon face her toughest challenge yet. Chronicling the events of 'the lost year’ through the eyes of those left behind, we embark on a journey to reunite a family torn apart. Set directly after the events of ‘Going Home’.

I Believe In Us

Rating: T Summary: After the kiss that sent Emma back home to the future, Storybrooke’s fate is now uncertain. Can the curse still be broken without the Saviour? Will Regina be able to move on from her latest heartbreak and mend her relationship with Henry? Set during ‘The Once & Future Queen’.

Note that the rating is mostly up to M in BTP, you know what that means 🍑💦

Teasers below cut... ;)

Distance Is Overrated

Deliciously yummy smut in the mayor’s office... Excerpt:

“Laying kisses on the mayor’s stomach, Emma’s hands frantically push Regina’s skirt up around her hips, placing a kiss between the brunette’s thighs before ripping the mayor’s panties from her body.”

Consider This

How will this indecent proposal play out? Excerpt:

Evil Queen: “You were wonderful, Emma. (Emma gasps:) Don’t worry, this will be our little secret.”

Guardian Dragon Pt.1

C’mon, DragonQueen is the quilty pleasure ship we all love... Excerpt:

Maleficent: “You won’t regret this, Regina.” Evil Queen: “Hm. (Smiling:) Shall we seal the deal?” Maleficent: “Absolutely.”

Guardian Dragon Pt.2

A little bit of voyeurism never killed anyone... Excerpt:

“Closing her eyes when Emma’s mouth makes contact with her breast for the first time, Regina arches her head back in ecstasy.“

I’m Glad You Came

Smut (in front of the fireplace) with feelings is the best alibi... Excerpt:

“Leaning in for a kiss, Regina almost topples from Emma’s lap when she feels curious fingers probing beneath her skirt and finding their way inside Regina’s underwear.“

Seduced By Darkness

The Dark Swan and the Evil Queen feasting on each other(’s darkness),go on, say it does nothing for ya, you liars... Excerpt:

“Sinking to her knees, Emma hungrily pushes up Regina’s skirt, kissing her panty-covered crotch before reaching up and tearing Regina’s underwear from her body. Arching her neck with a gasp, Regina struggles to remain standing as she feels Emma’s mouth upon her.”

The Long Way Home

Honestly there’s so much more feels than smut, but it’s so f*ckingly good 4-chapter you won’t mind... Excerpt:

“Gazing into each other’s eyes, Emma moves toward her and they kiss, pouring all of their love into it. The year’s separation simply melting away between them.”

I Believe In Us

Okay, no smut here (at all), but it has Sameen the hammer Shaw in it (and meta!Shoot too) Excerpt:

Shaw: (Flips through the storybook:) “I don’t know, if the people in Storybrooke are even half as hot as they appear in this book…“ Emma: "Don’t you ever think with another part of your anatomy?” Shaw: (Staring at a picture of a fairy named Astrid:) “I know who’s anatomy I’m going to be thinking about tonight.” Emma: (Throws up her hands and grabs her coat:) “I need some air.” Shaw: “Emma, come on…“ (Slamming the door to her apartment closed behind her, Emma pulls on her coat and heads towards the stairs.)

Note: the excerpts were selected to tease but not to show the “very best” parts, also they don’t necessarily belong to the artworks :)

#the swan-mills saga #between the pages #Maleficent #sq #swanqueen #swan queen #swen #emma swan #regina mills #mrs&mrs swan-mills #dragon queen

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thelightofthingshopedfor · 3 years

Text

so I wrote most of this...four days ago, and then somehow didn’t get around to finishing it until just now, which feels super weird because after writing this I started getting worried about future episodes again for a variety of reasons, and of course now we’re at T minus 10 minutes? (honestly if I’m somehow late for my own funeral I’m pretty sure no one will be surprised.) but I still wanted to post this to go over some of what I liked so much about episode 4, even if...I am no longer anywhere near as confident as I was a few days ago about where the show might be going. whatever.

***

I’ve done almost nothing for the past day or so except chew over episode 4 some more, partly trying to figure out why I liked it so much when it was broadly very divisive, and I realized that a lot of what I’ve been feeling from this episode is relief.

the thing is I’ve been paranoid since at least Infinity War about Marvel doing setup that looks like it’ll lead to a big payoff and then nothing (Loki’s death, but also Gamora’s and maybe Vision’s, and the general fact that the “fix” to IW was convoluted, took place much later, and caused as many problems as it solved, and just, Endgame in general), so I don’t really trust Marvel that way anymore. plus Marvel has pretty badly fumbled a lot of different things in the past, especially on various social issues, by introducing unfortunate implications that apparently didn’t occur to them even though they’re obvious to literally everyone else...stuff like Thanos’s “sacrifice” of Gamora, or how the Flag-Smashers were portrayed and Karli was a villain for no real reason, or how it would’ve been so easy to add a couple lines in WandaVision that would fix the whole thing where the Maximoffs weren’t just whitewashed but they also voluntarily worked with Nazis and they whiffed that too.

so, while I’ve been enjoying the show, a lot of that enjoyment has been based on meta I’ve seen and me sort of going “this interpretation is really cool and it makes a lot of sense, but at this point I can’t know if it’s something the showrunners are doing on purpose or if they sorta accidentally implied depth where there wasn’t any and it’s not actually leading anywhere” with things like the TVA being very clearly authoritarian but also supposedly the good guys, Loki being constantly described as an awful person, Loki sometimes being manic or incompetent, etc. etc. etc., along with the similar interpretation of “sure, we fans know all this stuff about how Loki is not an awful person actually, thanks, and the people who arrested him aren’t automatically Good Guys just because they’re in opposition to him but casual viewers--including not-casual-but-not-fannish viewers who should really know better--have not figured any of this out and so the show needs to go out of its way to demonstrate things that are obvious to us” but I wasn’t sure. the second half of episode 1 made me feel pretty good about where the show was headed as far as Loki’s characterization and emotions were concerned, but the more lighthearted aspects of 2 and 3 had me wondering again.

so then what happens in this episode?

the TVA goes fully mask off. the Time-Keepers are in fact fake, the Sacred Timeline by extension is also basically fake, the people who work there are all variants, the ones we know (C-20, B-15, Mobius) show grief and anger over the lives that were stolen from them, Sylvie is arrested as a child who did absolutely nothing wrong (and then put through the same process Loki was in episode 1, which is cool because a lot of it was kinda played for laughs then but showing the same things happening to an innocent child also serves to reframe what happened to Loki as, hmm, not that funny after all maybe!), Renslayer is willing to prune innocent people--friends and coworkers, even--just because they learned too much, all the sinister propaganda WAS SUPPOSED TO BE SINISTER

Loki gets very serious very fast in this episode. he displays a lot of genuine emotion and trauma but he mostly does it in a calculated way that shows just how fast his brain works and how he’s always, always thinking about what other people want/expect from him. (like--even the complaint about too few guards seems to fall into that category, given that he only says it after Mobius insists he must be wanting to make some kind of quip!) his self-image is garbage but through Sylvie he’s starting to maybe work on that. he goes up against multiple armed enemies while completely unarmed and holds his own until he gets a weapon. he pushes back when it matters and doesn’t just accept everything Mobius throws at him. he lies, pretty competently (the fact that Mobius doesn’t believe him is...really not his fault, considering Mobius wouldn’t believe him at first about the truth either, so I’m pretty sure he wasn’t planning to believe anything Loki outright told him), when it actually matters, primarily in what sure seems like an attempt to protect someone he cares about.

and Mobius. says that Loki WAS RIGHT. ABOUT THE TVA. FROM THE BEGINNING!!! I would still love to hear him say explicitly, look, I said a lot of shitty things to you and tossed in some actual physical torture at the end there oops but the vast majority of it was stuff I didn’t really mean and was only saying to get a reaction and/or information and of course it turns out I was wrong about all the TVA stuff, so I want to say for the record that I was wrong about you personally in many different ways and I’m sorry. (which, honestly, would probably be very awkward for both of them because I doubt Loki has much experience receiving genuine apologies.) but I’m mostly okay with it if he doesn’t, because I feel like you were right from the beginning, and by the way you can be whatever you want does a decent job of implying most of that. (...enough for casual viewers to pick up on it? well, I’m not hoping for miracles but sure, probably some of them.)

in other words? all that stuff the casual viewers were missing (not helped by misleading statements from the showrunners), about the TVA so clearly being bad guys, and Loki being a pretty decent person who presents different versions of himself in different situations and also has some shitty coping mechanisms, and the other Loki variant also not being evil just because they were trying to take down the TVA? we were right. that is, in fact, how the showrunners intended all those things to be taken. they didn’t want to come right out with that stuff at first because they wanted to tell a story and have some twists, and the fact that these things were twists for casual viewers is exactly why it was frustrating to a lot of fans, because it felt like obvious things were being misrepresented or overlooked. I still think that’s reasonable, because see above on why Marvel doesn’t necessarily deserve that trust, but at this point I’m a lot more comfortable believing that this specific show more or less knows what it’s doing.

I mean, yeah, there were some cool fan theories that went nowhere, like the whole thing with the broken TemPad, and I agree that was dumb and it’s very annoying that it really was just sloppy writing, but I guess specific things like that just...don’t bother me as much as more systemic, overarching elements like the characterization of Loki and the TVA. and yes, of course I’ll always be annoyed that we’re apparently never going to get explicit confirmation that Loki’s alliance with Thanos was coerced at best. but, you know, what we got isn’t nothing.

#loki #loki show #loki spoilers #mobius m. mobius #sylvie #marvel cinematic universe #meta #loki meta #my meta #I should add links but uh...maybe later

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janiedean · 3 years

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I feel bad for all the nice J*nsa shippers who like their ship for whatever reasons (tropes, pretty art, aesthetic appeal, whatever) and know it's not canon but get associated with the misogynistic Dany hating crowd who act like Jon being attracted to Ygritte is J*nsa foreshadowing because red hair (I guess Jon should fuck Edmure Tully too? Omg give me Dark!Jon getting revenge on Catelyn by seducing her brother!) Tell me something. I'm new to the fandom but was J*nsa popular before the show? And I've heard something about the OG J*nsa shippers being alienated by the new shippers who insisted it had to be canon and acted like the series is called, "A song of J*nsa #danysux." I don't find that hard to believe because I know people who are now ashamed of calling themselves J*nsa shippers. Like, at this point, it's not only rival shippers who hate it. Even Gendrya/Braime/Jon stans/etc have started disliking that ship. You know your fandom is a problem when people who have nothing to do with Jnsa have a problem with it.

me: reads this ask

me: iwastheregandalf.gif which I can't find now but

okay anon buckle up because I am sadly well-equipped to answer this ask but before I do lemme tell you dark jon seducing edmure to take revenge on cat is LITERALLY THE BEST THING I'VE EVER HEARD but *clears throat* ALL RIGHT THEN.

disclaimer: as anon says I have no issue with like the shippers mentioned by anon in the beginning and ngl I agree, I have ABSOLUTELY ZERO FUCKING STAKES in the j*nsa vs j*nerys war and the only het jon ship I gaf about is jon/ygritte and we all know where that ended up I just... have been here since 2011/adwd was over and all the fic around was just for the books under secret lj communities and asoiaf qualified for yuletide and I have... seen... things.... and I actually have like uh had... beef... with some people in there and I know things bc ppl who hated those others told me stuff so anyway *sigh* buckle up anon I'mma tell you the story of jon shipwars through the years

in order, the old gods help me here, under the cut bc this is long as fuck

when I got into fandom also given what numbers were on ao3 one ship was popular and it was sansan. no like sansan was lit. the only asoiaf ship on ao3 with more than 200 fics. jb had twenty when i checked first. jc had like around 100-ish because of the show but sansan dwarfed anything. I posted the first jon/ygritte fic on the ao3 tag and the fourth throbb fic and like the others were all reposts from lj kinkmemes. nothing was popular before the show except for sansan when it comes to huge numbers bc grrm doesn't like fic and it was all hush hush until the show made it impossible to control and that ship was the one with a huge enough fanbase it actually had numbers, so like... j*nsa wasn't popular in the way nothing else was popular until it got screentime on the show

now, that stated, j*nsa had a... fair amount of fic for a rareship which was mostly book-based and from og shippers that were there from before the show and liked it for what it was but literally none of them thought it was gonna be canon, like it wasn't huge or anything but it had a small but dedicated fanbase who did their own thing and thought it was fun/liked the idea but that was it

that fandom had their own niche of hcs that they cultivated and shit except that like... at the end of S5/beginning of S6 there was a surge in shipping for... well obvious reasons bc it was obv sansa was getting to the wall and that would have been all nice and good but a) it was the time puritanical shipping was starting to take root and the 'shipping sansa with sandor or tyrion is hella problematic' rhetoric had started to circle coming from sans*ery shippers mostly but I'mma not open that fucking can of worms here, b) while the ending of S5 had more of a theon/sansa spike, the j*nsa stuff started getting big

now here we have to mention my villain origin story ie: j*nsa fandom had this one stan whose name I won't make because honestly it's been years and if she's still around I don't want her to remember I exist who was a bnf, wrote for... the website that created the whole larry/carol thing etc who was really fixed on this thing that j*nsa was actually canon and started writing extremely popular meta about it. now you're gonna ask how do you know, I know because this person once wrote a meta named 'why robb stark is a dick' and I told her that it was really fucking bad meta and she took it so badly she kept on trash talking me on her blog/her podcast (I was apparently the insane robb stark fangirl l m a o good lord) and like that was when some sane ppl who argued with her informed me in pvt that she was basically harping on the CANON thing when they'd have been okay with like... it being crackshipping and that she was basically cultivating a hoarde of followers who were harping on them/the ogs and basically ostracizing them;

I would like to add that this person - before her tumblr got 'accidentally deleted' and remade it therefore deleted most receipts for, er, her so-called meta which included stuff like ned and cat raised sansa as a sexual object and only wanted to sell her like cattle - had at some point started a round robin fic thing where... some of the characters mocked openly said stuff that some of the og fans had said specifically targeting them and people in that side basically went harassing anyone who didn't agree with that specific notion

now never mind that this person basically coined an entire term to describe ppl who liked white guys and excused all their wrongdoings out of my conversation re robb basically lying about everything I said as if I didn't have the receipts and tried to sell shirts with it and it didn't work and like then she got kicked out of her own website because she was telling her commenters disagreeing pretty shitty insults (considering I was called psychotic for disagreeing with her that time I don't doubt it) I think at some point she stepped back from fandom bc idk wtf she's up to these days and I don't want to, but basically at that point the dam was broken and there was a bunch of puritanical shippers harping on anyone who didn't agree with j*nsa is canon endgame stuff

this also includes an incident when those ppl were like... passing themselves as throbb shippers and ended up trying to tell t*hramsay shippers off the theon tag based on moral reasons and I ended up arguing with all of them (and they were all from that crowd) which in turn landed me in contact with other og j*nsa shippers who were like detached from that fandom bc those same people harassed them away as well ssooooo fun

anyway when S6 happened everyone was high on it and whatnot but I wasn't gonna begrudge them that I mean... you shipped it for years, canon is delivering you, good for you, but then j*nerys happened

god j*nerys happened

aaand basically...... I mean personally I was there like are y'all seriously arguing about the best incest jon ship out there but like basically the j*nsa endgame side was like AH JON IS PLAYING DANY SEE IF IT DOESN'T HAPPEN, the j*nerys obv got defensive af and both sides were sort of alternatively shitting on jon/ygritte anyway and depicting any other romantic rship jon could have as abusive™ and during S8 it just got worse and like I tried to stay out of it but basically from what I'm seeing now idk how the j*neryses are doing but on the j*nsa one it's ah jon's gonna play dany anyway and she's going to go insane like in the show so SHOW TRUTHING EVERY OTHER WAY and like again denying that sandor exists or that tyrion exists and like I barely touch my corner (sansan) but I ended up arguing with j*nsa/th*nsa people on twitter who were antis and is2g it was white-hair inducing and I know for sure the sansa/tyrion shippers were harassed to hell and back throughout so FUN

and even if the show didn't go there now since everyone there banked on the jnsa endgame thing and admitting you're wrong is like... not a thing, they still haven't let go of it and attach to that ship any shred of evidence which honestly is grasping at straws half of the time (like... the sansa/alysanne parallels like guys please no) and which is why every other ship is starting to get fed up, attaching canon proof of stuff from other ships onto theirs see that batb argument and jb is platonic but jonsa is not nvm taking all the sansan stuff and throwing it on j*nsa but then denying that sansan has canon evidence (like guys I had to read sansa touching his shoulder when saying gregor wasn't a true knight wasn't meaningful and we were seeing things please) and blah blah blah

this also goes hand in hand with the fixation on like... villanizing dany at all costs and like is2g I have zero investment in dany or her storyline I don't even remember it and I don't particularly care abt her either way and sure af I'm not for j*nerys endgame but like.... some stuff I read is completely excessive esp when fixing on how she's a completely mad tyrant who's gonna have to be put down and like... guys no

(also there's some srs stannis hate in that corner which I honestly don't get why they even care abt stannis but I had to read stuff like ppl don't recognize that dany and stannis are the real villains in this saga and like........ idek)

I think most of the og shippers are gone or don't ship it openly bc they don't want to be attached to the drama but like I also think they're pissing off everyone else bc like... I mean a bunch of them also were down with sansa being paired with other ppl as long as it meant a good ending for her except those ppl were... like everyone but the ppl she has actual contact with in canon which meant that at some point sansa/gendry was a thing and like.... you can imagine why arya/gendry shippers & arya stans were fed up, and there's also this tendency to behave like sansa is the center of the entire saga which like these books is named a song of jon snow basically can we pls make peace with it and personally I've had it with both j*nsa and j*nerys people since they started with that dumbass JON/YGRITTE WAS AN ABUSIVE RELATIONSHIP rhetoric but I'm also fed up with the total ignoring that sandor exists/depicting us as delusional and honestly I also was by proxy fed up from the harassing of the sansa/tyrion shippers soooooooooooo

there were also instances of 'well theon is an acceptable choice other than jon bc he can't threaten her' which... i mean we all know what that meant and I'm not even commenting it bc it's one AM and I have no force to but I don't have to explain why it's not a progressive take now do I

there were also metas about how cousin incest being legal in half of the world means that jondany is a worse incest and j*nsa doesn't count as such and I was basically there like guys please just fucking own up to it but honestly I chose to forgot where I read that and I couldn't find the link if I tried

tldr: no one wants to admit that it's not gonna be endgame which considering the amount of fic they have on ao3 is imvho useless bc they have more content than like.. anything I ship that's not jb or that's actually like canon *cries in joncon/rhaegar but I mean renly/loras is canon and has less fic than them* so idk what's the problem with enjoying that instead of insisting it's gonna be canon when not even the show validated it while show truthing anyway when the only show truthing that can be truthed is the small council made of minorities and possibly jon eventually fucking off with the wildlings but not like that but like most people who thought it wasn't gonna be endgame had left/were made to leave by the time S7 rolled by and at this point since wow isn't out yet everyone is fandom-grasping at straws to find stuff to discourse on and we're here beating dead horses *shrug*

so that's... how it is but I would again like to point out that I don't judge ppl on their shipping, I don't particularly care about this entire feud bc I only ship jon with ppl he's not related to in whichever way and I try to stay out of this mess bc I don't really care to argue with ppl who have already decided to bend canon to whatever they want and will have to realize that it's not what grrm wrote at some point but like I have a very good memory and the above rant is as objective as possible also bc again I don't literally have a stake in that race I just think romantic/endgame j*nsa is not a thing and that ppl should stay in their lane and not harping on other ppl who ship whatever in general but especially when their ship is the most popular thing in fandom in the first place /two cents

#1 #2 #3 #4 #5 #anonymous #ask post #anti-jonsa #anti jonsa #anti-jonerys #anti jonerys #both of them for equality

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oumakokichi · 4 years

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Hello!! Since I saw you were enjoying YTTD, what do you think about Sou and possible parallels to be drawn between him and Kokichi? Love your blog!

Oh boy, that’s a pretty great question. I had a feeling when I started YTTD that it was only a matter of time before Sou wound up being my favorite, and I wasn’t proven wrong over the course of the game. There are definitely some similarities between the two of them—and some differences too!

Spoilers for both games under the cut, so be careful when reading!

Well, to start with the similarities: they both lie. Uh, a lot. In fact, lying is sort of the most memorable thing about both of their characters.

Kodaka has stated that Ouma represents ndrv3’s entire theme of lying on multiple occasions, and I don’t think anyone needs any convincing that lying is Ouma’s entire schtick. With Sou, Nankidai has never (as far as I know) said anything about him representing the concept or idea of “lies,” but it’s still pretty evident nonetheless from the narrative.

Where Sara tries to keep the group united and cooperating with each other honestly, Sou undermines her attempts at nearly every opportunity and lies time and time again, both in and out of the main game. Even his theme song emphasizes how much he lies. Vgperson did a great job translating the title in my opinion by making it “Not So, Sou,” and in Japanese the title is “Sou no Uso”—a play on the fact that his name is a rearrangement of the Japanese word for “lie.”

They even have a few physical similarities as well: Sou is physically taller and older, but both of them are fairly scrawny, underweight (this is lampshaded with Sou in Your Turn to Shine by the fact that he can put off dying from starvation for at least one extra turn), and of course, they both wear scarves.

I have actually seen a few people in the DR fandom call Sou “green Komaeda” when playing YTTD for the first time, probably due to his role as the “trickster” character within the main game, but I honestly think it’s much fairer to say he’s similar to Ouma instead. If anything, it’s kind of hard to not see the similarities between the two when going from one game to the other.

Ouma does, after all, go out of his way to antagonize people within trials as well, and both he and Sou are considerably paranoid and mistrustful of others’ intentions. Both of them are all too happy to play the role of the villain even if it means being hated by everyone else, because they want to make it out of their respective killing games alive and they don’t trust anyone who talks openly about “cooperating” and “believing in each other.”

Of course, that’s not to say that the two of them are carbon copies of each other. Sou is similar to Ouma, but he’s definitely not identical. Their key differences are easier to see when you look past their surface-level personas, as well as their motivations for why they do the things they do.

To put it simply, both of them lie, but for almost completely different reasons. It’s true that Ouma in part does lie because of his own paranoia and lack of trust for the rest of the group—but also, Ouma just really, really loves lying. It’s a core part of his character; he states multiple times that he believes having the ability to lie is the same as having free will, and this shows how deeply he resents the idea of “having” to tell the truth, or well, being “forced” to do anything, really.

He also lies to entertain. He says so pretty explicitly in his salmon mode ending, and it’s absolutely not a lie: Ouma is someone who loves being dramatic, over-the-top, and entertaining. He hates being bored, and he hates the idea of boring other people even more.

After playing ndrv3 at least once, it’s really easy to see that deep down he’s just a clown with a love for funny wigs and really dumb pranks, so I wholeheartedly believe that even outside of a killing game, Ouma would still lie all the time (in fact he does, again, in his salmon mode route). It’s just that his lies would lack any malice or hostility to them.

The thing that sets Ouma apart from many other “bastard trickster” characters in fiction is that his love for lies isn’t some of act or façade that he’s putting on. He enjoys it in the same way that a kid enjoys making a prank phone call or putting a whoopee cushion on someone’s chair. Within the constraints of a killing game, it’s absolutely true that Ouma is cold, calculating, and manipulative—but he’s also genuinely childish, fun-loving, and silly. These traits are honestly the reason I love Ouma so much as a character and find him so interesting.

By contrast, Sou lies out of absolute necessity. Knowing that he has a 0% chance of survival only increases his desire to make it out of the game alive all the more, and solidifies his distrust in Sara with her high rate of survival. He lies out of sheer desperation, willing to talk and act like a completely different person from his true self if it means giving himself even the slightest sliver of an opportunity to stay alive.

Even his name (his real name, that is), reflects this. He took on both the name and, to some degree, the persona of the real Sou Hiyori: a first name that is, like I said, an anagram of the word “lie,” and a surname that means “sunny.” By contrast, his actual name, “Shin Tsukimi,” means “truth” and “moon-viewing.” Before the events of YTTD, Shin Tsukimi was an extremely gentle, timid person who was honest and trusting to a fault, further confirmed when we actually see an AI of him in chapter 3 who acts completely different from Sou as we know him.

Sou might put on an act and pretend that he enjoys lying and being a huge bastard in the middle of the main game, but he’s not nearly as good at keeping up the villain façade as Ouma, and his cracks show a lot easier. Multiple characters, particularly Sara, Kanna, and Keiji, call Sou out on his bad acting at various times, and insist that he isn’t nearly as evil or uncaring as he’d like to pretend. This is a sharp change from Ouma, who remained an enigma even after his death and played the part of the ringleader so well that nearly everyone still believed he was a Remnant of Despair until nearly halfway through the chapter 6 trial.

From what we can see of Sou’s personality, both in YTTD and YTTS, he’s not lying because he likes the fun of it all, or because he’s just a kid who loves pranking people deep down. He’s really, truly scared shitless and eaten alive by his own paranoia for pretty much the entirety of YTTD, and while he’s certainly not the trusting or naïve Shin Tsukimi anymore, he nonetheless tends to still show signs of being quiet, timid, and occasionally even grumpy and closed-off from other people.

For example, Sara has multiple opportunities to tease him or attempt to befriend him throughout the game. When you teasingly insist that you’ve “always been close friends” with him during the second half of chapter 2, he looks completely startled and taken aback, even a little horrified at her persistence in wanting to get to know him after all the stunts that he’s pulled. You can also have Sara bother him while he’s working on the laptop after they get rid of Mishima’s AI, to which he responds with more and more irritation. In my opinion, I get the sense that Sou is more used to being the butt of jokes rather than making them, and doesn’t enjoy feeling as though someone’s poking fun at him, even if people like Sara are doing it with good intentions.

While I called them both scrawny earlier, I do want to clarify that I absolutely, unironically think Sou is weaker than Ouma physically too. Ouma isn’t exactly super strong or anything; he complains when lifting the inugami statue with Saihara in chapter 3, and he doesn’t seem to like PE class from some of his dialogue in salmon mode. But it’s really clear that Ouma does hide some of his aces up his sleeve, and that he can punch a hell of a lot harder than he lets on, like in chapter 5 when he counters Momota’s second attempt to punch him.

Meanwhile Sou… Sou struggles to open cabinet doors and probably pickle jars too. He has weaker physical strength than both Kanna, a middle schooler, and Gin, an elementary schooler, in his YTTS stats. I love him to pieces, I think he’s a fantastic character, but it’s just too funny. Sou is not merely scrawny, he’s essentially the biggest, weakest pushover despite being around 20 years old or so and I think that’s great.

Anyway, these are just my thoughts on the similarities and differences between the two of them! Both of them are absolutely willing to go to extreme lengths in order to try and survive their respective killing games, and they’re both extremely paranoid and distrustful of others. But removed from the killing game, Ouma is pretty clearly someone who aspires to be a clown (both a class clown and a literal, pie-throwing, nose-honking party clown) and to entertain others, while Sou is honestly just an exhausted and extremely grumpy convenience store worker bordering on unemployment who has zero upper body strength and just wants to be left alone.

Thank you for the really fun question, anon! I really love both Sou and Ouma, so I had fun getting to write this meta for them!

#danganronpa #your turn to die #kokichi ouma #sou hiyori #shin tsukimi #ndrv3 #my meta #ask #anonymous #ndrv3 spoilers //#yttd spoilers //#okay to reblog

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lany-d-flow · 3 years

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Whisper Talk: Going Against Alternate Timeline Theories with a Theory, and Answering Questions Saying Otherwise.

Those who look with clouded eyes see nothing but shadows. -Sephiroth, Final Fantasy 7 Remake.

SPOILER WARNING

Pressing “Keep Reading” will bring you into spoiler territory for, well... Final Fantasy 7 Compilation and Remake, so this is your warning, all right buddy?

Also, this is one person’s interpretation of another work. What I predict may very well turn out to be untrue, and if you disagree with my prediction then that’s totally fine! (If you’d like, we could chat about it).

But honestly, I have spent the last few months thinking about this game in an unhealthy manner. I think having all of these whispers inside of my head with my frustration getting bigger is not going to move anything forward. So it’s time to wake up, get up, get out there and write thoughts about what is actually going on with Final Fantasy 7 Remake, while trying to clear up misconceptions that may be leading people astray. Perhaps the latter is the intention of the developers. If it is? Well, let’s move past the clouds and find the sunlight.

All right, let’s mosey into this nonsense.

It’s been months since the release of Final Fantasy 7 Remake. After a long five-year wait for many fans, we got a piece of the story on the Playstation 4 in March and April 2020. It was exciting to see the capital of Final Fantasy 7, Midgar, be brought to life with state-of-the-art graphics. Treading through mako reactors, Sector 7 and Sector 5, the nasty Wall Market, Shinra HQ, hearing conversations of lively NPCs, exploring the subtle easter eggs and symbolism through visual storytelling... Goodness, so much of what this game had to offer was a delight! The developers put their heart and soul into fleshing out a section of Final Fantasy 7 that was, at most, 6 hours long. This level of detail cannot go unnoticed, and I’m sure it’s made everyone excited to see the reimagining of Gaia when we receive future installments!!!!

Oh, but wait... the developers introduced a new monster called Whispers, otherwise known as Arbiters of Fate, and... What purpose do they serve?! Why are these things in Final Fantasy 7 when they never had a role in the original game? Based on everything we saw in the story, they seem to be making sure the story of Final Fantasy 7 runs exactly as it’s supposed to. Without these ghosts, the story will not be 1:1. To make things worse, we have Sephiroth who’s from the future?! No wonder these Whispers are here, Sephiroth’s trying to rewrite history because everything he has tried before failed him!

So based on what we saw in Final Fantasy 7 Remake, the developers decided to create a metaphor for the fanbase, and since we defeated ‘destiny,’ we’ve defeated the fanbase’s say in where the story goes, thereby giving the developers permission to change the story the way they want it. Wow, this is pathetic on Square Enix’s part. Final Fantasy 7 is an amazing story with layers and layers of complex themes, why would they try to form it into something else? Now we’re going to have time travel and alternate timelines in the plot and Sephiroth seems unstoppable now. Heck, the developers are probably going to make sure impactful moments in Final Fantasy 7 do not happen, so Zack and Aerith are probably going to survive. And they’re also ditching the Compilation? Can these people be trusted?

Final Fantasy 7 Remake is ruined!!!

Still with me? Well, this is just some of the talk that I’ve heard based on the execution of Final Fantasy 7 Remake’s plot. I won’t try to list every possible thing people are talking about, but I think we get the idea of the impression that our game’s ending put on a lot of players. So I wanted to give my input on what I believe is actually going on with the story, as well as answer many questions popping up about the circumstances of our game’s characters.

So, do I think the developers are changing the story?

Short Answer: No, at least not in the way that many people think. They’re “changing” the story by putting in new elements, moments that tie with the rest of the Compilation, but the main plot points (Overarching plot, the main crisis, the internal plot, the emotional climax, etc.) still need to happen. This series is more than 2 decades old, and with time it has received: a movie, 2 books, a sequel, 2 prequels, and now a remake with existing materials to tie into the game.

Long Answer: All right, if you’re still with me, thank you. I will do my best to explain all of what’s going on. I’ll give my input via understanding how the FF7 Universe works; in other words, what the Whispers are, how the Whispers work, how they’ve actually always been apart of FF7 and are now receiving an expanded role, and how Sephiroth and Aerith showing meta behavior makes sense due to the power that the Planet has given to the Arbiters of Fate (exposure = visions out of context). I will also be answering questions that one may bring up as proof of an alternate timeline/story change and argue what their purpose may actually be.

So, let's Talk about A Whisper

Wait a minute...

So, let's talk about the Whispers.

Let’s start by explaining what the Whispers are, what function they serve to the Planet, and how the Planet creates them in the first place:

Whispers are souls that act as arbiters of fate and have been a part of the Planet for as long as the Planet has existed. They know the fate of the Planet from beginning to end, and their function is to make sure that a specific destiny runs its course. They all unite under the will of the Planet, just like the Sephiroth Clones all act under the will of Sephiroth, which is probably the reason why they were given a cloaky look: the Whispers' function parallels the Sephiroth Clones' function and both act under the authority of something else. They cannot be seen by everyone, and to actually see their physical manifestation, you need to either be 1) deeply connected with the Planet, or 2) receive some form of physical contact from someone who has a strong connection to the Planet. This is established early in Chapter 2 of Final Fantasy 7 Remake. Cloud meets Aerith for the first time, and at first glance she seems to be blown away by the wind. After Cloud and Aerith have an exchange and Aerith gives Cloud a flower, immediately after this we are greeted with an illusion of Sephiroth tormenting Cloud and more importantly, Aerith touching Cloud, allowing him to see the Whispers floating around the street. This follows the logic of my two points, as Aerith is a half-Cetra who’s been receiving visions of the past and future for years (her mural of symbolism in her Shinra HQ room was drawn when she received a vision as a child, though she does not understand the full context of what it means), and of course she ended up giving permission for Cloud to see the Planet’s protectors in action.

So how do the Whispers make sure destiny happens as intended?

Well, they do so by constantly observing the actions of the Planet’s people, sometimes in sight, sometimes not. If something happened that is off course, the Whispers immediately act to correct the course of said issue. We see this multiple times in the story. Some examples include: Aerith trying to leave the street where she meets Cloud, then proceeding to leave the street after meeting Cloud, following the Whispers’ intentions; Jessie getting injured in Sector 7 because destiny needs to make sure Cloud goes on the next AVALANCHE mission. If this didn’t happen, then Aerith and Cloud probably wouldn’t have met again; Surrounding the debris on top of Jessie to ensure her death takes place on top of the Sector 7 Tower (I’ll cover the speculation on her “survival” later); stopping Cloud from remembering everything about the Shinra Research Lab; stopping Hojo from revealing the truth of Cloud’s past (no way in Hell are they going to let the internal conflict unfold this early); reviving Barret from the stab wound that the Sephiroth remnant gave him; lastly, pushing Wedge down the Shinra HQ tower to ensure his death happens. Destined events either eventually happened, or they got delayed. This implies that the Whispers are nigh-omnipresent beings, especially given how many they are and how they were able to surround Midgar entirely, and their part of correcting destiny follows the flow of a river. As Red XIII puts it, “The flow of the great river that is the Planet, from inception to oblivion… For it is the will of the Planet itself”.

Cool. So how are the Whispers born? Where do they come from?

It’s actually a pretty straightforward explanation, and Aerith tells us in Chapter 18: Destiny’s Crossroads. Before the Whispers became Whispers, they were “Those born into this world. Who lived and who died. Who returned. They’re howling in pain.” This adds on to what Sephiroth said a moment ago: “All born are bound to her.” All Whispers were once living people, animals, etc. And all that are given life on the Planet are bound by something like a contract: You get made into an image and are given a physical life. In exchange, once that time’s up, you must return to the Lifestream and become a part of the Planet, being one of many who follow her will. You’re born, you live, you die, and you serve another purpose in a collective of spirits who are now tasked with making sure the flow of destiny is as it should be. By following all of this, we can conclude that 1) Everyone who lives on Gaia could eventually become a Whisper, and 2) since Whispers are a part of the Planet, they are formed from the Lifestream, the Planet’s lifeblood. This leads us into the next question...

How do the Whispers know the course of Destiny from start to finish?

Great question! The logical explanation to how they know is quite simple: the properties of the Lifestream. The Whispers are made out of Lifestream, and that gives them knowledge of the Planet’s destiny. I argue it is not farfetched to make this claim, as the Lifestream has shown time and again what it is capable of. Infact, let’s make an analogy of Lifestream manifestations via state of matter.

Lifestream: Its Three States of Matter and their Benefits and Side Effects

Mako is the liquid form of the Lifestream, Materia is a solid form of the Lifestream, while the regular Lifestream itself can be most equivalent to something of a gas/plasma, at least one that can be seen. Throughout Final Fantasy 7 we’ve seen what all of these forms can do. Mako is an extremely powerful energy source that powers all of Midgar through reactors, and is also what SOLDIERs are bathed in to possibly receive superhuman strength; Materia are jewels capable of all kinds of powerful magic; summoning fire, lightning, ice, creating shields, copying abilities of other living beings, healing, elevating other materia abilities, and most notably summon manifestations of powerful beings (Bahamut, Shiva, Ifrit, Odin, Knights of the Round). While the Lifestream itself? That’s all the souls of the planet with a consciousness that follows the Planet’s will. Some can appear as a physical manifestation, but they’re not quite solid, which is how Cloud’s buster sword moves through the Whispers as if he didn’t cut through anything. Use of the Lifestream can also create projections (think Aerith’s Chapter 14 resolution), allow access into someone’s subconscious under certain circumstances, and of course, give people visions of the past and future without any context as to how those events happen(ed).

All three forms of the Lifestream have side effects, too.

Materia can degrade the vitality and strength of the user. Think of it as a trade-off for borrowing the Planet’s lifeblood in the form of a jewel.

Mako can cause extremely intense mental breakdowns and break the psyche of those without strong mental resilience, which is why Cloud was unable to make it into SOLDIER. But he eventually received Mako exposure anyway. What happened? Oh yeah, he went into a comatose state not once, not twice, but THREE times. First during experimentation, second when he arrived at Midgar before Tifa bumped into him, and when he fell into a pool of Mako and washed up on the shore of Mideel.

Meanwhile, Lifestream side effects are non-contextual visions, loss of sanity similar to Mako (think Tifa before she entered Cloud’s subconscious), and if the Lifestream has something in it, infection! That’s how Geostigma came to be: Jenova cells from Sephiroth, Jenova, and the remnants were floating in the Lifestream, and when the latter destroyed Meteor, it also exposed humans to Jenova cells, turning into a severe disease that is deadliest toward hosts with emotional fragility. This is why Cloud has a “Geostigma episode” in Advent Children when he runs into an injured Tifa.

Even with all these side effects, the benefits are far too great to ignore. All this power from the Lifestream is why Sephiroth and Jenova wanted to siphon it for themselves in the first place. By siphoning the Lifestream resisting side effects, one can receive unparalleled powers. Sephiroth himself said it in the original game:

Notice how the last quote aligns with what Sephiroth said in the Edge of Creation about the Nebula?

“Our world will become a part of it… one day.”

We’ll come back to that statement, I promise. But for now, based on everything I’ve told you, here’s what I think is going on in Final Fantasy 7 Remake:

Sephiroth is not from the future. His exposure to the Lifestream for the last 5 years gave him the side effect of non-contextual visions. Among these visions, he probably saw his master plan fail. Eventually he realizes that the reason he has these visions is because of the Whispers and more specifically, the Planet’s Weapon Arbiter. The Whispers are fighting against Sephiroth as he’s gained both a rough understanding of the future and the Lifestream’s powers by siphoning it up. So, his new master plan? Defeat the Arbiters of Fate and THEN continue with his original plan. Sephiroth being omnipresent makes sense given his control over Jenova and her shapeshifting, S cells that allow him to puppetize clones and Cloud, and being in the Lifestream basically giving him more power with one form of that being omnipresence. What’s going to lead to his downfall is ultimately his arrogance: he probably thinks that just stopping the Whispers is enough for him to win. So while the physical manifestation of fate is gone, Sephiroth still needs to meet the same criteria to win: get the Black Materia to summon Meteor, his ticket to siphon up all the Planet’s Lifestream, which means he also needs Cloud to give him the Black Materia, which then means that eventually Aerith will have to summon Holy and eventually become one with the Lifestream to beat Meteor.

See how all of this comes together without time travel theories that go off on insane tangents? It’s established that the Whispers know the course of destiny from past, present and future. But WHERE did it say that they can travel through time? WHERE did it say that Sephiroth can travel through time with the Lifestream? That kind of power would be an enormous retcon to the story and the functions of Gaia, and it would also lead to a really convoluted plot that can deviate from the main themes of the story (trust me, some theories out there are wild). We do know that Whispers are in a singularity and it moves like a river, which as @silver-wield cleverly put in a post about the story of FF7R, translates to:

The arbiters of fate issued a correction to Wedge and made him fall out of the window in the Shinra building. Which means fate cannot be altered, merely delayed, which then leads to a more painful end for not accepting that fate.

...Or perhaps shuffled up with ultimately the same necessary outcome, because the river of destiny was put on a different course but is still heading to the same destination. There are multiple works in the compilation that the writers and developers would like to tie together to the main story. What’s a way for them to execute this? By making a metaphor for the OG storyline and by beating it giving them permission to add new things? From a certain point of view, sure, but the developers never needed permission to do this in the first place. But the side effect of beating the physical manifestation of destiny was likely shuffling parts of the story of Final Fantasy 7, prequels all the way to the chronological sequels. One can make a case for this based on the explosion felt at Midgar when the Arbiter and Sephiroth were defeated in the Singularity. The glitters of light could also reflect this change. From all this I argue freedom came to be, and characters from the Compilation might make an appearance during the main story such as Kadaj, Loz, and Yazoo. However, no matter what changes are present, the outcome will be the same. Cloud is not properly himself yet; he still thinks he made it into SOLDIER, he gets slight interferences from Jenova throughout the story (example: Cloud’s hand twitching when against Sephiroth at the Edge of Creation), he has the Buster Sword but still doesn’t remember who its original owner was, so his unreliable narration, downfall and emotional climax still need to happen. Aerith is the only character who can summon Holy and the only character who can call forth the Lifestream, and the only way she can call forth the Lifestream is by becoming one with it. How can she do this? There’s only one way: Death. Sorry guys, but if both Sephiroth and Aerith have prophetic visions of the future, there’s a chance that both know what must be done for themselves to get the upper hand. Sephiroth still wants to siphon up the Lifestream and become an omnipotent God, and the best way for him to do this? Summon Meteor. What does he need for this? The Black Materia. Who does he manipulate into giving him the Black Materia at the Northern Crater? Cloud.

My point from all this is that there are specific beats that need to happen to move the plot forward, no matter what new things they add from the Compilation. Using a different crisis for the overarching plot that isn’t Meteor is a retcon to the story, and why advertise Meteor and have it as the centerpiece of artworks and the title screen if you’re not going to use it in the first place? That’s just… really strange. We can add things in the middle of the plot to flesh out the main themes of a story while staying faithful to the outcomes. Adding something entirely different as a crisis like time travel in a game that has never been about time travel is out of place, unnecessary, and people are placing way too much faith in this being true while not looking at the bigger picture and function of Final Fantasy 7’s power tools. I believe the developers want you to think that the story is changing, that a happier outcome is in store for everyone. This all works with what Final Fantasy 7 did for many players in the first place: subvert expectations by placing us in an illusion with an unreliable narrative. We assumed Cloud made it into SOLDIER until we found out he never made it into SOLDIER and created a facade to conceal the truth that he was afraid to face. We thought Aerith was the love interest when the game kept making us appreciate her perky attitude until she ended up dying and then we discover in the Lifestream Sequence that Cloud’s romantic feelings, his whole reason for fighting, was for Tifa. We thought Shinra was the main antagonist of the game until shortly after going through Midgar, the main antagonist is Sephiroth. We thought we were fighting Sephiroth throughout the game until we find out that the real Sephiroth was encased in a crystal sucking up the Lifestream. We don’t actually fight him until the very end when he merges with Jenova and the Lifestream into Bizarro Sephiroth and Safer Sephiroth.

See where I’m going with all of this? The developers want to continue using red herrings and playing the theme of illusion by using different methods. The old methods will not work anymore, so they have to find a new way to subvert expectations in a way that gets us confused, excited, and uncertain what will happen until we actually play through the next installments. When that time comes, be prepared to get your heartstrings pulled, because reality hits our characters hard, just like it hits us hard. Think Biggs, Zack, Aerith are going to survive, and that Sephiroth is travelling through time to accomplish his devious tasks? Well, think again.

Now that we’ve gotten this far into this Whisper Talk, there are a load of questions I will need to address. So without further ado, Let’s mosey!!!

How is Sephiroth not from the future? His one-winged form from Advent Children Complete was shown in the final boss fight, the boss map looks eerily similar to Edge, and we saw multiple Sephiroths throughout the story. The game is heavily implying that Sephiroth is from the future and he wants to try to achieve victory a second time.

Well, for starters, First Class SOLDIERs having wings has been a thing for a while. Sephiroth was not the only SOLDIER to have a wing. As Final Fantasy 7: Crisis Core showed us, Sephiroth’s comrades, Angeal and Genesis, were able to grow wings at will. They had different cells (G cells) which gave them a different ability, make copies of themselves, rather than control others who share their cells, sure, but that is NOT stopping any of them from growing wings at will. It’s something used across the board for all three of these really powerful SOLDIERs and it’s no surprise that this time around, they want to show Sephiroth using more of his abilities throughout the game.

Also, Sephiroth having one wing is nothing new. It’s part of his Safer form and is named on his track, One-Winged Angel. So, as an homage, they wanted the villain of the game to use a wing during his fight in Advent Children.

There’s also another way we can explain this. Sephiroth formed a body of his image in Advent Children thanks to Kadaj. And what purpose does Kadaj serve? He’s a strengthened remnant embodying Sephiroth’s cruelty. In other words, he’s another puppet Sephiroth can manipulate. And he uses Kadaj’s body + Jenova’s head to form his image. A clone and Jenova cells, or just straight up Jenova, allow him to shapeshift as that’s one of Jenova’s trademark abilities. So using this as an implication of time travel doesn’t add up.

When it comes to Sephiroth’s 70 alternative accounts, each of them have a straightforward explanation, including the one that confuses most people. Here we go, according to the FF7R Ultimania:

An illusion only Cloud can see:

Cloud has S cells injected into him. The same S cells are also Jenova cells. Jenova cells allow hosts to read the memories of those nearby, inherit the memories of other hosts, and give Sephiroth shapeshifting and puppeting abilities on those who have S cells. This is how Cloud created his SOLDIER facade thanks to Zack’s injection, similar memories and instinct to hide from the truth. What’s likely going on here is Sephiroth is able to make Cloud hallucinate thanks to said S cells, hence why it’s an illusion ONLY Cloud can see. We saw this during the Nibelheim flashback, meeting Aerith for the first time, after the Sector 7 Plate collapse when he was behind Tifa. This is another way of showing Sephiroth’s omnipresent power.

Also, if we're going to get really specific about the properties of Jenova cells, we can look at a source like FF7 Ultimania Omega:

Jenova's mimic ability Jenova has a mimic ability which allows it to read the memories and feelings of others, then adjust its appearance, speech and behaviour accordingly to imitate what it has seen. Jenova once used this ability to get close to the Ancients and infect them with its virus, which killed many of them.

This ability is not limited solely to Jenova itself, for those who have its cells within them passes it as well, though in an incomplete form. Immediately prior to the start of the game, when Cloud's mind was shattered, he ran into Tifa and seemed to immediately return to "normal"; this was because of the mimic abilities of the Jenova cells inside Cloud read her mind, seeing her memories of him, which were then combined with his own ideal vision of himself, fashioning a new personality for himself.

And there you go. Jenova's signature abilities are shapeshifting and illusion. It's mentioned in her backstory, It's shown in her boss battles, it's shown in Jenova-infected hosts, and it's even shown in her OST! The illusion aspect being something only Cloud can see makes sense, thanks to his Jenova S cells, so the developers are expanding this ability.

Black Robed Man:

Simple. These are Sephiroth Clones, also known as Remnants. Each of these puppets have S Jenova cells injected into them, which is what allows Sephiroth to create illusionary projections of himself via their bodies. They can also create an illusion of Jenova’s Lovecraftian forms. If predictions are correct, there’s a chance that a couple of them could end up becoming the Advent Children (more on that later).

Flashback:

Also simple. This connects to what was mentioned in Cloud’s illusion. Cloud knows events he should not thanks to his Jenova S cells, and flashbacks like, “Within my veins flows the blood of Ancients. This Planet is my birthright!” are events that will be featured later in the game in moments like the Kalm flashback. Moving on!

Unknown:

This is where people get confused. But believe me, the answer is MUCH simpler than most people realize. The Unknown Sephiroth is the last form of Sephiroth that we fought in Final Fantasy 7. Yes, the shirtless one. From here forward I'll call him SOLDIER Sephiroth. For reasons I do not know, they decided not to make him shirtless this time around (too sexy by far?) but believe me when I say that that Sephiroth is the same one we saw at the Edge of Creation. How am I so sure of this? Look back at how Cloud met that Sephiroth in Remake and compare it to what happened in the Crater. They have the same tunnel of light and Cloud’s visiting a persona of Sephiroth that exists in a dimension unaffected by time and space. The Lifestream gives Sephiroth the opportunity to pull Cloud's conscious mind into this dimension. Cloud being in the Singularity during the final battle of FF7R Part 1, and the Singularity containing Lifestream = ability to take Cloud to meet SOLDIER Sephiroth in a pocket dimension, the Edge of Creation. In OG, being exposed/near the Lifestream in the Crater allowed Cloud to visit Shirtless SOLDIER Sephiroth in another dimension and finish him off, with Aerith helping Cloud return his consciousness to the real world.

See?! It actually makes a lot of sense, only this time Sephiroth hasn’t been stripped of his God powers and is currently siphoning the Lifestream. So this time around, Cloud couldn’t beat down Sephiroth. The reason the FF7 Remake Ultimania labels this Sephiroth as unknown is because it’s following a narrative where it assumes you do not know everything yet. Final Fantasy 7 Remake has only covered Midgar, and there’s still many places and moments we have yet to explore. But the Ultimania is not going to cover them until they are published in the next installments, and why would it tell us unrevealed "secrets" of the story? So for now, it has to act as if this is a mystery. This is the same case with Zack being labeled as “Missing in Action” rather than dead in the Ultimania, because we have not reached that moment in the plot yet. But I’ll cover that a bit more on one of the next questions.

As for Sephiroth being prophetic in the Edge of Creation, it’s simply foreshadowing what we’ll eventually have to face. “That which lies ahead… does not yet exist” is telling us that the final battle still has years before it’s ready to be unleashed. As for the Nebula, “Our world will become a part of it… one day,” this is a more vague statement of what I quoted earlier:

“By merging with all the energy of the Planet, I will become a new life form, a new existence. Melding with the Planet… I will cease to exist as I am now. Only to be reborn as a god to rule over every soul.” The Nebula that Sephiroth is staring at is stated in the FF7R Ultimania to represent Sephiroth’s wing(s). This same Nebula also has a similar shape to the original sketch of Safer Sephiroth. So, based on what SOLDIER Sephiroth told Cloud, we can conclude that Safer Sephiroth will one day be born and be the last fight for our team, maybe even taking place in the Edge of Creation. BUT it’s not quite time for that to happen yet, as Safer Sephiroth's physical body is still resting in a crystal at the Northern Crater. So there you have it!

Lastly, conceding the battlefield against Sephiroth, it is an homage to Advent Children and Edge, yes. That does not automatically mean that Sephiroth is from the future. We just fought arbiters of destiny who turned themselves into depictions of the three Advent Children. This is ultimately the developers' way of ending the game with an exciting boss battle and a somewhat familiar scene. It's just a manifestation of one of Gaia's locations while in the Singularity. Also, this whole boss battle was ultimately a fanservice-esque decision by the developers, particularly Co-Director Naoki Yamaguchi. They originally did not plan to have this boss battle in the first place, but they wanted to end this game on some kind of high note with the main antagonist. They could've ended the game with the Arbiter boss battle, and I think doing so would have confused less people, but the reason behind the Sephiroth boss battle has been spoken. We can conclude this: it was a Jenova/Remnant copy of Sephiroth using expanded abilities like his wing and absorbed some of the Whispers' power before this Sephiroth was defeated by the team and the Whispers were released from his grasp. There is no need to overthink this decision (but yes, I don't think it was entirely necessary).

But what about the Arbiters manifesting into images of Kadaj, Loz, and Yazoo? Whisper Rubrum, Viridi, Croceo, and Bahamut SHIN are all representations of Advent Children’s antagonists and their bio says they are from a “future timeline.” Isn’t this proof that there’s time travel and alternate timelines going on?

Well, you are right about the enemy intel bio in Final Fantasy 7 Remake stating that these guys are manifestations of figures from a future timeline. BUT that does not imply that multiple timelines are forming. Technically speaking, we all live in one timeline that follows through a singularity. This is the same case for Final Fantasy 7, and the very place we are fighting these Whispers is called the Singularity. The reason the Whispers are forming into these creatures is because of their future knowledge. This is their way of shapeshifting into powerful foes that can defend themselves against the team. They are turning into foes that destiny will one day birth, but in the form of something akin to a Weapon just like the main Arbiter itself, and this is also the developers way of adding a homage and possibly a hint of the foes that will appear in the future. They are NOT the Advent Children themselves, otherwise there would probably show more personality, and they would also… look more like them. So what happened with “time” after defeating these Advent Whispers and the Arbiter Weapon? Well, it sharpened the curves of the river and put destiny on a new course, but to the same destination, hence the “set beginning and end” that the developers mentioned before. In the river’s new course, we’ll get new events that while still having original events that will all be more fleshed out. In part of this new course of destiny maybe there’s a chance that we will see the Advent Children themselves. How can I be sure of this? After speaking to a friend about it, the remnants we encountered give us a hint. Marco, #49, resides in Sector 7. Who was a teenager that resided in Sector 7 before becoming a remnant and then Advent Child? Kadaj, also known as the manifestation of Sephiroth's cruelty. Meanwhile, we have #2 in Sector 5, who shows strong features fitting for someone in SOLDIER. Who fits this category? Loz, also known as the manifestation of Sephiroth's strength. People have theorized that #2 is Zack, but I do not agree and will address that later. The only remnant candidate we have left is Yazoo, the manifestation of Sephiroth's allure. This makes sense as he’s the most silent of the trio, so the developers will keep his remnant in mystery for now. But there you have it. By Nomura stating, "Come back to me a few years later and ask me what remake means," what I believe he means by "remake" is write the original story of Final Fantasy 7 with characters in other parts of the compilation included. Hence, a shuffled story with the same necessary outcomes.

Okay, but didn’t the developers say that Final Fantasy 7 Remake is not canon to the Compilation, thereby making it a different story from the Compilation and proving the developers are ditching the original story in the process?

Let me tell you right now: if those lines were what they actually said in full context, then they were lying. How am I sure? Because throughout FF7R, parts of what happened in the Compilation are included in the story. Zack’s Last Stand was featured in a flashback; Hollow’s lyrics greatly parallel the lyrical version of Price of Freedom; one of Cloud’s old Shinra Military comrades was featured and mentioned Kunsel, from Crisis Core; and of course the big Arbiters being manifestations of the Advent Children.

For saying the Compilation is being ditched and is the bad ending, why include characters and homages specifically from the Compilation? If they really were, they wouldn’t put pieces of it into the story like this. All that was stated by Director Tetsuya Nomura was that FF7 Remake is not canon to the Compilation YET. Keyword YET. The story is incomplete and the developers need to see Remake through from start to finish before they can say it’s truly canon to the Compilation. And what have Scenario Writer Kazushige Nojima and Producer Yoshinori Kitase said about the story?

Does this sound like they’re ditching the Compilation to you? I think this should sum up how they are tying the series of Final Fantasy 7 into one big package, but there are some people saying that the team seeing Advent Children and the Planet 500 years later, followed by Red XIII saying it’s “a glimpse of tomorrow if we fail here today” as proof that what happens in the future is a bad ending. This is not entirely true. It makes sense for humanity to be gone 500 years later with the Planet living on because that was the life that the team was trying to save in the first place. What Red XIII told us was simple: that if Destiny wins, then the river of Destiny will run the same course, and that includes the events of On The Way To a Smile, Advent Children, Dirge of Cerberus, and of course humanity being gone 500 years later. This is another case of the team receiving future visions without context, as I addressed before. They saw an event where they maybe saw people they knew, but do they know what leads to it? No. So what they assume about the outcome of the future and what’s good and bad may not necessarily be correct. They will find that out as the next parts of Final Fantasy 7 Remake are released.

Okay, but aren’t the characters free to do whatever they want now that they have beaten Destiny? As Aerith said, they have boundless, terrifying freedom.

They have freedom from the Whispers, and like Zack once said, “The price of freedom is steep.” They can begin their journey without the worry of the Whispers acting up if they do something that strays far away from what’s necessary. That doesn’t mean that they are not going to head to all the destinations we needed to reach in the original game. We will still probably have the flashback at Kalm since it’s the nearest town away from Midgar. We still need to pass through the Mythril Mines to get to other destinations. We still need to pass through Corel, Barret’s hometown, to get to the Gold Saucer where we will meet Cait Sith and reach Barret’s character climax. We still need to reach Gongaga and this will likely be a required place to visit because of how much more importance Zack is given in Remake. There’s also no working reactor in Gongaga so there’s a chance that yellow reunion flowers will grow as foliage. We still need to head to Cosmo Canyon, where Bugenhagen will teach us more about the Lifestream and where Red XIII will learn the truth about what happened to his father Seto. We still need to head to Nibelheim where a lot of confusion is going to rise within our team--specifically Cloud and Tifa--and also where we need to release Vincent from the Shinra Mansion. We still need to cross Mt. Nibel (we might get a flashback from Cloud) and head to Rocket Town to meet Cid and drink some goddamn tea. We still need to head to the Temple of the Ancients for the team to find out what needs to be done to save the Planet, and also the place where Sephiroth will manipulate Cloud and the team into giving him the Black Materia. We still need Aerith to head to the Forgotten City as it’s the only place she can use her prayer to activate the White Materia and summon Holy. We still need to head to the Northern Crater as that’s where Cloud will likely have his downfall and submit to Sephiroth….

We could keep going on with this, but I’m sure you see my point. New things will happen but there are important locations that the team needs to reach in order to come closer to their goal of stopping Sephiroth. The simple thing is that, from here on out, the Whispers will not intervene, giving us the illusion that things will change, but we most likely will learn the hard way that the necessary outcomes will still happen. So once again, the river is on a new course to the same destination.

Okay. You’ve talked about Sephiroth not being from the future, but what about Aerith? Her prayer stance in the opening cinematic looks eerily similar to her stance in the ending of Final Fantasy 7. Based on this, is she from the future/did she see the outcome of the Meteor-Lifestream-Holy Conflict?

No. What probably happened was the developers paid homage to that ending screen. What follows immediately after that is Aerith picking up a crushed reunion flower, symbolizing the non-reunion that Aerith and Zack could not receive in life, but eventually receive in the Lifestream. And once again: Aerith has received visions of the future, but without context as to why and how they happened. In a novella it’s mentioned that Aerith received a vision as a child and drew her mural of symbolism in her room as a result. We know she’s been receiving non-contextual visions for awhile, but being forced into a big responsibility by the Planet is something she needs to learn to accept, and that’s part of her character arc we will receive in the next parts of FInal Fantasy 7 Remake. There is no evidence she can time travel, and she doesn’t always know the Whispers’ intentions. When the team asked her what they were doing while surrounding the Shinra HQ Tower, she simply replied, “Who knows?”. She’s not omniscient. She has some meta knowledge and a big responsibility, but does not know how to handle this role yet. And that's where character development comes in for our Maiden of the Planet.

Cool, but why are people like Rufus and Hojo able to see the Whispers in the first place? And maybe Zack, too?

Actually, there’s a pretty straightforward explanation for this. As we know, to be able to see the Whispers, once again you have to either be heavily connected to the Planet or touched by a special person. Aerith spent a portion of her childhood in the Shinra HQ Tower. Who else was there with her? Her biological mother Ifalna. These two are both Cetra, one half and one full-blooded. Hojo likely spent hours upon hours with both of them, especially Ifalna, so receiving contact from them is not farfetched. Also, that gross f***** of a scientist does unfortunately play an important role in the plot and keeping the flow of destiny on course. As for Rufus? This man was a teenager when Aerith and Ifalna were living in Shinra HQ. It’s very possible that he ran into one of the two cetra and maybe received contact from them. If he didn’t? Don’t forget, this man is the president of Shinra throughout almost all of FF7. Even if the team opposes him, they still need him. He is very necessary to destroy the barrier that blocks the team from getting into the Northern Crater. Without his actions, the team cannot make it to Sephiroth. It’s that simple. And even though he can see the Whispers, how much does it matter? It’s only going to matter if the Whispers make a resurgence sometime in the plot. There you have it.

Okay, but why is Zack alive after his Last Stand? And why were the Whispers present during this? Also, what about the Stamp bag? Isn’t this proof of time travel and alternate timelines?

And here’s where the red herring comes in! He did beat the Shinra Army. And yes, the Whispers were present. BUT why were they present? Remember what was mentioned earlier? The Whispers are dead souls returning to the Planet, and if that’s the case they have been part of the Planet for a LONG time. This means that they were ALWAYS present through the course of events in the Planet. The reason we see them during Zack’s Last Stand is likely to throw one off at first, until they connect the dots with how old the Whispers actually are. And they are showing themselves in the Last Stand because this is an extremely important event that has to happen for Cloud’s next journey to begin. We didn’t quite get to see how the Whispers changed up the event, but they likely did form it in a way where the developers wanted to trick us. It's also left ambiguous if he can see the Whispers or not, although they do not seem to alarm him IF he can see them.

Now, about the Last Stand, If you compare Remake’s Last Stand to Crisis Core and Final Fantasy 7 OG, you’ll notice that Remake’s moment has similarities to the OG scene.

Zack walks, drops Cloud in a safe place, and defends himself against the soldiers in all three. So here's where the cutscenes get different:

FF7 OG: Zack fights against Shinra infantrymen. We don't see the troops, but Zack thinks he defeated them. Afterwards he heads to Cloud but immediately gets shot by a group of Shinra troops, and I mean shot. Afterwards, there is no dialogue between Zack and Cloud, Cloud grabs the Buster Sword and starts breaking down in the rain. Thus, his journey--nearly--begins.

FF7 Crisis Core: Zack confronts the Shinra army. He begins his monologue:

Boy oh boy... The price of freedom is steep. Embrace your dreams, and whatever happens... Protect your honor, as a SOLDIER!

We then proceed to battle the Shinra army. Eventually, the screen fades to black and we see Zack mortally wounded. The same group of Shinra troops from OG come over and bullet Zack to death. Eventually, Cloud wakes up in shock, and Zack parts Cloud his sword and last words:

For the both of us... You're gonna... Live. You'll be... My living legacy. My honor, my dreams... They're yours now.

Cloud then proceeds with a breakdown, and afterwards begins his journey, where he'll bump into a certain someone while in Mako comatose. Sheesh I hate watching that scene due to its deadly side effect.

Where does Remake stop?

Right in the area where Zack’s grave is, a cliff with a steep descent to flat land. It’s the same spot where Zack got shot by a Shinra infantryman who pursued Zack throughout his running away from Shinra Mansion; it's the same spot where Cloud placed the Buster Sword to honor his close friend’s wish; and the same spot where Zack declared, “For the both of us… you’re going to live. You’ll be… my living legacy.” The developers intentionally stopped us from seeing the outcome of that moment because it’ll either be the same place where Zack will die, or we’ll see his fate get delayed and placed somewhere else.

I have also seen people argue that #2 is Zack, or if not Zack, then Zack’s corpse.

This is false.

Remember why Zack was placed in a cryosleep tube in the first place? Because, like Cloud, he was considered a failed experiment by Hojo because the S cells could not turn him into a Sephiroth clone. Zack becoming a Sephiroth clone would be a major retcon to the story and how he was able to escape with Cloud in the first place. Zack becoming a clone would mean that he was never a failed experiment. And what would happen if he wasn’t a failed experiment? Cloud wouldn’t be able to escape and FF7 wouldn’t have happened. Could Hojo have picked up Zack’s dead body after his death? Maybe, but is there evidence that his corpse would still become a clone? That’s extremely unlikely in my personal opinion. We would have to assume that Hojo did another clone experiment this time around and the Shinra troops decided to take his body with them when they had no good motive or order to do so anyway. Their orders were likely “shoot to kill” and that’s it. We don’t need Zack’s corpse to be remade into a clone, and we certainly don’t need him to be a clone if Sephiroth wants to do something like create an illusionary projection of Zack. Remember what happened in the Northern Crater? Sephiroth used Jenova to create an illusion of Tifa in order to trick the Black Materia holder into “helping” the team.

Lastly, that bag of Stamp's Champs, Original Flavor.

It’s interesting, isn't it? And Nomura told us to pay close attention to both stamps. This is probably the biggest case of an alternate timeline being real, but after thinking about it for a while, I argue that it's not proving an alternate timeline exists, but rather it's being shown to give focus to two different heroes. And how does this work in the FF7 world? Well, Shinra probably has simple rebranding of Stamp on a Shinra product. It’s not uncommon for corporations to rebrand their products into a different name (just look up Lay’s Potato Chips and you’ll come across Walkers, as shown in my poorly collaged photo). BUT there's another example to talk about, as a friend mentioned. Stamp's Champs are the "original" flavor. This original flavor and Terrier is being used to represent Zack in FF7, as he was once called a "puppy" by his mentors in FF7 Crisis Core. Now, that bag is calling to the original hero, who was Zack (could also be an homage to how Zack's design was originally assigned a "different" role in FF7 OG) up until he passed his dreams on to Cloud. So what this means is both Stamps are used for wither a different flavor or got rebranded after a certain amount of time passed, or the Stamp brand has the same flavor is different depending on the location in Gaia. Now for the second functionality for Stamp: It's being used as a red herring to mislead the players deeper in to the mouse trap. Remember Stamp’s original function in the context of Shinra? It served as a propaganda device for Shinral to promote its use of warfare for wealth to mislead the public into thinking Shinra’s deeds were for progress and beneficial for the Planet. It’s very possible that the developers are using Terrier Stamp as a propaganda device to trick the face-value players into thinking everything’s going to be different for the story until we're shown otherwise. And if it actually is an alternate timeline? It will not affect our team. As established previously, there is no time travel that our team is capable of, and the Whispers act on a fixed flow under the Will of the Planet and are almost omnipresent, so they must correct the course of destiny in the present and as quickly as possible. That alternate timeline would probably just be used to show us that no matter what we do, what’s set in stone needs to be kept in stone. So, don’t get your hopes up that Zack is going to survive, especially since he already passed on the Buster Sword to Cloud in the present "timeline" that we're playing.

But why is there a different Seventh Heaven sign shown during the ending sequence? Isn’t this proof of an alternate timeline?

Careful now. There’s a big possibility that what was shown during that shuffled sequence of events was the original Seventh Heaven bar. That’s right, there was a Seventh Heaven before Tifa’s in Sector 7. How do I know this? It’s a sidequest in Final Fantasy 7: Crisis Core. Zack met an unnamed carpenter in the Sector 7 slums and helped name the bar. The canon answer in the narrative is to choose the name Seventh Heaven. So what’s likely happening here is 1) we saw a past event of the first Seventh Heaven bar being worked on, as the folks of the slums are building their homes together; 2) we are seeing the folks rebuild the Sector 7 slums, and perhaps to honor what was once there, the folks are building another bar and making sure to keep the original name Seventh Heaven, or 3) pretty much what I said before and it’s happening in an alternate timeline. Regardless, there’s a good chance that Crisis Core is being referenced here. And if it isn’t and it’s different events happening in an alternate timeline? Once again, our friends can’t go to that alternate timeline because time travel is not a power they have. So, it doesn’t really affect the main beats of our journey. What may happen, though, is our team will visit the Sector 7 slums later down the line, and they’ll have a reunion with a rebuilt home before settling the score with Shinra and Sephiroth. Until we see it, though, that’s just headcanon.

But why is Biggs alive? Aren’t Wedge and Jessie alive, too?

Biggs is shown to be alive, yes, but at what point of time and for how long? Also, even though he is shown to be alive, how is that going to drastically alter the story for our friends? He may stick around and have a minor role later, but he could very well die again depending on where the Destiny River is heading, and there’s likely very little he can do to somehow drastically change the story. Is he going to suddenly appear and sacrifice himself to make sure Aerith survives? Highly doubt it. See what I mean? Even if someone like him is left alive, he’ll either receive the same fate in a different way or just get a role that won’t change much of the main story. So, are Wedge and Jessie alive? Wedge, absolutely not. He was pushed down Shinra HQ Tower and there is no way he was able to survive a fall that high. There is no evidence that he “survived” after that fall as well. As for Jessie, we saw her gloves and headband on a dresser next to Biggs, but that’s it. Why would they place those next to him and not next to Jessie if she’s still alive and being taken care of? She was high atop the Sector 7 tower and it’s very unlikely anyone besides our team was able to run up and grab her on time. She was also in a worse state than Biggs and probably got crushed by the tower collapsing. In other words, she got crushed twice. Once when she set off her bomb and Cloud and Tifa bump into her; the second, when the plate dropped. What the glove and headband are, are likely nothing more than the remains of a friend who couldn’t make it. There may have been time for someone to pick up Biggs and that’s how he ended up in a bed, covered in bandages. As for more proof he’s the only one who survived? Wedge had 3 cats he held. Out of the three, only one named Biggums survived. The other 2 missing, I believe, are symbolism for the fate of the AVALANCHE trio. There you have it, three charming but minor characters who had written character arcs that got fleshed out in Remake, but don’t serve an extremely important purpose to the main plot points of the game (no offense to the trio, I do like Mr. Not-Charlie-Sheen and I wonder what they will do when the inevitable happens).

This is cool and all, but what about Sephiroth's line? "Seven Seconds till the end. Time enough for you, perhaps. But what will you do with it? Let's see." Also, this Sephiroth used more informal phrasing in the Japanese acript, such as "ore." He seems to be aware of what the future holds, too. So what do you make of this?

Ah yes, this moment, also one of the first pieces of script the writers thought of:

Well friend, I actually covered this topic before:

Seven Seconds Before the End: Theory vs. Context

While that post was made to debunk a theory, I believe what I wrote in it can easily be taken into the context of this post. That's one thing people constantly overlook about this line: it already has a given context. What do I mean by that? Check out the story log here:

In the world beyond, Sephiroth shows Cloud a vision of the planet seven seconds before its demise. Having strayed from the course destiny set for them, they strike out on a path toward an unknown future.

This is what Sephiroth was referring to: the end of the Planet. Unfortunately people are taking this line WAY out of context and using it to write theories that stray far away from the line's meaning in the first place. It's part of what Sephiroth is after, and it's part of what Cloud is fighting against. The team fought against the Arbiters of Fate because they believe what they saw was the end of everything for them without seeing the long-term outcome, while Sephiroth lured the team to fight against the Arbiters of Fate because he may have seen his failure, and believes that with the physical manifestation of the Whispers gone, he can continue his plan without any chance of failure. A part of the future, no matter what seems to happen, will involve making a decision seven seconds before the Planet's demise. What will cause the Planet's demise? Meteor. That is the main calamity we are trying to stop after defeating Sephiroth, and we need to defeat Safer Sephiroth and SOLDIER Sephiroth to make sure his will cannot block Holy from being summoned, as well as prevent Aerith from calling forth the Lifestream. So once again, this is from Sephiroth's rough understanding of the future, and it's a meta message for the players of what the ending of Remake might entail. It is NOT Sephiroth from the future suddenly sending his body/consciousness into the past in a really odd moment to give Cloud a warning.

Even with all this, the ending of Final Fantasy 7 Remake stated, "The Unknown Journey will continue." What do you have to say about this?

Yes, there is an unknown journey. This is a journey with new content to tie the rest of the Compilation together, like a possible story shuffle mentioned earlier. There's bound to be new and revised scenes in between the set beginning and end, hence "the unknown journey." I talked about this before, but for the developers to put something like "The same journeys from 2 decades ago will continue" is counter-intuitive to what they just showed us in the ending and would mess with all the anticipation for what's to come next. We have to think about this in a different perspective, and not the perspective of "oh, nothing is going to change." The developers need to keep people excited, and part of keeping that excitement is marketing a tease. It's pretty much how marketing works, too. A marketing scheme that only tells the literal facts without trying to juggle the consumer's emotions isn't going to interest the consumer that much compared to the marketing scheme that teases at the possibilities. As for the reason Yoshinori Kitase will then say that the team is continuing FF7R as FF7 has? He's in a different mindset during interviews like that. The game Final Fantasy 7 Remake is telling us things like a book, ending the events with a To Be Continued cliffhanger. Meanwhile, Kitase can state that FF7R will continue as FF7 because that's technically a vague statement. We know we'll get key locations and scenes, but we don't know how they'll get fleshed out. And we sure as heck don't know about any new scenes and how those are going to be executed in the next installments. In other words, think of a classic sandwich with a hipster rendition. The set beginning and end are the top and bottom buns, the protein is almost the same, maybe a couple spices added in there; and the unknown is all the new toppings added in your hipster-style classic sandwich. I know this is a strange analogy, but hopefully it gets the point across. So don't worry too much; Nojima, Nomura, and Kitase haven't shown us the new condiments yet!

Conclusion

If you're still here after reading through my wall of jargon, thank you! After all that I've written, I hope I was able to accomplish my goal: to ease your worries about the developers' plans with the story. And I hoped to do this by giving an in-universe explanation as to why certain things are happening. There is context to the Whispers' powers, and with the Whisper following a continuous flow of destiny, pieces of the future and past are scattered in that river. Sephiroth's been basking in this river for years now, so he got similar exposure as Aerith did and now has rough knowledge of what's to come. I think people who are clinging to time travel theories are taking the Whispers' powers out of context. We saw vague bits of the future; Aerith did, Sephiroth did, we did, and do you know who else? Cloud, Tifa, Barret, and Red XIII. Heavy exposure to the Whispers gives visions as a side effect. They're not travelling through time from the future to fix things when they've always existed as dead souls who returned to the Planet; they're continuously moving around Gaia and watching folks--especially key players in saving the Planet. The flow of a river doesn't stop, it keeps moving through its closed course. Maybe it can change its course in a slightly different direction, or get shafted into sharper curves to delay the flow, but it will still head to its final destination no matter what. While we are in the current of this new course, we'll stumble upon some untouched terrain before we get to the set ending.

However, even if we know about the inevitable, that isn't going to stop us from feeling intense pain for our heroes.

Thus the journey continues.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm gonna go sit my ass down and drink some god-damn tea.

Special Thanks

@otp-oasis-heavenxearth (Also known as @magicalchemist)

For taking the time to read my rough draft and pointing out the goofs, bringing in your theory ideas, as well as helping me solidify my confidence in Final Fantasy 7 Remake's future. Seriously, if you haven't, check out her blog. She's incredibly knowledgeable when it comes to FF7 and looks through every different perspective while sticking to the facts. In other words, straight up awesome!

@silver-wield

For allowing me to cite your post, as well as being the first person that made me faithful the developers are staying true to their word with their direction of FF7R. Seriously, thanks! If you haven't, check out her blog. Her attention to detail is incredible!

28 notes · View notes

scullysflannel · 4 years

Note

Your XF analysis is always thought provoking and forces me to consider things I might have missed. In that vein, tell me some of your favorite underrated moments from the show and why they're important to you.

Oh, love this! Let’s go.

season 1: At the risk of endorsing some very catchphrase-y writing, I really like the underlying idea behind the exchange “You’re entitled to the truth”/ “I can’t afford the truth” in “Fallen Angel.” It gets at something The X-Files understands better in season 1 than it does in any other season, which is that Mulder and Scully are in a position of privilege. Not everyone can fight for these big undefined ideals. If this woman speaks up against the military, she’ll lose her husband’s pension. I like that the early episodes in particular are so aware of the power imbalance that exists not only between the government and the people Mulder and Scully are fighting for, but also between Mulder and Scully and the people they’re fighting for. Everyone in season 1 is always clamming up for their own good, and the show respects that. I also like that in early season 1 in particular, Scully is practical in a way that makes her the voice of those people. Mulder is all about the big ideals, but Scully is focused on the problem at hand. It’s an interesting dynamic that the show mostly loses after that until Doggett (poster child for staying focused on the problem at hand) shows up. When we talk about how Mulder changes Scully, we always focus on how he opens her up to belief, but the first and quickest way he changes her is by making her think big about the truth.

season 2: I’ve already written about both of these, but "To know that you're all right” in “Little Green Men” is so vulnerable and romantic in a noir kind of way. I love Scully telling Mulder he’s worth it as a friend. And Scully opening the Great Unknown exhibit in “Humbug” and triggering an exit door sums up the romance of the whole show. The puzzle box will always be unsatisfying, but the outside world is what’s worth wondering at.

season 3: Mulder and Scully and Skinner in that off-the-map diner in “Paper Clip.” First of all, that scene has unparalleled “agents on the run from the law” vibes, which should have been at least half the show, and it’s important that Skinner makes clear where his loyalties lie (they should have trusted him flat out after that). But the thing I love most about that scene is Mulder letting Scully choose what to do with the tape. It’s one of the few times the show feels like it’s actually building on what Mulder learned in “One Breath,” because he isn’t just putting aside his big ideals for the sake of someone he cares about; he’s putting them aside for the sake of someone Scully cares about. That’s growth! The fact that he gives Scully complete control in that moment, because she has the most on the line, is selfless of him, and it shows a lot of respect for her. It’s nice that Mulder can see Samantha in someone else’s sister in a productive way—in a way that makes him realize he’s not the center of this story.

season 4: I love Mulder asking Scully in “Small Potatoes” who she’d be if she could be someone else for a day and Scully saying “Hopefully myself.” It’s not a lack of imagination; it’s that she knows there’s absolutely nothing bigger to imagine than being fully who she is. She’s dying, and what she wants is to make the most of the life she already has. And then I love Mulder’s response because it’s cute when he’s fake deep and real deep at once: “Ultimately, maybe it's other people's reactions to us that make us who we are.” On a sort of meta, capital-P Platonic level, this gets at the idea that the capital-T Truth is always going to be unknowable, and that the truth that matters is interpersonal. We experience ourselves through other people. While Scully is trying to be more honestly herself, Mulder is considering how he’s been redefined by Scully.

season 5: The way Scully says "Mulder?" after he almost shoots her in “Kitsunegari” is so little and desperate.

season 6: “Tithonus” in general does not get enough appreciation, but especially Scully’s long conversation with Fellig in his apartment. “Love lasts 75 years if you’re lucky. You don’t want to be around when it’s gone” is HAUNTING. Usually the way The X-Files wonders at the world feels so endless (“How can you have too much life? There’s too much to learn, to experience”), and I think the way “Tithonus” pushes back against that is really interesting and sad without betraying the show’s optimism at all. It’s just another angle on it. It makes death the great unknown.

season 7: Mulder flirt-whispering “There’s one detail that does” in “Theef” is obscene.

season 8: Season 8 Scully in general is underrated; she’d rather become Mulder than lose his voice in her ear, and it exposes how much she’d already opened up to belief but didn’t want to admit it, because she and Mulder couldn’t let go of that little dance they do. She also knows that thinking like Mulder is the best way to get him back. But it’s still a strain on her. For the sake of narrowing it down a moment, I like that Doggett correctly points out in “Patience” that Scully is trying too hard to be Mulder and then builds her up by telling her she’s doing good cop work. He’s a good egg.

I know there are more seasons, but I think we rated all those moments pretty accurately.

#thanks ismat!!!!#sorry this took a while #txf #perplexistan #xf thoughts

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murasaki-murasame · 4 years

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Thoughts on Higurashi Gou Ep11

*Rika voice* we poppin’ the BIGGEST bottles next week when we successfully tear apart fate and reclaim our happy ending! :)

Anyway, thoughts under the cut.

I think we can all agree that there’s no way in hell this is going to go as smoothly as this episode wants us to think it will, when we still have 13 episodes left to go before this all ends, lol.

Obviously this won’t play out exactly the same as Minagoroshi, but even Minagoroshi ended with everyone getting brutally murdered because they didn’t actually manage to achieve the proper win condition, so going into this type of scenario was never really a good sign anyway.

And yeah on that note, this episode takes a hard swerve into full on Minagoroshi mode, which I figured might happen, but not in such a 1:1 way. But the fact that it’s suddenly lining up so much with that arc just makes me even more suspicious that we’re being given a false sense of hope.

Obviously the bottom line is that one way or another, this isn’t Minagoroshi, it’s Tataridamashi, and the overall situation is distinctly different. Like how Ooishi is on bad terms with Keiichi this time around, unlike in Minagoroshi, so they’re probably going to have a much harder time getting the large-scale protesting done if he decides not to help them. Which might also lead to the Sonozaki family refusing to help them either.

I also get the feeling that even if Keiichi has been successfully convinced by his dream to not murder Teppei, it still feels like both Rena and Shion are on the brink of going off the deep end, and if their attempts to handle the situation via peaceful protesting gets shut down by the cops this time, that might push them over the edge.

And even though I have mixed feelings about the ‘Satoko culprit theory’, I’m becoming increasingly convinced that the big twist of this arc will be that Teppei already got murdered off-screen by Satoko before anyone else could get to him, and she’s been lying about it.

Specifically I don’t like the idea of her being some kind of villain who’s intentionally and maliciously lying about being abused to get away with murder, but I think it’d make a lot of sense if we find out that Satoko did something like accidentally overdose Teppei with his medication, or push him down a flight of stairs in an abrupt fit of her syndrome, and then afterward she might enter the stage we saw in Tatarigoroshi where she straight up hallucinates that he’s still alive. So even if he’s dead, she might not be intentionally lying about it.

I can at least imagine a scenario where the gang [or at least part of the gang] gets fed up once and for all and breaks into Teppei’s house to murder him, but they find his corpse instead. And in a Tatarigoroshi type of way, maybe Satoko will see them and assume that they’re the ones that killed him, and everything will go to shit.

Then there’s also the whole separate question of what’s going on with Takano and Tomitake, and the statue in the Saiguden, and so on. We should at least get some more clues about that stuff before the question arcs end.

This episode is also making me even more confused about how much Rika actually knows about what’s going on, and what arcs she actually remembers. She seems to directly quote Keiichi from Minagoroshi in this episode [I think], but even in the VN they stated that she completely forgot what happened in that arc, and Hanyuu had to tell her about it later.

But her being more active in this episode and thinking that they actually have a shot at winning this is kinda just making it even more strange that she hasn’t said or done anything about the Takano situation. Especially since the entire deal with Minagoroshi in the first place was that they assumed dealing with Teppei in a timeline where neither Rena or Shion go L5 was enough to get a happy ending, but then Takano came around and killed everyone. So the fact that she seems to have basically the exact same mentality she had in Minagoroshi after Keiichi convinced her she could change fate makes it feel like she’s in the exact same position of thinking that Takano isn’t important.

And then there’s the fact that in ep2 she talks about ‘knowing who kills Furude Rika’ and how they all achieved their happy ending, so really there’s just a lot of conflicting information going on here, lol. I honestly can’t tell if it’s intentional, or if it’s literally just weird writing and Rika is acting ‘out of character’ because having her immediately reveal the Takano situation would spoil new fans.

I can’t exactly deny that it might just be a weird writing issue that we shouldn’t think much about, but I think it’s more interesting to try and think about what it could mean if this apparent contradiction in Rika’s level of knowledge and her actions in Gou thus far is actually intentional and meaningful.

I haven’t entirely ironed out my theory about this yet, but my current idea is that the whole meta-structure of Gou is that it’s basically a series of fictional stories created by Rika and Featherine together after the events of Matsuribayashi, and the Rika we see in Gou is effectively just a fictional character in this story who doesn’t actually align fully with Rika from the VN.

Specifically I think that Gou’s whole story is basically written from the premise of being a what-if fanfiction of sorts, where the Rika we see in Gou is more or less based on Rika’s character as of the end of Meakashi, or maybe Tsumihoroboshi. So she starts off in Gou at the point where she’s already figured out the basic rules of the gameboard, but doesn’t actually know about Takano, and also hasn’t experienced in any timelines where they successfully deal with Teppei, and she maybe also hasn’t seen any of her friends start to remember past timelines yet.

And I think the way they might explain what we see Rika say in ep2 of Gou is that Tataridamashi is actually the first arc chronologically in Gou, and it might with a deceptively happy ending where everyone on paper gets their happy ending, and everyone even survives long enough for Rika to go to high-school, but then she winds up dead there, and it’s after that point that Rika wakes up in ep2.

I don’t even necessarily think this would be incompatible with the idea of this arc going off the deep end and going in a more tragic direction. Maybe Teppei does end up dying one way or another, but everyone else survives, not even Satoko goes L5, and Teppei’s murder gets successfully covered up and everyone just goes back to living their lives. And because of whatever’s clearly been changed behind the scenes with Takano, the GHD never happens, so everyone just assumes they managed to achieve their happy ending by killing Teppei. But then Rika ends up dying a few years later in high-school anyway, in a way that ties into whatever the actual mystery of Gou is that all the characters are missing. At the very least I think teenage Satoko is gonna end up being the one to kill teenage Rika, and I could easily see that happening in a timeline where Teppei dies and she doesn’t immediately go off the deep end, but still has psychological scarring that nobody is fully aware of or properly deals with. So maybe she ends up becoming secretly resentful of Rika and all of her friends, blaming them for what happened, and she winds up killing Rika because of it.

I think this would actually pretty neatly explain the apparent contradiction of Rika talking about ‘knowing who killed her’ and ‘getting her happy ending’, while coming across like she genuinely doesn’t understand what’s actually going on. Her wording to Hanyuu in ep2 was always intentionally vague, but instead of just being about hiding the truth from new fans, maybe it was a multi-layered twist where what she’s talking about is totally different to what VN readers assume she means. Maybe the happy ending she meant was Tataridamashi, with everyone killing Teppei, and the person who kills her is Satoko.

She did act like she knows who kills her in *every* timeline, but if Rika in this arc is effectively pre-Minagoroshi, and this ends with a version of events where Takano never kills anyone and the GHD never happens, and it’s Satoko who kills Rika, that might lead Rika to falsely assume that her death in at least most of the timelines is just a result of Satoko going L5 and killing her.

Gou’s whole deal seems to be based on the idea that Rika is acting on false information, so I think it’d make sense if we find out that the truth she talked so confidently about knowing in ep2 was totally misleading.

One thing I’ve also been considering that might support this is that we see what at least seems to be teenage Satoko in the OP, but given that they’re going to change the show’s subtitle for the second half, they might change the OP too, which would imply that we’ll see teenage Satoko before this arc ends. Which makes me think that there’ll be some kind of timeskip epilogue at the end of the arc, and it’d be pretty likely at that point for that to be the big pivotal thing that happened with Rika as a teenager.

It’d also just flow better for new fans if the timeskip stuff with them in high-school takes place after one of Gou’s arcs, rather than Matsuribayashi, since that’d be kinda confusing and make new fans feel like they’re missing out on vital information.

Either way, like most people I think most of Gou’s central mystery is going to revolve around Satoko, and I think ultimately it’s gonna boil down to the question of what it would truly take to ‘solve’ all of her personal problems, and whether or not just getting rid of Teppei would be enough. For one thing, I imagine this arc will also still leave Satoshi’s whereabouts completely up in the air, which is another bit of unresolved trauma for Satoko.

More broadly than that, though, I feel like the Gou gameboard is Featherine’s way of giving her own perspective on the original story of Higurashi, and being like ‘if I take control of the story and introduce a new element to get rid of Takano before she does anything, does that automatically mean that everyone will get their happy ending, or is it more complicated than that?’. And I think this arc might be the best representation of that, where everything seemingly goes well for everyone, and Takano seems to never do anything evil, but everything still goes to shit anyway because of the various issues that the main characters still have even if Takano is dealt with.

I’m not sure exactly what new elements Featherine could bring to the board, and how it could lead to Takano being dealt with in every arc, but it probably has to do with what Takano found in the Saiguden, and also the fact that Featherine herself literally appears in the Saiguden in the OP.

I won’t get into super explicit details about Umineko here, but I think that Umineko Ep5 gives a pretty good example of how a new author can take control of a gameboard and insert a new ‘piece’ in order to achieve some new goal.

Anyway, once we get into the second half, I think the next arc will basically just be a version of Meakashi that acts as Watadamashi’s answer arc. We’ll probably spend about three episodes on Shion and Satoshi’s whole backstory from Meakashi [mixed with some of the flashbacks from Matsuribayashi], and then the arc will end with showing Shion and Mion’s perspective on Watadamashi, which I don’t think would take very long if they just focus on showing what they were doing in some of the important scenes. And some of it still might be left a little intentionally ambiguous.

Then I think that either whether they label it as it’s own arc or just treat it as part of one big final arc, we’ll get around three episodes that show Onidamashi from Rena’s POV, which would basically serve as a substitute for Tsumihoroboshi, and we’ll finally get an explicit reveal of how Keiichi hallucinated part of their fight scene. It might play out in the exact same way, but I could also see it seeming like a 1:1 retelling of Onidamashi at first, that then diverts at the last minute by having Keiichi remember the truth of what really happened in Onidamashi after he invites Rena into his house, in time for him to talk her down from killing him. Then after that I think we’ll basically get Gou’s take on Matsuribayashi, where everyone properly tackles the real issues and mysteries going on, to achieve a proper happy ending.

I’m not really confident about a lot of this, but I think it all more or less makes sense, especially since I’ve been thinking for a while that Gou will probably end up being much more of a remake than a full on sequel.

And then in the final episode we might get a glimpse at the ‘outside world’ where Rika/Bern is going over Featherine’s manuscript version of Gou, to help explain the whole framing device.

Also, I’m still wondering if Lambda is gonna play into Gou’s story at all, going by how we’re more or less already dealing with Bern, and Featherine has shown up in the OP and will presumably come into play later on. It’d feel a bit weird to have those two show up but not Lambda.

I feel like it’d be much harder to provide context for her whole deal compared to those two, though, but if Gou is effectively a fictional story in-universe, then she doesn’t necessarily need to follow the same logic she did in the VN. She was technically already present [but unmentioned] in the VN as being the witch who provided Takano with her blessing of certainty, so maybe she’s going to do the same for Satoko here instead [and maybe her not providing Takano with her blessing within the context of Gou is part of how Featherine is ‘dealing with her’]. Maybe a post-Tataridamashi Satoko ends up making a deal with Lambda as a result of her years of unresolved trauma and whatnot. Maybe she wants to go back in time to stop herself [or her friends] from killing Teppei, and Lambda agrees to provide her with the power to turn back time.

And along those lines, I’m also wondering if that might be part of why the Saiguden statue’s hand is undamaged in Gou. We’ve seen how Satoko thinks that she got cursed when she did that, and that it caused everything in her life to go to shit, so maybe she specifically wants to go back in time to prevent that incident from happening. And like I’ve also theorized, maybe the statue is undamaged in the first two Gou arcs because they happen chronologically after this one, and start from the premise of Satoko avoiding that incident.

Anyway, this is a whole lot of wild speculation that might not turn out to be true at all, lol. For one thing, even though I think teenage Satoko will show up in this arc because she’s in the OP, I’m not sure if or even how Featherine might appear in this arc, and that might really take things in a whole new direction I can’t predict.

#murasaki rambles #higurashi #higurashi gou #this got longer than I planned but I've got lots of theories lol #I probably should have just made a separate post about them but oh well

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timeladyjamie · 3 years

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Robin Hood - 3x10 Bad Blood Meta

Here’s another crazy Robin Hood meta by Jamie about her thoughts pertaining to the confusing and retcon mess that is episode 3x10 of BBC Robin Hood.

Let me know your thoughts and I hope you enjoy my ramblings once again.

“I’ll free you, free you from the bad blood that shackles you to each other.” - Malcolm of Locksley to Robin & Guy

Where do I begin with this? No honestly, I’m not sure exactly where to start.

I guess I’ll start with the obvious fact that while most of the fandom dislikes Season 3 in general, this episode is only one of the things that fuels it more. You can tell that the writers were trying to come up with a Surprise Mcguffin™ to keep the show running despite a good majority of the cast wanting to leave the show (all except one honestly.) Hence the retcon mess that transpires. Don’t get me wrong, I actually love some things about this episode, but there are also somethings that make me (and the fandom) scratch our head and just downright facepalm.

Follow me through the ride that is this episode and make sure you don’t forget about that Mcguffin. There is a pop quiz on it later.

Welcome to the first episode where Guy has become an outlaw. What there is only 3 episodes of this before it’s the end? Yeah, I feel ya. We should have gotten more of this. Anywho, Robin runs into the newly outlaw Gisborne in the forest as the two do what they do best: argue and fight with each other. It leads to a strange hooded man in the forest who shoots them down with poison darts, ties them up, and tells them a bedtime story of their past once they awaken because he wants to end the bad blood between them.

Kay...sounds legit???

Flashback to 20 years earlier!

We are introduced to a couple kissing. Oh, don’t worry, it’s just Ghislaine of Gisborne and Malcolm of Locksley having a secret affair with each other. WAIT, WHAT?! Guy and Robin sit around the campfire as Gisborne tells him of the fact he spotted this happening. The stranger reminds Robin he was once on a different path. In fact, Guy and Robin both were.

This episode is pretty much about the affair between their parents and is mostly a flashback episode, so the only way I can explain it all is in the characters themselves.

Ghislaine of Gisborne - Guy & Isabella’s Mother

She’s a supposed widow who has two kids, is ridiculed by the villagers for not only trying to run a manor/village all on her own, but for also being French.

I LOVE THIS PRECIOUS MAMA! FIGHT ME! Her two children idolize her and love very much and so does her husband. Ghislaine was one of my favorites from this episode because despite her affair, it only ended up happening because she thought her husband was dead and since women (yes, even noblewomen) didn’t have many rights, the only way to secure her children’s future was to have a husband. Did Ghislaine love Malcolm? Yeah, probably, but there is also no denying the fact that even when her husband returns back from the crusade alive and is discovered as a leper, she still dearly loves him. She even sneaks to the leper colony to feed him and make sure he is well.

As for the way she dies....by pretty much getting knocked back by Malcolm and hitting her head on the floor, I can see it, but I still call BS.

Ghislaine was greatly loved by children so much that even once they discover the truth about her affair, they try to deny she would be capable of such a thing.

Malcolm of Locksley - Robin’s Father

THIS ASSHOLE! With all the problems I have with this episode, they all stem from this man right here. Who knows what happened to his wife? She’s never even mentioned, but it’s assumed she passed away. He’s a somewhat good father to Robin...at least he gives him helpful advice. He helps support Ghislaine while her husband is gone.

But once everything is out in the open about the Secret Mcguffin, this shitstick says that despite the fact her husband has returned, he will declare his feelings for her, marry her or else once it’s discovered her husband is a leper, she will lose everything. Ghislaine is obviously having trouble accepting this, so he says she will have their Secret Mcguffin in secret and have it taken away for a short while until they can recover it.

Once Roger is kicked from the village for being found as a leper, probably by the hands of Malcolm since he was with the priest and bailiff when it happened. However, after the event when Robin refuses to go inside a lepers house, Malcolm at least calls his kid out on his shit. He also tries to defend Ghislaine from the bailiff who has spotted out their Secret Mcguffin, but does a wrong move by trying to marry her soon or else she will lose her lands to sneaky bailiff that goes to take the deeds at his order.

But here’s the cake taker for me: despite fighting Roger for breaking the code to visit his wife, Malcolm of Locksley fakes his own death and makes his son think he is dead for years until he shows up to tell him this very story. Yep, the strange hooded man is none other than Malcolm of Locksley himself, much older and scared by the fire during his fight with Roger. Oh, and he only appears in this one episode to unite Guy and Robin to find the Mcguffin before disappearing again.

*sarcastic* A+ Parenting right here. Wow.

Roger of Gisborne - Guy & Isabella’s Father

This man is literally EVERYTHING Malcolm wants to be...no honestly, he’s literally trying to take his wife, and his lands, and probably his kids too.

Presumed to have died fighting in the crusades, he mysteriously returns back with a secret (and no, it’s not the Mcguffin.) He contracted leporsy. He confides in his wife who tries to keep it a secret despite the villagers talking about the possibility of it. This man loves his wife and his kids dearly and pleads with his wife to pronounce herself a widow so his family doesn’t follow in his fate; homeless in a leper camp in the forest. Roger even tells Malcolm to take good care of his wife and kids, but still doesn’t know of the affair between them.

When Guy comes to warn his father of the fact Malcolm is trying to get Ghislaine to marry him, rules be damned. This man goes back to the village and speaks with his wife. Malcolm walks in on them and that’s when shit hits the fan. The asshole fights him for no good reason and when his wife is knocked dead, Roger refuses to leave her side and stays in the fire to die by her side.

I mean, it doesn’t help their kids, but the kids have already lost their future at this point.

Meet Young Robin of Locksley

He’s small, a great archer, and comes off as an irritating brat that accidentally causes trouble and ends up almost getting you hanged for it (whoops, sorry Guy.) He doesn’t listen to others that well, but can you blame him? He’s only 11.

He is assumed to be childhood friends with Guy, or at least they live in the same village and their parents know each other (a little too well.) While the focus is on the parents in this episode, it was nice to see a Young Robin and Guy. Especially at the end when Robin finally listens to his father’s advice and takes up his bow, refusing to be afraid and fight for what’s right.

Sure, I mean his dad faked his death and left him all on his own, but this kid will go places.

Meet Young Guy of Gisborne

Me being the big Guy fangirl I am, of course I have a lot to say about him. And of course it’s one of the reasons I love this episode: because we get hindsight into his backstory and find out why he turns into the asshole he is later on in life. This is pretty much a episode that makes you sympathize with him if you haven’t already and lets us see why he has no family as he’s told us in Season 1 and 2.

Despite being 15-16, this boy comes off like an older brother figure when interacting with Robin. He easily shows his emotions unlike his older self and honestly just wants to protect his family. He doesn’t like that his mother is having an affair and feels she is being used by Malcolm. He also doesn’t like that his mother is visiting his father in the leper colony despite telling him not to do so himself.

While trying to defend his parents when Malcolm comes bursting through the front door like a wild man, Guy grabs a torch, trying to scare him away. Malcolm pushes him back which ends up causing said torch to fall from his hands and start the house fire. While the parents quarrel inside, the manor burns to the ground and the parents with it.

The other asshole (and supposedly main villain of this episode) Bailiff Longthorn exiles the Gisborne kids since the lands are his now and Guy is left to raise his little sister; homeless, penniless and without any help. He had to quickly become tough in life. Sorry, it just makes me sympathize with him more.

Meet Archer: The Mcguffin - Robin & Guy’s Half-Brother

I love and hate this character so much. He only appears as a baby in this episode, but he is the reason that Malcolm of Locksley finally shows his face after hiding for years. Apparently he had been searching for him the whole time, but neglected Robin, wow. Okay....sure.

It’s not Archer’s fault but yet it is. When you meet an older version of him in the next episode, there is no denying he has a wonderful personality and lots of potential, but yet the reason he was created bugs me, especially since we only get to “know” him in only 3 episodes which isn’t enough honestly.

Jamie’s Pros & Cons of this episode:

Pros:

Backstory exploration showing the history between Guy & Robin that explains their conflicts with each other (Despite both losing their parents, Guy also lost his home and titles which were given to Robin by the villagers.)

Introduction to the parents (Roger, Ghislaine and Malcolm.)

The Acting

Young Guy and Robin. Just look at how adorable they are.

A cause that unites Robin & Guy to work together for the only family they have left (Archer)

Cons:

The story can be confusing at times. I definitely didn’t understand it the first time I watched. In fact, I still question things.

The somewhat love triangle between Roger, Ghislaine and Malcolm. It feels more forced on Malcolm’s side then anything else because he is literally coming between a couple that is already married and clearly in love with each other.

Malcolm of Locksley. Mostly everything he does in this episode is stupid. Lets not talk about the fact he left his kid thinking he was dead for years only to show up once telling him the story of how he abandoned him....only to abandon him once again. Great, give this man Best Dad in the World mug.

The townspeople who don’t help the Gisborne kids and criticize them for being French and exiling them, but giving everything to Robin because he’s the kid of an English Noblemen. What assholes.

The fact that when you think about it: this episode is just a way to bring Guy & Robin together as well as keep the show going with Archer as the new Robin. Yep, that’s pretty much why our Mcguffin was created. I think they could have brought Guy and Robin together in a way that didn’t involve a secret Half-Brother between them....but that’s just me.

The puzzling questions of Retcon:

Is the land that the Gisborne’s run Locksley village or is it an unnamed village? Where is Marian? How did Robin grow up fine and well if Malcolm left him behind? How did Guy and Isabella survive for the little bit they had together before he sold her as bride when she turned 13? Why wasn’t this established sooner? Oh yeah, that’s right, it’s a retcon.

My thoughts in total:

Despite my issues with this episode, It’s actually one of the ones I enjoy in Season 3. I love that we got a glimpse into Guy and Robin’s backstories and firmly know that a character’s backstory is what shapes them into the people they are going to be later on down the road and this episode is proof of that.

It’s a good episode in itself, but it clearly has some flaws that just don’t make sense and leave you with questions. I think if anything, this should have been revealed earlier in the season or done differently.

#Robin Hood meta #bbc robin hood #Robin Hood bbc #guy of gisborne #sir guy of gisborne #robin of locksley #Malcolm of locksley #Ghislaine of gisborne #Roger of gisborne #Jamie's Metas #JamieWritings

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