#hate using endo terms but in this case it gets attention

[anti-endo-safe-space]

It kinda rubs us the wrong way when someone says "traumagenic system". You mean, a system? plain and simple?

Because "traumagenic" implies you can be a system by other means that are not trauma, what is... obviously wrong.

What are even those "-genic" things mean. What do you mean :3genic? Willowgenic?? Sillygenic??? What do you mean programmed system????

I will never understand those terms endos use. I swear, it's all just so confusing.

— Wysteria, from Ballad Of The Royals.

Hey Wysteria, agree with everything you said EXCEPT for programmed systems. From what we understand, those tend to be a type of system where they've gone through extreme cult like abuse and it causes a split. We're not experts but it's something to look into. Those are a legit system

Also we use it here simply to make it known we're anti-endo

[thetreeshavenotongues]

Spy x Family Mission 75 Spoilers-ish (But mostly just a dissertation on Melinda Desmond) :

Alright, I’ve finally calmed down enough to have actual semi-coherent thoughts about Melinda. So here we go, this is gonna be a long one.

I’ve seen a few posts calling her terrible and that she’s a bad parent but I really, deeply believe that’s not the case at all. I don’t think she’s a character that Endo put there for us to hate. I think she’s a character that’s there to be pitied.

She is clearly a severely broken woman. We got a hint of it in her reveal with Yor, we saw glimpses of the duality -her saying she didn’t care about the punch or really anything in Damien’s life at the table with her friends, then asking in the car when she and Yor were alone if Damien and Anya were friends - and then she gave us that expression.

I think we were all supposed to have our own opinions about what that face meant at the time because it was just so hard to pin down (and we have no Anya to give us insight) but now that we know a little more about her, it’s starting to make more sense. It’s warped and fractured and a caricature of what a happy smile should be. I think it shows that she has two very distinct, opposing mind sets about her life and the lives of her family and because of that she’s a very conflicted and complicated woman.

The fact that she raced over to see Damien shows us that she loves her child. She ran to that boy with tears in her eyes and dropped to her knees to hug him, that was a mother who was distraught. No one expected her to do that. Damien himself definitely didn’t. Anya even likened her thoughts about her son to a Yuri level of obsessive compassionate. But the second Damien mentioned his father a switch flipped. She fractured.

Donovan seems like a very cut and dry asshole, I’m sure he has some different facets but they’re probably all just variations of shithead. He was pretty blatant with his ideas, beliefs and ideologies when we met him, (for now) he’s an easy character to understand. Melinda, on the other hand, seems to be the opposite. I’m sure we all have our theories on her background, she’s most likely from a wealthy family and whether her marriage to Donovan was an arranged one or they actually did at some point love each other (or some truly wild Third thing that probably is the case given this manga’s propensity for curveballs), it’s clear that at this point they’re not on good terms. It’s obvious that Melinda hates Donovan, I have a theory that Demetrius may be the root of that hatred.

I believe that after he was born and she witnessed Donovan’s indifference towards their child aside from indoctrinating him with his twisted views something in her shifted. Donovan probably even made sure her interactions with her first born would be limited as he was grooming him to be his heir. I’m going to guess that not only will we find out that Demetrius looks like Donovan but he will act like him too. My theory is that she wanted a second child, not Donovan, (especially since it seems like Damien is the only one of these rich kids with a sibling) Melinda wanted a child to teach to be good and to love and dote on since she saw that Demetrius was too far for her to ever actually reach. But I think that even that didn’t work out the way she wanted and it probably became evident to her pretty quickly that even though Damien as the second child would never get as much attention from Donovan as the first, she still wouldn’t be able to completely remove his influence from their shared child’s life. And every time that she saw him, her precious second attempt, search for approval from a man who she hates some of that hate transferred over to her feelings for Damien, (because to her, why would he love a man who clearly has no love for him when she’s right there showering him with it? Why does he care about that man’s approval when she’s right there giving him hers?) I think Damien’s desire to be loved by both parents, and her witnessing that she can’t change that slowly chipped away at her until she became this heavily fractured, incredibly wounded woman who probably had no healthy coping mechanism and it developed into this severe dissociation when it comes to her thoughts on her children.

It’s heavily implied that Damien and Demetrius have very different personalities and I’m assuming that as much as Damien looks like his mother, Demetrius will be a copy of his father as a way of showing us which parent they take after. Demetrius was his fathers project and Damien was his mother’s (failed) attempt at combatting that influence. And I think that’s why her thoughts about Damien that first time are so…let’s say enthusiastic (obsessive), and why when she hears him talk about his father - a man who couldn’t even be bothered to show up after his child was in a bus hijacking - we see her thoughts jumble. We get both sides, the incredible love and the bone deep loathing and unfortunately both are directed at this softest, sweetest of beans.

TLDR: she’s complicated and needs much therapy.

[anti-endo-safe-space]

saw Aftongenic the otherr day on pluralpedia and we laughed our ass off

its a funny time when you go on there and hit random term a bunch i think

-milo from bathypelagic orchestra

they (endos) try so hard and its funny

[anti-endo-safe-space]

‘were ganna send ___ to yalls headspace!’

sugercube. what.

I-

WHAT?

[anti-endo-safe-space]

Endos saying you don’t need trauma to be a system like trans people don’t need dysphoria doesn’t work as an argument because dysphoria isn’t the cause of being trans while trauma is the cause of being a system. And as a trans person and a system it just rubs me the wrong way one is an issue (saying it like that bc it isn’t just sunshine and roses) and the other is how you feel as a person and affects your outward expression

!!!!!

[anti-endo-safe-space]

Endos will say they’re not disordered plurality and it’s valid and then turn around and say you’re ableist for denying their existence. Like PLEASE Pick are you not disordered or are you disabled therefore making other ableist for even just avoiding the topic of endos?

Exactly! We once saw an endo and commented "hey you need trauma for DID/OSDD/USD" and went "we're not claiming we have that. Stop being abelist" like yo. Decide which you wanna claim

[anti-endo-safe-space]

Some endos really are just making fun of actual CDD systems (wtf do you mean cheesegenic, :3genic?? DID endo system??) but they're somehow always supported??

But if an actual traumatized system speaks up and says "hey that's not cool", they're ableist, a sysmed and traumascum...

Endos and pro-endos need to hold accountable the rotten ones in their community. I don't give a fuck anymore. When I see anti-endos being absolute shits and harassing endos and telling them to kill themselves, I don't go "oh wow, they're so valid for that <3"

!!!!!!!!

[anti-endo-safe-space]

At the moment we have the host and five trauma holders at front having a general horrible time with flashbacks. As well as remembering and missing people that we should not because ultimately they were not good for us.

I wonder if endos would still find it fun to be a system if they experienced the bad parts of it. The 95% of the system experience that they disregard and throw aside in order to romanticize it.

— ❄️ of the 🏚️🌒 system

We are so so sorry y'all are dealing with that, hopefully the flashbacks can stop soon.

They most likely wouldn't, they forget that with being a system comes the flashbacks and some trying to reach out to people they shouldn't

[anti-endo-safe-space]

I was curious and checked the pro endo tag.

I saw someone say that they were endogenic, and that they had "made" their alters to deal with their trauma.

I honestly just feel bad for them... This is just denial. It's okay to be a system.

I feel like the endo community has just made us traumagenic systems into the broken ones, those that no one wants to identify with because they're victims. And it's harming so many people...

CDD systems can thrive and enjoy their lives too!! Stop erasing us!

!!!!!

[anti-endo-safe-space]

Endos saying you don’t need trauma to be a system like trans people don’t need dysphoria doesn’t work as an argument because dysphoria isn’t the cause of being trans while trauma is the cause of being a system. And as a trans person and a system it just rubs me the wrong way one is an issue (saying it like that bc it isn’t just sunshine and roses) and the other is how you feel as a person and affects your outward expression

THIS !!! THIS THIS THIS transgenderism is never inherently a medical issue because of social transition and all the other facets of being trans, but being a system will ALWAYS be a medical issue because it's a disorder and disability, WHICH ARE INHERENTLY MEDICAL!!!! endos get it in your thick skulls that systemhood is INHERENTLY MEDICAL BECAUSE ITS A DISORDER OMFG YOU GUYS WJAT IS A ""SYSMED""

As a trans system that always pissed us off. Trans people aren't required to have dysphoria, we might but we have a friend who has a trans partner who doesn't and is comfortable dressing as the stereotype of their agab.

Endos are convinced that you can just be born a system (as a child of a system (a parent of ours is also one) it does slightly increase your chance the same way that having a parent with PTSD increases the likelihood of you getting PTSD, it just makes it a simple bit easier and is still not fully researched), you can will one into existence and you can just choose this. That's not how this works.

To be a system, you need to have a disorder. And if you don't have some sort of CDD and think your one, please go see mental health help because chances are, it might be something very very very concerning

[anti-endo-safe-space]

endos after encouraging younger and recently discovered systems to deny and repress their trauma:🥳 🎊🎉🎉🎆🪅🎊🎊🎆

Yep

[anti-endo-safe-space]

more of a neutral vent, but I was on pluralpedia because I have nothing to do and I wanted to get terms for my headmates (anyways that's not the important part) and I find the perfect term for me but it's coined by a pro-endo or something like that they made endo terms...

also the amount of endo terms that- no, just, no

like wdym ''starligenic : Starligenic is a Xeno-Origin related to starlight.'' WTF IS A XENO-ORIGIN THIS IS NOT GENDERS

''Xenogenic or xeno-origin is a term to cover the gap left behind traumagenic and endogenic, along with othergenic as an even broader term. Xenogenic isn’t really defined under traumagenic or endogenic, though the system could be trauma-aligned or endo-aligned, or TraumaEndo.

Based on xenogender; system/system origins that can't be contained by human understandings of plurality; more concerned with crafting other methods of system categorization and hierarchy such as those relating to animals, plants, or other creatures/things.''

I copy pasted this vent from discord (It was also written by our host, and I'm not the host) but we often go on pluralpedia but now we lost it, not going back, there's like 80% endo terms... -Tubbo

I am so sorry Tubbo

all we can recommend is never going on that hellsite, it's just toxicity

[anti-endo-safe-space]

writing this on behalf of our Sally Williams little (fict of Sally, the Creepypasta.)

endos have made her literally scared to front. all the harassment we went through in this one server— the insults and shit because of her source and because of her childish attitude when she's literally a kid.

"oh but she's a Creepypasta she has seen worse🤭" bullshit. I don't care what you think of her source, what hcs u have if youre in the source of her fandom, whatever. she's still a kid, it's worse when you know her story (the one shes DEEPLY ATTACHED TO thanks to events that happened to this body). she's still a traumatized kid.

endos will not respect an alter's boundaries and it shows. they just want the funny "imaginary friends in your head" and it shows. but when an alter's behaviour is that of a deeply traumatized being, they start calling you shit, they start with their bigotry.

anyway, system littles you're so strong and I love you all very much. system fictives who are attached to source trauma, I love you all so much and you're doing so well by just existing. I hope things become easier for y'all. /platonic.

— Ballad Of The Royals' host and its protector.

Oh dear. We are so so sorry y'all had to deal with that. She is a child, no matter what

You all did nothing wrong, those pieces of crap did that

Please remember system littles, you are all so cafes for and loved.

[anti-endo-safe-space]

I hate how endos are so mean most of the time. They're addicted to using serious words as buzzwords calling people ableist for not supporting them. They call systems traumascum for not supporting them. I had an Endo supporter say I had a hate boner for asking endos to stay off of my blog. Just like hey man what's your problem? And don't use words like ableist if ableism isn't happening and guess what faking a disorder is ABLEISM.

I'm so sorry identitysoups, that sucks ass. They tend to be rude and mean, hell if you say your anti-endo you tend to get a ton of anonymous asks saying how your stupid or "research" done in a google doc.

Dude that supporter can go fuck themselves, I'm being honest but they can. You have every right to ask them not to interact with you, just like they have every right to ask us to not interact with them (which if they do, just block and move past them, they aren't worth stress).

Exactly. As a sys who's disabled in more way than one, don't use abelism if something isn't actually abelist which, oh yeah, faking illnesses are abelist

[anti-endo-safe-space]

This isn't like a respond or anything but we figured we needed to make this clear mostly so we don't have anything contradictory and if anyone disagrees they can leave our page

we support self-diagnosis if you have done extensive research and it's a case of like it's not safe to get diagnosed. We don't support if you just look something u;p for a second and go "oh yeah I have it totally"

We support xenogenders (obviously if it's something like "I'm an attack helicopter" we're ignoring because let's be real, we've yet to see that). Some of us USE xenogenders. Our psys uses xenogenders.

We aren't sure what mogai is but that's because we tend to avoid learning about things that can infuriate us and from what we've gathered, there's some genders and sexualities to do with mogai that make fun of disabled people which as a disabled system, we get annoyed by

[anti-endo-safe-space]

m' considering deleting my endosarentvalid blog because of the harassment 😭 being accused of telling people to kill themselves n shit

Hey we saw what was going on and hey, you did nothing wrong. That's a common proendo argument. They like to claim antiendos go after them and accuse them of saying that shit and that they harass everyone. Really, especially that person causing all this, has a history of trying to find anti-endos to cause that. They'll leave comments calling them babies on every post they make and then once the person defends themselves, they're "harassing and telling someone to kill themselves