#loona criticism

[penguinofspades]

It's funny how Helluva Boss is so badly written that it actually taught me what parental abuse is and how to recognize it due to Loona's treatment of Blitzo.

The Stolas/Blitzo plotline is also a really good example for Quid Pro Quo and the fact that rape and sexual coercion isn't always with brute force.

And yet we're supposed to root for Loona and Stolas lmao.

[showtoonzfan]

The moment between Loona and Octavia comes off as cheap and forced to me because:

1. Loona and Octavia never interacted before, never having any form of relationship beforehand. Loona and Octavia only know each other as the other person’s daughter and nothing else.

2. Loona has no relationship with Stolas, so why is she defending him, confident that she knows he’s a “good” father? She’s only seen or heard about Stolas but never really interacted with him.

3. Loona treats her father like shit, physically abusing him. Yet, she tells Octavia she should be “happy” that Stolas cares about her, believing this should be enough for her, and shouldn’t be upset over the neglect because he’s going “through a lot,” and it’s the “thought that counts.” However, in the same episode, Stolas comes to earth looking for Octavia, only to forget about her to play around on a sitcom set and flirt with Blitzo, no longer caring his daughter is missing.

Honestly, the entire scene came off as the show disregarding Octavia’s feelings because they don’t want to admit Stolas is a shitty father. They would much rather tell Octavia she needs to “appreciate” the bare minimum from Stolas, ignore her feelings, and claim she has no right to be mad at him for the neglect since he’s an “innocent victim.”

Agreed, you said the exact issues I had. However, there is ONE thing about this scene that I hate that no one seems to mention yet, but for me personally, another reason why this scene is so bad (other than the points me and literally EVERYONE else has been saying) is that Loona’s kind behavior and change of heart isn’t believable. Like….Viv expects me to believe that Loona was kind enough to look for someone she didn’t know jack about when she threw her coffee away, despite LITERALLY flipping off Blitz when he asked to go look for her, only to spend time on her phone and only THEN looks for Octavia when she noticed her on the internet. It’s the same issue with Blitz and Stolas, there’s just no buildup for Loona’s character, or even for her to warm up to Octavia. I hate how they get along immediately, and like lemon-critiques said, they should be allowed to actually be CHARACTERS around each other first. Loona has been nothing but a bitch, that’s literally her whole character and yet she turns 180- nice to give Octavia an emotional scene because the plot demands it. The issue is that it would have made more sense if they were just allowed to connect in a different way and get to know one another, because they already have a few things in common, being both goth girls with daddy issues, however not only does it not WORK because Loona doesn’t even know Stolas as a father and her situation is not the same as Octavia’s, but because I highly doubt she would give a shit about Octavia. This is literally someone who was revealed to grow up in a shitty abusive pound throughout most of her life, and she’s never nice to Moxxie, Blitz, or Millie, so why Octavia? Again….this all feels forced because Vivzie can properly let her female characters be CHARACTERS and explore and expand them BEFORE the emotional cores. Instead it’s just “Loona and Octavia bond because the fandom wanted to see it anyway and because we said so. Also Loona is nice because we also said so”. This is just a personal nitpick of mine, but still, it’s how I feel. I wish Viv would stop showing her characters one way and then suddenly in another without any proper flow or in between. This honestly goes for all the characters honestly.

[tooningin]

A rewrite of Via and Loona’s talk in “Seeing Stars”

Loona: Try to cut your dad some slack. He may not always get it right but… he’s trying. That’s-

Via: TRYING HIS BEST?! WHAT DO YOU MEAN?! EVERYTIME HE SAYS HES GONNA SPEND TIME WITH ME HE EITHER BRINGS THAT FUCKASS IMP WITH HIM OR NEVER SHOWS UP AT ALL

Loona: *Is shocked*

Via: YOUR DAD IS THE ONE ACTUALLY TRYING HIS BEST, AND WHAT DO YOU DO?! YOU BEAT HIM UP ON A DAILY BASIS

Loona: *Gets defensive* B-but, he always gets in my space, and-

Via: Have you ever tried, oh I don’t know, TELLING HIM THAT INSTEAD OF RESORTING TO SHOVING PICTURE FRAMES DOWN HIS NECK?! *She begins to tear up* He’s far more likely to listen anyway…

*Via heads for the stairs, and Loona watches, realizing just how badly she treated Blitz*

[deadbeat-motel]

ᑕᖇYᗰIᑎI ᖇEᗪEᔕIGᑎ

So this redesign is on a character that doesn't appear in the series proper. This is Crymini.

Her purpose in Deadbeat is to fulfill the sloth part of the 7 sins theme and be the most modern character we have in the roster (still debating whether she should be from the 2000s, 2010s or the 2020s).

Theres really not much I can say about this redesign.

My issues with her Original design:

A "Punk rock" character who has a pretty bland design. Her outfit consists of only two things, a skull print dress and a black jacket.

How in the 9 hells does that hair work??? Two segments are fighting for space on her head while the third one acts as a giant ponytail???

She suffers from the same problem all anthro female characters from Viv suffer from: they're made from the same hourglass body wolf base. If I were to take out the spots from her body, could you tell that this is a hyena and not some generic cat/wolf character? If she ever gets into season 2, Hopefully, she gets a second redesign to give her a unique body.

The thought process behind the design:

Gave her a nonfeminine body, or more like a body type where she doesn't have a cinched waist.

My roster was looking a little bit too muted and she needed a pop of color to distinguish herself from the others, hence the blue stitches on her grey hoodie.

The collar is a manifestation of her feelings of being controlled by her family, being visually too tight and almost suffocating. Despite being far from her family now, she hasn't outran the issues they cause for her

Her clothing choice is pretty bland since I don't think she would be the type of person to have a fashion sense. As long as it feels good, it's nice enough for her.

[that-guy-in-the-chiton]

Me when anything bad happens to Blitzo, Loona or Stolas:

[gartenofbanny]

So while taking a shower. I just realized Mammon is a pretty stupid antagonist now that I think about it, Not just because he's a poorly thought out interpretation of the Sin of Greed, but because his only antagonistic trait is being a shitty boss.

He physically assaults Fizzarolli, insults Fizzarolli, manipulates him, fatshames him, and gets mad when Fizzarolli messes up.

However, there is another character in Helluva Boss who shares ALL of those traits but is somehow a protagonist of the show. That being Blitzo.

Blitzo physically assaults Moxxie, fatshames him, insults him, gets mad when Moxxie messes up, and even threatened to rape him and his wife all the way back in the first fucking episode.

Helluva Boss has a tendency of "Rule for thee, but not for me" and I'm just tired of it. When the protagonists physically assault and insult each other, it's supposed to be funny, but when the antagonists do the same, we're supposed to hate them.

I'm sorry, but you can't have your cake and eat it too. Make your characters face the consequences of their actions instead of dismissing their abuse because it's funny. Also, one more point Entertaining Antagonist doesn't equal Good Antagonist.

Anyway, that's all I got for today, I might post tomorrow idk shit's been less than well lately.

[arteicetb]

Despite my hyperbolic nature, my criticisms of Helluva and Hazbin do come from a place of genuine concern and hope for the show. I wish nothing but the best for the artists who are busting their butts on this show, they’re great, but sadly visuals can only take a show so far if the writing doesn’t improve. That’s my bone to pick with this series because it’s both fascinating and disappointing how far it goes for some characters (Fizz, Stolas) than others (Barbie, Loona, most the women honestly). If ppl enjoy the direction it’s going in, cool, glad they can. They have every right to share what they love about the show however…those of us that loved the demon show about Imps we thought we were gonna get also have a right to be critical about it.

That being said, I want to make a video reacting and rationalizing our “Helluva/Hazbin Hot Takes”🔥🔥🔥

Such takes range from reasonable to outrageous and I wanna hear them all!

[yourlocalnetizen]

I love love love that Blitzø prioritizes Loona over Stolas

& I NEED Stolas to start prioritizing Octavia over Blitzø

Blitzø has been a father for 5 years max and even though his adult daughter isn’t even particularly nice to him most of the time (quickly want to say I love Loona, she’s got her own trauma & her feelings are valid) he made a commitment to her by adopting her and cares for her needs like a good father should.

Stolas… oh boy. I get that he never really had a choice in having Octavia and both his marriage and having a child was something forced on him by his father way too young but Stolas does love Via and clearly thinks he’s a good father but wtf man, your daughter feels like she’s being neglected and 90% of your thoughts are about your crush who you have a physical relationship with instead of her.

[definetlyaddicted]

On the stolitz breakup...

What a beautiful scene. What a long time coming. THIS is what I've been begging Viv for over a year for. We can see just how flawed they both are in this scene.

Blitz, for lashing out without trying to understand Stolas' intentions, for inadvertently mocking him for his feelings, for sticking his head in the ground and refusing to listen.

Stolas, for attempting to rush a confession out of Blitz (regardless of how well-intentioned). For not considering how confusing this may have been for him, for springing this on him so quickly and expecting a smooth sailing ride. He knows Blitz better than that.

Ive been critical of how the show has handled their dynamic since the beginning of season 2, I'm happy that they have finally taken the steps to breaking this couple down at their seams and re-building them. Its what they need.

[pedanticat]

I will never understand why folks will insist that the Workplace premise of Helluva Boss doesn't matter and that the characters and their development is more important even though there are several shows that manage to combine those two things perfectly.

[doodle17]

Helluva Redesigns! Woooooohoooo

I wanna take a sec to ramble about the design choices I made while working on em

SO first is Millie. Idk why but if I looked at her, I wouldn't even know she came from wrath. There's literally NOTHING to say she came from wrath other than the fact that shes.... Idk aggressive sometimes? But that's kind of it. I like the idea of Wrath having a cowboy theme to it, so I decided to, y'know, make her have a more country look! Also covered her in scars because she fights alot. I also changed her personality to be a lot more sweet than she looks, still has fiery attitude though. I decided to make Moxxie have a more greed look. My version of greed imps are covered in various jewels and sparkly stuff, hence all the gold. And since green is the main color for greed, I implemented more green into his design. His personality has a BIG change, and is more like his pilot personality. He isn't a sopping wet woobified nerd, now, he's a hardworker who can't stand his boss, and he doesn't take ANY of his shit. He'd probably quit if he and Millie weren't in a bad place financially.

Heres Mox with and without his glasses

Loonas design is probably the most changed. Whenever someone tells me to think of a hellhound, what comes to my mind is Cerberus, who I also imagine as a Doberman breed. SO I decided that all hell hounds are Doberman! Because loona looks like a fucking devaintart fursona, NOT a hell hound. (This isn't to say Doberman are evil btw! I love Doberman!! I made them Doberman because they're badass 😎) Also, Loona isn't adopted. She's just worked with Blitzo for a while, and him seeing her as a daughter is kind of one sided, but she's not as bitchy about it like she is in canon. She's more relaxed, but still aggressive. Blitzo's design is probably gonna get changed more, because I don't really like this result I ended up with :P anyways, he's still really crude, but he's also a lot more charismatic and sinister. He also doesn't want to have sex with literally every breathing thing, and he's unapologetically an ass. No sad backstory to make uo for all of it, NOPE! He's just a jerk because he wants to be!

Anyways, who would you guys wanna see redesigned next

[almacambiondaughterofsaleos]

Helluva Boss's Handling Of Stella and Stolas's Relationship Is Equivalent Of Family Guy's "Screams of Silence: Story of Brenda Q"

I think one of the most criticized elements of Helluva Boss is how the series handles Stolas and Stella's relationship. We see in the Circus that it's been abusive since they have been married and Stolas has been covering up the more unpleasant parts from his daughter. It has been praised by fans for showing male domestic violence, but in my opinion it's very hamfisted. It doesn't feel like it's domestic violence to show how accurate and disturbing it is. More like it's being used as an excuse to justify why Stolas belongs with Blitzo and how he was right to cheat on her. Their relationship reminds me of another badly execution of how to address domestic abuse is Family Guy's "Screams Of Silence: Story Of Brenda Q".

It first came out in 2011 where it was met with divisive reviews mostly because of the fact that it was going to handle domestic abuse seriously rather than as a joke. However, critics of the episode felt it was tone deaf due to how it was going along with the shift especially the episode before that "Seashell Seahorse Party" was encouraged to stay in an abusive relationship for her own family's sake and Brenda and Jeff's first depiction was portrayed as dark comedy like other situations before. There was also the fact that Jeff and Brenda's written as so over the top that you can't take it seriously and that they are very flat characters. Also we never see why Brenda stays with him or drew him to him in the first place. Or maybe even say he's threatened to kill her or even is financially dependent on him since he's a unemployed bum. In other words, they just exist to sell a message and not actually be interesting on their own.

The same thing can be said of Stella and Stolas' relationship since "Circus" there is nothing to her character except Stolas's bitchy ex wife. She never interacts with her daughter and everything we hear about them is through second hand accounts but never anything about how they both feel about each other. In other words, Stella feels like a male Jeff who is just defined by the fact that she's an abusive asshole who lives to torment Stolas and she even admits it. She's not even smart as shown in "Western Energy" she's shown to be instructed by her older brother in order to think anything through. As a result, we see less of a hated tormentor and more like a poorly executed hate sink made with tons of badly written fanfiction tropes found in yaoi fanfiction.

Most of all is the shows' hypocrisy in depictions of abuse. Both state that abuse is not funny, but then in another episode treat another character physically abusing someone as comedy. Again Family Guy's constant abuse of Meg made the episode hypocritical when you keep in mind the narrative tries to depict it as right she goes back to being a punching bag. The same thing with Helluva Boss it tries to depict Stella as despicable for abusing Stolas but allows Loona to do the same thing to her father who saved her from being aged out of the system and thrown on the streets. Again when you are trying to do comedy with serious moments don't get things muddled when it comes to the latter moments because then things can get confused.

[ms-cartoon]

Before I make another post regarding the recent ep of Helluva Boss, I just wanna say something slightly off topic. This is more about my last post about most of the women being made to be mean in the show just because. All lot of people argue that Loona is far from being b*tch or just being a bad person in general. Look, if y'all wanna like Loona and think she's a good person somehow, then fine. But there is NO WAY you can look past these moments--

And say she's NOT a b*tch!!

[hasbrohotel]

this fucking thread😭😭😭😭

[lust-for-ultraviolence]

*Unhappy campers

[that-guy-in-the-chiton]

Loona is a literal bitch with the way she treats her adoptive father like shit even though he tries to be a good dad. But yet she capes for Stolass and defends his actions to octavia

I always despised Loona from day one with how she basically bullies Moxie for no reason and constantly disrespected her adopted dad, the guy that literally took her out of that hell-hole and treated her as a daughter even when he didn't have to (I hate Blitzo, but credit where credit is due 🤷) And she repays him by basically abusing both him and his employees. No wonder the b doesn't have any friends. I bet the only reason she has a fanbase is because of her appearance. I bet if she were drawn as unattractive she'd be the most hated character on the show, no doubt.