#politics in thai bl

[oliventrae]

The politics of "Never Let Me Go"

What prompted me to finally watch the series “Never Let Me Go” was seeing a specific scene from the series. It’s the scene on the beach, where Nuengdiao is yelling at Palm about them being from different classes, different societies etc. This caught my attention as something that could have some aspect of political commentary. I didn’t expect it, but I hoped for it. Especially as I kept on seeing opportunities for this commentary to occur while watching the show. 

Disclaimer: I know that this show utilises a lot of lakorn tropes and isn’t necessarily meant as political commentary, but I still feel that it is relevant to investigate the politics of the media that we consume. Also, I don’t understand Thai and therefore do not have knowledge on the actual meaning of subtitles I’ve quoted or much knowledge on the culture. 

To go back to the beach scene that I just mentioned; I was baffled to actually watch the context of it. When I first saw it on social media, I thought it would have been a sad speech made in a time of hardship, especially for Nuengdiao. Actually watching it, however, it was a moment where Palm made the slightest rejection of Nuengdiao, pushing him away whilst he was grieving the death of his mother. This was the first time Palm had in any way been disrespectful to Nuengdiao and it was in every way justified given the context. However, this grasp for control in their relationship was entirely rejected by Nuengdiao and what had previously seemed to me as a heartfelt speech was suddenly not only an immature and disproportionate temper tantrum, but an attempt at oppressing Palm even further. Know your place. Although Nuengdiao never says it and frequently tries to convey the opposite, the message shines clearly through much of the show: If you’re poor, know your place. If you’re rich you can do whatever. This is especially illustrated in the contrast not only between Nuengdiao and Palm, but also between Palm and Phum, the bully. Nuengdiao, as I’m sure we are all aware, has a bit of a temper and is frequently controlled by his emotions. This is contrasted by Palm, who is very controlled and can even be described as obedient in most situations. As I just mentioned, whenever Palm tries to break away from this obedience, he is immediately knocked down by either an emotional story from his father or a bunch of mean-spirited yelling from Nuengdiao.    

Nuengdiao is being empathised with by the show. An example of this is when Palm has a conversation with the woman who cooks Nuengdiao’s breakfast and Palm mentions that the amount of food being cooked is exaggerated. We might initially think that this is because Nuengdiao is spoiled, but when Palm goes to speak with him, he complains that the cook insists on cooking too much food for him. After this, Palm’s father is the one to say that Palm shouldn’t eat with Nuengdiao, not Nuengdiao himself. The inequality between Nuengdiao and the workers is therefore blamed on the working class more so than on Nuengdiao, Nuengdiao’s parents or the economic system. Palm is also sympathised with, but I would argue that this is only because of his forementioned obedience. Palm is an empathetic character because he respects the wealthy and is willing to sacrifice himself for their well-being. When he is not keeping an eye on Nuengdiao’s alcohol consumption at a party, he is punished. A similar situation is when Palm pushes Nuengdiao at the beach. Palm lacks the self respect to ever really hold Nuengdiao accountable for his actions, which I feel bleeds into the opinion of the overall show. He also falls in love with Nuengdiao very quickly and gets a tattoo of his name after them having been together for maybe a few weeks, at most a few months. I think it’s supposed to be romantic, but in reality it’s really just bad writing. For the most part Palm plays the part of the Good Poor Person and when he doesn’t, he’s put in his place. The Bad Poor Person contrasting Palm is Phum (although I’m not entirely sure he’s poor since he’s at the school and he has the money to pay for the outing video, but I think that his experience with his dad and his anti-capitalist politics code him as poor or at least not wealthy). Phum is a character that, like Nuengdiao, is very controlled by his emotions. He starts bullying Nuengdiao when Nuengdiao’s mother’s new decisions at the family company affect his family’s (and others’) finances so much that his father attempts suicide. This is obviously a deeply traumatising thing to experience for a young man and whilst the bullying is not justified, it makes sense that he would do some of the bullying that he starts out with, e.g. putting the “cheater” graffiti and flyers on Nuengdiao’s locker and stealing the necklace that is connected to Nuengdiao’s father and Nuengdiao’s position in the company. The outing, which is arguably the worst thing he does, doesn’t happen until after he is confronted about the bullying in episode 3. This confrontation scene is complicated because Phum is not in the right here, but neither is Nuengdiao, although he is portrayed as a saint for only asking for his necklace back. Phum explains his reasons for the bullying and the very sensitive information that his father tried to kill himself because of what Nuengdiao’s parents did, yet Nuengdiao shows no regret, sympathy, self-reflection or apologeticness. I’ll say it again: Phum was not right in his aggressive manner of handling the situation, but Nuengdiao’s continuous lack of sympathy for the lives of people less fortunate than him is similarly despicable although it is not portrayed as such. When confronted about the bullying, Phum also says that he’s doing it because of Nuengdiao’s “capitalist parents” (EP 3). I think this illustrates that the villains of the show are people who do not respect Nuengdiao’s family’s authority. Anti-capitalists are necessarily the villains of the series because our protagonist and hero is the heir of one of the biggest capitalist companies in this fictional version of Thailand. The heroes are cheating, evicting and causing people so much financial insecurity that they attempt suicide. Of course anti-capitalists, leftists and poor people would function as the villains in this scenario.

Similarly to the Good and Bad Poor Person, the show also has Good and Bad Capitalists. Nuengdiao and Chopper are the Good Capitalists. Nuengdiao finally does something about the protests in EP11, where he goes to the poor people at the market. He is met by banners with messages such as “the market belongs to everyone” and “give the land back to us.” He doesn’t give the land to them, but he does announce that he is going to let them keep using it. We never see their reactions to this. Nuengdiao also stops a casino from being built at the hotel because it is illegal and interestingly mentions in EP11 that illegal business is already taking place at his company, but that he is going to end it. Once again, the morality of his parents, who most likely implemented this illegal business, is never questioned. The show even has themes of having to choose between what is right and one’s parents with Chopper and his father, but the show never dares to extend this questioning onto Nuengdiao and his parents. Chopper is also a Good Capitalist because he makes his own money through stocks and other supposedly fair methods and he keeps saying to his father that he wants to make his own money. The villain of the show (his father) points out to him that it’s not very easy to make your own money, which is true although it obviously doesn’t mean that what he is doing is right. We never really see anyone struggling with money, except the villains (and a flashback of Palm’s father) because the Good Poor People are loyal to their employers and don’t expect anything more than what they get. Chopper’s father is the villain because he is disloyal to Nuengdiao’s family and wants to cheat his way to something that isn’t rightfully his. It is rightfully Nuengdiao’s because… well, it’s his birthright. 

Honestly, I found that "Never Let Me Go" is quite poorly written and the use of lakorn tropes might have been what led to the questionable politics of the show as well as the fact that Nuengdiao’s father originally was supposed to be a mafia boss (or so I’ve heard). In many ways I think "Never Let Me Go" contrasts "Not Me" with its complete lack of class consciousness and self reflection for our main character, which is unfortunate because it could have had such interesting political commentary. If only the writers had been willing to give their characters - both pro- and antagonists - some more depth.

[hallowpen]

My lovelies,

If there is ever anything you are unsure about regarding Thai culture (beliefs, customs, values, etc.), interviews/posts in Thai that have not been translated to your language, checking the accuracy of certain things that have been subbed or translated by a source whose native language is not Thai (or even if the native speaker is Thai but does not have a firm grasp on the English language. You'd be surprised -or not- that a lot of the subtitles you read in a series are actually not what's being said at all hehe), or any other general questions about Thailand... Please do not hesitate to ask me for clarification. If it is something that I have knowledge of and can help with, I genuinely don't mind AND if it's something I am unsure about, I'll be very clear about that and do my best to point you in the direction of a source that might have a better understanding.

Obviously, there are limits... and I do ask you to be respectful of my time. I'm not going to translate super long interviews or passages word for word (even more so if it is something I would otherwise not have an interest in), but I can give you a general idea of what's being said if I have seen/read them. In terms of dramas, I don't follow a lot of Thai series or actors... but if you've been following me or are aware of my interests then you probably know what it is I will sit through hehe (i.e. anything GL related, everything FreenBecky or BounPrem, The Sign and/or IDOLFactory news)

I'd just really like to avoid the spreading of misinformation as fact, which has been happening pretty frequently. Even something as simple as tone in language can lead to a big misunderstanding, so it's important to know the difference.

That is all! Please feel free to reach out ❤️❤️❤️

[chicademartinica]

I just realized that Playboyy the series and Only Friends shared a writer. Originally a mystery novelist, acting coach on KP, he wrote Only Friends first and put all the sex trade/exploited sex work/more acidic political discourse in Playboyy. He wrote War of managers in War of Y and that shit was dark. So hum one thing that man can write is egotistical and manipulative borderline violent characters. Also this very queer man likes to make the straights uncomfortable, said it himself and doesn’t consider BL as a genre for heterosexual cis girls. Somebody’s gonna lose it and end up in Klong Prem prison for sure.

Bonus : He also wrote for BOC’s Mansruang.

[heretherebedork]

Having this be the dialogue over Fire (as played by Neo Trai who also played Boston who was, actually, the last person I saw giving this exact speech but in the opposite way...) is amazing and glorious and is like a beautiful little inside joke for people who watch all GMMTV queer shows. Fantastic. @absolutebl I can honestly admit this isn't what I expected from this bit of the show.

Bonus: Man, this show is really just kind of doing whatever it can, sometimes, eh?

I mean, damn.

[absolutebl]

Hello! In the latest EP of I Feel You Linger in the Air, Yai addresses Jom as Por Jom. Jom seems surprised but I have no understanding of what Por means so it's significance is lost on me. Perhaps you can help shed some light? Also, how was Yai addressing Jom before?

Por/phor honorific in Thai - I Feel You Linger in the Air

I'm glad you asked it so I don't have to.

I have not encountered it before in BL.

Any of the the Thai language spies still out there wanna weigh in?

I did some poking around - but I could be way off base. Still this what I discovered:

Por is a paternal honorific, luang por is used for respected monks.

So I am assuming this use is relatively old fashioned (the reason we don't hear it often in our normal BL) and either one step more intimate or, more likely, one step more respectful than no honorific. Possibly scholarly?

I'm thinking all this has to do with Jom's demonstration of education. Yai has figured out that one of the reasons Jom doesn't belong and cannot fit in with the servants is that he is more educated than a peasant, which adds up to him being originally from a high status and wealthy family, especially speaking English and having travelled (he has a non-Chang Mai accent).

There is very little Thai middle class at the beginning of the 1920s since trade is being dominated/dictated by the West, or Chinese merchant operations, and Siam is a monarchy. So for a nationalize Thai citizen it's either military, landed gentry with trade operations (like Yai), military, or... none of the above. This changes, especially in the south, throughout this decade (as it did in other parts of the world). So there is a rising bourgeoisie going on in the background but it's not that obvious in Chang Mai at this time.

What this means to Yai is that Jom's family either got wiped out or politically entirely disenfranchised possibly as part of the 1912 attempted coups (or even WWI)? This would be mystifying for Yai because Jom doesn't act like he comes from a military family at all. So his background and status is very confusing for Yai, but Yai does know one thing...

Jom is NOT lower class by the standards of Yai's temporal worldview and existence.

For a young man to be educated and yet entirely alone is very dangerous and suspicious. Also, let's be clear, Jom doesn't look or act like a laborer. He red flags "cultured" all over the place.

Yai is paternalistic and caring towards Jom out the gate because Yai has a big ol'crush but also because he recognizes "his own" is trying to survive while isolated and scared. Yai wants to rescue Jom.

Some Historical Context for I Feel You Linger In The Air

I love history and so here's some quick info that any Thai watcher would likely know, but you might not... ready?

Remember:

Burma (Myanmar) to the west is occupied by the British.

The French hold Vietnam to the east.

Everyone is bickering over what would become Cambodia & Laos.

China occasionally gets involved from the North (also, lots of immigrants from China at this time accounting for a large percentage of the merchant/middle class)

Eventually, Japan would invade during WWII.

In part, The Kingdom of Siam was kept a "neutral" party because none of the surrounding colonial powers wanted to risk offending any of the other players in the area.

Siam re-negotiated sovereignty in 1920 (from USA) and 1925 (France & Britain). But during the time of this show (mid to late 1920s) it was back to it's customary type-rope balancing act of extreme diplomacy with the allied western colonial powers that surrounded it. Recognizing that Thailand was never colonized, it's boarders were constantly nibbled at and it was "ambassador-occupied" off and on by Westerners whose military backing and exploitive business concerns simply outmatched the monarchy, especially in the technology department (as well as by reputation on the global stage at the time).

In other words, the farang in this show (James & Robert) are bound to be both the baddies and the power players of the narrative.

The king of Siam at the time (Vajiravudh AKA Rama VI) was initially somewhat popular but also regarded as overly extravagant since Siam was hit by a major postwar recession in 1919. It should be noted that King Vajiravudh had no son because he was most likely gay (which at the time did not much concern Siamese popular opinion, EXCEPT THAT it undermined the stability of the monarchy).

He "died suddenly" in 1925 (age 44) with the monarchy weakened and succession handed off to his younger brother.

In 1932 a small circle of the rising bourgeoisie (all of whom had studied in Europe, mostly Paris), supported by some military, seized power from the monarchy in a practically nonviolent Siamese Revolution installing a constitutional monarchy.

Siam would then go through: dictatorship, WWII, Japanese invasion, Allied occupation, democratic elections, military junta, the Indochina wars, communist insurgency, more democracy and popularization movements, multiple coups, more junta, more monarchy, eventually leading us to the somewhat chaotic insanity of Thai politics we have today. (Which is, frankly, a mix of monarchy, junta, democracy, egocentric popularism, and bribery.)

(source)

[scarefox]

[dear-someone-letterstomyself]

For everyone saying that the end of episode 11 doesn’t tonally make sense… I disagree.

Because everything is out there now, there are no more secrets among these boys. Yes they were incredibly angry at first, rightfully so, everyone kept secrets and everyone ended up getting hurt… but do you realize what happens when you release something you’ve been hanging on to for a very long time? When everyone finally knows about the one thing you’ve been keeping quiet, regardless of how much you’ve been crushed under it’s weight?

You feel relief.

These boys… they can finally BREATH. Probably for truly the first time in years.

Yes there will be the aftermath, but for now… for now the storm has passed… and there’s a moment of calm.

The student film isn’t just some silly side plot thrown in. It’s legitimately Wats way of helping Akk and Ayan, it’s giving them an excuse for their actions. You can see even when they’re doing their little planning Akk is still incredibly scared of the idea of publicly coming out, he’s in no way ready. So this gives them an out… and it also serves as a distraction… it gives these boys a reason to laugh and have some fun.

Because despite everything, despite all the shit, you need to remember these boys are still best friends and they’re also still kids. And the thing about kids? Kids are resilient. The easy option would be to give up. To lay down and be crushed under the weight of everything that’s happened… but these kids are brave. And the brave option, is to just keep living.

[forkaround]

This post by @heretherebedork got me wondering about why commentary doesn't work. This isn't just a BL thing but a universal writing thing. I think since 2016 this making commentary thing has increased in all media over all. A lot of that has to do with evolving political landscape of the world in both good and bad directions. But nothing I can say or do about that. What I am interested in is why sometimes it works and other times it doesn't.

It works in Gotham Knights, Agents of Shield, even Cutie Pie to a degree and then there are shows built upon the political landscape like The Eclipse and Not Me. It doesn't work in Supergirl, Doctor Who (13th Doctor's run), and just about most shows that try.

For me the ages of the characters on Gotham Knights, Legacies, The Eclipse, Cutie Pie make it work. With GK and LGS, they are American teens and irl a lot of Gen Z are like that and so it becomes about reflecting real life. For comparison, when TVD came out the cultural consciousness made it possible to succeed in a way it won't today. Same with Twilight. Cutie Pie and The Eclipse has the PC built into them with the gay marriage and anti-authoritarian thing respectively. Same for Not Me.

But if you look at Supergirl, it came from the comics, comic have been PC or ahead of their time a lot of the times, but as a show it's 'lessons' fall flat. Compare the Alien Immigrants storyline in Supergirl with a similar but better anti-inhuman one from Agents of Shield. The difference is when Supergirl did it, it was a one season and done thing. Whereas Agents of Shield built it up slowly over the course of multiple seasons. AoS also gave multiple opposing views on it from members of the team. Supergirl had all it's main cast agree that it's bad to treat alien's badly. Some of it is baked into the character dynamics from the get go. The Supergirl team leaders were Hank, an alien himself and Alex, Supergirl's sister. While AoS's team leader was Coulson someone with experience in spy work and someone who understands people.

On the BL side, like I said the ones that do it well get away with it because of the basic premise. The ones that fail like War of Y, which I would argue didn't fail completely, Step by Step, which has the Supergirl problem, do so because of weak writing. With WoY, given the subtitles and overall quality I didn't expect much. The Commentary has stilted dialogue but so does the rest of the show. Same with House of Stars. It fails but doesn't stand out as egregious.

To Conclude: Some advice as an author,

if you are going to include PC into your story either bake it into the premise or don't make it stand out.

Also it's always good to have opposing views, good and bad. Try to make things as round and without edges as possible.

The characters should be talking to each other, not to the audience. or worse, at the audience.

Don't rely on woke points to propel your story.

It's a story, a narrative first, commentary second.

[ichigokeks]

Someone at MeMindY responsible for the subs about to get fired...

[gillianthecat]

Not Me

These are my notes, raw and only lightly copyedited, from four months ago, taken as I watched Not Me (around September 8th). In them I think about revolutions and the culture of activism, make predictions about what happens next, am endeared by romance, and fangirl over First. Among many other things. It is interesting to read over what I noticed then and how I felt about it, after having had months to mull it over and reading other people's thoughts on the show. Even now, I still have complicated tangled feelings about the show. It felt incredibly important and unique, and also like it was trying to do too many things at once. It felt flawed to me, swinging between a very human sort of realism and complete ridiculous nonsense. But having since learned more about it's fanfic roots and how much was changed from the novel it was based on (thanks @moonchildridden!), I can see why that came to be, and admire just how political they managed to make this show despite everything. I wrote early on, "this is not escapism for me," and that still very much feels true, even though the romance was beautiful and tender and I adored it. It brought up all my feelings about the times in my life when I was an activist, and about why I'm not doing that now and how I can get back to that. And all my thoughts about how to do activism, and how to actually make change in the world. Which is a lot, and the main reason it took me so long to write about this show. I only took notes up to episode 9, so there is nothing on the last three episodes. It got too intense for me to want to write about it, though I do remember many of my thoughts and want to write more about the series as a whole. I did write some about the romantic relationships in (or not in) the show, my love for Sean in response to an ask, and talked about the realism of the Not Me world in comparison to KinnPorsche in this conversation with @lelephantsnail.

long so all my notes are below the cut:

Episode 1

I get so anxious for characters when they have to pretend to be someone they're not. Although less so here than usual.

Ok. Looks like they have chemistry! I see why they're a popular actor pair!

That dirty oil fight is adorable but also... dirty motor oil! Blech. I can't focus on the cuteness for the grossness of it. 

I like the voice overs actually. They're not necessary, Gun is conveying everything with his acting. But it's nice to have my questions articulated. 

Yok is hot -> Wait, is that First？-> *checks MyDramaList* -> Ah, yes.  That is First. 

Episode 2 (and 3?)

It's so fascinating to be putting together a picture of Black based on the little snippets of what people say or how they react to White.  And of course White is going through the same thing. 

I live in a much drier climate than Thailand, but it still makes me nervous to see people starting fires in the middle of the forest. 😳😬

Oh no! Please don't have this fellow activist vandalizer die in the fire!

This show is intense for me. I'm feeling kinda raw about it. Definitely not escapism. 

I love that they have this mute character and are portraying real issues. I wish it wasn't portrayed in a scene where it felt like Yok and his mom had never met each other before. 

Wow they are not pulling their punches. I am really curious about the context that this got made in, and what the reception in Thailand was like. 

Lots of feelings on my failures as an activist. Something about that room in the garage, evokes all those warehouse punks from my 20s. They still exist, I'm just not a part of that world anymore.

This show is very didactic. I don't know how it would work for me if I was a Thai activist. Or Thai in general. I think if it was a US show, or English language at least, it would feel too didactic. Either annoyingly earnest or I wouldn't trust the filmmakers. 

But because I'm watching it as a foreigner, and it's about a political scene I know little about, the didacticism doesn't bother me. 

Also I'm watching with the assumption that this was politically risky to make. I'm guessing that just making the film is a political statement in Thailand, and so I already admire it for that. Whereas in the US it often feels like it's relatively, not easy, but uncontroversial to make a political film, so I accept more. Or at least don't admire their bravery. It may be hard to get funding, but for the most part it doesn't feel like the government is breathing down filmmakers necks in the same way

I am making a lot of assumptions about the Thai political context. I need to learn more to have a proper opinion. 

However, it feels really honestly radical, and getting that on mainstream tv in the U.S. would simply not happen. Indie films yes. Series by a mainstream company this overtly political no.

In this us there might be radicalism for the aesthetic, but not actually a look into the issues. Not actually a show that direct action as anything real, rather than a dramatic superhero moment. 

I can't even think of any tv shows that are directly about activists and activism. In a metaphorical way, yes,  but not direct like this. I'm sure they exist, but what are they?

And a lot of the tv shows films that are about activism are historical. Black panthers, etc.  

I don't even know about in other counties. 

Whew, this show has got me in my feelings and thoughts. 

Anyways 

I wonder if this show is going to address the parents each abandoning half their children. And how/why etc Black and White didn't talk for a decade(?). Or if that was mostly a plot device to get the false identity thing going.

I like that this is a lot about White's relationships with other people besides Sean. That those seem to be equally important, or more important than his awaking.  

So far it is more about his radicalization than the romance. Which I actually am glad about. 

The pace of Sean figuring out something is wrong is good. There is chemistry but no flirtation or anything like that yet, which feels right. And the fake identity thing gives a good reason for Sean to be an asshole without making him seem like an unredeemable asshole. 

I wonder if we'll ever get to hear what Sean was thinking during this time. I hope so. 

Voiceovers. Getting very didactic. Mixed feelings about that - see above. 

Are they contractually required to have a pratfall kiss? The towel mechanism was stupid (although better than a bouncy wall, á la The Eclipse), but at least the almost kiss was better than usual. I liked that their faces were actually offset, no lips touching or almost touching. That fits them better, is more realistic to what bodies would actually do in that situation, and I'd better for the pacing. 

Guns are a lot more terrifying in this real world than in the mafia world. 

I hope we get more of that dude from the diplomats exams. 

Episode 4

Political modern dance!!

Aaah! The Kinnporsche pool. I'm afraid that's seared in my brain as part of mafia mansion now, I don't know if I can buy it as another place but I'll try. 

Are we suspicious of Todd? 

Initially I wasn't because he was the one bringing White in. And I think people ship Tod & Black. 

But I got suspicious when I saw how rich he is. (Oh right, they were childhood friends.) Is his dad Tawi? Would White have known/remembered that? 

They seem to be a totally isolated group? Which is probably plausible for self radicalized university students?  But also makes the show feel less grounded in real political activist work. Gives everything more aesthetic activism vibes. 

Also these boys don't know how to organize or create a campaign? Which is also plausible, but they feel like dilettantes. I guess I don't need the ideas to be any better, just lots more talking to get there...

Episode 5

Oh, and hooray for a trans woman character who like an actual character and not comic relief or whatever. (Possibly multiple characters in multiple settings (I don't know what I was referring to here)). 

This violent stretching while they're cold is making me anxious. 

Ok this leaping across building stunt is annoying me more than it should. I think I have to let go of my expectations of realism here. The political message is legit. But the depiction of activism is closer to the aesthetic/fantasy side of the scale than I initially hoped. 

Ok. I think I'm not going to love this as much as @lelephantsnail does.  Or as much as I want to.  But I admire it a lot. And if I adjust my expectations I can like it a lot. It's hard to enjoy exactly because it's hitting too close to home. Or at other moments too watered down didactic. (Black is defending capitalism and monopolies? How are they not more suspicious?) But I can enjoy parts. 

Episode 6

Oy. I don't like thread of Gumpa constantly testing them. I get that it's to heighten the tension without going too far into plot that can't be backed out of but... partly I guess I don't think the emotional fakeouts are a good thing. 

And partly I feel like it makes a joke of the activism? Like, it's quite possible it's a real training technique used. But combined with the general floppiness around the activism world building, it just... it's just like a standard spy thriller. Which is fine I guess but not what I expected or wanted. 

Also, if Gumpa can call on all these extra guys for this test, why is their little group so isolated. Gumpa acts like a mentor but is supposedly not the leader? What is their internal organization anyway? What are their connections? Are they just privileged kids who decided to become anarchist [vigilantes] on their own? Are they connected to any broader movement? Have they considered and rejected less violent/illegal means, or is that not happening in this world? Would I understand better if I knew a lot (or even a little) about Thai politics? Or even if I just understood Thai?

Ok, final having a conversation about how to do activism. 

Ok I genuinely love that this... romantic? not exactly yet but there's something there... scene is White-as-Black earnestly discussing political philosophy while Sean is drunk and floppy and red faced. It's just so unique and real. 

Which maybe is why I get annoyed at the other stuff that feels less real. But I will hold judgment to the end, because I honestly don't know who's evolving in what direction. And what the final message on activist tactics/philosophy is going to be. 

I also really like the music (other than overdramatic hospital music.) 

Also! They have a beverage sponsor, and the plot is them targeting a beverage manufacturer?! Bold. 

Police brutality is brought up as well.

I like getting insights into Sean, but I don't think it works with the structure that’s been set up. Mostly we're discovering everything along with White, and then all of a sudden we'll get Sean's memory? It feels out of place. 

Also, I appreciate this version of only-one-bed. OOB as a get-along-shirt. 

These boys are beautiful in sunlight (see: Sean on the rooftop). 

Like I know it's usually good storytelling technique to not have them endlessly talking in the same place. And it adds drama to have the conflict in the moment. But also why the fuck did that not plan all this basic stuff out ahead of time? Why are they having these basic conversations at the site? There had to have been a third option. 

I guess part of what makes me anxious is I can't tell if their bad plans are because they're supposed to be inexperienced activists or if it's because of filmmaking shortcuts (or perhaps even ignorance on her part about radical activism?). 

I genuinely love that they gave this romantic moon gazing scene to a platonic pair. 

Oh poor Gram. I keep forgetting, but these boys don't know their friend is in the hospital and almost died 😞 

Episode 7

I don't know if I've mentioned this yet but I really like the cinematography. 

Sometimes I really love it!! 

See I'm glad they agree with me that Sean's plan was stupid. But why they hell aren't they discussing this beforehand? I feel like every activist group, even the most pro-destruction anarchist terrorists, has endless discussions of philosophy and strategy. Anarchists especially are not just going to follow one guy without asking questions or sharing their opinion. It's just so odd. 

Unrelatedly, I love Yok's tattoos. So hot. I unironically kind of want the bird one. Although I do not have First's biceps and deltoids. 

And I love the set design and these kids hanging out in boxers and low cut tanks all the time. The aesthetic feels very authentic. Which is why it's weird when the activism style doesn't. It's not so much that they're bad at it, but the way in which they're bad doesn't feel genuine to me. But also what do I know. I've never been part of the anarchist property destruction movement. And I don't know what it's like in Thailand obviously. 

Thank you Yok! Finally some logical strategic thinking. 

Ohhh. Interesting intersections here...

(I'm trusting this is not going to end with oh Tawi isn't so bad after all, we should be happy to be part of society etc. But if it does I will be PISSED. 

Ok. This is going somewhere interesting. Starting a movement?

(Yok's fireworks moment was ridiculous but also a wonderful image. And hot. By the way.)

Oh thank god other people. I should have had more faith in the director. 

Yay! Huge rally! But also

Where did this huge rally come from? This is not a spur of the movement reaction to their (frankly) silly little direct action thing. There have been other people planning and organizing against Tawi all along? Why are these kids so disconnected from it?  Like I believe it's plausible that they would be, I just want to understand the story there. 

The secret identity plot creates some weird constraints around the activism plot. Like in a way Sean et al are being de-radicalized? Instead of getting frustrated with the slow pace of community organizing and turning to property destruction, it seems like they started there? 

So Sean and White will meet in the middle? 

This dance!  This feels like a real protest. 

I mean, sometimes a small seeming thing will light the spark. But there also seem to have been organizers there ready to seize the moment and build the movement

And Black is clearly part of a larger movement with Eugene and her political dance. Yok & Sean and there street artists.  Will we ever find out why they were so isolated? I'm starting to have hope that we may. 

Gram is staring at Eugene. But I can't tell if it's because he's in love with her or jealous of her and in love with Black.  Was he lying to Yok about Yok not knowing the person he was in love with?

Also, why couldn't anyone see that video of Black that Eugene took? Was their relationship a secret? 

Registering protesters? I need to read up more. 

Gun does a good job of making Black seem like a different person than White, even than White pretending to be Black. 

Again I keep forgetting Black's friends don't know he's hurt and then I get sad. 

So I guess that Gram is in love with Eugene. What's with the card White found then?

When is White going to tell them all? Are they going to deal with the fact he's been hurting them all with this? 

Nuch's... PSA is what it is. It works here. Despite most of her dialogue being political statements she feels like a real person. And the didacticism of her statement on marriage equality feels good actually. It's a reminder that this film is not just about activists, but it is activism. And to put myself aside, because I'm not actually the target audience. I can watch and appreciate, but it's not about me. 

Oh my god this scene. This fucking scene. I teared up when the queer couple catwalk across the rainbow flag started. I was not expecting that.  And then Sean and White staring at each other across the flag. And walking toward each other underneath it. Sean's expression. Like he doesn't even know what to think any more. Taking his hand. And it isn't even romantic exactly. It's victory. That temporary victory. 

This is the slowest of slow burns and it feels exactly like how their story needs to be told. 

Who is Gumpa in all this, anyway? Why is he training them but not participating? 

The high of victory!

Ooh, Sean and White are sitting on the couch together...

Ok, one thing a love about this is seeing a trans or any visibly queer character I can trust the show will treat them with respect. It's such wonderful and also a relief as a viewer. 

Yikes. I was thinking why is he cooperating with the police and then he started to run, lol. Again. Love this building. Feels like a real art school.

Is this cop or whatever kind of bad guy driving product placement car? That would be hilarious and... something. 

Oh, probably not the bad guy actually. Probably the artists friend rescuing him. It's still hilarious to see him getting handcuffed against the sponsors car. 

God I love all these sets! 

Oh wait, that's the artist himself. I forgot what he looked like. And that he had the cop ID card.

Yok you flirt. First's smile is dangerous. But Yok, why are you carrying this man's wallet around with you? Have you been waiting for this very scenario to arise? 

Hmm. How are they going to handle this cop romance?  I was kinda thinking the ID card was fake. 

I'm not so sure about this other guy yet, but First can probably carry their chemistry on his own. His smile! My god. 

Yok, you flirt!  "Of course you can paint me…” I had to stop and make my terrible gif. 

Ok, maybe this INAR actor can keep up.

Halfway through and it seems the romance arcs are starting in earnest. I am pleased with this pacing I think. 

I was gonna go to bed but now I gotta see what happens now that Sean pushed his way into White as Black's room. 

Also the way Sean (nervously?) fixed his hair though the peephole was adorable. 

Episode 8 

I love the physicality of all the characters in this. They feel like real people. The way they were slouching on the couch last episode so their jackets rode up. So real. Like I feel like I went to college with these dudes at moments like that. 

This scene! The soft warm lighting. The blocking floor bed floor etc. the way they're looking at each other. The way White listens. That story. 

Ack so much adorable. The head bonk 🥺 the trust fall

There's content and awww here and I don't know what to write about first because the aww is so cute. And such a relief. The first real softness between them. 

Oh but the lying. I'm guessing White doesn't even remember he's lying right now. He means it that he wants to trust and be trusted. But it's kind of ironic considering. Will Sean be mad when I finds out Will it be addressed? I'm somewhat hopeful yes.

Although that last line sounds manipulative so I don't know what to think...

And again all I can say is:

This scene. Tears charcoal intimacy the closeups on their faces so much of the time. Inar actor you've got me convinced. The flirting to start that turns so quickly to intimacy. Yes that makes so much sense he would cry being vulnerable like that to this man of all people. Yok's reaction? To draw first and then comfort without asking questions? I'm very curious about where this regretful cop story will go. 

Everybody's spying on everybody. Which is stressful in an activist setting.  But fits the enemies to lovers with several twists thing going on.  So I don't feel bothered. 

Honestly I  think simply connecting them to a broader activist community though the rally eased all my anxieties. I don't know if my objections have been/will be solved but I feel better.

Oh yeah, I forgot about my glasses related questions. How had he been seeing this whole time? They never show him putting in contacts, he just removes the glasses and goes. Does he have a very mild prescription? Are the just for fashion? Has he just not been able to see much (seems unlikely). 

But anyways, Sean is about to figure something out, we'll see how much...

Lol, ten seconds later there's a contact lens case.

Ok but he took his advice and is trying to bite himself out of those ropes. 🤣

Oh hello mic pack holder. But I honestly do appreciate the actors' commitment to physicality. In this case squirming around on the bed. 

They are starting to get sexy together and I like it. I really appreciate the slow development of their chemistry actually. Immediate BAM! is fun,  but this fits better for them and their story and is nicely nuanced. 

Ooh I love the recall to the first day with him now unthinkingly jumping this same wall. 

Dudes. You or someone else should have made a plan for how to protest this lecture. It doesn't even need to have been a good one. But there was this whole street of organizers? And apparently Tawi is the Jeff Bezos of this version of Thailand? So someone would have tried to organize a protest, right? Thai organizing can't be that different, even with a different culture around respect? Or maybe it is???

Like I get this shows Sean's passion and anger but...

Oh forgot their last interaction was Sean leaving White-as-Black tied up. 

This really is Only One Bed: The Series. How many different places can she conspire to have them sleep together. 

Episode 9

Sex scene tender sweet and hot. Consent communication can be very sexy omg. 

This feels very different from any BL sex scene I've seen yet. More real somehow? Why? The intimacy of the tent? The way the are communicating? Maybe because White's anxiety is not about sex but about being intimate while lying about who he is. The hands! The ear bite! Maybe because I haven't seen a bl sex scene get that montage/time lapse editing yet. It was a wonderful way to make it feel like they weren't just fading to black while still not showing a lot. (Which I guess why it's commonly used technique in other film industries lol.)

Did Black wake up because his twin was fucking? I'm not even sure what to think about that. And were the tears his own or transference from White?

That heartbeat convo and the little kiss. It felt so genuinely post coital. 

They seem to be transforming from enemies into softest boyfriends ever. Which I think I'm good with.

It felt rushed in a way but then also it didn't. Like there was all this under the surface that suddenly was ready to emerge. 

I love how they got a scene with the gayest bridge but it was actually about the decaying pier. Perfect. Although I'm disproportionately annoyed by the impossible leaps. 

I'm anxious about this cop boyfriend thing. Which side of the storytelling will win out, bl's hea or activism's acab? Why was he there to rescue Yok?

Ok. Yok may be falling for the dude but at least he's being smart about not revealing their work. 

Return sad poignet (probably I meant poignant? I don’t know what I was trying to say though.) amazing acting Gun. The grief of your long lost dead brother staying closed off to you ...

De transformation. Give me my phone. (I have no idea what this comment was supposed to mean.)

Called it! about shady Todd. 

And that was all the notes I took. After episode 9 I think I was too overwhelmed by the show and my thoughts about it to write down my reactions.

[shouldiusemyname]

I saw someone on TikTok (don't come at me 🫣) saying that the bb and atots crossover eps on our skyy 2 are the result of GMMTV having something against EarthMix.

I call bs!

This is the result of P'Aof wanting to give us more of his best most beloved characters.

He knows we want more patpran and phupatian and he is more than happy to provide.

[dropthedemiurge]

Love for Love's Sake | Things you didn't notice (probably)

Finally, I am watching a good K-BL and can enjoy multi-layered meanings within language, culture and translated subs altogether (unlike with Thai series where I need to learn a new language again xD)

So I'll be pointing out some fun things that I noticed for fellow foreign viewers =) Beware of a long post!

Disclaimer: I'm not fluent in Korean, but I've been learning and using it for years + lived and studied in Korea for a while so I'm offering my perspective and knowledge but it might not be the Ultimate Truth

Episode 1

«I prefer lonely supporting characters instead of happy protagonists. Cha Yeowoon is still unhappy. ... - Where are you going? - To see my main (최애). I mean, Cha Yeowoon.»

The word Tae Myungha used to described Cha Yeowoon, as I heard, was actually 최애 (choe-ae). It's a slang that can be translated as "my favourite" and typically is used for K-pop group members, meaning "my bias" (think One True Pairing but One True Person instead). Then, as his fellow classmate gets confused, hearing such word referring to a popular student in their school, Tae Myungha changes to "I mean, Cha Yeowoon", and it works because the word and the name sound similar.

Myungha uses this word because in the intro he stated that Yeowoon is his favourite character in the book out of all. So basically, his first reaction was "- Where are you going? - I'm gonna run to find my blorbo<3", which is so admirable. I'd also get obsessed with making happy my fav side character that was treated unfairly by creators :D

«Kids like chocolate, right? ... (Yeowoon grabs an icecream, Myungha grabs the same, adding with surprise:) Didn't see that coming. Bi-Bi-Big (비비빅)? You eat like an old man.»

What surprised Myungha there? That Yeowoon chose this icecream->

It's a traditional icecream that is made out of red beans. This taste is usually associated with older people (because typically kids like sweet things and older people like less sweet/bland tastes), also red beans or read bean paste is used in many traditional desserts in Korea. Yeah, who would've thought that a high schooler would choose this icecream out of all options?

Later, Myungha gets the message "You can compare Bi-Bi-Big to big Ba-Bum-Bar (another icecream with "old man taste" from chestnuts), why the hell would you eat it?" and gets confused as the message seems missent. I am confused as well, because Myungha wasn't the one choosing this icecream and Yeowoon wasn't typing in his phone. Considering that the phone number is unknown, I can guess that it might be a commentary from the book's author who's watching Myungha playing his story game? Let's figure it out in the next episodes!

«- You eat like an old man. - Do you play sports? - No. - Weird. You're a whiner like I've always heard. - Kids these days have no manners.»

My quick translation->

«- You eat like an old man. - Sunbae, do you play sports? - No. - Strange. You sound like one of those older jerks (꼰대). - Kids these days have no manners.»

More on the differences between Tae Myungha and Cha Yeowoon:

Myungha tried to poke Yeowoon about his "old man tastes", and Yeowoon called him out for his conservative/stereotypical thinking.

Yeowoon keeps calling Myungha sunbae (because he knows MH's a senior in their school so he must be polite), and Myungha REALLY TALKS LIKE AN OLD MAN to him ("Kids these days" in the subs does translate this style of speech correctly! I'm glad). We all know he's much older before he was thrown into high school times (~25-30yo?), but his words and intonations really make you feel like he's 50-60yo or something xD

Yeowoon doesn't like this at all, though, so he calls Myungha a sort of derogatory term 꼰대 (kkondae), which is used to described old conservative people who are set in their ways and keep nagging and scolding young people for not behaving properly. And, as a runner, he implies that there are senior sportsmen that are hazing or nagging younger sportsmen like this as well, that's who Myungha reminds him of. No wonder the affection stats fell down in the minus zone so hard!

There you go, guys, these are my comments on the first episode of Love for Love's sake! It is filmed so well, I like the idea, and I really enjoyed it (if this one gets really popular just like Semantic Error, we might get more BLs about gamers or gamedevs and I WILL LOVE IT I am so here for it, hehe)

Stay tuned for more as I watch next episodes :]

[absolutebl]

Hii I've seen in your weekly windup that you're watching For Him, I had a linguistic question where i think i keep hearing Him say 'kha' when he ends a sentence. Is it just me or is that just the way he says khrab or is he actually saying kha? Please help i didn't know who else to ask about linguistics! Thank you!!

He's using the "ha" particle.

It's a version of kha, but also something a bit different. It's a softening of politeness, household intimate but not rude, warm. It's also a touch feminine, straight men flirting with their girlfriends or at home with wives may use the ha. Brothers with younger sisters. For example Phun uses ha with his beloved little sister in Love Sick.

It's also used by... gay men with each other. (So is ja, but ja is more camp and harsh.)

There's a kind of pulling back on tough masculinity with the use of ha. It's also pretty linguistically modern. So it's more common with younger generations. In Bangkok you'll hear it paired with borrowed words, especially English ones. For example: okay ha.

What's interesting about Him, is that he used ha with Nail RIGHT away. He didn't start polite, he jumped right into ha. This told Nail instantly that Him was a probubly a player and that he was gay. Note Him has never gone back? He always uses ha with Nail, he's the only character I've ever heard do this in a BL. Usually ha is situational and circumstantial. For special occasions not everyday wear.

I love it. It's a very telling characteristic and personality trait. It says a lot about Him and how hard he is trying to make this second relationship work.

It also makes him very very slightly... sleazy.

Incidentally, Nail avoided polite particles all together, he's rude and curt, as a kind of flirtation.

FYI. Men will also use kha on women, especially when flirting or with MUCH younger girls. For example when Pete (very VERY polite character) meets Ae's toddler niece he uses kha in Love By Chance.

(source)

[squeakygeeky]

Calling all BL academics! You should check out Intersections: Gender and Sexuality in Asia and the Pacific Issue 49, June 2023. It's devoted to Thai BL and it's Thai scholars, publishing in English, and available free. So basically everything I ever wanted.

Thai Boys Love (BL)/Y(aoi) in Literary and Media Industries: Political and Transnational Practices - This is the introductory article. One interesting takeaway is that there's a market for western M/M romance in Thailand and I'm dying to know what sort of titles have gotten Thai releases.

Chinese Historical BL by Thai Writers: The Thai BL Polysystem in the Age of Media Convergence - I didn't read this one. It's about the phenomenon of Thai writers writing danmei set in ancient China.

Authorial Revisions of Boys Love/Y Novels: The Dialogue between Activism and the Literary Industry in Thailand - This one was super intersting. It was about how the backlash to certain problematic tropes affected both revisions to Y novels and their tv adaptations. It uses Jittirain as a case study and includes passages from 2gether that were rewritten.

Boys Love (Yaoi) Fandom and Political Activism in Thailand - This article has a lot about Not Me, both about the backlash to the novle due to it being originally a GOT7 fanfic (allegedly) and the political context for the series. It also discusses a few other series related to the youth movement and marriage equality.

Heterosexual Reading vs. Queering Thai Boys' Love Dramas among Chinese and Filipino Audiences -This really only covers up to 2019 and as we all know everything is changing fast. I'll be interested in future scholarship that covers the current period. Basically expands on some of Baudinette's work.

Provincialising Thai Boys Love: Queer Desire and the Aesthetics of Rural Cosmopolitanism -I just skimmed this since I'm not familiar with either series mentioned or the rural culture of Isan.

[scarefox]

(link)

translation by  @BE_LookNooh

Recently, the whole world have more awareness on equity. But many organization aware of the rainbow washing problem which I agreed to aware and be more understood about it. (1)

(2) But the campaigns of this month also widen the view, the realization and how the treated unfairly. Before you deciding on the morality of a brand or organization, may you recall that if they have ever give support to the lgbtqia, ...

3) or they just make a market plan according to the trend. If they treated the lgbtqia community with significant and equality, we'd not would reject if they wanna do market plan with this. But if not, the consumers will decide on what you are doing.

(4) For those campaigns targeting the private sectors and indivials understandable of the problems that lgbtqia facing, the main power is the government. They should provide resources, welfares, and laws that allow the equity and equality to the people of all difference to get...

(5) ...the fair result. In the future of 10 or 100 years later, maybe we don't have to talk about these when the social stop discriminate like until now. And we'd only just commemorate how we fought for it.

(6) But now, as there are still inachieved. The process of ignite the realization, the claim for justice would still go on. #HappyPrideMonth ���‍🌈

[thebroccolination]

“IF NO ONE ACCEPTS YOU, YOU HAVE ME”

Lately I’ve seen the narrative around Krist shifting from “he’s homophobic” to “he was homophobic, but he got better :)” so!

Let’s go back to a moment in 2017 during a ceremony where Krist and Singto accepted an award from the Thai branch of the gay magazine Attitude (now defunct). That’s the magazine that published this photoshoot:

[Attitude, 2018, promoting SOTUS S] (they also did one in 2016 for SOTUS)

Krist said that a friend of his once came out to his parents, and the parents wouldn’t accept him, so Krist told his friend, “It’s okay. If no one accepts you, you have me, and I accept you for who you are.”

So, yes, Krist was hotheaded when people kept harassing him about his sexuality, but can anyone truly blame him? No one looks at all the times he answered politely. Just the one time he broke. [EDIT: I just spoke with someone who was there when the infamous IG story was posted, and they said: “Krist's tone and demeanour when he emphatically said "no" was like, y'know, still friendly. It's like when friends tease you relentlessly and you say ‘no’ more forcefully to get them to stop?” And that actually was my first impression of it back in 2020—a joke that landed badly. And it lines up with his first apology: that he felt badly because his answer was taken out of context.]

There are people today who film these guys at the urinal. Who treat them like property because of money and time spent on them. Who hire trucks to drive around their company building making demands. And it’s 2024. GMMTV has legal teams on this stuff now. But you and I can’t imagine what kind of invasiveness Krist and Singto went through in 2016 as one of the first pairs in the BL industry to gain overnight fame and rabid, unprecedented focus from millions. Of course he snapped. It’s widely known that fans and reporters target Krist over Singto to get information even today because Singto never gives anyone the satisfaction of a reaction, but Krist is a people-pleaser and truly struggles with saying no to people. He’s always been the emotional one, the one who overthinks, the one desperate to make people happy. And when fans wanted to force KristSingto to publicly say that they were secretly dating, fans thought they could get Krist to break first, and they were right. (Personally, I always thought the Instagram story was an exaggerated joke that was a barely veiled “drop it.” EDIT: I’m glad at least one person who was there at the time can corroborate this.)

Then interfans came along, marked him as an easy target, and maliciously miscast him as a bigot to wave after wave of new interfans who never bothered to research further after a random person on the internet told them he’s a homophobe.

Krist asked his parents for their blessing to audition for SOTUS when he was still a teenager. He was afraid of what they’d think, but because his parents are lovely people, they supported him. And they still do. Krist’s father has a running joke that he’ll let Krist marry Singto if Singto brings a durian for the dowry.

I never included Singto in my clarification thread because I knew how quickly people would dismiss anything with Singto as conniving, tricksy fanservice. But you really don’t know anything about Krist until you see him with people he considers his safe spaces. That includes people like Mike. Like Gawin. Godji. Oat. These people who love him because he’s earned it.

I know I talk about this a lot. But I won’t ignore it when people try to twist his character, especially with I see them making assumptions about the premise of Ex-Morning. All I believe is that he was angry and afraid and overwhelmed. Then he reacted, apologized, and learned how to handle the fame and the invasiveness better.

Please stop trying to claw marrow out of a past mirage.