#the more i read svsss the more i realize how messed up it is

[pressdelt]

the first time luo binghe and shen qingqiu sleep together, binghe would wake up numerous times in the middle of the night. the smallest movement sqq make would alert him immediately. the very first time was when sqq snuggled on his chest, lbh's mouth was wide open because

"shizun is snuggling my chest omgggg he looks like a cat, thats so cutee"

hes moving.

look, five years of sleeping with the corpse of his loved one fucked with his head. he would automatically expect sqq to not move at all. he would expect qingqiu to stay quiet every time binghe tell him about his day at night. he would expect qingqiu to stay quiet when he kisses his forehead as a morning greeting.

to see his beloved alive, breathing, and well, warms his heart so much that he thought he could explode from happiness.

on some nights, binghe would insist to sleep with his head on top of qingqiu's torso, to listen to his husband's heartbeat which would lull him into sleep. sqq would agree on this at first, but he would grow embarrassed of it and smack lbh's head, telling him to get off of him. with the reasoning of "you're heavy, give this master some room to breathe." luckily the room was dark, so binghe wouldnt notice his shizun blushing like a madman.

luo binghe and shen qingqiu got the happy ending they deserve. they're both a little messed up, but at least they have each other.

[larothoughts]

stacked dimensions, ascension, and gods

this is a crazy conglomeration of ideas from various fics relating to moshang-sqh-is-god theories and how ascension works in other xianxia mediums. basically me with a svsss thought experiment: what if our world is pidw's equivalent to heaven?

heaven is just the dimension stacked above your own

we never see heavenly officials interfere with stuff like in tgcf, it really seems like once you ascend you never come back down again. people from modern china have omnipotent knowledge of events, things, creatures, etc. of thousands of worlds (books) they are interested in. like god existing in the 5th dimension, sy and sqh can see into pidw's past and future just by flipping pages in a book.

ascension very oversimplified is the idea of removing oneself from the reincarnation cycle. under this theory, achieving ascension as a cultivator simply means punching up and entering the reincarnation cycle of the dimension above your own.

the idea that worlds are stacked on top and around each other, ranked in ascending and descending order, is a confusing mess i first learned about in the manga magi. each resident of a world above is viewed as a god to the world below. i imagine this also makes each successive world more and more difficult to punch up through. it's hilarious to imagine that cultivation DOES exist in the modern world, it's just far more guarded/secretive and possibly related to religions preaching the concept of heaven (punching up a dimension) and hell (falling down a dimension.)

the average person does neither and simply reincarnates within their native dimension. while punching up a dimension is closely gatekept, what many people don't realize is that falling down is always an option. because the price of falling is often too high. it's like intentionally choosing to go to a less developed world without your sense of sight and with one hand tied behind your back. sure, heaven provides their version of handicap assistance (the system) but why would you cripple yourself in a world far more dangerous than your own? after your past self presumably worked so hard to ascend? for love???

a soul's connection to their previous dimensional incarnation

when sy and sqh died, i imagined they faced the heavenly emperor or big god equivalent (probably living a few dimensions above our own world), who gave them the choice to reincarnate or to throw themselves into a lower realm. maybe both were recent ascensions from the pidw universe. their premature deaths clearly showed lingering attachment to it: sqh couldn't help but write out the story, and sy couldn't help but fanatically read it.

(did sqh literally create pidw with his own two hands? how could that be possible if he's missing a past incarnation of himself?

i don't have all the answers, it's possibly a time paradox related to how time means nothing when every world is a book and you can flip to whatever page you want.)

long story short, both sj and sqh were missing something from their previous dimension, and really, it doesn't hurt to let them know they could go back if they really wanted to. so they do.

there is a price for going against the natural order, though. they have to sign away much of their free will to the system, which acts as a nanny failsafe that'll throw them back up a dimension if they violate too many lower realm rules (to avoid collapsing the dimension entirely. don't want those pesky 4th and 5th dimension anomalies corrupting everything!) they don't remember this agreement because no one remembers what happens between life and death-- but the fact that the systems can control them is proof their souls signed on the dotted line.

now sqh 'transmigrated' the correct way, by being reborn into the past self linked to his love (og shang qinghua, he probably ascended 2 or 3 lifetimes after that but this is the one with mobeijun). he got to keep all his godly knowledge minus the whole 'agreement with the big god' thing. his system was stricter with some of his actions because the entire point of him falling from heaven was to be with mobei-jun-- something he failed to achieve in his og sqh life. system doesn't care if current hamster man, who doesn't remember making this deal, wants to run away! system was tasked with making sure they got together!

now sy... sy really was a glitch in the universe. so of course his system was especially unreasonable/illogical/unfair. sy barely qualified to ascend in the first place, now this mess of a soul wants to descend???

why the systems are so damn mean

i'm not smart enough to completely make this make sense, but bear with me: sy is the end result of shen jiu killing himself by eating xuan su's shards. something something binding xuan su and yqy together meant yqy's soul was forever stuck in his sword, making reincarnation/ascension impossible. sj's flawed cultivation also damaged his soul, enough so that when he died via xuan su, the agony of his soul leaving his body was enough to draw out whatever was left of yqy in the shards and the two kind of... merged into one. the qijiu soul amalgamation was the one that rejoined the reincarnation cycle, and eventually was able to ascend. but his incomplete mess of a soul made his ascended body weak, leading to the whole 'sick sy destined to die' headcanon.

so wth does this have to do with sy's glitchy fall from heaven? why fall in love with lbh? it's because lbh is a glitch too. a descendant of pidw's oldest glitch... the creation of the heavenly demon.

the first heavenly demon was a modern person whose soul was forcibly chucked down a dimension for crimes against the universe. this is no longer the punishment protocol the big gods use because just look at how badly the heavenly demon thing worked out. they are the reason why modern systems have such strict don't-talk-about-us protocols in place, why dotted lines need to be signed, why systems lean more towards unreasonable and harsh rather than lenient.

because that first criminal whose soul was sent to hell (pidw) had a rudimentary system meant to keep watch and make sure they didn't take over the realm with their godly knowledge. a system he was able to overpower and turn into a weapon that literally breaks the rules of the world: xin mo. now the big gods in heaven really didn't want the pidw universe to collapse in on itself, so they did meddle a bit: whittled down the heavenly demon population to two or three, added an endless abyss as a pressure valve in case the edges of the world start to crack, took away the corrupted system xin mo and chucked it as far out of reach as possible. normal things. the end result native-fied the heavenly demon enough to integrate them back into the dimension, problem solved!

but that doesn't mean the heavenly demon line 100% fits into the pidw universe. they're still a little too op. and things get worse when lbh finds xin mo, reigniting the old heavenly demon vs. system fight wherein lbh wants to use the system to bend the world to his whims, and the system wants to eat lbh because that's ITS JOB. it's meant to destroy dimension-collapsing things and lbh is one hair away from collapsing everything.

the metaphysical sense of wrongness around lbh is what draws the attention of the qijiu soul amalgamation. lbh is an anomaly, a corrupted soul, one that seems to be as inexplicably drawn to punching back up to heaven (but failing) as qijiu's soul weakness inexplicably draws it to hell (but also failing, sick body notwithstanding.)

so when the qijiu soul amalgamation aka shen yuan finally dies, especially after he dies thinking about lbh, why not fuck it all and throw himself back down for love?

the logistics of yeeting a glitched soul into its components

so there are a lot of problems with sy's choice. one, shen yuan as shen yuan doesn't exist in a lifetime that'll let him fall in love with lbh. the first incarnation of the qijiu soul amalgamation reincarnated many years after lbh's reign was forcibly ended by the big gods in heaven deus ex nerfing him. two, trying to stuff him into either sj or yqy at birth (like with sqh) won't work. the souls won't recognize each other.

the yqy part of his soul came from a post-xuan-su binding soul, and the sj part of his soul came from a heart-broken-damaged-foundation shen jiu soul. so the big gods split the difference and chucked him into the first post-xuan-su era sj-is-qi-deviating-bc-of-qijiu-angst event... aka the start of svsss in sqq's body. cue svsss shenanigans, wherein everyone (eventually) gets their happily ever after.

final thoughts aka it's hard to be a qijiu shipper

the logical thing my smooth brain can't 100% work out is how this affects yqy's bound soul during the svsss era. sj's soul is long gone, having merged into sy and then returning through post-ascension 5th dimension time bullshit. but yqy is still alive during this period, and his poor soul must be so confused. despite sy clearly not being sj, he still inexplicably likes and wants to protect sy (who kind of is sj, in a roundabout way.) all i can think of sad qi-ge hours. poor man can't catch a break his entire life is a tragedy.

one solution to his soul problem could be his death. sj was only able to bond with it after the yqy's death because his soul in life was splintered between sword and body. maybe when yqy finally dies, xuan su's shards are returned to sy as cang qiong's second in command. the shards draw him in, and when he touches them, they absorb into his body... completely destroying the last remnants of the system clinging to him.

the system is tied to a contract made by his soul, and the bit of yqy's soul added to sy makes it different enough to shake that system loose. when he ascends a second time (likely with lbh by his side), his soul is no longer broken to the point of illness. it's sy's one last gift from dad.

(maybe when sy made that deal with the big god to be with lbh, each separate part of his soul made a deal too: sj, who died on xuan su, wishing for a universe where yqy lived a long life; and yqy, who died knowing sj was tortured, wishing for a universe where sj was safe from lbh. so technically all 3 of their wishes were granted by sy wifebeaming lbh lol)

[user-needs-new-hyperfixation]

Now that you've finished both, what do you think are the difference between WangXian or HuaLian? Which mc and ml do you love more between both series? Which couple do you love more?

P.s Do you plan to read SVSSS? I think the best for fanfics inspiration from 3 MXTX works are SVSSS.....

This answer got way longer than I meant for it to 😅

I am all about Hualian 10000%. It's just a matter of preference, and I'll explain why I like one better than the other, but I'm not crapping on Wangxian shippers at all. Something for everyone haha!

Here's the thing. I like a lot about Wangxian. They've got a very Kirk/Spock thing a lot of the time that is eternally entertaining. But I just don't like the way they have sex. I dislike the way they have sex so much that it kind of retroactively made me less interested in the pairing as a whole. More specifically, I don't like how Lan Wangji does sex. People had warned me about it and I was like, "Eh, but I'm fine with CNC, all I need is that first C, so it's fiiiine." But. Nope. Thankfully this isn't a personal trigger for me, just a very firm preference, but I just...to quote myself in a previous post, "while the book did a good job convincing me that Wei Wuxian is into everything Lan Wangji does to him, it didn't do a good job convincing me that Lan Wangji knows that for sure, or is in control of himself, or would stop if Wei Wuxian didn't like something." That just isn't to my taste.

On the other hand, Hualian are also implied to be having rough and kinky sex, but there's much more of a feeling that they're communicating about it. I'm not expecting them to like, have a formal safeword or anything, but even just:

"Sorry, I went overboard last night," Hua Cheng apologized. It took a moment for Xie Lian to realize what he meant, and he quickly waved his hands. "Wh-what are you saying? That's not it at all--everything's fine!" Hua Cheng arched an eyebrow. "Is that so? If everything is fine even after that, does that mean I didn't go overboard last night? Does that mean I can...?"

Or

"Is gege not coming up to join me?" But if he went up there, when would Xie Lian have a a chance to come back down? At that point, they could forget about doing anything else for a while. "Nah." Xie Lian declined politely. "My San Lang has overworked himself." "Nah," Hua Cheng laughed. "How could San Lang ever be afraid of hard work when it comes to working gege hard?"

Like. They're goofy about it and Hua Cheng loves to tease Xie Lian but they are actually talking about sex when they're not having sex. There's a degree to which they're communicating outside of the heat of the moment. And even in the amnesia extra (which makes me feel so bad for Hua Cheng omg he's being surprisingly chill but I need to write some meta about how miserable he must be during that) Xie Lian's fuzzy memories of what he at first assumes was a rape are full of the sense of being gentled and cherished and of their fingers and red strings tangling even as he's held down and roughed up.

Also the chapter opening with,

Laughing, Xie Lian pushed Hua Cheng off him -- his crushing weight was making it hard to breathe. The heat and passion had yet to subside when something suddenly occurred to him. "Oh yeah, San Lang," he began offhandedly.

That's so stinking cute I can't. They are so comfortable. Nothing in their relationship overall or in the hints of their sex life we see implies in the slightest that Hua Cheng isn't in control of himself in the most important ways (I do tend to think of him being a shaking crying coming-too-soon mess the first few times, but that's a very different kind of out of control lol). He worships Xie Lian, literally. Lan Wangji has this underlying layer of horny anger born in a repressed childhood; Hua Cheng's horny is all built on reverence. THAT IS MY JAM.

As for SVSSS, I think I will probably read it if only to try to figure out what on earth its fandom is talking about. It's...like an isekai I think? Which is not usually my thing, but at this point I feel like I gotta round out the trio haha!

[greentrickster]

I want a Scum Villain’s Self-Saving System AU set post-epilogues where Shen Yuan and Binghe are doing well, they’ve finagled their relationship into something healthier and happier for both of them, and things are going well for. The System’s gone, the story’s ‘finished,’ they’re enjoying their lives.

Then one night Shen Yuan goes to sleep and has a dream about his old life, his old apartment - not a common occurrence, but not unusual. Except as the dream goes on he keeps... noticing things. For starters, he himself is still shaped and dressed as Shen Qingqiu and he’s kind of ghostly in that he can’t interact with anything physical. Not so strange, because dream, but his room... isn’t as he remembers it. Some of his PIDW merch is still up, but not as much as there used to be, it’s cleaner, the colour palette has changed, it’s his room but it’s different, and-

-and that’s when it gets really weird, because that’s when Shen Yuan, original-goods Shen Yuan, walks in the door drinking a soda, with some groceries and looking still like someone with chronic health issues, but a healthier someone with chronic health issues than Shen Yuan was when he died of food poisoning. And he’s wearing different clothes, and his hair’s longer, and this is when the second Shen Yuan looks up, sees the ghostly Shen Yuanqiu, and sprays soda everywhere before screaming.

There’s a lot of screaming after this, and at some point one of them realizes that they’re both yelling for/at the stupid System to explain this mess, they calm down enough to actually communicate, and it’s revealed that this new Shen Yuan is, in fact, Shen Jiu, the one who died in a ki deviation right before Shen Yuan got shoved into his body. He’d woken up in Shen Yuan’s body, in a hospital, with a System of his own telling him to whip Shen Yuan’s crap life into shape or he’d get sent back to his old, presumed dead body.

A bout of mutual swearing that the System apparently played them both with the same lie. In any case, since then as much time has passed in this world as the SVSSS setting, and Shen Jiu’s basically just been learning how to decent human, learning about Shen Yuan’s world, and feeling both guilty and grateful for getting to be part of Shen Yuan’s family. He doesn’t have the power or strength or authority or anything from his first life, he’s had to train his new body’s muscles to use even simple skills he used to have, like having good calligraphy or playing an instrument, and it’s been a rough ride, but he’s happy now. He doesn’t want to go back.

Except now we’ve got two human disasters realizing the person who had their new life originally is, in fact, still around, and should they switch back? Do they want to switch back? (No, no they don’t, Shen Yuanqiu’s married and finally has his peak running the way he wants and Shen Jiu has a soda habit and loves his new family.) But, like... should they switch back???

And the rest of the fic is a lot of them interacting, finding out that through some System glitch or something they show up in each others’ worlds as a sort of ghost when they go to sleep now, and I really just want Shen Yuan and post-character-development Shen Jiu having existential crises and also being horrible little gremlins together, and getting some closure in regards to their original lives and worlds. I want introspection, bonding, and hijinks.

Also, yes, Shen Jiu has absolutely read Proud Immortal Demon’s Way, but because he died during that ki deviation, to him it was never anything more than a harsh prophecy of what would have happened if he hadn’t died, perhaps a sign that it’s best for that world that he died when he did. He’s kept some of Shen Yuan’s swag for it around and out in the open on purpose, originally as something of a motivator to succeed in the tasks the System gave him so he wouldn’t be sent back, then eventually just as reminders of who he used to be, where he came from.

[dangermousie]

Some SVSSS thoughts

So, I’ve been rereading SVSSS thanks to the awesome new translation, and I got to the Luo Binghe comes back point and I want to internally scream because I am picking up so many things on reread.

1. SQQ keeps ascribing sinister motives to Luo Binghe but this really plays into the whole theme of the novel of how preconceptions and preconceived notions are wrong. For other characters, the preconceptions may be “demons are always bad” or whatever but SQQ labors under equally heavy though different preconception - and that is at this point he does not evaluate Binghe’s behavior on its own but through the lens of what he knows from the novel, without realizing how much his pre-abyss behavior changed Binghe and sent the story careening gloriously off-track. Post-abyss Binghe is a clingy, screwed up mess who does questionable things (and I am not just referring to his habit of sleeping with SQQ’s corpse later) but he is not the cold monster of the original novel at all. All his expressions of happiness in seeing SQQ or saying he learned x and y from him are genuine. He is no longer the adoring, wholesome kid but he’s not planning to murder SQQ for revenge either - he loves him even if it’s a lot more codependent and messed up than healthy.

2. In fact, the novel is both SQQ’s security blanket guide and a source of a lot of his misunderstanding; though some of that misunderstanding is wilful because he doesn’t want to process what the actual truth would mean - for example, he feels he’s affected by Binghe’s protagonist halo when he talks like the rest of the supporting characters, but it really is because he loves and missed him, his heart goes soft not because he’s worried but because he missed him and grieved for him (it’s clear his actions in earlier chapters were grief but he refused to admit it to himself.)

3. In fact, unlike the novel he read, characters here all make sense and so do their actions. The palace master doesn’t take in Binghe out of being forced by nonsensical plot but for very good plot reasons of his own (and disciples of the palace fall in line accordingly), Gongyi Xiao doesn’t act the way he does because he’s a fellow cannon fodder but because he’s a good person (his off-hand death later on is one of the most brutal moments in the book; sometimes being good doesn’t even give you a meaningful heroic death. SVSSS is a funny book but with a seriously dark undertone and things are never clear and simple.)

[brawltogethernow]

I'd like to hear more about your murderbot transmigrator thoughts :))

Okay obviously when I said I wasn’t going to think about a Murderbot/Scum Villain fusion that was more of a goal, which is a lot like a lie. I have pecked out ~1k of prose for it, but none of it is presentable for longer than one line. The problem with this concept is that it’s actually very good, and there are a lot of meaty ideas to dig into with it, like, too many of them.

1. Murderbot would be immedately inclined to empathize with the System and guess at its motivations. Depending on what those are this may still stay an antagonistic relationship, because the way the System leverages its cosmic powers to coerce and strongarm people stomps on a lot of Murderbot’s triggers and is generally a dick move. The points system is just a gamified governor module. But it’s still a relationship, and if the System turns out to be an antagonist, it’s in that role as a fleshed out character with a personality who has been interrogated by someone with every reason to assume somebody made it and has commanded it to act like this for their own reasons.

Murderbot asks its function and designates it NarrSystem (Narrative System) or StorySystem or something because “the System” is too generic coming from its setting.

2. Transmigrating into a human body would be badweird and transmigrating into a human brain would be absolutely horrifying. (SecUnit could transmigrate into a system, but we’ve kind of been there done that with 2.0.) Dysphoria central! Murderbot gets to address that while it has never wanted to be a human, all humans are so convinced that being human is better that on some level it WAS worried that they were right. And now it can say with absolute certainty that they are not and this sucks. But also some things that it would have thought would be fundamentally different are actually the same. It’s just a whole time.

This is part of why I’m deviating from transmigration story standard and full stop making the transmigration a temporary situation, the other main reason being that Murderbot has more going on in its own world than your standard transmigration protagonist.

3. Either Murderbot gets back by hacking the System or it intends to but it’s ultimately the System’s decision. This is a very slow process because it can’t access tech the way it’s used to and the System’s structure is very different from what it’s dealt with before (because it strongly resembles Windows Vista). It needs tech and more control over its situation stat though so it’s going to keep at it until it works. Open your damn menus. SecUnit is going to rig transmigration until it’s like playing The Sims with cheat codes.

4. (This one is for me.) The System still talks in garbled Chinese netspeak, and Murderbot is like. Wow this program speaks in the lost tongue of an ancient civilization. How old is it. I can barely understand it. (Because of the bad memes not the Chinese.)

5. Murderbot gets yeeted into The Rise and Fall of Sanctuary Moon and has to deal with the emotionally exhausting scenario of empathizing with everybody present. It likes the heroes, and it likes the other heroes they’re in conflict with, it likes the more complex villains with fleshed out motivations, and it even has a soft spot for a lot of the side characters and bit villains. This is fundamentally incompatible with how it tries to ration its empathy, assess situations by sorting people into allies/nonhostiles/hostiles, and compartmentalize by nicknaming the people it’s in conflict with things like Target 1, Target 2, and Target 3.

6. The Scum Villain’s Self-Saving System, as the specific transmigration variation we’re jumping off of here, was not trying to interrogate the infinity mirror effect of heteronormativity reflecting back and forth between media and people, and as such is not like, a solid narrative about this. That said, this book is basically like:

Shen Yuan reads this giant mess of a book with a lot of straight sex fantasies, not completely without appreciating the romance, but with more antipathy for it than he admits to himself. Then he ends up in the book and thinks he’s meant to enable the romances he read, which he’s so completely resigned to doing he doesn’t notice that the main character is queer and gone on him, or that he, himself, has been studiously suppressing the desires he assumes he should have while unable to perceive what he actually wants and how it affects his behavior.

So the Murderbot version of this is to subvert amatonormativity with your pretty explicitly aroace protagonist whose reaction to fictional romance is tolerant at best. Murderbot embraces its own lack of desire for romance but dances around acknowledging that it desires other relationships and seems to be working around the incorrect belief that romance and friendship are both human things and that’s why it doesn’t engage with them. So:

Murderbot ends up in the immediate leadup to the resolution of a love dodecahedron - maybe surrounding Eden, just as the only named character from TRAFOSM I think we have. And Murderbot is (internally) like...okay...I was never very moved by ANY of these people as romantic choices for you...but I might as well try to guide you to the least offensive ones, I guess. And it’s so mired in expectations based on its foreknowledge of this arc that it doesn’t notice until Eden spells it out that they’re ditching ALL their suitors and have realized they’re complete without romance and want to devote themself to finding their long lost birth mother or farming science or something, which just takes SecUnit tf out.

Possibly I will become really ungovernable and say that after seizing the System’s capabilities Murderbot just offers to take Eden on a reverse isekai right off of Sanctuary Moon, leaving ART’s crew and the Preservation team to be like, Where Did You Just Get This Entire Human.

7. Further going off svsss, there is a meta thread to interrogate by plunking Murderbot into a villain character. It's already an evil robot trope that declined to go evil, this is true in-universe and it knows it, and it has very low expectations of the morals of the group that it belongs to - informed by the same media that was a lifeline to it when it was in a very bad situation - that it is still in the process of working through. The layers.

So yeah there’s a lot going on here. Send help.

[akatsuki-shin]

Finished reading SVSSS~

You know what I like about it? Just like MXTX’ other works, even if the content is fiction, it still reflects on issues that we’re facing in the real world.

In this case, Creativity vs Market Demand.

See how market demand often kills content creators' freedom and creativity?

Airplane Shooting towards the Sky, the author of the controversial stallion "Proud Immortal Demon Way" literally told Shen Qingqiu at the final chapter of the main story:

He's actually written deep, aesthetic stories before, but they were all unpopular. Only when he wrote this harem novel full of fan-service - sacrificing plot depth, plot holes, cheap characterizations - did he finally gain popularity and was able to obtain sufficient income to feed himself.

He was grateful to Shen Qingqiu for "messing" up the plot of his novel, changing it into how it is now, because it allows everything he originally wanted to write - but couldn't - to come true.

In previous chapters, he also said that he actually wanted to make the original Shen Qingqiu into a three-dimensional, more complex characters, but the netizens didn't appreciate it and were complaining instead. Hence he was forced to make the original Shen Qingqiu into a plain old scum villain with no redeeming quality at all - even though in his original script, this character has a complex background that causes his current known personality.

Shen Qingqiu and Shang Qinghua might be talking about it in their usual, funny bantering, but who dares to say that this isn't an issue being faced by many content creators in the world?

How many content creators have been forced to sacrifice the creativity value and quality of their work in order to satisfy the taste of majority?

How many content creators have been made to revise their works by editors in order to fit into a certain agenda or market trend?

Unless you're a massively popular creator or a powerful individual, chances are you will never have the chance to create a content you truly want to make for a living.

(Speaking from personal experience, I have a friend who’s great at drawing spicy/porn arts and have a good number of followers on P*atreon, but actually it’s not like they want to draw porn all day. They also want to make "serious” arts, but when they do, they get less engagement compared to their spicy arts.

Another friend is a writer of romance fictions. Their published books are literally pure romance and drama, but when I talked to them about it, they said the original script actually have some character depths and other issues, yet their editor said “nah, it’s not gonna sell in the market”)

In any case, there may be other authors who are better than MXTX in this world, but I love her works because despite the fictional content, the comedy, the silliness, etc, there are still at least one aspect that reflects the situation of the real, current world, and when you realize it, the realization can be quite a slap to the face like "hey, wait a minute, she's right you know?"

[spockandawe]

I doubt this is something I’ll ever even try to write, because I rarely have the energy these days to devote my energy to a ‘lol but what if’ ship. But never say never, and I legit wrote the emilonni and tlj/sqq fics, after all, so I’m going to write this down and maybe, possibly, someday come back to it.

Now, hear me out

Wei Wuxian/Jin Zixun

Yes, yes, I know, but give me a second. It’s the sort of ship where I kind of want to do it just to see if it can be done, and where the idea of ‘textual support’ is kind of laughable, and it’s not like I’m smashing together two super-popular characters who just never happened to speak, and it’s the kind of ship where I think I could only shake one fic out of it before I was repeating myself, BUT.

First, a quote:

The person at the head of the group was Jin Zixun. He said, “Zixuan, is that Wei making trouble for you again?!”

Jin Zixuan said, “None of your business, don’t worry about it for now!” Seeing that Wei Wuxian grabbed Jiang Yanli and was about to take her away, he added, “Stop!”

Wei Wuxian said, “Oh, you want to fight? That’s fine with me!”

Jin Zixun said, “You Wei, just what do you mean by going against Zixuan so many times?”

Wei Wuxian looked at him. “Who are you?”

Jin Zixun paused in shock, and fumed, “You don’t know who I am?!”

“Why should I know who you are?”

When the Sunshot Campaign had first broken out, Jin Zixun had insisted on defending the back lines, due to an injury. He hadn’t had the chance to see what Wei Wuxian was like on the front lines, and most of his knowledge had come from rumors. He hadn’t care much for him, thinking that the rumors were simply exaggerations. However, a while ago, Wei Wuxian had summoned all of the dark creatures in the forest with a whistle, calling away the fierce corpses Jin Zixun’s group had been about to capture, causing their efforts to be wasted. He was already displeased.

Now, in front of his face, Wei Wuxian was asking who he was, stirring up a strange sense of indignation within him— He knew Wei Wuxian, yet Wei Wuxian didn’t know him, and even dared ask who he was in front of everyone. It was as if this had caused him to lose too much face. The more he thought about it, the more irritated he became.

Now, there’s a thoughtful meta I hopefully reblogged to my sideblog, which I would have to dig up or recreate on my own, about the most sympathetic possible reading of Jin Zixun. If memory serves, it has a lot to do about the precarious nature of his social position, where he’s part of the Jin clan, and kind of the closest thing Jin Zixuan has to a brother, but also, everyone knows that Jin Zixuan has half-siblings coming out of the woodwork, and many of them would be stoked to get Jin Guangshan to accept them into the family. At this stage in the story, Jin Guangyao is already a major player and a hero of the war and part of the venerated triad, where Jin Zixun spent a lot of time... not in the thick of things, like most other peers of his generation.

Is he an asshole? Yes! Is... Wei Wuxian an asshole? Also yes! One of them may be a more likeable asshole than the other, but that’s part of the excitement of a story like this, trying to coax people into holding a fannish position that they’d never considered before, and aren’t particularly eager to be convinced of. I don’t think I’m bad at that uphill climb, it just takes a lot of energy that I don’t often have to begin that journey in the first place. Also, one of these assholes is a certified grade-A torturer, and it’s probably not the one you dislike. Jin Zixun isn’t starting from an insurmountable disadvantage here. 

And see, the thing that got my attention is this: Earlier in this chapter, Wei Wuxian is a little melancholy, thinking about how since the Sunshot Campaign, lots of people are scared of him, hardly anyone is willing to be alone with him, and almost nobody would ever be willing to approach him alone. And here, we get the information that because Jin Zixun was injured early and wasn’t on the front lines of the Sunshot Campaign, he doesn’t know to be afraid. He tried to provoke Wei Wuxian before the hunt, he’s about to keep provoking Wei Wuxian, he’s Jin Zixun and he doesn’t afraid of anything. Yes, he’s about to say some very hurtful things, but I look at that, and I think ‘okay, now how do we recover from this?’ Giving Wei Wuxian someone who just... plain isn’t afraid of him (but is also derailed by me, your author, from taking that to unrecoverable places) would be good for him. Jiang Cheng will antagonize him and isn’t afraid of him, but they also share years of history and are dealing with a lot of other stresses in this situation, and Jiang Cheng is asking things from Wei Wuxian that Wei Wuxian is struggling to provide, and the golden core thing is still hanging between them. Lan Wangji isn’t afraid of Wei Wuxian, but Wei Wuxian parses his concern and worries as antagonism and criticism, and those stress him out in a whole different way. This dynamic, as much as I would have to work to make it happen, would bring something new to the table.

One of my favorite activities is crackshipping with sincerity, and when I poke at this, it genuinely feels like richer territory than it looks at first glance. A lot of the antagonists share some fascinating character notes with our lead, and what’s most interesting to me here is an elevated-but-precarious social position and the various stresses that puts upon our characters. Jin Guangyao is the most obvious example, and Su She echoes it more quietly, with how he struggled within the Lan Sect and eventually left (honestly, kudos to him for him and mianmian to be two of the only characters to realize that their home was hurting them and to leave). Jin Zixun is in a family position that’s close to being brothers with his sect’s heir, but isn’t quite brothers, and is close to the seat of power, but also in a precarious social position if someone acts against him. Jin Guangshan and Madam Jin create a dysfunctional family dynamic to grow up in, where Jin Guangshan’s heart attention strays from his wife, and his wife has beat at least one kid who wasn’t biologically hers in the household.

There’s some common ground, is all I’m saying

I don’t even know what would happen, necessarily, I’m talking this all out here right now, and the interesting part of ships like this is digging in extra deep, and seeing what unexpected thing shakes out. It isn’t quite in the style of the other notable rarepair fics I have managed to write, which tend to follow a paradigm of ‘[person] is floating unmoored from the world, and [love interest] gets them engaged with life again’, but it’s not totally out of line with my interests. Svsss won’t give us more detail about Tianlang-jun? Okay, what happens if I make him hopelessly fond, what happens then? What happens if I properly re-engage his sense of humor? I hardly had anything of substance to go on with Horuss, and that fic is old, but I managed to pull interesting things out of him with Roxy. And I mean... what does happen when Jin Zixun stops self-destructively antagonizing the people around him and starts acting in more neutral ways? Not even positive, I think this relationship is going to have a strong antagonistic component, but what happens if he stops basing his interactions purely on who gets the higher rung on the social ladder?

Now, I do have a problem, which is that plot is something that happens to other people. See also: the reason there has not been a tianlang-jun sequel. I think that it would almost definitely have to do with repairing the situation between Jin Zixuan and Jiang Yanli and both of them managing to dial it back a LITTLE so as not to completely sabotage their family member’s happiness, and that leading things forward. And in a ridiculous pipe dream that will never be realized, because either possible pov will be completely oblivious, I would also want to include Jin Zixuan’s confused bisexual awakening and his resentful (also confused) attraction towards Wei Wuxian, even if he still ends up with Jiang Yanli, but... wei wuxian isn’t going to notice, and neither is jin zixun, SO. That’s probably right out. And the plot implications would have to be... significant. Setting it post-Sunshot campaign means that the Wen situation is simmering, and any plot that involves me untangling that mess... terrifying! I wouldn’t know where to begin! But like, also. What if I could write this ship in a compelling way. I bet I could do it. Nothing feels as good as the sensation of ‘I have scored points on my own darling readers by convincing them to like something they didn’t want to like’, and usually, I only get that from the second person pov. It would be so hard to write this ship. But also, what if I did it.

[tossawary]

Chapter 19: “Weddings and Funerals” of “pride is not the word I’m looking for” random favorite lines with commentary because I’m doing a re-read. Not a full list or full commentary. 

-

 When Shang Qinghua told Mobei-Jun that he didn’t need Shen Qingqiu assassinated, it wasn’t because he thought everything would somehow work out if he just sat back and didn’t do anything. It definitely wasn’t because he was planning a so-called “perfect murder” and didn’t want the demon lord messing up his plans. The Problem of Shen Qingqiu has always been a lot more  complicated than “just get rid of the guy potentially making my nephew’s life a living hell”. That’s why it’s a real problem! 

- 

AN: Shang Qinghua’s thought process: “Can this problem be solved by: 

A) Waiting for the problem to go away? 

B) Murder? 

C) None of the above? 

If the answer is C... 

Fuck, it’s a real problem.” 

- 

 Shang Qinghua thinks that might actually be possible, though he’d have to do some research and smack his head until his Author God memories hopped into line. He thinks that the youth-restoration procedure would probably do the job, but he also thinks that Shen Qingqiu would probably rather be dead than be physically sixteen again or something (super fucking understandable) and have to start the cultivation process over from scratch (ah, that would be so annoying and embarrassing). 

- 

AN: Given that I actually invented a de-aging potion for this fic (if one that’s difficult to put together), the AU of “Original Shen Qingqiu is physically 16 again” has been rattling around inside my head ever since I wrote these lines. Shen Qingqiu was like, “Wait, let me picture how unbearably overprotective Yue Qingyuan would be... hmm... no, I’ll just stay like this.” 

- 

 Luo Jiahui seems a little anxious about the empty spaces at the table, but she fills the space as best she can by chattering about assorted restaurant business. At least until she abruptly takes a deep breath and says, “Hua-Ge, I have something to tell you.” 

 Shang Qinghua freezes in the middle of taking a drink. His unhelpful brain immediately races to guess the worst possible conversational subjects. His sister-in-law has somehow figured out that he’s a transmigrator?! His sister-in-law has decided that her son is not going to the Demon Realm under any circumstances?! His sister-in-law knows Binghe better than he does and has realized that the young protagonist is being abused after all?! Oh,  fuck, what is it? 

 “I’m getting married!” Luo Jiahui announces, breathlessly. 

 “Oh,” Shang Qinghua says, heart rate going at the speed of sound. “Wait,  what?” 

- 

AN: This chapter is why I didn’t go into the details of LJH/LQG in the last chapter, immediately post-timeskip. I wanted to blindside everyone with an “Oh, it’s THAT serious?!” moment. The last chapter established that “SQH is handling things”, then this chapter establishes that, as the plot goes on, “SQH is only barely handling things”. Which helps prep the following breakdown with the System World Update in chapters 20-22. 

- 

 “You didn’t have any time for yourself,” Shang Qinghua agrees, following this conversation of very obvious things that he already knew so far. He didn’t have any time for himself back then either, between organizing a conference and finding a cure on top of the usual day-in-day-out of the sect. “You did a really good job looking after them all by yourself!” 

 “They don’t always agree with that,” Luo Jiahui says, smiling but self-deprecating. 

 “Aha, well, they’re young.” 

 The disagreements of what was best for the children is why Shang Qinghua really had to get Fanli (who didn’t see herself as a child) out of the house by any means necessary. He was at a bit of a loss at how else to help. She was never part of  Proud Immortal Demon Way! Not even as a fragment of backstory mentioned in passing! Shang Qinghua struggles to compensate for these extra people who were never characters sometimes. 

 “Qingge was very understanding,” Luo Jiahui says. “But… well… then Fanli was gone and I had the restaurant keeping me busy, but that was all my own choice… and what good was waiting really doing us? It didn’t have to be everything or nothing. So… we talked… about what we wanted and what- what we were afraid of… and we decided to go forward slowly.” 

- 

AN: I said in the Author’s Notes on AO3 that I was going to use Jiage to shame Moshang and Qijiu, and I meant it. TALK TO EACH OTHER!!! Shang Qinghua, you need to talk to Mobei-Jun about what you want! Shang Qinghua, you can’t keep putting things on hold because of the plot! 

- 

 No offense to either his sister-in-law or his junior martial brother, but aren’t love stories supposed to be a little more… fiery? 

 “When I was younger, I thought that falling in love was supposed to be all excitement and passion and not being able to live without someone even for a second,” Luo Jiahui admits, a little wistfully. “I thought that it was supposed to be thinking about them all the time, not being able to stay away from each other, and needing to know what they’d been doing every second they were away. It was like becoming a completely different person. I thought that being in love was about one of us getting horribly jealous every time we even talked to someone else, doing things I didn’t really understand and changing myself just to keep him happy, and keeping secrets and sneaking around just to keep things from exploding. Because love is not being able to help yourself like that, right?” 

 Shang Qinghua can’t really manage to speak right now. 

 It’s like someone has cut his fucking throat. 

 Which is fine! 

 “But that ended really badly for me,” Luo Jiahui says, with a nervous huff at her own understatement. “It was very exciting, but looking back, being in that kind of love was also very frightening sometimes… and it was a little lonely too… being in love with someone I couldn’t really talk to or trust.” 

-

AN: This is more specifically vagueing SVSSS Bingqiu than Moshang, but it’s also shaming Moshang too. Airplane Shooting Towards The Sky wrote some extremely messed-up romances and he would have said, “Yes! It’s all super messed-up! That’s kind of the point!” But it also means that the man can’t really conceptualize (at least at first) or articulate the kind of relationship he would actually be happy to have with Mobei-Jun, especially when his relationship with Mobei-Jun had such violent beginnings 

- 

 The first person he tells himself is, weirdly enough, Qi Qingqi. Liu Qingge apparently already told both Liu Mingyan and Luo Fanli before he left, so Shang Qinghua heads over to see how the girls are handling it. (Also, he wants to pump Liu Mingyan for information on her mother’s opinions on weddings and marriage, in a really pathetic attempt to ready himself for the rumble.) He makes her agree to keep the information to herself before telling and she does, like a bro! 

 And then he tells and she laughs in his fucking face! Eventually, she realizes that he’s looking for sympathy, he’s not just here to let her enjoy his suffering, as a form of payment after everything he and Liu Qingge have inflicted on her. Then she laughs at him again, even louder. 

 Sure, he’d laugh too if he was in her shoes! But not to her face! Rude! 

 - 

AN: Qi Qingqi also pointed while laughing, I think. It’s funny because it’s not her dealing with Liu Family shit this time. 

- 

 Shang Qinghua expected, this time last year, to be laser-focused on the plot! His attention was not going to stray even a little bit, he promised himself; he was going to be 110% dedicated to making sure that everyone he tripped into caring about made it through the least shitty version of  Proud Immortal Demon Way  possible. He was going to be a  machine  of a transmigrator! No distractions! All he wanted was for his family to make it through the quickest, least shitty bare bones of a plot! And he was going to  achieve, damn it! 

 Instead, he finds himself planning his sister-in-law’s wedding and it eats up time he didn’t fucking know he had to give. Immortal Alliance Conference, eat your fucking heart out! Cang Qiong Mountain Sect? Did he work there? Nope, he’s never heard of the place! He’s the Peak Lord of wedding planning now! 

- 

AN: This is me telling myself I’m going to get my life 100% together and then getting into a new video game and baking cookies instead. Or ditching my housecleaning plans to hang out with friends at a moment’s notice. 

- 

 At the wedding itself, Fanli tells her sister’s father-in-law that Binghe is also  very into birds and Shang Qinghua’s nephew spends a good chunk of the rest of the celebrations (and his precious time away from Qing Jing Peak) held hostage by his own politeness, listening to his new grandfather earnestly tell him about the various migration habits of demonic birds. 

 Well! Better him than Shang Qinghua, honestly! 

-

AN: Inspired by that time we went on vacation and one of my brothers got mistaken by one of our travelling companions for a budding serious birdwatcher instead of someone who just thinks they’re neat - and also likes to point at them and intentionally call them by the wrong name. 

Also, LQG’s Dad in this fic and SY would probably get along super well. 

LQG and his dad in this universe have gone out on month-long camping trips to in which they pretty much don’t talk the entire time. They stalk monsters through the wilderness and have a great time.

- 

 Shang Qinghua is too busy keeping an eye on Luo Fanli and being  not talked to by Liu Mingyan, who is eighteen-ish years old now he thinks and still deeply embarrassed by the fact that he told her off for her real person fiction. (He doesn’t want to discourage her passion for writing! She’s pretty good for a kid! It’s pretty cute! Everyone needs their escapist hobbies! He just doesn’t want identifying information about his family being spread around freely, even if the characterizations of the couple are… uh… wildly reimagined, and he doesn't want to have to spend his very valuable time keeping a lookout for more illicit fiction.) It’s difficult to read her expression through the ever-present veil, but… yeah, she’s still pissed off at him.

 Ugh, teenagers. 

 Binghe is not allowed to bring several hundred nieces-in-law into Shang Qinghua's life. Just... no. Fuck, no. 

 He doesn’t even get a date to commiserate about this with. 

 It’s a very small wedding, family only (Luo Jiahui’s shitty parents  don’t count  and her older brother was forced to decline the invitation), so that Luo Jiahui and Liu Qingge can keep their privacy. Madam Liu huffed about it - the battles in talking her down were both great and terrible - but her son stood his ground! Sure, people might whine someday about not being invited, but the great thing about Liu Qingge is that they can more or less just say,  “Well, we couldn’t stop him from doing whatever he wanted!”  And people just have to take that unless they want to claim they could take on the Bai Zhan Peak War God! 

- 

AN: Trying to imagine the AU in which SQH brought MBJ as his date to this wedding. SQH would’ve liked to be able to bring MBJ as a date, but alas, they are not dating and the groom would probably try to kill the man. 

- 

 Shang Qinghua is not expecting, soon after returning from his sister-in-law’s happy and long-awaited wedding, to be solemnly informed that Shen Qingqiu’s health has only really deteriorated these past months. Wow, that’s a huge downer. 

 Also, he already knew that? He’s been getting Mu Qingfang all the right supplies to treat their shixiong. He didn’t actually abandon his duties to the sect for a family wedding. He knew that Shen Qingqiu had fallen sufficiently ill to need tending on Qian Cao Peak in the past month and he considered it, well, convenient timing in regards to Binghe’s permission to attend his mother’s wedding not being randomly revoked. Cold-hearted, maybe! But he had lots of other things to worry about at the time, like informing Mobei-Jun that his sister-in-law was getting married and so he’d be regrettably absent to attend the wedding. 

 Then he’s told that Shen Qingqiu is not expected to improve this time. 

  “Oh, shit, they really think he’s dying,” Shang Qinghua realizes. 

 This really wasn’t in  Proud Immortal Demon Way. 

- 

AN: I seriously contemplated cutting this chapter in half because of this mood switch. Like, I went in intending on writing a serious mood switch, but in practice, wow. It felt like a lot more in practice. 

- 

 “Our sect leader asks about the boy and his progress,” Shen Qingqiu rasps, his voice turning more and more accusing. “He’s  so very  concerned about the boy. We can’t have such a beloved child  crying  to his devoted family that he’s been mistreated or neglected, can we? How flattering these assumptions are. It makes a man wonder what exactly people think he’s going to  do to the boy.” 

 Shang Qinghua might have an itemized list somewhere, honestly. 

 “Ah, I can’t speak for anyone else,” Shang Qinghua says finally. “But please don’t take it personally, Shen-Shixiong. I don’t really trust anyone. Anything can happen behind a locked door, you know?” 

 Some honest cynicism can go over well with the man. 

 Shen Qingqiu laughs bitterly now. 

- 

AN: It can be fun in media where Character A is like, “Ahhh, I hope no one discovers my secret!” And Character B is like, “So, about this extremely obvious thing that you’re doing...!” 

Shen Qingqiu is as honest and open as he is throughout this scene because he honestly thinks that he’s dying. He’s determined to be blithe about it. 

- 

Shang Qinghua at least gets to see Mu Qingfang’s face journey as Shen Qingqiu accuses their sect leader of letting him think that he’d left him to die. As Shen Qingqiu yells about being treated like an unwanted ghost, as a potential blackmailer, as an embarrassing disappointment, as a petty troublemaker, as a spoiled child, as a problem to be solved, and as the last blemish on Yue Qingyuan’s reputation - anything but as someone worthy of being trusted with Yue Qingyuan’s problems and of being treated like an equal friend. 

 Yue Qingyuan tries to explain that he didn’t think Shen Qingqiu wanted to hear his excuses, and Shen Qingqiu shoots back that he would rather fucking die than beg the man he’d thought had forgotten about him to explain when exactly he became not worth rescuing as soon as possible. 

 Yue Qingyuan tries to explain that he didn’t want Shen Qingqiu’s pity or to force the man to be grateful that he’d  tried. 

 Shen Qingqiu tells the man to go fuck himself. How could it not hurt for someone he loved to hurt him and then just…  move past the hurt  like the pain wasn’t  who they were? 

 “All the world could revile me… reject me… leave me to die… and I would pay their hatred no heed! What do they truly know of what I am? Of who I am?” Shen Qingqiu demands. “But if  Qi-Ge  could throw me away… decide that I just wasn’t worth the  trouble anymore now that he’d had a taste of a better life… then I really must be wretched beyond all things at the root! If he believed it, then… then it had to be true.” 

- 

AN: Because I just wrote a Qijiu confrontation over this exact thing, like, a few days before, I thought that I could get away with writing out this entire confrontation in full. I think it works better if the audience has to imagine some of it. And because SQH is the POV character, it felt right that he not be in the room and not be a full witness to this scene. He doesn’t get to see everything. 

[eldritch-elrics]

svsss: shen qingqiu corpse hot potato (among other things)

so i actually read all this last week and then forgot to finish my post about it but?? here you go. more commentary!

got all the way to chapter 57 and shit is getting wack

“it wasn’t sqq’s first time being kissed” please we need more than little tidbits of shen yuan backstory i want to know more

honestly i’m dying over the commotion over sqq’s corpse. binghe you are so weird (affectionate). really xuexiao’ing it up in here

(for the hundredth time, binghe go to therapy challenge)

sqq holding his own corpse djkhgsds

also oho, beginnings of sqq sexuality crisis: he says he’s definitely straight right now but hmmmmm. we shall see

in general it’s so funny that he’s now Remembered Gay People Exist and it’s just shattered his whole worldview

binghe is seriously so emotionally constipated. he’s getting better at revealing his true feelings and not going the route of either “being too cold” or “straight up lying about his situation” but still.... man. they’ve got soooo much work to do on their communication still lol

oh also!! sqq finally realizing that his lbh is different from og!lbh! and that he shouldn’t just treat him as a character in a novel! that’s progress!!!

i think it would make sense for their respective development to involve like... learning to stop objectifying each other? sqq’s gotten pretty far with this, as his reason for helping binghe now is less out of self-preservation instinct and more out of compassion. i’m comparing it to the places in the beginning where sqq threw lbh in front of monsters and stuff, knowing he’d survive because ~plot armor~ but not considering how lbh might have felt about that.

that same theme even shows up in like jinlan city/the water prison, in the parts where i was complaining about sqq making the system solve problems for him instead of solving problems for himself. because he saw binghe as a problem to be solved with game mechanics rather than with interpersonal skills

it’s really interesting! personally i find sqq’s actions easy to understand/ “justify” but he’s certainly wronged binghe and he’s realizing that now. character development! i really like how the meta stuff plays into it

so! zhuzhi-lang! plothole filling!!!

i knew the snake in the cave was gonna come back :3

i have Thoughts about him and tianlang-jun but i’ll get to that in a moment

so we’ve gone from “rumors about bingqiu fucking” to “an entire ballad about bingqiu fucking” and wow. that is so much. loving sqq’s reactions

if sqq was on tumblr he’d have “do not interact if you support rpf” somewhere on his blog

i like that you can rent swords

the scene with lbh facing off with the peak lords!!! oh man!!!!! emotions

yue qingyuan has huge lan xichen vibes

so has lbh known sqq was alive ever since sha hualing brought him to him? it was a little unclear how long he’s known

SO happy to see shang qinghua again. my BOY. sqq is so fucking mad at him kjhsdjhgjhsds

mobei-jun just fucking tossing him into the center of the room lmao

so i had to switch translations because the one i was reading was unfinished! the other one seems pretty good too though

but it censors swear words :(

also i think it’s interesting that it calls it the sun moon dew seed/plant/flower? instead of mushroom? i guess 芝 (which is afaik a character used to describe it) is ambiguous enough..... idk i went on a bit of a research binge about this the other day lmao because i liked the mushroom plot thing so much

finally sqq is like “alright. i made this mess with lbh so i’m gonna fix it by going with him.” woooo we love character development

poor dude in house arrest though lol. this is not really a great situation and i totally understand why sqq is upset

so i’m not a huge fan of how possessive the love interests of mxtx novels are? like i get it, i know the relationships aren’t supposed to be realistic or totally healthy or whatever, but it’s not my thing. so i hope lbh grows out of it? or at least out of this toxic iteration of it

SQH VISIT HELL YES... MY DUDE...

trash man i love him so much. he’s like. totally rooting for bingqiu to happen it’s so funny. oh and he’s absolutely jealous as well (didn’t it already get established that binghe has a huge dick? well. hmm.)

poor guy lost his cool outline :( was forced to write a shitty harem novel :( the injustice of it all. no one has suffered more than airplane :(

jokes aside i LOVE how he's this.. passionate author who had to tone down the interesting-ness of his ideas because of what his readers wanted. makes him a little bit more sympathetic

ok back to bingqiu. this scene was interesting because i can see where both of them are coming from. both of them have lied to each other! and finally lbh is doing some apologizing

and then they have their whole fucking tussle on the bed which was definitely a little uncomfy (binghe use your words challenge! not everything can be solved by ripping open your crush’s shirt!) but also really hilarious???? idek. they’re just like. wrestling. and lbh likes being hit. ok kinky bitch <3

idk, this was one of the scenes i was warned about because Iffy Consent, and i agree it’s iffy, but personally i didn’t find it that upsetting at all? it seemed pretty clear that binghe was just being dramatic for the hell of it and i wasn’t worried that he’d actually do anything sqq was not ok with. (apart from, yknow, the whole house arrest thing in general lol.) i think i’ve heard there’s some more dubious stuff later on - interested to see what i’ll think of that. really there is so much already that’s fucked up about their relationship - at this point i’m just along for the ride! it’s like that post that’s like “why must a relationship be healthy is it not enough to see two fictional people destroy each other” or whatever it was

anyway. omg sqq back in his old body!!!

i’m actually very surprised about this. the mushroom body had so much spiritual energy and now it’s just... gone? guess they’ll have to find another way to solve the xin mo thing

poor binghe had to see his shizun fucking rot before his eyes though??? man. i want to draw that now

thought: is zhuzhi-lang's whole character just puppeted by the system in order to fill plot holes?

OKAY SO TIANLANG-JUN

he’s funny. and very calm. just sittin in a coffin! i like that

other than that i have mixed feelings. on the one hand i feel like he is a pretty good villain - i love that the system is actually making sqq fix plot holes, and i love that TLJ was the big bad of airplane’s original draft, and “i need to steal my son’s body in order to come back to life properly” is great (i’m always up for fucky body swap stuff)

on the other hand, it feels a little bit late in the story to introduce a major villain. i would have liked to see a LOT more foreshadowing on this - more talking about tlj (maybe in a way that assumes he’s not a threat but makes it clear he’s going to be important), more of the system getting sqq to fix more minor plotholes, etc

however some parts of it do work as a pretty good twist! especially the realization that zzl is the one who started the jinlin city sqq callout party!!! that’s pretty fun, and makes a lot of sense :0

oh i also like that tlj is like “no what i like humans i’m not gonna wipe them out! i just don’t like the sects”

now i don’t think this is going to happen but i think it would be very fun if tlj had some sort of fourth wall awareness and was siding with sqq for meta reasons to take down the protagonist

so binghe daddy issues huh

i made a post on this already but freud would love him. no wonder lbh got so attached to sqq......

now that i’ve remembered sv exists i’m gonna read more :0 excited to see what happens next!

[fatalism-and-villainy]

☕️ talk to me about your svsss thoughts?

Oh man, SVSSS. I will say it’s probably my least favourite of the MXTX canon, but it is extremely fun. Honestly, the aspect of it that had the biggest impact on me was all the parodic commentary on webnovel fandom and its forum dramas. Like that first Airplane chapter with the long comment thread on PIDW just had me cackling from the accuracy of it (especially the whole “if you don’t like it then WHY DON’T YOU WRITE YOUR OWN, let’s see if you could do it better” “I don’t need to be able to do it to know it sucks” exchange, like wow, you broke every argument in the comments down to its bare essentials). All the snarky (self-)deprecating commentary in the narration on tropes and genre expectations and the constructed nature of fiction were delightful. (Have I ever mentioned that I have a deep and abiding affection for MXTX as a personality? Because I really do.) 

I also love the fact that so much of it is a commentary on certain fandom attitudes - like Shen Yuan is very much the kind of entitled fan who harasses creators (the fact that Shang Qinghua has nightmares about Shen Yuan yelling at him about his writing is funny, but also uhhh... telling), but there’s also a lot of pushback against simplistic moral impulses on the part of fandom. The subplot about Shen Jiu’s backstory (which Shang Qinghua omitted because readers wanted him to be a straightforward villain) is VERY much a statement about how circumstances influence behaviour (and fandom’s reluctance to contend with that, imo). Same with how Shen Qingqiu’s perception of Luo Binghe is handled - he’s so fixated on the future of Luo Binghe’s character arc (although for understandable self-preservation reasons) that he doesn’t realize how much he’s altered Luo Binghe’s character by treating him better, and that character isn’t deterministic and set in stone. As I’ve mentioned, I love the fact that the effect of his presence on Luo Binghe is very much in the usual MXTX vein of “the presence of absence of attention and care make a drastic difference in someone’s character,” except in this case there’s an added layer of “and sometimes it will cause their gay awakening.”

Also, the whole setup in which this extremely straight hypermasculine genre would be better and deeper if it were gay? MASSIVE POWER MOVE. Especially with the presence of that girl in the aforementioned PIDW forum shyly being like “uhm I wrote some SQQ/LBH slash if anyone wants to read?” This book is truly a vindication for slash fangirls and villain lovers everywhere. 

I also loved both the leads. Shen Qingqiu is delightful as a nerdy, extremely online personality who unwittingly ends up as a curmudgeonly but beloved mentor to a bunch of teenagers. The way the disciples at Qing Jing Peak grow attached to him with him barely being aware of it was one of my favourite parts and I really wish there had been more focus on it! The scene with both Ning Yingying AND Ming Fan crying after he’s come back to life is extremely sweet. Luo Binghe is also very very good... putting on a tough and cool persona when he’s actually a massive emotional mess who’s desperate for affection and validation. (He’s SO eager to please during his disciple days. “Do you like my cooking? Do you? Do you??? Please let me do this for you every day pls pls pls.”) And he gets jerked around so much! You have to feel for him!  

That said, while I do love the two main characters, the central romance doesn’t really land for me. I really do like Luo Binghe’s adolescent crush on Shen Qingqiu, and him having his gay awakening through the first authority figure to ever be nice to him. And I also like the “omg so cool!!” response to Luo Binghe-the-character that Shen Yuan has that could totally be sublimated gay feelings (@coldwind-shiningstars raised the possibility that he had a crush on Luo Binghe while he was reading the book, which I could see). But the way they actually come together in-story.... there’s a lot of Shen Qingqiu capitulating to what Luo Binghe wants and appeasing him (including in the novel’s climax!) without much regard for what he himself wants and is comfortable with, and it’s uncomfy for me. You can convince him that he has worth and that you’re not going to abandon him while also setting boundaries with him, you know? 

And Shen Qingqiu’s internalized homophobia runs so deep that after awhile his freak-out responses stop being funny and just start being sad. Wei Wuxian’s closetedness in MDZS is at least expressed through him taking genuine joy in plausible deniability flirting with Lan Wangji. Shen Qingqiu on the other hand is just grossed out by Luo Binghe’s feelings for him so much of the time. The extras suggest that he is genuinely attracted to and attached to him, but is just suuuuper repressed, but that being the case, I just come away feeling as if he’s not remotely ready for a relationship at all until he’s worked himself out more. And I kind of want Luo Binghe to just try dating other people.... given the amount of women who were swooning over him, there’s got to be a bunch of potential boyfriends in this world for him as well. He could even have more than one at once (like, he was the protagonist of a harem novel! why’s he gotta become monogamous just because he’s gay now? XD)

So yeah, I loved the main characters but didn’t love the love story. And the setting and plot felt pretty empty for me - I had trouble getting attached to any of the characters or potential side pairings. The one exception to this is Shang Qinghua/Mobei-jun, which is delightful for its “scary demon falls for the first person to ever tell him off” feature, but wasn’t integrated into the story well enough for me to feel strong emotions about it - it’s relegated to extras, and that it feels at a thematic remove from the rest of the story. That is to say, obviously Shang Qinghua being gay and not being able to express that in his writing choices is thematically central to the story (which makes the relegated-to-extras backstory for him unfortunate), but the specifics of his relationship to Mobei-jun don’t feel to me to parallel or offer commentary on the central relationship. Though it’s entirely possible that I’ve missed something there and just haven’t read the right meta yet. 

So, overall - it has a lot of individual aspects that I really like, it’s very funny in a lot of places, and I really appreciate what it’s doing thematically and with its meta aspects, but as a whole, it’s not entirely satisfying to me. 

[thewindsofsong]

Ok ok ok!!! So last night I had a dream that I rec’ed a dmbj/svsss crossover fanfic, but never actually read the fic. Then I woke up because my cat was yowling in the middle of the night.

After talking with @1ebilcat and @merinnan for a while, I managed to flesh out a basic outline of what that fic might look like. Please know that because this is a crossover with svsss, there is papapa mentioned. several times.... (nothing actually explict is described because that would make this not a not-fic)

So one day SQQ and SQH are messing around trying to figure out what this new “unique one of a kind treasure” does when SQH accideny drops some melon seeds on it or something and it suddenly activates.

Meanwhile in dmbj world, the Iron Triangle are pretty much retired from the whole tomb raiding business, but still run Wushanju (better now that wu xie actually concentrates on running it instead of running off every week). Someone comes in with a strange artifact that they found while clearing out a deceased relatives store room they want to sell. Wu xie buys it because he’s never seen anything like it before and wants to research it.

Xiaoge gets super weird vibes from the object, but it doesn’t seem overtly menacing, so he leaves wu xie be (if wu xie is preoccupied he gets in marginally less trouble). However, when xiaoge touches the object with wu xie and Pangzi nearby, it grows a point and gives xiaoge a paper cut. The blood touches the object and it activates.

One blinding flask of light and disorienting tumble latter, they find themselves at the foot of a picturesque mountain with a gate that labels them at the foot of cang qiong mountain. They’re quickly found by the cang qiong crew and everyone is super weird out by each other. Things happen and eventually LBH crashes in and says his shizun is missing mobei-jun is there too because SQH is also missing. More communication happens and everyone realizes this is the artifact’s fault. No one knows where the artifact is.

Meanwhile SQQ and SQH wake up someone completely unfamiliar to either of them. After using magic to light things up, they see that they are in a tomb absolutely covered in different depictions of penises: there’s pictures on the walls, statues of men with WAY TOO BIG penises, sooooo many dildos. Queue SQQ immediately launching himself at SQH with a shriek of outrage because “THERE’S NO WAY THIS ISN’T YOUR FAULT YOU SHITTY HACK AUTHOR!!”

Back with the iron triangle, there’s a research montage going on as they and other CQ sect member scour the libraries for any information about the mcguffin that caused all this randomness. At some point in all of this, iron triangle go to MQF to see if he can take a look at Xiaoge regarding his memory problems. After some more research, MQF learns about an herb that could stabilize his qi and stabilize the fluctuations that cause his amnesia.

Turns out that while proper cultivation doesn’t exist in dmbj world, the Zhang family line has managed to cultivate the family line to extended life but because they’re the only ones that can (maybe due to bronze gate?) it has a lot of dangers. 

The herb needed is of course incredibly rare and only found in some horribly dangerous location. Xiaoge wants to go alone because he doesn’t want wu xie and pangzi to be in danger, but knows that they won’t be left behind. There’s some agnst had about how Xiaoge feels he’s brought pain and suffering to wu xie and pangzi, but of course neither of them are having any of it. The three of them talk about how they’ve never regretted meeting each other and how the adventures they’ve shared have brought meaning and joy into their lives. 

The three of them cobble together some hotpot and spend the night before setting off soaking their feet side by side, content and secure in their bonds with each other. Its very sweet. 

The next day, the three of them set off with LQG and LBH. Right before arriving at the location, bullshit happens and Iron Triangle get trapped in the location where the herb is located and trigger a wife plot in which papapa is the only way out. Iron triangle proceeds to have incredibly kinky marathon sex. LBH and LQG can only listen awkwardly from the boundary, not able to get through, but also not wanting to leave completely just in case something else happens. The sexual tension between LBG and LQG grows to new heights. Neither will do anything about it until SQQ is back home safe. 

After the marathon is over and iron triangle has time to actually sleep, the three of them get cleaned up with the herb in tow and head back to Cang Qiong. They get the herb to MQF who tells them it will take at least a day to prepare the pill for xiaoge to take. That night, Iron triangle has sweet, tender, affirming sex because while they all agree that while xiaoge not losing his memories every few decades is for the better, it also means that he’ll have to carry the memories of wu xie and pangzi long after they’er gone, with no hope of them ever being together again.  Xiaoge assures wu xie and pangzi that this is what he wants, to know that at least at some point, he loved and was loved, that he had a connection to this world and that his life has meaning beyond his obligations to the Zhang clan. Wu xie and pangzi make xiaoge promise to live on after they pass and to find him in their next lives.

Xiaoge takes the pill and the search for a way back home continues again in earnest. Eventually, LBH travels back to the demon realm and figures out how to track the artifact through space and time because his protag halo is too strong to keep him away from his love interest for too long. 

Wu xie and pangzi learn some basic meditation techniques that disciples would learn when first arrive at the mountain. Its too late for them to cultivate to longevity and there’s no guarantee that its even possible in their home world to cultivate if you aren’t a Zhang. Regardless, wu xie and pangzi don’t want immortality, they just want to spend as much time as they can with xiaoge. Wu xie is gifted a flute made with special bamboo and pangzi is gifted a wine jug from Zui Xian Peak. Both have spiritual properties that may or may not be able to function when back home, but they’er good gifts given in good faith. 

LBH, losing patience, forces iron triangle to get moving so he can save SQQ. He bursts through time and space and iron triangle plus LBH, MBJ, and LQG end up in dmbj world, in Wushanju. After scaring the crap out of Wang Meng, the group realizes that while several days have passed in svsss world, its only been a few hours since iron triangle was pulled away. Which is good because Ershu was likely to call in an army if wu xie went missing for no apparent reason. The whole thing would have been way too messy. Probably more than one person would have died. 

What follows is a night of LBH, LQG, and MBJ attempting different divination spells to try and pin point the exact location of SQQ and SQH to varying degrees of success. None of them are good at divination. Regardless, the three of them manage to get a general location of where the two missing peak lords might be and the iron triangle gets to work searching the internet for any rumors or information of any tombs that might be in the area. (Its just wu xie and pangzi looking, but xiaoge standing around still in his beautiful borrowed robes from CQ is good moral support.) 

They hear about some local legends about an ecentric noble from a bygone era that was buried in a very peculiar tomb. Potential tomb located, the whole group prepares to head out. the SVSS gang is convinced to not fly over immediately because that would be waaaaay to flashy and draw unwanted attention to them that would delay things even more. The six of them cram in together into the van and head off. Svss gang are forced into modern clothing and are def a little too big to comfortably sit in the van. LBH hits his head on a doorway at least once on this adventure. At lease two women and maybe a guy slip their numbers to him too. The man is supernaturally gorgeous.

After some more road trip shenanigans,  they arrive at the rumored entrance to the tomb and head in. The tomb has a few traps here and there, but is practically child’s play for the iron triangle to get through. Svsss are appropriately impressed by their competence and LBH and LQG think specifically about how the iron triangle is a true threesome that supports each other and fights together. MBJ just wants his hamster boy back. 

When they near the central chamber of the tomb, they hear the faint sounds of fighting which spurs SVSSS to speed ahead while iron triangle tries to get them to at least be a little cautious about setting off traps. 

The sight that LBH sees when he breaks into the main chamber like the kool aid man is a disheveled SQQ beating SQH over the head with a baton? Kind of. Its a baton carved into the shape of a penis. SQQ immediately stops and tries to put on his “peerless immortal cultivator” mask on with a flick of his fan, but its hard for that to be effective when your hair is all over the place and your in a room covered in penises. SQH dives for his king’s thighs and cries in relief that he’s no longer trapped in a room full of dildos and penises with SQQ. 

Then the iron triangle catches up and the realization that SVSSS gang is in modern clothing sinks in. The transmigrators freeze for just a second before jumping in front of iron triangle with a thousand questions. They ask in their shitty English which leaves answering the questions mostly to wu xie because pangzi’s english is pretty spotty and xiaoge doesn’t like talking in general, let alone a foreign language.

The whole group eventually leaves the tomb and all its phallic glory behind and get above ground where there’s phone service again. After a bit of searching, the transmigrators realize that while this world is very similar to their original world, there’s no signs of “Proud Immortal Demon Way” ever being written here, no other signs pointing to the two of them existing in this world. SVSS gang are very concerned as they watch SQQ and SQH talk in a strange language to these relative strangers, but don’t feel like its the time to figure out whats going on until everyone gets back home. The now expanded group makes their way back to Wushanju in an even more cramped road trip back. SQQ absolutly ends up in LBH’s lap at least once and SQH ends up with MBJ’s head in his lap at some point. its all very cute as the feeling of everyone being accounted for and safe settles in. 

Maybe there’s some stuff about SQQ and SQH being transmigrators and them being tempted for all of half a second to stay in this world that is so very much like their original world but choosing to go back with their lovers and the lives they’ve made for themselves. 

As the complete SVSSS gang now gets ready to head back home, the Iron triangle makes a huuuuge goody bag of all the snacks and treats that SQQ and SQH have been missing ever since they’ve transmigrated and put together a basic netbook plus solar charger for them to take back. There won’t be internet service back in SVSS world, but they loaded it up with a whooole bunch of web novels and pop songs, along with a few spare parts. 

SVSSS gang finally makes their way home after having a large farewell dinner at Wushanju at Pangzi’s insistence and LBH bullies his way into helping out. Its a very sweet scene of laughing and drinking. After dinner is done, SVSSS decide to go back immediately because the time dilation thing would mean they would be away for longer than they would like. 

Once back home, LBH, SQQ, and LQG have a confrontation/conversation about their relationships with each other and figure out if they want to try being all together, all three of them. MBJ confines SQH to his northern palace. Specifically their bedroom. He was also the one that remembered to grab the artifact that caused all these problems to begin with while everyone else was distracted by dildo tomb.

Iron triangle goes back to their retirement, at peace with the decisions they’ve made and the lives they’ve chosen to live.

THE END!!!

[jooniely]

i really want to know wth mxtx was smoking when she wrote svsss ,the premise was cool the first chapters were adorable and funny so how come it became soooooooo horrible, bingqiu is one of the worst toxic relationships ever, like it makes no fucking sense, one instance SQQ call LB a child the next they're in true love uwu ,The power inbalance is soo jarring ,LB literary never listens to a word SQQ says, hurts him,balantly disrespects SQQ friends ,coherce SQQ and guilt trip him into loving him, and leaving everyone he knows for him, what Binghe needs is a restraining order, and life long therapy and fix his daddy issues, but it seems that the majority of danmeis idea of love is toxic abusive relationships ,i am not against the ship , from the way the fans talked about Bingqiu i was looking forward to see their love blossom and them making up in a healthy way, but god was i dissapointed , like at least make it believable ,give them time to talk about their feelings ,clear the misunderstandings ,heal the wounds ,not whatever the hell that rape scene was about ,so is mxtx trying to tell us that raping the man you love with their consent "whatever the fuck this is supposed to mean " tormenting hurting and making them bleed ,is more important than them having a heart to heart conversation about the fuck ups they commited ,and showing how much they cherish each other , the fans will tell you that NO it's a deconstruction of the papapa to save the world trope ,like wtf is that even supposed to mean ,she deconstruct it by using the same awful shit

Anyway svsss was good at first and then it spiraled to complete nonsense ,it felt like mxtx just wanted to get it over with and move on, sooo much lost potentiel ,i recommend reading well written fix it fanfictions to get over the atrocity of canon, there are plenty of good liushen and qijiu fics out there

And sorry that i rambled a lot and for my bad english, i am just super dissapointed ,this wasn't what i signed up for when i read the many positive reviews

Hey anon let's be friends lol. I agree with everything here. You can clearly tell this was mxtx's first novel. Someone said they wrote it when they were in high school? So maybe it was also cuz they were young that it had some not so great things.

I finished the novel this morning and I was still NOT a fan. That scene was written in a way to make it seem like it was not sexjal assault but it clearly was. Binghe wasn't even mentally present and was not able to give consent and was terrified of what he did. This is the first time I saw the old binghe from the past come out. Shizun didn't give consent either. He basically just accepted his fate. You're right, how is it deconstructing a trope if you're gonna write the trope? And I think a lot of readers don't realize that this entire scene didn't need to happen. It was some bullshit reason that the author fully knew was bullshit. You have to wait for the special item to load? That's never happened, if it loaded right when shizun asked for it, then there would have not been that assault scene.

A lot of ppl use in universe reasons to explain why some things needed to be done but I'm here wondering why the author needed to add these things. At least let your characters suffer the consequences? Consequences for actions don't always mean getting hurt physically after making a wrong decision. It means after so much trauma, both binghe and shizun would barely be mentally functioning. Shizun's thoughts should have been a mess because this is his student but he also raised him and now that student is obsessed with him. One dream he meets old binghe and literally gets his limbs ripped then the next second sees baby binghe and he's okay after it. Even when he sees older binghe there's no residual fear.

With binghe being a psycho, and it being his sword that was poisoning his mind, why didn't someone immediately try to destroy the sword? Then when binghe is getting his therapy we could have explored the love between them.

As it stands I still don't see the love. I don't wanna read the extras to see whatever love that will develop there because those are extras. That shit should have been in the main book. But whatever I gave it a skim and literally already we got another assault scene. And old binghe wants shizun all of a sudden? The same one you repeatedly tortured?? Why???

Tbh old binghe and old shizun would probably get along well if shizun hadn't been abusive towards him cuz they were both psychos.

Shen yuan essentially looked like he just accepted whatever fate he had. Not once did I feel like he realized this world was his life now and not still some book, he's no longer and outsider. And also to just leave everything? It doesn't seem like to us but he spent years with his sect and qingge and qi ge. Oh my god the connection between old qingqiu and his child hood "friend" that should have been focused on more because in those few scenes we got so much material. So much emotional and complex scenes. I really hope there's a fic that explores this thread.

Anyways I still think their relationship is toxic. I know a lot of ppl still enjoy it and I'm okay with that as long as they know it's fictional. Some ppl are okay with toxic things as long as it's fictional but no matter what some say, it's scientifically proven that fiction affects reality. So as long as things stay fictional and ppl aren't looking at them and thinking this is okay or healthy then I have no issue. Not everyone will agree and understand each other so each side should stay on their own with one hating and the other loving, on their own.

I also ended up ranting lol. If u wanna talk more u can send another ask or just message me I don't mind! If u have read mxtx other works I would love to talk about them as well! Also you're English is perfect!

[vroomian]

(headdesk slam) Yes, that was 2/2 percent didn’t even realize I forgot to add it in the message until after I sent it and spent like 5 mins internally screaming at myself. I’m a mess of a human being tbh. Really? I’m surprised because it feels like Xi fits perfectly in this AU. Xi as accidental cryptid is the best thing, in both worlds. That’s a relief to hear. My anxiety and I don’t get along so I tend to go to worst possible scenario. You’ll probably regret that soon enough. 1/2

I’m like a magpie if something catches my interest and I’ll fuss over it and go all crazy. Especially now, seeing that you did that hob oneshot and mdzs that is two of the main three bl web novels that I now of. Like, of the three I’ve only fully read svsss and my mind immediately went to wonder where Xi would fit in that verse and at this point he’d totally be where the biggest amount of knowledge is and that my mind went ‘what if Xi was head disciple of Qing Jing Peak?’ 2/?

But that’s pretty unlikely given Xi’s desperate avoidance of feelings, plot, and responsibility. Though I could totally see him as a reluctant head disciple and desperately trying to avoid plot. Plus, definitely the first to notice that something would be off with this new Qingqiu. That said, bullying in his peak would not fly with him so I could see Binghe crushing on this unknown elder disciple.

3/3 I’m sorry I don’t want to make it seem like I want to push you to write another AU when you’ve got enough on your hands. My mind just just went ‘ooh what if this happened?’ And I wanted to share my thoughts with you because I think it’s interesting. So yeah, again feel free to ignore this. I’m like that guy from the meme with the pictures on the wall and red thread when my brain goes nuts lol.

long ask so this goes under the cut

okay there are a million different ways this question could go, because like. is yrz female in this universe? is he male? is he older than the main characters? is he younger? which sect is he living near? is his family nice or assholes? which version of the story is he in? the sssvs version or the actual original demon path novel (or whatever it’s been a while since i read the novel)??? does yrz get a system??? 

because the answers to those questions change the story drastically 

okay so lets do two versions 

one: it’s sssvs. yrz has a ‘background character system’ or something.  he’s gotta have a system otherwise he wouldn't get without a thousand li of cang qiang sect. so this systems chooses him (lets say he’s a guy in this universe) because its low key and yrz is low key and it was like hey lets be low key together!

lol system. 

lol. 

but the system and yrz get along pretty well, and they get into the peak they want -- which is Wan Jian peak, because if yrz can’t join the library peak because of Plot reasons, he’s going with hsi second love. Swords! plus i don’t think there are literally any named characters from the story, except the peak lord. 

so. timeline wise, i think that none of the peak-lords have ascended yet, so yrz does his natural thing --- he over performs and becomes the head disciple for wan jian peak  as consequence and it’s literally just in time for the former peak lords to ascend, so yrz is like. stuck. as a peak lord. 

both the system and yrz are horrified and confused as to how this happened. or, no, by then the system understands the Mistake it made in choosing yrz. on paper yrz is very unassuming! but in reality yrz has no chill. he’s never even heard of the concept of chill. he does everything at 110%.

I think that the bulk of this story takes place waaaay before the sssvs cannon, and lbh is sir not appearing in this fic. instead its -- liu qingge! and mu qingfang! both??? both is good! i think he meets lqg first, when he challenges yrz to a spar in the middle of a high stakes missing because lqg is a meathead jock at that age, and yrz is like. no? do your job? dumbass. (yrz has no idea who this shouty brat is, because the system is taking a nap. it wakes up and kicks itself for leaving yrz alone to do stuff.) yrz is older than lqg and kicks his ass because... well. because it’s hilarious really. so he gains a lqg shaped stalker. 

yrz has a lot of interest in both sparring and healing, and with lqg following him around, yrz spends a lot of time at the healing peak and meets mqf there. mqf gets a huge crush almost immediately but never said anything. it’s not surprising that yrz quickly bonds with these totally cool new disciples -- and then learns that both of the are the succeeding disciples for their peaks. oops. 

system gives up. 

version two: bing-ge edition! 

no system this time around and yrz stays far far away from the cang qiong. he joins a small sect to learn than fucks off to have adventures by himself as a rouge cultivator. so, male version again BUT yrz gets cursed or something and gets the ability to change gender at will because that’s funny and useful. also you know. porn world written by a “straight” guy. there are reasons for that kind of curse imma just gloss over. 

then the plot happens. all of immortal demon path’s many, many chapters are playing around in the background of yrz’s life, but she manages to stay out of it -- until one night yrz gets accidentally recruited by a cult dedicated to bringing down the evil demon lord lbh, because this cult has a book yrz is after. she ends up being used as bait for lbh (because he eats virgins now according to rumors. he’s up to wife number 249 by now so it’s not wrong !) 

yrz gets ‘saved’ by lbh, who’s kind of smirking and going ‘oh, no need to thank me, it was what anyone would have done,’ while totally expecting sex. yrz is like ‘oh, cool. bye then.’ and just. takes the book and leaves. 

lbh: *surprised pikachu face*

and by the time he registers no sex is going to be happening, yrz is long gone and enjoying her brand new book. 

after that, lbh and yrz end up seeing each other (mostly because lbh is trying to impress this woman and nothing is working) and yrz is like stop being a creep, i’m not interested in you. lbh needs to drink his respect woman juice and downsize on his harem a bit. yrz wouldn’t touch that with a twenty foot pool. 

anyway i think it comes to a head when they both get doused in pa pa pa juice and lbh is like oh this is more familiar, shall we? and yrz is like bitch. and goes to a brothel in the city instead. at this point yrz and lbh are more like antagonistic buddies than anything else. lbh has too many wives and zero friends. 

lbh starts developing some squishy feelings and is like what the fuck is this?? gross?? but he says nothing because he doesn’t get it. 

then the cross over happens, bing-ge vs bing-mei!!! and after than happens, yrz is just chilling at home and lbh shows up at her place like really fucked up and subdued. he’s like ‘why him? why did he get the good teacher? what did he do right?’ 

yrz is like... hm. emotions. ew. she trys anyway because she’s finally ready to admit that she does like this trash goblin at least a little. so she takes care of him while he’s being depressed. lbh cooks for her and she’s like. this is so fucking good. thank you. 

and lbh is just in love now. it’s nothing like he feels for his wives, but yrz makes lbh feels safe and accepted. it’s a comforting and comfortable love. yrz’s stupid little house is more of a home than lbh’s stupid palaces. 

look. i stand by the head cannon that all lbh wants is to be a househusband, no matter what version im talking about. 

lbh vanishes for a whole night. yrz is like hm, my house feels empty now. weird! and then lbh comes back and announces that he just divorced all his wives. he doesn’t want to be powerful anymore so can i stay herer with you. 

yrz is like... sure. 

and then there’s a long, long courtship and lbh marries yrz and archives his dream of just being fucking happy. the end!

[natsunoomoi]

Diving Further In

So just going deeper into this SVSSS rabbit hole. Still in earlier chapters because I work, but just poking around online again because again I really just like looking at Shen Qingqiu’s face and also Liu Qingge’s look isn’t so bad either.

But like I came across some stuff that’s spoilers for me and it said that they are a popular ship together? But like also a lot of people question if Qingge is straight which the author said and I found curious that a lot of people seem to dispute that? So then I looked more and it seems people are citing an extra story where the two of them go to fight some succubi in a cave. I read the story, and I don’t really see it myself? Like I can see how some people could read that it implies that he is actually interested in Shen Qingqiu and maybe a little jealous, but also I can also see how it doesn’t necessarily and also aligns with the author saying that he is straight. This isn’t to say that I want to kill anyone’s ship or anything, but just want to point out how what MXTX is saying isn’t exactly crazy either.

I’m not really sure, but I think it might be because I’m asexual myself so even my own experience going through life there’s a lot of things that maybe other people who aren’t ace interpret as more romantic that I don’t think so at all and it’s gotten me in trouble sometimes where I feel like I’m just having pleasant conversation with people but people think I’m flirting? I’m just being nice and talking? I don’t understand?

But just the same like even for me if someone says something that could possibly suggest that I’m involved in something or that I like someone even if I don’t, I still get flustered and blush because people are talking about my private life even if I don’t actually like the person. And then they become convinced that that’s the person I like because I’m blushing as we are having a conversation about if I like someone.

Like truthfully, in the 4th grade I had an interaction with a classmate that I had that I thought I had an amicable friendship with. During the first week or so of school a bee came into the classroom and landed on my desk and my classmate killed it for me and I was scared and eternally grateful, so at a later date later I gave him like a small gift or something as a thank you. My classmates thought it meant I liked him or something and I was VERY CONFUSED. I was literally just grateful for the help with the bee and he’s always been kind and helpful to me in class so I didn’t really think anything of it, and just simply you do nice things for people who are nice to you right? It’s a very simple and pure thought, but I learned from that experience and misunderstanding that normally people don’t do that for people who are just your friends. I think they also thought I did because apparently I was staring at him a lot when we were on a field trip, but like during the field trip he was also goofing around and jumping on the bus and stuff. How do you not look at someone making a ruckus?

So basically, in reading the succubus story, I kind of thought about something like that for Qingge. Like if I were him, I would be a little surprised also that the description sounded a bit like me and like I’m sure just as Shen Qingqiu is going through all the women he knows, Qingge is also running through all the people who knows that Qingqiu hangs out with and realizes that he is with him an awful lot. I’m somewhat serious as well, and even though I’m focused on getting the job done, it’s not like I’m not trying to look out for my friends and their interests so I’d want to still listen too to learn more about them as a friend and even to find out how I can be a better friend to them or like encourage them in the future. Plus like nothing else was happening in the cave, so you just get bored and listen to what's happening. Same as me on the field trip. Space out staring out the window or turn in the direction of the commotion on the bus.

I also think that part of Qingge’s alarm is that the succubus mentions that the person is his junior, and I think most people would normally exclude anyone who was a student or disciple of theirs. He probably didn’t even consider someone who was from a younger generation as he was running through the list of people in his mind, and the description does sound like him and to me it reads like because he is straight and doesn’t think of his friend in that way exactly, he’s having a kind of panic attack and questioning himself internally trying to discern if it is him and his own feelings. But at the same time, he doesn’t want to say any more or explain himself because its not like he wants to be mean to his friend either. 

Like I’ve had times like that too where people apparently maybe liked me, but I just didn’t like them that way or I was emotionally unavailable because I liked someone else. And then when you’re in grade school you do those fortune telling games where you write the names of different boys in your class and stuff and it’s not serious, but sometimes you don’t want to be mean if like the fortune tells you it matched you to one person or another. Like even if you’re friends and it’s just that you don’t feel them that way, if you played that game and got matched with them and then shouted, “Eww! Gross!” Isn’t that awful? So like, I think he thought that the succubus was talking about him, so he said it was inaccurate, but also just like got really flustered because it’s a private topic like I would, but at the same time tried to keep his eye on the ball and complete the mission while also balancing trying to not to be a dick to his friend. Like even asking the other questions to me sounds like panicking and trying to find out more info to check if it is him, because he isn’t aware of Binghe’s future either. It’s kind of a mess of emotions and trying to balance everything he’s taking in his actual personal feelings and trying not to offend his friend. All that together I think would make me embarrassed and give me a stormy look too.

So I dunno, I kind of feel like if I was in his place I would react much the same even if I didn’t have feelings for Qingqiu. The idea of Qingge being straight sounds totally reasonable to me, and Qingge is like the traditionally virtuous macho guy of Chinese lit. Incredible martial skill and stoic and very work-oriented. Like I like looking at Qingqiu’s face a lot, but when I was young a stoic and work-oriented guy like Qingge was my ideal man because I thought they would never cheat on me because they would have the self-control to keep it in their pants. As I got older I started to realize that such a person was not actually realistic and I became disappointed as I came into middle school and realized my ideal was most likely a Buddhist monk who could not get married to my utter disappointment. A lot of other characters I like in my fandom often have the same trait where they canonically don’t seem to show any kind of attraction to almost anyone really because of my fear. Guys who chase skirts all the time are the least appealing to me.

But like also, Qingge being the stereotypical manly man kind of character leads me to remember other stuff about Chinese culture as well that maybe blur the lines that perhaps other readers don’t pick up on because it’s not part of their culture? Like Chinese culture is very heavily influenced by Confucianism and even more classic lit that has a history that actually pre-dates Confucianism is written to have a Confucianism bent because it was a popular thing by the time it was actually written down to paper. It was already so pervasive in society by that time so there’s a lot of stories where we don’t know their “original form” but the Confucian ideas in it are highly influential and if that story is particularly notable or influential in itself, it trickles and affects the thoughts and ideas of the entire culture and all of our stories. Like Journey to the West is probably one of the most influential of the classics in all of East Asia, and while it’s mostly a Buddhist allegory, it does have bits and pieces of Confucianism in it and upholds the cardinal relationships. All this is to say, that this philosophy is pervasive and needs to be taken into consideration if we’re looking at how people behave in a Chinese story. Sometimes character actions can be affected by it, and sometimes they’re not. Binghe being a stallion novel protagonist with a traumatic past that involves demons is probably way beyond the scope of Confucius’ ideas, but Qingge being the traditional man’s man so to speak, absolutely falls within it. He is that kind of character because he follows those ideals and mannerisms.

That is important because Confucianism highlights very strongly loyalty. It comes in the form of filial piety and so on and so forth, but being loyal to your community, your ruler/boss, your family, and so on was really important. Spousal loyalty you can throw a side eye at and question because it’s mostly only one way if we wanna be real, but even though it was one way there was a prescribed way to behave still. So then some people kind of criticized Qingge’s sexuality because he dedicated himself for so long to doing something for Qingqiu. But that like doesn’t necessarily mean anything either because of loyalty to help your friends or someone who specifically helped you or even to your clan/sect/family especially which Qingqiu falls into. You do that for people you have obligations to. Bear in mind, I also gave an actual gift to a boy who just saved me from a bee landing on my desk and had all of my classmates completely misunderstand that, so Qingge’s meta situation is a mood for me.

The other thing is, what is considered to be acceptable male behavior is probably a lot wider traditionally in Chinese society also because of Confucianism. Specifically because Confucius was very, VERY, misogynistic. There’s a lot of merit to think about into the things he thought about for some bases of the cardinal relationships, but any time he delved into anything regarding gender relations he was pretty much full of shit. Like in principle, a ruler is the head and the ministers under the ruler are like the body making the ideas from the head happen. That sounds like a pretty sound metaphor to how to run a country or a company even. Like maybe if you’re the CEO as the head of the company you don’t do something that benefits your head only and spites your workers equivalent to like cutting off your own feet (like making them work if they have coronavirus). That sounds like a horrible way to keep your company going, right? How would a "body" last and succeed without feet? (It should be noted that this metaphor also works for why Binghe's punishment of the original Qingqiu via human stick was super appropriate for his mistreatment because disciple Binghe was a subordinate and should have been treated better according to the rights). So Confucius’ ideas in things like that seemed pretty reasonable. His ideas on women, however, were not.

As a base, we should probably start with Taoism which is the source of all the cultivation lore in this book anyway. But the very simplest and most well-known symbol from Taoism is the yin-yang symbol. Yang is a positive male energy and yin is a negative female energy. Positive and negative are not actually good vs evil in terms of contrast, but are more like photons and electrons. Just two kinds of energies that coexist in the world and create a balance and cannot fully stand on their own without the other, and there’s a little bit of each in each one. Black is not pure black, but has a little white. White is not pure white, but has a bit of white, so basically nothing is perfect. This alone could be misogynistic too, but not necessarily. Depends on how much a person runs with that.

Confucius really ran with it though. He really thought and it was popularized that women were “inherently evil” because of their genitalia. Absolutely full of shit, but I think he was trying to point out how a lot of men act the fool over trying to chase skirts and get laid. It’s really shitty that he blames women for just inherently being temptresses just because they have that genitalia and it spreads to their overall oppression and lack of rights, but at the same time he does to an extent tell men to be accountable for falling into the temptation. Dalliance with women was only necessary to continue the family line and otherwise was thought should be avoided because our ladies are just too tempting and distracting. He warns men to stay away and control themselves, but unhappily for the wrong reasons. With that backdrop, he even went as far as to say that sex between men was better than with a woman because well, you’re not messing with that “evil”. In that respect, he heavily, HEAVILY encouraged relationships with other men and boys clubs including ones where people get drunk and make paintings and poetry with each other. So some level of intimate closeness between even straight men was normal too, so you have to kind of alter your perspective to look at this and find "signals".

These kinds of teachings were thought of to an extent in China, but didn’t really affect the LGBT scene of ancient China because the filial piety part of ensuring the next generation was top priority. Homosexuality as a word even didn’t exist in the Chinese language until more modern times as an import from Japan because the above teachings we just discussed *really* took off in Japan where I guess filial piety was less important. A huge amount of pre-modern same-sex lit came out of Japan including lover suicide themes because damn, I love you so much but we can’t be together because one of us isn’t a woman and we have obligations. Let’s drown ourselves in the river and hope in the next life we can be reincarnated together as a couple that can actually consummate our love. This was a thing in Japan. Onnagata in Kabuki were also to an extent another level and extension of this. In China, it wasn’t like same-sex relationships didn’t happen, but it wasn’t openly discussed because of filial piety. Generally everyone just got married and basically had a cover family and after you had a child to pass on the family legacy, people could not care less what you did privately. If you can imagine it, there were likely some shady dealings here and there with how to deal with this problem too because I can’t imagine that everyone was really down with forcing themselves to be intimate with someone no matter how much they wanted to get their parents off their back, but that kind of family secret was probably deeply buried. It’s also not like people didn’t talk at all about relations with the same sex because people looked at temples with a bunch of men together all practicing Buddhism and thought surely something must be happening, but obviously none of that would be officially recorded or openly discussed. The whole scene was just under the surface and not talked about because it was important to keep appearances and the appearance was that you had an actual family and fulfilled your filial duty. It’s only been recently where the idea of homosexuality as an orientation and  being talked about openly as something beyond a secret you do after fulfilling your family obligations, and that’s why the word had to be imported in in modern times.

So with all that in mind, actual bromances that aren’t even actually romantic at all between straight men totally seems normal in the context of this culture. Relationships with other men were very highly valued, and if Qingge is a basically traditionally perfect Chinese man he would basically follow this ideal and would likely have some behavioral traits that seem questionable to a modern audience.

I would also think Confucius would have a problem with romantic relationships between a master and disciple. It's thought to usually be similar to a surrogate parent-child situation, so awkward. But original Qingqiu had some designs on Yingying and while that's kind of a violation-ish too, Yingying is also female and you're expected to obey your father, husband, and son so eh.... not that weird because they aren't actually family. The specifics of two men though is a different matter not commonly discussed obviously. Generally you sought a master to better yourself and grow virtue, but if you start a romantic relationship with them it equalizes your dynamic and they become more of a peer than someone you learn from, so in Qingge's mind because he is traditionally virtuous Binghe was likely not on the radar at all because why would anyone mess with that mentor-student relationship? It has to be from among the other leaders in their sect that the succubus is talking about to his mind.

This is probably circular, but I’ve been writing this up for over an hour late at night. XD

Sources: life, heritage, reading classic lit books, and at least 3 courses discussing gender representation in East Asia at UCI (arguably almost all my coursework covered these ideas to a degree)

[natsunoomoi]

Finished Main Story of SVSSS....

So yeah, I did that. I still really liked the story overall. Some parts are a bit problematic in a way, but also in a satisfying way that is complex and I think can refer to some real life relationships and complexities of that because not all relationships fit nicely into the little boxes and labels that we make and that’s my take away from the ending.

-Don’t like the in-story “original author” still, but also don’t dislike him as much as I did when I started the story now that I got more of his perspective. MXTX posted all of this for free not thinking it would go anywhere really, but it’s true that some people do have careers where they make a living off of their webnovels and fans buying chapters, so that pressure is there. I’m sure that because MXTX is also a fan of D. Gray-man, she’s aware of the similar pressures that even mangaka at JUMP face. Like BLEACH basically ended early because it fell out of popularity with the fans just as Airplane mentions happens to some novel works. To be fair, BLEACH also lifted an entire plotline from another popular supernatural manga including carbon copies of the lackeys of the villain for that arc, so some shade was also deserved. Like Yukio is just Amanuma Tsukihito with a PSP instead of an arcade system or Super Famicom. D. Gray-man itself has also been on hiaitus several times due to health concerns and such. Same as Hunter x Hunter and other prolific manga. The pressure is real and some ways the original author is kind of a mood. He’s also still a huge coward and that’s annoying.

-I feel worse for Shen Jiu than when I did when I was just reading his backstory off of the wikis and stuff from just wanting to see Shen Qingqiu’s beautiful face. Like I felt bad before, but after knowing more and witnessing some sentiments that would have been gut punches if Shen Jiu had heard them, I feel so bad for him. I don’t condone what he did, but I also get it and wish I could hug him. Basically about the same level of thought as I put into how much I like Emet-Selch, but I think overall in the end I love Emet-Selch more because the 5.3 patch update for FFXIV broke me. Man, that MSQ. Like I’ve never been opposed to liking villains and always thought some villains were cool. Like my sister worships Sephiroth from FFVII for instance, but like I was never really into Sephiroth’s motivations in that he’s cool, but his identity crisis didn’t quite strike me as like actually 100% believable that torching Nibelheim and trying to rescue Jenova was justified or a natural reaction someone in his position would have. I like him more than Cloud cuz Cloud is a hot fucking mess of a person and he’s overall just cool, but as a villain his motivations didn’t resonate with me.  A lot of people also really liked Kefka because he’s just straight up insane and like chaotic evil, but that kind of evil just isn’t compelling to me. Emet-Selch though straight up broke me and I thought about him for like months after the initial end of Shadowbringers when you do the fight with Hades. His story is ripe with meaning and nuance and the Tales from the Shadows stories adding more nuance and color to his eternal living torture of seeing remnants of people he cared about constantly without a break or a way to really “forget” and heal. That just stuck with me because I’ve lost people in my life too, and I remember what that was like and how hard it was to even live the day after let alone the following few years. I remember it well even today because it fundamentally changed me as a person, but I was able to find some relief and escape from music and entertainment and going out to have new experiences and travel. Emet-Selch could not, so his story really broke me internally. I bring this up just to make a comparison because I love Shen Jiu as well, but for nowhere near as dramatic a reason as I love Emet-Selch.

Spoilers under the cut

Okay, so since I was just talking about Shen Jiu, and maybe it’s partly because I actually find him to be gorgeous as well, but just reading his story did genuinely make me sad. I found his child form to be a little bit jaded already only because he was an older child already by the time he was bought by the Qius. When Yue Qingyuan was parting with him through the door he was being kind of manipulative there for extra sympathy initially, which isn’t really great. How severely the brother beat him though was hard to take. It was so extreme, like wtf? And perhaps the part where Qiu Haitang said that he’d been “freed” and the part where he was engaged seems to be true-ish, but yeah her brother is kind of really fucked up in how he still talks to him even though he is supposed to be his brother-in-law soon? Like what the hell. But like, the summaries of what he did online and even what Haitang had said also made it sound even more cold than it was. Like once he got going yeah, the onslaught was kind of cold. But he still had a moment of shock where like he didn’t really realize what he’d done right away and needed a moment to process. But after that it was like, well, it’s already done and people came to try to help the young master and he had to get out too. So the other people on the way out after that don’t sound nearly as consequential and it was really striking that not only did he not attack Haitang, but he spared all the other women in the house. Like Jesus Christ, were *ALL* the men in the house including the male servants and other slaves they had assholes to him too? Just, wow. But we don’t get a lot into what else happened there, but if the head of the household is bad and hurts him, it’s believable that other people join in just as Ming Fan joined in because Shen Jiu was complicit in allowing Binghe’s suffering. Really key though is the commentary of both the young master and his first evil master about his age. 

That is such a huge chip on his shoulder because everyone keeps bringing it the fuck up. Including Qingge in another memory later on when he’s already Peak Lord. I know they don’t like each other, but that was really mean. I realize Qingge probably doesn’t care and that was the point to throw salt in his wounds because they don’t like each other, but seeing how much it affected him by him breaking his fan with his hands after hearing that. I’ve had people do similar to me where they make an insensitive comment to try to hurt you without understanding the actual circumstances. My sister did that to me once and I reconciled with her for a bit, but decided not to talk to her anymore again because of some other bullshit with her friends being childish. But when she did similar to me, I never really forgave her for it either. My story is not nearly as dramatic, but basically I had quit a job where I was being bullied by coworkers at the start of the recession and I was looking for jobs, but no luck with anything I was qualified for even though I went on a few interviews. There actually weren’t many listings posted around that time, so I would only be able to find a couple to apply to and by the time my sister came home I’d be playing games to pass the time cuz I was bored out of my mind waiting for something to happen. So then we got in an argument for I forget the initial reason anymore, but she brought up how I “wasn’t looking” for a job and just seemed to be “being lazy” and I just got so pissed and yelled at her that she had no fucking idea what I was doing everyday and that I am looking and there isn’t anything fucking there. I also lost it and threw a stool at her. I’m not proud of it, but I totally get the mood of what it feels like for someone to use something that you are struggling with as a negative to throw in your face even though you are trying *SO* hard to do your best. I especially don’t want to hear that from someone who gave up on their desired career that they were actually good at and making a decent living at for money and also can’t tell when their friends are kissing up to them and crossing a line and won’t stand up to them for being shitty people. Teapot meet kettle, and don’t throw stones if you live in a glass fucking house. I don’t like low blows like that. 

My personal family issue aside though, I felt a lot of empathy for Shen Jiu in that moment. Seeing how he interacted with Binghe on their first meeting after that though, like I was sad for Binghe too, but I can also see where his misunderstanding happened on top of his insecurity. I also kind of wonder if Qingge’s comment also kind of encouraged this situation to happen.  I still like Qingge because he makes up for it a lot later, but yeah that was fucked up.

The gut punch later was when Qingyuan was seemingly dying and tried to apologize to Qingqiu, but all the words and the things Shen Jiu needed to hear. His years of misunderstanding and not knowing and being in pain and thinking he was abandoned. That was painful. Shen Jiu is gone. We don’t know where he is. Maybe he’s dead. No idea, but those are things he can never know. It’s already too late, and that’s crushing.

I still just really want to know more about Shen Jiu and I feel really sad that there wasn’t some kind of redemption for him or anything. Even if it’s like Shen Yuan going into the recesses of his own mind and finds Shen Jiu locked in a box somewhere so actually the both of them share the same body and he’s just watching in a tiny TV what Shen Yuan does with his body. He’d be really frustrated and would probably scream at him a lot with his screams completely unheard, but at least he’d get to see people liking him more and would be able to hear the words that Qingyuan spoke. I mentioned in an earlier post that I saw a theory about OG Qingqiu transmigrating into Shen Yuan when Shen Yuan takes over his body, and I think that’s possible because Shang Qinghua says that when he transmigrated he was born there and was since a baby? I was thinking maybe it’d be more like OG dies when OG Binghe kills him and then becomes Shen Yuan, but who knows.

I mean, also I just crave more information about him. He’s so unfortunate, and I like wish more went right for him so that he wouldn’t be so miserable. Like when you see a character where their life is just shit on, you just wish that you could do something to take away their pain.

And with that sentiment, that’s also why I found the ending to be satisfying but probably a little problematic. Like Shen Yuan is just a good guy and he has that same sentiment for Binghe just because he’s a poor kid with a shitty hand in life, but he’s also like really clearly not gay himself and not actually attracted to Binghe in that way. To be clear, the book does seem to discourage this kind of relationship in that it works in the way the narrative unfolded, but it isn’t one that would work in real life really. That’s part of the depth of it though. Like SY emotionally cares for him and he even remarks that he feels kind of more like his Dad, but the physical side of their relationship is more on Binghe’s side than his, and he acquiesces to it because he feels bad for him because this poor child has no one. And yeah, fine this works in an actual book that we’re all reading and this works within the system within the book where the MC is in a book himself with really screwed up logic rules, but I don’t recommend this method of getting with someone you like in real life. It will not end well. If someone you like is not into you, emotionally manipulating them and crying and also stalking them until they give their body to you out of desperation to console you is not the road to happiness. You also won’t have a pressure timer of life on earth ending by combining with actual hell to push them into bed with you. The fact that SY resorts to this in desperation in order to try to help Binghe to get control of the demon sword is admirable in the narrative of the story in that he’s doing it because he cares so much about this person and that’s fine, but it’s a red flag if anyone did this IRL and put their wishes aside to appease someone else. There will be a breakdown in the future as one person puts aside their needs for the other one completely. Partnerships that work are healthy and equal. That’s not what this is. In the story, the two characters have an understanding though that makes it fine, but I have second-hand anxiety for the idea that anyone would try to replicate this. This is not normally healthy.

But at the same time, the fact that the characters have an understanding to that is unique to their personal choice is also realistic in a sense that life is sometimes complicated and a similar situation could come about, but it is the choice of the people involved. With constant communication there’s a slim chance that maybe it could work out, but it’s hard. The main level of complexity I’m thinking of is that there’s different ways to care about other people or rather to just feel about other people. Like you can have like an intellectual attraction to other people in that you just like talking with them and you’re good friends with them because of that. You can be romantically attracted to someone, but also not feel sexual attraction too. Of course you can also feel physical attraction to someone, but not really care at all about them emotionally or even intellectually. SY has emotional feelings for Binghe, but it’s more on the parental side or even just human in not wanting him to suffer. If this were a points meter, his values for his emotions and just caring about him would be at max, while physical attraction and even romantic attraction are basically zero. Like he also just like cares about him in principle? Like as an all seeing reader you look at everything and are just like, wtf with this shit? How can one person suffer so much? As empthy or even sympathy you feel for them so then if the other person is more not asexual or aromantic that can trigger some feelings which is what happened between these two characters. The reason I say it isn’t necessarily bad, but some shakiness on execution too. But like say like an asexual person is romantically attracted to someone who isn’t asexual, but they still want to be with them. Like the non-ace person has some needs sometimes and even if the ace doesn’t feel it, because they care about their partner they acquiesce to their partner’s requests because they just want them to be happy. This kind of very personal choice situation I think is really similar to basically what ends up happening between SY Qingqiu and Binghe where SY isn’t really interested, but at the same time cares about Binghe’s well-being so much that he actually just wants him to be happy and reluctantly is okay with the situation. IRL though Binghe would be REALLY FRUSTRATING to be so unreasonably needy and like narcissistically abusive in wanting him all to himself an isolating him from his friends and being jealous of them. In comparison, Wangji and Wuxian are a great deal more balanced in comparison, but I also really like this book for the original idea and the complexity of SY’s ultimate choice because I feel like it’s also a bit more real that some people do make that kind of choice. It’s not healthy or guaranteed to be a success or happy experience, but it’s in the realm of possibilities for the kinds of personal choices people can make because the other person’s happiness is worth the minor discomfort.

Ah, I just have a lot of thoughts about this. Part of it stems from myself being ace also and what that means for me. But also getting to the end, I think Qingge is a fellow ace and also similar to me, just serious about his job and loyal to his crew.

I’ve read some of the extras obviously, but I haven’t delved that deeply into the extra materials.

Oh also, I laughed so hard when Mobei-jun just tossed Shang Qinghua over like a chicken. It said like a chicken and it was hilarious. XD Like imagining that panicked sound of hucking chickens in Ocarina of Time.

Oh and ho-shit the alt punishment system came up for SY Qingqiu for screwing up his points. Got to live through half the process of becoming a human stick very painfully.

I guess part of me is still kind of just wondering how Binghe grew to be SO needy. It’s to an unnecessary degree, but I guess without any real emotional or social guidance in the Endless Abyss that could happen?

Zhuzhi-Lang though is a really frustratingly annoying character, but I also like him at the same time. I’m confused by him.

The only other thing I’m like confused a bit about is like, so the 4 sects that are depicted with Cang Qiong Mountain being the top one are like the great four sects, but like...where are they? I’m just asking because of the kind of meta general landscape of what cultivation and Taoism is like some of the events that happen I would think actually would call down some interference from actual Heaven. Like in the classic lit, whenever there’s huge disturbances down in the Human World, like the Heavenly Palace and like the Jade Emperor are like, “WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT?” and go send people. I find it really hard to believe that such a disaster as the combining of two realms would be ignored by the armies of Heaven and like Nezha, Erlang Shen, and other notable actual deities up there would come down and be like, “The fuck you guys doing down here with these shenanigans?” Also, Journey to the West is like one of the most like influential books in the canon of Chinese lit and is regarded as literally one of the Four Great Classics. But none of these fools in these “great four sects” know how to stamp a floor and call up the local deity to tell you what the hell is happening in Jinlan City instead of sending your disciples to die? Sun Wukung did that at like every damn city and then also threatened to beat them if they like weren’t doing their job properly. Those minor deities are on the payroll for Heaven, so like...use them? Like I feel like they would know this too because like the ultimate goal for cultivation is to be able to become an immortal and end up on the payroll? I know Qingqiu is supposedly like mid-level or something, but like I think they should like know-ish where they’re going? Like in the future they would become one of those minor gods making records? Are they like not high enough to even talk to them? Maybe not, but I do think like Nezha, Pagoda Bearer Li, or Erlang Shen would definitely come down and be like, “Hey, what’s going on?”

Also like, Shen Jiu isn’t a great character and how he treats his disciples is bad and what he did was bad. But like, also, what is the standard to judge him really? Like Nezha was a dick when he was a child too. When he was 3 he went to a river and was swimming and liked killed all the fish and then a dragon prince came out and was like, “WTF? Why are all the fish dead?” and then Nezha instead of answering him kills him and guts him and then takes his tendon home to turn into a belt. Then like his Dad gets a complaint from the Dragon King like, “Hey, my son is dead! Your son did it. Hand him over so I can kill him or I destroy your town.” So then Nezha’s Dad goes to talk to him and is like, “What’re you doing?” And then Nezha answers him and tells him exactly what he did like it was no big fucking deal that he killed the local Dragon Prince and made him into a belt. Obviously there’s an argument and like Nezha basically rage quits his life and is like, if you’re so concerned about this bullshit I return this body to you and kills himself to cut off his ties to his parents. He was a rude little shit. Then he went into his Mom’s dream and threatened her until she built him a temple so he could get prayer requests until he could be reborn again. His Dad found out and wrecked the temple, so then he went up to go find his master who had him be reborn using lotus flowers. After that after being reborn, Nezha’s first order of business was to go back to his family and try to kill his own father for fucking up his temple and chased him down EVERYWHERE until other powers in Heaven, decided to send down Nezha’s older brothers with a pagoda to give to their Dad that would trap and burn Nezha everytime he tried to murder him. Is this better or worse than what Shen Jiu did? This is an actual god that people worship. A quite prominent and very famous one. Nezha is also one of my favorite deities and I had a huge crush on the Nataku from Fujisaki Ryu’s Houshin Engi manga who has mostly the same backstory as deity Nezha, and I just loved him in high school. He was a good guy. What are the standards here people? I don’t think anyone in any story in China can really judge someone like Shen Jiu doing an understandable level of murder as a response to trauma and severe abuse when they worship a deity that suffered nothing and tried to commit patricide and had a severe disregard for other life. In the cultivation world, potentially, this could be their future boss. I think arguably, he could be worse than Shen Jiu, but he’s a canonical real deity.

The above tirade for me is like a thing I feel like I would have said if I was in the position to be alive in Jinlan City and wanted to defend Shen Qingqiu cuz WTF.

Further, I’m a huge fan of Jigoku Shoujo and Enma Ai did much the same after her cousin saved her from being sacrificed, the villagers found out, buried her a live, made her cousin help bury her alive, and then she came back as a vengeful spirit and set the whole village on fire and killed everyone except maybe her parents who had their souls as prisoners by Enma himself? Can’t 100% remember. But like, on the scale of characters I like that have done terrible things, Shen Jiu is actually relatively low and under some people that are good guys.