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firelxdykatara · 4 years

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ppl love to forget that katara: 1. has her own taste, 2. developed around aang, he needed her for his development and vice versa, 3. ZUTARA IS SHIP BETWEEN AN OPPRESOR X OPPRESSED!!! Ignoring all of the development they had with their respective partners and the trauma Zuko caused Katara!!

In the infamous words of one Luke Skywalker: amazing. every word of what you just said was wrong.

It’s actually kind of ironic that you bring up Katara’s taste, since, throughout the show, we have examples of the guys she likes, to greater or lesser extents in canon--Jet (explicit romantic feelings on her part, word of god that jet was her first kiss--a kiss that would have been consensual, incidentally, something you should keep in mind for later) and Haru (she denies the crush, but that could just as easily have been because of the abomination he’d been growing on his lip rather than denying those feelings ever existed), both of whom have much more in common (in terms of both emotional and physical maturity, and physical appearance) with Zuko than either of them has with Aang.

Zuko’s book 3 hairstyle is almost exactly reminiscent of Jet’s, even, if not quite as floofy.

(This is probably in part because of Jet’s function as a foil of Zuko within the narrative, particularly given their book 2 encounters, which I think just further solidifies my point that, were it not for extenuating circumstances [like the fact that Zuko was introduced as an enemy and they had significant obstacles to hurdle before they could be friends], Zuko would have been exactly Katara’s type. Had they met under different circumstances, she could have been the girl he went on a date with in Ba Sing Se. Just something to think about.)

So, yes, we’ve established that Katara has her own taste. Her tastes seem to be boys with great hair who are taller than her, the same age or older, and of a similar maturity level.

Aang falls short (heh, short) on all counts. So it isn’t Katara’s taste in boys that led her to be interested in him. Hm!

Next, you claim that Katara ‘developed around Aang’--that she was necessary for his development, and that he was necessary for hers.

Let’s take a moment to examine that, shall we?

I will absolutely grant you that Katara was necessary for Aang’s development--only to a point, of course, but we’ll get to that later--but was he really necessary for Katara‘s growth? I suppose I could grant you this on a generous technicality--he did, after all, provide her with the means to finally leave the South Pole and find a waterbending master to teach her (although she wound up largely self-taught anyway). But that had nothing to do with his relationship to Katara and everything to do with the structure of the plot--Katara and Sokka find Aang (and he never would have gotten out of that iceberg without Katara’s own righteous anger, so even that leads back to her own power), and then they go on a quest to find teachers for the Chosen One and save the world.

The story could not have begun without first finding Aang and then providing means for the other main characters to travel with him (or, in Zuko’s case, chase him), but this has nothing at all to do with Aang’s relationship to Katara. Aang was not a mover in Katara’s developmental arc--if anything, he acted as an obstacle more often than not, his actions ranging from innocent but obnoxious (playing and flirting with girls rather than helping with chores like picking up vital supplies, leaving Katara to do all of the quite literal heavy lifting and keeping her stuck in the role of caretaker that she’d been thrust into following the death of her mother), to deliberate and harmful (hiding the map to Katara and Sokka’s father, a truly selfish action, regardless of his lack of malicious intent, and one for which he never actually apologized), to somewhere in between (”she didn’t really mean that” he says to the man refusing to train Katara because she’s a girl, when yes, she very much did mean that, and Aang was no help in finally getting the old codger to eat his words--Katara had to shove them down his throat her own damn self).

While Katara’s overall arc wasn’t exactly big and dynamic (like Zuko’s redemption arc), or in-your-face (like Sokka getting force-fed Respect Women Juice and his eventual growth into a tactician and leader), it was very much present and woven into her character--and Aang had almost no part in it. He provided her with the means to get to the North Pole, but left Katara alone to fight the patriarchy herself. He messed around while Katara took it on herself to do the chores and keep the Gaang alive, but he did almost nothing to decrease that burden so she could grow out of the caretaker role. (Contrary to popular shipper claims, Aang didn’t actually teach Katara to have fun. She already knew how to have fun. But she couldn’t indulge, because she had a responsibility to her family and her tribe, and later to her brother and Aang and Toph, and Aang goofing off and trying to get her to do the same only added to her burdens rather than subtracting from them.) He provided Katara with the necessary motive to learn to heal herself, but he certainly didn’t seem to learn from the experience of accidentally burning her, preferring instead to claim he was never going to firebend again, despite already knowing, at that point, that he was going to need to master fire along with the other elements to become a fully realized Avatar and defeat the Firelord.

He didn’t help Katara keep them alive during The Desert. (In fact, he ran off, leaving her to desperately try to keep Sokka and Toph from succumbing to the heat while worrying for his safety.) In The Painted Lady, Katara makes the decision to stall the Gaang and do what she can to help the Fire Nation villagers on her own--Aang agrees to help her when he finds out, but he wasn’t actually instrumental in her making that choice. The Puppetmaster was, again, Katara finding a master of her own, and having to deal with the fallout from that. And in The Southern Raiders, Aang was--perhaps unknowingly, if I’m being generous, because he is a child and could not reasonably be expected to fully understand the implications of what he was asking her to do or why it was impossible--actively impeding Katara’s development! She desperately needed closure, something he could not understand and actively belittled and dismissed. The only reason he relented in the end (but not without a condescending ‘I forgive you! Does that give you any ideas???’ parting shot lmao) was because Katara was planning to take Appa anyway, and letting her go (and hoping she’d just magically wind up doing things his way) was easier than trying to fight her on it.

While Aang’s existence was necessary for Katara to start down her own path, she needed neither his guidance nor his approval to follow it--and absolutely nothing would change about Katara’s arc if you removed their romantic relationship entirely.

Possibly because the only changes needed to do so would be to remove the two times Aang kissed Katara without her consent (which, hopefully, no one would actually miss), and the epilogue kiss (which was awkward and unnecessary to begin with, since ending the entire show on a romantic kiss as the final shot kind of missed the point of the story to begin with, but that’s another discussion). None of these kisses (which are the only moments in which Katara’s feelings for Aang are so much as addressed; do note that addressing them, or hinting that they needed to be, is not the same as saying she exhibited any sign of reciprocating them) altered anything about Katara’s behavior, her personal arc, or (and perhaps most critically) her relationship with Aang.

It’s that last point that is really damning, as far as ‘Katara obviously had feelings for Aang, she kissed him in the finale!’ goes. Because she didn’t ‘obviously’ have feelings for him. And the fact that he kissed her before the invasion and then she forgot about it (she literally had no idea what he was talking about during the play’s intermission until he reminded her that he’d kissed her) is pretty clear evidence that she didn’t actually have feelings for him. Not the kind he had for her.

I’ve been a teenage girl. I know what it’s like to be surprise!kissed by your crush. And I absolutely for a full fact know that I had not completely forgotten about that kiss three months later and had, in fact, spent most of my waking hours thinking about it and remembering it and trying to talk to him about it. Now, granted, I was not in the middle of a war, but even if I had been, I doubt I would have needed reminding about the fact that the boy I’ve supposedly been developing feelings for had kissed me and showed clearly that he had those feelings for me too.

At the very least, if Katara was harboring feelings that she was worried about approaching until after the war, her relationship dynamic with Aang should have shifted. But it didn’t. She acted the exact same way with him after the Day of Black Sun as she did before it--that is, as a mother figure and a caretaker, responsible for his wellbeing. (And it’s clear she never took him down off the pedestal she needed him to occupy, either--let it not be said that the unhealthy aspects of their relationship only went one way.)

And book 3 is, incidentally, where Katara went from being vital to Aang’s development to being detrimental to it--or, rather, Aang’s refusal to let go of his attachment to her (despite ostensibly having done as much at the end of book 2) was. Because despite having been told by, perhaps, the greatest authority left in the world on Air Nomad culture (even more than Aang, who had left his temple with a child’s understanding of his culture that was never able to mature because he got stuck in the ice berg while his people were wiped out) that he had to let go of his possessive attachment to this girl who never even expressed the possibility that she might harbor romantic feelings for him to begin with, after Azula killed him and Katara brought him back, he went right back into the mindset of Katara is mine, it’s just a matter of time.

And the narrative validated him for it.

Notice how, during Ember Island Players, Aang says the following (emphasis mine):

“We kissed at the invasion, and I thought we were gonna be together. But we’re not.”

First of all, if you go back and watch the scene, it’s clear it wasn’t a mutual kiss. Aang sprang a surprise kiss on Katara, which left her shocked and unhappy after he flew off. (The decision to have her looking away and frowning was a deliberate one on the part of Bryke, who wanted Katara’s feelings kept ambiguous. Heaven forbid you allow the animators to make it clear that this fourteen-year-old girl who was just kissed without her consent by someone she’d never once demonstrated romantic feelings toward might actually have some. Heaven forbid she have a little agency in her own romantic narrative. But whatever.)

Second, he says he thought they were gonna be together.

He thought.

He never once even asked Katara what she thought--or even how she felt. He just assumes. He assumes that if he kisses her, she’ll kiss him back and they’ll get together. He assumes that she must have feelings for him, even though her body language is closed off and she told him with her words that she did not want to talk or think about this right now, and kisses her regardless of those signals, upsetting her and leading her to storm off.

And the narrative rewards him, because despite the fact that they don’t have a single significant scene together after that second disastrous kiss, Katara just decides off-screen that she Does Love Him Really and walks onto the balcony to make out with him.

The upshot of all this being that, while Katara was indeed instrumental to a lot of Aang’s early growth and development, Aang was not necessary for her own arc, and their romantic relationship (such as it was) actively hampered Aang’s development in book 3, while removing it would change absolutely nothing for Katara (except saving her from some painfully embarrassing memories).

As far as your third point, I’m simply not going to get baited into explaining how reducing Zutara to an ‘oppressor/oppressed’ relationship is not only insulting to interracial couples irl (not to mention any other couple with a potentially unbalanced dynamic of societal power, since there are many more axis of oppression than just racial), but demeaning to Zuko and Katara, their personal arcs as well as their relationship development together.

However, I will point out that Zuko was not responsible for any of Katara’s trauma. She did not find violence and fighting in bending battles to be traumatic--in fact, she reveled in it. She enjoyed fighting against Zuko at multiple points (especially noticeable in their battle at the end of book 1), because she wanted to fight--she always had--and once she had the ability, she was ready to throw down with anyone who gave her the slightest reason. (Including, by the way, her own potential waterbending master.) Aang’s death at the end of book 2 was Azula’s doing, and while I think that contributed to Katara’s extreme reaction to Zuko joining the gaang, it was not something for which she actively blamed him, and it wasn’t something she believed would be repeated--she let him go off alone on a journey to find the original firebending masters with Aang well before she chose to forgive him. So she already trusted Zuko’s intentions and that Aang would be safe with him.

Finally, because this has gotten long enough already, I hope you now understand that Zuko and Katara getting together would not require ignoring any of their development with their canonical romantic partners. We’ve already established that Katara’s arc wouldn’t change in the slightest if all of Aang’s romantic advances were removed, and I haven’t even gotten into how Mai meant nothing in the grand scheme of Zuko’s development because I’m pretty sure that’s just self-evident. I mean, the video compilation put together by Nick showcasing Zuko’s journey throughout the series doesn’t include a single scene with Mai, though it does include several with Katara, and even Jin makes an appearance--because Katara, and even Jin, played key roles in Zuko’s personal journey, while his relationship with Mai happened entirely off-screen and her only real function was to showcase just how unhealthy trying to force himself back into the role of the Crown Prince was for him.

What development, exactly, is there between them to even ignore?

At any rate, I’ve gone on long enough--I hope you enjoy the fact that you activated my wordvomit trap card right when i was about to go to bed, anon, because I just spent two hours writing this instead. In case you’re interested in the TL;DR: at the end of the day, there was no meaningful, mutual development in Kataang’s romantic relationship, and those romantic feelings that did exist were largely one-sided and ultimately detrimental to Aang’s development in the final third of his overall arc. Meanwhile, Mai meant nothing to Zuko’s journey--rather like Aang’s romantic overtures, she could be removed from the show completely and nothing about his story would change--while Zuko and Katara were both vital to each other’s overall storylines, arcs and development. This, coupled with the fact that Zuko never actually traumatized Katara and, in fact, helped her achieve closure from the biggest source of her own trauma, means that Zuko and Katara have better and more believable build up that could potentially lead to a romantic relationship than either of them have with their canon romantic partners.

So no, anon, I didn’t forget anything--I think you may have, though. Perhaps a rewatch is in order? Make sure not to close your eyes for the back half of book 3 this time.

#atla #zutara #zuko #katara #aang salt #kataang salt #maiko salt #salt for ts #just trying to cover my bases #asked #Anonymous

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nightswithkookmin · 4 years

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JIKOOK DYNAMICS: JIMIN'S LOVE LANGUAGE

PREFACE

In my previous post, I shared my thoughts on what I think is Jikook's love language, specifically Jungkook's; and how in my estimation Jimin is the only member within BTS that speaks it, comes close to speaking it and most importantly makes the effort to speak it.

In this post, I attempt to outline what I think is Jimin's love language and show the various ways I feel JK speaks it or comes close to speaking it more so than the others in BTS.

Now I have to state for the record that I do not know or purport to know Jimin or Jungkook or any of these members herein mentioned in any way special and personal other than through the content we all consume on them.

Nor do I intend to be malicious or disrespectful towards them with this post, to intend to strip away their individuality for the sake of shipping symmetry.

Thus, I reiterate, everything I express in here is my thoughts, my observations and my opinion and I pray you treat it as such.

Let the records show, also that, I will bug spray any fake woke wannabe edgy shipper with a Tuktukker complex that takes my words out of context, misconstrue it to suit their own agenda and then turn around to call me out for it. In the name of Jesus, I will avada kedabra your ass. Seriously.

JIMIN

I've always been fascinated by Jimin. By the person he is. And although I do not have a comprehensive understanding of this man's inner workings, he's got to be the most complex and frankly interesting character I've come across in all my shipping years.

His duality is confusing and coupled with his Libra energy, his character and personality can be and is quite often misconstrued and misinterpreted within the shipping community.

He is friendly, cute, funny, beautiful and ship compatible with anyone.

Very often, I find, most people cannot tell his personality from his idol self slash persona or even his love language from his affectionate nature; thus resulting in these bizzare fallacies and ridiculous assumptions about him such as: he is a flirt, hoe, clingy, homewrecker, attention seeker and a plethora of slurs and sobriquet that's defamatory and slanderous at best- its ridiculous.

I get that not everyone likes him and as such wouldn't hesitate to filter his words and actions through arbitrary metrics to arrive at conclusions that profits them and does nothing but help them make sense of their hate- Y'all don't love yourselves enough.

Not to say he is my bias therefore he is perfect. That would be a blunder. He has his shortcomings, he is human after all. What I'm saying is most people don't get him and as such read him wrong?

What's more discombobulating, is the stan who swears up and down they know Jimin well enough but don't see him treating JK any different from the rest of the boys in BTS therefore Jikook isn't real- insert shook pikachu face.

Then there are those stans with genuine shipping concerns about the love dynamics between the two:

Those that feel JM gives more to JK than he receives back. That he is more supportive of JK than JK is of him. Very often, these people would bring up the issue of JK not promoting Promise when it first came out as evidence of this- it's been years let it go.

JK not being as vocal and open about his feelings and interest in JM the way Jimin is and has been about JK is also another area of concern for these stans. If you try to explain to them its because JK is/was shy they will kick- your- ass. Hell, I will kick your ass too. I'll explain later.

Some people also- I know I have at one point- have described JK's interest in and descriptions of JM as a bit shallow and vain compared to how the other members speak of Jimin.

To them, the other members usually talk about how smart and intelligent JM is, how kind and nurturing he is. How much of himself he gives to them. That the way the members talk about Jimin often helps give us a glimpse into the real Park Jimin as distinct from the persona we see on the screens.

But then there is JK: JM hyung is sexy. He has pretty eyes. 'I want you.' Then he proceeds to drool over the Jibooty, squeeze them legs shut tight while struggling to sit through a Jimin solo dance without popping boners left right left around Jimin- Bless him.

I mean, dude nearly snapped his neck trying to catch a glimpse of the Ji-abs in the middle of a performance? Damn.

To be fair, the other members don't talk like this about Jimin and sexualise Jimin as often as JK does because, they don't want to screw Jimin's brains out? Cough, cough. Hashtag save Jimin from JK. Lol

If JK is sexually attracted to Jimin, how else do you expect him to express that? Never mind that he's done some of these things subconsciously at times. You know what...

Y'all need to give this man a break!

[RANT]

He was a hormonal teen- he is still relatively pretty young. It's ridiculous to expect and demand such high level of maturity from a 16/17 year old experiencing a nonplatonic love for the first time in his life and more so in an unforgiving and invasive environment such as that in which he found himself.

Jk and Jimin found each other before they found themselves and it's unreasonable to think that that didn't have a toll on their relationship dynamics. They are human.

They are each growing and maturing at different paces. Their relationship has suffered through its growing pains; Certainly, one person is going to appear lacking in one or two areas in one way shape or form and at any given point in their love journey. That doesn't make them less real.

Again, their careers and the pursuit of it haven't exactly given them the space, time or normalcy to explore what they are and who they are in a functional way, in my opinion.

Everything is moving fast in their world, everything is highly exaggerated and highly scrutinized. Kpop is not exactly a healthy space to foster a healthy relationship and it would be a miracle if any of them should come out unscathed.

Neither one of them went searching for this love thingy nor were they even experienced enough to look at their relationship beyond the convenience of it and the excitement of it- The orgasms were enough reason for them, I think.

I get uncomfortable when some Jikookers, out of good intentions, claim Jikook knew what they were doing, should have known therefore could have known the consequences of them coupling up in a group like BTS before entering into their relationship- let me stop you right there!

While this assumption may seem like a compliment to them it also perpetuates the adultification of early days Jikook which I find disturbing.

They were teens not grown adults when they fell in love. We can't expect and demand such level of maturity from them at that age as cool as that would have made them.

They don't need to be cool to be real. They don't need to be mature to be real.

Jikook is real regardless of whether they were thoughtful or not thoughtful about the consequences of them choosing to date in a group setting, or a homophobic society at the onset of their relationship.

It's ridiculous to dismiss what they are now on the grounds that S.K is a homophobic society or that dating a coworker is not inconsequential.

People date their coworkers all the time and there are gay couples in S.K.

Jikook were too young to comprehend the consequences of dating because which teen worries about all of that before popping one off for the lord? On which planet, sir/ma'am??Were they thinking with their 'ducks?' I believe so. But again, that doesn't make them any less real.

From what I can tell anyway, 2018 was the year Jikook had anything resembling a serious thoughtful contemplation of the status of their relationship- Well, 2018 and this later half of 2020 as some of you might have already noticed. More on this later.

But yes, this adultification of early days Jikook is absurd and needs to stop. And what's equally disturbing is the infantilization of the adult day Jikook- you can't expect Jikook dynamics to remain the same throughout the years. That's bizzare.

Don't expect them to be their same jeonlous, Jimlous, possessive selves. They are growing. They are evolving as individuals and as a pair.

I side eye the fuck out of these fake woke shippers and 'grown ups' who filter Jikook interactions through adult lens and tag moments like Jimlous and Jeonlous as toxic and unhealthy without taking into context where they were at in their love journey or even their age. What y'all think this is? Fiction? Get the fuck outta here.

Jikook have had to learn and grow on the Job and around their job and learn to love eachother under the scrutiny of severe cameras and weird Ahjummas. Leave them the fuck alone or I swear I will petrify your ass for an entire comeback season. Lol

[Rant over]

All that being said, I get it. The way JK talks about Jimin isn't exactly special or unique from the way the other's speak about Jimin. But it isn't exactly superficial either...

And yes, it's quite unsettling that he doesn't describe Jimin in a way that gives meaningful insight into Jimin's personality as distinct from the others', given as he has exclusive access to Jimin more so than any of the members- we have a lot to unpack today, don't we?

Then on the other hand, there are those who think the exact opposite and see JK as the one who gives more to their relationship. That JK takes their relationship more seriously than Jimin does. They see Jimin as a bit wishy-washy when it comes to his commitment to their relationship- this breaks my heart.

Often, such people will cite Jimin's flirty nature, his lack of boundaries with others amongst other things, to prove their point...

Grab a seat, this discussion is going to be a long one. Smiley face.

JIMIN'S LOVE LANGUAGE

Jimin first got on my alt-ship radar in Rookie King when he was given an opportunity to air any and all of his grievances accumulated over the years against any member or staff of BigHit but instead chose to use that opportunity to talk about JK and how JK's actions had been hurting him.

Prior to this, he was just my bias and I would casually ship him with Suga, V, RM and basically all the members- except JK. I just couldn't ship JK with anyone.

Back then, I had a vague sense of JM's personality but felt I knew enough about him to theorize on his love language and JK was the last person I thought of as capable of meeting those emotional needs of Jimin's.

Rookie King changed my mind.

Jimin wasn't just trying to squash his differences with JK, he was trying to get closer to him. To get emotionally intimate with him- this is one of the things that sparked my interest in their dynamics.

Because it wasn't as if they weren't close. They were. They had a skinship between them. Skinship, or lack of physical boundaries as I like to call it, is one of the means through which BTS achieve intimacy amongst them.

Jikook had that between them at the time, they went everywhere together, woke each other up- they were close.

Yet Jimin felt they weren't close enough. That there was a wall between them. Now, I see a lot of people misinterpret this period in the Jikook timeline as that Jimin was crushing hard on JK. He wasn't. In my opinion.

You see, Jimin was the last person to Join the band. This was bound to have an effect on his relationship dynamics with the rest of the members as he had missed out on two years worth of emotional connection and camaraderie with them.

He had had only one year to bond and get to know the others away from the cameras and in a way that could help him develop a sense of belongingness within the group.

Within this one year, he had school, voice training, and other activities that possibly got in the way of him truly building an intimate connection with the others.

He is the only member out of the seven whose intimacy journey got captured on camera. He had to foster a connection with the others with the cameras around.

But building a connection with people even in a platonic sense is quite an intimate and private process. It takes vulnerability, honesty, a willingness to submit and subject oneself to varying degrees of humiliation, a sacrifice of the self, ego and pride in a way that just strips you naked- metaphorically speaking.

And in Jimin's case, he had to go through this stage and process openly and with the cameras around- the second hand embarrassment I get from watching early days Park Jimin!

He literally had to be the clown of the group, the hufflepuff, the clingy one, the flirty one, the one with the abs, the loud and chatty one as well as all the tasteless epithets people now weaponize against him.

I believe, all he was trying to do at this stage was breach the barriers he felt existed between him and the others as the newcomer of the group so he didn't feel like an outsider.

That is his first love language- the need to belong. He has a strong desire to feel connected with people. He cares about people and connection. He's reiterated this throughout the years and even more loudly in the recent Japan interviews.

He wanted to be part of BTS both physically and emotionally. He wanted to fit in, to belong with them, to be accepted and viewed as one of the boys- BTS.

You could see this in the way he had adopted the mannerisms of the group- the skinship, the love language of the group if you will.

It is why when Suga complained about him not liking him as much, Jimin immediately drew closer to him and wrapped his hands around him, initiating skinship between them to show he liked him.

Jimin tried to speak the groups love language so he could bond with them but he also began to infuse his own love language.

If you've seen his relationship with his father you'd understand that Jimin expresses his love through giving, nurturing etc. It is how his primary care givers showed him love and so how he also shows and conveys his love.

The members have talked about how he would encourage them to talk, to open up, how he would listen to them, be there for them and give them gifts- the birthday gift exchange culture in BTS didn't exist until Jimin arrived in BTS.

What I'm trying to say is, Jimin has a distinct way of showing love that is unique from how everyone else in the group expresses their love. That, there is also an established love parlance within BTS that everyone speaks and that is skinship.

So when Jimin does skinship with any member he is not acting 'clingy' he is just speaking the love language that the group understands. But when Jimin nurtures and acts supportive and what not, he is speaking his own unique love language.

Now I have talked extensively about how Jimin expresses his in my last post so I will be focusing mainly on how he receives loves or what gestures he interprets as love.

And since there is a general consensus that VMin have an emotional connection, I will be referencing their relationship a lot for comparisons sake.

Tae is the only member Jimin got to spend the most time with around predebut without the intrusion of the cameras. This i feel allowed Tae room to strip back and be fully vulnerable with Jimin without reservation as is required of intimacy- which was not the case for Jikook hence JK shying away from interacting with JM in front of the cameras.

Jikook wasn't accorded the luxury of privacy VMin had to build their bond. Jikook had to build their bond with the camera's trailing them. How many times have we seen JK give death stares to the camera people for invading his me time with Jimin?

Not to be psychoanalytic but I feel, this is what induced the exhibitionist tendencies we see in them- or perhaps I'm wrong and this is just them being extra. Bless them.

Within the one year JM was trying to connect with JK through skinship, JK was also only coming around to understanding what skinship meant to him. They were evolving at different paces.

JK has the most walls in BTS. He wasn't just physically closed off to skinship in the early days forcing Tae to strip him naked in the bathroom, he was emotionally closed off too.

He is still pretty much emotionally closed off- he likes to put up walls. He had his own room at the dorm, does his own laundry, barely keeps in touch with the others or pick up the damn phone when they call etc.

Jk barely partakes in the group's established way of life except for perhaps the skinship. In my opinion.

It took JK a while to understand this culture of skinship though. And the members, all of them, had to push his boundaries further back in order to connect with him.

For instance, Jin pinching his nipples to wake him up, Tae doing- well, all of it. Go watch Taekook sexual tension edits, I dare you. You'll understand.

These members had three years off camera with JK to build a connection with him and even they were met with some resistance from JK.

All Jimin had was a year with JK. I feel Jimin lowkey coveted what the others had with JK and perhaps wanted to have that with him too. Why? Because of his need to belong and connect with people. Watching JK's dynamics with the others probably made him feel left out.

I also understand how this could have been overwhelming for young JK who was having both his physical boundaries and emotional boundaries breached at the same time by this person whom he he'd known for only a year.

That's just one of the major differences between Jikook and Taekook: while Tae was busy breaching the physical walls between him and JK, Jimin was attempting emotional heist on him. Bravo Jimin, Bravo.

So do I think at this point in 2013 that Jikook were falling in love or had fallen in love? NO. But what I took from that moment was that Jimin wanted and needed to feel a sense of belongingness with JK.

Mind you I said he wanted to belong, not owned. Freedom is a component of Jimin's love language. In as much as he wants to be kept he wants to be set free- To be be given the room and freedom to explore options and take risks without judgement and without sanctions.

This need is often misconstrued as him being noncommittal.

His need for freedom, I believe, stems from his being raised in a conservative home with parents that directed and dictated every facet of his life and wouldn't even allow him to pursue his passions until later. It took a while for his father to give him the go ahead to pursue his dream- which is performing on stage.

This is why I said in my last post that Jimin has a need to be in control of the decision making in a relationship. Being able to do as he pleases is important to him. Being able to control his own narrative is important to him. And the only person in BTS that permits him to have such authority over him is JK.

Now, I know you are going to say 'but JK is a bit possessive yadda yadda yadda'.

Listen, Jimin's need for freedom is inextricably linked with his fear of judgment and repercussion. What this means is, although he wants his freedom he is often afraid of what will happen if he should go for it.

As such, very often he wouldn't do anything without permission. Especially if he feels it's going to land him in trouble.

I fist noticed this in the 2014 Jikook bangtan bomb when he said he was starting to take a liking to JK but then right after he asked if JK was ok with that. Suga have also said, Jimin doesn't go out of his way to do things that makes people hate him- See this is why he needs JK. He could use some rebellion in his life.

However, this fear of sanctions often makes him complacent to and an accomplice in toxic behavioural patterns.

For instance, until recently, he would enable JK and encourage his acts of jealousy and possessiveness and even incite them at times. He would hold on to the thorns if it means keeping the rose.

But I see him asserting himself and demanding space within their relationship at times but when he does and JK withdraws he would act clingy around JK.

It is what Manila was about, what August 2019 was about and what April/May 2020 was about. I know some of y'all don't agree with my analysis on these moments, but I'm gonna have to stand by it.

Jimin is all about the balance of scales. The balance of needs and wants. The balance of fears and desires. It's just the Libra in him. Give him too much freedom and he will feel unwanted, hold on too tight and he would feel suffocated.

'I value my relationship. Spending time with my friends is gold' remember this shade?

Jimin's fear of Judgment comes from being a perfectionist and also being raised in a conservative home with a lot of expectations of him to be the model son as the elder male.

Thus, he instinctively gravitates towards people who are less judgy or have too much expectations of him.

Also, because he believes he has to work hard to achieve the things he wwants he wants to be loved, it would mean a lot to him if he didn't have to work hard to have someone love him.

It makes sense then that he would gravitate towards JK.

Jk embodies all of Jimin's wildest desires. I call this the allure of the Golden Maknae. Jk doesn't conform. He doesn't care about people's opinions of him and lives his life on his own terms- something Jimin is striving for.

No member in BTS is as free spirited, or as rebellious as JK is. When Suga told him not to get a tattoo because the fans would hate it- he's gotten it anyway hasn't he?

The best part, JK fell all on his own. And you damn right. he fell hard.

Still on the subject of fears, another fear I feel Jimin has that speaks to his love language is the fear of being a burden.

It is why he gives and gives and keeps giving. He'd rather give than receive. Which by the way, JK is the only member I have seen Jimin demand back what he gives him. Emotionally speaking.

Because he gives a lot of himself, he burns out quickly and feels emotionally drained quite often.

He has admitted himself that he used to drink by himself in his room whenever he felt drained. I assume he drank by himself because he didn't want to be a burden to others. Aka JK.

You see, JK is an empath. He feels people's pain as if they were his own. You just have to see him tear up while watching JM cry to understand what I mean by this. Jimin is a nurturer, he knows what it feels like to listen to someone's pain.

And if Tae is the one he goes to when it becomes overbearing then what does he need JK for? Glad you asked!

What JK offers Jimin is nourishment. A safe space for him to heal and reboot. JK replenishes Jimin. It is why he constantly wants to be around him.

Jk has been a canvas in their love dynamics from day one. They've both had to negotiate their needs and wants to make their relationship work. Which is something I find unique about their dynamics and why I believe they are real.

JK's lack of experience in dating, meant he had gone into their relationship without any preconceived notions of love. He's had to learn to love Jimin the way Jimin wants to be loved.

Coming from the background he's coming from, and having been denied his ambitions for such a long time, I see why Jimin would be drawn to people that are quite ambitious.

And even though, JK wasn't this person at first, Jimin has had to hype him up to the task. He pushes JK to be more ambitious.

When it comes to JK, I feel it's more about his potential to be everything Jimin wants in a partner and JK seems more than happy to comply with this.

Because of Jimin's duality and as a natural nurturer, I feel Jimin would also be attracted to someone emotionally open to recieving his love but not too emotionally dependent on him- the balance of scales I mentioned earlier.

It is why VMin wouldn't work, in my opinion. Tae is too emotionally dependent on Jimin. He ends up taking too much than he gives. On the other hand, Suga isn't emotionally dependent enough.

Again, for a man who's battled insecurity for years, it's safe to assume security, certainty and stability are an intricate part of his love language.

He seeks validation of these needs through the most random of things. In my opinion. He wants to be the one that knows JK the best. It matters to him if their clothes match, if their hair colors match, if JK meets his eyes in the middle of a serious comeback interview, if he checks all of JK's answers- hell, dude be whispering sweet empty nothings in JK's ears most times, talking about they are destined to be together and shit. You are me, I am you. Shit.

As annoying as some of these behaviors may be, JK is very considerate and tolerant of them and consideration is another one of Jimin's love language. This goes back to having been denied his dreams by his father. That denial flowed from a lack of consideration of his needs.

And as much as emotionally connected he is with Tae, Tae barely takes his feelings into consideration. And you see this in the letter Tae's written to Jimin. Or even in the dumpling incident where Tae put his want above Jimin's.

Not to mention the moments, JM have had to walk out of rooms because- Tae won't stop playing with JK's dam hair! Lol. They are cute.

People take from Jimin without reservation. But Jk is considerate as Jimin is of JK's needs.

Jk wasn't the 'exhibitionist' in that pair. He's a very private individual from what I can tell.

That PDA, that exhibitionism we see in them, that's all Park Jimin. He kinky. Dude freaky as fuck- we ain't mad at that. Bless him.

He enjoys public displays of affection. It's how he receives love. But PDA is not JK's love language, in my opinion. Yet he goes out of his way to show his affections for JM openly.

The best example I can give of this is Rosebowl.

JK understands that in order to be intimate with JM he has to allow himself to be influenced by him.

And Jimin understands that, as much as he wants to be close to JK that he doesn't have to rush him or force him into giving him the things he need from their relationship.

They are both very considerate of each other's needs, as random and ridiculous as those needs may be and cater to them in a way that is uniquely them.

Take the New Jersey live 2019 for example. Jimin seemed exhausted. Didn't want to be on another Live that night but JK clearly wanted to be seen on a Live together with him so he was there.

Another instance is the rock bison incident, where JM exchanged his toy for JK's just to make JK happy.

CONCLUSION

Listen, Jimin is in love with Jk no matter how imperfect you think he is.

No matter how much you think JK sucks at expressing his feelings for JM, Jimin loves him. No matter how close JM is with the other members, aka VMin, Yoonmin, Minimoni and the others; no matter the lack of emotional and physical boundaries between him and the others he will always fall back on Jk because none of those relationships fulfill him as much as JK does.

Jimin's constant need to be around JK could only mean there is some he gets from JK, a sense of fulfillment he gets that he doesn't get from any other member.

Keep supporting Jikook.

Signed,

GOLDY

#jikooktheories #kookmin analysis #jikook analysis #kookmin theories #jikook #jikook is real #jikook scenarios #nightswithkookmin #goldy #Jimin's love language

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pointlesstrashyexistence · 3 years

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I know other people have said it in better words but I really don’t understand how that finale was good. Ok bear with me. Yes I’m a destiel shipper but Cas not being in the episode and the confession not being acknowledged in any way aren’t even in my top 5 reasons for what I hate about the finale. I don’t even know if they’d make it into my top 10.

We had a bunch of episodes before the extended break due to Covid happened where Sam kept having dreams of Chuck’s ideas for how Sam and Dean die, usually by one killing the other, in other universes. And then in the episode with Becky, she talks about how sad and hopeless the ending Chuck writes is and there is this positive light put on how in her own fanfics, Sam and Dean are often just at the bunker doing regular things like bonding while folding laundry. And in the end, Dean dies and Sam lives the rest of his life with this deep sense of unhappiness without any of the other hunters and friends he’s made in the last few years that could help him and provide him some kind of emotional support. He’s just kind of going through the motions before he dies it seems like. And Dean just dies and goes to heaven and basically waits for Sam to die and show up. And as someone who, while I’ve never attempted suicide, became very depressed from around middle school because of constantly being in a space where I was told my sexuality meant I was going to Hell and wondered if maybe the only way I could escape that deep unhappiness and loneliness I was feeling was in death? The idea that death is the only release and the only time where you can achieve true happiness is horrifying.

Dean has always had scenes, even episodes built around him wanting to live some kind of apple-pie life and believing it’s something he can never have. Dean has always tried to provide for Sam and make sure Sam has what he never could, including Sam having an apple pie life. Dean always believed he was going to die young and while on some level some of that had to do with him being a hunter, it also had to do with his own issues of self worth. Why couldn’t Dean realize and accept that after all the horror and bullshit he’s dealt with, he does want to grow old and live an apple pie life and be happy and be better? Why couldn’t Dean have some version of an apple pie life? Not even with Cas, just some version? I don’t think anyone would’ve like Dean having a blurry wife, but Dean just owning a bar that becomes the Roadhouse 2.0 where he gets to see the Wayward Sisters and AU Bobby and AU Charlie every few weeks? Why couldn’t Dean examine why he’s become an increasingly worse person and realize he needs help? That would’ve been nice.

Sam seems to want it at first only because he wants to be normal and then realizes that not only is he really good at hunting, but he actually enjoys it, maybe even more than Dean, and he steps into this leadership position later. He still wants a relationship (I will never forget you Eileen. You are an awesome character and its horrible that when very little deaf and hard of hearing representation exists and you were shown as not only a serious love interest but an amazing independent hunter who realizes her revenge won’t bring her happiness and continues to find her happiness after revenge only to be brushed aside and ignored). However, it seems like if he did it would’ve been way more integrated into his hunting life. Because having a family and hunting aren’t mutually exclusive. Bobby and Karen would’ve had children but couldn’t. Jo lived a happy loving childhood with Ellen and her father until John used her father as bait, and Ellen continued to love Jo and tried to get her to leave hunting for her safety. Jody takes care of 3 teenage girls who are either active hunters or want to be involved in some way. Why couldn’t Sam be a leader and in a relationship? Why couldn’t Sam have a wife and child like he wanted, except him having a family is not because he’s chasing a sense of normalcy but because he actually wants one?

These were things the two of them wanted but doubted they could have. In a world where a god is no longer controlling you, a conventionally attractive middle aged white man with access to large amounts of money and many issues they want to work through but haven’t been able to because of multiple apocalypses, what else do you have stopping you from pursuing the things you want other than yourself?

Now I know there are a lot of fans who didn’t like that the show centered less on Sam and Dean’s relationship. Yes, the show, at least in the first 5 seasons, was exclusively centered around Sam and Dean. The last 5 haven’t been though. Yes, the show went through many different directors in the 10 seasons after it was originally supposed to end and that is why. The last 5 seasons still have Sam and Dean’s family slowly extending, even when they seem to become shittier people. I’m not saying the last episode shouldn’t have focused on Sam and Dean’s relationship because that was the original centerpiece of the show and remained one of the key features. But why did it seem like they could only be happy when they were dead in heaven even when the two of them still have things they need to work out.

Even if the last episode wanted to exclusively focus on the two of them, why couldn’t we see them actually have a time where they’re alive and doing this? Supernatural starts as a show with two fucked up brothers and ends with those same brothers killing the god they realize has orchestrated almost every aspect of their and are now trying to learn what a life free of control means. Why couldn’t the last episode have them actually sit down and reflect on the people they’ve lost throughout their 15 years together? Why not have them discuss how horrible they’ve been to each other over those years, keeping secrets, gaslighting each other, intentionally doing things to harm each other, and deciding to end the cycle of trauma from both sides of their family by seeking help or maybe indefinitely separating themselves, realizing that they have the ability to bring out the best and worst in each other?

I would prefer much happier endings, but if we were continuing with the idea of kind of a return to the beginning, of bringing Supernatural back to its grassroots as a show about two brothers, why not have the show that started by their reunion end with their separation? It still pulls at the heartstrings, it still hits the notes it needs to, it’s hopeful, it focuses on Sam and Dean, and it ends with them recognizing that as much as they love each other, they have an unstable unhealthy relationship and without a god pulling the strings it is now up to them to decide if they want to leave this relationship to grow mentally and emotionally and seek out the help the other can’t provide. The last season was all about them trying to take control over their lives back, so show what happens when they actually have full control and deny the audience access to what they then do with the rest of their lives because they refuse to be seen as entertainment.

#supernatural #Supernatural #SPN #spn #spn finale #SPN Finale #dean winchester #sam winchester #Dean Winchester #Sam Winchester #dean deserves better #dean deserved to live #sam deserves better

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manggaetteokkie · 4 years

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I kind of feel disappointed in Jikookers lately. Like part of the reason I would proudly say I was a Jikooker because when I first started shipping Jimin and Jungkook, most were based in reality. The delusional shippers were a very small embarrassing group and things weren't overblown. Now I feel like almost everyone is blowing things out of proportion. It was my understanding that Jikook were a possibility but now people talk as if they're definitely a couple and the tiniest things are....

Turned into shipping moments when there really is nothing. Take for instance the video just came out of Jungkook watching his younger self talking about Jimin being his favorite hyung basically and how Jimin bought him food. Older Jungkook was surprised Jimin bought him food. He didn't even remember. He also said it's not like that now (no favorites), that they're all a family. People are awwwing that! How is that cute in terms of Jikook? Jikookers are becoming Taekookers and I hate it here lol

(okay hopefully I connected the right asks together because there was another one that was sent right before you sent part 2)

I think the important thing is keeping in mind why you shipped it in the first place. As the fandom keeps growing, not even just to jikook but for the group as whole, there’s no way to control who joins and what they think so you’re bound to see some posts that make you question your sanity. I usually just ignore and move on, and otherwise try to filter who I follow/block to avoid weird things lol

Two things I’ve personally always disagreed with is 1) this whole concept of feeling “threatened” by the relationship either of them have with other members and 2) reading way too much into certain things.

For point 1), I disapprove of any kind of member-bashing or degrading simply to elevate your own ship. Just because I ship jikook doesn’t mean that the life and friends they have outside of this ship is bad. This kind of mentality has to go because it’s so unhealthy. Please learn to accept their bonds with other people for what they are. For example, you are 100% allowed to appreciate taekook or vmin because they are all important people to each other and it’s not your place as an outsider to be the judge of that, especially not over some ship. This kinda ties with point 2 because I feel like some people overanalyze to prove something to others when it’s really kinda not necessary...

For point 2), sometimes there really isn’t an explanation to things apart from “just because”. I take small moments as they are, just a proof of their relationship being the way it is, and seeing them makes me happy. This point is a lot more subjective because I know I’ve personally analyzed moments between jikook that others may or may not agree with. Also, I know a lot of people like to analyze and pick apart every interaction to a varying degree, with a whole following of people who like to see it happening (thinking about how tkk_lives and their elasticgirl-level reaching has such fervent supporters). Sometimes, when I’m spending time with my friends, I have a little intrusive thought about “how would this action I just did get misinterpreted if I was an idol and shipped with my friend”. It’s kind of a way to keep myself in check and avoid getting in way over my head.

As I said at first, you gotta know why you ship in the first place. Personally, I really really like their dynamics and I find their bond really special, from how Jimin has a soft spot the size of Jupiter for Jungkook (pretty much let’s him manhandle him however way he wants and will always concede to his demands) to how Jungkook always watches out for Jimin (both physically and mentally). Even without the shipping factor, purely based on cold hard facts, I still love them just as much. Don’t turn the members into mere instruments for shipping~~

If people wanna pull a tkk_lives and reach that far, it’s not my place to convince them they’re wrong cause it’s not like they’ll change their opinion either. Meanwhile, I prefer just keeping myself happy with whatever they’re willing to share :)

#thanks for the ask!#bangtan #bts #jimin #jungkook #jeongguk #jikook #kookmin #anon #anonymous #answered #my post #my stuff

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ajokeformur-ray · 4 years

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Arthur will love you. But what he won’t do is coddle you when you’re tired and need some TLC. That’s on his terms. His character is etched with severe mental illness and a repugnance towards a lot of people. Perhaps not towards you, but for the majority. My two cents is that he shows his appreciation in indirect ways. He’ll actually try to make you laugh and behave like a gentleman. Other times, though, he’s a handful little shit that likes to be chased lol

Hi, darling!💖

I’ll be honest, I very nearly didn’t respond to this because some of it is so different to how I view Arthur. However, I consider myself to be someone who is open minded, and I strive to have a blog which enables everyone to have a voice, whether or not I agree with them, so for this reasoning I went ahead. I’m a bit nervous about responding (this is a reflection of me and not you, nonnie!) so I apologise if my tone comes across as anything less than my standard.

I strongly agree with the first sentence, for one thing. I don’t say this as a self-shipper or as someone who loves Arthur, I say this because in his journal he has things written such as “where’s my one and only who understands me” and “I want someone in my space but not all alone” (heavily paraphrased, I can’t remember the exact quotes), which suggests to me that he does yearn to love and to be loved for who he truly is. With this in mind, I do think sometimes he would take extra care with his partner. I don’t think he’d coddle them, necessarily, because I wouldn’t appreciate being coddled if I was tired (I’m grumpy when I’m tired; just cuddle me or leave me alone) so I imagine others wouldn’t appreciate that either, but it can take a great deal of patience to look after an elderly person. Arthur clearly has patience with Penny (though he does show irritation and microaggressions, like when he shushed her when Thomas Wayne’s was on the television), so it stands to reason that he’d have more tenderness and more patience with a romantic partner.

There’s no denying that Arthur is severely mentally ill, though there’s no confirmation in canon (as far as I’m aware) as to what he was diagnosed with, but I can’t think of a moment in canon where he shows repugnance towards someone else. When I say this, I’m not including his segment on the Murray Show at the end of the film, or the scene at the end in Arkham, I’m purely talking about Arthur before he transitions into Joker (he is the same man but I hope that you know what I mean). When he’s taking care of Penny, he’s tender and so gentle I could cry. He caresses her cheeks, makes sure she eats, and while he does put medications in her food which lead to her having a stroke due to withdrawal symptoms, I also believe that he had good intentions. He takes care of her even when he is exhausted, and that, at least for me, speaks volumes as to his character.

I do agree that there will be times, and some of them to be more often than not, where Arthur would be less than what you need him to be. He has so much on his plate; his full time job (fifty-nine hours a week, which is almost twenty hours over what’s legal, at least in the UK), his therapy, his journal, his active pursuing of his career as a stand up comedian, his mental illnesses... Arthur is exhausted and he does his best, I believe. There would definitely be times in which Arthur is less than ideal as a partner, but then there would be times where his partner is less than what Arthur needs; the give and take equation of a relationship is different every day and one person has to give or take more on any given day. This is good and normal so long as the reverse is equally true. Arthur definitely has his moments of being cold or angry, but overall I think that he would do his best in the moment (sometimes it’s more, sometimes it’s less) to show that he cares.

I also agree that he would show his appreciation for his partner in indirect ways. Due to his social isolation, Arthur lacks the social cues which most others take for granted, and there are very definitely problematic behaviours which he displays in canon, such as stalking, but I believe that this stems from that social isolation - no one bothered to teach him how one should interact with others in certain situations. All he has to go on are the old films he watches in the evenings and observations he makes. Arthur is emotionally intelligent and he shows awareness that he’s being creepy, but he can’t help himself. I’m not saying this to excuse or condone his actions, but I’m trying to offer some evidence within the canonical context. If his partner was patient and persistent, one could arguably... not change Arthur, but at the very least offer Arthur more of an awareness of how to act and of how to be around other people. Love cannot ‘cure’ or ‘fix’ people, but in my opinion Arthur doesn’t need those things; I love him just as he is. Love would aid him and help him, I think, and he would show his appreciation in ways which, if you’re not looking for them, you would miss them. For example, I have night lights because I’m afraid of the dark, and Arthur could show his appreciation for me by changing the batteries in my night lights without saying anything. Again, I say this not as a self-shipper or as someone who loves Arthur, but this was the nearest example I thought of.

All in all, I think that any partner Arthur had would have to be someone who knows him and knows how to help him; someone who understands him to his very core, and once Arthur found someone who loved him, it would take a long time for him to accept it due to his issues with reality perception. When I say this, I’m thinking of how he showed awareness (in my opinion) that his moments with Sophie (prior to breaking into her apartment at a last ditch attempt for hope and help) were only daydreams (or delusions or hallucinations; this is up for debate, too!). When at last would Arthur actually accept it, he would cling to his partner to almost unhealthy levels, hardly daring to let them go in case he wakes up to hold the cold and empty air. He would definitely be a gentleman and he would love to make his partner laugh; I can see him practising his comedy in front of his partner. Over the weeks and months, his comedy would be tailored to his partner, so needy and desperate for validation is he (here, he displays narcissistic tendencies due to a lack of validation and love in his life. I don’t believe that Arthur is a narcissist; it’s learned behaviours from being raised by a narcissistic parent (credit for this statement comes from @fleckcmscott, who unknowingly taught me a lot about this recently), and he would love to make them laugh.

I just want to make it clear here that I am not, in any way, trying to tell you or anyone else how or what to think. I saw this as a chance for a discussion, which is also why I have responded in this way. I adore reading different people’s interpretations and other people’s metas and analyses and I hope that this opens up that gate! Arthur Fleck is such a complex man and his whole point is that he cannot be labelled; he’s so, so hard to accurately characterise because one minute he’ll say one thing but then say another, and I truly adore how everyone has a different view of Arthur!💚 I mean this answer in no way to be rude and my hand’s are kind of shaking right now and my forehead is hot on the inside because I’m worried that I’ll offend or upset someone (the worst thing to come out of this, I would never intentionally do that), and I just hope that my intentions of opening a discussion properly come across.

Thank you so much for sending in your opinion, nonnie, this was an interesting response to put together! I hope that you’re safe and well.

#nonnie #requests closed #arthur fleck #i really hope this comes across as friendly discussion #thats my only intention #joker 2019 #if you have something to say abt this please be nice #im really sensitive to conflict #it'll send me into a panic attack

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strangehorticulturist · 4 years

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people are sometimes very black and white about ships, which i guess shouldn't be surprising. as a catradora shipper, i am so happy with the season and catradora becoming canon in the way that it did. it's a ship i've rooted for from the beginning

however, when i see posts that completely write off the reality that catradora was toxic at any point, i greatly dislike it. because that's so against what this season has shown us and also diminishes the progress that was made within the dynamic.

catra and adora had a very unhealthy relationship, wherein catra withdrew, lashed out, and even actively rooted against adora at times because of how hurt she felt in the moment. and this was regardless of if adora had actually done anything wrong in the first place. and adora, because of how much she loved catra and how much she accredited her own self worth to what she could do for others, never drew the line in the sand -- never set the distinct boundary of "we cannot be friends if you behave like this."

and in this season, we see both of them grow from this. adora, after rescuing catra and realizing that catra was still acting as if they were enemies, finally set that boundary. if catra was going to continue to behave the way she had been, there would be no more chances for her to be a part of Adora's world, and Adora would no longer be part of Catra's. This must've been hard for her to say, as "giving up" on Catra was the very last thing she wanted to do. And yet, after thinking that maybe things would automatically be different, she saw the reality of the situation: if Catra didn't want to change, nothing would change. And so she finally gave the ultimatum: Either you work on your behavior, or I am out of your life.

And for Catra's part, she begins to change her behavior by time and time again choosing to make better decisions. It's clear, even before the confrontation, that she wants to get along with Adora and the others, but doesn't believe that that's possible. But after that confrontation with Adora, she immediately begins to adjust her behavior. The first step she took, of course, was letting herself reach out to Adora and ask for her to stay. A genuine moment of vulnerability that she very clearly tried to avoid over and over again during the previous 4 seasons.

And then her growth continues -- we see her apologize multiple times to different people she has hurt, something she herself claimed she would never do. We see her rethink and recant after saying things that clearly seem to have hurt someone. We actively see her rethink her ways. She even says herself that she's working on her anger.

She takes so many steps to not only be the person Adora knows she can be, but to be the person she has always wanted herself to be.

And that's what's amazing to me about catradora. It's a difficult process to actively work on your behavior, but they overcame their own unhealthy patterns to form a healthier dynamic because they love each other that much. And that's why posts that act as if catradora was never unhealthy bugs me so much. It completely erases how hard they had to work to get to the level of health they have now. They put in that work for themselves and for each other, and that amazing amount of growth should be acknowledged.

#spop spoilers #lemme tag that before i forget #spop #she ra #shera #she ra and the princesses of power #catradora

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hmsannlett · 3 years

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Foe the salty asks:

4. Do you have a NoTP?

25. Would you change the ending of Anna/Hewlett(/Selah)???

4. Anna/Abe is a big nope for me and is probably the ship that irks me the most on the show because there’s so many destructive elements to it, and yet the show just kept pushing it. Their relationship has huge collateral damage for everyone who has the misfortune of getting dragged into it and, imo, does a disservice to both their characters (especially/mainly Anna).

Anna/Simcoe also bothers me, because she could not more clearly be terrified of him, and he uses that against her and doesn’t respect any of the times that she says no to him. It especially strikes a negative chord with me because I’ve been in Anna’s position more than a few times with men that just won’t take a no (although not to the extent that Simcoe took it to), so I truly empathize with the powerlessness that she feels. It’s the worst position to be in, and to feel completely alone like she does makes the situation all the more unsettling.

Both ships are unhealthy in their own ways, imo. Fortunately, neither ship is/has been very popular in the fandom.

25. Oh, goodness. So many thoughts on this. I’ll try to not write a whole thesis here lol and just distill it down to my main thoughts.

In short, yes, I would love a different ending. I will preface all of this, though, by saying that I’d like married couples to be happy with each other and remain together as much as anyone. I’m not completely against the idea of Anna/Selah (though Annlett is my fav and will always be my otp); I just don’t agree with how all of Anna/Selah was written and how Anna/Selah/Hewlett ended.

So, from a writing perspective, I think Selah was brought in too late in S4 to have the character development that he needed after how he was depicted in S1 (and, according to the show’s writers, Anna and Selah were supposed to have a pretty unhealthy dynamic in S1; some of these scenes had to be cut for time constraints, though, so we only get small glimpses of this dynamic). There wasn’t much opportunity to connect positively with Selah in S1 or S4, and as a result, his quick character arc in S4 (to me) breaks the age-old writing rule of showing vs. telling.

There’s no buildup to Anna’s and Selah’s reunion that shows him growing as a character or even what it was that caused him to grow and respect Anna. Why would he suddenly respect her now in S4 more than he did in the first part of S1 after she all but said that she wanted to end their marriage by jumping from the boat, publicly humiliating him, and causing their lengthy separation – during a time period when desertion/an extended period of separation was, in some of the colonies, considered equal to divorce? There’s no apparent motivation (that we’re shown) to inspire his growth. We’re just told as an audience that he’s changed, and I think that weakens the growth that the writers were aiming for. It could be that Selah spent a lot of time reflecting while he was in Philadelphia, but we don’t get to see that onscreen. And for me, what is shown on the screen is much more convincing and effective than whatever we are told happens off-screen.

My other issues with Anna/Selah’s ending are that

1.) If their relationship was so unhealthy before, is his change in how he treats her sustainable? (Would he still treat her with respect after he found out/got confirmation about her affair w/Abe? That tended to make a woman “damaged goods” back then.)

2.) If Anna feels that “he’s not the same man I married,” why then does she seem so upset in 4.10 when they return to Setauket and in the epilogue? It seems like the story ends w/Anna being in exactly the same spot she was in in S1 – unhappy w/her life for whatever reason – and feels like she had more of a character circle than a character arc. She didn’t really end up anywhere different than where she started, even though she had grown so much throughout the show. It just feels like lazy writing to me, and I had really hoped that all of Anna’s sacrifices and growth during the war would be rewarded (even if that wasn’t necessarily a future w/Hewlett like my shipper heart wanted).

Conversely, there was excellent growth shown between Anna and Hewlett, both individually and as a couple. We got to watch each of them grow to respect each other’s character, sacrifice for each other, and fight for each other over the span of almost two seasons – and do so even when both of them felt there was no hope that the relationship could continue. There was a purity and selflessness to their relationship that none of the other relationships on the show were really able to capture, and, imo, is absent from most relationships in films/shows. And I had hoped that that kind of character development would be rewarded or at least considered in S4 after dedicating so much screen time to it. I also feel that Hewlett offers what Anna truly wants: respect, agency, and to be seen as a person, an equal. Like I said above, I don’t know if Selah could offer that level of respect long-term in their relationship. I’d like to hope so, for Anna’s sake, but she definitely doesn’t seem satisfied to me in 4.10.

Anna and Hewlett each left a significant mark on each other and were an enormous part of each other’s individual growth, and I feel like that was largely ignored in S4. For two characters so dedicated to their causes (and practically acting as the epitomes of the two sides’ warring ideologies) to be able to see each other as people and respect the person/character they saw in each other, even at the end of their relationship, is huge. And it seems like the writers just abandoned that without a second thought because they felt that they (finally) had to be historically accurate.

So for me, it’s disappointing that a show that was so heavily focused on character development (and, by and large, executed that development very well throughout the seasons) took what felt like a cop out and didn’t fully realize/fulfill Anna’s, Selah’s, and Hewlett’s individual character arcs. Since the showrunners felt they had to keep Anna/Selah for historical accuracy, I would have preferred that their relationship had been given more time to develop before his arrival in S4 because they had grown very far apart and had significant issues to address before moving forward. But ideally, of course, my Annlett shipper self would have liked the writers to stick with the two seasons of character development between Anna and Hewlett, resolve their relationship, and find a way of kindly writing Selah out (because, tbh, he kind of deserves a better ending too. Anna did betray him deeply, and it’s a lot to ask of him to just overlook/forgive that and move forward with their relationship. Furthermore, I don’t know that Anna is capable of really, truly loving him – it’s always come off as more loyalty/obedience to me – and that’s not a very satisfying conclusion for his character either). And as for how I would end Anna/Selah/Hewlett…well, there is a fic in the works…

Annnnd this is over 1k and has indeed become a thesis, so I’ll leave it at that because this is probably waaaaay more than you wanted lol. This post pretty much hits the nail on the head (succinctly! unlike me lol) with my frustrations about the writing of Anna/Selah/Hewlett and the closure of their character arcs/relationship arcs, as well as the balance of character development and historical accuracy. If you want me to explain any of my litany of thoughts more than I have here (this is the best I can do at an overview of all my thoughts lol; I have many), I can write responses/metas that go into more detail. :)

tl;dr: I wish the show had decided earlier on whether it was going to go with the character development it had created or with historical accuracy, because I don’t feel either Anna/Hewlett or Anna/Selah got the ending they deserved. Annlett was left with two seasons of development unfinished and forgotten, and Anna/Selah was drawn to a close without enough development to make it feel truly convincing for me.

#ditching the usual tags because I know my Selah opinion isn’t popular #might have offended the Simcoe fans too #sorry guys #meta #my meta #asks #wellisntthatlovely

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starsandheartsforever · 4 years

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Okay I wanna talk about Greg for a second because the Jasper episode got so much more attention. One reason is this post on twitter.

Okay so I love that Greg is like the most understanding and laid back parent like ever but I have a small problem with it right now because sometimes that's not what a kid needs. My mom was my strict parent while my dad was the laid back one. As I'm getting older dad's more or less the same but my mom is now all go with the flow and stuff, and it hurts. So I kind of get where Steven is with his dad right now. He loves his dad obviously but he doesn't want another friend right now. I think that's why during their trip you can notice little moments where Steven still looks unhappy. He's lost, doesn't know what to do who to go to etc like he says. A LOT of people both young and older feel the exact same nowadays and being told something like "hey just chill." "Everything will be fine / work out." "Just go with the flow." Or my personal favorite "Life's too short to be worrying or mad all of the time." That can really be like the worst thing for someone in a similar mental state as Steven to hear. Steven reacting to Greg's carefree ideals like he did is beyond relatable. (To me personally and to others) Personally I think Steven needs someone who is the opposite of his dad and the gems right now and that's why he went to Jasper. He knew she wouldn't coddle him and tell him everything's going to be fine. He knew she would look him in the eyes and say you need to stop running, stand tall and vent! And sometimes that's just what someone like Steven needs, a healthy way to vent. Training honestly can be a big help. However now there's a very real chance that he might revert back to square one if not either damn close or worse. Because he quite literally killed Jasper! He may have been able to bring her back but the fact remains the same. This is going to add a new fresh level of trauma to him on top of now she's bowing and calling him my Diamond. So here is my theory for the last four episodes based off the leaks and titles I've seen. Firstly the gems (though I love them) are way too pushy and its going to push him over the edge again and make him accidently make those Steven plants we've seen around Garnet. Maybe to try and hold them back from stopping him trying to leave. Secondly he is going to head to homeworld. This is where it get interesting. So out of all of the characters we've seen in SU there have only been 4 that could beat or come close to beating Steven that is before he manga to work things out with them. Those have been his fellow diamonds and Spinel. (And yes I am a shipper but this has nothing to do with my ship) The diamonds are the only ones who more than likely not be scared of Steven's powers. I mean I'm sure they would be shocked and worried but scared? Please we've seen what Pink was capable of. So Yellow would probably replace Jasper for his anger venting while Blue helps him cry it out. White could help with controlling his powers more (scenes we all know how good she is at that.) And Spinel well a whole damn movie was made to show us how much trauma she went through so if she can't help with that then nobody can. Rebecca is covering some serious shit here and she (as we all know) never does anything without meaning. You can't tell me we got an entire movie with Spinel as the main attraction and then just what throw her out the window especially with all of Steven's similarities to her same problems. So yeah this is my theory for the begining of the end of the series as for how it will end I still think he'll kind of take Greg's advice and take a self discovering trip. And as for corrupt Steven I do believe it's going to happen I'm kind of partial to it being an unhealthy fusion rather than corruption otherwise I think it'll happen maybe during his visit to HW. But that's what I got from Mr. Universe and Fractured along with my theory it gave me.

#steven universe #steven universe future #suf spoilers #steven universe theories

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theshinobiway · 4 years

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you’re literally my favorite naruto blog i love your stuff so much!! you write and understand team gai better than kishimoto!

THAT IS SUCH A HIGH COMPLIMENT?? Thank you so much for that anon!

I’d hesitate to say I understand any character better than the original author, but I certainly put more focus on those characters more than Kishimoto--hence the Team Gai blog. In one way, I understand that Team 7 was always the flagship on the series, but I certainly disagree with Kishimoto when it comes to their decided endings.

As an author, I know that it can be overwhelming to manage multiple characters and to neatly tie up hundreds of plot points, but for characters that “broke out“ like Lee and Gai, I wonder sometimes if Kishimoto stifled his own creativity with those characters to keep Naruto in the focus. It would certainly explain why the ending didn’t seem to fit the original premise for many of his characters.

If I could give anyone general advice for writing any character that isn’t your original work, it would be the following:

If you are intending to keep their characterization as close to canon as possible (which is what I do to preserve the authenticity of the character that everyone already loves) I would like to stress the importance of looking for character qualities through a non-biased lens.

What I mean is this: In fandom, we often like to create caricatures in our head of what characters are like based on a few of their major qualities. Hence, this is why Team Gai is always SO out of character when I see them written in the fandom. If we’re being honest, here’s a comparison chart of how Team Gai is portrayed versus how they actually are; Be warned that I was extremely blunt with these.

“Fandom” Team Gai vs. Reality:

Fandom!Might Gai: Springtime of Youth! TALKING IN ALL CAPS! KAKASHI, RIVAL! Portraying this man with sex appeal, ever? Either you mean it as a joke at his expense or you’re REALLY into KakaGai.

Real!Might Gai: Goofy, but with Sagelike Wisdom. Youth is a theme of his teachings and a catchphrase, but he acts like an adult most of the time. EXTREMELY Emotionally literate--Gai is not oblivious! He can read people really well! Will know if you’re hiding something, even if he can’t remember your face. Can lose his temper if his loved ones are threatened or if his direct teachings are disobeyed. Gai gets tired too--Lee can wear him out! Goofy old sensei who combines humor and wisdom with some of his eccentricities.

Fandom! Rock Lee: Springtime of YOUTH, 2.0! Very Stiff Ways of Speaking! Lovesick! ‘Creepy’ if he’s not the love interest of the work. Cinnamon roll who would never get mad, ever. Feels like Gai 2.0. Woah when he takes off his weights he’s really cool!

Real!Rock Lee: A SERIOUS CHARACTER. Lee can be goofy with his friends as much as anyone, but Lee’s usual expression is serious! He’s self-motivated to an unreal degree. Diligent, tidy, and disciplined. Hopeless Romantic. Very gullible! Extremely idealistic, to the point of possibly deluding himself. Minor codependent behavior exhibited towards role models. Hot-Blooded. Adores cute things. Secretly envious of those around him. Lower self-confidence. Seeks approval.

Fandom!Tenten: Loves weapons, but does she have a personality besides that? Let me just fill one in. Portrayed often as either uptight and like a bully, or as a slightly more tomboyish Sakura. “The Tomboy” archetype. Tenten wants romance just like every other girl, what do you mean? Lovesick/heartbroken over Neji, stays single for the tragic romance. She was Neji’s training partner! She can’t stand Gai or Lee and looks down on them. Often has weak characterization because she gets sidelined into being a love interest. (...and then her entire character revolves around her (male) love interest.)

Real!Tenten: Loves weapons of all kinds, especially Kunai. Impulsively buys weapons she likes. Doesn’t understand many of the girlish inclinations like love and delicacy, but is not anti-feminine. Has canonically stated that she has never been interested in love or relationships. Has never had a crush on anyone. [Also, she was not Neji’s exclusive training partner, she was simply his training partner for the third round of the Chunin exams. ALL of Team Gai regularly trained together or in different pairs at any point in time. This was a comment that was taken way out of context by shippers and has spread false information ever since. This fact is no more real than Lee "balding."] Is tactless, but definitely not a bully. She loves to investigate and play pranks, especially when older. Balances work and rest. Is the “glue” of her team. Cares about her self-image. Has deep insecurities about how others perceive her, and constantly compares herself to her team.

Fandom!Neji: “Destiny Boy.” Either a brooding, calloused douchebag or a brooding, “bad boy” douchebag. Goes out of his way to say mean things OR doesn’t utter a single word for the entire story. His and Shino’s personalities are indistinguishable. No emotion. Stiff. Not empathetic in the slightest. Unhealthy portrayal of his personal relationships, even his friendships. Who would want to be around this guy? I’ll just make him the ‘strong and silent’ type with anger issues and snarky one-liners and call it a day.

Real!Neji: Disciplined and traditional. Reserved, not emotionless. Has a WIDE range of emotional expression and communicates primarily on the nonverbal level. Speaks in either metaphors or to the point--it depends. Some modicum of patience for foolish behavior. Master of projecting his problems. Is only a ‘bully’ pre-exams, but was already on the comedown by the time we’re introduced to him and his team. Deeply emotional at the core, but can be overwhelmed in his by own emotions, especially when it comes to his ego. Learns to maturely manage himself later on. Very perceptive of his surroundings. Cares very deeply for Hinata, his team, and his close friends. Hinata is his closest female relationship whether you like it or not. Witty and sometimes blunt, he doesn’t go out of his way to be a jerk once he’s older. Fits into the respected "big brother" role for both Hinata and his friends.

The Conclusion

When reading through characters and their actions, I cannot stress enough that you often have to let go of your preconceptions of a character and actually look at what they are thinking and doing and how. Your idea of a character's canon personality should be measured up against their canon. Do not measure a character’s canon against your caricature.

Again, fandom will always do what it wants and take creative liberties where it chooses--as is their right as an audience--but discussing canon and ‘accuracy’ of a portrayal is another thing entirely.

My assertions about Team Gai focus on their canon portrayal of their personalities and the goals they had within the story of Naruto. My headcanons are always kept separate, and my assertions about their character arcs and endings have to do with how to approach--through the literature--their internal/external conflicts and to reach an appropriate resolution that makes sense within the story.

Thanks as always for contributing to the blog!

#naruto #naruto fandom #naruto headcanon #headcanons #Team gai #team guy #best team #Gosh these notes really do keep me motivated #I always feel bubbly even after I've read them a hundred times #ahhh #you all are such amazing influences on my writing #I'm so glad i get to write for you all!#theshinobiway #the shinobi way #pumpkintalks #pumpkin talks

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