Do you know why is 云深不知处 popularly translated as cloud recesses? As far as I know (by that I mean recesses), it makes no sense? Like what about recesses makes them unknown or deep
(Ngl when I first heard 云深不知处, I thought it was 云深不知出 and if you called some place that, no wonder someone would think you’d be trying to imprison them lol)
Hi there!
For context for others and the original poem this comes from first:
Traditional Hanzi:
1 松下問童子
2 言師採藥去
3 只在此山中
4 雲深不知處
Simplified Hanzi:
1 松下问童子
2 言师采药去
3 只在此山中
4 深不知处
Pinyin:
1 Sōngxià wèn tóngzǐ
2 yán shī cǎi yào qù
3 zhǐ zài cǐ shānzhōng
4 yún shēn bùzhī chù
English (Just gonna have to deal with my shoddy attempt):
1 Beneath the bow of pines, I asked a disciple
2 My Master has gone to gather herbs that grow wild, he said
3 Somewhere on these mountains
4 Hidden in the clouds unknown
And here we have chù and chū at the end of these sentences. Simplified 处, Trad. 處,. And 出 which is what areuils is speaking of! The character to classify a location a place (usually somewhere that's pretty official, think office, facilities departments, etc) as well as 出 being used to classify dramas and opera plays. The 处, 處, character also heavily denotes punishment and discipline. This makes it seem a lot more intimidating and nightmarish. For the teenage boy that Wei Wuxian was at the time, it kind of makes it a fun little word play of his expectations and early views of the Lans and Lan Wangji and his own wild imagination at times.
For the English choice that the original translator chose (ExR) I at least thought it was wanting to stick to the spirit of the ideal monk-like ambience the original poem was portraying and took some heavy liberties for an English audience to keep in mind that the Gusu Lan clan are heavily monastic in living and tradition and are also mysteriously ethereal and untouched by the world (like the master we never see on page). Recesses sounds more monastic and peaceful I suppose in English even if it's not linguistically similar in the slightest to the hanzi and denotes a pathway more so than the actual unknown of mountains.
I personally enjoy the shrouded steeps as one translation to go with, as you said the official English denotation lacks the feel of a lurking unknown that the boy in the poem seems worried over and still too immature himself to go in like his hermit master.
I was also not one to enjoy how 乱葬岗, Luànzàng Gǎng is translated as Burial Mounds, as that still feels far too respectful for it, even if meant ironically in English.
But the woes of translations eh? And that footnotes cannot be chapters in themselves for readers because it's all just so brilliant and wonderful to delve into.
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