#And totk is even more massive

[carpisuns]

I’ve clocked 120 hours of totk play time in three weeks girl help

I haven’t even done much side stuff!! Just the main quests! google says you’re supposed to be able to do main quest in like 60 hours but I took twice as long 🫠 the curse of being…just not good at video games but still very invested…lol

[cherry-bomb-ships]

Good morning lovely followers 💝💝 I'm watching a video abt the best video game animation last year and like. Holy fuck 2023 was an absolutely stellar year for video games wasnt it 😭💖😭💖😭💖

[askmerriauthor]

Homie. Darling. Muchaco. Please help me. You're an animator. You've worked in the video game industry. When you get to That One Memory in TOTK (you know which one I mean and if you don't, you will),

Please help me figure out what the fuck is going on with Ganondorf's face rigging

Man, I didn't even need to look anything up: I knew EXACTLY what you were talking about as soon as you said it.

Short Answer: Need more polys.

Long Answer: It's simultaneously a case of limited model structure and potentially some degree of intentional design choice specific to Ganondorf's presentation in this particular game.

Discussion below the jump, just for the sake of not stretching out people's dashboards. No worries about spoilers: none of this is story-relevant.

So! To give a very broad strokes bit of coverage on the wide and varied nonsense that is 3D modeling, this is a case of Topology. The basic thrust is that topology is the overall structure and layout of the mesh that makes up the 3D model's various shapes. The lower the polygon count on that mesh, the more angular its structure and the less capacity for deformation it has. The higher the polygon count, the smoother its structure and the greater its capacity for deformation. The trade-off, however, is that low-poly models are easier for a game engine to render. High-poly models are a massive drain on processing power, to say nothing if they're built inefficiently with a bunch of wasted geometry bogging things down.

Here's an example of a low-poly model on the left and a high-poly model on the right.

So when you want to make a character emote, you're basically grabbing a bunch of those polygons around the face and moving them around to shape the face into the desired expression. If you don't have a lot of polys to play with, it causes folding and tearing issues where the model and its textures do some pretty wonky shit.

Something both BoTW and ToTK have going for them is that they're actually very low-poly games, which is extremely helpful in making the games run as smoothly as they do given the world size and seamless loading. The lighting and texture work do A TON of heavy lifting to make the game look as good as it does. Really look at these models closely and you can see how angular they are. Look at Zelda's outstretched hand or how sharply light falls across the character's features. In the bottom right, notice how you can see the sharp points that make up Zelda's shoulders? They're not rounded; they're angled just enough to give the general illusion of a curve at a glance. Same goes for her eyes; you can count the angles that make up the shape of her eye but, at a distance and at a glance, they look big, round, and doleful.

Something you can also notice is when characters talk, a lot of them have little to no facial deformation. Mineru, for example, basically has a one-hinge Muppet mouth outside of pre-rendered cutscenes. A lot of characters' eyes are basically painted onto their faces and switch between static texture shapes as opposed to being fully rendered and animated orbs modeled into their heads.

Ganondorf actually has a fairly complex character model, especially compared to Link or Zelda, but he doesn't have a lot of model deformation. Basically the only parts of his head that move are his eyes/brows and mouth/jaw. If you look closely around his eyes you can see they're rendered basically as triangles. There's only two or three points along their shape the model can deform at. Further, since the rest of his face doesn't really deform when he emotes, it means the only thing that really moves are those small key elements. Which yields moments like this:

The animators are basically pushing his expression as much as they are actually capable of with this model's limited structure. See the hard fold in the lower eyelid, or the fact that his teeth aren't attached to anything inside his jaw? It does the job though; it overall looks good and, in the moment this scene happens, really adds something to the unsettling nature of what's going down.

I mentioned before that there may be a certain intent as well. Something specific to Ganondorf in this iteration is that, more than ever, he's become an Oni. Ganondorf's character design has slowly been leaning toward more Japanese-specific visual concepts over the past few appearances but he's gone full yokai for ToTK. Not just in his build, but in his clothing and weaponry. Dude is swinging around a kanabo for the first time ever in the franchise.

In Japanese mythology and Noh theater, a Red Oni basically functions as the embodiment of all the worst parts of mankind. They're greedy, brutal, cruel monsters who revel in causing destruction. If you want to look at their good aspects, it's traits like passion, ambition, and a wild spirit. But, overall, they're the bad guys. Ganondorf is 100% depicted as a Red Oni in ToTK. So when you keep that in mind, add in the implications of what Ganondorf just did in that scene, and consider the traditional appearances of a Red Oni...

...then that face-breaking grin makes a lot more sense.

[botwstoriesandsuch]

HEYA WHO WANTS TO LEARN ABOUT GRASS AND VOLCANOES

Yes I'm alive and yes I'm making posts and music again. Ok so moving on HAVE YOU SEEN THIS GRASS???

This patch of grass is from a Youtube video by Quincyvhs ranking grass in Tears of the Kingdom. He's a cool guy and has a similar video on Breath of the Wild and I highly recommend you watch it cause his editing is very cool.

HOWEVER. He made an egregious error today by ranking this patch of grass, this lovely, magnificent, extraordinary patch of grass upon Death Mountain as a mere B Tier. It clearly is an S Tier.

How do I know this? Well this patch of grass indicates miracles. It indicates determination. It indicates the spirit of adventure, of change, of liberty and mayhaps even the purest form of happiness the world round...

...and as later corroborated by the actual geologist that I am dating, it is an indication of the massive shift in Hyrule's ecosystem and climate.

Let's Begin.

Using my ace detective skills I have located the site in question in both Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom (Botw and Totk). The general consensus is that there is a 5~ year time gap between the two games.

Given that the grass does not exist here in Botw, this means that this patch of grass took at maximum 5 years to grow. However, I'm going to prove that it probably took even less time than even that.

Below is the site on Botw's Map:

We are unable to get an accurate temperature reading of the area because the Sheikah Slate decided to give up. So we're going to use science to determine this soon to be important number

Given that wood near instantly ignites at this location in Botw, we can conclude that the temperature in the air is around 370 degrees Celcius or 700 degrees Fahrenheit.

Now typically, rock and soil serve as good insulators of heat, so the air temperature around a volcano itself isnot usually that much higher than the ambient temperature (unless you are actively within a Pyroclastic flow, which would be a more pressing problem than analyzing grass to say the least)

However, when near the presence of lava, that temperature of the air can actually reach up to 1000 degrees Celcius (1800F) so this reading is actually even more reasonable when you note that we are in good distance of the Medingo Lava Pool.

Conversely, we can actually grab an active temperature reading of the area during the time of Totk thanks to the Purah Pad.

It's 102 degrees Fahrenheit.

Easy. Simple. Fantastic. I love when my job doesn't require four hours of research for every single question!

Anyhow, here are some figures from the Oregon State Volcanology Laboratory on the rate of lava cooling

Yes this post is still about grass, stay with me.

To truly appreciate the glory of science and the glory of this patch of grass, we are going to calculate the exact amount of time needed for the temperatures to lower on Death Mountain to one sustanable for growth (That being around 100 degrees Farenheit).

SPOILER ALERT: It takes less than 5 years. This is insanely impressive considering grass of this type* typically takes DECADES.

Anyhow, The Figure 2 and 3 have to do with the depth of the lava, and Figure 4 deals with the thickness. (Many thanks again to my partner for providing their geological expertise and resources)

The thickness of the Medingo Lava is very easy to calculate given that Link can literally jump in with a splash and drown in it like the world's worst hot tub--the bitch ain't thick at all. So we use the lowest listed reading for that.

The depth of the lava is more tricky, but comparing the lava pool in Botw and Totk, and using Link as a marker of around 5 feet, we can say that the pool is around 10 feet deep.

Therefore, the Medingo Lava Pool took around 2-3 years to cool after Death Mountain stopped erupting.

Now when exactly did Death Mountain stop erupting?

According to the catalog of Volcanoes of the World by the Smithsonian Institution, 93% of volcanos stop erupting within 3 years.

Now I know that Death Mountain only started erupting because of the return of the Divine Beast Vah Rudania, and Link only "stops" the eruption of Death Mountain by defeating it. So one could argue that Death Mountain's "eruption" had to be less than a year or something.

My rebuttal to that would be 1) Within the game's canon, I don't see how we could justify Link taking one day, or even one month to wake up from the Great Plateau, travel immeidately all the way to Death Mountain. and then tame the Divine Beast in less than a month, and 2) Link didn't really stop shit because we can clearly still see active lava flow after taming Rudania. He only stopped the rock falls caused by the Divine Beast, the actual activity of Death Mountain still continues.

Given its insane size, I am going to say it took the full 3 years for its active lava flow to stop on Death Mountain. Volconologists in the notes, feel free to correct me.

SO! The Timeline is:

3 years for Death Mountain to stop actively flowing

2 years minimum for Medingo Lava Pool to cool

= >1 year for temperatures to be right for grass to grow!

This is an insanely quick time period for grass to thrive! The literal instant that the conditions were correct, we are able to see not just grass, but stoloniferous grass as well other types of shrubbery thrive! We would usually need several years for the volcanic rock to erode to rich soil (such as the soil in the Akkala region)

Allow me to elaborate:

This is Fountain Grass. Fountain grass is usually the fist type of grass that you would see in a volcanic region. They grow from a rhizome root system, which is a very vertical downward root system as you can see. This is good for young volcanic regions where only specific dotted areas are good enough for plants to grip onto and grow.

They grow something like this:

This patch of grass below I would call some sort of rhizome. (Botanists feel free to correct me in the notes)

THIS. however. (amazingly) is an example of stoloniferous grass!

This is thick bladed grass (as opposed to the more thin, fine-bladed grass with rhizomes) that grow in a stolon spreading pattern that is much more horizontal. It's a lot like the grass that might grow in your front lawn, if you're rich enough to have one of those in this economy--

They grow a bit more like this:

This type of grass need soil! Especially if we want to classify that other red flower behind the rock there as some sort of volcanic flower

We're basically talking about mass, rapid volcanic erosion in less than a year for this to happen. For context, the soil necessary for the region of Akkala to grow could have taken anywhere between a decade to thousands of years. The weather and erosion necessary for this patch of grass to grow took, at most, 3 years.

And all this in the period of time following an actual apocalypse. How quickly the tides have turned for Hyrule's ecosystem!!!!

IT'S A VERY IMPRESSIVE AND COOL PATCH OF GRASS AND THUS IS DESERVING OF THE S TIER RANKING

Also here's some behind the scenes of what my much smarter than me partner had to say about it ["Last pictures referencing the rhizome grass which, indeed, would be the oldest grass among the patch given it needs the least specific conditions to thrive/less soil to get started]

Growth is cool.

[dreadlock-detective]

Good news for those in the tags of the last Gerudo Girls post - we’ve kept thinking about these doofuses and they’re really fun to draw~

1- Kosha’s very fond of Lurelin village and is excited to show the other gerudo more about fishing. Probably pissed as shit when she sees the state it’s in at the start of TotK. She just really likes swimming and water in general 2- Calyza’s tastes in voe continue to impress as a certain mailman has caught her eye~ (Forget Ganondorf, why has the Mailman not appeared in any games since Twilight Princess? Dude is glorious, and I was thrilled to give him a bit of a Hateno makeover) Unfortunately for her, he’s a rather busy man. She hasn’t even managed to get his name yet!

3- Lachoo loves racing zonai vehicles and, naturally, has built one to resemble a sandseal. Her bestie Bipp rides around in a custom made backpack whenever it’d be hard for her to get around on her flippers. Kosha and Calyza ride in the back, which is of course completely unsecured and a massive health hazard. Calyza’s gotten pretty good at running to catch up with the car

[ganondoodle]

totk rewritten (for me, specifically)

since i dont have time to get to drawing it right away AND im worried people might take this the wrong way, i thought i could write out some bullet points about my rewrite of totk (meant as a fix FOR ME not saying its inherently better) to give you a better idea on what im going for:

the core structure largely remains the same, the biggest change is no time travel, thus making zelda your travel companion, and zonau tech being lagerly gone/broken with shiekah tech instead

it is not shown but said in dialog that shiekah tech, such as the ancient furnaces, shrines and towers are either turning off or have flickering power supply and purah having calculated that all their connections point towards beneath hyrule castle

game starts pretty much the same as real totk, most zonau ruins are so withered away that they are barely recognizable and the further you get down theres more and more shiekah tech pipes and occasional a miasma vein, some pipes are broken and spill miasma, others flicker

instead of the room with the wall carvings theres one with old ancient shiekah research remains, old broken tech and prototypes you dont what their purpose was, all documents are too withered to read but zelda finds one that was sealed in a container and takes it with her (she got a backpack now)

theres a structure similar to the bed thingy of the shrine of life from botw but its working in reverse; within it is sealed ganondorf (i gotta work out the details around it still)

(details still missing) it breaks and zelda takes the enigma stone but doesnt touch it directly and puts it within a sealed container (you know kinda like you should do with soemthing you have no idea of what it is and was alsO LOCATED ON A CORPSE)

ganondorf isnt the elegantly talking villain type in this version but more of a mess, talking in different languages both modern and ancient but you cant make out any clear sentences, struggeling with suddendly being awake and half alive after spending thousands of years in an agonizing limbo, having witnessed every second of the passage of time yet also it feeling like everything just happened all at the same time

the ground breaks as he recognizes zelda (bc of her fighting calamity ganon in botw) but also not really, still sees her as a threat (also bc of the enigma stone in the container she still has in her hand) attacks her, link deflects with the master sword, it breaks and damages his arm, zelda drops her torch and pulls link away towards where they came in from and both run as the caves fill up with miasma like a flood with arms starting to reach after them while they both run back through the tunnels (creepy chase sequence anyone?)

cataclysm happens (ground breaks, miasma bursts out of the ground, especially where shrines and towers where since they were still connected to the pipelines) ground shifts massively in some places giving alot of the map a whole new structure; all shiekah tech that was not independent stops working due to power loss

links arm is amputated since otherwise the miasma would spread to his whole body; purah, robbie and zelda work out a prosthetic arm prototype to give to link (protoype at first will be upgraded at halfway point of the game) that can switch between multiple modes, like a hand to hold normal items or a weapon that isnt crafted, and a fusing ability (though maybe limited in the prototype) that lets you make weapons similar to the weapon fusing in canon totk (potential upgrades including an extendable guardian arm that doesnt break, grapple hook anyone??, also the ability to build stuff out of shiekah tech parts, not glue needed you actually screw it together, maybe zelda even helps)

now you are given free roam of hyrule, the goal is to explore and find what has changed and check on people, see what the underground has, new monsters have spawned etc.

zelda is your companion the whole time, she can use the shiekah stone/purah pad to analyze enemies for you, she also carries at least a dagger for her own self defense but doesnt contribute much to the fight (subject to change maybe), you can talk to her anytime and she usually has something to comment on depending on where you are or what you just did, can give you tips and advice IF ASKED FOR IT, when you discover ancient ruins, whether zonau or shiekah, she can either decipher it for you or take photos for later to find out more about everything that has happend and what it means, she also takes part in conversations when you talk to someone, her outfit changes with yours (meaning when you wear the tingle set she wears it too, opens up alot of funny interactions njfkdk)

purah has built new towers but they function different (still working on the details) mainly that they function independent from the energy source in hyrule castle

there are floating islands but they are bigger and in more connected clusters, when reaching them its ancient withered ruins that the ancient shiekah built support around (like the platform used by monk miz kyoshia) to keep them afloat; there are building like observatories and research labs, but all very overgrown due to being up there for so long, theres a titan prototype on one of the islands, its shaped like a whale and zelda deciphers it was called vah narisha (reference to the whale deity in skyward sword) (i havent decided yet if its fully broken and just a big piece of enviroment to explore or half functioning floating around, or maybe first broken but later half repaired so it can fly around at least giving you an easier way to reach other island, you cant steer it tho) some of them are falling bc of energy loss but the bigger ones have independent energy sources (work in progress)

the underground has more diverse zones depending on which part of the map it is located on, there are old mines (for luminous stone) from the zonau but all is extremely withered, in each one its been mostly built over by the shiekah but there are construct remains that were clearly dissected and studied, half built shrines and towers, you can find collectibles and lore there (working on more details, but an idea was to include remains of ancient shiekah tha fled there when they were persecuted by that old king of hyrule, adding to the eery vibe)

some titans (maybe two, and the other are still on the sruface, like vah medoh) feel down during the cataclysm, broken apart or malfunctioning/ possibly being a boss as in they were used by a big cluster of miasma hands like a hermit crab uses its shell, the inside filled with eyes and different sized hands dragging itself towards you like a drowing man grabs after anything to save him)

dongos are your go to transportation here and a little different, when you call one they dig a path to you (not permanent, just so they can always spawn near you) they glow in the dark and can climb on walls (bc why not), and can point you towards the next objective/point of interest, likely where theres a high concentration of luminous stone since that is what they eat and its usually where old mining/construction sites are (still working on a replacement for light roots that are less invasive)

the rat from the trailer is a miniboss/boss you need to defeat in order to get the broken mastersword back into your possession

(im still working on how the sages work, but the idea is to incorporate their abilites for more efficient and reliable use into links shiekah prosthetic, so you can still use their abilities but only when you actually want)

(again still working on details) halfway point of the game is you trying to find out where ganondorf went, not intending to fight necessarily but just to find out more but it devolves into you fighting some sort of miasma monster (either him or some sort of manifestation he made) and you get a bunch of short memory flashes from him, all vague and a wild mess from both the time he was sealed and from the time afterwards, maybe even a perspective shift from when link was fighting dark beast ganon, but from ganons view, from zelda when she was keeping that manifestation in check, random views from the malice eyes from botw, from the blights, maybe even from the fight with the old and new champions, from the point when shiekah built their tech around him while he had to watch not able to do anything etc.)

links arm gets upgraded from prototype to a full prosthetic, opening up more fusing abilites and other things (like the grapple hook, again working on it, im open for ideas lol)

i will reblog this and add more over time if you want, but do let me know if you like it thus far, bc im still unsure if its worth the effort of working more on this QnQ

(also if you dont like just keep scrolling, i dont need to know that you hate it, it literally changes nothing but make me annoyed xD)

[comicaurora]

Slowly making my way through the TOTK B roll stream, had a few thoughts on the emptiness of the sky islands. In a way, would it not be more surprising if there were more remains to be seen? Ignoring the whole 'it's a game, decisions were made by the developers' bit, nature can take over surprisingly quickly in the right circumstances. In a way, it's more surprising so much survived in BOTW (like the bomb hut ruins. Fire damaged wood? Should be gone in a decade or two anyway). (contd)

So the thing about the Sky Islands in Tears of the Kingdom is that, not only are the ruins fairly well-preserved - presumably due to having been in the Sacred Realm for the last 10,000+ years - but even with them damaged and tumbledown, it's fairly clear from the layout of the islands and their structures that they were not residences. That's not something that would've been lost to erosion and time, that's something foundational to the architecture of the place.

When the game designers want to show a place people live on the surface of Hyrule, they hit a few key points: distinct-looking homes with beds, places that make food, and an inn for travelers. The buildings are different sizes, decorated or personalized by the residents. They're laid out relative to one another in a way that allows for easy, convenient traversal. It's intentional design that makes the villages feel lived-in, cozy, and worth protecting.

Inside the buildings, little details show the presence of living people, even if the building is empty at the time. Table settings, notebooks, pictures on the walls. They feel like they've been shaped by the influence of people, living and working and customizing their environment.

These are all, to be fair, things that we wouldn't expect to last very long if the town fell to ruin. When we explore the sky islands, we aren't expecting to find well-preserved paper maps or notebooks or anything. But if they were lived-in - if they were Zonai population centers rather than temples, ritual centers and factories - that would still be reflected in the basic layout of the structure itself. A residence is designed to accommodate for every basic need, meaning we'd expect the buildings to have places for them to sleep, to eat, and to relax. On the Sky Islands, we find none of these things.

The most common buildings on the sky islands are these isolated stone one-room ruins. They look and feel like storehouses - a few pots, some crumbled masonry. No doors or interior rooms for privacy, no comforts, no sign of a place to sleep, no adjoining buildings. These things were never homes.

The Great Sky Island is the only really plausible candidate for a place the Zonai might've actually lived, being about town-sized with several buildings, but it's not laid out like one. The buildings are either small one-room storage sheds or the massive Temple of Time, and there's no sign of other specialized buildings that could have been used for things like food, rest or other necessities. The Great Sky Island feels like a large, beautiful public park built grafted onto the Temple of Time.

The larger dungeons are more internally complicated, but not in the way that residences are complicated. The water dungeon looks like some kind of huge open park - wide avenues, plazas, devices built for mobility. It feels like a place meant to be traversed and admired, not stayed in.

The wind dungeon is more clearly built as a weapon platform, nowhere we expect people to live. It makes sense that it feels sterile and lifeless.

The larger, more complicated sky islands are also designed for clear utility. The spheres are some sort of celestial observatories, featuring a control system, a treasure chest, and nothing else.

Wildcards like Lightcast Island were clearly built to serve a single purpose - in this case, a lighthouse and attached microdungeon - but contain no signs of life. Zonai came here for a reason, but they didn't stay.

The glide challenge islands are visually impressive, but ultimately the rings are empty - they don't even have structures on them. They exist for the dive challenge and nothing else.

Same deal with the labyrinths, which exist explicitly as puzzles and challenges.

The mines in the depths are also clearly structured for utility - storerooms, construct part repositories and a lot of conveyer belts for moving zoanite. The purpose of the building is very clear just from the layout, and these are not places where anyone was supposed to be staying outside of work hours.

This, along with the layout of towns on the surface, shows that the designers are very good at constructing architecture that reflects the in-story utility of a place, which means the lack of signs of life in the sky islands is not a limitation of the console or the imagination of the artists - it's an intentional design choice.

The end result of all of this? The Sky Islands feel like somewhere that the Zonai built and visited, but not where they lived. They feel cold and unwelcoming and liminal. There's no sense of loss or tragedy, just a feeling of emptiness - people used to come here, but they don't anymore. There's none of the poignancy of an empty dining table's unused place settings or an abandoned child's toy. None of the Sky Islands that descended during the Upheaval were places where the Zonai lived. At the peak of their power they were mistaken for gods, a massively thriving technologically advanced civilization - I'd expect their homes to be cities, towers of jade and marble bustling with the activity of a post-scarcity utopia. None of the Sky Islands show us anything like that, and given how well the designers can portray a lived-in place even without any people in it, this is assuredly intentional. The Zonai built and visited and used the Sky Islands we can explore, but as a whole they lived somewhere else.

But throughout it all, there's this pervading unease - the fact that there's no obvious tragedy makes the sky islands feel more unnerving. We know just enough of the story to infer that something happened to the Zonai - something bad, if we read into Rauru and Mineru's reaction - but whatever it was left no scars. The Zonai constructs don't even realize anything's amiss. The buildings have been damaged only by time and gravity; the forges and mines and observatories and temples are silent and abandoned, like the Zonai all went home one night for dinner and just never came back.

The Sky Islands don't feel dead, they feel lifeless. A place people passed through but didn't leave their mark on. When Link traverses the islands, he isn't just alone - he doesn't even have the comfort of signs of life. The only evidence he has that anyone ever came to these islands are the fact that somebody built them in the first place. They left no marks, no art, no notes, no diaries, no toys, no graffiti. They're just gone.

[derrickwildsun]

The obsession with wanting "consequences" to TOTK's ending are infuriating and shallow. (Massive TOTK Spoilers ahead)

"Why did they have to change Zelda back?"

Because her kingdom NEEDS her. Everyone, not just Link, is fighting together to get her back. NPCs tell you about things she did in between BOTW and TOTK to help them, stressing her importance as a leader. One of the schoolchildren waits outside her house every day in anticipation of her return. Speaking of which, Zelda was able to take her nerdy interests and love of learning and channel that love into bringing improvements to Hyrule via establishing a school and a research team. The kingdom is worse off without her. The title "Tears of the Kingdom" is important because the tears are Zelda's, and she IS the kingdom since she's all that's left of the royal family. It's kind of like the story of the Fisher King: the King is the land, and if the King is sick/ailing, so too is the land.

The main theme of the game is community. Director Hidemaro Fujibayashi had this to say about the game's core theme:

Everyone working together to push back the forces of evil and save their homeland. It's emphasized that Link (and many of the characters, especially the sages) can't do the job alone; he needs help. This even extends to the ending. Link's Recall wouldn't have been sufficient to change Zelda back; Rauru and Sonia amplify his power the same way Sonia and Zelda amplified Rauru's light beam in the Gerudo Invasion memory. Likewise, Rauru and Sonia couldn't bring Zelda back because Link had the necessary ingredient: a motive in the form of his love for Zelda. Just like how Zelda found the necessary motive to unlock her powers and save Link in BOTW, so too does Link accomplish the same in TOTK.

Leaving Zelda as a dragon would have contradicted her character development in BOTW, which amounted to her learning to move past her failure and loss from the Calamity. She also, um, can't figure out "what kind of person she's going to be and what she is going to say" if she's a dragon. The end of her arc amounts to her taking up the role of leadership and restoring her kingdom with the help of Link, the sages, et al. Again, the theme of community, connections, and working together to overcome obstacles.

"Why couldn't she come back with dragon features?"

To quote Mr. Garrison: "That's fucking stupid."

Sonia explains that Recall recalls an object's memory, meaning the only result of the Literal Triforce of Link, Sonia, and Rauru using an amplified Recall on Zeldragon was to return her to the state she was before she ate the stone. This is why her stone is tied around her neck at the end. She couldn't have leftover dragon parts because she was never a dragon to begin with. Also, the greatest loss one could suffer from becoming a dragon is, as emphasized by Mineru, the loss of self, not the body.

"Why does Link get his old arm back?"

The amplified Recall restored it. Also, thematically, it works better for Link to grab hold of Zelda's hand with the hand with which he initially failed to grab her at the start of the game.

"Changing Zelda back nullifies her sacrifice."

No, it doesn't. She fully accepted she would never change back. She wasn't thinking about the possibility of Link saving her because as far as she knew that was impossible; she made her decision out of love for her kingdom and Link. In the end, she succeeded in her mission (as did Link). If she made the sacrifice with the assumption Link would save her, then I could see this argument holding water. But Link was never going to give up on her because he LOVES her. Even she's in disbelief at having changed back (and very thankful because now she's home). In the secret ending, she says, "I never thought I would stand in this place again." We feel the weight of her sacrifice in the final memory, and the ending provides an emotional release because we the player repay her for all she did to help us and because she more than proved her heroism. I liken it to the ending of Pinocchio (1940) wherein the Blue Fairy changes Pinocchio into a real boy as a reward for giving his life to save Geppetto's.

"Her not remembering being a dragon is a copout."

Mineru explains very clearly that becoming a dragon means losing one's self. You lose all your memories and indentity; you cease to be the person you were. So, yes, she wouldn't remember being a dragon flying around for centuries. But you know what she would remember because it happened before she lost all sense of self?

Though not outright stated, it's clear from the character animation that Zelda was in immense pain as the transformation began to take effect. Also, you can tell she was absolutely terrified in that moment. She knew what she was doing was necessary to save her kingdom, but she's thinking, "Shit, these are my last few seconds before I lose myself forever. I'll never see my loved ones again: Link, Purah, Robbie, Riju, Sidon, the schoolchildren in Hateno, etc. And I'm doing this all on a MASSIVE gamble and act of faith that Link will find me, reclaim the Master Sword, and destroy the Demon King." That's not the kind of traumatic event you'd easily forget. She'll probably be contemplating "Wow, if Link hadn't been so determined, I wouldn't be here now and that would have been my last moment alive," for some time. And no, you don't need to see her suffering psychological effects in-game; that's best left up to the viewer's imagination; there's only so much story they can cram into the game before it's overstuffed.

"Why did Rauru and Sonia come back to restore Zelda?"

Because they loved her, and Zelda loved them. From the moment Zelda met them, they promised to find a way to return her home to reunite with Link. They have an emotional (and familial) connection to her. By helping Link restore her, they're extending a final act of love to the princess they adore so much. It's a beautiful sendoff to them, because unlike Zelda's biological parents (Zelda's mother died when she was six, and Rhoam was too busy being a king to actually be a father to her), they were able to provide for and help her on her journey. It would have been a mistake to not bring them back to wrap up that plot point.

I think a lot of nerds suffer from Cinema Sins/TV Tropes brain: only able to deal in the most literal without any room for meaning. "Punishing" Zelda for her sacrifice wouldn't have added anything to her arc, as the whole point of her character isn't to be a stoic symbol for her people to mindlessly obey. The game deals in second chances, not just for Zelda obviously but also for Link. Link gets a second chance at the end to catch Zelda to make up for not catching her at the beginning; that's parallel storytelling with actual deliberate meaning behind it. Otherwise, the story amounts to, "He fucked up and there's nothing he can do about it." Remember that much like Zelda, Link had enormous pressure placed on him from a young age. He was expected to carry his duties out lest the entire kingdom be DOOMED FOREVER. But with TOTK's ending, he can realize that he doesn't have to worry about that pressure since no one's forcing it on him anymore. He can shape his own destiny and bounce back from a mistake; he doesn't have to lose Zelda forever.

I've already explained that the power Link, Sonia, and Rauru use is just an amplified Recall, but technical explanations aside, it's mainly the sort of scene that's driven more by emotions than by "logic." A good example of a scene that relies on the emotions of the story to carry it is the climax of Disney's Dumbo (1941). Animation critic/historian Michael Barrier writes:

If you're the sort of person who questions why Dumbo is able to fly without the "magic feather" or how Dorothy Gale goes home just by clicking her heels and repeating the mantra "There's no place like home," you probably shouldn't be watching movies.

Special thanks to @avalypuff, @blueskittlesart, @thecagedsong, @aquaticpal, and @nolongerapileofashprobably for their posts on the subject; all of you made some excellent insights on the ending and how it ties in with the game's themes. I'll go ahead and link to said posts for further reference:

[aikoiya]

LoZ: LU - The Chain in the Depths

I just had a thought. How would the Links react to the Depths?

Like, my theory is that it's actually what remains of old Hyrule from before BotW/TotK.

By that, I mean that the Deku Tree did what he said that he would in WW by using trees to reconnect the islands, which is what makes it possible for the Era of the Wild to be at the end of all 3 timelines. This is supported by how there are so many massive roots all over the place. As well as the fact that the map inside the Forgotten Temple shows that there'd been more water in Central Hyrule during Rauru's time.

But, specifically, how would the rest of the Chain react to the sheer amount of Poe Souls, the Shadow Soldiers, whether they all can see the Poe Souls & Shadow Soldiers (because, remember, apparently not everyone can according to a Yiga journal & the only entities to really make mention of the Poe Souls are the Bargainers), the Bargainers themselves, seeing the Heart Island with the green poe & the pink poe, & the Blupee Burrow?

Not to mention the implication that at least some of the Poe Souls belonged to people who died during the Calamity based on the Ancient Underground Fortress in Akkala. Also, how the triple stone mounds seem to correlate with monuments meant to honor & remember soldiers who died fighting the Calamity. All being at what appeared to be places where great battles took place.

I remember a fic suggesting that the Poe Souls were the souls of people who'd died excavating the Zonaite for the Zonai. However, the thing is that while I could see that being the case for a few of them, I don't think that's the whole story.

I think that the Depths are something of a liminal space where the dead of Hyrule just gather before moving on & that it has become a reflection of the Surface. "As above, so below" & all that. This is supported by, as mentioned before, the state of the Ancient Underground Fortress in Akkala.

This liminality can be partially attributed to having been saturated with magical water for millennia before the Zonai drained it.

And the "as above, so below" phenomenon could be due to the fact that in the Downfall & Child Timelines, Hyrule was lower in elevation while the Hyrule that the Deku Tree would've recreated would obviously have been at a much higher elevation. And when whatever it was that supposedly merged the 3 timelines back together (*cough*War of Ages*cough*) took place, plus the land beneath being saturated with magic, could've intrinsically linked the Surface with the Depths in a way that one simply doesn't see anywhere else. (Not that this is the case, but it's a possibility, I believe.)

And if this is the case, then it'd still allow for landmarks from previous games to appear on the Surface.

It's also possible that what actually fasilitated the merge in the first place was that the War of Ages allowed for things from all 3 timelines to also exist in the other 2, which may have allowed them all to create an inevitable outcome: The Era of the Wild. And once all 3 had a major enough event in common, it allowed for the merge to solidify. (But that's honestly little more than hairbrained speculation on my part.)

However, if this is the case, then it's possible that Ganondorf returning in the Adult Timeline could've simply been a very convenient excuse to cause the Great Flood which would've been a linchpin in allowing for the merge to happen at all.

Hell, it's even possible that had this perceived merge not taken place, then perhaps there wouldn't have been an Era of the Wild. Or a Wild, for that matter.

Also something to note is that we don't know how the Depths looked before the Zonai arrived, nor do we know how they looked during Rauru's reign.

Either way, I'd very much like to see someone go into this. Possibly even with Spirit in the Chain.

There's theories that he'd have what amounts to the Mind's Eye unlocked from birth. And I personally hc that the Spirit Train is used to transport the souls of the dead to the afterlife in New Hyrule, so if no one else, I def think that he'd be able to see them all. Possibly even better than Wild.

May even be able to talk to them & the Shadow Soldiers. Or just hear their final wishes if nothing else.

Fudge... imagine Wild learning that one of those Shadow Soldiers was the shade of his father desperately trying to do whatever he can to help his son... Aaaangst...

I believe this is concept art of them.

And imagine the shame of still not remembering him or the sister he once had.

Or, if he does end up getting his memories of them back & breaks down at the realization that he'd failed them. Obviously, it wasn't his fault, but let's be real here. Wild would absolutely take it that way. And imagine how much Wind would try to sympathize with him, but Wild might not appreciate it because Wind, at the very least, had been able to save his sister. Wild had failed his. (I know that it's implied that Wild's family had lived in the Hateno House.

And imagine the shock & fragile hope of learning that last his father knew, his sister was still alive & that this meant Wild might have nieces & nephews.

And now suddenly he feels so very small & strangely desperate to have just one more connection to the life he once had. Because he might not have been the same man as he was & he may even be happier now, but that does not mean that his old life was bereft of joy & love.

Perhaps, he wants a little bit of that love back. Even if only in second-hand stories of the family he hadn't quite realized until this exact moment that he lost.

Just one more thing that the Calamity pilfered from his grasp.

Or perhaps she's still alive, just incredibly old & weak & unable to even get out of bed anymore.

I also hc that FD is the Hyrulean god of death (among other things) & that the Bargainer's Statues are basically very early depictions of him.

That he created the Sheikah, who were tasked with helping the dead to move on & were once the ones who brought the Poe Souls to the Bargainer Statues in the Depths, specifically those who've trained their mind's eye. However, that has obviously changed.

Something else that I'm not sure I've seen. Time & Wind interacting with Wild's Deku Tree.

If anyone has info on the timeline & the order of the Links, it'd be him.

LoZ Linked Universe Masterlist

[rawliverandgoronspice]

Okay so this has been on my mind for awhile and I wanted to get my thoughts out there. Regarding the topic of Rauru and Ganons relationship, I feel like rauru has kinda been bashed? people seem think that rauru in memory 6 (I believe) had a bit of a god complex, and that he was disrespectful. I feel as if rauru kinda had a right to act the way he did.

Rauru had wanted to become Allie’s with the gerudo. Not necessarily because he wants them to serve him but more for resources. Or more likely knowing Ganon he was attacking hyrule. The reason why I suspect this is because during the molduga incident rauru and Sonia seem to be very familiar with theses types of attacks. So it’s likely Ganon had ordered monster attacks on them before. Likely the attacks were getting to much for rauru and Sonia to handle; on top of establishing hyrule, rauru sent out messages for Ganon to join the kingdom in order to stop the attacks. Or another reasoning is that the gerudo were likely suffering. Ganon has been shown to not always prioritize his people. And knowing from past games the gerudo desert doesn’t have much resources. We can kinda see this in Totk they seem to only have hydromelon and voltfruit (I highly doubt that the gerudo had men at the time bringing them food from hyrules fields). If you’ve talked to rauru on the sky islands you’ll know that rauru is actually a very sweet and sympathetic guy, so I believe this could be a possibility.

Moving forward to raurus attitude during their meeting.Now rauru wasn’t exactly the nicest during the meeting, but I don’t really blame him. Rauru probably annoyed that ganon has been ignoring his letters and putting his people in danger. Also Ganon was very sketchy during that entire meeting and was rude in his tone.

Why did Ganon bow? Ganon and rauru are not equal, yes they are both kings but rauru has massive amounts of power and has a much larger land mass. (and zonia are kinda gods) but I don’t think the reasoning for Ganon bowing is because he less than or non equal to rauru. More like he was apologizing and giving rauru respect for the countless times he’s ignored him or tried to kill him.

More of raurus tone in the meeting Again I think he was really fed up with Ganon and rauru seems very non confrontational (he apologizes in the sky islands that the constructs attack link, and ask link not to be angry because they can’t understand) rauru likely wanted it to get into ganons mind not to attack the kingdom again because rauru had a lot of Allie’s and power and will attack Ganon if he pulls a stunt.

Ganon vs the gerudo. This part is a little off topic but, lots believe rauru is low key kinda racist towards the gerudo. But if this was true why was gerudo sage working with rauru? I don’t think that the way rauru acts is how he acts to all gerudo. The sage of lighting very obviously doesn’t like Ganon. The reasoning  could be my first point. And later on after the imprisoning war the gerudo still stuck with hyrules side.

That’s all I have for right now, sorry if it’s all jumbled up I tried to make it coherent. Anyways I appreciate you for reading this :3

-🔺

Hi, thanks for the lengthy ask!! I'm sorry for the lengthy answer this beckoned, but I think this conversation is pretty important --even beyond Zelda and this specific case. We're talking themes and tropes and framing!!!!

I will try to reply to all of this in a way that kind of threads through several layers of why people have been bashing Rauru, me included. I will try my best to explain why I dislike this character, and try to parse out why I am this miffed by Tears of the Kingdom's storyline overall.

The long story short is: I don't dislike Rauru as a person (I mean, I also would tbh), I dislike him because of what he represents.

I think the waters did muddy a little in the "discourse" recently, and it's a good thing to take a step back and re-explain where I'm coming from (me personally, not going to speak for anyone but me here).

Also, before jumping in: this is not a condamnation on anyone who enjoys this story or these characters, nothing is unproblematic, it's fine, everybody does what they want, all of the things. I like the game and I keep playing the game in spite of being harshly critical of the ideas pushed forward. Also: it's fine to digest this and come back later (or not at all) if that feels like a lot, or if some of these ideas don't immediately click. But it's also partially why I think it's important: this game is aimed at a young audience, and one who might not have all of the keys to decipher what's going on, which is why I think it's quite irresponsible (which is the charitable interpretation) on Nintendo's part.

Anyway. Too many words underneath the cut.

The Story

So, first of all, I want to say that I believe you completely and fully read the situation as Nintendo intended it to be read. This is the text of the game (aka, the story taken at face value). You picked up on every single safeguard put into place to have Rauru and Sonia act in the most justifiable way possible, and have Ganondorf, on the other hand, act as a duplicitous, power-hungry and downright insane as they could have made him. In the reality of their universe, and only taking into account what is given to us through the narrative, trusting it comes from a neutral place and isn't influenced by anything, everything you said is 100% correct.

Rauru and Sonia WERE acting in self-defense, and were even kind not to turn their incommensurable power against the invading army.

The kingdom Rauru built as a demigod IS a paradise and they WERE very generous to invite neighboring nations to bask in their wealth and its technological and natural blessings (and the results of their extensive mining and why are there killer robots everywhere if this world was such a peaceful paradise uhh let's not ponder about this too much). That Ganondorf was too prideful and envious to accept IS a sin that rests solely with him.

Rauru IS a brave hero that sacrificed himself to seal the invader that killed his beloved wife.

Every single Sage IS extraordinarily devoted to protect both Rauru's lineage and their own lands, and gleefully pass down that duty to their ancestors --all thanks to Zelda, heir of that blessed royal line who returned to the past and made them promise to fight alongside Link to seal the Evil once more.

The gerudo WERE (apparently) oppressed, as they decided to fight under Rauru's authority freely (so against their own chief??) and, also, must make amends for having put Ganondorf in this world in the first place? ( I think we are already starting to see some contradictions --were you always victims or did you start this conflict in the first place? what is your place in all of this? why don't we ever get to know?)

This IS the story of Tears of the Kingdom. A story of a great sacrifice that happened in the golden mythical past (confirmed as unquestionable truth through the archeology motif), done by benevolent godly figures of royal blood and immense power they would never abuse, giving their everything to bring Light into a broken world corrupted by the degeneracy of Evil, echoed by the devotion of nations who swore fealty to that divine being and must now renew their vow in the present to defend their lands and Hyrule at any cost. Also, the impossible and magnificient suffering of the princess, whose tears lead to a trail of truth into the very land, informs the current population about why they're fighting now; she's at once a hero of the past and a martyr in the present, completely incapable of acting on her own, carrying with her the blade that will slay the crushing and violent sway of Evil for good and bring eternal peace into the land (Evil who uses her own appearance to cause chaos and violence against her own people --the blasphemy!!). The title of the game reflects this too: the Tears of the Kingdom are hers. Zelda is the kingdom here, and her pain/the pain of that mythical past is what is centered.

Also Ganondorf IS green so it's not racist okay let's stop right here and unpack all of this mess, because BOY oh boy oh boy oh boy.

oh boy.

The History

Now comes the time to point out the obvious, but that bears being repeated: this is a fictional story. It's a story crafted by a very powerful game company set in Japan. It's a story crafted by a huge number of people, who debated for years how to best tell it, why, and what for. Every single choice made in the narrative is purposeful, has been weighted against other options, and was picked over what could have been virtually anything else. Again, I want to state that I don't know if any single person took these decisions, probably not entirely, and it's even possible Nintendo didn't realize (I doubt it heavily tbh, but I'm sure there are people in the team that didn't get it or didn't see the issue), but a certain kind of story was crafted in the end, and it's the one we got.

One word that has been tossed around a lot as far as TotK's story goes is ✨ imperialism ✨, and I want to pause and take a second to analyse exactly what we mean by that and why I think it's painfully relevant here (and, honestly, I think another word would be very very relevant here also, but it's the kind of word you keep for after you're done with your argumentation not to scare off the unconvinced audience --but, to anyone who reads and might have picked it up already, yeah.)

In our real world of Earth 2023™, we have seen quite the number of extraordinarily powerful nations becoming gradually larger, engulfing neighbors, breaking apart, and leaving the buds of new future empires behind them. Hell, there's a number of them existing right now, even if they don't call themselves empires and don't have literal emperors at their head anymore (though Japan does, and it is important here). Of course, no nation, especially nations striving for expansion, worldwide legitimacy in culture and power, and their own understanding of "greatness", would ever call themselves anything but enlightened and justified. After all, the Roman Empire brings aqueducts and infrastructure to the lands they conquer, China unifies disparaging regions struggling under constant barbaric attacks, France and Spain converts local populations of the "New World" and save their souls from eternal damnation (wow thanks guysss), the British Empire brings industrial revolution uhhh everywhere please don't ask what was the cost, Africa sure loves everybody ripping their culture and lands apart and were so super glad to receive whatever "civilization" is supposed to mean when their literal people were being pillaged away to keep on building said empires using their blood as mortar, the URSS protects neighboring nations from the Evil Capital/West, fascists want to purge the world of anything they consider impure, the US brings freedom to the world and the whole world is grateful forever!!!

Everyone always has an excuse, and everyone is always kind of semi-mandated by God (in the largest possible sense; divine responsibility would perhaps be more appropriate, it's kind of the idea that with great power comes responsibility, while defining what responsibility means and inflicting their conclusions to conquered lands to squeeze even more value out of them) to do whatever the hell they want to others, claim their lands, their bodies, their minds, their culture --and demand gratefulness on top of it all to avoid having to feel bad.

There is a large body of fictional works that are dedicated to boister the image of the Empire. Every single empire has a number of them; their goal is often to mythologize, in some form or another, the story of their expansion. It often flattens every nuance, paints the actions of the empire as the natural order of the world and its opposition as morally malignant, their leaders are charismatic, benevolent, powerful and self-sacrificial. Often, it invokes previous empires to cast the current one as inheriting a grace that was tragically lost and must be restored through war, hard work, and healthy natality --I'll dip into the forbidden comparaison but Nazi Germany loved its greek myths of Sparta and Athens (and modern day fascists still do), or the Napoleon Wars so they could retell the story of their own empire by invoking a legacy of moral diligence and ethnical greatness being restored. But the pattern is often very similar: we used to be Great, a tragic event due to both external invasion and internal corruption precipitated our golden age into chaos and degeneracy, and now we must fight off current day corruption to restore the Glory of the old times we lost --all of this under the benevolent gaze of our leaders, whose mission is a direct or indirect intervention of divinity into mortal lives. It is righteous and glorious to fight/die for the nation (and its leaders) and protect it from the uncivilized, who are inhuman and exist solely to trick us, corrupt us, attack us and assimilate/destroy us.

Are we starting to notice some similarities here :) :) :)

The Narrative

There's two conversations running in parallel here.

The first one is the least important in my opinion, even though it's the one we tend to focus on a lot as theorists/enthusiasts/enjoyers of media: is Rauru oppressing the gerudos, and does that inform Ganondorf's actions?

Honestly? Textually? Probably not.

There are arguments to be made (and that deserve to be made) about the insane power imbalance, there are a lot of suspicious aspects that deserve to be picked apart like the address and deference of Ganondorf towards Rauru, the whole mining thing that I don't see being discussed much but could be a huge part of it --there are ancient mines in the gerudo region after all; since when? what's the history here?-- the strange masks the Sages are to wear when Zelda, as a direct descendant, isn't wearing any, etc etc. Lots of other posts have been made about the million tiny red flags that litter the game, but I think that if we take the game at face value, they barely matter. I would love them to have been placed with intent (and they maybe were as a desperate attempt by an employee trying to inject grayness back in the equation and if that's the case I SEE YOU random gamedev and I love you and you did the best you could <3), but to me that's more a case of wishful fan thinking (including mine tbh) that any concrete argument that the story is secretely about Rauru being imperialist and this costing him everything. There are some hints of a more nuanced world (the Horned God, the Bargainers, that some NPCs are invested in monsters are creatures worthy of study and awe --tho almost all of them ridiculed in some form), but these demand that you go out of your way to collect them and make the connection yourself. Can this even qualify as subtext? As in: the story under the story? As much as I wish this was the case, I don't think so. We can't make the case that it's a simple story for children that isn't trying to say anything grand while also demanding people to make insane mental gymnastics on their own, without any help on the game's part, for it not to be a blatant endorsement of imperialist thinking.

(especially not the kind of game that repeats 3 different times back to back that Sidon didn't talk to Yona because he was afraid to lose her like he lost Mipha --honestly what's up with this writing I don't get it, BotW didn't act like its players' brain was this unplugged, ANYWAY)

The story is about Ganondorf being duplicitous and monstrous and destroying the beautiful kingdom of the past, and us preserving our modern day kingdom from its corrupting influence by recruiting allies and friends in that fight. We are given a plethora of situations that paint him as inhumanely cruel and chaotic, and none that breath even the suggestion of a critique towards our heroes. He's evil: we must stop him.

Now comes the second conversation, and one I think is more important: is this entire storyline built off imperialist tropes that were created to oppress and exploit marginalized populations in real life while justifying the violence inflincted upon them?

In my opinion, yes. Undeniably so.

I am not so much invested in Rauru being racist towards Ganondorf; I am invested in the real life Nintendo videogame being racist towards the idea that Ganondorf represents: the scary foreigner that will lead to the fall of civilization if we let him in.

(and perhaps this was Rauru's hubris all along: to believe he could let a scary (male) foreigner in and then trust him to remain docile.... a little too much. And then he reaped what he sowed.

checkmate liberal.

This makes an uncomfortable amount of sense and I kinda hate having made the connection tbh)

This is especially true when it's the second time around that this exact storyline is represented, and I believe it to be much more insidious this time around --because now, gerudos are our friendssss and feel great shame and personal responsibility towards that aspect of them that once rebelled. Meanwhile in OoT, a majority of them were onboard with Ganondorf as their leader and explicitely did not want to be assimilated in the kindgom (Nabooru being specifically painted as one of the exceptions). I go more in depth about all of this in this pre-TotK post about gerudo culture. We had plenty of conversations about orientalism and islamophobic representation in videogames since; it was A Thing at the time, the turn of the century was particularly egregious in that regard. But It's not 1998 anymore, and I personally believe it's pretty inexcusable to rethread that same ground beat by beat without batting an eye at any of its implications (especially since they have done better since; even Twilight Princess, who gave him very little grace overall, dared to criticize hylians through Midna, Zelda and even Zant --and Wind Waker towed the line rather beautifully between the part of him that was human and the part that was monstrous, and the tragedy of these two cancelling each other out constantly). I was expecting much, much better than what we got --I didn't even dare to imagine they would just double-down on that aspect and make a worse version of Ocarina of Time to reintroduce the character.

This is also partially why I'm so uncomfortable with the green skin situation: can you imagine how this scene would have felt like, with the single brown-skinned guy having a central role in the game kneeling in front of a white old man with a droopy mustache (which was Rauru's first iteration in the series, and the one I always keep in mind when having these conversations) and his blonde wife, and Zelda being "hmmm he's evil for sure"? And then he 100% is, with no justification or reason beyond an urge to consume the entire world --even this, which is not uninteresting, remaining completely unexplored in a 150+ hour open-world game that decided to focus on everything under the sun EXCEPT Ganondorf's motivations and his relationship to his own people? Can you imagine how obvious of a racist caricature Ganondorf would have been just by keeping his skin a normal brown (not to pretend he's not already super coded as Foreign in every possible way)? The man is intimidating, uncomfortable to be around, he's greedy and power-hungry, he's insane, he comes for our lands and our women and oppresses his own and also corrupts everything through either infiltration or literal disease. Also he's uhhh the Devil, for good measure.

As much as we can rationalize and embrace these parts of who he is as fans, there's no ignoring how icky this entire situation really is.

So, to tie everything together.

There are three readings of this game competing in my head.

The first one is: the textual interpretation. Rauru is self-sacrificial and a victim, Zelda is deeply brave and an icon of the empire's longevity and deep-rooted history, Ganondorf is utterly inhuman and must be destroyed at all costs. What the game says it is --and what it is.

The second one is: the critical interpretation. That this story sounds awfully convenient for the prosperity of the Empire (here the empire being Hyrule), paints Zelda, the current leader, in a weird fanficky way by literally sending her back to the past with her super cool ancestors and allowing a military victory in the present while also being a martyr to the cause and being much more of a symbol than a person, and nobody even bats a fucking eye in the direction that Hyrule might have been questionable in any way --everyone is so happy to be a vassal, see? Let's not unpack why the king of the zoras prefered hiding himself than facing the consequences of what would happen if Zelda really did attack him out of the blue (this plot point is insane, but its potential is too good so therefore it's illegal and immediately dropped). Let's not unpack the absolute insane amount of abuse false Zelda gets away with by virtue of acting as the princess of a sacred bloodline (but she's nice, right? because that's how you want to make a sure a ruler won't hurt you: praying they will be nice). There are enough red flags to doubt this world, its reality, the complexity of these people's inner lives. The rejection of the notion that any sort of flaw or problem could exist within the system makes it borderline dystopian in my opinion (especially when compared with BotW's Hyrule, which had problems who led to its own downfall and were the fault of nobody but their own actions as Ganon is portrayed more as a natural event than an actual, malicious person), and this is the first reason why I don't like Rauru: the entire world revolves around this goat-kangaroo-furry man's chiseled navel. Everyone is, quite literally, a faceless tool in the glorious and tragic story of his lost empire (or they're women here to become sacrificial objects serving the fights of men; or they're Ganondorf, who's a non-person and an antagonistic object lacking any interiority or humanity, and the narrative being completely uninterested in that), and only his bloodline and his vision for the future really matters. Not that Rauru thinks like this --but the game does. And so, it's hard for me not to see him as either the most narcissistic person ever if we accept him as the narrator of this story, or a flat propaganda machine built for an even greater cause (Hyrule, the Empire).

And then, the third one: that Nintendo would put out a game that is so deeply embedded in imperialist and orientalist language and tropes, so invested in its traditional and patriarchal values, so uncurious about the Other and so critical of it while refusing to look inward, is not neutral (yes even if the game is super fun and has other great qualities, I do believe this game is a monumental achievement in game/level design and in optimization/tech art while also being a trainwreck in quest and narrative design). This rethoric is not neutral, especially when addressed at the West at large --especially right now, with such a global uptick in traditionalist values overall, and Japan not exactly being spared. I won't pretend to be knowledgeable enough about Japanese history and culture to pick up all the little nuances of what is going on here, but I know enough to recognize that such stories do play out a certain understanding of this country's history, its fears and its difficulties to reconcile with its own (very recent) past as a colonialist empire --both the terrors it unleashed on others and the terrors that were unleashed upon it as it was dismantled. Instead of exploring that subject, every potential for nuance and conversation and self-criticism is slammed shut immediately, often at the cost of their own characters and the depth of their quest design/writing. The unearthed past agrees with its current understanding of itself; there is nothing discovered that leads to being questioned and reconsidered. Everything wrong is the fault of a single, corrupting entity that can be identified as Foreign and Other. There is a literal Heaven (zonai and civilized, Rauru's) and Hell (monstrous and corroding, Ganon's). None of this is neutral. Especially when infused in a game targeted for a young audience lacking context.

So I hope this very verbose answer helped a little to parse out what is being criticized at which level! Thank you for giving your thoughts, and I hope mine were clarifying to a degree.

I understand it can get a little confusing; but a lot of the urge not to take this scene at face value is born from the knowledge that nothing is ever that simple in real life, that these sort of self-serving narratives often hide horrific amounts of systemic harm underneath its perfectly curated presentation, and that, well. Some Zelda fans, especially the older generations that were invested in these characters and their re-imagining, expected Nintendo to be less..... like this.

And the wake-up call stings a little more than we would have liked.

(again obligatory disclaimer that I'm not saying TotK is Bad or should be Cancelled or that you're Bad for liking it --but it's still important to explicitly talk about how themes like these are being utterly glossed over when I don't think they would have been if they'd come out of a new IP, and not with the huge nostalgia cloud that envelops The Legend of Zelda and has people being extremely uncomfortable at criticizing the ideas the series can sometimes champion --though the series never veered in that direction nearly as hard before in my opinion)

[lil-tottie]

Sidon in Totk and why it's a problem

Let's talk about this. Spoilers for TOTK. This is an off-brand, slightly more serious post.

Here's a TLDR:

1. Sidon fills a niche few other characters in LoZ fill

2. Nobody expected SidLink to be canon

3. Sidon's fiancé felt shoehorned in and served no purpose other than pissing people off.

First of all: As someone who has been playing LoZ games for a long time, there have been very, very few options for attractive male-presenting/male characters. And before you say that LoZ is not a romance game or meant for people to be thirsty, please understand that there is an obscene amount of explicit content for nearly every attractive female/female-presenting character. Ffs, there's a Zelda for all the season. There's Midna, Din, Ilia, Ruta, Mipha. When players were into these characters- and believe me, doesn't matter if the game isn't a dating sim, they were- they weren't shamed for them. Sidon gave players this option, but since Sidon is a guy and the part of the Fandom that likes him is predominantly female or queer, it's suddenly a problem. And yes, maybe the fans are more fiesty than the rest, but can you blame us? How long have we waited?

Secondly, I see the Fandom split with one side in mourning and the other side celebrating in news of Sidon's fiancé. I've seen quite a few posts- some here, but a lot on reddit- shaming Sidon fans and Sidlink fans. Considering that we live in the world that we do, I'm pretty sure everyone knew that Sidlink would never be canon. It was still fun and gave players something to look forward to and attach themselves to. You can take your puritanical high ground that Sidlink is "annoying" and never call yourself homophobic or fragile, but there's no reason to hate a whole subgroup like that. We can just pretend that Zelda wasn't a bunch of people's sexual awakenings. Imagine your ship being canon (ZeLink) and still bashing on non-canon ships. Fuck right off.

Lastly, Sidon getting a fiancé served no purpose. She has never existed before in any game and has virtually no connection except for the shoehorned exposition dump in Sidon's diary. Even from a game development standpoint, why would you slit the throat of your cash cow? You had to put in so little in like a few lines of dialogue and 1 or 2 cutscenes, and you cultivated a massive following. So, is this your version of slash-and-burn because the "wrong" people liked LoZ for the "wrong" reasons?

[soniclozdplove]

So I have a mini theory about TOTK based on the memories, major spoilers under cut

So Zelda is around 10,000 years in the past, in the Era where this iteration of Hyrule was first founded. I say this iteration because I believe that this isn't the true original Hyrule that we know to have been founded form Skyward Sword but most likely a refounding of the kingdom from further down the timeline, similar to how New Hyrule was founded by Link and Tetra after Wind Waker, but that's my own headcanon and I don't really want to deal with the whole timeline bs right now. Which is why I'm only focusing on Zelda doing time travel in TOTK.

So... my question here is, exactly how long was she in the past!? The answer is 10,000 years, I know, but I mean... how long was ZELDA in the past. Not Zelda the Light Dragon but Zelda as herself. Time travel is a finicky subject since, for us, she could have only been missing for weeks, maybe months, before the end of the game. For her it could have been much, much longer.

My idea stens from a few factors, first being her relationship with Sonia and Rauru and the second being the Imprisoning War. A little bit of Ganondorf thrown in there too.

First and foremost, the bond between Zelda and her ancestors. Queen Sonia and King Rauru treat Zelda, a literal stranger to their politics and therapy, like a daughter. Far more so than he rown father ever did! When she has something to say, they listen to her concerns and validate them. Now that could just be them being good parental figures to their decendant, but Rauru had no reason to believe a word Zelda said about her concerns over Ganondorf's treachery when, in her time, the Imprisoning War that hadn't even happened yet was little more than a legend and barely remembered history. Nobody even knew who the Zonai were by the time BOTW came along. Yet Ganondorf aoemhow knew Sonia would listen if Zelda asked to see her in private, and Sonia and Zelda were both able to put a contingency plan in effect to thwart the attamped assassination. True they failed in the end, but the initial attempt had failed and the fact Ganondorf knew Zelda's image would move Sonia to leave her protection and her husband says a lot in and of itself.

Then the war itself. First of all, war isn't a quick matter. There is jo su h thing as a fast war no matter what history claims. All war is messy and takes years to deal with the fallout. And the Imprisoning War wasn't a simple skirmish. It was a massive war that put the Hylians and their aloud forces to the rbink of extinction, one that had long lasting consequences including but not limited to the longterm exclusion of all males within the Gerudo tribe with the exception of Link over 10,000 years down the line, and even then that only happened AFTER he saved the tribe twice over. A war that is o far reaching it is mere jyth and legend yet still very present at the time of BOTW. By the time the Sages swear allegiance to Rauru, he was the last bastion against the Demon King in his rampage with the last of the Gerudo falling shortly beforehand. That is, the Gerudo who are OP as hell in BOTW in all accounts and are literally trained from childhood as elite warriors in most cases.

Zelda had FOUGHT in that war and had spent an undetermined time after its ending, preparing the Kingdome of Hyrule and the remaining survivors for Ganondorf's inevitable revival as best she could. That in and of itself will likely take years, especially since she had to find a caretaker for Rauru and Sonia's unnamed and unseen heir to ensure her bloodline lasted long enough for her own birth.

So, I bring you back to my theory... Zelda has been in the past for at least several years before she turned into the Light Dragon. She did not immediately go to the Temple of Time and swallow the secret stone. She had to have had at least several months after the war at minimum before she could transform into a dragon. I know the Tears make it appear shorter than it was but there's no way all the events of the 8 tears can happen within a span of a few months. It had to have been years.

[echoesofwisdomcountdown]

25 Days until Tears of the Kingdom Release. Is it really? Haha the smaller the number gets the more I doubt reality. I've just been waiting for this game for so long that even with all the marketing and the trailer analysis it's hard to believe its actually happening.

Spoilers under the cut for the last batch of screenshot trailer analysis.

So this tear has the recall chicken symbol on it. I checked. Zelda also has the Master Sword with her. Either she's fixing the sword and that's something only she can do or Zelda is in the past so the sword isn't broken yet and she is leaving something there for Link.

Ganondorf, mummy version I'm assuming, spewing red malice stuff but much brighter red this time. I wonder if Malice is just Ganondorf's version of fuse. Link gets green glue and Ganondorf red. After this there is a shot where the red stuff hits the sky and starts summoning monsters. The trailer transitions it to make it look continuous but once we get into the game we'll most likely find that it's separate cut scenes or different parts of the same cut scene but not continuous. Honestly, I think this might be where Link and the Master Sword get attacked but I'm still not giving up on the possibility that the malice emerges from the Master Sword outwards as Fi looses control on Demise.

I'm pretty sure I mentioned the lack of lynels in the other analysis I did. Welp here they are with their massive antlers (oof on the damage those things will probably cause) and the sword looking thing sticking out of one of their heads. I wonder what fusing Lynel horns to shields, swords, or arrows will do. I think I'll fight some just for that.

What else do I have to say? It's the main man, Ganondorf. I can't wait to kick his ass again.

Never seen this enemy in any of the Zelda games I've played. However, I will look forward to this boss fight/mini boss fight and whatever skill or item we need to defeat it. Maybe ascend or some ice weapon? I heard that ascend works on certain enemies and I'm very curious about which ones. It'd be interesting if this enemy tries to swallow Link and Link just ascends through the roof of its mouth.

This is Hylia or some version of Zelda from the past (yeah I'm aware that Hylia is technically a version of Zelda but whatever.) I think she's very pretty, super amazing, and very strong considering she laser beams a bunch of Molduga with no sweat.

RIJU!!! Look at my girl double wielding swords (Can we do it too as Link? Nintendo?? I wanna duel wield.) Riju appears to have grown into her own and mastered her lightning powers without needing the Helm. I'm so proud of her and I can't wait to fight along side her.

I can't tell you how cool it is to see that Link will be working and fighting alongside other citizens of Hyrule. The resistance in Twilight Princess walked so that TOTK NPCS can run. At least that's my hope. Also neat looking sword Link.

Now this part of the trailer nearly gave me a heart attack. I was like no freaking way will the new champions literally fight besides Link and not just in a cut scene. How sick is this? Of course, I heard some people say co-op but I don't think that's what's happening. You see the blue glowy stuff on Sidon? Yeah it was on Tulin too. I think the new champions might be like summons, automated companions. I think Nintendo took the wolf link amiibo and the Yunobu follow quest and beefed it up. I'm very excited about it.

So Riju doesn't have a tear that we can see and they haven't shown Yunobu but Tulin and Sidon have different tears. I'm very curious about what these things do. I'm also amused that Sidon got blue and Tulin green considering the colors of Mipha's Grace and Revali's Gale. I'm not sure about the symbols on them since I don't think they correspond to any of the abilities icons unlike recall. Anyway, it's just another thing that can't be answered until the game is out.

Giant fire gleeok or three headed evil dragon or whatever it's called, it's a sick looking boss that I can't wait to fight. Also the weapon that Link is using looks so other worldly. It's got the shape of a wing and its probably ice related. I wonder what enemy Link got it from but it does remind me of Naydra so maybe it's a dragon part? Nintendo really popped off with the Fuse ability.

So Ganondorf is most likely what this mural figure represent but look at the Hylian (i think it's a hylian, could be a Zonai) beneath him. I think the figure with its hand raised represents either Link or the person who owned the ancient hand and sealed Ganondorf.

It's a bit hard to see but see these four warriors? I think they might represent the four champions since these guys are the only warrior figures in the middle of the horde of monsters. The warriors that aren't yet in the midst of monsters must represent the other NPCs, the citizens of Hyrule that are also fighting back. I think the mural is neat and I wonder where we might see it in the game.

Lastly, Zelda holding the Master Sword and saying "You must find me Link." The first time I watched the trailer I went "Zelda?? If Link has to find you then where the heck are you??" And that's where time travel to the past is looking like a more and more likely theory. The only other theory I have involves realms/alternate worlds since A Link Between worlds exists and so do the Twilight and Silent Realms. But again, I think we'll just have to wait and see what the game has in store.

Thank you for coming to the end of this analysis with me. I'm ecstatic to have my questions answered on May 12, 2023.

Edit: It has been brought to my attention that Riju does in fact have a visible tear and I even posted a picture where it is visible. Guess my brain was so focused on how badass she looked while duel wielding swords that I missed it. Welp that's three for three tears so I'm expecting Yunobu to have one.

[powdermelonkeg]

Alright so ive been thinking about it (probably far too much) and want a second opinion.

Tears of the Kingdom and Baldurs Gate 3 were the same price.

TotK gave me a total of like. I think it was 160 hours to 100% completion (koroks ignored) in my case. And then i set it down and have had no urge to touch it again.

I'm about 120 hours into BG3 now. I have not completed my first playthrough, and I expect Ive still got some 30 hours left of it. I DO intend to play through it again, and I know that there are countless things left for me to do in it still.

And like. I ENJOYED TotK. It was a blast. But looking at BG3 now, complete with its 3 stage city map, like five other maps too, full voice acting, complex storyline, multiple endings, replayability, etc.

It has me realizing that TotK reused its old map. The only major addition was a procedurally generated single-biome underworld and a couple of floating islands (several of which were copy pasted around the map). Most of its gameplay was already built on the previous game.

So the thought I keep coming back to then is that TotK was fine. It was fun. But if BG3 is a 70 dollar game, then TotK has no good reason to be any more than $40.

But I think youre more into both games than I have been, so I wanna know your thoughts.

Sat on this for a little bit and...yeah. $40 is a good price for it.

Like, I'm not too mad about the map thing. BG3 was in production since BotW came out, while TotK started in 2019 and has to deal with a physics environment. I know what I'm getting into with a Nintendo game when I buy one, I know the level of writing and effort (and railroading) to expect. But the price thing has been a thorn in my side that I've ignored for...awhile.

I do think BG3 deserved another year to cook. Maybe two. I'm extremely GLAD it came out when it did, because I found it when I did, but the third act, for all its complexity, has a lot of loose ends that need tying together. Which, I also am not mad about. When you've had Pokemon-level writing for most of your life, and you connect dots in Zelda, literally any snippet of BG3 writing feels incredible. Even the worst bits of Baldur's Gate are so rich in comparison to the Nintendo games I play. But I DO think that they rushed themselves, and they definitely did it so as to not compete with Starfield.

Which is like...I've spent a decade evaluating whole wheat bread, and you've put a massive chocolate cake in front of me. I'm not going to care that the icing on the third tier isn't as fancy as the first two. I am kind of going to lament that the baker had to rush it out the door, though.

Also BG3 replayability >>>>>>>>> TotK replayability. Like, it's past Skyrim levels. I love games where my choices matter and aren't retconned.

[curseofpower]

Finally I'm doing it. It's been over 3 months since I nearly 100% ToTK and studied every landscape on my stupid hoverbike. But here it finally is.

My big ass ToTK post.

After I completed the game, my mind was going wild with theories and possibilities about what happened to Ganondorf.

I could not and still do not believe he was 'born evil'. I think something happened to him, and it happened right around the same time Zelda showed up so we never got to see who he really was. Not entirely, anyway. I believe the evil Rauru sensed was the ancient evil spoken of in the shrines (because why else would he be so familiar with the feeling of it?) and what do we know about the ancient evil? It existed before Ganondorf. Possibly long before, because there were old looking shrines connected to lightroots in cutscenes from the ancient past before Ganondorf became the evil's source.

I believe the ancient evil is something that came from the depths. It was unleashed by the ancient Zonai due to their excessive mining. I believe they created the lightroots and shrines above to try to control it, but when they couldn't, they simply left.

Because they knew the world was doomed.

As for why the evil would have ended up with Ganondorf and not some other powerful leader? Well, before the Zonai disappeared, they must have closed up all the holes they'd used to get to the depths in an attempt to bury the problem before leaving.

All except one.

The one in the Gerudo desert which is in an area that had once clearly been inhabited, before we knew there would even be depths in the world (botw). The damn thing even is a massive plot point in both games due to the Yiga clan. It's not subtle. It's there.

So here's where the evidence ends (mostly) and the story formed in my mind. I'll be posting snippets from something me and my partner co-wrote based on my idea.

While my original plan had Ganondorf fighting the demon alone and losing (becoming possessed) only to come back home alive and be hailed a hero for his apparent 'victory', our story has Link going into the past to make sure that failure doesn't happen, and he has the souped up master sword to do it with.

---

The lightroots began to go out with no one to care for them. The ancient evil, no longer contained, started to seep forth. This thing I call a demon, was too weak to break forth immediately due to being indisposed for so long, so it began to attack the closest civilization to it.

This started with a plague.

The demon was angry. It's entire being is hatred and greed personified. It wanted to lash out just as much as it wanted a host in a position of power so that it may more easily inflict eternal suffering on the world above. Ganondorf and the Gerudo were prime targets in all regards, as back then, they were very well off and well established.

So here's where Link arrives at the kingdom. Still Ganon's pov.

As you can see, I didn't go with the popular idea that Ganondorf's Second and Third are Koume and Kotake. I made a couple OCs instead out of those two in the cutscene. Sorry. Neither are Nabooru either because uh this isn't OoT as much as it wishes it was. lol

Anyway, Link's POV, written by my partner.

Ganon's POV

That's all for now.

This is a slow burn ganlink story alongside... everything else it is. I took massive liberties with Gerudo culture based on what I know from other games later on in the story, and also played much more on the fact Ganondorf is a sorcerer than the game did. I took away what I could, however, making him adept at creating illusions mostly.

Also I'd like to say the way Link gets to the past is much different than what happened to Zelda. It's a doozy, but since my cowriter came up with it I'll let them decide when I can reveal that.

But anyways this post has gone on long enough. Let me know what you guys think, if you want!

[creativesplat]

💘, 🐳, ⛩️, 🙊?

💘, 🐳, ⛩️, 🙊

💘 MIPHLINK!!! Do I have to say it? Absolutely 110% Miphlink. Honestly they are a pairing that I love more than all the other ships I have ever shipped, and I come back to them whenever other hyper fixations fizzle out or I want something comforting. I love them both so much. AoC is one of my favourite zelda games for that reason. (BoTW too, but the tragic lovers vibe is so sad)

Skyward Sword Zelink, a little bit, I wasn’t head over heals for them, but SS Zelda reminded me a fair bit of Mipha (if Mipha had been brought up in a less dangerous time and with less royal duties they would have probably been more similar), so that was that! 

I really wish I shipped Revali with someone, because I love the birb because he is stupid and fun to draw, initially I was a pining Miphvali shipper, but like, I wasn’t a massive fan of that, so maybe ZelVali? Some people ship that, and I’ve got to say the Revali and Zelda talking scene is one of my favourite cutscenes in BoTW, not to mention Zelda’s dialogue to Revali; If not romantic, definitely platonic. 

Teba and Saki are the adorable birb parents so I quite like their couple dynamic? Im not really the biggest shipper outside of Miphlink tbh.  

🐳

I honestly have no idea? Probably a Hylian (boring answer sorry!), but maybe a Rito. I love the decoration styles, and bright colours, and also they live in a cool climate and I do not like hot weather. So maybe a rito. 

⛩️

I think my favourite dungeon would have to be the Ancient Cystern in SS, I just love how beautiful the whole thing is, with all the lotus-y patterns and the pinks and turquoises and the flowers and stuff. ITs just so dang beautiful!! I also really loved the Sandship Dungeon. I think in terms of play through that was my favourite from start to finish. Location is SO much harder. Aesthetically Satori Mountain, and Rito village, story-wise and where I spend my most time in BoTW Zora’s domain, I also Love the Zora’s domain and Rito Village music. Also sweet cozy little skyloft is so nice and permanent and homely. The great plateau is so nostalgic and I love that too… AAA I don’t think I can pick! In AoC it has to be Scero’s Supplies, I know you can’t really go there, but the merging of Zora and Hateno architecture is just so beautiful and I LOVE IT SO MUCH! 

🙊

Ohhh… Unpopular Zelda opinions… I have quite a few of those. Ok. Here we go. 

ToTK is AWUFUL. Hot dang it is the worst thing ever. It wasn’t even the story that made me stop playing. It was one line from an NPC in Rito Village. Molli wants to make elemental arrows, and has an idea for arrow inventions, that can freeze enemies! No way that’s so cool, except… that is literally one of the main things in the last game. You can buy elemental arrows from the shops. Like what the heck? At least explain to me why a very common commodity that EVERYONE but Particularly the people who’s job it is to look after Bows (Harth and Moli) know about and have access to is somethign they want to invent now. I hate is. I hate it. I hate it. I hate it. I ha- anyway. I despise whatever Lazy idiot decided that was the way to go. Who cares about lore? Not us apparently. I also have a massive problem with the imperialist mass-destruction weapon wearing zonai as well. And as a historian I just love BoTW so much better than ToTK. It treats its history with respect, and nuance, and good golly thats not how ruins from 10,000 years ago would work and o my word stop suspending my disbelief!?! 

Anyway. I could rant for far longer about far more things, but I’ll leave it at that. 

Way more unpopular, and Zelink shippers please ignore this: I think BoTW Zelink is creepy. The power dynamic is insanely bad (princess and her servant who literally cannot disobey her father), and the age gap is also awful (16 turned 17 for one day and “20 something” from the BoTW art book). 

Also, the women deserve better from that fandom. But that’s not news.

Thank you so much for the ask Stars!