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firelxdykatara · 3 years

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I’m just really confused as to where this idea that Zuko is gaycoded came from. Like people are allowed to have that headcanon but I don’t understand where people are coming from when they try and claim that he was undisputedly gaycoded and trying to deny it is homophobic when he’s only ever shown romantic interest in women.

I made a pretty long post on the topic a while back, but the ultimate gist of it is this: there are a lot of elements of Zuko's status as an abuse victim and trauma survivor that resonate with queer folks. This is understandable and completely fine! However, there are some parts of the fandom who have taken that to the other extreme and will now insist that those elements are uniquely queer, and that they can only be read as some sort of veiled gay/coming out narrative, even though that doesn't make much sense since there is no part of Zuko's narrative which is unique to any sort of queer experience.

I think the problem really does stem from two things being conflated--Zuko's history of abuse and trauma, and trauma&abuse being something a lot of queer people have experienced. I suspect it goes something like 'I see a lot of myself in Zuko, and I was abused for being gay, therefore Zuko must be gay too in order to have had similar experiences.' This can then lead to feeling dismissed or invalidated when other people point out that those experiences are not unique to being queer--but on the flip side, abuse victims and trauma survivors whose abuse&trauma do not stem from queerness (even if they are queer themselves) can feel invalidated and dismissed by the implication that their trauma must be connected to their queerness or it isn't valid.

This is also where the 'people don't actually know what gay coded means' part comes in, and I realize now that I didn't actually get into what gay coding (and queer coding in general) actually means, since I was so hung up on pointing out how Zuko doesn't really fit the mold. (And the few elements that exist which could be said to count are because of the 'villains historically get queer coded bc Hays Code era' thing and mostly occur in Book 1, not because of how he acts as an abuse&trauma survivor.)

Under a cut because I kind of go on a tangent about gay/queer coding, but I swear I get back to the point eventually.

Queer coding (and it is notable that, with respect to Zuko, it is almost always framed as 'he couldn't possibly be attracted to girls', rather than 'he could be attracted to boys as well as girls' in these discussions, for... no real discernible reason, but I'll get into that in a bit) is the practice of giving characters 'stereotypically queer' traits and characteristics to 'slide them under the radar' in an era where having explicitly queer characters on screen was not allowed, unless they were evil or otherwise narratively punished for their queerness. (See: the extant history of villains being queer-coded, because if they were Evil then it was ok to make them 'look gay', since the story wasn't going to be rewarding their queerness and making audiences think it was in any way OK.) This is thanks to the Motion Picture Production Code (colloquially and more popularly known as the Hays Code), which was a set of guidelines which movies coming out of any major studio had to adhere to in order to be slated for public release and lasted from the early 1930s until it was finally abandoned in the late 60s.

The Hays Code essentially existed to ensure that the content of major motion pictures would not 'lower the moral standards' of the viewing public. It didn't just have to do with queerness--cursing was heavily monitored, sex outside of marriage was not allowed to be seen as desirable or tittilating, miscegenation was not allowed (most specifically interracial relationships between black and white people), criminals had to be punished lest the audience think that it was ok to be gay and do crime, etc. Since same-sex relations fell under 'sexual perversion', they could not be shown unless the 'perversion' were punished in some way. (This is also the origin of the Bury Your Gays trope, another term that is widely misunderstood and misapplied today.) To get around this, queer coding became the practice by which movies and television could depict queer people but not really, and it also became customary to give villains this coding even more overtly, since they would get punished by the end of the film or series anyway and there was nothing to lose by making them flamboyant and racy/overly sexual/promiscuous.

Over time, this practice of making villains flamboyant, sexually aggressive, &etc became somewhat separated from its origins in queer coding, by which I mean that these traits and tropes became the go-to for villains even when the creator had no real intention of making them seem queer. This is how you generally get unintentional queer-coding--because these traits that have been given to villains for decades have roots in coding, but people tend to go right to them when it comes to creating their villains without considering where they came from.

Even after the Hays Code was abandoned, the sentiments and practices remained. Having queer characters who weren't punished by the narrative for being queer was exceptionally rare, and it really isn't until the last fifteen or so years that we've seen any pushback against that. Buffy the Vampire Slayer is famous for being one of the first shows on primetime television to feature an explicitly gay relationship on-screen, and that relationship ended in one of the most painful instances of Bury Your Gays that I have ever personally witnessed. (Something that, fourteen years later, The 100 would visually and textually reference with Lexa's death. Getting hit by a bullet intended for someone else after a night of finally getting to be happy and have sex with her s/o? It wasn't remotely subtle. I don't even like Clexa, but that was incredibly rough to witness.)

However, bringing this back to Zuko, he really doesn't fit the criteria for queer coding for a number of reasons. First of all, no one behind the scenes (mostly a bunch of cishet men) was at all intending to include queer rep in the show. This wasn't a case where they were like 'well, we really wanted to make Zuko gay, but we couldn't get that past the censors, so here are a few winks and a nudge', because it just wasn't on their radar at all. Which makes sense--it wasn't on most radars in that era of children's programming. This isn't really an indictment, it's just a fact of the time--in the mid/late 00s, no one was really thinking about putting queer characters in children's cartoons. People were barely beginning to include them in more teen- and adult-oriented television and movies. It just wasn't something that a couple of straight men, who were creating a fantasy series aimed at young kids, were going to think about.

What few instances you can point to from the series where Zuko might be considered to exhibit coding largely happen in Book 1, when he was a villain, because the writers were drawing from typically villainous traits that had historically come from queer coding villains and had since passed into common usage as villainous traits. But they weren't done with any intention of making it seem like Zuko might be attracted to boys.

And, again, what people actually point to as 'evidence' of Zuko being queer-coded--his awkwardness on his date with Jin and his confrontation with Ozai being the big ones I can think of off the top of my head--are actually just... traits that come from his history of trauma and abuse.

As I said in that old post:

making [zuko’s confrontation of ozai] about zuko being gay and rejecting ozai’s homophobia, rather than zuko learning fundamental truths about the world and about his home and about how there was something deeply wrong with his nation that needed to be fixed in order for the world to heal (and, no, ‘homophobia’ is not the answer to ‘what is wrong with the fire nation’, i’m still fucking pissed at bryke about that), misses the entire point of his character arc. this is the culmination of zuko realizing that he should never have had to earn his father’s love, because that should have been unconditional from the start. this is zuko realizing that he was not at fault for his father’s abuse--that speaking out of turn in a war meeting in no way justified fighting a duel with a child.

is that first realization (that a parent’s love should be unconditional, and if it isn’t, then that is the parent’s fault and not the child’s) something that queer kids in homophobic households/families can relate to? of course it is. but it’s also something that every other abused kid, straight kids and even queer kids who were abused for other reasons before they even knew they were anything other than cishet, can relate to as well. in that respect, it is not a uniquely queer experience, nor is it a uniquely queer story, and zuko not being attracted to girls (which is what a lot of it seems to boil down to, at the end of the day--cutting down zuko’s potential ships so that only zukka and a few far more niche ships are left standing) is not necessary to his character arc. nor does it particularly make sense.

And, regarding his date with Jin:

(and before anyone brings up his date with jin--a) he enjoyed it when she kissed him, and b) he was a traumatized, abused child going out on a first date. of course he was fucking awkward. have you ever met a teenage boy????)

Zuko is socially awkward and maladjusted because he was abused by his father as a child and has trouble relating to people as a result. He was heavily traumatized and brutally physically injured as a teenager, and it took him years to begin to truly recover from the scars that left on his psyche (and it's highly likely, despite the strides he made in canon, that he has a long way to go, post series; it's such a pity that we never got any continuation comics >.>). He was not abused for being gay or queer--he was abused because his father believed he was weak, and part of Zuko's journey was realizing that his father's perception of strength was flawed at its core. That his entire nation had rotted from the inside out, and the regime needed to be changed in order for the world--including his people--to begin to heal.

That could be commingled with a coming out narrative, which is completely fine for headcanons (although I personally prefer not to, because, again, we have more than enough queer trauma already), but it simply doesn't exist in canon. Zuko was not abused or traumatized for being queer, and his confrontation with Ozai was not about him coming out or realizing any fundamental truth about himself--it was about realizing something fundamental about his father and his nation, and making the choice to leave them behind so that he could help the Avatar grow stronger and force things to change when he got back.

TL;DR: at the end of the day, none of the traits, scenes, or behavior Zuko exhibits which shippers tend to use to claim he was gay-coded are actually evidence of coding--they aren't uniquely queer experiences, as they stem from abuse that was not related in any way to his sexuality, and they are experiences that any kid who suffered similar abuse or trauma could recognize and resonate with. (Including straight kids, and queer kids who were abused for any reason other than their identity.) And, finally, Zuko can be queer without erasing or invalidating his canon attraction to girls, and it's endlessly frustrating that the 'Zuko is gay-coded' crowd refuses to acknowledge that.

#atla #zuko #on queer coding #atla fandom salt #salt for ts #asked #mudbend

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dwellordream · 3 years

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“...On June 26, ad 4, Augustus adopted Tiberius. Livia’s son, forty-four years old, now became officially the son of her second husband. Henceforth he is called Tiberius Julius Caesar and is clearly the man designated to succeed the emperor. As he had in the past, Augustus made provision for the possibility that Tiberius might not necessarily survive him. Agrippa Postumus had not given any evidence of being temperamentally suited for high office, but Augustus perhaps hoped that in the general way of things an unruly youth could mature into a responsible adult. Hence the emperor adopted Postumus on the same occasion.

Moreover, Tiberius was obliged, before his own adoption, to adopt his nephew Germanicus, who would thereby become Tiberius’ son and would legally have the same relationship to Tiberius as his natural son, Drusus. The marriage of Germanicus and Agrippina followed soon after, probably in the next year. There is no reason why the unconcealed manoeuvring on behalf of Germanicus should have upset Livia unnecessarily, despite the clear implications of Tacitus that it did. Germanicus, after all, was her grandson as much as was Drusus Caesar. The arrangement reinforced rather than weakened the likelihood of succession from her own line, as was to be demonstrated by events.

The marriage would prove extremely fruitful. In time Agrippina bore Germanicus nine children, six of whom survived infancy. The first three were sons, great-grandsons of Livia: Nero, the eldest (not to be confused with his nephew Nero, the future emperor); Drusus (to be distinguished from the two more famous men of the same name: Drusus, son of Livia, and Drusus Caesar, son of Tiberius); and Gaius (destined to become emperor, and known more familiarly as Caligula). She also bore three surviving daughters, Drusilla and Livilla, and, most important, the younger Agrippina, mother of Livia’s great-great-grandson, the emperor Nero. The adoption of Tiberius in ad 4 would have been an occasion of joy and satisfaction for Livia, and would have helped to efface any lingering grief that still afflicted her over Drusus’ death.

If we are to believe Velleius, not only Livia but the whole Roman world reacted jubilantly to the new turn of events. Needless to say, his account should be treated with due caution. There was, he claims, something for everyone. Parents felt heartened about the future of their children, husbands felt secure about their wives, even property owners anticipated profits from their investments! Everyone looked forward to an era of peace and good order. A colourful exaggeration, of course, but there probably was considerable relief among Romans that the succession issue seemed at long last to be settled.

…In the immediate aftermath of the adoptions the ancient authors inevitably tend to focus on Tiberius and the campaigns he conducted in Germany and Illyricum, and they virtually ignore Agrippa Postumus, whose name was to be invoked later by sources hostile to Livia. A few details about Postumus emerge. In ad 5 he received the toga of manhood. The occasion was low-key, without any of the special honours granted Gaius and Lucius on the same occasion. It also seems to have been delayed. Postumus would have reached fourteen in ad 3, and under normal circumstances might reasonably have been expected to take the toga in that year. Something seems to be wrong. Augustus had certainly endured his share of problems with the young people in his own family. The pressures facing the younger relatives of any monarch are self evident, given the sense of importance that precedes achievement, to say nothing of the opportunists attracted to the immature and malleable, and prepared to pander to their self-importance.

As Velleius astutely remarks, magnae fortunae comes adest adulatio (sycophancy is the comrade of high position). These pressures must have been particularly intense in the period of the Augustan settlement, when no established standards had yet evolved for the royal children and grandchildren. Gaius and Lucius, the focus of Augustus’ ambitions and hopes, caused him endless grief by their behaviour in public, clearly egged on by their supporters, and on at least one occasion Augustus felt constrained to clip their wings. Gaius’ brave but distinctly foolhardy behaviour during the siege of Artagira is surely symptomatic of the same conceit.

There is no reason to assume that Postumus would have been immune from the pressures that turned the heads of his siblings. Whatever traits of haughtiness Postumus might have displayed in his early youth, they were not serious enough to have entered the record, and the exact nature of his personal and possibly mental problems is far from clear. The ancient sources speak of his brutish and violent behaviour. Some modern scholars have suggested that he might have been mad, but the language used of him seems to denote little more than an unmanageable temperament and antisocial tendencies.

For whatever reasons, eventually Augustus decided to remove him from the scene. The details of this expulsion are obscure. Suetonius provides the clearest statement, recording that Augustus removed Postumus (abdicavit) because of his wild character and sent him to Surrentum (Sorrento). The historian notes that Postumus grew less and less manageable and so was then sent to Planasia, a low-lying desolate island about sixteen kilometres south of Elba. Tacitus has no doubt about where the ultimate responsibility for Augustus’ actions lay. Postumus had committed no crime.

But Livia had so ensnared her elderly husband (senem Augustum) that he was induced to banish him to Planasia. Tacitus’ technique here is patent. The use of the word senem is meant to suggest that Augustus was by now senile, even though the event occurred eight years before his death. Incapable of making his own rational decisions, he would thus be at the mercy of a scheming woman, just as later Agrippina the Younger reputedly ‘‘captivated her uncle’’ Claudius (pellicit patruum). No reason is given for Livia’s supposed manoeuvre—which as usual, according to Tacitus, was conducted behind the scenes—except the standard charge that her hatred of Postumus was motivated by a stepmother’s loathing (novercalibus odiis).

Yet nothing in the rest of Tacitus’ narrative sustains his assertion, and the historian himself admits that the general view of Romans towards the end of Augustus’ reign was that Postumus was totally unsuited for the succession, because of both his youth and his generally insolent behaviour. Moreover, Augustus had made the strength of Tiberius’ position so patently evident that Livia would hardly have considered Postumus a serious candidate. This seems to be confirmed in a remarkable passage of Tacitus which uncharacteristically reports public reservations about a potential role for Germanicus, supposedly Tiberius’ rival.

After reporting the popular view that Postumus could be ruled out, Tacitus says that people grumbled that with the accession of Tiberius they would have to put up with Livia’s impotentia, and would have to obey two adulescentes (Germanicus and Drusus) who would oppress, then tear the state apart. Tacitus concedes that even the prospect of the reasonable Germanicus and Drusus being involved in state matters caused consternation. This surely offers some gauge of how far below the horizon Postumus was to be found. The precise reason for Postumus’ removal to Sorrento, if it was not simply his personality, is not clear. The initial expulsion may have been provoked by nothing more serious than personal tension between him and his adoptive father.

Whatever the initial reason, it soon became apparent that if Augustus had hoped that sending his adopted son out of Rome would solve the problem, he was mistaken. Dio places Postumus’ formal exile to Planasia in ad 7. If, as Suetonius claims, he was sent first to Sorrento, what might have precipitated the change in the location and the more grave status of his banishment? We have some hints in the sources. Dio suggests that one of the reasons for Augustus’ giving Germanicus preference over Postumus was that the latter spent most of his time fishing, and acquired the sobriquet of Neptune.

Now this could point simply to irresponsibility and indolence, but the picture of Postumus as an ancient Izaak Walton serenely casting his line does not fit well with the very strong tradition of someone wild and reckless. His activities may well have had a political dimension. The choice of the nickname Neptune could allude to the naval victories of his father, Marcus Agrippa. The fishing story might well belong to the period after Postumus’ relegation to Sorrento. This could have proved a risky spot to locate Postumus, because it lay just across the bay from the important naval base at Misenum that his father had established in 31 bc. The innocent fishing expeditions might have covered much more sinister activities.

Augustus may well have concluded eventually that Postumus was too dangerous to be left in the benign surroundings of Sorrento. During Postumus’ second, more serious phase of exile, on the island of Planasia, he was placed under a military guard, a good indication that he was considered genuinely dangerous rather than just a source of irritation and embarrassment. This final stage of banishment was a formal one, for Augustus confirmed the punishment by a senatorial decree and spoke in the Senate on the occasion about his adopted son’s depraved character. Formal banishment enacted by a decree of the Senate would be intended to make a serious political statement and should have buried completely any thoughts that Postumus might have been considered a serious candidate in the succession.

We cannot rule out the possibility that Postumus became involved, perhaps as a pawn, in some serious political intrigue, if not to oust Augustus then at the very least to ensure that he would be followed not by a son of Livia but by someone from the line of Julia. If Postumus was being encouraged to think of a possible role in the succession, it might reasonably be asked who was doing the urging. Although there is no explicit statement on the question in the sources, many scholars have accepted the notion that there existed a ‘‘Julian party,’’ responsible for much of the ‘‘anti-Claudian’’ propaganda directed against Livia and Tiberius that is found in Tacitus in particular and possibly derived from the memoirs of Agrippina.

…Whatever the intrigues in Rome, Livia’s son was able to keep himself aloof and to play the role that suited him best, that of soldier. Tiberius conducted a brilliant series of campaigns in Pannonia for which a triumph was voted in ad 9. (This was postponed when Tiberius was despatched to Germany in the aftermath of the disastrous defeat of Quinctilius Varus, in which three legions were lost.) When the Pannonian triumph was voted, Augustus made his intentions crystal clear. Various suggestions were put forward for honorific titles, such as Pannonicus, Invictus, and Pius.

The emperor, however, vetoed them all, declaring that Tiberius would have to be satisfied with the title that he would receive when he himself died. That title, of course, was Augustus. It also appears that a law was later passed to make his imperium equal to that of Augustus throughout the empire, and in early 13 his tribunician power was renewed. His son Drusus Caesar received his first accelerated promotion, designated to proceed directly to the consulship in ad 15, skipping the praetorship that should have preceded this higher office.

The virtual impregnability of Tiberius’ position should be borne in mind in any attempt to understand the final months of Augustus’ life. In the closing chapter of her husband’s principate, Livia reemerges in the record to play a central and, according to one tradition, decidedly sinister role. This is perhaps the most convoluted period of her career, where rumour and reality seem to diverge most widely. To place the events in a comprehensible context, it is necessary to note one later detail out of its chronological sequence. As we shall see, after Augustus’ death there was a rumour reported in some of the sources that Livia had murdered her husband.

In the best forensic tradition, a motive would have to be unearthed to make the charge plausible, especially since sceptics could hardly have failed to notice that Augustus had never enjoyed robust health and was already in his seventy-sixth year. Death from natural causes could hardly be considered remarkable under such circumstances. The requisite motive would indeed be produced, and the kernel of the intricate thesis that evolved is found in a brief summary of Augustus’ career by Pliny the Elder. Among the travails that afflicted the emperor, Pliny lists the abdicatio of Postumus after his adoption, Augustus’ regret after the relegation, the suspicion that a certain Fabius betrayed his secrets, and the intrigues of Livia and Tiberius.

Pliny’s summary observations are clearly based on a more detailed source, which suggested that Augustus felt some remorse about Postumus. This simple and not improbable notion is developed by other sources into a far more complex scenario that creates an apparently plausible motive, because it could be claimed that Livia would have wanted to remove her husband before he could act on his change of heart. This reconstruction of the events is clearly reminiscent of the closing days of the reign of Claudius, when the emperor supposedly sought a rapprochement with his son Britannicus, to the disadvantage of his stepson Nero, and thereby inspired his wife Agrippina to despatch him with the poisoned mushroom.

But it is important to bear in mind that as Pliny reports the events he limits himself to the claim that Augustus regretted Postumus’ exile, without further elaboration, and although Livia and her son supposedly engaged in intrigues of some unspecified nature, Pliny assigns no criminal action to either of them. Pliny’s ‘‘skeleton account’’ is to some degree validated by Plutarch. In his essay on ‘‘Talkativeness,’’ Plutarch, in a very garbled passage, relates that a friend of Augustus named ‘‘Fulvius’’ heard the emperor lamenting the woes that had befallen his house—the deaths of Gaius and Lucius and the exile of ‘‘Postumius’’ on some false charge—which had obliged him to pass on the succession to Tiberius. He now regretted what had happened and intended (bouleuomenos) to recall his surviving grandson from exile.

According to Plutarch’s account, Fulvius passed this information on to his wife, and she in turn passed it on to Livia, who took Augustus to task for his careless talk. The emperor made his displeasure known to Fulvius, and he and his wife in consequence committed suicide. This last detail was perhaps inspired by the famous story of Arria, who achieved immortal fame in ad 42 when she died with her husband Caecina Paetus, who had been implicated in a conspiracy against Claudius. Plutarch’s confused version of events does not inspire confidence, and in any case, although he gives Livia a more specific role than does Pliny, he follows Pliny in not attributing to Augustus any action, only supposed intentions.

Dio’s account is a much contracted one, but derived from a source that has added a very important wrinkle to the story and has Augustus taking action on his change of heart. Dio says that Livia was suspected of Augustus’ death. She was afraid, people say (hos phasi), because Augustus had secretly sailed to Planasia to see Postumus and seemed to be on the brink of seeking a reconciliation. This bald and surely implausible story, involving a round trip of some five hundred kilometres, is given its fullest treatment in Tacitus, clearly drawing on the same source as Dio.

He says that people thought that Livia had brought about Augustus’ final illness, because a rumour entered into circulation that the emperor had gone to Planasia to visit Postumus, accompanied by a small group of intimates, including Paullus Fabius Maximus. Fabius, clearly Plutarch’s ‘‘Fulvius,’’ was a literary figure of some renown, a close friend of Ovid and Horace. He was also an intimate of Augustus, consul in 11 bc, governor of Asia, and legatus in Spain (3–2 bc). He would thus be a plausible participant in this mysterious expedition. Tacitus reports that the tears and signs of affection were enough to raise the hopes of Postumus that there was a prospect of his being recalled. (It is striking that Tacitus is ambiguous about the meeting’s purpose and is too good a historian to bring himself to claim that Augustus had gone there to commit himself to Postumus’ rehabilitation.)

Fabius Maximus supposedly told the story to his wife, Marcia, and she in turn passed it to Livia. The text of the manuscript is corrupt at this point, but Tacitus seems to say that this indiscretion came to the knowledge of Augustus (reading the text as gnarum id Caesari). The subsequent death of Fabius, Tacitus says, may or may not have been suicide (the implication is that Augustus ordered it, as Plutarch suggests). Marcia was heard at the funeral reproaching herself as the cause of her husband’s downfall (this presumably is how the story got out).

After this detailed account Tacitus undercuts his own case when he goes on to say that Augustus died shortly afterwards, utcumque se ea res habuit. The force of this phrase is essentially ‘‘whatever the truth of the matter.’’ It hardly inspires conviction. The story of the adventurous journey to Planasia and the tearful reconciliation has generally been greeted with scepticism by modern scholars. Jameson is an exception. She uses the Arval record to argue that Augustus did take the trip, noting that on May 14 there was a meeting of the brethren for the cooption of Drusus Caesar, the son of Tiberius, into their order. Fabius Maximus and Augustus were absent from the ceremony, and submitted their votes, in favour of the co-option, by absentee ballot. But is there anything remarkable in their absence?

Clearly, the election of Tiberius’ son was not in reality a particularly important occasion, for Tiberius himself failed to attend. Moreover, Syme notes that no fewer than five other arvals were absent from this meeting, and that there could be a host of explanations for Augustus’ absence. Also, if the co-option was seen as an important family event, then it would surely have been the very worst time for Augustus to try to slip away unnoticed. The emperor was by this time in declining health, so weak that he even held audiences in the palace lying on a couch. In ad 12 he was so frail that he stopped his morning receptions for senators and asked their indulgence for his not joining them at public banquets.

Yet we are supposed to assume that he made the arduous journey to Planasia, and that he did so without Livia realizing what he was up to. It is also important to observe that both Tacitus and Dio drew on a source claiming that Augustus was on the verge of making amends with Postumus. An actual reconciliation seems to be ruled out by the later sequence of events. Certainly he did nothing whatsoever on his return to strengthen Postumus’ position or to weaken that of Tiberius. Finally, one might ask whether Augustus could ever have seriously considered recalling Postumus. He had put him under armed guard. There were plots to rescue him. His supporters published damaging letters about the emperor. It all seems implausible. Syme suggests that the details of the journey might have been added soon after Augustus’ death, a ‘‘specimen of that corroborative detail which is all too apparent (and useful) in historical fictions.’’ Syme bases his argument in part on aesthetic considerations. The episode as it appears in Tacitus is introduced in an inartistic fashion and appears to have been grafted on as an afterthought, introducing two names, those of Fabius Maximus and his wife, Marcia, that will not be mentioned again in the Annals. Moreover, neither Pliny nor Plutarch mentions Planasia.

…The plot described by Suetonius might then have been a last desperate effort to rescue her. In any case it seems to have come to nothing. In addition to the supposed political intrigues in the period immediately before Augustus’ death, there was no shortage of signs that the gods, too, were feeling distinctly uneasy, ranging from the usual comets and fires in the sky to more opaque portents, like a madman sitting on the chair dedicated to Julius Caesar and placing a crown on his own head, or an owl hooting on the roof of the Senate house. But Augustus seems to have had no premonition that he had little time left when he set out from Rome in August 14.

At that time Tiberius was obliged to leave the city for further service abroad, and he departed for Illyricum with a mandate to reorganise the province. Livia and Augustus joined him for the first part of the journey. This very public gesture is an affirmation of the emperor’s faith in Tiberius—a very odd signal to send if only a few months earlier he had become reconciled to Postumus and had changed his mind about who would succeed him. The party went as far as Astura, and from there followed the unusual course of taking a ship by night to catch the favourable breeze. On the sea journey Augustus contracted an illness, which began with diarrhoea.

They skirted the coast of Campania, spent four days in Augustus’ villa at Capri to allow him to relax and recuperate, then sailed into the Gulf of Puteoli, where they were given an extravagant welcome from the passengers and crew of a ship that had just sailed in from Alexandria. They passed over to Naples, although Augustus was still weak and his diarrhoea was recurring. He managed to muster up the strength to watch a gymnastic performance. Then they continued their journey. At Beneventum the company broke up. Tiberius headed east. As Augustus began the return journey with Livia from Beneventum, his illness took a turn for the worse. Perhaps he had a sense that his end was near, as he made for an old family estate, in nearby Nola, where his father, Octavius, had died.

Augustus was not to leave Nola alive. His condition quickly grew worse, and on August 19, 14, at the ninth hour, in Suetonius’ precise report, he died. According to Tacitus, as Augustus grew more sick, some people started to suspect (suspectabant) Livia of dirty deeds (scelus). Dio is more specific, but is still cautious about the charge. He notes that Augustus used to gather figs from the tree with his own hands. She, hos phasi (as they say), cunningly smeared some of them with poison, ate the uncontaminated ones herself and offered the special ones to her husband. As can be seen in his handling of other events, Dio does seem to relish rumours of poisoning.

He relates, for instance, that Vespasian died of fever in ad 79, but adds that some said that he was poisoned at a banquet. It was similarly said that Domitian murdered Titus in ad 81, although the written accounts agree that he died of natural causes. In the case of Augustus it may be possible to discern the origins of the rumour. Suetonius confirms that the emperor was fond of green figs from the second harvest (along with hand-made moist cheese, small fish, and coarse bread). Given Livia’s interest in the cultivation of figs (she even had one named after her), she may well have had an orchard at Nola to which she would have given special attention during her stay.

Dio in fact seems to have had little personal faith in the fig rumour, for he goes on to speak of Augustus’ death as ‘‘from this or from some other cause.’’ By its nature the fig story is unprovable yet impossible to refute. It falls in the grand tradition of such deaths, the best-known being the supposed despatch of Claudius by a poisoned mushroom. If Livia murdered Augustus, then her timing was oddly awry, for she had to go to considerable trouble to recall Tiberius, who was by then en route to Illyricum. Why not do the deed when he was still on the scene?

It is perhaps worth bearing in mind that Livia had an interest in curative recipes. It is possible that she would have inflicted one or more of her own concoctions on her husband. In the unlikely event that he was poisoned, alternative medicine might be a more plausible culprit than the murderer’s toxin. From Beneventum, Tiberius headed for the east coast of Italy, where he took a boat to Illyricum. He had barely crossed over to the Dalmatian coast when an urgent letter from his mother caught up with him, recalling him to Nola. There are different versions of what happened next. Tacitus describes Augustus in his final hours holding a heavy conversation with his entourage about the qualifications of potential successors. Dio and Suetonius allow him a lighter agenda.

They recount that he first asked for a mirror, combed his hair and straightened his sagging jaws. Then he invited the friends in. He gave them his final instructions, ending with his famous line of finding Rome a city of clay and leaving it a city of marble. In conclusion, he asked how they would rate his performance in the grand comedy of life. He seems to have taken a high score for granted, because just like a comic actor, he asked them to give him applause for a role well played. (The curious coincidence of the comic actors brought in during Claudius’ last hours should be noted.)

He then dismissed his friends and spoke to some visitors from Rome, asking about the health of Tiberius’ granddaughter Julia, who was ill. The most serious discrepancy arises over the part that Tiberius might have played during the emperor’s final hours. Dio preserves one tradition, which he says he found in most authorities, including the better ones, that the emperor died while his adopted son was still in Dalmatia, and that Livia for political reasons was determined to keep the death secret until he got back. Tacitus reflects a similar tradition, reporting uncertainty about whether Tiberius found Augustus dead or alive when he reached Nola. The house and the adjoining streets had been sealed off by Livia with guards, and optimistic bulletins were issued, until she was ready to release the news at a time dictated by her own needs.

The story is reminiscent of Agrippina’s arrangements after the death of Claudius. She was similarly accused of keeping the death secret and posting guards as Claudius lay dying. The suspicions about Livia do not appear in the other extant accounts. Velleius reports that Tiberius rushed back and arrived earlier than expected, which perked up Augustus for a time. But before too long he began to fail, and died in Tiberius’ arms, asking him to carry on with their joint work.

Suetonius is even more emphatic about Tiberius’ role. He says that Augustus detained Tiberius for a whole day in private conversation, which was the last serious business that he transacted. His final moments were spent with Livia. His mind wandered as he died—he thought that forty men were carrying him away—but at the last instant he kissed his wife, with an affectionate farewell, Livia nostri coniugii memor vive, ac vale (Livia, be mindful of our marriage, and good-bye), then slipped into the quiet death that he had always hoped for.

That Livia might have kept the news of Augustus’ death secret for a time is certainly plausible—there are all sorts of sound reasons why the announcement of a politically sensitive death might be postponed, although the similar delay after Claudius’ death is disturbingly coincidental. She also may well have put pickets around the house, but no sinister connotation need be placed on the action. The final hours of Augustus would doubtless have attracted the concerned and the curious, who in such situations follow a herd instinct to keep crowded vigils. After Agrippina the Younger had been shipwrecked near Baiae in ad 59, crowds of well-wishers streamed up to her house, carrying torches.

The same would surely have happened in Nola, and some sort of control might have become necessary to give the dying emperor some peace. The house certainly became a place of pilgrimage afterwards, and was converted into some sort of shrine. The romantic account of Augustus expiring in Tiberius’ arms may be highly coloured, and Suetonius’ claim that Augustus and Tiberius spent a whole day together sounds exaggerated, given that Augustus’ health was fading so fast.

But it is difficult to see how that whole sequence of events could simply have been invented if it did not have at least a basis of truth. In any case, rumours surrounding the events at Augustus’ deathbed were totally eclipsed by dramatic developments across the water. As an immediate consequence of the emperor’s death, Postumus also lost his life: primum facinus novi principatus fuit Postumi Agrippae caedes (the first misdeed of the new principate was the slaying of Agrippa Postumus), as Tacitus words it.

The events of this first and possibly murkiest episode of Tiberius’ reign have been much debated, and it is probably now impossible to disentangle fact from rumour and innuendo, since there is considerable ambiguity in the ancient accounts of the incident. The general outline of the events is not particularly controversial. The officer commanding the guard at Planasia executed Postumus after he had received written instructions (codicilli) to carry out the deed. Postumus had no weapons other than his powerful physique, and he put up a valiant but ultimately futile struggle. A desperate attempt by a loyal slave, Clemens, to save him was frustrated when the would-be rescuer took a slow freight ship to Planasia and arrived too late.

After the execution, the officer then reported to Tiberius, presumably still at Nola, that the action had been carried out. He did so, as Tacitus describes it, ut mos militiae (in the military manner), presumably in the sense of a soldier reporting to his commander that his orders have been discharged. Tiberius denied vehemently that he had given any such orders. According to Tacitus, he claimed that Augustus had sent the order, to be put into force immediately after his death, and insisted that the officer would have to give an account to the Senate. Tacitus at this point adds a new wrinkle to the story, and gives a role to a figure not mentioned in any of the other sources in the context of this incident.

The codicilli, he claims, had been sent to the tribune by Augustus’ confidant Sallustius Crispus. This man was the great-nephew and adopted son of the historian Sallust. Although his family connections had opened up the opportunities for a brilliant senatorial career, Sallustius chose to fashion himself after Maecenas and seek real influence rather than the empty prominence of the Senate. He rose to the top through his energy and determination, which he managed to conceal from his contemporaries by pretending a casual or even apathetic attitude to life.

He acquired considerable wealth, owning property in Rome, and among other landed estates he could list a copper mine in the Alps producing high-grade ore. More importantly, at least until his later years, he had the ear of both Augustus and Tiberius, as a man who bore the imperatorum secreta (secrets of the emperors). When Sallustius learned that Tiberius wanted the whole matter brought before the Senate, he grew alarmed, afraid that he personally could end up being charged. He interceded with Livia, alerting her to the danger of making public the arcana domus (the inner secrets of the house), with all that would entail—details of the advice of friends, or of the special services carried out by the soldiers—and urged her to curb her son. Beyond this general framework the details are highly obscure, and, it seems, totally speculative.

Tacitus says that Tiberius avoided raising the issue of Postumus’ death in the Senate, and Suetonius observes that he simply let the matter fade away. There would thus have been no official source of information. Yet fairly detailed narratives have been passed down, which could have come only from eyewitness accounts. In particular one has to wonder how the supposed secret dealings between Livia and Sallustius could ever have become known. This uncertainty over the source and reliability of the information clearly makes it impossible to determine who was ultimately responsible for Postumus’ death.

Suetonius summarises the problem nicely. He states that it was not known whether Augustus had left the written instructions, on the verge of his own death, to ensure a smooth succession, or whether Livia had dictated them (dictasset) in the name of Augustus, and, if the latter, whether Tiberius had known about them. Dio categorically insists that Tiberius was directly responsible but says that he encouraged the speculation, so that some blamed Augustus, some Livia, and some even said that the centurion had acted on his own initiative.

Tacitus found Tiberius’ claim that Augustus had left instructions for the execution hard to believe, and describes this defence as a posture (simulabat), suggesting that the more likely scenario was that Tiberius and Livia hastily brought about the death, Tiberius driven by fear and she by novercalibus odiis (stepmotherly hatred). Velleius may have been aware of these speculations, for he is very cagey about Postumus’ death. He insists that ‘‘he suffered an ultimate fate’’ (habuit exitum) in a way that was appropriate to his ‘‘madness’’ ( furor). Velleius may well have been deliberately ambiguous to avoid becoming enmeshed in a contentious and sensitive issue that might reflect badly on Tiberius.

Scholars have generally been inclined to exonerate Livia, and only Gardthausen has held that Livia was totally responsible, without even Tiberius’ complicity. Syme accuses Tacitus of supporting an imputation against Livia ‘‘which he surely knew to be false.’’ The implication of Livia has been challenged by Charlesworth in particular. He sees it as emanating from the same tradition that had her poisoning Augustus. Certainly Pliny’s brief summary imputes no criminal action against her. She seems on principle to have refrained from taking independent executive action. (The picket she set up around Augustus’ house would be the only known counterexample.)

At most, it is possible that she knew of such an order, but it seems highly unlikely that she initiated it. Even if a meeting did actually take place between Sallustius and Livia, as Tacitus alleges, this need not mean that anything sinister had necessarily been underfoot. Sallustius may have wished simply to appeal to the wisdom and experience of Livia to counter the political naïveté of a son who had spent his career on military campaigns and had not yet become adept in the complexities of political intrigue. The suppression of information about the activities of the soldiers could just as easily have been meant to refer to Augustus’ instructions as to Livia’s, in a system where secrecy for the sake of secrecy was considered a vital element in the fabric of efficient government.

If Livia had somehow been involved with Sallustius in carrying out Augustus’ instructions, there would have had to be secret and dangerous communication between Rome and Nola, unless Sallustius was also with Augustus at the end (and Tacitus would surely have mentioned his presence). Tiberius seems largely exonerated by his own conduct. If he had been guilty, he would hardly have wanted an investigation by the Senate, and could simply have claimed that the execution was carried out on Augustus’ orders or even have reported officially that Postumus had died from natural causes. We can surely eliminate Dio’s barely tenable suggestion that the guard might have executed Postumus on its own initiative, and the hardly more convincing notion that Sallustius Crispus similarly might have acted on his own initiative.

On balance, the most plausible suspect is Augustus, although plausibility is far different from conviction. Augustus might well have issued standing orders to the tribune to execute Postumus the moment news of his own death arrived. Sallustius could well have sent the announcement of the emperor’s death in Tiberius’ name (with or without his knowledge), which could account for the centurion’s coming to Rome to make a report to Tiberius.

When he needed to, Augustus could behave quite ruthlessly against those who threatened him. He put to death Caesarion, the supposed son of Julius Caesar and Cleopatra, for purely political motives. He also could be harsh towards his own family. He swore that he would never recall the elder Julia from exile, refused to recognise the child of the younger Julia, and would not allow either Julia burial in his mausoleum. It was he who had set the armed guard over Postumus. Moreover, Augustus did make meticulous preparations for his own death.

He left behind three or four libelli, with instructions for his funeral, the text of the Res Gestae, a summary of the Roman troops, fleets, provinces, client-kingdoms, direct and indirect taxes—including those in arrears— the funds in the public and in the imperial treasuries, and the imperial accounts. There was also a book of instructions for Tiberius, the Senate, and the people. Augustus went into considerable detail, with such particulars as the number of slaves it would be wise to free and the number of new citizens who should be enrolled.

He was clearly a man determined not to leave any issues hanging in the balance, and the future of Postumus would have been an issue of prime importance. Postumus’ death was the final blow for Julia the Elder. From this point on, she simply gave up and went into a slow decline, her despair aggravated by her destitution. She received no help from Tiberius, although he had earlier tried to win leniency for her from her father.

According to Suetonius, Tiberius, once emperor, deprived her of her allowance, using the heartless argument that Augustus had not provided for it in his will. As we have seen, Livia might well have helped the exiled Julia at one point by giving her one of her slaves, and she certainly helped Julia’s daughter when she was sent away from Rome. But she does not seem to have tried to intercede on this occasion. Julia died in late ad 14 from weakness and malnutrition. The new reign had got off to a bloody start.”

- Anthony A. Barrett, “The Public Figure.” in Livia: First Lady of Imperial Rome

#livia drusilla #postumus #octavian #tiberius #roman #ancient #history #anthony a. barrett #livia first lady of imperial rome

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tendercoretroglodyke · 3 years

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... I’m interested in legitimately gay Reese (I assume one piece of evidence is “look at what they’re doing and tell me you’re not gay”)

okay this is like 2 days late but this is why reese malcolminthemiddle is legitimately gay:

(side note: did anyone need a queer media thesis paper or something... I am willing to share lmao)

so none of this is like... rock solid evidence or anything but I need to believe at least one main character of a show is gay and/or trans to maintain interest and reese is the most plausible gay character. also it’s early 2000′s so he just gets a lot of vaguely homophobic jokes lmao

first of all, yes, the biggest piece of evidence he’s gay is those lines from that episode I quoted the other day--thinking malcolm is gay, he tries to show his support by giving him a gay porno: “’Naught Pool Boys 3!’ I watched 10 or 12 of these, and this one seems to have the most stuff you guys like.” and when malcolm says he isn’t gay, reese responds “Malcolm. Check out what those guys are doing in that movie, and THEN tell me you’re not gay.”-- so, 1) reese sat down and watched like a dozen gay porn movies to ““find a good one for his gay brother”” and 2) he thinks malcolm would reconsider his heterosexuality if he watched what was in that movie, implying that HE reconsidered his sexuality after watching that movie, or at the very least found it hot

in the same episode, the character tricking malcolm into thinking reese is gay lists the following as evidence: he obsesses over his hair and his looks, loves his gourmet cooking, has a bunch of magazines covered in comically muscular men, and that he’s angry and acts like a jerk because he’s “dealing with something weird and confusing.” now obviously, the obsession with hair/looks can be chalked up to the fact that he’s a teenage boy, and there’s nothing inherently gay about enjoying cooking. the dozen magazines of muscle-bound men could certainly be taken as gay evidence, though, and it IS established in the show that his entire bully persona is his way of masking his inner feelings and insecurities. there’s literally a whole episode where he & malcolm realize they have no friends because they act like little shits to push people away because they’re afraid of rejection and/or abandonment from their peers. they ostracize themselves before they can be ostracized by the other students at school. I could probably write a whole other essay on reese’s psyche tbqh lmao there’s a shocking amount there!!

of the brothers who are actually old enough to be attracted to girls (reese, malcolm, and francis), he shows the least interest. now bear with me here. you might be thinking, “well, yeah, it’s malcolm’s show, we’re not gonna see things from other people’s perspective!” but that is actually surprisingly untrue, the show is very much equally shown from each family members’ perspectives. starting about s2, when malcolm is in early middle school, he starts getting crushes on girls and pursuing them. francis goes after a few women in the first couple seasons and then marries a woman we see a lot throughout the show.

in the roughly... 130?? episodes I have watched so far, nearly all of reese’s “interest” in girls involve either: competition with malcolm, genuinely just liking her as a friend, or some completely ulterior motive. the only exception to this I can think of is in the early seasons where he has a crush on a cheerleader and tries to get on her good side by joining the cheerleading squad, which the writers clearly set up as a way to make gay jokes about reese. let me give you a few examples of his relationships with girls

the first relationship we see him in is with a “stupid girl” that malcolm tried (and failed) to date, and the main reason they get together is that they think on the same wavelength and genuinely seem to enjoy hanging out. they take breaks from their bro chats to make out every once in a while. eventually he gets her to break up with him because he doesn’t want to go to the school dance with her (he doesn’t want to go at all). years later, he’s dating some girl we meet for like 5 minutes, before he goes to confess to her that she’s the first girl he’s ever loved. she then breaks up with him. he’s sad, but taking it fairly well. he’s about to leave when he sees malcolm hiding under the bed, and learns that he stole his girlfriend. he then runs away to join the army. he was clearly MUCH more upset that his brother stole his girlfriend than he was that his girlfriend broke up with him. there are many more instances of him and malcolm competing for a girl’s affections, and he seems mostly motivated by the competition itself.

in addition to “stupid girl,” he also manufactures an “attraction” to his female army buddy in the last season. the premise of this episode is that his old army buddy (a girl he play-wrestles with and insults like he would his own brothers) comes to visit him, and malcolm convinces reese that she’s attracted to him, and that reese’s nervousness at learning that fact is proof he’s in love with her. there’s a misunderstanding where reese asks her if she has certain “feelings” and she says she does, but what she ACTUALLY means is that she has a crush on reese’s MOM. she’s a lesbian. reese later propositions her (saying he’s saved his virginity for this--he’s probably about 18 here), and when she says omg no im gay, he is HUGELY relieved they can go back to being friends. CLASSIC mlm/wlw friendship moment.

there’s an episode where these cute girls pick up reese (& nerds) to kiss in front of their boyfriends to make them jealous. reese is all for it, and when malcolm argues that it’s not worth his dignity and the beating he’ll get from the girl’s boyfriend, reese counters that that’s WHY he wants to do this--he’s completely invisible at school, and thinks getting beaten up for kissing some guy’s girlfriend will at least make him known around school. at no point does he indicate he’s actually attracted to this girl, and when it comes time to kiss her, he finds the weakest excuse to run away at the last minute.

im not gonna list all of these but there’s more lmao

the following is a random assortment of one-off gay jokes and out-of-context lines with gay reese implications, often homophobically bc its early 2000′s writing:

says “I’m gay” to a girl to give malcolm a better shot at her

(again in competition with malcolm) tries to flirt with a girl by spraying milk in her face as the punchline to a joke, which is. well. hm. self-sabotaging, to say the least!!

Reese: “Do you think it’s right to totally change who you are and turn your back on EVERYTHING you believe in, just to impress a hot guy??” [his dad gives a long, blank stare, before asking:] “...Burt Reynolds hot, or Sting hot?”

“YEAH I like clouds! I call them sky kittens :)” (I just think that one’s sweet!)

“Look, Christie, here’s the thing. When I first met you, I was just messing around. But we’ve gotten so close that, now... I really like you! I can’t keep this up anymore. I’m not the person you think I am. I’ve been pretending since the day I met you. It’s so hard having to constantly cover my tracks to keep my story straight... and I don’t WANT to anymore! I’m tired of living this lie! I’m done with it. I’m sorry.”

he catfishes some guy to blackmail him, but is implied to continue the flirtation even after the catfishing/blackmail is revealed

reese is, technically, married to a man. this particular plot point is played as a joke and manages to be both racist and homophobic, so I won’t go into it. but I believe he is still married to that man. technically.

reese takes care of a huge box full of caterpillars until they pupate and become beautiful butterflies. I feel like there’s some kind of gay coming out metaphor here somewhere.

I think there are a couple other times where he comments on a guy’s attractiveness but I couldn’t find specific instances.

In conclusion: Reese is a deeply repressed gay kid who was socialized SO thoroughly as an early 2000′s straight boy that, despite his attraction for men and his obvious compulsory heterosexuality, he still cannot admit to himself that he is gay even as he enters adulthood. Furthermore, his subconscious frustration about this fact is turned outward to form the “schoolyard bully” costume he uses to mask his insecurities and keep others from getting too close to him.

Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk. I could be convinced to come back for another talk about how Dewey is trans or about how each and every member of that family is neurodivergent in entirely different ways. Assuming anyone has read this far in the first place!!

#sorry this was so long lmao I legit spent 2 hours on this #I have 2 modes: not doing the thing and overdoing the thing #hey anon if you actually see this I'd appreciate a quick message saying so lmao I'd hate to write all this only for you to miss it #I'll probably rb sometime tomorrow at least #also liz if you're reading this i was GONNA add a bit about francis' gay potential like you mentioned but I ran out of steam so remind me t #i think reese has the most gay potential tho #mitm #malcolm in the middle #anonymous #Anonymous

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antiloreolympus · 3 years

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7 Anti LO Asks

1. tbh the fact rachel purposely didnt let persephone have any romantic relationships before hades gives the impression that had persephone had any other experience, she'd see right through him and not want him because she had better. not having any other point of reference isnt good. its setting up that hades can get away with whatever he wants because she doesnt know anything else. thats really not a healthy dynamic to have even while dating, much less eternal marriage.

2. You know what’s weird? How Hades is a 2000+ year old being and still has not gone through his trauma. We know that he was eaten by Kronos when he was around 8 and stayed there for like 13 years if i’m correct (in the LO version), so we can assume that when he got out he was in his early to mid twenties. And then he fought in the war which we don’t know how long it was in LO bc there’s no info on that at all but let’s assume that that lasted 100 years.. he’s still pretty young there. So how is it that he’s only now getting help for his traumas? Which we don’t even see actually, it’s just a sentence said by him when he adopts the little dog. We don’t even know how old he actually is bc it’s always assumed it’s 2000+ but 2000+ years old could mean 2030 years old or 2999 years old or even 3000 and more and he has just lost track of time. All of these years and he still has not processed or made any progress?? At all?! Unless therapists are a new thing in the Underworld but we have Chiron who says that she was a physician in the old world but got tired of it so she decided to study the human mind. And that must have been quite some time ago. So why exactly is Hades a 2000+ broken man who needs to be fixed by a 19 year old going through her own trauma?

3. The underworld being an infertile world doesn’t make sense at all. If we compare the underworld with the underground it’s a fact that where there’s decay if is more fertile. Not to mention that in the myths the underworld is in fact considered a fertile land. We know that the underworld is full of souls, and souls are considered what give life to a body or place, so the underworld being a desert still doesn’t make sense at all.

4.If I may also add, just because LO is a “retelling” doesn’t mean it doesn’t harm Greece or Greek people. They still exist, funnily enough, they didn’t all die once Alexander the Great stop conquering. They’re a country full of strong, passionate people who have gone and are still going through massive problems and hardships. They are also a country who are still, at best, ignored, or at worst, mocked for the suffering they must endure by nations that are far from economic instability and from actual war zones like Greece is. Despite all that, their mythos are seen with great reverence to this day, and they don’t “gatekeep” it, you can ask any Greek in here and they’ll tell you they enjoy stuff like the Disney version or PJO just fine, but you have to stop and wonder why LO is a Greek myth product that is almost universally despised to Greeks who know it exists.

It’s pretty obvious why, RS not only butchers the myths completely to where they don’t even resemble what they once were, but her constantly silencing and badmouthing actual Greeks who want to help her make it more accurate is not a great look. She’s acting as if she, a white woman from an island made of literal England reject descendants, somehow not only knows more about Greek myth than actual Greeks, but that she OWNS the mythology and she can do whatever she wants with it, and only those who agree to her biases know what they’re talking about while everyone else is wrong, so obviously Greeks don’t know Greek mythology! Even media products in the same, non-Greek realm as her get her ire. Case in point, we know she’s hostile to PJO, she badmouths the Disney movie all the time, she complained about Blood of Zeus (emphasize on ZEUS) didn’t revolve around HxP, and despite them being heavily promoted by her own employers, she never speaks of Punderworld or HxP ficlets, even when her fans harass them and in Ficlets case purposely got them kicked off Canvas for “copying” LO, meanwhile she will happily promote OSP because they confirm her biases and kissed her butt in their HxP video. What does this tell us? Because it doesn’t seem very nice.

Of course she’s allowed as a creator to play with the mythology as she wants, but even then there are still limits to adhere to, and she never does it because obviously her half-baked concept of the “mythology” is way better than the 3000+ years of texts and interpretations out there. Sure she has people flinging themselves at her to offer her help for free, especially Greeks and academics, but what would they know over her, the self proclaimed master of mythology itself? Obviously she created it all in 2016 when she decided to draw a sexy pink girl and that’s it. Greece and everyone else was just using a fake version this whole time!

It seems from her POV, Greece ands its citizens are, in her own words “haters” who apparently know less about Greece and its own mythology than her, a white woman who uses a fanfic-writing white supremacist as a main source. The ego on this woman is astonishing.

5. May I also add to the age discourse, something like Edward and Bella can get away with it because Edward stopped aging physically, mentally, and emotionally at 17, and even in story there is a logic to them still going to HighSchool after all this time. He may be 117 age wise, but he’s at the same exact level as Bella in every other regard. That doesn’t excuse his creepy actions, of course, but there is in canon logic to it to justify it and make sense.

I’d say LO could use this too, but tbh it wouldn’t work. Either it’d involve making a CEO king as immature and childish as a 19 year old (not great) or it’d have a 19 year old suddenly be way wiser beyond her years which wouldn’t make much narrative sense, but also has some really creepy implications to it. Anyway RS dug herself into a stupid hole and doesn’t know how to get out of it.

6. im in the same boat 😭 i was watching one of those LO critique videos you posted and they were showing panels from early on and i just thought "they photoshopped this, right? theres no way it looked this bad. they're just goofing around with this" and nope, that's exactly how they looked the video didnt change a thing. the bright colors really were distracting your eyes from seeing how bad it looked.

7. Correct me if i’m wrong but in one of the first few episodes wasn’t Hades annoyed with Persephone? Especially at the panel where she wanted to drive his car? Like nothing has really changed in her behaviour with him apart from her being more flirty, but the only change is that Hades started viewing her more sexually. Always thinking about her breasts and butt, and nothing else. Half the time he was thinking about her, he wouldn’t even think of her face. So how exactly is their relationship a romantic and lovely one?

#anti lo art #anti lore olympus #lore olympus critical #lo critical #anti lo

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gebtoons · 3 years

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my contribution to the bapo timeline discourse bc i’m just gonna propose a timeline and will not be taking criticism <3 (under the cut bc this is gonna be a long post probably)

ok disclaimer I am quite stupid, however I’m gonna use my knowledge from my own 12 years in american public high school and what little info I have about american boarding schools/catholic schools that I have from my friends lol. so. idk.

i’m also gonna date songs/major events and i’m gonna be taking some “just trust me bro” liberties bc y’all are right it does NOT make that much sense.

January 6: Epiphany; this is like an actual holiday lol. like its always on the sixth. idk its good that this is the starting point bc its an actual date yknow? For the purposes of this timeline were going with that its early in the week, so lets go with Monday idk

January 6-13: You and I, Role of a Lifetime; so we’re all kinda in agreement that this timeline (at least the beginning) only really makes sense if you and i/role of a lifetime aren’t like. a singular moment and are instead multiple days. so yeah, of this first week, this is like. monday-next sunday ish yknow.

January 14: Auditions, Plain Jane Fatass; ok so having auditions for a spring musical right after kids get back from break actually makes perfect sense to me, like i can see it being like “ok take break to prepare so as soon as you come back we can have auditions so we can jump right into rehersals” yknow? and since the rave is clearly on a friday (”we’ll meet in tanya’s room on friday night”) so i’m going with the monday before.

as for pjf, i know it doesn’t make a ton of sense for them to get a two week late birthday package their first few weeks back from school, but hear me out it makes sense. the implication throughout this entire show is that the twins have decently shitty parents. from bits of dialogue (in this song in particular lol) i’m kinda inferring their the “only concerned with how their kids make them look to others” kind of neglectful. so I don’t think it’s too outside the realm of possibility that they went away for the holidays, didn’t bring the twins, and instead mailed them a birthday package and having it show up two weeks late. realistically the timing of this isnt that important and the explicit “two week” time frame could’ve been an exaggeration on nadia’s part to mock her shit parents (idk its in her character) basically ppl are a little two fixated on this imo but anyway. moving on.

January 18: Wonderland, A Quiet Night At Home, Rolling, Best Kept Secret; a very agreed upon point in the timeline. its the friday following the auditions. moving on.

January 21: Confession; also very agreed upon. the monday following the rave. moving on again

January 23: Portrait of a Girl; the date here is kinda arbitrary, but bc sister chantelle says “ok lets try to put yesterday’s rehearsal behind us” and i for the life of me cannot think of a scene she could be referring to (there’s none in the script either) that implies it wasn’t the same monday as confession (bc even in a boarding school i think holding extracurriculars that aren’t sports over the weekend (especially when they are no where near crunch time lol) is weird and not common) so i just picked a random day during the week

January 25: Birthday Bitch!, One Kiss, Are You There?; from matt’s line in wonderland, ivy’s birthday is a week after the rave. in my timeline that’s january 25th (an aquarius queen).

btw given all grown up’s “17, how will i manage?” ivy is 16 during 17 at her party, which is strange given shes a high school senior and seniors are typically 17 during 18. so either a) she skipped a grade, not an unheard of thing. or b) shes not a senior, shes just a junior who hangs out with a bunch of seniors, which is also pretty common. and looking through the script i can’t find any mention that she is also a senior, other than yknow she graduates with them, but she isn’t mentioned during the class ranking scene? so idk not that it really matters just a fun detail

February 3 (at night): 911 Emergency!; ok controversial. i know i like the joke about how its funny that peter having a weird dream when he was high prompted him to want to come out and really ruined his relationship with jason. BUT. i think the dream (despite it’s weirdness) would have a lot more meaning if it wasn’t the result of being really high, but if it was a dream he had like a week later as a result of a building sense of guilt/anxiety bc he told matt. also it fits better given later timeline things. (this timeline literally only exists if there are weird jumps in time that don’t make a ton of sense) (EDIT: I forgot one line about Jason crashing at ivys but fuck it forget that bitchass line this makes for more drama its staying this way)

February 4: Reputation Stain’d, Ever After; the next day following peter’s dream, idk what else to say, moving on.

February 25-28: Spring; another jump! i’m sorry but the only way for this to make sense logistically is for there to be quite a few time jumps! however, i also think this one works bc i think it gives time for everything from around ivy’s party and peter and jason’s break up to stew emotionally. like obviously a musical only has so much time to tell a story so the audience cannot see every realistic beat, but honestly i think it makes the whole thing a little more dramatic™ if there’s space for everything to settle, and for ivy to come and apologize and such. also, the reason it’s multiple days is bc in the script, ivy is trying to study (presumably for some sort of midterm) while nadia is playing, so that probably takes place a few days before they move out, so before finals. but in the script, jason and peter are packing and peter is leaving, so that part of the song/staging takes place on the 28th. yes, that’s weird, but we are clearly thinking more about the logistics of this school than the writers were so.

March 1: One; assuming st. cecilia’s works kinda like boarding schools here, they probably do staggered move out/move in, just bc that would be a lot to have people coming and going at once so it makes sense that peter left the day before, while jason and ivy are leaving the next day. also, given that peter is trying to call jason while he and ivy are banging, it’s probably been a hot minute since the actual break up, since peter was clearly very hurt by the whole thing, it would make sense (at least to me) that peter would reach out a month ish later, rather than like a few days later (you have to make so many assumptions to make this timeline work granted they aren’t super out there assumptions but still this is annoying)

March 1-25: Spring Break. the coworkers I have who are in boarding school work over their school breaks, which are longer than the public school breaks (which are only a week) so i put their spring break at 3 weeks. it makes sense, and it makes the later part of the timeline make sense.

I know i’m already halfway through this, but to me it makes sense for their to be quite a few time jumps in the story bc its a musical. they cannot show every day. there are a lot of other shows (particularly shows set in high schools) that are set over a whole school year, but if you just look at the events of the story that doesn’t make sense, so you have to imply that obviously they are not showing every little detail. moving on.

March 25: Wedding Bells, In The Hallway, Touch My Soul; peter wakes up from his nightmare in the church, so im assuming he fell asleep in church (like he almost did during epiphany). also it makes sense that class ranks are announced in late march-early april, I know my school announced ours in like, the first week or so of april? so yeah. moving on.

(from this point on i was giving myself a headache trying to make it make sense so its all weird from here!!)

April 4: See Me, Warning; the date doesn’t really matter here, I picked a random day in early april. the script said peter is calling from him and jason’s old dorm room, as he was picking up the last of his things, so he clearly made the roommate switch after school started (makes sense to me).

April 15-20 (approximately): Ivy finds out she’s pregnant. look google tells me on average people find out they are pregnant around 5-7 weeks after conception. i went with around 7 just so this timeline makes a tiny bit more sense given the later stuff, so yeah here we go.

May 4: Pilgrim’s Hands, God Don’t Make No Trash, All Grown Up, Promise, Once Upon A Time, Cross; a rough night for our heroes. so given sister chantelle saying “again? wonderful.” and nadia saying “i can’t believe you missed rehearsal again”, clearly ivy has been missing quite a few rehearsals, so for dramas sake maybe from when she found out she was pregnant? also i know i’ve been saying they wouldn’t have rehearsals on weekends, and given my weird timeline this would be a saturday, but its tech week so i’ll allow it.

May 5: Two Households, Bare, Queen Mab, A Glooming Peace; pretty self explanatory, and it makes sense to have the spring play in early may. rip jason.

May 11: Absolution; the day before graduation peter goes to confront the priest. gives him a small amount of time to start processing, and it makes sense it would be the night before, at least to me.

May 12: No Voice; i fucking hate this. “peter, we graduate next sunday” i hate that stupid fucking line. do you know that this timeline literally would be fine if it weren’t for that stupid fucking line? bc then, the school play would be in early may and graduation could be in late may-early june (when most high schools hold graduation) but no. keeping with continuity, they have to graduate the sunday following the school play. “peter we graduate in a month, are you really never gonna talk to me again?” would have been fine. but no, now we have beef. literally everything else about the end of this timeline being kinda weird would work itself out, except for the fucking graduation. god damn. anyway, may 12th, the graduate on may 12th which is really fucking weird bc of that one fucking line. whatever. i didn’t write the damn thing bc if i did i wouldn’t have written that fucking line. (i’ve been at this for over an hour and a half, so i’m a tad annoyed, can you tell?)

anyway, that’s it. that’s my long as hell proposed bare timeline. if there’s anything glaringly wrong with it i don’t care bc this timeline literally cannot make sense. but honestly, now that i think about the Popular Tween High Schooler Musicals (heathers, bmc, deh) the timelines of those (especially heathers and bmc) don’t make tons of sense either. that’s just the way it is, that’s the way its gonna be. and we have to live with it.

this post is so long it is actually slowing down my laptop as i type it

#bare a pop opera #bapo #me speaks #i stg there is no real way to make this timeline make sense #a whole lotta this is #it makes sense bro trust me bro #also apologies if this is hard to read i am not very good at phrasing things over text #or at all

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astralaffairs · 4 years

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i know mc is specifically a political journalist, but what if she was covering a story like the blm on the side or a riot or smth, and happened to get arrested while on the job? any headcanons for how thom would react? i see him wanting to use his political influence to get her out but i feel like he might give away too much if he does that?? or would he not care at this point bc he just wants to make sure she's safe?

mc uses her prison phone call on either lafayette or dolley for the SOLE purpose of them getting her in touch w thom

because so many people were arrested, the cops arresting yet another journalist probably wouldn't make the news

so when she calls either dolley or laf she just has to hope that they know what she means when she says to "spread the word" that she's been arrested

when word reaches thomas about it, though, he damn near loses his mind because "they can't just hold her there indefinitely!!!!!"

however, because her invocation of habeas corpus is just met with a statement that she's suspected of "rioting" or some variation of theft or property destruction at the protests, they all realize that they can, in fact, hold her there indefinitely

because our criminal justice system is so wildly fucked up

being a certified Broke Bitch, our poor heroine cannot post bail, so she's there until either charges are dropped or she scrounges up enough money for bail

dolley and lafayette both come to visit her (regardless of who she calls w her one phone call, they each tell the other pretty quickly)

when they learn abt her situation, they're also freaking out

they both offer to pay her bail money, but considering that they're both public figures closely associated w the jefferson campaign, mc thinks it would look too sus

lafayette comes in the next day claiming to be her lawyer so he can talk to her alone (she j runs with it bc this might as well happen)

but really he just did it so he could have space to tell her that thomas was insisting on bankrolling her bail AND legal fees

his plan is to just fund it w/ offshore investments; if the $$ is coming from nevis, no one's gonna be able to track it back to him (haven't u heard thomas jefferson was implicated in the panama papers??)

she tells him fuck no u can't do that

because then she'd have evidence of him using offshore investments to evade taxes (and she'd publish that info w/o hesitation)

because of course he's guilty of tax evasion 🙄

she'd basically tell him to take his money out of the offshore accounts if he was gonna bankroll her anything; she refuses to let her bail fund b paid by dark money

meanwhile, alex and lafayette are about to throw down bc alex is pissed that lafayette is acting as mc's lawyer

"He doesn't even have a law degree! Why the hell would you trust him with this?"

and lafayette is ridiculously smug abt it, but he knows the only reason she's letting him act as her attorney is so he can act as an intermediary btwn her and thomas

(once she no longer needed to communicate w thom, lafayette would be losing his role there)

but anyway thomas quickly realizes she won't b letting him pay her bail fund (and that she's probably being more reasonable abt it than he is)

so, being the extra bitch he is, he literally funnels millions of dollars to washington dc bail funds (cool donation, mediocre motive)

however, despite him being lauded as a hero of the people and an Activist, mc's bail doesn't get paid

relative to the other people who are being held in the same jail as her, her bail is low-cost, and her charges aren't very serious, so bailing her out is low priority

so, being the extra bitch he is, thomas assembles a fucking legal team to take the arrest of reporters and journalists at the protests to the dc district courts as a first amendment violation

mc is fucking shocked when she finds out

she's even more shocked when she finds out alex forced his way onto thomas's legal team bc he decided he had a stake in the matter

he, of course, does not realize that thomas literally brought the case to the court for the sole purpose of freeing mc

and, yknow, protecting the bill of rights, of course

he wins his case, of course

it gets him ridiculously good press and his approval ratings jump significantly

he shows up at the holding cells at the county jail when the judge orders that all journalists and reporters are released partially to rub his win in the cops' faces

but also, by now, mc has been in a holding cell eating prison food for 8 days and thomas is absolutely worried sick

he hasn't seen her, spoken to her, or heard from her except by way of lafayette's interpretation of her words, and he has no clue how she's holding up

dolleys been doing her best to keep him updated

but, yknow, he has to personally see to it that the judge's orders are followed and the journalists are released

and mc is beyond overjoyed to see him

but she also thinks he was being extra as fuck, and he didn't need to do all this just to get her out

she thanks him for all his efforts in a very formal interaction when they're both at the county jail but she's clearly mildly amused that he went to all this trouble

and he just looks WORRIED AS SHIT. he wants to hug her and baby her and ask her if she's alright

instead, when she shakes his hand in a gesture of awkward gratitude, he subtly lets her know he'll be home all that evening

and then he's texting her all afternoon after she gets out

but she wants to stay home :( needs to be at her own place after all that time in a fucking holding cell

so she isn't shocked when thomas shows up for coffee at the diner around 10 pm

in fact, even tho she isn't working right then, she goes downstairs just on the hunch that he might show up

and when mc offers to let mira go, then, and leave closing up shop to mc, mira isn't shocked, either

by then, she's caught thomas sneaking out the back door of the building in the early morning one too many times for her to not suspect anything (even tho he always claims he was there for coffee, he swears)

mira just sighs and sends thomas upstairs w/ mc once the diner is all cleared out, and they're both like "shit shit fuck she knows oh my god"

but she doesn't push the conversation any further just then, so they figure it can wait until another day

and then, of course, thomas spends the night absolutely babying her

he insists on cooking for her since she didn't eat dinner (she claimed she didn't have an appetite, but he was fairly certain it was just the prison food making her feel sick)

she puts up a fight, but when the food is in front of her, it's a little too good to resist

and if they don't fuck when he spends the night, neither of them says anything about it. didn't this count as the "friends" part of "friends with benefits"?

and if it briefly occurs to them that friends aren't supposed to casually make out on their kitchen counters, they still don't say anything about it

and if mc spends the next couple nights sleeping better than she has in weeks because her bed smells like thomas, she doesn't say anything about it

#this got way too long and tangential #but thats ok #hzl talks #freedom of the press #hamilton x reader #hamilton #hamilton fanfic #hamilton fic #send me asks!

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ectonurites · 4 years

Note

for the character headcannons ask game, jason and cass?

ALRIGHT ALRIGHT im putting this one under a cut because it got SUPER long bc i cant shut up ever

lets start w jason

A (realistic headcanon):

ok using the ‘realistic’ category here loosely but GOD i love the idea of Damian & Jason having interacted while Jason was staying with the League before getting dunked in the Lazarus Pit. like. this obviously would need to be set more in preboot and following the Lost Days & Batman Annual 25 version of Jason’s resurrection, but god the idea of it just makes me scream in a good way. Like... these are things Jason likely doesn’t remember very clearly once he’s brought back to life more fully by the pit because he was uh pretty catatonic, but Damian being a little kid and knowing about the boy that his mother keeps around the base, that she’s trying to help bring back to health. Damian not even knowing that’s his big brother, just that he’s a presence that shares his mother’s attention. Jason again being unresponsive but like, ok god you know that part of lost days where Talia shows the others observing him that he only fights back at those he perceives as genuine threats trying to hurt him,

Because Jason can perceive that she’s safe, she’s not actually trying to hurt him, he trusts her because she saved him? thinking about lil child Damian who is ya know already being trained in fighting stuff and like the idea of him trying to provoke Jason just to see what happens but Jason not fighting back because on some level be it his connection to Talia or even little baby Damian visually reminding him of Bruce, he knows that Damian is safe too 🥺

and then when Jason and Damian meet again in Gotham as Red Hood & Robin respectively, Jason not really remembering because there was so much going on back then for him, but Damian realizing that oh... that was Him

B (hilarious):

alright so if we are looking at comics currently, in modern stuff jason is what, like 22? hes old enough to drink in the US but still definitely early 20s so around my around my age, thats what im using as a basis here. if we adjust timeline and still consider his death having happened when he was 15, that puts it around 2013. and then coming back to like interacting with people about three years later if we still kinda base things off of the preboot timeframe (since we never got a super solid retelling of the timeline of death -> resurrection -> training -> tries to get revenge aside from knowing he went to the all-caste instead of the lost days version of the story) making him reenter the regular world and stuff around age 18 in 2016. meaning a solid three years of pop culture that he was entirely missing, and like im sorry but he really doesn’t strike me as the type to bother looking into what he missed, he’s kinda busy focusing on other stuff. lets take a quick look at some major things from those years. 2013 gave us ‘what does the fox say’ and ‘the harlem shake’ . 2014 had that time U2 just put a fuckin album on everyone’s phones, The Fault In Our Stars movie came out. 2015 introduced the phrase ‘Netflix and Chill’ and the whole blue & black vs gold & white dress debate happened. imagine any of the other batkids (or even arguably roy during rhato stuff) bringing these things up and jason’s ensuing confusion. thank you for your time

C (heart-crushing):

so. there are two specific instances from rebirth era Jason i want to bring up here and much like a lot of these it’s less a headcanon and more of an inference based on observations, but i wanna take a sec to discuss Jason’s relationship with other people’s death. early in rebirth, Tim ‘dies’ from that whole thing in detective comics. he didn’t actually die, we as readers know, but in-universe they all very much so thought he was dead. frustratingly a lot of the batfam wasn’t really shown mourning him aside from in the Detective Comics Rebirth title itself (which just. when a major character dies even if its temporary- that should have a ripple effect) BUT an exception to that is in RHATO 2016, where we get this offhanded comment in Jason’s internal monologuing

similarly later when Roy, who like, had an incredibly close relationship w Jason that had just gotten mended before Heroes in Crisis, gets fuckin murdered in that whole thing... Jason doesn’t go to his funeral either. He leaves a dramatic voice mail and then visits the grave on his own later, choosing to instead keep working on the mission they’d started rather than going and taking the time to mourn properly.

Jason’s relationship with death is incredibly complicated, obviously. He has died, he has come back, and he now is willing to cross the line most other bats won’t and will kill people when he deems it necessary. I think thats something important though- he doesn’t just like... go around killing for fun (usually, some writers preboot made him a little murder happy but even then usually this still was vaguely followed) he kills people he thinks deserved it. Like, even looking back at the mess of Morrison’s Jason during Batman & Robin 2009, Jason was still trying to bring a sense of justice with who he was killing (”punishment that fits the crime”), it wasn’t killing for the sake of killing. He sees things in this kind of almost black and white ‘people who deserve it’ and ‘people who don’t’ way, and he has no problem dealing with death when it’s with the people he thinks deserve it.

but when someone who doesn’t in his mind ‘deserve it’ gets killed? i think he just goes into total avoidance mode. throws himself into other things he’s doing, tries not to dwell on it too much no matter how much he still thinks about it (this is especially evident in him consistently telling people “i’m fine!” after what happened to Roy, despite bringing Roy up literally like every few issues for a WHILE after he died and very clearly still struggling with it, Artemis is the only one who gets through to him on it a little bit)

but yeah, I just think that from Jason’s relatively unique situation of having been murdered, he knows what it’s like and he is perfectly fine wishing that on people he thinks are bad and deserve it, but it crushes him to imagine the people he loves and cares about having to experience something as painful as what he went through. not to mention the whole “I came back, why do I get a second chance at all this when they, who are a much better person than I am, probably won’t” mindset we get some implications of him having

D (canon is a coward and won’t)

hello DC i am once again insisting a batfam member is bisexual

CASS TIME

A (realistic headcanon):

ok so we know cass likes ballet. thats canon. however i think we also should in general explore cass experiencing other types of dance/performance as well, be it herself as a performer or even just watching. like... god imagine her & like my brain just automatically for group activities puts her with tim steph and duke but also for this in particular I feel would be a Jason embraced activity, but like them going to see a broadway show or some other professional theatre or something, and her just being enthralled by the reading of body language of the performers! like again by any point in current stuff cass does have like, the ability to speak fine (reading still hard tho) but even so I think like. okay im a theatre kid if that’s not obvious from the Everything About Me but one thing I always do after seeing a show is ya know spend dinner afterwards discussing it with whoever i saw it with.

I just think that like, bringing those people i just mentioned to the table to discuss seeing a show after would be so FASCINATING because cass would bring this whole perspective of critiquing their acting on a whole different level- not based on how well they delivered lines out loud, but by what their body language was saying as they moved on stage. like im very amused by the idea of cass getting a totally different picture in her mind about what a character’s motivations were because she was paying way more attention to what their physicality was saying vs the words that were written and how they were delivered. i think the debates her and the others would have would be EPIC there. jason defending the text as it was written adamantly and cass being like ‘ok yeah sure but thats not what they did’

B (hilarious):

cass having no concept of money because why would she bother? is SO funny to me. like it’s not that she couldn’t be reasonable if she wanted to, but like, she knows that the Waynes are well off so it’s not something she actually needs to be concerned about, so she just goes hog wild. takes steph out to fancy dinners and makes steph order for them since cass ya know doesn’t really read the menus, and steph’s like ‘jesus christ this costs-” “don’t worry about it” “but cass-” and she just holds up one of bruce’s credit cards and steph’s still like “but you don’t even know the range-” “it is fine”

bruce does not have the heart to tell her to stop

C (heart-crushing):

i mean this is pretty much canon but especially now after death metal where she’s remembering, not just being told by a guy using weird alternate timeline technology, that she used to be an adopted member of the Wayne family... like that hurts so bad. To look at these people who have ya know been kind to her, Bruce has still been a father-like figure to her (i mean literally from the moment they met in New 52 canon during the flashback in Batman & Robin Eternal, where he’s telling her that she’s not a monster just because of what people forced her to do.... that she’s a hero... that hug.... dad behavior), and they do to some extent treat her as family... But to then really know, to feel and remember that she was actually adopted! She was a part of their family. To look at how she’s been calling herself Orphan while working with them this whole time... that’s so heartbreaking! I have cried about this idea so much! I want so badly a conversation between her and Bruce now where he offers to officially adopt her again, I need it so bad and if it doesn’t happen at some point in the next year or two I will be so distraught.

D (canon is a coward and won’t)

i want an in-depth exploration of cass’ relationship to her own gender. being raised without language and you know with so much of her life being independent (remember: CASS RAN AWAY AROUND THE WORLD WITHOUT REALLY KNOWING ANY SPOKEN LANGUAGE) and outside of an organized society impressing too much of gender expectations on her, i feel like the way she experiences it would be very unique! like sure she’s so far been fine with being assigned ‘girl’ (ya know that comes with batgirl, and how people just automatically treated her based on how she looks) but in terms of gender expression and like her actual relationship with ‘traditional femininity’ etc like... because of how she was raised I just think she’d have a really different perspective on it that could be cool to explore, and I think she’d fall outside of the binary after she really thinks about how she identifies.

tldr on that: she/they nb cass is what i’m getting at here

#onwater #jason todd #cassandra cain #sam writes

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in-class-daydreams · 4 years

Text

:000 Offends me?? For wanting to read my writing??? Anon, I adore you, you’re so sweet and I appreciate you being considerate of me <3 Thank you for the sweet ask and just for you, I will post a snippet of the first draft of Neo!Blue Star that I’m trying out!

Love,

Admin Mango-Chan

(Reposting this bc tumblr hates me and refuses to let me format my posts dammit)

NEW! Blue Star Sneak Peek under the cut!

Pairing: Oikawa Tooru x Reader

Chapters: [In Progress]

Genres: Fluff, angst, sexual implications/content

Warnings: None in this snippet

Summary: After a physically and emotionally traumatizing fall during Nationals in your first year of high school, you’ve decided that you hate volleyball now. You transfer to Seijoh High and apparently you’re an anime protagonist, because even when you want to keep your head down, drama seeks you out. You meet an avid fanboy of yours, come across an old friend, and apparently your childhood crush is stupidly hot now, so finishing high school is looking to be a lot harder than you thought.

That morning, I noticed someone staring at me, but I figured I was just being paranoid. I felt eyes on me again on my way back to the classroom. New kids get stares, sure but this dude’s gaze was locked on me.

He was a bit on the taller side with glasses and a ash brown undercut. Even with the glare from his glasses, I felt the intensity of his stare. His stare cut across the hall from his place leaning by the window, surrounded by a couple other students I assumed were friends of his. Despite their presence, his sole attention was on me, and I felt him looking at me all the way up until I got back to class.

‘Well, that was super creepy,’ I thought, but I ignored the uneasy feeling and opened my notebook to start class again.

Not a whole lot happened that first week of school. I went to class, that weird guy stared at me during breaks, then I went home. People stayed away from me and I kept my distance from them. It was the perfect setup. I did as much homework as I had the energy to do, and on my worse days, Wakatoshi came over to hang out and help me through the rest of it.

Nothing interesting happened until the following Tuesday, after I’d stayed behind after school to talk to an advisor. That was when I ran into that creepy weirdo in the stairwell after school.

“Oh, it’s you! Hi!” He grabs my hand in both of his. I immediately yank it back, but he doesn’t seem to care. Instead of replying, I just stare at him. He takes a step forward, ending up even deeper in my precious personal space.

“I’m Itoi Justin! I can’t tell you how excited I am to meet you!”

I lean back and eye him warily, getting a pretty good idea of where this conversation was headed.

“Uh, okay,” I say dumbly.

This Itoi is apparently perfectly content with having a one-sided conversation.

“I’ve been following your career since forever! I was so sad when you disappeared after your injury, and to think I’d meet you here of all places! It’s just-- I mean--!”

The guy is absolutely breathless in excitement, and it’s getting super uncomfortable.

“Look,” my nails scrape at the inside of my bracelet, “I don’t know who you think I am, but I’m not her.”

I sidestep him to make for the exit, but he gets in front of me. Once again, he’s way too close.

“No!” He shakes his head so hard I’m worried his glasses are gonna fly off, “I’d know you anywhere! You’re her, you’re the Blue Star!”

Blue Star. Huh. I haven’t genuinely been called that in a long time.

“You used to be-- Hey, are you okay? I’m not gonna bite you, y’know.”

I glare up at him. He seems to shrink back a bit even though he’s almost a head taller than me.

“Well, I’m in an empty stairwell with some guy I don’t know who likes getting up in my personal space,” I poke a finger into his shoulder and he steps back willingly, “And he’s bringing up old shit that I moved here to avoid, so I can’t say I’m having a great time right now.”

Itoi visibly deflates. Even his glasses seem to slide down his nose a little bit in disappointment. He looks so sad that I feel kinda bad for being mean to him, even though I’m like this to everyone.

“Oh, I, uh, I’m sorry. I didn’t mean to make you uncomfortable,” he says quietly. He shifts in his spot like he wants to stay, but is having second thoughts.

“Don’t worry about it,” I say, shoving my hands into the pocket of the hoodie I’m wearing under my uniform blazer. I brush past him, fully intending to make a hasty exit, but I can’t seem to get myself to leave. Cursing myself, I turn back around.

“Fine, Ichi--”

“Itoi.”

“--you come on a little strong, but I appreciate that you were my fan at some point.”

I take a labored seat on the stairs and try my best not to manspread in a skirt. Resting my elbows on my thighs I look back up at him.

‘Mm, he’s pretty cute,’ I think to myself.

It seems like all the life came back to him with that one sentence pseudo-apology. His eyes are shining with delight and he takes a seat next to me. He acknowledges my need for space, as he slides away from me to the other side of the stair.

“My father’s a journalist for the same publisher as Volleyball Monthly. He took me to one of your games for an article of his and I’ve been a fan ever since,” he tells me. “Even after my dad transferred to a different magazine, I kept following your career online.”

I make a face like I drank rotten milk, “Why?”

Itoi turns to me. For the first time, his face is missing the overwhelming excitement and it’s replaced by gentle, but passionate, admiration.

He grins, “I wondered that myself. I thought it was weird how interested I was in some random city girl’s volleyball career.”

“It is pretty weird,” I say.

The brunette huffs a laugh at my comment, “Maybe, but… I don’t know. It’s like when I saw you play, you weren’t just playing the game. It seemed like the game flowed through you. Your game came as naturally to you as breathing, and I could understand how you got your nickname. I never saw someone shine so bright.”

Even while my nails are nervously dragging against the engraving, I resist my desire to flee. Of course I’d been praised before, but never so openly and so, I guess, genuinely. My heart is stuttering in my chest in embarrassment, and I can’t seem to keep my voice stable.

“I-- Uh, thanks,” I grunt.

Itoi leans in further, “But I confess, I came to talk to you for a reason.”

“You came to murder me horribly.”

“Sadly, no.”

“Darn.”

The boy giggles. He looks forward and seems to stare off into space. “So, after I saw you and how electric you were playing volleyball, I tried to learn to play myself.”

“And how’d that go?”

“Terribly. I have the athletic skills of soft tofu.”

The corners of my mouth lift slightly.

“Once I realized I’d never be good at volleyball ever, I became a manager of the boys’ team in my first year. I’m better at the thinking and the analyzing, y’know?”

“We’re really playing into that glasses character stereotype, aren’t we?” I quip.

“You bet we are. The thing is, there’s a certain level of thinking to the game that requires experience on the court. I can’t provide that, but--” his intensity is back up and his eyes are boring into my soul, “You can.”

I pause, taking in everything he’s saying. The implication of what he’s asking washes over me like a hurricane.

“No.”

“Hear me out--!”

“No way!”

I stand up and stomp towards the exit.

“You need to join a club anyway!” He says desperately. Itoi gets up to follow me.

I reply without turning around, “I don’t care.”

“Don’t you want to be involved with volleyball again?” he asks.

My jaw clenches almost painfully. He takes me by the arm, and rather than slap him silly, I say nothing, and he continues.

“You used to love it. I can’t pretend to know what you’ve been going through, but I can’t imagine you want to abandon it completely,” he says desperately.

His tone makes my chest hurt for some reason. Right now, he’s annoying the crap out of me. He met me today. He’s only ever seen the me play volleyball at my tragically early prime, and he’s naive to think that using some lines an anime protagonist would say right before the final battle would magically fix every problem I’ve ever had since I ate shit in front of hundreds of people a year ago. I couldn’t tell you how I feel about abandoning volleyball but I do know that I feel like I want to vomit whenever I see a net.

I violently wrench my arm away and put space between us.

“You’re right,” I snap. “There’s no way you could understand what I’m going through. But don’t feel bad,” I hitch my bag up higher and throw a look backwards over my shoulder, “Not a single person does. Find yourself another manager.”

As I leave, I fully expect Itoi Justin to stop fanboying once and for all after finding out that the Blue Star is a bitchy, cynical person who can’t even play volleyball anymore anyway. I guess it was my fault for underestimating his blind faith in me.

“So?” he asks.

I stop in the doorway in surprise.

“What?”

He crosses his arms, making no move to come closer to me now that he has my attention. I could walk out the door right now, heaven knows I wanted to, but somehow that asshole knows I’m going anywhere.

“Of course no one understands how you feel. People may have seen you get injured or have heard of it, but in the end, you’re the one that got hurt. How’s anyone else supposed to know what you’re thinking? Bite and snap at me all you want, but it won’t make me feel your pain.”

He runs a hand through his hair, “I want you to be co-manager with me. I’m in my third year and I want the team to be taken care of after I graduate. I’m not asking you to play again or to give me an answer right now, just… Just consider my offer, okay? No one on the team knows who you are, if that makes you feel any better. And there’s one more thing...” he hesitates.

“Hurry up,” I say.

“The truth is, Seijoh has never gone to Nationals before,” he says slowly. “But you? You were projected MVP for a team almost certain to make it to at least the semi-finals!”

I give him a look, “And we both know that definitely didn’t happen.”

“I know, I know! I just-- They - the boys, I mean - have been working so hard and they’re so talented, (L/N). Please, you need to join a club anyway, and if you can’t do it to save your own soul or as a favor to me, can’t do it to help them? You remember wanting to go to Nationals, don’t you? Volleyball Monthy listed you as the number--” I cut him off.

“Holy shit, you talk so much it makes my head hurt!” Rubbing my forehead, I think about my first year in high school. He’s wrong about most things he said about me, but he’s right that, at one time, I wanted nothing more than to win Nationals. I remember wanting it so bad, by entire being would electrify just thinking about it.

Itoi waits patiently as I stare at the floor in careful deliberation. With a loud sigh, I look back up at him.

“Fine,” I snap.

“You’ll consider it?” he practically screeches.

“I’ll consider considering it,” I grumble and try once more to take my leave. He doesn’t stop me this time, but when I’m out of sight, I can hear his excited screaming echoing throughout the stairwell.

#haikyuu!!#haikyu #haikyuu x reader #oikawa tooru #oikawa x reader

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guccifloralsuits · 5 years

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You should also explain to anon what larries are and why you need to stay away from them... i feel like it should be part of the crash course for new harries because (speaking from own experience) new fans often easily believe their bullshit and their views of harry and his relationships become warped bc of it

Prospective New Fan Crash Course: Larry Stylinson

Introduction:

Larry Stylinson is a ship name given to 1D band mates Harry Styles & Louis Tomlinson, after some fans became convinced they were in a forcibly closeted relationship due to Modest Management. The two denied being together and repeatedly asked fans to stop, and invasive fan-shipping is attributed to the decimation of H & L’s friendship. By the end of 1D, they could barely stand next to each other or talk in public without rabid fans (& sometimes tabloids) dissecting every millisecond of their interactions. It was incredibly uncalled for, Invasive, downright creepy, and some people still believe in the conspiracy, today.

A Short Timeline:

One Direction was formed to compete on British X Factor. Harry & Louis were fast friends. They pretty much immediately clicked — and you can see this really clearly when the band started recording video diaries, and in early interviews with 1D.

For the first few years of one direction, it was really clear that they were best friends. They did a lot of interviews together - they even lived together for a short amount of time. A lot of people shipped the Bromance, but increasingly some fans became obsessed with the idea that the two were secretly in a relationship - despite repeated denials, them saying they were uncomfortable with fan behavior, and asking fans to stop, constantly.

Band members, family, and they themselves often remarked about how uncomfortable they felt with the shippers who wouldn’t let up.

Band members on Larry Shippers:

Liam:

“It’s like, when you know the ins and outs of what is going on with people and it’s just annoying when it’s so stupid,” the 22-year-old said. “It becomes like a conspiracy or like a cult, the people who watch them and think that every move they make is a gesture toward them being together, and I know it’s just not true and it makes me mad.” (XXX)

“I get tagged in drawings of Louis and Harry being together. I remember one time I was sitting next to my dad and I see this picture of me on top of Niall [Horan], which was quite intimidating. It’s just really weird to have people drawing these sexually explicit pictures of us in strange situations.”

Zayn:

“There’s no secret relationships going on with any of the band members,“

“It’s not funny, and it still continues to be quite hard for them,” he said. “They won’t naturally go put their arm around each other because they’re conscious of this thing that’s going on, which is not even true. They won’t do that natural behavior.” (FADER)

Niall:

Tends to be the quitest (aside from Harry but harry never comments on anything, ever). Shaded a bunch of larries a few weeks ago on twitter tho if I recall correctly lol

Larries would (and still try to) micro-analyze every single interaction, no matter how small. And the media would sometimes hop onto the bandwagon, going out of their way to make both H & L uncomfortable questing if Larry is real.

After constantly dealing with this, a lot of public interaction stopped. But as Larry shippers had less to work with, they became increasingly obsessive about keeping up their fantasy. Some highlights:

Repeatedly dismissing Eleanor Calder, Louis’s long-term girlfriend as a ‘beard’ often going so far as to harass her social media, her family, & rip her apart for every minuscule action or reaction.

Calling Louis’s son not actually his, and believing that management forced Louis to pretend to have a son to save face & keep his relationship with Harry a secret. (Deadass. They think Louis’s son isn’t real & is still being used as a cover).

Don’t get me started on how horrible some of the fan-fiction is, it’s so so invasive.

still think the two are together in a hidden relationship, despite not publicly being in the same location for around 3 years.

Today some larries still exist, but we don’t welcome them into these parts.

In 2017, Louis straight up said that Larry shippers kinda completely ruined their friendship.

Louis on Larry:

“It kind of happened naturally for me and Harry because a certain amount of the fans drew up this conspiracy,” Louis said about the Larry Stylinson conspiracy theories. “When it first came around I was with Eleanor, and it actually felt a little bit disrespectful to Eleanor, who is my girlfriend now. I’m so protective over things like that, about the people I love.”

“It created this atmosphere between the two of us where everyone was looking into everything we did,” Louis said candidly. “It took away the vibe you get off anyone. It made everything, I think on both fences, a little bit more unapproachable.”

recently & notably, TV series “Euphoria” had a fanon imagined sex scene between the two on the show, which neither band member constented to and Louis made a statement expressing his offense at. This is just…one example among many for fans and media taking things way too far. I can pull up the reciepts for more but….god it makes me tired & angry. There are so many messed up & invasive questions, fan actions, and media articles.

Implications:

Larry changed the way RPF fandom works, being to first shift from “this is a fantasy about two real people I wish were together” and beginning to project a fans own reality onto the two. Effectively, they treat Harry & Louis like dolls in a game which they get to make the rules for. It’s fucked up, and we don’t support them. moral of the story: don’t insert fan made fantasy into the lives of real people.

this has been a tea-party hosted by yours truly. F Larry shippers, full stop.

For Further Reading

#asks #HS info #this is about to lose me a lot of L**** followers and ya know what? good #anti larry #harry styles #this turned in to a full on essay w an intro thesis evidence and conclusion ghjdkeldjtryuioiuytryuioiuytryuio #L slur

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talesfantastic · 4 years

Text

Mun Things and Fandom Notes

about the mun. fill this out & tag a few people you’d like to get to know better !

tagged by the lovely @vetlanwrites tysm tagging some people I haven’t tagged before: @amalgammuses, @animus-inspire, @kychchc, @rotinthedark, @warofthebeasts & YOU!

name: my name is [ loud music interrupts ] nickname: you can call me Kat or KF! preferred pronouns: she/her age range: 30+ favorite animal: cats pets: cat and a dog tattoos/piercings: I had my ears pierced several times and they won’t stay pierced so I gave up on anything -shrug- star sign: virgo! I’m an August bby how long have you been in this fandom?: doing just the ones I currently have muses for, and not the ones I’ve only talked about -

Dragonball(Z) - I’ve been writing in DBZ since... oh geez, the late 90′s? I think the first fic I ever posted was DBZ and it was around that time. I didn’t start rping it until like, early 00′s though.

Final Fantasy - I actually dabbled in 9 a little bit around the time it came out in ‘00 (my friend had it!) but I wouldn’t say I really did much until I really got into 7, and that was around... geez, ‘05? I rped it a little with a friend around then but I didn’t really start writing it much until nearly ‘10. #latetotheparty Yet I do consider it my “home” fandom - I always come back to it.

Harvest Moon/Story of Seasons - early ‘00s! My first HM/SoS game was Friends of Mineral Town on my trusty GBA and I love it so much to this day. SO excited for the remake!

Legend of Zelda - I really, really loved Ocarina of Time from the get-go when I got it on the N64 in ‘98 (I got it again for the GameCube and the 3DS and would totally buy it for the Switch, just sayin.) Majora’s Mask creeped me out a bit and was stressful but I liked it, too. And then of course later titles like Twilight Princess were just... -chef’s kiss- but I didn’t really dig into the fandom until ‘10-’11 when I started rping Link with a friend and briefly tried joining a forum rp group (shoutout to ZRPG!) with an OC

Marvel Cinematic Universe - I want to say around ‘12, when Avengers came out? Like, I’d seen Iron Man but I didn’t really dig into it until then.

Pokémon - late 90′s / early 00′s because I first started my Pkmn journey playing Gold and Crystal. While I didn’t write fanfic or rp it, I definitely had headcanons and a lot of feels.

Sailor Moon - early 90′s! I first watched the anime as it came out, though I’ve since forgotten most of that and only have the manga/crystal in my head to run interpretations off of. It was so pretty tho.

Stardew Valley - a newer fandom for me, I really only started getting “into” it about a year ago, but man... I love it, I really do

Star Wars - despite early access to the OT as a kidlet, I didn’t actually get “into” Star Wars until the Prequels in ‘99 (fite me) when I fell in love with Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan and promptly, voraciously, dove into fixit and timetravel fanfic. By the time KOTOR came out in ‘03 I was hooked.

Threads of Fate - I think I got into this one on the ground floor, so to speak. My friend had just gotten it and I borrowed it from her and my brother’s PS1 in ‘00 and that was it, I was in love.

why did you choose this specific character/s?: under a cut bc I have like... nearly 30 muses now

I’m doing alphabetical order (by fandom / first name) bc it’s just easier to go down my list:

tl;dr I picked them all because I love them. Read on to find out why. Click their names to read their bios!

Dragonball Z

Vegeta - oh man, actually one of the first characters I ever rp’d or wrote in fic, and that’s saying something. I picked him because I love him. He’s an absolute ass, but he grows so much throughout Z. (I have yet to see Super, hoping to one day remedy that but we’ll see!) I guess I picked him up for nostalgia’s sake? I really love the character and think there’s a lot of growth yet to see buried under that pride and ego. If you can unearth it.

Final Fantasy

Angeal Hewley (FF7) - actually my first muse on Tumblr, back in... oh, 2013? The blog has been deleted, but he was the first muse I ever played seriously out of FF7. There’s parts of Angeal that really resonate with me, enough that - when I was a less experienced writer - I got tangled up in him a bit too much, made him a bit too personal, and I realized I had to take a step back from writing him. But I love Angeal, and after some time had passed, having written him in various fics, I’ve felt confident adding him... even if I haven’t done anything with him here yet.

Cait Sith (FF7) - I know a lot of people see Cait Sith as all sorts of negative things, but frankly I adore the little guy. And I guess I took him on partially because I couldn’t take Reeve on and not take Cait on, but partially because I see so much in him that could be interesting to explore and would really, really love to. (Any Reeve’s or AVALANCHE - or Turks! - come at me!)

Chaos (FF7) - I picked Chaos up on a whim, as far as Tumblr goes. I really enjoy rping him/Vincent off Tumblr and writing him in fics, and I suppose I just wanted to present a different side of him than I usually see. I’ve even had a thread that has a great deal of promise so I think it was worth it.

Genesis Rhapsodos (FF7) - my third FF7 blog, I think? It’s still up, though obviously not in use, just because I’d put so much work into it. I really adore Genesis, and love writing him. I love his sass and flare, but I love that he’s deeper than all the fire and flamboyance, if you’re willing to look past that. I’m lucky that I’ve had some lovely partners to explore him with, though I’d still kill for an Angeal to throw him at. XD Or a Sephiroth, for that matter.

Lazard Deusericus (FF7) - Lazard, my second FF7 blog and an unexpected love. I picked him up because I had recently started writing him in earnest with an off-Tumblr rp partner ( @thegeeksqueaks ) and was really enjoying him, and hadn’t seen him on Tumblr yet so thought I might get more partners that way. (It turned out there were a couple but they were inactive.) His first blog was accidentally deleted - over five years worth of character development and relationships - so after briefly working him up again solo I brought him over here. He’s not getting the same level of attention but it’s worth it not to be juggling blogs.

Reeve Tuesti (FF7) - pre-Remake, most of the Reeve rpers had gone inactive (shoutout to the fabulous @engineering-robotics and @animus-inspire for coming back!) and just... I love the character too much not to see him in the RPC. Of course, I love to write him period myself so I’d love more threads there but regardless he’s so much fun.

Tristan Pierce (FF7 OC) - Triiiiiiiiiis. Tristan was actually born as an NPC off of Lazard’s blog, who took a life on his own because he was just... so full of life. He actually had his own blog, too! I’ve barely done anything with him here, but I still keep him just because he gives me feels and he’s just neat. (He does still appear in the background of Lazard’s threads though.)

Harvest Moon / Story of Seasons

Iris (SoS) - I actually picked up Iris as a muse first for a fantastic HM/SoS/SDV/etc rp group I’m in a couple years ago, and liked playing her so much I thought I’d bring her here. Elegant lady novelist? Yes please.

Neil (ANB) - unlike Iris and Trent, I haven’t written Neil anywhere else, but he’s my love from A New Beginning and just... he seems like he’d be fun to write? I’d love to flesh him out.

Doctor/Trent (FoMT/MFoMT; DS/CUTE) - Trent, like Iris, is one I write for the rp group and I legit picked him up because of the opportunity for h/c I am not sorry. But seriously though, he’s grown on me so much and I love my awkward doctor.

Legend of Zelda

Midna (Twilight Princess) - TP is one of my absolute favorite Zelda games, and Midna a favorite character. There’s just so much to her you don’t get to see that I was really hoping to get to dig into, still hope one day to. We’ll see. Worth keeping on roster.

Revali (Breath of the Wild) - my newest addition! I keep saying in complete seriousness “Genesis with more feathers” but seriously, I may have a type? I love him so much and wanted to see more of him, and by god if I have to do it myself so be it. (I have been playing a ton of BOTW lately which probably has a lot to do with it. XD)

Sheik (Ocarina of Time) - I love them so much. OoT didn’t have a ton of character building, but the sheer implications of the character speaks volumes that I want to explore. I’m lucky enough to be getting the chance to, too.

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Tony Stark - did I mention I have a type? I feel he makes a good argument for it. I originally picked Tony up because I just fell head over heels for the character in the first couple Iron Man movies + Avengers. I... am less in love with him in the later movies, not gonna lie, and am so far behind on lore that I’m considering dropping him. But yeah, originally picked him up just because he had so much potential. Thx Disney, great job there.

Pokémon (gameverse)

Lily Hart (HG/SS OC) - another OC of mine, this time for a fandom that... I only really know through the games, as opposed to manga/anime. I picked her up because I really liked the idea of doing events or little ask things with her, and still may try to initiate some more of those. We’ll see?

Sailor Moon (manga/Crystal)

Ami Mizuno/Sailor Mercury - I actually picked Ami up because of a plot with @magicalxgirlsxrp where we were splitting up the Inners and the Shitennou for some mega threads. XD But yeah, I do like her. Even if she’s a challenge to write sometimes because she’s very much not like me, and very much smarter.

Kunzite - Kunzite I have always loved, always, and I’ve had him on here because I really wanted to explore him more. I love him even more after the teasing in Crystal of what might have been, be still my shippy heart.

Mamoru Chiba/Endymion/Tuxedo Mask - super fond of Mamoru, too; I didn’t care for him so much in the 90′s anime, but in the manga and Crystal I really became more fond. I do a few things differently, I think, but don’t we all? I picked him up for that very reason, in fact.

Minako Aino/Sailor Venus - Minako is really interesting to me because there’s so much more to her than her airheaded, bubbly persona that fits her like a glove... but is just as superficial. I mean, she’s sunny and happy but she’s also the OG Senshi, the leader of the Inners, a powerful, commanding fighter - she’s complex, and I really wanted to explore that + getting to have fun with her bubbliness.

Nephrite - another picked up from @magicalxgirlsxrp‘s enabling. But I do find him really interesting so it works out well. Haven’t done a lot with him, but we have plans. Plans I’m looking forward to.

Stardew Valley

M. Rasmodius - I knew I really wanted to do something with SDV, once I got to playing it, but I wasn’t sure who. I thought about Sebastian and Elliot, but already had interacted with a couple who were just fantastic. So instead, I did a good fallback of mine - because I never, ever get tired of playing mages. Ever. XD

Star Wars

HK-47 (KOTOR) - the attitude. I wanted to write HK entirely because of the scorching levels of sass from this droid.

Liana Raine (SWTOR f!JC) - the Jedi Consular storyline is one of my favorites out of all of SWTOR (tied with the Inquisitor, but I’m revamping her) and I really just wanted to keep playing with it even once I’d done the dedicated storyline.

Revan (KOTOR LS!F) - give me female Revan you cowards. -ahem- I have feels about Revan, okay? I love her so, so much - she even had her own blog, I love her that much. I would absolutely love to do something more with her but I will hold on to her if for no other reason than to make sure at least one black, female Revan exists in the world. (I want all the timetravel and crossover threads, hit me up.)

Tharan Cedrax (SWTOR) - another for attitude, really, and also definitely my type. XD He’s charming, he’s snarky, he’s sassy, he’s brilliant... I very much like Tharan and really felt he, like most of the companions, deserved more screentime. So, I’m here to give it to him.

Threads of Fate (Dewprism)

Duke - he’s so cool. I mean, he’s a dork, but his powers are amazing and he’s just a fun, incredibly upbeat character to play. And well, anything to spread my love of that teeny fandom.

Fancy Mel - Mel hits all the sweet spots for a mage character. She’s got flavor, she’s got amazing powers, and she had room to create a fantastic backstory with amazing crossover potential. Is she a bit OP? Yes. But she has no intention of using it for anything but her amusement/whimsy.

Rod the Bladestar - I love Rod. I love his oddly genteel manners, I love how he’s unwittingly sexist but quickly cleans up his act when put straight, I love how driven and passionate he is. Could do without such a typically-Square-outfit, but you can’t have everything. (In the right artists’ hands, he might even be pretty amazing, actually.)

Did you read all of that? Amazing. Any of them strike your interest? Hmu and maybe we could plot a thread! :eyes:

Also I sincerely apologize to mobile users who had to read all that because Tumblr can’t get it’s act together.

#about the mun #roleplay notes #long post

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laurapaq · 4 years

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Roman Farming

Overview:

Nowadays, we mostly remember Rome for her republic declining into an empire, or her military prowess. However, Romans thought of themselves as peace-loving, and even violent figures such as Sulla or Pompey the Great retired (temporarily, in Pompey’s case) from public life to their farm, as did the idealized Cincinnatus. Festivals celebrated farming holidays, art depicts farming tools, and noble gentlemen wrote farming manuals. Perhaps this was because the Romans rarely had a hard time providing food for themselves, their own land was fertile, and as the empire expanded they were fed by north African farms, or perhaps it was because the city of Rome was started as a little military outpost to protect Italian farmers from their northern Etruscan neighbors.

Because farming was so idealized, it’s a difficult subject to cover extensively, I’m going to highlight some practices, inventions, and produce that could add realism to historical fiction or fantasy as well as distinguish it from the typical fantasy landscape, then go into some of the cultural implications (besides people having better things to do than starve to death).

Specifics:

Even if farming was an appropriate side hustle for patrician nobility, farming itself was difficult, and it yielded far less than it does now. Nearly half of the crop had to be used as seeds. Even still, Romans farmed so well that their farming methods were picked up by Britains and Gauls, which is appropriate since Romans built off efforts by the Greeks and people of the Near East. Additionally, despite the difficulties of the ancient world, the period between 500 BC and 500 AD had peak farming conditions in Europe (as opposed to the mini Ice Age that followed). Italy had other farming advantages; although rainfall can be spotty at times, it’s normally abundant, there are plenty of rivers and streams, and the soil is rich from volcanic ash.

The Romans grew wheat, spelt, barley, legumes like peans, peas, chickpeas, alfalfa, turnips, radishes, and fruit like figs. Wild fruits and nuts could be collected at will. Grapes and olive oil were popular and sold abundantly—both grow naturally in Italy—and with grain were the most important plants, sometimes called the “Mediterranean triad” (2). Though olive and grapes could be grown with little effort, grain—around 75% of a normal person’s calories—required extensive effort. Moreover, early Roman holdings were often as small as 1.25 acres or half a hectares. Normally, 1 acre will feed one person.

Because there’s a large difference in the temperature and rainfall in north and south Italy, there’s a good bit of variance in farming method. However, we can get the idea in broad strokes. Roman tools were bronze or iron, hand tools like hoes and mattocks, plows (with a forecarriage—an apparatus at the front that makes it steadier), carts, harrow, manure hampers and baskets, spades, shovels, rakes, scythes, axes, wedges, an olive-crushing mill and oil press.

The plow was used first to turn soil over, as it is now, and could invert soil if turned sideways; some plows had metal ‘ears’ on the bottom that improved them. In light soil it could be pulled by a donkey, otherwise, it might require a few oxen. That was followed with a mattock (which looks like a cross between a pick-axe and a wood-axe), which broke up large lumps of dirt so that the seeds could fall into the proper rows the plow had turned up. Fields were plowed at least twice to conserve moisture (called cry-farming, still a staple around the Mediterranean), and manure was laid down after the second plowing, which came from a compost pit with animal excrement and rotting leaves, weeds, or leftovers. Seeds were either thrown out (which is quicker), or placed by hand. They were then raked over with a harrow, which could be a tool with iron teeth like nails raking the ground, or a convenient thorn bush.

Harvesting was done with a sickle (curvy knife on a stick that looks like a bad guy’s weapon), which has changed little since then, and was then brought to the threshing floor. Threshing was done by animals stomping on the grain on a hard floor, or by being crushed by a tribulum, or wooden frame with metal on its belly which was pulled across the floor. Winnowing was done by tossing the threshed grain and letting the light chaff blow away while the heavier grain well back down. Grain was then usually ground with rocks, although there were some working water mills at the end of the empire.

On rainy days when not much farming could get done, Cato (one of the politicians writing farm manuals) says to make sure to remind the overseer of work that could be done “scrubbing and pitching wine vats, cleaning the farmstead, shifting grain, hauling out manure, making a manure pit, cleaning seed, mending old harness and making new; and that the hands ought to have mended their smocks and hoods. Remind him, also, that on feast days old ditches might have been cleaned, road work done, brambles cut, the garden spaded, a meadow cleared, faggots bundled, thorns rooted out, spelt ground, and general cleaning done.” (4)

Although vineyards and olive groves remained unchanging, the Romans realized that they couldn’t grow the same crop the same place forever as it depletes the soil, so they divided their fields and rotated crops between them. They also identified which soil was best for which plant, and paid attention to that as they were cordoning off sections; for instance, olives were to be planted in thinner soil and exposed to the sun, at intervals of twenty five feet. Forage crops were also planted, such as alfalfa, which also aided the farm animal’s fertility. Vegetables were also grown to supplement human and beast, though farmers would also forage for acorns or other foodstuff to feed their animals through winter.

To offset the dangers of a poor year, in the good year, farmers stored as much as they could—not just food, but animals and jewelry that could be sold. People also used each other as resources; when one person helped another, the person helped incurred an obligation to return the favor.

Certain plants were also grown for medicinal purposes: Pliny reports that garlic had 61 medicinal uses, radish 43, and lettuce 42. Parsnip relaxed the stomach and relieved swelling when used as a bandage, the onion’s juice was used to relieve pain from snake bites, the wild cucumber’s juice was used for tooth aches and to heal eyes, beets were boiled and eaten with raw garlic to cure tapeworm.

Farming evolved as Rome did. Initially, it was a family thing, with that small acre and change farm earlier described. However, as Rome grew and the need for soldiers increased, Rome turned to conscription. Young men were pressed into military service, and while they were gone those rich off of conquests bought up land that couldn’t be maintained without the citizen farmer, and used captured slaves as free labor. These slave run estates were so common, there was even a name for them, the latifundia. These latifundia undercut the family farm and forced the rural people to the city, where they struggled to find work and depended on the empire’s bread and circuses. However, this theory has come under fire recently from new archeology evidence which doesn’t seem to support a decrease in small farms, yet even if it wasn’t true, it was the narrative the poor Romans told themselves. Regardless, it is verifiably true that as the empire expanded, it depended more and more on fertile North Africa, such as Egypt, Tunisia (where Carthage was), and Algeria, as well as their own islands Sicily and Sardinia.

Why It Matters:

We can see a tension between Rome as it was originally, a farming outpost, and the military empire it became in Cato, who has nothing but praise for farmers, but still draws them from their farm claiming that they make the sturdiest soldiers. More subtly, in the Aeneid, Aeneas’ father Anchises tells him it’s the Roman legacy to conquer, and yet the author Virgil spends more time on the domestic scene, in romance and familiar love, than battle. Seeing as no culture can live up to its ideals (unless they have lame ideals like flaying people *cough* Assyrians), a good fantasy culture will have both what it wants to be, and what it is. Sometimes those two are even in conflict with each other, or ideas mutate without the (sophisticated, fancy smancy part of) culture realizing or noticing the difference. Moreover, even if you want to cast a nation as ‘the bad guys’ they’ve got good motivations; Roman expansion was initially defensive, or honoring treaties with allies.

We can also see that cultures love their origins. Rome seemed to be more proud of their agrarian roots, than of their military prowess, which they actually seemed almost ashamed of early in their history (the ‘victory arch’ began as a sort of atonement ceremony where soldiers had to purify themselves before entering the city). Which is why we see houses in the city decorating their houses with natural scenes rather than scenes of battle, so that they can pretend they were proper Roman farmers.

As always, the technical details can help with realism.

1. https://www.britannica.com/topic/agriculture/Improvements-in-agriculture-in-the-West-200-bce-to-1600-ce

2. https://facultystaff.richmond.edu/~wstevens/history331texts/farming.html

3. https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1002/9781444338386.wbeah20007

4. http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Cato/De_Agricultura/A*.html (Cato’s On Agriculture)

5. http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Plin.+Nat.+toc&redirect=true (Pliny’s Natural Histories)

6. http://factsanddetails.com/world/cat56/sub408/item2049.html

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