#Sinsmas discussion

[cute-little-fly]

I was just rewatching Sinsmas and Octavia’s reaction makes so much sense, and is rooted so much in the dysfunctional family dynamic.

Ik a lot of people have pointed out this, and how much this topic has been discussed, but, so many people still don’t realize that the only thing that balanced the dynamic in the household for Via was Stolas. This is why she is so devastated.

Even if she sees her mother abusing her by taking her phone and referring to her as: “his daughter” like if she wasn’t in the room, she knows that if Stolas was there Stella would not be allowed to do that, or Stolas would take the phone and give it back to her and defend her. Or maybe that would not even happen. You see now?

Stolas was the only thing shielding her from the abuse by being the shield that took it. She is not completely conscious of this, but she just knows that Stolas left, and that she is alone now.

This is why it is so hard for her to accept the reality that Stella was abusive, because she loves her mother even if she can’t really count on her as a parent. Via was able to bond at some extent with Stella because Stolas was the one taking the blows, not because Stella was really “calmer” before. Stella is there as she always has been, but Via thinks Stella is worse now because of what Stolas did…

In Via’s eyes he left her defenseless and never was trully happy even with her. She thinks his unhappiness is because he stayed for obligation and not for love, but you can love your daughter and still be unhappy in your life in general because you can’t use your child to fill your own void like that.

You need someone to comfort you, and you are your kid’s caretaker, so your kid can’t help with that. Is actually a good parental trait that Stolas didn’t parentified her, and didn’t made her fill his own emotional needs by telling her his pain, and making her comfort him about it. But, it also was bad that he never explained anything because it kept Octavia in a parallel reality. However, this is a very hard situation to handle. Honestly I wouldn’t know what to tell a child in that situation.

For her it was she and Stolas against the world and that was fine the way it was.

Stolas was her everything while she grew up, her entire happiness. So, she feels a betrayal to learn that he wasn’t as happy as her in those moments (we know he was in those moments even if he endured unhappiness in the marriage and his personal life, but she thinks that).

Is so painful because they were the world for each other, but she doesn’t understand that he was so mistreated at the same time, and not loved back by anyone else. By an equal, by a partner or friends and he also has depression. That is not related to her…

[cute-little-fly]

I fully agree with you.

“You saved me in return” rubbed me the wrong way. It looks like a transaction again, It looks like he returned to that safe place after what happened. This is why for me what Blitzø does after is so important. It isn’t a transaction, he stays because he wants to. He is not doing any of this because he has to repay anything. They do look ridiculous and well… It doesn’t really matter at all. Blitz is creative and Stolas is flexible. Blitzø will keep trying until he is better and eventually gets it.

For me the reason(s) is(are) either:

He refuses to fully believe it.

OR

He thinks he doesn’t deserve it after he caused all of this to him, Blitzø and Octavia.

OR/AND

He fears that if he lets Blitzø in and then he goes again, after that he won’t stand the pain that will bring to him. So, if that has to happen he better doesn’t get attached and have illusions. He needs to understand Blitzø and where they previous misunderstandings and break up came from.

As cute as the scene of them dancing is, I think it’s notable that Stolas said, “I imagine we look ridiculous right now.” Even before then, he said Blitz risked his life fighting Andrealphus “in return.” When we know his little red ass would have done it no matter what. If Mastermind never happened and one month of not talking turned into two…three…four…and Blitz heard Stolas needed him? He’s there instantly.

Even after everything, Stolas is giving Blitz an out. Giving him an opportunity for Blitz to pull the rug out from under him so it’s not a surprise when it happens again. And again. And again. And again…

But Blitz would never. And hopefully Stolas’ cPTSD ass will see that soon.

[fujosh1dreamer]

Guess we're talking about millie being preggo I originally didn't want to discuss this, I wanna talk about stolitz lol. Unfortunately I forgot this fanbase is filled with misogynistic scum, so let's talk about millie.

First off, she didn't cheat, she's not having an affair, she didn't get assaulted, and she's not selling her body for money.

It's stupid that I have to say any of that, but if any of those statements are things you genuinely believe you need to take you're misogynistic beliefs and shove them and afterwards get away from my page.

You know what is going on with her... she's found out she's pregnant which is not always a happy thing, nor should it be. Having children uproots your entire life, and changes everything. The way people think about you and the way people see themselves.

We have already established multiple times that millie is a character that only sees value in her strength and abilities.

Now, let's get into the moments in the episode and the things that are foreshadowing the pregnancy reveal. If people perceive the only sign as the one where she is throwing up and when she lashes out at moxxie there's more. When the client comes in a blitz initially declines the offer both moxxie and millie too absorbed into sinsmas wrath to notice the reason why. Moxxie even laughs and goes "really?" They're not paying attention, which is actually out of character for millie (ie hormones) millie is usually really on point and supportive when it comes to Blitz and his emotional needs.

After she throws up, we get this small moment at the window where she's not even looking at the scene. She's no feeling well she wants to get out of the cold, and we can also see the concern in moxxie as he looks at her.

Then there's this moment and it works well to reestablish that millie loves her job, and it also works to show she's no all there emotionally. Everyone including moxxie her husband is walking away, but millie wasn't in that moment that everyone one else had. So she's confused and upset, which is understandable.

This results in her lashing out again.

She insults moxxie, and of course immediately apologizes, and she doesn't even know why she responded that way. Millie is usually pretty well in control with the exception of seeing Chaz and later in happy campers (which was justified) and ghostf*ckers (also justified) are the only times she gets upset and lashes out.

Moxxie once again is not upset he's just concerned, he knows something is wrong, he just doesn't know what it is.

Want to take this moment before the in episode reveal to talk about how hard it is to rewatch these two scenes knowing that millie is preggos. The stress is real omg.

Next this scene of millie deciding to use guns is also interesting because it might be setting up for season 3. If millie keeps this a secret for a long time in season 3 I can see her doing more long range killings in the future. At least until she decides what's she's going to do.

I love that she decided to talk to her sister, and I also love the small detail of their mom being the first to notice something is off.

This is a hard transition for millie because she loves the life she lives, and she loves her husband. We hear her say in ghostfers that's she's happy, we've also seen their lives be uprooted already. Now millie feels like after finally finding stability things are ruined again.

[funhouse-mirror-barbie]

I may go into more detail about “Sinsmas” later, but I did want to talk about what I considered to be the one scene/sequence that I thought was very well done and that I truly enjoyed—Octavia’s song, “I Will Be Okay”.

(Song/Character Discussion below)

Octavia’s song is almost everything I could have asked for. A somber echo of Stolas’ song from season 1, Octavia’s I Will Be Okay, finally, finally, gives Octavia a voice and the chance to express her grief over her father’s abandonment.

For the first time in the series, there’s no one to tell Octavia that she should give her dad some slack or that she should forgive him. She’s finally allowed to be upset, to fully mourn her relationship with Stolas and to get mad about what happened. She’s finally allowed to start working towards accepting the ways Stolas’ neglected her, and begin healing from that pain and trauma.

Octavia’s experience is both terribly heart-wrenching and, in the most painful way, freeing. The lyrics reflect that perfectly, with Octavia acknowledging that while she’s not okay now because of everything Stolas put her through, she WILL be okay, and will grow into her own person without him.

The song is a direct response to Stolas’. Octavia is answering him, saying “Yes, I will be okay. Not because of anything that you were supposed to or failed to provide me as a father, but because I will forge my own path, and in doing so will heal from the pain you caused me.”

It’s a bittersweet song about finding the strength to cut contact with someone you loved who has repeatedly failed you in the worst ways, and who isn’t going to change.

I do have one “criticism” for this song and sequence, not because anything from it was poorly done, but because, in my opinion, the song’s visuals could have been even better.

The following scene was in the original storyboards for “I Will Be Okay”, and was changed in the final episode:

I think the decision to change the visuals for these lyrics in the song was a mistake. Please don’t get me wrong, the animation in this entire episode was fantastic, my critiques of Helluva Boss are almost never about the animation.

But the above sequence just has so much more emotional weight to me. It’s the visualization of Octavia realizing she can’t rely on Stolas, that she has to look to herself for comfort.

Octavia taking her younger self from her neglectful father’s arms, symbolizing that she’s accepted that Stolas cannot be depended on and that she’ll have to take care of herself now, is such a powerful image.

It really is a shame to me that they cut this scene, because I think it fully encapsulates everything Octavia has been through in such a simple and effective way. I think the scene really loses something by cutting this visual.

With all of that said though, Octavia’s song, and the scene where she FINALLY calls Stolas out for his behavior were very cathartic for me. I know that the scene’s intent was most likely to make us empathize with Stolas for losing his daughter, but I found myself empathizing only with Octavia, and hoping that she gets the time she needs to heal.

I would love it if the show actually let her decide whether or not she wants Stolas back in her life, but given the way HB’s writers portray women, I worry that it’s likely some big event will happen that “reveals” Stella to be awful, and Octavia will forgive Stolas just like that, and will probably end up apologizing to him instead (like in “Seeing Stars”)

Anyway, just like Octavia being the only good thing in Stolas’ life, “I Will Be Okay” was, in my opinion, the only good thing in “Sinsmas”. (well that and Octavia calling Stolas out)

[caldella]

To touch on a point semi-made in some of these reblogs, it's kinda funny (sarcastically) when I see people criticize Stolas for having fantasies about being saved etc. based on his romance novels.

Because, I mean, I don't see how he could possibly find any personal comfort in characters who are:

Born into royalty

Married off against their will at a young age

Isolated and mostly friendless

Repeatedly considered weak by people working against them

Unable to leave their own social bubble without being extremely conspicuous

Abused and unable to truly escape their situation on their own

Have the abuser/person most greatly withholding their freedom doing so in order to gain power

Have the fucking vocal skills of a Disney princess

Fall in love with someone of a different class who is more of a free-thinker than the people repressing them

Have an evil relative/spouse etc. try to stop them from actually obtaining happiness or independence because that wrests power away from them

Be put in situations where they have to sacrifice their freedom or happiness as a trade-off for that of a loved one's

Wow, how dare he! 😱

Stolas has romantic fantasies about being saved because he IS, in fact, a trapped prince/princess in a shitty situation that is almost 100% put upon him by his society and his own family, which he cannot escape without violent consequences. If Andrealphus wasn't a power-hungry asshole intent on making Stolas' life miserable and usurping his position - just like a stereotypical fantasy villain - the fight wouldn't have even happened. Stolas fantasized about things like this because he has very much been forced into that position.

Of course he wants a fantasy - that's all that's ever been available to him. His biggest exposure to happy relationships were probably books and video, and he related to characters who were trapped in their position like him. He's not wrong to dream about escaping from it - but he's never had the means to do so without destroying his life (which would, as we've seen, also destroy his daughter's).

And also, since I've just recently posted on how HB breaks common tropes, I'll also say they broke it here, too. The prince(ss) gets saved, has a big romantic kiss with the lead male who comes bravely riding in...

And the day is not saved.

There is no magic happy ending. The male lead isn't even the one to defeat the hydra-dragon! Stolas ends the episode completely losing Octavia, with newfound grief and at a massive emotional low. Once again, the show displays how its characters initially fit into a story trope but how a character forced into that trope isn't actually funny, but a sign of their internal/external problems.

(And hard agree that it both showed how I.M.P. is a force to be reckoned with - their tenacity and inventiveness giving a Goetia a run for his money - but also just how powerful the Goetia immortality healing is because Andre legit got his throat slit by Loona and recovered in, what, a few seconds?)

I totally get everyone has preferences and their own likes and dislikes, but it still baffles me when people say the Andrealphus fight was their least fave scene in Sinsmas and some even wish it wasn't in the episode at all....

Like, respectfully disagree /gen, but that is literally my fave scene in Sinsmas (at most it's tied with the balcony dance) on top of Sinsmas being my fave episode in the entire show and I can't think of a single scene in that episode I genuinely didn't like.

What can I say, I'm a simple girl. I see a damsel in distress getting rescued by their knight in shining armor as they kiss while falling through the sky and I fold!

Not to mention it ends with Octavia being a total badass! And then it goes right into heartbreak, ahahaaaa... I'm fine.

[warblogs17282]

Now that helluva boss season 2 has hit it's finale, let's discuss everything we know about season 3 at this point in time!

aka, a comprehensive list of everything about season 3 that we've been told about so far. (Please tell me if I've missed anything, thanks!)

I do not think that any of this information necessitates a spoiler tag on this post, but if you want to go into season 3 completely blind, click off this post now.

Bluesky Stuff:

What we learned from this bluesky thread posted shortly before Sinsmas was released is as follows:

The wait until Season 3 starts will be quite long.

The team decided that helluva boss having closer releases of episodes was the best decision (heard this meant a month in-between episodes but I forgot where I saw that), so thee team wants to commit to a more traditional release going forward.

Confirmed once again that season 3 has a total of 15 episodes.

We will also be getting shorts in-between the wait until season 3 starts, and I assume this means monthly shorts as well, based on the fact we had monthly shorts last time as well.

Vivziepop has also described season 3 as a 'queer roller coaster.', so we gotta be prepared to get back on that ride again.

At some panel it was confirmed that in season 3 we will be getting an episode that contains some more Millie backstory.

Tweet link here:

In some other panel, alongside confirming Vassago's appearance in the Mastermind episode, they also confirmed that we will be seeing 'much more' of Vassago in season 3, the post in the picture above contains the clip of this moment in the panel as well.

In what appears to be a recording for the second half of season 3, they're doing recording work for a Stolas song titled 'Dirty Bird', and yes, it is going to be super horny. There is a video of this Instagram post on the post below, plus one extra screenshot.

In the Los Angeles Comic Con 2024, quite a few things were revealed to us, with those being as follows:

As said before, this traditional release schedule does mean that the episodes will hopefully be a month apart from each other, and that Vivziepop saw the show was moving towards a more narrative direction, with this also being where the heart of the show is, and as a result, the direction the team is going in.

Lastly, we probably won't see all 72 Goetias, but we will see a lot more of them in season 3.

Post referenced in above screenshot contains a youtube link to said Comic Con.

According to the reblogs under this post, it appears that Erica (Loona's VA), was asked what her favorite song/episode was, and she responded with 'the song that Loona has in season three', confirming that Loona does have a song during season 3.

Video can be found within this post:

At 1:06:19 of this video, Vivziepop does state that the show will eventually get to Stella's perspective, which I have to imagine the show will get to in season 3, and that Vivziepop hearkens Stella's character to the character of BoJack Horseman's mother (Beatrice Horseman) because they are very similar in that regard.

Finally, Vivziepop posted these screenshots of her doing some audio editing to her Instagram over a year ago, we don't know what episode this is from but based on the long name in line 7 that doesn't appear to match any character we know at the moment, this appears to likely be a picture of some season 3 audio.

The main things we can gather from these screenshots appear to be Millie talking with Stolas a bit, and the absolute explosion of voices following something that Blitz said.

Post where I found these screenshots from can be found here, some additional discussion regarding is also in the reblogs:

This YouTube video covers a few instagram videos covering recording footage that Vivziepop uploaded to her account, with them being from the first half of season 3.

What we learn from these instagram videos is that Wally Wackford returns in season 3 with some new lines, and there's also a courtroom scene as well involving Blitz and Stolas, with it also looking like Stolas will be acting as defense for Blitz regarding something we don't know at the moment.

According to Vivzie's instagram, we will be seeing Anthony Padilla and Ian Hecox (You might have heard of them before from something called Smosh) be the VAs of some special future characters at some point during season 3.

In this helluva boss podcast that Brandon Rogers did, Brandon Rogers stated that season 3 has a packed cast of guest stars, and then mentioned that we'll be seeing people from Brandon Roger's universe, aka, his own YouTube channel, in the hellaverse at some point during season 3.

In a helluva boss QnA panel, it was confirmed that we will be seeing more of Blitz's circus past at some point, and of course, that also means that we're gonna get more flashbacks to traumatic moments in Blitz's life as well in regards to his circus past, trauma flashbacks if you want to call it that. (Credits to Lexipop398 for transcripting all of the QnA, can find the full transcript of the QnA here, do note that you have to be signed into bluesky to view the post, however.)

To wrap things off, I believe the next significant reveal or such regarding season 3 will be found in the 2025 LVL UP EXPO, as there are quite a lot of VAs involved with Helluva Boss there, plus Sam Haft and Vivziepop.

Especially considering that in the 2024 LVL UP EXPO, the first helluva boss short was shown, we got the song featured in s2 e8, 'When I See Him' and the season 2 trailer.

[tealvenetianmask]

Stolas Makes Decisions Alone

I'm here to predict more problems ahead for Stolas. But don't worry- I do think he'll get through them because of character growth.

Stolas has a pattern of taking drastic actions that he believes are right and getting so caught up in his own point of view that he doesn't really listen to anyone else. I don't think he realizes this about himself. As much as he's now dealing with the consequences of his decisions at the end of Season 2, he hasn't yet learned that he can't go it alone. That he needs to communicate with the people his decisions impact- namely Blitz and Octavia, the people he cares for most. What I'm saying is, even though he's not the only one, our lovely owl man is a misunderstanding factory.

As for why he's like this, I have some ideas, but first, let's quickly go over the ways we've seen this behavior play out in HB.

It's treated as kind of light in Season 1 . . . despite being great with words, he's a lousy communicator because he gets carried away with his own ideas.

In Murder Family, Stolas has no idea that Blitz is panicking and . . . yes, I believe feeling pressured in this moment, even if he likes the deal later. In Loo Loo Land, he doesn't pay attention to Octavia's (not subtle) reactions enough to realize that no, she does not want to go to Loo Loo, and she absolutely doesn't want to bring the person Stolas cheated with along as a bodyguard. Also . . . as soon as Stolas listens to Octavia here, their communication improves, and Octavia is allowed to decide on the next father daughter activity.

The independent decision making tendency becomes more serious . . . tragic . . . in The Full Moon.

Stolas goes into the episode with a plan to do what he believes is right (freeing Blitz from himself), and he's so set on it that he blindsides the guy and shuts him out at the first hint of rejection, unable to pay enough attention to realize that it's . . . not actually rejection, just another wounded person reacting to a sudden change, since the entire decision making process already happened inside Stolas's mind.

Okay . . . Mastermind and Sinsmas.

I'm letting him off the hook for Mastermind, because he had only seconds to do something to save Blitz's life. I don't think he's wrong here. BUT symbolically, in the courtroom, Stolas rarely looks at Blitz. Someone who loves him is standing behind him, and there are moments of recognition between them, but Stolas still faces the decision, and his fate, alone.

In Sinsmas, we get the most blatant version of this kind of decision making. Yes, I know he's off his meds and going through a lot. He could have waited a few more minutes for Blitz to get back and talked through his decision to march up to his palace and demand to see his daughter. Blitz could have helped him calm down, and they could've had a conversation and decided on the best way to do it.

But that isn't how Stolas makes decisions. It isn't how he's EVER made decisions. Helping Stolas would put Blitz in danger, or Blitz might try to convince him to wait. So in Stolas's mind, if it's a choice between being kept from his daughter and dying alone by Andrealphus's hand, well . . .

There's so much that could be discussed here. Medication/depression. Suicidality. Autism . . . does this pattern stem in part from difficulty reading social cues?

These are all topics worth analyzing but . . . here's one thing that I think is at the core of Stolas's character regardless of the situation or other factors.

Stolas had all of his decisions made for him for his entire life. No one consulted him. Ever. Not about his career. Not about his marriage. Not about how he would choose to behave and conduct himself in the world.

Then when he was somewhere between 18 and 20, he had a child. And suddenly, his decisions mattered. Not in the big ways for himself. He still had to carry out all of his responsibilities. But he could decide how to raise this kid (Stella wasn't really interested in raising her after all). He could do everything in his power to make her childhood joyful, to make her feel loved, to teach her that she could be herself.

The problem is, making decisions for a kid doesn't make you a great collaborative decision maker. Being a parent means being an authority. He wasn't totalitarian like his own father, but there wasn't really anyone to honestly talk through his decisions and process his emotions with. So he's spent 35ish years never making a decision with someone else.

He's also rich and powerful, and that both keeps him isolated and gives him . . . a somewhat outsized view of his own importance and ability to control situations, in my opinion.

But now Octavia is 17, and making decisions that impact her without adequately communicating doesn't really work anymore.

And the other person he loves is Blitz. And yes, Mastermind is an exception, but Blitz usually doesn't need to be rescued or protected. He certainly doesn't need to be protected from Stolas (i.e. The Full Moon). He needs a partner. And Stolas needs one too.

So yeah, until Stolas learns to communicate (or at least learns that it's necessary) I worry about what he'll go off and do on his own.

Note: please don't take this as me blaming EVERYTHING on Stolas. Blitz and Octavia both have some responsibility for the miscommunications that go on. I just think this particular tendency of Stolas's is interesting and wanted to explore it.

[lost-romantique]

The Parallels Between Sinsmas & the Full Moon Breakup

Note: Please do NOT turn this post into a discussion on who's in the right and who's in the wrong. I think what happened between Stolas and Octavia is a complicated issue, and I think it's unfair to take sides. (We do not need another Blitz vs Stolas debate, especially between Father and Daughter.)

~~~~~~~~

Both breakups involve Stolas breaking it off with the two people that mean the world to him: Blitz and Octavia. 

The only difference is whereas Stolas had every intention of breaking up, or setting free Blitz in the Full Moon and did. 

Stolas had NO intention, and NO inclination of his daughter breaking up, or should I say disowning him in Sinsmas.

~~~~~~~

Let me start off by saying that Octavia, throughout the entirety of her argument with her father, exhibits traits from both Blitz and Stolas.

Octavia lashes out in anger the same way Blitz did in the Full Moon. However, unlike Blitz, who had no real way to gain control of the conversation and pull it in his favor. Octavia, from the very beginning controls the conversation, even while she's lashing out. 

Octavia’s entire tirade is filled with harsh truths, half-truths, her truths (even if they're false, they are true to her), and harsh call-outs. Similar to Blitzø’s tirade in the Full Moon.

“It was your choice, you chose HIM!"

“Can I get a fucking minute to think after everything you put me through, you pompous, rich ASSHOLE?!”

“You never loved mother, you don't love me, YOU LOVE HIM!”

“TREAT ME LIKE ONE OF YOUR BUTLER IMPS? You can't just dismiss me like that!”

"So does that mean you just stayed miserable because of me? Was I some fucking obligation? Is that why you didn't even hesitate when you got the chance to leave?"

"I mean you royal fucks think you can do this every time. Like you can just play with our feelings because we're smaller and not as important!"

Meanwhile, the one trait Octavia really takes from her father is the fact that, right now, she is stuck in her own head, not considering her father's own thoughts and feelings, and dismissing them.

Octavia doesn't bother hearing out her father, and fails to take into account his feelings. She doesn't see the pain and anguish she's causing him. 

Stolas does the same in the Full Moon (before Blitz's tirade), completely blind to anything else, aside from what he needs to do (give Blitz the crystal), he doesn't notice the fact that he drove Blitzø to tears.

~~~~~~~

But that's not all…

Pretty much every single negative event that Blitz experienced in Full Moon, Stolas is then forced to experience, by the hands of his own daughter.

It's almost cruel, as it is ironic.

(I just want to preface this by saying that Stolas was justified in the way he acted in Full Moon when Blitz triggered him, and I can not fault him for that. However, Blitz also had a right to get angry at Stolas for disregarding him. Complicated situation all around. I really don't want to turn this into a who was right and who was wrong debate.)

…

Stolas ruminated on the events of the Full Moon, and had a plan in his mind for how it was going to go down. His mistake, he didn’t even bother giving Blitz a heads up on what was happening.

Octavia's life came crashing down all around her the moment she saw her dad was willing to die for a man she assumed was just a homewrecker. By the time she confronts her dad, her mind was already made up.

…

Stolas controlled the entire flow of the conversation with Blitz in the Full Moon, and sent Blitz into a tizzy, making him grow ever increasingly distressed. 

Octavia controlled the entire flow of the conversation with her father in Sinsmas. Stolas becomes frazzled and desperate, trying to explain himself to his daughter.

…

Stolas forcefully gives the crystal to Blitz, without his consent. But was something Blitz ultimately needed. 

Octavia forcefully gives the bottle of antidepressants to her dad, without his consent. But was something Stolas ultimately needed.

… 

Cruel parting words are said to the other as a last Goodbye. 

Stolas to Blitz in Full Moon:

“Blitz, I think so very highly of you. I didn't realize you think so low of me… Goodbye Blitz”

Octavia to Stolas in Full Moon:

“You lied to me once, you will again. Have a great fucking life with him, Dad.” 

…

Stolas shuts down the conversation. He later teleports Blitz out of the palace.

Octavia shuts down the conversation. She forbids her father from chasing after her any further.

~~~~~~

The same way Blitz was forced to realize that his words and actions hurt Stolas so deeply to the point that he essentially lost him (Stolas) by the end of Apology Tour, and could genuinely do nothing about it, without fucking things up any further.

Stolas is forced to watch the person he cares deeply for, lose trust in him completely, and being unable to do anything about it. Unlike the other times Stolas could just hug his daughter and apologize. and make everything better; things are different now, his apologies don't mean shit to her.  It's too late. He's hurt her too much, and now she's blinded with her growing resentment of him.

Stolas is forced to feel what it's like to be truly abandoned by someone that mattered the world to you; the same way Blitz has gone through that feeling over (his mom)  and over (Fizz)  and over (Barbie) and over (Cash) and over (Stolas) again. Stolas is forced to feel that pain, to know that feeling Blitzø is so terrified of, the feeling of being truly abandoned.

[helluva-cubus]

I thoroughly believe as soon as stolas starts feeling well enough to express domestic fluff onto Blitz. It's so over for him. He's either going to ascend to cloud nine or melt into a puddle

I am so proud of Blitz's developement in the finale, especially in regards to his and Stolas relationship. Blitz is expressing his love for Stolas while being patient, understanding and supporting him through this difficult time.

What really gets me is the hug at the end. Blitz hugs Stolas and though he doesn't hug him back, Blitz still smiles as the episode fades to black. That is him being patient and understanding.

He knows their love is mutual, but Stolas needs time and when he's ready, Blitz will still be there for him.

[cute-little-fly]

Random thoughts about Octavia and Stolas after sinsmas

I trully hope Octavia doesn’t get any hate after this episode, and also, Stolas deserves to be happy beyond his daughter. This two things are true at the same time. I hope that more people understand this. We don’t need more division in this fandom.

Octavia thinks her father was the one who broke the family, that, even if it was in shambles the family could have been ok if Stolas was ok with them, if Stolas accepted them. She never realized Stella behaviour was not normal, and that Stella didn’t loved him at all since the beginning.

She thinks Stella resents him because of his cheating and that the family would be ok if he hadn’t done that with Blitzø, she thinks Stolas is guilty of breaking the family appart because Stolas sacrificing his emotional life was the only thing keeping the family together.

But she never saw it, and I think Stolas did well things by not putting that emotional load on Octavia’s shoulders… but she also needs to understand the complexity situation now that she is more grown up. Now she might feel guilty because Stolas was so unhappy…

She thinks Stolas suffered because of her, that he didn’t leave before because of her and that he endured suffering because of her, but what she doesn’t understand is that all of that was for LOVE and not for obligation.

Is natural that she is so hurt, and is also congruent to what has happened in earlier episodes. Where Stolas is always caught up about the divorce or Blitzø and leaves her behind. Is normal that makes her feel abandoned. Stolas never tried to talk bad things about Stella to Octavia, so, she doesn’t think that the cheating and Stolas suffering is mostly due to her mother. Now, Stella doesn’t care about talking shit about Stolas in front of Octavia, so is logical she puts the blame on him. That made me so angry, it is so unfair… This is something common for people that live under scapegoat abuse cycles.

“The family scapegoat is singled out and blamed for problems in the family. The burden of dysfunction of the group is placed on one member, regardless of the true causes of these issues. This person can be a child, step-child, troublesome uncle, or even a family friend. Being the family scapegoat can be a painful and isolating experience throughout a person’s lifetime.” Source: https://www.choosingtherapy.com/family-scapegoat/#:~:text=A%20family%20scapegoat%20is%20a,sibling%2C%20or%20another%20family%20member.&text=To%20put%20it%20simply%2C%20the,our%20own%20actions%20and%20mistakes.

Of course, from Via’s perspective this makes sense because she doesn’t understand a huge part of the situation and Stolas did fail her a lot of times and broke her trust. But I find interesting that Stella is not a good parent either, and she never wonders what role Stella had in Stolas unhappiness, or if there is something else behind everything.

Concluding remarks…

Octavia was just like Stolas in a lot of ways this episode. She confronted Andrealphus and looked Blitzø to give Stolas his pills, even if she is mad at him and thinks he doesn’t trully love her. The same way Stolas saved Blitzø even without knowing that our lizard loved him or cared about him at all or not. (Maybe this is a little bit off topic, but I found that poetic and shows deep down that they are the same).

Stolas has the possibility of recovering Octavia’s trust. He needs to build that trust again because he didn’t properly cared for it before, and now, Stella and Andrealphus took advantage of that. She would have heard Stolas if he did better things before, now he needs to make her feel he loves her. Not that she is just a responsibility, give her more.

Also, she needs to understand that Stella is the real source cause of most of the family issues, and Blitzø and how the cheating happened was just the culmination of all of it. That Stolas just couldn’t take it anymore; and just after experiencing a little bit of what he had been missing he got completely out of himself. Of course, Stolas could have done this better, but, he was very young when he married, and he didn’t had a proper social development.

I feel that a lot of people miss this, I don’t know if it is because Stolas is a dad. Even if Stolas at least had his stars, books and plants, he was emotionally neglected and lonely his entire life and that will always damage a person. Stolas needs someone to lean his shoulder on, to talk about problems and share emotions… that is a human need and Octavia as his daughter can’t do that for him, because he is the parent. He needed someone else in his life to do that and Stella failed in that.

We can understand both of them. Is tragic, but we know they will be ok :)

Sorry for the long rambling.

[ironyscleverer]

One aspect of Stolas and Octavias relationship that I think deserves a little more attention is the fact that Stolas is traumatized as Fuck, and growing up with a traumatized parent can have a pretty profound impact on you as a kid. Even if they’re a good parent, even if they try their hardest in every way, their issues always find a way to make themselves known. So even though Stolas clearly loves Via to bits, and she him, I wouldn’t be surprised if her relationship with Stolas was more complicated than what we see onscreen, even beyond the “abandoned her for some random imp” of it all.

There’s not a lot of discussion of this in canon, understandably since most of Stolas and Octavia’s immediate issues stem from the divorce, but there’s a hint of it in Loo Loo Land, when Stolas talks about how much Via used to love seeing RoboFizz:

It’s pretty clear in this scene (at least to me) that Stolas is projecting his own love of clowns onto Via, who was in fact terrified by RoboFizz as a child. He goes so far as to misinterpret her tears as “tears of joy.”

That’s a pretty weird detail, and doesn’t really have anything to do with the Divorce, so there’s any number of ways to interpret it. At first, given Stolas’s character in season 1, it comes across as self-absorbed, but looking back, i could see how that self-absorption might be Stolas’s response to always ignoring his own needs and wants for the sake of others. Stolas spent 17+ years believing he couldn’t make choices about his own life, and constantly sacrificing his freedom and well-being for others (his father, his wife, his daughter). He spent well over a decade being abused in order to give his daughter a normal, happy childhood. If he’s convinced himself his desires don’t matter, one way around that is to do things because “Octavia likes them.” So if he convinced himself Octavia liked clowns,,, you get the idea.

So anyway, in Sinsmas this side of Octavia’s childhood isn’t really the main issue, but I like to think she is starting to realize not only how weird and sad her dad always was, and how much that may have affected her upbringing. We see a tiny hint of this when she confronts Stolas about his pills:

Of course, Octavia doesn’t know the full story, but she knows enough to be upset. She knows that Stolas was unhappy enough to need the pills, and he stayed in that environment for her, and thats a lot to process at 17. It’s not a nice feeling to realize your childhood was an extension of your parent’s trauma. It’s also not fun to realize your parent chose to harm themself for you, even if they did it to protect you. It makes you feel used, like you’ve been made into an accessory to hurting someone you love. In my mind, Octavia is processing all of this, AND that her dad ran off with a random man.

All this is to say, by my wildly non-canonical interpretation, I really feel for both Stolas and Octavia in this situation. For Stolas, making his own choices and following his instincts for once was important for him to do. For Octavia, it’s reasonable for her to feel upset at her dad, perhaps for more reasons than she realizes. She’s looking back on her relationship with Stolas, and how he raised her, and reevaluating everything. Their relationship is changing, and I hope we get to see a bit of that reflected in season 3.

[holymolyfizzie]

i don't wanna derail @kityana's post about stolas's pill popping, so i'm making a separate one. but something kityana said finally made me think about something: "i'm still not sure if those pills are actually helping him or if they were just given to him to numb him to how shitty his life is"

I've wondered something related to this a lot myself. but Stolas takes his antidepressants with alcohol (and in the aftermath of alcohol, like at the end of The Circus), which is a depressant. taking antidepressants + alcohol at best just cancels out your antidepressants so they don't actually do anything. but both at once, at worst, makes your depression symptoms a lot worse. taking them together is the sort of stuff that college girls get yelled at for, but i guess no one told stolas. i wouldn't be surprised if he's been popping them like candy and upping his dosage because he was told they would help him…and then they don't because of the rampant alcoholism. which is to say that we don't know if the meds even worked for him at all (i'd argue strongly they didn't, considering his alcoholism only ever got worse and he kept taking more and more pills, like they never worked enough) or if they were a placebo while he was taking them

and this might be a bit too nuanced for such a show, but as someone who has suddenly gotten off antidepressants that didn't work at all, the withdrawal symptoms don't always affect mood that much (they did nothing for it to begin with) and they sure as hell don't last a full month after getting off. in fact, going cold turkey off of meds that do work for you shouldn't have withdrawal symptoms that last a full month (if you do, it's a Talk to Your Doctor moment). i just really wonder if Stolas noticed the lack of antidepressants after the first few days beyond the old habit of taking them, and if we really can contribute much of his mental breakdown to getting off antidepressants

but you know what he was taking religiously, that did affect him for sure, and that we haven't seen him touch in a month now? the alcohol. he was drinking during Mastermind, but he clearly hasn't touched it since the trial. Blitz doesn't seem to have alcohol around, and Stolas wouldn't ask for the extra expense -- he's being forced to quit. he passes up Loona's beelzejuice at the Sinsmas party, noticeably. the beelzejuice is brought in, and Stolas immediately goes outside for a smoke instead. he's not drinking anymore. and quitting alcohol cold turkey is an insane process, esp at his level of hard liquor. we're talking about disastrous health consequences and a whole host of withdrawal symptoms -- anxiety, depression, irritability, fatigue, loss of appetite, brain fog, hallucinations, and much worse stuff (in humans, seizures). it's impossible to underestimate the severe damage alcoholism does to your brain and body longterm. and a lot of those withdrawal symptoms stay weeks after stopping cold turkey

like, i don't want to detract from him going off of antidepressants; he needs and obviously wants working antidepressants, he's desperate for them. but i'm gonna be so for real, i've had my experiences going off ineffective antidepressants, and i've watched family members try to quit alcohol. an alcoholic quitting is a brutal, drawn out process that shakes me to my core. there are reasons a person still says "i am an alcoholic" even a decade after quitting. that shit's insidious in a way that antidepressants aren't, and it was affecting stolas noticeably more, surely enough to render his meds useless. if you want him back on antidepressants, then you need a sober Stolas first, and this is what he's FINALLY working on

so i think more emphasis needs to be placed on Stolas's recovery from alcoholism when discussing his mental breakdown, irritability, etc. the fact that he's doing this without rehab or other interventions is miraculous, nearly impossible. i don't want his impressive recovery (so far) from alcoholism to end up getting buried under the antidepressant talk ngl, especially when his getting off of alcohol now means that his antidepressants may actually work in the future and help him. this is something to be so so proud of!!

[caldella]

Stella: Pawn, Perpetrator, Perpetuator

Upperclass politics, Stella's abuse dynamics, and the actual depth behind her"flat" character

Back again with more character analysis/fan theories! This IS Stella, so TW: Abuse right off the bat. And TW: SA based on her discussion of her/Stolas' sex life in The Circus.

This post is made after the end of S2 and before any S3. How TF did this get so long? I'm not even a Stella fan!

This is not an 'in defense' post. If you are extremely Pro-Stella or in any way Anti-Stolas, I suggest not engaging with this. Stella IS abusive. While I will discuss potential reasons behind her behavior, I do not excuse it or feel like Stella was justified in them or retconned in S2 to be a villain. Signs were always there. If this take bothers you, this post will likely waste your time.

ALSO: If you read my post on Stolas/Via and prophecies, I mentioned having post drafts inspired by/coincidentally similar to other bloggers'. I've been meaning to make a Stella post for a while, but @cute-little-fly made this excellent post first. It contains several points I planned on making + ones I never would've thought of. Noting how Stella shows training in proper table etiquette and comparing her to the villain in Addams Family were inspired ✨. And Anemicjellyfish's reblog to that same post has a lot of the same backstory theories I have, too (just saw that one as I started to make this). So as usual, credit where credit is due! Let's dive in!

Stella's Base Traits

These might seem pretty obvious, but it's important to lay them out before we get into this. From what we've seen so far, Stella is:

Extraverted/social: She seeks out social settings and loves parties. When not with friends or Andre, she's usually on the phone.

Attention-seeking: Stella likes to have people drawn to her and seeks validation/recognition from others.

Vain/Conceited: She values her appearance, social stability, and the benefits of her upperclass position.

Impulsive/Temperamental: Ruled by her emotions, Stella acts on her feelings without fear of consequence.

Short-Sighted/Selfish: She acts on what would make her happy in the moment without considering long-term implications.

Unintelligent: Related to her short-sightedness, she is not book smart or politically clever and is blind to the complications of her position.

Selfish: She doesn't consider others unless it's in conjunction with what she wants.

Superficially Confident: Stella does not accept being spoken down to or anything she views as being treated poorly.

Probably Actually Insecure: She needs constant validation. She dresses formally and wears her crown even casually around the home (even wears the crown with her robe in Sinsmas!). She follows Andrealphus' opinions when given and falls on him as a backup/threat when vulnerable. She shouts back immediately when as a defense mechanism, even against Andrealphus. She surrounds herself with people who act as an echo chamber for her opinions and can't handle anything that goes against them.

Backstory So Far

She comes from a marquis/marchioness family. While this is a noble title, and marquis are often appointed to important positions by royalty, they are not royalty themselves.

As shown in her child photo in The Circus, Stella has always been prone to aggressive/violent outbursts, yet no one around her has treated this as abnormal. Paimon called her charming.

Based on Viv's hints about Stella's upbringing (coming Season 3), she came from a family with extremely unhealthy/possibly violent or abusive dynamics, and an emphasis on a woman's traditional role in families/high class society. She likely grew up with her position as future wife/mother forced on her. Much like Stolas, she was given a restrictive role and not allowed to deviate.

As cute-little-fly pointed out, she learned etiquette so far as formal dress/public image. She holds teacups and wine glasses etc. mostly correctly. She probably had a focus on 'finishing school' style education to be a 'proper lady.' She was not educated or interested in things like science/math/literature. And if she was taught about polite mannerisms - she didn't absorb those.

She was betrothed to Stolas at a very young age without choice.

Current hints seem to indicate that she never liked Stolas. From the first pic of them with each other (assumed to be their wedding portrait), both of them look miserable, and she's not even looking at him.

She has implicit trust/understanding with Andrealphus. While willing to shout back at him, she never questions his judgement. She divulges her worst schemes to him without fear. It's likely they grew up with a close sibling dynamic.

Stella as a Political Pawn

Perpetrators of abuse are often victims of the systems that created them. All signs point to Stella being little more than a pawn to her family, especially her parents. She was not brought up to be smart. She was betrothed to a stranger in childhood, a prince who would improve her social standing. She also has never shown use of magic powers, leading to fan speculation that she either doesn't have them (and was therefore valued even less) or was neglected to an extent that she never received training. Marrying her off dumped the responsibility of this potentially powerless, not-clever daughter on someone else while also creating a connection to King Paimon.

And to top off all this was Andrealphus, her indulgent and scheming older brother. People complained that his character stole focus from Stella and left her undeveloped, but I disagree. Andrealphus added depth by revealing that Stella has been/is a pawn for her family, even for him.

Andrealphus does look out for his sister and seems to care about her. Their dynamic might have started in childhood, scheming around their home's staff or ducking restrictive or abusive parents. However, there is manipulation happening here. Andrealphus either never tried to better educate/improve Stella or gave up trying a long time ago. Despite them being very close, he doesn't entertain any thoughts of breaking her from the system that screwed her over. He only encourages her to work within it for their mutual benefit.

The palace makeover in Sinsmas showed that he was less interested in giving Stella her own power/autonomy as he was taking Stolas' things for himself. He treats Stella like a spoiled child to indulge and is unable to say anything positive about her beyond her good looks. Her lack of intelligence hampers their plans but also enables him to control her. While Andrealphus looks out for his sister and prevents her from sabotaging herself, he devalues her at the same time.

Lack of Choice/Embracing the System

As stated, Stella was born to be little more than a chess piece for her family to "win" the social game. This role is clearly normalized in their culture. The Goetia see no problems with non-love pairings and associations for personal gain/political sway. Romance and individuality do not serve much purpose.

At some point, Stella had these ideas pushed into her until she embraced them. Her violent/aggressive behavior was also never checked or corrected enough (if at all), and lacking traditional smarts, that became her main tool. Stella wanted attention and to be allowed to get her way, and this was the most convenient way to do it. She absorbed the catty, selfish, domineering lessons taught by their culture and perhaps her parents. Since Andre is a Marquis, she was probably a Marchioness. She was also a Goetia - she was entitled to acting superior. Stella grew up to be beautiful, self-important, and aggressive. Loud, selfish, tempestuous behavior got her the attention she craved. "Lower" beings like poor people/imps only good to throw around or do her bidding. She became a living example of the worst aspects of her upbringing, in order to fit into her position.

A Pairing That Sowed Resentment

I have mentioned this theory before, and I saw Anemicjellyfish mention something along these lines as well: I think the cute kid portrait of Stolas was sent to Stella's family first. I think she found out about the engagement before him, and the raging child Stella portrait sent for Stolas was her immediate reaction. This betrothal induced rage in her before the two of them even met, further sowing the seeds of her future abuse.

Stella probably knew what obligations she had getting into a marriage: be pretty as part of her social status, get a husband whose title would improve her position, and produce an heir. After that, her purpose was essentially served besides continuing to look good, literally and socially. I think she decided to get the 'requirements' of her marriage over with as soon as possible to move onto what she wanted to do: gossip, host parties, absorb the attention her connections gained her. Perhaps she expected her future husband to have the same attitude. It was normal in their society, after all.

Instead, she was matched with a shut-in, eccentric bookworm with niche hobbies. Stolas was a well-meaning but socially unskilled man who avoided conflict. I think their first impressions were probably bad, with Stolas trying to set his "make things comfortable for us" boundaries right away in his attempt to establish clear communication. It would've been a considerate, well-intended thing to do, and something Stella wouldn't appreciate. Stella doesn't appreciate boundaries in general. She was raised to be above them. It turned out Stolas was not a husband who would draw attention to himself or flout his position. He didn't pull himself up by (intentionally) bringing others down. And he was never attracted to Stella no matter how "hot" she was. Stolas was nothing like what a male Goetia was supposed to be, and I think Stella hated it.

She hated him. Hated his personality, his quirkiness, his interests, his unobtrusive nature, even his singing. I can't emphasize this enough: there is no way Stolas could have ever made Stella happy that didn't clash with who he was as a person. This was not a failing on his part but genuine incompatibility. I don't think Stella wanted to communicate better or come to agreements. There was NO WAY for Stolas to 'win' or do things right.

A Broken Step Up the Social Ladder

I couldn't find a great place to put this, so I'm putting it here. One of the criticisms I see against Stella's character is that she's too traditional evil queen/evil stepmother coded, a shallow trope from a children's fairy tale. But these tropes, which we consider cliche now, exist for a reason.

The Goetia/upperclass of Hell seem to follow old European/royal hierarchies. This social structure is strictly upheld: Sins, Kings like Paimon, Princes/Princesses like Stolas and Octavia, middle ground royalty like Dukes, and non-royal nobility like Marquis/Earls/Barons. Stolas is a prince, but one far, far down the royal line, and Stella is a younger sibling from a Marquis family. Titles and inheritance follow children before spouses. Typically it would be oldest male child, though Via seems an exception. This means a few important things:

Stella's marriage bumped her up a couple rungs on the social ladder, but only technically. She is only associated with royalty by marriage and likely would not be considered a "real" princess, maybe a princess consort at best.

Stolas is, himself, so far down the line, and the Goetia so immortal, that he would likely never inherit more than he currently had. His position was stagnant.

As soon as Octavia was born, she became the direct heir. Stella had no stand to inherit anything from her family - that would go to Andrealphus - and now no stand to inherit from Stolas.

Bottom line: Stella is part of nobility but has no independent wealth. She only lives in Stolas' palace, or stays with Andre, because she's permitted to. Otherwise she would have nowhere to go unless her parents would take her back. Goetian culture makes women like her dependent on their relatives/spouses while insisting they uphold all the appearance of wealth and privilege. This dynamic can create two drastic ways to "fit in:" giving in and being submissive or eagerly upholding the system to control it. Take a guess which Stella leaned toward.

Fairy tale evil mothers/stepmothers are often in this position - the wives (usually 2nd or 3rd) of a prince or king who decide that the children threaten their potential security. Stella lacked the intelligence to realize this, though Andre did at the start of Mastermind. But it's important to note that Stella does exist in this form of upperclass limbo.

Perpetuating the System

Stella went from a potentially abusive/neglectful upbringing to living with a stranger in his home. She had been passed like a possession to someone who didn't know/connect with her and didn't share her ideals. Stella was also not raised to have close emotional connections to lean on besides Andrealphus. Stolas was equally a victim, stuck with a stranger in his home/bed and expectations to sleep with her and produce a child. Neither were given a choice. But Stella didn't care about this. Despite fitting into their culture, Stella was suffering from it as well, and chances are that Stolas was the easiest thing to blame.

Rather than forming a 'comfortable' more platonic marriage with Stolas, Stella turned her frustration on him, perpetuating the negative culture that raised her. Stolas tried to keep the peace, but peace was never what Stella was after. Stolas was her personal punching bag, every perceived flaw of his a further scapegoat. They were incompatible, but Stella treated that as his issue and not one brought on by their forced marriage/culture.

Stella used physical, verbal, and emotional abuse. She shamed him to her friends, dragging his reputation into the dirt. In drawing people to herself, she further isolated him, making him even more of a disappointment and an even easier target. She probably also kept her idea of speed-running through her 'requirements' of marriage - to the extent where she pushed sex on Stolas when he was unwilling and dissociated/couldn't look at her as a self-defense. Stolas' depression worsened over time, and he clearly grew numb and conditioned to the abuse, which probably escalated Stella's behavior. Abuse demands attention. If her behavior started to feel normal to Stolas, it was probably time to get worse. This is one of the many ways abuse/behavioral issues can escalate IRL - as the victim becomes accustomed to the abuser's behavior, it worsens in order to get a desired reaction.

And while i don't see it discussed much, I think Andrealphus had a key part in encouraging/aiding Stella's behavior. In Mastermind, he portrayed himself to court as the concerned, caring brother-in-law trying to look after his sister's weak, easily overpowered husband. No one doubted that the prince was easily manipulated and overpowered by an imp, a race they considered the lowest/weakest. I think this was a long game 19 years in the making, as Stella and Andre whittled away the public's opinion of Stolas and stripped away his autonomy together. The worse Stolas looked, the less people paid attention to him. The better Stella and Andrealphus looked in comparison and the more his position became 'theirs.'

And through this all, Stolas tried. In the morning part of The Circus, pre-Not Divorced party, with Octavia not present, he heard Stella mention him and turned around with a friendly face to speak. Only he was gestured by Stella to wait, and he realized he was the topic of derision again, not being spoken to.

Stolas endured childhood neglect and forced marriage/unhealthy cultural norms. He tried to be an accommodating husband and a good father despite this, tried his best to break the cycle at least for Octavia. And he did this even when she wasn't present. It was a genuine attempt. Stella didn't want to break cycles. She became part of the problem instead.

Not a Mother, Not a Family

I'm getting this out of the way - Stella is NOT a "good" mother and is shown since Season One to have never been. Octavia's childhood wall doodles didn't depict her, hinting at her lack of presence. In Loo Loo Land, Stella verbally insulted/threw things at Stolas in front of Octavia and left the room without even addressing that Octavia came in. Potentially projecting my own issues, but I've been in a similar situation to Via here and picked up on this scene on first watch. A responsible parent would not throw things at their spouse in front of their child. A responsible parent would not leave their child alone/unacknowledged to deal with the outcome of a domestic argument. Even if Stella and Stolas HAD been in a loving relationship that he destroyed - which they hadn't - Stella was neglectful to Via since her first non-pilot, in-show appearances and showed no care if her behavior hurt or caused issues. She was willing to abuse Octavia's father, plan to have him murdered and/or banished, and, as the story progressed, manipulate Octavia directly. In Sinsmas, she even made her feel shameful for wanting to speak to Stolas.

Season 2 stepped up the portrayal of abuse and neglect, but it was always there. Octavia was an egg that 'dropped' out of Stella - something that finally rid her of having sex with Stolas but did little else. She was a necessary part of Stella moving past her social obligations and not an important part of their 'family' like Stolas felt. Stella has never called Via her daughter in the show. The first time she addresses that Via exists is to accuse Stolas of "turning her against" Stella in Seeing Stars. I don't think she wanted or understood what a real relationship would be with Via, despite what Stolas tried. A child might be entertaining for outings but couldn't provide the kind of attention Stella sought. Any child Stolas raised wouldn't share Stella's conceited viewpoints, either. While Stella doesn't appear to hate Octavia, I think she's completely neutral, to a dangerous extent. This isn't too far from historic nobility/royalty, either, where marriage and children were ways to secure power and not done out of love. Stella is mostly indifferent to Via. She cares that she can potentially take Via's attention and opinions away from Stolas, but I think she doesn't deeply care about Via the way a parent is meant to.

Family Portraits: Hiding in Plain Sight

I've seen SO MANY people point out the family portraits as signs that Stella wanted to be a loving wife. But I disagree. Sure, Stella put on a smile for them, but she never touched Stolas or Octavia in them. The Loo Loo Land portrait is the only one where she even looks at either of them, and she has her arms crossed to avoid physical contact. In older artwork before her redesign, she IS touching Stolas, but by painfully gripping/pinching his wrist while he subtly winces/scrunches his eyes. This abusive dynamic is not a retcon. It was always planned.

Stella has had no individual portraits so far with Octavia, yet Stolas had them since Episode 2 (right above the doodles on her bedroom wall). And in the only portrait with just Stella and Stolas, Stolas is leaning away looking terrified. The illusion that she was a 'proper' wife/mother was just part of Stella's role and, I'm guessing, something Andre probably also encouraged. Again speaking from personal experience, this isn't uncommon for an abuser. It all helps strengthen the public's opinion that they're right, that their life is ideal and the victim is the one who breaks the family. Privilege can easily hide problems.

The "Not Divorced" Party

Just-a-theory note: I think Stella's short-sightedness caused the biggest fuckup in her/Andre's abuse that finally gave Stolas his break. The party in The Circus was couples only. Andre wouldn't have been able to attend, unable to help or to hover over Stolas if needed to keep him in line. Congrats, Stella. You dug your abusive schemes their own grave.

The Party as Abuse

For all of the "Stella lacks depth" arguments, this party was one hell of a confident power move on Stella's part. It wasn't a "let's celebrate our marriage" but a "let's celebrate me for sticking with this disappointment of a husband." Stolas might've been the prince, and this might've been his palace, but she was showing the upperclass of Hell that he was the lucky one to have her there. Skinny, lanky, boring, bad in bed: Stolas was so pathetic, but they still weren't divorced! This party gave Stella her social outlet while reminding Stolas that he was stuck with her and no one else wanted him.

Why Stolas Couldn't "Refuse" to Go

I don't like the argument that Stolas could just "refuse" to go to this Not Divorced party. That's not how abuse works. An abuse victim is never given a way to 'get out' of consequences, only minimize them. This party was intended to trap him.Stella planned it at their (Stolas') palace, in their ballroom, To the public eye, HE was co-hosting. She didn't tell him about it, leaving him to find out either when attendees showed up or when he read it as an advertisement in the newspaper. By the time Stolas knew this party was happening, he was left with the following options:

Attend the party, where he'd be miserable but present. Stella would get her party, shut up, and move on. As net-neutral a choice as possible.

Cancel the party/throw people out as they arrived, as there wasn't time to cancel it with enough notice. Further degrade his society's opinion of him as he became the prince who advertised parties at his own home only to kick everyone out. Live forever with the violent retaliation for "ruining" Stella's public image and "destroying" her ability to throw her beloved parties because now no one trusts to come.

Not attend the party and spend the night as a metaphorical prisoner in his room or study. Still hear the party down the hall/under his bedroom balcony and have people crawl around his home without keeping track of it. Get further derided as the prince who held an event at his own palace and couldn't be bothered to show up. Live for the next several weeks/months with whatever violent retaliation Stella created for further "embarrassing" her in public for being a no-show.

There was no option that didn't just make him a further target.

Stolas slept with Blitzø during a party dedicated to him being undesirable. He slept with a lowerclass imp in the bed he shared with Stella, who derided poor people and held her lofty position as key to her identity. At a party that made Stella look good for staying with him, he demanded a divorce. Suddenly, Stella's abuse tactics were blowing up in her face. Stolas was acting out of her control, and out of the social norms that she was so deeply entrenched into.

"Justified" Violence & Losing Control

From this point, Stella's verbal and physical violence escalated and become more open and public. From an outside perspective, it looked like a wife rightfully lashing out against an unfaithful husband. In reality, it was an abuser who suddenly had an easy excuse to retaliate against her victim. Not a reason, an excuse. She likely never considered that Stolas might actually act out against her. She'd spent 19 years pushing him into the mud, and Andre possibly spend those years convincing the public that Stolas was too weak and easily coerced to have autonomy. I think the both of them bought their own narrative so heavily that Stolas' attempts at autonomy in the show surprised them. Breaking away from an abuser is the most dangerous time for a victim.

To Stella, standard abuse was no longer enough. Stolas had slept with an imp, made them look like fools, and was continuing to sleep with the same imp. He didn't care how he looked to the other Goetia, and hating him publicly didn't shame him into submission. He stood in the way of the image Stella wanted. He went against the very conventions of their race. Stella didn't think about lines of inheritance, or that him dying would leave her in a more precarious situation. Short-sighted, impulsive, entitled Stella decided that it was time to fully exert her power as a member of the Goetian elite. Stolas had to go. Stella likely saw nothing unusual or extreme about her behavior. While her murderous response here seems extreme, it unfortunately reflects a situation actual victims find themselves in.

Then, while Stella was already plotting his assassination (and failed once), Stolas doubled-down and demanded the divorce. I find his, "I would be sorry if I had hurt you," line about sleeping with Blitzø fascinating, TBH. Because he is technically right. Stella had no emotional connection to Stolas. She is not hurt that he slept with someone else, that he betrayed some sort of trust and love between them. Stolas had no emotional obligations to Stella at this point, and never had as soon as the abuse began. But Stella doesn't value love or considering others: she values her image and position, and in her eyes, Stolas HAD hurt that. Does that mean Stolas was wrong to consider this not-cheating? Nope. Stolas' choices were his own. But the abusive dynamic, the control, the poor communication that led to Stolas' misery and his chaotic, risky way of breaking free: they were all of Stella's creation. If she had actually wanted a healthier situation between them, I'm convinced that nothing would have gone down like it did.

Stolas didn't care what the other Goetia thought of it, and using Andrealphus as a threat didn't work against him. Stolas was determined in a way Stella had clearly never seen before. He was completely out of her grasp. He kicked her out! In being kicked out, Stella no longer had a palace or wealth - she probably ended up moving in with her brother. At this point, she and Andre were both convinced that Stolas' things should be theirs, as they were superior in every way they valued. Stella knew that she wanted him dead, and once the divorce started, she wanted him to suffer, too. He had embarrassed her in public and now removed her from HER home. He deserved all of it.

And an important note: in real-life history, assassinations or executions for slights to a family (or perceived slights) were not uncommon. Stella just handled it in a brash, politically incorrect way, while Andre convinced her to play the longer political system instead. History is littered with royal/noble rivals who've done very similar things.

Stella Going Into Season 3

I do find it interesting how blind she is to her own vulnerabilities. Despite having Stolas out of the palace, she's in much the same position she was when she shared it with him, if not a riskier one. With the divorce, Stella is likely no longer a "princess," if she ever was one. A divorce probably makes her "less desirable" despite her beauty. She has no husband, no individual property, no independent wealth.

Also, Andre controls Stolas' palace while Via is underage, but once she reaches adulthood, everything goes to her. Andre and Stella living there or having any of the power/influence will be completely at her discretion. I see some of this becoming a conflict in S3-S4, and I don't expect Stella to suddenly develop a better conscious or more mothering instincts when it happens... especially if she continues to let Andre take the reins.

I think a lot of the backstory stuff I've guessed at is going to be shown in S3. We're going to see an explanation of how Stella was molded into who she is now, but it's not going to be an excuse. Stella thrives on the crooked system that made her and doesn't want to alter it. If anything, I expect her character arc to continue to make her worse while also showing her as Andre's willing pawn. Stella is a victim of a crooked system who has chosen to be part of it for her own benefit. If she doesn't "develop" in a positive way, I don't think it's because the writers are inadequate or that they skipped her over. It's because Stella is the type of individual who does not want to change or improve. She lets Andre do the heavier scheming work and still gets what she wants. Stella has no interest in breaking the problematic cycles of abuse. She sees them as correct, and she gets what she wants by perpetuating them.

[trailmix-silent]

"Millie cheated!" - why it's wrong and kinda misogynistic

I started writing this not long after the season finale, but I only finished it now. I'm sure many people have already voiced similar opinions on Millie's pregnancy reaction, but whatever. I wanted to rant about it too.

So I mainly want to address a theory that appeared soon after Sinsmas aired, and it seems many people believe in it. Many seem to think Millie cheated on Moxxie, which is why she seemed so distressed when she found out she's pregnant. I think that's pretty much the only argument behind that theory, but correct me if I'm wrong.

Honestly, not only do I not believe in this theory, but I think it's kinda ridiculous.

As we've seen throughout the show, Millie clearly loves Moxxie. As of now, they've only been married for a little over a year, and they still seem to be in the lovey-dovey phase. They flirt, compliment each other, and are just really wholesome together. Not only that, but Millie has put her life on the line numerous times to save Moxxie. From fighting a giant fish monster, to breaking into a human government facility, to single-handedly eliminating most of a mafia family. Moxxie has also saved her multiple times, like in Murder Family. It seems like there's nothing they wouldn't do for each other.

Additionally, there doesn't seem to be any issues in the bedroom. We all know Millie happily pegs Moxxie on the reg. They've also flirted in a not-so-innocent way. And let's not forget the whole spinning-and-shooting-while-making-out thing they did in C.H.E.R.U.B.

And if that wasn't enough, she has shown no interest in other potential partners. Like, anytime someone flirts with her, she either looks disgusted, or straight-up kicks them across the room.

All this to say, Millie seems to be pretty happy in her marriage, and doesn't crave any outside affection. I can't think of any reason as to why she would cheat on Moxxie. With this in mind, what other reasons could there be behind her negative reaction to her pregnancy? I have a few suggestions:

First, the pregnancy could be unplanned. Actually, that's most likely the case. Because believe it or not, a woman's natural reaction to an unplanned pregnancy is usually not to leap of joy.

Second, she could be nervous about Moxxie's reaction when he finds out. Obviously he's not gonna be mad or aggressive, I think Millie knows that. But it's possible that they haven't even discussed having children yet, so she has no idea if he'll be happy or upset. Or, on the contrary, maybe Moxxie has said he doesn't want kids. Given his severe daddy issues, he may not want to be a father himself. Whatever the case may be, an unexpected pregnancy can damage even the happiest of marriages.

Third, financial issues. IMP is a very small company, and we've seen that all the employees are struggling to pay the bills. The most recent example would be Blitzø and Stolas stealing clothes from a store. We've also seen M&M's apartment building, which looks old and run-down. Under such circumstances, taking care of and providing for a baby is not ideal.

Fourth, the dangerous conditions of their work. Both Millie and Moxxie travel to the human world to assassin people for a living. Many times, they have ended up in dire and even life-threatening situations. What if one day, one of them won't return home? I can't see them both quitting, since they seem pretty happy with their profession, and being unemployed wouldn't exactly improve their finances.

Finally, and this may sound crazy, but what if Millie just...doesn't want kids? Like, at all? That's also a very real possibility.

So, with all of this in mind, why do so many immediately accuse Millie of cheating? I'm no expert, but I think these accusations stem from some classic TV drama tropes. According to tvtropes.org, surprise pregnancies can result from a fling, an affair, a long-term relationship, or through supernatural influence. We can rule out the fling, and probably also supernatural means. So the father is either Moxxie, or an affair partner.

Cheating is a very common theme in TV shows and movies. It adds drama and conflict, which makes a plot more exciting. So I suppose it's not completely strange that some believe this is the case with Millie. Though, I believe there's more to it. I actually think this could be a case of unrealistic gender norms (just hear me out).

For much of history, women have been expected and even pressured to bear children. That has created a distorted image of what women want, that still persists today. Surely you've heard or seen someone online talking about how "all women deep down want children" or "women can only be happy as mothers". At times, this can bleed into the media we consume. How many times have you really seen a happy childless couple in a TV show? As a contrast, how many times have you seen a woman be unhappy, then she gets a child, and suddenly all her sadness is gone? Or the classic childless career woman, who's bitter and angry all the time? You get it.

Media often portrays motherhood as the happy ending for all women, which is just inaccurate, especially in modern times. More and more women are choosing not to have kids for various reasons. They live happy, fulfilled lives. It seems that this shift in society is slowly being recognized by writers and portrayed properly, which is great. However, those outdated expectations are still present.

Going back to Millie, if we look at her life, it seems that so far, she's walking the path that many women in stories have walked before. She met a good man, fell in love with him, and married him. Now they're a young happy couple who's been married for just over a year. Now there's only one thing left: children.

For a viewer who's used to this classic story, to the point where they expect it, it's not surprising that they are suspicious over Millie's reaction. On the surface, it seems she has no reason to be upset over being pregnant with her loving husband's child. Thus, by that logic: she must have cheated.

I don't really have anything else to say, so I'll wrap this up. To summarize: Millie is not a cheater, she has plenty of valid reasons to react they way she did, all women are different, and media has lied to you.

If you agree, disagree, or just wanna add something else, feel free to comment your thoughts! I'm curious about what other people think. Just...y'know...don't be a dick.

Have one last cute M&M pic:

[definitive-receipt]

The Very Disjointed Themes and Subtext of Helluva Boss

-It's okay to drink and abuse medication! [The Circus, Stolas having no reprecussions for his actions]

-If someone is disrespectful and not understanding it's because they're un-medicated and you shouldn't take them seriously [Sinsmas towards Stolas]

-It's okay to treat lower class/poor people with disrespect because they just have nothing better to do then be poor [Oops, Western Energy towards Striker]

-It's okay to cheat on your partner if they're abusive all the abuse is one-sided and you don't need the other partners' side of the story! [The Circus towards Stella]

-If you're a child of divorce then it's your fault and you have to fix that relationship yourself otherwise why even consider yourself a good child! [Sinsmas towards Octavia]

-Divorced children shouldn't be upset towards their parents if they don't know the full story and should be told excuses about why the divorce happened, not the truth [Sinsmas towards Octavia]

-If you question your parents' parenting don't! Cut them some slack they're 'trying their best' is all people will tell you making excuses for them [Seeing Stars towards Octavia]

-If you've been abused it's okay to abuse others around you, they don't know how hard you've had it! [Stolas, Blitzo, and Loonas treatment in general]

-If you're in a relationship, it's 80/20 over discussing problems you see fit and you should always sacrifice for the other even if the other barely notices or recognizes you about it [Respectively Blitzo, Millie, and Fizzes treatment within relationships]

-If you've been dumped by someone hold onto that grudge for as long as you can it's totally justified to not move on, you go girl! [Spring Broken and Apology Tour towards Verrosika]

-Alcoholism is cool and you don't need to change yourself one bit, it's hell it's okay if characters consistently drink and the show displays it as a sign of power hell yeah, 'Fuck it up'! Who needs to get better or sober when you're in hell you deserve that drink![Crimson drinking, Stolas drinking, Stella drinking, Blitzo drinking, Loona drinking, Moxxie drinking, Belzebub drinking, Mammon drinking]

-If you're having a child your family comes first over your partner! [Sinsmas towards Millie] *though not that egregious really eyebrow raising as to why she hesitated telling him about it but she's okay with telling her family first?

-Starting arguments and belittling anyone who tries to argue back with you even if they're right is so not cool especially when they call out how you treat others. Just cry and guilt trip it's not your fault! [Apology Tour towards Verrosika and Stolas]

-Don't rekindle old friendships because acknowledging a misunderstanding is bad and the other person probably doesn't want anything to do with you! [Oops with Fizzeroli and Blitzo]

-Cheating if you're gay is a-okay [Sinsmas with Blitzo, Stolas in general]

-Risking your life for a side-piece and part-time lover is expected, after all you do love them don't you so you should put your life on the line for them! [Sinsmas with Stolas]

[h0r53f7y]

Spoilers for Sinsmas being discussed:

As painful as the episode was, I'm glad that Stolas is handling this situation maturely. He is hurting, which is perfectly valid, but he also knows this is all on him, and isn't blaming anyone else. That's a lot of growth in him already, and I look forward to seeing more in him, as well as realizing much like the Sin of Pride needs to, that while he has fucked up, and needs to be accountable for that, he still deserves loves and happiness. Hopefully it won't take forever for Octavia to see things as they are, while she is valid in being hurt. Hope she stays safe too, given she's literally the only thing keeping Stella from all Stolas owns