#after iwtv and in the later books i very much think that if louis was ever like 'armand i want you again in the way we were in paris'

[thelioncourts]

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[cbrownjc]

Some spoiler thoughts for episode 2x05

I haven't done a rewatch yet, so these are just some initial thoughts on the episode (spoilers):

Daniel was so not let go after those 3 days. Bank on it.

Daniel already said it -- the drug den thing was a fabrication of his memories being rewritten. But, more to it, Louis' memories of that time were also rewritten. Between that as well as his extensive burn? Who knows what Louis even remembers of the 1970s either.

Neither Louis nor Daniel remember a damn thing of what happened during what would be the Devil's Minion period! (Particually because who knows how long it took Louis to even heal. With those types of burns, I'm going to say a few years at least.)

The show left things extremely open-ended for both Daniel and Louis' characters at the end of the flashbacks which can be filled with whatever the show writers might have ideas about that time period over how many whatever seasons. They haven't locked themselves into one single thing going forward leaving it open-ended that way.

Yeah, even if they want Louis and Daniel to have had sex sometime later. Because again, they both don't remember anything. 😏

But Armand -- Armand does. He remembers all of it. And oh you dear, f-ed up gremlin, I really did think you might not have been responsible for Daniel's memories, but now I'm starting to wonder . . . .

Louis, in 1973, doing what he does in Merrick. Because it was remembering Claudia -- how she manipulated him -- that sent him running into the sun. And even though he tried -- and failed -- to do it in 1973, he's going to fully remember it in the present day too IMO and, this time, he'll succeed at doing it.

Because yes, in Merrick, Louis actually succeeds in killing himself. It's only because of how vampire blood works, and a lot of it being poured over Louis' body, that he is revived. And I really think we are headed toward a "rule of three" wrt this. I think Armand clocked Louis was close to killing himself sometime directly after Paris because of maybe almost really trying so, and that is why Armand put a veil up over Louis' mind.

Because even back in 1973 it's clear that Louis actually didn't remember the bit about Claudia until he drank Daniel's drugged-up blood! Between that and Arman directly saying "She didn't love you!" (which yes, was a line taken directly from toward the end of the IWTV book that Armand says to Louis about Claudia), whatever cloud Louis was actually under in 1973 lifted for a bit . . . enough for him to run out into that sun and almost succeeded -- which I feel we'll learn/see was actually his second attempt.

His third (and final) attempt will be in the finale. And that time will be the one that succeeds. (And then he'll be resurrected/reborn).

"Am I going to be on suicide watch for the next 1000 years?" Yeah, Armand, it looks very well that you are -- will be.

I loved Luke as young Daniel! And I feel very sure we're going to see more of him. He and Jacob had such a bouncy chemistry.

And oh, the scenes between him and Assad as Armand -- so creepy and sinister! Just what it should be at this point in time between Daniel and Armand, at the beginning of things. They even had Daniel held prisoner in the house for three days, the same length of time he was held in the cage in the books. But everything Armand did to Daniel here was so much more unnerving, particularly the chair thing.

So . . . Armand really didn't know the Talamasca was watching then? Hmm, okay show but I'm side-eyeing that one. Because really, he should have IMO.

Though I did notice that Daniel strategically didn't show Louis the pictures of him and Armand taking Daniel out of the house. Which I still don't think makes any freakin' sense, them doing it the way they did, even with Louis being hurt like that. I supposed Louis wanted to make sure Armand didn't hurt Daniel still, but . . . .

And oh, Armand. I can see any and all attempts to defend you wrt what is coming have really slipped away much after this. I know why you are doing all of this, I get it I do, but . . . *sigh*

You should have told Louis that Lestat was saying, "I love you." But you are still so scared of being alone . . . this is all going to bite you back next season Armand. So, so much.

Would I say it's my most favorite episode of the show ever so far? Not yet. But I known it's the one of Season 2 that I'm going to rewatch over and over the most so far. Yes, I love it for the beginning of Devil's Minion that it gave us, of course. But I love that it also really started to show the friendship and trust that Rolin Jones kept saying last season was between Louis and Daniel. Louis and Daniel just being friends is something I never expected going into the show and has become such a favorite dynamic of mine too.

So yeah, it was a wonderful episode. I do think it was hyped up a bit too much in the "most disturbing thing I've ever seen" department because I actually did not find it to be all that disturbing in the horror department. But as far as character development and dynamic building goes it was stellar and revealed some great things, so I can ignore my little nitpicks.

[alwynwitch]

Raglan James, Marius de Romanus and Daniel Molloy's memory loss

Okay, this sounds insane and I could be very wrong... but I still think it is possible that Justin Kirk plays Marius. Hear me out.

Obviously, Raglan James is a real character and I think AMC is going to use him (for later iwtv seasons and maybe for their talamasca show as well). But in season 1 Rashid was also really Armand... and Rashid is now a real character with a role in the story as well. The same could be true for Raglan James.

So, why would Marius be impersonating Raglan James?

Mainly, because he feels protective and responsible for Daniel. I think Marius played a role in Daniel's memory loss and recovery as a person after the first interview (and possible chase/love affair with Armand). Armand and Louis left him broken and confused and needed someone to help and take care of him. Enter Marius.

Biggest clue:

Roman Weiss Publishing House? Like, come on. No publishing house is called like that, unless it is connected to Marius de Romanus. Also, this is Daniel's memoir, his other books are published at a different (normal) publishing house. But the memoir that is connected to his memory loss is published by Roman Weiss.... hmmmm....

Don't forget: in the books it was Marius who helped Daniel recover after he lost his mind. Daniel stayed with Marius for years. Marius loved Daniel and loved taking care of him.

(And yes I think AMC!Armand can know at this point that Marius is alive, because I think Lestat will tell him out of spite before Armand throws him off the tower. And Marius's painting is in the Dubai Penthouse.)

I think the Talamasca really has a stake in the interview and sent an agent, Raglan James (who I suspect still works for them at this point). But Marius interfered and kidnapped Raglan James and threw him in his basement.

He wants to help Daniel with his memories. He could be annoyed at Armand and Louis that they are toying with Daniel now, after all he did to take care of Daniel. And he is invested in the bigger picture of the vampire world. He is still taking care of Those Who Must Be Kept and will be aware of the great conversion, because it impacts them (and Amel). He might not like the idea that the Talamasca knows too much about this. And he might know Raglan James is a bad person and he doesn't want him near Daniel (and Armand).

So in this new role he can help Daniel and as a double agent he can keep Raglan James and the Talamasca at bay.

(The Talamasca seems to have a more active role in the AMC Universe than in the books, see also Mayfair Witches. So vampires might also engage with them more actively.)

Are there clues that Raglan James is not who he says he is?

A few. He speaks weirdly. He articulated his name in a weird way and Daniel immediately asked: "Got a real name?" Like he doesn't believe it. It is a clue for the audience: something is going on and we need to pay attention.

And he seems to be bad at his job. Raglan James was not bad at his job, he was just reckless because of bad character. He was actually a genius, but bored and distracted easily. He got kicked out of the Talamasca, because he was using his paranormal powers and knowlegde for personal gain. He lied to the Talamasca and robbed them. David says in ToTBT: "He deceived us with elaborate fabrications and counterfeit records on a scale you wouldn't believe. He loves that sort of connivance." And: "With his gifts he should have been able to deceive us forever."

And look at his interaction with Daniel:

Raglan James says awkwardly (and too loudly): "I will stop looking at you now." And pretends to have a phone conversation. At the end, the whole restaurant is looking at them and listening.

Does that look like a genius secret agent who could have deceived the Talamasca forever? I don't think so. A good agent would have the situation under control. Something is off. Is it Marius? Pathetic, nerdy, vain and controlfreak Marius who thought he could play a secret agent and failed miserably? Maybe.

[nalyra-dreaming]

Hello! Interested in your encyclopaedic knowledge on this. Skim-rereading the VC now for first time since I was a teenager and have to ask - does Louis ever, like - do anything for Lestat? This prompted particularly by TOTBT which my god is so savage. I can’t believe he’s happy to just… let him die?!? He doesn’t lift a finger, he doesn’t even try to protect him? It’s IWTV all over again, only supposedly their relationship is much better by this point.

It got me looking for examples where Louis does anything whatsoever proactive for Lestat and I’m really struggling. At the end of QotD, it seems like lots of the other vamps are trying to look after traumatised Lestat a bit, but I don’t think Louis comes to him? He just wanders off to New Orleans? Maybe I’ve missed a bit though. He looks after him a bit in his coma? Although not moreso than anyone else. But in the end it is Lestat who ends up waking up to save Louis. Even that bit in PLaTRoA where Lestat is about to have his heart stopped - Louis sitting next to his coffin - but Lestat reaches out to take Louis’ hand, not the other way round. Aside from verbally saying that he loves him, other than being generally nice and calm and polite, does Louis ever do anything to show it?

Hey nonny!

(Not sure about the encyclopedic but I‘ll try 😅💕) I do see a lot of the mentioned events a bit differently, allow me to explain (this is gonna be long^^):

Soooo to address your mention of TtotBT first off, I personally do think Louis thought of Lestat first and foremost when he sent him away in that scene.

Louis was tempted. It's no surprise imho that Jacob really wants to do that scene with Sam, because the power dynamics are inverted of course, but it is also emotionally very raw.

I want to pause here and recall a quote from QotD here, which is important:

Louis, the watcher, the patient one, was there on account of love pure and simple. The two had found each other only last night, and theirs had been an extraordinary reunion. Louis would go where Lestat led him. Louis would perish if Lestat perished. But their fears and hopes for this night were heartbreakingly human.

Louis... would perish if Lestat perished.

For Louis to send Lestat away... is to resign himself to death also. I think that has to be taken into account for the scene you mentioned, where Louis decides that Lestat deserves to save his soul, before Louis himself deserves to save his own. His rejection of Lestat there is done in full knowledge that he condemns himself there to a very lonely, cold, and ultimately fatal existence. He rejects Lestat there, knowing he will lose his greatest love.

I wouldn't call that happy to let him die? And I, personally, don't see it as a parallel to IWTV either, though it might feel a bit like that for Lestat, but the Louis here knows how much this will hurt. He knows what he is doing. He is condemning himself, hoping it will free Lestat.

And, while we're on TtotBT, in the beginning of the book there is the mention of Louis coming by Lestat's, to 'Netflix & chill', to share space and spend time, watch movies (for example "Company of the wolves", just being there. Talk. Discuss. Being together. So Louis did come by, for Lestat. And Lestat visited Louis, in his shack, had his own chair there. They were in each other's lives.

And... in the end of that book - when David show's up? What does Louis do? He takes David in. Makes room for David in their old home in Rue Royale. Accepts David - for Lestat. Accompanies them, too. Honestly, given David is David... that is a HUGE sacrifice! He let's David, the new fledgling, into their home. Because he is Lestat's. Later on, in PL, he will do the same for Antoine, which is obviously something that had to grate quite a lot as well, and I have always seen that as a rather conscious decision to allow it. To allow Antoine into their lives, because he is Lestat's.

Louis also tries to protect Lestat before the concert.

I know a lot of people read that from Lestat's POV and are just happy with the reunion (and of course it is beautiful and I really want to see it on the show!!) but... it's not only that.

Louis comes, to Lestat, not only because he can do so. But he pleads for Lestat to stay safe, too, to not do the concert. Because he is afraid for Lestat. He wants to keep him safe, wants to keep him with himself, too. He pleads with him not to go on stage. Offers to talk, to make plans, to 'Let us have each other in this century the way we never did in the past'.

You mentioned the end of QotD, and... in their universe, all that happens right after this reunion. A few days, a week at most. And then Lestat hides himself away again, in a room, trying to cope. Because he has been used again, abused, too, in a way he himself can only cope with by reframing it as love.

Louis knows it isn't. Wasn't. And he knows that he and Lestat cannot talk freely with the others there. He and Lestat are not able to use the mind gift directly. And... he is deeply unsettled by Jesse's report, the report she gives Lestat. Claudia's ghost. Deeply, deeply personal and something they share, very painfully. They go by Louis' tombstone, and then they can talk. A bit. Louis trusts Lestat and in his new powers. Falls asleep in his arms.

And that... is a rather powerful statement.

Louis (admittedly begrudgingly) enters that "adventure" with Lestat, fully trusting in Lestat. Kissing, embracing. Sleeping in his arms. It's a statement.

A statement that, despite Lestat feeling changed, and alien, that Louis still trusts him. Trusts in him, too.

And it is Louis, who tries to take Lestat home in Memnoch, Louis who pleads, begs for Lestat to be released. Louis who cries out when Lestat is locked up. Louis is the one who saves the books, Louis is the one who tries to comfort Lestat. Louis is the one who holds the proverbial fort at Rue Royale, with David, for long, long years. Louis is the one who despairs, eventually, when Lestat goes back into that half-awake coma, his soul taken away by angels.

Though there is more to that, too. You say Louis did not look after Lestat more than others, and I'd beg to differ. Louis was the one in the chapel, guarding Lestat. Holding his ground with the ancients, and the riff raff that Armand hunted down (even once with Lestat later). Louis is the one who keeps Ruy Royale, and makes sure Lestat is kept clean during his episodes of stillness, and it is only when he breaks, eventually, when Merrick takes his focus... that that... stops. When the Merrick events start, David visits Lestat, and Louis is 'there, seated on the marble beside Lestat, reading in a hushed voice from an old book of English poetry'.

Louis never leaves Lestat's side for long. Armand notes how he seems emaciated, hungry when Armand comes by in his version of the tale.

It is only when Merrick's spell unfolds that Louis leaves Lestat's side, that his focus shifts. And with the shift to Claudia and her ghost... the despair takes hold.

And it is when Louis heartbeat stops - that the "angels" lose their blackmailing material.

Lestat later tells of how he was forced to do "their bidding" by them threatening to take the eye... and though he doesn't elaborate... it is very clear what that means wrt Louis.

Because there simply was nothing else they could threaten him with anymore. Nothing else was more important than Louis. Not his eye, not his soul.

This always sends a shiver down my spine.

But that just as a note.

Louis is the one who accepts Lestat's judgment, after Merrick's creation.

He also accepts Lestat abandoning New Orleans, eventually, because Lestat cannot stand it anymore to kill the riff raff, those who "offend Armand", something Lestat calls "autocratic, ruthless" wrt to Armand's killing of them.

Louis accepts Lestat's decision there, and goes to Armand. Something that Lestat in turn accepts and supports(!):

My beloved Louis de Pointe du Lac left soon after, and from that time on lived in New York with Armand. Armand keeps the island of Manhattan safe for them—Louis, Armand, and two young blood drinkers, Benjamin and Sybelle, and whoever else joins them in their palatial digs on the Upper East Side.

And when Lestat is finally ready, it is Louis who apologizes to Lestat for the "past" by hunting a woman who wanted to murder her husband - in front of Lestat.

Personally, I find that a very poignant "doing-it-for-someone" :)))

But there is more.

Louis is the one who rescues Rose! Rose, Lestat's charge. Louis knows about Rose. Lestat's lawyers know about Louis. Louis takes over when Lestat is unreachable.

There is so much in these simple facts!

Like, they must have talked about Rose. Louis knows about Rose, knows she is important to Lestat, he takes the responsibility, saves her from fire, kills the ones who harmed her. Brings her to him. And he is the one Lestat's lawyers reach out to when Lestat is gone? Unreachable? What a statement is that in and by itself?! Louis is the one Lestat trusts with that child, the girl he saved and who will become his immortal daughter. Their immortal daughter.

And then, when Rhosh is there in NYC, at that table, and the axe scene happens... what does Louis do?

He smiles.

Now I don't know if you know that scene well, but it is quite the scene, and I honestly cannot wait to see it on the show.

And Louis... smiles. Shows support.

Quiet. Steadfast. The support Lestat needs, probably more than he consciously realizes.

And then, of course, later on - knowing what "Lestat cannot confide". They are finally sharing blood again, and Louis becomes Lestat's confidant. To all the things Lestat cannot speak about, all the things he has hinted at but cannot put into words. All the things that are too heavy to address.

That is no trifle.

And the silver cord, where Louis pushes the matter against Lestat's (not) better judgement. Where Louis is there, for Lestat to reach out.

Your ask made it seem (a bit) as if being there and offering is not sufficient, but strength shows itself in very different ways. Lestat is more direct, "flashy". Louis' strength is more subtle, it is an offer for support, unwavering support, whenever Lestat wants it. For as long as Lestat wants it. Not taking agency from Lestat, which is like the worst thing that could happen again... because that is something that has been taken from Lestat again, and again, and again. And Louis knows that.

And so he doesn't.

He doesn't take. He offers. It shows he knows Lestat. And he accepts him, and their respective pasts, and all the shit that has happened.

Again, that is no trifle, imho.

There is more. Little mentions, in the books.

A "grotto" they once shared. For example. Louis wearing the clothes Lestat chooses.

But for the most part you have to "read between the lines" as Lestat says, for the juicy details - however, I think when you consider the arcs? The arcs that span all the books?

The things we are told actually speak for themselves, imho.

Louis does a lot of things for Lestat. The important things, actually.

He is there for Lestat to turn to when Lestat's strength fails.

And yes, that includes the rejection in TtotBT - because Louis thought he had to be the one to show the strength for Lestat - to hold fast to the initial belief. The initial hope that drove the body switch - because Lestat had just found out he could not die anymore. Even if he tried. And he had tried. And it had sent him spiraling.

Would Louis have held out indefinitely? Probably not :) But that's another discussion.

[knightotoc]

Just finished IWTV book, so now I can say the differences between the book, movie, and show. The movie is quite accurate to the book, while the show is more original. I love them all quite a lot, but I think the show is my favorite since it's the most romantic. Long post with spoilers below the cut.

book:

The depth of Louis' interiority, especially his thoughts about religion, can only be found in the book. I am also ex-Catholic so this is high-key my shit. Especially knowing Anne Rice went back and forth later in life. I can relate. Louis wants to talk about his feelings with other vampires, but Lestat and Claudia aren't interested, which is the main reason Louis is attracted to Armand. Where is the Brideshead Revisited crossover?? Louis get in a bisexual love triangle with the Flytes for me🙏

I learned in the Matt Baume video on Anne Rice that she wrote IWTV while grieving her daughter, who died of leukemia just before her sixth birthday. This feeling of grief, reflected so clearly in Claudia, is the most moving and unique aspect of the book, far more than anything between the adult characters.

One reason this feeling is watered-down in both adaptations is that in the book, Claudia is only 5/6, the age of Anne's real daughter. In the movie she is 10 and in the show 14. Of course it would be impossible to find a 6 year old actress who could act with the maturity of an 80-year-old woman. But the character is even more pitiful and bizarre as a little child than as one nearing puberty.

In the book, Lestat is shown to have survived the murder attempt pretty early on, and he keeps jump-scaring Louis and Claudia on their adventures. I prefer the movie's version where they hold off on this reveal. Though of course I always love to see him, lol

In the book, I got the impression that Lestat and Louis are both bi, but Lestat prefers men and Louis prefers women. Still, their motivations aren't driven by sexuality in a straightforward way. For example, Lestat's ideal prey is a young man, because he loves to destroy their potential. Louis feels something like love for a few women characters, because he feels empathy for their misfortunes.

The adaptations soften/change Louis' status as a slave-owner; in the movie, he frees his slaves, and in the book he just flees. As much as Louis is a soft-hearted quasi-feminist, defined by his guilt and regret, he is still racist and close-minded in most ways. This seems realistic to me.

I did think it was interesting and cool that the enslaved people can tell Louis and Lestat aren't human, while the other plantation owners and even Lestat's dad have no idea. But we don't get their perspective, just Louis' racist assumptions.

Yeah in the book Lestat has a dad! It is rather confusing since Lestat explains nothing, but it creates some great melodrama. I guess I have to read the next one and hope for a backstory reveal.

Fun spooky detour into Eastern Europe! I hope the show goes there in season 2.

Louis and Armand's discussions are really cool. I especially loved Louis' monologues after Claudia's death. There wasn't room for these discussions in the movie, but I feel like it'll be a main focus in season 2 of the show.

movie:

Like I said, the movie is impressively accurate, and a beautiful work of art on its own. The best innovation is holding off on the Lestat reveal until almost the very end. This makes it look like their murder attempt really did a number on him, and it took decades and decades of rat-eating to even drag himself out of the swamp. I like that.

The movie also has a more exciting and ridiculous ending, in which Lestat attacks the reporter in his car and drives away to Guns N' Roses. The book ends with the reporter hurrying off to find Lestat himself. It's funnier and more awesome if Lestat is the one driving the plot and the car. Pleased to meet you :D

"How avant-garde." Best line in the movie, and it's not from the book!

Since the movie cut out most of the minor characters, there isn't as much evidence for Louis' bisexuality. Louis seems more like, gay but closeted. And Lestat seems more like, gay but misogynist, so he'll prey on women just for sport lol.

I'm a Fight Club guy so I love that this is, like, a reverse companion movie (this time, Brad Pitt is the pushover in a dangerous gay duo)

show:

This is the only version that is clearly gay. But this dynamic is the same: Louis wants to talk about things, and Lestat does not. In this case, the focus of these discussions is not vampirism or religion but their relationship. Louis points out that he is gay and Lestat is bi. Perhaps it's just because I saw this version first, but this is my favorite version of their sexualities. The show simply spends more time with this dynamic, and how it affects everything, including their interracial relationship and openness in society.

In the book, Lestat is a talented but soulless musician. He can play anything, but without heart. In the show, music is Lestat's one genuine connection to humanity (even if this connection just leads him to kill musicians who don't impress him). I believe later books go more into Lestat as a musician, so I'll have more thoughts on this later.

Since the reporter is cynical, old, and dying, this creates a much more compelling conversation within the framing device. He holds Louis to task with a forcefulness that rivals Lestat. It is a clever way of modernizing the story, since Daniel references their last interview in the 70s (when the book was published), and you are meant to wonder which version is more truthful.

Since Claudia is 14, she can pass as an adult, and she is able to go on her own rather disastrous adventure. It is exciting, terrifying, and sad, and a welcome addition for this character, though it is much different than the book's helpless, heartless Claudia.

The Catholicism in the show is flashier, but not as interesting as the book. For example, in the book, Louis is haunted not just by Paul's death, but Louis' failure to meet Paul's faith-driven monetary demands. In the show, Paul's ideas seem like more of an annoyance. Maybe there will be more religious doubt in season 2, but I don't really expect it.

In the book, it seems like Louis and Claudia throw Lestat in the swamp since it's faster and more thorough than fire. In the show, the oven they use is a major plot point, and Louis can't bear to put Lestat's body in it because he still loves him. Instead they throw Lestat in the trash, which is one of my favorite tropes (see: Maul in The Clone Wars, Soldier 1998). This is just one of the many ways the show complicates and deepens Louis and Lestat's bond.

I feel like the show is more believable and has more deepness in general, since it's a smart retrospective on an old franchise and a response to decades of vampire fun in pop culture. For example, in the show Louis has volunteer humans to feast upon, and it's very "safe, sane, and consensual," versus the universally predatory relationships in the book and movie. Because we all know now that if vampires were real, and they were hot and rich, they could get all the blood they want without hurting anyone. An ethical vampire like Louis isn't impossible anymore. Compared to other billionaires, he's a pretty decent guy.

So, I'd say the book has the most profound perspective on grief, the movie has better structure, and the show has the most complex romance.

[ladymelisande]

You know reading this part of IWTV again. I can see why Lestat tore the book to shreds.

“ ‘But Louis …’ Lestat was saying softly. ‘How can you be as you are, how can you stand it?’ He was looking up at me, his mouth in that same grimace, his face wet with tears. ‘Tell me, Louis, help me to understand! How can you understand it all, how can you endure?’ And I could see by the desperation in his eyes and the deeper tone which his voice had taken that he, too, was pushing himself towards something that for him was very painful, towards a place where he hadn’t ventured in a long time. But then, even as I looked at him, his eyes appeared to become misty, confused. And he pulled the robe up tight, and shaking his head, he looked at the fire. A shudder passed through him and he moaned.

“ ‘I have to go now, Lestat,’ I said to him. I felt weary, weary of him and weary of this sadness. And I longed again for the stillness outside, that perfect quiet to which I’d become so completely accustomed. But I realized, as I rose to my feet, that I was taking the little baby with me.

“Lestat looked up at me now with his large, agonized eyes and his smooth, ageless face. ‘But you’ll come back … you’ll come to visit me … Louis?’ he said.

“I turned away from him, hearing him calling after me, and quietly left the house. When I reached the street, I looked back and I could see him hovering at the window as if he were afraid to go out. I realized he had not gone out for a long, long time, and it occurred to me then that perhaps he would never go out again.

It's clear why Lestat would be so furious at first, even if he loved Louis too much to reprimand him when they reunite later in the book. This is the only part of the book he actually says Louis is straight up lying and I can see why this part offended him. He didn't deny his treatment of Louis and Claudia but this scene pricked the hell out of him.

Why? I think it is because Louis implied that he couldn't endure. Like, Lestat had gone through a lot of shit by the time he wakes up in the 80s since the became a vampire: lost his relatively happy mortal life, lost his first boyfriend, all his family was killed, his mum bailed out, his own family tried to kill him, Armand locked him up, tortured him and then threw him from a tower. And yet with all he was determined to keep living.

And yes, Louis didn't know all the shit Lestat went through but hell, even before that he himself described Lestat as full of life. So is very rich coming from Mr. I Am Going To Make My Unlife As Miserable to Myself as I Can Because I Got Catholic Guilt™ to paint himself as the strong one.

I can see why this part of the book pissed Lestat off so much he would hold it over Louis' head years later.

[papayanna]

I just wrote an essay in someone else's tags about this but honestly it deserves its own post. I'm such a fan of how the writers have reframed Lestat and Louis' romance.

In the IWTV film and the original book, their entire romance is framed through the lens of Louis' bitterness and resentment towards Lestat. Though it is undeniable in both that there is underlying affection and dependency between the two, Louis seems so blinded by his own retrospective remorse about the way things ended with Lestat - plus Claudia's death of course. Plus, I got the distinct impression in both the film and book that Louis is embarrassed about his love for Lestat - I think largely because in hindsight he understands wholly what an asshole Lestat really was, and is ashamed that his younger self fell in love with him so easily. As a consequence, many of the good things about their relationship - especially Louis actually falling in love with Lestat - sort of get glossed over.

I kind of love this framing device and the use of the Obviously Biased Narrator, and I sort of hope we'll see some of that bitterness seep through in Louis' retelling in later episodes, but I think the changes to the story they made in episode one work so wonderfully!

In the TV show, we get to see Louis fall for Lestat in slow motion, every tiny event which pushes him over the edge. The writers go to careful lengths to demonstrate that the love between them was real, liberating, and incredibly significant to Louis. What's more, because Lestat is there right from the beginning, Louis falls in love with Lestat before being turned, rather than after, giving them the chance to actually know each other (and for Louis to have at least a modicum more of informed consent about being turned). In the end, Louis seeks out vampirism to escape being a societal outcast and find acceptance and empathy from someone who promises he is just like him. He seeks understanding, he chooses life and love beyond the constraints of the racist homophobic society he lives in. What a contrast to the suicidal and apathetic Louis of the books! I'm going to be honest, I love this change. It clearly puts WAY more emphasis on the love story between Louis and Lestat rather than just focusing on the themes of grief so present in the original. It also changes the idea of vampirism as something horrible foisted on Louis without his consent, to something he chooses out of love, out of desperation, yes, but also out of hope for a better future. (Though of course we've yet to see just how much Lestat was influencing events!)

In my opinion, IWTV the series and IWTV the book tell two very different stories, and Louis is two very different men in each of them. Aside from the more obvious changes to characters' backstories and appearances, the themes are different as is Louis' driving motivation. (Though I would argue that some of the more obvious changes - like Louis being a Black man - very clearly contribute to thematic changes and the difference in the way his love with Lestat is portrayed. Him constantly fighting for respect from white society and having to prove himself to people he is more than equal to definitely contributes to the thought that he can escape to a 'better' reality through vampirism.)

Anyway, I just love how the writers have changed this story! I think that although it's very different to the source material it definitely offers an equally compelling and beautiful - if thematically different - plot. I'm so excited to see where the series goes from here - for example, will Louis still struggle with Catholic guilt after rejecting Christianity so openly at the end of EP1? Since Louis actively chose vampirism/to be with Lestat, how will that impact their relationship? How will it impact the turning of Claudia? Especially in the context of Lestat's whiteness, has Louis really found the understanding kindred spirit he thinks he has? So many questions. Hopefully the remaining episodes will be just as brilliant as the first!

[licncourt]

I totally understand your opinion about amc Lestat but don't you think this could just be Louis' perspective on him? Or Claudia herself? They portrayed Lestat as a demon in first book, I want to give a chance to the 2 second , the show plays a lot with things from point of view and memory, I think people are giving up too soon...

I've talked about this before, but it was over a year ago now so I'll explain again.

While I understand where you're coming from, I honestly don't think it would matter to me. Even if what happened in ep 5 was 100% something Louis or Claudia dreamed up, I would still have major issues because:

Even though ep 1 had a content warning for Paul's suicide, there was absolutely nothing before ep 5, something that the viewers had established trust with the creators to do. I think there's one now on AMC+, but that was added weeks later after backlash. The showrunners doubling down and the episode director almost mocking fans who were upset was incredibly tasteless as well.

The story as pitched by the showrunners feels very much like bait and switch false advertising. It was pitched to the viewers as a gothic love story that was "the most faithful adaptation of IWTV ever". Not to mention the insane tonal shift into something that moved from fantasy violence against NPCs to brutal domestic violence and the vampire version of sexual assault. Anyone coming from the books had no reason to anticipate this dynamic between Loustat, nor would anyone who checked out the source material prior to see if they would be okay with it

If they go the "Louis/Claudia imagined this/made it up/misremembered the events" route, I think that's a questionable at best and offensive at worst narrative to put forth about domestic violence victims since the showrunners seem to not see anything wrong with it. Portraying it is one thing, not seeing how presenting domestic abuse as "the fallibility of memory" is pretty messed up is another

Especially considering Rolin Jones' comments after one of the episodes that he wanted to "play with race" as a white man, I find the ep 5 events combined with the dynamic in ep 6 gross as hell. It's explicitly referred to as being like a master/slave relationship, that's insane considering the stated goal of the show was to make the story modern and racially aware. Obviously AMC wants Loustat to be romantic endgame, but they're starting off with a white man basically owning his black partner and child like animals

My problems with the episode also extend to Claudia's sexual assault. Again, not something that was in the book at all but rather added by a white male creator because I guess that's the only way women are allowed to face adversity in media. Claudia is already an incredibly tragic character, that was absurd to add for what, drama? Having Daniel make cruel comments about it to Louis and having Lestat (a canon sexual assault victim) mock her for it is the cherry on top.

Overall it was just a really shitty thing for the creators to do no matter what the ultimate outcome. Several of my good friends who are book fans were extremely triggered by the scene and totally blindsided by something that felt completely gratuitous and honestly like shock bait to be edgy and generate social media buzz. Again, unbelievably tasteless.

I don't have any faith in the good intentions of the creators anymore, and that sucks because there were a lot of good things about the show before that.

[lou-iz-stat]

We are now 6 weeks away from the iwtv s2 premiere! And I am back for a rewatch of episode 2 of s1 in preparation for s2. I’m not going to lie this is probably my least favorite episode of s1 but that still doesn’t mean I don’t like this episode. It’s still an important episode for the greater story, it just doesn’t quite excite me as much as the rest of the episodes. And I’ll mention again that this post will have spoilers for the rest of season 1 as well as the books.

Anyways let’s watch it again!

IWTV S1 E2: After the Phantoms of Your Former Self

We start this episode with Daniel looking at the painting that Marius painted! Woah first Marius mention. This should have been obvious to us that Rashid was actually Armand when he started talking about the painting. But I guess hindsight is 20 20. Also when he talks about ‘serving a god’ I still have no idea what he means here. I mean it’s supposed to imply that he is talking about Louis but now that we know he’s Armand he must be talking about something else so hopefully we’ll find out what he meant next season. I don’t know if anyone else has noticed this but when Daniel is about to sit down for dinner, in the background there seem to be lots of scratches on the wall in the very back of the room. So weird…

Ok so when Louis finally enters the room he apologizes for his outburst from before and I actually have a whole other post about why I think that's interesting so check it out here

Also first ‘Memory is a monster’ mention in this episode!

‘The Farm’? As in Blackwood Farm?

Now we are back in flashback territory and we get our first rule about not drinking ‘dead blood’ which actually doesn’t kill vamps in the books it’s just uncomfortable to do so.

And in Louis turning Lestat comments ‘there’s the spark’ which to my knowledge is when someone is turned depending on how bright their spark is, is how compatible the person is with vampirism. I could be wrong but I think that’s the reason Nicki went mad was because his spark was pretty dull so he wasn’t very compatible with vampirism.

I have to say after being exposed to the vampire chronicles vampire lore all other vampire lore is just not it for me. I am currently watching these guys react to the first season of the vampire diaries on YouTube right now and that vampire lore is nowhere near giving as much as Anne Rice vampires are. All other vamps are officially nothing burgers as of now. I can’t stand any of them to be honest. Even the look of the vampires in this show is just so much better than any other vampire ever.

When they go to Mama Du Lac’s house for that party, Jacob looks so good in those sun glasses. 😍

I really love how in his vampirism Louis now has the power to take out these racist men like the lawyer. When he was human he just had to take all of these aggressions towards him but now with this power he doesn’t necessarily have to take the racism all of the time. But as we find out later his race can still hold him back even with this vampiric power he has. The writers are really able to weave in Louis’s race so seamlessly into his character and story.

For the record I still do not think Louis ate his nephew.

‘The great convergence’ plot line is something that I do not know if I like yet. I guess we’ll see.

Say what you want about Louis and Lestat’s relationship but in the beginning, for the most part, they were really sweet together. 😭

And in the scene where they go to opera it makes me free such complex emotions. I feel for Louis because he still has to deal with being black in America. And when they are in their box and Lestat looks over at Louis and can tell he is upset, his eyes just soften because he feels bad. It’s just too much! I know Louis sees this as an opportunity to manipulate him more but I really feel that Lestat really just genuinely wants him to feel better. And the way Louis looks at Lestat when he’s excited about the opera is just so cute. And then the tenor had to go and ruin all of that. *sigh*

Finally we get to Daniel talking about his first wife Alice. Louis makes a comment that he is familiar with the place that Daniel proposed to her in Paris. Could this mean something? I originally believed the Alice is Armand theory but now I don’t. I do think Alice was a real person but Daniel and Armand were probably seeing each other at the same time he was seeing Alice. I’m so excited to see s2 so we can hopefully get the truth of Daniel’s past that he is unable to remember it at the moment.

If you are still reading this thank you for sticking with me. And hopefully you will see me next week as I rewatch s1 e3.

6 MORE WEEKS Plus a new trailer on 03/31/24

[vampire-sugar]

Again, this blog is going to be about my experience reading QOTD, but wanted to just list out some of my thoughts on the first couple books! (No real analysis just writing how I felt about them). My previous post was about IWTV, and now here are some of my thoughts on The Vampire Lestat!!

Spoilers ahead. (Tw: mentions of incest and grooming)

The Vampire Lestat (1985)

Big change of tone, lol. I enjoyed Lestat's narration, even if it was a bit ridiculous at first and so different from IWTV. But he's funny! Like when he talks about how much he likes the 80s:

LOL.

And of course it was rock music that rose him from his slumber. So camp.

I really enjoyed getting some Lestat lore, and vampire lore in general. Loved getting to see mortal Lestat. His relationship with his mother is definitely something. Gabrielle is described as someone who doesn’t talk just to talk, and everything she says is definitely interesting. I like how she so succinctly describes Lestat's personality/character:

"You're such a fighter, my son. You never accept."

And then when she tells Lestat "You are the man in me." Wow. Feel like that describes exactly what her relationship to Lestat is as well as her relationship with gender etc, idk. Just liked that line. And then of course the relationship later becomes romantic, although it did feel like it was building up to it as opposed to like the horrific realization that I got in IWTV of Louis and Claudia. This one I saw coming but it was just very tragic.

Everything about Nicki was devastating he really was going through it. The lines where Lestat is describing him/their moments together were very romantic though. When Lestat tells him "(...) light and beauty come together in you in a thousand different patterns." And later, after Lestat is turned, "You are light itself, and what am I now? Eternal as I am, I curl like a cinder in that blaze." So cheesy I know but it really got me.

Ugh, when they are having "their conversation", and Lestat is going on about how what they do (acting, playing violin) feels good and makes others feel good, so it must be good, and Nicki responds with "Lestat, sin always feels good.” Shoot me now. Anyway, RIP Nicki you will be missed.

We got some Armand lore! I finally understand the Armand/Lestat beef that is always mentioned online lol. And also, fuck Marius, seriously. Like from the bottom of my heart. I feel like we’re supposed to read Marius’s actions as having saved Armand, when really he could have busted him out of the cell he was in and killed his enslavers and have just been his mentor. Instead, Marius paid the slavers money to buy Armand and then groomed him. Not only is he horrible, he is also very boring which is actually the worst thing you could be as a fictional character. Like the second I got to Marius's Story I checked how much I had left of his lore and I gasped at how much there still was like why was he talking for so long? Also of course you get some of Anne's racist rhetoric seeping through via Marius. It’s stuff like this that makes it so hard to read or take seriously when the immortals start philosophizing about good and evil like you just went on a rant about how people in the East are actually bottom of the barrel evil while the Westerners were more civilized or whatever idk man. Again have no clue why Marius spoke for as long as he did.

Cute vampire reunion in the end. Got treated to a vampire concert which was nice although I feel like Lestat could have gotten a little more creative with the lyrics lol. Overall I enjoyed it, I think Lestat is a fun narrator and loved all the lore and character backstories.

These were some of my unorganized thoughts of TVL, my next post will be about QOTD! I’m almost done reading the first part and from then on will probably post chapter by chapter. Feel free to follow if you wanna read along with me!

Bonus quote:

ijbol

[nalyra-dreaming]

WAIT OMG! we never actually hear show louis tell lestat that he loves him?? i know i probably sound stupid but i don’t think that’s something i’ve ever truly picked up on until now. i was rewatching some loustat scenes and got extra sad over lestat constantly feeling like he’s rejected and not loved, then it dawned on me that i don’t think louis said it or even showed it?? do you think that type of declaration will happen in future seasons?

this isn’t louis hate btw, i love them both so much

I love them both, too, and yes, ultimately I think we will get it^^.

…. okay this is a bit of a wasp‘s nest, so... fair warning^^.

Quite a while ago the IWTV writer's room (yes they are, or at least were active on Twitter) answered some questions.

One of them was this:

This... produced quite the backlash and made some huge waves around the fandom.

The thing is, Louis withholding and using that withholding (something the writers called "weaponization of language" here is canon behavior in the books, and something Louis in later books apologizes for.

Of course it is all a bit more difficult than the simplified (tweet)answer here. There is for example the added complexity of Louis losing Paul right after saying these words (something that, given this canon behavior does soften (for lack of a better word) said behavior, and as such was very much done on purpose, imho).

In the clip from the "Murder Mansion" we have already seen Armand commenting on the "withholding" as well, so I fully expect the show (aka the writers here) to keep this canon characterization, as they are obviously building on it.

It is something I also touched on the "intimacy post" a while back. Because for Louis and Lestat, in their good times, when they had sex regularly and bit each other during sex... Louis' inability to say the words probably meant next to nothing. Lestat would have been able to read it in the blood.

Only later, when the eating disorder set that fatal downwards spiral off (again, it bears repeating, this is not assigning blame, but it is an important aspect that started with the choice to not eat human anymore) the lack of the said words started to actually weigh on them.

So yes, eventually, the lack of the words was probably very much grating.

And for Louis it might have actually made it impossible to speak them.

Because, from experience^^, when you mean something it can be very, very hard to say that thing, especially if you know you maybe should have said the words earlier, but didn't - for valid reasons - but now... now they just seem unable to pass your tongue.

I think that is something that happened to Louis there. And Lestat probably didn't really feel rejected at first, but more frustrated, then estranged somewhat, mixed with concern, and then anger, and then and then and then... because he loves Louis.

And Louis loves Lestat.

Very much. Too much, maybe. Too much, maybe, for these words.

(Which is also why he and Lestat were both able to so easily say them during murder night, because then... then they were not meant.)

In the books he eventually does put it into words.

… I love you with my whole soul, and I will always love you, [..] you are my life. I have hated you for that and love you now so much that you’ve been my instructor in loving.

...this is from Blood Communion. Since we already know they are taking from that book.... :)

[devourcr]

thoughts regarding the coven under les innocents & lestat / nicolas

CLAIRE, BE CAREFUL. don't think about reading until after the episode. also ily.

( everyone else too if you don't want show spoilers or if you don't want to hear me rant on about book canon vs show canon vs my personal headcanons all surrounding the latest episode. )

so prior to the season, i was sure that armand's version of events was going to be essentially "armand's fanfiction" about lestat / paris. in book canon, lestat gives us the story first, but here, armand gets the first shot and there's no good reason for him to be honest about it. ( the fact that we have an interview from assad where he hints at armand lying to paint himself in a better light is honestly revealing on its own )

armand is going to paint lestat in the worst way possible because he's still salty af about him rejecting him. armand begs and begs lestat to take him with him, to love him. i don't see a version where armand is honest about that to louis or honest about it to daniel unless forced to bc the truth is already out. the real story makes him look weak and it makes him look cruel ( because he is fucking cruel ).

from a visual standpoint, it looks like someone telling a tale of romance when lestat and armand have their moments together. their confessions of love. all of that feels like what armand would have wanted the most. it's a fantasy and he's selling it. even the music in the bg... it's a romantic fantasy.

i see what armand did as simplifying the story and taking huge liberties with what actually happened. why mention what actually happened with lestat, gabrielle (that she even exists), or even the true tragedy of nicki? that doesn't fit his narrative.

i don't think armand stopped believing in the coven prior to lestat. i will always say that i think that for armand to give up the children of satan's values, he had to unpack a hell of a lot of his own trauma and stare too much into the past for his own liking. for the children of satan to be wrong about their beliefs, it means that their attack in venice was senseless. it means what happened to him, what happened to the boys that died, was wrong and that there was another way to live. i think there were always holes in his beliefs, but it was easy to believe in ritual, it was routine, it made sense. (i'll probably write headcanons about that later, rather than ranting more about it here)

i feel like there's some parallel with the louis/armand storyline throughout the episode. like there was something to be said about louis & claudia lying about their "maker" throwing himself into the fire and armand mentioning that the coven threw themselves into the fire. i don't know if the show will say otherwise ( i trust it will eventually ) but i absolutely maintain that armand killed most of his original coven, aside from the survivors who joined the theatre. we get kind of a common thread of "it looks better when they kill themselves," kind of thing.

i think armand tried to make himself seem like more of an active participant along with lestat in what the theatre became. i think he willfully reduced nicki's role and also wasn't going to talk about what he'd done to him within the theatre. or that it was lestat who pushed him to go to the theatre bc he refused to let him come with him.

i will stand by the fact that armand said he'd rather go into the fire than go to the theatre initially.

armand's not going to say lestat beat the shit out of him for biting him, that lestat felt enough sympathy to take him back to the tower, only to have armand beg him to take him with him. also, he's not going to explain the shit they did to nicki when he did go back to the theatre.

do i think the show's changing the book canon? no, not to that extreme. do i think armand is lying? absolutely. s2 is still very much within the boundaries of iwtv and i don't think we're going to get much in the way of what really went down until s3. i'm pretty confident that we'll get lestat's version of events, and frankly, it needs to be concise in s2 or else it'll feel repetitive when we get there.

[scarfacemarston]

So you’re new to the Vampire Chronicles fandom:

Long post. I know I’m not “known” in the fandom, but I’ve been a lurker and popping in here and there and I just want to share my thoughts. I’ve been a fan since 2004 and this is a very special series to me. I know with IWTV coming soon, there is going to be a huge influx of people. That’s not a bad thing. There has been a lot of people join the fandom recently. A couple things: A lot of the fans are older, but there is a lot of diversity in terms of age and background. Just don’t be surprised to find people over 25 here. Yes, they exist. Scary, we know. The books and the show are extremely different and NOT just based on the changing of race. The setting/time frame, the characters’ ages,  backgrounds and what appears to be some personality traits have also changed so be aware of that when exploring. Even from the trailer, the Interviewer, Daniel, has a completely different age and background. Louis’s personality is already different in some ways from what we’ve seen and his background has changed. Some of these changes are huge and it’s okay for people to point out these changes as long as they aren’t racist,sexist, homophobic and generally creepy about it. I can’t believe I have to say that but this is a horror series. Characters are going to do things that are “problematic” like murder or intimidate, abuse or threaten, or stalk. That is the point. That is a horror series. No one should at all think these things are ok and most people who watch the movie or read the show already know that, yet this still seems to pop up anyway.  The Anne Rice Vampire Chronicles are the most famous vampire books after Dracula, of course it’s going to have all the dark elements to it. But I find it ironic people give the vampires from resident evil a free pass for doing the same thing that Anne Rice’s vampires do  I hate using the word problematic, but I’m using it to quote what I’ve seen.  It’s thrown around constantly and this risks losing meaning . The fandom knows that unfortunately, there are definitely some issues with the series, Anne Rice herself and a few additional ones with the tv series. Racism has zero place in the fandom. This is something that I’ve seen burst through the roof.  People say Lestat and Louis are “problematic” - well yes, that’s the point the books are trying to make. They love each other despite their issues. Again, this is a horror novel about vampires discovering their monstrosity while trying to balance humanity. They’re complex. There aren’t too many “Good vampires vs bad vampires” until later and those vampires that are bad are extremely obvious.  Lestat is an example of this for Louis and Louis has his own “problematic” moments with Lestat.. However, my statement from above changes a bit  with some of the race changes some aspects of the relationship are being looked at through a new lens which does lead to some concerning ideas. We’ll have to wait til we see the show for sure as that does change the dynamic of the relationship, but overall, no one should be viewing this as a healthy relationship and Louis is already clear on that. 

Another example: One of my most interesting ships is between a 500 year old vampire named Armand and Daniel. (Who is the name of the interviewer and is actually a 32 year old who was turned into a vampire instead of an old man.). The relationship can be dark and has abuse, too but the way its written is that Daniel has just as much power in his own way making it a very interesting read.He fights back and can be nasty, too. Yet, some parts are strangely sweet in some aspects. Just because I find the dynamic interesting to read about does not mean I condone something as messed up as Armand/Daniel’s relationship. Never in a million years. This attitude should apply to many aspects in this fandom.  Too many people are getting into the series “just for the gay shit”. Come on. There isn’t an issue with enjoying mlm relationships, but fetishization and watching a show just because “you want to see gay vampire fuck” is your prerogative, but it’s shitty because the series is so much more than that and characters shouldn’t be reduced to just their sexualities. (Btw, Anne Rice's vampires don’t have sex, fyi.) So that’s just a few things I thought I’d point out. I understand not everyone will agree with me, but any sort of abuse will be blocked immediately.

[showmey0urfangs]

Just a thought on canon: my impression is that (not having read the books, so please excuse the presumption) Lestat finds it difficult to connect how formative his experiences with violence were with how he enacts it on others. I think if someone floated the idea that his abusers had complex internal justifications beyond sheer cruelty/shallowness, he would find that very hard to parse not for the average reasons, but because that would mean that he may hold that same space for others he loves.

Hi there! First of all, welcome to the IWTV fandom!!! 🎉🥳 I hope you enjoyed the show as much as I did when I first watched it and it rewrote my brain chemistry. 😆

To your point, I think that Lestat is aware of it to some degree. He seems to have enough discernment and self-reflection to realize what his actions lead to, but not enough to try and break the vicious cycle.

For example, he points it out in episode one, after his outburst at Louis's family dinner; ❝I'm cursed with my father's temper❞ And Louis also says in episode 6 that Lestat admitted he felt a profound sense of shame after the DV.

We see the same pattern where he will have a violent outburst, regret it afterwards and try to make up for it in some superficial way, with gifts or more love bombing. Regardless of his awareness, he seems unable to stop himself from perpetuating the same cycle of abuse his parents inflicted on him—the physical violence from his father but also the neglect and dismissal from his mother which he in turn exhibits with Claudia, especially in the later episodes (this may be a mild book spoiler but basically Lestat's mother was dealing with her own shit and didn't really have time or energy for him).

He does end up becoming the tyrannical father that his own father was, and the neglectful mother that his own mother was.

I'm not sure if this answers your question but it's certainly a very interesting topic to dissect.

[licncourt]

Hi!!!! I have been reading your tvc metas, and they are wonderful and I want to thank you for it!

I have been struggling to read theses books, and it really help me, I love IWTV, Louis is my fav, the aspect and style of first book is astonishing, the entire loustat dynamic is fascinating. And as much I love Lestat too, I didn't like TVL, and it left me frustrated with myself and disappointed with the book. It took me weeks to read TVL, and even more months to finish QotD. For me IWTV could stand alone, the other books seem to be part of a completely different series.

Your metas have helped me deal with my frustrations with TVC, and thank you for that, because i love theses characters (some of them) and I want to know their stories, still sad due to the lack of Louis, and I will try to read all the books so that my information about it are not all second handed.

and most important, I love your blog, I love your art and your fanfics 🫶

That's so nice of you I'm so so glad!! It's so exciting when someone likes my metas and fics, I love to write them! It's especially cool if it's made the books more enjoyable!! Book Louis is my special little guy of all time and like a small weird mangey rabbit that I keep as a beloved pet even though he bites so I'm also very happy to hear that you loved IWTV!!

As pretentious as it sounds, I was disappointed that a lot of new fans coming from the show didn't really Get book Louis or make an effort to understand his character. He's....challenging (nasty and gross) but there's so much rich character building there and it makes me sad when people write him off as boring and one note. AMC Louis is a really great character and I enjoy him a lot, but I don't like sentiment that he's a "fix" for a bad character.

As for TVL, I really do love it (even though IWTV is my favorite), but I can see how the style change can be jarring. In a way, it almost IS a different series because the narrator and POV has changed so drastically. It's in the same universe, but a totally different take on it to match a contrasting personality. I think it comes across better on a second read too because you're more prepared for the switch and have more context.

I can understand being partial to one style or the other (plenty of people prefer TVL to IWTV which I understand for sure), but I hope that even if the book itself wasn't for you that you enjoyed the insight into Lestat’s character. The first two books combined make for such a fantastic relationship dynamic in top of great stand alone characters, even better than just IWTV on its own in my opinion because now we know so much about them both.

This might be somewhat controversial among VC fans (?) but I don't really care for QotD either, with the exception of the Devil's Minion chapter and the ending with Loustat. I think it really shows the flaws beginning to emerge in AR's writing, but it's SO much better than what comes after that it gets more praise than maybe it deserves. Then again, I'm extremely partial to character-driven stories, so maybe if you're a plot guy it's a matter of preference.

If you've read my metas I'm sure you know that I don't really recommend anyone read past QotD, but I also see it as kind of rite of passage if you really want to be in the real trenches of the book fandom. It's miserable and you won't be the same afterward but the curse of forbidden knowledge is kind of a unifying factor, the ties that bind. If you choose to proceed then I wish you best and hope you'll come back to commiserate later.

Either way, I'm really glad you got some value from my metas! I love some of these characters so much and I'm super happy they were validating for you as a reader and maybe enhanced the experience in other ways! I aim to provide only the best VC Sparknotes.

I always have more to talk about (in meta and in fic), so I hope you enjoy everything that's coming just as much!

[dwreader]

I enjoy reading your analysis. Loumand has always been compelling to me because of it's premise. A wild romance where both people have a strong attraction to each other that is past physical. The idea of a man loving you so much that he kills your child and deludes himself into thinking you can get over it sounds like what are you willing to do for love? And Louis in the book having an inkling of Armand's part in Claudia's death but being so numb he continues to live with Armand for decades only to be vicious when Armand finally is tired of waiting is so good. The whole thing points to Louis' struggle with vampirism. Before Claudia's death he tried to be human. After Claudia's death he tried to be all vampire, cold, unfeeling. And at the end of IWTV you get this feeling he still doesn't know how to be a vampire. And I love the ending where he rejects Lestat too. Not a heartfelt hug. It makes more sense that after reliving his life through telling the story, he's disillusioned. He doesn't run to any of his lovers to save him or find comfort. Running to Lestat cements the soulmate part that AMC is selling and is almost unbelievable if we're going to see the trial play out how it does in the book. It also would mean a change in the material where Lestat hasn't lost his mind and is feeble and living in ruin.

thank you ❤️ and I totally agree I think anne rice accidentally wrote loumand very very well and it’s unfortunate she decided later that lestat had to be the center of universe at the expense of actual good writing she did before. and you’re so right about running back to lestat in the end if he does that I think I would actually bust out laughing like it would not be a serious show anymore it’s just pandering.