#and I feel like I should be bc of how effeminate I am/feel

[belladonnafleur]

🐸

[genderkoolaid]

something ive noticed as a very effeminate trans masc that dresses pretty androgynous & has been on hrt for many years is that the status of being a "dangerous man" can and will be placed on you (ime most often by cis white women) whenever expressing any kind of negative feelings. if i told friends of mine - even queer ones - that something they did hurt my feelings or made me upset, i was suddenly a dangerous man or a (man)ipulator or whatever - even if i didn't raise my voice. the very fact that i am unhappy combined with my proximity to manhood makes me a supposed threat in their eyes.

a couple years ago i had a group of cis girl friends. they would constantly pull me into women's bathrooms n such so i wouldn't be left behind saying its fine its fine bc im one of the girls (gender neutral) but then as soon as i was upset about something i was suddenly a dangerous man who needed to stay out of women's spaces,,,, despite the fact that of the 4 of us, the girl who joined after me was the one spreading this shit around my friend group so... how was i encroaching on womens spaces if i was there before her and i was invited in? luckily one of my friends told me that the other two were plotting to kick me out of my friend group on the sole basis of my proximity to manhood so i at least knew why they were suddenly treating me like shit

its just.. i cant understand why people dont think trans mascs and trans men are discriminated against when they literally said it was my "toxic man energy" that made them want me out WHILE ALSO being the ones convincing me to go into womens spaces bc they wanted to go somewhere and didnt wanna have to leave me behind & like i said im extremely effeminate and faggy and also NONBINARY so i dont understand what "man energy" they were talking about other than the fact that im on testosterone and thinking testosterone = man is just transphobic no matter how you try to twist it

but my taking testosterone was never a problem or made me evil or scary when they wanted me to go with them into women-only (&nonbinary too i guess unless youre amab (and they can tell) or been on testosterone for too long) spaces, it was only a problem when they wanted 1. a reason to criticise me relentlessly, borderline bullying or 2. a reason to dismiss any of my concerns or criticisms of their treatment of me

all of that, to me, is transandrophobia point blank. i dont know what else you could call it other than transphobia, but transphobia doesn't address any of the very blatant and obvious connection of how my transness affects their perception of my proximity to manhood and how that affected the situation

God that sucks. I'm sorry you went through that.

You make a very good point. This is why I don't want to define transandrophobia/ATM as just transphobia and misogyny directed at transmascs. I still think transunity theory is a really valuable way of looking at transphobia & its important to me that we are vocal about how masculine tropes are weaponized against trans people by cis people on the regular because of how we are positioned in relation to gender. Too many people think the that the only thing wrong with saying trans people have "dangerous male energy" is that its misgendering. So trans people who choose to associate themselves with manhood are left in the trash by the people who should know best how much being made out to be a Dangerous Male Invader hurts!

[10hourshift]

When you think about the lack of adults in fnafhs, and the lack of narrative importance they have*, Bon's dad becomes a very interesting character, even if he just appears in like one minute of one episode.

It's not THAT long but ion like scrolling

*not to say that there aren't any adults in the series, just that the ones do Nothing™ when they appear, I mean, the only one that comes to mind that ACTIVELY affects the plot (or would affect bc season cut short) is Ms Lana, but she never got to do anything so ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

I'm just gonna talk about the old man this should be quick. (Finishing notes, it wasn't)

He is part of the Yaoi shonen ai subplot alright, at this moment Bon is especially conflicted with his feelings about Bonnie as he has already realized what they are but is afraid to admit it*. The only question now is: why won't he admit them?? It's clearly something he has considered from the beginning, and, after spending more time with Bonnie, is almost a fact that is love (ignoring the possibility of platonic feelings for a bit for the sake of the argument). The answer is: his dad.

*this is more of a personal reading as we know edoo would extend the "maybe maybe not"a lot more. BUT I say this confidently bc at the end of the whole camp arc Bon gets the heartbroken forever alone joke or smth when Bonnie insist on being friends, I rest my case, I got derailed for a bit lol

In the scene where The Man appears (he is nameless you see) we get a glimpse of what the relationship with his son is.

When bon is in his room getting ready for school (and pondering on his results of the Am I Gay? Quiz of life) we hear the voice of his dad to come downstairs. He notices the (not so subtle) injuries on his son and ask what that's about. Bon tells him it's from a fight. He gets up from his seat to clearly interested about it, whether he won, if he used some technique he taught him, etc., looking all invested and proud at his son's actions, finishing the conversation saying how he is proud that Bon is finally acting as a man and that he was getting worried of Bon being "effeminate" (or woman-like to be exact) with all the accessories and especially the sleeve he usually wears. He doesn't make another appearance from there (besides at the end of the episode where he introduces toddy, but he isn't important in here, so it doesn't count)

So, his character is pretty straight forward, he is stereotypically masculine, incites violence and is emotionally distanced from his son, as we see how he dismisses his interest and tries to push him to fight with his lessons on various fighting "techniques". Bon gets pretty bummed out from this short conversation afterwards, having to reassure himself after leaving his house. From here we take that Bon is not close with his dad, and also that he seeks for his approval or at least to not get on his bad side, and understandingly so, seeing how he reacts to smaller things, such as the sleeve.

So what's so interesting about him then?? He gives Bon depth, even if said depth is just showing that he comes from a "kinda homophobic-ish, idk if my dad would kick me out of the house if I'm gay" background. This small information gives us a new perspective of Bon's conflict, after that it's not only a story of a teenage boy trying to understand his sexuality and get a bf or smth, it goes deeper now, what are those feelings exactly, how much influence does his dad have on him?, how does this affect the relationship with his dad? What would he do if his family rejects him for being himself?

Soo idk what I'm going with this I just wanted to talk about my thoughts about the old man whose role is being homophobic for the plot ok bye

[bijoumikhawal]

Part of the problem with MLM fetishization discourse (mainly found onTwitter, but i see it here too), is that people see effeminacy and femininity in men itself as a fetish, and therefore can't be assed to understand actual issues we face with regard to sexuality

It's impossible to talk about fatphobia, underlying assumptions often related to white supremacist beauty standards, adultification, ageism, etc that feminine men experience because people are too busy getting in a tizzy over a guy wearing skirts in media. One of the big issues for me is hypersexualization- I was getting sexualized at a very young age for being what I am, it's a big issue historically, and a lot of media I could access when I was younger was basically just porn/erotica. And that porn/erotica was often like. Racist, it hypermasculinzed Blackness in comparison to white effeminates, and it only portrayed fem men as submissive bottoms (which isn't itself bad) whose effeminacy was humiliation, and submission was bc they're worth less than "real men"

And like, the joke is people are so focused on wether or not people writing femmes who bottom is bad (it's just a thing that happens irl) that you can't talk about anything else. It's also a form of hypersexualization. The only other thing ppl wanna discuss is "heteronormativity". Fiction where femmes are fucking isn't a bad thing with that being said, and desexualizing us is also a common homophobic thing to do, and tends to loop back to the "less than a real man" thing.

And like, "yaoi"/"BL" isn't the big driving factor in hypersexualization here. If nobody in the US knew what that was I still would've been getting hit on by men twice my age at 16 (who sometimes would loudly advertise their interest in femmes specifically, or more accurately, "femboys" and "tr*ps").

And honestly when you deal with just like- grown ass men looking at you that way, people moaning and bitching that the big concern for fetishization here is basically wether or not the character exists only deepens the shame felt from those interactions. I was made to feel uncomfortable and gross because my gender presentation was seen as sexual when I was a teenager, and all this shit does is go "yeah, it is sexual, when I look at people like you I think about sex and how the sex you have is bad". And part of my Ick with portrayals of femmes is that we're assumed as submissive bottoms because I'm not, but this is still deeply harmful to people that are because you're telling queers the way they fuck is morally wrong and you're instilling shame over it.

And like... actual fetishization for me is more often when femmes as objects of sexual desire are seen that way through a lens of "you're a faggot so you're beneath me, you should thank me when I call you slurs and do xyz, you're trash, shaving you so you have less body hair (so you look more feminine) is a punishment and symbolizes my superiority" because it's just intracommunity femmephobia/effemiphobia with a boner.

Its not that other things are non-issues but cis women clumsily writing a masc/femme dynamic is probably more likely to make me laugh than feel ashamed or disgusted, and instances of feminizing a character for bigotry reasons in fandom are less common than people complaining about effeminacy existing at all (including with femme transmasc characters, especially because usually those aren't being written by cis people). The actual things that have made me cringe with shame and disgust about cis women's view of feminine and effeminate men sexually are more difficult for me to unsnarl because I see it less often, and it's sometimes more visceral because while I was sexualized by men I was actually abused by women, but I'll be frank; those things usually aren't occurring in discussions about fandom.

When I get disgusted in fandom discussion isn't about femme characters existing at all, or top/bottom/switch- they're about people acting like writing romance/erotica about men fucking is the sacred right of cis women and any discussion about equity in publishing means you're attacking fandom when they're two different things, and that that right is more important than the fact that queer men can struggle to get published in romance- and subsequent issues with poverty. Or the insistence that to be fetishized you need to be a woman because fetishization is stored in the pussy (revealing they haven't thought about racism in the romance genre, and don't think about trans women). Its about queer men in fandom writing smut and getting harassed by women who write the exact same type of it because the way they do it is somehow bad. It's about my sexuality being seen as piece of land to fight over, that I'm not supposed to be on, not writing about men in fishnets.

[blubushie]

Blu your speaking straight FACTS on the demonization/ostracization of masculinity in the queer community! Like I was talking to my brother about this ( him a gay man and me a bi women) about how he wishes there was more queer men that leaned into masculinity bc while he has no problem dating/getting to know effeminate men he prefers the masculine men. While he was apologizing for sounding harsh about his feeling, I was like no I totally understand bc a drag queen that I like put it best "I am gay man. Meaning I like men and their features. I like deep voices, big body, hair everywhere." Like when I was getting to know the queer community more in my teens I was finding it weird/off how the gay male community would want their ideal men to be that stereotypical man but anybody they deemed not fckable with those features they would ostracized.

Even in the Sapphic community leaning to much into masculinity ostracized the Sapphic that embraced it and they'll be accused of wanting to be a man or accused of betraying Sapphic women for leaning away from the feminity their attracted too. Like doing this demonization damages the community because 1.) It makes it harder for those ignorant of themseleves/on their journey to understand themselves TO UNDERSTAND themselves bc the features/actions that they have are hated by a community they thought was opened (as u said.) 2.) Ostracizes those who do know themselves and want community ( AS U SAID!) 3.) Kills hope in that their are no positive examples of healthy masculinity so those attracted to it give up on finding a healthy and positive partner who is masculine or give up on the idea they themselves can be queer and engage in healthy masculinity.

Going back to the talk with my brother, I told him I'm like him in that I like my men to look like men too. While my bisexuality has me attracted to people with gender presentation fuckery, I also do like it when a person of that gender presents their stereotypical gender BECAUSE IM ATTRACTED TO MEN AND WOMEN AND I SHOULD LIKE AND APPRECIATE THEIR FEATURES BC THATS WHAT IM ATTRACTED TOO!!!

Like when I see TF2 fanart of the mercs with body hair and body fat/heftiness I go 😍🫦😝💦😜😍👀🫦🤪 bc here are some hot men that look like MEN. ( I treasure the fanart that has Scout having body hair and muscle bc 1.) He a full grown adult not a twink high-schooler 2.) Mfer can go 1 on 1 with someone like Heavy [might not always win but there are chances he can win- looks at his meet the... video], it's his job to fight other beefed up guys, and have you seen how thick/muscled up baseball players can get.) Bc even in fanart, not just TF2 fanart, men are depicted in a narrow ideal of masculinity where they are not allowed to have masculine features which to me makes it artificial. And that something real is the masculinity the community keeps denying/gatekeep in real life and online.

I'm gonna rustle some feathers. In EVERY queer environment I've ever been in, the only way I've ever gotten the vibe that it's ok for a man to be a man is if he's a girl. If you're too tall, too bearded, too hairy, too fat, too bald, too deep a voice, too masculine in presentation, you're irredeemable—god forbid you LIKE how testosterone has changed your body. You are the monster in their fairy tales. You have to prove yourself as "not like other men" somehow because if you're a man and you like men, that's not queer enough. If you're a trans man who is too masculine or passes too well, you're betraying your community somehow, or your birth sex. Fuck your dysphoria, we'll only feel comfortable with your presence if you walk in tits out in a miniskirt, ~flambouyantly GNC~, and even THEN we'll make comments about how your masculinity makes us uncomfortable because you still look too male.

And if you're a bisexual man? Hell you might as well be straight. Won't even give you the decency of calling you an ally—nah, mate, you're an invader. Iunno what the B stands for.

[maybe-theres-hope]

Hello!

001 911 lone star

002 Tarlos

003 TK and Carlos, please

Oh wow this will be a long one haha but thank you!! Okay here goes:

001: 911 LS

Favorite Character: TK. Yes, I'm projecting. Sue me.

Least Favorite Character: It hurts to say, bc I LOVE Billy Burke, but I absolutely cannot stand Billy lol. They could have done so much better with the character.

5 Favorite ships: Tarlos, Marjan/Nancy, Paul/more screen time, Mateo/stability, EMS 126/all the awards

Character I find most attractive: Well, like...pure aesthetic/the person should be a statue in the Smithsonian? Carlos. Hands down. But...person I would be DTF for instantly if they asked? Nancy.

Character I would marry: Nancy lol

Character I would be best friends with: Definitely TK. My boy and I are on the same wavelength most of the time.

A random thought: I love this fandom seriously

An unpopular opinion: I'm not sure if this is an unpopular opinion or not, but I definitely cannot see/ship Marjan/Mateo. Like...idk. She seems more like his mom friend than anything. But that doesn't mean I don't respect people who ship it! Please don't come for me lol

My Canon OTP: If you have to ask you don't know me haha

My non-canon OTP: Marjan/Nancy with me in the middle

Most badass character: Tommy omfg queeeeen

Most epic villain: I'm still on the arsonist train lol

Pairing I'm not a fan of: Well, I already said what I said up there but another one is Owen/Gwen. Tbh it was obvious they didn't work and having Owen propose was like....it just rubbed me the wrong way. I'm glad she said no. The woman knows what she's about. Also she's still alive shhhhh.

Character I feel the writers screwed up: Well I said Billy already, but I'll also throw in Owen. I feel like the whiplash from S1 to S2 (re: parenting skills/habits) was like....too much to take. S3 has offered us absolutely nothing regarding parenting skills they've shared like one scene together like for real. I'll be honest the absence of the toxic masculinity angle in this father-son relationship in S1 was the reason I started watching.

Favorite Friendship: TK and Nancy. EMS chaos duo ftw.

Character I most identify with: TK. I'm am not in recovery or anything like that, but there are just so many things we have in common/habits we have that I just connect really well with him.

Character I wish I could be: Marjan...so cool. so scary. so awesome.

002: Tarlos

When I started shipping them: When Carlos asked TK to dance lol so adorable.

My thoughts: oh dear. Absolutely too many thoughts to put here. I love them lol.

What makes me happy about them: How real and....tangible the relationship feels? They're both flawed people and the writers aren't afraid to show that.

What makes me sad about them: Not much tbh. Can't think of anything.

Things done in fanfic that annoys me: Okay. Okay. hear me out. Top Energy vs Bottom Energy is definitely a thing (source: my multiple decades in the queer community and my own queer relationships) but like....that's a very vague thing that a lot of people NOT in the community don't get. And it's not explainable to people outside the community without sounding....borderline fetishy. You know what I mean. So the thing I hate in fanfic is when they choose to make one of them (99% of the time its TK) an uwu smol bean who needs to be coddled and taken care of, and it inevitably leads to effeminization that is so blatantly misogynistic it makes me nope out immediately when I see it. And I see it a lot. Idk. Let people be people without putting them in boxes. If you can't do queer identity justice, then don't do things like that at all. I'm not explaining this well at all, but idk. Anyway moving on.

Things I look for in fanfic: Omg I love getting together, enemies to lovers, and period aus. I will usually read anything within those parameters.

My wishlist: Does this mean what I want for them in canon? Definitely marriage and kids. They deserve all the happiness they want. But like. At a reasonable pace lol.

Who I'd be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other: may I direct you here

My happily ever after for them: See my wishlist lol

003: TK and Carlos

How I feel about this character: I love them both, but identify more with TK as I said above

Any/all people I ship romantically with this character: See above lol

My favorite non-romantic relationship for this character: For TK, I absolutely love his and Nancy's friendship, and I LOVE TK and Judd's brothers relationship. For Carlos, I do miss Michelle's relationship with him, but I could definitely see a deeper friendship forming between him and Grace. They were an amazing team!

My unpopular opinion about this character: Carlos - he's flawed. He has flaws. He is not perfect. I feel like this is way too unpopular an opinion lol. But it's what makes him interesting!! TK - he's not a horrible person. He's a person who tries to do better every day and he does deserve Carlos' love and affection. I also feel like this is too unpopular an opinion... Honestly if you live in a world where if someone fucks up once they are fucked for life, I don't want to ever be where you are. I have to believe that good people do bad things and they can learn from them and be better.

One thing I wish would happen/had happened with this character in canon: Carlos - I DEFINITELY want a Carlos begins omg I need it like I need air. TK - I wish we could get more of his relationship with Gwyn. Because she's still around and we can totally have that in future seasons definitely. Yep.

Favorite Friendship: Answered this up there!

My crossover ship: I do NOT ship them with anyone else lol

[morvantmortuary]

Mini Rant:

I wish I had any of the Morvants as a real life SO, honestly, I’m not deserving of someone as kind and caring as they are, but I can dream. I wish my partner understood why some days I may want to wear more effeminate jewelry, (he’s bought me two engagement rings, one is a simple band I wear on masc days and the other is lightly jeweled) or why I keep my hair so short but am willing to wear makeup. I wish I could just feel loved and that we would stop fighting over how he should call me, and reading these stories has helped to bring me a great deal of comfort. I can’t wait to read more. 🖤

(Nonny, I saw this when you sent it to me, and tbh I've been circling it ever since trying to think of something helpful to say.

I'm going to put the bulk of this below a cut, bc I have a couple questions that are totally none of my business and out of my lane, but I maybe thought someone should ask??

First and most importantly, though: I bet you're not as undeserving of someone who will be sweet to you and respectful of your needs as you think you are. I used to think the same thing too, for a long time. <3

That can be a really hard cycle to break. It can feel pseudo-self-aware to think you don't deserve kindness. You can spend ages thinking you're "just being honest/realistic" with yourself, that there's something about you that's too inherently flawed to be deserving of softness, or to have the wounded part of you handled with care. But I don't actually think that's true of anyone anymore, to be honest.

If someone you loved said that to you, that they were similarly undeserving - insert your best friend, your sibling, or hell, pick a Necromancer if that's easier - you would immediately argue that wasn't true, right? Of course they're deserving of love, because they're them. There's no reason that they shouldn't deserve kindness, or someone who will support them in all their changes.

If you look at yourself on paper, as best you can as a third party, are you really so different from them that you are somehow undeserving? Or, to put it another way: do you really think you're the only person in all of Earth, time, and human history, who didn't deserve that kind of kindness, or to have someone treat them as a whole human person with needs? Because needs are not flaws, Nonny. We've been made to think they are by a lot of different systems, but they aren't. They're just facts about you, just like mine are facts about me. They're neutral. They're not good or bad. They just are.

If someone doesn't acknowledge the very real, tangible facts about you, I would like to gently assert that maybe they're not the person who should be tending to you. That's like trying to keep a plant alive while totally ignoring how much light and water it actually needs, but worse, because you are a cognizant person who deserves the bare minimum and then much more.

And another thing - even if you've read all this and you're like "but no Rae, really, I don't deserve it" - well, sweetheart. How are you going to get any better at this if you never let yourself be treated gently? You might have some stuff to unlearn, yeah, and so do I. But you can't hate yourself into a different version of you, or you and I probably both would be very different people right now, right? How do you expect to become someone who can let someone else be gentle with them if you don't practice receiving that? If you don't let yourself be open to it, even a little?

Again - I used to flinch away from that sort of thing too. But I only did that because I was scared to admit to myself how much I wanted it. It's okay to be scared - emotions are scary!! - but eventually, you do have to let yourself be brave enough to let someone see the part of you that needs tending to. Even if that person doesn't stay forever, at least you will know how to let your guard down that much more than you did before.

To your particular predicament, I'm just going to wildly guess based off what you've said above, so I'm fully prepared to be completely misreading your life and for that I apologize. You don't have to answer anything I'm about to say (and if anything, it might be a better idea to have another version of this conversation with someone much more qualified than me so you can get the most accurate advice possible), but here's what I see. Your person is seeking commitment, and has done so to the point that they've bought you two engagement rings based on how you need to present that day. On the surface, that seems like quite the gesture, right? That they should want you to be comfortable with the symbol of your commitment however you feel that day?

But I'm more worried about the fact that this person can't seem to support you in smaller, everyday facets of your presentation. That while the Big Symbolic Stuff is settled, it's you actually living your life on a day-to-day basis that you have to keep re-explaining, or that they seem reluctant to address you how you would want to be addressed.

Now, again, I'm just spitballing here, but I would feel remiss if I didn't ask: if this person is willing to make the one-time investment, but doesn't want to call you the right name - should they be the one tending to you for the rest of your life? Honestly?

Again, you super don't have to answer this to me, and if anything, if this question is maybe eating at you at all, I would absolutely take it to someone with actual training in this sort of thing: a therapist, a relationship counselor for the both of you, anyone who's properly equipped to handle this stuff and not just someone who writes serial killer romance novels on the internet. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

All this to say, I'm very, very honored that you like my weird spooky family, and that my stories have been a source of comfort for you. I look forward to sharing the rest of this story with you, and I hope you continue to find what you need here. <3 But you also deserve every opportunity to be just as happy in real life, I promise. That might involve some hard changes, on your end or his or both, but you really don't deserve anything less than someone who will love every facet of you like the Morvants would. I promise.)

[firelord-frowny]

re: that last reblog,

Not Cool! “Attraction to men, women, and trans people”  Why: By separating out trans people, this implies that trans men are not men and trans women are not women.” 

Okay so like. I Get It. I’m not mad about it. I agree with the intended sentiment behind this explanation, and I also get that the thing I’m about to talk about isn’t necessarily what was being addressed here, and is more like a Closely Related Concept that I’m sensitive to. 

So anyway,

As a trans dude, I quite embrace the fact that I am not a cis dude. i’m aware of, and not afraid of or saddened by the fact that even if/when i do ever gather up the resolve to undertake the challenge of physically transitioning, I probably won’t ever ‘pass.’ I’ll probably always have a voice that’s higher-pitched and effeminate in cadence, and barring multiple major surgeries, I’ll probably always have a shape that’s recognizable as ~female~ to some degree. 

So like... for me, personally, I don’t want to be categorized with “men” in the sense that when people say “man,” they usually mean “cis man” without actually saying so. 

i KNOW that the actual ~issue~ here is that people don’t bother to specify “cis” when they probably should. So like, a person could say “I’m attracted to cis men, cis women, and trans men and women,” and that would probably be a more or less not-problematic statement, I guess, and would serve to clarify that someone can be attracted to any kind of person who is categorized as a man or a woman of any sort, but not people who are something other than a man or a woman.

So like... when I read the statement “attraction to men, women, and trans people,” my assumption isn’t that they’re singling out trans people - it’s that they’re neglecting to single out cis people. Bc like... saying you’re attracted to “men” is an incomplete assessment in my opinion. Like, if I was going to describe my own sexuality as accurately as I could manage, I might say:

I’m attracted to masculine-presenting people with “male” anatomy.

I mean, you could still nitpick that description into oblivion, but i’m basically saying i’m into people born with dicks who align, visually, with many traditionally accepted aspects of “masculinity.” In other words: cis males! But ALSO, I could be, and have been attracted to somebody who just ~looks~ like a cis fella, but is actually nonbinary or agender. Or even a trans lady who’s content to remain in the body she was born in. My attraction doesn’t really depend on how a person describes their own gender experience. If you’ve got a peen and I think ya look hot, then I’m into you! And for me, some degree of traditional ~masculinity~ is uuuuusally a prerequisite for thinking somebody Looks Hot. 

but yeah, like....

idk, personally, i don’t necessarily want or need to feel included when people say “men.” and it’s kind of the same feeling i have about being “american.” 

like, ok, yeah, i’m “american.” but i KNOW what kind of person most people are really talking about when they say “american.” they’re usually talking about some white person in fuckin Colorado who goes to church and actually celebrates 4th of july instead of just using it as an excuse to have a cookout. like, if anything, i WANT to be excluded from the term “american.” if anything, i WANT to be hyphenated, or referred to by something different altogether, because the assumptions that are attached to the label “american” are things that are either not true about me, or things that repulse me, or both.  

i’m cool with being ~african american~, or black american, or black, or a person of color, or whatever. but “american”?? no thanks. 

Similarly, I’m happy to embrace any version of transman, transmasculine, transdude, whatever. 

but “man”??? gag!!! No Thank You. 

this is so Specific and i don’t expect many people to share this exact same perspective lmao don’t mind me. 

[mblay-and-company]

It’s Self Indulgent FanFiction time, ya’ll!!!

So I came across this Prompt List by @palettes-and-prompts and IMMEDIATELY became intrigued by the very first dialogue prompt, and since a certain Hotel in Hell with a certain Radio Demon has became my Hyperfixation for the time being, I have decided to indulge myself.

When I started, I really struggled to decide if I wanted to directly insert myself into this or make it a Reader Fic.  I decided fuck it, this is for me!  And then I struggled to decide which name to use for myself, bc most of my OC’s are named after me in some degree and it’s very awkward... :I

So, without further ado, have a FanFic featuring a human me hanging out in the Hotel and having been foolish enough to have made SOME deals with Alastor, but not stupid enough to sell my Soul to him.  Misadventures of Michaela the Hell Temp, go!

"C'mon, toots, ya gotta tell me what yer kink is!"

Michaela let out a hard sigh, looking at the Effeminate Spider Demon with an exhausted glare.

"I don't need to tell you anything, Angel-"

"But I gotta know what freaky shit Smiles is into!  You two clearly are into something!"

After Angel Dust learned about the "bizarre Deal" she admitted to have with Alastor, along with what she described as a light crush, he immediately started making assumptions.  Honestly, it felt like he had been drilling her for hours for the "deets," even though it was probably only a few minutes at best.

"Angel, do you not understand how being Ace works-"

"Is it a Foot Fetish?!  Are ya two into suckin' toes?!" He almost let out a cheer when he watched her react, but quickly realized she was recoiling in disgust.

"Angel, that's fucking gross!  Do ya even know how much DEAD SKIN there is between toes???" She gagged out, her nose scrunched up.

"And why are we wondering about dead skin cells?" The two quickly turned to see a curious Alastor, quietly drinking a cup of coffee.  He could hear the sounds of their argument halfway across the Hotel, and it finally piqued his interest.

"Al, you really don't wanna be a part of this-" She tried to warn him, only to get shoved out of the way by Angel.

"Smiles!  What kinky shit do you two do during sex???" He practically screamed out with excitement.  Alastor let out a sudden cough, choking on his coffee.

"I beg your PARDON?!" He sputtered out, his grin pulled tight and twitching in the corners.  The static that emanated off of him seemed to intensify in agitation.  With another hard sigh, Michaela gave Angel a harsh check to his side, knocking him to the ground.

"This idiot is CONVINCED that we must have sex together just because we do business with each other.  He's been trying to delve into this nonexistant sex life for WAY too long, and I can feel a migrain coming on because of it." She scowled, rubbing her temples.  Alastor made a cough to clear his throat out, looking over at Angel.

"I fear you have forgotten that not everyone is in the Prostitution Business, my effeminate fellow!  And besides, I believe it is in your best interest to know that your little pet has squeezed himself under the oven, and our Charming Demon Belle can't coax him out.  I offered my assistance, but she doesn't seem to trust me with the pig's safety!"  He cried out in feigned offence, dramatically putting his hand over his heart in a swoon.  Upon being told his beloved pet was potentially in danger, Angel let out a distressed gasp.

"Fat Nuggets, hold on, Daddy's coming for ya!!!"  He cried out, sprinting down the hall at full speed.  Michaela let out a hard sigh of relief, her shoulders slumping down.

"I thought he would never leave..." She muttered, before looking up at Alastor.  "Is Nugs really stuck?"

"It would seem so..." He hummed thoughtfully.  "I wasn't planning on telling Angel about it, but it certainly became a much needed means to remove him from the room!"

"It seems we both conveniently benefit from this..." She mused, rubbing her temples again.  She was trying to think of ways to politely thank him without incurring a higher "tab" of debt with him.  The dealings she already had with him were careful, but she knew full well that he was much more cunning than she was, and he was VERY good at pulling the "favor" card.

"Most certainly, my dear!" He laughed heartily.  "I couldn't leave you in such a distressing state!  Not when I would find myself just as uncomfortable!"

"Thanks for that..." She let out a soft sigh.  Perhaps finding situations that were mutually beneficial really was the way to go?

"However..."

And there it was.  She couldn't help but cringe as she watched him tap his chin thoughtfully, his eyes focused entirely on her.

"I can't help but think that our business dealings isn't the ONLY reason that spider was so insistent on believing we had a... Less than professional relationship?" His eyebrows quirked as he carefully studied her expression. She was a combination of conflicted, embarrassed, and possibly mocking?  She was a massive kaleidoscope of emotions, many often showing off at once, making a very entertaining - Sometimes even unique - show for him.

"First of all..." She started, swirling her hand in circles to keep her thought process going.  "... Describing our relationship as "Professional" is kinda laughable, considering the CLOSEST I could be described is a Temp for you."  He simply responded with a static laced chuckle, followed with his disembodied laugh track, and a shrug.

"Second of all..." Her pause was a lot longer, rubbing one side of her temples with one hand as she held up a finger with the other, as if to say "One moment."  She let out another hard sigh, and let out a mumbled "I can't believe I'm explaining this to you..."

"You have my full attention now, sweetheart, I am most intrigued with what you have to say!  No backing out now!"  He chimed with a quirked eyebrow, his eyes glistening with intrigue and possible mischief.  With another sigh, she looked him dead in the eyes.

"I have a minor crush on you... A small infatuation..." She admitted, already regretting saying anything.  She braced for the inevitable mocking as he processed what she said to him.  Eventually he broke the silence with the hard laughter she expected of him, and after what felt like an eternity he wiped a tear from his eye.

"A horrible decision, really.  I pegged you to at LEAST be a little smarter than that, darling..." He chuckled darkly, before bending down to bring his face to eye level with her.  "After all, you know full well what horrors I am capable of, yes?  What I have done, and will continue to do, for all of eternity?"

She could feel a lump of nervousness caught in her throat.  His grin was impossibly wide and extremely dangerous, and his eyes were half lidded.  He looked exactly like what he was; A predator with full control over the situation.  If he decided to, he could kill her with such ease.  With a hard swallow, she explained herself.

"I'm not naive...  Nor am I complacent.  I certainly don't support or condone the atrocities you've done..." She let out a hard sigh, repeating the circling motion with her hand to process her thoughts.  "It's just easy to be... Charmed by your more gentlemanly behaviors... Your... Damn it, brain, you had this word five seconds ago...  It's usually used in reference to illnesses that spread easy..." She muttered as the circling became much faster.

"Contagious?" He offered with a chuckle, straightening himself out.  She admitted to this problem of forgetting words quite a while ago, despite her brain fully remembering the concept of the word she's attempting to say.  It was an interesting dilemma, to say the least.  She once anguished over forgetting the word "oven" for a week.

"Yeah, that one.  Your high energy and smile are very contagious..." She said with a point, before continuing.  "I always enjoy the music.  I may be modern, and I know you don't support most of my taste, but I do really like smooth jazz and swing.  You also genuinely make me laugh with your Dad Jokes, I find them hilarious..." The circling of her hand slowly became slower as she started to run out of her steam.

"I could never, in my right mind, try to chase after a serious romance with you, knowing full well the kind of monster you are...  But I can still find some of your other traits endearing.  I absolutely love a man who is passionate, kind of silly, gentlemanly, and for fuck's sake, you're an amazing cook!  It's hard to not be smitten by something that's being chased away by modern views of how men should act..." With a final sigh, she looked him in the eyes, resolved but quite tired.  She was surprised to see how much his expression had softened, especially with her last sentence.

". . . You are a remarkably. . . Perceptive individual, Michaela." He started softly, the static crackle nigh inaudible.  "Especially with how your own mind works.  I have seen, time and time again, fools allow themselves to spiral in such frivolous fantasies and drive themselves mad not knowing WHY they chased them in the first place.  And yet you seem so capable of picking apart your own brain like a professional Psychologist.  I'd be lying if I said I wasn't impressed to some degree."

She looked at him with a bewildered look, certainly not expecting any form of PRAISE from him like that.  She said nothing, cautiously holding her tongue and waiting for the preverbal "but..."

"Given Angel's more... Crass nature, I can certainly see how he misconstrued your infatuation.  However, it's clear as crystal to me that you wouldn't harbor such lustful intentions towards me!" He nodded to himself, seeming almost proud of this sudden character study.

"Never really was interested in sex." She laughs out matter of factly.  "And I think most of us can agree you aren't, either, so I don't see how two people not interested suddenly makes a duo WILDLY interested, especially in the weirder things Angel was suggesting..." She cringed slightly at the thought of the toes again, but the both of them started laughing again.  Alastor took a step closer, giving her a firm pat on the shoulders.

"Yes, indeedy, my dear!  This is an unexpected turn of events for me, to find someone who shares my woes!" He chimed happily, using his hand to gently coax her head to look up at him.  He hadn't seen her laugh and smile like this in a while, and it was a nice change of pace compared to her exhausted melancholy or entertaining - Albeit quick - flashes of anger.  "There's that lovely smile that's been missing!  As you know-"

"Yeah yeah, never fully dressed and all that." She chuckles with an eye roll.  "Though it IS definitely nice to talk to someone who actually UNDERSTANDS the lack of interest..."

She continued to ramble on, but he stopped listening.  She was usually very cautious about how he touched her, showing to be quite aversive if he attempted to go close to her neck in particular.  But it was like she didn't notice where his hand was, and was getting complacent.  Comfortable.  Lowering her guard.  He didn't bare his teeth to her, yet, but his smirk still pulled tight.  He watched through half lidded eyes as she caught herself stumbling over her words, and slowly realized the situation she was in.  As she slowed her ramblings to a stop, she attempted to move her head away; Only for him to tightly grip onto her face, his clawed fingers dangerously close to cutting into her cheeks.  It was at this point, looking at her terrified realization, that he bared his teeth to her.

"A-Alastor, I..." She quietly pleaded, feeling cold sweat starting to bead on her forehead.  Her body had tensed and her arms raised half way, but she stopped herself before trying to pry his hands away.  Not only did she know that it would be a futile attempt with his Demonic strength, but it could have been foolish to DARE try to touch him.  Her hands trembled in fear and conflict as he slowly pulled her face closer, forcing her to stand on her tiptoes, as he leaned in to close the distance.  Mere hairs separated their noses.

"I will admit..." He started coolly, his eyes flicking down the hall quickly to make sure no one would interrupt him, before returning his gaze to the frightened girl in his grasp.  "... The fact that Angel considered such a thing possible is quite amusing, even despite our... Lack of sexual desires.  Do you know why, my dear..?"

"N-No, I don't..." She swallowed hard, not understanding where he could be bringing this conversation.  She shuddered as he let out a cold laugh.

"It's amusing because even if we were both more active in seeking sexual gratification... You are still a small and weak living human.  And, if I could be so frank..."  He leaned closer to her ear, whispering with a sweet venom that made her blood run cold. "I don’t know if your fragile body can handle what I want to do to you."

He let out another dark chuckle before lowering her and releasing his grasp, reveling in the look of utter terror on her face; Eyes wide, mouth slack, and trembling like a small kitten caught in a rainstorm.  And then, as if a switch flipped in his mind, his expression softened to the more excited and less threatening version of himself.

"Now, I do believe it's lunch time!  Now I'm sure that Angel managed to get his little pet out of that little spot of trouble it was in, but perhaps I'll be able to have some bacon anyways!" He laughs with a jovial energy, as if the previous conversation never happened.  He quickly disappeared around the corner, heading straight for the kitchen.

Michaela stood alone in the hall, slowly bringing her hands to her cheeks.  It started to check the damage, but she slowly found herself becoming flustered as she thought about his strange threat.  What could he have considered?  Biting?  Clawing?  Crushing with tentacles?  The thought was, admittedly, exciting, and she had to stop herself from calling for Alastor to ask for clarification.

The last thing she needed a Sadist like him to learn was that she was, very contradictory to most of her Asexual nature, Masochistic and easily excited over such thoughts.

[adamsvanrhijn]

Hello there! I have been happily working through your incredible wtmy,tbws fic like a duck enthusiastically eating a bowl of peas, and was wondering if I may request a director’s commentary on the "never cared to 'til a minute ago. Always been a delicate bloke." conversation OR whatever scene from that fic that you most enjoyed writing? Thank you!

thank you! i am loving that simile very much.................. a duck enthusiastically eating a bowl of peas. amazing.

under cut because the fic itself is Adult Content haha

& also because this is Absurdly long... doing this meme for other people is really hammering in for me how much i rely on single line dialogue & short paragraphs lol. i’d love to work on that, but, womp womp, it hasn’t really been happening.

there is ... a lot going on in this scene lol. i feel very galaxy brain while writing this fic and it’s very pretentious, but i’m just gonna poke at the relevant bits around that quote instead of quoting The Whole Thing. this is from chapter 5 of when to my soul, the body would say ! 

context -- they’ve had morning sex in front of a mirror, then they went for breakfast at the place they’re staying, where richard is using a persona for Safety Reasons, & now they’re just hanging out and richard has been checking thomas out for the last 5-15 minutes without him noticing... until he comments on thomas smoking, and then thomas...

...lets his eyes wander, himself. 

Richard, fully dressed save for his shoes, is turned from the bureau, arm slung over the top of the chair. He did his hair this morning, because Evelyn Price would not have gotten up to anything in the night that could possibly alter the work of a week's worth of Brilliantine, and Thomas sort of hates it.

Not how it looks.

What it means. Or represents, rather. That they've got people other than each other upon whom they need to make good impressions, be they in service or just in the world at large.

right, so, this is like, the Ground Work Thoughts for thomas here as far as this particular interaction is concerned, because this is Very Much about perception / Being Perceived, and before the conversation even happens he’s paying richard a lot of attention, almost to the point of scrutiny. and richard is put together in a way that is very much not for thomas’s sake, it’s for they-left-the-room’s sake, and so he’s noticing that and that’s his frame of mind as they move on.

side note! hair styling oil & pomades really were worn for multiple days in a row. amazing. i could never. there should really be more in this fic about richard’s hair being all floraly <3 <3 <3 but there isn’t. womp womp. that would have been a Factor in this bit huh lol.

"You ever try it?" asks Thomas. Meaning smoking.

"No," he says. He tilts his head thoughtfully. "Never cared to 'til a minute ago. Always been a delicate bloke."

Thomas coughs impolitely.

"I don't see the harm in saying it, Thomas."

The feeling he can't describe leaves him, and a different one forms, in his gut instead of his lungs, an uncomfortable and unwelcome weight. Knotted.

aaaaand boom. thomas Did Not Sign Up For This. 

richard’s being 100% honest, just speaking casually, but thomas’s reaction is enough to get him on the defensive & he’s not an idiot so he knows why, but this is also not something he has lately put a lot of thought into. he’s Accepted It About Himself (we’ll get into this). thomas meanwhile is not ready to approach the subject of Delicacy for anybody he cares about, because to him it’s not a good description, it’s not something he aspires to be or wants to come across as, but he has many times in his life come across as it anyway. he’s Not Like That. 

so the word alone sticks in the wheels of his rolly suitcase emotional baggage, even though it’s richard using it on himself.

"Well, you clearly haven't got a problem with playing at being normal," Thomas says pointedly. Tough not to be pointed when he feels like this, because he's no stranger to it, is he. "If I didn't know better I'd be asking after your wife and baby like the rest of this place."

Lucky those people were leaving after breakfast; Thomas wouldn't be able to take two full days of it.

He hasn't asked about the photographs in the wallet yet, either, and he's not sure if he will.

normal being heterosexual, in this instance, which is contemporary vocabulary.

and richard is very good at playing straight when he’s not fearing for thomas’s life, so. it’s true! it’s a legitimate opinion. but it’s also a pretty significant logical leap that richard is about to pick up on, because that makes him uncomfortable, given thomas is basically saying.... you seem straight, what are you talking about, which isn’t going to make him feel excellent about the sense of identity he’s settled into. 

the rest of this is an Achievement Thomas Is Yet To Unlock so i won’t say much other than that this is not a significant addition to richard as the reader might know him from ywntmha, but, a lot of the big emotional work & development in that fic happens in 1929, with this meeting as the impetus... so it is very significant for thomas, at this point. we’re still in january and they still have a ways to go both in the next 24 hours and in the rest of the year.

Richard raises his eyebrows. "And what's that got to do with it?"

He shrugs.

It should be obvious. It would be obvious, to anyone who bothered to think about it for more than half a second.

that’s not a good faith question; richard’s goading him into actually saying the underlying thought. on one level thomas knows that, which is why he doesn’t say that part out loud and only thinks it.

"It's pretending, is all it is," Richard continues, a little too gentle.

"Don't call yourself what they call you," Thomas returns, a little too sharp.

and since goading doesn’t work, new tactic on richard’s part here, and though thomas can tell it’s intentional it does work on him, so.

writing this was interesting for several reasons but one of the big ones is, and anybody who’s been following me since Before da will probably know this, i like... have very little patience for discussion about personal identity, especially when it comes to reclamation ? i am way more interested both on a personal and academic level (bc i can’t lie about that lmfao, hashtag english major) in community + external ideas imposed on people.  

and this might seem like a very 2010s conversation for them to be having, but... this period of time was really the Dawn of queer/lgbt identity Concepts: words were being coined, communities were coming together in new ways, in continental europe & the us especially there was a lot of rapid development and transition here owing to various roaring 20s factors, and i think richard given his situation would have been exposed to that, for one, but also just, it’s gonna be in both their environments because it was getting to be a thing from the victorian era w/ the medicalisation of homosexuality and things are only expanding. 

"delicate” is a euphemism, not a slur, but it has hella connotations & they are both fully aware of them.

"Rather it be me saying it than them."

Blasé like it doesn't mean a thing at all.

You should know better, he wants to say, you should know better than anyone.

"Don't see how you can feel that way when it's not true to begin with."

thomas’s Only Gay Friend Is My Boyfriend is showing here lol, this is shining light on a gap in what he knows about richard & what he Thinks he knows about richard, so there’s a dissonance. and he sees richard as Masculine on a conscious or subconscious level, and he’s in a These Are Antonyms place re “delicate”. some black & white thinking going on here.

& i feel like the other part is probably fairly explanatory but, richard gets a sense of control and self-assurance by using a word for himself that might not be kind coming out of other people’s mouths and Being Okay With That.

"Thomas…"

They lock eyes.

A tense moment passes.

It is Richard who breaks first. He turns back to the desk with a small sigh.

"This has very little to do with you," he says carefully.

richard, knowing thomas as he does, is able to tell that he’s taking this personally, because he Is, so that’s that there, but again this is something he’s already settled in himself and so there’s also an element of having to justify again this thing he’s already figured out, which he isn’t exactly fond of.

anyway i said i’d get into this -- there’s a lot of interesting like, Societal / Subcultural / Etc politics with regards to being a male servant in this day and age and Gender In General, and valets especially -- throughout the time period leading up to this but ESPECIALLY in the 1920s when there are fewer men in service than there ever have been and more and more kinds of, say, manufacturing jobs as the automobile industry picks up & labour saving devices start having more complicated parts, and probably yknow most of the boys he went to school with are in that or mining or railways, so he’d have thought about it earlier on in his life probably. or Has rather. ftr his brother was in the carriage works i don’t think that ever comes up but there’s a lot there lol. there’s some family stuff in but level in time that we’ll get to........... someday. ANYWAY. 

the point is.

valeting is an effeminate job.

like, point blank. i’m seeing that idea both in sources specifically about servants & just general of-the-era stuff about great houses. when you’re talking about gay men in service a lot of them are valets, and some of that lines up w stereotypes & common lifestyle habits of gay men in general -- looking after hair shoes and clothing, obvs, attention to detail in physical appearance (note that men who Get Valeted also care about details, but they are not the ones who actually have to think and decide about it; whereas their wives are probably giving their ladies’ maids more directions as to hair styles and dresses etc etc because they’re expected to care about that part of the process in a way that men weren’t), exposure to social mores in a variety of different contexts, being well-connected within both the communities that help him get work done: tailoring, hairdressing, shoemakers, drapers, etc and in General, having softer skills like sewing and whatnot. and you’re unmarried and looking after the presentation of another man so there’s some like, desexualisation stuff there.

and thomas and richard would both know this very, very well. they’d have encountered the idea both as men in service and as gay men and especially as gay men in service.  

this richard has been working at buckingham palace for more than twenty years at this point, minus his war backstory which....... is complex and i haven’t gotten into it very much anywhere but he was getting cosy with some higher ups and having To Do about presentation there too and like, was in the service corps which was non-combat supply lines ....... and apprenticing valeting / actually (non-principally) valeting the Literal King Of England for nine.

he has had a LOT of time to get over his shit.

he not only likes his job* but he’s also very good at his job, literal 2nd highest valet position in frankly The World, which is fucking wild, and that combined with his Childhood of like, being second best to his older brother who was like, a perfect human being so far as he could ever tell and that included being very traditionally like, athletic and Leaderly and having-a-sweetheart-in-your-youth-you-then-marry when he was more interested in, you know, story telling and Arts N Crafts (i’m being tongue in cheek) and just generally not ... especially into the Boys Will Be Boys stuff............................

he’s fine with it! he is Fine with being called delicate, it’s helped him get over a lot of his issues just to decide oh, this actually fits my personality and the trajectory my life has followed, so i’m going to just accept that and move on ! etc. 

but thomas is not anywhere near there for himeslf and therefore he isn’t for other people, too, because one of thomas’s Problems is that he hates seeing other people comfortable and happy when he isn’t... and that even applies to richard, because love does not make us perfect. 

*he wants to leave service and he’s tired of the constant scrutiny of working where he does for whom he does, but he does like his actual duties in a lot of ways.

well here’s a novel. i hope this satisfies you!!! <3 <3 <3

[b0x]

😔 some Thoughts on the Trans Experience under the cut that i wanna vent out bc of some posts ive seen around that just kinda didnt sit right with me i guess

every time someone on here is like “trans men cannot experience eldest/only daughter trauma bc they are men and are therefore experiencing transphobic trauma” it’s like... man, gender is way too complex to be so cut & dry about a topic like this. many trans men grew up experiencing the traumas of being a daughter And being a trans man daughter, both pre-transition and post. saying that isn’t saying “trans men are actually women because they experienced this women’s trauma” it’s just recognising that many traumas overlap, regardless of gender. i know it comes from a supportive place, validating us as real men, but that should include validating our unique experiences too. 

i hope this makes sense, but a trans-man-daughter is still 100% a man, still 100% a son, but is very different to and does not have the same experience as a trans-man-son. and a trans-man-daughter doesn’t mean “a trans man raised as a daughter because they didn’t know they were trans at the time”, or “a trans man raised as a daughter by a homophobic parent even after coming out and already knowing they are trans”. no, a trans-man-daughter can still also be a trans man raised as a son with 100% support, because a parent’s trauma can still pass on regardless of the circumstance, because a trans person’s relationship with themselves and their own gender and body and mind is so unique and one-of-a-kind that we were practically designed to overlap the many gendered concepts that so many gatekeep as a sense of empowerment. 

and it sucks making our own posts/experience sometimes, because they never feel like “our own”? because they all come from traumas and bigotry that have already been boxed and labelled and sorted into sections, and to be someone who has bits and pieces from all those different boxes/sections? a trans person can, for example, experience misogyny one year and then transmisogyny the next and that doesnt make the misogyny the prior year “actually transmisogyny”, it was still misogyny that was experienced, even if it’s later relabeled as “transmisogyny”. if anything that just makes it TWO kinds of misogyny experienced instead of just one. it’s terribly confusing. and trust me, for every cis person confused by a trans concept, i can almost guarantee you it’s just as confusing for the trans person themselves. and this isn’t also me saying that ohh trans people have it worse because we experience Double the bigotry and trauma - no absolutely not. i just think it’s important for people to realise that there are people who will experience both misogyny And transmisogyny and that in itself creates its own new kind of bigotry/trauma experienced, if that makes sense?

of course, i don’t speak for every single trans man, but it’s a very specific kind of transphobia a lot of us experience that ties in directly with eldest/only daughter trauma, and why we relate to and connect with posts like that, even when they’re aimed specifically at those who identify primarily as women.

and on top of all that, i see quite a few of the same trans man “supporters” who say “trans men can’t experience daughter’s traumas because they’re men” do complete 180s and say that trans women can’t experience eldest/only daughter trauma bc their transphobia doesn’t correlate with “womanhood” at the source, because trauma that sons/men/male at birth experience is different to the trauma that daughters/women/female at birth experience, which is.. horrifically and bewilderingly transmisogynistic, transphobic, alienating, and just..  Shocking. shocking that these two points can be somehow made in the same breath together without any of them realising what they’re saying.

it’s like.. this weird group of people who are somehow both the opposite of and exactly the same as terfs? theyre more like... tirfs - trans Inclusionary radical feminists - the people who treat trans men like a substitute for the “effeminate cis gay best friend”, the one’s who will validate your masculinity but not entirely consider you a 100% guy, latching onto that “biological fact” of trans men being “female at birth” and therefore considering you more of a “sister” than a “brother”, regardless of them knowing and understanding that you are a man. i guess its kind of very similar to the transphobes who make awful comments that nonbinary people are just closeted lesbians/gays?

anyway, yes, many traumas are gendered due to binaries designated by society and a misogynistic and men-restricting patriarchy (and many other factors that all play parts in this whole big system such as religion and the upper class), but traumas are traumas, and honestly shouldn’t be gendered, because they all overlap regardless, and can be experienced by anyone if the exact circumstances are met. that and every single trans experience is so unique and so so complex because gender in itself is an extremely unique and complex concept that it just cannot in any way be monitored or labelled into strict rules and laws and binaries.

every time i see a post on here about womanhood and daughter traumas and cis women’s misogynistic experiences and hell even a lot of lesbian traumas/experiences, i find myself completely and entirely relating to many of them every single time even though i am 100% a trans guy, and half grew up as a son. and i guess it’s just kind of weird but not so weird because sure while some days it just feels like im not calling myself a true trans guy, most days its just me validating and relating to an experience that i had that was unique to me and doesnt necessarily mean that im a woman because of it

because womanhood and manhood are temperaments, traits we are either born with or without, traits that are ever-changing and developing as we evolve generation by generation. anyone can pick up or be born with parts of womanhood and/or manhood. like that’s what makes all of us so unique, not a single one of us are alike in any way shape or form because of that. the combinations are always unlimited. so it’s just dumb seeing stuff like that gatekeeped. you cant Own an Experience like thats... what the hell is going on. every time its always the same thing, everyone’s always tryna play god in some way, be it mastering themselves, their own emotions and life, or controlling others, dictating what they think how certain things should be etc

it’s like that one post that’s like everything would be so much simpler if everyone was bi and nothing was gendered ghadjgdkgj

idk.. just.. to gender conceptual things like gender and traits and personalities and traumas is just so... unhelpful and unopen to change and not fluid whatsoever as theyre supposed to be. i dont wanna be all “nothing is real” abt it all but labels and binaries and decided systems and set laws are literally the reason, since the beginning of time, for wars and bigotry and oppression and poverty and the whole shebang. bc Someone decided one day that being a woman means this this and that, and being trans means that and this and that, and those meanings will be the basis we will rewrite occasionally and maybe add to, instead of completely scrapping our whole outdated initial ideas about it bla bla bla. 

im just tired gender is weird and stupid why are we arguing why are we so protective like just have a convo man rule with curiosity not adamancy and you’ll be sooo much happier trust me

[magsy-blog1]

11 Questions tag

hhhhhh thx to my beautiful @cent-dix-huit for tagging me

1. 3 songs u started listening to this week

well maybe not this week but recently i’ve been playing ‘dance like we’re making love’ by ciara, 'gucci’ by jessi and 'dusk till dawn’ by zayn and (my everlasting love) sia on a loop

(also bts’ new album especially mic drop bc dude that shit is LiT)

2. what is your favorite conspiracy theory

what are thooose

(no but srsly tho I legit don’t even know any so answering this is kinda complicated)

3. tell me about a memory that you’d like to keep forever

it’s not exactly like a particular one but every dinner at home when we don’t fight and there’s no tension and nobody shouts and I just make my mom laugh so hard she cries is a tiny, beautiful piece of happiness that I wish sometimes I could record and watch again when things aren’t really at their best

4. your house is on fire! what are the 5 things you take?

(first of thank u so much for making those five and not only one bc I couldn’t have been able to answer)

my plushie (it’s an old worn out elephant but I can’t sleep without it so)

the two rings that look rly alike, are from the same store and were gifted to me by @cent-dix-huit and my mom which I have on basically everyday

my usb flash drive on which there is about everything i’ve written these past sixteen years

my favorite book aka The Great Gatsby

and probably my Pizza oversized sweater (also a present from @cent-dix-huit good god, you really are too good to me)

5. your go-to feel good food?

the kebab place two streets from my school

best fucking meal ever

6. you can meet someone that inspires you, what would you tell them?

i’d meet parris goebel and tell her she has made my love for dance and myself and my body grow so much from the moment i’ve discovered her work up until now; that she has taught me that women can be sexy and provocative and show off their bodies and be perfect, not vulgar, not obscene, not sluts; that I look up to her so much and I admire her art; that there’s quite frankly not much in this wolrd i’d want more than get to dance with her

7. where would u like to be right now?

either at a concert, at a party or under a blanket with @cent-dix-huit, junk food and mamma mia! on her laptop

8. chicken or pork?

uGGgggh u can’t do that to me

chicken but I’m only saying this bc sadly pork isn’t always with caramel while every kind of chicken is always the best kind

9. if you could have a superpower, what would it be and why?

i’ve pretty much wanted to be able to fly since I was a little kid so

idk I just think it’s so cool you know?? i’ve always had this dream of seeing the world from above and it just feels like it would be so great

(on another level i’d very much love to read into ppl’s minds bc srsly, that shit’d be rly useful)

10. what advice would u give 10-year-old you?

brush your hair. seriously, brush it. comb it. do something.

and stop cartwheeling while walking, yes, it’s impressive and kinda cool, but mostly it’s just weird and embarrassing to your parents. and on top of it you’ll get permanent scars on your palms for doing it on all types of surfaces and you really don’t want that.

11. rant a little. let it out.

I’m so sick of people calling others fag or bitch and getting offended, or worse laughing at your face, when you call them out on it because it’s not okay

I’m so sick of people not acknowledging your existence and making you feel insecure about yourself for the rest of the week and believing you did something wrong because you made explicit eye contact and they just turned around while you both clearly know the other was right there

I’m so sick of people saying “don’t eat this, you’re gonna get fat” or “why do you eat so much? you’re gonna get fat” like being fat is some kind of disease absolutely no one wants to catch because then no one would love you - and because I love food and I love eating and i’ve seriously heard this sentence way too much in my life already and I’m sick of it because honestly, I don’t really give a fuck if I get fat as long as I feel good but you’re already making it way too hard for me to like myself the way I am just now, so thank you for ruining my confidence

I’m so sick of people thinking it’s alright to make jokes that are racist/homophobic/misogynistic and brushing it off when I get pissed of with “it’s just a joke” “just between friends” well you know what, jokes about me belonging in the kitchen or gay men being effeminate in a sense that is bad because you shouldn’t be like a woman when you aren’t one because it’s already degrading enough to be one or about black people eating bananas or about asian people having small dicks don’t make me laugh, have never made me laugh and will never make me laugh so yeah, sorry to be such a buzzkill but if you’re gonna do these types of jokes, just don’t

I’m so sick of feeling pressured everyday, to look good, to be cool, to know the right thing to say at the right time with the right people, to not be boring, because honestly all of this requires so much more social aptitudes than I have and I’m already way too tired

I’m sick of people telling me to shut up when I start ranting about feminism because honestly YOU shut up, you absolute piece of shit, I’m actually trying to educate you on something that you do unconsciously and which is really bad and instead of telling me to go back to my stove you should just shut it and listen to me because it’s not because I’m not a boy that my words hold less value

And I’m so sick of this world telling me I have to know what I’m gonna do and work in as a grown-up when I’m barely sixteen and still a kid with a head full of dreams that I really don’t want you to break as well.

Guess that is all lmao, here come my questions, and anyone, just feel free to answer them, love y’all

1. what’s the one thing you’d really want to be like super good at?

2. what’s the movie that always makes you smile so damn much and makes you so damn happy no matter how many times you’ve watched it already?

3. if you had to choose only one fic to read for the rest of your life, which one would it be?

4. what AU would you like to live in?

5. what is the most important lesson life has given you so far?

6. what is your favorite instant noodles flavor I need to know

7. give me some chill songs to listen to plss?

8. do you like anyone?

9. what does family mean to you?

10. if you got to learn a language, which one would it be?

11. if you had one last place to go to before you died, where’d you go?

[boyjadzia]

I’m gonna put this under a readmore bc it deals with like, unwanted advances/intimate contact, not sexual assault but just like men being gross, generally, also it’s really long

so this weekend I went to this party, I was invited by a dude I met on tinder. I didn’t know anyone there, I didn’t even really know him, we’d never met before. maybe I was a dumbass for just going with it, even though it was obvious he was interested in me and I wasn’t sure I was interested in him? but I thought, I’m an extrovert, I like meeting people, and I feel like I can’t really decide how I feel about tinder people just from a few texts back and forth, so I was sort of hoping I would be interested in him once I met him. idk.

Anyway, he was clearly flirting with me when we were texting and once I got there he was basically on me the entire time. like, hovering over me, had blatantly no interest in introducing me to other people at the party (also he was at least a foot taller than me). I guess I tried to push away my discomfort bc I’m used to feeling like I’m “colder” than i “should” be bc of my antidepressants and complicated relationship history that makes me not want to jump into things. and I don’t get many opportunities to feel like people are into me, being trans, and my friends thought he was good looking so. I just went with it. Even though he really didn’t present me with much evidence that he was actually an interesting person, and I probably should’ve picked up more on the fact that he couldn’t sense my discomfort.

well long story short I tried to keep him at bay, I left the party to go walk a dog and came back, (and I kind of didn’t want to go back but I did anyway bc he asked me to and I was like well alright I should try to put myself out there, be cool, have fun. why was I trying to convince myself this thing that obviously wasn’t fun was fun? why didn’t I trust myself. idk.) but I went back, and drank a bunch more, and eventually he started putting his hands all over me, I mean not sexually just like rubbing my arms and my back and sides. i felt conflicted about it bc on the one hand, like I said, I’m normally pretty isolated from romance and physical intimacy by being trans, and he wasn’t exactly coming on to me explicitly, but on the other hand I wasn’t actually comfortable with it. and I was really drunk. so I basically just sat there and did nothing and he kept it up (he was also super drunk, but that’s not relevant). and we were having a conversation (with some other people) about like, gender and sexuality and whatever and I think he sensed that this was like, kind of a heavy subject for me, so he was trying to be comforting? idk. but he definitely also just wanted to touch me.

Anyway, eventually it was late and I had to leave, and he offered to let me stay, and I declined, and he offered again as I was going out the door, and I declined, and he kissed me a couple times which I don’t remember very well bc I was very drunk but also just extremely tired. I never really rebuffed him. I was just ambivalent, and he just pushed ahead.

I was kind of vaguely uncomfortable with all this from the outset but it took me a day or two to really process it. but what’s getting to me is like, now I’m reading all these articles about sexual assault that people have been sharing and I’m struck by the fact that this very easily falls into that pattern. Like I said he didn’t actually do anything explicitly sexual, but it was on that path. he wasn’t paying attention to me or what I wanted. he didn’t really care, he only thought about me in relation to himself. it’s messed up.

But the thing that’s really really getting to me is like, these articles are always about women, and I’m not a woman. it says I’m trans very explicitly on tinder, I only have it set to men looking for men, this guy never would’ve met me under the guise of my presenting as female. but I know I look like one, and even beyond that, I’m just a generally small and effeminate person. and one of the things he said in the course of our convo about gender and sexuality was that he’s pan but he doesn’t actually like men that much. or, the way he framed it was that he “doesn’t prefer dicks” which, yikes. and all his previous relationships had been with cis women. idk, I don’t think he was a chaser, but even being super drunk and tired I was taken aback and it def made me uncomfortable.

so part of me wonders, was he acting that way bc he saw me as “basically a woman”? or is this just how he acts, with everybody? this is messing me up a lot because, I’m a nonbinary person, not a man, my masculinity really only feels relevant to me in the context of intimate relationships/sexual orientation, and yet I’ve been feeling so much pressure lately to “pick a political category” because I have to either fall on the side of oppressive/male or oppressed/female. and I know that not being a woman means benefiting from misogyny, etc etc, I don’t care about trying to avoid that, it’s just that in situations like this— where this guy’s behavior was still probably related to my not-maleness, even though he knew I wasn’t a woman so like it obviously wasn’t misogyny, idk. I already feel really alienated from maleness for a lot of reasons. but this wasn’t transphobia in the sense of him not seeing me as a “real man” because i’m not. this was its own weird mix of like, nonbinary/gnc-related transphobia and toxic masculinity, or something.

I’m just confused. because I know nb women (pretty much always AFAB tho) who get annoyed at the implication that you can be a nonbinary person and not a woman and still be oppressed by men. like, the idea that you would be part of a “political category” that maleness oppresses and yet not a woman is an oxymoron. but I just feel like idk how else to conceptualize this. how else do you describe this kind of predatory male behavior? the fact that he definitely didn’t see me as a man, and I’m not? this is why the separation of transphobia and misogyny as being like, totally unrelated axes of oppression feels lacking to me. Bc they’re very intertwined, even if they’re obviously two different things.

I’m just tired of feeling confused and like a bad person. like being nonbinary and trans is an empty statement and not something that I live every day that impacts my life. I’m tired of cis-adjacent nonbinary people, who aren’t trans and are aligned with the binary gender they were assigned, dictating the terms of how nonbinary ID relates to gender as a political construct. of feeling like i’m a bad person for thinking of incidents like this as relating to a larger pattern of oppression by cis men because what else is it? transphobia, yes, but a particular type of transphobia that’s bound up in maleness vs. my lack of conformity to maleness. that reinforces a distrust and fear of men, not just cis people. I’m tired of feeling like this means I’m not really trans and should just go back to IDing as a woman or woman-aligned.

basically, I’m tired of having to deal with binary trans people’s lack of empathy for nonbinary trans people, and non-trans nb people’s presumptuousness. I’m tired of my experience not making any sense and feeling like I don’t fit into anything.

I legit don’t know what to do. I don’t feel like I have any of the right answers. the idea of talking about the oppressive behavior of men in terms of “women and nonbinary people” feels dangerously close to the preposterous “women and femmes” thing. and there are obviously issues women have that I don’t. but like, how am I supposed to deal with the emotional fallout of being preyed upon by men if I’m alienated from every gender-based social grouping in the course of these discussions?

[reactingtosomething]

Reacting to Crazy, Stupid, Love

Old Fashioneds for Charity: A Cocktail Philanthropy

The Setup: Kris actually gets into the long version of the Setup below, but this is also the first time all four of us have Reacted to Something together in real time! So it’s super long and a little clunkier than usual, but hopefully also fun. We’ll probably try to do it again at some point.

As always, post-chat annotations are in italics, and you can click on the first appearances of our names to see summaries of the TV shows, movies, and other things that influence our points of view.

LIZ: soo.. Crazy, Stupid, Love.. am I RIGHT?!

KRIS: I’m worried I’m going to disappoint all of you

(Are we all here?)

MARCHAE: Yes!!

MIRI: You laughed out loud multiple times while we watched

KRIS: Yes

MIRI: I don’t think you’ll disappoint us

LIZ: Kris, don’t be worried. We will just unfriend you on social media first and

THEN cut off all contact

IF THAT HAPPENS

MIRI: hahahahaha

LIZ: ❤️

MIRI: So, Kris--thoguhts?

MARCHAE: LOL

MIRI: Or thoughts

whichever you feel like

LIZ: I forgot so much.. Kris go first

MARCHAE: I want them ALLLL

LIZ: General opinion/ reaction then nitty gritty!?

KRIS: I guess I’d like to start with the [name of my writing teacher] story first

Just to explain how we got here

MIRI: Ok, please do

MARCHAE: storytime with kris 

KRIS: We’re just jumping right into like late second-act spoilers for Crazy Stupid Love, dear readers, all eight of you

MIRI: omg ❤️ 

KRIS: So [Writing Teacher] wanted to give us an example of subtext

And writing dialogue that doesn’t suck

So she gave us a scene, minus action description and names, and it’s a woman asking a man for advice on fixing a water heater

And she asks, what do you think this scene is about?

And we know it’s a trick question, but for whatever reason even the people who’ve seen the movie haven’t picked up on it yet

So the answers are like “she doesn’t really want to ask for his help”

LIZ: Sneaky. Love it

KRIS: And then [Writing Teacher] turns on the TV and there’s the title screen for Crazy Stupid Love, and some people are like ohhhh

And [Writing Teacher] doesn’t say anything and she goes to the scene, and obviously it’s not even remotely about a water heater

And more people are like OHHHHH yeah

And I was like, damn

That’s good

And I guess I was over at Miri’s, or maybe we met somewhere for something, and I was telling this story

MIRI: “Damn. That’s good. Maybe I should listen to Miri when she tells me to watch things”

KRIS: And it comes up that I haven’t seen the movie

And Miri is like

MARCHAE: (Which is still unbelievable)

KRIS:

MIRI: You’ve used that gif about me more than once

KRIS: Yes I have

It’s a good gif!

I like Elizabeth Jennings!

MIRI: And I am still complimented and also concerned

It is an excellent gif

KRIS: So this was October, I think

MIRI: I like her too but I’m not sure I should want to be her!

October sounds right

LIZ: I dont think his advice was even legit to be honest so don’t read it or watch it if you are struggling with a water heater issue!

Liz is looking out for us all, dear readers

READ THE MANUAL

KRIS: And every once in awhile it would come up and Miri sort of led this slow-but-steady charge of We’re Going to Make Kris Watch Crazy Stupid Love

and Kelly signed onto this in some capacity

Kelly is Miri’s roommate and another friend from our grad program

And obviously Marchae and Lemon

Reminder: Lemon = Liz

So here we are

MIRI: We’re humanitarians like that

Here we are!

KRIS: that was a looooot of preamble

sorry

MARCHAE: (And we had to get you on board with Hamilton too... kris I see a pattern) 

MIRI: I like the preamble. Now, tell us your thoughts!

KRIS: I liked it?

See this is why I’m worried about disappointing you

MIRI: Are you not sure about that?

Or do you just not have more expansive thoughts?

KRIS: No, I’m sure

LIZ: you did like it or you liked it ? 

KRIS: I’m sure there are more thoughts, but I’ll need some prompting, I guess

MARCHAE: I'm sitting on the edge of my seat her!!! 

Here* 

MIRI: Ok, we can prompt

LIZ: Who cares what we think! I took some notes because I forget a lot of things and a lot of my notes were sassy.. so what?

KRIS: I think the only thing I’d seen Gosling in before this was The Nice Guys

MARCHAE: Ok can you talk about the Ryan Gossling character 

LIZ: MASCULINITY

MIRI: WHAT

LIZ: GOD

MIRI: ???

LIZ: go*

KRIS: and probably a couple of episodes of Young Hercules

LIZ: hahaha

MIRI: WHAAAT?

LIZ: this is a topic for another day

MIRI: True

KRIS: I never saw The Notebook

MARCHAE: What!?!

LIZ: LASDKF;SLAKGJASL;KFJASLKJF

MARCHAE: What is happening!?!?!

WHAT IS HAPPENING 

LIZ: You need to want ALL OF IT EVERY DAY (the notebook that is)

KRIS: I can see there’s going to be a Make Kris Not a Philistine syllabus at some point

MIRI: YES

But also you have tons for us to watch too

KRIS: I guess where I was going with this is that I realized watching CSL that Gosling has pretty strong Brad Pitt vibes

MIRI: Focusing on this movie!

RYAN GOSLINGS IS SO HOT in this. And I love that he’s hyper masculine without being so in all ways.

KRIS: Does that seem right? Or was this not representative?

LIZ: Talk about... representation in this movie... I had a lot of questions about masculinity rewatching

MARCHAE: Ew

So did I liz 

LIZ: and then about how women are portrayed obviously always.. but what are your gut reaction thoughts

MIRI: Like, he’s got some slightly effeminate affectations that go with his kind of dandy vibe

MARCHAE: And Miri to be clear the ew was for you 

MIRI: Um ouch??

KRIS: Hang on I’m just pulling up IMDB to get character names

LIZ: ew what? he’s very hot

MIRI: You don’t think he’s hot?

LIZ: did you not see his body

MIRI: He’s hot!!

It’s like he’s photoshopped!

LIZ: HAHAHA exactly

MARCHAE: And now you liz. No i think he generally looks dehydrated and like he needs to bathe 

LIZ: ........

MARCHAE: The photoshopped line is funny but no 

LIZ: He has a tan?

MARCHAE: Go on Kris 

KRIS: Marchae’s descriptions of unattractiveness are always so specific

Miri: Marchae once told me she thinks the Rock looks like a toe and I have NEVER forgiven her for it.

MARCHAE: I am also tanned 

MIRI: Ohh, you’ve had this complaint about him before that he needs to wash

K: Marchae was not rooting for La La Land during the Oscars

KRIS: “dehydrated”

MIRI: Ok, let’s talk about toxic masculinity and this film’s deconstruction of it Because I’m into it

KRIS: OK

MARCHAE: Yeah the bags under/around his eyes -dehydration 

LIZ: lol at marchae’s tan.. and nobody’s here to say YOU ARENT HOTT! ❤️ 😉

MIRI: very true! 🔥

MARCHAE: Thanks gang 

MIRI: I think the film is pretty clear on the fact that Jacob’s perspective on women for most of the film is not super healthy or ok

(and also he could use some therapy)

MARCHAE: Ok so I did [rewatch] and I think because I knew we were talking pay more attention to how okay women are with RGs character 

MIRI: And we’re all tired of the whole The Right Woman SAVED Him narrative, but I do like that he has actual growth

I would argue that he’s a womanizer, but not a misogynist 

KRIS: (I did wish both Emily and Hannah had bigger stories in this)

MIRI: (or at least not to the extent of most)

Kris, I second that

MARCHAE: Same here 

MIRI: And not just because they are both such talented actors

The movie is mostly about the men’s growth

MARCHAE: Miri I feel like he might teeter on that line. He almost feels he has a right to these women he seeks out 

MIRI: But the women are allowed to be characters rather than set pieces more than most

MARCHAE: Kind of like that one that's the one I want and I will get her 

KRIS: Yeah, and of course it’s not inherently objectionable that this is a story about two dudes

MIRI: except the women they sleep with, mostly

Very true! I think we could use more stories about men having emotional growth and healthy friendships

MARCHAE: No not at all (three if you track the little boys story) 

YES!!! 

MIRI: The whole “You don’t ask them, you tell them that they want to come home with you” thing is not great. It’s pretty bad. But it’s also not the language that they ever use when actually talking to women--it’s always “wanna get out of here” type stuff

So I think that Jacob is not as much of a misogynist as he thinks he is!

I may be being too forgiving

But I love him

LIZ: I think he feels less entitled to the women and more just confident in his “game” bc consent is obviously important to him.. he doesn’t have to talk anyone into anything, which SHOULD BE THE WAY IT ALWAYS IS but unfortunately is not in real life and in how “wooing” is portrayed in film and what nots

MIRI: Very true! He’s super forward, but will take no for an answer without being creepy

KRIS: I feel like on the page Jacob would probably come off as more of a dick

Gosling underplays it in a way, he’s very not Frat Dude

MARCHAE: I agree Kris!

MIRI: When he first hits on Hannah he keeps talking as she leaves, but he never gets up or tries to stop her (Again, low bar)

Yes!!

The performance really makes it

LIZ: That character could’ve easily ruined the movie

the shopping with Cal part is especially lovely

MIRI: Love that!

KRIS: I think that’s because Hannah specifically was never really his objective; at that point she’s interchangeable with any other woman he might want to take home

LIZ: I am a sucker for physical humor apparently (throwing his shoes and slapping him(

MARCHAE: I don't generally love him and Hannah/Nanna notes the ridiculous nature of the game he plays 

MIRI: I also adore the section where they talk and have the infomercial stuff--one of my favorite film sequences

MARCHAE: So then I'm on board once the movie itself recognizes ok this guy is a doofus 

MIRI: Do we believe that he actually remembered hitting on her that one time when she kisses him? Or is he just going with it?

KRIS: That’s an interesting question

I think the intent is that he remembers her

LIZ: Gosling also never said like “all I want is to have the sexy times with as many women as possible”.. he just is kind of good at it.. I think if he ever said that was all he cared about or aspired to be... he’d be an asshat of the highest caliber

MIRI: I think the movie always knows that he’s a doofus, but doesn’t show its cards early

KRIS: I’m not sure if it’s the answer that makes the most sense or is the most interesting

MIRI: I’ve never questioned it before

LIZ: I think he remembered her bc she turned him down

and we don’t see anyone else do that

KRIS: I buy that

MIRI: Nice

MARCHAE: *YAS LIZ*

MIRI: Do we believe his redemption? Or change of heart or whatever?

LIZ: But then I felt like.. masculinity is kind of very set in stone and in stages of life in this movie

I know it is more complex

but does society kind of not ask it to be?

MIRI: Say more

What stages do you see?

LIZ: The kid with the crush ... the womanizer sexy young guy... the sad dad/ divorcee with his walking shoes and ill fitting clothes

MIRI: And are you saying the movie reinforces those ideas about particular types of masculinity or no?

LIZ: Cal is able to kind of morph into Goslings characters TYPE and I think at the end he is his own person and a NEW version of a man, but the ENTIRE movie kind of puts men in boxes.. which is FINE BC WOMEN ARE USED TO THAT TOO

KRIS: Is this kind of a Dan Fogelman thing? I’m not super familiar with his corpus

LIZ: and the douche boyfriend of hannah is kind of the alternative to the sexy young guy.. the safe boring young guy like SHOULD I MARRY KOKOUM.. STEADY AS THE BEATING DRUM? that shit

I am asking.. because I don’t know!

MIRI: Hmmm

KRIS: I think these are definitely all types/boxes but I don’t know if I’d map them into linear stages

MIRI: Maybe it’s more a question of him using and playing with types than anything else

MARCHAE: Liz I notes that too though not as eloquently 

KRIS: I got more of a “you can be this, or you can be that” vibe

MARCHAE: Noted*

LIZ: There is something to be said of the separated married couple trying to maybe make it work.. and the way Cal turns into a better human who cares about himself and then his life more too bc of that.. idk

yeah

MIRI: And then ultimately you can be you with an element of this and that if you want

LIZ: Like the wife is flawed, but open and trying from the first scenes where he rolls out of the car, which I appreciate

MIRI: While Cal’s journey gets way more screen time, I like the building blocks of Emily’s a lot

“Can women have midlife crises??” Yes, they totally can

LIZ: Yeah I agree, I’d have loved to see more Emily and Hannah

MIRI: And more of Liza Lapira, the friend!

KRIS: Also shout out to Asian Best Friend

MIRI: I love her and she never gets big enough parts!

LIZ: Right!?

MIRI: Kris, were weirdly in sync here and I love it

KRIS: There are like two not-white people in this movie and the other one is credited as “Hip Hairdresser”, so

MIRI: The phone call when Hannah is studying and ABF sees Jacob at the bar is hilarious

LIZ: She deserved to have something nice happen to her.. she gets creeped on by a fat old dude and gets to drool at Gosling! Not fair!

wow at hip hairdresser

MIRI: It is an extremely white movie

Like, down to the extras at the school and office

MARCHAE: Par for the course though for our friend Hollywood 

KRIS: Unless you count Emma Stone

Sorry

Too easy

I’ll show myself out

MIRI: HAHAHAHAHHAHHAHA

LIZ: Yeah there is no reason why the babysitter and her family or the school staff or the people at the bar needed to be all white.. very gross

MIRI: Omg

It’s very 10 years ago, too

MARCHAE: *KRIS*

KRIS: Oh let’s see if we can finish this masculinity stuff but do remind me to come back to the bar set

as a set

MIRI: We will try

Kris, as our man do you have anything to say about masculinity?

LIZ: like the kid, the dad, the player, the douche.. then the kind of controlled by his wife married angry ish guy (the friend w the mays bag) those are the people to think of as a refresher of type of dudes

KRIS: I don’t know that I have any fresh insights you all haven’t covered

LIZ: insert(eggplant emoji)

well do you think that it has anything right or anything wrong?

MIRI: 🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆

LIZ: like the adolescent kid is actually given a good amount of depth

MIRI: There you go, Lemon

LIZ: thank you I didnt know if we could use those hhahahahha

MIRI: We can

MARCHAE: Can I say one thing

LIZ: well

🍆

MARCHAE: I did not love the end bit with the babysitter giving the kid the nude pics

MIRI: THANK YOU

MARCHAE: It was odd to me and not a thing I think a girl would do 

MIRI: I find that pretty grody

KRIS: Yeah I didn’t love that whole story honestly

MARCHAE: Like here is my gift to you young flower

NO

KRIS: And I understand that part of this is just my general aversion to humans who aren’t old enough to drink

MARCHAE: And No

MIRI: And technically distribution of child pornography since she’s 17

KRIS

K: As previously established, I am generally not a person who is won over by cuteness of the non-furry-quadruped variety. I’m the one who doesn’t say anything when one of the others sends baby pictures in our group text.

KRIS: But yeah, even the persistent text messages

MARCHAE: LOL 

Yes and he kind of quasi stalks her 

It's. Not. Cute

MIRI: Yeah, “I’m not going to stop sending messages that make her uncomfortable” is not great

KRIS: I guess I’m not sure when this came out in relation to our sort of broader cultural understanding of social media’s role in rape culture and harassment more broadly

LIZ: Technology moves so fast

KRIS: But that was all on my mind

MIRI: I think it was before that general realization

They still had slide out keyboard phones

MARCHAE: But not before the general realization of stalking 

And harassment 

LIZ: I think it is harrassment

MARCHAE: And the exchange of kid picks 

KRIS: Yeah

MARCHAE: No adult human said 

Young sir stop it's not cute 

It was all 

LIZ: I think things hit the fan sexting wise after this though

MARCHAE: Go get her! 

KRIS: BOYS WILL BE BOYS

LIZ: BOYS WILL BE RAPISTS HAHAHAHAH SO CUTE

jk but actually

Her crush on Cal was disturbing

like.. no.

MIRI: He is her dad’s friend!!!

LIZ: I was a hott mess in all the ways as a teen, but no!

MARCHAE: I guess I was lost on why it was supposed to be cute

MIRI: As creepy and not ok as the kid story is, I do like some od it

LIZ: The little girl.. the youngest.. Lets write her sequel.. she needs the most therapy

MARCHAE: I thought all of this the first time 

MIRI: Like it was definitely written by a guy not really getting the reality of rape cultre

culture

MARCHAE: RIGHT 

MIRI: but I do like that his idea of love is neither purely romantic or solely sexual. He sees her as his soul mate and it’s nice to see more than one aspect of attraction represented in one

MARCHAE: Or the reality of LIFE

KRIS: I feel like a lot of this movie works better than it should because the performances aren’t too broad

Like everyone’s actually pretty easy to empathize with

MARCHAE: I think you're right though 

If even one of them has been not redeemable it would have not worked 

LIZ: I think soul mates are kind of bullshit.. which isn’t unromantic of me, but more like... we see that this idea can force things that are not right and its not good for young people to fixate on someone like that!

KRIS: Even Jessica (babysitter) isn’t presented as hysterical or like, hormone-addled

MIRI: True

Oh I think soul mates are bullshit too

MARCHAE: The kids are all pretty self aware 

I guess that gives it the pass 

KRIS: So as uncomfortable as the story is when you take a step back, from pretty early on -- I’m thinking the car scene when Cal drops Jessica off -- she’s kind of restrained and thoughtful

LIZ: the only semi hysterical female is the teacher

but i think she is kind of fucked with in ways that bring that out

MIRI: My computer is being weird so sorry if my texts come in at a weird delay

KRIS: So I guess I liked that Jessica is afforded the same amount of humanity as anyone else, if that makes sense

LIZ: right

KRIS: Marisa Tomei!

LIZ: she definitely is

MIRI: I just like that the kid who’s jerking off to a girl also likes her as more than a sex object

Yes

LIZ: Ugh that is so gross

MIRI: Marisa Tomei is so funny

What's gross?

LIZ: yes she’s great

MIRI: Him jerking off with her IN THE HOUSE?

LIZ: Just thinking about having kids of either sex that age

I can’t pick which one would be worse

KRIS: ha

MARCHAE: But he also isn't apologetic to the fact that he's made her uncomfortable about it and that's what bugs me

LIZ: he does apologize at one point

MIRI: I genuinely am bothered by that too

LIZ: but it kind of takes his world being crushed

which is odd

KRIS: Well, I don’t like it as a story but I buy it from a 13-year-old

MIRI: All of the men need to Grow Emotionally in this movie

LIZ: I guess

yep

MARCHAE: But doesn't he say I'd do it again and she laughs 

MIRI: And the women mostly need to get outside their comfort zone, I guess?

K: I don’t think so, actually. I’d say it’s more something like, they need to be willing to say what they want/need from relationships, and/or don’t expect your partner to be a mind-reader.

MIRI: I like that reading. I also think they need to be willing to examine what they want for themselves--Jessica does’t end up with a partner but she seems to be happy and to have realized that pursuing a crush that inappropriate is probably not the way to go.

LIZ: I have specific questions at some point about certain parts of the movie

MIRI: Go for it!

LIZ: Hannah being seen as “chaste” by refusing Gosling’s advances kind of give her that angel dynamic, versus the slut thing that all of the women who readily go with him automatically might get, so then she DESERVES to hear about this parents and see his massage chair and be his one love... and I AM SO FUCKING SICK OF THAT

also.. I did note.. “WHY IS HIS MASSAGE CHAIR IN THE GARAGE? PEOPLE ARE STARVING” which was in the moment but I stand by it

MIRI: I never thought of it that way. I assume she’s been sleeping with Human Valium

LIZ: I have more but THOUGHTS?

KRIS: I think it’s totally in character for the chair to be abandoned in the garage

But to your larger point, yes

MIRI: Yes Jacob needs to stop trying to buy happiness and start volunteering and giving to charity and funding cool research or something

I think he’d find it much more rewarding

KRIS: I definitely think there’s a (really familiar) undercurrent of assuming most of the women Jacob sleeps with are empty airheads

MIRI: Definitely

LIZ: “Old Fashionds for Charity” a cocktail philanthropy

MIRI: “Am I boring you? I’m totally boring you!”

Well there’s the post title

Well done, Lemon

LIZ: Spelled wrong

lol

KRIS: We can spell it right in the heading

MIRI: There goes our integrity 

LIZ: hahahhaa

MARCHAE: I didn't think they were airheads but maybe... as the kids would say

Thirsty 

MIRI: I think the intent is that Hannah is the one that challenges him, not that she’s virginal

But it’s still kind of shitty

LIZ: I don’t want to feel seem like Im hating on Hannah btw

MIRI: No, you don’t!

KRIS: Yeah, I think it’s like “Hannah is a Woman of Substance”

LIZ: Her awkward, wet, weirdness where she says what she’s thinking is amazing and I really identify with it.

MIRI: I am a little concerned that she went from being ready for Valium to propose to in a pretty heavy relationship with Jacob over the course of a rainstorm

Yes! Great moment of weirdness

When she’s asking about the logistics of his moves it’s amazing

LIZ: I felt like she thought he might and shed be flattered, but I think she also might have had a come to jesus moment if he HAD proposed and left also

MIRI: Fair

KRIS: I got the sense there was a little bit of a time lapse presumed after they get together

LIZ: bc its at a cheese cake factory type of place (not that nice even) at a mall

MIRI: There’s at least a couple weeks

But still

LIZ: oh for sure

MIRI: The El Torito Grill!

KRIS: I mean even if it wasn’t a super intense relationship I buy her not breaking up with him because Dad Says So

LIZ: oh yeah, she’s an adult... that is insane

MIRI: Definitely! 

KRIS: Oh, okay, so now that we’re here, I should say that the Twist worked well enough for me to say “Whaaaat” out loud

MIRI: But also she’s totally emotionally invested 

He did!!!

LIZ: because you thought nana was a grandma?

MIRI: It was great!

KRIS: Up until that point, I was sort of like okay, this is a charming movie but I don’t feel a need to rewatch it ever

LIZ: also they are so into their kids.. why does she not come up! it is kind of CONVENIENT

KRIS: But now I would maybe want to rewatch it to see how they plant that

MIRI: They plant it well!

MARCHAE: "Charming"

KRIS: I did have a moment earlier in the movie of like “huh, they cast two redheads”

LIZ: ha

MIRI: When Cal talks about his kids it’s always “my youngest” (rather than my girl) and “I have kids--plural!”

MARCHAE: That's true and he also just calls Hannah Nanna right?

MIRI: right

KRIS: Yeah, and they do sort of plant the banana thing in the not-proposal scene, right? 

Or maybe the earlier restaurant scene?

MARCHAE: Yeah! 

KRIS: So at no point was I like “buddy, that’s a stretch”

MIRI: Hannah Banana!

LIZ: thats good

KRIS: I would just be curious to spot all the pieces being set up

LIZ: they definitely are

MIRI: It’s a good rewatch

MARCHAE: I like it a lot actually 

LIZ: also.. there are cheesy parts.. which seem to be on the nose, but the movie is very self aware

like the rain starts and he says like “so cliche” or something

MIRI: Yes!

LIZ: but his kid is like “dad you did change, you just got new clothes” and I did think BARF OKAY NO

MIRI: And Emily actually mentions how things are “in the movies” when talking about midlife crises 

Like, a cliche lampshading of a cliche is still cliche

KRIS: That did jump out at me

MARCHAE: It knew these things 

KRIS: I don’t know if it bothered me but I don’t think I would’ve missed it either

LIZ: there was also a part about half way through where I realized why I like tv more most of the time.. like even if I had never seen it.. I knew what would happen and I am so sick of that fake roller coaster/ formulaic bs

MARCHAE: Does that make the movie smart

KRIS: I think it makes it self-satisfied

LIZ: No, but it is cute

MIRI: I think it’s both self-satisfied and cute

KRIS: sure

MIRI: Like, it’s a little annoying but I’ll allow it because I like the rest so much

MARCHAE: Fair 

MIRI: Also this is not at all connected to what we’re talking about but “I don’t want your slutty money” is one of the best moments ever

LIZ: oh yeah

hahaha

MARCHAE: And Emily's response was the best

LIZ: because it isn’t overdone or too dramatic.. it is kind of exactly how someone would think they are really telling someone off, but it is more like a passing strange comment built up in their brain

what about kevin

they say his name 3084028408 times and I have forgotten it

MIRI: David Lindhagen

MARCHAE: I was like was his name Kevin?buut I'm there now 

KRIS: I’d watched a couple episodes of I Love Dick shortly before this so I was like Oh hey, Kevin Bacon! but I don’t have deep thoughts

MARCHAE: I think the story could have easily been told without ever actually having seen him 

KRIS: I liked that he wasn’t a cartoon villain

MIRI: But then we don’t get the fight scene!!!

Which is amazing!

Yes! I think he’s a nice seeming guy who is a little shitty for going after a married woman

LIZ: yeah the fight scene is great

MIRI: He’s not a massive dick, but he’s not a hero

LIZ: nobody really is ha

MIRI: Jacob’s desire to punch him is great

KRIS: Yeah, exactly, I did like that a lot about the movie

LIZ: except when cal calls the bartender.. a cocktail servant that is the meanest thing 

Right that felt like real family

MIRI: But he’s definitely seen as being a dick for that

LIZ: like you can be mad at each other but still have a common enemy

MIRI: Even he knows it was dickish

KRIS: cocktail servant was weird, yeah

LIZ: yes he did

MIRI: Yeah I like the way the family can fight and still come together

Very genuine feeling

LIZ: another amazing part... “amy heard you crying in the bathroom. we all thought it was cancer.. thank god!”

and they don’t talk for a while but still kind of love each other and the what nots

KRIS: So about the bar set, I liked that Cal ended up back in that seat after having been in Jacob’s spot looking at some other balding sadsack who was obviously supposed to remind him of himself

It’s simple, but I liked that use of set geography to establish power dynamics

K: Off the top of my head, this AV Club article (on the study table in Community and the elevator in Captain America: The Winter Soldier) is my favorite little internet thing about using a set to establish, and then play with, audience expectations.

LIZ: with a straw!

MARCHAE: Ohhhhh nice!

LIZ: yeah

MIRI: Yes!

Very good use of space/visuals

My perpetual question about Jacob--is he supposed to be Jewish??

LIZ: I also don’t think any women go to that bar twice

for his whole scheme to work

MIRI: He says shvonz (I don’t even know how to spell that) and his name is Jacob.

This is my only evidence but I feel strongly about tit

LIZ: He feels Jewish and sometimes Italian to me haha

MIRI: Yes!

LIZ: maybe both!

MIRI: His actual pronunciation of words does not feel Jewish to me, but that could be regional

MIRI: Please note that I’m not trying to imply that all Jewish people must “sound Jewish.” For example, I have some of the speech patterns that characterize Jewish American speech but almost none of the pronunciations.

Yes, he could be both!

LIZ: but yeah the shvonz (autocorrect can’t guess a thing) seems like yiddish or pretend yiddish

MIRI: Definitely

LIZ: seems like eastern european with a spray tan and a come-as-it-pleases brooklyn accent

MIRI: (HOW MANY TIMES DO I SAY DEFINITELY IN EACH ONE OF THESE??)

LIZ: DEFINITELY A FEW TIMES

MIRI: hahahahahaha YES Liz

LIZ: no I didn’t notice hahaha

KRIS: About as many times as I say “like” and “for sure”

LIZ: or as many times as I ignore punctuation, spelling, capitalization, and grammar in general? jk that is always for me (IM NOT SORRY! I MAJORED IN IT AND I PROVED THAT I KNOW IT)

MIRI: hahahahahaha

KRIS: Marchae I feel like you must have four pages of handwritten notes, is there anything you’re dying to bring up that we haven’t covered?

MARCHAE: HAHAHAHAH  

This time I didn't have as many notes! 

LIZ: HA 

good! that means you just watched and enjoyed!

MARCHAE: My thing was mostly the odd kiddie crush bits that we covered 

KRIS: Yeah interestingly I feel like there’s not a lot to overthink here outside of larger cultural issues

LIZ: Why didn’t Jacob buy Cal’s drinks or some of his clothes?

His house is like.. clearly a 4 million dollar plus home

KRIS: Does he ever say what his job is?

MARCHAE: I also wanted to add that I want a story that focuses on Hannah and Jacob

MIRI: That’s true. Like, there’s a lot that’s done really well but it doesn’t take ling to say that

MARCHAE: He's a hustler kris 

LIZ: I think he got a large inheritance

KRIS: oh right

LIZ: (pillow talk exposition)

Hesssss a hustler babyyyyy

MARCHAE: Ha! 

MIRI: At least he’s not a scrub

LIZ: he knows about new balance rules and he eats pizza w a napkin!

KRIS: That pizza thing is actually the first moment where I thought of Brad Pitt

I think because of Rusty in the Ocean’s movies

LIZ: I think you can wear stylish and supportive footwear btw.. I didn’t like that message

MIRI: Sbaru Sbarro? 

I love that moment

LIZ: Brad isn’t my fav

MIRI: Yes, Jacob has some unhealthy rules

KRIS: But he has a similar low-key charisma

LIZ: If you think Brad is charismatic 

can you seriously go watch the notebook

MARCHAE: Brad Pitt does?

KRIS: I mean I’ve always liked him

MIRI: In Oceans he totally is

Whether you like him in general or not

LIZ: People don’t forget is all I’ll say about thim

MIRI: We should have Kris and Marchae do a Notebook reaction 

And Liz just annotates after

MARCHAE: See the notebook makes me cry 

LIZ: oh yes

of course it does

(no spoilies)

MARCHAE: I won't  

I'd be down! 

LIZ: 😀

MIRI: Ok, anything else we want to say about CSL?

KRIS: I don’t actually harbor DEEP resentment toward Emma Stone for Aloha

MARCHAE: HAHAHA

KRIS: I just hope she makes better choices in the future

LOOKING AT YOU, JOHANSSON

MIRI: Agreed

UGHHHHHH agreed

MARCHAE: Yes!!!!!!!!

MIRI: Like, learn from your mistakes

Stop making even bigger ones

K: Actually I just realized, I’m not sure what else you’re referring to besides Ghost in the Shell.

MIRI: Lucy. While not actually a case of whitewashing, it is pretty bad on the Yellow Peril front and she caught some flak for it...and then upped the ante by playing a Japanese character in Ghost in the Shell.

K: Look, I stopped paying attention to Lucy the second I realized it was premised on that “we only use 10 percent of our brains!” horseshit. 

But Johansson didn’t write Lucy, and it was what “proved” she could carry an action movie on her own, so I’m inclined to cut her slack there that I’m not willing to cut her for taking on a specifically whitewashed lead role in Ghost. Expecting actors to answer for writers and directors (in this case Luc Besson) is a slippery slope. Go too far, and it’s like blaming Candice Patton for The Flash writers’ inability to make Iris more than a damsel in distress for longer than half an episode at a time.

MIRI: Very true! I think Lucy is excusable, but Lucy and Ghost combined makes for an uncomfortable pattern. And yes, the 10% of the brain thing is ridiculous.

KRIS: I do like the whole Woody Harrelson Introduced Emma Stone and Brie Larson and Jennifer Lawrence to Each Other thing

MARCHAE: YES MADAM HOT SAUCE DISAPPOINTED ME

LIZ: Amazing

KRIS: We have to talk about this Madam Hot Sauce thing

And we will -- or at least, Marchae will, with our very first Guest Reactor sometime in the next week or two. Because apparently “Madam Hot Sauce” is what Marchae calls Scarlett Johansson, and Marchae has discovered that she has strong opinions about the Marvel Cinematic Universe.

[eddiegirls]

if i don't like butch lesbians, that's wrong? what am i supposed to do? how do i change my feelings about them.

well like…sometimes you’ll just have a preference and there’s nothing wrong with that. but i think sometimes not being attracted to butch women can come from like….society telling us How A Woman Should Look. only you yourself know exactly how your attraction works, but it might help to ~Reflect on why you don’t like butch women. is it just preference or is it because you think of them as lesser women because they’re not effeminate? 

but no, there’s nothing inherently wrong with not being attracted to butch women. idk if you’re the same anon but in the last ask i got abt this you (or whoever it was) kinda implied that butch women annoy you or you find them weird and that’s definitely not okay. like that implies to me that you think of butch women as Less Than Women bc of how they dress/act/etc.