#batfam just has a lot more punching and explosives than most

[aspiratinganxiety]

So I love when you rant and give detailed explanations about certain topics so: was Jason better off not being adopted by Bruce?

So, I’m not sure if you’re asking about any particular story line or alternate universe in which Jason is not adopted, and so I am going to answer under the assumption that you’re referring to headcanons floating around about the way things would have gone for Jay if he’d never been taken in as a Robin. 

Furthermore, I’m going to answer this with absolutely zero self-pity. Do not mistake my relating low-income struggles that were present in my life as bellyaching. There were a lot of reasons why things were the way that they were for me, and I do not need an ounce of anybody’s pity.

So, without further ado, Anon, as somebody who was raised in an incredibly low-income environment with violence, drug abuse, and all other manner of illegal activity going on in my home through my childhood into adolescence: No. 

Fuck. No.

Jason remaining in a dangerous environment, no matter how he thrived there, would not leave him in a state that I consider “better off.”

Simply through the lens of base needs, no fucking way. 

Being from a home without resources was literally the worst part of all of that nonsense. At least, for me. 

The emotional/physical abuse lingers, whatever. The drug and alcohol use was a wild ride to witness as an outside party, sure.  

Not having hot water for a shower? Not having more than two pairs of pants that weren’t pajamas and no place to wash them? Not having a toothbrush or anything but cold canned carrots from the food pantry for supper?

Not having pads or tampons as a scared 12 year old girl who then has to bear the humiliation of my school nurse going out and buying them for me because everyone knew that my family was too poor and the government subsidies weren’t being spent on keeping our home livable and providing for our needs?

Yeah. No. Jason Peter Todd was a clever, gifted child who would do well in any environment. That doesn’t mean that squalor suited him better than an emotionally stunted man-child that did the motherfucking best he could to love him and give him everything that he could possibly need and then some. 

Making Jason Robin and putting him in danger was like handing-over your keys to a car thief and accepting that you were gonna be calling your insurance the next day. Bruce didn’t have a lot of choices there. Jason already had a thirst. He already sought the thrill. The only thing Bruce thought to do was offer him proper skills, training, and equipment. 

Along the way, he loved him. Grew alongside him as a person and a father-figure. He guided him to the best of his ability, and when that backfired?

It broke him too. 

I was taken in by my eldest sister. Granted, she’s no Bruce Wayne and I didn’t oil myself up to slide into a neon crime-fighting get up. I did, however, provide so much childcare and support that I was the only person to cook, grocery shop, meal plan, or be allowed by the baby to bathe her and brush her hair by the time I was 16. My sister didn’t mean for me to take over so much domestic responsibility, it just happened that way.

I was a profoundly grateful people pleaser desperate to be somebody (anybody)’s favorite, and she had a husband who worked nights and so was basically functioning as a single mom with a houseful of 4 kids (plus me) to worry about.   

And I hurt for the nervous disorders she fed by expecting me to provide as much or, in some cases, more care to her home and children than she did. The unhealthy dynamic we fell into left me an anxious mess with little to no self-value as a human being if I am not providing others some kind of measurable benefit.

Five years out of her house and I have to work on this mentality every day.   

All the same, I got the opportunity to live in a home that was well-managed. I had clothes, food, showers and baths, school, and adults who were invested in my education and development.

Jason's situation is similar, in my opinion. He suffers for some of the damage done by Bruce. Ultimately though, he is better and more loved for having been his son.

Having the unique experience of being literally saved from a broken home (which Jason didn’t even fucking have. Poor baby was on his own) and lifted up into a household with actual disposable income, affection, education, and delicious produce regularly?

Jason Todd was the luckiest boy in the world. 

The depictions of Bruce and Jay that have them being nothing but violent and hateful toward one another hurt my heart so much, I cannot even express with words the pain I associate with it. 

I would like to note here that I do understand the abusive link between Bruce and a lot of his kids. Being idolized as a parent and literal hero sets you up for failure. Nobody can ever hope to live up to those kinds of expectations, and Bruce is all kinds of fucked up in his own right. 

The physical abuse and resentment I understand from both sides, though it kills me.

One can see how Jason returning as a man who lived to spit in the face of everything he worked so hard to foster in him would push Bruce over the edge into more progressively abusive behavior, where before he had been emotionally neglectful and selfish as a parent. Blind, even, to the non-physical needs of Jason. 

I 100% relate to Jason’s shock and horror upon being utterly disillusioned with his hero, the man acting as his father. 

He failed to save him. He failed to avenge him. While he was alive, he failed to understand him. 

What more can you do? 

Jason gave it all. 

He gave his life.

And he’s still not good enough for Bruce?

Fuck’s sake. I’d blow shit up and put heads in a bag too.

Damn. 

Anyway, TLDR: Though the unhealthy/abusive aspects of the relationship between Jason and Bruce are brutal and heart-wrenching for all involved, I do not think that Jason would have been better left to his own devices. He was a child who needed a home with enough resources to care for him. 

Bruce provided that.

Additionally, they love each other.

This, of course, is not an excuse for abuse. 

Canon or headcanon, doesn’t matter: I argue that the love between Bruce and Jason was the first time Bruce truly felt a parental connection. Dick was like a younger brother. A nephew. A darling student. It wasn’t until he could contextualize his affection for Dick through the channels he developed toward Jason that Bruce realized the reason he could never see Dick as an equal companion was because he held him in his heart as a child. 

His child. 

Like Jason. 

All families are fucked up. They hurt each other. They shape one another through pain as much as they do love.

I can’t handle the especially hateful and violent depictions of Bruce and Jason’s relationship. It literally kills me, and I actively disregard them as shittily written canon with no deep concept of characterization.     

Same for Bruce and all of his other children.  

[stxleslyds]

you know how dc keeps forcing this sudden "we're a family" narrative out of nowhere? I'd love batfam content but years of hurt among them make the recent content seem unearned.

bc you know more about dick and jason than the others, how do you think they would realistically become family to each other, or would it even be in character for them to be the "bros" they're written as now?

Oh anon, this question is amazing, I love it! I saw it when I woke up and since then my brain has been brewing this answer, I was thinking about it as I brushed my teeth and as I was making breakfast, and now I am ready to give you the answer, I hope you enjoy reading it as much as I enjoyed thinking/writing about it!

DC keeps forcing the wrong relationships, and they keep forcing the wrong centre of this supposed family, they make it out to be the Bat-Family when in reality the Bat (Bruce) should have never been invited to this party.

This is why I give you the… Dick-Family!

Oh yeah baby, I am going there. Dick is the centre of this “family”, he is the guy who is actually connected with everyone, he has been around for so long and he has been present when almost all of the remaining characters were introduced! Bruce might have come first but that guy has nothing on Dick Grayson.

Dick has cared and loved for everyone in this family in a true and beautiful way, no matter how much fanon and DC try to tell us otherwise. This man was an amazing son to Bruce and Alfred (my love for Alfred and Dick is brought to you by @hood-ex), a fantastic brother to Jason, Tim and Cass as well as a phenomenal father/older brother to Damian.

Dick Grayson is the centre of this whole thing, and thanks to DC now being an Omniverse I will be able to explain my line of thoughts. But first let me clear some ideas up.

The way I see it Jason would only get along good enough with Dick. I am not here for Jason and Tim having brunch together (honestly, Lobdell, what were you thinking), Jason never cared for Tim, and then writers that didn’t know how the Red Hood worked made him try to kill Tim so, to me, that relationship is non-existent, Jason doesn’t really perceive Tim (yet).

Jason and Damian, listen, I know that there is this fanon theory that Jason knew and cared for Damian while he was in the League, but that is just fanon talk and it doesn’t really fit in canon either. Jason wasn’t really capable of doing much other than fight, and after he was put in the Lazarus Pit he either had to leave because Ra’s wanted to kill him or Talia took him to the All-Castle. So, Jason’s only real interactions with Damian would be when Jason was written as a crazy, blood thirsty dude that actually tried to harm a child. So, him and Damian wouldn’t really have a good relationship (yet).

Jason and Cass… that’s just a no. Jason and Barbara, I mean Barbara was older than Dick when she first met Jason, so they wouldn’t have much of a relationship.

Now, lets move on to how I will make the Dick-Family work.

Dick (bless him) actually talks and listens to people, unlike Bruce, so the change would start there. Let’s set the timeline, I will stand right after the events of Under the Red Hood. Bruce just chose saving Joker over letting Jason kill the Joker and the building they were in exploded.

Batman keeps on being himself (trash) and Jason, having survived the explosion, moves on to keep on building his empire. He really wants to control the drug trade in Gotham, so he works on that, he slowly but surely takes his place as a drug lord again and is a constant pain in Black Mask’s ass.

While Jason is doing that, Dick is trying to put together his life after Bludhaven was attacked with Chemo. Let’s say that Bludhaven isn’t completely erased from the map but he does have to leave so the city can be re-built. He goes to Gotham, where the Red Hood works.

Let’s say that Alfred told Dick who was under the Red Hood, so Dick being a good brother goes looking for Jason. Their first interaction out of the mask wouldn’t be nice, Jason barely remembers his life before the pit and he really is convinced that Dick is the absolute worst.

But then Jason being a nosy man would make an appearance, for some reason, let’s say that he hacks into the Batcave and when he does that he finds some footage… The footage in question would be the one which shows Bruce punching Dick and sort of blaming him for Jason’s death. (Oh yeah, I am going there). The footage will make a memory come to mind, Dick taking Jason on a skying trip.

So, the next time that Dick and Jason see each other is because Jason went looking for Dick and here is where these two actually talk. The way I see it, Dick is more flexible with the no killing rule, he has worked many times with people that are villains or that just have different ways of doing things. So, I think that he would understand where Jason’s coming from with his ideas. As they begin to understand one another Jason begins to recover more and more memories from before the Pit.

They get together once a week and they chat about life as well as vigilante stuff. They become friends.

At the same time Dick is also very good friends with Tim and also acts like the amazing big brother he is with him. They chat, they sometimes work together and one day they come across a very complicated situation involving a new drug being introduced in Gotham.

Dick would call Jason and now both of them and Tim are reunited in a safe house working together so this new drug doesn’t fall in the wrong hands. Jason and Tim wouldn’t really like each other. Both of them are there for Dick and because they have to get the job done.

That’s how I see Dick forming the Dick-Family unconsciously. Hell, I will introduce Barbara now. Do you guys remember that in UtRH Barbara was mad with Bruce and didn’t want to work with him but she was still in contact with Dick? Well, I am using that so it can fit my narrative.

Dick, Jason and Tim need more intel so Dick calls Oracle (real Oracle) and because Barbara trusts Dick she works with them.

Here is where it gets interesting, through Barbara, Dick meets Cass, through Tim he meets Stephanie. You see that Dick’s connections are leading him to form a group of people. Cass and Stephanie are trained by Babs and Dick and they become the new Batgirls.

As all of that keeps developing Jason and Dick become “partners in crime” they help each other, they start building a brotherly relationship again. Although Jason refuses to say that out loud.

Then comes in Damian, a difficult child if there has ever been one but he has Bruce so Dick doesn’t have to jump in that fast… right?

Oh brother! Bruce is dead (omg what would we do? Battle for the cowl maybe? No!). with Bruce gone there is only one person who can take his place and everyone knows it has to be Dick.

Dick would feel a lot of things as he is taking Bruce’s place as Batman but he has a group of people ready to back him up (Alfred, Jason, Tim, Babs, Cass, Steph), and he also has to take care of Damian, he is a child and with his father gone then maybe his mother would want to take him back to the League of Assassins, Dick obviously doesn’t want that so he talks to Tim and tells him that he sees him as his equal and that he has a plan to make Damian stay and it involves making Damian his new Robin.

Tim would obviously be sad and a little hurt, but he understands Dick’s decision because they talked about it and Dick actually took the time to explain why he was doing what he was doing (really DC half of the problems you guys come up could be fixed in seconds if people would only take some time to just TALK!).

Dick and Damian work as Batman and Robin and Dick starts assuming the position of his father. They would live with Alfred in the penthouse and maybe Tim will join them from time to time (when he wasn’t busy with Young Justice/Teen Titans stuff). Slowly Dick and Damian will become the Dynamic Duo that we love today.

So, Dick would have his own Robin, Oracle (who is also managing her own team with Black Canary and (why not) the Batgirls), Red Robin and Red Hood working with him if he needs them. They are always a call away. Jason is the most difficult to reach and he will only involve himself in that kind of drama if its about controlling the drug trade or scaring the living shit out of some very shady people.

So, Red Hood wouldn’t be working with the new (and improved) Batman but Jason would hang out with Dick sometimes.

From there they build up. Dick renovates Arkham Asylum and makes it work they way that it is supposed to work. He might also recruit Catwoman when he needs someone really sneaky, they have known each other for so long, I bet Selina loves Dick, she would certainly help him out.

But as all things do, this happy and well-connected Dick-Family is disrupted when Bruce comes back, he inserts himself slowly back into his role as Batman and as he does that Dick starts to move away from it.

But Dick’s connections are strong and well cared for, so, even when he goes back to Bludhaven and starts fresh (again) as Nightwing those connections remain. Oracle still gives him intel, Robin and Red Robin come over to Bludhaven to patrol, maybe they even have their own rooms at Dick’s place.

With Bludhaven functioning again, all of the terrible people that were working there also come back, maybe some of them never left and they have been corrupting the city from its very core. So, when Jason tells Dick that he would like to expand his operations to Bludhaven, Dick says yes, as long as Jason keeps him updated on his work and also lets him know what is going on.

I think it works! What do you guys think so far?

From then on with the whole Dick-Family being connected and strong I think they can actually act and solve their problems as a family. All those arcs that didn’t work very well because Bruce was in the middle of it being a jerk, I think they will work if Dick is at the centre of it. Let’s say that Bruce hid the fact that Joker knows their identities and all that, with such a strong family the second that the Joker tries to manipulate Jason into believing that he created him, Dick will come out of the shadows and shut that bullshit down. If Joker tries to do something to the Circus, then the Birds of Prey and the Robins will be there in seconds helping Dick.

The Court of Owls, those little shits wouldn’t stand a chance against this team, this force of nature! Jason would be the one working from afar because you know my boy wouldn’t be subjected to the “no-killing” rule but if he does it, he has to do it away from the children (Damian) and away from Cass, if he doesn’t want to know real trouble. (He probably arranged those things with Dick a long time ago and he is happy with it).

Now, please forgive me but for angst reasons I will actually let the events of, Batman Incorporated #8, Forever Evil, Nightwing #30 and Spyral run its course.

Let me explain, after Damian’s death Dick holds the Dick-Family together, as well as Bruce because he is amazing like that, but then after Dick supposedly dies, things change just a little bit. Jason would retreat back to his own corner because the only thing attaching him to the Dick-Family was Dick but he would also keep his eyes open and he might also have a direct line with Oracle if things go south.

Aside from Jason, I do see the others working on keeping their connections intact. When Damian eventually returns the land of the living, I can see all of them coming together even more because that’s what Dick would have wanted.

And then Dick will come back from Spyral and here is where the Dick-Family will show the “Bat-Family” why its superior to it in every aspect possible.

The Dick-Family will notice that something must have happened, Dick would never play dead and leave them like that, but Dick loves Bruce and he doesn’t want to tell them the truth, Bruce has no memories now and his family doesn’t deserve that kind of drama BUT Jason and Tim are suspicious, they know Dick at this point and they trust him so they firmly believe that he is hiding something to protect someone. And here is where life repeats itself. Let’s review the Batcave’s footage, yes, I did it again, I just love the fact that Bruce has footage of himself being the absolute worst to his kids, how does DC not use it! Anyway, Tim and Jason find the footage from the events of Nightwing #30 and suddenly the Dick-Family have their “Dick defence squad” jackets on and they are ready to party.

After all that Bruce eventually gets his memories back and he is held accountable for his actions. Also, around this time the events of Robin War would have already happened so Duke is also introduced. Dick lets him join and all that, and then Duke and Cass become besties and they work together.

And yeah, as Rebirth comes closer the Dick-Family would be more united than ever.

The end.

That is how I would have done it. But this way is slow, and DC wouldn’t be able to monetize it as much as they would want.

Jason wouldn’t be giving hugs and calling everyone their brother or sister, he will only get along with Dick and he would be professional with everyone else.

Tim and Damian would get along but they wouldn’t go for ice cream together on a sunny day. Steph and Damian would and so would Cass and Tim or Cass and Duke.

Oracle would work with Dick and the others as a side thing because her main thing would be the Birds of Prey, this time with Helena too.

Alfred would spend his time with Bruce but he would also be very aware of Dick and his influence on everyone around them. Bruce eventually would be integrated to the Dick-Family because Dick is a sweetheart but Dick would also make Bruce follow his rules, Dick is a little bean but he is also the most badass person in the room (whichever room) so you better listen to what he has to say.

The Dick-Family would be something that grows silently and doesn’t need a “Joker War” in order for them to be there for each other, they would try their best each step of the way and they will talk things out when mistakes are made.

This is the way that I see this family dynamic working.

I would even go as far as to say that Talia can be part of the Dick-Family because she is connected to three people, Dick, Damian and Jason.

Dick is the person with most connections in the DC Universe, the Titans, the Justice League, Deathstroke, they all have connections to this treasure of a man. If he needs help in Gotham or Bludhaven then he can call people from the “first circle”, if things are beyond a “street level” threat them he can call the Titans and if shit really hits the fan, Clark and the others are a call away.

Anyway, this was unnecessarily long, I am sorry about it but I am also not because I really don’t know how to answer your question without going on a long rant.

In conclusion the Bat-Family doesn’t work and sadly it wouldn’t work no matter how much they force it. These people don’t have connections, Bruce is not able to make connections between people. And DC has erased entire relationships that Dick used to have. I mean, they got rid of Dick and Tim being close brothers just so they could give us a shitty brunch between Tim and Jason? Only yesterday we saw a true and beautiful interaction between Dick and Damian.

DC is handling the “Bat-Family” in all the worst possible ways. It just doesn’t work.

They should have used Dick all those years ago and they shouldn’t have destroyed Jason’s characterization with Lobdell’s ideas.

So, sadly, my dear anon, I don’t see the Bat-Family as a in character thing for any of these people as they are written currently, but I hope that you enjoyed my version of it. May the Dick-Family bring everyone who reads about it a little joy!

[abiik]

❄️, ☕️ and 🍂 for Zoe in the oc ask game!!

❄️ What makes your OC sad, so sad that they can’t help but cry all day? How do they cheer themself up? Does their sadness upset any of their loved ones too?

ooof okay. probably the thing that still makes her choke up is thinking about her twin brothers. like without a doubt, if any of her thoughts go to them, whether it’s her going down memory lane and feeling nostalgic bc she saw something that reminded her of them, or it’s because she’s actually purposely thinking about their deaths, the injustice of it, how mad she still is about it, and how helpless it makes her feel to think she couldn’t even manage to save her baby brothers, what makes her think she can save the rest of the world, she always chokes up. it’s the sort of thing that either has her staring teary eyed at some dumb joke that wasn’t meant to trigger those thoughts or she’s locking herself in her apartment, crying until she passes out.

another thing that really gets her down in general is thinking about all of the people she couldn’t save. she wears the whole world on her shoulders constantly, even if she’s reassured that despite everything, she’s still just a person too.

zoe usually either just has to let it all out because it’s been brewing too long – this includes crying and/or hitting bad guys in space until she’s too exhausted to even stand. – or she has to go do something, get her mind off of it, dive straight into a job or a project or something because she can’t think about what’s bothering her right now. back before she came back to earth, she would drink everything away, but now that she’s sober she tries to find better ways to release.

her sadness is something she hides a lot, so she’ll usually disappear (unless she goes to you to join you for mission) bc her loved ones are all pretty vigilant. gran-gran has eyes like a hawk and a feel for zoe’s emotions better than anyone else and will not let her cave in on herself but she also doesn’t want to force her to talk about it if she doesn’t want. so she’ll put her to work on the ranch until zoe comes to her and tells her what’s wrong. keme is pretty good at reading his sister and it only affects him so badly because he can’t like…how do you punch your sister’s insecurities and bad thoughts?? you can’t!! so he kind of will just arrive to spar with her whether she likes it or not (it helps a lot actually, especially when she’s feeling insecure about her role in the world). 

and then of course… the batfam. they’re not the most like,, emotionally stable? conscious? people in the world but jason’s been friends with z forever and believe or not, he takes a more cautious approach with her. cause when zoe’s sad, she releases it like a big explosion of teary eyed, ugly crying, snot faced angry crying and shouting. and jason has a tendency to react in kind and sometimes zoe doesn’t need jason to be yelling too, so he’ll just come invade her space. it upsets him to not be able to really do anything, too, so he’ll just take up space on her couch or her dining table and wait for her to come around and when she does, they either talk about it or they just go right back to being

annoying friends. dick and donna have more proactive ways of dealing with an upset zoe, just like keme. donna gets upset when zoe gets upset bc she loves her so much and pls stop running away from this, just come sit on my couch and talk to me or something. or she knocks a little sense into her, like a wonderful big sister. dick is usually the last resort person to come and kick zoe out of a rut if gran-gran can’t make it. roy just brings lian. rose kicks her into shape and tells her to “stop crying.” sometimes it works wonders! other times… not so much

so like, yeah. her loved ones do get affected by it. esp when one day they’re happily talking with a bright eyed and smiley faced zoe and then the next day/week she’s just gone and isn’t answering texts or phone calls. when she’s upset, it’s like they lose her all over again and that…really sucks. they don’t want to go through that again (and for a few of them it kind of triggers them).

☕ Give us one (or more if you feel like it) of your OCs deep dark secrets! Why do they keep it hidden? Spill the tea!

oh jeez hm. she doesn’t know how many people she’s killed. and it bothers her so she doesn’t tell anyone that she has no idea and that it kind of scares her. she’s kind of scared to find out, even if her opinion on killing bad guys isn’t as severe as other peoples’.

also like, not really a deep dark secret, but whenever she thinks about killing the joker, she doesn’t really feel anything. she doesn’t feel any guilt or remorse or like she’s some kind of monster for wanting to end someone’s life. she just kind of feels…fine. which is why whenever she thinks about his still being alive, still doing the things he does, and how it would change so many peoples’ lives, definitely probably for the better, she gets so fucking angry. she doesn’t tell anyone because it makes her mad to think about how other people can dictate how she might feel if she followed through with something like that.

oh uh not to get a little shippy but she’s definitely in love with dick grayson. she never tells anyone and when jason figures it out, it’s because he figures. it. out. not because she was like oh jay let’s have a heart to heart where i tell you i love your older brother!!!

roy is the only one who knows. because he was THERE. but she’s had sex with roy. she’s kind of embarrassed to tell anyone. ESPECIALLY DONNA OR DICK OR ANY OF THE OTHER OG TITANS.

🍂 What are their opinions on the different seasons? Which one do they hate and which one do they love and why?

zoe h a t e s the cold, so winter and fall are like no-goes for her temperature-wise. she doesn’t hate the way winter and fall looks and she definitely enjoys all of the mandatory this is required i have a doctor’s note and everything cuddling and warm hugs she gets during the fall and winter. bc she’s a cold-blooded baby. summer and spring are only more enjoyable bc she’s not sluggish or fucking c o l d. also she gets to wear her best and ugliest clothes to piss all of her more fashion concerned friends and family off.

zoe loves winter and fall for like other things tho. like being able to get all of the people she cares about presents for the holidays without having to come up with a reason (bc everyone around her is so damn suspicious) or the festivities or having an excuse to shove her freezing cold hands under people’s shirts and startling them.

summer and spring are fun because she doesn’t get allergies like everyone else (boo you whore) and because she likes to spend a lot of her time at home at the ranch when she can. ALSO she gets to see more of the kids she hosts pottery/clay classes for bc they’re all off school and she loves her kids!!!

thank you for asking!!! (also i apologize this is so much)

send me asks about zoe!!!