#its-leethee

[raayllum]

I don't know how I could cope between-seasons without your tdp analyses; Raay, thank you so much! I was (re)reading your meta section, specifically Articulation of Need. It hit me that, 4x07, Callum finally says "I need you" to Rayla... and it's just devastating. I guess I don't have a question, I just want to reiterate how grateful I am that you've shared your analyses as I've gained so much insight into and appreciation for this show because of you. Thank you.

🥺

Re-reading aAAH gonna pretend I know how to deal with all those compliments eloquently but I'm so glad you're enjoying it still!! Inspiring and spreading appreciation is all I wanna do (as well as emptying my lil meat cage brain so I can think other things) when it comes to posting meta so like!!

Aah thank you so much, that meta was one of my favourites to write (and I actually cried a little at my job at the time over it, constructing it in my head while doing other tasks, lol! Still gets me a little teary now) and like, S4 was Insane for it as an add-on??

TLDR for anyone who doesn't feel like reading the full (2k-3k??) meta but: Rayla's big loving Callum speeches are always about how much she needs him and can't lose him. Callum's big loving Rayla speeches are always about how much he admires/adores her, not expressing that he needs her in the same manner. Rayla always places herself in between him and the threat as much as possible, reinforcing that she doesn't want to lose him. Callum almost always just asks to go with her, indicating that the threat is worth the risk of both of them.

Case in point: Callum has never asked Rayla to stay. In S4, we see this begin to shift in Rayla's direction. She's gone from asking if he'll stay to asking if she can stay.

Even her little mini speech while he's sleeping is all about how special he / they were (are) to her, how much she doesn't want to lose him, how he's the best thing she ever had. Alternatively, Callum is so much more confused; it takes to the end of the season to be able to move past just all the anger and admit that he's "so glad" she's back. But just like in every season prior, Callum shows that he needs her - to not emotionally repress, to not go down a path of darkness - in action rather than in word. And just like every season before, he's surprised that she doesn't know this, because he's surprised that she's leaving (again). To him, how can she not know that he needs her?

But we know that she doesn't, because S4 gets so close - closer than they've ever been before, while ironically simultaneously understanding each more and less than ever before - and then pulls the rug out from under us.

Because in her mind, her parents all left because they didn't need her; Runaan was only taken ('killed') because she was a detriment to the mission: "Five of us won't be enough. We need all six" "We'll be stronger as five." And in Callum's mind (for most of S4, but not by the end, I think) how much could Rayla need him, when she left him behind?

But this is what is most beautiful about their S5 / possession plot line set up. Rayla will be asking for him to stay with her, because she needs him, all over again. And in coming back to her, he'll prove in action (yet again) that he needs her, and maybe even in word, And, through many different options of circumstances that may extend past S5 or past this plot line (although again, I lean toward it being resolved in S5) Callum will reiterate that he needs her - not to kill him, but in order for him to truly feel like he's living.

He will finally ask her to stay, to realize that it needs to be asked and to be willing / brave enough, after everything, to ask it. To ask her to stay. And Rayla will have finally had the development she needs, too, in order to say Yes.

[imminent-danger-came]

no epiphanies to share but did you know that black holes don't actually suck you in, but if you approach one too closely you won't be able to climb back out? so yeah well i've been thinking about cannibalistic ourobourus bagels all day today and i might've gotten a little too close help

I'm sorry to infect you with my "canabilism as self-perpetuation" ouroboros thoughts mixed with the everything bagel

[self-spaghettification]

All sightings of this symbol so far

Aaravos’s hood (season 2)

both end credits from s5. left appears to be a celestial elf. (5x04) right is 5x09

the book with the infantis sanguine spells. “It’s one of the old spells.” (5x09)

mirror breaking in the same pattern. (4x04) ( @raayllum post)

back side of the coins (5x01) (thank you @its-leethee !!)

this is the symbol for deep magic actually!

thank you! @ok12857

[kradogsrats]

tagged by @elvesdragonsanddarkmagic but I always feel weird continuing the long reblog chain lmao

Last song: Kleptomainacrow by Madilyn Mei

Fav colour: orange, even though people look at me like I'm insane when I say it lmao... looking at orange things just makes me happy, I'm sad when there's a choice of colors for something and orange isn't one :c

Last show: I've been catching random episodes of Taskmaster or Apothecary Diaries that spouse is watching? Probably doesn't count, so last full show I sat down to watch was Ahsoka and oof, not worth it.

Sweet/savoury/spicy: usually sweet but I just ate an entire bag of cheeto puffs and I buy the big bottles of sriracha so idk all three

Relationship status: married (12 years today, actually! Did I seriously forget my own anniversary until just now? .......... yes)

Last thing I googled: "sex bomb skating," don't @ me I was looking for Evgeni Plushenko's 2002 routine last night for reasons that made total sense at the time and I couldn't remember his name

Current obsession: being obnoxious af about The Dragon Prince, also that old man(tm)... no, not that one, the other old man... look, he's the one who's actually older than 45-ish, I don't know what to tell you

@sarasade @thrandilf @its-leethee @konmaao3 and anyone else who hasn't been tagged already and is always all up in my notes but I feel awkward calling out because we've got more of a "brief nod while passing each other in the hallway" relationship and going straight to "tell me your google search history" is a bit of an escalation

[kravchikfreak]

ship reveal party, but stay tuned for more "panels" coming (maybe if we're lucky) soon

p.s.

@a-certain-elf bold of you to assume i'll do something vanilla like that

@its-leethee bingo!

@avtoservis how could you assume i'll do something vanilla like that?

@raayllum yep and you're the exact one who's responsible for the idea of drawing all that in the firls place

[air-seaprimal]

Thank you to @its-leethee for sending me the age chart, the only issue is the chart doesn’t specify a year so I guess were all taken a shot in the like half dark.

[lifblogs]

There quite literally is a deaf voice actress for amaya

Hi, anon! Thanks for being informative. I have been aware of this now for half an hour thanks to @its-leethee, and updated my post. Hard to remember since the VA really doesn’t have a lot of work with Amaya. At this point my wish would be that Amaya had a couple verbal lines to go with her signing since many Deaf people do communicate with both at times. It’s okay if they don’t. But I want there to be an end to the “Deaf people don’t speak” rhetoric.

[imminent-danger-came]

Here, friend! I refilled it and wanted to pass it back in case maybe you needed it today, too.

Thanks I appreciate it

[imminent-danger-came]

I have another one for the lmk music recommendations, and I feel like I should apologize because it's Linkin Park... But. Listen:

"Breaking the Habit"

I don't want to be the one The battles always choose 'Cause inside I realize That I'm the one confused I don't know what's worth fighting for Or why I have to scream But now I have some clarity To show you what I mean I don't know how I got this way I'll never be alright So, I'm breaking the habit

I was a certain age in the 00's and that music holds parts of my soul hostage still

I grew up with Linkin Park, so it has my respect!

Anyways "I don't want to be the one the battles always choose" FUCK DUDE.

Very "If it could just stay this way, forever? That would be awesome." "Yeah well...forever's a long time bud." ; "Do you ever just wish that things would stay like this? Like they are right now?" "Pssshhhkkk, where's the fun in that?" core

Thank you for sharing!

[raayllum]

Gift Giving & Primal vs First Elves :: Or Going Off Into the Deep Lore Deep End

Remember that meta I compiled about Greek mythology, deceptive gift giving, and TDP? Yeah it's time to talk about the gift motif properly as well as some other deep lore things because these excellent thoughts ( @spicyviren, @kradogsrats, and @its-leethee) got the wheels in my brain spinning.

AKA an unknown amount of sectioned word vomit into the nature of magic, where it comes from, how deep magic operates, some gifts and motifs, and Leola, just a little.

Let's go.

Gift Motif

The gift motif is one that's a bit of a slowburn in TDP. While characters will often pass and hand over objects — tools, artefacts, metaphorical responsibilities or trust (handing over the egg, for example) — to one another, there's not a big emphasis on gifts in the first three seasons.

There are some, such as Callum's letter from Harrow (that he's given by Claudia once again initially as a goodbye), Ezran giving Bait to Barius in S3, and Rayla's family pendant, but most of these, as you've might already noticed, are contextualized within Goodbyes. Whether the gift motif will amount in arc 2 to escaping this "final gift" context remains to be seen, but that's how it tends to work in interpersonal relationships.

There is an element of peace offering in hoping that returning Zym — a gift and/or gesture of good will — will help usher in peace, but I think (as of now at least) that ties further into the series' theme of Reciprocal Exchange (the assassin mission being an eye for an eye vs olive branch for olive branch) than outright gift giving. (Although we will probably talk about Exchange and gift giving at some point because there is also a thematic tether there.)

However, there is one other thing that is more and more often referred to as a gift in Arc 1, and that's Magic. Specifically, dark magic.

Now, this actually isn't that dissimilar from what the Goodbye gifts amount to, either. In Harrow's letter, he gifts Callum the Key of Aaravos believing it to be a powerful magical relic of some kind; Rayla's pendant makes its way from Ethari to her to Callum, who then uses it for magical purposes; and Bait, as a glow toad, is connected to an arcanum himself.

I do think it's noteworthy though that in Arc 1, (dark) magic being a gift is emphasized upon, specifically because of these lines for Khessa:

Upon first watching it back in 2019, it made sense that dark magic would be referred to this way, even when I just thought maybe it was that humans had been given 'nothing,' as Claudia says. Dark magic is closely tied to ideas of theft and thievery — stealing magic from others to harness its power for yourself — and the series is deeply interested in concepts of ownership or who has 'true' ownership over something, in magic, a throne/crown, a price to pay, etc. This follows neatly into Arc 2 (for ex: why Karim seeking to steal the Sun Seed is a metaphorical dark path even if it didn't outright involve dark magic through Kim'Dael), which we'll build on later.

That said, given the depth of the knowledge at the Great Bookery that is open to Sunfire elves more than any other type of elf, and the information that Tales of Xadia and Ripples gives us...

While elves warned that if humans were meant to wield magic they would have been born with it, [Leola] gifted the wisest humans with secrets: the language of the dragons and the runes that shaped spells. With the unicorn’s gift, the most determined minds among the humans could finally harness primal magic.

It happened long ago, when humans had only just learned to hold fire in their hands without burning. They nurtured their precious primal flames secretly—in the dark of night, beneath shadows and shrouds—as cultivating its glow drew the eyes and ire of monsters [...] Humanity had been given something it was never meant to have. And so there came a calamity.

It makes it more than likely than, unlike other elves such as Lujanne or Ibis, Khessa had reason to believe/know that there used to be primal human mages in the past... and that it wasn't 'enough' for them ultimately, because they still hungered and developed (and were given?) dark magic. "Your kind could not be satisfied with what you were given" was about the rejection of primal magic from Leola (the unicorns) in favour of a darker kind that involves theft and "dirtying yourself" (5x08) with dark magic.

But at the same time, this complicates the Gift Giving motif of including not just dark magic, but being also for primal magic — for humans, at least.

And also for elves. (Ignoring how "great orb" is very similar to "great one" for now.)

Janai: It was a gift. But there's more to it than that. The great orb began as this. Karim: This is... a sun seed?

Now, the Great Orb being grown from a Sun 'literal' seed makes sense. We've known for a long time that in Xadia, "magic is everywhere. It's just part of the vibrance or spirit of things" (1x05). Primal magic naturally occurring in plants, animals, and elves likewise makes sense on that note. Just as not "many could bear the gruelling path of a rune mage," Karim cannot bear to have patience and faith in something that will only come to fruition centuries later.

That said, I raise the question: how functionally different is the Great Orb from say, a sun primal stone would hypothetically be? If primal stones and primal magic were gifts to humanity from unicorns — from creatures connected to the Star arcanum, for lack of a better understanding — then why not magic from Startouch (?) elves to other elves.

How do we know that all magic isn't simply a gift that was given once upon a time?

From the First Elves to the Primal Elves.

Primal vs First Elves

So what's the difference between First Elves and Primal elves?

Well we have a few pieces of lore:

1) Zubeia's status as a "heavenly majesty" (which we'll come back to in the next section) gives her authority to speak in the name of the first elves, who are effectively gods to humankind and/or Xadians ("Have our Gods died? / Where do the fabled Great Ones hide?" —the Epic of the Void

2) It seems that the First Elves are, as of now and for a while, exclusively in reference to what would otherwise be called Startouch elves, although the latter is seemingly a name that came later given Rayla's affirmation of "ancient legends". This is reaffirmed in Tales of Xadia's two lone mention of First Elves:

No group of elves presents a greater mystery than the Startouch elves. Sometimes called the First Elves, those bound to the Star primal are rumored to have made great marks on Xadia’s ancient history—but beyond story and legend, little real evidence is left to us today [...] Among the few extant records of Startouch elves are the Scrolls of the First Elves, now kept in the Great Bookery of Lux Aurea.

3) At a post-S2 con in 2019 (how's that for a far reach?) we got a timeline of the events of Xadia laid out for us. The description of the very first piece of history and era we know of goes as follows, with the Rise of Elarion happening 2000 years ago re: the Dragon Prince era ("The Return of Aaravos"):

The Era of the First elves is the first recorded era 5,000 years prior to the current era. Dragons and elves were not allied during this period. There were no distinct primal elves. This is an era before all that. Humans suffered during this period. 

—2019 con timeline

4) Justin and Aaron reaffirm this at the 2:30 ish minute mark of this video (a couple of months before even S3 was released) by reaffirming distinctly to Primal elves. Later (7:40-ish mark) we see this distinction reaffirmed again through the statement of, "The patterns have been that these primal based elves have grown cultures and civilizations that have become separate and differentiated from kind of whatever the early days were with the First elves were."

Okay, so there was 100% a time where there were only First Elves, and humans, and Primal elves as we knew them (maybe still with the hands and horns, but no arcanum? Or no singular, distinct arcanum) didn't exist. Why does this matter?

This is where the deep lore timeline gets tricky, as we don't know precisely when 1) humans received magic and 2) at what stage the First Elves / Great Ones / Startouch elves 'left' Xadia, only that they did, apparently, when Elarion (the human city) needed help: "Elarion, unworthy whelp / Wept as the stars turned black the sky / They donned their masks / They turned their backs / And left Elarion to die". Why abandon the city (beyond indifference/cruelty as Aaravos would likely claim), who knows.

However, we can assume the timeline looks something like this:

Era of the First Elves

Primal elves (and presumably archdragons *) are crafted / develop into being, whatever that means

Humans are magic-less and are having a bad time

Unicorns / Leola extend sympathy despite the fact that the First Elves tell her not to (Book One: Novelization / Tales of Xadia)

Humans have primal magic (Ripples / Tales of Xadia)

This attracts negative attention, consolidated in Elarion ("the stars she asked their light to cast / and stop the dragons’ fiery might" / "as cultivating its glow drew the eyes and ire of monsters. Eventually, for the audacity of their fire, they were hunted")

Elarion asks for help and the Stars leave

Aaravos, the last star — presumably already Fallen from the First Elves — gives them dark magic under the guise of protection even though it will inevitably help him (i.e. give him the ability to possess people)

Dark magic replaces primal magic as the primary form for humans

Tension and violence escalates (unicorns are hunted to near extinction). Sol Regem is removed as King of the Dragons

Under Dragon Queen Luna Tenebris, the daughter of an elven leader suggests the Judgement of the Half-Moon, causing for humans to be banished rather than eradicated, and the continent split in two

Again, nothing too crazy / not too much we haven't already known or guessed at for a while.

But like I said, I'm gonna propose two theories, so bear with me:

Theory #1: What is Deep Magic?

The First Elves engaged with what we're gonna call Deep or Old Magic, for lack of a better term. There can be an assumption at times that this magic would be more 'pure' or less 'diluted' than dark magic or even the primal magic we've seen on screen. However, I think that's less than likely. Dark magic is often times a bad path for good outcomes, and primal magic can be a 'good' magic for bad outcomes (the blood freezing spell, for example).

While dark magic is a more textually malevolent magic system and primal magic is more true neutral — able to be used as a tool and a source of connection for the user — I don't think this necessarily means that Deep Magic is inherently enlightening (we see with the Ocean arcanum and S5 that knowledge can be an immense burden) or that it's on the opposite end of the spectrum and is outright benevolent.

What, then, am I suggesting Deep Magic to be? Well, we have some clues likewise from the same old interview post-s2 that we haven't had much basis to (potentially) understand until now, in which it's stated:

Deeper magic and deeper gifts that the original beings received [...] practical, usable, powerful magic is drawn from the six primal sources, right? But there is this idea that there's this earlier, less differentiated power kind of magic that's deeper and more - I don't kind of want to say what all of them are. It's not that important now, it has more to do with the history of beings and their interactions with each other. But Aaravos cares about some of this stuff. The best I can say is that one of them's Power — but well, what does that mean?

The six primal sources — potentially just five (hence why only 5 gemstones seem to occur naturally in nature, and Star seemingly doesn't) — are all based around physical, somewhat tangible principles. Earth, Ocean, Sun (fire/light), Sky (wind/weather) are perhaps the most tangible, with only Moon dipping into something into something more metaphysical: illusions and questioning the nature of reality, the nature of death, etc. However, I'd argue that the Moon arcanum's emphasis on death still makes it something that is particularly important to creatures who are mortal (but more on that later).

What I am arguing for is then, therefore, that Deep Magic is magic drawn from Concepts and Ideas > tangible things found in nature or parts of other magical creatures.

Three concepts, to be exact: (translated dark magic screenshot from Cartoon Universe spells reversed).

Zubeia: He chose as his instruments those who had strong hearts and strong minds, but who had an insatiable thirst and fascination with magic (power).

Three quasar diamonds, three deep magic concepts. Heart, Mind, Power.

("To know something truly and deeply, you must know it with your head, hand, and heart. Mind, body, and spirit." / "She laid before me her scales, her blindfold, and her sword, and told me to choose.")

Now, I don't know if it's these three concepts exactly — I could Truth, or Justice, or something like that — or even if it's three. But given what little we know about Deep magic thus far and how much the series' likes its threes, I think that's the likeliest number and combination.

We've known for a while that there's something weird with the connection between dark magic, spells that use blood, and 'star' magic. We know it's unlikely that Aaravos being able to possess people who have used dark magic was just a happy accident discovered after humans started using it. We know that when Callum is offered the dark magic version of the cube in his dreams, the symbol is blood red: "You can have unlimited power." And that dark magic "became the key that unlocked a place of power for humans in Xadia" (Tales of Xadia).

So what if dark magic stems from the vein of Deep magic that's taken from the concept of Power? What if when Aaravos offered his pawns "unlimited" Power, or when Kpp'Ar accused Viren of (potentially using star magic) "making the same choice you always made: the one that gives you Power," they meant it?

Alternatively, this could mean that most other Startouch elves — their longevity, their indifference — comes from the vein of Mind and subsequent intellectual detachment? Enough intelligence and reason not to hunger for more (Power), but not enough compassion and empathy to sympathize with others (Heart).

And it would also tie into Leola being unique among her own kind for her heart taking pity on the humans, and giving them primal magic — perhaps in the vein of Heart, if we're keeping things consistent — and why love ("To know something truly and deeply [...] I love you with all of myself, and I always will" / "To love is simply to know this: the tides are true as the ocean is deep") has been consistently tied to Callum unlocking arcanums. The "Narrative of Strength (power)" vs "Narrative of Love" being even more literal than we thought.

This wouldn't be too out of line since Moon arcanum philosophy already borrows heavily from Plato's idea of the forms/reality (Plato's allegory of the cave, anyone?) and the forms basically mean "your imagined ideal of the object in your mind is going to be more perfect than any tangible, 'real' version of the object could ever be." That being applied to living beings who are literally in the sky would track a certain amount, in addition to the idea that however primal magic is set up in Xadia right is "the whole world is like a giant primal stone; sky magic is all around us, and it's also in me, with every breath we take." But I digress.

With the distinction of Deep Magic as 1) separate and a sea that flows into the primal as well as 2) older and earlier than primal magic, now onto the next theory:

Theory #2: First elves and the Archdragons?

Now admittedly this one is more speculative since beyond knowing 1) the First elves = what we'd call Startouch elves, 2) the rest of them except Aaravos 'left' Xadia a while ago, and 3) the aforementioned possible 'Mind' deep magic thing, we very quickly run out of set knowledge into full blown speculation. Beyond

With that in mind, I wanna talk about the... weirdness, I suppose, between the Archdragons / draconic royal family and the First Elves.

There's a few notes to this: we know that Ancient Draconic is the language of primal magic, indicating that dragons existed and presumably had primal magic before elves did, and that elves had to be given that linguistic knowledge at least to a certain degree.

Then we also have the way Zubeia is referred to being mirrored with the way she describes Aaravos later:

Likewise, the one person/creature we've seen referred to as a god outside the Epic of the Void poem is Avizandum by Harrow (bonus points for the game motif of "entire armies have fallen like toys" because of him):

Bloodmoon Huntress also asserts that from an elven point of view (or at least Lain and Tiadrin, and presumably Runaan, too) that "Dragons are the lifeblood, the very core of Xadia" and generally assumed that dragons have the most powerful connection to their individual primal sources.

So I'd be willing to wager (esp since Sol Regem is at least 1,2000+ years old) that Archdragons at least once upon a time had been contemporaries of the First Elves if not peers. What and why that connection exists and how relevant it is for today, I don't know, but I do think there's something there, especially since the one example we have of a First Elf-Dragon relationship in Aaravos, Avizandum, and Zubeia, was perceived to be positive somewhat on all sides — a matter of trust on his end (in order to be "betrayed") and a matter of reverence and importance on theirs; "admired and loved by all" / "you meant something to him".

There is also something to be said for the Archdragons being the most powerful embodiment of the primal sources (alongside maybe some rare and noteworthy elves, like Queen Aditi) still being "unable to risk a direct confrontation" with only one singular and Fallen Startouch elf. What would a whole slew of them at the height of their power look like? (And yet it is implied that the Nova Blade is "ivory draconic" so... maybe you just have to get a First Elf close enough to the mouth to be consumed / bitten? Or perhaps the Nova Blade is made from the tooth/claw of a 'Star' arcanum dragon.)

TLDR; it's looking more and more like Startouch elves as we understand them and First Elves in generally are — while emotive and feeling the way humans and elves are — something very different from anything else we've seen thus far in terms of knowledge and power skill, and that distinction is only going to be made more and more apparent as the story goes on.

Theory #3: Where do we go from here?

So if Deep Magic is distinct from Primal, and is distinct from 2/3 kinds of Deep Magic in dark magic (derived from 5-primal and Power deep magic thoughts)... where do we go from here, magically speaking?

Well, the important thing to note is that the story has given us some thematic clues. Aaravos is concerned with exile and power, both things we see thematically most represented by human characters (with some elven exceptions like Karim and Kim'Dael). The other Star touch elves are very on brand for "Xadian exile" as their favourite punishment as well as extreme isolationism ("I knew I had to be strong alone" etc). Therefore, whatever answer we give Magically also has to reconcile these issues from a thematic and character based standpoint.

It seems like a switch of where people are concentrating energy — for Startouch elves and humans — needs to have a drastic shift to one of the other veins/concepts of deep magic that will hopefully heal the rifts. If Aaravos is Power (humans) and the others are 'Mind' (Xadian indifference/isolation and banishment) for lack of a better idea, then subverting that binary and shifting more to a third 'Love' path seems to be very on brand for TDP. Holding both at the same time but being guided by a higher principle of peace and harm reduction is what Ezran's 4x03 speech is all about, after all.

Something something both Xadia and magic and the First Elves being reunited with Xadia / humanity and elvenkind as TDP's endgame, something something.

Other Gift Giving Thoughts

The other thing I wanna talk about now that everything else is laid out is how gifts are Given, in TDP. We see time and time again relationships and magic systems being framed on the idea of whether they are giving, taking, both in a bad way or in a good way. There seems to be two main indicators for gift giving, therefore, either that in the receiver is worthy, or that the exchange is going to be reciprocal.

At its best, a gift works as intended.

Humans (and elves?) are given primal magic and generally use it for exploration and to care for themselves / one another The sun seed is given to the Sunfire elves, but they must nurture it. Callum gives Rayla her father's bow and she uses it to protect them. Callum achieves enlightenment and understanding of him and is rewarded with primal magic twice, even if the Ocean in particular is a bit murkier than he'd probably like. Gifts and belongings are relinquished or restored for freedom, for hope, for peace.

Here we have to wonder if Leola's Last Wish reconciles both the Goodbye gift motif and the gift of Magic motif, possibly resulting in the gift of the sun seed or more likely something to do with primal magic / alleviate the fallout of dark magic's consequences.

For example, to get an answer from Rex Igneous — a seeming wealth of knowledge — you have to give him a worthy gift that is also a sacrifice of some kind, according to Nath'an.

However, Ezran points out the major flaw in this line of thinking, as "We offered gifts that meant a lot to us, but the truth is, they don't mean anything to you." Not everyone is going to value the same thing or think the same thing is worth the price that was paid.

We see this interpersonally most with the mage fam ("Maybe the world would be better off without magic" from Soren, whose life was saved with it) and with Rayla and Callum (as Rayla's gift of sacrifice by leaving is something Callum did not want and rightfully did not receive well, alongside her moonstone pendant). Again: what is defined as worthy, or worthiness, is in the eye of the beholder.

Just like one of the initial thoughts that inspired this meta, Khessa asserts that dark magic is a magic that "takes" > being reciprocal for both parties, nevermind a gift. The irony, however, runs a bit deeper, as Aaravos thinks the same of his fellow stars:

But the stars kept from them one secret still: that their first lesson—patience—was not a gift of the stars at all. You see, patience is a lesson the humans taught themselves. No, the stars do not know patience, for they have no need for it. The stars want for nothing, and take all to their liking.

And we see this idea of a 'false gift' show up time and time again in the series. Nyx pretends to offer passage but actually wants to steal Zym; Rayla's act of love in leaving is a curse upon Callum's heart and wellbeing; dark magic itself is a false trade of sorts, given how unevenly it tips scales in Aaravos' favour and how much it ruins both the environment and body of its caster.

[The elven thief Lasair] never saw the precious blossoms fade and turn to cold ashes when exposed to the dawn. They never learned their gift was perceived as a curse, not a trade. 

—Tales of Xadia

Kim'Dael goes to Queen Aditi under false pretences ("The Queen's Mercy") but the gift that Aditi gives her is nothing good at all:

What pretty bauble, she wondered, had she tricked the queen into forging as a token of protection? What could be powerful enough to ward away the wrath of dragons?

Just as humans sought the stars' help to protect them from the ire of the dragons, Kim'Dael sought Aditi's. And just as Aaravos offered them a false magic that would protect and ultimately trap/destroy then, so does Aditi, with magic that doesn't seem to be entirely dark or primal:

“But know this: the binding around your neck—it is made with magic not unlike your own. It is a magic that demands, that takes."

A form of magic even maybe that demands sacrifice for that kind of Power.

You could almost say it's something Deeper.

Conclusion

Hope you enjoyed going completely off the rails with me, and that this long (winded) post got you thinking! I'll probably do a followup discussing the implications of what we have here for potential Laurelion-Aaravos later. In the meantime, take the fruits of my labour, and spin your own hamster wheels if you'd like.

[raayllum]

I've been thinking about the parallels between the Relic Staff and the Key of Aaravos all the time lately. This is for a few reasons:

Both are 'ancient' relics and have been passed down through the ages. For the Key, it was the royal line of the Orphan Queen; for the staff, it was likely dark mage to dark mage, although it could've become Katolis' high mages in particular (if only from Kpp'Ar to Viren, say)

Both are gifts, i.e. Harrow gifts the Key to Callum, and Aaravos gifts the staff to Ziard

Both the Key and the Staff are identified to having belonged to Aaravos directly once upon a time, though they fell into human hands

Seeing the staff seems to be what piques Aaravos' interest in Viren as well as establishes why Aaravos thinks Viren would be a useful pawn. I'm gonna say this goes double for Callum since the cube is literally in his intro, and Viren's staff doesn't even make the cut

The staff likewise works as a key, capable of both trapping elves and required to open the chrysalis (each providing evidence that the staff has something star magic-y going on too)

The Cube is called a key, although how much it works as one is unknown. However, like the staff, there are indications that it was related to humans developing dark magic (the dark magic dreams + blood magic, it being associated with Aaravos at all, the pawn intro, etc), which is also tied back to Aaravos on its own

Shout out to @its-leethee for catching the "legends say it unlocks something of great power in Xadia" and the "dark magic became a key that unlocked a place of power in Xadia for all humanity" in particular.

Now, I'm prepared for what I'm about to say to be basically moot the second Claudia is given an intro of her own in S6, if she is, but I am intrigued by Callum and Viren alone being highlighted in the pawn intros, even when Claudia is much more of an active pawn in arc 2 than say, Viren, who is mostly a carrot dangling over her head to motivate her to be more active. We also know (minor 6x01 spoiler) that Viren's statue crumbles in the 6x01 intro once Aaravos touches him, so it seems unlikely that Viren is a prominent pawn for him going forward.

That all said, it would be interesting to me if the Staff and the Key are related to one another somehow. Maybe the staff helps unlock something in the key, maybe the key leads to something in Elarion that helped lead to the construction of the staff, maybe both the staff and key (aka Viren and Callum, respectively) will be needed / called upon to free Aaravos from his prison by using both of these objects. (Or play a part in his grand revenge plan, whichever comes first.)

Again: I don't think this is necessarily likely / I don't feel confident about it, but it could be an interesting connection to explore with a little more lore legwork.

[kradogsrats]

@its-leethee I felt weird reblogging my own huge post for this lmao

I'm totally willing to accept all of that without question (Christian upbringing, I guess?) but what melts my brain out my ears is if Harrow and Viren had swapped bodies, would Viren's dark magic corruption stay with his body, or with his spirit/essence?

I mean, that and "wait why does the coin spell appear to literally draw the spirit out of the body, but then the body also disappears"

[self-spaghettification]

as promised, here is my version of the tdp speculation bingo!

some of these predictions/theories are mine, some i’ve adopted from others, ie, @xadian-daydreams @its-leethee @clown-fession @raayllum @parroset :>

honorable mention to

-viren relapse with dark magic/aaravos

-aaravos & ezran interaction

blank template below the cut

+ link to original post/creator

+ link to my meta masterlist for insight i guess

[kradogsrats]

Keep forgetting to do this after @sarasade tagged me, rip - original post

Three Ships: virrow (The Dragon Prince), aldarius (The Owl House), and I unfortunately still have a gross soft spot for kylux (Star Wars)

First Ship Ever: a shit-ton of weird OC x canon stuff as a kid, but in the traditional internet fandom sense probably Mustang/Hughes (OG FMA)

Last Movie: oof probably Glass Onion back when it came out, my movie buddy moved to another state shortly after that and I just… don’t really watch movies alone?

Currently Reading: I have a copy of “This is How You Lose the Time War” (as recommended by Bigolas Dickolas Wolfwood) waiting for guilt to eventually overcome my ADHD

Currently Watching: Gravity Falls, A:TLA (for the first time lmao), and Kaguya-Sama: Love is War, all at the blistering rate of one episode per week

Currently Consuming: diet coke and antidepressants

Currently Craving: TDP s5 trailer I have kind of convinced myself is likely confirmed to drop next week

Tagging: @armchairaleck @spicyviren @konmaao3 @legend-of-the-fandoms @its-leethee and/or any of the people who are all up in my notes all the time, yes I see you and love you

[kradogsrats]

I saw you reblogged a post involving Claudia using snap magic. Do you think that it is connected to deep magic?

Maybe! There are a lot of things we don't know that would clarify it, like when exactly Claudia started doing dark magic. My money for that is on after Kpp'Ar disappears and Lissa leaves, just because I think it's overall unlikely that even Kpp'Ar would be letting a six-year-old start up dark magic, considering that it's implied Viren was like... probably somewhere in the 16-20 range. Previously I had thought Viren started closer to 11-13, so it would be unusual but not completely unreasonable for Claudia to be carefully taught simple spells at like... five, or whatever. Knowing now that casting your first dark magic spell, no matter how minor, is universally going to be a dangerous and traumatizing experience... ehhhhhhhhh personally I think she did it without supervision as a way of acting out, and who's going to stop her, after the fact?

But yeah, as described in the post in question by @its-leethee, what we previously have been told about dark magic without reagents or incantations is that having done a some amount of dark magic allows you to perform simple, low-power spell effects (seen with Viren and Claudia, and described in ToX) and sense both dark and primal magic (described in ToX).

Mechanically in ToX, a character needs to be carrying some level of corrupted stress to use these "parlor trick" spells, and some level of corrupted trauma to sense magic (at least in a useful way). It's hard to say how much corrupted stress a six-year-old Claudia might be carrying around, but we do know she's been attempting a fair amount of dark magic spells and failing at them, which is technically how you gain corrupted stress. That being said, it feels really weird and off to be like "okay, you've done exactly one spell and it gave you corrupted stress, you can now light candles with your fingers." Like, Callum would technically be able to do it, it that case, and that just seems wrong. (Though he's never tried, so who knows.) But it's definitely possible that snap magic is just describing this dark magic effect, and Kpp'Ar was like "let's maybe not tell the small child that it's actually a side perk of something that can literally kill you." Like the equivalent of panicking and saying "Sears catalog" when a kid asks you where babies come from and you haven't prepared an age-appropriate explanation.

ANYWAY, as alternative speculation: we've seen Callum gain understanding of two different arcana after doing dark magic. I clearly remember the writers saying that doing dark magic is not required to gain an arcanum, but going through his first-time-user subconscious trip definitely seems to help Callum gain a deeper understanding of himself that winds up being the last piece of understanding the Sky arcanum. So if deep magic is something innate to everyone, tied to blood or life or whatever, it's possible that doing dark magic cracks open the door to it just a little, and thereby also makes grasping an arcanum just a tiny bit easier. I personally think it's important that after Callum spends so much time with the Sky primal stone, he draws a connection between how it felt to use it and how the lightning strikes "feel" to some sense he didn't have, before—he's developed some kind of internal connection that energy, possibly to magic, but not fully to the Sky arcanum.

Like ultimately "magic" is "channeling some kind of power into a desired effect by force of will." The description of "innate" dark magic spells in ToX compares them to the "day-to-day" spells of primal rune mages, in the sense that you wouldn't make a dark mage character or a Sun mage character roll to light a candle, but it wouldn't surprise me if a Sun mage could light a candle with a look or touch instead of having to draw out a whole rune and speak draconic. Would that would be drawing small amounts of primal magic through their arcanum or accessing deep magic? Hmmmm.

So yeah, I think it would be cool if it was, if only because of the definite sense that Kpp'Ar knows a lot more than he may have previously let on to Viren, but ultimately evidence-wise I think at the moment it could go either way.

[self-spaghettification]

ok as far i know its-leethee, m4rs.exe, ripple-rapple, and virenkinnie are all going to wondercon ahekfjhgwiowjafwha