#so that I can get footage of the alternate ending to this scene

[fivelasanctum]

Dark Fivela hints are canon

Recently their was a slight leak over a dark scene where five dreams of Lila losing her mind. Looks like something straight from a horror film. Rather disturbing but adds new insight into their relationship. Being stuck in their limbo of being a hell on one side but heaven in terms of freedom and having their own world to grow closer in. The original poster said their were darker takes. Could see them putting emphasis on their shared madness. Skeletons from their closet haunting them (Mostly due to malnutrition and repeating the same actions of survival. That pushed their minds to the edge) Five has been paranoid and incredibly suspicious in the past. This dream most likely terrified him over his darker fears manifesting. Relying on Lila, being vulnerable, protecting her and making her his purpose to get her back home. What happens if he couldn't protect her mind from being broken? His did and that's originally how he created Dolores. Over the years he would attack, shoot first in his original apocalypse. Which was odd since nobody but him existed there. Not like in the case of the subway stops, where they never knew what they would be getting. Think his first inclination towards violence was a testament to the madness of being alone with no true escape. The extended cut of the leaked footage could have been Lila trying to choke him or seeing him as an enemy. Forgetting the present in favor of the past. Or Five being forced to kill her in defense. Being met with that reality would push him to insanity most likely. He has grown close to her by this point. They were family and friends with hints to the growing tension between them. Five burying his own feelings before the subway. Knowing how he tried to kill her in season 2, only for it to catch up to them again despite the years and time spent growing closer. In gamer speak this would have been an alternate 'bad end' 'for them. Killing each other or one being left surviving from the attack. Could also be an insight into Five's own darkness he is struggling to keep at bay. He succumbed to it the first time around in his timeline and with lila, felt it wouldn't happen again. Yet they had become each others rock. If one cracks then they both do. She is wearing the same outfit, has the same length of hair and similar lighting was used in the quick scene from the montage below. It's my theory that he woke up from that nightmare. Obviously troubled. Think lila comforted him or made one of her more blunt jokes, laughing loudly. That infectious laughter made five smile and do the same. Showing that she is still herself and able to be content with his company. Not to say she doesn't miss her old life but it's not seen as a third ring of hell given their was affection between them before all this had happened. I would say this takes place in year three. Their madness and break downs.

In the end, think the dark edge brought them closer. Both fighting back and embracing their darkness. Seeing each other at their worse. Possibly around that same time they helped each other more. Five removing the glass from her foot. Her in turn, doing the intimate task of shaving him and no doubt cutting his hair. The love and trust growing with those actions given the more than likely, brief breakdowns that occurred and the fear of madness tearing them down. Their relationship looks to be quite strong even before it became official. Lol or I might be overthinking by being so excited over something new from the subway storyline xD Perfect timing for Halloween~! Apparently Lila and Five can be the face of Spooktober coming up lol

[stiwfssr]

[foone]

AAA games? Pfft. Indie games? Double pfft.

I only play games from the alternate history where Hillary Clinton was elected in 2008 and banned all video games. You can only imagine how weird their underground gaming scene is. People like to call unlicensed games "bootlegs" but they've got actual bootlegged games! I've played games about helping your grandmother in hospice care realize she's a lesbian by reading Sappho to her, at 2am in a speakeasy in Baltimore. The cops raided it the next night, hundreds of Gamers were arrested. They posted pictures all over Friendster of the Baltimore PD destroying the arcades with axes.

I nearly got busted once because I was imaging old disks from a 386 and someone tipped off the gaming cops that there was a copy of Commander Keen in there. I had to prove that I didn't know it, I was imaging the disks blind and then indexing them later, and I would of course turn over any contraband to the proper authorities.

I was already on a watch list because I'd been known to have some gamedev-related activities pre-ban. They can't arrest me for making games back in 2007 when it was still legal, but they do want to keep an eye on me since I have the skills to break the law.

Anyway that universe's bootlegs are mainly PC games. Can't really have console games if there hasn't been a console release since the Wii/PS3/360 era. At one point Nintendo threatened to release the Wii SDK so game devs in the US could make unlicensed games, but that didn't happen as there were quickly no functional Wiis left in the US, except for very rare holdouts that never move. PC games are easy to distribute samizdat and hide on a USB stick or CD-R labeled "nickelback".

Japan's games industry is still going, so the later Nintendo and Sony consoles still exist, but Microsoft got out of the business of course. They sold the franchise to Sega who were hoping to release the 360 successor (the Xbox One in our universe) as the Sega Phoenix but it never materialized, either through their own financial incompetence or because of pressure from the US. There's a lot of international treaties that the US has pushed "and this aid only goes through if you ban games" clauses into. That would have been an official UN resolution if the USSR hadn't vetoed it. For once, thank God for the security council, eh?

I mainly get my gaming news through Japanese gaming sites (through a set of VPNs, since they're blocked at the border firewall), and some tor onion site run by a weird guy in Minnesota who is obsessed with documenting all the underground US games.

There's a lot being worked on, but it's always a tricky trade off. Too much attention and the police might be able to track down the creators, and it's basically impossible to fund underground games, as the VISA/PayPal etc funds get seized immediately. There's a whole task force for that.

Anyway one of the weirdest differences between our two time lines is that they've gone back and edited out gaming from a bunch of movies. Those that they can, of course. War games was just banned because they couldn't remove the tic tac toe ending. The Net just removed the scene at the beginning where she's playing Wolfenstein 3D, by recording some new screen footage and a new voice over. She's fixing a spreadsheet in the new edition.

(Yes, I've seen The Net from this alternate timeline. On Laserdisc, of course. I'm just that kind of person!)

They even edited Star Wars. You know that scene where R2-D2 is playing holochess with Chewie? They edited it to be a board game instead of holograms, because that made it too "video gamey".

Technically it's not illegal to show gaming in a movie, but it needs to be an 18+ film and you have to show the deleterious effects of gaming and/or the gamesters coming to a bad end.

This has affected films less than you'd think, to be honest. They were never great about showing video games even before they banned them.

Anyway, go have fun playing your AAA games with hundred-million-dollar budgets. I only play indie games made by people under a constant threat of arrest for their art.

[holmesxwatson]

The Private Life of Sherlock Holmes dir: Billy Wilder, 1970

I only watched The Private Life of Sherlock Holmes for the first time a few days ago but it lights my brain up in that special way that I know I’ll revisit it a lot. Don’t get me wrong, it’s far from perfect, for one thing Colin Blakely’s Watson is a little too shouty for me, but it’s very worthwhile to check out despite its shortcomings, which I think mostly come from the fact that so much was cut from the intended script.

I absolutely love Robert Stephens as Holmes. His face is so good, he has a way of looking at Watson when he doesn’t know he’s being observed that is very soft. I thought I was hallucinating the beginning of this movie with Holmes telling the ballet dancer he’s gay and in a relationship with Watson. I thought it was going to be played for a joke, and it was a bit, but it didn’t just end there. Holmes and Watson have a conversation about the repercussions in a lengthy scene that turns very serious by the end. I can’t believe this was 1970 and no one has since tried to build on this specific dynamic in a more meaningful way. Someone needs to remake this into a mini-series exactly how Billy Wilder intended it to be, here’s hoping public domain can make it so.

[above: script page from the cut story The Curious Case of the Upside Down Room, where Watson creates a fake case to make Holmes feel better]

Also, the backstory of the making of this film is so out of control: Robert Stephens’s nervous breakdown and suicide attempt during the production, the amount of years Billy Wilder was trying to write it and get it made, the interference of ACD’s son, the Loch Ness monster prop that the crew lost in actual Loch Ness, the immense scope of the episodic story they were going for, the way it got cut down from its original 3 hour 45 minute runtime and how that cut footage was lost forever! (this is crazy! everyone go check your attics and storage lockers right now).

In one of the interviews I found, Robert Stephens says “if something is boring — if it’s three minutes long it’s too long, but if it’s interesting it’s never long enough…you don’t want it to end.” Big same Toby Stephens’ dad, big SAME. I didn’t want it to end. I read the uncut script and I am just floored at what we missed out on. Thankfully some footage and audio remain of some of the cut scenes (but still! check your basements too).

Just fully let it settle into your brain that they filmed all of these stories in the script, and then cut most of it away. Like that is mind-blowing to me, it existed at one point as it was fully intended to be. If this was made now during home entertainment times, they would have no problem releasing an almost four-hour movie, but at the very least there would be a big director’s cut dvd release and we would be enjoying all the small Holmes x Watson moments we deserve.

Anyway, in pretty short order I found a bunch of interesting links to stuff, details below. I also consulted my very well-thumbed Conversations with Wilder book by Cameron Crowe, but there wasn’t that much more information in there. I have Robert Stephens’ memoir Knight Errant and the TPLOSH blu-ray on order so I’ll add to this post if I find any more good resources. Let me know if I’m missing anything, and enjoy!

Full movie on YouTube (x) <-update: this link went private, but it's also streaming for free on Tubi and Freevee, and available to rent on YouTube, Google Play, and Apple TV

Original roadshow draft of script on Internet Archive (x)

Missing footage: Prologue [sound only plus stills] (x), The Curious Case of the Upside Down Room [sound only plus stills] (x), The Dreadful Business of the Naked Honeymooners [footage and soundtrack only, no sound dialogue] (x), alternate ending [sound only] (x)

Making of documentary that includes behind-the-scenes snippets of some of the cut scenes [this doc is in German, but you can turn on the auto-translate to English in the YouTube settings] (x)

Interview with Ernst Walter, film editor of TPLOSH (x)

Interview with Christopher Lee “Mr. Holmes, Mr. Wilder” 2003 (x)

My YouTube playlist with all of the above links in one place plus an excellent fan vid by Just Bee that I added to the list because it’s just so good (x)

Missing Movies: A Case for Sherlock Holmes from 1994 BBC Radio 2 on Soundcloud [includes interview with Robert Stephens and folks involved in the production] (x)

Articles about the lost Loch Ness monster prop (x) (x)

The soundtrack by Miklós Rózsa (x)

[saurongorthaur9]

So something logistical occurred to me that makes the "Galadriel goes dark" theory even more likely, in my view. I realized that come season 3, Sauron is going to be lacking characters to be his main scene partner. Celebrimbor will be gone. Based on footage we've seen, I think Adar is a dead man walking too. And it's too early to go to Numenor to mess with Pharazon. Sauron's to-do list includes anything from distributing the nine rings, making the One Ring, making himself King of Men, and waging war on the elves. I feel like I can see a lack of opportunities for some other character to come in and interact with him one on one heavily during this period besides orcs and/or random new human lords (OCs no doubt)... The creators seem to like the idea of Sauron having a main scene partner also and idk I feel like Galadriel remains the best option and they probably think the same. She could be that without going dark side of course - maybe if he captures her and she's his prisoner for a while. But her being there by *choice* makes for such interesting potential conversations between them as the story evolves, as we we see her potentially struggling with coming back to the light.

That's a very good point. Charlie is a great actor, but he (and Sauron) are definitely at his peak when he's got a scene partner and I think the showrunners know that. I do think the canon focus of S3 will be the creation of the One and the seducing of the Nazgul, which will be great in any scenario, but it would definitely make S3 juicier to somehow put him and Galadriel back together as scene partners.

A reasonable alternative that I could see them going with though is bringing in the Witch King as a main new character next season and focusing on his relationship with Sauron and his rise to Sauron's new second-in-command. I wouldn't be opposed to that at all.

But I also keep thinking, if Galadriel is 100% successful in resisting Sauron's Temptation 2.0 at the end of S2, where does that leave her character development to go for the next three seasons? She will have won back the trust of the elves, she will have successfully resisted Sauron, and she'll be well on her way to being the wiser Galadriel of LOTR without many obstacles left in her way.

On the other hand, if they do go with a corruption arc, I could very well see it going like this:

S2 Finale: Galadriel succumbs to Sauron's temptation and agrees to work with him to some extent.

S3: Galadriel struggles with her corruption arc, seeing how her joining Sauron is corrupting both her and everything she loves. S3 finale: Celeborn returns and plays a critical role in helping her find her way back to the light.

S4: Galadriel struggles with the trauma of anything she might have done or helped Sauron do in S3, and she reconnects with Celeborn and finds peace and hope with him and is able to contrast that to how she felt at Sauron's side.

S5: Galadriel and Celeborn found Lothlorien and Galadriel completes her arc into the wiser but grief-filled elven queen that we know in LOTR.

In my opinion, that would be such a compelling arc. It would also allow Galadriel to continue having a dynamic arc in S4, which is probably going to be the Fall of Numenor, where otherwise she could kind of fade into the background and not have much of a story for that season.

Obviously, this is all just my speculation and I know what a huge risk such a story would be for the showrunners, so I'm really trying with all my might not to get my hopes up. But gosh, if they went there, I would eat up that storyline like dessert.

[coraniaid]

“In every generation there is a Chosen One.  She alone will stand against the demons, the vampires, and the forces of darkness.  She is the Slayer.”

All but two of the first eight episodes of this season have opened with these words, or with a minor variation on them.  At this point the show is still somewhat finding its feet – and trying to expand its audience – and they’re an efficient way of quickly getting new viewers up to speed with what to expect from Buffy the Vampire Slayer.  

So, right before the opening theme plays us in, over suitably spooky establishing footage of tombstones and occult symbols, the off-screen voice of Rupert Giles lets the uninitiated know what to expect from the next forty-five minutes of television.  This little speech sets out the core premise of the show, simply and plainly.  Buffy is the Slayer, the Chosen One, and she stands alone.  Unique.

There’s just one small problem.  That little speech isn’t true.

It hasn’t been true, we learn in What’s My Line?, since Buffy’s temporary death at the hands of the Master.  It hasn’t been true since a new Slayer was called to replace her: Kendra, who we meet for the first time this episode.  It will never be true again.  The show will run for 144 episodes in total, and Buffy will only ever have been the unique, singular “Chosen One” for 12 of them.  Buffy is a Slayer.  That’s still true.  But she’s never going to be the Slayer again.

Kendra’s very existence represents a fundamental alteration to the core premise of Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Something that forces a reconsideration of just what Buffy’s life might have in store. Maybe Buffy isn’t in this fight alone after all.  Maybe she has a choice about whether she fights at all.  Maybe she can quit, if she wants to.

In the middle of the first half of this two-parter, Buffy reminds Giles that “there can only be one.  As long as I’m alive, there is no-one else.”  But by the end of the second half, she’s learned that she’s wrong.  Yes, being a Slayer is still part of who she is – she never does take six months off to go to Disneyland, the way she suggests to Willow that she might –, but it doesn’t have to be as isolating and lonely as everyone’s been telling her.  To paraphrase her final conversation with Kendra: she’s still a freak, but now she knows she’s not the only freak.

I don’t think it’s an exaggeration to say that the audience’s understanding of the show is completely changed after the end of this episode.  

In future episodes, we will go on to meet many more Slayers other than Buffy: both previous Slayers and potential Slayers yet to be called.  Buffy’s initial awkwardness with Kendra – her conflicted feelings about not being Sunnydale’s only Chosen One; their arguments over the proper relationship between Slayer and Watcher and whether Buffy is right to try to maintain some semblance of a normal life; the fact they disagree about Buffy’s romantic attachment to Angel and the question of whether the people Buffy cares about matter more than “the mission” – will turn out to anticipate so much of what will happen in the next five seasons of the show.   The very spell used as a resolution of the show’s seventh season in Chosen would be unthinkable in an alternate world where Buffy had never gotten to meet Kendra and so realized that different Slayers could coexist after all.

You might think that all this makes Kendra important.  You might think it makes her somebody that the show wants us to care about.  You might – at the very least – hope she’ll get to appear in a couple more episodes.  You might think Buffy and all the other Slayers we’ll meet down the road would talk about Kendra now and then, if – for some reason – she isn’t around herself.

On the other hand, you might have watched the show before.

So you might know that Kendra will only appear in one more episode, months from now, an episode that she will not survive.  You might know that, apart from a very brief mention in a single scene of an early season 3 episode, Kendra’s name will never be spoken out loud again after the end of this season.

Of all the seven recurring human characters the show has introduced so far this season – Jonathan, Devon and Oz in Inca Mummy Girl, Larry and Ethan in Halloween, Kendra herself and sleazy bartender Willy the Snitch in this two-parter – one (not Kendra) will still be making appearances on the show in its final season. Of the ones that don’t, two others (neither of them Kendra) will still be being talked about on screen in that final season.  Along the way, one of the seven will be added to the opening cast (not Kendra), one will be the center of an entire episode (not Kendra), and most of the others will appear or be mentioned in over a dozen episodes each (but not Kendra). 

More than half of them will still be alive as of the show’s final episode, and all but two of them will still be appearing in the show in its fourth season, two years from now.    Just one of them won’t make it as far as the year 1999.  Just one of them will only appear in one episode after What’s My Line?  Just one of them will be dead before the season is over.

(Whether or not there are any other noticeable differences between Kendra and these six white men is left entirely as an exercise to the reader.)

It seems bizarre, finishing a rewatch of What’s My Line? in 2023, to realize that I have already seen the majority of episodes Kendra will appear in.  She does at least get to make a little bit more of an impression than some of the other Buffy analogues this season has introduced, like the woman pretending to be Ampata Gutierrez in Inca Mummy Girl or Sheila Martini in School Hard. But honestly, not that much more.  Perhaps her biggest contribution to the lore of the show will be gifting Buffy her lucky stake; a sharpened bit of inanimate dead wood whose name will be spoken on screen far past the point that Kendra’s herself ever is.

Now, as it happens, I like What’s My Line? quite a bit.  The world of the show feels better defined than ever, there seems to be a definite improvement in both the special effects and the fight choreography and the plot is actually rather fun.  With Dru (apparently) taking over from Spike as the season’s Big Bad, with Oz and Willow finally meeting face to face and with the arrival of new writer Marti Noxon (who will go on to have a huge impact on the future direction of the show, writing several of its very best episodes) it’s really starting to feel like everything is firing on all cylinders.  

School Hard ended with Spike announcing the show’s plans for “a little less ritual, and a little more fun”.  After a bit of a bumpy start, I think the last few episodes have definitely given us that.  

In fact I think (taking the two parts as a single whole), What’s My Line? is one of the better episodes of the show so far.  Perhaps not a truly great one, but a very promising sign of things to come.  

But for Kendra, at least, it’s a promise that won’t ever be delivered on.  Buffy rescues Angel but fails to stop Spike restoring Drusilla, and it’s Kendra who will go on to pay the price.  The writers introduce this paradigm-altering new character … and then they rapidly lose any interest in her.

It’s perhaps a sign of how little the show cares about Kendra as a character or what her existence implies for the world of the show that, skipping ahead to the next episode, we’re greeted by something familiar.  “In every generation,” the off-screen voice of Rupert Giles solemnly tells us at the start of Ted, “There is a Chosen One.  She alone will stand against the demons, the vampires, and the forces of darkness.  She is the Slayer.”

Kendra isn’t even dead yet, and already the show wants us to forget she exists.

[captain-crowfish]

The Warrior Cats Phenomenon

A beloved xenofiction series that is, in reality, incredibly mediocre, is subsequently glamorized and over-inflated by the perception of adolescents, influenced by the cultural landscape at the time of the fandom's mainstream conception. The era of the early 2000s brought about the popularization of the internet, and with it came a new sub-division in alt. youth pop culture; which for the sake of this tangent I will refer to as "Alternative animal expressionism." In less formal terms, just about all the artsy kids on deviantart had a fursona that walked on four legs and was adorned with an abundance of accessories and bright colors, as well as punk/emo-resembling hair styles. This is reflective of the commonplace visual aesthetics we now refer to as MySpace/MyScene subculture. MySpace was designed as a platform for older teenagers and young adults, and just so happened to collide with the rise of Youtube, and with it came two other communities that were skyrocketing in popularity; AMVs and furries. The history of furries is too long to elaborate on here, however many of them were pioneers in developing crucial components of code still used in modern operating systems. What defines a "Furry" is debated, but mostly revolves around an enjoyment of anthropomorphized animals. arguably one of if not the most popular forms of media depicting animals with such characteristics at the time was Walt Disney's The Lion King, and the growing number of forum websites meant that multiple forums and websites were bound to surface that were entirely dedicated to The Lion King and its fans, serving as a dedicated space to discuss the film, and potentially their own fan-made characters. AMV is an incredibly broad and potentially outdated term. The Acronym "AMV" was first coined as "Anime music video." Although for reasons I will touch on a bit later it can also mean "Animated music video." Again, with the notoriety of forum websites and online fan spaces, information can much more easily be found, given, and spread. Anime was still a relatively new concept in the world of Western entertainment (and was first popularized by, you guessed it, Furries.), and until files and videos could easily be shared over the internet, the only way to watch Anime was to get your hands on a physical VHS tape, which at the time still proved to be difficult and an incredibly niche practice, especially if you wanted subtitled or dubbed Anime.

Now in the 2000's, the popularity of Anime has increased almost tenfold. And while animation is a media that can be easily translated is necessary and enjoyed by a Western Audience, Japanese music did not quite reach the same level of popularity, at least not alongside Anime. Western audiences often combined clips of various Anime TV shows and films to music, most of which was Western-made. The intent, editing style, and end result of each fan-made music video often differed greatly from each other, although a common idea was evidently present: The music landscape at the time, brought on by the newest wave of counter culture, could be relatable to the situations of the animated characters. (This was not a completely new concept, and full disclosure I do not know how people made fan made music videos before computer video editing software was invented. According to Wikipedia, "The first AMV was created in 1982 by 21-year-old Jim Kaposztas. [He] hooked up two videocassette recorders to each other and edited the most violent scenes from Star Blazers to "All You Need Is Love" by the Beatles to produce a humorous effect.") These were also sometimes referred to as "Anime mixes", particularly if they contained footage from more than one property. Similar media also included MMVs ("Manga music videos"), FMVs (literally "Fan Music Videos") and HMVs (which were obviously created for a more adult audience).

The oldest AMV on Youtube (at least that I could find) After some time, the appeal of creating a fan-made music video spread to other fandoms (again through social cross-pollination, i.e. someone who was a fan of both Anime and The Lion King was more likely to adopt these mediums), particularly The Lion King, and fan made music videos using footage from the film and its sequels began to surface, although still using the "AMV" Moniker. The next logical step for anyone who enjoyed Western mainstream animation was to include other Disney properties in fan-made music videos. But why stop at mainstream? Why stop at films? the medium soon evolved to contain and pay tribute to all kinds of Western animation, from Walt Disney to cult classics such as the likes of Watership Down, to TV shows like Avatar The Last Airbender (the latter of which was often understandably grouped in with Anime and AMVs).  In 2003, a group of authors underneath the pseudonym Erin Hunter released the first book in what would become one of the most popular and most beloved xenofiction book series of all time. Warriors: Into the Wild. Like most budding fandoms, Warrior Cats also sprouted dedicated fan websites for discussion of the series. The up-and-coming Warrior Cats fandom found itself somewhere on the spectrum between the anime and furry communities, combining the ingenuity and creative thinking with the"Sparkledog" furry art style. However, the more "visual" creative types lacked almost any pre-existing media to work with, and before 2009, fan-made music videos often consisted of picture slideshows with simple or non-existent effects and transitions, with some scattered fan-made animations here and there. And then, everything changed when a small team of artists and animators driven purely by devotion, passion, and seemingly sheer creative will, released the first episode of their new Anime-inspired, episodic retelling of the first Warriors book. SSSWarriorCats was so Anime-inspired, both in animation style, direction and pacing, perfectly straddling the balance between the Anime and furry communities, respectfully. The series, although technically incomplete, still garners an enormous fanbase to this day. Evidently Warrior Cats fans have been inspired by these animations for over a decade, and it's not hard to see why. And thus the release and subsequent releases of episodes sparked what is regarded as the “Classic” period in Warrior Cats fan animations, and also sparked the creation of “MAPs” (“Multi-Animator-Projects”), as opportunities to collaborate with fellow artists. To summarize, Warrior Cats had the ingenuity of Anime fans to create music videos out of already-existing content, but upon realizing they had none, looked to the furry, tactile-based artistic side of their fandom’s conception to create it, instead of waiting for an official adaptation to surface. (And considering what Tencent animation is doing… I’m glad they did.) In other, perhaps more unserious terminology, the Warrior Cats fandom is the cultural brainchild of the Anime and Furry communities. To summarize, Warrior Cats had the ingenuity of Anime fans to create music videos out of already-existing content, but upon realizing they had none, looked to the furry, tactile-based artistic side of their fandom’s conception to create it, instead of waiting for an official adaptation to surface. (And considering what Tencent animation is doing… I’m glad they did.) In other, perhaps more unserious terminology, the Warrior Cats fandom is the cultural brainchild of the Anime and Furry communities. The Warrior Cats Fandom continues to persist, even after two decades, seemingly out of sheer artistic will. But, of course, the question remains as to why all of this happened, why does the possibility for these ideas to occur exist in the first place? The answer is simple, The perception of adolescents that such amalgamated fan-made media can be perceived as "mature" or even "edgy" is not one that has disappeared from our culture and probably never will. Cringe culture is dead.

[magentagalaxies]

Kids in the Archive: Episode 8

welcome back to kids in the archive! the show where i highlight iconic kids in the hall sketches that i have procured the original scripts for and break down a behind-the-scenes comparison of script and screen

Previous Episodes: Episode 1 - armada finale ("do we make it?") Episode 2 - fran & gordon: the vacation Episode 3 - comfortable Episode 4 - cathy & kathi: is he? Episode 5 - danny husk: kidnapped! Episode 6 - trappers Episode 7 - sizzlers & the bank

on today's episode, i bring you the highly revised sketch that is Darcy and Francesca!

i've always enjoyed this sketch - francesca fiore is one of my favorite scott characters and i really enjoyed both darcy pennell show sketches and i wish they did more. however the reason i'm showcasing it today is because this is the most any kids in the hall script has deviated from the final product out of the ones i've read so far. i've had scripts with a slightly different ending beat or a change in casting, but aside from the sketches that never made it into the show at all, this one presents the most interesting alternate universe where this aired as written, and raises questions about why these changes were made in the first place

Darcy's Personality

The first thing you'll notice in this script is that darcy pennell has a bit more of an edge. her opening song's lyrics reference mood swings and lithium (we stan a bipolar queen), she gets mad when she can't parse francesca's nationality, there's a line where she talks about having a thing for the tin man from wizard of oz, she even sits behind a desk! okay, the desk thing isn't that edgy, but that also shows us how the setup of this show differs as well, with darcy constantly calling to unseen camera men with increasingly ridiculous names.

a bit of this edge remains in the sketch that aired - like referencing the show's previous episode as giving makeovers to the women on death row (a line that was added since it does not appear in this script), or teasing the next episode as darcy joining the hell riders (which is still in this ending). however, these jokes are juxtaposed with the daytime-talkshow-positivity and mom-vibes darcy gives off otherwise. i think this works, both because the contrast makes both traits pop and because it plays to kevin's strengths. some of my favorite beats are not in this draft - while script-darcy pulls out popcorn to watch the clip, screen-darcy puts on nonfunctional glasses so she can get used to them. while script-darcy complains about subtitles, screen-darcy talks over the clip by saying "what a lovely wall!"

Francesca Fiore Lore

the sequence of darcy trying to parse francesca fiore's nationality is a bit more drawn out and includes specifics of francesca's global backstory:

personally, i like the final sketch's version of this conversation much better - quickly going back and forth setting up a country she's from and then denying being from that country. i also like the ending of the screen version's conversation better - where instead of getting mad, darcy is somehow able to grasp that francesca is somehow irish. however, this lore-dump is also interesting considering as this is only francesca fiore's second appearance. the first page of the text has to justify her as being "from hazy movie," the only sketch she's been in thus far.

The Censorship

by "the censorship" i don't necessarily mean the sketch itself was censored (or do i?), i mean that in the alternate universe this sketch provides, it's abundantly clear the theme of this sketch is censorship! sure, censorship is referenced in the final sketch (the clip of francesca's movie being cut, francesca's line "shoot shoot bang bang kill kill is fine, but show seven genital and everybody go crazy"). however, the script goes even farther.

after the clip concludes, darcy commiserates with francesca, saying any time she tries to bring up anything controversial, the camera just cuts to calming beach footage until she brings up hairstylists. then this happens:

following this, we have the same francesca line about violence being allowed but not sex, and darcy teasing her next episode.

so what do we make of this? well, the kids in the hall have always had issues with censorship from networks over the years, and the juxtaposition between censoring sexuality while allowing violence unfiltered has been part of scott's work for years. a decade after this sketch, he'd be taking on this subject again in his one-man-show The Lowest Show On Earth, whose poster (featuring scott with what appears to be semen on his face) would cause controversy, leading scott to comment on how if it was blood there would be no issue. interestingly, the topic of censorship became even more prevalent during the amazon prime revival decades later, because while scenes of sex and nudity were more acceptable, the third kind of censorship (censoring discussion of controversial topics, like darcy runs into) was even more prevalent. this topic is also going to be a staple of the buddy cole documentary, and i wonder what scott thinks of this alternate script

so why was the censorship commentary toned down? i have three theories:

a) they were censored (either the network didn't like their portrayal of the censors being met with violence or the violence was so gratuitous that it was not allowed on television) b) it was too expensive to shoot (a lot goes into filming a sketch like this - location, special effects, the cost of filming itself) c) it just wasn't that good

personally, as interesting as i find the kids in the hall's (specifically scott's) relationship to censorship to be, i'm inclined to go with the third option. this alternate ending makes a point, sure, but it's not as funny. i don't think i'd be returning to the sketch as much as i do if this script was the version that aired. even when looking at the youtube comments on this upload, the top comments are all referencing jokes that aren't in this draft. the darcy theme song, "what a lovely wall", and bruno counting the genitals in the clip are all iconic moments and as much as i love satire, i think these sillier moments make the satire itself stronger.

but i'm glad i have this look into what this sketch could have been, to make me appreciate the process.

[oneinathousand]

In 2020, there was a documentary hosted by Viktor Andrienko called The Star of David Cherkassky which went over his career and all his projects, I haven’t found any English subtitles for it, so I don’t know what they were talking about, yet I was intrigued by one section where they showed what I assume were some Radna Sakhaltuev storyboards from Treasure Island 1988 for a scene that wasn’t animated:

So it looks like Silver finds either Flint’s actual treasure or some other treasure, he goes to Las Vegas, brings back women, money, and wine, then the pirates and heroes get along with each other?

If anyone who’s seen this documentary knows that these were for, whether it be a deleted scene, an alternate ending, a commercial, or for some sequel project, let me know. You can watch the documentary here (the part showing these storyboards starts about 1 hour and 3 minutes in): https://youtu.be/jNSEMXVkMJs

One of these days I gotta get somebody to translate the full thing cause I’m sure there’s all sorts of trivia in there. Oh, they also show some more footage from the unfinished movie “Crazy Macaroni”, so that’s cool.

[jazy3]

ST5 BTS Teaser Trailer Thoughts Part 2

So the Basement Scene! I could talk about this scene for days! There is so much to unpack here! This appears to be the basement of the local radio station that they've been filming at a lot. I think it's going to be this season's Creel House!

You can see the Pink Floyd poster from the BTS pic we got in January behind the group and it looks like this is the same set where we got that set pic of Millie with the Duffer Brothers in front of a telecom tower. In the photo we got of Steve outside the radio station the brickwork appears to match some of the telecom tower and the silo BTS photos.

The schematics photo we got back in February is for a remote radio head so it looks like radio is going to play a hugh part in this season. In this footage we can clearly see Joyce, Will, Nancy, Jonathan, Dustin, Steve, Mike, and Lucas. It looks like Robin might be sitting next to Nancy but it’s hard to tell because Will is in front blocking our view of this person.

Steve’s wearing the red and brown shirt from the Day 1 of Filming video of Joe and Maya which indicates that this basement scene is from Episode 1 of Season 5. Which is interesting given the group dynamic in this shot and where we left things at the end of Season 4. Both Jonathan and Nancy look miserable in this scene! What jumped out at me most was how much space there is physically between the two of them.

Nancy’s sitting on what appears to be a chair next to Robin and Jonathan is sitting at the end of the couch behind them. There’s a whole person's width of space between them and they’re not touching at all. They’re not making eye contact and while Nancy is looking towards Joyce. Jonathan is looking straight ahead towards the camera.

It stood out to me because if you look at their body language in Season 3 they’re very close physically. Even when they’re having problems in their relationship there’s still a physical closeness there that appears to be totally absent in this shot. This gave me pause the same way that Steve and Nancy’s ‘See you on the other side’ scene in the Season 4 trailer and the lack of Jancy scenes in that trailer gave me pause.

You can see that Nancy is wearing the red and white striped dress that we saw in the warehouse video. Could be a candy striper outfit so she could have come from volunteering at the hospital. If that's the case it could explain why she's sitting next to Robin. As it's possible they're volunteering together to keep an eye on Max.

It’s interesting that Steve is sitting on the other side of the room next to Mike and Dustin when Nancy and what appears to be Robin are sitting on the other side of the room. Although this could be because he picked up Dustin from the cemetery after he got beat up.

And we get our first good look at Jonathan this season and he's got a new look! He’s gone from California stoner bro to folksy alternative guy! Honestly, I'm not sorry to see that look go. It was horrendous! Later on we see Jonathan in the same outfit pointing at something on the projector. And then we've got a shot of Mike standing at the projector with Nancy beside him looking worried.

I'm excited for Mike and Nancy to have more scenes! I feel like the last time we got substantial scenes with just the two of them was Season 1! And I'm really curious to see how we go from the Season 4 finale to where we are in this scene. Jonathan, Will, and Mike look totally different and you can see how worried and scared everyone looks. And Joyce is wearing her corduroy jacket and blue shirt from Season 1 which indicates that by this point the Byers stuff has arrived from California.

Part 1: https://www.tumblr.com/jazy3/757938426475577344/st5-bts-teaser-trailer-thoughts-part-1?source=share

[firelance2361]

What If…The Iron Overtook The Man?

Here’s another horror-centric idea for a What If scenario before the end of the year, based on the recent Darkhold Saga from 2021.

{In this alternate timeline, when Aldritch Killian and Maya Hansen kidnapped Tony Stark, instead of just merely torturing Tony with footage of Pepper being given the Extremis Serum, Killian decides to go a step further and inject Stark with the serum as well.

Moments after injection, when Tony desperately tries to call the Mark 42 suit back to help him, the fusion of the suit’s technology and Tony’s Extremis-fueled blood caused a horrific side effect, merging the man and his mind into the suit.

After the newly created Iron Maniac brutally kills Killian, Hansen escapes and frees Rhodey, escaping with Trevor Slattery before Tony can hurt them.

As the heroes attempt to handle the horrific situation and rescue Pepper, Tony’s mind begins to descend into madness as he binds up Killian’s men and starts bonding them to his now-Extremis-laced armors, dissolving them completely into the suits.

He soon learns from them the whereabouts of Pepper and decides to spread this newfound “gift” to her and all of the his friends.

As Rhodey, Maya, and Trevor attempt to free Pepper from the Roxxon Shipyard, Tony shows up with an Extremis-Empowered Iron Legion, including the now-armored remains of Happy Hogan.

The group then battles both Legionaries and A.I.M. Troops alike in a bid to escape, with Trevor getting turned and absorbed in the process.

As the group gets close to escape, Stark corners them, cutting off their exit. Rhodey and Pepper engage with him in battle to allow Maya to repair their escape boat; as they fight Tony’s deep paranoia and emotions then begin to surface, making him more dangerous and erratic.

After Tony injures and knocks out Rhodey, he then gestures Pepper to a suit of her own, claiming that it will “cure” her as well. While Pepper seemingly agrees with him for the moment, she then uses this distraction to kick him back and rip into the suit’s weapons arsenal, ripping out a missile from it.

As Rhodey regains consciousness, she then heats up the missile with her powers and throws it at the Iron Maniac, which Rhodey follows up with a repulsor blast, knocking everyone back.

Pepper, Rhodey, and Maya manage to escape the horror scene, but unfortunately, so does a now-damaged Tony. Then on Christmas Day, as the trio assembles with the other remaining Avengers to deal with this rising threat, the Iron Maniac publicly announces his ultimate gift: a suit of armor around the world, one for every person in it.}

I know this one is probably dark in a lot of places, and that many would understandably prefer an Iron Man vs. Wenwu episode, but I thought it would be another possibility to remix for Season 3 or possibly beyond.

IDK, let me know what you guys think!

Hope you like it and have a Happy New Year!

[moltz23]

Did a Potential Overhaul in the Post-Timeskip Cutscenes mess up with 3H's Development? - Development Mystery/Theory

Back in 2021, Nintendo released a video called Fire Emblem : Vol 1 to celebrate the franchise's 30th anniversary. And around 30:35, the video shows the 3H Movie "Rematch", used for Chapter 17 of the Azure Moon and Verdant Wind routes.

With a catch.

It's not the same one that ended up on the final game:

A glimpse into an alternate reality?

People went wild back when they noticed Edelgard and Claude in this version are using the outfits of their Emperor & Barbsrossa classes rather than the Armored Lord and Wyvern Master ones seen in the game we got, leading to much speculation surrounding what this meant for Three Houses. And it goes without saying that, while unseen, fans suspect that Dimitri uses his Great Lord outfit rather than the High Lord's in this version. So... The heck is up with this movie???

Well, as uncovered by VincentASM from sereneforest.net, it's highly likely this take of the movie shown in the promotional Nintendo/FE video is from an early build of the game. A build so early, that Edelgard skin and eyes were more saturated, and characters still didn't use unique palettes when using generic classes (which was incidentally used in February's JP Nintendo Direct of 2019).

Your call as for which version looks better.

It doesn't just end there though; if Three Houses' datamine is anything to go by - namely, the internal order the classes have in the code - we can find evidence that can answer why the endgame lord classes were used in this variation rather than the "middle ones" early on: simply put, Armored Lord, High Lord, and Wyvern Master did not exist during most of 3H' development. In turn, this explains why the Flame Emperor Class - Edelgard's enemy-only class for Part 1 - is internally, a model swap of her Emperor class rather than Armored Lord's: the latter didn't exist during development of Part 1, so Emperor was used as a base instead.

With this evidence uncovered and the answer giving resolution to the promotional footage shown, hopes waned down for the future of 3H, and everyone moved on.

This raises two questions I haven’t seen anyone point out before, though.

How much (if any) did this change mess up the post-timeskip movies? Is it the reason why the Silver Snow Theorem happened?

To explain these inquiries further, I'll go into greater detail about each one:

1. Two Types of Animated Movies.

Corporate needs you to find the differences between these two pictures.

Three Houses uses 2 types of animated movies for important scenes. The first one (see the one on the left), was done in-house by KT through pre-rendering shenanigans with the 3H engine. Meanwhile, the second one (on the right) was outsourced to SANZIGEN.

The distinction between both is relevant because the movie showcased in the FE Castle Conversations video - as well its final version - belong to the former category. Meaning that, should the character designs get tweaked during development, in the best case scenario, as far IS & KT were concerned, swapping models should be enough to keep things up to date, which might as well be what happened with the "Rematch" movie once the House Leader's main post-timeskip designs were swapped.

But what about tweaking the other type of movies, though? The ones commissioned to the animation studio? I can't imagine the whole process being cheap in their case, more so given that 8 out of the 11 movies commissioned to SANZIGEN feature the 3H lords post-timeskip:

What's important here is that ☆ = Doesn't feature any 3H lord in any capacity.

Granted, the smartest course of action in this instance would've been to simply commission the post-timeskip movies near the end of development to avoid consistency/revision issues, for which there is a plausible chance that’s the case. After all, in the E3 2018 trailer for the game - which was the first instance we ever saw footage of it - the only animated movie outsourced seen was the one from the intro.

But... What if that’s not the case?

Call me paranoid if you want, but I raise this worry for a reason-

2. "The Theorem of What?????"

Love this banner so much.

A few months ago I did a breakdown on how 3H distributes it's movies across routes, and if there's anything that stood up a ton besides the predictable stuff, is that the game followed a clear pattern which determined which routes would get the most movies, versus which ones would get screwed instead. In my breakdown, I coined this pattern "The Silver Snow Theorem" which proposes the following:

"The amount of movies and fullscreen CGs present in a route’s main story by Part 2, is directly and inversely proportional respectively, to how much the narrative follows Silver Snow’s story beats."

And as a refresher, Silver Snow matters to the development of Three Houses because: A. That's the first route the developers worked on; and B. was used as the basis for the other 3:

Which route specifically did you create in the beginning to establish the world-building? Kusakihara: It was one of the two paths in the Empire route—the one fans refer to as the “church route”: “Silver Snow” [...] afterwards, we had Koei Tecmo’s scripting team start work on the nitty-gritty of the other house leaders and the story of their respective routes.

While Silver Snow having this much influence over the Part 2 movies is noticeable in hindsight, truth be told, I did initially brush it off as just a side effect of being used as a template for development. Looking back now though, a part of me now wonders if the Part 2 movies were first commissioned once Silver Snow was late into development and AM and VW had been already decided to borrow a ton from the route’s first half. Because if that’s the case, then there might have been cutscenes outsourced to SANZIGEN that did feature Edelgard, Dimitri and Claude with their second post-timeskip lord classes rather than one ones fans are most familiar with.

But then, it was decided during development that the house leaders would rather use different outfits instead. And this might have caused problems with budget since changing those outsourced cutscenes ain’t an easy task compared to the ones KT made in-house.

Like, seriously.

Goes without saying that all this is merely conjecture. But I feel it’s worth making the question because, to reiterate, the Silver Snow Theorem highlights that the more a route follows Silver Snow’s story beats to a tee, the more animated cutscenes (and less CGs) it gets. And given evidence points out the lord’s main post-timeskip classes fans are familiar with were a late addition… I guess y’all know where I’m going by now.

I usually don’t make threads focusing on fan theories and stuff, but this has been in my mind for a long while so I wanted to see what you guys think about it. Do you think more movies with the lord’s 2nd classes got made before the outfit swap was made? Or perhaps the issue the devs ran with that caused the Silver Snow Threorem might be due to something else entirely…? Also, what's y'all's opinion on SANZIGEN's movies compared to the ones done by KT?

[duhragonball]

Neon Genesis Evangelion: Death and Rebirth

This one's gonna be pretty quick, but I wanted to get it out of the way before I tackled End of Evangelion.

All right, so the Neon Genesis Evangelion TV series (1995-1996) was a success, and there was also a strong fan demand for a different ending. I'm pretty sure fans thought the original ending in Episodes 25 and 26 was an incoherent mess, but maybe they were more supportive about it. Anyway, those two factors led to the release of the first NGE movie, Death and Rebirth, in March 1997.

The movie is actually two smaller movies and both of them are kind of bullshit. The first half, Death, is just a trumped up clip show, which is pretty rich considering how much footage they already recycled making Episodes 14, 25, and 26. The second half, Rebirth is actually all-new material that serves as an alternate ending, but only the first 25 minutes' worth of that ending. This 25 minute segment ends on a cliffhanger, and it would air again, along with the conclusion, in End of Evangelion, released in July 1997.

So really, Death and Rebirth was just an extended preview of End of Evangelion. A fan would have gone to the theater for D&R in March, and gotten a recap of the TV series, followed by the opening third of EoE. That would presumably whet the fans' appetite to come back in four months to see EoE in its entirety.

So in 1997, this was probably a cool idea. By that time, NGE had been off the air for about a full year, and fans might have appreciated a highlight reel of all the big moments from the series before diving into the next thing. And seeing 25 minutes of a new episode doesn't sound like such a bad deal either.

But, it's 2024, and from my vantage this just comes across like a cheap stunt. It looks a lot like End of Evangelion was the movie they wanted to make all along, but they couldn't get it finished in time, so they slapped together what they had and padded it out with old clips. Then they released End of Evangelion as they had originally intended, but this way they got their fans to pay twice for that same 25 minutes of footage.

Any way you slice it, there's not much of value in Death and Rebirth. The first portion is just clips from the TV series, and the second portion is just the first portion of End of Evangelion. What does that leave?

Well, a little. I think this "found footage" clip from Misato's dad's lab is new? I could be wrong. There's not much to it. You hear people talking about stuff and then everyone gets upset because Adam is awakening or something, and then Second Impact happens.

There's also a bit with Kaji and Asuka talking while they're en route to Japan. Kaji tells her that one of the other Eva pilots is a boy, but she doesn't care about boys her own age, all she wants is Kaji.

There's a framing sequence where the Eva pilots each show up to the empty theater from Episodes 25 and 26, and they prepare to play classical music. Shinji's on cello, and I can barely tell what the others are even doing. It's all meaningless filler disguised as some sort of powerful, meaningful thing.

I think this is new footage of Unit 00 removing the Lance of Longinus from Adam Lilith's body. When the lance comes out, the bottom half of Lilith expands and grows into a pair of humanoid legs, as opposed to the bulbous mass of many teeny legs.

Maybe this was in the TV episode, but I feel like I would have remembered seeing this before.

Also new, maybe? This scene of Clownshoes talking to Yui Ikari and baby Shinji. He isn't keen on SEELE and their predicted scenario of Third Impact happening in the next ten years. Yui's a member of SEELE, and she assures him that they're just trying to ensure that Third Impact happens in a way that humanity will survive and be prepared for. Clownshoes also says that he basically got an offer he can't refuse from SEELE, which is why he's reluctantly helping them. And mybe this was in Episode 21, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't because I remember wondering when and how Clownshoes joined up and being irritated that a scene like this didn't exist to spell it out.

Oh, here's that suitcase with the embryonic Angel in it, remember that? Gendo called it "Adam" when Kaji delivered it, and I didn't understand this. Then they called the big white angel on the cross "Adam", except it turned out to be Lilith. Well, what they did was they shrank Adam down into embryo form so he'd be easier to move around. This also had the benefit of keeping him hidden when the other Angels attacked NERV in search of him. We found out Lilith was kept on the cross as sort of a decoy, but where was the real Adam, then?

Uh, in this guy's hand? I guess? They never show whose hand this is, but it just occurred to me that Gendo always wears gloves, and there were a couple of battles in the TV show where things were looking pretty dicey and he got up to leave his command post. Maybe he was trying to keep Adam away from the intruding Angel during those moments.

We also get a clip of Kaji greeting whoever shot him, but instead of the gunshot we hear a slap, and then Shinji telling Asuka that Kaji is gone. She refuses to believe it.

After that, things pretty much wrap up with the final battle against the 17th Angel. That segment is basically a quick rundown of Episode 24, but the stuff before that is a jumbled collage. I think they tried to organize it thematically. A bunch of Shinji stuff, then Asuka moments, then Rei moments, and so on. When I first learned about this movie, I assumed the Death portion was like an abridged treatment of the TV show, but it really isn't. This would be a terrible way to introduce a new viewer to the franchise. All the big important story beats are included, but in a jumbled order, often with no context. It's designed for a fan to watch and go "Yeah, I remember when that happened."

Anyway, the kids wrap up their music practice and exit the stage. Whatever.

Then there's an intermission clock before the Rebirth feature starts. Cute. I made sure to take a screenshot of the clock on 4:20, because that's the weed number. Ha ha, can you imagine what it would be like if everyone in Evangelion was high? On weed? The NERV logo would be green, and instead of a maple leaf it would be a marajuana leaf, because that's the weed plant! And when they get in their entry plug, they would be full of bongwater, and it would be green from all the weed molecules in it. Instead of LCL fluid, they would call it "THC fluid", amirite? Also Shinji and Asuka would be a lot less upset all the time.

After that, Rebirth starts, but I'm not going to get into that here. We'll save it all for End of Evangelion, since the whole thing is supposed to be there. It might take me a little longer to write that up, but I'm sure it'll be ready this weekend. Doncha dare miss it!

[starseneyes]

Chenford REWIND- Lucy Chen / Tim Bradford - The Rookie - Season 5 - Ep 1

That's right, folks, I've been talked into going back to the beginning of Season 5 (which is when I was first talked into watching this show... I'm sensing a theme, here).

SPOILER ALERT: This is going to spoil the entirety of Episode 1 of Season 5, and may reference past The Rookie episodes and Chenford moments. Please abandon ship NOW if you don't want spoilers.

Episode 1 of Season 5 was juicy, but it was also heartbreaking in a number of ways. What do I mean? Well... I'll tell you... after the "Keep reading"...

Previously On... Snogging Your Boss

To catch everyone up, Season 4 ended with Tim and Lucy awkward with one another after they lip-locked while attempting to get under the skin of their alter-egos, Dim and Juicy. That was a delicious scene, but we're in Season 5, now, so let's see where Lucy is...

Dreaming of Said Lip-Lock

Lucy is smiling in her sleep thinking not of her "work in progress"... but of her SO (who she wants to be her SO... if you know what I mean).

I've gone back and forth on whether this is an un-used take, or whether it was shot for the episode. Perhaps one of y'all can illuminate, if you know.

But with the track-around shot being so bloody perfect, and no signs that this alternate angle was used in any of the footage that we see in Season 4's finale, I keep thinking it was shot just for Lucy's dream.

Lucy Chen is having a sexy dream about Tim Bradford. (that one's for my Miggy mutuals out there).

Not only that, but she's making him a little more assertive in her dream... cupping her face with his hand, pushing the kiss deeper as her lips part. Lucy wants Tim to take charge. Yowza!

The knock at her door coincides with the door-interruption in her dream, and Lucy wakes rudely, shaken from the very nice feeling dream. (and then she shakes a very flimsy bed that will need an upgrade if Tim and Lucy are ever to share it... just sayin')

Tamara opens the door (can't believe Tamara c*ck-blocked Chenford in two different episodes in two different realities back-to-back), and steps in. She's worried about her Mom/Roommate.

"I could blow off class, if you want. We could go shopping. See a movie." "I'll be fine. I'm not going to be anywhere near Rosalind. Tim and I are station-bound waiting for the phone to ring." "On your undercover thing?" "Yeah, the original go-time fell through and it's just been radio silent ever since."

Thank you, expositionary dialogue, for helping catch us up. Look, it's one of those necessary evils, sometimes, when you're trying to quickly bring viewers up to speed. Some people can do it well, and some people really can't.

My husband is a huge Star Trek fan. I mean, I'm a fan... he puts the fanatic in fan, if you know what I mean. He has a USS Hood hoodie, for goodness sake.

Anyway, he once learned that there were certain actors who were given all the expositionary dialogue on Star Trek: The Next Generation because others totally botched it. I'll let you figure out who.

Here, with confirmations, affirmations, and back-and-forth dialogue, we've gotten through that a little smoother than if one person monologued it for us.

"This the same undercover thing you and Tim were discussing the other night?"

Mom just got called for making out with her "friend" by her daughter. Yikes! And while Lucy's face screws up trying to determine which emotion to display, Tamara watches, the teenage snark at the ready for anything her Mom uses to deflect.

"I already told you, that kiss didn't mean anything." "Right. Right. It was for the case! Make out. Stop crime. That totally tracks."

Thank God I wasn't drinking anything the first time I heard this line, because I would have spat it clear across the room in a fine spray of incredulity.

Because Tim and Lucy weren't just kissing, there. That kiss had several distinct mouth movements of deepening from lips colliding, to smoothing into it, to a breath of air before diving deeper for more.

Tim was about to go fishing for Lucy's tongue if that door hadn't opened.

Lucy has a lot going on. We know from end of Season 4 that she's aware of her growing feelings for Tim. Watching him fake his engagement struck an unexpectedly dissonant cord.

But that doesn't mean she's ready to face them. Tim having Ashley and her having Chris helps create a boundary... right?

"Go to school!" "Okay. Well, have a great day. With your boss. Who you kissed."

Lucy can try to deny it all she wants, but when Tamara walked in the other night, Lucy's hands were on Tim's chest. Her eyes were closed. His hands were on her arm, and they were decidedly not sharing a peck. They were snogging, and it would have been a while before they stopped—if they stopped—had Tamara not walked in.

And Lucy's been trying not to think about that. Look at how she squirms when Tamara walks out.

Because, while we know that Tim had his Moment of Realization when he left Lucy's sight, she has no idea about any of that.

She knows that they tried to talk about it at work the next day, and he didn't mention anything between them. So, she's compartmentalized that it's all in her head... not knowing he's done the exact same thing.

Because while Tim and Lucy can be very different people, there are places in their lives where they align like mirrored puzzle pieces, designed to fit together, yet unaware until they shift into the right positions (heh).

Both of them are rationalizing, burying, and trying to pretend it meant nothing. For one thing, they're both with other people right now, and neither is a fan of cheating. Secondly, this is a big deal.

Tim hasn't dated within the Station since his wife, and they were Rookies together. Lucy hasn't dated within the Station since she dated Nolan and she swore off cops as potential partners.

Not to mention their friendship that has built over the years. They're finally in a good place. Do they really want to risk this comfortable place where they've finally arrived? Is it worth it?

They don't know, yet. So, they're both spiraling.

"You kissed Lucy?"

Let's not pretend Angela doesn't know what's up. Girlfriend is a detective and she happens to be Tim's best friend. When he was spiraling because Caleb took Lucy, he called Angela. Why? He needed to talk it out.

And much as Tim used to complain about Lucy doing it in the Shop with her love life, he does the same thing... when it comes to Lucy.

Angela knows that Tim needs to talk it out because he's spiraling emotionally, and he doesn't handle that well on his own. So, he needs an outside perspective.

Keep in mind, this is days after their kiss. Tamara said, "the other day". So, not yesterday... but sometime in the last week or so. Tim hasn't been able to get Lucy's lips (and their taste) off his mind in days, so he is finally cracking and calling in Angela for the assist.

"No. No. Dim kissed Juicy. Okay? Or, Jake kissed Sava. Whatever."

Tim, honey, there's a river I need to tell you about... It's one I feel like you must've visited before called... DENIAL. You can't rationalize away feelings, Timmy, my boy. It doesn't work that way.

Angela's smirk game is PEAK at this moment. This is all she needed to know that Timothy is getting in his feels about his former Boot. And, let's be real, Angela knows a thing or two about feelings that can't be denied. She'll be the least judgy about all this... but she'll also be the most brutal in her teasing.

"The point is, we had to be comfortable going undercover, so we practiced being a couple." "How much did you practice?"

Angela Lopez, te amo. You are now my hermana and we're going to get along famously because you called Tim out so effortlessly. I always knew I liked you!

Tim is not happy with it. He really wants someone to agree with him and help him rationalize what he can't loosen from his head (and heart).

Kissing Lucy felt good. Kissing Lucy felt right. He didn't want to stop. He wanted to keep kissing her. And when Tamara walked in, he felt like he'd been caught. Why does he still feel that way?

Why can't he loose the feel of her arms in his hands, the smell of her skin to close to his, the taste of her mouth... and why is he still craving it?

The two of them faced a scare like this at the beginning of Season 4. Presumably, he wasn't dating Ashley, yet, when Lucy spent the night (or half a night) after Jackson's death and Angela's kidnapping.

He'd held her in his arms, then. And even when they'd separated, his left hand was still rubbing up and down, offering comfort as she looked up at him with those big eyes.

Feeling her breath on his neck, he'd abandoned ship faster than Billy Zane's character in Titanic. But he'd thought of her. Heck, we don't know if he might have been on his feet walking to her when he got Wesley's call as she was on her feet coming to him.

But that time he was able to push it down. Kissing her awakened something that's refusing to silence in his brain... an anxious hum that only quiets in the peace of her presence, her arms, her embrace.

Damnit. He never should have taken that UC assignment.

"It was just a kiss. Not that big of a deal." "Then why are we talking about it?"

He's begging her to say the same thing. This is the equivalent of Lucy's "Right?" when she really needs affirmation.

I mean, he doesn't even have a ready answer when Angela asks... and he deflects. Hard.

"Because, what if it wasn't just a kiss for her?"

See? I'm thinking about her not about me.

"You think Lucy has feelings for you?" "No."

And he means that. Tim Bradford doesn't believe Lucy could have feelings for him, that she could love him, that she would ever want to be with him.

And he's never thought about it seriously before, himself. But now it's getting harder and harder to ignore.

"Then she probably sees it how you do—just a weird thing you had to do for work." "Right."

And that's the part he didn't want affirmed... that Lucy feels nothing romantic for him, and it's all in his head.

That's what he believes. Tim has spent his life thinking he was un-loveable. First, my an abusive father. Then, a wife who abandoned him. A girlfriend who chose her dream job.

And, even now with Ashley, it's all wrong. He hates the beach and he's dating a lifeguard who wants to vacation at beaches.

He's trying to make it work because it's the most stable relationship he's had in a while... but it was always rocky and the cracks are becoming more apparent the more he ruminates on this Lucy situation.

Angela notes every second of Tim's discomfort.

"Timothy... do you have feelings for Lucy?" "No!"

Have we ever heard Tim's voice go that high? I'm struggling to remember, but I laughed aloud the first time I watched that and had to rewind to see the rest of the line, which is really all another rationalization.

"No, I'm dating Ashley, and Lucy is with Chris, and I'm her Superior Officer, so..." "All true. Not what I asked."

Because she doesn't need to ask. Angela knows why they are having this conversation, and Tim's growing increasingly frustrated because he wants to believe he doesn't have feelings for Lucy.

But he does... and it's getting harder to deny.

"What'd I miss?" "Nolan got a Golden Ticket."

Now I know Tim Bradford is in love because there was zero commentary on Lucy being late to roll call!

"Your lady squared away?" "Hell, no. You think we don't got lives of our own waiting around on some mystery gig?"

It's the debut of Lucy's take on Sava. Assertive, just like Nova. Just like Lucy.

"Yo. Davion's money." "Davion's handsy. Get someone else."

This isn't Chenford directly, but I love seeing how Tim's not as on top of the UC thing as Lucy. It's not a ding on Tim. It's simply a reminder that Lucy is a natural at this, and that she can manipulate the situation as needed.

Is it always successful? No. But she knew how to keep Tim and Jackson alive during the op when she was pulled over, and she's trying to spare them getting made here.

"Oh! Looking good, Juicy."

Look, I know it's Aaron saying it, but Tim's reacting, too. Look at his face, taking her in.

And it kills me that we don't get a good reverse on his reaction her thong comment. Kills me. I'd love to see Tim "No, I don't have feelings for Lucy" Bradford not react to the idea of the thong she is currently wearing.

"Airstrip. I thought this job was local." "It's not. That a problem?" "Yeah, that's a problem. I travel with three suitcases minimum. It requires precision to look this good."

Again, it didn't work, but Lucy was quick on that response. Lucy, maybe you should really pursue this UC stuff. You're pretty good at it!

Dim and Juicy Roll Up in Tamara's Car

The music's blaring, and Tim and Lucy have left themselves behind. They've slipped into the skin of two flirty, horny, lust-distracted ne'er-do-wells, and I am here for it.

Look, I know we all laughed at the beginning of their kiss scene because Tim and Lucy were so uncomfortable. Now, those who were still alive by the end of the scene know they are perfectly capable of getting coupley with a little prodding.

"You're late." "Yeah, well, our quickie wasn't so quick."

Lucy winds an arm around Tim's waist, and he wraps an arm around her shoulders, fitting against one another as though they'd done it a thousand times.

Tim is completely in her space, and though the clothes and personalities are borrowed, we get a sneak peek into a future Chenford. They just fit together so well!

"First, cell phones."

Lucy's POUT and how Tim immediately snaps to her. I'm convinced half of the reason he's so bloody convincing during this whole episode is because he's completely under her spell.

Yes, he did well running solo. But can you imagine if he'd run this op with Nyla or Angela? He might've pulled it off, but not to this degree of believability.

Tim and Lucy turn over their cell phones, and then they're right back to one another's embrace as Dim and Juicy forget anyone else is there.

And this is yet another glimpse at Tim and Lucy's future... Because some part of them is aching for this.

Right now, they can live vicariously through Dim and Juicy and pretend it's completely on the level. "It's not really US. It's THEM! We aren't doing anything wrong."

But it's all about how they feel, and that's quickly catching up with them.

Hands. Hands. HANDS!

Look, the scene where Lucy hands Tim a glass of champagne and drapes herself across me is choice. Lucy drapes herself over him, he wraps his arm around her waist, settling on her thigh, and she places her hand over his.

As he talks and his hands move, hers move with him, like a magnetic pull. They never practiced this. Because the second Tim and Lucy let go and give into the couple shtick, it brings out their natural rhythm.

"Rosalind Dyer escaped."

Sava disintegrates and Lucy is left stunning, sitting atop Tim's lap. Tim notes her shift immediately and grabs onto her hand, much as she grabbed onto his when he pulled her over during her first solo UC op. It's comfort.

While Lucy has led the way for their alter-egos, it's now Tim who comes up with the perfect excuse to get her alone (*ahem*) and invites Juicy to join the Mile High Club.

As the baddies roll their eyes at Dim and Juicy's antics, Tim gets a barely-held-together Lucy into the bathroom and away from their gazes.

Let's be real, any one of us would be reeling, too. The one time Lucy and Tim were in the presence of Rosalind Dyer together, that woman had Lucy spinning out in seconds. It took Tim—her fierce protector—to snap her out of it and silence the singing.

Now, that same fierce protector has to snap her out of it so they don't get massacred above the clouds. It's not a time for kid gloves... it's a time to get her head in the game, or cut their losses. He's not willing to risk Lucy's life for an op*.

*Keep this in mind later in the season

"I'm fine. I can do this." "No. No, you're not. I'm pulling the plug as soon as we land."

Because he knows her. She can't play him, anymore. Yes, there was a time she could get away with it, but he's staring in her eyes and he can feel the fear and anxiety flowing off of her.

"No. Look, the stakes are too high. This is our one chance at Madris. The news threw me for a second, but I'm... I'm fine. I can do this."

And while we all know (Tim included), Lucy is far from fine, he believes she can get her head in the game enough to see this through.

And we all know that's because he is helping her. She always knew that when it was too much for her to deal with, he'd be there to help. Maybe he didn't believe it at the time, but Lucy did. And she was right.

"Okay. Lucy, if you change your mind, you just say the word."

Tim is so commanding in this moment. It's not anything he's lording over her, no. But he's reminding us that he's the Sergeant in this situation, and he is not going to let her go down for an op.

"Wait." "What?" "We're supposed to be hooking up in here."

And that doe-eyed boy truly has no idea what's flying his way.

I'm reminded of Cary Grant's line to Audrey Hepburn in Charade. "When you come on, you come on."

That's Lucy. When she's ready for something, she commit to it completely. Whether it's a moment or a lifetime.

And right now, she's committing to this moment of her lips on his lips, her hands on his body, and her mind on something besides the anxiety and fear filling her from Rosalind's escape.

Lucy grabs ahold of Tim's face with both hands and lunges herself at his lips. He reels back, nearly falling onto the counter behind him. But as soon as his brain begins to process what the hell is happening, his hands easily reach for her.

Tim doesn't waste time, this time. He didn't know if he'd have another chance to kiss her, and he wants this more than he'll admit.

Now, in both kisses, Lucy has her arms between them. So, their bodies aren't pressing together, and that makes Tim's hand placement a little more awkward.

Could be an actor choice. Could be a directing choice. Could be a writing choice.

Whatever the reason, Tim's options are more limited. But as his hand runs up her arm, it becomes less timid, and more sure. He pushes back against her kiss and she moves with him, letting him take point. She needs this.

Lucy could have smeared her lipstick on him. She could have rumpled his clothes. But Lucy needs something to center her right now.

She needs another emotion to draw from besides her fear. And while she doesn't know how Tim feels about her, she knows that kissing him feels good, and right, and comforting.

They transition from Lucy sucking on his top lip to his bottom lip, and her hand finally drops away, giving Tim the space to put his hand in what I believe to be his favorite place—her face.

He wants that skin-on-skin connection. He wants the romance. Tim wants every second of this kiss.

Which is why he says, "More" when she pulls away. Turn up the volume and watch that boy's lips. Tim Bradford is GONE, my friends.

And Lucy's shaking. Melissa O'Neil, herself, confirmed that this was a planted callback to Lucy's hands shaking after Tim resuscitated her in the desert. Lucy's a bloody mess, but she wants to make this work.

Oh, what about Tim? Tim's in bloody shock. Each kiss is progressively worse for his ability to shove those emotions back down. Now he's the one who needs to get his head in the game.

Luck Be A Lady Tonight

I love the glances to one another in the car... the subtle check-ins. These two are such soul-mates.

"Hello, back off." "Must be the new skank." "Who are you calling a skank? You better get the hell outta here. If I see you again, I'm gonna rip this janky ass hairpiece outta your head. Hm?"

Tim and Lucy had no idea that Jake would have a connection at this casino, and getting made is the worst thing that could happen. Lucy leaps into action, and I really think Tim is impressed... and a little turned on.

"She's solid."

We've talked before about how Angela is a good detective, but she's going with Tim's gut on this. And Lucy knows the weight of it. She's not going to let Tim down.

"You're really good at this, you know? The whole Undercover thing." "Thank you."

Tim doesn't give out a lot of compliments, but he's seen Lucy in action, today, and she's been amazing on-the-fly.

Sure, he's watched her undercover ops from afar (and that one time he pulled her over), but this is different. He's been in the moment with her and seen her make moves he'd never think to make.

Also, I love that her way to prove to Tim that she could handle Undercover was to fake her feelings for him. And today's op has been all about embracing those feelings under the guise they are fake.

Is that the definition of irony? I'll have to ask my English-teacher husband.

And I find it fascinating that this praise doesn't activate her Praise Kink. Perhaps it's her aching head or the stress of Rosalind, but she seems more... confused by Tim's compliment.

Maybe she thinks he's complimenting her kissing skills... because, yeah, they're fire together.

"Uh, do you mind if I take the first shower?" "No, it's fine. Hey you hungry?" "Yes! I would get some french fries if you're ordering.

Tim looks up just in time to see Lucy's shirt swish off of her, revealing a bare back. Can you imagine the neurons firing off in that man's mind right now? Now he knows she wasn't wearing a bra the whole damn day.

Tim backs up like he's been struck by something heavy and he turns away, trying to get his brain to start firing and his secondary brain to stop revving its engine.

He mutters about fries as he sits on the bed, trying to focus on the menu in front of him.

But half-naked Lucy is right there, and his eyes drift back to the door, just in time to see her whisk past. He looks away, again... Then back, again.

And, let's be real. If he was struggling not to go after her when she was fully clothed on his couch, imagine how hard he's struggling not to imagine Lucy in that shower... and imagine himself with Lucy in that shower...

And... maybe y'all need a cold shower by now. You good? Good.

But Tim Bradford is far from good. He's so far from good that he turns on sports, and rather than getting lost in the game and upset about any interruptions, he's begging the game to take him away from the thoughts running through his head.

Because he never thought it would come to this. He never thought she would kiss him again. He never thought he'd be in a position where he would have this beautiful woman right there who might possibly feel what he's feeling.

And so Tim Bradford does something I never thought I'd see him do... he takes a leap.

"What?" "Do you want to talk about it?" "About what?" "The airplane bathroom... your apartment... Look, I don't know, call me crazy, but it just doesn't feel like pretend."

Remember I said this episode was heartbreaking? Here's why...

Lucy thinks Tim is calling her out on her feelings for him.

Tim thinks there's something between them and he wants to know if she has feelings for him.

And because Lucy feels caught... she deflects.

"It's an intimate act. We'd have to be dead inside for it to not trigger something, right? It's basic biology."

Tim Bradford took a leap... and then he took a fall. And it kills me every time to watch his face as he takes the rejection. Lucy doesn't want me.

Oh, poor Tim Bradford. He's been rejected over and over by people in his life. So often, he's the one who finds himself broken because nobody sticks around for him. Nobody puts in the effort for him.

It doesn't take a traumatic childhood to make a person feel unworthy of love, but Tim has that and more.

And Lucy doesn't even know how he feels. She has no idea. This was a speech uttered to cover her own growing feelings. But the unintended consequence is that she hurts Tim.

"So you're saying it's not a big deal. Doesn't mean anything." "Right?"

It's a confirmation of what Angela told him at the beginning... Lucy doesn't want me.

And it's not that his whole life was hitched on this notion, but it's yet another rejection in a long, long string of rejections. And Lucy doesn't even know that's what she's done.

The phone rings, deflecting the conversation, and a dejected Tim picks up.

"I'm just alone with Lucy in the hotel room" "Uh-oh."

Literally the last thing he needs to hear right now. But, Angela doesn't know he was just struck down. She's all for some Chenford Sexy Time.

"Don't do anything I wouldn't do."

Tim slams the phone down faster than the remote when the Rams toss an interception. Lucy rushes back to the bathroom, and the moment she goes, Tim shakes his head. It hurts.

Tim took a leap. And Tim fell. And now Tim has to add it to his layers of scars.

"Remind me not to take a guy out while I'm wearing a robe. I showed him the entire world right now."

First off, I love that Tim was the damsel in distress in this scene that needed Lucy's rescuing. Second, I believe this is when she starts to think there's something physical between them.

Let's be clear. Lucy has feelings for Tim, but she doesn't think Tim has feelings for her. She thinks he's attracted to her, though. I mean, look how she watches him as he shakes his head. And while feelings are tough for Lucy (more than she'll admit), sex is easy.

"I can nott wait to get out of these clothes." "Yeah. I'm not gonna miss that hair." "I kind of like yours." "Thank you... thank you for walking me up." "No problem."

Let's be honest... Tim is walking Lucy up because he knows as soon as he walks away, they won't have the excuse to be this close together, again. And even though she rejected him (in his mind), he wants to be close to her.

"So, I guess this is it. Tomorrow we are back to being us." "Right. And everything that happened undercover, we will just leave behind." "Right. What happens undercover stays undercover."

I'd shake my head at Tim's comment, but the boy's doing a good job shaking his head at himself. "Why did I say that?" Lucy, however, is ready to test a theory... about Tim's attraction to her.

"You know, in a sense, since we haven't been debriefed, we're still undercover." "Yeah, I guess you're right."

Tim doesn't know where she's going, but Lucy offers a pointed glance at her apartment door. Tim doesn't bite.

Why? Because he's ruled it out as a possibility. He doesn't believe there is any scenario where this is really happening. She already rejected him, right?

Lucy registers his lack of comprehension, though she doesn't realize the reason.

"Do you want to come in?"

Tim is flabbergasted. He doesn't believe what he's hearing, and that man literally short circuits at the realization that this moment is happening. Heck, I was short-circuiting. I thought the fans were making something up when they started tweeting about him accepting an invite to go inside.

Like, is this happening!?

Tim cycles through shock, acceptance, fear, and ultimately lands on right and wrong. He is dating Ashley. And he's not a cheat.

"I shouldn't."

It's not that he doesn't want to. But for so many reasons, he shouldn't go in. Lucy nods, accepting his answer. For her, this isn't a personal rejection (because she doesn't even think that's on the table). It's a sexual rejection, and that's fine.

But as she opens her door and walks in, the light from the door strikes Tim's face. When he looks back, he sees light... and Lucy.

And much as he wants the full relationship... this is what she is offering here and now. And who knows if he'll ever have the chance to be with her, again?

There are no thoughts of Chris and Ashley, right now. The two of them are looking at one another—Lucy on one side of the threshold and Tim on the other—and they are considering this moment and nothing further.

So twice in one episode... Tim Bradford takes a leap.

He crosses the threshold into her apartment, and she closes the door, sealing them in. Tim's eyes wander to Lucy, hesitancy rushing through him. "Should I start? Will she start?"

Lucy has twice jumped the man, but even in her state of wanting him more than thinking about right-and-wrong, she offers him a drink.

"I'm good."

Because up until this point, he thought this was impossible. And now that it is possible, he wants to be completely clear-headed so he doesn't misinterpret anything.

Lucy moves to set her purse down and we finally see... Chris. Lucy opens her mouth as Tim looks to the sky and curses it for this f'ed up situation... only for Lucy to realize Chris is bleeding out.

Tim calls it in without hesitation, and the last thing we see is a terrified Lucy calling out to her greatest comfort (even if she's too scared to admit it)—Tim.

Looking into the Future (since this is a REWIND Meta)

Now... am I glad they didn't start their relationship like this? Hell, yeah. I love that they had the time to step back from this and get to a point where they realized they both wanted it all.

It's not about sex. Yes, that's a part of it. But, this is about two souls crying out for one another and not yet speaking the same language.

They've spent years learning, but that type of love is a lifelong pursuit... and you have to get on the same page, first.

Lucy and Tim aren't there, yet, in this episode. Yes, this episode pushes them closer to one another and those moments to come. It's essential to the development of their relationship. It's another step on their path...

As always, thanks for reading (and persuading me to do this... I do love writing Metas and Chenford make it easy!). Hope to see you on the next!

[beheworthy]

Thor Love and Thunder deleted scenes - 1 & 2  These 2 scenes show that Zeus visits Thor and Jane in the hospital to give Thor the thunderbolt. He advises him on how to use energy for thunderbolt and gives directions for Eternity. Jane makes the choice to go with Thor. Out of other options, they use the goats to travel there.

It's nice to see Thor get some fatherly interaction and behave like his former self: the smile at 'I have many sons', not speaking much but actually listening, being intelligent enough to know what was said in Roman. Little things.

However, these scenes show us an entirely different version of the film. If we go by them, Thor never 'killed' Zeus and left Omnipotent City on possibly good terms with him, given how he casually strolled directly to Jane's hospital bed to talk to Thor and they're all cool with each other.

The Shadow Realm confrontation might have happened as is because Jane is injured and Valkyrie is also out of the picture entirely. Thor is about to go face Gorr alone w no Valkyrie or Jane or Thunderbolt or Stormbreaker or even Mjolnir and not knowing how to reach Eternity perhaps (whatever could go wrong?). But with Zeus giving him the thunderbolt and Jane joining in, the entire climax of the film changes again.

Rant incoming:

Sh*t like this makes me wonder do they shoot 13 different versions of everything and 15 different movies, hoping to find the actual film in editing? That's such a massive waste of the cast and crew's time and effort. These aren't even deleted scenes. These are alternate universes from movies that could have been. Multiverses, if you will.

Deleted scenes are fun additional details the audience could do without. Like Thor returning the mug he broke or Frigga berating/begging Odin to end Thor's exile. Or they're a different/alternate version of existing scenes that may change the context of some things in the story. Like Odin freakin’ letting Frigga die. You could or could not add them but at the end of the day, they don't make a difference to the eventual story.

But in Thor4, if you add Zeus visiting the hospital, you gotta scrap out the entire confrontation at the Omnipotent City. If you add Jane just choosing to ignore Thor's heartfelt request to stay at the hospital and Thor not freaking reacting to it as well (??), you gotta change the entire climax again. I hope to god in the multiverse where this scene of Zeus showing fatherly affection to Thor exists, the scene from the theatrical cut of him ripping Thor’s clothes for fun, looking at him creepily and saying ‘pretty boy’, and inviting him to the o*gy doesn’t. Go to jail, Marvel.

I just-- it doesn't make sense. What even was the original story? Was there a story at all? This is important because Thor is the only character in the MCU to get the elusive 4th film. If you're going to continue a series against the norm, it should be because you really have a story to tell. Like Mad Max: Fury Road, Dexter: New Blood, and John Wick: Chapter 4.

Though I don't think producer Kevin Feige cares much about things like core story and character progression because Thor brings in the $$$. And director Taika Waititi doesn't either because he shot over 4 hours' worth of movie that he can surely cut out a theatrical version from - with every possibility on the cards, whatever the test audience reacts well to.

It's the cast and crew that are the real victims of this methodical merciless studio filmmaking. It's been well-documented that the VFX artists working on Marvel projects have been heavily overworked. A lot of their hard work could have been saved if there was a more definitive story structure so over half the footage they tirelessly worked on wouldn't end up on the cutting room floor. To add insult to injury, Waititi went on to mock them for giving their sweat, blood, and tears to his project. Classy.

Poor Christian Bale shaved his head to play Gorr, only to have most of his scenes cut from the film. Natalie Portman also did physical training for her role.

And Chris did the most extreme training he has ever done for this film. He already did excruciating training for the extreme physique as is. Add to it the dehydration for the shirtless scenes and not eating meat for kissing scenes - just willingly making life difficult for himself. Could have saved him a lot of torturous training by not shooting 13 different versions of every scene out of which 12 won't make it to the final film.

I'm aware that shooting movies works like that - you shoot different versions of scenes that don't make it to the final edit. They signed up for shaving their head and dying training to maintain the impossible physique. All I'm saying is that it's sad that it's all in service of material that just doesn't do them justice. It’s all vapid corporate thinking with no vision.

[tdciago]

Having read your and @thefutureiswhat's season 5 finale theory I'm curious to know your thoughts on this shot:

Is it possible that one of these potential endings could involve both Dot and Roy making it out of the farm during the events of the raid and he, with nothing else left to lose at that point, attempts to take her again? She's wearing different clothes so I'm betting that she's home, or at least on her way there. Plus her seemingly shocked expression and the lighting suggests that something's happened, possibly something burning...?

What do you think? Could this be the ending scenario that "Dot prepares biscuits for"? (Maybe even the her poisoning him theory?)

Sending you both the ask because you each have really compelling ideas and speculations.

it's funny, because I was just thinking about this scene and how we probably aren't going to see it, because Dot is clearly wearing different clothes.

Your suggestion of how we might still see it is excellent, but the one thing working against it is time.

The run time for 5.10 is 49 minutes, which seems impossibly short. That's why the idea of 3 alternate endings being strung together as one continuous narrative seems more plausible than showing each ending separately (assuming there actually are three). It also fits with the way the story has been told so far, with strange inconsistencies between scenes and episodes.

I think there was a tremendous amount of footage left on the cutting room floor this season, maybe too much. There are also a lot of tantalizing clues that deserve to be paid off, including Roy saying he'd let Dot go if she begged to stay and meant it. We also have things like the flamethrower; the tank and Wink's foreshadowing of a tank battle; the windmill blades that look like matches; the Trojan horse; all the stag imagery and a guy named Buck Holt, which means "forest deer"; Witt Farr and his 100-pound backpack; Oedipus and the right of way, etc.

From what some actors have indicated, the finale is crazy. So maybe they can pull off including this scene, which always felt to me like Bluebeard's wife discovering the bodies of all the previous wives. But we've basically covered that ground.

Roy did say the options for killing the tick were suffocation or fire. "The Tiger" also mentions suffocation. And Roy is covering Dot's mouth.

I think there is going to be a huge potential for fanfic about this season, because of all the stuff we didn't get to see, some of which was teased in promos but never happened. There are a lot of gaps to be filled. I hope we do get to see this somehow.

Meanwhile, that new spoiler regarding Roy has me thinking of the biscuits in another context.