#spn finale fuckery

[insanesonofabitch]

You know, as a (kind of) new fan, I barely know shit about the full spn experience of watching shit unfold in real time—which obviously took years. When I was scrolling through Nov 5th tag, destielgate and all that, I found a fairly huge amount of people shitting on Andrew Dabb, especially for writing the finale. And I got curious about this infamous writer guy, like what else did he write?

Then I went to Google and saw that he wrote What’s Up Tiger Mommy. Then Hunteri Heroici. Clip Show. Road Trip. Bloodlines??? Stairway to Heaven?????? The Things We Left Behind????????

The Prisoner???????????

All Along The Watchtower?????????????

Lost & Found??????????????????

Like obviously, none of these episodes are perfect. But these includes HUGE destiel scenes—like pivotal moments that greatly affects the relationship and it’s development and how the audience view it. And so much of these are obviously, blatantly romantic. As explicit as it can be. Like the direct canon couple parallels? At least THREE times? You’re telling me this man is responsible for The Lovers Quarrel ft. Suffering Sam in season 8? “I’ll watch over you”? The Dean/Cas - David/Violet parallel???? Cas’ deleted personal heaven???? “Don’t lose it over one man”????? Cas giving up his Angel army for one guy?????? The Dinner Date?????? The Sam/Jess - Dean/Cas - Claire/Kaia parallel??????? The climax of Cain/Colette - Dean/Cas Mark of Cain plot line??????? “You know, I always thought I could be a good dancer if I wanted to be”???????? The PURGATORY REUNION?????????? The start of THE FUCKING WIDOWER ARC?????????????

The Fucking. Widower. Arc. The stark contrast between that and Cas being barely mentioned in 15x19 and 15x20???????? Listen—and I’m just spitballing here—but what if this guy isn’t the fucking problem. You cannot convince me that someone who wrote all that, who contributed to all that, does not fucking see it…

…oh my fucking god. What the fuck were in those omitted scenes?

[samsrowena]

i know we talk about this episode all the time because it really does foreshadow the end in a horrifying way but i am just feeling so sick about the fact that we see this before chuck writes his first ending:

and then we see this after he rewrites it to be even worse:

like how is this not just a blatant call to attention of network meddling

[mybrainproblems]

yeah, true facts: the finale isn't shorter than average. even if you remove the fourth wall break it's 41:05

i have an absolutely sick obsession with this episode

[destielfandomlore]

Important info for navigation/submissions

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Cat 1b: primary source part 2 - live transcriptions from cons/meet and greets, accounts of personal experiences, things of somewhat questionable veracity

Cat 1c: primary source part 3 - descriptions of things that happened in canon but offscreen

Cat 2: secondary source - interpretations or collections of primary source material

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Cat 4: inferences/speculation/conspiracy theories (must have some level of circumstantial evidence however)

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Important Note:

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[hornystiel]

listen. listen. yes the finale would've been better in almost any other scenario we've been seeing for the past i'm-scared-to-say-how-much-time-has-passed months. well it'd have been worse with jimmy there but i digress. in ANY way. dean is still dead, his path ending on such a note after all those years is a huge fuck you to everyone who was associating themselves with his struggles.

fuck your heaven i wanted them be happy on earth

[deancasforcutie]

waiting 10-30 years for the Supernatural writers’ rebellion to be vindicated in the tell-all documentary and every queer studies class isn’t enough I need to be on the right side of history Now

[angelsdean]

just realized when y'all say s16 or a movie you guys are thinking like...blockbuster in theaters movie and not a shitty little made for tv movie the way shows would have a two hr special and call it a "movie". like, yeah sorry i really Do Not think spn would translate well to The Big Screen and cannot imagine a continuation thing like this being something that would show in theaters.

it's either gonna be a s16 / miniseries type thing or like, a 2 hr longer episode situation. and i'd rather they have more time to address everything and untangle the finale fuckery than have them try to cram everything into an extended episode type thing

[killerbees-hehe]

HEY SPN FANS

I’m making a presentation called What the FUCK Was Up with Supernatural and it’s gonna be an in depth analysis about all the nonsense caused by our favorite nightmare show.

Some things in including;

The fuckery on set (Jared gets stabbed with a real knife, the 65,000 live bees, Jensen falls on real glass, crew member gets struck by lightning, etc.)

Writers strike 2008 -> God

Misha accidentally gets stuck on the show for 11 years

The CW’s desperate attempts to kill Castiel for 11 years

The inherent misogyny -> accidental Destiel pipeline

The influence on fanfiction tropes

Misha has to come out as straight (not technically caused by spn but worth mentioning)

J2 Twitter war

Jackles thinks he is actually Dean

(All this gets its own section ⬇️)

✨November 5✨

The Destiel news meme

Canon in Spanish, aka Rouge/Not Rouge Translator

The forbidden knowledge of the final season

‘Release the Tapes’

Destielgate 1 and 2

WHAT ELSE SHOULD BE INCLUDED I FEEL LIKE IM MISSING A LOT PLEASE HELP???

[shinelikethunder]

kinda fascinated by the mechanics of SPN 4x03 In the Beginning as a time travel episode, not in terms of paradoxes or scifi handwaving but just. narrative structure. because there's a thing that happens in some time travel stories, of hitting a point where you just... sit back. disengage from the stakes. let it wash over you. because on some level you've realized they've broken the timeline so definitively that there HAS to be a reset button coming.

and 4x03 edges further and further into this territory, as people find out things they shouldn't know and then the bodies start dropping. and finally the demon snaps John Winchester's neck and you're like "ok. cool. clearly a bunch of this never happened and is going to be put back." because it'd be unthinkable to keep it, right? that's just - not what HAPPENS. it makes everything that WILL happen impossible. it cannot stand.

except it does. all of it happened. none of it will be made to unhappen. if any of it gets reversed, it won't be by time-travel fuckery but by other, more desperate measures.

and the final effect this produces is to put the viewer in Mary's shoes. when the demon tells her that for just one of these things, the unthinkable one, the one that pushed the entire universe irreparably out of alignment, she CAN have a reset button, and the deal won't even cost her soul... that's when it fully sinks in. that THIS is "the beginning," and the rest of the carnage we've just witnessed had been the backdrop to it all along. that by the time Mary agrees to the deal that seals the family curse, we've already been led to understand why it could never have been otherwise. that the magnitude of her grief in that moment has been made OUR grief, our denial, our disorientation at a universe shaken loose from its rightful axis, our shocked and bewildered protectiveness over what could've - should've - must've - been.

[seenthisepisode]

when i tell you spn finale conspiracies bring me to life i am not lying, i am barely alive now with major flu and fever but all it takes is one post about the finale fuckery and my eyesight is suddenly focused, my breathing is on point, my memory is working full speed and i feel like i could fist fight rober singer any time

[insanesonofabitch]

Them not leaving any trace of Cas except for the handprint makes me SO FUCKING INSANE because they know. they know. they know that if they were so careless as to leave even a coat for Dean to properly mourn and host a funeral with it would end up becoming much more explicitly romantic AND RECIPROCAL than even the previous widower arcs in seasons 7, 12 and 13, which definitely goes beyond what they want their audience (the conservative audience) to see. And the sole reason they even killed Cas and then later on Dean in the first place is BECAUSE they DO NOT want to show that queer story having any sort of satisfying conclusion and finality and for their american action fantasy hero to show any sign of reciprocation or even proper acknowledgment of his best friend’s feelings for him to the said conservative audience! And the only reason they even allowed Cas to leave that bloody handprint was because Dean mourning and dealing with it is much more easier to brush off and leave off-screen (which they did) than Dean dealing with Cas’ lifeless corpse in the bunker would be, because having a dead body would prompt the audience to wonder how they dealt with it and where is he buried or where did they spread his ashes which would force them to show Dean mourning AND THEY DO NOT WANT TO SHOW DEAN MOURNING. BECAUSE IT COULD AND WOULD SHOW EXPLICIT RECIPROCATION FROM DEAN’S SIDE AND I’m going to tear someone’s throat with my teeth

[samsrowena]

there was a job application on his desk....

[mybrainproblems]

a non-exhaustive list of timing marks from 15x20

00:00 - then/now segment

00:48 - teaser start

04:00 - pie fest

05:45 - robert singer laughs in the background

15:47 - jenny? jenny who??

16:42 - fight start

17:12 - stabby pokey

18:04 - sam is gonna call an ambulance and dean stops him

24:29 - dean finally shuffles unceremoniously off this mortal coil

total monologue: 7min, 12sec

30:24 - heaven

34:02 - driving & sam montage START

38:57 - driving & sam montage END

41:05 - initial credits

my animal brain shakes in fear at the fourth wall break

41:48 - "aaand... cut!"

[aishitara]

what did jackles do???? what did he do???

oof, at this point, what hasn't he done? okay, so, first i must gesture to ::all of JIB:: that con was absolutely unhinged. A+ cockles content, but also jensen said some really lovely and thoughtful things about Dean, and his relationship to Cas, which i believe is super relevant because me and my small group of friends who suffer from Winchester Derangement Syndrome are 99.9% sure The Winchesters is not what it is on its face, and is in fact jensen's own fix-it for the series finale of spn. which in and of itself is amazing. boy really said 'i fucking hated that ending, gonna go write a new one' like the (secret) fangirl he is. this week's episode of TW (1x12 "The Tears of a Clown") felt so lovingly directed at all of those folks (obviously, myself included XD) who've been clowning about destiel from the beginning, and tbh the resolution to the motw made it feel like the message of the episode was: telling the truth turns clowning into reality. i intend to edit this response to include a frame from one of the panels at JIB, because someone asked what the reunion between Dean and Cas would look like, and jensen gave what seems to be, these days, a very jensen answer which was to answer seriously and then pass it off as a joke (like the ily --- like a bro thing from VanCon back in october of '22). but i think the smile on his face screams "i know something y'all don't know" and it has sent me. i could also talk about the very destiel-flavored lyrics from the newest Radio Company album, too, but i don't know if tumblr posts have a word limit 😂 lol thanks for asking and sorry if this is more long-winded than you were expecting. you were my very first ask and i may have gotten carried away! 😅 eta 03.02.23: please ignore my fuckery i forgot how tumblr works for a hot minute

[catsconflictscopicsandchamomile]

ok so here's why throwing Fae Lore into spn makes a revival/continuation possible

Here's the setup:

-"Blurrywife" is a Faerie, specifically a malevolent/vampiric one, definitely a Succubus type. The mimes are her human thralls, hence why they don't act like normal vampires.

-Baby, yes the car, is ALSO a Faerie, specifically a kind of shapeshifter called a Pooka. John captured her in the early 80s, and, being John Winchester, never told his kids about this.

-Chuck Won. duh???

-Jack is, and was always destined to be, the next Jack O' The Lantern, and after Chuck threw his flaming corpse out Heaven, he's been ruling his own spoopy little candy-coated afterlife. pumpkin boi

Here's the timeline:

-Blurrywife & Mime Crew are kidnapping kids, likely for The Fae's 7-year tithe of souls to Hell (a thing that exists in the lore), when the Winchesters show up. Sam & Dean, as usual, have NO idea how to identify or fight Fae, and get their asses handed to them, with Dean falling to some weird Gaelic cold-iron magic fuckery (points to Blurrywife & crew for figuring out how to fight with iron despite being unable to touch it. 10/10 fuck these guys tho fr)

-Sam, alone and grieving, is an easy target and she picks him off before he even gets to the car, taking (something close to) Eileen's form and trapping him in a dreamscape, similar to how Djinn attack in spn.

-Sam, Dean AND Baby (there's def some Fae Drama going on there, yikes) have been stuck the Fae Realms for THREE YEARS as of Nov 2023.

-Dean and Baby escaped at some point, staying with Jack for a bit before running off to the 1970s like a dumbass and getting EVERYONE, including Jack and Bobby (why is Bobby even here??? HOW DID BOBBY'S GHOST GET STUCK IN THE FAE REALMS WHAT DID HE *DO*) recaptured.

-Sam has had it much worse, being drained to a white-haired husk of his former self and left for dead within a few days/months. DJ is half-faerie, raised in the fae realms, and could be 3 years old or 50, who knows. I don't like thinking abt how he happened.

-Here's the setup for the continuation:

Dean (fairly intact besides the cursed stab wound in his back) escapes with Sam (nearly dead, white-haired, displaying more or less the typical signs of someone who was taken & drained of life by The Fae) and stumbles into Charlie's safehouse. the Fae Arc can continue from this point, w Baby's true nature being revealed, Blurrywife as a major antagonist/BBEG, DJ going from possible threat -> clearly a well-meaning and very brave kid -> newest Winchester family member who Sam fully accepts as his son (plus s4-cas-esque moments as DJ tries to adapt to living on Earth. DJ ilysm but most cars aren't sentient and you can't bring your longbow to community college)

also Cas is still in The Empty, and Jack & Bobby are still captured, so that's some major plot points right there

Destiel is canon.

...anyway, this is all still pretty convoluted, but it allows for:

-15x20 to have been "not real" without being retconned

-DJ to exist without either setting the continuation ~30 yrs in the future (how would that work), or repeating spnwin's time-travel-kid-ex-machina (that's just not good writing I'm sry)

-spn finally doing something w The Fae (& related lore) besides one-off eps

-human!impala as main character

-explanations of weird shit in the finale (rebar, vamp-mimes, etc)

-collective fandom catharsis at Blurrywife's bitch ass

-the full horror potential of a faceless woman in a long dress standing ominously in the corner while time blurs forward around you and you age to death in five minutes

-some VERY fun metacommentary & crossover easter eggs if you use certain bits of Fae lore

-still works w my other big finale theory/revival idea/if-they-dont-do-this-i-will-be-so-pissed, which is the whole Deanmon 2.0 thing. but that's a post unto itself.

(also yes. making Blurrywife a djinn IS simpler and requires 0 new lore and makes perfect sense in canon. however, I hate how djinn are portrayed in spn. it feels vaguely racist and makes me uncomfy to write/read. so um that's why I didn't do that)

[deancasforcutie]

me talking about cursed spngate knowledge you have to be thiiiiiis👆 unwell about it to even hear about