I mean Neil said once that the sequel involved Jesus arriving in America on a plane with secret service agents, and the S2 opening sequence shows a plane, so I'm... fairly confident that he's an adult? Jesus died when he was like 33 right
afternoon anon!!!✨ see i recall this (ask on neil's page?) and remember the response but cannot for the life of me find it anywhere (and im pretty good at Finding Stuff), do you - or anyone else reading for that matter - have a link to this? just so i can save it for future reference.
now, i hope you don't mind if i do this, but i would like to use this opportunity to parse out a more coherent rationale on the second coming, if that's okay? yeah? cool.
(previous incarnation of this theory).
thing is that the premise of the baby swap in s1 is based on the omen, right? takes at least a huge chunk of inspiration from that as the origin of how the antichrist came into the story. but it goes wrong, obviously, and there's a third baby thrown in the mix. makes a cursory wave to the omen, but isn't a carbon copy of it.
now i can't help but feel that narratively it would make sense to bookend this and have the second coming be a bit bollocksed up too. seems to be a theme in GO. and actually, when i thought about it (with extreme bias, granted, because im chomping at the bit on this theory), the second coming was potentially already fucked up anyway.
now, disclaimer time -
i completely get that people will look to the bible in reference to parsing out the second coming (or indeed any other theory). obviously i do too, for references to certain verses etc. in order to draw the relevant parallels. but there are multiple instances in GO where it is based on the bible or other texts, but doesn't follow it exactly; how GO portrayed the book of job, for example. it takes these texts, and distorts or reimagines them slightly or completely.
the way i see it, we are reading/watching GO as if this is in fact the true telling of those texts, as if (and not trying to be diminutive here) the bible is an inaccurate telling of GO, not the other way around - because, of course, we're seeing GO from the angel and demon that were 'actually there', so to speak.
im not saying that this - or any - of my theories are indisputably correct, far from it. but to me, with the information i have from the narrative as first source, and then looking at the referenced texts that inspired it, what i come up with, and write, is what makes sense to me. and it might make sense because it would be poetically apt, is in-keeping with how i interpret the characters, and/or is just plain funny or ironic (GO is after all, a comedy).
so whilst i fully anticipate people to duly correct me on how it all goes down in the bible (as they should, i love being educated!!!), please know that im not trying to deliberately misinterpret anything, but more trying to think outside the box, from the viewpoint of the GO story itself, and what direction would make the most sense in which it will reimagine these texts.
- exit disclaimer.
anyway! theory time!
so we have the imagery from the s2 sequence of the "thy kingdom come" plane, and this is obviously a reference to the resurrection as you've said, anon: that jesus arrives by plane. i truly love this imagery because if we take matthew 24:36 (KJV): "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.", the concept that in the great plan the date and time might finally be revealed in the form of a flight number, airport, and ETA is frankly hilarious to me. furthermore, "cometh with clouds" (revelation, 1:7 KJV) being reimagined as a literal plane landing again sets up the comedic backdrop so well.
now wherever the plane lands, whether from the US or to the US (again, don't have the original neil answer to refer to, but going based on your ask, anon, it's the latter), it regardless involves americans. this is where i feel it would be a perfect narrative symmetry opportunity to refer back to s1/the book, and reintroduce the dowlings.
and you might be wondering, "well no because GO set up the dowlings to be involved only insomuch that they were meant to be custodians of the antichrist - why would they also be involved in the second coming?" well, i wondered this too. the only conclusion i can come to, frankly, is GO!god having a very warped, twisted and ineffable sense of humour. they saw what satan had planned for the dowlings in inadvertently raising the antichrist, possibly did a bit of shifting around in the mystical threads, and decided that actually - just to throw in the wildcard of chaos - they should instead be the bearers of the second coming. this degree of mind-boggling ineffability, to me, would be comedically on-brand.
regardless; whilst just a theory, the whole thing makes sense to me - that in any case, the dowlings are going to make a reappearance. and with them, or on his own (if we follow the biblical telling that jesus was resurrected as he was from the crucifixion, at age 33yo, and therefore would suggest a timeskip from s2, but this isn't necessarily guaranteed - ie: might not be how GO chooses to portray it!), comes warlock. now we know that warlock was meant to be the antichrist, before crowley and the nuns managed to bugger it all up.
but heaven wouldn't necessarily know that its the dowlings arriving, right? presumably they'd just all gather on the tarmac awaiting the arrival, and lmao SIKE, it's bloody warlock. heaven hasn't met warlock, and therefore still think he's in fact jesus resurrected... but aziraphale has met him. he helped bloody raise him. and he knows now that he is essentially a normal kid/adult (albeit a very stuck-up one) and definitely not the second coming.
well then, if jesus was meant to be on that plane, according to the great plan, a plane being used by the dowlings... then why isn't it warlock? well, because the dowlings' actual baby isn't warlock. lets go back to the baby swap in the book/s1:
*apols, editing to correct this somewhat because it isn't quite right and lateral thinking is not my strong suit*
ANTICHRIST was meant to go to: the DOWLINGS. instead, went to: the YOUNGS. this is Adam.
YOUNG BABY was meant to go to: stay with the YOUNGS, but got mixed up. instead, went to: the DOWLINGS. this is Warlock.
DOWLING BABY was meant to go to: adoption/something nefarious instead, and indeed did. this is... Greasy Johnson.
and i love this for all sorts of reasons. now im lifting this next bit, essentially, from another ask of mine, but to keep things all in one place:
"greasy is posed as the antithesis of adam/antichrist, has a gang surrounding him that you could infer are loyal disciples, and is a mirror to adam in that adam on the whole seems to be a well-adjusted and morally-upstanding young boy.
i further think the fact that adam is the antichrist put against greasy being the second coming is a well positioned reflection on the nature vs nurture argument. ultimately adam grew up in a largely loving and supportive environment, and as the literal son of satan, you'd expect his nature, the circumstances of his birth, to rule out every other influence.
ultimately it does for a short time, but adams narrative iirc is that it is reflective of his desire to save the world... he wanted to get rid of things that were Wrong, and naively (he is still an 11-year old boy after all) thought that destroying the world and restarting it would do just that. his friends however reinforce in him that destruction and reparation are not the same thing, and so his upbringing, the nurture, wins.
greasy? we don't know a lot about him, only that he is a bully and represents the opposite of adam and the them... [and there exists] the whole [sic] analogy that greasy and the johnsonites vs adam and the them are meant to represent the hell vs heaven war..."
and then we have this small, relatively innocuous detail from the book:
as i said, possibly something of nothing. but the deliberate wording of 'breeding the fish', which is left out of s1, is - i like to think - a bit of a clue.
and before anyone comes for me on this, i am aware that this is based practically on fuck all of jack shit; im painfully aware of that. im aware that it deliberately misinterprets certain passages (not going to do the soapbox speech again, promise), but i just like to have fun. i honestly do not care if this is wrong; whatever happens in s3 should and will be better than anything i can come up with. yes, it's fun to get a prediction or speculation correct, of course it is, but it's not the endgame here. i get that others will have conflicting schools of thought, see things differently, or just plain think it's crap - that's okay! but, if that's the case, just move on from this post with a shake of your head. im not here to do anything other than have a good time, lads (gn)✨💓
edit 21/08: additional reading because now i feel vindicated: here from amuseoffyre, and my tags on this post too.
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Okay so I want to get all my good omens s2 thoughts out there in one big swoop and try to sound coherent… and ofc I’ll later post exclusively what I loved because there is A Lot to love about this show!
I largely loved the first four episodes. I thought they were amazing, there was fantastic chemistry and humor between Aziraphale and Crowley. The back in time sequences were brilliant and slightly darker than they were in season 1! I felt they portrayed Heaven in a more critical light than we’ve seen before… ex: Heaven condoning the murder of children, messing Job’s life over a silly bet, kicking Crowley out for asking several questions.
I think the back in time sequences really showed Aziraphale’s struggle with his desire to follow Heaven/God because they're the Good Guys verses what Heaven/God is actually telling him to do being straight up bonkers. We see the first time he lies to other angels to save Job’s children, but this deed ends up in direct violation of God’s orders, so there’s this internal moral conflict here…
It was amazing to see angels and demons try to understand humanity and fail, versus Aziraphale and Crowley who are well-versed in humanity and their traditions and have the upper hand in this regard.
I love love LOVE Jim. I mean, Gabriel. I mean, James! The dynamic between him, Crowley, and Aziraphale was amazing! You have this horrible, completely awful boss who’s narcissistic and self-centered and completely detached from any form of human emotion… and you wipe his slate clean and stick him with two characters who think he’s a mega level asshole and watch their interactions unfold. I think Aziraphale promising to protect Gabriel and then upholding that promise despite Gabriel being a douche is so sweet, so in character… and Crowley going along with it even though he hates Gabriel with all his heart. And the way Crowley struggles to reconcile and accept this version of Gabriel with the one he’s seen in the past was very interesting to watch. Gabriel learning the alphabet, dusting the bookshop because he wants to be helpful, Gabriel jumping out the window because Crowley tells him this is how he can help Aziraphale really sold it for me— now, without his memory, Gabriel is kind and nice and just wholesomely curious. I think I would have liked to see more Gabriel-as-Jim scenes before he got his memory back, which brings me to what I don’t like about the show, namely, the last episode.
(HRHSHSHSBSZHSH)
So, the ultimate episode has the big resolution— it’s revealed Gabriel decided against a second Armageddon after his blossoming romance with Beelzebub, then he gets his memory back and the two of them go off together to live a life of romance and love and all that on Proxima Centauri, presumably.
And.
Just.
It’s too neat. It’s too tidy. Crowley and Aziraphale had all of creation to alleviate their prejudices and fall in love *cough they just don’t know it yet cough*. It’s not believable to me that Gabriel and Beelzebub would fall in love in such a short period of time based on such minimal interactions, I feel like love (a very human thing) is something pre-Jim Gabriel would look down on altogether. I wish we had more of Jim. I would, frankly, be fine without seeing the return of Gabriel altogether… or at least some scenes that show Gabriel as being grateful to Aziraphale and Crowley for hiding him out and risking destruction just for him…
I don’t know. I think that end was wrapped up too neatly and too tightly. I’d be happy if Gabriel never got his memory back this season, and we see the continuation of Jim in season 3. Why build a character up only to have him disappear just when we start to like him?
I didn’t care for Nina and Maggie. I thought they were superfluous in every sense of the word. I feel like their characters had a lot of potential in the beginning and then the plot just sort of ended up… not doing anything with their characters? Nina is in a maybe emotionally toxic relationship with Lindsay, but then that ends and we don’t even get to meet Lindsay. Maggie’s character has no development except for her love of Nina and her owning a record shop. And the two of them giving advice to Crowley at the end to just talk to Aziraphale just didn’t do it for me.
I was crushed when Aziraphale was asked to rejoin heaven and did so immediately and with open arms— it’s like that scene at the bandstand all over again, when Aziraphale said, there is no our side. He still believes in and wants to follow Heaven, whereas Crowley made his peace with being on his own side (not Heaven or Hell’s) many years ago.
So, essentially: I loved the show, but I’m not satisfied with the conclusion to Gabriel’s story or Maggie/Nina’s involvement, which sorta soured it for me. I do love the show! Especially every back in team featurette with Crowley and Aziraphale, any and all Crowley and Aziraphale interactions in the present today together and with Gabriel, the major ship vibes this season was pumping out! It was funny and lovely and aside from the imo lackluster Gabriel resolution, all around great!
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Making friends with writers or anyone with an interest in art or music or stuff like that is always so weird because I walk around saying I’m a fan but then I meet this person who also likes it and suddenly I once again realize I really don’t know what I’m talking about!
It’s like…. When you enjoy something you don’t tend to think about the fact that you haven’t yet finished it, or you haven’t heard of this other popular thing that’s a continuation of it.
But sometimes you meet someone who you admire, that also likes these things! And they really seem to be nice person!
A week in it gets brought up again and they ask you “oh by the way…..” you know when X thing happens? Or, have you heard of/ seen Y? Or, my favorite part was Z! What about yours?
And then you start to realize that you’ve actually just been hanging out in this little bubble of knowledge, because you actually don’t know, you haven’t heard of that, you haven’t gotten to that point yet!
And it’s always a yet, when I reply nervously “o- oh… I- I didn’t know that! I haven’t gotten around to X yet….” It’s a yet because YES YES!!!! More stuff! But it’s also scary because what if you don’t like it? What if that yet never becomes a have?
Do they think I can’t properly enjoy those conversations anymore…?
I don’t know. And I still don’t know, because I keep dancing around these questions..
I’m glad we’re friends but dear god I really need to branch out my interests!
Actually I kinda got side tracked. Ranted. Not sure exactly what I even said.
But I’m glad I have friends like that. Because I always want to know more. It’s just hard sometimes.
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Can't wait for your costume analysis, Conor in check again, and he was giving me bad vibes in his scenes. Honestly felt what Athena said about grifters preying on people's desperation could fit with him/buck. The way he spoke was off liuke I get being upset but then going to someone workplace airing it all out(also why ring him today and not sooner if its been 4 weeks) but then his grin when he relaises the team heard after buck said about keeping it quiet.
Hey Nonnie
I hope you enjoyed the costume meta this week 💜
Connor really was giving off weird vibes wasn't he and yes that grin was making me 👀 I do think we're supposed to take something from the grifters comment Athena made, and apply it to the Buck sperm donor situation, because Connor is most definitely playing on Buck's need to please and feel useful - the more of Connor I see the more manipulative I find him - its very clear he has figured out Buck and he's now using it to his advantage and the choice to turn up at Bucks place of work (and after only one phone call - surely you'd make several attempts to get in contact with Buck via the phone if you were worried) screams of intent. The intent to make him feel backed into a corner and thus manipulate further.
I totally understand that C&K are stressed and anxious about the whole process, but I don't think that excuses their behaviour (especially Connor's!) in the slightest!
I could totally buy someone turning up at someone else's work in this situation - if they'd made plenty of attempts by phone to get in touch - and only if they only asked to have a catch up - something long the lines of 'we really need to have a chat but i've not been able to get hold of you by phone - do you get a break or what time does your shift finish, so we can go get coffee and have this conversation' or something to that effect - thats how a considerate and normal person would do it!
I mean we all know this is going to end badly one way or another, and I'm very interested to see how it plays out, I'm currently in a place where I think it might get a bit ugly and we'll really get to see Connors true colours - I can very much see him trying to put all the blame onto Buck in a vicious way when things go south (whichever direction they chose to take it - either Buck being an unsuitable option due to the family medical history, or an unsuccessful donation followed by Buck deciding that he doesn't want to give more sperm or another way) because Connor is very much striking me as someone who never takes the blame on himself (the assumption that Kameron's fertility was the issue rather than his own plays into this as a concept).
however it ends up playing out I just can't see Connor coming out of it well - just based on the vibes i'm getting, they seem to be setting him up as a 'villain' in this story arc!
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