#you're allowed to like the villains

[remarcely]

Something was itching me about Kipperlilly as a character for a while that I couldn't place down but I just got it.

There is so much of a connection between her storyline and the radicalization a white suburban kid can have to something like white supremacy that it's not even that deep, it's surface level.

Think about it:

She has a strong hatred for a minority kid in her school because he's got great grades and is viewed as a hero

She's envious of the hardships he's gone through and starts hating her family for being so 'normal' (a lot of white people can feel angry about their identity and what they think is a lack of a culture because they 'don't feel oppressed enough' to justify their own feelings of unfairness)

She takes all that anger and infects the people around her, hurting them and 'radicalizing' a few others

Is so insistent that this random kid had an unfair start because of his family situation that she wants to permanently change the bylaws in her school so he's put at a crazy disadvantage, just so she feels like she has an upper hand (think of racist people being mad that there's more POC going to college and crying that they're only getting in because they're a minority, ignoring the real work those students put it despite the disadvantages they might have faced)

She doesn't do any self introspection, doesn't decide to put more effort into her grades or personal relations, she takes that hatred and lets it poison her from the inside out. She rants about fairness when she doesn't put the work in and chooses to despise the people that do, just because they're not as miserable as her.

Her guidance counselor doesn't know how to combat that anger because he doesn't agree with her politics, a creepy adult in her life recognizes her hate and takes advantage of it to stir up the flames, we don't even see her parents but it's safe to say they're not exactly involved or watching her.

I don't know, I'm just annoyed because I keep seeing people say 'if you hate Kipperlilly that's just misogyny' as if she is not a genuinely hate-able character.

You can hate a woman for being evil, you're allowed.

And on the whole 'redemption' thing, sure that's entirely possible but let's face it. You cannot force someone to change, that's not how redeeming yourself works, you have to want it. Kipperlilly has no desire to change because she believes she is right. What use is it to her to abandon a worldview that suits desires her so well?

There was no way that could have been covered in an epilogue well enough to justify it and do you really think all the people that had their lives ruined and were literally murdered (Lucy, Oisin, Ivy, Ruben, Mary Ann, Buddy, etc.) would be bending over backwards to check on their killer?

[utilitycaster]

You know what's interesting to me? For all people keep claiming at every juncture that perhaps Bells Hells will come around on the gods and see the harm they do (which, as discussed extensively, is, half the time, simply not intervening) not only have they never done so, but also they never quite cross the line into saying the party should join the Ruby Vanguard or aid them - and indeed, they defend against it - so what does this achieve? It feels like they're asking for a story in which the party stands idly by, which isn't much of a story nor, if I may connect this briefly to the real world, a political stance anyone should be proud of.

That's honestly the frustration with the gods and the "what if the Vanguard has a point" conversations in-game. What do we do then? Do we allow the organization that will murder anyone for pretty much any reason that loosely ties into their goals run rampant? The group that (perhaps unwittingly, but then again, Otohan's blades had that poison) disrupted magic world-wide, and caused people who had the misfortune to live at nexus points to be teleported (most, as commoners, without means of return). While also fomenting worldwide unrest?

Those were the arguments before the trip to Ruidus; with the reveal of the Vanguard's goals to invade Exandria, the situation becomes even more dire. Do you let the Imperium take over the planet?

And do the arguments against the gods even hold up? If Ludinus is so angry at them for the Calamity, what does it say that he destroyed Western Wildemount's first post-Calamity society for entirely selfish means? (What does it say about the validity of vengeance as a motivator?) What does it say that Laudna told Imogen she could always just live in a cottage quietly without issue before the solstice even happened? (Would this still be true if the Imperium controls the world?) What does it say that when faced with a furious, grieving party and the daughter she keeps telling herself was her reason for all of this, Liliana can't provide an answer to the question of what the gods have done other than that their followers will retaliate...for, you know, the Vanguard's endless list of murders. (That is how the Vanguard and Imperium tend to think, huh? "How dare your face get in the way of my boot; how dare you hit me back when I strike you.") She can't even provide a positive answer - why is Predathos better - other than "I feel it", even though Imogen and Fearne know firsthand that Predathos can provide artificial feelings of elation. Given all the harm Ludinus has done in pursuit, why isn't the conclusion "the gods should have crashed Aeor in such a way that the tech was unrecoverable?"

Even as early as the first real discussion on what the party should do, the fandom always stopped short of saying "no, Imogen's right, they should join up with the people who killed half the party," it was always "no, she didn't really mean it, she just was trying to connect with her mother." Well, she's connected with her mother, and at this point the party doesn't even care about the gods particularly (their only divinely-connected party member having died to prevent the Vanguard from killing all of them). So they will stop the Vanguard; as Ashton says, the means are unforgiveable. As Laudna says, it's not safe to bet on Predathos's apathy. As Imogen says, she's done running; the voice that she used to think of as a lifeline belongs to someone she doesn't trust. So I guess my question is: if they're stopping the people who are trying to kill the gods (and defense of the gods isn't remotely their personal motivation)...do you think the next phase of the campaign is Bells Hells personally killing the gods? Reconstructing the Aeor tech and hoping none of their allies notice? How does this end? Does your ideology ever get enacted? Or is this entirely moot and pointless and the story ends with Bells Hells saying "well, I'm really glad we stopped the people who [insert list of Vanguard atrocities from above]; none of us follow the gods or plan to, but honestly, the status quo we return to is preferable to whatever nightmare Ludinus had concocted in his violent quest for power and revenge"?

[dizzying-faust]

Sometimes I feel like the Toontown fandom needs a reminder that liking the cogs isn't the same as condoning their actions let alone people aren't bad for liking them.

Edit: Because of the tags in a retweet I wanna also say this before people say similar things.

Yes, there is an issue with parts of the fandom woobifying the cogs.

No, that doesn't negate my point that some need to chill with people liking the cogs.

"There's criticism with the fandom woobifying the cogs" and "There's criticism with parts of the fandom attacking people for liking the cogs" are both statements that can coexist.

[thatswhatsushesaid]

shitpost dispatches from the sangyao dungeons - [???/π] incorrect but plausibly canon quotes edition

[nortyourself]

Listen. I'm just here to enable people to unapologetically love villains without needing to justify why

[psalmsofpsychosis]

Some Batman: Telltale thoughts

[this is a Batman Telltale critical post, ye be warned.]

So. There are perhaps no words in the english language to describe with how stupid i feel right now.

I started Telltale Batman because i thought that it's one of the more distinct unconventional Batman narratives that would let you have a more interesting, complex and nuanced relationship between Bruce and Joker— the game even lets you bring all of Bruce's sincere hypocrisy and sentimental selfishness to the surface and have him admit that yes, he can fight the rogues gallery because it takes a madman to know a madman; to love a madman. For a moment i geniunely thought that i can escape the everpresent shadow of DC hays code in the freakshow funhouse that is Batman comics, i thought Telltale had done something different.

But telltale's approach to The Enemy Within is so flaky and flimsy and timid at best— such noncommittal twist on themes of pain and grief. They take on a hefty plotline, "what does it take to actually fight through evil and be surrounded by it? How long does it take before your resolve and your selfhood cracks? When you lose the mask, which one did you truly lose— The ideal persona, the superhero, the crusader, or the person underneath, the casket that holds all your humanity and your heart and your hopes? How long can you stare onto the abyss before it stares onto you?" It's indeed a very Nietzsche approach to Batman— except that a good Nietzsche narrative takes a lot of intentional plot points and honesty of thought and of heart. And Telltale doesn't commit, not to Bruce's characterization, and not to any other character, and definitely not to Joker's journey in any variation of it. The existence of the Vigilante route is useless on every front; Joker is going to turn into a villain anyway, just with a different hello kitty eyeshadow palette and an extra bland consolation lollipop. No good choice Bruce makes on Joker's behalf affects anything whatsoever, and i particularly love the "community and friendship and sympathy do not help the mentally ill and all that ever works is punishment and shock therapy and confinement and loneliness" message the vigillante route puts on the table, charming charming status quo commandments from DC as always.

Telltale Batman could only be revolutionary if it had dared to break comic convention and let the vigillante route play out like Selina and Bruce's relationship always does; very grey morality, irrational, full of tension and trust, unstable, intriguing, inexcusable, irreversible, unavoidable and heartfelt, human. But we can't have nice things in batmanverse, so both Joker routes run on stuck gears and topple and fall into a predictable narrative hole that neither Bruce nor Joker can claim out of.

And on the predictable front? this story is too lukewarm to be a good time for me personally. When you get 84 Batman comics per minute every other Tuesday, all ending the same way no matter whatever the fickity happens inbetween, you have to pull no punches. This is my 53368532th Batman-with-tragic-batjokes-implications read of the week, say something new or forever hold your blue-balling silence, i dont care.

[girlscarpia]

No but it's so funny how the semifinal's polls are full of people bribing and spamreblogging and involving non-opera people (and it's normal practice for tumblr polls, you're encouraged to do so even) but when I (jokingly!) suggested that people were doing it a few phases back I got a vagueblog making fun of me specifically lmaooo

[navree]

"you can't put alicent in a mother's day asoiaf comp because she's not a good mother and that's okay :)" but you have no problem with cersei fucking lannister in it when half her affc chapters are just about how abysmally she fails as a mother to her children so i think you're just a cunt

[theinfinitedivides]

have been listening to the Pathaan OST on and off for almost three weeks(?) now since its release and Vishal-Shekhar really said they'd give some of the best songs in their career to the gays in War (2019) and then took the leftovers to give to the king of Bollywood,,,,,, i'm crying

[bonetrousledbones]

at this point i’m convinced folks saying “people ONLY want perfect unproblematic queer characters but I’M different and want them to KILL” are just making up guys to get mad at because who. literally genuinely who are the people that only want flat/”perfect” queer rep i haven’t seen a single one since like 2018 but i’ve seen like 6 posts like this in the past week

[autism-swagger]

There's nothing I loathe more than fans who pretend like their white boy favs did absolutely nothing wrong and are actually the victims.

[mishkakagehishka]

Where's my post ab being a two-faced bitch bc i like both eichi and valkyrie i'm feeling it again

[leatherbookmark]

i had op blocked so ray’s rebloggathon was tragically Absent from my dash but now that i caught up, *hyeju voice* el oh el

[cuntvonkrolock]

people who get all high and mighty about disliking lestat on the basis of him being evil are weak. the entire goddamn point of lestat's character is that he's simultaneously charming and evil. you're supposed to like him and you're supposed to hate him. lestat is not a one-dimensional villain designed to be universally disliked by readers and viewers, he's a complicated villain designed to give readers and viewers mixed feelings about him.

[myhamartiaishubris]

People can't really be Sol defenders. Like he literally represents imperialist theocracy and we're saying he "didn't deserve" what he got?

[savageboar]

seeing another jackass on reddit "saving" a tarantula paralyzed by a tarantula hawk wasp. jesus h christ