#and it has persona 5 (royal) instead of p3 | Explore Tumblr posts and blogs

frauleinandry · 2 years ago

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after many months (mostly caused by dropping it temporarily to play P3P before the remake came out), i’ve finally finished persona 4. for a detailed analysis, check under the cut (note: it’s NOT spoiler free), but my ultimate feelings are.... hm. not exactly positive for reasons that both are and are not the game’s fault. while it did some things well (looking right at the culprit here), my experience was heavily tainted by the fact that i simply didn’t like a lot of the characters and humour, which is Very Bad given it’s a character/”humour” driven game. ultimately, i’d have to give it a 4/10.

okay, so, i’m gonna start off with the reason I didn’t enjoy P4 that much that wasn’t the game’s fault. as with persona 3 and 5 i didn’t go into it blind, and this is the only time that mattered. look, i love murder mysteries - in fact, it’s the only ‘realistic’ genre i consistently like. that, however, is because i enjoy the guessing game. so, knowing that adachi was the killer from the get-go sapped a lot of the fun out of it.

while i’m on the topic of the genre, while P4 is a murder mystery game, it’s also a slice-of-life one to a far greater degree than 3 and 5. that isn’t necessarily a bad thing, though I admit it’s a genre I find boring in of itself without other stuff included. slice-of-life is like romance to me - it spices up a pre-existing meal, but I’ve got no interest in eating a mouthful of raw cinnamon. still, i don’t mind slice-of-life moments... with characters i actually like. which, does not include the investigation team. i’ll talk about that last though, as the characters are definitely the thing I’ve got the most to say about.

instead, let’s move on to the gameplay. admittedly if i’d played FES instead of P3P my opinions here would probably be different, but… P3P was better, honestly. don’t get me wrong, being able to choose what skills are inherited in persona fusion is a godsend, but the quest system and the way social links are handled both suck ass. the fact that all the TV dungeon quests require backtracking is baffling to me. who the hell thought that was a good idea? i could barely tolerate doing the dungeons once, let alone crawling through them multiple times. suffice to say, i did not do many quests.

secondly, the social links. in royal and P3P i managed to complete all but one link on my first playthroughs, but by the time i’d finished golden, there were 4 links I hadn’t completed (despite the fact that the game goes until february), not including the two branching ones. the fact that there are no gifts to minimise hold-out ranks sucks, and the night hangouts are too random and limited to compensate for it. my least favourite thing though was how you can basically only level up one social link on a rainy day. In fact, rainy days were just awful in general. the fact that you can do nothing but fish and level up stats is one of the most baffling game design choices ever. like, gameplay limitations that increase atmosphere are fine, but there are far too many rainy days for them to feel anything but tedious.

speaking of atmosphere though, one positive thing about P4 was that the soundtrack slapped! while I think P5 has better dungeon/battle themes, the overworld ones in P4 are brilliant. probably my favourite in the series as a matter of fact - heartbeat heartbreak and backside of the TV were the highlights. also, i think the december fog easily did the pre-climax disturbing atmosphere thing the best. the nyx cult felt very shoehorned in and was ultimately irrelevant, and everyone giving up free will in P5 happened too quickly to have much effect. meanwhile, the whole thing with the gas masks and the illness and the changed overworld in P4... it was fantastic, honestly.

still, while the game’s atmosphere was good in parts, thematically speaking, it was a mess. while they could have taken in further, rebellion is a huge core tenant in P5, and P3′s theme of parting is so well executed it makes up for the game’s simple plot/threadbare lore. meanwhile, P4 was just kind of a mess.

so, the two core themes are “it’s worth facing the truth even if it's painful”, and “having bonds and connections allows one to prosper”. already, the first problem should be obvious. there are two themes instead of one - neither of which are simple topics. as a result, both of them are underdeveloped and poorly executed. the truth theme is introduced first and is reflected in the TV dungeons/investigation team plot, but is pretty much absent from the social links. instead, the social links are all focused around the second theme - namely, connecting to others. the problem is that theme isn’t introduced into the main plot until the very endgame, so as a result, the social links feel very disconnected from the main story.

eventually, the game tries to wrap both themes together in the izanami/hollow forest arc, but by then it’s too late and it just feels like izanami’s trying to do two things at once, instead of having one cohesive goal. ultimately, I think P4 would have been served far better if the central theme was “reaching out to others is hard/scary, but it’s only by human connection that we grow”, with the truth stuff minimized. after all, adachi’s refusal to integrate with people is a key component of his misanthropy, while namatame wouldn’t have done nearly so much damage if he’d had dialogue with people instead of making a wild assumption about how the TV world worked.

speaking of izanami, holy shit!! i owe an apology to yaldabaoth P5 now - i thought he was poorly integrated into the main story, but at least he actually was. unless you go out of your way to deliberately ignore the game’s prompts, you just... never encounter her, and honestly, that’s probably the better way to play the game - i’ve never experienced a final boss that felt so shoehorned in in my life. there are literally two lines of foreshadowing for her existence, and That’s It.

generally speaking, the lore was pretty weak, but then again, it probably was a step up from P3, so yay, progress...? on the complimentary side though, I think the TV dungeons are a super interesting idea - i love the whole having to face yourself to unlock your persona thing. admittedly, I think palaces on the whole execute the same idea better, due to the presence of cognitions and the way continued exploration reveals more about the ruler, buuuuuut palaces wouldn’t exist if the TV dungeons didn’t. so yeah, they don’t lose that many points for that.

this seems like a good time to segment into talking about the investigation team/characters in general. as individuals, I like most of the team. chie and kanji are funny, naoto and kanji (again) get interesting development, and yukiko’s neat, even if she’s woefully underdeveloped. rise admittedly does nothing much for me (I find her aggressive simping for the protagonist utterly tedious, and I don’t like the way her more withdrawn side was dropped post joining the team), but eh. that’s just me.

speaking of yukiko/kanji/naoto, i know a lot of people are annoyed with the generally collectivist messages behind their arcs, but honestly? i don’t mind it. my opinions might have been different pre-covid, but in the wake of that, I think that sometimes people need to do shit they don’t necessarily want to for the sake of others (*cough* masking *cough*). i know yukiko staying at the inn pissed a lot of people off, but I don’t think that in of itself is problematic. it would have been better if the reporters were introduced at rank 5 of her social link, and the latter half was about her choosing to support her family because she wants to, but ultimately that’s a minor gripe.

moving on to naoto and kanji, or to be more specific, their queercoding/the controversy drummed up by that. given the game came out in 2008, there was no way in hell naoto was ever going to be trans. while I think their shadow confrontation is absolutely written that way, it clearly wasn’t intentional on the side of the writers - I wouldn’t be surprised if they didn’t even know what a trans person was back then. i understand why people are upset about it, but... it simply wasn’t a realistic expectation. i think their arc is less an example of intentional bigotry, and more of an example of a bunch of cishet writers accidentally stepping on a landmine.

if the game ever got a remake, I do think it’d be neat if naoto was portrayed as transmasc, or their shadow wasn’t about them feeling uncomfortable with their gender, and more about them being fine with being female, but feeling forced to hide it to fit in and get the respect of their male peers.

kanji, meanwhile? he’s fine. like i said before, P4 is not a recent game. korra simply holding asami’s hand was a humungous deal, and that was aired over seven years after P4′s release. it’s amazing they even got away with implying kanji might be same-sex attracted in the first place. not to mention, his character arc isn’t really about his sexuality? it’s about him learning not to use aggression to cover up his insecurities. which, again, isn’t a bad message?

at the same time though, there are major characters who i disliked the writing for in this game - namely teddie, and my most hated character of all, yosuke. christ on a bike, he’s the humanoid embodiment of everything i dislike about P4.

so, stepping away from yosuke and towards the game’s writing on the whole, you can absolutely tell this was released in the early 2000s, and I mean that in the most derogatory way possible. while P3 and P5 have a few jokes that hit the wrong way, they’re thankfully limited (and most of them feel OOC in P5 anyway). conversely, as a more slice-of-life focussed game, there are a lot more “comedic” scenes in P4, and dear god, they are all trash. sorry, but I don’t get what’s so funny about homophobic comments and constant goddamn sexual assault. it wasn’t funny back then, and it ain’t funny now. this isn’t even some trite accidental pervert shit - i cannot think of a single comedic scene that didn’t involve the male characters actively going out of their way to sexually harass the girls. like, flirting badly is fine. groping, peeping, and constantly leering is not. i cannot describe how deeply this shit is entrenched in the game’s DNA - over 60% of P4 is just... that.

stepping back to yosuke (and to a lesser degree teddie), one of his main roles is to be the instigator of these garbage excuses for jokes, which completely sours me on his entire character. this sucks, as a) his social link exploring his relationship with saki is genuinely really good, and b) he’s the deuteragonist and is therefore around all the bloody time. i know some people use the whole “he was initially designed as a romance option” thing to dismiss this, but nah. that content was cut. his actions don’t come off as an internalised homophobia thing, just him being a jerk. it doesn’t help that he never grows out of it too - if he was written like say, sokka, who starts off being gross but gets better over time, that’d be fine, but he’s not. yosuke starts the game as an awful sex pest, and finishes as one. pass.

the problem with yosuke being so hateable is that it completely ruins the investigation team’s dynamic on the whole. one of the crits I saw about P5 from older fans is that the phantom thieves didn’t feel like friends. if you’re comparing them to the investigation team though, i’ve got to ask what you’ve been smoking. chie and yukiko are friends. kanji and naoto are friends. all the girls tolerate each other, but beyond that... these people treat each other awfully, and not just in a joking banter way.

moving away from the investigation team and on to the greater cast, most of them are... pretty mid, honestly (admittedly my experiences with P3P make me think that the non-plot social links were all pretty bad pre-P5). dojima isn’t dreadful I guess, but he’s blown out of the water by his successor sojiro in every way possible. nanako is good - i don’t care for kid characters on the whole, but she really contributes a lot to P4′s soul. her relationship with the MC is a huge part of the game’s backbone. marie on the flipside is just annoying - while the hollow forest is really touching, her base personality comes off as... unnatural, I guess? like, she feels like several anime tropes stuck together, not an actual human being.

i’m gonna finish this off with a bang though, and talk about the one character I absolutely loved. surprise - it’s adachi! sympathetic villains are good and all that, but sometimes I just want to see a guy who’s genuinely just a bad dude. and adachi is a bad dude in very realistic way. the entitlement. the immaturity. the pettiness. his goals and motives suck, but they suck in a way that feels both in character and more importantly, like something someone would actually do. like, bad people irl don’t tend to be mass-murdering cultists or whatever. they tend to be entitled people who think their needs and comfort trump everyone else’s.

it also helps that he’s just a fun character in general. compared to the other major non-sympathetic human persona villains, adachi blows them out of the water. strega and ikutsuki are woefully underdeveloped, and shido feels like an obstacle, not a human being. adachi on the other hand is both hateable and genuinely entertaining to watch. if P6′s villain takes after him, i’d be more than happy.

#persona 4 #this is really fucking long and definitely fairly critical so uh yeah be warned #review tag

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ochazos · 1 year ago

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VERSES

To the unknown I go against my sorrow: Follows the main story for Persona 3 with heavy inspiration from the movies and reload. Goes from the start of the game to the end on the rooftop.

Cover your eyes and hide in the dark: Following the events of the game if Makoto chose to kill Ryoji and forget everything. Most of his bonds with SEES outside of his classmates is gone and all of his development is erased.

With all of my unanswered prayers: Verse where Makoto joins Strega.

He doesn’t get “accidentally” put in the SEES dorm. Instead, he goes to the boys dorm. He stays pretty reclusive until the night of the full moon. He sees Pharos and sneaks out of the dorm in the hopes of seeing him since he thought he left the dorm. There he is attacked by the big shadow. Despite not having an evoker, when he is almost killed by the Shadow, Thanatos awakens but Makoto can’t control it. This leads to the shadow being killed by Thanatos more or less being a huge risk to himself and everyone around them. Takaya manages to stop him and “rescues” him. Due to this, Makoto is asked to join up with them instead. Feeling obligated at first, he joins. He has almost no control over his Persona at all, making him incredibly dangerous. The ONLY way he can easily control it is with the pills Takaya gives him Now, Makoto’s issues worsen and his feeling of not fitting in gets worse. The only time he feels comfortable is during the Dark Hour. He makes no friends at school and retreats into himself, his only real contacts being the other members of Strega. While Makoto is still a sympathetic character to an extent, he is incredibly selfish in this verse. It is very much a villain verse. It’s still being worked out, as I am only now getting into the meat of Strega being in the game in reload and it’s been like 10+ years since I played the original game lol.

YOUR WISH: Persona 5 Royal verse.

Persona 5 Royal verse. This verse takes places during the events of Persona 5 Royal. Heavily plotted out with Irons. The Answer never happened in this verse and all of SEES ended up growing up and going their separate ways. When Maruki took control (or before if a character met him and confided in him), Makoto was brought make to life. With no memories after the rooftop, Makoto reappears in the world. He instantly knows something is wrong. His biggest concern is to solve the mystery of why he is back before his absence can allow Nyx to come back. This verse takes place roughly 10 years after the events of Persona 3. I am willing to plot out things with Persona 5 or 3 rpers. Though if I am interacting with Persona 5 rpers, I will assume a lot involving the P3 cast solely because of the affiliation the verse has with Irons and his muses.

this is his metaverse outfit. credit to the artist. also he goes by midnight if he joins the thieves

THE DAY AFTER: Makoto survives verse

Makoto doesn't die on 3/5. Maybe as a gift from Ryoji or Igor, or through his own stubborn will... Makoto is split. While much of him became the seal, he is still at least somewhat tethered to his body.

After the rooftop, he falls into a coma with little hope of waking up. Despite pessimism from the doctors and no real known cause medically, he is basically in a vegetative state for at least a month if not longer. He does eventually wake up. He struggles, at first, with eyesight and moving around. But eventually he regains some semblance of independence.

Makoto is alive but has severe issues. He had chronic exhaustion and pain that seems to have no cause. He is incredibly sickly and struggles after any strain physically. For the most part, he is living on borrowed time. He could die in a day, in six months, in a year, in ten years. But it doesn't really matter to him, because all he wanted was more time with the people he loves. He isn't afraid of dying because he knows it's all worth it to protect the world he grew to love thanks to SEES.

#*˖ ⊹ meta. ╲ verses. ⋅#for people without access to custom theme!

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arcplaysgames · 2 years ago

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The Persona 5 Post-Mortem, Part Two: What I Did Like 8)

Okay let's talk about what I liked about Persona 5 Royal because despite tearing it a new one last post I think it did a lot of good things.

Joker is a great fucking character.

We made it, folks, we did it. We have a player-directed mostly silent protagonist who is just bursting with personality.

My biggest and loudest complaint about Persona 4 Golden was the protagonist. I felt like he was such a blank, empty void that the game frequently had to compensate for the space he should have filled.

Joker was the perfect answer to almost everything. He was vibrant, funny, heartfelt, and kind of a bitch. He had force of personality. There was backstory to him that drove the story. Instead of "grey dude staying in small town for a year, no further details available" we had

"Do-gooder gets framed for assault and is forced out of his small hometown, moving to Fucking Tokyo to attend a prestigious but strict high school, all while being told at every turn to make himself small, to not make waves lest he fuck up his life more. He tries to do as he's told but his desire to push back and protect people gets him in trouble almost immediately."

P4MC gets involved in the Inaba murder mystery because he fell in a TV; Yosuke is the one with personal motivation to start with. Joker gets involved in the Metaverse because he's genuinely motivated to help people and push back against authority. If you took out the personas, the wild cards, the supernatural element of this story, Joker would still be an interesting person and something would have happened to him regardless.

Joker also is much more than a passive observer to the plot. He is a catalyst. He is inherently wrapped up in the central conflict. He's a showoff, he has a vicious grin when he's pulled off something clever, he's actually a Trickster. He's a fucking character!

And while he is player-directed, Joker absolutely, genuinely has his own motivations separate from player control. He has attachments that the player doesn't decide for him, and in Royal it becomes the most shocking moment of the game.

There is more authorship to Joker, and he is not just the player's avatar. There was zero reason for P4MC to be gender locked because he was almost entirely built from the player's projection. Joker succeeds by being his own person who the player is guiding.

The secondary cast of the game is frequently very good.

Hot take: I think Sojiro is a better character than at least half of the Thieves. He's more complex, has more gravity, and feels like a part of the world in the way the literal main cast often does not.

And it's not just Sojiro. I think the non-teammate SLinks in P5R are broadly speaking much better than the previous games. Yeah, I am annoyed at how much Atlus just cannot stop writing grizzly sad dads while keeping single moms off camera, but. i cannot deny that the actual characters we get are good.

Sojiro, Maruki, Kawakami, Tae, Iwai, Toranosuke, even Mishima who I hated as a person but have to admit he was an interesting link. Compared to previous Persona games, I was more interested and invested in more SLinks in this game than in P3 and P4. And honestly I don't think any were Actively Terrible like, say, P3's Hanged Man or P4's Devil.

I think this is aided by how varied the SLinks are. Many of the SLinks in P3 and P4 are other students, and that kind of limited what stories they could tell, imo. In P5R, we have an ex-yakuza gun nut who adopted an abandoned child, a fairly unethical disgraced doctor who is trying to test a new drug, a failed politician who still believes in governance of the people-- these are interesting! They're good! Not to be flippant but they're better than "yet another classmate, but this one is Wacky because X reason."

Living in digital Tokyo was honestly a delight.

Okay yes I have some complaints about the lack of localization in P5R's environments and how the lack of context really hurt a few sections of this game and I really stand by that.

HOWEVER, as someone with a dear friend and penpal in Tokyo, it was... honestly really nice to explore the city as much as the game let me. One of the real joys of the game was just experiencing a simulacrum of that space for a year. I got a laugh out of the POLLEN WARNING!!!! days and how similar they are to my own days in Georgia. And as someone who has never lived in a city and only academically understands how they are laid out and function, just exploring busy streets was fun.

A few times, i skipped using the Fast Travel menu just to walk to the various places I needed to visit.

I loved Kichijoji the most. 8) And the little moments when i recognized a place (my gasp of delight at the FIRST TIME I saw Shinjuku!!!), that was fun because learning the layout of Tokyo gave all those locations more of a sense of scale and place.

Inaba was frankly very similar to my own super small midwestern town in America. Digital Tokyo was a new experience I really enjoyed.

Morgana was a talking cat that slept in Joker's school desk and rode around in his bag.

Enough fucking said. As someone who is not a dog person, it's nice to finally have a game for the Cat People. Finally some goddamn representation.

Yes, I think Joker faking his own death and Yaldaboath as the final boss were messy as hell, BUT...... they were stylish.

I could (and have) sat here and poked holes in these sequences, the two Huge Setpieces that anchor the game. We all know by now that both are messy as hell, don't make a lot of sense, and don't really hold up to scrutiny.

However: unlike the Izanami reveal in P4G which Just Sucked (and I will never stop mocking), these flawed climaxes are smoothed over by the full tilt all-in bombast employed.

They were fun enough to make me go "well, I can't be mad at every damn thing." Which is something.

The Third Semester/Royal Content.

This probably needs to be its own post, because it is dense enough to be its own game and singlehandedly saved Persona 5.

Part Three soonish!

#p5 #persona liveblog #post mortem #long post

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verxsyon · 3 years ago

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happy halloween! have y’all seen scara’s drip? D A M N. it’s kinda scary how it’s also the anniversary of bohemian rhapsody as well as when the 1.1 trailer came out, when we first met him. interesting...

enough of that, how have y’all been? so persona 5 royal was released on the 21st and i’ve been playing it ever since. as someone who majored in psych as an undergrad and studying counseling psych for grad school, the information about personas and shadows are accurate and literally, i’ve haven’t been this happy. also, the storyline and the characters are AMAZING (i'm in my akechi kisser era lol love that pancake loser to death and i’m an ann kinnie love her). i’m looking forward to play strikers afterwards and both p3 and p4 when they get released 1/19/23.

some of the genshin impact vas are in that game -- ann’s, ryuji’s, and mishima’s specifically -- and that gave me an idea of a persona au. each nation released so far will get their own hcs!

persona has a feature called social links where you hang out with characters you’ve met throughout the game and they’ll give power-ups for your journey. i’ll be assigning a character to a role in the team for each nation, what persona they would have based on constellations, and what arcana they would have for their social links with the reader based on their personalities and ideals. i hope that makes sense?

teams:

mondstadt - amber, kaeya, jean, lisa, diluc, venti, mona, albedo, eula

liyue - ningguang, keqing, tartaglia (childe), zhongli, ganyu, xiao, hu tao, yanfei, shenhe, yelan

inazuma - kazuha, ayaka, yoimiya, ei, yae, sara, kokomi, thoma, gorou

sumeru - tighnari, collei, cyno, candace, nilou, nahida, al-haitham, kaveh, dehya, scaramouche (wanderer)

notes:

each team has 9-10 members each. p3 to p5 the range was 8-10.

team composition was based on the characters who participated in the main storyline and/or were considered important during the interludes. in some cases, some were important to the event storyline (e.g., mona and albedo) and some were just thrown in there (e.g., hu tao and kaveh).

childe is in the liyue team as he was released during that chapter i.

scaramouche is in the sumeru team instead of inazuma as he was released during chapter iii and received his vision in the nation (check drip marketing).

it felt like a crime not including itto into the inazuma team because his eng va max mittelman voiced ryuji so i was thinking of including social links with npcs (as in playable characters of genshin who aren’t in the team but can benefit from forming relationships with you) as well.

#✦ .concepts #genshin impact #persona #need to finish my royal au hcs lol #haven't been writing...#distracted from academics and playing p5r LMAOOO

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1eos · 4 years ago

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Hii Princess Kendra! So I’m playing P5 and (this is a mini rant abt Ak*chi’s character so please ignore this if this is a bother) but I genuinely wish hardcore Ak*chi fans could just realize that they’re obsessed with the Potential that this character had instead of the character itself… because even with Atlus tweaking parts of his Link and expression of his personality in Royal, they really just gave us all fucking nothing in the end (which is a shame because I feel like his character could’ve been a genuine exploration into how childhood trauma can differently affect a person’s psyche and self worth & unfortunately increase the likelihood of getting them gr00med etc etc). It’s so sad honestly… anyways Ryuji & Yusuke >>>>>. Sorry for this and hope u have an amazing day!

dont ever apologize for being right!!!!!! cuz you’re spitting nothing but facts! i totally agree nd i say it all the time but the two narrative shortcomings of persona 5 is that it doesn’t explore the trauma of the characters enough nd that it’s relying too hard on persona 4. like p4 balanced that exploration of trauma w light comedy hijicks better bc the narrative structure nd core gameplay mechanic was overcoming your shadow which is the physical embodiment of your trauma almost. you spend hours with each character exploring their deepest issues at the time! even persona 1-3 make addressing trauma a fundamental part of the narrative (in persona 3 the characters don’t get their evolved personas until they begin to heal from a traumatic event in game) wheras in persona 5 they give u a taste of that trauma nd then move on. nd its up to the social links to do the bulk of the fleshing out so if the s-link is underwhelming (and akechi’s fucking was) you don’t really get much more? but persona fans still love akechi bc atlus borrowed facets from p4 characters notably naoto nd adachi but we don’t love naoto just bc she was a fucking detective. just like ppl aren’t obsessed w adachi JUST bc he was fake. but bc ppl know of the kid detective archetype or the backstabber archetype they can fill in the blanks when in reality the akechi we got was v v v v empty. like now that im on my 3rd or 4th playthrough ive noticed that this rivalry akechi has for u comes out of fucking nowhere. and AGAIN its something done well in p4 nd stuck in here. he just tries to talk to you nd vaguely trauma dumps while ure like ??????? in the coffee shop so his betrayal isnt shocking kgakgkag when ure betrayed in p3 nd p4 its genuinely a shock bc 1. u spent a LOT of time w those characters, naturally, nd they purposefully were made to be a comfort to you of sorts which is exactly why the back stabbing hurts! whereas akechi is suspicious the whole time. which could be fine if they actually gave u hints that he had a hate boner for the protag. like it wouldve been so easy to have akechi be soooo nasty to akira in small doses mean girl style when they were alone in a way that directly contrasts how nice he was in public bc he had an image. like there was so much to be done w someone who craves attention nd success bc of their abandoment issues nd how even with power he still was subject to being used nd manipulated bc he had no one around him that truly gave a fuck about his well-being but in the end we got a really one note character with this great mask off moment at the end nd that was it. literally i need a podcast bc there’s so much to talk abt how persona 4’s mega success affected persona 5

#idk akechis whole thing was just not it #like they were trying to do the p4g route nd give u a s-link but u still dont get too close to a character #but it doesnt work bc w persona 4 there was probable cause as to why u couldnt get that close to adachi #for one he was an adult that didnt WANT help #he’s not like everyone else who wanted a friend he didnt care #but w akechi’s link u didnt even get to know him or get a chance to be put off my him #which would have been so good #atlus just didnt commit #is akechi this tragic case of a friend u couldnt save or is he this unforgiveable rival that needs to be brought down a peg #cuz at the end of the game the characters are so sad acting like they failed akechi #but like….u didnt know him LMAO this emotional moment is wasted on a character we never got to know #nd its fine to not know an antagonist that well if they lean into being nasty #buttttttt #i have way too much to say abt this

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c-is-for-circinate · 4 years ago

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I'd love to hear more of your thoughts about why P5R didn't quite land for you. I had the same reaction to it, but I've never quite been able to properly articulate why the last section fell so flat.

God okay so I've tried several times to answer this, and it seems like the answer is 'I still have way too many feelings, personally, to say this in anything less than thirty pages and fifteen hours of work', because Persona 5 the original is a game I loved a lot and care about a great deal. And most of the reasons I disliked Royal feel, in my head, like a list of ways it broke some of the things I liked best about P5--which means explaining them feels like I need to explain everything I loved about the original game, which is a book in itself, complete with referents to P3, P4, Jungian psychology, the Joseph Campbell mytharc, and fuck all even knows what. And that is too much.

But today I realized that I could instead describe it from an angle of, Persona 5 Strikers succeeds really well at doing the thing I think Royal was trying to do but failed at. And that I think I can talk about in a reasonable amount of wordspace, hopefully, behind this cut because I have at least one friend who hasn't played Royal yet.

Note for reblogs/comments: I HAVE NOT FINISHED STRIKERS YET. I got through the jail that pretended to be the final jail and have not yet gone into the obviously inevitable 'ohshit wait, you mean there's something more than simple human machinations behind all of this?' dungeon. (I got stuck on a really frustrating side quest, put the game down, and then dived into Hades to avoid throwing the Switch across the room for a while--and anyone around this blog lately knows how THAT'S been going.) Please no spoilers past Okinawa!

So, one of the many, many things I really appreciated about Persona 5 was its straightforward and unashamed attitude towards abusers and their acts of violence. Because, while yes P5 is a story about the use of power and control to make others suffer, it fundamentally isn't about those abusers themselves. It's about their victims, those that survive their crimes. And this shows up repeatedly over the course of the game.

We do not give a shit why Kamoshida wanted to beat and rape his students. We really don't. Kamoshida does not deserve our attention one moment longer than it takes to make him stop. Because, ultimately, that's the goal of P5, start to end. We don't know for sure if what we're doing is fair, if it's justice, if it's questionable. What we know is that people are being hurt, badly, actively, right now this second. What we know is that victims are suffering. What we know is that we, personally, us-the-protag and us the Phantom Thieves at large, are in danger. And in those circumstances, we don't care about the abuser's side any more. We don't. We don't have the space or time or capacity to care, because that is not the point.

The point is to help the weak. To save the people who need saving, right here and now. To give others the courage to stand up on their own behalf. We're not even out to change society, not really--that's a byproduct. We are reactions. We are triage. We are important.

There's something so empowering and validating about that as a theme, y'know? In a media landscape so full of "sympathetic villains", the idea that, you know, maybe sometimes you don't have to break yourself to show compassion that might possibly heal the bad guy--that sometimes you can just make the bad guy stop hurting people--feels both refreshing and satisfying. I really appreciate it as a message! I liked it a lot!

And yes, there's nuance to that theme, and the game is not without compassion. We save Futaba, because 'make the bad guy stop hurting people', in that case, means 'make this person stop hurting herself'. We give Sae a path forwards, help her fix her own heart. Yet it's worth pointing out that in both of those cases, while we were very glad to do those things, to save those people, we also went into both of those palaces for extremely practical reasons to begin with. We needed Futaba's help. We needed Sae's help. The fact that we chose to talk Sae into a change of heart rather than simply stealing her treasure, while ultimately a very good thing for her, was absolutely a practical choice predicated on the need for her palace to still exist to save our life. And yes, we wanted to save her, for Makoto's sake--yes, we wanted desperately to save Futaba. But Sae and Futaba let themselves be helped, too, and that doesn't change the overarching themes of the story itself.

Akechi (and to some extent Okumura) would not let himself be helped. Akechi's another interesting nuance to this theme, because of all our villains, we do learn the most about what drove him to the cruelties and crimes he's committed. He's at that intersection of victim and villain, and we want to help him, as a victim--but we also know that stopping him as a villain is more important. We'd like to save him from himself if we could, because we save people from their sources of trauma, it's what we do. We regret being unable to do so. But in the end, what matters to the story is not that Akechi refused to be saved--it's that Shido and Yaldabaoth need to be stopped, for the sakes of everyone else they're hurting now and may continue to hurt in the future.

The thing is, there's space and maybe even a need for a corollary discussion of those places where victim and villain intersect. It's an interesting, pertinent, and related topic. Strikers made an entire video game about it, a really good video game. It's centered in the idea that, yes, these people need to be stopped, and we will make stopping them our priority--but they're not going after us, and that gives us some space to sympathize. Even for Konoe, who specifically targets the Phantom Thieves--compare him to Shido, who actively destroyed the lives of both Joker and Futaba, who ordered Haru's father's death, who's the entire reason the team is still dealing with the trauma of Akechi's everything. Of course the game can be sympathetic to Konoe where it can't with Shido. There's enough distance to do that.

But right--Strikers is a separate game. It's a separate conversation. It's, "last time, we talked about that, so now let's take it one step further." And that's good writing. (It's something Persona has done before, too, also really well! Persona 3 is about terrible, occasionally-suicidal depression and grief. P4 is about how you can still be hurting and need some help and therapy even if things seem ok. Related ideas, but separate conversations that need to be separate in order to be respectful and do justice to either one. P5, as a follow-up to P4, is a conversation about how, ok, changing yourself is great and all, but sometimes the problem is other people so how do you deal with that? Again, still related! Still pertinent! Still alluded to in P4, with Adachi's whole thing--but it wasn't the time or place to base a quarter of the game around it.)

So one of Royal's biggest issues, to me, is that it tries to tack on this whole new angle for discussion onto a game that was originally about something else.

Adding Maruki's palace--adding it at the end, which by narrative laws suggests that it's the true point that everything else should be building up to--suddenly adds in about a hundred new dimensions at once. It wants us to engage with "what in this abuser/manipulator's life led him to act this way?" for basically the first time all game (we'll get to Akechi later). It wants us to engage with, "if the manipulator has a really good reason or good intentions, does that mean we should forgive them?" It requires us to reflect on, "what is the difference between control and cruelty?" It asks, "okay, but if people could be controlled into being happy, would that be okay?" (Which, based on the game so far, is actually a wild out-there hypothetical! Literally not a single thing we've seen in the game suggests that could ever happen. Even the people who think being controlled is safer and easier are miserable under it. Control that's able to lead to actual happiness is completely out of left field in the context of everything we've encountered all game so far.)

That's too much! We don't have time to unpack all that! We only have an eighth of the game left! Not to mention we are also being asked to bring back questions we put to bed much earlier in the game about the morality of our own actions, in a wholely unsatisfying way. Maruki attempts to justify his mass brainwashing because "it's the same as what you're doing", and we know it isn't, but the game didn't need Maruki calling it out in order for us to get that. We already faced that question when we started changing hearts, and again several times throughout the game, and again when we found our targets in Yaldabaoth's cells. The fact that we change hearts does not mean we think "changing hearts is fine and kind and should be done to everyone, actually." Changing hearts has been firmly established in this game as an act of violence, acceptable only because it prevents further systemic violence against innocents that we must prevent. The moral question has never once been about whether it's ok to change the hearts of the innocent, only about how far it's ethical to go against individuals who are actively hurting other people. Saying "you punched that guy to keep him from shooting a child, so punching people is good and I will save the world by punching everyone!" is confusing! and weird! and not actually at all helpful to the question of, how much violence is it acceptable to use to protect others! So presenting the question that way just falls really flat.

(And right, I love Strikers, because Strikers has time to unpack all that. Strikers can give us a main bad guy who wants to control the whole world for everybody's own good, because Strikers has earned that thematic climax. It has given us sympathetic bad guys who started out wanting to control the world to protect themselves and ended up going too far. It's given us Mariko Hyodo, who wanted to control the world to protect other people and went too far. It's given us a long-running thread about police, the desire to serve, and the abuse of power that can lead to. And since we are actively trying to care for the people whose hearts we're changing in Strikers, we can open the door to questions about using changes-of-heart and that level of control to make other people happy. We can even get a satisfying conclusion out of that discussion, because we have space to characterize the difference--Konoe thinks that changing peoples' hearts means confining them, but the Phantom Thieves think it means setting them free. We have seen enough sympathetic villains that we as an audience have had the space to figure out how we feel about that, and to understand the game's perspective of "stop them AND save them, if we can possibly do both." And that message STILL rests firmly on Persona 5's message of "it is Good to do what you have to do to stop an abuser so long as you don't catch innocent people in your crossfire.")

It's worth noting that the general problem of 'asking way too many new questions and then not answering them' also applies to how Royal treats its characters, too. P5 did have unanswered questions left at the end! The biggest one, and we all knew this, was Akechi, and what actually happened to him, and how we should feel about him, and how he felt about us. That was ripe for exploring in our bonus semester, and to Royal's credit they did in fact try to bring it up, but by god did they fuck up doing it.

Akechi's probable death in the boiler room was absolutely the biggest dangling mystery of the game. It was an off-screen apparent death of a key antagonist, so all of the narrative rules we know suggested that he might still be alive and would probably come back if the story went on for long enough. So when Royal brings him back on Christmas Eve, hey, great! Question answered. Except that the situation is immediately too good to be true, and immediately leads to another mystery, which leads to a flat suspicion that something must be wrong. We spend several hours of gameplay getting sly hints that, oooh, maybe he's not really alive after all, before it's finally confirmed by Maruki: yup, he really died, if we end the illusion we'll kill him too. Okay, at least we know now. Akechi is alive right now and he's going to be dead if we do this, and that doesn't make a ton of sense because every other undead person disappeared when the person who wished for them realized they were fake but at this point we'll take it. So we take down Maruki, and okay, Akechi really is dead! Probably! We're fairly sure! Aside from our lingering doubts!

And then we catch a glimpse of maybe-probably-could be him through the train window, and I just want to throw something, because come on.

Look, it is just a fact of storytelling: the more times you make an audience ask 'wait, is this character dead or aren't they?', the less they will care, until three or four reversals later you will be hard pressed to find anybody who gives a shit. Royal does this like four different times, and every iteration comes with even less certainty than the last. By the end, we somehow know even less than we did when we started! Did Akechi survive the boiler room to begin with and Maruki just didn't know? Or was Maruki lying to try and manipulate us further? Or was he actually dead and then his strength of will when Maruki's reality dissolved was enough to let him survive after all? Is that even actually him out the train window?

Where is he going! What is he doing! How did any of this happen! What is going on! We all had these questions about Akechi at the end of the original P5, and the kicker is that Royal pretends like it's going to answer them only to go LOL JK NO. It's frustrating and it's dissatisfying and it annoys me.

The one Akechi question that Royal doesn't even bother to ask, though, let alone leave ambiguous, is how does the protagonist feel about him? The entire emotional weight of the third semester rests on the protagonist caring about Akechi, Sumire, and Maruki. Maruki's the person we're supposed to sympathize with even as we try to stop him. Sumire's the person we're trying to save from herself. And Akechi is our bait--is, we are told, the one thing our protagonist wished for enough to actualize it in this world himself. Akechi's the final lure to accept Maruki's deal. Akechi's survival is meant to be tempting.

For firm Akechi fans, this probably worked out fine--the game wanted to insist that the protagonist cared for Akechi the same way the player did. For those of us who're a little more ambivalent, though (or for the many and valid people who hated him), this is a super sour note. Look, one of the Persona series' strengths is the way it lets players choose to put their time and emotional investment into an array of different characters, so the main story still has weight even if there's a couple you don't care about that much. It has always done this. The one exception, from P3 all the way through P4 to here and now, is Nanako Dojima, and by god she earned that distinction. I have never met a person who played Persona 4 who didn't love Nanako. Nanako is a neglected six-year-old child who is brave and strong enough to take care of herself and all of the housework but who still tries not to cry when her dad abandons her again and lights up like the sun when we spare her even the tiniest bit of time and attention. It is impossible not to care for Nanako. Goro Akechi is not Nanako.

And yet third semester Royal doesn't make sense if your protagonist doesn't feel linked to Akechi. The one question, out of all the brand new questions Royal throws out there, that it decides to answer all by itself--and it's how you as a player and your protagonist ought to feel about an extremely complex and controversial character. What the fuck, Royal. What the fuck.

In conclusion, I'll leave you with this. I played the original Persona 5 in March and April of 2017, as an American, a few months after the 2016 election and into the term of our then president. It felt painfully timely. A quick calendar google early on indicated that the game's 20XX was almost certainly 2016, and the closer our plot got to the in-game November leadup to an election destined to be dominated by a foul and charming man full of corruption and buoyed up by his own cult of personality, the more I wanted to laugh/cry. It felt timely. It felt important. It felt right.

I went through Royal (in LP form on youtube, not having a platform to play it on) in summer of 2020, with a hook full of face masks by my front door and protests about racial tension and local policing that occasionally turned into not-quite-riots close enough to hear at night if I opened the windows of my apartment. The parts of the game that I remembered felt as prescient and meaningful as ever, if not even more so. The new parts felt baffling. Every single evil in the game felt utterly, painfully real, from the opening moments of police brutality to the idea of a country led by a guy who probably would use his secret illegitimate teenage son as a magical assassin if the opportunity presented itself and he thought he could get away with it. Yaldabaoth as the cumulative despair of an entire population who just wanted somebody to take over and make things be okay--yes, yes, god, in summer of 2020? With streets full of people refusing to wear masks and streets full of people desperate for change? Of course. Of course that holy grail of safety should be enticing. Of course it should be terrifying.

And then Maruki. Maruki, who was just so far outside the scope of anything I could relate to the rest of the game or my own life. Because every single other villain in the rest of Persona is real. From the petty pandering principal to the human-trafficking mob boss. The corrupt politicians and the manmade god of cultural desire for stability. And this game was trying to tell me that the very biggest threat of all of them, the thing that was worse than the collective force of all society agreeing to let this happen because succumbing was easier than fighting back--that the very biggest threat of all was that the world could be taken over by some random nobody's misguided attempts to help?

No. Fuck no. I don't buy it. Because god, yes, I have seen the pain and damage done on a tiny and personal and very real level by the tight-fisted control of someone trying to help, it never looked like this. Not some ascended god of a bad therapist. All the threats to the world, and that's the one I'm supposed to take seriously? This one man is more of a threat than the fundamental human willingness to be controlled?

Sorry, but no. Not for me. Not in this game. Not in this real-life cyberpunk dystopian apocalypse.

#c plays persona #driveby meta attack #p5 royal spoilers #p5 strikers spoilers #holy crap I did it #I actually wrote a semicoherent essay of a length I'm willing to put on Tumblr #about my problems with this game #I have been trying on and off for MONTHS #I wanted to like Royal SO BADLY #it makes me SO UPSET #anyway #now back to your regularly scheduled Hades blogging #asked and answered #Anonymous

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philliamwrites · 4 years ago

Text

One Fool’s Heart [Rank 5]

Fandom: Persona 5

Pairing: Akira / Reader, later: Akira / Akechi (one-sided)

Warnings: age difference, consensual underage romance, implied/referenced self-harm, implied/referenced child abuse, references to depression, unreliable narrator, angst, hurt & comfort, p3 cameos, p4 cameos, no persona 5 royal spoilers

Summary: All you wanted was a nice part time job to scrape by. But if you had known how much of a smug sass-master Akira Kurusu would turn out to be, you’d have thought twice about agreeing to tutor him.

Notes: Rank 4 | Rank 6 Masterlist

[Rank 5]

The first thing you remember about your father is that he loved to give piggy-back rides. Though in the pictures surfacing from a deep, black sea, it’s never quite clear if it’s you or your brother sitting on your dad’s shoulders, wagging tiny sticks at everything in your reach. Only the remembrance of summer with its humid air, the sweet smell of flowers and strawberries waiting on the veranda of your grandparent’s house in the countryside is palpable enough as evidence of some better time.

Now, those days feel like a different life. This man sitting in front of you doesn’t look anything like someone who would grab children and swirl them around while making plane noises to charm giggles and laughs out of them. No, in front of you is someone powerful enough to stripe a person from everything important to them with only a couple of words in the prospect of good payment and reputation.

You’re sitting at your tiny table, poking around the take-out your father has brought, now spread out in front of you. Background noises from the TV fill the silence. On the screen, a red haired girl is smiling into the camera, her straight back just as much of a statement as her next words. “… I don’t quite like The Phantom Thieves. In the end, people have to solve their problems on their own, I think.”

The presenter hums approvingly. “And that was our royal princess, Rin Amamiya, on the newest development of the Phantom Thieves,” he says. “We will keep you updated on her upcoming entrance to the Shujin Academy as a first year.”

The cutlery lands with a sharp sound on the table. When you look up, Dad is scowling at the TV. “What nonsense,” he says. “A group threatening our law system with their childish view of justice. It seems our media has too much latitude to cover a topic like that.”

You shrug, shoving vegetables from one side on your plate to the other. Before that, thinking about the Phantom Thieves has always left a sour taste in your mouth. Now, the spite towards them is replaced by a feeling of fellowship if it means opposing your father, so you say, “It seems they do better than some people I know.”

Heavy silence crawls like a beast, ready to pounce, and when you look up, Dad watches you with a strange expression. It’s close to how your mother would look if a cockroach would scurry around her kitchen floor.

“Why are you not eating?” he asks instead of pressing your previous statement. There’s so much of you in this little act, you feel sick.

“I’m not hungry.”

“Should I have brought nigiri with eel instead?” he continues, a small smile stealing into his stern expression. “You’ve always liked that.”

The sickness twists right into nausea as you drag your chair back, trying to get as much space between your bodies as possible.

“No, it’s Kinoe,” you say, curling your hands into fists at his confused stare. “Kinoe likes eel.”

“Ah, that’s right,” Dad says, not looking embarrassed in the slightest. “It’s always nice to remember the first time your brother had it.”

“Oh yeah? Just like how nice it is to remember how you left him rotting in that hospital?”

The little smile dies on his lips. Dad considers you with a scrutinising look, his eyes a steely mirror of your own.

“I don’t understand what gives you that impression,” he says, his voice several notes deeper. “Kinoe is in that place because he needs help. And he will get it from skilled people capable of fixing him.”

A shudder rips through your body. “He doesn’t need to be fixed ! What he needs is for you people to leave him alone and get him out of that … that prison!”

“I think you do not understand,” Dad says, collected and dissociated like he’s talking about a distant relative. Maybe that’s really how he sees his son. “You worry too much, and that worry prevents you from seeing the big picture. It makes you weak, and more importantly, it makes you hold on to something that will drag you down.” Dad gets up. He looms over you, and you hate how it makes you feel like a little child that is scolded for supposedly wrongdoings. “Let it go. If you don’t let go of what will drag you down, you won’t come far in this world.”

“I’m not—” You gasp for air, fighting the swelling tears piercing your eyes. “I won’t be like you.”

“And you will see how much you will regret that later.”

“Maybe you have stopped believing in him,” you say, rising in your seat, straightening your back to appear as confident as the girl from the news show. “But I won’t.”

Dad watches you, and for a moment, you see the anger blazing in his eyes before it quickly settles. It doesn’t calm your heartbeat. You’ve learnt that anything he has planned for you that isn’t his loud, unleashed furry, will be worse.

“So you won’t listen to reason. I give you a roof and a shelter. I give you a chance for education and prosperity. I ask of you one simple thing, and in return you question my ways and act like a child. If you stand against everything I hold high of value, then there is no need for me to give you what you so clearly despite. Your rent, your college tuition.” He raises an eyebrow in challenge at your shocked face.

All air leaves your lungs. “You can’t— you can’t do that,” you stammer. “You can’t have bothchildren fail the family.”

He must notice how you’re desperately clinging to whatever threads cross your mind. A pleased smile spreads on his lips as he goes to your couch where he’s left his suit jacket. “I can do as I please. I’m certain a lot of children would do anything to have the same opportunity you have, and your mother agrees.”

This is the last strike your heart can take. Your voice breaks when you nearly sob, “Just what happened to you?”

Dad looks from you to the TV screen where they’re broadcasting another report about a psychotic breakdown. He straightens his unwrinkled jacket and moves to the door.

“This is your last chance,” he says, slipping into his shoes. “I don’t want to hear anything from you about your brother.”

You stay silent, speechless in front of the giant abyss gaping in front of you, threatening to swallow you whole. Dad considers you a last time, his hand already on the doorhandle. “And call your mother from time to time. She’s upset there’s little she can tell her friends about your studies.” He doesn’t wait for a response, and only after the door closes behind him, you manage to come up with some sort of reaction. You remove your slipper and throw it at the door. “I HATE YOU!”

No one answers. You take the other slipper and throw it as well, the second bang even louder. “YOU’RE A MONSTER!”

Someone laughs behind you. A comedy is running, some people with painted faces dressed in animal costumes dance on the screen. Their joy only fuels your seething anger, the laid table with the take-away the only obstacle hindering you from punching the screen. So you kick the table instead and send the remaining food containers flying through the living room. It doesn’t stop there. Whatever gets in your hands ends up smashed against the walls or stomped. Before you can consider throwing your rice cooker against the TV, someone pounds on your door. A bolting fear strikes you. It’s Dad, ready to commit you to a hospital as well. Wiping your tears away, you arm yourself with a brush, ready to fight until the bitter end. Let’s see how he’ll like that to his face.

But behind the door is just Iori, standing there with a corncob in his hand. Over his shoulder, you see the door to his apartment standing wide open.

“Dude, are you okay?” he asks, his brows furrowed in worry. “It sounds like. Someone’s getting killed in there. Like. It’s really bad.”

“Well, I certainly wish someone was dead,” you mumble, staring at him and hoping he’ll get the meaning and leaves you alone. Iori nods like he’s been part of the catastrophic dinner with your dad and gets why you’re so angry.

“Sorry to hear that.” He tries to get a look over your shoulder. You get on your tiptoes.

“Here, I hope that makes you happy.” His corncob is still warm as he pushes it in your hands. You look back up at him. “Why?”

“Cuz when you’re upset, you’re hungry. And when you’re hungry, you get upset.” He taps a finger against his temple, grinning. “Simple math.”

Despite all things, you take a bite. He’s even taken the effort to put butter on it, and something little as that manages to ease the hold of the clutches of despair clawing at your back.

“Iori, what would I do without you.”

His brilliant smile is blinding. “Yeah, man. Sometimes I wonder the same.”

The next time Akira texts you, a couple of weeks have passed since his high tail. Since then, he’s cancelled most of your study sessions, each reason more vague than the previous until you’re convinced you won’t see him ever again. But then, finally, a message from him waits in your mail box, looking quite innocent and with proper grammar asking you to come around and help him for his upcoming finals. The lack of emojis and misspellings is the last evidence you needed to know your friendship is officially unrepairable. Speaking of unrepairable, throwing your furniture around wasn’t one of your brightest ideas and now you’re faced with additional expenses you don’t need with college tuition coming up, especially since you don’t know if your dad will keep his word or will let you have a first bitter taste of what will happen if you continue defying him. All in all, it certainly isn’t the best time to be you, and oh how much you wish you could shed your skin and become someone else.

The cicadas are unbearably loud in this part of Yongen-Jaya. Vendors hide in the shadows of their shops, their eyes following you with caution, but lacking their usual predatory glint. Inside Leblanc, you’re the only customer. You find Akira in a booth hunched over the table. Something squirms in his arms, a desperate meow drifts in a single note through the cafe. A tiny white paw pushes against Akira’s cheek. Morgana is cradled in his arms, but happiness looks different. His tiny feet struggle as he tries to break free out of Akira’s vice grip.

“Do I need to call the animal protection service?” you ask, sitting down and looking for Sojiro. Except for Akira, the cafe is empty.

Morgana gives you affirmative cries. Akira looks up, sleepiness colouring his eyes darker, and lies his cheek on Morgana’s belly. “I give him food and a place to sleep. That’s the least he can do for me.”

Morgana thinks otherwise as he chews on Akira’s temple stem. When he manages to wiggle free, Morgana jumps out of Akira’s arms, over the table and settles on your lap like he owns it, glaring at his owner across the table. To compensate for the trauma he’s experienced, you scratch Morgana behind his ears. When he starts purring, Akira gives him the look of utter betrayal.

“So we’re going to make you ready for finals, huh,” you say, trying to make small talk. “I can’t believe six months are already over.”

Akira doesn’t seem to want any of it. “Uh-huh,” he says, scrolling through his phone. You wait for the elaboration on that sound, but Akira remains quiet. With nothing left to say, you spread the materials on the table. Akira watches you like a predator on hunt.

“You wanna go over some stuff from last time?” you offer, trying to look past the gleam on his glasses.

Akira shakes his head. “Actually, we should wait a little more.”

“Wait?” You stop reaching out to the papers in front of you. “Wait for what?”

He hesitates the tiniest second, but it’s enough time. Behind you, the door opens and welcomes a gust of warm wind inside the room.

“Hey Akira! We got the snacks!” an all to familiar voice announces, followed by multiple feet stomping into the cafe.

“Ryuji, stop pushing!” Ann shoves him to the side like a bag of potatoes. Akira avoids your eyes as you turn around to greet his friends. Besides Ann and Ryuji, two other unfamiliar faces watch you with curious eyes.

“Oh, you made her come!” Ann exclaims, clapping her hands in excitement.

You look from them to Akira, then back to them. And back to Akira. A mischievous glint lights up his eyes, the breath hitching in his throat as he opens his mouth, then quickly presses his lips together when he notices you starring daggers at him. Seeing your murderous gaze, he seems to think twice before jumping on that innuendo and instead clears his throat.

“Yeah,” he says, looking away from you. “Just as promised.”

“Oh, really?” You swallow around the lump in your throat. “You guys wanted me to help you study?”

“Hell yeah!” Ryuji slides right into the seat next to you, glaring at Morgana sprawled over your lap as if just by the will of his stare he’s able to switch their positions. “Akira didn’t want at first, but come on! Except for our school’s Prez, there’s no one who can teach us that stuff better than someone who’s been through it all, right?”

You nod, the smile frozen on your face. Now that’s some news you could have gladly been spared today. No wonder Akira sounded so formal when he asked if you could come over. He must have really wanted to avoid you longer, were it not for his friends. And judging from what you now about him so far, he isn’t one to deny requests.

“Yeah, that’s no problem at all,” you say, quickly filling the silence before your lack of response became suspicious. It’s strange Akira didn’t tell you about the others coming though. Maybe he’d feared you’d decline. Or charge extra. Which you totally will, now that you think about it.

“Hello,” offers the other girl now sliding next to Akira. Her short brown hair curls around her jaw and falls over her forehead, just inches away from concerningly sharp, brown eyes. “Thank you so much for accepting us into your tutor schedule. I am Makoto Nijima.”

“It’s no problem at all,” you say, scooting over to the wall so Ann can fit next to Ruyji. The other boy in this round of strange teenagers takes the free place beside Makoto. He exchanges very suspicious looks with Akira, then proceeds to stare at you for a solid minute. Ignoring it succeeds only so long, before you give him a small, awkward smile. “Hi there?”

Makoto nudges him with her elbow.

“Ah, yes. My apologies, I am Yusuke Kitagawa. And you must be the one Akira has mentioned so often,” he says, nodding like he’s met with a revelation. Shuffling comes from somewhere next to you, a leg brushes against yours. Yusuke jumps slightly and glares at Ryuji, swallowing a gasp of pain. These kids should really learn a thing or two about subtlety.

“Anyyyway, how about we start?” Ann intervenes with her brilliant smile. “Looks like you’ve brought lots of material for us to go through!”

And that’s how one of the most awkward 90 minutes of your life start. Everyone’s brought a little something from their classes which is fine until you’re looking at tasks from English and suffer through some serious PTSD, thinking back to your English finals and entrance exams. Luckily Ann comes to your rescue, and that’s how you get to know a little bit about everyone that day; that Ann’s half Finnish with a love for sweets that surpasses every child’s; that Yusuke likes to fill every blank space in his notebook with studies of hand drawings, glancing at Akira’s for reference; that Makoto is a junkie for brightly coloured sticky notes with a brain that is just beautiful to hear thinking; that Ryuji absentmindedly kneads his right knee whenever he’s struggling to come up with the solution to a task. The only slate remaining the same, filled with little to no facts, is Akira’s. He's still refusing to acknowledge you, his attention shifting smoothly between his friends and only turning to you if it's necessary. He knows how to keep conversations polite without ending on an awkward note, and seems somewhat relieved once you stop trying to talk to him. If that’s how he wants to play it, then so be it, but he’s underestimating you big time if he thinks you won’t confront him about that once you’re alone.

“Maaan, I can’t do this,” Ryuji groans. He stretches and leans back, his pen long forgotten between textbooks, and takes up too much space between the three of you in a booth that’s meant for two people. Ann thinks the same and drills her elbow in his side.

“Can’t you focus for at least five minutes? You’re disturbing everyone else,” she says, twirling long strands of golden hair around her finger.

Ryuji gives her a nasty glare, rubbing his side. “I can’t work like that, man. I need some kind of motivation or else nothing’s gonna happen.”

“Not failing your test should be motivation enough for you, shouldn’t it?” Makoto offers, not looking up from the sentence she’s writing down.

Ryuji grumbles to himself, then perks up. “Oh, I got it! Fireworks! We should go and see the fireworks!”

Several heads look up, their expressions varying from interested to doubting. Ryuji quickly continues now that he has everyone’s attention. “It’s on the 18th, after finals, and it’ll totally make up for all the anxiety and stress I’m going through right now. Plus, like … there’s another. Reason. Right. Akira?” he says, jerking his chin towards Makoto between every last word. It’s obvious there’s something he can’t say out loud, and Akira immediately picks up on it. Yusuke not so much.

“Another reason?” he asks, abandoning his math equation. “Which is?”

Ann’s forced smile is threatening to split her face in half. “Oh, you know, Yusuke! Celebrating that Makoto became one of our friends.”

Whatever this is, its cringe is too painful to watch. For a brief moment, you consider calling them out; telling them that you know ‘friends’ stands for something completely different and you’re onto them.

Yusuke, the sweet summer child, asks, looking at you, “I see, of course! Then please, would you come with us? Now that you’re also our friend, it would only be fair to invite you as well!”

Several heads snap in his direction, the reactions going from a hissed “Yusuke” to a hushed “Take the hint, man”. Only Akira is looking at you, probably evaluating how much you’re interpreting from everyone’s reaction.

Needless to say, it’s a lot. You can clearly see you’re unwanted, and even Morgana has sympathy with you as he rubs his chin on your bare thigh. Or maybe he just wants you to resume patting him.

“I don’t think that’s a good idea,” Akira finally offers, staring back down on his task like it needs his complete concentration. “She has enough to do for college. It would be bad if we stole more of her time, right?”

“That’s not for you to decide,” you don’t snap at him because you like to think you have that much dignity. “Yeah,” you agree instead. “Deadlines coming up and stuff.”

“Oh, that’s too bad,” Ann says, slightly wincing herself at the relief in her voice. “But maybe next time!”

You’re pretty sure there won’t be a next time, but you nod nonetheless so they don’t feel bad about it.

After the session, you join Ann and the rest when they leave Leblanc, seeing as there is no way to get a hold of Akira and talk to him in private with how he avoids you like the plague. Outside, the streets are much cooler. More people linger around the shops, drawn out of their homes and now more active in the evening hours. Your little group moves towards the underground station, and you’d really like to say how strange it is to hang out with those youngsters, but something about them all appears age-less, like they don’t follow basic laws of nature, defying the very notion that age is something that might differentiate people. That is until Ryuji sees the poster of the game Punch Ouch coming out soon and turns into a four year old, getting so excited he starts pulling at everyone’s clothes.

“Why is he such an idiot,” Ann says beside you, wearing an exhausted expression. You sort of want to admit that it gives him a certain kind of charm, but Ann quickly continues, “By the way, thanks again for today! Now I finally get why Akira’s been on top of our class for so long.”

“I think he’s a smart guy by default,” you say, but the compliment flatters you nonetheless, especially coming from Ann.

“Oh, totally,” she agrees, quickly checking herself out in the reflection of a window. “Sometimes it feels like he’s soo much older than us.”

“Akira certainly is very mature for his age,” Makoto joins in. One thing you’ve noticed is her unnervingly straight back and drawn back shoulders, a posture your mother surely would love to see on you as well. Thinking of her, you hunch even more. “I’m sure that whatever he’s planned for his future, it will work out in his favour.”

“Not with that sassy attitude of his,” you mutter, but no one picks it up. Seriously, if you had known how much of a sass-master Akira turned out to be, you’d have thought twice about agreeing tutoring him. Not that it matters anymore. When you said your goodbyes earlier, he didn’t say anything when you missed out on telling him what to do for next sessions or that you’ll see each other next time. Seems like it’s time for you to look for a new job.

“It’ll be the first time me going confident into exams,” Ann chirps, glancing briefly at Ryuji and Yusuke arguing about something. “Remind me to invite you to crêpe next time we meet!”

“I think we should all think about little thank you gift,” Makoto agrees. “We wouldn’t want you to think Akira is surrounded by inconsiderate jerks.”

You don’t quite follow how it matters what you think of them, but it’s certainly refreshing meeting someone so polite.

“The only jerk we got around is Morgana,” Ryuji unhelpfully joins, earning an exasperated sigh from Ann that sounds like this isn’t the first time they're holding this kind of conversation. Instead of starting another argument though, she turns back to you and says, “But I was kind of surprised how at ease Morgana was around you. You must be hanging out a lot with them, right?”

Multiple eyes wait for your answer, and somehow you feel no matter what you say, there isn’t a right one.

“Sort of,” you drag out, pretending the colourful adverts hanging on the buildings need your full attention. “But like Akira said, I’ve been busy lately, so …”

“The cat’s just friendly cause you’re a girl,” Ryuji clarifies, rolling his eyes. Ann kicks him. “But man, they’re both so lucky living above that cafe and all,” he continues. “I’d pay anything to have Boss make me some of his sick curry every day.”

Yusuke mutters something that sounds like “as if you could appreciate the fine craftsmanship of that”. You just stop listening to whatever Ryuji snaps back.

“By the way, does any of you know why he lives there?” you ask into the round. “Boss is what? A relative? Or just someone who took him in?”

The kids grow quiet all of a sudden. They exchange those looks; looks that say more than words, looks only shared by people who are intimate with each other.

Ryuji breaks the silence first. “Truth is, he got involved into some real stupid—”

Makoto cuts him off with a sharp glare. “Ryuji.”

“It would be best you ask him yourself,” Yusuke provides with a stern expression. “We are in no position to talk about his situation.”

Situation he calls it. You don’t press further, respecting these kid’s loyalty. If you needed any further proof that Akira is surrounded by friends who really cherish him, this is certainly the selling argument. What still bothers you though is that chances are high Akira won’t tell you even if you ask him. Akira is an enigma you can’t solve because every time you think you have the solution for a part, it turns out it doesn’t fit at all and instead opens a dozen new riddles. It’s frustrating, and disheartening, but you stand firm to what you told Akira all those weeks ago. If he thinks he can get rid of you that easily, you’re up for the challenge to prove him wrong.

“I need to get laid and you’re going to help me.”

You look up from your essay, only a couple hundred words away from finishing it and going into a long overdue relaxing weekend. Whatever Kenji Tomochika sees in your face, it isn’t the reaction he’s expected because he immediately turns on his begging strategy and drapes himself over your table, covering your books with his body. Kenji is a nice guy. A little too eager to please, and what he lacks in theoretical understanding, he makes up with a lot of on point intuition that borders on scary. As a law senior, he’s already done with most of the obligatory part and now focuses on looking for a place to finish all his internships. With his natural flirty tendency, it’s a surprise he’s asking anybody for help. You’ve heard from a third party that he used to date a teacher back in high school, but you take them for what they are. Rumours.

“Come oooon, I promise I’m gonna prepare all your presentation slides for the rest of this term,” he offers, blinking up at you.

You ignore his pleading eyes. “No offence, but your slides tend to be the most useless I’ve ever seen.”

“More like full offence,” Kenji mutters, leaning back. “It’s not like you have I any other plans for today evening. Right?”

“Maybe I do.”

“Narukami’s outta town. You don’t hang out with anyone else. I’m willing to spend some time with you out of the goodness of my heart. There’s literally no reason to decline.”

You answer with the most blank expression you can muster, hoping Kenji fills it himself with a clear One reason is simply I don’t want to hang out with you. Kenji remains clueless.

“Don’t tell me there’s no one else who wants to be your wingman,” you say.

Kenji looks sheepishly away. “You’re the only one I trust.”

What a smooth gremlin. Plus you’ve always been weak to dimples and oh boy, Kenji uses his like a sharp weapon cutting down your defences. It’d be great if someone could finally put a leash on him and stop him from flirting with everything that fancies two legs.

“When and where?”

Kenji’s eyes light up like a child’s. “I could kiss you.” You don’t miss his hand sneaking up to your thigh. “Actually, if you wanna—”

“I’m going to chop off something very important to you if you don’t take your hands off,” you say, not looking away from your essay. Kenji gives a nervous little chuckle, but pulls his hand away with lightning-speed.

So that is how you end up standing in front of Crossroads, a popular bar tugged away under a large office building in Shinjuku. Kenji is fashionably late, as always, but when he finally arrives ten minutes past your meeting time, you can’t stop the groan once he stands in front of you.

“What are you wearing?”

Kenji looks at his attire, tuxedo and tie looking sharp like they just came out of the cleaners. “Why, what’s wrong?”

“We’re going to a bar, not to the Prime Minister’s wedding.”

“You think the Prime Minister would invite me?!”

You groan again, pushing him towards the door. “Just get inside.”

The interior hasn’t changed much since your last visit a couple of months ago. Pinkish-red light throws black shadows into the corners of the room. Lots of patrons linger around, even though it’s barely 8. You can hear Lala’s smooth, deep voice rumbling through the air, the sweet smell of booze lingering everywhere. Undeniably, this establishment has class and all of a sudden you feel out of place and wished you were wearing something as fancy as Kenji, who seems to read your mind and gives you a smug jerk of his chin, celebrating his own attire.

“Welcome to Crossroads,” someone greets you from behind the bar, and your legs freeze, succeeding in Kenji walking right into you. You can’t believe it. Behind the bar stands a lanky boy wearing an apron, thick black curls sticking in every direction. Motherfucker.

“What are you doing here?” you ask Akira who blinks innocently at you like he’s never been anywhere else than in this bar. He’s scrubbing a glass, and nods at you like a cowboy who doesn’t want to hurt another cowboy.

“Welcome,” he repeats. “What can I bring you?”

So that’s the game he wants to play. Fine, you’re pretty good at ignoring people as well, so you pull Kenji towards the farthest seat away from the bar, ignoring his complains about how you’re putting wrinkles in his suit jacket. Unfortunately, he thwarts your brilliant plan by growing roots and remains right there in front of the bar stools.

“Wait, let’s just sit down here and have the booze keep coming,” he says, and sits down right in front of Akira. You don’t miss how Kenji sneaks glances to the girl in a pink evening dress sitting two stools to his left. Akira considers you for two seconds, then moves to the far right, away from you. Kenji looks after him with apparent interest like a shark that’s scented blood from miles away.

“You know him?” he asks the unavoidable, and now you’re feeling really petty, so you answer loud enough for Akira to hear, “Barely.”

Kenji doesn’t look like he believes you. The girl in the pink dress sitting beside him doesn’t look like she believes you. Behind you, Akira coughs what suspiciously sounds like “Liar.” You refuse to acknowledge him, and Kenji thankfully doesn’t comment on it as well. Finally, Lala comes around and greets you, flipping ash in an ashtray next to the sink and looking astonishing as always in her beautiful kimono.

“Why, if this isn’t Kenji. Nice of you to show your face again after all this time,” she greets him, then immediately turns to you. “And this your girlfriend?”

“I wish,” Kenji says at the same time you throw back, “Heck no.”

Lala doesn’t even blink. “Yes, you do seem too good for him.”

When Kenji complains, she softly chucks the bottom of his chin with a loose fist and smiles, promising to serve you two drinks right away. She’s just everything you aspire to be.

“Look at her, treating me like I’m a little kid,” Kenji mumbles, picking on his paper towel. His eyes quickly shift to the girl, before he picks himself up again and straightens his back. No time can mentally prepare you for what he’s planned to pick her up. “But back to what I was telling you! I’m currently working with pharmaceutical companies. They were looking for a prosecutor who’s got experience in that industry, and well,” he says, wiggling his eyebrows. “There’s no one better than me.”

Oh God, how often did you tell him that gloating about himself isn’t the best ice breaker. You say, “Great,” but it comes off too dry, so you clear your throat and try again with as much awe as you can stuff in your voice, “Grrreeaaat.” Kenji nods eagerly, and then starts rambling about some bad cases and some worse co-workers, and it becomes really hard to focus on what he says and react accordingly. At least the drinks Lala keeps serving are a nice consolation for the evening that you lose. You’re basically just slurping away your drink during Kenji’s frantic speech, when suddenly something hits the back of your head. When you turn around, a little nut clatters to the ground. Kenji looks over your shoulder, staring down at the little thing.

“Woah, where did that come from?”

You have a pretty good idea, and when you raise your eyes, there’s only one person in your sight. Akira whistles like it’s no one’s business, but he left the bowl with nuts and raisins close to him intentionally so you can see them. You take a deep breath. Maybe his hand slipped or something.

“Okay, and so how did the case end?” you resume the conversation, squaring your shoulders so Akira can see they’re a wall separating you two. If Akira understands your idea, he answers by using nuts as bullets to tear it down. Another nut lands against the back of your head. Then another, then another. The fifth gets stuck in your hair. Carefully, Kenji points at it with his finger. “You got, uhm. You know, there’s—”

Akira snorts and that’s when you snap. You jump to your feet, glaring at him. “What the heck is your problem?!”

He whirls around and slams both hands on the counter. “What the heck is your problem?”

“You can’t do that, I asked first!”

“Well, I don’t want to answer!”

“Kids, if you don’t settle down in three seconds, I will throw you out of my bar,” Lala chirps from the side, her glare sending chills down your spine. You stare at Akira. “I’ll meet you after your shift.”

Akira gives a sharp nod. “Behind the vending machines at 11. And no kicking!” he yells after you like you’re elementary school kids after you slam some coins on the bar and stomp outside, ignoring Kenji calling your name. The cool evening air will surely calm you. The dozens visual stimulations will surely distract you before you come up with the best way to strangle Akira. If he thinks you’ll go easy on him for ignoring and then annoying you, he’s got something bad coming.

Akira is waiting for you exactly where you planned, leaning against the wall with both hands stuffed in his pockets. Even from a distance, you can clearly see the tension in his shoulders, and you think, Good, he better be nervous about this. You raise your chin when you’re finally standing in front of him. Akira looks down at (on?) you, and immediately you feel your temper boil again.

“Are you going to apologise or what?” you demand, putting both hands on your hips to underline how upset you are like a mom chiding her child. Immediately, your arms drop, but you stand firm. Akira cocks an eyebrow at you. “For what?”

The coldness in his voice cuts you like a sharp shard of glass. It’s a new side of Akira you haven’t seen before, one you’re not willed to face without fighting back.

“Oh, you know. For being a jerk?”

Akira looks at you like you’re speaking a different language, like the very notionof him being connected to that word just doesn’t exist in his understanding of the world. He leans his head back against the wall, exposing the elegant curve of his neck. “Don’t know what you’re talking about.”

“Why are you such an ass?” you hiss, feeling your patience dissipate with every second. “I didn’t do anything to you, did I? Or is this your stupid idea of keeping me away because of Kaneshiro?”

Akira’s eye twitches. He pushes himself off the wall, now looming over you. “This has nothing to do with Kaneshiro,” he hisses, voice gravely low. “You still shouldn’t say his name out loud where his thugs might hear you.”

Okay, point taken. “So, why then? Did you just spontaneously decide you’re not interested in—” me you almost say, but quickly finish with “— being friends anymore?” If he says Yes, it will probably be the biggest friendship you’ll regret. Already you have poured too soon too much from yourself into it, and it will be difficult to pick up the pieces Akira might decide to throw away once he walks away from you.

A shadow jumps over Akira’s face. For a second, he seems uncertain, but it quickly makes way to a frown. “I just thought you might want to spend more time with your boyfriend instead of wasting time on tutor hours.”

You squint up at him, unsure if you’ve heard right. “Excuse me, what?”

“You heard me quite clear,” Akira says, his tone back to freezing point save for a little tremor that betrays him.

Since you can’t decide on either smacking or kicking him, you settle for a weak punch to his side, affectively damaging nothing at all. “You are. Really, really, really stupid … for someone who’s on top of his class.”

Akira blinks. ”Did you just call me dumb.”

“What boyfriend?” you almost shriek. “Who says I have a boyfriend?”

“I—” Akira starts, then points at the crook of his neck. There’s nothing on his skin, so his argument falls flat, until he points at you and miraculously, you connect the dots. Both hands raise to your face as you bless Akira with one of your rare face palms.

“Akira,” you say into the palm of your hands. “Why the fuck would you read something like that into a hickey.”

Akira gives a half-gasp, and when you peak through your fingers, you see his dumbfounded expression. “It’s a hickey? Who else would give you one?”

You don’t even understand why you have this kind of conversation. Why Akira caresabout something so personal. Feeling you’re already too deep down the rabbit hole, you decide it can’t get any worse.

“Akira, there’s this thing called one-night stand,” you yell-whisper, and feel a tiny, smug satisfaction when all colour drains from his face. He opens his mouths, then closes it. The fight almost leaves his body, but doubles back. Akira hisses, “How was I supposed to know?”

“Not at all!” you hiss back, just faintly acknowledging that you’re standing close enough to each other for your toes to touch. “Because there’s another thing you should learn a thing or two about and that’s privacy.”

Akira looks ready to fight you for his honour and principles, and it takes a second or two before you realise he’s freaking sulking. You’re ready to hand him his ass, promising some direly needed lessons in basic human interaction which doesn’t include assuming about other people’s relationship status and acting like an asshole because of it, but suddenly you remember Makoto calling Akira mature for his age and God, how you wish you could save this moment via video and show her that no, Akira is a fucking brat who acts like a little kid who is denied playing with his favourite toy—and that makes you laugh and dissolve the tension inside you.

Akira interprets it wrong, and you can see tiny red blotches on his face. It looks charming on his pale skin. “Oh, that’s rich. Yeah, keep laughing at me.”

“I’m not—” you start, but don’t know how to finish. Eventually, you only come up with, “Akira, what are we doing here?”

Akira gives you a scrutinising look. “We’re fighting, and no one’s winning. Which sucks because I like winning.”

“Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think anyone is happy with this.”

Akira presses his mouth into a thin line, then relaxes, and just like that, the air leaves his lungs and he slumps back, defeated. It’s all you need to know everything is going to be okay.

“Come on, I’m buying you a sandwich,” you say, tugging at the hem of his shirt.

Akira follows reluctantly. “Why a sandwich.”

“So you can be the idiot sandwich that you are.”

Akira grunts, a barely passable laugh. It uncoils a tight knot in your stomach, allowing you to breathe easier.

The good thing about any of the big districts in Tokyo is that most shops and stalls are still open past midnight. The streetfood is famous for its high price but amazing taste. You decide on okonomiyaki, and take a free bench in Toyama Park. Since it’s mostly couples strolling under the dim lanterns and dark trees, holding hands and leaning into each other, you leave an arm’s length between you and Akira out of politeness, and dig in.

“It feels like we haven’t talked in ages,” Akira admits, chewing on his plastic spoon. You could tell him that yeah, it’s been almost a whole month, but you don’t want him to think you’re keeping tabs on how often you see each other.

“Yeah, you look like you’ve grown again, bean sprout,” you say, dodging Akira’s foot trying to nudge yours.

“Plus I’m getting a serious sense of déjà vu,” he continues. “Our last fight ended with me apologising as well, didn’t it?”

“You want me to make a tally for that?” you offer smiling, but your words lack any bite.

Akira manages a little smile. “I’m sorry. That makes it the third or fourth, counting each time I was a jerk to you.”

“Forget about it. As long as it doesn’t happen again.”

“Promise.”

And you really believe him because it doesn’t seem far fetched that Akira is someone who treats promises like a holy oath. With the air cleared between you, but now tense, you really want to lay it to rest, and your brain provides a strange topic out of the dumpster that your memory sometimes is: “By the way, I heard The Phantom Thieves dealt with Kaneshiro. Pretty convenient, huh?”

Akira’s head snaps up. “What?”

You turn around. “What?”

Akira looks like a dear caught in front of a car’s headlights. “I mean, you heard about that?”

“It was basically everything everyone talked about, right? Hard not to hear about it."

“Yeah.” Akira gives a strained laugh. “Convenient.”

“You know, I gave them a lot of shit when they turned up, but lately, I’ve been wondering if they’re actually really doing something good for our society,” you admit, avoiding Akira’s eyes. He’s nice enough not to gloat about it, and asks quietly, “How come?”

“Well, they’re just … they’re doing something?” you offer weakly. “It might be wrong how they do it. But so far, all their targets deserved it? They take down corrupt people, so … they must be good, right?” You hate the insecurity in your voice just as much as all those questions. Since your fight with your dad, you’ve been checking out the Phansite a lot more, trying to keep up with the news and comments. Especially the request section caught your interest, and more than once you caught yourself wondering if you should try it out yourself, asking them to change your Dad’s heart. But they wouldn’t notice your post, not with all the flooding messages coming in. At least that’s the convenient excuse you tell yourself.

Occupied with all these questions, you only notice Akira talking to you when he lightly puts the tips of his fingers on your bare thigh.

“They try to help,” he says, his fingers remaining on your skin even though you’re already paying attention to him. “But they would also not be doing what they do were it not for people like Madarame and Kaneshiro.”

And Dad, you think grimly, looking down where Akira’s fingers slightly dip into your skin. He waits another second before finally pulling back, his back straight—a clear indicator that he’s preparing himself for something you won’t like.

“Can I … uhm … ask how your brother is doing?”

Your body tenses, but your brain luckily doesn’t answer with a counterattack immediately. Apparently, your heart has accepted Akira trying to creep inside.

“He’s fine … I guess,” you mumble. Really talking about it is too early, especially since you’re still sorting out how to replace the broken furniture after the fallout with your dad. But it doesn’t leave you choking on raw emotions which is a good start. “After giving you shit for your behaviour last time, I guess I owe you an explanation, don’t I.”

Akira slowly shakes his head, but it lacks determination.There’s never a good way to start talking about it, so you just set out to be done with it as fast as possible.

“He’s in a psychiatric clinic. My parents think he’s a danger to himself and those around him, so they try to lock him away, but the only thing they care about is their reputation. You see, you can’t be anything but perfect, and to them depression is a sickness you can just … just carve out of you or something if you try hard enough. So they leave him there. They let the doctors do their work, but they don’t really do anything.” Your voice is barely audible now, just a remnant of breath left stuck somewhere inside you. “They don’t care about his wellbeing as well.”

Just thinking about it flares the sharp agony of grief up in your chest—you feel as you imagined a fish caught on a hook might feel, twisting and turning to get away from the spike of pain driven into its flesh.

Beside you, Akira ruffles his hair and mutters, “It all comes back to adults, huh.”

Certainly not the reaction you expected. When you look over to Akira with confusion clearly in your eyes, he huffs a little sigh, and leans back against the bench, looking up into the treetops. A hand comes up to tug at his bangs, and you can’t help but wonder how his hair would feel between your fingers.

“Originally, I’m from a little town called Yamato south from Tokyo,” he says. Your heart stumbles, not believing what’s about to happen. But before you can tell Akira he doesn’t need to feel pressured talking about himself, he drops the bomb. “And now I live here on probation.”

Immediately, your back rises straighter. “Probation?” You exhale slowly, voice shaky as you try to joke. “Is this the moment you tell me you murdered someone?”

And that’s how Akira tells you the story of someone trying to do the right thing, only for it to backfire like a high caliber cannon because of two horrendous adults, one suing, the other betraying him. The story leaves a bitter taste in your mouth, and even though you know how most cases like that go about, and how small justice stands for someone so young facing a powerful politician, you can’t help but protest. “Why didn’t you speak up?” you ask Akira like it could be that easy. “You did nothing wrong!”

Akira doesn’t look at you, his expression somewhat impassive. “Why should I? They wouldn’t have believed me anyway. I was branded a delinquent, so I played the role.”

“Still, it’s so wrong,” you say as if Akira doesn’t know it himself. “And what’s up with your parents, just going with it and sending you away?”

Akira shrugs, but he’s started kneading the back of his neck, clearly not wanting to talk more about them.

“So my parents suck, and your parents suck,” you conclude, kicking pebbles around like a petulant child. “The question is, what are we going to do about it?”

“Hmmm.” Akira’s hand falls back to his side, resting on the bench with its open palm facing you. You really want to press your thumb inside and see if the skin is soft or calloused. “I don’t know about my parents, but I’m pretty sure something can be done about yours,” he says.

“Oh, pfff. Yeah.” You roll your eyes. “What do you youngsters say? Only ‘until Hell freezes over?’”

Akira raises an eyebrow.

“You know, it’s impossible. With my parents. And did you actually now that Dante has Hell frozen in his work? Cause he had balls. And knew heat rises. So it makes perfect sense for the deepest part of Hell to be freaking ice cold,” you add, rambling on and on to ignore how light you feel after telling him about your family, and even more that he’s trusted you with a little honesty of himself. Maybe it’s the only way to cope. A little sadness for a little sadness.

“So not so impossible after all,” Akira remarks, smiling to himself like he’s just solved a secret.

“You can give me a call once you’ve figured something out,” you say, and then add with a grin, “country boy.”

Akira groans. “Please don’t.”

“Country roads, Take me home,” you start singing. Akira looks like he wants to strangle you. “To the place, I beLONG.”

“Who’s behaving like an ass now,” Akira says, crumbling his leftover food paper back into a little ball. He throws it in the garbage bin a couple feet away from you, hitting bullseye. You whistle.

“I gotta go back before Sojiro decides he won’t let me out at night,” Akira says, standing up and stretching his long limbs. “He may be nice to all my friends, but he’s going to hand me my ass if I don’t show my best side.”

“I’m sure he just wants the best for you,” you say, standing up as well, stretching as well. Not looking at how the muscles in Akira’s arm strain when he pulls them high above his head.

“Yeah,” Akira breathes, his face softening when he turns into the orange light of the lantern. “Probably.”

“I want the best for you too, you know,” you mumble, poking his side with a loose fist. “So we’re going back to our regular schedule, and you can bet your ass I’m going to make you work on everything you’ve missed.”

“Yeah,” Akira breathes again, this time smiling with his eyes as the skin around them crinkles slightly. “I’m looking forward to it.”

It’s good to be back, to return to your routine of going to Leblanc and enjoy some good quality coffee while watching Akira work on tasks you’ve deliberately made a little harder just to test how much smarter he really is than he lets on. So far, he hasn’t disappointed you, but you get the feeling it’s because he’s agreed to play your little game for now. So you decided to change tactics today, entering Leblanc with a stride that speak volumes of what you consider to be your victory. Akira is already waiting for you, but he’s not alone. On top of him him, another boy is pretty much lying on him, one hand curled tight around Akira’s left wrist where Akira is holding something, the other propping his weight on the back of the seat. Akira is the first to notice you, and he stops his struggle against the other boy who uses that split moment of distraction to reclaim whatever Akira was holding in his hand, when he finally follows Akira’s eyes and looks at you and, wow, you think, that is Goro freaking Akechi jumping Akira’s bones.

“You want me to come again once you’ve finished?” you ask. A quick glance to Sojiro for help tells you that he’s ignoring you all in favour of staying out of whatever bullshit Akira’s gotten himself into now. You could learn a lot from him.

“This … this is not what it looks like,” Akechi quickly says, scrambling to his feet.

“Honey, saying it like that makes it exactly look what it looked like,” Akira unhelpfully adds. Akechi throws him a quick nasty glare, then smooths the nonexistent creases out of his uniform and strides with as much dignity as he can maintain to the exit, giving you a bright, if forced smile. “If you excuse me.”

You make room for his leave, slowly returning your gaze to Akira, who’s still half draped over the seat, and you try go ignore the stripe of skin showing where his shirt has shifted up.

“You’re friends with the famous Junior Detective Prince?” you ask, closing the distance until you sit down opposite from him.

Akira’s eyes wander to a spot above your head, then back to the notebook in front of him. “Something like that,” he says, and opens the notebook, signalling the end of this topic. Now that’s interesting, and totally none of your business, so you push it far away in your mind. Also, why doesn’t he call you Honey. Not that it matters. You hate pet names anyway.

Just like you’ve expected, Akira needs a little more time to figure out the solution to the math equations, but he manages to come up with the right result using a completely different formula because apparently even the logics of mathematics succumb to Akira and act in this favour. No matter that, the sight of him think and fiddle with his pen, twirling it between his slender fingers and occasionally pushing the end against his lips is a good compensation for your loss this round. You just love looking at this hands, the very one Yusuke has used as reference to fill pages of his notebook, and you remember you read somewhere that beautiful hands are somewhat religious, worthy of worshipping. If this doesn’t speak Akira’s name, you don’t know what does.

But you notice he’s working slower today than usual, mainly because he keeps looking at the door like he expects someone to come. Or maybe return, you realise, thinking back to how Akira’s free hand was splayed on the small of Akechis’ back.

Oh, you think, looking at the faint red finger marks on Akira’s left wrist. Oh shit.

#philliamwrites #ao3 #fanfiction #reader insert #persona 5 #p5 #akira kurusu #ren amamiya #persona 5 joker #akira kurusu x reader #ren amamiya x reader #persona 5 joker x reader #reader #goro akechi

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casualotptrash · 4 years ago

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Why the Persona 3 FES vs Portable Debate Makes Me Want to Fly Into the Sun Pt. 3

Part 1 | Part 2 | Part 3

Da da da daaa!

Part 3 of this lovely emotional rant is here, for anyone who wants to spend their time reading these. With the last two posts, I have mostly tried to be informative or just complain a bit about why this debate makes me want to fly into the sun, but for this post it’s going to go a little different. Perhaps a bit more subjective than the others.

In this post, I’m going to go over everyone's favorite clusterfuck...a definitive version of Persona 3.

Now, as we established in the previous post, we know that the argument of FES vs Portable is essentially pointless because everyone’s opinion on either game is subjective. However, I have neglected to bring up this topic that puts a huge ass nail into this dusty old coffin: the fact that there is objectively no definitive version of Persona 3.

Everyone can argue all day and night about which version of P3 is better, but no one can deny that either version are “definitive.” By definitive, I mean that the game has the most content that is offered, like Persona 4 Golden or Persona 5 Royal. The reason none of the P3 games are definitive is because base P3 lacks stuff from FES and Portable, FES lacks stuff fro Portable, and Portable lacks things from FES. It’s a gamble of whether you want to experience cutscenes, an overworld, and The Answer, or a whole new route with the FeMC and the brand new option of dating male party members and saving...you know who.

One might be able to say FES is definitive because it has The Answer, which I believe is considered canon according to the Arena games. Another could say Portable is the definitive version because it came out after FES, added the FeMC (who is technically canon as per the second Persona Q game), and removes The Answer (which a lot of people said The Answer messed with the core theme of P3). However, the definition of definitive in this case, and with all of the other games, is that the game offers the most content. Arguably, FES and Portable provide the same amount of content, just in different ways. This is why this whole conversation of which one is better, or which to play first, spawned in the first place.

The reason I am bringing this up in this post, about why this whole discussion physically pains me, is because having a real, definitive version of the game could finally put this discussion to rest. At least, it somewhat would. People would probably still argue that FES is the best for some reason.

Now, the argument becomes...well, what does a definitive version of Persona 3 look like?

I have seen quite a bit about this topic, and people seem to really miss some common sense points. For example, they get caught up in whether it would be considered a remake or a remaster. I know some use those terms interchangeably, but the “official” definition for each is that a remake is a game that is made from scratch, while a remaster is made by updating the existing assets and engine. For example, the upcoming Nocturne HD release is a remaster. Personally I find it difficult to neatly fit the typical persona definitive editions, like Golden and Royal, into either of these categories. It may just be me not fully grasping the differences between the two, but I believe they would fit into more of the “remaster” category. It is true that there are new assets and content being added to the game, but it’s so minor that I’m not sure it could be considered a remake. On the other hand, because new content is added it couldn’t just be defined as a remaster because typically the effects and such aren’t even changed that much. It’s just gameplay and story content that is tweaked.

When people get so caught up in what it would be considered, logic seems to...go out the window? For example, in a debate between a P3 remaster or remake, a person made a comment that if a remake was to happen then people would demand that all of the social links be available to anyone. Now, that just isn’t possible for a variety of reasons. There’s no way we could ever mix and match social links to get a preferred grouping. Another issue with this is that if just a remaster was made, then one of the two games would be left out.

This is why I don’t really think about whether a definitive edition is a remaster or remake, because using such strict labels make it harder to judge what could, or should, be in one. This is why I’m just referring to this process as making a definitive edition. That being said, I would consider a definitive P3 game to be more of a remake (not that it really matters) because my ideas would essentially combine FES and Portable, in a way?

So here we go, into my idea of what a definitive version of Persona 3 would look like. (Warning: This will contain spoilers for all of the P3 story and *gasp* may be a bit biased toward Portable because I like it more)

1. Presentation

In simple terms, I would want the game to essentially be Portable...but with updated graphics, cutscenes from FES, and an overworld. It’s easier to use Portable as a base because it’s already closer to the format of P4 and P5, so then adding in the good parts of FES with the cutscenes and overworld are par for the course. As far as graphics go, I would like the models and environment to look more like P3D (aka whatever engine they used for Persona 5?) because damn did the characters get a glow up.

2. Gameplay

Along with the format of Portable, I would also want the gameplay of Portable to be in this definitive version. That means no jealousy system, no fatigue until after you leave tartarus, the vision quest, and the other changes I mentioned in the first post. Sorry FES fans, but yes...I would still want the option of controllable party members. However, a new change that should be added is backup members earning exp. I don’t think baton passes or anything should be added, we don’t want a clone of P5, and the combo attacks in P3P kind of fill this role anyway. The idea of having social links give certain perks with ranks, like how confidants work in P5, is interesting but I don’t think it would be necessary. I would also say that the soundtrack should be exclusive for each side, like how it is in Portable, and that there should be an option to choose which skills are inherited.

3. Social Links

The stance I would take with social links would essentially be how Portable did it, but with a slight tweak. No matter how much it would be cool to date Rio or Saori as the Male MC, or vice versa with Kaz or Keisuke and FeMC, I don’t think any mixing of the two sides would really be feasible. However, I would love to see cameos of those characters in the opposing routes. For example, you see Yuko and Kaz in the female route, but in the male route you could see Saori and Rio at school. That being said, and this is probably one of the biggest issues, I would want the male protag to be able to have social links with the entire party, men included. This brings up the issue of what social links you would cut out because you can’t have two social links be the exact same arcana. Unless they want to add more arcanas to the game, which would probably not go over well either, the best option is probably to prioritize the male party members and then have who would usually be in their place just show up sometimes. For example, Kenji would show up in the social link with Junpei instead of the magician social link just being about one or the other.

I know this seems weird, but it does kind of avoid shafting one or the other. If it was too hard to fit the two together (such as Chihiro and Ken both being Justice), perhaps a few more school scenes could be added where the MC interacts with the school friends that are not seen as much (Kenji, Chihiro, etc.) However, and this might piss off 1% of people but whatever, but the moon arcana with Nozomi (Gourmet king dude) could just be completely taken over by Shinji. Nozomi is a meme, but he is not needed in any way. Also, I would prioritize Yuko in the male route over Koromaru since, although he is a very good boy, he is still a dog. Also, please get rid of the option that you’re forced to romance every girl in the male route, and personally I would say keep in the fact that you cannot date Junpei. In a headcanon sort of way, I totally dig the idea of the MC being able to help Junpei through his rough time after Chidori dies (if she dies?) and feelings grow from there, but from a story perspective I think it’s integral to his character that he friendzones the player if they try.

So TLDR; who the social link is about would mainly stay true to the original route (male route with Kaz, etc. and female route with Rio, etc.), however in the male route the party members would take priority (so Akihiko would take the star arcana place and Mamoru (track guy) would just be featured in the link sometimes), and in both routes Shinji would take Nozomi’s place as the moon. Important note that besides including the other character, the main substance of the social link shouldn’t be changed; aka they should not change the format of the social links to operate more like P5 social links where the MC is just solving all of their problems.

(Sidenote: This is imply my idea on how to include party members into the social links for the male route, however if they just decided to keep the social links the exact same as Portable with no male party member social links with the male route then I’d be fine with that too. It wouldn’t really take away from the game as a whole for me, personally.)

4. Romance Options

Riding off of the social link talk...and I know this is like the least likely option of happening, but please make some gay options Atlus? If we can romance every single girl in the male route, why not just add the romance option for the men too? Yes yes there’s the whole argument about the issue of “making everyone bi” (thanks for erasing sexuality that care more about connections rather than gender?), but I say look no further than how Dragon Age 2 did it. Every romanceable option in that game can be romanced be either the male or female main character (barring a DLC character who is only romanceable by females), and it works just fine. Turns out, no one really gives a shit if it’s “realistic” enough (aka only having one or no bi/gay people apparently?) because it’s a video game and people want to romance whoever they want...because it’s a video game. Even if you really, really don’t like this approach there is also the option of going the Dragon Age Inquisition route, where characters are able to be romanced by certain genders and not by others (race also plays a role in this in the game, since there are elves and other fantasy races and such, but this is not applicable to Persona obviously). This is simply a hypothetical example, but how this would work is that like Fuuka can only be romanced by the Male MC, Akihiko and Yukari could be romanced by either MC, and Mitsuru could only be romanced by the FeMC. Obviously social links specific to a run would be a romanceable option to the MC in their route (as in Yuko would only be romanceable by Male MC because she’s only in her run, and social links like Saori could be a romance for FeMC because she’s specific to her route). I have a gut feeling this would cause an even bigger uproar with the fandom, so having any romance option (barring route specific social links for the route they’re not in) be available for either male or female MC is the best option in my opinion.

Take out Ken’s romance option altogether though. I know some of the language is different, so it doesn’t say you “spend a long night together” or whatever, but that doesn’t really make it any better. I do think it’s fine if Ken has a crush on the MC, and maybe has a whole Kenji thing of thinking they are together cause he’s 10 and kids can be like that, but the MC wouldn’t actually act on this and the player could be given the choice to actively dissuade Ken. The only good thing that came out of Ken’s romance option was the fact that him and Akihiko can argue in Tartarus if you romance them both, and I don’t want to lose that hilarious dialogue.

5. Tartarus

Tartarus...uh...to be honest I’m not really sure what to do with this beast. It’s boring and tedious in the first place, probably by design for symbolism in the game, but I’m not sure how to make it interesting without copying the dungeon/palace format. Perhaps the blocks could be restructured to act more like a big puzzle that needs to be solved, like certain sections of palaces in P5, but also have bosses and shadows thrown in. For example, perhaps one block could be more reminiscent of hide-and-seek stealth tactics while another is formatted like a series of arena-esque gladiator fights. Also probably lower the number of floors you need to climb? It gets a bit ridiculous when you realize there are 264 floors of Tartarus and 99% of them are the same but just with more funky music and slightly different decorations. This job is suited for someone with actual video game making experience though, and not me.

6. Awakenings and Pacing

Let’s talk about some quick fixes to awakenings and pacing of the game. Now, since this is a definitive version and not a true remake, I wouldn’t want them to rewrite the entire story or something. Most of the party member’s original awakenings happen off screen, which can be kind of lackluster. The MC’s and Fuuka’s are the only two we really see, and those moments were really cool in my opinion. Obviously we wouldn’t see Mitsuru’s, Akihiko’s, or Shinji’s original awakenings, but that is fine. Yukari and Junpei also fall into this boat because Yukari awakens before the MC gets to the dorm, and it would be hard to show Junpei’s awakening while also having his whole “reveal” moment when he comes to the dorm to live there. I don’t know if it’s ever mentioned when Ken awakens to his persona, but making a scene to show both his and Koromaru’s would be helpful instead of just saying Ken has the potential and he’s joining, and hearing about Koromaru awakening but not actually seeing it. As for the pacing, I’m mainly talking about the summer time where you can’t hang out with a good number of social links. I would just change this so that you can hang out with school social links during this time more readily, like if they’re just hanging out somewhere in town if they’re not at school. Like I said, this isn’t a remake (and I’m not a video game designer) so I didn’t want to get into how to fix the overall pacing of the story, which can be pretty slow until October or so. My one suggestion is maybe adding in a few extra scenes with Strega before October so it’s not like we run into them a couple times and suddenly they’re a major villain.

7. Shinjiro

(Spoilers for after October) I know certain people will definitely not like this point, but I think the option to save Shinji should remain in the game (and Chidori too). I’ll go into this in another post, but my main reason for keeping this in is because some people really do like this option, so it would be kind of unfair just to get rid of it because other people don’t like it. However, I would suggest a change to his social link so that there is the option to save him or not while also being able to complete the social link. Perhaps after rank 10 would be when you could give him the pocket watch, so that people could get the rank 10 and not be forced to save him.

8. Extra Content

(Spoilers for the ending of Persona 3 and The Answer) Each definitive version has extra content in the “third semester” (because Persona 4 and 5 both essentially end after December), but in Persona 3 the natural game ends in January. I am not sure if they would try to add another whole months or so on, but because The Answer already exists, but I assume they wouldn’t add extra content in February or something for the MC. For The Answer, I would keep this in the game as sort of the “extra content” but add a FeMC version of this. Obviously it would be largely the same, except with the FeMC and perhaps the male party members could get more of a focus since the female party members get a larger focus in the male route (ie. Yukari breaking down with the keys. Maybe Junpei or Akihiko could take on this role as the people who don’t want to let go). Also, as a possible new addition to The Answer, Shinji could be a part of it if he is saved during the main game. In the NG+ run of Portable FeMC route, if you romance Shinji he comes to the rooftop for that final scene, so in a way it could be possible for him to recover by the time The Answer happens in March.

Now, if Atlus decided to add a more typical “extra content” thing, I hope they wouldn’t try to cram The Answer in on top of that unless they were able to do it cohesively. It might be a lot to have the whole ending of the game in January, come up with a reason to have extra content in February (presumably with the MC still alive, but also combat would need to be a part so then the issue arises of Tartarus coming back or something?), and then have the answer take place right after near the end of March.

Well that’s the end of that I think. This will also be the last post in this little “series” because I pretty much went over everything about this debate that makes me want to fly into the sun. I know the things I talked about in these posts will probably never stop, but I really hope that if a definitive version comes out at least the discussion will change to saying what is good or bad about each game rather than FES supremacy or whatever. That being said, above all I really hope this debate doesn’t discourage new fans from Persona 3 or the series in general, because that would probably be the worst outcome from all of this. It’s a great game, and it’s a shame that the game itself is kind of held back by being split into two (I’m not counting base Persona 3) different forms.

#persona 3 #persona 3 portable #p3 #p3p #long post #this is the end guys #my rocket is finished and im ready to fly into the sun #thank you to whoever decided to read all of these #you're the real mvp #is there a hashtag for persona fans to stop fighting persona fans #or to at least stop persona 3 fans from having a pissing contest with one another

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sillyfudgemonkeys · 5 years ago

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Persona Q2 Problems: Lore-Summoning Discrepancy

Ok, so this is something that’s been bothering me for a VERY long time, it was something that caught my attention back when they were just advertising the game (if anyone is wondering, it was how the cognition worked in this game…and that questioned snowballed to say the least into what this was), but I wanted to wait till the game came out to talk about it (took really long cause I wasn’t sure how to approach it, I mean this thing came up as about 7ish pages in GoogleDocs so like....yeah 8U lotta writing).

Before I begin, yes I know there are different ways to summon persona. Yes they can coexist in the same series, that isn’t the issue. The issue is how P5 and onward’s lore has been handled. I also wanted to do a complete replay of Arena, Ultimax (esp this one cause it’s a bit funky with the DH and red fog), and PQ1 buuuuuuuuuuuuuut due to events (aka me working despite Corona happening), I didn’t get around to it yet. So consider this a “version 1″ post, with the possibility of there being a “revised version” later. I also won’t really touch on P1/2 much (I’ll bring them up a few times), not because they aren’t important, but because this mostly pertains to PQ2 and the games associated with it.... as well as my sparse knowledge on P1/2 (so I’m sorry in advance if I mess something up while talking about those two games ;w;). We also aren’t talking about P3D, P5D, Royal or Scramble (maybe I’ll include Royal/Scramble in the possible revised/add on/sequel post to this but not now….cause spoilers….and PQ2 came before those so I’d rather focus on what built up to it rather than what comes after).

Also yeah some of this will contain a theory (the theory parts is me trying to reconcile canon and it’s at the end of the post, the rest is me pointing at a hole in the canon/lore tho.... so no this isn’t a glorified theory post, I’ll point out when I’mma enter my minor theory). Anyway, under the cut cause length! 8U:

So first we’re gonna start off with a question. At one point my bf asked me “What dictates why the characters summon the way they do in their games?” To which I replied, after thinking about it for a decent minute, “Setting......maybe with some god interference but it’s usually cause they created that setting, so really it’s just the setting.” If we look at all the games, they all summon things a bit differently (P1/2 being the closest in similarity, with P4 being the closest to them among the newer titles), but what also is different in each game is the setting.

P1 does a Jojo summon cause of a Parallel world, P2 does Jojo poses thanks to the rumors, P3 uses evokers (but otherwise they can just make it appear if they concentrate hard enough, or if you are a VR attendant then you use cards) thanks to the Dark Hour (DH), P4 uses cards (but like P3, can sometimes just summon without manifesting a card similar to P3’s evoker-less summons and P1/2 summons) thanks to the TV World (TVW), and P5 uses their masks thanks to the Metaverse.

So next (2) question(s).....What would happen if you take one team and put them in another teams’ world? How would they summon their persona’s then? Well.....it depends on the setting, but spoiler for the rest of the post....they would either use cards/no cards (ala P4 style, from here on I’mma just say “card style” but keep in mind cards may or may not be utilized), or have a PT outfit/mask summon (aka P5 style). OR, if they are struggling and have an evoker on hand, then they’d use an evoker (but not if it’s in the Metaverse). So to use an evoker, they’d have to struggle with summoning in a P3ish type area (which keep in mind is similar to a P4 type area), and if they aren’t struggling then the default would be P4 type summoning (I mean they could still use the evoker if you want, but the card style is the default tbh). Oh yeah there’s a lot to unpack there. You see, P3/4 can exist together without issues, P5.....can’t.....with either of them…..At least not without certain rules being established in a setting, and then ALL THREE having to follow those rules. (Tbh it feels like the P5 era/PQ2 specifically, they seem to prioritize iconography over logic. Aka “Well P3 used evokers because they are P3!” rather than looking at the implications of the world they are utilizing and instead prioritizing something the audience will recognize rather than following the rules they have built.)

Ok so I know I just threw a ton of facts at you, so let’s backtrack and explain how I know these are facts by going through the games (cause I know you can’t just take my word for it)!

Now, how do P3/4 work well together? It’s simple.....the DH and TVW are similar (TVW is a more...”potent” DH and makes it easier to summon things), well similar in feel as Arena states:

Ok so they are similar in feel, and tbh the means of being able to summon a Persona is similar too! P3 kids don’t NEED evokers, it’s proven that characters can summon a Persona without a need of an evoker in both the DH and Real World (ex: Labby in Arena when escaping the lab, Mitsuru in The Answer flashback, Fuuka in Arena iirc, Takaya all the time in P3, Chidori when her Persona tried to kill her, and possibly Tatsuya/other P2 characters prior to the rumors going rampant during the P2 game), HOWEVER it’s very hard to do so. It usually requires intense concentration, or a rush of emotion or a life/death situation (which all examples fall under one or both). The evoker is designed to help facilitate this life/death feeling (*cough* tho it takes the shape of a gun cause Mitsuru thought it’d catch Akihiko’s attention*cough* I mean Koro doesn’t need it being a gun so the shape could be whatever they just chose a gun so they could seduce Akihiko 8U). But regardless, the evoker is a man made tool that helps one summon a Persona (aka creates an artificial focal point), but it’s not a natural focal point made by the user (ie, card, clutching your head/no card/possibly P1&P2 style, or P5′s mask), so really anyone can use an evoker. (one more side tangent since we’re on focal points, as for how P4 can have two different ways of summoning, ie card/no card, it could just be that the TVW allows different forms of a natural focal point to form, either via thinking of summoning the Persona, or having your mind form a physical card in front of you, so the setting of the TVW gives a choice to the user)

Now remember when I said that the TVW is a DH that’s easier to summon Personas? Or that if a user isn’t struggling then the default is the card/P4 style summoning and not the evoker? Well Arena showcases how easy it is to summon in the TVW:

So there we go, it’s easier to summon in the TVW than the DH. Can’t argue with that! The reason is probably because DH is a layer on top of the Real World, so it’s closer to reality, while the TVW is closer to the Collective Unconscious/aka CU (aka the TVW is an alternate world, rather than a camera filter like the DH is), so that could explain why it’s easier.

So what have we established so far?:

DH and TVW are very similar, but TVW is probably more is closer to the CU than the DH (while the DH is closer to reality), which makes it easier to summon in the TVW.

Evokers can be used by anyone because they are a man-made tool, but they aren’t natural ways of summoning like show cased in P1/2/4/5.

P3 cast can summon Personas like P4 cast, and theoretically vice versa is probably possible if they ever gave the P4 cast evokers.

Now from Arena, we will go to PQ1, then Ultimax, then briefly on P4D before we get to P5. (I’m doing PQ1 before Ultimax because I’m doing the it in the order of the JPN release not the US release, and no I’m not counting the arcade Ultimax release 8U)

So let’s look at PQ1. Now from my memory....I don’t recall them really talking about the P3 cast specifically not being able to summon their personas without their evoker in the PQ1 world. Like they talk about their differences in summoning, but I don’t think the P3 kids tried to summon without their evokers. And the reason I bring this up, because we could probably say this is a discrepancy too, is because the P4 kids still use their card style, which means the PQ1 world is similar to the TV world, where it’s easier to summon via using the cards. And since the P3 kids can use the card style, in a setting that allows card styles…..that means they could summon the same way the P4 kids can in PQ1! But the P3 kids don’t have the same thought process as they did in Arena, where “oh we summoned our personas without our evokers! Only just thinking about it!” And like....that’s a red flag....BUT, as I said before, evokers and cards can exist at the same time. In Arena/ Ultimax the human P3 users (minus maaaybe Junpei) use their evokers when doing a finisher. So we could just chalk it up to them being used to it out of habit. It also helps that Arena was released not long before PQ1, so we know they can both exist at the same time thanks to prior knowledge. So like yeah there’s a tiny issue here, but nothing glaring or a very big deal, it’s just them avoiding addressing something rather than creating a contradiction. Maybe in a remake they’ll add a line saying “huh that’s weird, still gonna use my evoker cause we’re used to it.” XU And it’d be all good.

Now Ultimax is a little.....more concerning. Technically there’s a dark hour....but you can summon without your evoker (and also they call the Fake!Dark Hour F!DH taking place in the “real world”):

Now I can’t remember the rest of Ultimax to that specific of a detail, so I dunno if they 100% explain why/how the F!DH it’s easier to summon than the DH, but they really seemed to hint at the red fog in these early scenes (where I rewatched to get the screen grabs), with it having some influence and possibly being the culprit behind the anomaly (I’d say the same thing for the TVW, but Teddie says Shadows have been there since forever, and Izanami only found the TVW not created it, she did bring the fog, so it’s possible the fog isn’t what dictates summoning in the TVW just TVW as a place, but in Ultimax the combination of the red fog and the F!DH makes the setting more palpable like the TVW rather than the original DH. So yeah F!DH needs special fog to work, but TVW doesn’t really need for summoning to exist it seems). There’s also the fact...Kagutsuchi is also there and his power might also have something to do with this cause, remember at the beginning I said sometimes there’s a god messing with the place to make that setting viable for summoning Personas? Yeah that’s probably what’s going on. Red Fog+Special DH+Kagu’s influence=TVW levels of card/natural summoning. Not the cleanest, but hey they at least tried giving us a reason! I’m at least happy for that! ;w;

So after briefing on the small issues (or just plot questions with PQ1/Ultimax), now for P4D. P4D it’s possible to summon your persona like in the TVW, but you can’t fight. So you instead dance to defeat your enemies.... So the area is similar to the TVW, BUT it has special rules (implemented by the god, so yeah a little god influence on the setting, but still the setting nonetheless is what dictates the summoning). Yeah that’s it, but it just strengthens the setting dictates stuff.

So again, to reiterate what we know:

If a place is like the TVW, then card summoning is the default.

DH and TVW are similar, but DH is a….”less palpable” TVW (probably cause it’s farther from the CU), so while card summoning is possible, it’s better to use the tool/evoker to help you.

The F!DH, PQ1 world, and Midnight Stage are all similar to the TVW so card summon is the default.

Evokers can be used in card summon settings, but they aren’t needed.

Anyone can use an evoker

So....let’s get to P5. P5 has the Metaverse, which has A LOT of distortion and cognition. I mean it’s possible that P1-4 have some cognition, but the Metavers is just…..there’s an abundance! Anyway, we know that P5 has outfits because it protects the user against the world (kinda like the TVW glasses, but unlike those, they aren’t a tool anyone can just.....use. Teddie makes the TVW glasses, PT outfits come with the summons). But they only get their cool outfit once they obtain their personas (either via fully or partially awakening their Persona, the persona has to at least be awakened). Thus the Persona is connected to the outfit, and the outfit is connected to the environment/setting. I should note that unlike the above screenshots, which are explicitly stated in the lore, this is implicitly stated instead. Something that isn’t outright said, but it’s backed up via consistency and repeating it (also this is the first consistent thing I found in P5! Yay! ;w;)

Anyway, it makes sense right? And without the need for an evoker (which...causes issues thanks to that world’s rules on guns), it seems that the natural way for summoning in a Metaverse-like setting, is a mask summon.

Ok. Now what’s the issue with PQ2?! 4-5ish pages in and still no answer I know. Well the answer is all three can’t exist at the same time. P5 can’t compliment either P3/4. Either P5/4 has to adapt to P3’s way of summoning, P5/3 have to adapt to P4′s way of summoning (aka everyone needs an evoker or everyone card summons), or P3/4 have to adapt to P5 (aka everyone gets an outfit and mask summons). And here’s why:

We know P3/4 characters in a TVW like place can summon their personas like P4 kids. So it doesn’t matter what game you are from, if you are in the TVW you summon like the P4 kids. P5, if one has a persona in a Metaverse they should have an outfit, because P5 vanilla establishes that (again it’s implicit but nonetheless it’s established). So P3/4 kids should get an outfit if they were in the Metaverse because it’s the only logical thing that makes sense (aka this isn’t confirmed by Atlus, but by following the logic of their lore, the explicit content, and the implicit content, it leads to this conclusion).

The issue is…. PQ2 tries to apply DH’s, TVW’s, and the Metaverse’ rules all at the same time.....that doesn’t work. While DH and TVW complement each other, TVW becomes the default if the two are combined. “But Silly you said that P3 cast can use Evokers in the TVW” Yes! But you see PQ2 doesn’t understand that....Because..... Minato couldn’t summon his Persona when he lost his evoker and had to rely on Aigis the entire time:

From what I can find, he’s never shown summoning his persona (even in a life/death situation, which is also odd in and of itself and a whole other issue) during this time. I don’t think it’s ever mentioned it’s because he’s tired, just because he lost his evoker. Except this shouldn’t be the case, because P4/5 can summon just fine WITHOUT an evoker, so an evokerless summon should be possible. And that’s the issue with PQ2 that PQ1 avoided, PQ1 didn’t call attention to this, while PQ2 made this a plot point and...well...made a really big plot hole (and a side plot hole with the whole life/death thing).

Then there’s the DH and the Metaverse. Now Atlus was trying to fix the gun and evoker issue that well…..was created because of….(what is what got this post rolling) “Cognition.” Cause the Metaverse is like “If the gun looks real then it’s perceived as real! Even if it’s a fake gun.” And well….evokers are real guns who have been hollowed out (in english releases they changed it to fakes tho, but they are actually real guns). And well evokers and the Metaverse don’t mix well, and we’d have a lot of headless SEES. So Atlus tried to be like “Oh it just doesn’t work here!” But…….that reasoning doesn’t work, because the PT still have their outfits, and Mona is still in mascot form, which exists because of….you guessed it…”cognition”. And because of all that it leads to these questions:

Does this mean there’s a specific quantity of Cognition that needs to be met for there to be outfits but for fake guns not to work?

So how can there be enough cognition to dictate that they can have outfits but NOT guns?

How can Mona still be in his cognitive cat form at the lobby, but the rest of the team reverts back to their normal clothes despite both being connected to? He’s only ever in that form when the other teams are in their PT form (only time he isn’t is in PQ2’s lobby, and the early PVs of P5 which never appeared in the game)

Why doesn’t the P3/4 cast have PT outfits, despite the fact having a persona in a cognitive world indicates a PT outfit (at least implicitly via P5 vanilla)?

Basically how is it that the P5 Kids are the only ones that seem to be affected by the Cinema’s World Cognition but no other groups are? Answer, there is no answer, it just doesn’t make any sense! And that’s just P3 and P5!

Now we have Metaverse vs the TV World. While they are both natural means of summoning, they can’t coexist at the same time. They are like night and day, they can’t exist at the same time in the same place. If there is that much cognition in the Cinema world, then everyone should get an outfit! Otherwise they’d just use cards! You have to choose one!

“But Silly! What if it’s how they obtained their personas? Like maybe the way P5 got theirs is why they are special?” And…...that’s the thing dear reader….that’s not the case. Because let me introduce my Smoking Futaba Cannon! You know what Futaba has in common with the P4 group? THE SAME KIND OF AWAKENING! Her awakening is different from EVERY OTHER P5 CHARACTER! Her awakening is the same as the P4 kids! She accepts her shadow, and gets her persona! But do you know two things are different between Futaba and the P4 kids? 1) The setting, and 2) She gets an outfit! :0 Oh dear, she gets an outfit….and…..the only thing different from the P4 kids is the setting? Wow it’s almost as if….the setting dictates how you summon a persona! :D So because Futaba, who’s awakening is a P4 awakening, gets an outfit. Then ALL P4 kids, who have a P4 awakening, now get an outfit when they are in the Metaverse! But wait! Remember how P3 was able to easily change to the P4 style of summoning? Well since P3 is similar to P4 in this sense, and P4 is similar to Futaba, who has a PT outfit…..then P3 would get an outfit as well! You get an outfit! You get an outfit! EVERY PERSONA USER GETS AN OUTFIT! 8D

So what do we know now?

DH and TVW are similar, but if combined then the TVW rules overrule the DH rules

The DH seems to be closer to reality, while TVW and Metaverse seem to be closer to the UC which is why it’s easier to summon in the latter two.

The F!DH, PQ1 world, and Midnight Stage are all similar to the TVW so card summon is the default.

TVW and Metaverse can’t coexist at the same time (one has to overrule the other)

Evokers most likely can’t work in the Metaverse the same way they can in DH or TVW.

Evokers can be used in card summon settings (aka TVW) tho, but they aren’t needed.

Anyone can use an evoker (or have Teddie glasses 8U)

Only Persona users (either fully awakened or partially) can obtain a Metaverse/PT outfit.

Awakening doesn’t define how you summon Persona, the setting does (see Futaba vs P5 and compared to P4).

Because of Futaba, P4 kids should get outfits in the Metaverse.

And because of Arena and how the P3 kids have the same summoning in the P4 setting, it goes to say they’d also get outfits in the Metaverse too.

If reverse engineer this, then that’d mean P5 kids would get cards in a TVW-type setting (or would have to use evokers in a DH type setting).

I spent way too much time on this

It all comes together! Nice and neat! Arena establishes that you get a card summon when you are in a setting like the TVW, and P5 establishes that Persona users get PT outfits in the Metaverse (with Futaba showcasing it doesn’t matter how the awakening goes down you still get an outfit, which applies to P3/4). So, if the setting is like the Metaverse, they get outfits. If the setting ISN’T like the Metaverse, BUT INSTEAD, like the TV world, they do card summons. There the lore is nice and neat and clear cut!

…..EXCEPT! PQ2 …...just….makes no sense. ;w; It messes with all that is good and neat. ;w; And why? I don’t know! I can only think that, again, they chose the iconic looks of each game over the lore’s logic. Even if they were to say Enil made it so that the three types of settings could exist at the same time, it’s just…..too messy and wishy washy, and still doesn’t logically make sense (because of everything explained above). You can’t just mix water and oil! It’s just easier to choose a Metaverse or TVW type setting.

Now how do we fix PQ2? This is something Atlus can fix in a re-release on like the Switch, and it shouldn’t be too bad depending on how they approach it. But before I get to that I’m going to explain a theory, this theory makes it easier to break down the different settings, and thus gives Atlus a nice binary choice.

My theory is that there’s a cognition spectrum in these settings. Real life has the lowest to non existing cognition, the P1/2/3/4/4U1/4U2/4D/Q1 are all on the “low cognition” side (there’s some but there’s not a lot) while the Metaverse is “high cognition” (aka there’s a lot). Like here’s a rough (aka not 100% accurate, it’s just a general idea) depiction of what I mean:

Again it’s just a general idea on where they fall in terms of high and low cognition. P5 is obvie a new entry with us now exploring high cognition, which can lead to maybe a couple cool things. Maybe different places on the high cognition spectrum give us different ways of summoning too (give me a sec for a side tangent to explore that concept). Here’s an example, we have one high cognition plane called the “Metaverse” and another one called “Uverworld.” In the Metaverse you get a PT outfit, and summon with a mask. In the Uverworld, instead you take on your Persona’s appearance, either Digimon Frontier style or Digital Devil Saga style. We could say the Uverworld has even more cognition/distortion than the Metaverse and that’s why it’s different. And if any persona user from P1-5 were to summon their persona in the Uverworld, they’d summon it the same way as the Uverworld Persona users. And the Uverworld Persona users would summon the same way as say P4/5 depending on if they were in the TV World or Metaverse. This is how we can keep the lore consistent.

Now how does this high and low cognition apply to PQ2, and how could it have fixed it (and still could if Atlus makes these changes in a remake/re-release)? Well basically….they’d have to choose between a TV World type setting or the Metaverse, and have all three teams adjust accordingly! And they can either do what I call low asset route or a high asset route (which coordinate with low and high cognition respectively).

A low asset route, would’ve worked better for the original release on the 3DS (but I don’t recommend this for Switch re-release tho). It’d be that the PQ2 world operates like the TV World, everyone uses cards. That’d mean no one would get PT outfits (so less assets to make for the devs, and yes this includes P5 kids). Morgana, however, would have to remain in cat form (which shouldn’t be a problem, if we can give a dog a knife we can give a cat a knife 8U you can even have his character stats reflect something similar to Koromaru for the meta too!). P3 could still use their evokers if they want too! P5 the kids would probably crush the cards doing a similar pose they’d make if they had a mask, but tbh PQ doesn’t really show the characters in battle so we wouldn’t really need to worry that much.

Or we could go with a high asset route (which I recommend for a re-release), in which there’s high cognition, aka the Cinema world is more like the Metaverse. Everyone would get an outfit, and cause it’s the metaverse you can introduce a gun mechanic into PQ2! It’d require more assets, making outfits for all the characters (tho keep in mind Mona should transform back into a cat and out of his outfit in the lobby like everyone else!) Which we’d probably really only see in cutscenes rather than battle. While this could complicate some scenes (such as Hamuko dressing up as a police officer-wait that scene already doesn’t make sense considering P5’s lore-no no stay on topic DX), the rewrites wouldn’t be as as if you took the low asset route (which would work if thought of from the beginning but….yeah). It’d just be a few convo lines, and like a scene or two. One big thing they could add is adding the gun mechanic (they can even add a fun convo with the P3 kids saying it’s hard getting used to the new summoning method). Fans would love to see outfits for P3/4 kids, lore would make sense, you could have funny conversations, new combat system. Def a thing people would love to see added into a re-release! Plus it gives it more of a P5 flair, and considering this has P5 as the main focal point it fits! You can even say that the 3DS ver is still canon, but it was an incorrect recollection of a character’s dream, which could explain the inconsistencies I have mentioned before.

Oh and Minato/SEES can still carry their evokers in both scenarios, but Minato just gets tired from all the fighting and can’t summon his Persona anymore cause he ran out of mana. There that fixes that scene.

So there you go, PQ2 fixed (well summoning lore wise), Persona lore intact, and even a little guideline thrown in to help keep the lore intact! I know I didn’t go into how to rewrite every scene to adjust these changes….I could but not today.

Anyway I dunno how else to end it but…...I hope PQ1/2 can be ported to the Switch (or another console as well?) soon! I just really want a dub of PQ2 ;w; orz

#persona 5 #persona 4 #persona 3 #persona q2 #persona 2 #persona 1 #tagging p1/2 cause you guys are mentioned and while I don't go in depth on it as much #i'm open to hear more knowledgeable p1/2 fans' thoughts on this #persona lore #persona analysis #persona problems #persona q2 problems

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au-tumn-al · 5 years ago

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So after 110 hours, I finally beat Persona 5 Royal. Before going into complete FFVII mode, I wanna lay out all my thoughts.

Blah, blah, blah, spoilers for everything under the cut.

To start off, I loved Royal. The gameplay was so much fun and it felt like such a natural evolution from vanilla P5. Probably my favorite change was what wad done with Baton Pass. Trying to pass to your entire party was very fun and very satisfying, especially if Joker got the ×4 or even ×3 and got to abuse a possibly charged Hassou Tobi lategame. It was pretty broken, but I don't mind things being broken once you go to the effort of figuring things out. Speaking of broken things—

Showtime attacks are super cool. I didn't know what to think of them at first because of how stupidly strong they are, but after I got to some harder boss fights where doing about 1k damage per attack would only get rid of about a small fraction of the shadow's health, I wasn't complaining.

(Also, I never actually got to see Joker and Violet's showtime. Oops.)

The fact that the damage scaled like that was really good, especially once you get into the third semester where party members have severe and colossal damage moves and even healer Morgana can do 150 damage per basic attack without buffs on an enemy without debuffs. The enemies' damage output remained kind of sad though, but uh....you can't win 'em all ;;

To finish showtime talk, Joker and Crow's showtime was heccin' great. I never skipped it. It was Batman in my animu JRPG so it was 10/10. It also did way more damage than most of my party members' showtime attacks so ey. It finished off that Yoshitsune request boss too with around 2.4k damage so I'm obligated to like it. On that note, how is showtime damage calculated? Do certain showtimes do more damage, or does it just depend on the offensive stats of the party members using it?

Technical damage was beefed up too, and I probably should have tried to take advantage of it more than I did but I never figured out how to make technical damage reliably knock an enemy down. I know that there was a way to do it but I never figured it out. Yes, yes, I know it was because I skipped tutorials but everything else was so busted, I never felt the need to go back and read said tutorials. I did read that book about technical damage though in-game, but it just added more technical combinations.

Onto other changes though, it could have been because I was playing on hard, but status ailments became about 10 times more useful. ...Actually, no, it was definitely because I was playing on hard, but even so, I felt like more bosses were weak to them when compared to P5. They went back to being mostly immune to them, especially in the new semester, but during and before October or so, status ailments became invaluable. It could have been because I sucked that much, but my party members, and even sometimes Joker, would get left with double or even single digit HP by near everything, even if I debuffed and buffed. Queen got regulated to a forget bot, but man it carried me through some boss fights. ... i.e., Kaneshiro's fight. Well, that and Mona's confuse.

I liked the Will Seeds too. They were a fun way to kind of change up the palaces and for me to hunt down. Even though yeah, they are pretty broken (especially with the accessory you get from the 2nd palace being able to get rid of elemental weaknesses for whoever has it equipped, not to mention the ability to give charge or concentrate to another party member), I still can't say I used them over my SP adhesives most of the time. I used the one that got rid of elemental weaknesses on Crow, but that was just because I could only use him and Joker at the time and did not want enemies to get another move on him to get another chance to hit either of them.

The changes to Mementos were amazing. Like the rest of them, they were pretty busted, but still. Amazing. I feel like I'm in the minority with this, but I didn't mind Mementos. In fact, I kind of liked going through the grind of going through it. Although...tbf, I kind of liked Tartarus too. Its 264 floors were a bit much, but I liked being able to turn off my brain, put on a podcast or YouTube video in the background for me to listen to then go through Tartarus in one or two in-game nights.

Back to Mementos, collecting stamps and flowers for Jose was fun, and being able to change the cognition for Mementos was busted. Since you can get EXP from auto-killing, you get over-leveled very fast. It doesn't help that you have to backtrack floors for stamps since they randomly generate, so you get even more money, experience, and items. On the bright side though, no, I didn't need to wander around singing "I've Been Working on the Railroad" with Mona and Skull for an hour and a half trying to find the materials for the Eternal Lockpick (which was renamed in Royal to Permapick ... I guess???)

Because of the changes you can make to boost item, money, and EXP gains, Mementos became the prime grinding area. Even more than the card shuffle thing in P3. Since you got so much EXP from ramming shadows even without leveling up EXP gain. I put all my stamps into getting more items and money until I couldn't anymore and I had near max every single crafting item, and never had to worry about the cost of anything ever. Combined with the money gains from killing shadows, you can also pick up sellable treasure from the item cubes in Mementos and it can end up selling for well over a million yen. So getting to max didn't even require Joker abusing the confuse status ailment or abusing the shadows with "You can do better than that."

I didn't mind the Mementos music, even when I was playing the game without something else playing for me to listen to, but now that Mementos does have new music, yeah, I realize now how much better it is. I wouldn't listen to it alone like I would Rivers in the Desert or anything, but it was a nice change. I listened to one of the songs before the game had its western release and didn't like it all that much, but actually playing the game while hearing it made me actually like it.

I got to level 99 though before the game was over. It made it so Joker and Crow were able to tag-team the Reaper then kill it in 3 turns. I had thought that trophy would have been a lot harder to get lol. It was pretty weird seeing the Reaper in such clear lighting though due to the new Mementos area though, I have to say.

Onto the bosses though...

I loved the changes to the bosses (except the 5th one but that's just because I hate everything about the 5th palace, even if Royal did make it about a million times more bearable).

Kameshida having cognitive Shiho and Mishima as helpers for the boss fight was such a good change, and made him about that much more hateable.

Madarame's boss fight in vanilla P5 was the hardest boss in the game for me, even on normal mode, but it was made so much easier in P5R. Madarame didn't bring back his painting form, but instead brought back elemental versions of himself specifically so the player can abuse Baton Pass. Baton Pass combos are extremely satisfying to pull off, so I enjoyed it immensely. Honestly, having that as the second boss in the game was so much of a better decision than what was in P5. That, or I'm still salty about all the deaths I had from fighting him the first time.

Kaneshiro was definitely harder, and I was a little stuck when he called his cronies out to guard him. Mona and Queen using confuse and forget while Skull and Joker attacked Kaneshiro made it a lot more bearable though. I also kept using spotlights on Joker so the enemies would attack him. He had Shiki Ouji equipped and they only ever did physical moves when my status effects missed, so I was never at risk for losing the fight. ... And then of course Skull and Queen finished it off with a showtime attack after Mona got yeeted.

Sphinx mom was a lot easier. I didn't know that the right dialogue choices made it so Oracle would guard you until someone told me, so I was sitting there surprised at how much easier it was lol. I did get stuck at the end though because it didn't look like I was damaging it. I thought Oracle needed to bring back the crossbow so I just kept buffing and healing. It took about 10 minutes for me to get bored and start attacking it again and it turned out I could attack it, but it was just that sphinx mom's HP wasn't visually moving before eventually going down. Joker still used Shiki Ouji which had learned an immunity to wind so. Easy victory (ignoring the part where I'm a dumbass).

I switched to easy mode for Okumura. I just did not care at all. I hate his palace, I hate the music, and the enemies could range from being easier to kill than the enemies in the first palace to being a pain in the ass, so I wanted to have it be over. If I didn't have an unreasonable hatred for the 5th palace though, I probably would have liked the change. It was challenging without being complete BS, at least much more challenging than how it was originally in P5. Having the enemies run off though did get pretty annoying when I was trying to beat it legit but I was just so done at that point, it was more on me than the game lol.

Part of the reason why I was so eager to get through Okumura's palace though was to get to Sae's palace. Because I love Sae's palace, and just in general, the entire month of November. It has amazing story bits, still the height of P5's story if you ask me, a great palace, and Whims of Fate is one of my favorite tracks from P5's OST. Sae's boss was even changed to when she spins the wheel, whatever element it goes to, she uses that element and her resistances would change. I loved that, and it was extremely fun to take what you more or less should have learned about enemies' attacks and their correlating weaknesses and use them for a boss fight. So much better than the original where you don't need strategy at all other than "hit her hard lol."

Shido's boss fight was changed to be super climactic. They made it easier for the sake of Joker being able to confront the dude that got him a criminal record and directly ruining his life, and I can't complain. It felt amazing to 1v1 him. The game fixed the possibility of being screwed by it by having him attack in a certain order like the twins do in their special fight, so that was nice at least.

Yaldabaoth's boss fight was the same. Still easy enough, as long as you're careful. Or...not careful but extremely lucky. I wasn't able to finish it off while it was charging up its almighty attack, but my entire party ended up dodging it so it didn't even matter lmao. Now that I think about it, it very easily could have been because of that one Will Seed accessory that makes you dodge attacks but... I don't care. I was still super lucky I didn't get wiped and be forced to start the fight over starting from the Holy Grail.

The new boss... Uhm... It was taking way too long so I ended up cheesing it with Haru's third persona's new move that basically makes you invincible for a turn halfway through the fight. ^^; Noir was a Vault Guardian bot, Queen just healed and took advantage of one of the tentscles' nuclear weaknesses to Baton Pass to Crow when she could, and then Joker and Crow did all the work. Crow's third tier persona's almighty move kicked ass and you know what else kicked ass? Hassou Tobi abuse. The other 2 phases weren't even really fights, so at least that kept it from dragging too much, despite all the phases it had.

When Joker and the boss had that punch-out fight though, I lost my shit. I was laughing so hard I started to cry and my back was hurting. I don't even remember why I thought it was so funny, but I was laughing my ass off. I couldn't even press X to get Joker to punch because I was laughing so hard. Right before it happened, I joked to my sister that a tutorial would pop up and suddenly the gameplay will have the controls from that P4 fighting game and you have to learn that in order to have one last showdown. And then I got the prompt to punch. Then Joker punched. And I started laughing.

11/10 would punch Adam Kadmon man again

On the topic of the new stuff though...

Kasumi/Sumire/Violet was pretty fun to use but badly, badly overshadowed by both Joker and Crow, at least during boss fights. She offered to join the party before Shido's palace and she really should have joined then. Maybe she would just be absent for the Mementos dungeon & Yaldabaoth/Holy Grail boss fights, but she should have been there for Shido's palace. I liked her wanted gimmick of being the crit'er, but when you get her, Mona's third tier persona learns an AOE Lucky Punch, Joker already has high crit, and I would always baton pass to Crow because of his severe almighty AOE ×3. Plus, the way I built my Joker with practically exclusively two personas, Yoshitsune and Kuguya Picaro, he was already the phys and light attacker except with the addition of being able to have an auto-concentrate at the start of every fight (I have no idea why—it's something with Yoshitsune but idk what it is), the charge skill, Yoshitsune's nature of tripling the effect of charge, and the additional electric damage. She should have been a party member before the new semester. Obviously this isn't the case for everyone, but for me personally, I didn't often find use for her, especially since she can't do colossal or even severe magic damage. She is a very good physical party member, but again, Joker already covers that better than any other party member can, including Skull.

Crow was a great party member though. I used him in every request and boss fight after I got him. I was a little salty he couldn't switch back and forth from Loki and Robin Hood but I suppose if he did, he'd make Violet even more obsolete lol. I liked Loki while playing P3, so I'm glad I was able to use that persona again. He had Debilitate which was amazing. Queen learns Checkmate when getting to the third tier persona, which is an AOE version of it, but honestly, whenever I was fighting a boss that I thought needed it at that point in the game, I didn't need it to be multi-hitting. Plus, it costed about 90 SP and no way I was using that over her healing, defense buffs, and nuclear damage.

But anyway, back to Crow, I loved using him. He basically turned into my almighty damage dealer, even with his somewhat weaker magic, at least compared to his strength stat, but considering the final boss fight, it was extremely helpful. It did take up a lot of SP, but I had 5 Somas, a ton of SP restoratives, and had basically asked Kawakami to make me either curry or coffee every single night I was able to, so I pretty much had an infinite supply of it.

It helped that P5R made Akechi a much more likable character too. I liked him all right in P5, but didn't find him all that sympathetic, and thought that the characters treating him so sympathetically was extremely jarring considering all the horrible shit he did (which includes making orphans of both Haru and Futaba). That still kind of holds true, but since you can actually build a social link with him outside of the story, you can see more of his character and it improved him in leaps and bounds. Not to mention that his 8th confidant rank was....something else ^^; having a section of the new story too with just Joker and Akechi, (and kind of Sumire too, but mostly just those two) was awesome. I loved seeing them team up to punch Adam Kadmon man in the face. Plus, having more time with him in the Phantom Thieves without pretense had him going "I am surrounded by idiots" basically the whole time he was there. Like—I even felt disappointed that Akechi was actually dead and he didn't survive. That's a huge improvement over from me wishing one of the dialogue options was "fuck you lmao" during his death scene at the end of Shido's palace when he asked the Phantom Thieves to promise him to change Shido's heart.

For Sumire though, she had a good character arc. Like her gameplay though, she was badly overshadowed by both Akechi and Maruki. Even still, I liked her character arc and everything, and her social link. Even if I ended up liking Kasumi more in the end anyway rip

That's kind of all I have to say about her, oof. She was good, but other elements took attention away from her pretty badly.

Maruki though... Maruki was amazing. He was a fantastic antagonist because I got to punch him in the face, his palace was amazing, I loved the music, the different sections were cool, and I even liked the color maze bridge puzzle thing. I definitely wouldn't like it so much if I ever replayed it, especially if I try to get that final Will Seed, which wasn't hard, but did take kind of a while, but I don't think I will be so it's not a problem.

He had such good motivations, and the fact that he didn't ever actually hurt anyone other than when he punched Joker in the face made him really sympathetic and redeemable to me. At the end of the day, all he actually wanted to do was make people happy and not have to suffer, and was willing to destroy himself in order to achieve it. But just like with every belief, it went too far and he took away people's free will and ability to pick for themselves. The kind of moral question about the entire thing was very interesting, and I kind of wish it was more further addressed. There should have been Sojiro or some other character that was perfectly happy in Maruki's alternate reality so they could challenge the Phantom Thieves in a way Maruki wasn't able to. Still, what was done was really good and I liked it a lot.

...

Even all that said, I have no idea why the hell Joker could not use Satanael. There was such a perfect opportunity to use it once Maruki evolved his persona to Adam Kadmon, a giant persona. Hell, it was still small when compared to Satanael. It's after beating Yaldabaoth so Joker should have access to it. It would have been epic to be able to use a giant Satanael in a normal-ish boss fight. I'm sure there are some explanations as to why, but the game never mentions it or even acknowledges Satanael so it doesn't count and I'm still bitter. The writers forgot that Joker has a persona literally as big as a cognitive god and that kind of broke some immersion for me. Immersion completely went out the window once Joker and Maruki started punching each other but STILL. Satanael's not that great a persona, but having it show up in the story again would have been so awesome to use a persona about as big as Shibuya more than once.

Hardly comparable to my beef about Satanael, but I wish that while the party members were acting as Phantom Thieves, or at least while they're in the metaverse, the names on their text boxes would change to their Phantom Thief names. There's no reason why they didn't, especially since the characters exclusively use their Phantom Thief names to call each other anyway. It's not a huge deal or anything, but I would have liked it.

I loved Royal, and totally think it's better than P5 vanilla. Its new semester kind of takes away from the superb ending of the vanilla game, but the new stuff still makes up for it. Don't get me wrong, you can still get the original ending from the vanilla game in Royal, at least I'm pretty sure you can, but it involves you missing out on all the new content, including Violet as a party member and getting Crow back, plus Joker's showtimes so it's not worth it imo

I wasn't actually looking forward to the game when it was announced, or even planning on getting it, but I had the Phantom Thieves' edition pre-ordered for me as a Christmas present so I wasn't going to...not play it lol. I'm extremely glad I got it though, even if I otherwise wouldn't have, and now that I have finished it, I'm very happy with the game. The gameplay's improved by leaps and bounds, and the new content was all amazing.

... And I got to punch Maruki in the face.

I did end up getting the platinum trophy for Royal too, so despite the Phantom Thieves den thing, I don't see myself going back to it, at least any time soon. It was an amazing experience, but I can set my sights back to FFVII now lol.

...Although, I did hear you can fight the twins and Lavenza so uhhh maybe i won't be shelfing it so soon—

#persona 5 royal #persona #p5r spoilers #personal #long post

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