#being a closeted couple in a homophobic country

[stormblessed95]

Good afternoon Storm,

I love saying that! As I am a Marvel SUPER-STAN it feels like I am speaking to Ororo (Storm from XMen) and I love that!

So here is my first official ask for you (following all this months of “respectful stalking”).

What and/or how long do you feel/think it would take for South Korea to look into same sex relationships?

I come from a “Japanese Backgroud” in the sense that I am very familiar with the ways of the Japanese culture. Never lived there, mind you, but my life from 2010 was very much conditioned by it . Any holidays I could take I would go for weeks to Japan and then go back home in Europe. As a self-though, I successfully got my JLPT level 3 so technically I could live and work there as well.

When Japan announced that they were now lawfully taking into consideration same sex marriage, I was so f***inf shook. I love that country, but as a woman and a person who is part of the lgbtqia+ community I didn’t think I’d see any such change happening in my lifetime.

Now the women movement already had started but the same sex marriage came out of nowhere and literally my colleagues had to tell me that! I was so shook. I really didn’t see that coming. Now it is not a made law yet, but it is under revision in congress and some prefectures can already make it legal! Now, the fact that it is under revision has made many in the community much more comfortable over there and I almost cried on that day.

I’m really not familiar with the Korean culture. Not at all. And I was wondering if you happen to know at what point they are with their lgbtqia+ matters, because at the moment with my limited knowledge they seem to be so far away... Regardless of the Christian community which is very strong and very vocal, I was wondering about your thoughts on the matter. I was wondering if you think they might take a “Japanese stand” on the matter or just keep ignoring the matter and proceed as they are?

South Korea also has a very big lgbtqia+ community and it hurts me to think that they might have to struggle to no end.

Thank you so much in advance💜

Marengo.

Hi! So wow, this is a hard and dense topic where I'm not sure if I can do it total justice here in a blog post. I do have a post up from last year about homophobia in South Korea. Which is here for those who haven't seen it or want to reread as a refresher before this post

And I guess we can kind of take this as a part 2 for that post now.

I can't guess on how long something will take, I don't know that much about how policitical maneuvering works. I just know it will absolutely take too long no matter what. But we can sort of just touch on what things currently are looking like over there right now based on my admittedly limited knowledge.

They do currently have a new president over there, Yoon Suk-Yeol. In regards to the people he was up against for the presidency his stated stances for the 4 pledge recommendations in the LGBTQ category was a partial pledge in all four. South Korea is still one of the lowest ranking developed countries for gender equality and same sex relationships are still considered bad and taboo.

Though we can say that there has at least been SOME progress. In April 2022, South Korea's top court overturned a 2019 military court conviction of two soldiers sentenced to now suspended prison terms for a same-sex relationship they had. The Court said the original conviction did not take into account whether the defendants' relations, which took place in a personal space, were consensual, and thus excessively restricting their right to sexual self-determination. The two defendants were indicted in 2017 for having same-sex intercourse in 2016, while off duty and outside their base, which is punishable with prison for up to two years under the Military Criminal Act. In the past, authorities said this law was required in order to maintain discipline.

But some progress is not a lot. Nor has this (to my knowledge) actually decriminalized gay relationships in the military (yet). In 2019, the now presidential secretary, Kim Seong-hoe, made statements saying he believed that homosexuality was a type of mental illness and should be treated as such. He HAS acknowledged that past statement as hate speech and has "back tracked." In the way that politicians do. His statement is now not any better. His current statement regarding LGBTQ citizens? Here:

“I respect individuals’ diverse sexual orientations. However, personally, I am against homosexuality. And there are people who have innate homosexual tendencies, but in many cases, I think people mistake their habits or tendencies as their sexual instincts. In those cases, homosexuality can be treated, like how a smoker can receive treatments for cigarette addiction.”

Jackass.

And the president himself? When asked in a humans rights watch questionnaire about steps he would take to recognize same sex relationships, Yoon stated:

“Although one may have the right to choose their sexual orientation, I think we need a careful approach to the issue because denying biologically assigned genders and recognizing same-sex couples could have significant social impact.”

No, he doesn't mean a positive social impact either. At least in his "opinion." Yoon also made getting rid of the Ministry of Gender Equality and Family a central pledge of his during his campaign. Saying that there is no systemic discrimination of gender in South Korea. Which is fundamentally untrue and should show his stances fairly accurately. Not to mention that queer people are still considered bad, there is almost "witch hunts" for them in the military, which have been shared and talked about. And even Holland a few months ago posted about being attacked and hate crimed while walking the city with his manager just for being an openly gay idol

So do I think anything is going to change in the next few years? No. I really don't. Do I think that there are people fighting for their rights and pushing and that baby steps are being taken? Yes. I hope they will get there. I hope everywhere will get there. No one deserves to live in fear for simply being who they are or being out with someone they love. And this should serve as an excellent reminder to people who think BTS might be gay or who might be dating in a queer relationship and for jikookers who believe Jimin and JK are together but question why at times they may act differently than normal. Or just want them to confirm something. Or just want them to shut people down more effectively. Or whatever TF it is you want. Remember the society they live in and remember the things you are asking them for can actually harm them. Either mentally or physically or otherwise.

If you are queer, living in a homophobic society, that will affect you CONSTANTLY. And it will affect your actions at times too. Hell, even if you don't live in a homophobic society, it will still affect you at times.

As of now, with this current administration, I don't see things progressing any further than they are now. I'd love to be proven wrong. And I think that at least not letting anything get worse can be considered a small win. The current president campaigning to even partially promote some LGBTQ stances, but doing absolutely nothing about it yet also comparing it to a smoking habit that needs to be kicked. It's giving the same vibes....

Depressing. But again, Baby steps are baby steps and we can be happy for those while simultaneously wishing for more. And that's just South Korea. So many countries, even the ones that are doing better, have far to go.

[naneun-no]

From my drafts so it’s late but:

Today’s delulu thought is that Standing Next to You has too many lyrical coincidences to not be about Jimin.

🫣 I SAID IT WAS DELUSIONAL OKAY

You are free to disagree. You probably should 🤣

I mean we know it wasn’t written by Jung Kook but obviously the version he recorded was arranged with and for JK, and “leave your body golden” can’t be a coincidence right? Like it’s the whole ass album name, plus a word that carries connotations of JK himself, which the ppl who worked with him on Seven must have known.

So if that wasn’t a coincidence… then what about:

1. “How we left and right is something we control” — a callback to both Left and Right by CP feat JK, but also a nod to Butter, a massive BTS hit and a song that he performs alongside his boyfie bestie JM.

2. “When it’s deep like DNA, something they can’t take away” — a callback to another massive BTS hit, interesting. And *delulu warning* also reminds me of JM and JK’s extreme similarities that they themselves have referred to before?? They’re wired the same, they have the same sense of humor, they live and breathe for the same shit and even though they have some very key differences, they really do seem like twin flames (even if you just see it as platonic). They are similar in ways that seem braided into the fibers of their being. Like, in their DNA 🧬 some may say. *delulu warning #2* I’m also reminded of Jimin’s Letter lyrics: “After all this time has passed will we still be the same? Just like we were when we first met.”

Also, “something they can’t take away” is an interesting turn of phrase… more on that later.

3. Okay the real meaty part:

Screaming I’ll testify that we'll survive the test of time, they can't deny our love. They can't divide us, we'll survive the test of time I promise I'll be right here

[I seriously can’t believe how closeted-couple-coded this song is]

First off, again with the Letter lyrics mirrored here with the “test of time.” Then it’s got all this drama about being ripped apart and how it won’t happen and how they’ll be next to each other no matter what and that they have “something they can’t take away.”

Not only does all that line up with other Letter lyrics, but it is so goddamn dramatic and for what?

Be for real, what straight couple in this day and age would have this much working against them?? The only possible explanations are: 1) within the fantasy world of a song I suppose this could be some sort of Romeo and Juliet/West Side Story motif, and to be fair the music video did have a kind of rival gang/crime family look to it? Sort of? With the men fighting below the stage? Idk. Or it could be 2) the fact that idols do in fact often have to hide even their straight relationships, which is wild to me. But I know it’s a thing, so. I suppose there’s that. JK doesn’t seem the type though honestly. I think he’d be even more open about it than V.

On the other hand, the lyrics seem SO fit for a couple who are a) queer, b) closeted, c) currently in/about to be in a legislatively homophobic military and country (am I saying that right? Lol) and d) internationally famous pop idols in the SAME BAND who are both widely regarded as heterosexual sex symbols and would be shunned by many people in their homeland AND internationally if their queerness were to be revealed, much less if they were truly an item and THAT news broke.

Whew. That was a lot but like… that would be a real example of a relationship that would be VERY threatened by outside forces plotting against them and trying to separate them. Not JK and a hot blonde model, not him and a Korean actress, not basically any other scenario but a queer relationship.

Idk I know he didn’t write it but like ??? What the hell is that theme? I’m dying to get inside the mind of the people who DID write it, because are they or are they jikookers at this point like?!

4. Just for fun I’ll also point out the “leave your body golden like the sun and moon” 😏 like. Okay. At this point the songwriters are watching Jikook compilations, drooling over @slaaverin edits like convince me they’re not. CONVINCE ME.

5. “Deeper than the rain”?! “The pain”?! Alright I’m not even serious at this point but ??? Rainy day fight 🌧️?!?! 🤣🤣

6. “Standing next to you” oh you mean like… for 18 months? In a companion enlistment program? Like that?

Alright alright I’m done but you get my point. What even is this song if not an anthem of jikookery?! It’s more on-the-nose than Letter, more sneaky than Still With You. It wasn’t written by JK but at this point I’m calling that the songwriters are as delulu as me.

Hope y’all are well. If you made it to the end of this thank you for donning your tinfoil hat with me and I hope you at least got a giggle.

✌️

[butchbarbieagainstterfs]

I know I'm going to come off as paranoid, but I think my worry is this: if LGBTQIA+ topics are socially deemed to be "inappropriate to children", if you can't mention queerness or transness around kids at all, then the law can be changed so that LGBTQIA+ people can't be around children. Section 28 again, but applying to all occupations that might cause a queer person to interact with a child (so no teachers, librarians, or public sector work at all); people potentially being arrested or marked as perverts for being closeted and in these occupations. Queer and trans people being unable to adopt children, unable to access IVF, and even having their children taken away from them; trans people also having to be sterilised, unmarried and childless/with adult children in order to change their gender markers. I can go on.

I think people would say I'm using a "slippery slope" fallacy - perhaps linking protests about Drag Story Time to people having their families broken up - but a lot of these WERE the policies that the UK ran on until only 20 years ago (I know older butches who were threatened with losing their children, for example), and many countries still have some form of the other policies in place; I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility for this to be the end point of all this homophobic and transphobic rhetoric that's going around right now.

Am I being daft? I feel like it's the obvious "goal" of the right wing, but I've not seen anyone bring it up.

You aren’t. In some places in America they started kidnapping kids from parents not just if the kid was trans but even if one of the parents was too.

They don’t want us around kids. Full stop. Anyone who tries to claim it’s a slippery slope fallacy doesn’t understand how this shit works.

It’s like when people said “just go to another bakery” when a gay couple was refused a wedding cake, and then republicans literally tried to make it legal for people to refuse queer folk housing. Some people even on the left are waaaay too tolerant of anti-LGBTQ people.

[booasaur]

As someone at 27 y/o bi leaning towards women.. who’s born in a country that doesn’t support lgbt rights and also in the closet because of homophobic dad/relatives, im honestly so upset by this. The only way I can live my truth is to live vicariously through the wlw media that I consume and it fuckin hurts. It’s heartbreaking that even just being who I am is impossible and the only way I can is being ripped away from me. I don’t know how much more I can take, especially during pride month

Oof, I get you, anon. When it's your only outlet to something that for others can manifest in so many life-changing ways, crushes, first kisses, dating, sex, marriage, children, it can be so stifling when even the one avenue you have is closed off. And however far away it's happening, it's a reminder of the same homophobia and restrictions you see right around you, so it feels even more hopeless, knowing that in places that are supposedly better off, there are still these major battles to be fought.

I don't know your exact situation, but here are some of the things that helped me come to terms with these same frustrations:

First, focus on individual people more than trends. That's tough to do, for sure, especially when, again, you see so much homophobia directly around you so it seems ubiquitous, but if you're particularly taking WN's case to heart, remember that as much as Netflix tried to shut it down, the cast and crew fought for it! For all these cancellations, there are people who made the original media in the first place and tried to keep it going. It's not hopeless, there's so much support and so many allies.

This next part might be hard to accept, and you know, maybe it's not what'll work for you, but for me, I really did have to learn to not get really deep into any one show or ship. When things are good, they're so good, it all sucks you in, you check the updates all the time, and maybe most importantly, there's this whole community you become a part of. But when you lose it, not if, because in f/f you will, even if things end well, there aren't enough people to keep it going, the more you've made it a part of your life, the more you feel that loss.

All fans should exercise moderation and keep things in perspective, but I'm speaking more to people like us, who don't have anything in real life to balance out what we experience through media.

I answered this ask a little late because I did get sucked up into other shows airing right now that have f/f and that doesn't negate the core issue, this will be the final season for most of them, if not all, but there's still something to get into, even just in f/f media. Perhaps you may prefer lesfic, or the f/f Youtube/Tiktok scene, or webseries.

It's also worth getting into non-media hobbies. Or, you know, at least consuming non-f/f media. I remember being angry at seeing the m/f couples in pretty much everything else while we couldn't have anything, so I just didn't watch anything at all and instead just did those elaborate adult paint by numbers and listened to comedy podcasts. And once I did feel more in the mood to watch stuff again, it was goofy sitcoms and old school murder mysteries, where it wasn't really like, oh, I wish this had more of us. :P

Lastly, it really does sting at you if you feel isolated and alone even from your own family, so try to see if there are other ways you can connect with them. Otherwise it just adds to your negative feelings to resent and fear them.

None of this may work for you, there are so many other possibilities, moving away, coming out, getting involved with LGBT organizations near you or just meeting other queer people, but I'm sure you've already considered those options and they're not currently doing enough for you. But I would at least give some of this a shot, try some distance at first, and hopefully it'll start to feel better. It really doesn't help that we're globally going through a pretty rough time, but just focus on feeling better yourself.

[ask-serendipity-sky]

People who are remarking on how we don't see them in public anymore but used to and asking why their behaviour has suddenly changed - I have a theory. I have no evidence for the theory but I have it though 😭

I understand people's skepticism about being told that as enlistment approaches, they have to be more careful - but that's a fact. There's also an additional thing that happened from late 2022. We've spent so many years not knowing a single possible relationship of the tannies apart from rumors which were less than substantial. JK got into a scandal just because he was physically close to a girl but again that was flimsy.

However last year, one of the tannies relationships did get leaked and leaked in a privacy violating way where clear private pics of them hanging out together came out. You can't tell me that if jikook were an actual closeted couple that existed in this group, they wouldn't be affected by that. Taennie are both popular and the relationship didn't have anything unacceptable with it on the surface (by which I mean things like age difference etc were all ok) and yet they both still got hate after the reveal. I'm sure jikook were horrified on behalf of Tae but imagine what might go through their mind as someone whose relationship would be looked down on in their socially conservative country even if they weren't two of the most famous individuals in SoKor. I would probably cut back on all the things I can control like hanging out in public. And if I'm not mistaken, I feel like her group members also changed their approaches a bit this year as well but in the opposite way by being more open about their relationships (something that's not an option of jikook).

I could be completely wrong. Maybe they're on a break. Maybe they're dating others. Maybe they just don't have a traditional relationship. I'm just saying there's a lot of things that are going on in these guys lives that could explain how they could be in a long term romantic relationship even as we see less and less of them.

Hi anon,

I think this completely valid and realistic. Not only for jikook but all the guys saw the reaction army had towards Tae and Jennie. It makes anyone want to keep things on the down low. People still attack Jennie and will attack a non celebrity too. People doesn't love BTS the way they say they do.

Like you said, things for jikook are even more difficult because they are in a homophobic country....and their careers depend on people supporting them.

There are just too many things that could be happening. If we want to be realistic (we do but others don't), it's better to not jump into conclusions and see how the future plays out after the military.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

[bookscandlesnbts]

Dumb homophobic anon, yes homophobic... This is not only about Jikook's safety going into ms and it being normal for you or anyone else to see "two bandmates and friends" hangout. It's about what a closeted queer couple, in the homophobic country and industry trying to get into a super heteronormative industry, is comfortable with. They might not feel the same as you or anyone else who only see them as friends. They might not feel safe. They might not feel like letting you into their private lives. And for you or anyone else to expect or demand them to do things they are not comfortable with just to prove their closeness is honestly fucked up. They don't owe you shit. They are idols, artists and performers who are here to entertain their fans, but their relationship is not for your entertainment.

Jikook might not feel the same level of comfort sharing all about spending time with eo as they do their normal friends. And it doesn't matter how normal those interactions look to you. It's not the same to them. And honestly that in itself should tell you alot.

Yes!!!! This anon gets it and articulated it better than me. The audacity of these anons to demand interactions from them astounds me.

[thedreadvampy]

Idk like I have been thinking about queer progress (cause I just read a relevant book) and how we keep a healthy balance of like. Recognising how fucked and dangerous the political direction globally and nationally is for our community - the escalating attacks on trans and gender nonconforming folks, the rising tide of "groomer" rhetoric, the bit where There's Still A Bunch Of Countries Violently Criminalising Gayness - without losing sight of how far and how fast things have come in the last couple of generations.

When my parents were kids, it was a criminal offence in the UK for men to have sex with men. literally it took until 1982 for sex between men in any form to be legal across the UK. and progress isn't a straight line. 1967 homosexuality was legalised in England and Wales and in the 70s the gay liberation movement went mainstream - Pride marches, openly active LGBTQ community organisations, widely available queer media, a collective coming out of the closet as a political commitment etc. in 1980 homosexuality was legalised in Scotland, 1982 in Northern Ireland.

1988, section 28.

It being illegal to positively teach children about queerness is, pretty unambiguously, better than it being illegal to be queer. It's also pretty unambiguously awful and a terrible thing for the community. Queer history is full of taking ten steps forward and being pushed five steps back.

when I was a child it was illegal to speak positively to children about queerness, but queerness existed in the public consciousness as more than a shadowy threat. There were gay characters on TV and openly gay celebrities in the public eye. the WHO had declassified homosexuality as a mental disorder by then and conversation therapy was much less widespread in the UK.

When I was little, the AIDS crisis was in full swing and there was an upswing in homophobic violence, but by the time I hit my teens Section 28 was repealed, the age of consent was equalised, the Equality Act included legal protections against work discrimination for LGBTQ+ people, civil partnerships became available for gay couples, homosexuality was fully decriminalised (can you believe that took until 2004???) and legal gender recognition became a possibility for trans people.

Between 2004 and 2014 there was this surge in support and normalisation of queerness. when I was 15 equal marriage seemed decades away and by the time I was 20 it was in place not just in the UK but in a bunch of countries. and since then we've seen the TIE campaign in Scotland, the ban on conversion therapy, the protection of adoption rights and so on. and socially like. as my mum said over Christmas, in the 90s or the 2000s if you had a gay kid most people would be shocked if you 100% supported them - in the 2020s if you had a gay kid most people would be shocked if you 100% rejected them. like the social attitudes towards queerness have changed immeasurably in my lifetime.

but at the same time. just like the focus changed but the backlash came hard between legalising homosexuality in 1977-82 and creating Section 28 in '88. It's less socially acceptable to attack homosexuality but the backlash has fallen hard on trans people and, to a lesser extent, gender nonconforming queer people. (and that was noticeable even in 2013 bc the equal marriage bill, while a big step forward, also did kind of throw trans people under the bus by allowing their spouse to effectively block their application for gender recognition)

and there it is, again, ten steps forward five steps back. the whole LGBTQ community (including, but less so, trans people) have clawed back a lot of social space and basic rights they were still being denied a decade or two ago. that's good. Trans people in particular are the subject of violent social and legislative targeting across the UK and beyond. that's bad.

with criminalisation, with focused policing, with AIDS, with section 28, the community was pushed and it pushed back hard. but with the current attacks focusing on increasingly specific subsections of the community right now, a lot of people are finding it easy to get complacent. because if you're not trans and you're not politically engaged (and you know even a decade ago it was very - if you're not fussed about the difference between marriage and civil partnership) and you don't have much connection to people who are, then Things Have Never Been Better.

even for the most assimilationist white middle class gay men, homophobia isn't over, but for people who aren't falling personally foul of this wave of transphobia this past decade has probably been the safest and stablest time to be gay in UK history. not perfect. but better.

but that doesn't mean we get to be complacent because the backlash is still there. in the 70s complacency was gay people complaining that they liked it fine in the closet anyway. in the 80s, people saying well if people weren't getting AIDS and being loudly political and embarrassing, we wouldn't have an issue. in the 2000s, people saying can't we just be happy that we're allowed to be ourselves? what do we need marriage and babies for? In the 2010s and 2020s, people saying well gay people can just be normal now. I'm married and middle class and apolitical and monogamous and have 2.5 kids and don't need to make a thing about it.

and that complacency fucks us all. it fucks the people targeted by the newest wave of backlash and it eventually makes every queer person less safe and less secure.

and idk I think the lesson of the last couple of generations of queer history is twofold. we can't be complacent because if we rest on our laurels too long we will get pushed back down under the boot. but at the same time the common corollary to that is despair - nothing gets better or ever will - and fuck man that couldn't be less true. If we take two steps and get knocked back one, we're still a step further forward, and the LGBTQ+ community has got a long way pushing against the wind. and all the time we need to keep that in mind. things aren't good. but they're better. and they keep getting better step by aching embattled step until we realise what we thought as kids was the far distant blue-sky dream of "good" is way in the rear view by now.

dykes of my parents' generation grew up dreaming of just seeing a single out and proud dyke in the public eye. of a world where you could hold hands in public and tell people who you were. gay marriage seemed like a distant dream. now it's just part of life. trans people of my parents' generation almost always lived their lives either in the closet or in constant fear of being clocked, and an uncounted number of people were just never given language to understand their experiences. and now everyone I know knows at least one trans person, and kids have "the trans kid" in their class, and the backlash is enormous and violent and terrible but also. right now kids who are trans have the language to make sense of what they're feeling, and the possibility of accessing affirming care, and at least some people who can tell them they're not broken.

it's not ok. we're not in an ok situation. there's still a weight of brutal oppression bearing down and pushing us back. but fuck man look how far we've come in a lifetime. look how far we can still go. 🤷‍♀️ especially if the less affected parts of the community pull their finger out and understand this as a fight for collective liberation.

[crimson-azure]

Life update : started college for my masters and moved away from home for the first time. It’s been a month and i feel a lot of emotions and have had a lot of experiences. My home life was not great by any chance, if anything it was toxic. A controlling mother, anger-issues father, oh and not to forget a lot of homophobia(im gay) from their side. For as long as i remember ive wanted to leave. For the longest time i had this picture perfect vision in my mind of living on my own and being happy. Finding people who love me for who i am, maybe someone to care for, maybe a sense of belonging, because ive never felt that. Ive always felt on the outside looking in.

The thing is this spiral doesnt end just because one changes their location. “You take it with you”, the expression really is true. Im from a metro city in India and my college is in the most conservative state of the country. I feel like im being shoved back in the closet. And its suffocating. Ive heard a couple of people make homophobic jokes while im in the room and the rage and fear ive felt is real. I wish there was a button to change the minds of people for the better. I wish i could make them understand but i cant. And all i wanna do is go home……

I want to find one with safe windows that dont break everytime it storms. One that is warm and cozy with no leaky roofs when it rains. One that doesnt judge, just accepts and loves. Where politics and back bitching is non existant.

I hope i find it and i pray, so does everyone.

[menalez]

This is odd and I hope it’s doesn’t offend you but I want your opinion. Is it normal to just, not want to be gay? I hate it. I don’t find any joy in being different. I want to have a normal life with kids and not have to worry that my family will always be perceived as different. I’m so tired of having another layer of complexity to my relationships. I just wish I could be straight, but I’d rather die than date a man. I’d rather be single for the rest of my life. People say ‘oh you can try’ I don’t even want to think about it. I wish so many times a day I was bisexual and could stomach being with a man but I can’t. It’s not normal or natural for me and no matter how much I pray and hope i can be osa I just am not made for it. I’m literally hardwired to be a lesbian and I just wish I could be as fluid as these other people say they are. I wish I wasn’t stuck being hated and judged and different. I watch these romance television shows and know I’ll never be seen as pure and loving as the couples in them. I’ll always be a different kind of love. I just can’t stand it sometimes. Does this go away? I’ve known I was gay for years, since I was 11 I knew I liked girls. I’ve only kissed boys, and I cried after because I knew no matter how much I tried it just wasn’t right, it wasn’t attractive and it wasn’t what I was made for. How can I find acceptance? Love for myself? I’m so exhausted of this feeling

that’s pretty tough anon. honestly it sounds like you have some very deep-seated internalised homophobia. are you in a homophobic environment perhaps? if so, is it possible to change that environment into a more supportive one? something that helped me is being around other gay people and seeing that our love can be beautiful too. plus staying so closeted and rejecting yourself and forcing yourself to kiss men does not help, it probably intensifies the negative feelings you have. besides that, tbh i’d suggest avoiding the things that trigger those feelings and trying to change how you think about it. if you start thinking “it’ll never be viewed as pure!” ask yourself, so what if homophobes will view me from a shitty lens? they’re mistaken, there’s nothing about same-sex attraction that makes it less “pure”. if you start thinking “i just want a normal life with kids”, think to yourself that you CAN have a normal life with kids. sure, not a normal heterosexual life, sure not without discrimination, but potentially a normal life otherwise. i’m from such a homophobic country but i managed to leave and now i’m in a more accepting environment and frankly i can go quite some time before remembering that my “lifestyle” (ie my homosexuality) is somehow “unconventional”.

if possible, therapy can also help. bc your way of thinking sounds quite deeply rooted & so it may be hard for you to catch yourself and change your way of thinking on your own

[stormblessed95]

Aside from not realizing that every relationship is different and people have their own established boundaries when it comes to their partners, many of your weird anons seem to be missing a glaring fact, which is that if Jungkook and Jimin are indeed in a relationship, then they are a closeted couple in a largely homophobic country who have the added complication of being mega famous. This alone means that they cannot be expected to behave in the way that many of these anons expect them to, i.e "typical couple behavior". I constantly wonder how so many doubters and "insecure jikookers" completely ignore this fact when presenting their cases. For example Jungkook is not gonna sit there on a livestream viewed by millions and admit that he goes to Jimin's room often because he loves him and wants to see him. No, he's going to make an excuse because he's not an idiot and he knows that always being in Jimin's room is already suspicious enough and at some point they've gotta dial it back and maintain plausible deniability. And even while trying to maintain plausible deniability they have still toed the line so many times and had moments where they present themselves almost undoubtedly like a couple. And I personally believe that anytime this happens they tend to scale things back even more, at least for awhile before they let things slip again. TL:DR, if they are romantically involved, which as jikookers we assume they are, then it must be taken into account that they are a closeted couple, they cannot be expected to say certain things or act/react in certain ways publicly, so just let them be and accept that we are not privy to an explanation of all their interactions and behaviors when it doesn't meet our liking or our expectations for how a couple should behave.

Yes.

[daisy-blooms]

Daisy, and the name that I won't say.

Hi, this is my introduction I guess. I've never really used tumblr before, but I've always heard that the people here are unhinged. It was probably worse before they banned pornography. Anyways, I'm Daisy, y'all. I'm a semi-closeted trans woman currently attending a private Christian university in Tennessee. I live with my homophobic/transphobic/xenophobic/slightly racist parents under a different name that won't be said. I'm at a point in my life where I'm really trying to think hard about what it is I actually want to do.

Right now I am studying as an art major and English minor. But that's not super important to me. The only reason I'm attending college is because somehow I am getting paid to do it. My father works at the school I go to, so I get my tuition wavered. I have a couple scholarships as well, so since I live at home, all of that money goes straight to me. I'm also working two part-time jobs while I'm not studying or procrastinating. Basically, I'm doing fine financially, for now at least. I'm trying to take advantage of every opportunity in life to make money at the moment. My goal is to save up enough to move across the country to some state that's more friendly to people like me once I graduate.

In order to do that, I've had to do some pretty gross stuff. My attending college, and more than likely my housing situation, is entirely reliant upon the fact that I uphold my role as my parents youngest child, the son my mom gave birth to twenty (twenty-one in September) years ago. I had a therapist at one point, but that quickly became too expensive for a legal-dependent young college student without any personal health insurance. I have lied to my family and friends for more than two decades now. Again, as that name that I won't say. It eats away at a girl. Especially when it's over something so trivial as skirts and heels versus cargo shorts and sneakers.

I am at the precipice of the rest of my life. I am only one year away from being able to do what I have planned for about eleven years now. I feel like a lot of queer people can imagine the feelings going on in my head: elation, relief, fear, frustration and freedom. It's a lot for someone who never learned how to manage them. I have successfully turned every stress-relieving hobby that helps me relax into a way to make money or a waste of my time.

I do not know why I am here. I do not know why I am typing a Tumblr post right now. But it has helped me think about my situation and where I am at in life. It all boils down to surviving one more year while being called a name that I won't say. If I can do that... the only name that will matter will be the one that I picked a while back from a field of transgender flowers: Daisy.

Yours honestly, Daisy S.

[mrs-monaghan]

No one is changing fucking narratives. Think about it you dumb idiots. You're in the closet, in a homophobic country, trying to live your best queer life in a glass closet. You leave enough hints about your sexuality & the person you love. Hickeys, GCF Tokyo with a queer love song. People either believe it or don't. And one day you're enjoying a significant COUPLE HOLIDAY in korea, with said partner you did all the above things with & the next thing you know its spread all over the internet.

Now I understand why Jikook are doing what they are nowadays. They were caught together on a couple holiday without members, by locals & since then, Jikook's public outings have stopped. The way JM even tried to downplay White day, which might have worked had he not posted JK on White Day before they were caught out, but still, the fact that he even felt he needed to play down the holiday & even stopped going to that place, should throw up major flags. They've always been able to leave room for deniability, but it's hard to explain a couple day outing. Seems it scared them into becoming more private. That & we have JM's mail stolen & privacy breached around the same time. Jikook obviously felt they could go out & didn't worry cause for the most part their privacy is respected. And now that they were, they been cautious since. This wasn't some premiere outing with two friends & cameras on a random day. We are talking 2 people who have spelled it out they are queer, who are rumored to be dating, who were caught out on their private time together, on a COUPLE HOLIDAY with no other members of BTS & it spread all over the internet. The only duo of BTS rumored to be dating and they are the only two caught out together on a real couple holiday. Yeah, its a big damn deal.

I just know Hybe and The members said something to them day. If they police Jikook during random photoshoots like we've seen or interject, when they are just having fun together, oh you know they came down on Jikook that day & they probably got blamed for it, even tho its not their fault someone took a pic and posted it. The timing of WD & Jikook's public outings coming to stop, is too perfectly timed for it to be a coincidence.

If I had a shilling for everytime someone said coincidence in regards to Jikook I would be a millionaire 😂😂😂😂 when are we gonna give this word up and accept there ain't no such thing as coincidence with these 2??

You wanna know what a coincidence is? This.

JK splashes Jimin 13 times. Their favourite number. Now that, is a coincidence. Because JK would have kept going had Jimin not asked him to stop. That is how u use the word coincidence.

JK using There for you a "gay" song for GCFT is NOT a coincidence.

Jimin appearing at the exact same lyrics during GCF Saipan is NOT a coincidence.

Both Jikook being from Busan, is a coincidence.

This, was NOT a coincidence.

Them wearing plasters on their fore fingers during a fan meet for no reason was NOT a coincidence

The J on JK's hand been directly ontop of the M is NOT a coincidence.

Jimin having a moon tattoo and JK having a sun tattoo is NOT a coincidence.

Jikook recounted once how they saw ghosts when they still lived at the dorm in their early years. JK said while showering he thought he saw a ghost but it turned out to be RM. Jimin said one time when showering he thought he saw a ghost but it turned out to be Suga. Everyone on twitter was like "aww what a coincidence! You are me i am you" Meanwhile I'm just over here like; Guys, 👏🏾they👏🏾were👏🏾showering👏🏾to👏🏾ge👏🏾ther. Their stories were too similar, that's literally the only explanation. HELLOOOO!!! Y'all give young Jikook too much credit 😂

Jikook posting at the same hour, same minute, exact same second is NOT a coincidence

JK coming live on white day and Jimin showing up in the comment section was NOT a coincidence.

Jikook having moles in the same spots of their bodies, that's a coincidence.

This. Is NOT a coincidence

They👏🏾sleep👏🏾to👏🏾ge👏🏾ther!!👏🏾

JK allowing an account kookminaredating into his game was NOT a coincidence.

Y'all catch my drift.

Sorry anon, I saw the word coincidence and went on a tangent but u are correct. With Jikook, coincidence should be used very lightly. And yes to the rest of your ask. 💜💜💜💜💜

[seasurfacefullofclouds1]

If you read this review and a review by any of the Larries you wouldn’t feel like they were watching the same film.

https://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/my-policeman-movie-review-2022

Larries are ready to hand Harry his Oscar, I guess they thought just because a film festival gave the cast a prize which they invented for the first time and was not judged by a jury, Harry automatically was up for an Oscar. Not like film festivals are marketing ploys and the attention Tiff received by having Harry Styles and also Taylor Swift this year didn’t get them loads of sponsorship and notoriety which they strive for.

I mean even Oscars are, so maybe they are right.

Sometimes I look at Harry Styles and I feel bad for him. Not because he isn’t getting a fair shake, but because someone told him he could be a leading man without warning him about the time and work needed to become one. Hot on the heels of the world premiere of his upcoming “Don’t Worry Darling,” the Olivia Wilde-directed movie mired in controversy and less than generous reviews for his performance, Styles’ second film of 2022 is an adaptation of Bethan Roberts’ same-titled novel. Here, Styles’ inexperience as a leading man in a weepy British queer period piece is glaring. As the film's protagonist PC Tom Burgess, he stands and speaks like a tourist awkwardly stumbling upon a movie set. His co-star, Emma Corrin, is hardly better as his stuffy lover. She tussles with the least developed character of the bunch, but much like Styles, never proves herself as a lead. How can a movie with this much youthful talent be so breathlessly boring?

Helmed by an adequate Michael Grandage, “My Policeman” begins in the present day with the older versions of these characters: Tom (Linus Roache) and Marion (Gina McKee), now retired, live in a seaside town as they go through the motions of their milquetoast marriage. Their steady march toward resignation—which Tom momentarily pauses whenever he visits the sea with their dog—is interrupted with the arrival of their old, now estranged friend Patrick (Rupert Everett). A guilt-ridden Marion volunteered to care for him after a debilitating stroke left him nearly bedridden. And while Marion is ready to bury the proverbial hatchet, Tom refuses to see the man his wife says they owe so much to because he “Taught [them] how to see art.”

The pain that Patrick caused the couple is what “My Policeman” hopes to tell us about. And yet, how it tells us, and what it thinks we hope to gain from this story, comes with little flair and even less self-awareness.

The past on a sunny beach in 1950s Britain, where Marion (Corrin) sees the dashing Tom (Styles certainly isn’t lacking in the looks department) running across the sand. He teaches her how to swim; the pair soon start dating. Humble and working-class, Tom is the total opposite of the educated, arts-focused Marion. It’s why Tom goes to such lengths to read about paintings. The two eventually meet Patrick (David Dawson), a museum curator who knows Tom from being a witness in one of his cases. The trio become inseparable. It even appears that Patrick might be attracted to Marion, and her to him. That is, until we discover that Tom and Patrick are in a closeted sexual relationship.

The messy triangle that forms from these two competing relationships is meant to suggest tension and sympathy for a hopelessly romantic woman seemingly being a victim of two men, who are also victims of the country’s homophobic laws. We come to find, however, that this trio doesn’t fit into easy boxes: Tom demands law and order; Marion is homophobic; and Patrick is somehow their friend. This conundrum would provide juicy drama if any of these actors possessed a speck of chemistry with the other. It doesn’t help that Grandage, through his blocking and coverage, and the editing by Chris Dickens (“Slumdog Millionaire”) try their best to hide Styles’ deficiencies. His physical understanding of the character lacks specificity; his line deliveries are monotone; he doesn’t project allure. There is no interiority or charm in anything he does. Even his sex scenes—where Grandage confuses bare skin and moaning for passion—are without bite.

Instead, “My Policeman” finds smoother ground in the present-day scenes with a trio of older actors who can elevate a script. Make no mistake, the prime culprit in this soporific film is a terrible screenplay that tells a gay love story through the elderly Marion, a straight cis-woman, adopting Patrick’s memories by reading his diaries. It's also frustrating how the script's set-up is initially intriguing, only for a twist to throw all of the built up tension and angst out without a coherent vision for what comes next. And a rushed ending doesn’t instill any further confidence. The fact that the inner lives of these characters are so underwritten you barely understand their psychology—especially with the flawed Marion, who still might be homophobic—makes them unmemorable.

“My Policeman” is surface-level queer representation lacking in visual imagination and begging for better performances. It’s the kind of glacially paced movie that sticks around for two hours and tells its viewer nothing new; a series of moving images without any sense of emotion or wonder. “My Policeman” commits the gravest of crimes—it’s soulless.

This review was filed from the Toronto Film Festival.

My Policeman— and Harry himself— show that bad art, even if queer representation is the subject, is still bad art.

[alottamoney]

"I also think they exaggerate homophobia in SK , don't get me wrong, they are homophobic, but they aren't being guillotined over there either. Gay idols exist and yes, they lose out on work..."

I get what you're saying and I agree to an extent but I just want to say that openly queer idols usually have a lot more to worry about than just losing out on work. Openly gay idol, Holland, for example was physically assaulted in Korea because of his sexuality. I think there are overall safety concerns that probably outweigh any career concern, though I'm sure those matter too. Since BTS are at their level, they absolutely are more privileged than most in the sense that they have bodyguards and much easier access to protection and security should they need it, but they would still ultimately be jeopardizing their safety if they would come out. I'm not saying that any of them are for sure queer, but I just think we shouldn't say that they aren't coming out (hypothetically) due to fear of losing their careers. South Korea isn't the most homophobic country out there, sure, but it's not exactly the most queer friendly place either and I think we should take that into account. There's also a long history of homophobia in regards to the Korean military, which they're all about to enlist in soon. Like I said I understand your original point but I just wanted to add this

You don't need to convince me, anon. I am not the one coming up with elaborate closeting theories while simultaneously celebrating the allegedly closeted couple, like anon pointed out. If you think their life is in danger then maybe don't trend "taekookisreal" or point out couple rings or gas up Dispatch or diss the beard. You understand why doing all of this then showing concern for their safety is counterproductive, yes?

[spurgie-cousin]

Coming from a background of extreme Christian/conservatism and LGBTQ, I am not sexuality speculating when I say I honestly don’t think Jana would even know what to do in a wlw situation. It goes against everything she has ever known and she probably only has negative references for. You can care about your friends deeply, which I think she does (see Laura attending the trial by herself the day before Jana) but also have no basis for anything further. I don’t think she would even be entertaining courtships if there were something going on and that picture of her at the Wissmann’s Xmas was last year. I don’t mean this to be rude, but I honestly can’t see her even being able to have language or actions in that regard.

Well first I think you're under the impression that I ever thought they were a couple, which I haven't. I was just explaining to that other anon how speculation in the snarking community about Jana and Laura eventually reached them and why that's bad.

Second, I'm a queer ex-Christian who has been homophobic in the past because of religion and who also has known a fair amount of ultra-Conservative Christians in their life (at least compared to most people I've met). I'm gonna use bullet points just to avoid writing an essay about this because I could:

I think you're talking more about the act of dating than recognizing feelings, but just in case it's also the feelings thing, trust me, queer, closeted Christians recognize them. They just don't know what to do with them.

As far as she 'wouldn't know what to do' I mean, my thing is she just probably wouldn't for some of the reasons you've mentioned. Christians like Jana have been told that same-sex feelings are something to be curbed like alcohol or porn addiction which, if she buys into that, would probably lead her to try about 1 million other recourses before trying a relationship.

But for the people who do end up acknowledging their feelings, you don't necessarily need a perfect example of an LGBTQ+ couple to figure it out, ya know? I've heard stories from gay ex-Amish, Mennonites, IBLP, Mormons (who were practicing at the time of their first experimentation) and my summarization of all those stories is they figured it out lol. Think of it like gays who live in really conservative or religious countries, there's almost always an unspoken protocol of sorts or underground community for queer people (unknown to the establishment).

How queer, practicing fundamentalists deal with same-sex attraction is a completely individual experience, some people are able to really bury themselves in denial, some people find a way to justify secret relationships, it can vary.

Again, I don't have any proof or any inclination really that Jana Duggar is LGBTQ+, and since I don't think it's something she'd ever disclose even if it was true, it doesn't really interest me. But I guess what I'm saying is, I think we all underestimate fundies in the area of sexuality/what they're capable of figuring out if they want to.

[theboywiththewaves]

Travel Diary Entry 3

Let's talk about gay stuff 🌈

How men go about being gay in India has always been fascinating to me. Indian society is deeply conservative and tends to be pretty homophobic.

A couple of years ago I matched with a handsome filmmaker based in Mumbai and I asked him what the gay scene was like. He said it was very small and that most people in the community knew each other and discreetly carried on relationships in the shadows.

But that couldn't possibly be the whole picture. India is a country of 1.4 billion people, so there's no way the community can be THAT small. So now that I'm here, I resolved to do some investigation - with Grindr 😭.

When I opened Grindr in India, I noticed four things:

• There are so many men active on these apps, it really took me by surprise. The sheer amount of messages made me turn off my notifications - which I've never done anywhere else because I'm vain and like attention 😭.

• The men here have voracious sexual appetites and enthusiastically embrace kinks in a way that wouldn't be out of place in San Francisco. I don't know why exactly that's surprising, but I guess I expected them to be more conservative than they are. A lot of these men can barely speak English, but are perfectly adept at constructing truly filthy propositions (I'm not complaining about this).

• There are a suspicious number of white skinned muscle gods with ripped abs on the grid. Which leads me to point 4;

• Holy catfish. Being closeted or discreet is common in most places in the world. Usually this results in an abundance of profiles featuring headless torsos - the intent being "I can't show you my face but don't worry I'm hot." In India, the men are so deeply closeted that headless torso shots are too risky - so they post pictures of gay men from other countries. The practice is so common that you will find many profiles that have to explicitly state "Dp is mine." Dp is a very funny abbreviation because it definitely means something else in Western countries and at first I was in shock at how many people here were into that scene. However, I'm happy to report that it actually means "default pic."

My investigations into gayness here will continue (I've matched with a handful of really cute guys here so who knows - maybe a date is on the horizon.)