#but this speech and people's reactions to it

[nightcolorz]

I think part of why communities autistic representation with Abed is so good isn’t just how it portrays the symptoms and experience accurately, but also how it conveys plot lines and story arcs about the different types of people and interpersonal conflict an autistic person would face. Community definitely isn’t the first show to have ableism as a conflict, but in my experience of watching stuff it’s the first show I’ve seen that has such a nuanced approach to so many different types of ableism and different realistic reactions and solutions (all while being a sitcom with a cast of morally corrupt characters and absurd fantastical scenarios).

Frankie Dart for example, who is introduced in season 6, is kind of that level headed business woman archetype, conveys that she has a lot of experience with disabled ppl in her personal life, and (as is later confirmed) a lot of affection for them bcus she has a sister with a high support needs disability. This draws her to Abed, being that he’s autistic, and the two begin and understanding and friendship. Frankie is very kind and unusually understanding and compassionate towards Abed and his needs, and communicates with him in a way that is refreshingly easy for him to understand. And at the same time, patterns of infantilizing and condescending behavior begin to occur in their dynamic, until eventually Frankie outright says that abed “doesn’t know any better”, conveying to him that she thinks he’s too disabled to be aware of what he wants and believes, or to make his own decisions without someone who knows what’s best for him to guide him. And the great thing is everyone who witnesses her say this is disgusted 😭🫶 she is berated bcus everyone who knows abed knows that he is a grown ass man who doesn’t need to be hand held or condescended to.

But what’s so interesting about this conflict with Frankie is that she does earnestly mean well, she’s not a one sided abliest villain, she’s a person who could really exist. What is conveyed is that Frankie infantilizes abed bcus she has an expectation of autism that does not apply to every autistic person. She assumes that bcus her sister has high support needs and needs help making decisions, that abed is the same way, bcus she thinks all autistic ppl r like her sister and acts accordingly. And then she learns that this is wrong, and abed is fully capable of functioning without her help. It’s great! There’s no moral speech about how autistic ppl aren’t babies or anything like that. Frankie means well, fucks up, and is forgiven when she changes her behavior.

I just love it bcus ableism and other forms of bigotry aren’t often portrayed with so much nuance. Ableism isn’t usually this big thing, most people r on some degree abliest, and a lot of the time people who have a lot of experience with disabled ppl and mean well (especially ppl with disabled family or siblings) end up having the most abliest biases, it just feels so real.

[chaos-of-the-abyss]

I hope you don't mind me asking this, but why do you like Celegorm? I love that you're vocal about how stupid the Feanorian woobification in this fandom is because people who claim that they did nothing wrong or that they're not villains clearly hasn't read the Silm, but while there's still a level of sympathy to most of them, Celegorm is just genuinely the worst and I can't figure out what there is to appreciate about him lol. I'm sorry if this comes across as a bad-faith question, I really want to know how you like him while not ignoring, trying to deny, or worst trying to justify (which I have seen FAR too many people doing) his canon actions

you're totally good anon! i'd be happy to answer this. just want to preface, i perfectly get where you're coming from and why people hate celegorm, because he is, as you say, the worst. he's horrible. he's done awful things to countless people -- and by no means is he the only feanorian to have done that, obviously, but celegorm's actions in luthien's story make him a type of squicky that's unique even among the brothers. he, hm. how can i put this. he deserves nothing. and yes, people who try to justify him are just wrong. stop reading the silm if you want a mass murdering sexual predator to be glorified ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

that said! the succinct answer is that it's all about the vibes lol. all the feanorians are awful people, but celegorm is, imo, that particularly entertaining kind of awful. there's a certain interplay between his successes and failures that i find unbearably endearing (derogatory). he is canonically charming and magnetic and charismatic enough to sway people with his rhetoric, and i love that. i love that he's opportunistic, clever, and sly, and pounces on the chance when he spots it. the fact that his speech in nargothrond is explicitly paralleled with feanor's before the flight of the noldor says a lot. i find it compelling that while, in many ways, celegorm is the most distant from his family -- friend of a vala, a great woodsman and hunter which are two things that neither his father nor his brothers are ever even mentioned around -- he is the only one among the sons of feanor to be directly, textually compared to feanor, and feanor during one of his most pivotal and infamous moments, no less. the guy must be a force of nature when he really wants to be. yet at the same time, he's endlessly reckless, arrogant, and shortsighted, and he does not get to get away with his actions. his plans flop (just like he will continue to flop until his karmic and also really fucking funny death in about thirty years' time, i'll get back to that), his intentions are discerned, and he gets thrown out in disgrace for treachery with the embarrassing declaration "a maiden had dared that which the sons of feanor had not dared to do" following after him. it's that particular blend of hyper-competence followed hand-in-hand by prompt abject failure and humiliation that makes him so appealing to me.

oh and. another thing about celegorm is that he has the added charm of being a fucking sore loser and a petty bitch -- trying to kill luthien even though she spares his brother's life when she'd be justified throttling him and curufin with her bare hands and i just. he's sooo funny. what is wrong with him. so many things are wrong with him. tfw you kidnap and tried to rape this woman and she does you an untold, absolutely herculean grace and kindness that you know damn well you do not deserve and your reaction is to try to kill her for daring to show you compassion. he's insane.

then. then then then then. he gets chased by own dog and runs away "in terror." you know you've messed up when your dog finally has enough of your bullshit and runs you down because he's fed up with all the terrible things you've been doing. not to mention his dog also dies fighting next to a man that he hates, using his last opportunity of speech to say goodbye to said man. like. beren and luthien's story leaves celegorm, as skilled and magnetic as he canonically is, in absolute shambles and it's hilarious. how does one recover from that you may ask. and i answer one does not recover from that.

but that's not even all. after that saga of blunders he hangs around for about three decades doing absolutely nothing of note, then in his attempt to regain some relevancy winds up having the most mortifying death ever. my dude you were the "let's ambush doriath guys" spokesperson. you campaigned for that shit. this was your desire. this is what you wanted. and you walk in there and the guy who's *checks notes* THIRTY-SIX compared to your one-thousand-something KILLS YOU. elves are not developmentally matured until they're a hundred. your killer is like thirty. this is, generously speaking, about an eight year old by your standards. a fucking eight year old kills you. yes i know dior was not actually a child at the time but the fact remains that celegorm quite literally has more life experience than the entire human race and he's done in by the son of a human. then to add second insult to first insult to extreme injury, two of your brothers are also killed in this battle and in the end you all don't even achieve what the fuck you came there to do. THIS WAS YOUR PLAN. how do you lose that badly. holy hell. if i were him i'd stay in the halls of mandos forever out of pure embarrassment. you simply would never see me again. you think i'm walking out into society and showing my face around the block when an eight-year-old ended my life? nah. no sir not me

plus well. on a more serious note, dior is luthien's son. luthien, whom celegorm thought he could control, whom he saw as an object to further his aims and to lust after. he's killed by the son of the woman he tried to rape, and there's nothing more fitting than that.

so! there you have the basic rundown of why i like what's explicitly laid out about celegorm in canon. he's an objectively horrible man, it's just that i find the way he goes about being objectively horrible extremely funny. but i also think he is ripe for exploration in the realm of speculation -- and that speculation enhances what we do know about his actions during b&l and after until his death. aside from the kinslaying at alqualonde wherein all the sons of feanor participate, we see him and curufin acting unambiguously villainous a good bit before the rest of their brothers -- at the very least, they are clearly more willing to do horrible things at the point of time of b&l when compared to the likes of maedhros and maglor. like, they are out here committing actions that no sane person can rationalize as being anything other than abhorrent. it's clear that they've already given up on the idea of being "good"; they've already given up on keeping their hands clean and they've already shed whatever qualms they might have had in the past.

my thoughts on why? this is by no means canon, but tolkien does seem to like giving the legendarium's major villains some sort of arc and some type of insight into what they become (melkor gets history, sauron gets history, maedhros and maglor get history), so i don't see why celegorm should be any different. and for me, celegorm and curufin, especially celegorm, give the impression that they fell into despair and disillusionment far before the other feanorians did. and their response was to accept that they have no way of going back to the people they used to be, that they've already been rightfully damned, and if they've come this far they may as well do whatever they can to achieve what they fell so low for, because what does it matter anymore? it's part of why i think celegorm sees maedhros trying to look at beleriand and the war against morgoth from a larger perspective than just the silmarils, and both disdains and pities him for it. they've already been doomed and they already can't hope to make amends. they should do what they're here for -- and while, in celegorm's eyes, maedhros isn't willing to do what needs to be done, he is. i think that sort of mentality is fascinating. in a way, it's a self-fulfilling prophecy -- maybe if celegorm thought there was any meaning to him being better, or even just any meaning in not being nearly as awful as he resolved to be, then he wouldn't have stooped so low. but he did believe there was no hope for him, he did believe that he could never be forgiven -- and in believing that, he did go past the point of no return, beyond which he truly, legitimately couldn't hope to be forgiven. also, i just personally like the "well i'm a terrible person so i'm going to act like a terrible person"-type villains better than "oh no i'm a terrible person it makes me so sad and full of despair"-type villains (looking at you, maglor). again, none of this is canon, but it's my reading of celegorm's character, and i think it sheds some light on why he's so awful in b&l and afterwards. in his mind, it's already over for him anyway.

i hope this answered your question anon! i like celegorm, and i enjoy his character, because there are shades of a sad tale behind his descent to being the worst, he's entertaining while he's being the worst, and most crucially of all, he gets his comeuppance for being the worst in an extremely satisfying way. i definitely wouldn't like him (or the silm at all) so much if he'd been, like, successful in anything -- but thankfully he is written by an author who knows full well what an utterly reprehensible character he is. and boy does tolkien not spare him from that karma. he is simultaneously a singleminded and relentless fallen prince, a repulsive monster, and the story's laughingstock (one of them anyway). honestly, none of the feanorians tickle my brain quite like he does. i love him and i would beat him with a shoe

[thissmycomingofage]

That's so weird how I do not care at this point. I do not care if he cheated, I do not care if she cheated, I would even dare to say I do not care if she's happy. Because we're at a point where all that I can bring myself to care about is that she's, you know, dating a racist, antisemitic, sexist and so on and so on kind of person. She made me not care about her happiness, she made me resent her for proclaiming her happiness. She doesn't seem to care so why should I?

[sophsun1]

Queer As Folk – 2.06: Mixed Blessings

[buckycap]

something something it's getting extremely tiring seeing people admonish dorian's stance and how no nuance or understanding is ever given to him and how he feels and whenever he shows a stance that's different than the overall opinion he's always looked at as stupid and about to betray the group and it's getting increasingly harder to look at those reactions as anything other than bad faith arguments

[anxiously-sidequesting]

**slips and slides into the room with socks on and breaks the wooden table as i fall down on the floor in a haste** so anyways i actually just scared myself because i thought of exactly how deep Malorn's and Malistaire's parallels went. like in post-updated tutorial malistaire was said to have been kind and caring towards his students right. just like malorn right. just like malorn, right? isn't that just like malorn? hey everyone doesn't that sound just like malorn? kind and cares for his students? 'kind' and 'caring' are certainly two adjectives that describe malorn arent they huh? (is slowly sinking in quicksand as i desperately reach out to you as i say this) so if we are to say that malorn and malistaire are two sides of the same coin then what is truly stopping malorn from having one traumatic event from shaping the rest of his life into a descent of madness, grief, and isolation? Guys tell me what the difference is between this reality and an Evil Malorn AU guys? guys hello? hello guys? **(the quicksand has actually transported me to the Backrooms now, no one can hear me call out in distress)**

[clockworkreapers]

I'm curious, how do you think the general public would react if the existence of the camp planets and what goes on there was leaked? Assuming it spread far before The Luminary/The Emissaries could get a hold on it and stop the information from spreading.

That really depends how many trolls see it cuz it could be something that just gets left to simmer as like a conspiracy online. Mostly cuz no real or funded news stations or sites or even gov websites would cover that story unless you want to uh stop getting funded and/or silenced.

It also depends on the trolls and where their own moralities lay. I’m sure there are def trolls out there that just find it abhorrent and there will be a whole discussion on Alternian rights. But there’s also the reverse side of people not caring cuz it doesn’t concern them OR the fact that we’ll all Iv ever been told is that these trolls are bad they are mutants and threats to the empire that has done nothing but protect you. Like all you learn about history or have been told even from a young age is that these trolls are bad. The sufferer and summoner and most revolutionaries (or as they call them, terrorists) are trolls who are on the lowblood mutant or lime side and you only hear the empires recording of events. There is no “other perspective” you learn about or is recorded. So there is probs a morally weird mix of opinions even if your hope the majority are like huh what? No that’s bad.

Course… like what are you realistically going to do about it?

Plus it really depends what trolls would even think about this information if they think it’s true or not? Cuz the empire won’t care not even to be like hey shut up. They don’t need to. No one has access to those planets appart from the empire and specifically vetted trolls under imperial. And whoever leaked the information or has ties to leaking it will eventually be found silently disappear. The empire would probs make it so there is no open line of information or clarity on wait so like is this real was it a prank what was this? No legit news sources talked about it, the empire didnt even make a statement about it its just a lot of message boards and reactions to this information before it just stops after a while and then nothing actually happens.

Sorta like how real world issues happen flair up and then it just kind of stops getting talked about or heard about as much. Just take out the whole freedom of speech and information thing… yeahhhhhhh

[editor-the-benjamin]

GNAWING AT THE BARS OF MY ENCLOSURE I AM FEELING A LOT OF EMOTIONS AT A RAPID RATE

[iszapizza]

if i drew more prowlop but slighty hornier what then WHAT THEN—

[chronurgy]

I'm starting to dread (ha) Dreadwolf, partly because Solas is the main antagonist and I have...... Absolutely no feelings about him at all, actually. The best I can summon is a big old "meh". And if they center him (which it seems like they plan to) and make a big deal about whether you want to kill him or redeem him or stop him or join him... Well frankly I just won't care and I'm worried that means I won't have a damn thing to care about in the game's main plot

I'm also worried that his success or failure at taking down the veil will be preordained since that's too big of a plot line to leave up to the player - there just wouldn't be any way to structure future games to account for that player choice. This is obviously a less well founded worry, but it makes it really hard for me to care about the stakes of the game

Idk I'm not trying to shit on people who are excited for this game (I am too, despite the bitching and moaning) but it's really hard to get excited for a game when the one thing you know about it is so completely uninteresting to you

[driftwooddestiel]

I DID MY COMEDY PERFORMANCE TODAY!!! in front of like 200 people!!! and i didnt stutter or forget what to say!!! and people laughed!!!

[ithinkimauggie]

Deleted tiktok, i am finally free lets go gamers

[callixton]

there is something inarticulately special to me about that come to your senses performance..... like for one being able to See his nerves at the beginning. the depth of care that goes into the whole thing. and afterwards his grin + that tongue thing he does when he's not thinking and is just indulging in a good time. the way aaron tviet is leaning in to congratulate him when he's still halfway across the stage & the way he falls into the arms of like three different people at the end. ok well i articulated a little bit of it but there is still something about it that is so much more than the sum of its parts

[beedreamscape]

dnd is one of the safest ways to *feel emotions*... Tal took them on a thrill ride, I don't think anybody is that mad for it...

[adlibitur]

being told "you cant confuse ibs and anaphylaxis" isnt medical advice its actually common sense

[spacecasehobbit]

Every so often, I find myself thinking of the kind of story that Billy could have had if it had been Neil who got flayed in S3, instead of Billy.

If it was Neil who went off to work one day, and came back Wrong... not because he came back mean, but because he came back too nice. Too calm, missing all the sneers and casual insults that are usually thrown Billy's way whenever they're in the same room; strangely unconcerned with Billy's life but too concerned with whatever Max and that new friend of hers are up to, instead of offloading "responsibility" for his step-daughter's every move to Billy under threat of violence if he doesn't make her stick to Neil's rules.

And Billy is the only one who notices just how wrong this all is.

Max listens to him about as well as she ever does - which is to say: not at all - when he tries to bring up Neil's behavior with her (admittedly, he probably brings it up with his usual amount of grace and tact, which is to say: also none). It's not like Billy can tell the cops that his dad is acting weird by being too nice, if he was even the sort of person who went to cops to solve his problems. He hasn't exactly cultivated the kind of friendships where they talk about his relationship with his shitty dad, either, so he's exhausted his extremely short list of people who might understand as soon as Max storms off in her usual cloud of pissy, righteous teenage anger at his inability to talk to her without being a dick right off the bat.

And like, he's not even entirely sure why he's bothering to try and understand this new leaf Neil's turned over? Shouldn't it be a good thing that his dad is mostly just ignoring him, that Neil's finally taking a bit of responsibility for the kid whose mom he decided to marry and play happy little family with in the first place?

It's just... it's weird, is all.

It's weird, and it grates at him, and he can't help but drag himself into this mess, looking for trouble even when it doesn't find him first as his dad likes - liked - to say whenever Billy got caught up in the consequences of his own poor decision making.

So long story short, Billy goes from the one always being watched to the one always watching his dad, discovers his dad may or may not be starting some kind of cult with all his (white, male, because the man's definitely got plenty of bigotry that Vecna's perfectly happy to play along with, as long as he gets his army somehow) coworkers, discovers that actually it may be a literal fucking Satan cult or some shit when some of those coworkers and/or his dad start bleeding black (and maybe he catches sight of that new friend of Max's displaying what are definitely magic fucking powers), and winds up stumbling into the midst of the Upside Down plot all on his lonesome just as things are coming to a climax with the melted-people-spidermonster at the brand new mall, of all places.

And maybe Billy's been doing some of his own rather difficult and unpleasant personal introspection and character growth, in between spying on his dad and discovering that his sister and her nerdy little friends know way too much about magic and monsters, but still can't seem to notice just how fucking weird her own step-dad is acting until he goes straight-up feral at their little magic friend, said magical friend shoves him through a brick wall with her brain, and he escapes without so much as a broken bone so far as Billy can tell from his vantage point, hidden what is suddenly looking like a much less safe distance away from whatever-the-fuck-that-was than he'd originally thought.

The point is, Billy's done some thinking of his own. Some growing as a person, even, one might say.

So by the time he follows his dad to the mall, he still honestly has no clue what the hell is going on, but he knows his dad has always been a bastard, and he knows that little magic kid his dad is dragging towards a horror movie spider monster the size of their house might be the only one who can save this stupid nonsense town full of monsters and cornfields and bullshit and maybe, possibly, a few people who don't deserve to die horribly in some insane alien monster apocolypse.

In this universe, instead of El making a last minute, desperate attempt to reach out to Billy with empathy before the Mind Flayer feeds her to the monster, it's Billy who steps in out of nowhere to distract his dad from this random little girl the monster seems to want so badly but isn't gonna get.

Because Neil's been acting weird. He's been ignoring his fuckup of a son, paying too much attention to Max and hasn't even called Billy a delinquent or an irresponsible fuckup or a faggot in nearly a week, and apparently he's possessed by a monster that might literally be from hell.

But Max seemed to think Neil was still somewhere in there when he went crazy on her little magic friend, and maybe she couldn't reach him, but Billy's spent half his life learning just how to push his dad's buttons and get Neil's attention lazer-focused on himself.

Pissing off Neil Hargrove is an artform that Billy's long since perfected.

It feels good to be doing it on purpose because he's trying to stand in front of someone else to keep them safe, for the first time since his mom left and he started thinking he had to care about himself first, since no one else was going to. Doesn't even feel afraid when he tells his dad loud enough for the peanut gallery to overhear that he was right all those years, he raised a filthy fucking faggot who likes dick instead of pussy, that he doesn't give a shit about respect and responsibility if those things are supposed to turn him into a Man like the one that Neil Hargrove's always been.

Billy's always been a disappointment to his father.

Somehow, that fact doesn't sting like it used to.

Now he's got proof his dad hates him enough to shake off a shadow monster from another world just to beat on his own kid, and Billy?

Billy meets his dad's rage with a fucking smile.

For once, his dad's hits don't hurt more than the ache of the physical bruises they'll leave behind, don't come packed with that extra kick of guilt and shame and longing for a dad who loves him. For once, he makes himself get back up, bloody teeth bared with all the feral hatred and rage fostered from years of living in fear of his own father, and he hits back at the man who was already a monster long before he ever got possessed by one from another world.

Billy was never gonna be the kind of son his father wanted, but it's on his own terms now. Because Billy's never gonna be the kind of man his father was, either.

And step one of being a better kind of person is making sure this stupid fucking town and his annoying bitch of a step-sister and all the other weird little nerds and annoying classmates she seems to hang out with and all the other blissfully ignorant hicks sensibly enjoying the 4th of July fair instead of fighting eldritch horrors in the mall, actually survive to see July 5th...

Even if that means fist fighting his dad in the mall while a little magic girl takes advantage of Neil's distraction to take on a melted flesh monster in the background of this brand new form of fucked up mess his life has somehow become.