#i'd love to if time allows ^_^....

[pemprika]

💫 the IPSEITY pin collection in full! 💫

[blueskittlesart]

*sigh* thoughts on Nintendo's botw/totk timeline shenanigans and tomfoolery?

tbh. my maybe-unpopular opinion is that the timeline is only important when a game's place on the timeline seriously informs the way their narrative progresses. the problem is that before botw we almost NEVER got games where it didn't matter. it matters for skyward sword because it's the beginning, and it matters for tp/ww/alttp (and their respective sequels) because the choices the hero of time makes explicitly inform the narrative of those games in one way or another. it matters which timeline we're in for those games because these cycles we're seeing are close enough to oot's cycle that they're still feeling the effects of his choices. botw, however, takes place at minimum 10 thousand years after oot, so its place on the timeline actually functionally means nothing. botw is completely divorced from the hero of time & his story, so what he does is a nonissue in the context of botw link and zelda's story. thus, which timeline botw happens in is a nonissue. honestly I kind of liked the idea that it happened in all of them. i think there's a cool idea of inevitability that can be played with there. but the point is that the timeline exists to enhance and fill in the lore of games that need it, and botw/totk don't really need it because the devs finally realized they could make a game without the hero of time in it.

[basket-of-radiants]

Why were you so disappointed by Rhythm of War?

This has been sitting in my askbox for years. I've taken several cracks at answering, only to get frustrated with the subject matter and burn myself out every time. I didn't like Rhythm of War. More than that, I didn't like it in a way that tainted my enjoyment of the entire series. And despite what it may seem, I don't actually enjoy discussing things which I don't like. I always want to talk from a place of good faith. Which is why now that my feelings towards the series are a little more positive, I think I can finally answer this.

I'm going to try to stay away from specific plotpoints and story beats for this post, because my goal isn't to nitpick (if for no other reason than it would take a week to write this post), I'm just looking to talk about my overall impressions. I think that might mean the only spoilers here will be structural? idk, if you haven't read Rhythm of War yourself then you should probably do that before looking for other people's opinions anyway. 

I liked Way of Kings when I first read it. I didn't love it at the time, but I liked it. Certainly enough to keep reading once I'd finished. One thing that made me a bit uncomfy, however, was the war against the Parshendi. They were this unknowable enemy which the book was not interested in knowing. An inhuman army. Their main purpose was to kill Kaladin's friends, or else be killed by Dalinar's armies. And yet the Parshendi, and the parshmen in the form of Shen, did show hints of personhood. And so it bothered me how Dalinar spoke so casually about how the Alethi had decimated their numbers, how the others used the war as a means to amass wealth and power. (It didn't bother me in a "this is a bad book" way but in a "these characters are bad people" way.)

One of my foibles as a reader is that when a book is very clearly treating one side of a conflict with more humanity, I tend to be a bit predisposed towards the other to account for that. And with the Alethi clearly being the invading party and superior military force, there was also some underdog favoritism. I didn't really like how the book treated the Parshendi. This is to say that going forward, the singers would be more important to me than any other through line.

So imagine my delight at reading Words of Radiance and meeting Eshonai, one of the Parshendi, who even gets her own point of view sections! They were no longer being treated as a faceless mass, we were getting to see things from their perspective as well. And it became plain to see the damage the Alethi had done to them. I couldn't really bring myself to root for Dalinar or really any of the humans against the listeners. I couldn't even bring myself to like most of these characters. I still enjoyed the book but once it became clear there wouldn't be a peaceful conclusion, let's just say that I wouldn't have wept for Dalinar and Adolin if Szeth had managed to off them. Like everyone in the book, I assumed that going forward all the parshmen would be turned into evil voidbringers in the everstorm and that the listeners were mostly dead. Except for Rlain, and Eshonai because I'd read or been told that book 4 would be Eshonai's book and thus had assumed she was fine. (Oathbringer spoilers, she was not fine.) So ultimately it was still a bit of a downer way to end the book. 

So imagine my delight at reading Oathbringer, where for the first time singers were being treated as people, full and real people, and where the human characters could no longer ignore or dismiss them. We met Khen and the others, common singers who were sympathetic and just wanted freedom from bondage. We see Venli grapple with the loss of her home. We see Leshwi and Moash connecting with and understanding one another. We learn of a history where singers were the original inhabitants of the planet. Parallel to this, Dalinar is having a truly excellent character arc about confronting one's past actions and acknowledging them to move forward and do better. I loved Oathbringer, for some years it was my favorite book, and I was excited as hell to see what came next. At the time, it seemed to me that there is a clear direction the story is going. Two books about needless war, and then a third where the main cast is forced to acknowledge the personhood of their enemies. This was so cool, all of my feelings from the previous installments were being validated, the characters were going to have to face what they've done in the past and outgrow their militaristic mindsets, I was so sure of that.

Imagine my disappointment when that does not even remotely resemble the direction the story went in Rhythm of War. RoW presented a clear, straightforward “us vs. them" narrative, where every character was totally fine with killing singers. Characters aligned with the singers were either flattened into wholly evil versions of themselves (Moash) or were expected to turn on their side in favor of the humans (Venli.) Because clearly there was no reason good people would be on the side that's all former slaves trying to stay free. Maybe there's some sort of accord or understanding between Navani and Raboniel that I might have found meaningful if the seeds of mutual understanding weren't already there in Oathbringer and then apparently ignored for a year by all the characters.

I have a lot of issues with how the listeners are handled in these books. (Here's some elaboration.) Following OB, I had thought that all my concerns were going to be addressed. Following RoW, I knew they never would be. 

Which is my main complaint, because that's the thread that matters most to me in this series.

I have a lot of other Things as well. Gonna just talk about a few big ones. 

One outsized source of disappointment that may seem a little petty, and which probably is, is that I felt mislead by the premise of the book. It had been announced that this book would center Venli and Eshonai, and I was unbelievably hyped for that. That did not really turn out to be the case. The purpose for their backstory chapters felt less about exploring them as people and contextualizing their arcs, and more about filling in gaps of world history. In the main plot, Venli was a POV character and she certainly played a role, but honestly not a very important one overall. To me she felt like a side character in her own book. I don't think it's controversial to say that the main character of RoW was Navani. A lot of people really like Navani and are happy about that. Unfortunately I'm not one of those people, and I found it all the more difficult to enjoy her when it felt like it was coming at the expense of some of my favorite characters. 

This particular gripe somewhat comes down to preference, obviously everyone prefers to read about characters they like more than those they don't, and it can go both ways. (For instance, on a craft/technical level RoW is probably the superior book to W&T, but I liked the latter a lot more because of my stupidly outsized attachment to Szeth and Nale.) But I do think there's something of a real criticism in how the book would rather focus on the feelings of a queen rather than those of a genocide survivor, and how the former's are given significantly more weight and import. It ties in with my main criticism, I think. 

And then there's how human/human racism had also been wholly cast aside as a plot point. Jasnah fixed slavery so that's resolved, and the only person who still cares about structural racism is the evil bad bad evil villain Moash/Vyre, who is now wholly irredeemable and who you're allowed to totally write off because he's sold his soul to Odium. I've already talked a lot about this. Other people have already talked about this, probably better than me. The writing was actually on the wall for me in OB, but again, RoW was when I fully accepted that this was never going to be addressed. 

There's something else that probably deserves its own discussion rather than being quickly tacked on at the end here, but here we are. This book changed how the series approaches war. 

In WoK, war was very clearly portrayed as a bad and inglorious thing. It was brutal, it was painful, those at the bottom died cruelly and unceremoniously and pointlessly while those at the top turned a profit. Every day was a new horror. The enemy were never evil, they were always just more people forced to go through the same thing. Through the next couple books, it felt to me that even if the characters had accepted war as necessary, there was still a tragedy to it. Conversely, in RoW (and W&T) war is basically a series of boss battles, in between which our protagonists can kill dozens of footsoldiers with barely a thought in the same way WoK had criticized.

Final note on all this, it sucks how we have no perspectives from the former-slaves-singers demographic. Those guys are really thrown under the bus, and seemingly get no self-determination now or ever. It was a glaring problem to me in RoW. Conscripted and enslaved humans and singers probably have just as much ground to form mutual understanding as a fused and a queen. (In fact they already had. In Oathbringer.)

In essence, RoW disappointed me because it left me with the distinct impression that none of the series's most important through lines (well, most important to me) were going to be resolved well. I liked W&T, but I haven't revised my opinion very much about the overall handling of these topics across the series. Maybe one of the reasons I was able to enjoy W&T so much more was because I no longer had such high expectations.

[danwhobrowses]

Well now that the dust has settled a bit on the C3 finale and wrap up, I do wanna throw out some suggestions for 10 one shots - in no particular order - which I feel like would be great and fun and narratively tied in with the characters.

EXU: Crownfall Premise: In the future events (circa 15 years or less after the Rites of Catatheosis) the Crown Keepers reunite to try and free Opal from the crown, with ominous word that Lolth's mortal form is close to reawakening their memories and bringing their friend back into her service. Notes: Potential guest cameos for some Bell's Hells members and Deni$e if Aimee wants to double up.

Bell's Hells Go to PopCon Premise: Set a few weeks after the Rites of Catatheosis, Bell's Hells go to PopCon in Rumblecusp to support Chetney - the guest of honour. An egg is up for grabs for Fearne as a side plot but the hired hunters after Chetney during their reunion in Jrusar are also lurking in the shadows, likely at the behest of a disgruntled and aggrieved shopkeeper upset with Chetney's newfound fame. Notes: Potential guest cameos for Deanna and FRIDA, maybe even a long lost Pock O'Pea relative? Also maybe some conflict with TravelerCon happening on the same day!

EXU: Apogee Premise: Set either during the events of the final battle or after, an opportunity arises to see what Deanna, FRIDA, Deni$e, and Prism are up to in their own mini-adventure. Notes: Possible additions for other PCs to join the group, maybe even Tary and/or Kingsley given their absence in the campaign or let Matt play an NPC-turned-PC like Dancer, Joe, Xandis, or Ryn while another DMs.

Bell's Hells vs the Nine Hells Premise: In the absence of their Lord, a power vacuum is happening in the Nine Hells, and in turn many devils are coming to collect on their pacts to gain an advantage at the head of the table. Bell's Hells go to the Hells in order to dismantle an alliance of devils intent on taking over and laying waste to the material plane in preparation for Asmodeus' return - and their own gain and favour. Notes: Potential involvement for Zerxus, also potential to free Fearne from her pact with Klask, Braius stuff since Azzy M made him a marked moo, and maybe even a little fallout from Ashton pissing off Tiamat - who was sealed in Avernus. Also a chance to reshape the Hells in a more homebrewed structure if so desired.

Bell's Hells: Infinite Possibilities Premise: Irritated by the constant surveillance on them over the years, Ashton finally accepts the Kryn Dynasty's 'invitation' to visit and be studied: but they're not going alone. Tensions are high among the Hells given the Bright Queen's reluctance in the finale to aid them in the ritual or in saving Ashton's life, but Luxon lore is desired by both parties, as are answers about Ashton themselves - and, for Bell's Hells, getting them out alive and in one piece. Notes: Potential to also involve Essek, and possibly free him from the Kryn's corsairs, and Verin for family lore. Might also be worth noting Chetney's 'deal' with Leylas regarding bringing Ashton to them dead or alive, and possibly stealing some beacons for Nana or just for fun/spite.

Bell's Hells: A Kick in the Shattered Teeth Premise: Able to confirm that Ludinus Da'leth is in the Shattered Teeth from Caleb and Beau's scrying, Orym calls upon Bell's Hells to finish off the cloned corpse of that crusty-ass ancient elf once and for all. Returning to the Shattered Teeth does however come with some environmental chaos and obstacles, and while Ludinus has been 'retired' since his first death he is by no means unprepared for these kinds of visitors. Notes: Potential return for Captain Novos (are they still ghosts now that the Strife Emperor is 'gone'?), and Jirana - and her Toad Belly Hut - one last chance to bring up Molaesmyr again while confronting Ludinus', hopefully dissatisfied, feelings on the gods still surviving.

Bell's Hells: Shadow of Sorrow Premise: Just as Ira forewarned, the Unseelie Court have set their sights on Fearne and the rest of Bell's Hells for the death of Sorrowlord Zathuda. Leading the charge is Yu Suffiad, given her prior knowledge and experience in dealing with them, but much like how Zathuda was willing to turn on the court for his own gains, many members of the antagonistic court have ulterior fey-like motives. Bell's Hells must stand their ground and play to their own trickery and chaos against the Unseelie's Uncanny Ambush, and find a way to end the order put against them. Notes: A chance to bring back Gloamglut - and for Fearne to get that inheritance she was curious about. More Seelie/Unseelie lore especially now the Moonweaver is 'gone', possibly Traveler shenanigans too via Braius and maybe some more stuff with Ira and/or Nana to aid in the chaos.

EXU: RedBlue Premise: Ruidians of all races have started traveling to the Blue Promise, and a ragtag group of Ruidians have joined together in search of adventure and personal discovery in this foreign-to-them world that's existed only in their dreams. Notes: A light and fun way to reframe Exandria and its culture through the lens of Ruidians, as well as introducing more races of Ruidus and their own culture.

EXU: Mortal Premise: Set decades or more after the rites, the gods once again reunite in mortal form. This time though not to fell a city, build a gate, or find a lost sibling, but to seek out an adventure in places unknown or previously out of their grasp. But things adverse to and obscured from gods are not entirely welcoming, and the Chained Oblivion still seeks to free itself from the Abyss. Notes: Would recommend not using the same gods seen in Downfall and Divergence, just for variety, some of the less fleshed out gods (maybe some more Betrayers?) would be better.

Wedding Bells (Hells) Premise: Laura Bailey will not be denied and a third wedding is on the cards. But chaos will always follow and Delilah has made a gambit for one last escape from her Soul Anchor at the most annoying time possible - a particular specialty of hers. Notes: If it were me I'd do a bait and switch and say the wedding setting is not the Imodna wedding, but the two have an opening to get a marriage ceremony in the episode anyway. But otherwise it is the 3 for 3 wedding episode, also a chance for the Hells to clean up nicely design-wise, and ofc cameos galore.

[yo-yo-yoshiko]

Spineless (And Spineless' drawing of her god Sergei lol)

[harmonysanreads]

Here comes more competitions

[all-our-turf]

🎀+ all of the warriors for the hc prompts?

[ 🎀 ]ㅤ.ㅤwhat is their main love language ?

cochise: i think quality time, she just likes being present with the people she cares about, regardless of what they're doing. she's versatile yknow.

cowgirl: physical touch. she's constantly linking arms with someone when walking or grabbing onto someone when she's excited and leaning on the others on the couch or fidgeting mindlessly with someone's fingers or hair. i feel like cowgirl is very physical even in small gestures.

fox: i have zero evidence for this but i want to say gift giving. like i think fox constantly finds random trinkets and such that she loves giving to the others. she’s scarily good at stealing from stores or talking a stranger into getting her something or convincing a cashier to lower a price (all of which partly inspired her name) and so she’s constantly collecting things to give to the others. and they’re always for specific reasons or reminded her of a specific person.

cleon: i'm thinking words of affirmation but like. in subtle ways. she always makes sure her warriors know that they've done good. she knows she asks a lot from them and its important to her that they know how valuable they all are to the gang.

ajax: acts of service for sureeee. ajax is most comfortable expressing herself through action and will go to unimaginable lengths for the people she loves.

rembrandt: i'm also thinking quality time for her. rembrandt just loves existing in the same space as the people she cares about - she likes to watch them and hear their voices and idly sketch while her favorite people are around her.

swan: also acts of service. she's similar to ajax in the way she protects and cares for the people she loves.

mercy: definitely physical touch, we've all seen the photoshoot content right?

send a character + hc prompt from this list

[withthewindinherfootsteps]

So we know that Wei Wuxian's treatment after his death was horrible. Even if nothing could impact him directly, there was still neverending slander, hatred, misinformation, theft...

But, for a while after he died, the sects did try to impact him directly – namely, frequently trying to resummon his soul. And today I'll explore the possible reasons for this, their likelihoods, and why I'm so, so thankful that Wei Wuxian's soul managed to resist the summons. Because, spoiler alert (or, you know. maybe not)... none of them are good.

(Long meta ahead)

In my opinion, there are four likely motivations for this: confinement, coercion, torment, and potentially destruction.

Out of all of these, confinement is probably the most likely motivation, at least for most sects (Jins and Jiangs excluded, though it was likely what the Jin sect said their motivations were – but I'll get to them later). This one is the most simple – we know spirit-trapping pouches exist, and we know the sects also placed 120 stone beasts on the Burial Mounds to prevent Wei Wuxian's soul from escaping. Therefore, this seems to be the most likely motivation – and fortunately for Wei Wuxian, probably also the best case scenario, though it still certainly isn't a good one.

For the second, coercion – this is where the Jin sect come in (more specifically Jin Guangshan with the help of Jin Guangyao). Due to their wealth and resources, they're likely the sect who played the largest role in the soul-summoning rituals. We know what they're willing to do to try to gain power – keeping Wen Ning under the pretence he was burned to death and trying to control him with the nails, and working with and helping Xue Yang torture people to help him refine his demonic cultivation, in order to have the Yin hufu fixed. Along with working with many other cultivators, alongside Xue Yang – Jin Guangshan really, really wanted that seal.

And so, Jin GuangShan sought after all those who imitated Wei WuXian in cultivating the ghostly path and gathered them under his rule. He spent a great amount of money and resources and these people, ordering them to study and analyze the structure of the Tiger Seal in secrecy so that they could replicate and restore it. - Villainous Friends extra, EXR

(Note that working with these cultivators very likely happened after Wei Wuxian's soul had failed to be summoned, since this happens some time after Wei Wuxian's death, whereas the soul-summoning ceromonies presumably started happening very close to it.)

In the previous paragraph, he's also quoted as having 'lusted after' the Yin hufu, which we already knew but it's nice to have a direct quote as evidence.

Now, would Wei WuXian willingly work with the Jin sect in doing this? No. We know that, and, given Wei Wuxian's actions in his first life (refusing to hand over the Tally, not being afraid to stand up to the sects, etc), I’m pretty sure Jin Guangshan knows that, too:

He beat around the bush a couple of times, using all his skills, yet Wei WuXian didn’t give in no matter what, and it made him run into a bunch of obstacles. - Villainous Friends extra, EXR

So this could actually make things go two ways. One, I'm wrong and that wasn't actually part of the Jin sect's motivations, since they know they wouldn't be able to control him (and in that case, had they managed to summon him, I could imagine them putting him in a spirit-trapping pouch and doing something similar to what Jin Guangyao did to Nie Mingjue's head. Which, also, not good). Two, it was a part of their motivations, and they hoped to find a way around that. After all, there are other guidao users out there now, and Wei Wuxian would now be a gui*. Also, cultivators can obviously harm ghosts – see the very existence of Night Hunts, and I'd include Xue Yang's talisman-caused destruction of A-Qing as well (while he isn't a traditional cultivator, talismans can be used by everyone).

Now, would either of these methods actually work? I'm inclined to think not really (and I expand on the former method in a note below). Would that stop Jin Guangshan/Jin Guangyao/the cultivators they employ from trying? Especially considering Jin Guangshan's lust for power?

I'm inclined to think no, too.

For the third, look no further than Jiang Cheng's reputation of capturing and torturing demonic cultivators after Wei Wuxian's death, due to thinking they could be him. And this does happen – Jin Ling knows and talks about it, and there's not real motivation for him to negatively lie about someone he loves. Also, when they come across each other at Dafan Mountain, we're told this in Jiang Cheng's inner voice:

A moment ago, Jiang Cheng was certain that this person was Wei WuXian, and all of the blood in his body started to boil. Yet, now, Zidian was clearly telling him that he wasn’t. Zidian definitely wouldn’t deceive him or make a mistake, so he quickly calmed himself and thought, this doesn’t mean anything. I should first find an excuse to take him back and use every possible method to get information out of him. It’s impossible for him to not confess anything or give himself away. I’ve done things like this in the past anyways. - MDZS Chapter 10, EXR translation

This mainly shows that he's tortured people before, rather than that he's tortured people because he thinks they're Wei Wuxian, but this reason is confirmed by Jin Ling in Chapter 24. Of course, the reason is also mentioned in this chapter, and there are other moments in the chapter that illustrate my point better**, but they come from second-hand sources which I know are easier to deny. Do take note of Jiang Cheng's expression both times he comes across 'Mo Xuanyu' (after he suspects he's Wei Wuxian) in Book One***, though:

After a moment, the corners of Jiang Cheng’s lips pulled into a twisted smile. His left hand started to unconsciously stroke the ring [Zidian] again. He spoke softly, “… Well, well. So you’re back?” - Chapter 10, EXR Although his face had always been clouded, marked with arrogance and satire, it seemed as if every corner of it had come alive. It was difficult to determine whether it was vengeful wrath, fathomless hatred, or raving ecstasy. - Chapter 23, EXR

This does seem to line up with what people say his attitude to Wei Wuxian is – there doesn't seem to be any happiness at seeing him again at all. The only time a word that could suggest that ('ecstasy') is used, it's accompanied by 'raving', and considering the context and the other possibilities of his expression, it's... probably not due to happiness at being reunited.

So, considering 1) this, 2) his contribution to the Siege specifically intended to kill Wei Wuxian, and 3) that at the time of frequent soul-summoning Jiang Yanli's death would be even closer for him, I feel pretty confident in saying that yes, this is likely a motivation for the Jiang sect in trying to re-summon Wei Wuxian's soul after his death. And, as mentioned earlier, cultivators can harm ghosts (and we know Zidian is able to remove souls posessing a body from that body, and that Jiang Cheng used Zidian on 'Mo Xuanyu' in Chapter 10. If it wasn't able to restrain/harm ghosts, or other methods weren't able to, why would he risk Wei Wuxian's soul escaping?).

And finally, option four: destruction. We're heading into much more speculative territory here, so don't consider this on par with the first three. But consider this:

We know there are some spells, like Xue Yang's talisman used on A-Qing and the body-offering ritual, that can ruin the returning soul’s reincarnation cycle by destroying it. Therefore, soul destruction is possible.

The 'main'/supposed reason for summoning Wei Wuxian's soul back is to stop the "cultivation world, or even all of mortal land" from being "faced with the most insane damnation and revenge, sinking into nothing but chaos and despair" when Wei Wuxian inevitably returns. While, as mentioned above, I severely doubt this is the motivation for certain sects – and to me is likely a rumour which the Jins (again, especially Jin Guangsha) fanned the flames of to justify summoning Wei Wuxian back for their own purposes**** – there are other sects which would take it more seriously.

Although likely disrespectful, people already thought it served Wei Wuxian right to die without his body intact by the time of the second siege – something believed to negatively affect your reincarnation in your next life*****. This is only the logical next step, and I'm pretty sure the vast majority of people would believe that, again, it would serve Wei Wuxian right, or would at least lead to less harm of the world in the long run.

For these reasons, I could definitely see this as an option for some sects, especially the sects who consider themselves more 'righteous' (cough cough the Nies under Nie Mingjue cough cough). After all, evil is evil and good is good, and the evil deserve what's coming to them. And what better way to prevent that than from preventing his soul from returning at all? So for the Nie sect – and likely some of the smaller sects involved in the Siege, since among them, additudes probably vary – yes, I do think it could be a motivation.

I’m not as sure about the Lans being willing to go this far, and that’s largely for two reasons. One, Lan Wangji’s presence and his relationship to Lan Xichen, who does (not always, but he does) let this affect how he treats Wei Wuxian. An example of this is that, when Wei Wuxian's return is made public, Lan Xichen does let him hide and shelter at the Cloud Recesses instead of trying to pursue him, likely majorly due to Lan Wangji. I'd argue that the aftermath of the Nightless City also acts as an example of this, although it definitely isn't perfect. But though he, Lan Qiren and the 33 elders do come to find Lan Wangji and do not let him continue to shelter Wei Wuxian (after they see Lan Wangji's feelings), Lan Xichen doesn't use this opportunity to kill/capture Wei Wuxian, despite Lan Wangji being in a worse condition due to having fought 33 elders, Wei Wuxian being catatonic, and Lan Qiren likely supporting this outcome (especially considering he was the one who led the Lan sect in the Siege – chapter 68, Wei Wuxian's POV). And he did let Lan Wangji take Wei Wuxian back to the Burial Mounds after:

After he went out of his way to send you back to Burial Mound and returned in such low spirits to receive his punishment, how long he kneeled before the Wall of Rules! - Chapter 99, EXR

Again, this was right after the Nightless City massacre – there isn't any goodwill towards Wei Wuxian at this point in time.

Of course, the Lan sect did participate in the siege after Lan Xichen knew of Lan Wangji's feelings towards Wei Wuxian, which Lan Xichen was no doubt a part of (although Lan Qiren lead the Lan sect in the siege, Lan XIchen had to have at least known/given his support, if not participated.) And it should be considered that Lan Xichen letting Wei Wuxian shelter at the Cloud Recesses was after Wei Wuxian had been back for a while, and had not caused the downfall of the Cultivation World, like many suspected he would after his death. And of course, as stated previously, his handling of the aftermath of Nightless City wasn't perfect either (though please note that his main motive here was to protect Lan Wangji from being potentially executed, rather than anything about Wei Wuxian himself). So caring about Lan Wangji doesn't mean he won't harm Wei Wuxian. But I do think he could find bringing Wei Wuxian's soul back to completely destroy it a bit excessive. There is, though, the chance that the elders of the Lan Sect would react to this differently, and of course they would have a sway on both Lan Xichen and the Lan sect as well.

The second reason is smaller, but there seems to be more focus in the Lan sect than in others when it comes to letting ghosts rest peacefully/helping them move on. And that could definitely lead to more resistance to the idea of summoning a soul back to destroy it as well, which could especially impact the elders. So I'd assume that the Lan sect would be the most likely sect to summon Wei Wuxian's soul back just for confinement, or just for some way of making sure any resentment is disippated, his spirit moves on, and he can't cause more harm to the world (eg via Inquiry)******. Not that he would or does as a ghost or as a reborn person, but that's unfortunately not relevant to this.

But yes, as a motivation for the Nie Mingjue-led Nie sect? Absolutely.

So, these are the main motives I suspect to be behind the attempted summoning of Wei Wuxian's soul after his death (and if I've missed any, please let me know – I'd love to have a discussion). And, of course, none of them lead to anywhere good. Because of course it wasn’t enough to besiege Wei Wuxian, murder the 50 non-combatants he was responsible for (and throwing them into the blood pit as a mark of disrespect because why not?), and lead to his death via him getting torn apart. It wasn’t enough to steal all his inventions, and use them commonly while still slandering him with no reprieve – or to steal his notes and give them to people like Xue Yang to study (Villainous Friends, again) and to use for their own, extremely extremely harmful, purposes. Of course, the cultivation world has to try to harm Wei Wuxian after death as well ((:

We don't know whether Wei Wuxian rejecting the summoning ceremonies was conscious or unconscious, but if it was the former, these are very likely reasons he refused to return in this way. If it was unconscious – for example, maybe during the frequent soul-summons his soul was in a weakened state due to him dying from a backlash of resentful energy and getting torn apart, and it healed over time but not before the soul-summoning rituals stopped – well, I can only be thankful.

Finally, let me leave you on the thought that – although it may well have happened since we don't spend much time in the immediate aftermath of the Sunshot campaign – there isn't even any textual mention of this happening to Wen Ruohan. Who, while not being a guidao user, was still very dangerous, still an extremely powerful cultivator, and still had a lot of reason to feel resentment. So.

:')

Thank you for reading!

--

*Considering what we see of how Wei Wuxian's guidao functions – redirecting the ghosts'/corpses' resentment into doing something they'd want to do, eg attacking people, and directing it towards a target – I'm not sure using it to force a spirit to do something 1) extremely specific, and 2) explicitly against their will would actually work. Iirc the closest thing we get to this in text is Wei Wuxian using the corpses of Wens to attack other Wens in the Sunshot Campaign, but he's still just directing their resentment to a target of his choice, and fierce corpses do tend to be on the less concious side of things (hence why Wei Wuxian had to awaken Wen Ning's consciousness). Considering how Wen Ning attacks Wei Wuxian and the Burial Mound Wens before his consciousness had fully awoken, I... really don't think those fierce corpses were able to differentiate (or didn't care).

Meanwhile, ghosts seem to be a bit more in control of themselves – see A-Qing, and Wei Wuxian's own descriptions of his ghost self.

That, alongside ghost!Wei Wuxian being able to resist his soul-summoning and the fact that pretty much all of the new guidao users are a lot weaker than he was, does make me think that this this wouldn't work. I do wonder about Xue Yang, since his methods are pretty different as well, but he's more of a modao user than a guidao user (he controls living corpses rather than dead people) and I don't think you can insert physical nails into ghosts?? Though if he was specifically instructed to figure out some way to control ghost!Wei Wuxian (who's probably kept in a spirit-trapping pouch in this scenario), he might be able to do something at least. Though also he was also struggling to piece Xiao Xingchen's ghost soul back together, so he may struggle with those areas?

Well, whatever the potential outcome, I'm so so happy once again that Wei Wuxian's soul managed to resist the soul-summonings...

**Mainly this:

Everyone in the cultivation world knew that the young leader of the Jiang Clan watched out for Wei WuXian in an almost crazed manner. He would rather catch the wrong person than let go of any possibility, and took anyone who seemed like they held the soul of Wei WuXian away to the YunmengJiang Sect, inflicting severe torture on his victim. If he wanted to take someone back, the opposition would surely lose half of their life. - Chapter 10, EXR

But I have heard people say 'you can't prove that it's just more rumours' before, and I wanted my evidence to be as watertight as possible.

(And, off-topic... isn't it really sad how Jiang Cheng, in the present day, is described as young? Because, for a clan leader, he is. And another thing he is, is close in age to Wei Wuxian – who was killed 13 whole years prior :') )

***And do note that the only other time they run into each other before Wei Wuxian's identity is revealed to the world apart from this is their brief interaction at Jinlintai, where he can't just act however he wants. The next time they run into each other after it, Jiang Cheng is literally taking part in another siege against him, and still extremely hostile ("surrounded by hostile energy, face insidious, staring straight at him" – from EXR chapter 60). Then he loses his spiritual powers and can't do anything. By the time he regains his powers, Wei Wuxian, Lan Wangji and the Wen remnants' corpses have saved everyone during the Second Siege, and though public opinion hasn't properly shifted quite yet, it will soon after Sisi and Bicao tell the story of Jin Guangyao, and voila, a new scapegoat (do note that he doesn't completely bar Wei Wuxian from entering Lotus Pier after the Second Siege, though). Plus, throughout it all, Lan Wangji is still constantly present, which makes it hard for Jiang Cheng to really do anything. And then he's finally faced with the Golden Core reveal, which does alter his motivations towards Wei Wuxian (obviously the resentment is still there – read chapter 102 – but it's also mixed with other complex emotions, and he seems to start being able to move away from that a little in Chapter 103). I still definitely wouldn't describe Jiang Cheng's attitude towards him as positive, but it isn't at the point it was at the start of the novel (eg Chapter 10).

But even if his attitude does change, or would for whatever other reason apart from the reveal, that still doesn't change an initial motivation so isn't relevant to this meta. We know his intentions at the start.

****It's also possible they may have originated it, but I think WWX's reputation was bad enough for it to form naturally. Though you can trace a major part of that back to them, too.

*****That belief isn't outright stated in MDZS, but the fact people are specifically talking about the status of WWX's body in the aftermath of his death suggests that this belief does have some grounding in the MDZS universe, at least? And we know MXTX has included it in TGCF (though that doesn't mean it's definitely in MDZS), so she has used it in her works. If this isn't the case in the MDZS universe I am sorry (although that could also mean there's less importance placed on not disturbing the reincarnation cycle in the world of MDZS...? Which would work towards my original argument) – I don't want to spread misinformation that something is definitely true, I just think there's evidence to suggest it is true, which isn't the same thing.

******Again, I think this would depend on who ends up having more influence over who in the Lan sect. After all, normal resentful spirits only do what they do because of their resentment in death, whereas Wei Wuxian is 'dangerous' because of who everyone thinks he was in life – so him being reborn naturally could also 'cause a lot of harm to the world' during the time period this version of him would live in, unlike the resentful ghosts they appease. This could definitely lead to many advocating for confinement, I think.

[i-like-forcefem]

hi i have a question. my boyfriend is obsessed with lolita fashion and is constantly saving dresses and skirts and sending them to me saying "i would wear this if i were a girl" ...i told him he can wear them without being a girl but he said he doesn't want to, and i said "so you want to wear hoodies and jeans for the rest of your life?" and he hesitated before saying yes and looked visibly upset after... should i say something or just start dosing him with eatrogen

Awww, that's adorable :3 Here's what I'd do: Do whatever you can to give him plausible deniability to wear the dress, maybe do a bet where the loser has to get dressed up by the winner, or maybe say that you really want to BOTH go to comic con wearing lolita, maybe do something for Halloween! (do give her time! Don't force it too much, but if she's anything like me she'll jump on the first chance you give) Cuties like that are always day-dreaming about being allowed to be a girl, to be feminine without judgement, so give her that excuse she craves!

[almightyramtha]

I'm capital R Rambling about Wyll below, but more about story pacing with his choices in game:

I think Wyll's story would have benefited a lot by not having Mizora show up until act 2 as an actual character. A presence, certainly, a force driving Wyll, but a threat that cannot yet act on him. Giving him some breathing room to get to know Karlach, to wrestle with his objective to kill her—which I think would have made for an interesting night event. Maybe he's standing over her while she's sleeping, debating what to do, when Tav sees him and can either stop him or spur him on, then later talk about his headspace, maybe get some clues as to why he still struggles with his choice despite seemingly believing that she’s not the devil he was told she was.

But giving the player some space to see Wyll as a human, get attached to him, see him struggle with the weight of not obeying Mizora's directive (maybe while being really cagey about her, maybe being one of the few companions who was really gunning to get to the Goblin camp and "save Halsin" (which would later be revealed that his objective was really rescuing the already moved Mizora)), have him actually GET TO KNOW and learn to believe Karlach instead of it all happening in a single second and a single night, I think would bond you to him a lot more. I like to see a good internal struggle! And its such a big deal to him! Make going through with it or not a big deal to him too! For more than a single conversation!

You'd also get a lot more time with him sans horns and I think it would ultimately feel more impactful when they are foisted upon him because you would have seen him struggling to avoid this fate, but knowing that he couldn't, because he sees the good in Karlach, (the player also has time to get attached or not to Karlach too instead of making this choice to kill her or not right away). Imagine a guy who was on the verge of making a deal to break his pact with her (like in EA) and now effectively she can't do anything to him. He knows the threat looms, he knows acting too far out of turn might cost him later, but how refreshing would it be to take a full breath of air without her hovering?

Then when you finally rescue Mizora from Moonrise, she could give him one last chance and perhaps this could be a point where the player could stand back and get a sense of where Wyll had been pushed by that point (A la, nightsong, Gale blowing himself to smitheroons, etc) There's rarely a point I felt I truly understood where Wyll was standing without my intervention especially at flexion points like his choice to stay in his pact or not (which you’re not given an opportunity to let him choose for himself :\). So having a point he has the option to act without our intervention would be interesting and very welcome to me. Plus I think the pacing would be a lot better. His stuff is so front loaded the moment you meet Karlach, then so back heavy but without a good solid middle to support the back end. Imagine having a way to make him be his worst self with an all-in durge. Or realizing when you get to Baldur’s gate that not a day ago, had he not saved Karlach, he would have been able to get everyone into the city with no trouble, but now not a soul recognizes him for who he is. (Probably make it harder to get into the city for this storybeat to work better, something that would let the player really metagame wrestle on a second playthrough with which option is better, idk, just spitballing.) Also I think he should have mentioned Ansur in Act 2 so that his city saving promise floated better into act 3 and felt more pulling. It was a fun little puzzle gauntlet! But having three characters just tell me the same thing about it (and don't get me started on the emperor taking over that moment) kind of blew the wind out of the sails of the quest when nothing really comes of it. Like, damn, maybe let Wyll talk him into being an ally to call upon in the final battle or something. You literally asked me to find allies, Emperor! (Which personally I think would have been more impactful TO ME if for instance, maybe Ulder told Wyll the stories all the time as a kid, they had a falling out when he was a young lad, then Wyll comes back like “I’m gonna find Ansur!” and Ulder’s like “Wyll, omg that was just a fairy story I told you as a child, that’s not real!” but BOOM, he finds and recruits Ansur and its like “wow son, that’s so amazing of you, I’m so proud of you” And tav didn’t even have to force feed Ulder tadpole information about his son to get him to believe in and trust him, wow.)

Anyway, this has been part 1 of ???? of my sporadic essay on how I would fix Mr. Wyll with a y. I feel like I can see little snippets of where it was going, both between release and EA, and I would have liked to see him better because he’s a nice boy and deserves it, but also I recognize there’s something missing from the soup.

[crescentfool]

orpheus, thanatos, and messiah! 💙 (+ bonus sillie)

a totally normal lyre™

[after-nine-at-the-oasis]

am I the only one who finds myself getting more attached to bucktommy and Tommy himself the more people push against it or

[shortqueershakespeare]

sometimes i think that my sadness and grief and frankly anger about being single is about how fucked up that last relationship was, like i'm coming to terms with things in life and trying to be realistic with the fact that i might never be in another relationship even thought i want to be and that's okay! but i think the reason it cuts so deep is because if that does end up being true, i will be absolutely heartbroken that my last love was such a disaster and broke me in so many new ways adn he didn't even have the decency to admit that it was a relationship until he had to confront his own grief over losing it

[youchangedmedestiel]

I have 5 different fic ideas writing down in my phone memo. They all came to me in the space of a week.

I think I'm cursed with ideas and no time to explore them.

[riddlemearose]

Ugh the most annoying thing about being a high-masking auDHDer is that you like actually accidentally trick yourself into thinking that maybe your disabilities aren't really that bad bc you've got them under control! So it's all good!!

And then something happens that you need to respond to and you get stuck in that annoying executive dysfunction paralysis, and the abrupt reminder that no I actually am that disabled is just... absolutely frustrating.

And then you can't get anything done anyway bc your emotions are shot and you need recovery time lmaooo what even is this.

[s4pphoiduser]

in a world with an aftg show (because it Has to be a show, not a movie) seth would have a Pretty Guy actor playing him who looked even prettier when he was sneering or scowling and people would make edits of him with the velocity + slo-mo effects and be like "i can fix him"