this isnt gonna be coherent but thinking about Sandor and his relation to death..
he calls his horse stranger (just alone him identifying with the stranger, the seen-as-a-monster god of death and outcasts), constantly talks about how many people he has killed and how it gives him joy, keeps this "butcher" persona that thinks killing is necessary to survive even when its innocents, talks proudly if his sigil that was based on three dogs that died trying to protect someone,fights and kills a literal undead man-gets burned in the process- only for him to come back again lol (ok this ones kind of a reach but worth mentioning for the undead gregor parallelisms) , shows arya how to give the gift of mercy "that's where the heart is, thats how you kill a man" and he denies to dig him a grave.
and after arya denying him the gift of mercy(and goes on to train to become a death giver no less lol). and then "the hound is dead" but he is "revived" by a monk-like figure and becomes a literal grave digger.. almost like hes digging graves for all the people he has killed before, maybe its also like hes serving the stranger in a way. death has become from a violent act to a quiet state of being for him at this point of the story
also i like that he dies and starts over with a different identity figuratively while his brother dies literally and comes back with a different name( if you can call it coming back)..
i dont exactly know what to make out of this as a whole because i was having seperate thoughts but i love that its there and always loved the The Stranger part to his character.
bonus from his wiki because they remind me how much i love these books and how every character connects to each other and the story so seamlessly:
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what gets me about the shadow/maria dynamic is that it takes the trope of "weak helpless girl dies for a tragic plot device" and subverts it
Maria wasn't helpless in her fate. She did have a choice. Shadow would have been strong enough to protect them both (Where else could they even go? Would he need to hurt someone?) but instead she made a choice to protect Shadow.
Shadow's story isn't tragic because he failed to protect Maria and now spends the rest of his life tormented over it. Shadow's story is tragic because he is the strongest creature alive, but raw power isn't always enough, and his loving friend made a sacrifice to let him go hoping she was giving him a chance to learn compassion because she was strong!
Maria's purpose isn't that she's a weak little girl who dies. Maria's legacy is that she protects the strongest creature alive, and teaches it the strength of love.
Her character gives the moment purpose, not the other way around. Her willingness to die so he can go free, asking him to use his strength to protect the people of Earth, despite everything. It's her proof of love that gives Shadow's burden that kind of extreme weight. Shadow will live forever and with so much limitless power, would life be easy to discard without a second thought? Not Maria's. Not when she asked him to protect it. That weight will remind him, always.
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Ok ok ok I'm not Tryna start discourse but bluestars prophecy was my first ever warriors book and bluestar will always be my favourite so I'm gonna make some counterpoints to you about her being a Smajor character
bluestar has always been led by an intense loyalty and dedication to those she loves and cares for - this includes her mum, her sister, her clan, eventually Firepaw when he joins the clan, and she has a VERY strong moral compass when it comes to doing the right thing - when she sees thistleclaw teaching tigerpaw to hurt a then baby scourge she very much discourages it and is against it
Afaik scott is Not like that, he doesn't have an emotional or love-driven moral code, he does things because they're smart decisions in the long term or because he wants to. Granted I havent seen a ton of his stuff but I have seen his limited life and 3rd life perspectives and he is very much a singular team player there, there to look after himself and well if people align with him that's great he's got allies (jimmy and Martyn) but he won't go out of his way to care for them
Bluestars defiance of starclan in the first series is BECAUSE she gave herself to them and what the warrior code demanded so much - yes she broke clan rules by having kids with crookedstar but she did everything in her power to make sure they'd have a happy life and felt terrible that thrushpelt was willing to say they were his to save her reputation. She didn't do it out of a selfish want, she only ever wanted to help her clan and those she loved, and her becoming clan leader is emblematic of that want. When she rejects starclan so wholeheartedly in the first series it's because THINGS KEEP GOING WRONG WHEN SHES TRIED SO HARD TO STOP THEM FROM DOING THAT - starclan has never cared about the sacrifices she made to keep her loved ones and clan safe, she lost her mother, her sister, her kits, her mate, literally everything, and things STILL KEEP GETTING WORSE. it's not a demand that she deserves to have everything good, it's a cry for help that shouldn't something go right after she's tried so hard???
C!Scott isn't like that. He puts himself above others and inherently believes he will get the best if he just plays his cards right, and he is good at it, he's very competent at lasting a long time in life series and getting what he wants - the ruthlessness of gem driven by desperation kills him in secret life, Martyn's complete fucking about face kills him in limited life, and I'm pretty sure it's etho who gets him out in 3rd life by luck. He doesn't plan to look after the ones he cares about, because he cares about himself first and foremost. Yeah you can argue when he doesn't get what he wants he gets annoyed, but his is less of a 'why don't I get this don't I deserve it' and more of a 'oh fuck this didn't work. Ok new plan double down on getting what I want by appeasing to people cos they're easy to read and therefore account for'
I don't doubt Scott would make a bluestar adjacent character if he made a warrior cats oc BUT his character would honestly be closer to darktail or ashfur than bluestar and that's that on that.
(sorry you activated 13 year old me's unskippable cutscene sjdjsjsjja this isnt meant to be a serious argument I just love bluestar a lot and love talking about her)
OKAY 1. this is fucking awesome thank you 2. i am going to do something new and exciting (advocate for scott instead of beating him to death with sticks) because unfortunately this bluestar info has only made me believe she is a smajor character even more.
As a general note when I talk about smajor characters as a collective here I’m referring to characters more in the realm of esmp/traffic/rats/pirates/etc, less vampire scott or necromancer scott who are intended to be villainous.
Scott characters tend to operate under a “If I am not a Good Person I may as well die” rule, and consequently abide by a strict moral code to keep themselves feeling clean. For instance: traffic Scott will never go back on his word, he will avoid dishonesty, and he won’t take from others unless he is sure that he can repay them. He will never betray his seasonal primary ally (even when they betray him first), and will often give people things just because they asked him nicely. He stakes a lot of his own identity on this, because it is through being a “good person” that he justifies his superiority (and, by extension, his own existence); in his mind he deserves the best and *is* the best because he is such a good person. When things don’t go his way, he thinks he doesn’t deserve it because he has been nothing but good, so he tries to place a reason. He often assumes that somebody must “have a vendetta” against him, even if this somebody is the world (see: him asking if limlife episode 1 boogeyman is some kind of joke played on him for not giving in to the boogey curse in Last Life.) which is very Bluestar to me, convinced that her misfortunes are a divine punishment.
This is all to say that Scott does have a strict moral code and deep sense of loyalty. Being a “good person” and devoted partner in the ways he understands it are so ingrained into what he is that I think he definitely has the capacity to be a Bluestar if he were raised being taught clan values, even if his internal systems are often built around never letting gross emotions be fully felt rather than what those emotions compel him to do.
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Update on the Deadly Defender's Bow situation: according to the LotRO companion, there are a total of eleven bows that share this appearance. Two of them, however, I believe are not actually accessible in game, the Ashwood Recurve Bow and Tanglind, leaving me with nine options. I've put detailed information about each bow under the cut, but the short summary is this:
In Eriador, I might be able to find the Deadly Defender's Bow. It seems to be intended as a sort of Ultimate Weapon for level 40 characters, and has been in the game since very early in its development. My suspicion is that it was intended for "endgamer" players before Angmar was even open, and that I will actually find it on level 37-40 enemies, rather than 40 and above (as it isn't terribly uncommon in early game areas to find gear a few levels above whatever you're actually fighting, so you can "grow into it"), so I've been hunting around the endgame areas of Evendim and the Trollshaws, but without much luck on either count. Some challenges include the fact that the game doesn't appear to consider Gauredain to be "humanoid" based on the loot they drop (or rather the loot they don't drop), so I've pretty much been restricted to Angmarim and a handful of tomb-robbers in Evendim and the wights and hillmen in that one tiny corner of the Trollshaws.
In Moria and Lothlorien, there are 5 possible bows that might have the appearance I want: the Bow of Bluffing (58), the Masterful Bow of Extermination (52), two variations on the Supple Bow (59), and the Swift Bow (54). From my brief excursions into Moria I also think these might be found on enemies a few levels below the actual bow's level. Also, none of these names are unique. There are lots of bows with these names in Moria. There's more information about that below the readmore.
And in Mirkwood there are 3 possible bows: a different Bow of Bluffing (62) and two more variations on the Supple Bow (63). Again, these aren't unique names, more information below.
I'm not asking anyone to go on a hunt for this bow (I've been hunting for this bow for almost two years with no luck) but if you do see it, please let me know, and any information on where you got it from is much appreciated! This is the appearance I'm looking for:
(Low quality screenshot but it's the bow new Hunter characters hold during the first stage of character creation. And beautiful. Look at how beautiful.)
More information about each bow under the cut, as well as links to their LotRO Build cards for even more information.
Deadly Defender's Bow
Rare item
Item level: 42
Min. level: 40
Bind on Acquire
Ashwood Recurve Bow
Rare item
Item level: 75
Min. level: 75
Bind on Acquire
Note: The LotRO Companion includes a table of scaling information for this item which I believe it didn't include a few months ago (though I could be misremembering), showing scaling information from level 45 to 140. It's possible it's in incorporated into scaling loot tables, possibly to facilitate item drops in missions, though unlikely, as it still has the -10% Fire-arrow Miss Chance attribute, which still, as far as I can tell, doesn't refer to an actual skill in game. LotroBuild seems to indicate that this is a Hunter skill of some sort, but I have no idea which one, and still categorize this item as "probably obsolete" and "most likely just the item that the character creator screen references." (Besides, why would there be a level 75 bow with specific references to Hunter skills when level 75 Hunters ought to have a LI? That would be silly. Although to be fair I got all the way to 120-something before I sat down and really put work into getting myself a proper LI.)
Bow of Bluffing I*
Rare item
Item level: 58
Min. level: 58
Bind on Equip
Note: According to the LotRO Companion, this item can sometimes be found in level-appropriate wooden chests.
Bow of Bluffing II*
Rare item
Item level: 62
Min. level: 62
Bind on Equip
Note: According to the LotRO Companion, this item can sometimes be found in level-appropriate backpacks, corpses, and wooden chests.
Masterful Bow of Extermination*
Rare item
Item level: 52
Min. level: 52
Bind on Equip
Note: According to the LotRO Companion, this item can sometimes be found in level-appropriate wooden chests.
Supple Bow I**
Rare item
Item level: 59
Min. level: 59
Bind on Equip
Note: According to the LotRO Companion, this item can sometimes be found in level-appropriate wooden chests.
Supple Bow II**
Rare item
Item level: 59
Min. level: 59
Bind on Equip
Note: According to the LotRO Companion, this item can sometimes be found in level-appropriate wooden chests.
Supple Bow III**
Rare item
Item level: 63
Min. level: 63
Bind on Equip
Note: According to the LotRO Companion, this item can sometimes be found in level-appropriate backpacks, corpses, and wooden chests.
Supple Bow IV**
Rare item
Item level: 63
Min. level: 63
Bind on Equip
Note: According to the LotRO Companion, this item can sometimes be found in level-appropriate backpacks, corpses, and wooden chests.
Swift Bow**
Rare item
Item level: 54
Min. level: 54
Bind on Equip
Note: According to the LotRO Companion, this item can sometimes be found in level-appropriate wooden chests.
Tanglind
Legendary item
Item level: 35
Min. level: 35
Bind on Acquire
Note: This is a Hunter class item. It's also the only non-rare item on the list. A level 35 legendary item is already a bit odd, but it gets odder; it appears to be part of a set of level 35 legendary weapons that all share similar brief descriptions along the same lines: Tanglind's is, "Bow Song, legendary Elf-bow of Forest of Brethil." There is also a crossbow, Ferediron, which is class-restricted, but aside from that none of the other weapons are class items, although a few of them are unique. My suspicion is that this series of weapons were meant to be rewards for some kind of quest or deed in game that was never implemented, especially since the inconsistencies in construction make me feel like the series isn't even properly finished yet. And nobody I've talked to has ever found any of these weapons in game. (I wonder if they might implement them as rewards for class deeds, now that you don't get trait points from that anymore? Or something similar, anyway.) In any event, I'm not spending any time looking for this one.
*Items marked with a single star do not have unique names. There are lots of bows in the game with this name. However, if they only have a single star they can be differentiated by their level and rarity: the only rare quality bow of that level with that name has the desired appearance.
**Items marked with two stars cannot be distinguished by their level and rarity: there are several rare quality bows of that level with that name and not all of them have the desired appearance.
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