#origin discourse

[system-of-a-feather]

Thoughts on Anti-Endo Rhetoric and Pro-Functional Multiplicity Values

This isn't meant to be a callout post or a "gotcha" or anything hostile at all; it's really meant to be me pointing out a logical inconsistency I don't really get within the anti-endo perspective of things, because as someone who was once anti-endo and is now pro-endo (in the definition of "Endos are fine and I support them existing without harassment")

But I don't understand how you can both be anti-endo and support the practice and idea of Functional Multiplicity?

The idea of anti-endos is that one can't choose to be Plural, that someone can't become Plural, and that to be Plural you have to have dissociation and thus also have trauma.

But with that line of thought, what happens when a system with DID recovers to the point of having no dissociation?

If dissociation is required for plurality, under that logic, then can anyone who reaches functional multiplicity with a CDD truly call themselves healed? If so, are we really comfortable saying that functional multiplicity isn't a real or true form of healing?

Or alternatively, if we say that it is still a valid form of recovery / healing because PTSD symptoms are gone and the dissociation is still their albeit non-disruptive, are we going to just ignore the people who have recovered, gained functional multiplicity and claim to not have dissociation?

In that case, are we comfortable saying that people who have spent years in therapy working with their CDD don't know what dissociation is and what they feel and are incorrect in understanding their experiences?

If dissociation is required for plurality, under that logic, would recovery and the remission of dissociation require fusion into one whole? Because if plurality and dissociation are inherently tied and required, then should it not be possible to have plural experiences without dissociation? Thus if dissociation goes, then shouldn't everyone automatically fuse and cease to experience plurality?

I'm not asking this to play "gotcha" games with anti-endos, I'm asking it genuinely because honestly, these were things I really had to question as I recovered, hit functional multiplicity, final fusion, and then decided to choose to operate as plural whenever I felt like it and as a single fused whole at other times.

These questions are unironically a large reason I became heavily pro-endo (again in the "let them be, theyre not harming anyone and I think they should be allowed to be themselves" way, I still dont know much about endos as a community or subculture or whatever you want to label it). I've had these questions and thoughts for at least two or three years now, but I've never mentioned them on the account I didn't feel like I knew how to word it in a way that wasn't inflammatory in nature until now.

I could not rationalize how the trajectory of my recovery, my eventual reaching of functional multiplicity, my achieving of final fusion, and then my decision to still be plural could live side by side with my anti-endo then syscourse-neutral stance. I could not rationalize or find a genuinely good way to make both my experiences and my own actions to stay consistent with any real gripes or doubts I had about endogenic systems and created systemhood.

I guess one could say that people who had a CDD and recovered can do that because "system" is a CDD term and they have a right to that term, which to that I guess we can agree to disagree. I don't think system is a word people with CDDs own, even more so for the word "plural" and that disagreement hinges on that. If that's your stance, then feel free to just ignore this post because I'm not really interested in discussing semantics and word ownership right now, this post is just about opening discussion for people that do make the claim that dissociation is inherent to plurality and how their stance with that aligns with their views of Functional Multiplicity.

Also this is a judgement free and respectful space for BOTH opinion sides. If you are going to be mean or nasty to people in this conversation, also please leave this post alone.

I'd like anyone who would like to argue and debate and prove their point right to DNI with this post.

[unfamiliar-ghostly-system]

Created “systems” form the stigmas that keep us down. I’ll put it in simple cause and effect terms

cause: people pretend they became systems by choice

effect: people think being a system is a voluntary thing.

——————————————

cause: people think being a system is a voluntary thing

effect: people think systems are just roleplayers.

Do I need to simplify this further or is this good?

One) This is a negative interpretation and view of created systems, making every line of reasoning after it based on that negative feeling.

You believe created systems are pretending and acting, or, simply put, lying about their experience; this will affect your overall opinion and feelings towards them. So, of course it's easy to look at this group of people you think are asshats and say they are at fault for people having negative feelings towards all systems.

I'm not trying to say you can't feel negatively about created systems; it's chill, whatever. But this line of thinking is based on that negative feeling, and in reality I don't see how it's reflective of the issues systems face.

Two) A lot of people who are ignorant about systems don't even know the difference between endogenic and traumagenic, or that there are plurals who don't have a CDD, let alone what a created system is.

I'm talking about the people who have probably just watched cringe content on TikTokers with DID and decided it's not real. They watched cringe, decided these people were 'just roleplaying' or read the comments saying that, and they chose to express that in whatever way they do.

I didn't even know what a created system was until about a year or more after learning what DID was for the first time, and I was actively seeking out information on DID and systems.

And if we're talking about the people invested in not liking systems, like systemscringe users, they don't care if there is a difference between a person with DID and an endogenic and a willogenic; they don't care, they don't believe in any of it anyways.

I don't see any excuse for people knowing about CDDs, then learning about created systems, and then deciding that people with CDDs are faking.

People are responsible for their own actions and beliefs; if someone "stops believing in CDDs" because of created systems, they should not be pardoned just because "created systems might confuse them 🥺.".

[etz-ashashiyot]

Happy freedom weekend to all who celebrate!

[staffs-secret-blog]

Next april fools we're only showing people you've blocked on the dashboard

[peachviz]

ok TikTok may not think unification confirmed spirk but I keep seeing old insecure bigoted men on Facebook angrily calling the short brokeback mountain so that right there is solid confirmation of spirk

[that-satireguy]

Ok, so not even getting into everything insane about the whole 'forcemasc is a mockery of forcefem 'thing, I just want to address something, using this post, which i think is an interesting example.

So, clearly, this creator is speaking largely about the trans community when referring to the 'queer community', (mentioning t4t, forcemasc/forcefem, and gender affirmation).

Now, this idea that everything in the trans community came from transfems and trans women is pretty popular, and based in the fact that the majority of openly trans people, trans communities, trans people in activism, for much of recorded history were/made up of transfems.

What i struggle with, is the fact that someone can argue 'most openly trans people were transfeminine people', and also not acknowledge that this was... not transmascs choice?

I mean typically speaking, you can't argue 'majority of [community] was defined by, spearheaded by and revolved around [half of community]' and that theres a problem with the less represented, more history wiped, less common [half of the community] building stuff for themselves.

Its... not transmascs fault that they haven't been able to popularise any terms, make their own communities, be present in campaigning, explore their kinks, and set their boundaries until pretty recently*.

You do know thats not their fault right?

I mean transmascs have only recently been able to be openly out at the same 1:1 ratio as transfems*, is it really a surprise that their language developed later, and may be seen to be 'copied' off transfems?

We should be studying the reasons why transmasculine people appear to be one of the most stunted groups in the queer community at having their own spaces, terms, even medical care and representation in the public.

Not blaming them for it.

**Worth noting that this is Western focused. In the rest of the world transmascs still have not reached even close to a 1:1 ratio and still the majority of trans communities outside of the west do not include transmascs/are extremely heavily transfem

[moyazaika]

Fangdokja baby, unblock me, will you? I just wanna talk :)

Genocide. Antisemitism. Concentration camps. White supremacy. Islamophobia. The klu klux klan. Conversion therapy. Pedophilia.

Listed above, my loves, are only a few of the topics FD hopes to write about when it migrates platforms and leaves tumblr. (I mean thank christ. baruch hashem. alhamdulillah. we're finally free.)

FD says quite explicitly and at length that she has been, in her own words, holding back from writing about such topics due to tumbr guidelines and not, as she makes sure to let us know multiple times and very explicitly so, because of a "lack of desire” on her own part.

Huh. Okay, interesting.

Say, FD, why have you been holding back on writing about the very painful and devastating realities that billions of people in the world face every single day as if they are trivial topics and fanfiction tags you have been permitted to use? :)

Maybe I'm missing something here. Fill me in, won’t you? Why could you have possibly been yearning to write about little kids in a sexual context? How did you put it? Ohhh, yeah;

Infants? So close! That’s actually CSAM babes!

This is not even about yandere content anymore. It’s about your sheer ignorance and prejudice which prevents you from seeing just how fucked up of a person you are. Jesus did not ask you to trivialise and sensationalise incredibly sensitive experiences and prejudices that you will never understand nor live through.

You know what your religion does say, though?

1 Corinthians 10:23 NIV; "I have the right to do anything," you say—but not everything is beneficial. "I have the right to do anything, but not everything is constructive."

Think on that, won’t you? :)

Let me end this by saying, as a dark content writer myself, I firmly reject the idea of censorship and pirating fictional content both when it is created and when it is consumed.

However, I'm also not a fucking idiot.

When adults use their critical thinking skills to separate fiction from reality, I'm all for the exploration/unpacking/interrogation of taboo topics. It is very dangerous to condemn people for what they choose to write as an expression of their artistic abilities or personal experiences.

Fiction ≠ Reality. This idea is nothing new, and rightfully so. Everyone should be able to write what they want.

But a Christian woman shamelessly expresses homophobia? Has said very clearly in the past that the reader inserts in her posts will only ever be written as being pale, skinny, teenagers in mind? And now she wants to turn around and say she's writing about topics like conversion therapy and racism and expects anyone to believe it's from a purely creative standpoint?

Omg baby you must think we're all as moronic as you :(

Your vendetta, FD, is clear as day, and your vindication is utterly disgusting.

I condemn you.

I condemn your content.

I condemn the 'creative freedom' under which you and your supporters will defend your ability to take the lived experiences of millions of queer people, transgender people, jews, muslims, survivors of vicious hate crimes, children, victims of grooming, disabled people, black people, brown people, asians, and survivors of genocide to turn into content for your bigoted anime porn blog.

Whilst I still firmly believe fiction does not equate to reality, I wonder whether you think the same. Every other belief except for your own is up for grabs in a taboo free for all.

So when you say nothing is sacred in fiction?

I wonder whether that’s true of your own God as well—or just everybody else’s.

[renthony]

It's real fucked up how many queer people dread Pride season due to both systemic queerphobia and queer infighting. Pride season always rockets up my anxiety, and I know I'm not the only one.

This shit sucks, y'all. We gotta support each other more than the queerphobes hate us. I'm not saying we have to love each other, I'm not saying we even have to like each other, but we cannot keep subdividing communities, circulating callouts, and dogpiling each other over who has it worse. That shit will kill us all.

We cannot keep thinking of our individual experiences with bigotry as, "I know [xyz kind of queer] has it worse, but...", and we cannot keep looking at other experiences with bigotry as, "that's bad, but [abc kind of queer] still has it worse," when the reality is that we are all being targeted. It's all bad! It all deserves to be talked about and fought against without trying to put it in some kind of hierarchy! Hierarchies are not fucking helpful here!

Some fucking unity, please.

[glitter-stained]

"why does fanon love making Jason care about his goons when he kills them in canon" I'm sorry to tell you that Jason's Robin run is a significant work for his characterization. And that Willis Todd was in fact a goon. Like, that's a significant thing that happened.

(jaybin fans exist not every Jason fan is a hardcore UTH fan who thinks everything about Winick's writing is pure and just and the right way)

[pepperpuppy417]

A question!! Maybe a chain?

When did you get into LoZ, and how?

For me, I played BotW years ago and really enjoyed it but couldn’t get really into any of the other games. About a year and a half ago (I think?) I happened upon Linked Universe. I didn’t know who half the cast was but I was SMITTEN. After that I started ALBW and it was all over for me.

No pressure tags

@starwolfie @kilgoreontralfamadore @chibinur @raven8224

[phoenixyfriend]

"Why didn't the Jedi help Shmi after TPM?"

Why didn't Padmé.

Ignoring the expanded universe stuff about Qui-Gon sending the expensive lens or Padmé dispatching Sabé years later, so long after that Cliegg had already met, wooed, and saved up to free Shmi himself, why did Padmé not include "paying back the slave woman who helped me save my planet" in her post-invasion plans?

The Jedi have budgets that are regulated, to some unknown degree, by the Senate. Sure, there's probably some discretionary spending, but an Entire Slave would be flagged. Not a purchase you can hide easily! They're also NOT supposed to operate in Hutt Space unless undercover OR as official Republic envoys.

Padmé? Literally a queen. In the same galactic neighborhood. Has inherited wealth. Probably has room in her staff for a mechanic or something. Can easily justify freeing Shmi to her cabinet as payment for services rendered; remember, that Nubian hyperdrive was paid with Anakin's winnings, meaning they came at the cost of Shmi's freedom.

The real answer is that George Lucas needed Shmi to still be on Tatooine in AotC, and never bothered to expand on how Shmi was freed, himself, so other people took up the slack.

But if we ask why the Jedi didn't free Shmi, then I think we also need to ask: why didn't Padmé?

(I love Padmé. I fully believe she would have sent someone to free Shmi after Naboo was in order post-Invasion, and that it was just an oversight or even plot necessity from G Lucas. I just dislike the double standards of hating on the Jedi for not helping when Padmé is right next door and has That Cash Money.)

[russetfoxfur]

had the worst idea ever

💫star-of-the-show reblogged badassplum . . .

🔮the-universe-leads Follow

hey guys can we talk about the way the starromantics are appropriating the moonromantic flag? ive seen way too many ppl be just. chill with it??? saying mistfog like """"oh well the moon and stars are basically the same things"""" like babes have yall never looked up at the sky. those two things are Very Much Not The Same!!!!!

🍤plates-to-heaven Follow

the flags literally aren't? anything the same??? are you still using the moonro flag by stagefright-stardust. that guy was outed as a dischanger you know

🔮the-universe-leads

Wow! a clueless entitled vaugardian who without any proof decides that any astros are dischangers! stars could we just stop with the bigotry. anyways you're blinding wrong Look At This Fog:

like literally the starro flag is just two less stripes than the moonro flag. could yall not stick a moon or star onto one of them to show the difference

🕺lordjose-fan-dre Follow

Good Change, astros are annoying. We get it! You're all hopelessly infatuated with the night sky! You know alllll the little lights up there because you studied soooooo hard to get an A+ on the test!!! Leave the rest of us alone!

🔮the-universe-leads

my brother in stardust This Is Basic Knowledge

🔮the-universe-leads

like if this were me trying to get you to name the stars in the sky then yea id see how thats absurd but like???? how do ppl live like this?????

starsaboveearthbelow-deactivated

op i feel your pain :[ EDIT I KNOW ITS ASTRONOMY STOP CORRECTING ME

😺joyofjouvente666 Follow

Whats the difference between an astromantic and an islander /genuine

starsaboveearthbelow-deactivated

islanders are people from that Unnamed Island (you know the one, don't think about it). because its an island. this is most people. now scholars speculate that the Unnamed Island was really weird about stars. astromantics are people who feel like their romantic life is tied up with the island/stars. honestly im just a tranny dyke so i cant tell you what thats like

🔮the-universe-leads

so firstly YEAH! yeah i wish astro trauma was more talked about in the astro community! like calling stagefright a dischanger or just hating on astros. anyway obviously stagefright's not a dischanger but apparently like most astros she was taking refuge in vaugarde. However due to recent circumstances relating to a certain monarch,

💎jewel8gem6 Follow

as a starro i think youre stupid. they literally have a difference of two stripes!!! i bet youre not even a real astro. to my starro followers: you all are so valid and dont allow petty infighters like op to divide us astros!

🍤plates-to-heaven

well actually while youre right about the infighting thing yall do need a better flag than the standard one stagefright made. i drew this in like less than a minute (forgive the messiness i edited this at 2AM my time)

💎jewel8gem6

that looks blinding awful. are you astrophobic or something thats such a joke. blocking you

🍤plates-to-heaven

these are crabbing sketches??? not the real thing??? i know this is piss-on-the-poor website but come on

💎 jewel8gem6

Haha. what a fool you are to think me poor of reading comprehension skills. I am far above a blinded fool like you. Do you know what its like, being astromantic? every day people send me asks on anon yelling at me about my ugly white NATURAL hair, and you're just as bad as them. this is a disgrace to the astromantic community. you say in your bio that you are supportive of all astros but are you really? when you can create such mistfog as pictured above??? if you do not delete those pictures off your blog i will sneak into your house and suck off all your teeth one by one so you cannot speak your awful opinions aloud. i will tell the universe to kill your family and curse you with immortality so you can watch and suffer as horribly as i did laying my eyes upon these """""flags""""". wither and waste in the agony of your own unfulfilling and insignificant life, worthless vaugardian. be blinded forever idiot >:/

🔮the-universe-leads

i feel like this post is kind of getting off track could we talk about the flags again. plates' flags looked kinda cool and weren't cheap copies of each other

💎jewel8gem6

you SUPPORT this fool? you SUPPORT plates, who ruins the delicate harmony of astromantic spaces through xyr tasteless insults and mockeries??? how dare you calm yourself an astro op. TRUE astros must walk through fire in order to find any happiness in their perpetual incompletion. for example, i have been persecuted by ka buan officials for my sexuality, nearly slain by vaugardian defenders, and then forced to flee to mwudu in order to survive the king. fools such as you are the reasons we haven't found the island yet. a kiddie like you needs to go back to potty training if you think plates has any credibility whatsoever. go burn up in the atmosphere and let not a soul tell where you lie

🦀crabbingcastle Follow

Anyone in this thread eat crab

🌟officialastroposts Follow

Official Astromantic Post!

🔮the-universe-leads

i made this two blinding months ago and forgot about it are you seriously like. a vaugardian

👩🏿‍❤️‍👨🏼 mirafrin4ever Follow

EW AN ASTRO!!! go back to the ocean you mooneyed crabs. don't you crabbing weirdos know not to infest holy everchanging sites like tumblr with your weird stupid sky obsession. lol

🔮the-universe-leads

Saviorshipper. blocked

🍤plates-of-heaven

savior shipper, bolcked

💎jewel8gem6

Ew, saviorshipper. blocked

🦜pioupiou-9377 Follow

wow i cant believe ive found the original! ive only seen this in screenshots! and its only four months old!!!

🔮the-universe-leads

someone wish me out of existence already

#wow only six months old lol? this post is a mess. thx for putting this on my dash mira #poor op #islander talk #moot talk #longpost #shitpost #< i hope

47,368 notes ↪️ 💬 🔁 🤍

💫 star-of-the-show-2 . . .

@.star-of-the-show tutorial for you stardust! i want you sososo bad

2 notes ↪️ 💬 🔁 ♥️

[eloquentsisyphianturmoil]

I do think that any fan who believes Tolkien intended readers to view characters as deserving of death, instead of simply meeting death as a consequence of their actions (or that one state-sanctioned execution), is fundamentally missing the ideology conveyed in ‘Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement.’

[3kidsinacoat]

[mdzs-owns-my-ass-i-guess]

The reason why Jun Wu was so obsessed with modelling Xie Lian after himself was to prove himself what happened wasnt his own personal failing but the kind of thing that would happen to anyone else in order for himself to be able to make peace with his choices in this essay i will-

[proshipezreal]

I genuinely don't understand how antis can be self shippers like. Why is it "only fictional" when your boyfriend is a serial killer but the moment someone ships two siblings it's "disrespectful to SA victims" ? Like ? By that logic you're being disrespectful to serial killer victims and their families. Be so fucking for real