#perfect victim post

[horizon-verizon]

Team smallfolk will literally be like Daenerys, the former slave who spent her entire life impoverished, exiled, hunted, and abused, and enacts revolutionary violence against the ruling class, becoming queen of the Seven Kingdoms would be white supremacist fascist monarchist propaganda, but Sansa, the girl who despite experiencing abuse always lived in the lap of luxury, and who never experienced poverty or homelessness, who is actively classist, becoming queen would be a revolutionary marxist way to end the series.

A marvel.

[preyingmantits]

At the core of Armand is a little boy who is screaming and beating his fists at how unfair it all is. His ugly tendancy for painting himself as a victim even in times when he's clearly the abuser is directly related to him never being seen as a victim when he unquestionably was one (ie: in the brothel, the Palazzo, the catacombs etc.) There's a seed of resentment buried in his heart that has been growing for 500 years over this. What about my pain cries the boy as he burns ants under a magnifying glass. After all, isn't he just everything he was made to be? Isn't he owed the right to cruelty, after all that was done to him? What an insult it is to him that we would worry about the ants and see him as a villain.

[asexualbuthorny]

what do you mean to tell me a character who was abused in his childhood, constantly compared and overshadowed, disregarded and pressured, had to take up huge responsibilities when he wasn't ready and was mourning and was essentially lied to and constantly disrespected isn't the nicest, most sunshiney, most moral, most selfless, most whateverthefuck person out there?

that's not allowed we have to demonise that character, call him a scum and only see the bad in him

[tsuktra]

'Octavia just doesn't know the truth' what truth doesn't she know, exactly?

That her mother is an abusive person? I think it's not much of a secret.

That her parents hate each other? Even if she didn't know that when she was a kid she learned it when she became a teenager and she definitely knew it after they decided they wanted a divorce.

That her dad loves her? You can still love someone and keep hurting them, you know, without even wanting to. As Octavia said herself, Stolas hates Stella more than he loves Octavia (and by extension he loves Blitzø more than he loves his own daughter). Sometimes actions are more important that words.

He broke her trust too many times, she doesn't NEED to forgive him. He can love her all he wants, when everything he does suggests otherwise, it's only natural that she thinks he's lying, to think he'll betray her trust again.

Stolas is not a good father, even if he says he wants to be. Wanting to be something and actually being that thing are two completely different things.

[horizon-verizon]

the Wicked Stepmother acts the way she does beyond "she's just jealous/powerhungry/sadistic/whatever inherently unsympathetic motivation you can think of". Which Hot D, for all of its flaws, actually tries to do. Show!Alicent is deeply, profoundly Wrong, but not completely unsympathetic. She has layers and shit.

A)

The point of the OG post was not to decide on whether or not HotD's Alicent was "sympathetic" or not. That wasn't the concern. The concern was that the writers claimed the original story/female antagonist was sexistly written, and that they would rewrite it into something not sexist, but bc they did not understand the original character/story they created a sexistly-written female antagonist anyway.

F&B doesn't play the Wicked Stepmother trope "straight", as OP explains. What makes a TRUE Wicked Stepmother Trope narrative is there being a:

a passive, innocent, purely reactive girl, that patiently suffers and awaits for her Prince [...] that will save her from her evil Stepmother" so that "the willful and driven woman that is punished in the end (stepmother) Vs the passive perfect feminine figure that is rewarded in the end (stepdaughter)

There needs to be a passive young girl/perfect young female victim to be rewarded for suffering her wicked stepmother's manipulation attacks against her.

Rhaenyra is not a "perfect victim". In fact she's the opposite:

she is not patient, she has a toleration limit that grows shorter as she gets older because of all the attacks (thus she's a lot more "real")

she is willing to murder

she has extramarital sex & has, what some people have argued, are illegitimate children

she is very proud of her heritage and position & is told or accused of being "haughty" (as if Aemond or Aegon weren't, but that reveals how women and girls are told they shouldn't "think they're all that" since they are already undervalued)

she wears very fine clothing and loves to show off her looks and said position through her looks

she rides a dragon, which traditionally is actually the enemy of "Christian" European medieval society (the final or major boss of a knight's journey to prove himself and protect his domain), so she's not as helpless as a true Cinderella perfect victim

And thus it's not just about the stepmother herself. It's the Innocent StepChild AND thus who does the story "reward"/"punish" and why It's about rewarding one woman for not being self-motivated outside of survival so that a man can save her from a woman whom the story casts as evil because she wants power. As OP states, Daemon actually dies, unlike fairytales WS princes who survive to the end to live happily ever after with the female protagonist.

B)

We also don't really need to "sympathize" with a woman to judge whether she's been sexistly written/treated or not. If we can't acknowledge Cersei is evil, yet you can see how sexistly or non-sexistly she's written AS WELL AS sympathize with her at times for the i-world abuses & sidelining she gets. She is not "perfect" or blameless by any means, but she is definitely a victim of patriarchy.

Show!Alicent received much sympathy because she's first coerced into marriage and then raped, and next to that Rhaenyra looks like she's being too "spoiled" in her refusal to play by the same rules as "perfectly" as Alicent when even in the show she's still suffering from systematic & personal patriarchal abuses, AND Alicent didn't willfully start out wanting to obey the rules so much as was coerced.

Here's what xenonwitch had to say:

Instead of a woman who saw the individual power she could hold under patriarchy was far greater than allowing a woman to rule (and thus subvert or challenge the patriarchal status quo) as we see in Alicent (and real life Women for Trump and/or Conservative Women) the writers decided that a woman could only align with patriarchy if she had been brutally crushed beneath it and deprived or all agency. Hence Alicia becomes a doll for the men in her life to play with.

Why would making a character (who has already been victimized in the story and is only now starting to make political moves and exchanging it for a fate where she is stripped of all agency and violently abused be a “more interesting” story?

Because these writers and showrunners cannot find ambitious women compelling, and are far more satisfied watching women suffer and be victimized. To them, a woman must suffer in order to be relatable, compelling, and capable of empathy. Ambition and agency alone are dull and off putting.

Even though we're encouraged to feel more for Alicent, ultimately the basis for why we should make sympathy conditional on extreme debasement alone, so Show!Alicent is still subject to sexist writing.

We're encouraged to make an unfair comparison & judge who deserves sympathy; as if we should not cater to or support a woman when she's victimized when there is a rape victim to pour ALL our support or resources to. If there's a rape victim, suddenly other women do not experience serious sexism and suddenly the most victimized victim has the right to victimize other victims.

C)

I talk about this HERE.

Alicent maybe less criticized and slandered against than Rhaenyra in the original story, but there are a few examples of misogynist writing or people being sexist towards her in F&B. One is where she's not allowed to swear into the verbal agreement Larys Strong makes at the Green Council (it hinges on her womanhood disqualifying her from being an active & equal partner in their enterprise even though she enabled the council in the first place). Another is that Alicent, for a time, was suspected & lightly rumored of seducing Viserys for him to not marry Laena & thus climbed her way to her position by being "loose". She's still held to Andal beauty standards of women in that she's praised for being "still" slim after 4 pregnancies (her worth is being evaluated by how "hot" she is to men, even men who are supposed to not actively engage in sexual activities [septons & maesters]), as all women are.

Finally, narratologically, Alicent uses men's expectations of her as woman/queen Consort & their desires against her stepdaughter, which is not something the TRUE, conventional Wicked Stepmother has really done in popular media ever since its inception in fairy tales. She's an undercover-disobedient woman rather than an overt one, bc her cause is traditional (boys-first), and seems like she's just trying to get her boys their "rights", so most people around her do not think her cruel. Her cruelty is masked or excused behind the public perception. Whereas the stepmother's cruelty is more or less openly acknowledged in-world and to the readers, it's just that they also need to be "saved".

Ok I've rambled about this before but I want to do it once more.

You may need to sit down for this one but the Wicked Stepmother Trope is a reflection of very real life situations. There were and still are, "wicked" stepmothers. This is not just a stereotype. Irregardless of the societal reasons behind this (patriarchal structure of society), we cannot deny the fact that women, deprived of any real political power in the outside world, often abuse the little power they had inside their own household, at the detriment of other, weaker family members. Women are people, not holograms. Women historically had power however limited, and they too abused that power when they could, and they could do that against children because children are weaker. This is a centuries old societal problem that still exists today, especially in more traditional cultures. It is not mere construction. If you are not familiar with this issue, you have lived a very privileged life and I am happy for you.

However, let's suppose for a moment that the Wicked Stepmother Trope is indeed problematic and has a misogynistic nuance. I believe this is often the case and I will explain why.

If you want to deconstruct the Wicked Stepmother Trope, you have to be sure that there is a proper Wicked Stepmother Trope to begin with in the source material. You also have to make sure that the Wicked Stepmother Trope isn't already deconstructed in the source material. Which is EXACTLY the case in Fire and Blood.

So let's take a typical example of the Wicked Stepmother Trope : Cinderella. Let's compare Cinderella with Fire and Blood for a second.

There is no Wicked Stepmother resembling Cinderella's stepmother in Fire and Blood, for the simple reason that there is no Cinderella héroïne. What is a Cinderella héroïne : a passive, innocent, purely reactive girl, that patiently suffers and awaits for her Prince (a man) that will save her from her evil Stepmother (a woman). All these elements need to exist in order to talk about a proper Wicked Stepmother Trope. This trope gets this misogynistic nuance only when it is paralleled with the poor innocent fairytale heroine. It's the antithesis of the willful and driven woman that is punished in the end (stepmother) Vs the passive perfect feminine figure that is rewarded in the end (stepdaughter), that gives the Wicked Stepmother Trope the misogynistic nuance it has. And this is very important.

Now back to Fire and Blood.

Well, Rhaenyra isn't a Cinderella character at all. She is willful, she's radical, she claims her birthright, she makes mistakes, she dares, she goes against the status quo. She fits the stepdaughter role, and she too has a dashing Prince that tries to save her. Except that he doesn't. He dies, and so does she, horribly. She is not rewarded by patriarchy for her youth, beauty and submissiveness (very important factor if we wanna talk about misogyny in fairytales). Quite the contrary, SHE is punished by patriarchy.

Alicent fits the stepmother role, except that she doesn't fit the misogynistic Wicked Stepmother Trope because her punishment does not constitute an exemplary punishment for NOT being a Cinderella type of female. It's this juxtaposition to Cinderella that makes the trope misogynistic to begin with.

If anything, the Wicked Stepmother Trope is ALREADY deconstructed in the source material. By not respecting that, the writers achieved of course the contrary result : a deeply misogynistic narrative. Rhaenyra is basically a whore. The entire Dance stems from the fact that Rhaenyra had extramarital sex and that's it. That's literally it. The main antagonist was reduced to a rape victim, and had no ambition whatsoever. Since Rhaenyra wasn't a rape victim and had sexual freedom, morally she comes across as more ambiguous than the pure one dimensional victim that show!Alicent is. Rhaenyra had a choice, Alicent doesn't. So the whole BS that both women are equally victims of patriarchy comes at the expense of the actual female protagonist, the willful, daring, non-conforming female character trying to preserve her agency : Rhaenyra. It also comes at the expense of creating characters that feel real and consistent and are not just the product of a power-point on misogyny in uni.

Book!Alicent does not fit a stereotypical misogynistic Wicked Stepmother Trope, a trope whose main goal is to reward submissiveness and punish willfulness. It's already deconstructed in the source material. The author did all the work, all they had to do is copy it. They didn't, which is why we have takes like "oh if Rhaenyra didn't want to be burned alive she shouldn't have had a paramour in Court".

[astrababyy]

i always get so pissed when people point to feyre as an example of someone with trauma still being a decent person and use that as a reason to bash nesta.

it’s really not a good message to send when feyre stans split up trauma victims into “good victims” and “bad victims.” people make mistakes. though trauma isn’t an excuse for people’s actions, it’s important to approach conversations of trauma, even in fictional characters, with empathy and compassion. this kind of scorn for people who make mistakes is completely unreasonable and a horrible message to send to actual trauma survivors who are fans of acotar and see that kind of shit. i can’t believe i need to explain this in 2025, like i thought we’ve figured this shit out already bro.

[afterthelambs]

Found this comment on a jcbackfire video. Some people really get it. More of this from the fandom please

[imaloregremlin]

something I think people often forget about Shrub Berry is that she is not defenseless. I cannot count the number of fanfics I’ve read where she’s a scared, traumatized, terrified gnome who’s seperated from her people and is almost entirely helpless. This is a crucial part of her character, but she’s also so, so brave. Take episode 17 of Empires (Xornoth showed me the future of our empires!) Shrub is continuing her daily life in the midst of this incredibly traumatic experience. She is farming, watering her flowers, and mining, even as the threat of Corruption grows ever-closer. When Xornoth appears, she starts to run away, before realizing that’s exactly what they want. She starts fighting back, insulting Xornoth, and telling him to stop Corrupting the empires, arguing for him to let Joey She keeps them talking, even now, trying to probe for weaknesses. She defends herself and her wolves, in the midst of tragedy and death. She keeps going. It takes so much courage to keep going after your life has been ripped to pieces, it would be so much easier to just let the Corruption win. To lie down and let Xornoth kill her, have her body overrun with Corruption, to join the rest of her people, but Shrub. Keeps. Going. she fights back in any way she can, and she tries to bite back against the darkness, a cornered wolf, the last of her species, and the bravest little beacon of hope in my life when I was fighting my own demons and reminding me that bad doesn’t always have to win, bullies don’t always triumph, people can fight back and make a difference. Shubble literally kept me going when I wanted to just…give up fighting because of how bullied I was in school about three years ago. I know it’s a silly Minecraft smp, I know it was never meant to be so deep, but Shrub Berry literally saved my life. Thank you.

[dreamingofthewild]

I had to make it brief to fit the sign.

Can we normalise critiquing the media we consume and being open to other people's perspectives?

[brunettesparklejumpropequeen]

Academic weapon 2023 and 2022 me would slap tf out of 2024 and 2025 academic victim me

[normal-posts-4-normal-people]

Something that I absolutely love about bg3 is that, in an era of true crime-obsessed YouTubers speculating on the real-life horrors that people go through, Astarion is both a genuinely shitty person and a victim.

Recently, a Hulu original true-crime series came out called Good American Family. Good American Family is about the real-life story of a seven-year-old Ukrainian girl with dwarfism who is adopted by an American family. Said American family severely abused her and then falsely accused her of secretly being an adult woman pretending to be a child who was trying to kill them even though there was scientific evidence of her being a child. They used this objectively ridiculous excuse to abandon a seven-year-old with a disability, forcing her to live alone in an apartment without aid.

When the story got popular on TikTok, many people started to take the side of the parents. While some of them still went with the“ she was actually an evil adult” narrative, a lot of people acknowledged that she was a seven-year-old who was abused, but still said that the parents were right because she was “evil, crazy and tried to kill them” as if a seven-year-old with dwarfism who couldn’t walk without an aid was a physical threat to two grown adults.

In a world where victims of truly horrific abuse are turned into celebrities that are expected to be perfect angels who never do anything wrong, less their abuse gets turned into “hot gossip” to speculate about with sides like Team Edward vs Team Jacob, it is important that Astarion is just a terrible person sometimes.

Yeah, Astarion does fucked up things sometimes. He isn’t a misunderstood person, he is just genuinely kinda evil. And guess what, that doesn’t make what Cazador did OK in any way whatsoever.

[arcade-confetti]

Porcelain Jason au

The Porcelain Jason au is essentially a bit of a horror au where Jason gets replaced (or possessed, depending on version) by a doll that's a "perfect" version of himself!

This au is already something I've made before in a different fandom. The dolls are original characters/entity from that au I've brought here because I like them lots :], with some changes to fit in the dc verse, as well as Jason's circumstances

Perfect is subjective, but the doll's goal is to be in the batfamily's good graces, with a focus on appealing to Bruce specifically!

I really really want to read more modern Jason comics before I develop the au's plot further, this will take awhile for me to get to! Gotham War in particular has caught my attention as great potential for this au, but I dont want to skip ahead to it, I want to have a better feel for the situation.

But! I'm posting the basics of this au now because I like it lots and I want people to actually know what im talking about and making fanart for bdksbdks

What's the doll?

Dolls are not exactly shape-shifting entities but more like.. they're custom made for you. To be a better version of you. To be socially acceptable, embraced even. To be beloved. To do all the right things.

For the dolls, they want to be what others want, and to be perfect

They generally prey on people who are outcast, or cant fit in; yet desperate to be loved, or perfect. They mainly have a focus on high society due to their original au, strict rules, high standards, desperation to not fail or have a secret discovered, desperation to fit in and cut away parts of yourself to do it, are great grounds for them. Porcelain Jason enjoys galas as a fun reference to this

While I certainly wouldn't be surprised if other batfam members are desperate enough to be perfect for others to be doll prey, this au focuses only on Jason because I like him ^v^

Porcelain Jason quits vigilantism entirely to become a normal civilian. This is because the dolls, while capable of healing themselves, are rather easy to crack if directly attacked or punched, which is very noticeable, so they will avoid situations that risk this being noticed. This works out in benefit to the doll's goals as well, being less threatening and less opposing, and is a main contributor to me wanting to read Gotham War for this au ;]

Porcelain Jason wears sweaters and white button ups like Jason used to, as well as straying away from the red hood aesthetics (ignoring how dark jackets as well as black and red have always been in Jason's wardrobe) Porcelain Jason likes green, which is what Bruce says is Jason's favorite color. Loose clothing. Covered up scars to avoid any unfortunate memories for others. And has dark brown eyes, like Jason used to :)

Porcelain Jason takes alot of inspiration from Jason as a child, as well as what small things others think Jason enjoys, as to not confront their conceptions

He's very well behaved :), he's going through college right now, the others are welcome into his house anytime, he doesn't mind any questions or suspicions, he's very understanding. And is even a good ear and shoulder to lean on. He agrees with Bruce, and is firmly against killing in this new chapter of his life :), hes so dedicated to quitting the hero business that if he's ever in any trouble or disrupted he'll call the cops for help

He's very mellow, docile, hes accepted what's happened to him and is ready to move on now :)

He's physically affectionate with any ready for that, and he does well in crowds

Hes very happy and content

Hold on actually, messyy rough doodle stealing from my Jason ref + my porcelain Jason art from earlier

Is Jason ok?

No

I tend to go the death route with this au actually, a shell parading around, and even if you find it out you're still too late. However, as my intention for the original version of this au had been rotten (corpse) on the inside and perfect on the outside, and that fits less here. He may have a fighting chance, may, I do still just really enjoy killing him

Theres many ways for it to go, my favorite aus have TONS of branches. As above, corpse inside with a porcelain shell. There's also shell with a skeleton inside, or just a hollow shell, which is what appeals the most to me here

Generally for that, you turn into the doll, your skin hardens to porcelain and you're either hollowed out (it just sorta fades away) or left there to decay

The living routes are possession, or hidden and needing to be rescued. But no matter what. Jason is. Not doing so good, especially if he has to watch the doll succeed

Is this a fic or comic? Or plans to be one?

Not really! I just really enjoy making aus, making designs and concepts, rambling with others. Just a fun little project :]

I have already made some art for it, maybe I'll make a quick doodle comic, maybe I'll write a very short one shot if so inclined. But there's no plans or major story to follow, certainly not right now

[beanie-twink]

As someone who has experienced domestic violence sexual assault etc FUCK some of you bitchass fans of gaiman’s work. Every single time some abuser gets outed (especially if they happen to be in a creative industry) you guys bend over backwards to try to reclaim the work. Yall did this with harry potter so much, trying to find guilt free ways to enjoy what they put out. You prioritize assuaging your guilt rather than thinking about the victims who deserve recognition and to be supported right now. I understand these works were formative and important to you. But there is a bigger picture. And by your immediate jumping to this, you’re showing other victims of said person AND anyone who is a victim in general that as long as someone puts out good work, their atrocities don’t fucking matter in the end. You say they do, but your words (and actions) show otherwise. Do better.

[horizon-verizon]

The truth is out of the bag: I hate Jon Snow, it seems.

I remember distinctly saying that I didn't hate hate the guy, but I guess I was unconvincing when I expressed I didn't think Jonerys (the ship) was lasting and/or possible in canon and beceause of what Dany would have to go through to keep Jon versus Jon endangering her possible hold on power for being Rhaegar's bastard son.

What exaclty do you think makes Jon exactly like Rhaegar in personality, experience, psychological development, values, purpose, etc.? Dany like Lyanna? Because they are leaders for the "people", ful stop? Without stipulating that their similarity comes with different conditions, goals, philosophies, etc., that's almost like saying that bec Dany and Cersei are both queens, they can be near perfectly made out to be very similar people! Even the exact same sort! Could not be farther from the case.

I also never argued that Lyanna was "a means to Rhaegar's end". Espe because I call bullshit on the idea that he sought her out merely for the prophecy and needed a third child! I am not one of those who agrees with that theory. Not sure where you got that impression if you actually read anything I wrote about Rhaegar and Lyanna!

The argument above is an ad hominem, a logical fallacy where the person attacks the arguer's perceived or real identity and/or actions not havign to do with the argument topic or the arguemnts at hand, but meant to discredit the person and/or distract them and the possible audience to derail the conversation. Attacking character. Within it is also a strawman argument as the person has tried to make make as if I was ever judging Jon through his parents...very strange. The purpose is to transpose their own feelings about Rhaegar, transmute it as the topic, and use the "objectivity" of Rhaegar's deplorability to argue that my favor towards Rhaelays says somethign about me. Funny enough, this commentator did not bring up my arguments for why I argue Rhaegar was not the devil incarnate, but they do not care because that would mess up their aim--to discredit my rationality and throww some possile doubt on their own. If this was in an ask or a oublic thred, but thei was a DM, so I think they wanted to stir some doubt in me & shame silence into me.

but let's get back to this section:

You want the last legacy of a girl who risks her son's life to disappear. It's misogyny. What you're so excited about for Daenerys? Why do you do it with the son of a woman? What they did to Daenerys with Rhaego? Please stop belittling Lyanna and Jon because you're not a fan of Lyanna.

There's so many assumptions being made here.

First - The principal assumption here is that I am "belittling" Lyanna when I say that Jon is not politically safe enough a possible royal consort for Dany, one of the very few and only Queen regnants that have ever existed as she is capable of becoming and is currently being!

You want the last legacy of a girl who risks her son's life to disappear.

"Last legacy" implies the only one that gives any strong and valuable meaning to the woman/girl. IF you are talking about Lyanna, [3rd point below], she didn't do that. Doesn't work for Dany either. So who? If Lyanna, Jon is supposedly her only legacy (that matters or that you could detect and speculate), and I think that this is rather a sexist reading on your part as it assumes Lyanna only has Jon as an "accomplishment". Why? Because Jon is that badass so it stands to reason that Lyanna's "sacrifice" was necessary for his rise? Does this sound like it's in close proximity to another possible instance of the trope of a woman used--and worse killed off--for a male character's development in fiction? Same for Dany, except feministly, she lives and her son dies (without her desire but it happens) is accidentally used in part of a process that leads to her "birthing" dragons back to the world. In your schema of badass-Jon, a woman is narratively sacrificed for the man to be badass. This is not the case for Dany whatsoever!!! You should rather be the one NOT throwing a woman's importance to the bin! Truly, what was the connection here? Either way, any "legacy" that Jon would inherit from Lyanna would be tainted by his bastardry sociopolitically/in-world. It only matters differently to fans, as in-world, it'd be more a revisiitng of a scandal that led to a war if there had been no Long Night to face, which then would really be all about Jon's efforts and legacy, not Lyanna's! As of now in the books, Jon has more "legacy" or an inheritanc eof such from Ned, not Lyanna...bc of the whole thing being a secret still!

Feminism is not "a womans' son will give meaning to a woman's death & being". Feminism says "I spit on the whole thing, and maybe, in fact, I will reverse it and let the woman thrive."

There's a another sub-assumption about the world needing Jon more than they need Dany even thought you mention Dany as somehow disrepected by me precisely because you talk more about your dislike of me "hating" Jon, when I say what I say for Dany's interests alone. You don't seem to like that Dany could and should be separated in one's considerations of characterization and roles and development or narrative importance. To you, I think that Dany only matters bc Jon exists to give her meaning and a role and to make her actions in Essos have purpose instead of Dany's journey being a potential solo saga in itself about questioning rulers and subverting gender and sexuality! If you took Jon out, Dany's story--as it already has--would enthrall enough people to be a cultural phenomenon and she already is the most popular character of this series if you see the stats or had eyes. For goodness, sakes, her story ALONE won GRRM his Hugo award! I am not biased--look it up, these are the facts.

What does Dany's queenship have anything to do with Lyanna and Lyanna's death other than "granting" her a bastard nephew who shouldn't be a real political threat but is bc of this sexist world and the Dance's precedent and the Blackfyre Rebellion's example (sexism and xenophobia/racism-ableism)?

Why does it seem that the validity and very existence of Dany's queenship is narratively, socially, etc dependent on Jon's political success? As if she must needs be subservient to Jon to have any success in Westeros or to maintain any shred of power and credibility elsewhere? that we should look to her looking to Jon for an endured reign for herself when the text has given time and time again Dany is more than capable of ruling by herself and needs no "co ruler"...that a male "co ruler" is actually dangerous (Hizdhar) bc of how muc societies (that Dany will rule but still have to deal with local authorities there with their own rules, histories, etc. that she'd navigate as she does in Meereen) allow/credit men over any female relative or partner?! Whether the man is "nice" or not--was never about that and it's inconsequential to how the SYSTEM set against Dany anyway.

Second - How the hell do Dany's and Lyanna's "legacies" match"?! Lyanna is already dead while Dany is actively and currently doing stuff that only adds to what her leagcy would be after she dies!

Even if you manage to argue well for anything abt Lyanna's death to bring Jon into the world being Rhaegar just using her for her womb then informing the audience about Dany...Rhaego is DEAD, Dany is the one who lived! Nothing that happens to your version of Lyanna is going to happen to Dany and vice versa of Jon-Rhaego!

What in the world makes you believe that what we can relate and equate noble-privileged-even-she-is-a-teen-girl-Lyanna's decision to run off with Rhaegar to what Dany being sold (thus against her will) to Drogo and becoming a bridal slave?! Was Lyanna sold into sexual slavery by her own brother for an army in threat of mass r*pe if she didn't "comply"? Is Lyanna a queen now? How does what happens to Rhaego relate in anyway to HOW Dany's child was murdered for you to be comparing Rhaego to jon Snow, a bastard more privileged than most who, unlike Rhaego, got to grow into an "adult" (quotes bc he is one in his society and most of the world and that matters bc he gets to acquire a certain sort of authority because of it, esp as a man)?!

Obviously the assumption being made is that Rhaegar raped Lyanna and/or stole her away from her family or people against her will. The text gives SO MANY clues as to how this is just false. i already argued why and how in my earlier posts and reblogs of others sayign the same under "rhaeyla" or "lyanna and rhaegar"--tags in my blog. Since I reject this assumption and until you or others bring something that actually addresses what I argued, there's really no point in me addressing this assumption from you that is the foundation of your accusations other than:

Rhaegar and Lyanna were not tragic bc Rhaegar raped her or kidnapped her; they are tragic literally Romeo and Juliet styl;e where the love was impossible for their families' AND their individual sociopolitcal positions and they had no time/space afforded to them to be able to be totally fulfilled even if they had never met each other--critiques of whether a man and a girl could AND should be written as a love story to "teach" readers that such relationships are okay in real life is a different matter altogether [see bullet 3], and you don't have to like it, but you should not be denyign facts of story like how many green stans do with the whole Jaehaera v Daenaera bullcrap

you seem to like to waste my and others' time to feel smart

don't like this? Take it up w/GRRM. There is such thing as Watsonian readings of canon and Doylist readings of why the writer wrote what they wrote. I speak of what the story is telling its readers

Third- When did Lyanna "risk" Jon's life? Lyanna laid in the Tower of Joy for almost the entire war, pregnant with Jon, what "risk" is she putting fetus-Jon through? We can't even say Dany does that w/Rhaego bc SHE DIDN'T KNOW THAT MIRRI WAS GOING TO USE RHAEGO'S LIFE FOR DROGO'S!!! You make as if there's a possibility that this is true. So who are you talking about?!

Fourth - Somehow, I don't like Lyanna.

Person, this is the only girl of the Dead Ladies Club I care about and adore, partly bec she doesn't really fit even though she's definitely dead and her death fosters Jon's character (Knight of the Laughing Tree). Yeah, she and Rhaegar are a package deal narratively....Elia does not stand as a character without being Rhaegar's wife, though? And I don't like characters simply bc they are victims and happen to not be able to do nothing for themselves wehether they are partially to blame for that or not at all. And Lyanna, unlike Elia, is a packaged deal w/Rhaega bc from them comes. It's not fair to Elia that she is married to Rhaegar bc Aerys essentially wanted to make his own son less popular (Westerosi xenophobia against Dornishmen) and she grew sicker and bd bound in her gendered "duty" to provide him heirs...or that their marriage was not one Rhaegar would have chosen for himself. But sexism. Part of the point and something that negatively impacts Lyanna as well, NOT fans' insistence of "hating" or truly hating Jon!

Perhaps there is a racial bias against Elia on GRRM's part that makes him put a horrible fate on a darker skinned woman, even though Elia is NOT PoC in the way we think of PoC or what we are familiar with. In fact, she's a "white" woman who is not "white" like Italians and Irish people were at one point in the U.S. But all that would be on GRRM and a Doylist reading, NOT a Watsonian/in-text/story one!

And side note & jic, no Lyanna and Rhaegar's relationship was not one that made Jon legitimate or socially recognized as one bc Rhaegar did not contest polygamy against the Faith of Westeros after the Targs implicitly gave that up for the sake of peaceably marrying themselves in the Doctrine of Exceptionalism. Maegor may not have either, but he managed to dispel of his opposers to the marriages and thus they are "real". rhaegar, if he had married Lyanna, could not do anything like other the doctrine or killing off his foes, so Jon IS a bastard regardless.

[samble-moved]

reminder that homura is a middle schooler. she is 13 or 14 years old, depending on source. she is not old enough to drive or have a permit. she is not old enough to live on her own (it's implied her parents are out of the picture in some way — in the US she'd need to be in adoptive or foster care, or at least have a guardian or social worker, but this appears to be handwaved in the series and none are ever shown). she cannot vote. she is not old enough to get a job (earliest i've seen is 14 in the US, and that's usually in not great environments, in summer, and for low pay and short hours). she is only "independent" in the sense that it's forced upon her by lack of any adult support — nobody helps her fill out school transfer forms, she lives alone, she has no shown family or even mentions of relatives, nobody visits her in the hospital, etc.

i say this because a lot of "anti homura" arguments act as if this information doesn't exist, and that homura is "actually an adult" or at the same level as one due to looping. she canonically is not. her brain and physical body are not developing, she is only learning walpurgis tactics and memorizing test answers. her brain is not developing so she's not "mentally 26", like is often claimed by "homura is a predator" truthers. i'm not even going to touch on how weird and borderline creepy it is to say "she's a child but so mature for her age (from extreme, repeated, potentially pre-series trauma), so she must be an adult and can be treated like one".

there is a reason that children are typically tried differently in the US. unless "tried as an adult" for very serious crimes, it is widely accepted that children (and even young adults) are more impulsive, think less rationally, and are generally "less responsible" for their actions due to not having the experiences of a full grown adult. children are less mature, more prone to "overreaction" and panic, and are immature — because they are kids.

homura is a child. she also has extreme trauma, potentially from before the series even began (where are her parents? are they just neglectful? dead? why isn't there even a single adult helping her?) that is never helped or addressed. homura doesn't get help for any issues she has (obvious ptsd and depression, borderline delusions over the past being "just a dream" in wraith arc). she is not some spoiled, rich, mentally stable almost-adult who's never faced a consequence. she is a young and traumatized teenager, young enough to be a middle schooler, and has experienced:

neglectful, absent, missing, or dead family/parents

watching her friends die horrifically almost a hundred times

having zero adult support at all, no caseworker or help

bullying, half being because she's disabled

having her soul ripped from her body without consent and learning if she ever loses her soul gem (or god forbid accidentally drops it somewhere), her body will basically be "dead"

learning she and all her friends turn into eldritch horrors when they die, a process shown in rebellion to be something they are aware for (aka the horror that witches aren't "just" bodies being moved, they are actively and constantly suffering and aware to some degree the whole time)

learning that the witches they fight are girls around their age who fell into despair, and not purposeless monsters

learned of the prospect that witches can potentially "regrow" via familiars, thus if their consciousness transfers, this shows the possibility of literally eternal suffering as the witch is "reborn"

realization that, the more she tries to save madoka, the worse the situation gets

having a full on breakdown with delusions in wraith arc, thinking maybe madoka was all just a hallucination or a dream she had

finding out in rebellion it wasn't a dream, but then thinking she betrayed madoka by not stopping her from contracting

becoming a witch whose whole theme is based around suicide and wanting and waiting to die, but not being able to

being a witch whose familiars are malicious towards her and belittle her

trying to "fix" her believed betrayal of madoka by making a new world, ending up hated by sayaka and isolated from her friends

is still stuck as a witch while the last event happens!!! (her soul gem is never shown purified)

all of this while she is 13-14.

homura is not some cruel adult playing god because she is bored and likes the power trip and wants the world to burn. she is a deeply traumatized and mentally ill child who never got help. she is not a predator — and i honestly don't know if that is more of a "she's a predator because she's the most openly sapphic" or "she's a predator because she's traumatized and thus 'acts weird' due to trauma" belief nowadays in most anti-homura spaces, i've seen both. she is not a murderer or rapist or whatever else i've seen (yes, "homura is a sexual predator" claims exist, despite this never once even being implied). she is not an abuser — you can argue she's cold or rude, but she is not "an abuser".

if a child like homura existed irl (and they do exist), a professional's first thought would not be "this is an evil, irredeemable, abusive predator who can be treated like an adult", it'd likely be a reaction of horror and deep concern of "what happened to this child to make her act this way?". someone being "the perfect victim" — that is, being soft, demure, sweet, docile, flawless — in response to trauma is a harmful myth for a reason. some trauma victims will react with anger. some may be overly happy in an attempt to prevent further abuse. some, like homura, end up acting "cold" to try and avoid being further hurt. it doesn't mean homura doesn't experience emotion, hates her friends and wants them to suffer, is a predator, is "a bad person", etc.

think! when you write posts about how homura is actually an evil, awful, no good, very bad person with no positive traits, remember she is a middle schooler. of course, she's not a "real" child, and thus doesn't exist to have her feelings hurt over it, but consider this: would you say these things to/about a real child? are you aware that "real children" (often victims of trauma themselves) relate to homura due to this? i was one of them at 14ish, and while "homura is evil [for acting like a traumatized child often does]" discourse never left me particularly hurt, i know it does genuinely upset several people i know. and if you had, say, a real life child relative who acted "cold" after seeing their friends die horribly, would you call them an evil and irredeemable abuser as well?

[hopeswriting]

imagine you're luce, and you're born the heir to a mafia family. you're mafia-born, and so of course also mafia-raised, and then also a donna-to-be. you're raised to be able to take on the role, to be good and capable at it, are taught to make one of your core beliefs about how the many must come before the few, because the family must always come first. you're going to be the donna, of course you must always prioritize the family above all else, it's your foremost and most important duty.

if caring about the few too comes at the price of the many, comes at the price of the family, is it even worth it? if the happiness gained from it comes at the price of a greater suffering for others, is there even any meaning to it, even if it's your happiness we're talking about? you understand, don't you?

you're not sure if you do, but you care about your family, love it, want to do right by it once you become their donna, so you nod, listen and learn.

(you don't have to be taught the pain and loss and guilt and anger and bitterness is a fair price to pay for the pain you decide has to be inflicted and the sacrifices you decide must be made, including by yourself. it's the least you could do, even.)

imagine you're luce, and the gift of foresight runs through your blood.

you would not call it a gift. you did not ask for it either. and you'll never come to see it as something wanted by you.

you can see the future, and it happened exactly as you saw it would, so of course it's exactly the way you wanted it to go. you can see the future, and it happened exactly as you saw it would, so of course you didn't care to try hard enough to change it. you saw the future before the shape of it had yet to be breathed into existence, and who's to say it didn't come into existence only because you saw it happen? you saw the future, and it happened worse than it had to for it.

you can see the future, but you still can't make it anything else than what it was always going to be. you can even make the visions happen at your will, but you still have no say on what you see or how much you see. you still can only be the witness of it before anyone else can.

it does mean double and longer the happiness sometimes, means relief and gratefulness and hope beyond words, and it'd be cruel of you to voice out loud your feelings for others to hear the many more times it means something else.

you can see the future, and it doesn't make it any kinder on you than on anyone else, does not give you any more power or control over it than anyone else, but at least you can see the future. you're given the time to make peace with it, to brace yourself for it, to bargain with it, to plead and beg and fight against it however desperately and hopelessly, even if in the end it still happens exactly as you saw it would.

(you can see the future, and it still doesn't hurt you any less than anyone else when it happens, but you don't expect anymore for anyone to hold you any less responsible for it anyway. it would be nice for someone to do it one day, but you understand.)

you can see the future, and you decide it's a kindness to both yourself and others to keep it for yourself as much as possible whenever you can.

imagine you're luce, and your family has this set of rings they've looked after and protected for as long as your family has existed. they're one set of three of the most important artifacts in the world, ones that help in safeguarding its existence and balance. they're duty, the very first one and the most important one your family was created for.

the pacifier around your mother's neck is duty too, and the most important and powerful artifact among twenty-one in safeguarding the world and its balance. it's been passed down in your family too, from mother to daughter. it's duty, but less tied to your family and much more to the blood running through your veins. it's a curse, in fact, as it demands heavy sacrifices the rings don't, and one that can only be tied to the blood running through your veins.

(your mother looks at you as if expecting some kind of reaction from you, and you can only wonder at which point you weren't supposed to see it as a given. duty and sacrifices have been one and the same for you for a long time now. is it even duty if it doesn't require any sacrifices from you?)

imagine you're luce, and your mother dies for duty. she's the donna, and so she dies for your family. she's the sky arcobaleno, and so she dies for the world. she's your mother, but she dies anyway, doesn't fight it either, even knowing she will leave you behind, even knowing she won't ever get to see what you look like all grown-up.

everywhere you look, duty stares back at you, from your mother and the pacifier around her neck, her love for your family and the life she gives up for it, her love for you and how she dies anyway while you're still only a child. duty, from your family members and how they die for you and kill for you, how they do both at your command, how their lives are in the palms of your hands and how they weigh only as much as you allow them to at a time. duty, from the knowledge your foresight gives you and the shackles tied to the blood running through your veins.

your mother's only duty while she lives too. she loves you, but she'd have had to give birth to you anyway even if she didn't. she loves you, but she still gave birth to you even knowing the kind of life you'd have to live, the kind of hands you'd inevitably end up with, the burdens she'd have to lay on your shoulders, passing them down from her own. because she loves you, she finds the resolve to raise you to be able to face all of it head-on and come out on top, but she'd have had to raise you much the same way anyway even if she didn't.

(she doesn't die for you, doesn't fight to be able to keep living with you, and this, too, is your mother surrendering to duty one last time.)

(you're so sick of it, so angry at it, so hateful and resentful against it. you're so stifled by it to the point you've stopped being able to breathe for a long time now. or you would have been if they had taught you how to face duty in this way too.

it's for the better they didn't. a silver lining, sparing you pain that isn't necessary for you to go through. everyone you turn to only teaches you how to keep holding your breath longer, and you listen and learn, obedient and dutiful as you've ever been.

you're grateful for it too. really, you are.)

everywhere you look, there's no room for you to so much as question any of it, let alone anything more. duty is commendable, something you ought to look up to and strive towards, strive to achieve. duty is the right thing to do. of course it is.

(you exhale a breath of relief that shakes you down to your very core.

thank god, it's at least the right thing to do.

you're grateful for it beyond words. really, you are.)

imagine you're luce, and before it even happens, you know the choice you'll make when climbing that mountain, when standing on top of it, when waiting for a bright light to shine down on you from above. you know the choice you'll make then, even when pregnant with your daughter.

it doesn't matter since how long you knew, be it years, months, days, hours or minutes before. all that matters is that before you can even contemplate the idea of making another choice and all its implications and possible consequences, before the thought can even come alive in your mind, you already know the choice you'll make.

(you can see the future, but just because you already saw it, it doesn't mean it's now set in stone.

you can see the future, but just because you're given the chance to fight to change it, it doesn't mean it still won't happen every bit like you saw it.

it doesn't mean it can't still happen even worse than how you first saw it happen because you fought to change it, no matter how already dreadful it originally was.)

imagine you're luce, and before it even happens, you know they'll be others with you standing on top of that mountain. you're the only one who'll know it before it happens.

(because you can see the future.

and oh, you did not ask for it.)

they're strangers, people you don't owe anything to. adults who choose to show up at the first meeting, and to show up to every following mission after that. the chosen seven, whose ambitions and prides lead them to walk the path of the seven strongest too once laid down in front of them.

you don't force their hands in making any of those choices for them. you're not responsible for any of them.

you become coworkers then, accomplices, your hands stained in blood to various extent, but now dipping in the same pool of blood as you strive towards the same goal together. you have each other's backs, learn each other's strengths and weaknesses, learn each other's personalities, likes and dislikes. you keep having to spend more time together as the missions keep coming your way.

inevitably, you come to care about them. even more damning, they come to care about you in return. enough so they'll look after your daughter even after what'll happen on top of that mountain. enough so they'll look after your granddaughter too, warmly and fondly enough she'll call one of them uncle.

you're still the only one who knows they'll stand together with you on top of that mountain, not knowing what'll happen on it like you do.

and you do care about them, you swear you do. really, you do.

(you care about them the same way your mother cared about you, and how she still raised you to have steel in you and be made of sharp edges you know how to use. you care about them the same way you care about your family, and how you still send them to their deaths as needed so the rest of your family you care about just the same can keep on living longer and safely. this is the only way you've had the chance to learn how to care and love.

duty and sacrifices have been one and the same for you for as long as you can remember. it doesn't matter at which point sacrifices came to mean love to you too.

and most of all, you love your daughter more than anything else in the world.)

imagine you're luce, and this is who you are. this is who you've been raised to be, the only way you've been given room to grow up to be. this is the life you've lived and the kind of life that has shaped you as the person you are now. this is what you've been taught and told is the best version of yourself you could have grown up to be. this is who you ended up being by what you've been taught and told are all the right choices to make.

you're still the only one who knows what is about to happen on top of that mountain. it hasn't happened yet. the fate of the world hangs on what'll happen on top of that mountain, the same world you'll have to give birth to your daughter in. the same daughter you're currently pregnant with.

now imagine you're luce, look me in the eye and tell me you'd know how to even form the thought of the possibility of there being any other choice to make. look me in the eye and tell me you wouldn't look at the only choice in front of you, and know deep in your bones it's the only right choice to make. that it is right of you to make it. because it simply has to be.

(imagine you're luce, and you're not doomed by the narrative. of course, you're not.

why would you need to be when the narrative has painstakingly shaped you all your life to become its perfect, faithful and dutiful sacrificial lamb?

and then, imagine you're luce, and you're even grateful for it, so, so very grateful it held up its end of the bargain too.

truly, you are.)