#watcher community

[witchpussy42069]

Ok this is genuinely not ok anymore, I understand people are upset but it is NEVER OKAY to bully and harass someone just bc u disagree with a decision they've made.

People have been flooding the comments of Ryan Bergara's wedding photos on Instagram with hate, booing both of them and telling him she's gonna leave him when he goes broke from his stupid business decision. ITS FINE TO NOT LIKE WATCHERTV. ITS FINE TO NOT SUBSCRIBE. but it's not ok to completely dehumanize, other, and harass them. I've seen people telling Shane and Ryan to kill themselves. That is Not Fucking Okay. They are STILL HUMAN BEINGS. NOT UNTOUCHABLE 1 PERCENTERS.

I know cyberbullying and harassment is normal these days but it's not fucking okay. Hate on them all you want, genuinely criticize their decision all you want, but don't go to all their socials and send them that hate. They're human beings with feelings, and you guys need to go touch some fucking grass.

[crowleys-right-eyeball]

i lied abt only posting abt this situation once, i just saw this lovely person’s comment!! passing it on to tumblr 🫡

edit: SOMEONEE changed the password and ruined it for everybody :/ pls try this version instead!!

edit 2: WATCHER POSTED AN UPDATE

[lady-raziel]

Not to talk about the watcher thing again as I’ve already kind of said my piece, but one of the most batshit insane parts of this whole unbelievable situation is that for some reason they decided that for some fucking reason the BEST time to announce this highly controversial decision was literally DAYS before they would be going on an international tour and having to face irate fans IN PERSON. Guys. What the hell. At least have the sensibility to announce a move that you HAD to have known would make people upset AFTER one of the few times you actually interact in person with your fanbase.

I hope you’re ready to investigate the Tower of London for ghosts, because I have a feeling the Londoners will be more than happy to acquaint you with the building later this week.

Insane move after insane move. Truly.

[hxnnibxi]

im sorry people calling watchers response "too late" are incredibly wrong. they took two days. the original announcement was posted on friday and then they posted their response to backlash the following monday. that's a perfectly normal respone time. they took the weekend to gauge the opinion of the fans, reformed their plan and then posted an update admitting fault. im not saying i think their response was good or bad but it was definitely quick.

[teenageexpertslimedream]

ITS IMPORTANT!!!

THE TIKTOK BAN IS SO MUCH MORE THAN BANNING TIKTOK, IT WOULD GIVE THEM THE ABILITY TO BAN ANY SOCIAL MEDIA SITE THATS BIG ENOUGH, INCLUDING TUMBLR!!!

IT'LL GET RID OF ANY PRIVACY YOU HAVE LEFT, AND STOP A LOT OF PROGRESSIVE MOVEMENT IN ITS TRACKS. IT WILL EVEN TAKE YOUR RIGHT TO TALK ABOUT IT AWAY. IT WILL COMPLETELY VIOLATE YOUR FREEDOM OF SPEECH. IF YOU CARE ABOUT PRIVACY, PALESTINE, TUMBLR, THE INTERNET, FOR THE LOVE OF FUCK, PLEASE CALL IN AND SPREAD THIS!!!

[noodlesarecheese]

So Watcher is launching a Dropout (it's not called Dropout but they're clearly using the same template format platform thing idk what it's called, and the same pricing structure), and the reaction so far has been wildly different than what I remember from Dropout's launch. I was curious about why that was or if I was just misremembering the Dropout launch, so I went back to the Dropout launch video to compare them and I think I can see where some of the difference is coming from.

If you want to make the comparison yourself: Watcher's Video, Dropout's Video.

I wanna clarify first though that this isn't a knock against Watcher or the fans who are reacting one way or another or anything like that, I genuinely am just fascinated with how different the reactions are to what seems to be the same business decision. This also isn't a 'wow watcher sucks and dropout is so much better' I'm just using them for comparison because they did the same thing with different results. ALSO this isn't about the business decision itself, just the presentation! Disclaimers out of the way, here's the analysis.

Title and Thumbnail So the Watcher.tv announcement video is titled "Goodbye Youtube" and the thumbnail is Ryan, Shane, and Steven sitting on a couch looking serious, with a dark background. That really makes it seem like they're quitting (which, ok, they are quitting youtube but not quitting quitting). Viewers are already primed to be upset, and it's easier to go from upset to angry than upset to excited, curious, or neutral.

Compare to the dropout announcement video: "How the Internet is Ruining Comedy" - inline with other collegehumor video titles, might make you curious. Thumbnail - Big News! with Sam smiling and a bright background. We know its big news, but he looks happy, and the exclamation point let's us know they want us to be excited. Viewers are primed to be curious and excited.

Tone The Watcher announcement has 2 main tones. The first half is very sentimental, almost sad or wistful at times, and while there are parts that veer into pride at achievements, it's mostly bittersweet and sentimental. The second half is a bit more uplifting, but still quite serious. It reminded me of a tech announcement, like when they introduce the new iphone or something like that. Very professional, sleek, and serious, which isn't automatically a bad thing! But I do think that's not the vibe a decently-sized chunk of the audience expected or wanted. Many people watch Watcher for the cast's dynamic with each other, humor, and the more relaxed/conversational/friendly feel that most of the series have.

Compare to dropout - excited and comedic tone. Still professional, but also fits the expectations of the viewers. People watch collegehumor for the humor (it was in the name, after all). They also poke a bit of fun at themselves, which lightens the mood, shows self-awareness, and alleviates some of the bad feelings about paywalling.

Focus The Watcher announcement focuses a lot on the creative journey of the cast and company, as well as how this move will benefit them. Which isn't a bad thing, that's actually quite interesting! The problem here, I think, is actually more about what isn't here - a solid explanation of how this will also benefit the viewers and why the viewers should be excited. There's a brief description of one new show, and the promise that existing shows will get an upgrade, but we weren't given many specific details about how they'll be improved, and there's only one new show to tempt us into subscribing. Some people will be excited for that, some people won't, and some people will be excited but not enough to subscribe. Having 2 or 3 series (even if it's 1 fleshed out plus a few teasers of what's in production or what is being planned) plus some more details about how existing shows will be improved would've helped. Without that, it really does seem like it'll just be the same stuff viewers were getting for free, but now paywalled, rather than new and exciting stuff. That makes a big difference. I think with the fans not getting as much focus, this also led to some (accidental, I hope) hurt feelings. Based on what I've seen from fan reactions, all the talk about hitting the peak of what they can do on youtube and wanting more, translated for many people to 'youtube isn't enough' which became 'you (the current viewers) aren't enough.' Which I don't think was their intent! But I also don't think fans are wrong for feeling hurt by that.

Compare to dropout: They clearly explain how the move will benefit fans, and reassure viewers that existing content will stay where it is, and only new content will be behind the paywall. (Watcher clarified this too, but in a comment. It's not in the video itself, which is a huge problem.) They include clips of several new (at the time) series that would be premiering on dropout, including things that specifically could not be made on youtube (due to weed, violence, and sexual humor), so the reason for the shift is clear to the audience.

Advertisers Both videos contain the sentiment that being monetarily successful on youtube means working to appease the advertisers, and that over time what the advertisers want and what the creators want drifts further and further apart, putting strain on the creators.

However, I think the message gets lost a bit in the Watcher vid. Instead, it leaves viewers with the idea that the main problem is just ads are annoying instead of advertisers putting constraints on content. I'm not even sure what the specific constraints are for watcher, because they didn't give any examples. And the focus on ads being annoying leaves viewers frustrated because people typically either don't mind ads or they already have an ad blocker.

Timing and Size Okay, this isn't exactly about presentation, but it is still a factor that impacts perception so I'm tackling it. And I'm actually going to do dropout first. CollegeHumor launched dropout in September 2018. Pre-pandemic, but also pre-Sam Reich as CEO. The company was still owned by IAC. It was a Company, and while it wasn't huge it wasn't tiny either. So launching dropout was a Company Decision, a Business Strategy. Some people were upset about, but it wasn't a personal betrayal (generally, anyways). If I remember correctly, this was also not a high point for the company. They kinda needed dropout to do well to keep things running smoothly (which is why they shut it down and sold it to Sam just 1 1/2ish years later), so the sudden shift made sense.

Watcher Entertainment is a company, but it doesn't feel like one. Ryan, Shane, and Steven own and operate things, but they're also the faces, and they're youtubers. Which makes every business decision they make feel more personal to viewers, especially those who have been watching for a long time. They've also seemingly been doing well on youtube, which makes it more difficult for viewers to understand why the sudden change is happening now. They do talk a bit about it, about the company expanding and wanting to do things that advertisers don't like (which I've already covered). However, mostly the choice to start a streaming platform is framed as 'the next big step' without much clarification on why it's the next big step. Plus, it's post-pandemic, and a lot of people are still struggling financially with the ripple effects of that. Yes, $6 isn't a wild amount of money, but there have been some months where $5 absolutely meant the difference between paying all my bills or not, and I know I'm not the only one. This, coupled with a lack of clarity about why exactly they're doing this, leads to fans feeling hurt, betrayed, bitter, and frustrated.

Now, presentation and framing isn't everything. No matter how perfect your announcement is, some people are still going to be upset. It's a big change, of course people will be upset! But I do think a more careful presentation would've alleviated some of the hurt and anger that fans are feeling. While I do think a lot of the reaction we're seeing is due to the decision, I think (based on what I've seen) that some of it is also based on the poor communication in the video itself, and that could've been avoided!

So I'm gonna get a little speculative and describe what I would've done. In this hypothetical, they've decided to launch the streaming service and brought me on just for the announcement.

Firstly, switch the title out. If they're married to Goodbye Youtube then add a (and hello...?) after so it's at least obvious they aren't fully quitting. The dark color scheme of the thumbnail fits their regular vibe, but they want everyone to be excited so they should look excited. Next, let's lighten the tone up. Being proud of what they've done so far is great, but we don't need the sentimental music and bittersweetness. Remember, the goal is to get viewers excited about what come's next - so let's focus on what actually comes next! Talk about specific show plans and mention why they wouldn't work on youtube. Then, take some time to reassure the fans. Predict a few likely worries and address them in the video. Acknowledge that it's a big change, that it will take time to get used to, and that not everyone will be onboard, and let the fans know that it's ok if they aren't onboard.

Like I said, this wouldn't fix everything. There are a few differences in between dropout and watcher that don't have anything to do with presentation. Dropout launched with primarily new shows rather than new seasons of existing shows, and they continued uploading to youtube relatively regularly in addition to the content behind the paywall, which I do think went a long way to keeping fans happy. At this point it's unclear if watcher will do either of those or not. But, while I don't think it would fix everything, I do think improved communication in the announcement would've helped.

[quintin]

John and Hank Green created one of the longest enduring internet communities and still create killer content while giving their profits to charity but the Watcher boys are willing to fence off their community and only allow in the ones that can afford to contribute to them directly. that’s some bullshit

[liminalweirdo]

and another thing re watcher. lots of people saying "we don't need the high production value, we liked the blue and yellow text on the screen." like SAME! old unsolved had a charm and specialness to it that was unmatched!

but hasn't it occured to you that maybe the boys want to make stuff with higher production value? that these guys who love editing and collaborative creation and film?? might want to make stuff with higher production value to challenge themselves and see what they're capable of nearly 10 years on?

i just. what if it has nothing to do with you? we can't tell people to create/write/draw for themselves and then shit on them when they uh... do that. we can't say "pay artists" and then backpedal and say "i didn't mean I had to pay. I meant everyone else should."

why would you tell someone not to strive for their bigger goals if you have their best interests at heart?

[toomanywatchers]

here to spread the gospel

[jamiethebee]

Danny Fenton in Gotham is fun and all, but consider Penelope Spectra as Bruce Wayne's new therapist. She'd be thriving. Also consider that as Bruce gets worse, Batman gets more violent. Spectra puts 2 and 2 together (she already has experience with Fenton/Phantom) and gets a stronger hold on Bruce's misery as a result. Bruce's kids watch on helpless to do anything. Which leaves Alfred to step in and get some *interpersonal/hands on development with Bruce.

[witchpussy42069]

Don't make me tap the sign fellow watcher fans

[cherry-waves66]

everyone who absolutely fucking VILIFIED and demonized Steven Lim, and reacted to Ryan (and Steven) with such visceral racism don’t deserve to watch their new content btw 🥰🥰🥰

[cryptidjeepers]

My youtube is absolutely flooded with these cold ass take drama clickbait its fucking insane. Their apology (from what i saw) was well received. The entire situation wasnt even that big of a deal after things got sorted. Why are these wannabe drama channels so obsessed with such a nothing issue. "Wild apology"???? They gave REFUNDS and free access to patreon supporters. They agreed they fucked up??? And changed their plan accordingly. They still have things to fix but jesus christ move on already 😭😭😭 just saying, there are literal youtubers that were accused of grooming that got treated better by the drama new cycle than a youtube channel that just wanted more income. Im so tired of hearing about it now

[littlekingbergara]

was just thinking about how amazing it is that weird wonderful world and ghost files exist at the same time from the same company. you have the same minds, the same hosts, the same team and yet the shows are like day and night. www reminds us of the wonder and whimsy and joy all around us while ghost files showcases the world's darker side in its tragedies and horrors. and that they're able to execute both shows each with its own finely-tuned aesthetic and its own little universe is really a beautiful display of how much Talent and Love exists at watcher and it's so so special.

[watcherwatts]

i love us. i love that we still make silly unsolved references. i love how much we love them. i love how much we appreciate every member of watcher, not just shane, ryan, and steven. i love how excited we all get. i love how we love each other. i love how no matter who you are, this community is a safe place. i love how accepting we are. i love you community artists. i love you no matter what kind of art you make. i love our creativity. i love you shitposters. i love you casual fans. i love you watcher fandom. i love you.

[theghoulboysblog]

I wonder if he has emotional motion sickness.