#I JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT BECAUSE I REALLY DO LOVE BUDDIE BUT THE FANDOM DRIVES ME CRAZY

[bucksdaffy]

okay, so i've seen some people claim that tim minear is an avid buddie shipper and that he's slowly but surely laying the groundwork for buck and eddie to become canon in the future and...

i'm just thoroughly confused about this assertion.

i'll preface this by saying i'm very new to the fandom, so i'm prepared to be wrong about this. i'm aware i may lack crucial context because i've been here only so long. also, i don't know tim personally, so i obviously can't speak to his true intentions, but i'll make my case anyway.

i'll cite two RECENT comments by tim that i assume people might draw this conclusion from:

1. [?: There is a sect of the fandom that just wants 9-1-1 to be the Buck and Eddie show, and any cut that removes a second of them is going to get the same reaction. Nothing short of renaming the show "Christopher's Two Dads" is going to make them happy.] T: I totally get that. I even appreciate it. Which explains the entire first act of last night's episode. I kind of did for the Buck/Eddie fans (I mean I really do it for myself in the end). I just thought... they'd like it? Shrug. I liked it, so whatever.

2. Minear tells Rolling Stone that he hasn’t just been aware of fan reactions, he’s actually changed storylines in the past to avoid being accused of queerbaiting. But rather than help, he says it made the show worse. “Nobody wants to be accused of queerbaiting so I kind of stopped writing those characters together. And I think it hurt the show because I was so afraid to be accused of something that I wasn’t going where I would naturally go with the stories,” Minear says. “I just decided that I just have to write the thing that I think is right. I just have to be honest with the story I’m telling and let the chips fall where they may.”

now, i may be biased, but this doesn't read to me like he plans on buddie endgame at all.

while it's clear he loves the bond between buck and eddie and enjoys highlighting it in the show, saying he totally wants them to end up together feels like a reach.

he discusses being accused of queerbaiting in the past, which led him to backtrack a little and stop writing buck and eddie together. how does this suggest he did it because he wants buddie to become canon? if that were his intention he could have continued to drop more (apparent!) hints that buck and eddie may love each other in a non-platonic way. he wouldn't care about the accusations of queerbaiting so much, because he would be planning to make them canon all along. sure, there are external constraints that could prevent this from ever materializing, but that doesn't mean he couldn't write the dialogue in a clearly ambiguous way so that once he gets a pass and everyone else involved is on board with it, he could confirm that "yeah, you were right; it was a good ol' friends-to-lovers slow burn trope all along. congrats!!" no. instead he backtracked because he didn't want anyone to think he was writing buddie as anything other than a platonic relationship. that's it. but he eventually realized it doesn't really matter because people are going to think what they want to think regardless. and he obviously loves buck and eddie's friendship so he might as well just make the most out of it at this point. and if he ever feels like maybe it is a good time to turn their friendship into something more because it feels right for story, he'll go for it. but if not, he won't.

i see a lot of people claim buddie is a six-season-long slow burn, being carefully crafted right now for future canonization. and they say tim basically confirmed this. but i really can't see his comments being a confirmation of the sort.

if there are any quotes i'm missing that suggest otherwise, i would love to go through them. so if anyone's aware of any, please don't hesitate to hit me up.

but at the moment i believe y'all are just setting yourselves up for disappointment.

[i-mean-yeah-whatever]

re: the thing you were saying about people needing to stop interpreting tommy’s actions through the lens of a 22-year-old’s (for example) life experience —

i saw someone (in the last week or so) i ironically refer to what buck and tommy were in as a ‘situationship’ and i genuinely wanted to scream. no. at no point was that ever what they were.

lmao what? How? When? I mean, they can read this relationship the way they want but at this point it's really inventing something just for the sake of making it look bad. Because we know that saying they're in a situationship means it's not serious, meaning it's a trash relationship when Buck could have a beautiful teehee-butterfly-roses relationship with Eddie. But this is not where the canon is at.

When I started the show, I had a hard time with Buck's character because he's very much the opposite of me: hypersexual, very cishet, young and carefree, very extroverted. It's usually the kind of characters I "don't like" because there's nothing there for me to relate. But that was just a first impression and I didn't stop at that. There's more to him. He's kind, dedicated to the people he loves, brave (though reckless) and so much more. So I gave him a chance and I was sold quite quickly. And even if I didn't like him at first, it wasn't a reason for me to bash him and post about how "Buck is a player, he's trash". Now, I really love him, especially after following him across seasons and how he became so much more mature. It's a very nice character development.

And for Tommy, it should be the same. You can not like him but don't invent him an evil agenda just for the sake of using him to validate your ship. Because we all know the hate take its roots in this ridiculous ship war. If people think being considerate while advocating for yourself is being sus, a red flag, or using Buck... I don't know what to say. The relationships in those people's lives must suck big time. Tommy has only been shown being nice and supportive, while advocating for his own peace.

As I said before, being a new watcher, I followed all the storylines in a very short amount of time, after binge-watching everything over 2 weeks. And I never saw Buddie, not seriously at least, even as a shipper. The only moments I had some doubt were when Buck was being cheeky and kind of flirty with Eddie. But I didn't see anything past this. But in my culture, being "flirty" is very common, and it's even a source of confusion for more conservative cultures like the USAmerican culture, so men being "flirty" (though it's actually a very relaxed way to show friendship and complicity) while being platonic friends is not uncommon at all for me, especially among millenials.

In the end, the most unfortunate in all this is how a kind character is used to create such a mess. I really understand being disappointed by this new character if you're a Buddie shipper, I really do. But the hate that it created, and especially the hate against actual people in real life??? It's time to be better. In 2024, when we know people kill themselves because of bullying, when we know how some people can be really affected by harassment, this kind of behavior is unacceptable. There's room for everyone in every fandom, whoever you ship together, whoever you hate. There's room for all of us to coexist peacefully.

[scattered-winter]

AAAAA i did forget to say that i love my own tag!! i do love to be qpr anon 😭 and i enjoyed it sm to read your thoughts on the points i sent you, i can only give back a *strongly agree* for everything you said, it's like you took my brain and wrote your reply while using it 😂😂 did not expect my opinions to be received that well, i tried to go for admitting the hard stuff because that is usually more fun, so i hope it's okay if i bounce off more ideas based on your reply!! ♥

firstly...... HELL YES join the bucktalia train with me, the finale really made me love them a lot, and i hope we will see much more of them in s7! i have more thoughts on them specifically but i'll stick to the og numbering so it's easier to follow 😂 (this feels lowkey like school, i am so sorry LMAO)

1.) i totally get that the donor storyline squicked you! i was very worried about buck not being able to move on from the baby, with him buying that firefighter-like baby onesie and all... but WOW his maturity? that he helped them simply "because he could"? buck is just such a good person, i think we were shown again just how much he is willing to do to help others and how his help is unconditional as well 😭😭 it melted my whole heart. the callback to buck's wish to be loved by his parents unconditionally... how he called himself "defective" but called his own son "perfect"... just. wow. WOW. the fact alone that he helped during the birth of his own biological child, and he was so confident while doing so!! a masterpiece. i need fics with delivery nurse AU for buck ♥♥♥

2.) jjjjjjooooooooin the bucktalia train 😂😂 no jk no pressure ofc! but but but, i just really like natalia, and how they did things with the little time they had left this season! the couch stood for buck's agency and his peace with himself – he knows who he is, he knows he cannot force anyone to stay in his life if they do not fully accept him or fit his own values (abby, taylor), he knows that his partner must understand and accept his type of lifestyle and the risks related to it (ali), he knows that he won't be happy by living somebody else's version of a good life (i.e., having somebody else's couch instead of his own, which goes for abby, ali, and taylor). and just!!!! buck slowly learning that he is lovable the way he is and that he would rather be alone than settle for somebody who does not love all of him!!!!! it's so important to me. and i do not understand why everyone is saying he regressed! 😭😭 where?!? with every relationship and new experience, buck is learning a lil bit more about himself and his worth imo. it does not have to be linear, and sometimes it's babysteps instead of big jumps, but that's how development works. real humans do not just snap with their fingers and unlearn all their maladaptive behaviors and coping mechanisms either. give buck time ffs @ the fandom!!

2.1.) i am drinking the hot tea that you just served me, bestie. sip sip sip, you are so correct about everything re the buddie agenda and hivemind!! it's crazy to me because i genuinely feel like they almost gaslight themselves and everybody else with what they do?!?! even scenes that are unrelated to buddie are *used* for buddie purposes (e.g. the scene with chim and his dad, about biological fathers), and it's so damn frustrating to me because the facts get twisted and twisted and twisted 😭 like NO!! these scenes weren't even about buddie!!! or worse, they twist everything around to make canon love interests look like the devil when they are often more innocent than buck and eddie themselves (let's not act as if these two are unfailing gentlemen who always treat their women right, c'mon now). and then the fandom gets excited because they come up with some new elaborate theory again, and then they genuinely expect buddie to become canon every single episode. and are disappointed and angry when they aren't. buddie has much bigger problems than that when in 6 veeery long seasons, there was not a single hint dropped that buck or eddie are attracted to men even thought they had plenty of opportunity to do so fjsdfkdshk;; the fun time with headcanons and theories has ended like 3 seasons ago because of the buddie fandom taking over everything... just, ugh.

3.) i could not have said it better. not adding any comment, you spilled the truth.

4.) YES AAAAAA god i can't, i am full of emotions for bucktalia. and yes, she did help deliver the baby in the sense that she got utensils for buck to deliver it, and she also dabbed kameron's forehead with a wet towel etc!! 😭♥ especially the fact that natalia is a death doula has me sooo intrigued. people who work in such a field just have a completely different relation to death, and with grief, and with life (she called herself an "end-of-life doula", which i need everybody to know and think about – how she emphasized the life, not the death)!!! buck's job, his past death, his coma experience, daniel?!? he experienced death himself, he experienced those of others that he tried to save... i just think, in athena's words, maybe natalia is finally the "specific kind of crazy" that can fully accept what buck's lifestyle truly means. because natalia herself has been there to help those that are at the end of their lives – and so has buck. idk idk idk, their professions are different but also so alike! 😭😭

related to that, i LOVED that she wanted to talk to buck about his death experience! there, i said it, and i hate the fandom for twisting it into smth ugly. BUCK was the one joking about his own death, and natalia responded accordingly. it's literally her profession to deal with death, and to accompany people who will die soon on this last journey of their lives. humans have always been interested to know how death feels like, what comes after death... i find her passion 1000% understandable, and tbh? to think that maybe she was looking for an answer about all this, from somebody who was dead before but came back, so that she could be better at helping others?!?!?! i respect and love that idea. what do you think? ♥♥

5.) indeed!! "fandom illiteracy" is my new favorite word, it's so fitting, yes yes yes. and it's ALWAYS just when it's about buddie or a canon love interest that ""threatens"" buddie canonization (as if THAT is what threatens it lol. not the fact that we have yet to see either of them find men attractive?). also omg i originally called eddie an unreliable narrator in my ask but deleted that again bc i didn't wanna come off as too harsh 😂😂😂 and i must add, eddie did not even meet ana at a call! 😂 they met at christopher's school, and he had immediate chemistry with her, so much so that carla immediately side-eyed him for giving her hearteyes. what's that about *magic* and *chemistry* that eddie talked about again?? they reconnected thanks to a call, yes, but it was eddie's choice to ask for a date, and it was eddie who was burdened by past trauma that he had repressed for years, and it was eddie who was not ready for anything serious. ana said "it's your mess now" after he broke up with her in the most ineloquent way possible, after showing that ana was cleaning up his mess in the kitchen. i did not care much about eddieana overall but like... people put all the blame on ana, even for her calling eddie "edmundo", as if eddie is not an adult who can speak and advocate for himself. like, he is just A GUY. maybe the real issue was all his baggage that he hasn't dealt with yet, and not whether or not he met ana on a call. realistically, eddieana was doomed from the start no matter where they met because eddie was simply not ready for anything serious, emotionally and mentally. he would have also not been ready if it was buck, or marisol, or anyone else. that is OKAY. but i NEED the fandom to stop taking everything these characters say as gospel truth, as you fittingly called it. they are fictional, they are tools to tell a story, they are tools to create drama and evoke emotions! and for this, they often talk bullshit to learn a lesson later on. and well, we saw eddie dealing with his trauma finally, and moving forward at his own pace, and being happy to get a date with marisol!

6.) i agree with you on everything here YES. finale gave such great whump, i loved the action and the hurt and the dirty bloody looks and all!! hen wiping away buck's blood????????????? SCREAMING CRYING THROWING UP. i also agree that a bit more time for the recovery part would have been nice. then again, they also did not give us much of that when buck's leg was crushed or eddie was shot. the show often skips parts that would be very satisfactory imo lol. but i love good whump and hurt/comfort so maybe that's just me LOL.

share your fic ideas (ONLY if you feel comfortable doing so) and also i am incredibly sorry this got so long. i will now go hide under a blanket and fangirl about bucktalia dfdfgksdlk;

<33!!

for the sake of not repeating myself because we've both said stuff like this in the other post I'm just gonna say a blanket statement for all these and say HARD AGREE <33

HOWEVER i do want to individually touch on natalia because OUGH. I FORGOT SHE REFERRED TO HERSELF LIKE THAT. OUHG <33 I love that so fucking much.

also YEAH. justice for ana and taylor and ali and abby and natalia and every other character who was in proximity with buddie and suffered more than jesus for it

AND FOR FIC IDEAS i really. don't have a LOT of fully formed thoughts but idk. jee and maddie visiting chim in the hospital. buck (no broken ribs) driving eddie home and maybe staying over for a few days to help him out while he healed. athena + bobby being tender. hen + karen being tender. maybe all the hospitalized 118 get together in a single hospital room and plan a breakout. who can say <3 (this is only fic ideas to fit into the episode. however i have. uh. 50+ wips and aus for other things in this fandom. i have what you might call A Problem)

AND I'D LIKE TO ADD A LITTLE DISCLAIMER HERE. BECAUSE I'VE BEEN A HATER FOR THE PAST FEW DAYS BUT I NEED TO SET SOMETHING STRAIGHT. i LOVE buddie. i do. i love their tenderness, and their intimacy, and their friendship, and i love what they have, and i love what they could have. i love slowburns, and i love friends to lovers, and i love coparenting, and i genuinely love looking at them through a romantic lens because it sparks joy !! and i also love looking at them through a qpr lens because it sparks joy !! they spark joy in any capacity !!! my gripes with buddie are at the FANDOM LEVEL, not w the sillies onscreen. its because other characters and relationships are shoved out of the way, or twisted, or put down to prop buddie up, and its because its SO HARD to find meta, fic, or anything else in this fandom that focuses solely on any of the other incredible characters, pairings, or themes in this show because everything's always about You Know Who and You Know Who Else. I know I've been kinda spiteful toward them lately but I just wanna say that it's stemming from frustration of watching characters constantly be demonized/ignored/shoved aside so that Buddie Can Work(tm) as opposed to me actually hating the pairing. ty goodnight <3

[smilingbuckley]

So Oliver and Ryan can't even talk about Buddie's friendship and their views on it without being accused of 'shameless queerbaiting'.

I love Buddie to death, but leave them alone. Oliver didn't say shit for years because of fans accusing him of queerbaiting when he was just excited about how fans love the character and have their own theories. He's finally opening up again and boom, back are the people with 'this is shamelessy queerbaiting.'

Even if it were, which it really isn't because never did they say Buddie would get together, you think him being careful of his words is shameless? It seems more like he knows how toxic this fandom can be and he doesn't want to deal with people twisting his words like they always do.

And he's not a writer. He doesn't have control over it. So stop blaming the actors! Stop treating them like shit the second someone mentions Buddie

[madlori]

Ship dysphoria

Ok so a bit of time has gone by, and the 9-1-1 fandom is settling into a bit of an...existential crisis?

Because 90% of this fandom is built on Buddie. Buddie has always been the strongest driving force. We love our other blorbos, but it's Buddie that usually drives us feral.

Except...Buck/Tommy. OMG. It is WORKING for a lot of fans. (and JFC we cannot settle on a ship name. Tevan? Kinley? I'm gonna stick with Buck/Tommy)

A LOT of fans are having a "I'm a devoted Buddie shipper, why do I like this so much??" moment and it can almost feel like a betrayal, or that you're deserting the ship (the ship that, remember, Oliver told us to stay aboard).

And I think I can probably speak for everybody when I say that the last thing we want or need is a ship war in this fandom, something we haven't ever really had but which has torn other fandoms apart.

So I'm gonna put on my veteran-of-many-fandoms hat for a second and tell you a thing:

It's okay to ship Buck and Tommy. It's ok to do that and still ship Buddie. It's also okay to leave Buddie behind if it's not working for you anymore. It's okay to just tolerate Buck and Tommy and not really care about it, and stay focused on Buddie. You are allowed to ship however it works for you, and you are not limited to one and only one ship. If you decide you don't think Buddie will happen and you're going to cut your losses, that's okay, too. It is not a reflection on your character or something. You don't swear an oath of fealty to a ship.

We don't know how long Tommy will stick around, but Buck will still be bisexual. He may date another man. He may date a woman again. You can ship those things too.

But why is this ship hitting me so hard? I never thought I'd like Buck with another man! I'm so confused!

I get that. There are some reasons why that might be.

There is something very appealing about a ship that's canon. Some of you might never have had a canon queer ship, but the pull is strong. There's no guessing, no interpreting, no subtext-examining. It's there, it's real, you don't have to wonder if you're just overinterpreting things. Yes. Buck and Tommy kissed and are going on a date. Even if that's all it ever is, you'll never be accused of "seeing things that aren't there." Don't discount that.

Tommy, even in just 1.5 episodes, is a LOT more integrated into the firefam than any of Buck's previous girlfriends. Tim talked about not wanting him to be "siloed off" away from the main cast and that was exactly the problem with his prior girlfriends. Tommy is friends with Eddie. He knows Christopher and has hung out with him. He spent most of that loft conversation reassuring Buck that his place in Eddie's life was secure. He feels more like part of the gang than any other ones. That makes it easier to see him in Buck's life.

The mere fact of Buck's queer awakening is so monumental for so many of us that the character who helped him get there is going to naturally earn our affection immediately, and it's going to make you want that relationship to succeed, even if it's ulitmately not endgame for Buck. You want to see Buck have a good experience the first time out with a man. Of course you do.

And we just want to see Buck make out with a hot beefy firefighter. That is so valid of us.

Anyway. There is no need for a crisis. You can love Buddie with your whole heart and still be excited about this pairing, and want to see how it goes, and read fic about it. I may be writing a lil something myself.

You're good, fam.

[stevenrogered]

im still reeling from that episode but i wanted to talk about this part in oliver stark's tvline interview in particular

if you've been in the fandom for long enough, you would know that oliver used to be on twitter. and he was VERY active on it. he was really engaging with fans, he live tweeted the show sometimes, and it was great. but there was a small but very loud part of the internet (i wont call them buck/buddie fans bc as an actual buck/buddie fan, i do not claim them) who would harass him RELENTLESSLY because buddie wasn't canon/buck was never confirmed to be bi or gay.

and i mean relentlessly. to the point where he left/deleted twitter multiple times before leaving for good a couple of years ago. i remember him being SO EXCITED about buck begins only to get people mad- at HIM- for buck not coming out by the end of the episode.

of course he couldnt say anything, even if thats where the character was intended to go all along. the term queer baited gets thrown around so much and i've always been very vocal about the fact that i never thought 911 was doing that. sometimes you just have to wait and let something play out organically on its own.

but as happy as i am for buck, im equally happy for oliver that he now gets to exhale and let this out into the world and that hes getting so much love from this episode

[matan4il]

Buddie 614 meta

What I find to be the loudest about Eddie’s arc here is that the whole ep is meant to show us everything that can go wrong when people try to live up to others’ expectations, and how much better it is when people are looking in and figuring out what’s right for them, which means they’re performing for and as themselves. That’s the context for Eddie’s date and story. He needs to figure out how to want a romantic relationship again without feeling like it’s a task he’s performing just to please others. That’s the place he gets to at the end of the ep, which is a good place for him to be. ~~

And this is essential to Eddie. Based on how little people talk about it, maybe many in fandom aren’t aware of how 911 implied back in 217 that he only married Shannon because she got pregnant. Eddie said explicitly he didn’t think he was ready to get married at the time, and he brought this up in the context of Shannon and him having Christopher. So I think it’s very meaningful that here, when his aunt wants to set him up, he jumps straight to the (wrong) conclusion that he’s expected to marry Vanessa. He was under this pressure to perform for others before, he knows how disastrous it can turn out, and you know what? Trauma totally triggers this kind of reaction. It tells us where he’s at emotionally, that there are still things he has to deal with. ~~

Speaking of trauma, another symptom of it can be denial, and we do see a bit of it from Eddie during this ep. Remember how he claimed he doesn’t panic back in 501? Right to a doctor’s face while she’s diagnosing him with panic attacks? He did it again in this ep. The thing is that healing isn’t linear. He was advancing with some things, but in 614, faced with his aunt’s ambush, he feels cornered back into a place he’s been in before, a place that left its scars on him, and Eddie regresses. Which is okay! But that’s one step back in order to take two steps forward. Before the ep ends, he will figure out that it’s better not closing himself off completely to the idea of getting into another relationship, even if Tia Pepa’s surprise blind dates are not the way to go about it. ~~

As a side note, I loved Bobby basically trying to trick his subordinates into giving him a review, and poor Buck stepping right into that one. I saw it coming and I almost choked laughing. This show is damn brilliant with comedy, too. We don’t give it enough credit for that! But it's also a moment when I was really proud of Buck. If Eddie's panic caused him to take a step back, we got to see his husband, who grew up so unloved that he needs every bit of approval he can get, being mature and able to point it out when Bobby was over-praising him in his evaluation. And you know what's more? Bobby knew it would go like this. He has seen Buck's growth and he knew his surrogate son would do the right thing and correct this. Bobby's set up wouldn't have worked otherwise. Excuse me while I get emotional over this. ~~

Fitting for an ep where 911 flexed its comical muscles, it was embarrassing how hard I laughed at Buck’s reaction to Eddie’s romantic woes. Remember when Buck heavily implied how hurtful it was to be ghosted by Abby, saying in 502 that he had been in Ana’s position, of being unwanted and led on instead of getting a clean break up? Well, look at how quick Buck was to suggest ghosting as a viable option for Eddie this time! It’s almost like Buck doesn’t even notice that he will offer whatever it takes to keep his husband away from these potential Love Interests, even if it contradicts stuff he has said in the past himself. The way Buck could be so calm making this suggestion, and take the “threat” in stride, because duh, he knows his husband wouldn’t want these LIs intruding on their marriage and family either, and it’s absolutely legit to just ghost this girl if she doesn’t get the memo, was hilarious. And honestly, who can blame Buck? He’s defending his hot man. ;p ~~

Which brings me to my weekly gif set, that I dedicated this time to Buck pointing out on Eddie’s failure to let Ana down easy. I mean, it already IS canon that these two talk about everything, it IS canon that Buck is someone who gets to hear all about Eddie’s romantic woes. But this proves that Eddie doesn’t just fill him in using broad strokes, stuff like just letting Buck know that he indeed broke up with Ana. No, they get down to the finer resolution as well, and Buck gets to hear every detail about how Eddie did it with the delicacy of a bull in a china shop. And clearly, Buck wasn’t about respecting either Ana or Eddie’s pain during that break up, at least not enough to stop Buck from teasing his husband about it. XD It’s so funny how naturally Buck’s staking his claim on his husband even while they’re discussing going on dates. I see you, Buck, and am totally with you! ~~

One last “made me laugh” point. I’m tempted to snicker about Pepa telling Eddie he should be shopping for antiques. I’m queer, so please excuse my dumb queer humor, but ummm. That’s not a very straight suggestion for your nephew, Tia. Or maybe that’s deliberate, maybe it’s implied she is trying to set up Eddie with anyone, girls or guys? After all, she did use gender neutral language during this ep... So we can’t know for sure, but something tells me Pepa just wants Eddie to officially have someone, and if she learns that Buck actually IS her nephew’s other half? (I can’t call either of these morons ‘better half’, sorry) Then she’d be the first one to throw them a party! And I love that, and I love her. Because after all, she’s not just a sassy queen, she’s not just incredibly loving and caring with her nephew, she was also willing to sacrifice her own image in his eyes, she was willing to be seen as herself, and not as what he expects, in order to help remind him that even if his first marriage failed miserably, he can find the courage, move on and re-commit himself to someone else. And soon maybe Eddie will realize and Pepa will find out who is that someone else that Eddie can have a beautiful committed r/s with...

~~ (my weekly meta posts) (my Buddie gifs) (all of my content)

~~ My tag list will follow in the reblog, please let me know  if you wanna be added/removed here.

~~ Thank you so much for reading and for any reblog, like, comment or supportive tag! I really couldn't keep doing these without knowing people want to see them. Also, my eternal gratitude as always to @whosoldherout​. I'm always in awe of your giffing!

[kcrabb88]

Quinlan Vos and Obi-Wan Kenobi Are Not Normal About Each Other (A Thesis Statement)

Fandom: Quinlan and Obi-Wan have had sex, but it’s a reach to think they could be in love and/or care deeply about each other in some manner, it was just physical (this is not me saying I don't think they have sex I HELLA do and I've written a lot of smut to prove it, but I've seen wayyyy too many posts that basically say they can only be romantic as Padawans and NEVER as adults and/or were just fooling around as teens and didn't have deep feelings in some way whether they're FWB or romantic partners or whatever you like)

Me: *unrolls my scroll* I'm here to make a POINT as an addendum to this post I made recently.

Look at these little darlings! They just met and Quin's already trusting Obi-Wan, and Obi-Wan WANTS Quin to trust him. In another panel from this same comic, Quin helps Obi-Wan with his anxiety and it's very sweet.

Quin's been struggling with the dark side while undercover, and everyone thinks he's really truly fallen and can't be brought back except for Aayla, Tholme, and, YOU GUESSED IT! Obi-Wan. He goes looking for Quinlan on his own and finds him and they chat. Plus, look at this flashback of these little nerds flirting. Quin literally falls into the river and almost dies trying to flirt with Obi-Wan.

What do I even say about this panel??? Look at them!! Look at Quin trusting Obi-Wan with the dark parts of himself and Obi-Wan believing in him? Look at that hand clasp? Like shut up I can't take it.

Obi-Wan refusing to leave Quinlan behind and Quinlan, stubborn Quinlan, listening to him.

Their banter here shows how well they know and play off each other and that joke in the last panel SENDS ME.

This is from the new comic that came out in September, and this is just ONE instance of several of Quinlan mentioning Obi-Wan, who only appears in this comic via a psychometric vision, but Quin keeps bringing him up anyways.

I mean this is. THIS is what made me WANT to know more about Quinlan in the first place! It's not in this gif, but the way Obi-Wan smiles in this scene? The way his eyes light UP? That's love, babey.

I could literally paste so much stuff from Dark Disciple, which to me has always been a QuinObi book in addition to Vostress. Quinlan has fallen (pretty much without understanding he has because he so badly wants to uncover Sidious) and missing his check-ins with Obi-Wan, but Obi-Wan keeps going back to their bar over and over again and he's been waiting for like, two hours at this point when Ventress comes in.

"Not him." Okay, buddy. Okay. Obi-Wan has like three panic attacks and outright defies his fellow council members at various points through this book because he believes so hard in Quinlan. He is INSISTENT that Quinlan can be brought back to the light.

These two pages made me SOB.

"She saved Quinlan" in italics. Not just his life, but his spirit. Those italics speak for themselves. And "Vos knew he could never repay Kenobi for that, but he has the rest of his life to try." Do ya, Quin? The rest of your life, huh?

Anyhow, truly, this is just me scratching the surface as I was limited by only being able to use 10 photos in a post. I’m leaving out sooo many other examples. You don't have to ship them! But these guys care a lot about each other and saying that it's just, impossible for them to have romantic feelings on posts or fics where the creator is, indeed, shipping them is ... weird. So is trying to overlay other ships onto specifically QuinObi content.

This has been a PSA.

[lemotmo]

I need to say something...

I've seen quite a few Buddie fans confused and ashamed on my dash lately. Mostly because they feel guilty for not liking Tommy or the bucktommy storyline for various reasons. Some of them even feel anxiety about how the storyline will proceed and resolve. I responded to one of those posts earlier and I'm going to post my response here again for everyone who needs to hear it:

Never feel bad about not liking a character or a storyline. This is fandom and in my opinion all takes are valid. Take it from someone who has been in various fandoms for 24 years now. (Yes, I am that old ;)

If it will make you feel a little better: I don't particularly like Tommy that much either. I mean, I don't hate him but I feel pretty neutral about him. I can superficially see that he is a good guy that likes Buck. And I love him for making Buck feel good and helping him out of the closet. Let it be known that I'm a big fan of bi Buck and I'm so happy that 911 went there with him.

But personally I'm pretty 'meh' about Tommy and when he leaves in a couple of episodes I'll be okay with that. I've also seen some people that have fallen in love with him and want to keep him around. All these takes are valid and more than okay. As long as you respect other people's opinions and thoughts about a character it's all okay. Don't go out of your way to hate-post about him, because you aren't a 14-year old and it's just really distasteful. But, you also can't force yourself to like a character if the feeling is not there.

The same goes for a storyline. I'm okay with the bucktommy storyline at this moment, but I do want it to be temporary, because I want Buddie in the future. And yes, if bucktommy were here to stay, I would be very disappointed in that storyline. I haven't been watching, waiting and hoping for Buddie for 6 years to end up with both guys in another relationship.

And again, that is a valid take and those are valid emotions. It's all okay as long as you are respectful towards the people that do love Buck and Tommy together.

I cope with it by curating my fandom experience. I block haters (whether they hate on Buddie or Bucktommy), avoid bucktommy fanfiction and stay away from the bucktommy tag on Tumblr.

I don't avoid posts on my dash or in the Buddie or spoiler tag that are also tagged bucktommy. I read them, like or respond to some of them. Sometimes I even reblog them if they are interesting and have a link to Eddie or Buddie.

Lastly, don't give up on Buddie yet. I have a feeling things might get interesting the next couple of episodes. Only time will tell if I'm right about this.

[alittlebitofloveliness]

In defence of Steve Randle

Listen guys, Steve Randle gets a lot of hate in this fandom and as much as it pains me, it's valid. Everyone has their own interpretation of the source material, and fandom is supposed to be fun, so it is absolutely valid and ok to hate or love any character you want. You can hate Steve for many reasons or for no reason at all! This is fandom! That's ok! The story is for you interpret and love and play with and hate on to your hearts content. HOWEVER, to say that Steve Randle isn't an important character to the novel is simply not true, and to say that he hates Ponyboy requires ignoring or downplaying some pretty key moments of the book. This is especially true for those of you who love Dally but hate Steve, because Steve gets a lot of hate for being kind of a dickhead (which lbr, a lot of seventeen years old are, especially to their friend's little siblings) while Dally gets less for doing a lot worse (harassing Cherry, jumping kids, etc). This isn't to say that either character is better- they're both great, nuanced characters who have done bad things, but the fandoms attitudes towards them when they share a lot of characteristics is really telling. Even Ponyboy's narration about them is pretty similar- Pony doesn't particularly like Steve, and he was canonically scared of Dally, but they're both members of his gang and he doesn't hate either of them. You don't have to like Steve as a character, just like you don't have to like Dally or Darry or Tim Shepard or even Ponyboy, but he is important- and he doesn't hate Ponyboy, nor does Ponyboy hate him.

A really important moment in the book is when Ponyboy and Johnny defend Dally after he harasses Cherry and Marcia.

"Dally's okay," Johnny said defensively, and I nodded. You take up for your buddies, no matter what they do. When you're a gang, you stick up for the members. If you don't stickup for them, stick together, make like brothers, it isn't a gang any more. It's a pack. A snarling, distrustful, bickering pack like the Socs in their social clubs or the street gangs in New York or the wolves in the timber."

This line here is super important. Pony and Johnny were willing to defend Dally after he sexually harrassed Cherry and Marcia- soc girls who they clearly liked and were intimidated by- in the name of being a good friend, because that is what's important to them and their gang. If they're willing to do it in this context for Dally, you'd best believe they'd do the same for Steve, and him for them. Steve can and will rag on Ponyboy within the gang, but he'd never dream of bad mouthing him to anyone else. Dependability is important to the gang, and Steve would never publicly shit talk Pony, and vice verca. Regardless of their squabbles within the gang, at the end of the day they've got each others backs. They're buddies. We see evidence of this at the end of the book, when Pony grabs the bottle and threatens the socs with it.

"You really would have used that bottle, wouldn't you?" Two-Bit had been watching from the storedoorway. "Steve and me were backing you, but I guess we didn't need to. You'd have really cut them up, huh?"

The important thing here is that along with Two-bit, Steve was backing Ponyboy, no questions asked. Sure most of it boils down to Pony being a member of the gang and that deep rooted loyalty to one another, but the context for this scene is that Ponyboy was sitting on Steve's car waiting for Steve and Two to stop flirting with some girls. The three of them were hanging out- without Darry, without Sodapop. It's their school lunch break. We know Ponyboy has middle class friend's at school, or that he could've spent time in the school library. It was a deliberate choice to hang out with Two and Steve. He wasn't forced into it. Canonically, Steve and Ponyboy hang out. Never alone, but they're decent enough friends to hang out together in a group. Doesn't everyone have friends like that? I do. This isn't the only textual instance either where they hang out without the entire gang being present. Early on, Pony offhandedly mentions that sometimes Steve and Soda will buy him pop and teach him about cars if he hangs around the DX.

"I had walked down to the DX station to get a bottle of pop and to see Steve and Soda, because they'll always buy me a couple of bottles and let me help work on the cars."

He could've just said Soda's name here but he didn't. Steve buys Pony pepsi and teaches him about cars, even though he gets annoyed with him when Soda invites him to hang around with them too often. And honestly, who wouldn't? I'd be annoyed if my best friend always invited her little brother along with us, even if I liked the kid. Wouldn't you?

Now, we do need to address the elephant in the room. I'm talking of course, about this quote;

"I'd never tell Soda, because he really likes Steve a lot, but sometimes I can't stand Steve Randle. I mean it. Sometimes I hate him."

I feel like very often people forget the context this quote comes from, and so it's magnitude is blown way out of proportion. Ponyboy has just been jumped and then immediately scolded by his brother who constantly makes him feel foolish and unwanted. He's already scared, embarassed, and defensive and then Steve goes and makes him feel even more unwanted. Of course he wants to lash out. Of COURSE he feels like he hates Steve in that moment. I did even reading it. But Ponyboy doesn't truly hate Steve. This moment is PEAK fourteen year old having a rough night energy, it's not truly representative of Steve as a character or of Ponyboy's feelings towards him. In truth, Steve actually kind of likes Ponyboy and is at very least protective over him. This is evidence by the previous quotes, but also when Ponyboy comes back from Windrixville, and is worried about the state placing him in foster care;

"'No, [Ponyboy said] 'they ain't goin' to put us in a boys' home.' 'Don't worry about it,' Steve said, cocksure that he and Sodapop could handle anything that came up. 'They don't do things like that to heroes.'"

It's subtle, and not immediately obvious to the traumatized fourteen year old who is used to Steve's cocky nature, but this is both a reassurance and a very bold claim. Not only is Steve trying to look out for Ponyboy the way the rest of the gang models- by treating him like a kid, letting the 'adults' worry about grown up issues in a misguided attempt to protect Pony- he is also throwing in his lot to make sure nothing does happen. Based on this quote and the rest of Steve's characterization throughout the book its not hard to infer that Steve would fight tooth and nail to make sure Ponyboy stays safe with his family. Sure, part of it is gang loyalty, part of it is his devotion to soda, but part of it is because he and Ponyboy are buddies in their own right, no matter how much they fight. They are friends- and Steve is an incredibly important character for many reasons, but particularly to add depth to Pony's character, to the bond between the Curtis gang, and to highlight how the Curtis gang differs from the other gangs in Tulsa. Steve is just as much an outsider as the rest of the gang, and it's disingenuous to say otherwise no matter how much you may hate him as a character.

[buddiebeginz]

I keep seeing posts about how us Buddie fans are just being delusional. How we need to stop reading so much into what’s being said during interviews and oh also how it’s offensive to the current ship.

First of all let’s be clear here Buck is NOT in a relationship with Tommy. I feel like this is something you Buck/Tommy shippers are failing to grasp because I constantly see posts about how Buck shouldn’t cheat on Tommy. They have kissed once and been on 2ish dates they are not a couple yet. Being exclusive requires a conversation or at least some acknowledgment by the characters and we haven’t had that yet. They still barely know each other.

Second we have always theorized about Buddie when the characters were with other love interests. We did when Buck was with Taylor. We did when Eddie was with Ana. Is it somehow different now because Tommy is a guy? Is it different now because Buck and Tommy aren't straight? Or is it just because Buck is dating the guy you want him to be with now? I don't know there's just something very strange about how some of you are responding to Buddie/Buddie shippers with all of this.

What's even crazier to me is that so many of you who are all about Buck/Tommy now used to be Buddie shippers or still say you'll be happy if Buddie happens down the line. Yet you're still attacking Buddie and our meta and speculation because it threatens the current ship you want at the moment.

No one is saying that every one of our theories and speculation is 100% correct but we have always speculated on the show and the interviews this isn't something new people are doing. I feel like the response some you have is that we're somehow seeing/hearing only what we want to and or twisting the words of the actors/etc to fit some kind narrative we have about Buddie.

It's not like we're seeing interviews where Oliver, Lou, Tim, etc are saying Buck and Tommy are going to be together 4eva and then immediately twisting that to mean oh they must be lying Buddie is so obviously happening tomorrow. We're inferring what we think might happen based on spoilers and what the actors (and Tim) have said combined with what we hope might happen. We know not everything we think will happen will. We had a ton of theories on 7x04 and 7x05 (many of which turned out to not be true) and despite what some of you think we didn't all collectively lose our shit because they didn't come true.

You can dislike Buddie and us all you want and can disagree with us or our theories all you want but these posts talking about how we're just seeing what we want and setting ourselves up for disappointment come across as hypocritical (considering most of you used to be Buddie shippers) and patronizing. We don't need or want you to save us from our fandom experience. If we're disappointed by the storyline that's our business but right now we're having fun with where things in the show are and are going.

---

I also really don't like how some of you are trashing Buddie to prop up Buck/Tommy. Basically saying that because Buck and Eddie's feelings haven't been verbally confirmed on screen (like in an I'm in love with you kind of way) that we're making it into something it's not and it's not fair to Buck/Tommy because they are canon.

Buddie isn't in a romantic relationship at the moment but they have loved and supported one another and always been been more than friends since basically the beginning. Even Oliver just confirmed that Buck was attracted to Eddie from the first scene. And no attraction alone doesn't equal love but if you can look at the six seasons of history shared by these two characters and only see two bros being the bestest friends you really need to take some media literacy.

I feel like some of you don't understand that not every part of a fictional story is spelled out super literally nor should it be. We know how deep Buck and Eddie's love goes because we can infer that based on their scenes. On all the ways they are there for one another, on how they treat each other, on how their relationship differs from the other friendships on the show. On all the things they say and don't say to one another. A big reason we want to see them in a canon romantic relationship is because of how clear the show has already made it that these two men love each other.

As for Tommy even though I'm not a multishipper I get Tommy's significance in the storyline. I'm also more thankful than I can put into words that Oliver and the show have decided to do Buck's bi awakening storyline epecially considering I'm bi myself. Buck being bi and his journey is incredibly important all on it's own but Buddie being canon is equally as important not because we need to see these guys together but because of what they represent. We have never had a slow burn same sex love story like this and the way it would change media forever if Buddie were to be canon cannot be understated.

[kiwiana-writes]

Six(ish) Sentence Sunday

Thanks for the tag @hgejfmw-hgejhsf and @onthewaytosomewhere - it's always nice when I'm not kicking the week off lmao. I didn't get a lot of writing done this week because I was busy editing the Going Platinum podfic I posted today, but I've powered through so I have something to share!

Rockstar Alex is now officially fully epistolary, because I figured out how to get #3 from the five fun facts game into a fully epistolary format. If you are thinking to yourself, "Great! If it's fully epistolary then it can't hurt as much!" I would advise you to turn to your nearest Schitt's Creek fandom buddy who has read my fics in that fandom and ask them how they feel about chapter 5 of Meet me out at the end of my rope (aka angstapalooza), and calibrate accordingly 😈

SO. Below the cut is a little sneak peek of this with the skin on (and some bonus Reddit comments because when I go epistolary I go balls to the wall), but if you don't want to venture under the cut, enjoy the text version of an r/TIFU post:

TIFU by breaking my no-hookup rule Obligatory ‘this didn’t happen today’ but my friends are still making fun of me days later, so. I’m not a hookup/cruising kind of gay. Full respect to you if you are, it’s just never been my thing - I’m more of a serial monogamist type But it was my friend’s birthday last weekend and we all went out to a gay bar, and I ended up dancing with this guy who… honestly if I describe how off the charts hot he was you wouldn’t believe me anyway, so you’ll just have to trust me on this. He was there with a friend and the friend bought us a few rounds of vodka shots before fucking off somewhere, so me and this guy went back to dancing. And then the dancing was grinding, and then we were making out for a bit before he said he was gonna go to the bathroom with THAT head tilt. You know the one. Even my no-hookups ass knows the one. And yeah, I don’t do hookups, but fuck it. I said yes (I really cannot express how hot this guy was lol) and followed him to the bathroom. I won’t get into all the details but suffice to say getting blown by this dude was a religious experience. I’m just getting to the point of no return when he pulls back all of a sudden. And he’s got tears in his eyes, but I just thought it was from like… well, you know… but then he STOOD UP. I was like “what the fuck dude” and he just started APOLOGIZING, saying something about the song????? I hadn’t been paying attention tbh, I was a bit busy having my brains sucked out through my dick, but this guy just muttered something about the song and his ex and then he LEFT ME in the fucking club bathroom, dick bobbing in the wind. I think I’m back to no hookups from now on tbh. TL;DR: first ever hookup ended with a stranger literally sobbing his way off my dick, and ACD’s new song is a banger, but I’ll probably never be able to hear it without thinking of the worst case of blue balls I’ve ever had.

Forever feeling feral for whatever y'all are up to, so tagging @affectionatelyrs @anchoredarchangel @anincompletelist @blairwaldcrf @cha-melodius @clottedcreamfudge @cricketnationrise @cultofsappho @daisymae-12 @dumbpeachjuice @everwitch-magiks @firenati0n @getmehighonmagic @happiness-of-the-pursuit @heybuddy-drabbles @indestructibleheart @indomitable-love @inexplicablymine @leaves-of-laurelin @littlemisskittentoes @lizzie-bennetdarcy @matherines @myheartalivewrites @ninzied @notspecialbabe @orchidscript @rmd-writes @sherryvalli @ships-to-sail @smc-27 @sparklepocalypse @ssmtskw @stereopticons @tintagel-or-cockleshells @welcometololaland @whimsymanaged and, as always, anyone who wants to play! (If you take the open tag please tag me so I can see!!)

[lurkingshan]

The Ride or Die Drama Couples List

So the other night I got a little sassy on main because some of the girlies were complaining that King the Land is focusing more on the couple moments (aka relationship development) between Gu Won and Sa Rang and doesn’t have enough plot. Which is a very typical fandom complaint about romcoms that I absolutely hate, because in a good romance the relationship is the plot, people! It’s bizarre attitudes like this that get us random murder plots spliced into every other romcom for the ratings, and I am begging y’all to stop the madness. 

Ahem. Anyway, that post seemed to resonate with some folks and get them discussing other dramas, and so inevitably @troubled-mind wandered into my notes and said gee Shan, it seems like maybe you should make a list of dramas that show us couples in a relationship and explore how they make it work and ultimately stay together. And I’ve warned y’all before, if you make a stray comment in my direction there will be a list coming your way. So here I am again, doing the absolute most.

Today I present to you a list of my favorite dramas that show you not only how the couple gets together, but also how they stay together. Criteria:

The couple doesn’t have to be together when the drama starts, but they do have to actually begin their romantic relationship no later than halfway through the drama’s run so that we have substantial time with them as a couple

The relationship development between the couple is a primary plot driver (so no dramas where there’s a great long term couple just hanging out in the background)

The relationship story may include some physical separation or even a temporary breakup, but not the betrayal kind–these are the sort that actually force an unaddressed issue to the surface and ultimately bring the couple even closer 

Happy endings only, these pairs are sticking together 

Ride or Die Drama Couples

Bad Buddy - Pat and Pran

(Thailand, YouTube)

This is tumblr so do I really need to tell y’all about Pat and Pran? There is a reason we all lost our minds over this show and it’s because we got to be in this relationship with them so intensely and see them fight to stay together despite it all. Their ending is bittersweet because of their families, but the show leaves us no doubt that they both think the other is worth it and they will always stick it out together. 

Dark Blue Kiss - Pete and Kao

(Thailand, YouTube)

Shout out to the OGs! Pete and Kao originally got together in the Kiss series (you can watch it, but you really don’t have to, fam) and Dark Blue Kiss brings them back three years into their long-term relationship to give us a peek into their struggles with the closet and the toll it takes on both of them individually as well as the strain it puts on their relationship. 

Flower of Evil - Hee Sung and Ji Won

(S Korea, Netflix or Viki)

Hee Sung and Ji Won are already married (with an adorable daughter) when this drama begins, and the backstory of their relationship is unspooled alongside the larger mystery at the heart of the show. One of the most fascinating and heart wrenching love stories I have ever seen, centered on a character who is so emotionally damaged that he genuinely believes he is incapable of love even as love pours out of him. Damn, I’m gonna make myself cry into my oatmeal.

It’s Okay, That’s Love - Jae Yeol and Hae Soo

(S Korea, Viki)

Speaking of crying, lord. Ahhhhhhh. Let me pull myself together. It’s Okay, That’s Love is a healing drama about two people who fall in love and support each other through serious mental health challenges. I don’t really want to say much more than that. Bring tissues, besties!

La Pluie - Patts and Saengtai

(Thailand, iQIYI)

My beloved! This Thai drama is about a pair of soulmates–or are they–who find each other and try to make their relationship work. That’s it, that’s the show. In this drama, the relationship truly is the plot, despite some of the fantasy elements being used to highlight its themes. La Pluie is about the importance of choice and a rebuke of romantic fantasies that fate and destiny will handle your love life for you. I and many others have written about it extensively, so if you decide to watch, you can go nuts on meta. 

Lighter & Princess - Li Xun and Zhu Yun

(China, Viki)

I really love this show. This is a long format drama so there will be longer stretches where the couple still has not officially gotten together, but the relationship between them is the heart of the entire show, and we get the distinct pleasure of watching them fall in love twice, and the second time figure out how to make it stick. Such a treat.

One Spring Night - Ji Ho and Jung In

(S Korea, Netflix)

Oh how I love this quiet little drama about two people who fall for each other while one is still in a relationship with someone else, and figure out how to untangle the mess they’re in. We get to see them not only fall in love, but figure out how to become a unit who can withstand the harsh judgment coming their way and become a family on their own terms. Bonus adorable child alert!

Tomorrow With You - So Joon and Ma Rin

(S Korea, Viki)

This time travel melodrama is one of those that I started with no expectations and then sat up part way through and said what gave you the right to be this good! This is another one where the relationship begins for dubious reasons, but the suspect motives are quickly taken over by genuine feeling. We really get to live with the relationship in this one and the message is all about treasuring the life and time we have together. 

The Rebel Princess - Awu (Wang Xuan) and Xiao Qi

(China, Viki)

I think the phrase Ride or Die was actually invented for them. Talk about a power couple. Once these two get to know each other (this is a historical so as per usual, their marriage wasn’t actually their choice but rather the result of some asshole’s machinations in a quest for power, joke’s on them though) they are in, baby, and their devotion and loyalty never wavers. This is a historical epic in war time, so the couple will be physically separated multiple times, but it only makes them stronger and each of their reunions sweeter. Their relationship is the heart of the show and the throughline in their chaotic lives.

What Did You Eat Yesterday? - Shiro and Kenji

(Japan, the ether)

Saving the best for last because this right here is the GOAT in this category. It sits at the top of my all-time favorite dramas list and I love it passionately. Because y’all? This drama is explicitly about a middle-aged couple learning how to be together in a long-term relationship. That is the entire plot. And it’s fantastic. Stop reading this and go watch it!

Honorable Mentions

Yumi’s Cells - Yu Mi and Goo Wong 

(S Korea, Viki)

This one is not on the list proper because (gasp) the couple doesn’t end up together. I know, I’m still sad about it, too, even though I went into this drama fully aware of the concept (a season about each of Yu Mi’s major relationships). But man. Yu Mi and Goo Wong just have that something, you know? Even knowing they don’t stick it out, it’s a delight to watch them fall in love and settle into a relationship together. Technically there is a second season featuring Yu Mi’s next relationship (Babi? I don’t know her), but I don’t want to recommend it and you can’t make me.

I must also give a shout out to the bl season 2s that exist expressly for the purpose of showing how the characters settle into a relationship after the first season get together:

Gameboys 2 (Philippines, Gaga) - Cairo and Gavreel

Minato’s Laundromat 2 (Japan, Gaga)- Shin and Minato 

SOTUS S and Our Skyy (Thailand, YouTube) - Kongpob and Arthit

Still 2gether (Thailand, YouTube) - Tine and Sarawat

Utsukushii Kare 2 (Japan, Gaga) - Hira and Kiyoi

And because this is my post and I make the rules, I am also doing some honorable mentions of the friends to lovers slow burns where technically they are not together until the final arc of the story but let’s be serious they are together the whole time and just don’t realize it yet so you know exactly what their relationship is going to look like:

Fight for My Way (S Korea, Viki) - Dong Man and Ae Ra

Happiness (S Korea, Viki) - Sae Bom and Yi Hyun

Hospital Playlist 1 and 2 (S Korea, Viki) - Song Hwa and Ik Jun

My Only 12% (Thailand, iQIYI) - Seeiw and Cake

My Ride (Thailand, Gaga or YouTube) - Mork and Tawan 

Romance is a Bonus Book (S Korea, Netflix) - Dan Yi and Eun Ho

Weightlifting Fairy Kim Bok-Joo (S Korea, Viki) - Joon Hyeong and Bok Joo

Whoops you woke the beast @troubled-mind. @rocketturtle4 @neuroticbookworm @chickenstrangers here are more for your mile long rec lists. :)))

[batmanschmatman]

Book Rec: Coming Out Under Fire, by Allan Bérubé

Occasionally I see some discourse on Tumblr from folks in the HBO War fandom or different historical/history adjacent fandoms about how there weren’t that many members of the queer community involved in WWII, and I’d really like to point them and everyone else with an interest in queer history to this wonderful book. Originally published in 1990, Coming Out Under Fire gets into all the different ways queer folks DID participate in the war. It’s from an American perspective, so if you’re looking for other Allied experiences, unfortunately there won’t be much here for you, but it’s exceptionally well researched, and crucially a lot of the content comes from interviews with surviving servicemembers. There’s also a documentary based on the book, which came out a few years later and includes video interviews with some of the folks included in the text.

One of Bérubé’s main points in his introduction – and for writing the book in the first place – is the American government, history textbooks, Hollywood, etc. is able to paint the WWII-era military as an almost entirely straight military force because many queer people who participated in the war effort were silenced during their lifetimes, and were unable or unwilling to reveal their true identities. Some of this was from societal pressure – the post war period saw a huge surge in homophobic rhetoric and persecution in the name of fighting Communism, not to mention the ever present heteronormative pressure to get married and have kids – but also because so many queer veterans died during the AIDS epidemic. Bérubé was inspired to preserve the voices of those who were still with us and shed a light on some of the folks we lost. (Note that this was also an intensely personal issue for Bérubé, who lost friends and his partner to AIDS and thus saw first hand how devastating this was to the community in terms of robbing us of our loved ones, friends, elders, and history itself.)

In the book, Bérubé makes the point over and over again that queer people were involved at basically every level in the American military during the war. There’s stories about guys lying when asked “Do you like girls?” during enlistment, lesbians in the Women’s Army Corps being brought to trial for fraternizing, drag shows in POW camps and in reserve, front line combat veterans discussing losing romantic partners to enemy fire or coming out to foxhole buddies, who were supportive allies rather than hateful. One of my favorite stories that’s always stuck out to me is a guy who came home and decided to come out to his elderly mother, who was fully accepting and supportive of her son’s sexuality. I see so many people speaking in absolutes that there’s NO WAY you could come out to your family and be accepted in the past, and while that was certainly true for so many people, it’s also not an absolute truth.

Please note I am NOT giving blanket permission to make assumptions about real-life people’s sexualities or identities, nor am I saying Band of Brothers fics where half the company is dating each other are historically accurate, but it’s really sad to see folks on here (unknowingly, hopefully) perpetuating the myth that there really weren’t that many queer folks in the military during WWII. We were there, we just couldn’t be out the way we might have liked to be. After the war, the Red Scare, societal pressure, and a literal epidemic silenced countless members of the community about their time in the service. There’s no way to know how many people who fought on Guadalcanal or worked at stateside bases or sorted mail in France were queer, but it’s a lot more than you were led to believe.

As a member of the community and a historian (brief resume: MA in Public History, BA in American History, have published stuff and created exhibits for dozens of museums), I just want to remind folks that we have always been here, and our lives weren’t always miserable and tragic when we came out to people or decided to live as authentically as we could get away with. It’s not completely historically inaccurate to write fic or original fiction where your queer characters can come out to their families and not be shunned, or live with their partners and not be immediately murdered. Being queer wasn’t invented at Stonewall.

[hangmanssunnies]

All Bets Are Off

Summary: When Jake "Hangman" Seresin starts coming onto you in a club, you are convinced it is too good to be true. Your past experiences have taught you that there is only one possible reason this man might be interested. The question exactly is just how much money does he have riding on this bet?

Pairings: Jake “Hangman” Seresin x Fem!Civilian!Reader, Minor Javy "Coyote" Machado x OC

Fandom: Top Gun: Maverick 

Word count: 7.6k

Warnings: Fluff, shameless flirting, slight angst, drinking, minor cursing, Reader had been hurt in the past, Sweetheart Hangman, besties Hangman and Coyote, bets but none that are actually hurtful.

A/N: Some of this stuff has happened to me, I'm sorry if you relate. I never explicitly say it, but it's implied the reader is plus-sized. We all deserve genuine love from someone, Jake knows that. I love you, so does he. <3 Also, I do love me Javy, I wish I had included him more. I hope you enjoy!

The truth was, in your experience, men considered you a joke. It had been something that happened to you more than a few times. You could normally prevent it, but sometimes it snuck up on you. You wondered why guys thought it was so funny to ask you out on a date. Was it because the idea that they would be interested was so absurd, or was it the embarrassment that they were being made to talk to you? Or maybe it was the satisfaction they got when they rejected you and laughed that you thought it might have been serious interest from them. 

Whatever it was, it was cruel and never got easier to deal with. The feeling it left you with was hollowing. You had enough bad experiences when it came to men that you were always on guard. That was why when the attractive man you accidentally made eye contact with on the other side of the bar winked at you, you instantly averted your gaze, turning your attention back to the bar. 

Later that night, you were weary when you saw the same man and one of his buddies start to approach you and your girlfriends. It was most likely that they were coming over to chat up your friends and potentially ignore you. It didn't really bother you anymore; that was just part of having conventionally attractive friends. You loved your friends; you wouldn't trade them for the world. It was like guys wouldn't even see you when you went out with your friends. The times' men did notice you, it never went over well. So, at this point, you preferred when you were ignored. 

This wasn't the case tonight, though, when the two strangers approached y'all. They were both tall and well built, though not in the overly buff way like bodybuilders were. One of them was wearing a white shirt that stood out against his black skin. The other one, whom you had made eye contact with earlier, was wearing a dark grey button-down. One of your friends engaged them in conversation, and a few others made their way to the dance floor. You, however, dropped your eyes to your drink, swirling it and turning to angle your body slightly away. 

You didn't want to ruin any of your friends' chances with the attractive men, but it was also the girl code to stick together and watch each other's backs. You were half listening to their conversation and keeping an eye on the dancefloor, checking for your friends there. All this while patiently waiting for the bartender to come over and take your drink order. Your friend Lala wasted no time starting to flirt with the one who introduced himself as Javy. Just as you were getting ready to turn back to the bar and make yet another attempt to catch a bar tender's eye, you heard a loud voice over the music directed toward you. 

"What's your name, sweetheart?" You looked up, startled to see the blond man speaking to you. You briefly glanced over your shoulder to see if he was talking to anyone else, but you found there wasn't anyone there. You contained the grimace that threatened to take over your features, instead giving the guy a tight smile. 

"I'm Y/N. What's yours?"

"My name's Jake." He flashed you a bright smile, and part of you wanted to swoon. However, the suspicion in you shut that down quickly. You managed to give him a smile and nod. Lala was still on your other side, heavily flirting with Javy. 

"I saw you from the other side of the bar. I didn't know that they let angels in this club, but I'm sure not complaining." 

The cheesy line did not help you feel more at ease. Instead, you let out a dry laugh and drummed your fingers against the top of the bar. "That's a really funny joke." 

"It wasn't a joke, angel."

You opened your mouth, getting ready to shut down the unbelievably handsome man, who was no doubt out of your league. But, before you could, a hand on your wrist interrupted you. 

"I'm going to go dance with Javy," Lala was telling you now, grinning from ear to ear and wiggling her eyebrows so aggressively you couldn't contain your laugh. 

"Do you still want a drink?" You asked her, but she was already walking to the dance floor, her hand gripped tightly with the stranger she had just met. You shook your head at your friend and turned back to the bar. 

"I would love a drink. Thank you for asking," Jake's voice cut into you, disrupting your thoughts. You were shocked to see him still standing next to you. His job of playing wingman had clearly been successful, not that it seemed a man like Javy needed one in the first place. 

"I wasn't really asking you."

"Well, how about the drinks are on me then?"

"No. Thank you for the offer, though." 

"I insist." This made you sigh.

"Listen, buddy-" You were cut off, though.

"Jake," he resupplied his name like you would have forgotten it in the last minute or so. 

"Right, listen, Jake. Your work here is done. You succeed as a great wingman. Your friend got mine to go dance. So, you don't have to keep talking to me as a distraction or whatever."

The smile he had been wearing while he talked to you fell off his face for a moment. Then briefly, there was an adorable crease that appeared in between his eyebrows. 

"I actually am a great wingman, but what I wanted was —." 

Now it was your turn to interrupt him. "I have some other friends on the dance floor that I am sure would be more than interested. You probably saw them over here earlier. I can even tell you which ones are single."

"Thanks for the tip, angel, but are you interested in dancing?" 

The bartender had finally made their way over to both of you. You smiled kindly at them and started to put in your order for a red dragon. Jake jumped onto your order asking for an old fashioned and requested that the drinks go on his tab.

You narrowed your eyes at the man, shaking your head. You clenched your jaw at the forwardness of this stranger. Before the bartender went to make your drinks, you also asked for three shots of Jägermeister. You glanced a look at Jake, who raised his eyebrows but didn't protest to you adding more drinks to his tab.

The bartender poured out your shots before starting the mix drinks. You threw each shot back one by one, enjoying the caramel herby flavor of the liquor sliding down your throat. Jake didn't take his eyes off of you or the bob of your throat, swallowing, once during the whole process. 

"I will say I am impressed," he told you when you set the last one back down on the bar top. When his old fashioned was set down on the bar followed quickly by your red dragon, he still hadn't left your side yet.

"Do you want to dance?" He asked you for the second time, taking a quick sip of his drink. The two of you drifting away from the bar side. You concede that he definitely was a good actor, or maybe just a smart enough guy to be kind to you. Your friends didn't take it well when men weren't nice to you. 

"I promise you don't need me to take you over there. The single ones are Lala. Which, sorry, it looks like your friend snapped her up. Then there is Kana," you pointed at your friend who was wearing a bright neon pink form-fitting jumpsuit, "and Jamie is too." The finger you were pointing shifted to point at the blonde with long curly hair, who had decided to wear tiny short shorts and a bandana top to the club. 

"I have to warn you, though, you wouldn't really be Jamie's regular type." You took a sip from your drink, feeling proud of yourself. You were also a pretty great wingwoman; just by looks alone, either of your friends would be scoring with this man. When you looked at him again, though, his eyes were only on you. 

"That's nice and all, but you are the one I wanted to dance with, Y/N." Jake had stepped closer to you so that you could hear him over the club's noise now that you two had drifted closer to the dance floor. 

The shots you had taken made it so you weren't able to contain your laugh. "You want to dance with me?" You asked him in-between laughs and lightly hit his arm, shaking your head. That adorable eyebrow crease returned again, making you laugh more. 

"Yeah, I do," he told you seriously. 

"What is it?" You asked, swirling the drink in your hands. "Is it a bet? Or just a joke? Or is your friend Javy really that terrible you need to keep me completely distracted from Lala?" 

"I'm sorry, angel. I don't think I understand."

"I'm not stupid, men like you," you pointed at him, gently pushing your finger into the grey shirt of his chest, not shocked at all to feel firm muscle there. "Don't pretend they are interested in women like me without some alternative motive." You retracted your finger to point it back at yourself.

His mouth dropped open, and for the first time that night in your conversation, you were left with the impression that he wasn't sure what to say. 

"So, if it's a really good bet. I could be convinced to participate, but I really don't feel like being the butt of anyone's jokes tonight." He snapped his mouth shut and licked his lips. His eyes narrowed slightly. You raised your chin a little bit, feeling bold from the liquor with no intention to back down. 

"What kinds of bets have there been in the past?"

"Oh, all kinds of stuff, usually the stakes are money, but it varies what the bets are. One guy, the bet was to take me home and then leave me on the doorstep." You took another long pull from your drink at the memory of that. "Other times, it's to see if they can get my number, and then they sign me up for weight watchers or some plastic surgeons email list. Or they flirt with me all night and then see if they can get away with pawning their tab off on me. There is lots of variation. Not always bad, I guess. One guy was just dared to kiss me for $20 bucks. We split it and called it a night." You were careful to watch the tone of your voice, making sure that you didn't betray how much hurt you had endured before.  

"That is fucked up. I am so sorry." The line of his jaw tightened, and you could tell that he was clenching his teeth. 

"I don't need you to be sorry for me," You snapped back at him. "So if it's not something terrible, I'll play along. But if you just want to get a laugh out of humiliating me, I'll have to say pass and ask you to leave me alone."

"Well, I'm not known to disappoint, but there isn't a bet."

You stared up at his handsome face trying to figure out what sort of game he was playing. He simply gave you a kind and confident smile, not shying away from your prying eyes. Looking at this man, you didn't think it was possible for him to be shy. 

You sigh and shake your head. "Well then, I don't think there is anything I can help you out with, Jake."

"Well, angel, all I really wanted was to talk to you. Dancing was just going to be an added bonus. So if you aren't interested in dancing, at least tell me it's because you are taken."

You shook your head at him, lips turning up at the edges in a small smile. "I'm not seeing anyone at the moment."

"That's definitely a blow to my ego, angel. Single, beautiful, can take shots like a champ, and still doesn't want to dance with me." He clutched a hand to his chest as if he had just been shot and shifted backward on his heels before leaning in close to you again. 

"I find it hard to believe you have trouble picking up girls."

He shrugs and takes another long drink until his glass is empty. "I think I would surprise you."

"Are you trying to tell me that women don't flaunt to your side, vying for your attention, and shower you in affection?" Of course, you were joking, but in the flashing lights of the club, beyond the loud music and the alcohol coursing through your veins, a dark look borderline vulnerable shadowed his face, and it stuck. The side of his cheek indented, and you could see that he was biting it, shifting his weight like he was suddenly uncomfortable. Then the music shifted, and Jake changed with it, falling back into that pleasant neutral look. 

"I think the general consensus is that I'm too much of an asshole," Jake told you, adapting that flirty teasing tone again. You took a moment to tear your eyes off of him and check on your friends on the dance floor, ensuring they were all fine before trying to come up with something to say. 

"What's a hidden talent of yours?" 

"Pardon?" He asked you and leaned in closer like he suddenly couldn't hear you, which made you narrow your eyes but let the action slide. 

"Tell me something you are good at that I wouldn't know from just looking at you."

"I'm pretty good at darts."

"I think I could have guessed that by looking at you." 

"I think you might have a stereotyping problem, angel." 

That startled a genuine laugh out of you, which to your horror, started to drift into the giggle category. Those shots were catching up with you fast. "I'm sorry. You're right. I'll try and make sure to keep my implicit bias under better check. I'll try not to apply any of the stereotypes I have for hot, tall, blonde, funny men to you."

That made him laugh too, and he gently tapped his empty glass against the one you had in hand. "Thanks, Darlin. I was worried we were going to have to send you to sensitivity training."

You bit your bottom lip, trying to keep the giggle in this time. "Well, maybe I just need to be more educated. What kind of things should I assume?"

"Well, I can't speak for all tall, blonde, funny men named Jake," He starts, the grin on his face almost too bright. His eyes, which you couldn't quite make out the actual color of in this club, clearly had a sparkle. "But you could assume that they actually are good at darts, like to read, a quite talented cook, and sometimes they also like to go out on the town with their friends." 

"A few of those things certainly are unexpected."

"What about you? What kind of things should I assume about angels?" 

"If I ever meet any, I will let you know." 

He huffed at you, and his lips turned into a frown that you could almost categorize as a pout. "Oh, come on. I guess I will have to let my implicit bias run rampant then."

"And what would are your biases telling you about me?" You asked, raising an eyebrow. 

He stared at you for a long moment but didn't say anything. His eyes were scanning your face and then briefly flashed over your body, examining the outfit you had picked to go out in that night. You wondered if this was the moment that the shoe fell, that there really was a bet or a joke. That he was about to make some mean joke or assumption about you. Jake surprised you by grabbing your now empty drink glass from your hand. 

"I don't believe in forming opinions based on how people look. Even beautiful angels like you. Would you like another drink?" He wasn't smiling when he said it, but he sounded genuine enough.  

You stared at him wide-eyed and eventually shook your head no.

"Well, if you decide you want another one or do actually want to dance. Don't hesitate to come find me, Darlin." He winked at you, and with both your empty glasses, he made his way back to the bar side. 

You couldn't tear your eyes off of him. You watched Jake give the empty glasses to the bar back and then get a handful of water bottles. You still didn't manage to look away until he made his way back to his group of friends by a pool table on the other side of the bar. There Jake started to generously hand out the water bottles. One of your friends coming back over from the dance floor was what finally got you to refocus on the girls' night you were supposed to be having. 

You didn't talk to Jake again, never working up the courage to go over and take up his offer even though you stole glances at him the rest of the night. For the next month, you would occasionally hear about him because your friend Lala, and Jake's friend, Javy, had started to see each other. She swore it was just casual, but you didn't see it staying that way for long with how much they texted each other or considering that they now wanted all their friends to be friends. 

That is how you found yourself running into Jake again, at a happy hour in a Texmex bar. Lala and Javy deciding to mix the friend groups and introduce everyone over drinks and food while also displaying a ridiculous amount of PDA. He approached you first, sliding next to you at the table you were situated at. The table was on the outside patio while waiting for everyone else to grab their drinks from the bar. 

"Hey Y/N, you are a sight for sore eyes. How have you been?" You were honestly surprised that he remembered you, let alone your name.

"Oh, hey. Hi," you said, giving him a small smile. 

"It's Jake. We met the same night Lala and Javy did."

"No, yeah. I remember you."

"Oh good," Jake says with a pleased chuckle. Then he took a sip from his drink. You were shocked to see that instead of a beer bottle, it was actually a Jarritos. 

"Are you really drinking a soda?" You laughed. 

"What's wrong with soda?" He asked you, quirking an eyebrow and looking at the bottle in his hand. 

"There isn't anything wrong with it. I'm just surprised that is what you ordered at the bar, and not a beer or an old fashioned or something."

Jake tsked his tongue at you and shook his head. "I really am going to have to find a sensitivity and diversity class for you to take. These expectations you have are going to be a problem between us."

You couldn't help laughing at him and rolling your eyes at the joke. "Well, if you see any good ones, make sure to send me a link." That made him laugh. You admired the way his eyes crinkled a little at the edges. 

"I can't say you are completely wrong. As much as I would love a beer, I'll be wheels up in less than twelve hours, so no drinking for me tonight. Plus Jarritos is my favorite soda, I drank it all the time growing up."

You took a sip of your own drink, considering his words. "What kind of wheels?"

His face lit up at the question, and in this light, you could finally see his eyes in the evening sunlight deciding they were green. It was a tough call from blue, but green won over. "Plane wheels."

"Oh, so you are a pilot?" 

"Yeah, officially a naval aviator, but yeah. Javy is too, and a few of the other guys here." He tipped his bottle towards the group making their way out towards y'all on the patio. 

"Wow, that sounds like a pretty amazing job. Tell me more about that."

"Angel, I could talk about flying all night. But I still don't really know anything about you. How about we flip the script, and you tell me a bit about yourself?"

You opened and closed your mouth twice, trying to come up with a response. You couldn't remember the last time a man wanted to learn about you so much that he even set aside the opportunity to talk about himself. 

So this time, you didn't resist answering the questions Jake asked you. You also couldn't control the flutter in your stomach when Jake kept giving you his attention, even after the entire group had joined you on the patio. Finding lulls in the group conversation to ask you something, and more often than not, when you let your eyes drift over to him, he was already looking at you. 

Jake was the first to leave. He stood up and stretched just as it was actually getting dark. "Y'all, I've got to get going, but it's been great. I hope we all get together again soon."

Some of his friends booed him, but it was all playful. He shot you one more look but didn't say anything before making his way out of the patio. Feeling bold, you quickly finished the drink you had and got up as well. You half-heartedly said goodbye, not even really giving anyone an explanation, before hustling out of the door. You caught him walking through the parking lot.

"Jake," you called after him. 

He turned around to face you looking surprised. "Did I forget something, angel?" 

"Yes," you confirmed, drumming your hands against your side. You took a few steps closer so that you were only a few feet apart. His eyebrows creased, and his hands patted some of his pockets, confirming where his phone and wallet were.

"What did I forget?" 

"You forgot my number." It only took him a second to process your words before he was grinning and puffing out his chest a little bit. 

"You are right. I don't know how I could have forgotten that. I'm sorry." Then he is holding out his open phone for you. You quickly type in your number and hand it back to him. Locking the screen, you saw a picture of him with a group of people wearing flight suits, all posed in front of some planes. 

"So, now you have that," you trailed off, not sure what to say now.

"I'll text you, angel." 

You nodded your head, actually believing him, and headed back into the restaurant. Your phone vibrated, receiving a new text message before you had even sat down again.

Talking to Jake was easy. He was a great texter and really funny. He did work long, weird hours, but it was something you were able to live with. It took a week and a half of texting before he finally asked if you wanted to go on a date with him. 

It was supposed to be on another girls' night, so you text the group chat, letting them know you wouldn't be making it that night. Telling them that you had a date. Within a few minutes, you got a call from Lala, a picture of you two stupid drunk from freshman year of college showing up. 

"Hey, Las."

"Omg Y/N, do you have a date with Hangman tonight?"

"Who?" you asked, pulling the makeup brush away from your face and looking at the phone, confused. 

"Sorry, Jake."

"Who the hell is Hangman?"

"Oh, it's just the nickname that Javy calls Jake all the time."

You hummed in acknowledgment. "I'll have to ask him about it. He hasn't mentioned anything to me. He doesn't really like to tell me anything about his work," You trailed off. 

"Well, I don't really think their jobs are like ours."

"No, definitely not."

"So, what are you guys doing? Where are you going?"

"We are going to the Shakespeare festival!" You couldn't fully contain your excitement. 

"Oh my gosh, that is going to be so fun," Lala gasped.

"Yes, I am excited. They are doing Little Shop of Horrors." 

"I'm so excited for you. It's been a while since you've dated."

"It's just a first date, Lala."

"I know, but you're a catch, and Jake is too. I don't want you to get too in your head about it."

"I don't get too in my head about dating," you sigh. 

"Yes, you do. You are always suspicious."

"I'm suspicious because, in the past, I had the right to be. I don't want to be a joke. I can't put myself in that position, again or anymore."

"I know, but Javy says Jake is a good dude."

"You and Javy have only been dating a month," you deadpanned. This made Lala laugh. 

"Yeah, I guess that's true, but it feels different with him. I know it's been fast. It just feels real and right. You know?" She asked you, and the worst part was you thought you might understand precisely what she was talking about. 

"Javy might be a sweetheart, but Jake admitted he was an asshole the very first time we met. So, I'm going to be cautious."

"Okay, girlie, I get it. I love you. Have fun. The girls and I will miss you tonight. I want pictures and text updates on how it goes." 

"Love you too, Lala." 

You hung up the phone and finished getting ready, knowing Jake would be stopping by your apartment any minute to pick you up. When he got there, he had flowers, just a plain bouquet of sunflowers. You grinned at the gift. 

"Thank you so much! These are beautiful."

"Not as beautiful as you, angel." 

You clicked your tongue at him but you didn't actually mind the cheesy line. As you go to put the flowers away, Jake stops you with a hand on your arm. "Can I have a picture of you with the flowers?" He asked. 

"Sure," you tell him, a little hesitant but end up posing and letting him take a picture. 

After that, you head to the Shakespeare festival and watch the play. Jake tells you how much his mom and grandma loved the theater. It was something that had rubbed off on him growing up and going with them to all different kinds of productions. He also packed some snacks for you two, as well as a cold lemon orzo salad with feta cheese that made your mouth water. He admitted he made it himself. It was a great date, better than you have had in a long time. Maybe the best one you have ever had. 

At the end of the night, Jake walks you back to your door, acting as a gentleman the entire way. You invited him inside, but he politely declined. Then he leaned in and kissed you. It is everything a first kiss should be, kind, sweet, and a bit too chaste. The moment you tried to initiate more, he pulled away and kissed your forehead before telling you goodnight and leaving. 

You go on more dates with Jake and learn more and more about him. He is funny, generous, and too smart for his own good. He also can be a bit of an asshole, but at least immediately apologizes for it. You made the mistake of taking him on a date where you were mini golfing. That was when you found out he was extremely competitive and very cocky. It was the first time he referred to you as sweetheart in a condescending way, ruining the pet name for you. Before you had even the chance to call him out on it, though, he beat you to it. He told you after that he was sorry and got carried away with the game. He gave you fifteen more apologies than you needed until you finally had to tell him if he apologized to you again you were going to break up with him. 

Another time you go on a double date with Javy and Lala. It isn't a disaster, but you and Lala definitely saw sides to them that you assume are mostly reserved for work. The two might call each other best friend but the smack talk that they were saying while bowling would never give off that impression. That's also when you learn that when Jake has mentioned Coyote, the person he was actually talking about was Javy. 

You finally make an excuse and leave the lane y'all were using and drag Lala with you to get away from the two guys. You two probably take too long using the restroom and grabbing more drinks and food before coming back. Both were sitting, heads pressed close together, having a quiet conversation.

Javy is the first to apologize, "Sorry we got so into bowling. We should have left our competition in the sky." 

"Yes, we didn't mean to be assholes," Jake added. 

You frowned at him, not ready to let him off the hook so easily. However, after him pouting and a few sweet kisses, you let it go. Just telling him that he should be nicer to his friends. He agreed readily enough and was back to being the sweet happy Jake you were used to. Y'all had another round of bowling, much friendlier this time, before calling it a night. 

You and Jake just fit together, and before you know it, you had been dating for nearly three months. There were no major issues, and you were more than a little on your way to falling in love with him if you hadn't already passed over that precipice. The issue was Jake wanted to take things slow. 

It was something that shocked you when the two of you first talked about it. Jake had accused you once again of stereotyping him. He claimed that he was a fine southern gentleman who treated women right. This, of course, led to you squabbling with him that he had just stereotyped himself. It led to another round of discussing what stereotypes you were allowed to apply to him and which ones you weren't. 

The two of you had just spent the whole day at the beach, and Jake was driving home with the windows down and music blasting. He had given you his phone to pick the music. You hadn't been able to shake the grin on your face seeing that his phone background had now changed to the picture of you he took on your first date. 

"Jakers look at the phone," you requested while holding the phone up, trying to get the face ID to activate. 

"The passwords 1969, angel." He told you, pushing the phone away from him so he could focus on driving. Your smile only widened at how easily he gave you the password. 

"Why?" You asked him, opening up Spotify to start queuing music. 

"Founding year of Top Gun."

"You are such a nerd," You accuse him playfully. 

"I might be, but that's a secret you can't go telling people, angel."

"It's too late. I already told the girls about your Kindle and Audible accounts."

"There isn't anything wrong with reading. It's good for your brain," he defended himself. 

"I also told them how you own every single Nicholas Sparks book." He gasped hearing you told that secret and shot a glare over at you. How offended he looked, made you cackle with laughter. 

"It's official. I can never see a single one of your friends again." 

You rolled your eyes but didn't say anything. You continued to look through Spotify and decide on music for the drive. A text message appeared on the screen from "Coyote," and you quickly swiped up on it, in dismissal, not wanting to invade Jake's privacy. However, another one instantly popped up, and you couldn't help but let your eyes drift over the preview. And then Coyote just kept texting. You never actually opened up the messages, but you didn't need to. 

Times up.

You lost the bet big time. 

I expect payment ASAP...

It was like your blood turned to ice in your veins. You had to resist the urge to throw Jake's phone out the window. You took a few deep breaths trying to calm down. You didn't know what the bet was. It could be about anything. You couldn't just assume that it was about you. However, it felt like a switch was flipped in you, and suddenly you weren't sure. Was it possible that Jake had been playing with you all this time?

Logic said no, it had been months. Jake was always honest with you, sometimes to a fault. He texts you good night and good morning every day. You were his phone's lock screen background. If Jake had something to hide, why would he just give you his phone and password? You saw another text appear from Coyote, a small preview showing it was a picture of some kind. That was when you locked Jake's phone, setting it back in the cup holder. 

"Did you queue Renegade?" He asked, none the wiser to the panic sloshing in your veins. You had, actually, knowing it was one of his favorite songs. So you nodded to his question, not trusting your voice. 

You felt the need to get out of the truck and to get away from him, desperate for the chance to recenter yourself.  All your plans for the night now meant nothing, including the plad of coaxing him into your apartment and then the shower. You originally had the intention of washing the sea salt and sand off him, insisting you take a shower together to save water, of course. The dinner cooking in the crock pot and the fresh sheets on your bed were also forgotten. All of it went flying out the window as the word bet was on repeat in your head. 

Three songs passed, and you barely moved, just pressing your hands tightly into your knees and trying to strategize the fastest possible way to escape the truck and send Jake on his way when you got back to the apartment. 

"Angel, what's wrong?" You distantly heard him ask, and your eyes snapped from the road in front of you to his side profile. 

"Nothing, I'm fine."

"Woah, now, don't lie to me." He tossed a concerned glance your way. The two of you were stuck in traffic, and you were silently praying for it to clear up. 

"It's not a lie."

"Are you tired or hungry? Been drinking water? I know we were out in the sun for a long time." His concern was a step too far. You felt the bubble that was building in you snap as you slumped back against the seat. 

"I've been drinking water, and like I said, I'm fine, Jake." He frowned. You saw his brow furrow, clearly indicating that he didn't believe you. 

"You got a text from Coyote," You told him, watching his face carefully to see if you would see any trace of guilt there. 

"Oh really, what did he have to say?" Jake asked, his face not betraying anything to you. 

"I didn't want to read your texts."

"You can read them, angel. It doesn't bother me. If he wants to get drinks tonight, tell him to fuck off. He knows I was spending today with you."

You picked up his phone again and fiddled with it for a moment before typing in his password. You wanted to trust him. You thought you could trust him. However, even after three months, some part of you found Jake too good to be true. In the back of your mind, you were still looking for the explanation of why he would choose to be with you when he could have any girl he wanted. 

"Will you throw Cruise into the queue?" He asked you when you picked up his phone again. You hummed and quickly went to Spotify, adding the song before opening his texts again. You saw a squadron group chat, a few text messages shot off to the contact Rooster B^2 and then at the top of the list, Coyote. A picture of the two of them smiling in the little corner. The chat told you there were five unread messages:

Get absolutely wrecked Hangman. It's the 13th. That's three months! 

Times up.

You lost the bet big time. 

I expect payment ASAP. I'll accept cash only. 

Below that was a picture of some professional basketball player dunking a ball. You started to read the texts out loud, your eyes quickly going back and forth between the phone and Jake's face, not wanting to miss even a micro-movement of his reaction. Right as you finished reading them, another text showed up. You sucked in a rapid breath, feeling your whole chest squeeze tight. 

Better luck with the next girl you think you know the standards for. 

"What's this bet, Jake?" You asked. You tried to have a consistent voice but didn't accomplish that. You couldn't stop your voice from breaking on his name. 

"Fucking Coyote," he hissed, tightening his grip on the wheel, making your heart plummet even further.

You couldn't manage to find words. Instead, you locked Jake's phone again but gripped it so tight you were shocked the screen didn't crack from the pressure. 

"Y/N, it's not what you think," Jake quickly added on, but it was too late. You were already shutting down, starting to feel parts of you splintering inside. 

"I don't understand. I was honest with you. I was upfront that I couldn't be a joke again, that I wouldn't be a bet. That I've been too many bets," You whispered to him. You were questioning every date and interaction now. Questioning every time Jake called you beautiful or his angel. Had he actually meant any of it? Was this the reason he refused to sleep with you? 

Before he could even defend himself, you were talking again. "I don't understand why you dragged this out so long, but I guess I get why you don't want to sleep with me now." You chuckled, but it was a hollow sound. "I would have played along too. You are so charming; that first night, if you had been honest, I would have gone along with it. You didn't have to put in so much effort." 

"Y/N," He said, his voice gentle and deadly serious. You shook your head at your own foolishness, refusing to look at Jake now, preferring to stare at the picture of you on his phone again. You cut him off before he could keep talking. 

"I mean, this was overkill. Spending so much time with me, making me your fucking phone background, hanging out with my friends, double dates. What was the bet, Hangman?" You spat out. You had never once used his call sign since you had learned it. It was always Jake, he had even asked Javy and some of their other friends not to call him that around you. 

"Don't call me that," he immediately responded, his tone hard. Then he softened it and tried again to say your name. You were on a roll, though. 

"Fuck, I knew too, and I ignored it. But, like I always said, guys like you aren't into girls like me."

"No," Jake said. His voice was so cold and hard that there could have been ice on the windshield. You tried to start talking again, but Jake wasn't having it. "Shut up, Angel. It's my turn to talk." He was leaving absolutely no room for negotiation. 

"You were not the bet. You aren't a bet or a joke. And I hate when you say shit like that. You are a million times better than me. You are my dream girl. If I meet one of the fuckers who made you the butt of their stupid jokes, I'll kill them myself. Guys like me are into girls like you. If they aren't, they're fools because I am so into you. 

"I have been into you since the first moment I saw you across the bar, and the lights on the dance floor made it look like you were a literal angel. And there hasn't been a single moment where I stopped being into you. Not even when you tried to pawn me off to one of your friends. Who, by the way, aren't even remotely my type because you are my type. I've been dreaming about meeting someone like you for years. Do you understand?"

You didn't understand, not really. Jake had never been this serious with you before. However, you managed to give him a shaky nod trying to process his words. 

"You put up with me even when I'm an asshole, and somehow I haven't scared you away with my job or my friends. Which is already a goddamn miracle. I haven't wanted to rush our relationship because I've seen guys who rush things just to crush and burn. I'm not going to risk that with you because you are the one for me. I know it."

"What about this bet, and three months and…" You trailed off, still trying to piece together how he was practically telling you he was in love with you and the texts that you read. 

He sighed heavily then, "you weren't a bet, but Lala was."

"What?" you asked. Your own voice hardening hearing your friend's name.

"It's not how you are thinking. It wasn't a bad bet or anything."

"Women should never be the object of a fucking bet Jake. Is that hard for you to understand?"

"No. I just never thought they would make it. That first night when they decided to get breakfast after meeting and hooking up, I bet Coyote that he wouldn't ever make it past three months with Lala. He has commitment issues, and I could tell he really liked her. So, it was more of a push than anything. I knew I was going to lose the bet weeks ago."

"How much?"

"What?"

"How much was the bet?"

"Just $250."

"That's a lot of money. Is Javy just going to drop Lala now that he won?"

"No, absolutely not. Javy is in love with Lala. I wouldn't be surprised if he tries to propose here sooner rather than later. Also, that's not that much money. That's like one nice dinner." 

You bit your lip and felt at war with yourself and the situation, trying to decide if Jake had actually done anything wrong. "He needs to tell Lala about the bet."

"Does it really matter?"

"Of course, it matters," you hiss. 

"Okay, I'll tell him he needs to."

"If he doesn't tell her, I will," you warn him. 

"I understand," he confirmed. Then he ran his hand through his hair, which was wild from being on the beach and in the water all day. You wanted to reach over and help pull it back into place but resisted. Silence filled the space between you, filled only by the music playing.

"I'm sorry I keep doubting you," you finally said, breaking the silence between you. He sighed heavily and then held out his hand. You grabbed it, fitting your fingers together and squeezing them tightly. 

"I know you have been hurt in the past. I'm so sorry, you didn't deserve that. No one does, but please don't make me pay for the sins of those men, angel."

You felt tears prickle in your eyes, and you sniffed, holding them back. "You shouldn't have to. I'm sorry if it seems like I want that from you. You are amazing, Jake. I'll try and do better."

"You just have to trust me. I don't think you need to apologize. I don't want apologies. I just want you." 

"I want you too. I've never wanted someone the way I want you. Even when you are an asshole."

This made him chuckle, squeezing your hand in his again. "Well, you've got me." 

Neither of you said anything for the rest of the drive. When you got back to your apartment, Jake did come inside this time. He didn't stop whispering his affections for you or kissing you, not in the hallway, the kitchen, in the shower, or in bed. He made you feel like the only thing in the world that mattered and worshiped you, like you really were divine. Under Jake's hands and lips, you really felt like an angel. Mouthing into your skin that god had sent you to be his salvation in this world. 

Before you knew it, six months later, you were at Javy and Lala's wedding staring at Jake, who looked too ravishing in the tux he was wearing. He was standing in front of the crowd holding a microphone, his million-watt smile in place.  

"Now, I need to preface this story by saying women should never be the object of a bet. That being said, we wouldn't be here today if I hadn't been prepared to lose $250 dollars, or if I wasn't the world's best wingman," Jake started his speech. It made the crowd laugh. It made you laugh. You sipped the drink in your hand, and god, you knew you loved this man. So maybe bets weren't always so bad. 

[prince-liest]

Omg, I just wanted to say I ADORE your characterization of Al and Vox! I don't even have the words to express how much I love reading your stuff, especially the Anon responses you post on here. The behind the scenes thoughts are literally my food, lifesource, its so good when people not only write characters IN CHARACTER, but also include stuff about their analysis/understanding of the character too.. I'm literally obsessed with breaking down characters and yk, cracking their chrome domes open to see how they work (which admittedly, I am not the best at <_< but I love reading them). Just wanted to say how much I love your writing. I had maybe 2 questions, please don't feel pressured to answer them :>

What in your mind (in reference to the 66.6 fics) would motivate Alastor to let Val get close to him in the first place? Or was that more you picking these two characters up by the scruff of their necks and plopping them into a hypothetical scenario to explore their character and write some fun intimate thingsTM?

What do you think of the dynamic of Vox and Al vs something like Lucifer and Al? Personally I've noticed that something Alastor craves, behind the mask of his static smiling persona, is attention. He's (at least how I saw it) usually peeved when people don't care about his absence, and seems especially bothered by the King of Hell refusing to really acknowledge him, so he goes out of his way to push Lucifers buttons (like calling himself a father figure to Charlie, IN FRONT OF HER ACTUAL FATHER LOL) whereas with Vox, Vox is literally CONSTANTLY thinking about Alastor. Man literally interrupted his regular TV program to do a segment about how much he totally didn't at ALL care about Alastors dissapearance or the fact that he returned (suree buddy). So Alastor can have more fun with him and annoy him by ignoring and messing with him on purpose.

ty if you do respond to this, sorry if it was hard to understand, sometimes I forget how to put the thoughts in my brain into coherent words!

Ahhhh, thank you very much, anon! I'm especially happy that you're enjoying my commentary on Tumblr, haha - I spent a while on Twitter because that's where all the fandom zines I was in were being hosted, but nothing beats Tumblr for giving me a nigh-unlimited word count and a captive audience for my rambling! >:D <3 I'm back to cocooning myself on the OG hell site.

Thank you for this ask, it really brightened my day! :D

As for your questions:

1. I'm assuming that was a typo and that you mean Vox (but in case you did mean Val: that was just a funny accident of him walking by the room! Alastor wasn't paying enough attention until it was too late), and to that I say:

I think Alastor allows Vox to take a go at him in canon because he finds Vox's obsession with him to be entertaining, but also because Alastor is kind of a narcissist and that same obsession massively feeds his ego, especially in a political climate that otherwise forgot about Alastor. Vox's whole "Who gives a shit about Alastor coming back?! Haha, now let me have a public meltdown and short out power to the whole city about it! Oh, fuck, why is he back, though?? Can we send a spy in to find out??" is exactly the reaction that Alastor wants every time he mentions his mysterious absence and gets brushed off.

At the same time, Alastor doesn't seem to register Vox as a sincere and genuine threat. He's a big enough fish in the Pride Ring pond that his obsession with Alastor is gratifying, but Alastor's self-absorption also doesn't really allow him to treat Vox as a threat tier above "annoying in a funny way, and also television is stupid." (Perhaps this will change in season 2... :eyes: (or perhaps Alastor will get Even Worse) (please god let him get even worse))

So those two things in combination make Vox the perfect candidate for Alastor to experiment with while maintaining his ego and not feeling particularly threatened. Despite Vox's Safeword 101 talk, Alastor would never put stock into that system with Vox unless he was certain that he himself would be able to back up a 'no' with overwhelming force. Him even considering safewords in the Live On Air! series is less for his own sake and more a politesse he offers on Vox's request to warn Vox to slow the fuck down before Alastor tries to put his insides on the outside.

2. And in direct contrast, we have Lucifer...

... Who Alastor obviously actually cares quite a bit about, because he's a whole nother power tier from both Vox and Alastor, and furthermore and possibly even more importantly, a credible threat to Alastor's relationships and standing in the hotel. I think a lot of discussion I see about Alastor prodding Lucifer seems to talk about how quickly he got annoyed about Lucifer's comments, but that misses the fact that he was pissed off before Lucifer even showed up. He got pissy the moment he saw the welcome sign, actually! And I wager that he was narratively absent for the scene where Charlie actually calls Lucifer because he would have done his best to manipulate her out of doing so had be been there.

And given that the two clearly haven't met before (though obviously Alastor knows of Lucifer - and hates that the inverse isn't true, hah), it's not 100% clear exactly why he's immediately so annoyed, but in my personal view of things and barring something like "he's projecting onto Lucifer because his contract is with Lilith," I think that what we know of Alastor's personality points most strongly to "he liked being the hotel's benefactor and sees it as His Project, and doesn't like the idea that Charlie called daddy for something that she thought mysterious, powerful Alastor couldn't handle." He distracts a lot with obviously-goading comments about practically being Charlie's dad in his duet with Lucifer, but underneath that he puts a lot of emphasis on the work he's done for the hotel and the fact that he's been supporting Charlie and the hotel from the start, so why the fuck is this deadbeat asshole suddenly turning up?!

Tl;dr: Charlie missed her insight roll on Alastor's personal investments and he's sooooo offended - and taking it out on Lucifer!

I think one of my favorite things about both Lucifer and Alastor is that they both sooo obviously belong in the Pride Ring, hahaha.