#also at this point he's an adult so legally I don't think they can adopt him? hm. anyway. FOOLISH

[llycaons]

Fengmian finally divorces Madam Yu and sits down with his kids after to have a talk. They all go to family therapy, even Yanli because she snapped at her boyfriend once and started crying after because she didn't want to turn out like their mom. Wei Ying probably gets properly adopted into the family.

wow guys good thing myu was the only problem in the jiang family dynamic and excising her will solve all the problems they have/s

[sadlynotthevoid]

Since I saw that post about og!Cale solving a murder crime in Alberu's noble meeting, I've been obsessed with detective!ogCale, who solves crimes on his free time because he's too fucking bored.

Hence: bungo stray dogs crossover AU where, while a transmigrated RokSoo and company go around doing the usual "let's mess with white star" stuff, og!Cale got basically adopted by a bunch of weird professional detectives.

I'm talking about an AU where bsd happens in the world of tboah/tcf. So, while a member of the agency was going through the county for reasons, they witness og!Cale stealthy dropping a hint about a mystery to a near knight. Then he leaves, pretending to be drunk all the way to his home.

What everyone else sees is the local drunkard ready to cause trouble at the minor inconvenience.

What the detective in question sees is a very bright teen, good at solving crimes, who has nothing to do but pretend to be drunk. Needless to say, they take Cale back with them.

(It could be anyone, but it's most likely to be Dazai if they just take Cale with them and don't tell anyone. Though, I think it would be funny if it was Kenji the one who did it. Double-way adoption ensues)

Og!Cale is puzzled at how he ended up at the Armed Detective Agency as a recruit, but he doesn't complain. He even likes his job and his coworkers, even if Dazai keeps trying to unalive himself.

Besides, he doesn't have to keep with his trash act here. Everyone here is smart enough to tell he's acting. They're detectives, damn it. It would be strange if they didn't notice.

So, freedom.

And the ADA people like him too. This quite quirky, smart, witty and creative teen fits just right with them.

At some point, Ranpo has to tell him that "no, you're not smart. You're really smart. Not as much as me, although" because og!Cale's hypercompetence is normalized for him and sometimes he doesn't realize that "everyone else hasn't reach to that conclusion yet" when talking with normal people.

Fukuzawa looks at this sassy child and is like "I guess I got yet another son". Because, why would the hella rich son of some noble be so happy to join a group of strangers and do all this hard job? You can say he obviously loves his family from the way he talks about them, but he also brights up at the minor genuine act of care. It's concerning. Not urgent, but still concerning. He's keeping him. He's eighteen, legally an adult, and came on his own will. So, It's not a kidnapping.

[marshmallowprotection]

Hii, could you please clarify the timeline for the whole v and rika twin meeting and such? Like their age differences.. and specifics of how it all came together bc if there’s anything that confuses me more than certain dramatizations for this games story, it’s definitely the details of the timeline😭. Like at first Rikas official age was 23.. then it was changed to like I think 28 was calculated in the wiki..? Uhmmm… plus V’s age gap with Saeyoung isn’t even THAT big.. it’s like 5 years, no?? When did these people meet… Ive been a player since 2016, so a lot of dlc’s or secret endings I played have left my memories super fuzzy as I replay this game but omg. It’s so confusing to me ab Rika and V’s ages when they met, how long they’d been together as they ‘rescued’ or attempted to bring salvation to the twins by becoming their guardians without a legal procedure (which was understandable for their case bc of prime minister… i guess?). They’re made out to be these parent figures to saeyoung and saeran but idk kinda hard when they aren’t that much older.. or maybe it’s more than that and I just can’t really come to terms w how they’re portrayed cuz it’s such an icky feeling knowing how it plays out in the end for them when they entrust these people with their safety and full trust only to later have it crushed 💔💔 UGHH. sorry I kinda made this too long. I read a lot of rants before writing this, haha…. The twins story makes my heart ache a lot.

Rika's age is all the place. Do not try to gauge Rika's age or you will cry yourself to sleep. Her official age in the RFA Package was listed down as twenty-three at the time of her death.

However, there are many factors that lead people to believe she's older and it has everything to do with Rika Behind Story and as most people don't bother to read it, they're not aware of why things appear to make her seem older than what she was officially stated to be at debut.

tldr; CHERITZ RETCONS A LOT.

Rika fights her church and family over Sally when she is sixteen years old. Two years pass and she sees V's debut photography on display in a gallery. He is about seventeen at the time as mentioned. Another year passes and she meets Saeyoung Choi, which means she meets him when she's about nineteen years old and he is twelve years old.

Saeyoung comes to the church at an irregular rate, but she spends her time talking to him and helping him learn about math and other such subjects during this time. We can assume that since Saeyoung left his brother at around the age of fourteen or fifteen, that he had a few years with Rika before she encountered Jihyun Kim in the flesh. She also met with Yoosung for the first time during those years.

Her adoptive mother mentions during this time period that she will throw Rika and Sally out in two years since she won't be obligated to do so after that. The legal age in the Republic of Korea is nineteen, so I'm not quite sure why they would let Rika stay with them behind that since she would've already been an adult here, but hey, as far as I am aware of, she had a kick-out date of twenty-one.

She took Saeyoung to an exhibition that held multiple different works, he ran off to a science showing and Rika ran into Jihyun. That's the start of their partnership since it begins as an artist and model before it becomes romantic.

He takes her in as a model at first, but then their relationship builds into something more than that. She was kicked out after two months of doing work for V, so I can only assume she's turned twenty-one at this point.

He comes to her church to find her after her adoptive mother told him that she'd run off. Rika reveals a lot to him after that, talking to him about her demons, her fears, and more. They grow closer, and during that time, while the details we already know about the two of them dating, they were also trying to help Saeyoung and his brother.

So, if Rika was nineteen when she met Saeyoung and he was twelve, that means there is a seven year age-gap between those two. If V is meant to be seventeen when Rika is eighteen, that means he's about one year younger than she is. Which means, when Rika and V come together to help the twins, she's about twenty-one years old, give or take, and Jihyun is twenty, give or take. Which means that Saeyoung is fourteen.

He goes into the Agency at around the age of fourteen or fifteen. We know that he does some jobs on the side before he's pulled into that damn agency, so I work with the assumption that he's fifteen by the time they yank him overseas to study computer science.

Jihyun mentions in a phone call during Saeran's After Ending that he met someone who worked for the agency who convinced him that it would be safe for Saeyoung in the agency... and he believed it. That's tough to think about, you know? As someone who started this game back in 2016 when I was younger than Yoosung by a year, I just can't imagine being in Rika or V's position.

Yes, you're an adult at twenty and twenty-one but my God, there are so many experiences you've got ahead of you in your early twenties that by the time you get to the other end, you see that time as being a tall child. The me at those ages would not know how to help those twins, much less myself.

If Saeyoung is 21 in Casual and Deep Story, that means Rika would've been 28.

Where this can get perplexing is the fact that Jihyun is supposed to 26, which is two years younger than Rika, while some of this math is implied to state that there should only be a year between the two of them.

[greentrickster]

Coffee_love_Luna : I’m absolutely loving this fic(prolly cus of my daddy issues lmao), and I have a question: Do you think that alya&nino will get miraculous in their future? I personally think it would be okay if they didn’t tho

GreenTrickster: Thank-you so much! ^U^

I think that, in this universe at least, Alya would actually be a really good fit for the peacock miraculous once it's repaired, and I'll probably talk about that more in a post at some point. As for Nino, I don't think he gets his own personal miraculous, just because I don't really see the resistance succeeding in getting their hands on anymore (the Supreme got even more strict than usual after the loss of the bee to Chloe). That said, I can see this Nino being the sort of person who can swap between which miraculous he uses pretty easily. The first one he gets to try is probably the bee with Chloe, to counter some shenanigan from Volpina and Jack Badbit in-universe (and this is also the out-of-universe reason why he's the member of the group who gets gifted one of Chloe's combs (set-up!)), and from there things just evolve over time. His slightly go-with-the-flow chaos gremlin nature can often give him a unique outlook on situations that have him getting ideas for solutions that the rest of the group doesn't think of, and by the final fight it's reached the point where he can go, "Hey, _, I have an idea, can I borrow your miraculous?" and they'll go "Sure," and just hand it over.

Coffee_love_Luna : Also, I think hesperia would be horrified when he learns how canon!gabriel treats his son

GreenTrickster: Hesperia's going to find out how Hawkmoth treats Adrien and, for the first time since he became Hesperia, he's going to Choose Violence. Coffee_love_Luna : I like to think when hesperia adopted(literally or figuratively, your choice) them, they also adopted him as dad/uncle/etc And I also think there would be lots of stress cus yk, the whole empathy thing, and probably occasional ‘oh god I’m bringing children in to these situations-‘ break down, his usual business stress I like to think the teenagers(mostly nino) helps him during worse days, tho I feel more like hesperia would conceal his emotion due to guilt and responsibility

GreenTrickster: Probably a figurative adoption in a legal sense, and very literally in an emotional sense. It may not be Official On Paper, but it is still Very Very Real, and also all the kids notice first that they've decided that he's family and they absolutely accept this into their hearts once they do (albeit at different paces). He's the adult in their lives that they didn't even know they wanted, but they're so glad he's here now.

And, frankly, he's equally glad to have all of them. Yes, there's definitely a lot of stress that comes from having to care for a bunch of young teens with extremely volatile emotions, including and especially the ones you mentioned, but I think they're also very much a comfort and a balm. They feel so strongly and can believe so fully, in a way that can be very hard to replicate the older you get, but which can be very inspiring to people like Hesperia. The lightness they treat their lives and this situation overall with sometimes terrifies him, but watching them heal and become stronger and closer, watching Chloe, Shady, and Claw all grow into better, happier versions of themselves… it's an indelible reminder of why he's taken on this burden beyond his own guilt, of why it's worth fighting and hoping and carrying on.

He definitely goes out of his way to make sure he's not leaning on them too heavily, but by the end the kids are really good at making sure he always remembers that he's not carrying this alone. They're not adults, they can't carry or support as much as he can, but they'll do what they can. On his worst days, you're right, it's Nino who tends to be there with a playlist or a new track that he's working on (because music helps and heals in a way that transcends nearly all human boundaries). Alya's got everything organized and all her sources triple-checked, and will happily push him over to have a nap in the corner if he looks like he's overworking himself, he can double-check her work later, she's got this part down. Claw's really thrown himself into first aid and somehow wound up as the team medic, to the point that he'll fuss at Hesperia to quit bothering his patients, shoo, naughty butterflies get swatted! Shady's ability to talk smack about their enemies is just… so much funnier than he should find it. So, so much funnier. Chloe's impressively good at deciding she wants positive attention just when Hesperia needs to be able to take care of someone else, and also at calling him out when he's being cagey with his own emotions.

Coffee_love_Luna : So, I’m kinda seeing this au as found family trope with lots of trauma, learning to open themselves and relying to the others while defeated the evil(geez this sounds like 40k+ fic)

GreenTrickster: (stares at this, then sighs and goes to add the found family tag) Friggin' calling me out like that, no respect. (But seriously, thank-you!)

[zahri-melitor]

8 and 9

Of course you asked a spicy one.

8: Is there anything about post-Flashpoint canon you prefer to pre-Flashpoint canon? Be honest.

Well for the Flashes and Arrows we are currently fixing up things that happened at the end of pre-Flashpoint so that I actually prefer over where things finished off at Flashpoint. Lian Harper is alive and has hugged Roy. That is better than 2011! That said, both families have had a LOT of heavy lifting to fix things up as needed.

More generally - I like the interest in more diverse heroes and increasing the diversity of existing heroes. It's starting to feel less tokenistic.

A few specific narky points:

As far as I've been able to work out, post-Flashpoint nobody has re-established the 'Jim Gordon slept with Barbara's biological mother so he is simultaneously her bio dad, her legal uncle AND her adoptive father' plotpoint. Just fine that one is gone, Devin Grayson. I don't care if Jim's Babs' only dad or her adoptive dad, but I do prefer not having the situation listed above.

I think Alfred being dead has done interesting things to the storytelling and reversing it would be the coward's way out. Let him stay dead.

9: Superman in space or Superman in Metropolis? Does this change if I say Smallville instead?

Superman in Metropolis. I enjoy the contrast inherent in Clark of the conflict between what he can do with his powers, and the fact that as Clark Kent many of the things he can affect are through his journalism, in ways that don't involve smashing stuff or averting natural disasters. Also I subscribe 100% to the fact that in Clark's mind he is Clark Kent at heart. Superman and Kal-El are part of him but Clark's the one who gets up in the morning and decides to be a hero.

Answer probably doesn't change for Smallville subbing in for Metropolis, but I will say there's a much tighter limit on stories available for adult Clark in Smallville in contrast to Clark in Space.

[magicalgirlagency]

Watching MahoAko, there are definitively moments that make it good like your point on becoming a villain for petty reasons or just because you don’t like the heroes. And I like how they show how utena is different when she’s a magical girl compared to when she’s a civilian. And I do find their powers interesting. I like how they make the yellow magical girl the more aggressive one since those are usually the cheerful or scaredy cat one. But the fact that they’re minors and going through all that hentai stuff. Just have them be 18 and in college so it wouldn’t be so creepy. Heck, I expected the creepy stuff within the circumstances of the irregular witch with how they put emphasis on how the adopted daughter look older then her adopted mother but most of the time that show was wholesome. They didn’t do anything gross with the 16 year old daughter, they mostly point out how big her breasts are and how her grandfather in 1 scence who never knew that she existed was attraction but once he learn she was his granddaughter he apologize and acted accordingly. And there this character who find the young looking mom witch attraction but not in a creepy way more like still have a crush on her ever since he was little kind of way. And instead of sexualizing the mom and using the excuse that she’s in her 200 which could be use that she’s legal since she’s technically, they don’t and just have her act motherly . That better then what most anime do with their older but look like a child characters. They never show either of the 2 female lead naked and the humor is mostly poop/ butt jokes

Exactly, that's the problem with MahoAko, it's jailbait. If the characters were adults, I wouldn't mind the kinkiness and enjoyed it a tad bit more. I don't hate this animanga because it has lesbians in it, nor that it has villains doing villainous things; I hate it because it has minors in sexual scenarios.

Wanna do magical lesbian porn? Make sure that your characters are adults, then we can talk.

Also, I've heard of Irregular Witch, but I didn't watched it at the time it aired, because I was skeptical about how young the mother looked in comparison to her adopted daughter (but then again, I don't think that I, a 26yo woman who looks 15yo, is in any position to complain about looks and age)...

...but I guess I'll take your word for it, and watch it later.

[amor-immortalem]

I don't usually send asks because I'm awkward potato but I'm also really interested in your Azalea/next gen fics. I see your point about Azalea's schedule. I gotta say though I find it really sad and funny that the reason for that is because of Mammon 😂 Dude would literally forget to keep his promise of going to her important events and now she doesn't bother telling him 🤦‍♀️ Can't break a promise if he didn't make one but also still fucks it all up akdjsjfjdf. If I was her I would've disowned him as my father. I would've waited until I was a legal adult, moved out, and cut him off for good. I'm aware it's not that easy but I wouldn't waste my time chasing after the love and attention of someone who doesn't seem to value me as a person and as his daughter. I know you have an explanation for that but I'm talking more from Azalea's point of view. I don't know, I think I'd ask another one of the brothers to adopt me even if they don't and call them dad just to spite Mammon while calling him old man 😂

Their relationship now is just Mammon constantly sticking his damn foot in his mouth and saying the wrong thing and Azalea taking it the wrong way lmao but also its really sad bc they used to be so close before Mahlon was born.

And I think that’s ultimately what keeps her from disowning Mammon as her father. Its kind of like a “I love you, but you need to get your head out of your ass so things can go back to how they used to be” type of situation.

And like he does try. I have a wip from last summer saved in my drafts somewhere on word set between I Think I’m OKAY and 30 Miles North that was supposed to address Azalea not letting her parents know about an important school function (i think it was like a decathlon or something I can’t remember anymore) but Mammon managing to find out anyway and showing up to it without her knowing and Azalea being so surprised to see him in the crowd she ends up being so distracted that she loses a large amount of points for the team.

Anyway you could imagine how that might go.

Azalea’s character arc doesn’t really have a happy ending and its been something I’ve been quietly trying to “foreshadow” or “allude” to in fics that feature her ever since I posted the Dangers of the Human World (I’m sorry I’ve been trying to think of better terms bc those doesn’t quite fit but I can’t think of any)

Once you see Azalea and Mammon’s relationship start to get better you’ll know that her story arc is almost at its end.

Anyway, as far as asking one of the brothers to adopt her, that’s kind of already happened with Lucifer. Like Azalea never really came out and straight up asked Lucifer to adopt her but she does consider him less like her uncle and more like her second father since he’s the one she seeks approval from the most and she’ll go to him if she’s in need of advice.

She’s also called him dad once when she was like 13 but it felt weird and the both of them just agreed to never speak of it again.

[mylordshesacactus]

Do you have any particular trends, themes or broad concepts that seem to run through your OCs?

lmao im being CALLED OUT

let's see. off the top of my head.

There's:

Benevolence ("Benny"), my tiefling bard, who's my only actual Lawful Good character because her father (the uh, former high priest of Tiamat, shh) taught her his ethical code and she cleaves to those Three Rules the way some people cleave to their gods. You know. The girl who views the world through an unwavering lens of power--who has it, who doesn't, how they use it. How they don't. Who flies into a seething rage when anyone abuses their power.

Sedge Burdock, whose life is lived by the words of the uncle who raised her: Cruelty dies in daylight.

Rinda Broadstone, founding member of Paladins Against Parasocial Relationships because there is no ethical way to be a paladin unless you're willing, at any moment, to walk away and lose the blessing of your god forever if they ask you to do something that's morally wrong. She also adopted her late sister's five children with zero warning and no time to prepare solely to prevent their abusive father from claiming custody after their mother died.

Atri, ranger-cleric of the Raven Queen, Order of the Breaker of Chains, whose entire religious purpose is uplifting the powerless and checking the powerful.

Ihz, the antisocial mule courier and dog trainer who silently, stubbornly dedicated her life to caring for the Forsaken--who compares the way the living have treated them to a whipped dog, who learns to bite hard and on sight because it's been abused and its warnings and requests for space ignored for so long that there was no other way to keep itself safe.

Talet, the werewolf rogue who adopted a traumatized teenage bard on sight, and refuses to kill on orders or to kill her personal enemies even when she can get away with it, because wanting something doesn't give you the right to take it.

Velshada Wolfsong, gifted kid burnout extraordinaire, mage prodigy who was pushed too hard too young by her well-meaning mother and teachers until she completely lost control of her powers, broke and ran away, and had a long and difficult journey to heal from her trauma in the care of an adult who treated her like the teenager she is and taught her to value things about herself other than her magical abilities.

Levaden Mountaincall, self-taught feral druid who refuses to join a Circle because she feels they value Preserving The Natural Order above saving lives and is furious that they treat "people" as the opposite of nature, rather than an integral part of it. Whose motto is "Sometimes the point of a fight is to have it. if you're only willing to fight for something when you think you can win, then you don't really care. Someone has to be willing to lock antlers with you."

Beverly Hale, the file clerk/assassin whose life's work is meticulously reconstructing the legal system of the Kingdom of Lordaeron so that she can figure out who inherited its debts and sue them for the 1500 gold Arthas Menethil owes her for destroying her apartment right after she put down the first month's rent. Yes, he also murdered her, but SHE came back and her GODDAMN MONEY hasn't. Also, she's unionizing the Val'kyr.

THERE IS NOOOO STRONG THROUGHLINE HERE NNNNNOPE.

I am COMPLETELY capable of creating RPG characters who are not defined by a searing hatred for abuse of power, a fierce undying belief in a duty of care, a bullheaded "no, you move" brand of understated defiance, and, if standing in front of literally any trauma victim, the willingness to dig in their heels and fight god rather than give an inch.

[rayshippouuchiha]

Omg, Ray, I had the weirdest thought for the premise of a bnha fic. So like you know the idea of Shinsou being in foster care and getting adopted by Aizawa? What if instead of Aizawa, he gets adopted by Izuku? But there's NO AGE CHANGES AT ALL from canon??

I don't remember what fic it was but I was reading a fic where a quirkless person had the option of putting in the paperwork to become a legal adult/emancipated from their parents at like 12(? I think it was a coffee shop fic but can't remember and will probs look for it later). And that got me thinking cause I live in California where the minimum age to sue for emancipation is 14, right? And I know I had a bunch of paperwork and stuff with all the laws and guidelines about it somewhere cause I helped a friend's younger sibling get their paperwork sorted to sue like three years ago. So I found all the info and got read up on it and there's nothing explicitly saying an emancipated minor COULDN'T adopt another minor so long as they meet adoption requirements right?

Like logically it probably couldn't happen but I control the law in this scenario so why couldn't an emancipated quirkless teenager adopt another teenager if they have the means? I'm imaging it's one of those Izuku just goes full online freelance quirk analyst as a means to income cause he is still a child at this point and isn't in school (I have entire thought maps with red string about the possibility and application of quirkless discrimination at various severity just for fic purposes at this point, so we're going with essentially 'non-white american women in the 1950s' as a basis for what were using and building from there in universe). Cause it's just, can you picture a 12-14 y/o adopting another 12-14 y/o and no one really being able to say he can't?

Just like, Shinsou, who doesn't have a lot of good feelings about adults and parental figures on top of dealing with the judgement around his 'villainous quirk' and just trying to make it to UA and prove everyone wrong, meeting this weird green kid and the two become friends. Shinsou crashing at Izuku's apartment when his foster family/group home gets to be too much or he's running from something until after a while he's basically moved in. Izuku bringing up adoption, cause he fits all the requirements and "how hard could it be?". And then ACTUALLY DOING IT.

Parent-Teacher conferences would be hilarious.

I'm thinking of maybe having Toga being a big figure too, not sure if 'also gets adopted by the Green Bean' or just 'hangs around a lot cause Izuku is a safe place' kind of scenario, but it's be interesting! Might include some more of the LoV too, who knows?

I have a lot of feelings about the possibilities in quirkless!Izuku and Izuku doesn't become a hero kind of fics and this one just ate my brain for like four hours! Sorry this is so long! Hope you have a good vibe to exist in!!

Look no I love this. Izuku seeing problems and people and being like all of 14 and fully going "well I'm your dad now" and then following through is something I need.

Please by the gods do this and @ me

[partywithponies]

Jem Cotton apologists want to be like "but they're not REALLY siblings, Hetty and Eliza aren't officially adopted and they're not blood related to the Cottons, it was normal for the time"

FIRST OF ALL, the very fact Jem has to keep bringing up "but we're not blood related so it's technically okay" and had to double check with the vicar that it WAS legal proves that, while legal, even at the time it was seen as a bit weird.

SECOND OF ALL, I don't know how you imagine "official adoption" worked in those days, but the very fact Hetty calls Peg "mother", Peg calls Hetty "my little girl", and Hetty lives there is enough for Hetty to be considered officially adopted by most people in those days.

THIRD OF ALL, Hetty herself calls Jem, Saul, and Gideon "my brother" and Martha and Eliza "my sister". Not "foster sister" or "foster brother", even though that's in her vocabulary and that's what staff at the hospital call them, Hetty always just refers to them as "my brother" or "my sister". Literally Hetty and Eliza consider each other sisters despite not even living with Peg at the same time just on virtue of both considering Peg their mother and Jem their big brother. Eliza considers Martha one of her siblings even though they never even met. Even after Hetty discovers her bio family she still repeatedly refers to Jem and Gideon as "my brothers" and Eliza as "my little sister" even to people who never met them and even TO her bio family, and in fact refers to Eliza as "my little sister" and thinks protectively or fondly of her far more often than she does her actual biological younger siblings! When Clover mentions she lost a sister, a biological full sibling she grew up with, Hetty says she can sympathise because "my brother died too", referring to Saul! Literally if Hetty didn't consider her foster brothers to be her real siblings then a romance between Hetty and one of them wouldn't be quite so bad, even despite points one and two (if Hetty and Gideon weren't so devoted to each other as brother and sister and only saw each other as close good friends then maybe a romance between them would be kinda cute), the crux of the issue is that as far as Hetty is concerned, they are siblings, Jem knows this, and Jem continues to persue her anyway in the hopes he can change her mind. After also promising all the same things to Eliza.

Finally, and most importantly, JEM IS 20. HETTY IS 15. ELIZA IS 10.

(I swear to god people on the internet will be like "you can't ship these two unrelated adults because they have a found family relationship" then turn around and say "it's fine for this adult to romantically persue his teenage adopted sister despite her discomfort with it actually because they're not REAL siblings and also it was the olden days")

[twoidiotwriters1]

Copycat & The Spider-man —(Marvel Fem!Oc)

Words: 992

Phase two Masterlist

Previous Chapter // Next chapter

Listen to: ‘Loser’ -by Julian Moon

xxv: Graduation

"P.J. Stark..."

"THAT'S OUR BOY!"

Peter, MJ, Ned, and C.C. were clapping and whistling so hard her ears were actually hurting, yet she couldn't bring herself to stop, this felt adequate for the occasion, it wasn't every day that her adoptive-fake brother graduated from high school.

Tony, Pepper, Rhodes, May, and Happy were there too, being the only adults the teens could kind of consider family. Tony had helped them tons, so he deserved being included in the celebration.

He had his own parties to be planning though, his engagement to Pepper was no secret, but they were taking their sweet time to get everything done. The couple had also decided to wait until Pietro's graduation, not wanting to steal his thunder.

Pietro walked off the stage with his face flushed, C.C.'d never seen him that flustered. When the ceremony ended the group approached to give him hugs and kisses, Tony patted his back.

"Well done, Speedy," He smiled proudly. "Next stop: College. We have one thing to address, though, and that's C.C.'s housing."

"Mr. Stark, we talked to my aunt and she said she has no problem with C.C. staying at our apartment during the semester," Peter was quick to inform.

Tony looked at him with his brows raised, behind him Rhodes and Pepper were smirking and talking under their breaths.

"At your place?" He tilted his head. "What now, are you sharing a bed too?"

"Tony, don't start," C.C. warned him.

"I think your legal guardian has a point," Happy intervened. "You can't stay at his place."

"Where should I stay then? Alone? Or are you going to let me move into your place?"

"That's not such a bad idea," Happy admitted. "My place has plenty of room! It'll only be during the semester, you can move back to P.J.'s place during the holidays..."

"I was joking," C.C. backtracked. "Tony, tell him that's a crazy idea!"

"Happy, that's absurd," The man said. "I fully support it."

"No!" Behind her, Peter let out a groan. "May would be home all the time! And it's not like we would do anything crazy, most of the time we sit around reading books and eating pizza..."

"Life's not fair for teenagers," Tony teased her, then he frowned. "Wow, you two really are nerds. Who made you that way?"

"Peter did," MJ walked past without stopping. "Not even I have routines that bland."

On their way to celebrate they divided the crew into two separate cars. She and Peter were at the back of Tony's with Ned as their third companion on the back seat, and Tony with Rhodes at the front.

"I can't believe we're starting our junior year next August," Peter said. "That used to feel ages away! Soon we'll be making our college applications..."

"Have you guys thought of where you'd like to go?" Rhodey asked.

"MIT's our number one choice," Peter answered. "We've talked about it, Ned and I, it'd be amazing if we get in."

"The boys have spoken," Tony glanced at her through the rearview mirror. "What about the Cat? You're not gonna copy their career paths?"

"I haven't given it enough thought," C.C. admitted. "I don't know... something simple, perhaps. Maybe I'll become a middle school teacher or something like that."

"It'd be very benevolent of you," Tony said.

"You have the looks to be that teacher all the single parents have a crush on," Ned joked.

Peter made a face. "That makes no sense, Ned!"

"She kinda does," Tony agreed at the same time Rhodey mumbled: 'Think it's the vintage dresses...'

"Well, it doesn't matter cause you'll probably be married by then," Ned continued. "You'll be that person that married their high school sweetheart and everyone thinks they're dorks."

Rhodey's eyes lit up. "You heard that, Tony? We'll have another engagement soon, don't throw your suit away!"

"If our children wed I'm not wearing the same suit I used to get married, have some taste," He joked.

"I wanna be an engineer," MJ told her. "MIT doesn't sound so bad if I can get the scholarship..."

"Course you'll get it, your grades are great," Peter pointed out.

"Aww, thanks dude," She punched his shoulder lightly.

"I just want to finish high school," C.C. sighed. "It's a miracle I managed to pull through two whole years. Not on my own, of course, you guys are the best tutors ever."

"Well, it's a gift," MJ winked at her. "But why is it so hard for you? You're always doing your assignments at the last minute and you have all night every night of the week to get them done!"

Ned opened his mouth and Peter stepped on him, MJ gave them a weird look but C.C. was quick to distract her.

"Well, now that I'll be living with Happy you can be sure he won't let me slack as much as Pietro did... the guy's a control freak! I've only been to his place once, but he has cameras everywhere! I don't know what he'll do considering he's not allowed to film me."

"Why isn't he?" MJ frowned.

"Oh," C.C. cussed internally. "Well, you know..."

"It's just weird to be filming a minor, right?" Peter saved her. "And you know C.C.'s parents are—"

"Big on privacy, yeah," The tall girl raised a brow. "Your family's super weird."

"They're super alright," Ned mumbled, C.C. elbowed him.

"Guys!" Pietro put an arm around Ned's shoulders. "What are your plans for the summer? I wanna hang out with all of my tiny little baby friends before I leave!"

"Peter and I are planning to spend the whole time playing video games and watching movies, but I guess we can move things around."

"Hey, why wasn't I invited to that?" Ned pouted.

"Cause they're dates, Ned."

"So? Not like I would stop you from kissing, I wouldn't even pay attention to you two!"

"No no, you're not spending the summer indoors!" Pietro made a face. "You pair of losers are going to humor me just this once, alright?"

Peter and C.C. shared a look, everyone had spent the day teasing them about their boring routine, they'd had enough.

"Fine," She gave in. "What do you want us to do?"

Next Chapter —>

Taglist.

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[qqueenofhades]

Hi!! 💕I was reading across your medieval queer history tag, and I came to the part of Muslims and homosexuality where you mention the active / passive narrative that this activity had.

I had two questions and I don't know if you can help me with them. I was wondering if there was something similar to that position in Nicky's time (?) at the European part of the world. And based on that, would it be a problem for the sexual activities that Nicky and Joe might have had? (sorry for this insane curiosity) I don't know if I'm being clear, haha. I mean, would it be a problem being active/passive for Nicky and Joe? ( based on common Islamic and/or European thought of the 11th century)

Thank you!!

Hmm. I feel like this is a better subject for fanfic (i.e. how Nicky and Joe viewed their relationship in the early days) because it touches on something historians can’t answer: how historical individuals privately viewed their own internal/emotional decisions and preferences. Obviously, Nicky and Joe themselves are fictional, so the only inner feelings they themselves had about how their relationship first developed, whether in its sexual components or otherwise, are the ones that are created for them by a team of modern writers and showrunners. As a historian, I can offer some perspective on the institutional, legal, and societal mores and customs that influenced how queer behavior was collectively viewed, tolerated, or restricted, but I can’t say how any given individual would have then interpreted that to themselves. Obviously, some gay people have been raised in such deeply self-hating environments that their internalized homophobia is very embedded and they struggle for years to get over it. Some others have been raised in the same environment but have never actually accepted any of it and have less difficulty in leaving it behind. Once again, this goes into the realm of speculation rather than strictly provable history, and which goes double for fictional characters.

Queer people have always existed in a complicated and sometimes contradictory relationship with the mainstream (that is, often heteronormative) dominant society. Sometimes they accept all of it in an attempt to “pass” or because they have been taught to be homophobic, sometimes they choose to selectively adopt parts of it but try to live a secret “second life,” sometimes they reject all of it. These choices are conditioned by personal safety/family background, political, cultural, religious, and social environments, formal and informal education, kinship and friendship networks, positive/negative reinforcement, individual character, and so on. There is not necessarily a “wrong” choice for a queer person to make, because each course of action comes with its own risks and rewards, but if you’re choosing to embrace your queer identity and to live out its truth (as Joe and Nicky seem to have done relatively soon after they met), then that will involve an element of rejecting whatever constraints heteronormative society has placed on you. After all, the formal legal conventions about sodomy in the Middle Ages weren’t developed in consultation with actual queer people. They reflected the concerns of conservative establishment clergymen, who weren’t interested in promoting social acceptance of it (and yet again, this doesn’t touch on THEIR actual feelings or whatever they might have done in private). I’ve discussed the complexity of disentangling historical homoromanticism (which was pretty widely celebrated in the medieval era) and historical homosexuality (which had a rockier time, but as I wrote about in this ask, the attempted policing of sexuality and sexual behavior was as much the case for m/f relationships as m/m or f/f ones -- nobody got away from this and it wasn’t just for the gays.)

Basically, I personally don’t think that either Joe or Nicky would have had a problem with sex or certain sexual positions, just because if both of them had reached the point of deciding that a Catholic/Muslim was their true love and they were going to run off together and be a couple no matter what anyone said about it, that already entailed rejecting a huge amount of the ideology they were originally taught and grew up with. It’s again a subject for fanfic how much Joe and Nicky were personally comfortable with being queer before they met each other, so this would more likely be a rejection of religious teaching about the unworthiness/evilness of the rival faith (as Nicky says, the love of his life was from the people he had been taught to hate). Since almost all medieval queer behavior and views on queer people had a religious component, if Joe/Nicky had gotten as far as rejecting the religious tenet that told them the other was Evil, they were (again, in my opinion) extremely unlikely to use any of those old religious arguments for prohibiting or proscribing certain kinds of sexual activity. I’m sure they had to negotiate many issues in the early days of their relationship (as I write about in DVLA), but they’re clearly head over heels in love with each other, wildly attracted to each other and have been for almost a millennium, and eager to embrace the physicality of that relationship, so I don’t personally see this as being a major stumbling block.

That said, you did ask about European views on sodomy in the 11th century and whether there was a parallel to Islamic views on the moral acceptability of the active vis-a-vis the passive partner. Since antiquity, there has always been less “shame” attached to the penetrative/top partner in sex, no matter whether the receiving partner is male or female. Ancient Greece is another example of this, where the adult man could not be penetrated without insult to his manhood and dignity, but the fact of him penetrating a younger man/teenage boy was a fine and even accepted rite of passage. We can obviously talk about how this is related to phallocentrism and misogyny, because the person “receiving” sex is usually expected to be a woman or a woman-equivalent person, which entails lower social status. The dominant male can take whichever sexual partner he pleases, and it’s a mark of honor and status for him to be virile (the very, very ancient chestnut about why playboys are tolerated and admired while sexually active women are “sluts.”) The gender of his partners might not matter as much as their social class, their status in relation to his, his “right” to expect sexual availability from them, and a whole lot of other factors. This could be and also was the case in medieval Europe. But may we point out that the men engaging in these kind of explicitly unequal relationships, which are more about reinforcing power and control than real desire, are very, very unlike the equal and loving mutual partnership between Joe and Nicky, where they were clearly happy to please and respect the other in whatever way.

It has not always been the case that same-sex activity would automatically be defined and suspect, though yes, there has never been an instance in Western history where it was placed uncomplicatedly on the same level as opposite-sex activity. It had to be constructed that way. As I keep saying, modern homophobia is a lot more stringent and explicit than any medieval expressions thereof, because if “homosexuality” was not constructed as a clearly recognized identity, there was less ability to rail against it. In fact, the usual rhetorical tactic was to just ignore it. Sodomy is known as the “silent sin” or “peccatum mutum” in Latin, because moralists usually didn’t talk about it or discuss it or give it an actual framework for debate and thus implied legitimacy. There were obvious exceptions (Peter Damian, Peter the Chanter, Bernardino of Siena, Heinrich Kramer, etc, etc) and as the medieval era went on, homosexuality became more grouped in with other undesirables. But that also reflected a growing visibility/awareness among people as to what it was. As I keep saying, you can’t be anxious about something, you can’t be worried about people being susceptible to it, you can’t be worried that it’s happening in reality, if it’s just an abstract concern of rhetoric that only a handful of churchmen know about. The increasing visibility of queerness as a category of exclusion in late medieval polemics reflected a) the social stress of the crises of the late medieval world and the usual function of Others as a scapegoat and b) the fact that by then, people must have had enough awareness of it as a pattern of consistent behavior for clerics to get mileage out of attacking it.

Anyway. In an attempt to summarize: historians can’t possibly know how historical queer people felt about themselves, if they were influenced by societal or internalized homophobia (itself quite different from modern homophobia), how much of the dominant social narrative they accepted, the reasons for the choices that they made, if they saw their queer preferences as a sin or as a valid lifestyle, and so on. But it seems unlikely that historical queer people specifically in loving long-term relationships, such as Joe and Nicky, would be unduly tied to much of that, and that has always been the case.

[existentialstatesofmind]

Opening Up

Clare: often found new books online by browsing through suggestions of similar reads to past favorites. She was sure this wouldn’t be much different. “I like that feature already. The biggest problem I run into is looking for paranormal romance and getting horror. Yeah if the cover looks gory or violent, I won’t get it.” She grinned at him. “Thank you, if you really don’t mind helping me out. We probably will be using a wok. Unless they are worried about grease fires.” Clare became uneasy at the thought. “There are so many distractions in a classroom and I have slow reflexes.” She laughed nervously. “No problem. We’ll get along fine. I just have to warn Alli.” Her best friend was more outgoing than she was and could easily become defensive. Clare remembered how Alli had taken an immediate dislike to Jenna. Once she made up her mind about someone it was difficult to change it. “Good! I was starting to miss the days when I didn’t care about my appearance and would wear whatever I wanted even if it caused me to be made fun of.” She chuckled. “Yay!” She enthusiastically responded to going to a Cultural Festival. “What is Host Cafe?” Clare knew if it had anything to do with drinking the schools were going to say no. “Oh my god.” She squealed. “If we are doing this, we have to go all out! No point in doing something with so much potential half assed. You have to wear an apron with a big satin bow tying it in the back, gloves, high heels, maid headpiece and feather duster. Everything allowed. Thigh highs with the garter might be against the rules. Though I’d pay money to see you, Kota. Of course I’ll gladly wear a male waiter costume which is probably a vest over a button down shirt, black slacks, a bowtie, and men’s shoes. Can’t forget those. I’m going to have to buy a wig. What color should I go with? I want straight hair too that will make me look different. Maybe Alli and I can draw fake mustaches on each other! I think that would look better than one you glue on. I wonder if I can trick her into letting me give her a goatee?” She grinned mischievously. “I know. I just wasn’t sure how much you trusted him with. I’m glad he’s not like your brothers, you need someone to confide in besides me. So we let everyone think whatever they want? But I don’t have to lie?” Clare was glad she didn’t have to confirm any rumors that might make their way back home. She didn’t care about being thrown out of Jesus Club, however, Clare couldn’t let her parents find out she dared to sleep in the same bed as a boy (even if they weren’t doing anything other than sleeping). “Technically it’s an Irish Claddagh ring.” She doubted many girls would ask the meaning behind it. “I’m not ready emotionally, and I make no promises when I will be. Emi’s good birth control. I love her but I couldn’t take care of her full time like you do. My family’s a mess, I’d have zero support, and a baby is a lot more work. I don’t want us to resent each other because we had to miss out being a normal teenagers. I’m going away for college, I want to live in a dorm and be independent.” If she really got pregnant at 16, her parents and especially Darcy (who looked down on teen moms) would pressure her into giving the baby up for adoption but Clare saw no reason to bring that up. She nodded. “We’ll table it. I obviously am not comfortable with relying on a condom either, I’d have to come up with a way to get around needing parental permission. Or Mom’s head would explode.” Clare didn’t want Kota to change his mind later on and break up with her for a girl who was on birth control. There was nothing she could do about it though. “Seriously? That might be your best kept secret. I mean I have seen tabloid articles with headlines like Melanie Martinez goes on a weekend rendezvous with her younger man! But they never mentioned Toronto.” Clare didn’t feel stupid for not recognizing her own city or Kota if he’d ever been caught on camera too because no one else at school did either. Mostly Clare thought those articles were bogus. But sometimes they guessed Melanie was in some exotic location with an upcoming actor who had a baby face but was really 25. She listened to their crazy adventures, and more they could possibly have. She could never be apart of that. But that was okay. At least she was finally getting to go somewhere AND currently hanging out with Melanie Martinez! Clare smiled. “It won’t be a free for all but it will be parentless.” She walked out of the office and looked at Melanie before answering Kota. “How about starting with Yohio’s lab?”

Kota: looked at Clare when she mentioned paranormal romance and getting horror. "They classify paranormal as supernatural and I've read one supernatural romance that I liked. It didn't have horror, but it was also adult." he explained. "I'm not sure, to be honest I haven't heard of them using a wok, but if you go to someone's house to learn they may use a wok." he shrugged. He listened to her talk about warning Alli and nodded, then laughed when she mentioned her clothes. "A host club is basically a legal form of prostitution without the prostitution. We'd have to wear suits and look nice, the customer will get a list of names of who's on duty and pick which one they want to be with. We'd have to sit with the customer or customers while they eat, we'd be able to drink soda or something with them and we'd have to do what they say. If a girl tells me to flirt with her, I'd have to or we'd lose money. I'd have to kiss her hand regardless though, when the customers leave a kiss on the hand is a proper goodbye." he explained the best he could. Hearing Clare go on about the cafe causing him to shake his head. "You can't do any of that. Everything is supplied by the school. The outfits are decided by votes, the ones that get the most votes are what we will be wearing and they're handmade by our class. The wigs will be provided by the theater committee, the shoes will also be provided for us by the school. You and Alli cannot have facial hair of any sort, you'd have to look like a high school boy and there will already be someone to do your make up and mine. Who knows they may only straighten and style your hair, there are guys with long hair at school. To be honest, I do my hair differently in Japan, there are times when Natsumi stood on a chair and tied my bangs for me with a band on the top of my head. It looked like a small ponytail and it's not uncommon for guys to do that there like it is here." he assured. "No we don't have to lie. If they know you're a virgin who cares? If they think we're having sex, let them." he said honestly. He didn't correct anyone either, he just let them think what they wanted. "I feel the same, I'm not emotionally ready and I don't know when I will be either. I'm actually going to community college because most dormitories won't allow Emi to live with me in them and who's to say if and when my aunt will come back for her. When I graduate Degrassi, I'm getting an apartment to live in wherever I go to school and I'm going to bring Emi apartment shopping with me. If my aunt comes and gets her by then I'll stay in a dorm. I do know that newborns cry a lot and not all of them sleep through the night so continuing high school with a child is nearly impossible and it would be just as impossible to go to an actual college like we want, we'd have to go online and that would suck a lot. I don't plan on having sex until I'm able to take responsibility for whatever happens." he smiled at her and kissed her cheek. "We can worry about that later and I don't think you'll need to get your mom's permission for birth control. I'm not planning on being ready while I'm still in high school so there's no need to worry about that." he said honestly and listened to her. "No, we were in Cali when that happened so don't worry about recognizing the city. I'm able to take small trips between here and America when I want as long as my mom knows. Plus they didn't really get my face, I wore dark glasses and a hat so they couldn't get my face." he confirmed. As Clare spoke, he looked around his office to make sure he had everything and smiled. "Yohio's lab it is." he said before hearing his phone ring and answering it. "Great, I've been trying to call you." he chimed to the person on the other end. "I'm bringing my girlfriend when I bring the jacket to you so..." he trailed off and listened. "That'd be perfect. I'll make sure she's free and I'm willing to pay you back for this. Her name is Clare and please whatever you do don't embarrass her. If you do the IOU you have against me will be null and void." he stated in the phone and smiled. "Great and ok, I'll put paper in my fax machine so you can fax whatever you need to." he smiled. "Ok, I'll see you then and I promise not to tell her. Love ya too." he chuckled and hung up the phone. "Clare, keep your schedule clear for next Saturday. We apparently have plans and I'm not sure what's going to happen since I'm in debt to someone right now." he explained. "Ah, debt that you need to pay with your body." Mel laughed jokingly. "That's not funny, for all I know she could be planning something and though she won't make me her slave I'm still unable to find out what she has up her sleeve." he sighed and stood up. "To Yohio's office." he chimed and lead them down a corridor. "We can't go inside due to the fact he's working and if we scare him or the chemist it could cause problems." he informed and stopped to press a button on the elevator. "What is he making?" Mel asked. "Perfume." Kota answered. "We're selling it in the store downstairs and in Japan first. If the perfume sells well, we'll build him a lab in Japan." he added as they got on the elevator and he pressed the button for the third floor. "The girl you were on the phone with, do I know her?" Mel asked. "Not personally, but you know who she is." he said. "That could be anyone." Mel sighed. "I'll tell you who it is later." he said. "Maybe she just wants to hang out." Mel shrugged. "That's a possibility. I have only been able to hang out with her in America so maybe she wants me to give her a tour of Toronto." he sighed in relief as the elevator stopped and he lead them to a big window. "This is Yohio's lab." he said looking through it to see Yohio and waved at him, in turn Yohio waved back wearing a hooded lab coat, hospital mask, rubber gloves and protective glasses. "Where to next?" he asked.