#carthago delenda est

[havendance]

Okay, I want to play too. Building off of @dustorange's post and @silverwhittlingknife's post

I think, how I would play this: the circus still happens obviously.

And then Dick dies when he's 16 in circumstances similar to Batman #408, where Dick is shot by the Joker and it causes him to fall to his death. (Dick has to die by falling. To me.) Bruce isn't able to catch him.

Bruce is obviously devastated. Going off of Silver, we'll say no Robin!Jason in this AU. Jason can get away with stealing the tires off of the Batmobile of an extremely grieving Batman. As a treat.

Tim is also devastated. I usually have Tim being 3 at the circus, so I guess he's 11-12 when this happens.

I think the fact that Dick was the only Robin in this scenario means that Tim is more reluctant to push himself as a replacement Robin. That and the fact that his HERO Dick Grayson died means I think that he's slower to act.

Eventually though, things get bad enough in Gotham that he does just because someone has to and he ends up as Robin. We'll handwave the details for now.

I think that Dick should get to come back to life during the Knightfall Saga. As a treat.

He comes back to Gotham just in time to see that there's a new Robin and watch Bruce get his back broken.

Tim's been Robin longer before Knightfall in this AU, so he's got a little more experience, but he's also 14, and while Bruce is lying in the Batcave and they don't know whether he's going to wake up or not, and he's fetching the medicine in that one comic, he runs into this unknown, edgy looking vigilante who blames him for Bruce getting his back broken and it's just everything he's been thinking to himself.

Dick sticks around in Gotham long enough to see that there's a new Batman and of course Bruce has someone else he can get to do that. Of course he doesn't need Dick. He runs off to go do like, black-ops vigilante work somewhere.

I think he and Tim do run into eachother once more before Dick leaves town though and Tim's like 'I know I'll never be as good as the first Robin, but that just means I need to learn everything I can' and tries to bother Dick into teaching him stuff because he can tell that this mysterious vigilante is way more skilled than him.

Dick mostly avoids Gotham, but I think they keep running into each other, coincidentally. Tim ends up teaming up with him during Contagion instead of Catwoman and they're both in Paris at the same time etc etc.

And eventually on one of these team-ups, Dick does a quadruple somersault and Tim sees it and everything clicks together and he imminently runs away because that's Dick Grayson and Tim has been talking up the first Robin all this time and it's a lot okay?

I think this is about when No Man's Land happens so Tim goes to go hide in Gotham and help out Batman and become a National News story and all that jazz instead of thinking about it.

But afterwards, Tim is ON THE CASE. I think he doesn't tell Bruce about this because if Dick hasn't told Bruce then he probably has his reasons? And what he was actually wrong? (Even though he knows he isn't)

And then, um, let's put the Dick and Bruce finally confronting each other during Bruce Wayne: Murderer/Fugitive because Dick comes back to Gotham when he hears that Bruce murdered someone because he doesn't want to believe it, but I think he also can't have that same bone deep belief in his innocence that he does in canon because of all the estrangement.

So he attacks Batman and demands to know the truth (without revealing who he is) and Bruce won't answer. Bruce also doesn't know how this mysterious vigilante knows he's Bruce Wayne/got accused of murder, so he low key suspects DICK of framing him, which normally he'd be too busy being Batman full time to care, but here he also recognizes some of Dick's fighting style so he starts investigating him to uncover the mystery.

Meanwhile, Tim noticed that Dick is back in town, so he's trying to recruit Dick to help him get to the bottom of this. He knows Dick's identity now, but he doesn't tell Dick that, he just drops various hints that he knows and hooks Dick up with a line to Oracle (who he has also not shared his conclusions with other than a vague 'there's something about him')

And hmm somehow this all resolves with like, Dick's identity getting out and him and Bruce talking face to face. Bruce is just so desperately amazed that Dick is there, meanwhile Dick still has various issues that are not resolved and it probably ends with Dick running away again and Bruce holding himself back from chasing after him like he desperately wants to. Because if Dick doesn't want anything to do with him then that's just his right because Bruce WAS the one who got him killed.

He does stalk Dick from afar though. Just without initiating contact. Tim and Barbara are more pushy about trying to hang out/talk with Dick in the aftermath.

To skip ahead, I think Bruce leaves Dick the Batmantle after he 'dies' as this last ditch attempt to share how much he loves and respects Dick.

And this getting long so I think I'll call it here.

[richo1915]

[jacobpking]

The Evolution of Scipio and Hannibal Two of the most fascinating characters in antiquity. Their rivalry and eventual respect is the stuff of legend, so I just had to draw them.

[latin-phrases-showdown]

Round 1 Poll 3

Ceterum (autem) censeo Carthaginem esse delendam (often abbreviated as "Carthago delenda est")

Means "Furthermore, I consider that Carthage must be destroyed" / "Carthage must be destroyed"

Cato the Elder repetitively called for Carthage's destruction repetitively at the end of his Senate's speeches with this phrase, whether it was relevant to the subject at hand or not.

His main opposant mirrorred him, saying "Carthago servanda est" (Carthage must be saved).

Rome eventually declared war to Carthage, which was razed

Ultima latet, ut observentur omnes (often abbreviated as "ultima latet")

Literally, "the last is hidden, that all may be observed," and usually translated as our last hour is hidden from us, so that we watch them all. It means that we don't know when we die so we can/should enjoy life as it lasts without worrying about it / in the meantime

Found on ancient sundials and other timepieces. Delightfully morbid !

[victusinveritas]

[dubiousfacts]

1770SP|A95

Devon Stacey, a landmark American poet, envisioned this poem-writing machine 4 months prior to his unfortunate death.

[weatherman667]

The 1st Punic War:  Oversimplified

This was Rome’s first campaign outside Italy.  They captured a Carthaginian warship, copied it.  In about 4 years they had naval superiority over the naval power.  While they figured out how to fight a war at sea, not getting smashed up in a storm was a bit more complicated for them.

Carthage had no idea how to wage a war on the land, and so brought in a single Spartan general, who completely turned the tides of war.

Rome uniquely had it’s Legions.  The Legionnaires had 5 year contracts, and after 5 years, almost the entire army was replaced.  This meant that Rome could afford staggering loses that would destroy any other country.

Runtime:  27:33/22:04

[havendance]

Tiny Titans Icons!

Feel free to use or adapt with credit.

[havendance]

Remembering the one Hades and Persephone fanfic retelling I read where the author had clearly never eaten a pomegranate in their life and just had the character in the Persephone role take a bite out of the side like an apple

[havendance]

My silly headcannon is that Tim sends out a weekly email newsletter to everyone's batmail accounts like: Batman's going off the rails again 🙄 Oracle says you all have terrible passwords and need to change them because everyone fell for her phishing tests. Except Cass. Cass, Oracle says you need to actually check your batmail. The Joker's been lying low this week, but someone's been buying up a bunch of abandoned movie theaters so be ready. Also, Dick, you're out of Zesti again. You should get some more. It's on sale.

[havendance]

I think we should torture Dick by coming up with an AU where Tim's the one to get dealt the faked death/undercover in spyral thing instead. Like, congratulations man! You're the last one standing. (Well, except for Jason I suppose but Jason's probably causing problems on purpose.) You've won an even bigger than usual guilt complex. No, you can't opt out.

[havendance]

Anyway, my proposal for a run on Detective Comics where I write a series of one-shot stories showcasing all of the various supporting cast Batman has accumulated with stories, including, but not limited to:

Batman invites Nightwing to Gotham to help him solve a murder. The murder is very straightforward and they dance around the real reason Bruce invited him, until at the end, he finally admits in a constipated Bruce way that it's the anniversary of him adopting Dick and he wanted to spend time with him.

Huntress and Robin (Tim Drake) team up to investigate Killer Croc. It turns out he's turning over a new leaf in the sewers near the Marina. Huntress is dubious, but Robin convinces her to give him a chance, though she says she'll be watching him. We re-canonize Joker: Last Laugh.

Damian and Duke team up to take on a street-racing operation--a mission that naturally requires them to do some high adrenaline racing together.

The Riddler gets on social media with a plot that involves lots of puzzles and clues all over Gotham. Oracle taps into old members of "We are Robin" to take it down.

Batgirl (Stephanie Brown) and Batman end up on the same missing persons case. With the pressure on to find the missing child, they snipe at each other as tensions rise. In the end, after saving the kid, Bruce sort of kind of apologizes in a Bruce way and expresses some measure of respect for her.

Jason teams up with Ghostmaker to take on, idk, one of the Clayfaces. Does Gotham still have one of those? I haven't read any comics ghostmaker's in yet, but from I've heard it sounds like they'd have an interesting dynamic. Jason gets flashbacks to digging his way out of his grave.

Luke Fox recruites Harper Row (She does engineering stuff right? I also need to read comics she has a significant role in.) They take some new tech for a joyride and go bother the Penguin.

Batgirl (Cassandra Cain) and Azrael team up to take down Mad Hatter. He probably has some elaborate Alice in Wonderland theming going on that neither of them get. (I think neither of them should have read it.)

Batwoman and Catwoman team up to steal back some Kane family heirlooms, possibly from Jacob Kane (What's his and Kate's relationship looking like anyway?), possibly from someone else.

Gotham Girl and somebody. Me advancing my Cass & Claire agenda Possibly Oracle trying to rehabilitate her in that controlling yet well-intentioned way she has sometimes? Someday, I will get to being more up to date on what Claire's status quo in current comics is.

A handful of representatives from Gotham's various crime families get together in the backroom of a bar somewhere. They play poker and exchange stories of being busted by the various bat-affiliated vigilantes in which they are very scary and almost inhuman. It ends with Batgirl (Cass) busting in and beating them up.

Helena Bertinelli takes a gig as a substitute teacher at Gotham Academy. She teams up with Maps & other supporting cast when Mr Freeze takes the school hostage while trying to escape the police.

[havendance]

Tim showing up at Haly's Circus in a Lonely Place of Dying like

[havendance]

What about a world where Cass didn't get left alone after dying and coming back and loosing her friend and Blüdhaven got nuked? What about a world where she got to go on the around the world cruise with Bruce and Dick and Tim? What about the world where she wasn't manipulated and brainwashed and forced to kill again? She deserved so much better.

[havendance]

Velveteen vs The Masterpost

When I was in high school, I stumbled across Seanan McGuire’s series of “Velveteen vs.” stories, staring Velma “Velveteen” Martinez, a former child superhero with the power to animate toys, who stumbles from one misadventure to the next. Taking place in a world where superheroics is run almost entirely by a single corporation and child heroes are put through some of the worst abuses of child stars, the series features fun characters, worldbuilding, and relationships, and of course, cool fight scenes. In true comics fashion, it ends on a rather open-ended note and, as far as I can tell, she hasn’t written any stories since 2017, but most of the main arcs are tied up and I definitely recommend you check them out!

(I became obsessed with these stories after finding them. An example of me getting into comics before I actually got into comics.)

(Thank you to https://broken-engines.blogspot.com/ for compiling directory of story links I could borrow for this post.)

Velveteen vs. The Isley Crayfish Festival

Velveteen vs. The Coffee Freaks

Velveteen vs. The Flashback Sequence

Velveteen vs. The Old Flame

Velveteen vs. The Junior Super Patriots, West Coast Division

Velveteen vs. The Eternal Halloween

Velveteen vs. The Ordinary Day

Velveteen vs. Patrol

Velveteen vs. The Blind Date

Velveteen vs. Blacklight vs. Sin-Dee, Part I

Velveteen vs. Blacklight vs. Sin-Dee, Part II

Velveteen vs. The Holiday Special

Velveteen vs. The Secret Identity

Martinez and Martinez v. Velveteen

Velveteen vs. The Alternate Timeline, Part I

Velveteen vs. The Alternate Timeline, Part II

Velveteen vs. The Retroactive Continuity

Velveteen Presents Victory Anna vs. All These Stupid Parallel Worlds

Velveteen vs. The Uncomfortable Conversation

Velveteen vs. Bacon

Velveteen vs. The Robot Armies of Dr. Walter Creelman, DDS

Velveteen vs. The Fright Night Sorority House Massacre Sleepover Camp

Velveteen vs. Vegas

Velveteen Presents Victory Anna vs. The Difficulties With Pan-Dimensional Courtship

Velveteen vs. Legal

Velveteen Presents Jackie Frost vs. Four Conversations and a Funeral

Velveteen vs. Jolly Roger

Velveteen vs. Everyone, Part I

Velveteen vs. Everyone, Part II

Sponsorship: Velveteen vs. The Epilogue

Velveteen vs. The Aftermath

Velveteen vs. Hypothermia

Velveteen vs. Santa Claus

Velveteen vs. Global Warming

Velveteen Presents The Princess vs. Public Relations

Velveteen vs. The Thaw

Velveteen vs. Balance

Velveteen vs. Spring Cleaning

Velveteen Presents Polychrome vs. The Court of Public Opinion and Not Punching Anyone

Velveteen vs. The Melancholy of Autumn

Velveteen vs. A Disturbing Number of Crows

Velveteen vs. Trick or Treat

Velveteen Presents Action Dude vs. Doing the Right Thing

Velveteen vs. The Consequences of Her Actions

Velveteen vs. Going Home Again

Velveteen vs. Everything You Ever Wanted

Velveteen vs. The Retroactive Continuity (2)

Velveteen Presents Jacqueline Claus vs. The Lost and the Found

Velveteen vs. Recovery

Velveteen vs. Temptation

[havendance]

Seen any good Helena fics?

So most of these are at least 10 years old and like a thousand words because that’s where I’ve been able to find fics that dig into her comics character rather than stuff where she’s one of like 15 different tagged characters or Birds of Prey movie fic.

Winter Dark by Runespoor

<1k, complete. An atmospheric little piece about Helena in the early winter of No Man’s Land. Has dark fairy tale vibes.

Holding the Line by Dragonbat

<1k, complete. A look into Helena’s mind during her final stand against the joker in No Man’s Land.

La Familia by wabbitseason

<1k, complete. A short piece about Helena as an outsider from the rest of Bats.

Answers Over Ice Cream by Dragonbat

1.2k, complete. Helena and Barbara discuss the new question over ice cream.

evolving slowly by favouriteyear

<1k, complete. A bite-sized introspective piece around the Batman reborn era.

Finally, some bonus fics:

some nights by CloudDreamer

2k, complete. You probably know this one already, but for anyone else reading this list. Huntress and Green Arrow do some target practice together late at night.

To overlook the circle vast by Teland

3.2k, complete. This one’s more focused on Tim, but Helena does have a solid part in it. Tim & Helena post-war games/Identity Crisis. 

The Prince Who Runs Through the Night by Havendance

2.5k, complete. Look, I’ve got to self-promote somehow. Helena&Talia in a Bruce Wayne Helena Bertinelli role swap. Also with bonus baby!Damian.