#({and I recognize other fans who have interacted on my posts} and they're clearly not any of them either)

[ingravinoveritas]

After seeing all those stories of Georgia going shopping with David (I'm honestly surprised that David knows how to drive, I don't know why), I think David is fed up with so much video.

@electronic-chocolate @victorianlonging Okay, so...I have indeed seen all of the stories that are referenced here, and I think a couple of things can be true at the same time. But let's first get the visual up for anyone who hasn't seen it (all in one video, for ease of viewing):

The first thought that I had is how reminiscent this was of what we've seen recently, with Georgia filming David when he seemingly really doesn't want to be filmed (such as at that festival last month).

What also came to mind is something I think at least several of us thought of (if my DMs are any indication), which is that David is clearly, visibly annoyed. There's no real way to not notice it, with him looking incredulous in the car (though I did laugh when he said "I'm not dressed for this," given how adorable he looked without even realizing it), and then when she sets the tone by immediately using the word "content." There's no question that that's what the objective of this was: To have content of/with David that Georgia could post to garner attention.

Once they're in the store, we see him balling up the shopping bags in his hands, which to me came across as a sign of anxiety. And given how non-confrontational we know David is, it's almost amazing to hear him respond to Georgia's "Say hi!" with an immediate "Nope." And the whole thing sort of becomes what you might call a self-narrating zoo exhibit (or "self-paparazzi," as I recently heard someone aptly describe it) where David is literally just trying to shop for groceries while Georgia is sticking a camera in his face.

We also notice that at one point, David is recognized by some fans and stops to take a picture with them, which when you think about it is likely a regular occurrence, since he has one of the most famous faces in the country. But because that is the case, you'd also think he would feel a sense of relief when those interactions are over and he no longer has to be "on"...until he goes back to Georgia and she is filming him. And as good-natured as David is, there's no doubt that it must get a little tiring after a while.

All that said--and in the interest of providing a balanced perspective--it is possible that David was playing things up, to an extent, and perhaps even exaggerating some of the annoyance that we saw. And there was something else about this that stood out to me, and that deserves discussion: His shoes...

Yes, David was wearing gay pride Doc Martens. GAY PRIDE BOOTS, ladies and gentlemen and those of other gender persuasions. And when we realize this is the case, everything about this vlog/series of stories starts to gets very interesting. Because while the shoes were by no means the focal point of the Insta stories, Georgia had to know that David's eagle-eyed fans would clock them right away. And clock them they did (and I also noticed this pair of Pride-themed Doc Martens, and would not be at all surprised to learn that David owns a pair of those as well).

Leaving aside the fact that no straight man on this Earth--no matter how strong an ally--would wear those boots (I mean...come on), I almost saw this as a callback/follow up to Georgia's story from a few months ago where she appeared to use "their" pronouns when talking about David (rather than he/him). Much discussion was had at the time of this being a way to "test the waters" for David to start being more open about his sexuality/identity, and this almost feels like a continuation of that.

Having heard from queer followers of mine who are not fully out to their families/friends, it seems that it is not uncommon for folks in that position to wear things to drop little "hints" around people they are not ready to disclose to yet. And when you think about the number of "hints" from the last few months--the nonbinary pin, the pronoun Insta story, David getting emotional talking about Pride Month on that podcast, and now these new Insta stories wearing those boots--it makes you wonder if it's all building toward something.

Whatever the case may be, it's still difficult to overlook how uncomfortable David looked at times in those videos today--even if he was playing things up. For my part, I would genuinely rather never have Georgia post anything about David again than see him in her posts knowing that he is uncomfortable with it. I also agree that her hunger for content seems to be increasing, but I would also like to hope that if David did seriously ask Georgia to stop filming--for any reasons--that she would do so.

So I suppose we'll have to see what (if anything) this all leads to, and what will happen if/when she films him again. Happy as always to hear others' thoughts in the comments...

[aida-sparks]

Buddie fans are relentless (and it's a good thing)

Geez, I was not prepared for the rollercoaster of woe that comes from shipping a pair that is not canon (yet!).

I am not a new fan to the show, 9-1-1. I've loyally watched every week for years, cherished the members of the 118, cherished Buck and Eddie's special relationship. I just hadn't been involved in the fandom of it all up until recently. I was just a tv viewer. But being newer to interacting with the fandom, I admit that consuming social media about 911 and Buddie has thrown me for a bit of a loop. I keep seeing the same recycled tactics to argue why people who ship buddie are delusional and why buddie will "never happen". These arguments are off-putting and frankly quite poor. (I don't like to focus on the negative so this will be my only post dedicated to this.)

Argument One: "There's already a gay couple on the show." No kidding. The statement is problematic in and of itself; people don't go around limiting the number of straight couples on a show, do they? It's fantastic that we have a strong, integral gay couple in Hen and Karen, two beautiful and fabulous lesbians, that are vital to this show, but why can't there be more? One representation alone doesn't cover the spectrum of LGBTQ+ portrayals of different romantic dynamics.

Argument Two: "Why can't we have two guys be close without putting a romantic label on it? It's refreshing to see male friendship." Bro... Platonic male friendship is important (all friendship is). It's not all that uncommon, though. Male friendship is focused on a lot already in many shows. But two adult male friends discovering new aspects of their identify that shift their relationship with each other toward something romantic? That's the more refreshing take here; it's one that we don't get to see in media right now but should. Flip the script, 9-1-1.

Argument Three: "They weren't introduced as gay or bi-sexual. It would be too out of left field to go there now." Not true. The show has the creative freedom to explore this narrative and can do it plausibly. There is obviously a very large part of the 9-1-1 fandom that has already interpreted Buck and Eddie's story as having the potential to become romantic. The pair has many parallels to the other canon couples on the show. There are plenty of moments and scenes from prior seasons (post-tsunami with Christopher, the shooting, the Will, all of Eddie Diaz's fond gazes aimed at Buck, etc.) that can be referenced in future episodes via well-crafted montage/edit that will help shed light on any developing feelings from either or both Buck and Eddie. Besides, not allowing a relationship to evolve into something different just because it didn't start out that way? What kind of stunted outlook is that? We want a story about how individuals can question and explore their sexuality at any age. Heck, during the graveyard scene near the end of season 6, Buck and Eddie talked about how experiences have changed them. They're clearly still growing and changing as individuals. It is not a stretch for them to discover whatever they've been searching for this whole time is actually found in each other. ---- That's it from me on this. I'm going to try doing a better job of ignoring the negative talk out there. I hope all buddie fans stay positive too, and when they call us relentless, we take that as a good thing. I hope we all recognize and resect the other characters and ships of this wonderful, wonderful show of ours too! Most of all, I hope we respect each other.

[beautifulpersonpeach]

BPP, can I ask you your Jikooker origin story?

You're clearly an OT7 through and through, but your deep and special connection with the rapline makes me wonder how on earth JM and JKs' bond managed to snatch your attention away from them, even for a second.

***

Hi Anon,

I've written about my summary views on jikook before which you can find in my Masterlist under the "Jikook" sub-heading, but you can start off with this post.

If you're asking about how exactly I ended up here though, on jikook tumblr, that's almost entirely due to my joker friend, Abby, who convinced me to tap into the community here about three years ago. Generally, I don't think there's any Korean person who hears and sees how jikook communicate, who doesn't make a double-take. Most every Korean ARMY thinks they're one of the closest pairs. I mean, it's painfully obvious, and while much of the Korean side of the fandom eventually writes them off due to some cultural factors (it's just 'easier' and more respectful to not look too closely at people who could be queer), the fact is that a lot of people still have more brow raises with jikook than, well, anybody else.

I'd been following BTS since 2014 and by 2015 I already had questions about jikook, even just watching from the sidelines as a casual fan. And the primary reason for that was Jung Kook. His stimming behaviours have been obvious since debut, but one thing that was curious for me was how many times, his impulse to soothe would involve Jimin. Either by seeking close proximity to Jimin or by physically touching him - even times when it was inconvenient for not just Jimin, but other members like the rapline. I know a lot of people feel in their early days, Jimin was kinda heavy-handed with his attention on Jungkook, but I think Jimin acted that way primarily for Jungkook's benefit. I mean it's clear Jimin has cared for Jungkook deeply since debut but I feel the way he displayed it, so loudly and sometimes almost obnoxiously, acted as a key stabilizing and assuring force for JK in an environment that could've easily overwhelmed him. I mean, this is the same Jungkook who almost a decade later, says one of the most important tattoos on his body, is the plea to "please love me". What I mean to say is, their fundamental personalities, behaviours, and needs haven't changed the entire time I've been watching them, and I believe that over the years, they've recognized these things about each other and naturally gravitated towards each other because they know "we click".

The way Jimin managed his interactions with Jungkook was one of the biggest indications of his intelligence, to me, both emotionally and otherwise. These days, I feel their relationship is significantly more balanced and reciprocal. And like I've said elsewhere, their relationship to me appears to have only deepened with time. Today I have no idea what jikook is, but that doesn't matter to me because their respect and love for each other doesn't appear to have changed. At all.

[sweetblossoms]

saw your post abt rapunzel manipulating tim in their convo and god hard agree it Is concerning that so many ppl didn't see it. also crazy to me that ppl are mad at tim and defending rapunzel, saying that they would have taken the book too because tim was being rude etc. to me it seemed that both tim the character and ally the player Wanted to believe that rapunzel wasn't part of the plan and was good but just kind of strange, and both are successfully fooled. tim absolutely fumbles the interaction and ally could have played things better, but rapunzel was so clearly in charge of the conversation, leading him into saying worse and worse things and putting his foot in his mouth while tim was genuinely trying to be nice. tim is awkward and blunt and eccentric with Everyone, it's weird that ppl are saying he was being singularly rude to her or patronizing her or that he deserved to get the book taken. that interaction was clumsy as hell and so many words could have been chosen better but tim so clearly was trying so hard to fix his initial fuck up and be friendly w her in the same weird way he talks to everyone. I don't see how ppl came out of that scene on her side even if tim was a little rude and unfortunate w his word choice, and it's concerning to see ppl being like "ha take that stupid old man!!" abt the book being taken + in defense of a character we met an episode and a half ago and who we have been told outright is an expert at deceiving people. the princesses are so so interesting as characters and the morals going on are complex and that's a whole different conversation, but I feel like no matter whether you love rapunzel or not, ppl should be able to recognize that she was manipulating tim in that moment and taking advantage of his trusting disposition. not trying to start discourse in your ask box ofc!!! I've just seen No One Else express discomfort w rapunzel in that scene

anon this ask has been living in my head rent free since you sent it, i've been stewing over how to respond because y e s. for context, check out this post to save discourse on main (this is about to be a long one of fan critic analysis, get your popcorn and settle in if you wanna read, this is the longest post i've ever made), im gonna put my thoughts and response under a read more, sososo many spoilers under the cut read at your own risk

These were all in the replies and tags and I want to reply to all of them bc they're all worthy of being talked about bc i feel like the majority of the fandom is almost scared to critique?? So like let's talk about it since nobody else seems to be taking this approach from what I can tell (thank you to you anon for being on my side as well as the rest of you who are screaming with me) I will begin by saying that my original post is not critiquing ally the player, or any of the other players. i understand that they were in that dome, filming a session of dungeons and dragons, and improv acting and roleplaying for many hours on end with back to back episodes. i kind of get ally and the rest of the table maybe just wanting to "hope for the best", especially ally as they are quite a "hope for the good in others" type of person. it's frustrating from a viewer perspective sure, but i totally dont blame anyone ever for making a "wrong" or "non-optimal" choice while playing a ttrpg, they just have the misfortune of being filmed while doing so. i myself have made tons of bag fumbles while playing dnd, even when i thought everything through ten times over. so anything i have said or will say forward isn't to put any shouldering on to the people playing these silly storybook characters, like, i Get It

What i do want to critique is the fan response, which is the more worrying one!!! like i said in my original post, i was surprised by my d20 watch buddy having a similar response to ally. the total "oh, maybe she's just quirky bc of the self isolation, maybe she's autism rep" approach. my friend, love her to death, is also one of those "sees the best in others and hope everyone is always aiming to be their best selves" type of person, very similar to ally. i came online after that episode expecting everybody on the fanbase level to be screaming with me in a "i told you so!!" way

instead. i came online and saw people just on the attack and the defense in absolutely skewed ways!! out of NOWHERE, all these fans have come on to post about how "tim was patronizing her, and thats why she stole the book" "wow i would have hated being called girly and honey as well" "wow these conversations really didnt go their way why was tim so mean to her :(" or the opposite of "rapunzel is the evilest person to ever exist bc xyz these princesses are evil villains" or "we need to protect these princesses bc they just didnt know any better uwu"

i feel like, on a fan level, me and you anon (+all these lovely folks in the notes of that post) were the only ones screaming "hold on, that is literally not the same media i just watched"

i've seen before a lot of people be like "wow, media literacy is at an all time low" and i never really understood that until i saw the reactions after that episode. as a fan or viewer watching any media, we have the privilege of seeing more about the media than the people who are creating it. that's the best joy of being a viewer, we get to sit back and spot those foreshadowing moments and bite our nails in suspense when the music goes creepy and see the artwork and overall, we have the privilege of catching vibes that maybe those acting in it do not. this leads to those bonding moments of "i told you so" "wow im biting my nails and pacing" "oh they're gonna REGRET that". and, an "oh my god no no no do not hug her she wants to take your book god now she's feeling you up with her hair she's looking for the book ROLL INITIATIVE!!!!". it leads to glorious moments of ~dramatic irony~, a literary term for literally when something is happening in a story and the readers can catch it, but the protagonist probably didnt bc they're not seeing the full picture. While watching, from my perspective, yeah it was frustrating to watch the player bag fumble turn after turn, but it's a game of dnd, they film so many back to back, they don't get the same experience as us. however.

brennan did a great job at dropping the foreshadowing, to the point of not even so much subtly foreshadowing, he DIRECTLY TOLD THEM rapunzel was a liar and uses her words as knives. like someone pointed out, the players even PAID for that information, with the golden bridle. by the time they met these princesses, they probably knew the most about rapunzel's true nature over all the other princesses, that she uses her charisma to her advantage. the players made their choice to do the diplomatic route, to split up and chat. ally did the right thing for picking rapunzel with tim's 19 charisma stat, it would have been charisma against charisma, and an even playing field for someone they have been explicitly told is a master of words and deceit.

as fans, we've seen these episodes edited and put back to back. clues are lined up in a row. was it frustrating to see ally playing tim in a naïve way? sure. but tim's been pretty naïve this whole time, so you could stack it up to a character choice. what's more frustrating is seeing the responses of viewers being blindsided by the book thieving and chalking it all up to "evil vs good" and rapunzel's choice shaking them to their cores.

by this point in the story, by the time you get to that episode, rapunzel already gave enough bad vibes with the talk of her charismatic deceits and with her hair everywhere spying on them. maybe that last one wasn't explicitly stated, but it was heavily implied to the point of gerard writing the plans on a note instead of wanting them said out loud by elody, a scene that happened way before tim's. by the time we see rapunzel get to the kitchen, she is INSTANTLY catty. someone described her on the post as "eldritch regina george" and. yes. exactly. eldritch regina george. from our privileged spot as a viewer, rapunzel comes in, puts on the fake smile, puts on her fake tone, and says "what are you doing in here? :)". she was already ready to fight timothy. that first sentence was hostile. she was OFFENDED and checking on tim to make sure mother goose wasn't counter-spying. i honestly didnt think that would have to have been explicitly stated, she was in attack mode and plastered the fake smile for a show so that she had the upperhand in the conversation that was about to happen. this is something that fans should have at least caught on to right off the bat, we've been explicitly told that she is fake more than she is honest for the sake of being a "performative person"

the conversation happens, and she starts becoming more verbally hostile. "i dont know, what SHOULD we do hehe. it's ruined now :)" "no use in crying over spilt milk *pours milk with hair on the floor with a smile* oh no :)" "...or if it was on purpose :/ :)" "why dont you go get a mop :)" "i chose to be charming :)"

every sentence she replied with was carefully chosen. as viewers, we can watch brennan's face in full clarity of intimidation. we can have the knowledge that has been provided to not trust rapunzel as she is a charismatic spy who has words for knives. in my opinion, even without those clues before now, her show that she put on in the kitchen should have been enough as is to show that she is acting maliciously and with hostility. the smile is there as to not incite physical violence on tim's part bc then it would make TIM look like the bad guy if he attacked first. by the time she goes in for the hug. im sorry. but ally the player should have caught that, the whole table should have caught that, and-more importantly-the fans should have caught that. we all watched the same thing. we have all been told the same information. to purposefully ignore all of the red flags just to pull a "well tim was kind of mean and patronizing, and rapunzel doesnt have social skills from being locked in a tower, i forgive her, wow i didnt see that coming" is absolutely *batshit*

the lack of people catching on is what concerns me. i've met TONS of people growing up (sorry here, im all for women's wrongs, but mainly cis-girls tbh) who act like rapunzel does. from middle school and high school bullies/mean girls. mean girls at college. from parents or teachers or bosses. from normal adults in my life. they always have the same tone and inflections in the same places. the same faces with the wrinkled nose. the same sickly sweet smile. brennan played rapunzel, a known manipulator, perfectly. to a T. he embodied it fully. people JUST LIKE RAPUNZEL walk amongst us every day. i can guarantee you that even these fans that didnt catch it have met people like rapunzel in their own lives.

rapunzel is a character yes, but she is a character that mimics a masterclass manipulator. she IS the mean girl, the regina george. it leaked out of her every word, tone, and inflection. every single thing told about her and shown was, in no world, some "uwu the sweet bean was locked in a tower and doesnt have social skills". that was her origin, her start point. just like sleeping beauty locked in a castle, snow locked in her coffin. rapunzel directly says "i chose to be charming. :)." she had her origin of no social skills, her sad origin of being locked in isolation in her tower, and said "this is my greatest flaw, so i am going to dedicate my life to improving this skill bc it's what stopping me from achieving my goals." she trained her social skills to be good. too good. so good that she hopes nobody will catch her sweet charming self in the act of malicious intentions. this. was. directly. stated.

it worries me on a psychological level of the fans. yes it shows a lack of media literacy, something is frustrating on a fan-to-fan level. it shows a lack of ability of critical thinking. it shows a lack of ability to participate in dramatic irony, a necessary literary device to instill tension into a horror campaign. but also, and to what is probably my main point in this novel long hot take: it has real world implications. mean girls like rapunzel are a guarantee in life. i'm sorry, but it's true. maybe the person acts differently, maybe they aren't as obvious or more obvious. but these people walk amongst us. they use the same tone and same cadence to their words. these manipulators see what they want, and devise a way to convince the person into giving them what they want. rapunzel did not use the Charm Person spell, or the Friendship spell. She used. her words. like a normal human being. and by doing so, we as the fans were able to catch on and should have had a moment of "RUN GOOSE, RUN AWAY, NO DONT LET HER HUG YOU". but instead, a lot of people turn a blind eye to these manipulators in their lives. they pull a "aw but they have a tragic backstory, they're just confused and need love :/" "they cant be THAT bad..." they see a sweet little smile on the face and an upticked tone of voice, and go "well, they're playing nice, so now i have to play nice bc otherwise im the bad guy here" which!!! you do not!!

this is exactly how manipulators worm their ways in, this is what ALLOWS manipulation to work in its various forms. it's how people get trapped in abusive relationships. it's how people get scammed. on a personal end, i lived a narcissistic manipulator for a long time growing up, and it was exhausting. once you could put down the rose colored glasses and see right through the act, you notice how every inch of their mannerisms are performative. everything they say and do comes with the caveat of them wanting something from you and are trying to butter you up in the meantime. if you catch and call onto it, they IMMEDIATELY turn on you, they sneer and retreat to their next target who it will fool. the cycle continues, the next target is selected.

on a fan level, if we as fans cannot play into dramatic irony as a practice, if we cannot exit our seats of mind to catch on to those "eldritch regina george" quirks at the bud in a piece of fictional media where the puzzle has been handed on a silver platter, then there is a l o t more work to be done on 1) general media literacy 2) ANY fandom perception on media and 3) general awareness of how to spot and deal with manipulators in real life. if you can't catch on to it in a silly fictional ttrpg media, how do you expect to catch on to it in real life? how many of these same fans are trapped in manipulative relationships around them? how many more will they fall for bc of the "oh no but they have tragic backstory so it's forgiven uwu"? as fans, you cant sit there in the same breath saying that tim was condescending to rapunzel and then follow it up with not noticing what was ACTUALLY happening in real time. if you wanna say that rapunzel was ALLOWED to be a manipulator because of her origin, what other manipulators are you defending in your real life? how many of these manipulators continue their tricks BECAUSE they know naïve people exist and will fall for it? how many have been enabled in the same cycle bc it worked on one so it'll work on the next?

i wish i had a fun way to conclude this absolutely massive chunk of fandom critique gibberish, but i just dont. i wish i could find a more comprehensive way to scream about this, so take this post as me SCREAMING about this, anon my dm's are open if we wanna rant some more

[rainbowsky]

About the Video

I have gotten so many asks (and messages from antis 🙄) about this video. Rather than turn my blog into a "video Q & A", I'll just give my thoughts on it here in one post.

Fake, fan fiction, CPN.

I'm going to start by saying that the very best response to negative buzz or attacks on GG and/or DD (which this video definitely is), is always to simply ignore, keep quiet and let it blow over. The more engaged we get with the subject, the more buzz we are helping to build around it. In situations like this, it is not in GGDD's best interests for people to freak out. Often the entire purpose of an attack like this is to upset people and stoke up fan wars.

I say this all the time and you'll hear me repeating it again and again and again - block and ignore (and report when appropriate).

If something comes up and you don't see me talking about it, this is why. I don't like giving more oxygen to garbage like this.

THE ROAD IS LONG

Being a (happy) turtle requires critical thinking, media literacy skills and a high degree of fortitude. This is all basic self-care and intellectual self-defense. I've been saying this kind of thing a lot and hopefully it's getting through to some people. If you have a heart of glass, if you are gullible and easily swayed, if you are easily thrown into fits of anxiety and self-doubt, and if you aren't willing to change your self-destructive social media habits, this might not be the right fandom for you.

As turtles we are often outnumbered by enemies who are trying to harm us, debunk our CPN, harm GG and DD, stoke up fan wars, push their own heterocentric agendas, spew homophobia, fandom-phobia and RP/CP-phobia, spread hate against one or both of the boys, make BXG cry, etc. etc. etc.

This fandom is not for the faint of heart.

Heteronormativity plays a key role, here

We've seen countless interactions and sweet moments between GG and DD that make this idiotic video look like a passerby patting a stray dog in the street, and yet there are STILL turtles who are shaken by it.

We have seen a ton of evidence of BJYXSZD, and candies and CPN coming at a regular pace, yet turtles freak out over a 2 year old sibling-ish video clip that has clearly been maliciously edited.

If this video makes you feel shaken about GG and DD it might be time to self-reflect on your attitude toward queer relationships.

Heteronormativity and 'burden of proof' is a huge part of how things get skewed in the fandom. The (often unconscious) assumption among most people is that heterosexuality is the default, and queer relationships don't happen. People need a PHD thesis and a grand jury to believe that GG and DD's relationship is even remotely possible, yet they need nothing more than a rumor and a badly edited video to believe GG or DD is dating a woman. It's insane.

GG and DD could have their tongues down each other's throats and people will still scratch their heads and hmm and haw about them, but the second either of them talks to or interacts with a woman, the immediate assumption is that they're going to marry her.

This is just the way everyone is socialized in our homophobic world, and it plays somewhat of a protective role for GGDD. They wouldn't be able to be as open about their relationship as they are if they were a heterosexual couple. Heteronormativity means that evidence of their being a couple is easily dismissed by most people and they're able to fly under the radar this way.

But as turtles we should know better. We should be able to recognize this dynamic at work and not be thrown by it.

This is not a 'cute moment'

If you are viewing this incident as 'the leaking of a cute moment between friends', or if you are worried about the implications for GG and DD's relationship, you are missing the entire point of the video.

This video has nothing to do with GG and DD. It has nothing to do with friendship. Quite the contrary. It's a targeted attack.

Make no mistake about it - the filming of this video was not an accident. The release of this video was not an accident. The timing of both the filming and the release of it were not accidents. The editing and removal of context were not accidents. This was an intentional attack on GG, aimed at hurting him.

I'm not going to go into all the details of it here. It's an unsavory topic that is best kept private. But if you see something causing a negative stir around either GG or DD, that's probably the entire intent of the situation. To cause a negative stir, stoke up fan wars, and ultimately to harm them.

Context is everything

I want to remind everyone of the context here. GG had earlier that night just enjoyed a major 'comeback' moment after 2/27, when his fans greeted him with a sea of red. If you weren't around back then, you might not understand the significance of what happened.

We had just spent several months watching GG get trashed and attacked and negatively discussed in the media. He had been lying low for months and months. Many of us wondered whether he'd ever recover. As we all know - in C-ent, artists are routinely canceled and blacklisted, often for apparently minor 'infractions'. We had no reason to believe GG would be able to bounce back.

Then Tencent Starlight Awards comes along, and here's GG on the red carpet and then onstage, singing in front of a huge audience, and there was a sea of red light banners that fans had smuggled in to show their love and support. And GG was clearly deeply moved by it all, to where he got choked up toward the end.

I don't think I was the only person bawling my eyes out at that moment. I STILL can't watch that video without getting choked up. It was such an important moment in GG's career.

And GG was visibly relieved. I can only imagine how elated he must have been after the event, to see that his career was going to survive.

I have no doubt he went to that party in high spirits, happy to be able to go out and enjoy an evening celebrating among other stars. His guard would have been down in this closed 'backstage' environment where cameras were not supposed to be. And some utter dirtbag decides to film his interactions, with their own agenda in mind.

The filming and editing and release of this clip, the timing of it, the hot search, everything about it is intended to harm GG and benefit others. This isn't the first time such an incident has happened, and GG isn't the first victim (and likely won't be the last).

It was an egregious violation of his privacy and of his trust, and as people who love him we should be addressing it for what it is instead of having our own self-serving anxiety about what it means for GGDD. You know what it means for GGDD?

Sweet FA.

It means less than nothing. Anyone who thinks DD is jealous about this moment has their head in a moist, dark place. Let me guarantee you, DD is as pissed as I am about what was done to GG, and isn't harboring some ridiculous insecurity about GG's interactions. DD knows GG's real feelings.

Any doubts turtles feel are their own, and have absolutely nothing to do with GG and DD.

Anyone who knows GG knows he's casual and affectionate with others. He had shared a stage with the other subject earlier in the evening, so it's not surprising he had a friendly exchange with her. He is that way with co-stars, with colleagues and with anyone he works with. He's a genuine, down-to-earth, funny, sweet guy.

Those tendencies in him were taken advantage of in some pretty unforgivable ways, here, and THAT'S the real story. Someone is attempting to benefit at his expense, and that's the real story.

This will blow over. Let it. Let's all stop giving this BS story oxygen, and instead focus on loving and supporting GG and DD.

EDIT: More on this here.

[kuumara]

ok lets go

usually the original post is alright and its the comments that are weird, but not this time. bc i could say the exact same thing ab mcdonalds, that they would be disappointed crying pissing screaming etc when they see s5. i personally think more ronaldmcdonaldasses should be ok with a byler endgame, but if i said this they would all cry piss scream shit

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yeah, he did say he's scared of losing her. but as the saying goes that you've prob seen from alot of other stuff, "if you love something you're not afraid to let it go". so idk ab u but mike saying that just confirms that the relationship is toxic and if it continues it might even turn into an emotionally abusive one, IMO (its a pattern- ur anxious the partner will leave, u start being more cautious around them; even turn into a whole another version of urself u think the partner will like more (mikes lenora drip), etc etc. very stressful for u (mike) and also ur partner (el)).

"he's clearly inlove with eleven" idk it wasnt really clear to me when she offensively side-eyed him at the cabin and then he rolled his eyes or wtvr that was, which was literally the last time they interacted. not really madly in love healthy relationship of them tbh. and its EL not goddamn eleven that alone speaks volumes ab how much they care ab her well-being or character arc or wtvr their other excuses are (they say mike leaving her would crush her, but so would if u called her eleven in her face)

"it would go against everything we've seen in the show" i agree with this one. except, byler not being canon would go against everything blablabla 🤓 like, we've seen this happen before with steve and robin, this would just be even more bombastic.

then, the show dunks on homophobes all the time so Macabre canon would go against that too; and yes, it would be homophobic to use a gay character's CONFESSION and FEELINGS THAT ARE ALREADY CAUSING HIM PAIN to uplift the straight couple, making them happy married with 17 kids while the gay character is in even more pain and like dies or smth

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holy shit i thought yall were exaggerating when u said they actually think mleven is love at first sight.

1) the duffers wouldnt "suddenly scrap it", ppl have been finding subtext and set design clues since the beginning, since ep1. no its not delusions, its stuff for which there isnt any other actual explanation. it all makes sense, every subtext reference, every set design prop, every decoration on clothes- theres even an official st video on yt where the set design says she put triangles on robins clothes bc shes gay asf. Guess who else has triangles on his shirt (which he wears for majority of the show, might i add)? MIKE -but that just means he likes girls!! just like robin, to shut down any theories the fans made ab him liking guys!!! hes a lesbian😭😭😭

2) im assuming these are hard core fans, since theyre still in the subreddit and all that, and i dont doubt theyve seen the stranger things twitter account say they don't believe in love at first sight. so the writers=write the show. don't believe in love at first sight, it's just cheesy (infatuated) 12yr old shit. so, why would they include smth they think isn't real, unrealistic even? except if they're saying mike and els love isn't real-

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alright final one. the classic "yall delusional" argument. Nothing else to say besides we are seeing patterns and we are recognizing them. not my fault ur not as observant and intelligent🙄

[pooopopop]

I've seen nearly all of J2M's panels, interviews, posts, read articles about them and their own provided works etc. I find them all observationally fascinating and approach trying to understand them and their different life experiences with an open mind and can acknowledge that certain situations aren't always going to equal the whole truth of a famous someone because I will never know them personally and therefore cannot ask directly. Conventions/panels, for instance: they're for entertainment purposes, part humor and sarcasm, part truth. Stories, interactions, are often going to be embellished.

Whilst none of them are perfect — literally no one is! — and of course I don't know them on an intimate, personal level, I still feel very confident in saying that they're inherently good people, based on the conclusions I've reached from my own research. That doesn't mean I'm incapable of scrutinising certain behavior or thinking critically just because I'm not agreeing with your opinions.

I could continue to refute a lot of your points individually by offering a different perspective (and draw attention to where your so-called facts are simply incorrect) but I don't think persisting with circular arguments is a worthwhile use of time. You're entitled to feel differently about these things and clearly have made firm decisions based on the "evidence" you've gathered about Misha in particular. I rest assured knowing your POV is not the majority. ✌️

I mean you’ve been sending me long anons for days already and I’ve gone to the trouble of providing sources for all my claims for *you*, I don’t know why you couldn’t do the same if you’re already invested in talking to me anyways. If there’s individual claims I made that you take issue with because you don’t think they’re credible and I didn’t supply my sources, please be specific, and I’ll provide what I can to show either what I’m referring to or how it brought me to having my opinion. I think people just make excuses and justify questionable behavior in order to keep their attachments to them. Even if you think you’re looking at them critically and from a distance, you’re still fostering a parasocial relationship, and nobody is “inherently good”, least of which are rich celebrities. That doesn’t mean that you can’t enjoy them. I enjoy Norm Macdonald, the IASIP cast, and a lot of other people without needing to make sure I’m weighing their every sin and good deed on a scale, in order to keep enjoying them.

The difference is that these people constantly go to conventions and everybody besides J2 is pretty accessible. Misha in particular has gone out of his way to foster this environment where he knows the happenings in the fandom and recognizes fangirls, acknowledges them, responds to them on social media, sometimes meets up with them IRL, and has had things like Gish and his community phone number where he’s been even MORE accessible and uses terms of endearments with everybody. The last part feels especially suspect to me because it proves he’s speaking to an audience of fangirls (and people of whatever adjacent gender who are attracted to men, obviously, but we’ll still refer to them as fangirls for brevity’s sake and because I think calling them “minions” is stupid infighting shit that aligns me with J2ers).

I’m speaking to people on here because tumblr is a historically horny and obsessive fandom space and people are joining this fandom all the time and they are only made aware of whatever the circle jerk tells them first. Not only does it foster a bad relationship with middle aged men that you don’t know, and if you did know then it’s because they met you as someone who is a fan of them, it also fosters a bad community environment. People end up having whole friendship networks that depend on unquestionable loyalty to these men, and a hierarchy is created based on who proves themselves to be more devout; in their determination to defend these men, defend the people that they surround themselves with, defend their beliefs, and their every action big OR small. From Misha supporting ICE, the Clintons, the predatory advice in the threesome’s handbook, to the dumbest little things like how he made a Threads account and positioned it as a better alternative to Twitter. This fandom routinely cannibalizes itself and purges the whistleblowers out.

and I got triggered by that karla gif set the other day lol. SailorSally joined the fandom after November 5th and knows nothing but praise for the man, and while I didn’t send those anons to her I can sympathize with them. The cockles fandom can be the worst sometimes because they really push the narrative that he’s queer (and gay for jensen) because they think it’s a testament to his character and therefore it discredits a lot of the shit I’m complaining about. Even if they’re not tinhatters, then they think it positions Misha’s virtues above Jensen, because I guess he’s supposed to be like a bullied gay kid who is still so loving and affectionate in the face of Jensen’s Toxic Masculinity and Homophobia, or something, despite Jensen having gay gossip rags and magazines profiling him as a closeted cutie for way longer with a lot more persistence. Tbh

[outrunningthedark]

still stuck on how flat both the Taylor and Ana characters are. The only things we know about them are their jobs...oh and I guess we know Ana has a grandfather named Edmundo. But seriously, we know nothing else about them aside from their careers and who they're dating. How are we supposed to root for them? How do ppl already root for them without knowing anything about them? It confuses me

I know you came to me because I would share your opinion, so allow me to remind you that we are involved in a fandom that finds reasons to "defend" and "stan" a fictional female character because they believe she "deserved better treatment", completely ignoring myself and other individuals who have explained ad nauseum why her negative portrayal matters to US. (This fandom will make posts about the importance of bi representation that get hundreds of notes, but come across the harsh truths about ableism and they just keep scrolling. Even if you don't understand it, it costs zero dollars to acknowledge someone else's experience. That's what the like and reblog buttons are for. But I digress!) If there is support for A*a, I am under the impression it's limited, but regardless, I have no explanation for WHY anyone wastes their time. The actress behind the role deliberately presents herself as Latina despite having no such background. *That* should be enough to turn people off, but it's clearly not. Were she a white woman a la ScarJo who has been guilty of auditioning for parts originally meant for WOC, fans would be calling for her head. On top of that, Andrew Meyers (the writer in charge of 3x12 aka the skateboard episode) PURPOSELY illustrated ableism through her. The entire point of Eddie teaming up with Buck to create an accessible skateboard was to show that ANA'S SOLUTION WAS THE WRONG ONE. Christopher doesn't need TWO parents/parental figures who are scared to confront and adapt to his CP when times get tough. In that particular episode, Eddie very much thought like A*a, at least at first. BUT. He took time to reflect, had an honest discussion with his son about how poorly he'd been handling Christopher's disability, and then sought help from someone (Buck!) who he trusted to make Christopher's dream come true while also keeping him out of harm's way. Eddie NEEDS a partner who is going to recognize and call out his (unintentional) ableism when necessary, not one who tells him Christopher's CP is a sign he's not supposed to try certain activities. Anyone who is still a "fan" of hers most likely 1) isn't Latina and/or 2) doesn't comprehend what was so bad about her comment. (That goes for the disabled as well, because there sure are quite a few members of my community who love to say "well, she wasn't exactly wrong...", and to those people I say: YOU HAVE BEEN LIED TO. Able-bodied people don't know what the fuck we're capable of. Remember that.) I talked recently about why a portion of fandom might be rooting for T*ylor/BuckT*ylor here, but I also think A*a has inadvertently contributed to the intense stanning. Our fandom REALLY likes questioning why female love interests aren't given more depth. They are labeled victims because men hate writing strong female characters!1!1! With T*ylor, Tim awarded her more of a personality/presence than A*a, and also gave viewers more insight into the "connection" between she and Buck before starting to date than they ever got with Ali while she was his girlfriend. And! Now we can assume T*ylor and Eddie will tolerate each other for Buck's sake in the coming season, whereas A*a and Buck did not interact until the finale...through a one-sided phone call. A female love interest that is actually being integrated into the show?!? A female love interest that has her own life outside of being someone's girlfriend?!? (She's a reporter, y'all! We're going to SEE her in action!) When fans have the bar for "positive female rep" set on the ground, it doesn't take much to get on their good side.

[arthur-j-raffles]

Hey, why do you think people get upset (especially purists) with the concept of Johnlock when it's been here for ages? I love the thrilling impulsive disordered way Sherlock thinks and acts (like my ADHD, OCD, and other mental disorders which I headcanon Sherlock to have.) alongside his nurturing and supportive Boswell (like my fiancé). They're flirty, fun, and affectionate with their jokes and laughs with each other throughout their mysteries, and that comforts me. Canon is damned and I don't care what Conan's opinions are if it makes me happy. Why are people so sour, salty, and act like the idea of me writing fanfiction and buying fanart of my first ship at 12 (when I first read Sherlock from the public library with my nana a decade ago) is the worst thing in all of existence and ruins Sherlock Holmes? Am I the crazy one or is everyone else who's crazy? (Btw it's nice to see someone on Tumblr who loves the OG turn of the last century version Sherlock than the terrible show alongside Lupin and Raffles.)

Hi anon! I know you probably just asked this question to get me to respond about how it’s ridiculous that anyone would get that upset about a fictional ship, but this question got me thinking for a bit. I’m one of the most biased sources here (i’ve made posts about how i don’t tag John/Sherlock because it should be a given, etc.), but I’ll try to respond to this question with an honest and fair answer because there are a lot of factors as to why people get upset at John/Sherlock.

Below the cut I’ll talk about:

1. Cultural Osmosis

2. 19th Century Friendship

3. Distaste for Shipping

4. Homophobia

1. Cultural Osmosis

One of the reasons I think is most prevalent is that people who have never read or watched any Sherlock Holmes content assume because it’s so old and so popular that they’ve somehow absorbed enough of it through pop culture and references that they know what Sherlock is like via cultural osmosis. They know he’s deductive and doesn’t like people, so they assume he’s cold, always calculated, and the pinnacle of detective perfection. They know John is the narrator and Sherlock’s friend, so they just assume John is basic, boring, and so uninteresting that he’s barely in Sherlock’s social circle, but merely tags along with him. This vision of both of the characters is skewed so far from the canon that people either can’t fathom how you ship these two characters who in their minds are very incompatible, or the more common thing, people have a preconceived notion that you’re looking too much into it because nothing old and published can be gay.

(This kind of thing isn’t just exclusive to Sherlock, either. People will also gawk at the idea of Spock/Kirk from Star Trek TOS because they assume they know what TOS is without even watching it because they’ve seen the cultural impact of “beam me up, Scotty” and “live long and prosper.” They create a mental image of TOS that’s mostly full of their own assumptions, and gay subtext isn’t one of their expectations.)

2. 19th Century Friendship

Another reason is that historical male friendships are different than what the typical male friendship is now. In the 19th century, men were more open to showing affection for each other in strong ways. Photos from the century show male friend groups openly holding hands, arm in arm, and helping light each other’s cigarettes. Obviously a lot of men are shaking off ideas of “manliness” that limit the way they can express their platonic love to their friends, but there’s still a lot of men that won’t hold their best friend’s hands because “that’s just weird/that’s gay.” This is all a long-winded way of saying that, to some people, Sherlock and John are the pinnacle of close male friendship in the 19th century. They are the perfect show of platonic affection between men, something that some people look up to and aspire towards. To people who think of Sherlock and John as exclusively best friends, they may feel offended or baffled that anyone would try to “ruin” that friendship by making the two lovers. That’s why some people who are legitimate fans of Sherlock Holmes may take offense to the ship: they think it ruins the friendship between the characters.

3. Distaste for Shipping

It isn’t uncommon for fans of a series to have a distaste for shipping elements, especially for a series whose sole focus isn’t romance. Sherlock Holmes is in no way a romance, and some people feel that shipping shouldn’t be the focus of fandom content because the source material isn’t romantic. People who want to focus on mystery and suspense elements may believe that shipping ruins what fans should be focusing on and appreciating in the franchise. And they have some merit in thinking that shipping can ruin the focus of a franchise, because there are definitely some fandom subcultures out there that ignore important themes and messages in shows to instead focus on their ship. But, this is an over-generalization of any fandom, clearly.

The above reasons for someone disliking Sherlock/John are not malicious. They assume the person is well-intentioned but misguided. In the cultural osmosis example, the person just doesn’t understand the source material and thus doesn’t understand the ship. In the friendship example, the person just wants to see a male friendship that isn’t toxic, and mistakes the act of shipping for throwing away that interpretation entirely. In the distaste for shipping example, the person just wants to focus on the themes of Holmes and not the romantic subtext. However, saying that everyone who gets upset at shipping John/Sherlock is well-intentioned would be a lie.

4. Homophobia

There’s an obvious reason of—whether implicit or explicit—homophobia when some people get downright disgusted or outraged that someone would ship John/Sherlock. I don’t think it needs explanation as to what homophobia is, but Sherlock/John especially outrages people more than other gay ships because the characters are classic. Sherlock is known throughout the world, everyone knows his name even if they’ve never read any of the stories, and his iconography—smoking pipe, hat, and jacket—have become well-recognized. It makes ignorant people boil over when you say that this iconic character who has remarkable impact on the world may be gay, asexual, or transgender. They think that lgbtq identities are something taboo or something to be ignored. To them, lgbtq characters should be background noise at most. And vocalizing that you see John/Sherlock subtext in their interactions destroys that.

TL;DR: Some people may be upset by John/Sherlock because they don’t understand the source material, they think shipping destroys a friendship dynamic they liked, or they feel that shipping takes away from the story. Some people may be upset by John/Sherlock because of ignorance and homophobia.

[strangertheory]

"anti-Mileven"

I know you submitted this as a message and not an Ask, but I hope you don't mind if I answer your question with a longer post because this is a topic that is important to me but is complicated. I've meant to do a post about this, but kept putting it off because it is a very layered topic for me and my thoughts about Mileven are probably not what a lot of fans want to hear.

I respect that everyone develops an attachment to their preferred couples in stories for personal reasons, and as such any criticism of the dynamic between two characters that are dating can feel like a very personal criticism. I respect everyone's head-canons and favorite ships as sacred ground: I don't want to tell anyone how they should or should not relate to a story. That's unique to each of us as fans, and we will all enjoy Stranger Things for different reasons.

However: I do have some thoughts regarding the way that the narrative has established the dynamic between Mike and El. And I personally do not find their dynamic *as it currently is* to be one that is ideal for either of them yet.

I really care about Eleven and I really care about Mike. They are two of my favorite characters in the story.

To say that I'm "anti-Mileven" is a huge oversimplification of how I feel about Mike and El's dynamic.

I am very much anti:

overlooking the fact El has been treated as a lab rat and abused and isolated from society for the majority of her existence and her ignorance of her own identity and her own desires is repeatedly reinforced canonically. ("How do I know what I like?") El has spent only a few months out in the world beyond her cell at the lab and beyond Hopper's cabin, she knows very little about the world yet, and she is being taught much of what she now knows by her boyfriend who also happens to be one of the few people she interacts with in her daily life. The power difference and social difference between them is huge currently regardless of whether Mike is a nice kid with good intentions or not, and they are both fourteen years olds.

overlooking that it is superficial and not representative of a "deep" relationship to only kiss and make out with a significant other and not do other meaningful activities that establish a real day-to-day relationship (like hanging out with friends and other loved ones as a couple.) There's a popular misconception that the act of two people kissing is inherently romantic and a sign of emotional closeness. But kissing becomes romantic psychologically when two people share a deep affection for one another that is based on shared experiences and emotional and psychological connectedness. If two characters can be shown to care about one another without ever physically touching, they have the potential for a deep connection that is based on more than the thrill of physical affection. Give me a well-developed relationship first, and then kissing will seem romantic to me. Without an established psychological and emotional connection between characters, kissing is merely a superficial representation of the idea of intimacy between characters without any actual substance underneath. Sure that's what kids do when they're figuring out how dating and feelings and physical intimacy work and it's not harmful in itself provided that they are both comfortable with it, but keep this in mind within the context of the other concerns I list here.

trivializing Mike's dishonesty and blaming Hopper for Mike's lying when the truth is Mike could have easily explained to El that Hopper didn't want them spending as much time together and having some space would be better. El is well aware of Hopper's dislike for their time spent together. This should have been a very easy conversation. As Lucas rightfully asks as Mike is ranting about the situation he got himself into: "Why lie?" Good question, Lucas. Good question. El asks Mike this again later at the mall. "Why do you lie?" Mike stares back at her with an awkward expression, and does NOT answer her. Why is this answer not an easy one? Why has Mike still not addressed things with El? I think there is more going on here than just Hopper's threats.

I am very in favor of:

El learning more about who she is and what she wants to do with her life outside of the desires and expectations of other people.

Mike figuring out how to effectively express his thoughts and feelings honestly. He is clearly struggling to do this throughout season 3, and it is uncharacteristic of the kid who defiantly said and did what he wanted frequently in seasons 1 and 2. Clearly Mike is not comfortable and is nervous, which is understandable for someone exploring new emotionally vulnerable territory like dating for the first time, but he needs to learn to be honest and tell people how he is thinking and feeling or else he is also putting himself and his feelings and needs at risk and potentially establishing an unhealthy relationship that will hurt him and hurt others even if he doesn't mean to. Mike's nervousness is STILL present in the final goodbye scene in which Mike and El talk, and El tells him she loves him and kisses him. He is still stumbling over his words and anxious, and he seems notably confused after El kisses him. These small details are not trivial, they are clearly intentional.

Recognizing that Mike is the first person her age that was kind to El when she escaped the lab, and given that she has only known pain and abuse her entire life and has never known friendship let alone romance that her psychological readiness for understanding a romantic relationship is NOT the same as an ordinary 14 year old's and this cannot be stated enough.

Recognizing that societal pressures and personal insecurities might be a huge factor in how Mike clings to El's attention and affection for him, and that there is evidence in the story that supports this interpretation. We know that Mike is bullied frequently, and that there is a layer of homophobia often involved. (Even if James and Troy were speaking rudely about Will, they were still directly confronting Mike. The implication is there.) We know that Lucas yelled at Mike "No Mike. You're blind. Blind because you like that a girl's not grossed out by you!" This reveals that Lucas knows that Mike is insecure and wants validation. Just because Mike has a desperate desire to be loved and liked by a girl does not mean that his appreciation of El's attention is based on his genuine romantic affection for her. Mike might be dating El because he enjoys the attention, he likes being liked, and he likes how having a girlfriend makes him feel more accepted and normal.

Recognizing that every moment that Mike has tried to share something that he is passionate about with El (the Yoda figurine, the dinosaurs) she has been completely disinterested. Since El has no cultural connection to the pop culture stories Mike loves and she lived in the Lab her entire life, it makes perfect sense that she will have no interest in these toys. Her lack of interest in what Mike is passionate about, however, is worth noting: not because it's a bad thing, but because it's just one of many reasons they are "not even from the same planet" and cannot bond and connect easily. El has lived an incredibly different life from Mike, has suffered through so much, and is still learning about the outside world and about herself. She is severely behind in social and personal development. She needs time to learn and to grow and to heal so she can live her best life and recover from what she has been through. (She doesn't really care about your Star Wars toys, Michael, because she just learned what a phone is and is processing a lot of other things right now.)

*I want to credit @kaypeace21 for pointing out many of these particular observations listed above: you can read her very detailed and extensive analysis in her post here: El is Not in Love with Mike.

These are just a few of many thoughts I have regarding Mike and El's dynamic together, and why I find the romanticization and idealization of their dating relationship to be more suited to fan-canon and fanfiction. For El to have a relationship with Mike that I would personally enjoy and appreciate, the story would need to convincingly allow her to establish a notably better understanding of who she is and what she wants, and have time to heal from her trauma and learn a lot more about the outside world. While I suspect that the Byers moving away will be very difficult for Will, in many ways I think it will benefit El tremendously and I hope that she is given more opportunities to learn and to grow.

I also agree with @hawkinsschoolcounselor 's hypothesis that Mike is projecting his feelings for Will onto El. It's impossible for me to see Mike's dynamic with El as entirely separate from Mike's relationship with Will because El was found in the woods when they were looking for Will in season 1, El helped everyone find Will in the Upside Down and saved his life, and El reappears at the end if season 2 and saves Will from the Mindflayer. Until season 3, El's appearance in Mike's life has been directly tied to Will's survival and safety. I do not think this is a trivial aspect of El's narrative. El's importance within the larger story being told is repeatedly tied back to what Will is dealing with. The reason that El and Will's narratives are so deeply intertwined has not been revealed in the story yet, but I suspect that there are some important aspects of El and Will's stories that haven't been fully revealed yet that will bring all of these seemingly isolated plot threads together. The creators of Stranger Things repeatedly tie El and Will together visually and narratively (re: @kaypeace21), and I believe there is a very specific reason for this.

I look forward to seeing what happens in season 4. Whether my interpretation of El and Mike's dynamic is fair or not, I trust the writers have a compelling next chapter in their story for us all to enjoy.