#aspec coded character

[aspec-manga-snom]

Oshi no Ko: Lies & Love. Aromantic Coded Narratives

I'm going to edit this more, but I'm pushing it out to feel better.

This post is an incredibly cut down and curated version of a longer academic style paper on this topic. If there are any confusing bits or inaccuracies, let me know. A lot of this is rewritten for a more digestible format.

This post is going to talk about spoilers for a majority of the Oshi no Ko manga,the short story, "45510" and the song it inspired "Idol" by Yoasobi. I will also discuss relationships with power imbalances and the sexual relationships between two minors, as Ai Hoshino was 16 when she had children. There will not be explicit detail but it is important to keep in mind the conditions of Ai's relationships.

There will be major spoilers so if you are waiting for Season 2 of the anime, don't read on. I highly encourage everyone to read the manga if you can. If you haven't started it and have just found it through this post, start by watching the anime if it is available, it is excellently produced.

Some Background:

Oshi no Ko was written by Aka Akasaka, known author of Kaguya-Sama Love is War & Renai Daikou. A lot of his work is introspective on the nature of relationships and love, Oshi no Ko being no different.

Oshi no Ko follows the story of two twin siblings, Aqua and Ruby Hoshino reincarnated fans of their new mother, Ai Hoshino. Ai Hoshino was the famous main idol of the idol group B-Komachi. The two of them previously new eachother as a doctor and patient before the latter passed away from Anaplastic astrocytoma, a form of brain cancer, and the other stabbed by Ai's stalker.

The two of them live a regular life as Ai's children until she is murdered by the same stalker that killed Aqua in his past life. After her passing they follow in the footsteps of their mother and enter the world of Japanese Entertainment in pursuit of getting revenge on their unknown father who they blame everything on.

Both of them have a very pragmatic view of the world, but they aren't the focus. Lets talk about Ai.

Ai Hoshino, 45510 & Idol:

The main point of this post is to argue that Ai lies somewhere on the Aromantic spectrum. There are some light pieces of evidence for her also being asexual, but not nearly as defintive as her aro-ness.

Ai Hoshino is the driving force of the narrative despite her story only making up around 10% of the manga. The main reason I want to talk about her is how she is displayed in Idol and "45510". For this I'll be using a fan translation by u/64990022 on Reddit the link for which can be found here.

The short story follows another member of B-Komachi looking back on Ai's popularity with jealousy.

In this we get to see an old interview of Ai's which holds her perspective on love: "I think affection comes from trust. What was it, payback? Like, to return affection with affection. But I'm a coward. I can’t believe in the words “like,” “love,” or “affection” very much. I don’t know, I’ve never really fallen in love with someone before.” This is the core of Ai's identity as an idol and how she performs. She doesn't understand love and how to be affectionate towards other people. Additionally, she doesn't seem to understand the point of marriage: “I can’t imagine it at all. Marriage? Me? Even if you say you want to marry me, how much of that is true? I can understand when people want to be with someone they like, but why marriage? Is it an expression of love? To prove that you would stay forever with that person? If that’s it then maybe I understand a little.”

Personally, I think that this rings true as an aro perspective on love and affection, not understanding the conventions of love and instead coming up with her own. Without being told that its normal to not have the ability to fall in love, Ai has given her feelings its own definition in an objective sense.

She reached the conclusion that lying was the greatest form of love, all stemming from her experience as an idol and observing the world of fans. To her, idols expressed their love to their fans all the time in their words, but none of them truly meant their words. While this is most likely true, we can see how this came to a head in the construction of the stage persona of Ai in the lyrics of "Idol" by Yoasobi;

" That "I love you" again Now, everybody is lured and captivated by you The pupil that you got The words you vocalize Even when untrue, it's your perfected Ai "

Every expression of love is a lie to captivate the audience, but to Ai, even if its untrue, its an expression of care and appreciation.

" So strong, it's you, unrivalled idol There cannot be weaknesses to find The brightest star is residing in you The gaps and shortcomings, don't show 'em Dammit, dammit Parts nobody wants to know should remain hidden One and only If it's different, no way, no way Such a true love, it's the realest Ai "

Despite not knowing how to love, Ai believe she'd give her fans the most appreciation she could by lying to them. Things like this aren't uncommon in the lives of young aros, claiming to have a crush or to love someone to fit in with the expectations people have for them. Despite all of this, she did hope that one day she would feel a 'true' love towards someone, which ended up being her children right before her death.

The Father

This is where the spoilers actually begin. Despite Ai being in a relationship with someone, there isn't much proof that this relationship was anything within the realm of healthy if not completely manipulative.

The twins' father and Ai's ex-boyfriend was Hikaru Kamiki. He was a child actor the same age as Ai, 15, and shortly after the two of them meet Ai becomes pregnant and gives birth at the age of 16. At this point Hikaru Kamiki has had multiple of these relationships and, to the reader, is known to be a serial killer of women in the entertainment industry, luring them in before killing them. He is suspected to, if not almost fully confirmed to have leaked the address of Ai to her stalker as well as which hospital she was staying in.

Needless to say, their relationship is incredibly brief and ends as soon as Ai becomes pregnant and is forced into hiding. The entirety of their relationship is shown as being based around meeting up around hotels and lacks an air of romance commonly seen in teen romances. He most likely manipulated Ai into a relationship with the intent of murdering her but there is some evidence to him actually being in love with her as he brings flowers to her grave on the anniversary of her death.

At time of posting, we don't know enough about him or their relationship to draw many conclusions but as he is the only partner Ai has every had, omitting their relationship felt disingenuous.

TLDR;

Ai's treatment of love as a whole relates greatly to an aro lens of love and the institutions of love in society. Lying about love is not uncommon among aro experiences. Idol is a bop no matter the language and its a really good aro song.

[stiffyck]

I WISH ARO HEADCANONS WERE MORE POPULAR IN FANDOMS

[rocksanddeadflowers]

character: *shows the slightest disgust/disinterest in romantic or sexual anything*

me, grabbing them and shaking them violently around, chanting: ASPEC ASPEC ASPEC!!!!!!!!

[clowningaroundmars]

i know this has probably been said a million times already before but it really strikes me how asexual hannibal is as a show overall now that i'm on my 4th rewatch

hannibal himself doesn't ever seem to lust after anyone in any way aside from will (and their love for each other is far from the typical amatonormative conventions society likes to impose on ppl)

we only see hannibal have sex with one person and it's only as a means to an end

hannibal clearly favors platonic connections over sexual and romantic ones, or at least shows his attraction in... very different ways than what's considered "normal", but his insistence that will is his friend despite stating multiple times that he loves him is very telling

and in the first few eps, jack asks will why the minnesota shrike would target young brunette girls. he throws out theories and suggests sexual motives, maybe? but there were no traces of semen on the body anywhere and then that's when will EXPLODES and firmly shuts the theory down by stating "no, he wouldn't disrespect her like that!"

will actually got to live the "normal" married life with a wife and a kid for 3 years but that was simply not enough. at the 1st chance he got, he freed hannibal from prison after hopping on a boat to see him in italy

mads himself (in an interview that i forgot the origins of LOL sorry) said will and hannibal most likely would never let their relationship "become physical"

their love and connection and yearning are SO DEEP that it defies typical parameters of relationships not just bc they're gay, but bc their love transcends any need for the dog and pony show that romance and sex often demands. they literally don't even need to have sex to deepen their relationship

in hannibal's words: "the very sight of you nourishes me"

[good-beansdraws]

Fe Aspec Week Day 2: Friendship

An indulgent piece for today!!!! :') It's no secret the trio's friendship has always had a really special place in my heart, and I've been grateful for the taste of acceptance and contentment it brought me during (and long after) I played the game. To see them find the most caring and complete friendship in each other was truly inspiring.

Here's to all of us finding the people that make us "never long for companionship throughout the rest of our days" <3

[ruffffffing]

whatever. ARO BLASSTTTT

[laurellala-comics]

A couple of years ago I made a few comics about an alien shapeshifter named Shiv that tried to look as hot as possible to distract everyone around him from how out of place he was. It worked on everyone except his butch lesbian coworker who hated his guts and kept pointing out his weird behavior (it's ok, they become besties later). Here's some snippets from that:

other highlights from this comic:

Shiv was an actor who played an alien on a tv show for children that was basically The Wiggles in space. It was called Silly Space Squad (or SSS pronounced like a snake sound)

Shiv understood conceptually that some people were more attractive than others but didn't really get it on a personal level (aro ace king), so he moved in with 3 male models so that he could study them intently and copy how they looked

Vampires were also real in this universe, but this was glossed over because the alien thing was more important to the plot

[puppppppppy]

I have to ask, is your pfp Mutsumi from Skip to Loafer?

!!!! yeah it is!! i read the first volume last year and fell deeply in love with the characters and story, so its one of my favorites lol. i highly recommend it <3

[scrumptiousfoxglitter]

In honor of the month of pride, as this is kinda my first pride month actually out, I have (badly) concocted a creation that one may consider self indulgent.

Do with this what you will.

[livvylives]

sometimes I remember that it’s canon that Jace never had a crush on anyone ever before Clary. Like????? And it’s also canon that Izzy & Maryse noticed this were worried because of that??????? #aroacerights?????????

[tangents-within-tangents]

Local Ace overthinks headcanon and shipping culture

Happy ace week, my friends! Imma be posting some aspec hc's this week so I felt the need to overexplain my personal stance on orientation headcanons and such

To start, as with any and all fandom things: to each their own. People can do whatever they want, and (for the most part) I can choose what I do or don't engage with. I know that hc and shipping and stuff is mostly for fun, or for seeking/creating representation, no hate to anyone who does it and enjoys it.

But also sometimes things can be problematic and I can still be bothered by those things. Even things that are 'just for fun' or 'not for you' can impact and reflect our views and behaviors, so it's still worth speaking about.

Aro/ace-spec identities are really diverse and complex, and we're really underrepresented as is. We have historically and chronically been plagued by problematic misconceptions and tropes, both in canon representation (or lack thereof) and fanon mindsets. Some of the main issues to be aware of with this topic specifically:

The majority of (sometimes unintentional) representation being non-human characters (like aliens and robots) implying that sex/romance = humanity and/or a fulfilling life. (Here's some video essays that touch on this: X X)

Related stereotype issues like racist or ableist de-sexualization and infantilization of certain groups like Asian men, physically disabled people, or people with autism. (It's an intersectionality thing bc yes those people can be aro/ace as well but it's still complicated) (more video essays! X X)

Common erasure of historically aspec characters in favor of allo plotlines bc that's "more interesting/realistic". Or ignoring canonically established aspec characters in favor of allo shipping (often excused by the fact that some aro/ace people do have sex/relationships, which is true but the complexities and nuances are often ignored and there's lots of double standards) (Here's some posts that touch on this: X X X)

Amatonormativity's over emphasis on sex/romance as a fundamental and necessary part of life, which is often reflected in how media and shipping culture are generally allo-centric, and it can just get pretty pervasive at times (note: we aren't a monolith obv, some aro/ace people enjoy it and participate too, but others don't and it is hard to avoid) X X

So while I know there's lots of reasons for shipping and headcanoning, and for the most part there's nothing wrong with it and people aren't trying to do these things, there are still issues that exist. Honestly seeing posts talking about these things has been really validating for me bc it let me know like yeah this is a problem other's have noticed too and I don't have to just accept it.

So with respect and awareness of nuance, ship and headcanon however you want. The rest of this post is about my own personal preferences and such. I'm not necessarily trying to persuade anyone here, I just have some thoughts I want to put into words:

For me personally, when it comes to characters' sexualities/gender identities/etc, I prefer just to stick to whatever is established in canon (or in confirmed intentional coding), and, if nothing is specified, headcanons that are based in canon evidence (more like theories I guess, as opposed to reimaginings or straight-up projection that knowingly ignores parts of canon. Which is fine and fun if that's what you like but to me there is a distinction). This is because:

1: While fandom culture is all about freedom and creativity, I do think it's important in this day and age to recognize actual canon representation and strive towards that because that is what will reach more people and have impact (and personally I think that writers' intentions should actually be given more thought/value)

2: I think that shipping/hc/fandom culture in general tends to perpetuate amatonormativity (specifically in devaluing/erasing friendship and non-romantic love), and sometimes leads to harmful parasocial queer speculation in real life (though again, I know that's not the intention but it's still a thing).

3: Generally, unless it’s explored as a part of a reimagined fic or something, just saying a random character is aspec (or whatever identity) when they did not present that way at all in the actual media doesn't really help me feel seen.

For example, I've seen a lot of people headcanon Mabel Pines as aromantic and that really threw me off bc in the show she is obsessed with romance. Like if other's see themselves in her that is great I won't stop you (the idea is that her crushes are comphet, which is not something I personally struggled with, and maybe I could see it if I rewatched the show with that in mind) but when I watched the show, I specifically did not connect with or relate to Mabel BECAUSE of my ace identity (yeah this post was mainly about her lol) so it just doesn't do much for me to claim her as aspec, in fact it feels counterproductive.

Sometimes it can feel really tacked on too, like 'well it's not confirmed that this character has sex so they could be ace', or 'some ace people do have sex so they can still be ace.' And like sure yes they could be but often it's like a kid show or something so none of the characters' sex lives are relevant or explicitly confirmed. Just bc they aren't not ace doesn't mean that they are, or that saying they are is meaningful if the character/story doesn't actually speak to anything related to the ace identity or experience. (This can happen with canon characters too, like Sponge Bob being asexual means absolutely nothing to me, especially since I get the sense that the creator said that more in a 'sea sponges reproduce asexually' type of way :/ )

So basically, in terms of representation I prefer the theory/interpretation type of headcanons that have supporting evidence of some kind, because that evidence is what makes me see myself in a character and feel represented in some way by them. So that's the type of headcanons I'll be posting, and that's why I'll be discussing evidence and explanations, even though I know plenty of people have fun and find value in just claiming identities without any of that.

Another thing I feel the need to overexplain is kinda the reverse of that. I think it's important to recognize that a character does not have to be a certain identity for you to see yourself in them. Like that sense of relatability and representation is still valid even if they aren't, and I think it's good to leave space for that ambiguity.

This is coming mostly from the fact that I have always valued platonic relationships (between any and all genders) long before I ever knew I was ace. I've always wished that was better normalized and represented in media and real life. I think that is just as important as queer representation, and sometimes they can counteract each other.

Like yes Min and Ryan could be gay and if that's what the writers were going for despite restrictions, or if people see themselves in that, great! But I would also love for this story to give a close friendship this much narrative value for once.

Merida does not HAVE to be aro/ace (or lesbian) to not want to be forced into marriage with a stranger at the age of 16 (in fact she specifically says "I'm not ready" and "not yet"). But regardless, aspects of her story are still really relatable to us and applicable to living in amatonormative society.

Mako and/or Raleigh do not NEED to be aspec for this glorious refreshing no-romo moment to happen (nor does one need to be aspec to appreciate it)

And maybe claiming them as aro/ace could even undercut the power of this platonic bond (like saying the only way they could not be interested in each other is if they are not interested in anyone (same if you said they are gay, as if that's the only possible way for a man and woman not to be attracted to each other)). But it's still a moment lots of us aspecs love because platonic relationships AND aro/ace characters do go hand in hand and BOTH are so rarely portrayed in media.

So these ideas also play into my preferences, and I want to acknowledge that my headcanons don't have to be definitive (which like I know that is normal amongst fandom culture anyway) but are more about pointing out aspects we can see ourselves in and relate to, especially in a media landscape that is so lacking in representation and understanding of our identities.

[zorilleerrant]

hey, as long as we're talking about aspec coded characters, there's this line I love from Travelers. when asked if he has a girlfriend or a boyfriend, Phillip says, "it's not a priority either way." which I think might be intended as meaning he cares more about his mission than dating, but really could be intended to mean he's not that interested in relationships, as a rule. anyway, I love this line because it shows he has absolutely no opinions about gender (implying this is irrelevant in the future), but also that he doesn't really have sex/romance on the brain either. this is really cool because it's just casually juxtaposed against the other characters, who are married, dating, having ex drama, and starting an it's complicated respectively, and that's an important part of their narratives. I choose to read it as him being demi, because I like the idea that specifying not a priority means it's simply a possibility hanging out sometimes, but there's a lot you could work with there to build all kinds of ideas of how erotic relationships work in his future. he does sort of get a girlfriend at one point, but that's also a complicated messy relationship that's actually easier to read as not fitting with his sexuality, so make of that what you will. he's a relationship neutral character! you don't see that one much even on purpose!

[theroseredreaper]

love it when an author accidentally writes the ‘uninterested in anything other than my studies and job’ type of ‘eccentric’ character cuz they always read as aro and/or ace. love it just as much when said character falls in love and absolutely panics cuz it reads as an aspec character discovering they’re actually demi and going ‘this is what alloros go through all the time?! my health can’t handle it!’

[purplecelestial-buddy]

I feel that sometimes I tell people that Hirano is cat coded and they don't actually get what I mean, so let present you with a comparison between Hirano (a cat coded boy) and Izutsumi (quite literally a cat girl)

Are you seeing what I'm seeing? In case you aren't I butchered the paneling to have more of a direct comparison:

These people arw going through all the stages of the grieving process while being hugged, how is that not being cat coded?

[wlwitchofwhitestone]

Also now that they've finally kissed at least the rest of fandom will catch up that they've been together the whole time. We told y'all from day one, that's a qpr. They weren't oblivious. Imogen knew Laudna had other priorities - when it came to romance, not to her - and knew exactly what Laudna was okay with. And she waited until she couldn't know, until things had changed and she had to take Laudna at her word instead, and that's what made it matter and I'm just saying. We've been here the whole time having to watch people beg every week for something to become canon that was there from the start. Watched beauj*s start to play out all over again as people swore up and down these two "lesbians" (that's a whole other post) were madly in love and hadn't realized it. Turns out they knew exactly what they were, like we said. You could've saved a lot of time if you'd realized that a kiss isn't what makes a ship canon. I've had a great 65 episodes of a canon ship away from the mainstream fascination with saying things like "whatever they've got going on," but welcome aboard.

[questioning-pisces]

pjo fandom stop ignoring aspec characters challenge go!