you're Qin Su - you're the daughter of a minor sect leader, and during the war you're rescued by a kind, handsome, clever young man. after the war he's recognised by his father, the leader of one of the most powerful sects in the jianghu, and you decide to try and persue him as a match. he's ameanable - and though it is definitely you doing most of the chasing, you don't mind, as he's very polite and respectful and seems to like you very much! this seems like a perfect match! you two decide to consumate your relatonship to force your parents' hands.
it works! after only have sex once you're pregnant! you get married and everything is wonderful! except... now he won't kiss or touch you, let alone have sex, and seems uncomfortable even sharing a bed. but... he's still kind and sweet and respectful to you, so you try not be too hurt about it. maybe he'll relax over time.
he spends a lot of time with his sworn brother, but the sworn brother is probably the nicest person in the world and your husband doesn't really have many friends, so you don't mind. in fact, you're really pleased that he has the sworn brother to support him! they probably touch each other more than your husband touches you, and he probably spends more time with his sworn brother than he spends with you, but he still treats you with affection and respect, so you don't really feel like you can complain. you're just happy he's happy!
and then the baby is born, and it's a boy! you've given him an heir! it's perfect and you're so excited, because surely this baby is something the two of you can really bond over together and you can become close again-
and then he names your son as an obvious deliberate reference to his sworn brother.
like. what other conclusions can you really draw, at this point??? I am pretty confident Qin Su believed her husband was gay.
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What did Sagewhisker do? All I remember was that she was Yellowfang's mentor, and I used to love YS. (I was a lot younger at the time, though.)
oH Lord, a lot of people who read YS when they were younger kinda don't pick up on how shitty Sagewhisker is. It goes over their heads that she is the one who's actually responsible for Yellowfang being forced to be distant from Brokenkit
From a young age, Sagewhisker is pressuring Yellowpaw to be a medcat, when she doesn't want to
Yellow LIKES the satisfaction of healing itself, but LOVES being a warrior more.
She's a fantastic hunter, has always wanted a family, and is just genuinely filled with a lot of self-satisfaction when she gets to do her warrior duties.
(They also had to retcon the stupidest magic power, super-empathy, into Yellowfang so that she nonsensically wouldn't like fighting. Yellowfang. The cat whose first appearance in TPB is attacking Firepaw and didn't hesitate to blind Brokenstar. THAT Yellowfang.)
In contrast, when she starts healing, she's constantly filled with shame or horror. She also gets bullied viciously by several cats, while others do that Thing that an older family member does when they don't like what you're doing. You know;
"Ohhh that's so good, for you. If it makes you happy it's good!! I mean, but, wouldn't you rather do Other Thing? I mean no, I understand, you like This thing, but Other thing would... no no it's okay, nevermind. I'm happy for you."
This while she's already courting Raggedpelt, and planning a future with him.
So to begin with, she has a lot of negative feelings when Sagewhisker tries to pressure her into this role, especially as Sage insists she "Wants HER" and "It's your destiny." But that's not all;
When Cloudpaw (later Cloudpelt) gets viciously mauled and might not survive, Sagewhisker takes one look and says, "It might be kinder to let StarClan take him now."
Yellowfang is FURIOUS at how quickly Sagewhisker gave up, and Sage just waves this away with "oh I won't stop you but be prepared for heartbreak lol"
Sage continues to tell her shit like "You can't save every cat" after Cloudpaw's mother sees her son all cheese-grated up.
So... either Sagewhisker was going to just leave Cloudpaw there to bleed out or die of infection, OR she was implying euthanasia.
And it's probably euthanasia, because when Yellowfang is pregnant later, she says,
Sooooo... considering how WEIRD WC generally is about abortion, acting like it's not even an option and giving Clear Sky some Angel Fetus Children in DOTC...
Sagewhisker was probably implying that Yellowfang would smother infants. Or do whatever Sagewhisker was planning to do with Cloudpaw.
I don't even know if pressuring Yellowfang into an abortion would have been better... honestly this exchange is uncomfortable no matter how you slice it.
It gets worse ofc. Yellowfang gets this warning from StarClan about how “Only one thing can stop the tide of hatred this birth cursed cat will bring: the courage of a mother to know her destiny.” Silverflame also suggests just being his friend, if she can't be his mother.
Forget that though, because Sagewhisker continues to snap at Yellowfang and remind her that she can't look at him for too long, else people will get suspicious or something.
"It's a woman's responsibility to have children for our glorious war society, Yellowfang, unless they have A RARE GIFT THAT MUST NOT BE WASTED."
In the same conversation she's then like, "Also don't go into the nursery, the child I forced you to give up needs a chance to bond with the abusive foster who hates his little guts."
In general Sagewhisker also prevents Yellowfang from standing up for herself or her position in a way that is absolutely infuriating. Foxheart comes in and starts bellowing about "HOW DARE YOU HAVE APPRENTICES RUN ERRANDS FOR YOU?" and Sage is just like, "Turn the other cheek uwu"
Yellowfang is punished constantly for the sin of being Yellowfang. She is not allowed to be snarky at all. It fucking sucks. This book is MISERABLE
SO basically, Sagewhisker forces her into a role she isn't very happy in, stops her from standing up for herself ever, guilts Yellowfang over "wasting her special gift," gives up on cases that are too hard for her, suggests killing kits, says some wildly misogynistic stuff, prevents Yellowfang from doing anything about Brokenkit, and then dies.
She's the worst and no one ever talks about how fucked up this character is. and I really mean AS A CHARACTER
Because her PURPOSE in the story is to do all of these things and be hailed as a good mentor in the end. But the fandom is REALLY bad at analyzing characters as narrative tools.
She's right to pressure Yellowfang into her role, with the ending comic even trying to have Sagewhisker apologize for pressuring her and Yellow going "d'aww dwai you didn't force me into anything 8) ignore the entire fucking book before this point"
Giving up on a battered teenager is supposed to show Yellowfang's talent and resolve, not reflect poorly on Sagewhisker.
WC fully believes that "wisdom" she espouses about Lizardfang. Lizardfang is a bad woman because she doesn't accept her place as a queen. This kind of guilt and blame is reserved exclusively for mothers in WC, not fathers, note how Mudclaw doesn't help at all but no one gives a shit.
Killing the baby would have been the best option because, again, Brokenkit is BORN. EVIL.
I'm pretty convinced that "Courage of a mother to KNOW HER DESTINY" refers to the fact she is supposed to be a medcat, who kills her child. What FINALLY ends Brokenstar's reign of terror is being poisoned-- not the kindness she was finally able to show him in TPB while he was prisoner.
So Sagewhisker guilt-tripping Yellowfang into a position she doesn't like, keeping her away from her child, suggesting murdering the baby... that's all good, actually. That's something that is framed as correct.
And I think people really sleep on it. Sagewhisker is like this perfect little encapsulation of how shitty clan culture is in WC, an enforcer of the series' misogyny while being a woman herself, someone who makes Yellowfang's wife HELL.
But because she didn't do it violently, no one notices it.
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Orientation Day at Zapolyarny
Young Arlecchino, during her Fatui Harbinger onboarding session: Greetings, small wooden child. I understand that your mother abandoned you as a baby to fend for yourself in an empty domain because she thought you were weak.
Scaramouche: Wow, okay. Even if it wasn't incredibly rude to call someone a "small wooden child", I'm still at least 470 years older than you are. And where do you get off talking about me and my mother like that?
Arlecchino: My mother was also a wretched, awful woman, so I killed her. Would you like me to kill your mother as well?
Scaramouche: Are you asking me if I want you to kill the Raiden Shogun? I mean, you can try if you're up for it. It's your funeral.
Arlecchino: Very well. After I kill her, would you mind terribly if I then adopted you as my son?
Scaramouche: What the fuck are you talking about?! Yes, of course I would mind! I don't want you to be my mom!
Arlecchino: That is good to hear, seeing as how I will be your father.
Scaramouche: Alright, this has gotten too goddamn weird, even for me. Jester, is this really who we're bringing in to fill the Knave position?
Pierro: Yes, she is. Would you prefer us to find someone more like Crucabena instead?
Scaramouche: ...point taken. Welcome to the team, newbie.
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