#which WILL come back to cis women. it WILL. if we don't support trans women they WILL come after more rights we've already clawed for

[imwritesometimes]

It's becoming just.... blatantly obvious that all this GOP posturing on transgender individuals being about ~protecting women's rights~ is just them trying to save face after they got Roe overturned and that has since backfired massively for them. Like it's so clear they think this is somehow gonna win points with women 'see we really care abt ur rights! We're trying to protect you!' while they still try to pry those rights from our hands not to mention there's no danger cis women face from trans people anyway

[genderkoolaid]

I hate how sometimes as a transmasc guy I feel like I'm betraying the cause kind of. Like I end up feeling awkward about stuff that's supposed to be great for women because it's not for me anymore.

Most recent time came when I stumbled upon some reddit drama over women only parking spaces which are in better lit areas close to the exit. I don't want to side with the "I guess I'll identify as a woman for ten minutes while I park" types but sometimes I feel like I'm forced to shove myself back into the woman box if I want that safety.

Also the many "girls in STEM" opportunities. Like it's good that they're there, but I hate having to either feel really uncomfortable but still get the opportunity or try and navigate that world how a man would while I still look and sound like a cis woman.

Also this one orchestra I'm in, where a while ago we were trying to pick a composer to commission, and the director noted that he decided not to put any white male composers on the recommended shortlist. Again, I get where he's coming from, but then I worry that once I transition I'll be just another white male. Maybe that would net me some opportunities if I pass well, but it hurts a bit knowing that in some people's eyes I'll fade into the boring grey amalgamation of suits and ties oppressing everyone else.

I think this is a pretty common experience.

This is what happens when feminism fails trans men & other gender-oppressed people who are not women. Cisfeminism in general forces trans people to fight over who gets to count as a woman & therefore be deserving of feminist support, because the feminist framework being used was never made for us. The fact that trans people who aren't women- or aren't exclusively women, or are read as cis men- are vulnerable and under-represented goes ignored & we struggle to have our voices heard.

Its also part of the harmful ways trans men are expected to act in order to have our identities respected. We are expected to pass, go stealth (or at least not bring up being trans "too much"), and never talk about how our experiences differ from those of cis men. Nonbinary & genderqueer transmascs are expected to either dissociate themselves from men or never talk about being NB/GQ. We are told we are othering ourselves when we point out that groups in which cis men are heavily represented have never featured trans men to any remotely similar extent. It sucks and its part of "affirming" transmasc erasure: instead of being erased through misgendering, we are erased by having our transness ignored so no one actually has to confront societal & individual bigotry against trans-men.

[ventbloglite]

Some of you really need to step back a little bit and acknowledge how ignorant you are towards how misogyny affects trans mascs and how you yourself may be perpetrating said misogyny when speaking ill of trans mascs.

Which is not something you should be doing at all, fyi. You can talk about individual shitty trans mascs and certain community issues you dislike which involve or are perpetrated by trans mascs without just being transphobic towards trans mascs in general.

So many times I've seen the sentient of 'AFAB's have it really easy, everyone accepts AFAB's as trans, everyone loves AFAB trans people, the world caters to you, there is basically no problems for you if you're AFAB unlike AMAB folk' shown in a variety of ways from a variety of people including just outright saying it. Not to mention the belitting of trans masc experiences with transphobia and misogyny + the way those interact because they identify as men even though transphobes still consider them to be women and don't give a shit about their actual gender.

A main crux of transphobia (though many other factors which result in hating us come into play, too many to go into now) is that trans people are seen as and treated as their AGAB and punished for not identifying as it or portraying it 'correctly' by society. So tell me why so many seem to 'forget' about how misogyny impacts trans masculine people. Could it be because you believe that advocating for trans women and trans femmes and fighting transmisogyny somehow must involve being transphobic towards trans men due to that radfem influence you've absorbed? The world will never reach gender equality of any kind if everything is 'men versus women' so can we just fucking not bring that into trans spaces please.

Examples!

I saw recently a post which perfectly pointed out the potential risks associated with someone considered 'male' growing out her hair but OP clearly knew absolutely nothing about the same risks associated with someone deemed 'female' cutting his hair. Instead of not making that post or doing some research, OP thus assumed there weren't really any risks likely due to already believing that AFAB trans people have it easy.

The ignorance! Misogyny heavily impacts the way hair is treated on those perceived as women (including body hair) and women/those perceived as women have no end of people policing what they can and can't do with their bodies often taking things to the absolute extreme to do so. Short hair on woman may seem 'more accepted' but AFAB people of any gender could quickly tell you multiple situations where it's not and results in the same violence, abuse, homo(lesbo/butch)phobia and yes possibly even death depending on the situation even if you still identify as a woman. Pretending this doesn't happen is straight up misogyny btw.

'AFAB's pass easily by doing basically nothing' is another frequent one which makes me laugh. 'Passing' for most trans people is so situational and so dependent on what you do or don't do to strictly conform to gender stereotypes if you're even able to do that at all. To suggest that the world ignores feminine gender markers the moment someone's hair is short and their chest appears mostly flat ignores both the complexity of how humans perceive gender and how misogyny comes into play whenever a woman/perceived woman shows any masculinity let alone maleness. Considering the same misogyny comes into play frequently against trans women you'd think it'd be easy to remember.

This general sentiment of 'Being born with a vagina means your life is easy and everything you do will be loved and supported because society adores you. You don't and will never have any real problems, not like anyone born with a penis.' isn't magically okay and absolutely super different to when misogynists say it about cis women because you're using AGAB language and cite 'because you're men and blah blah patriarchy' as the actual reason you're saying it. It's very clearly same shit different coat of paint. The pool is there, your toes are in, stop preparing to dive for Gods sake.

[cowboyjen68]

Hi Jen, and hello every butch reading this. I need your help.

I don't know where to begin, this has veen a problem for me for almost a decade now. I've followed you (Jen) for a few years now, and you're a very comforting figure to my brain, so I was hoping you and possibly others could help me out a bit. If not answers, then some good advice, open mindedness, patience, and possibly links to resources and helpful places. I've wanted to reach out to older butches and such about my issues with gender for a while, because I've flipped between a few and always have my mind coming back to butch in some form or another. Whether I act on it between each circle back or not, it stays.

I came out as some flavor of trans around 13, and then moved towards binary FtM around 14 or 15, which is when I met my first partner ever. I've had a ton of jumps back to being just kind of butch but in a weird middle butch state of not lesbian, not ftm, not anything but butch. I grew up in the midwest for 10 years (starting at 10,) and came out as a lesbian at 11 or 12. Regardless of how I was identifying in highschool, I was bullied and catcalled as a lesbian my whole childhood, seen as a d/ke, called it, I got the worst of it all, had girls try to kick my ass and dudes try to "turn me." I hung out with the fem cishet alt girls half my height and half my weight, carried them around, I was the ugly tall bitch that protected them. Had a wicked shaved head, wearing mens clothes handmedown, mens boots, brought a swiss army knife everywhere and my own wallet and housekeys. Getting pencils thrown at my head, smoking weed in the girls room, forced to change in the gender neutral stall for gym cause the school didnt know what to do with me. Guys would honk as they went past and shout dyke at me, so I started trying to blend in with highlighter shirts and jeans etc. Typical midwestern shit. I feel that despite now living as a man, i had the lived experience since a very young age (even before moving to the midwest,) of a butch. I am now fully living life as a cis man, stealth, and dating an amazing queer trans dude whose possibly genderfluid, and also very fem. He also identified as a lesbian for a long time and experienced a lot of toxicity there, and was nonbinary in his past, and I met him when he was agender and queer. He's amazing, I'm going to marry him, and he's everything I love in a partner. Feminine, went to cosmetology school, pretty nails, chubby, likes to bake and shop and wants to cook me steak, wants me to carry his stuff and his groceries, calls me his scary dog privleges, wants to scratch my sideshave. He realized he was trans and came out after we met, and I've been his biggest support against everything else, and I always will be. I love him, I'm attracted to him and he's the only person i ever have been. So I dont think I qualify anymore as a butch, despite using the term and being a butch for so many years. I was a butch, I still feel it even if I'm not really into many people at all including women (also on the aro/ace spectrum haha), but now I'm a man, I have a beard, I have a boyfriend I will never leave, who knows how I feel and loves me and we both know no matter where we end up gender wise or sexuality wise that pretty much me and him are it, and if it contradicts, who gives a shit, yknow?

My dating history has always been feminine nbs, feminine trans boys, and femme lesbians. I have never dated a masculine cis man, masculine nb, anyone masculine at all. For lack of better terms due to my situation, I have always been butxh4femme and at least masc4fem. I have always been the guardian and gentle giant of my fem partners, I also am mostly a stone butch due to sexual trauma and asexuality. Due to my aroace-ness, I've also hardly dated literally anyone lmao! Maybe 3 people longterm and seriously in my entire 21 years. This is getting really long, and I'll be honest, I've been yelled out of all communities I've been in for being so damn complicated. I'm scared I'll hurt mt partner and he'll feel I don't see him as he is, I'm scared I'll hurt lesbians despite living and growing as one most of my life, I'm scared I'll hurt me by identifying as butch because I feel like I'll have to detransition. I also kinda look fuck ugly without a beard nowadays, cause lord knows I've shaved that shit fullon twice now because of this exact issue.

I want to be called sir, and I love being on T. I hate getting a period, and my bottom dysphoria is agonizing, but I probably wont get bottom surgery. I want to not be catcalled. I want to get top surgery eventually, and maybe I don't want a full beard. I wanna cut all the sleeves off my shirts again and get some sexy workboots and jeans. I know I want my pretty femboy boyfriend on my arm forever, I don't care how he ends up identifying or me either, and to see him wear his dress on our wedding day. I want to be butch but still be seen as a man, but I don't think I'm allowed because so many people have shit on me for it and said I'm not. But I still wear my keys on my belt. I still lift the heavy shit, emotionally or physically, every day for him. I still do my role, I still protect the people around me. But I don't want people to look at me when I say butch and assume me or my boy are women, out of respect for him and me too.

Advice needed, please, anybody that's willing to help me and help me find my path. It's been so back and fourth so long. Thank you.

- R

i am sorry for taking so long. Fall is a very busy season with all my jobs ramping up and getting ready for winter on the homestead.

Your writing was a lot to absorb and I admit I read it several times and had to come back because it weighed on my emotions and heart heavily. I was driving tractor last night so I had lot of thinking time. I went over in my head how you much feel, how I could possibly answer this with any coherant advice or even just some comforting words.

You are only 21, my advice if you were my child (i have 3--25 year olds, a 22 year old and a 16 yo), would be to slow your roll. 3 serious relationships by 21 is a lot. At a time when we are sort of socially and mentally programmed to be free and using our energy to exlplore our individuality you were putting efforts into maintaining viable relationships with other people who were probably also trying to figure themselves out. I was 23 before I even had one serious relationship and i was probably still NOT ready for it.

When we never live a single life or a life on our own it becomes hard to separate who we are from our partner. It is normal to bounce off of each other and to both want badly to share the same values, identity and interestes EVEN if as individuals those things might never have lined up.

I am NOT a therapist nor can I possibly know you or your exact feelings, I can only go by what you told me. When I am asked for advice I am honest but kind, go from my experiences and or those stories I have been told by friends. Sometimes what I say is NOT what you want or expected to hear. That is okay. You can take what I say or leave it. Or use what helps, ignore what doesn't . So here it goes.

My point about you both meeting young,and thus relying on each other to work on your individuality comes into play here. You are both, I am guessing around 21. Neither of you have had any time to forge exactly who you are. Stastically what are the chances of two women who both lived as a lesbian meeting after you transitioned  and the partner ALSO being trans but not coming out until AFTER the fact. Until after the relationship has progessed.? Speaking in terms of how many trans people are in the population that feels like quite a statistical anomally. What are the chances? Now I suck and math and I know the percentage of any given population in the LGBT+  community as compared to greater society seems sketchy, based on shitty research and at best a bad guess. It just gives me a bit of pause and might give you some food for thought, a chance to think over outside influence vs life long dysphoia or other factors. 

 I preface this by saying I can in no way know you or your partner or pasts or any actual feelings, only what you have told me. I appreciate your stark honesty and your willingness to admit you are struggling. Reaching out is hard even as an anon. Is it in any way possible your partner was influenced heavily by wanting badly to share your life, your values, to feel more inline with you and to feel more close to you and to solidify the relationship in a space that she perceives as more comfortable to you. OR perhaps even your friend group?  

You talk aboout pressure from all sides to be this or be that and if you are a trans man I am sure she was getting not too subtle pressure to not use lesbian even though she was maybe just fine with that, it felt right. There is a vicious push from inside the house to tell people how to describe their sexuality and relationship when it is no one’s business. Others feel uncomfortable when two people live their lives as they see fit and don’t rely on how people perceive them to be happy. It makes some people nuts  in fact. 

To your concern about detransitioning or not or what makes you happy. I know detransitioners and they slide just fine back into the lesbian community they used to have or they have found their own new lesbians friend group. It is not impossible. At many events I have been to in my life, women’s festivals included, there were tans men there who lived soley as men outside the protective walls of women spaces but were happy to be seen as women within the safety of the limited time and space of the event. You can find community among lesbian no matter how you land, it just takes a little bravery and ultimately being okay with yourself. 

I am not going to tell you it is easy no matter the path you choose. Reidentifying as a woman with a full beard and staying on T is never going to be as easy as just saying “I am THIS “. You would have to spend time coming back out, explaining etc until such a time you formed a community who knows you and understands your past. 

Everything you described that you love is everything I love about being butch, I am short, 5′3 so I didn’t experience some things like you have as tall woman in high school, BUT I was definitely clocked as a lesbian even with great effort to be seen has just wearing “typical midwestern shit”. My entire wardrobe was T shirts, sweatshirts, jeand and tennis shoes. I gave up my beloved cowboy boots because others said they made me “look even more like a boy” and in the 1980′s I tranlated that to “butch lesbian” even if I did not have those words. I knew damn well what they were inferring.  

I also know lesbians who take T and remain in the lesbian community, they just feel they need to pass more as men in the larger world for their peace of mind, safety, job, whatever. So deciding that lesbian and butch is right for you does not mean you can’t continue to utilize tools that help you to feel okay. 

This is getting a bit long and I will admit I am unendingly biased, I have never denied that and don’t hide the fact that I think being a butch lesbian is wonderful. GIven all the factors and insecurities you have shared with me being a butch seems like the path of least resistance. Cutting back on T, not constantly worrying about “am I or am I not” and getting back to the basics of what you seemed to understand as you were coming out, before there was transitioning on your table. EVEN in the face of bullying and knowing being a lesbian was not desirable to the outside world you could not escape it and you came out. Perhaps because when you can’t escape you meet something head on and embrace it since that pulls power from the outsiders. 

When you and your partner are alone, away from all others. In the safety of you bed, talking softly and about your day or your plans tomorrow, the world gets no say. You both know that is true in your hearts and please don’t let those in the world, in our own community poison that with pressure and accusations. DO NOT give them control of  your heart, of your love. 

Best of luck and butch hugs to you.

[pluralsword]

we know that tumblr is not bluesky so like. are we bonkers for saying this but we somehow dont think that the horny human bodied trans posts using the transformers tag (which is also not something sex workers and horny trans humans on bluesky do they're having a normal one) are coming from anyone but bot accounts. especially since some of them are using trans guy and trans gal (without like, a bigender or polygender tag, which is strange) and trans exclusionary radical feminist tags all in the same breath, and the kicker here is - a lot of these posts were within the last 24-48hrs with the trans day of visibility tag. TDOV is march 31st. nice try.

so like even before getting into how this effects trans transformers art and writing this takes up the trans tag too and its like. whatever fucking asshole is out there making a mockery of trans people of all kinds by and likely stealing photos of the likes of us for porn accounts let me personally, and respectfully say what I have to say about how people like you have been doing this for cis women too: This is an awful act, and I have the utmost disdain for you for commodifying our bodies without consent or agency. It makes navigating this website already bereaved with transphobia and transmisogyny (which effects everyone not just trans women but us in particular) more of a pain in the butt and it is deeply insulting to both the real variety of our expressions and our (a)sexual lives.

What we hate most about this is that the backlash by staff and mass reporting will likely result in actual trans people whether sex workers or not losing their accounts so scrap you honestly. YOU KNOW THERE'S A GENOCIDE GOING ON IN MULTIPLE COUNTRIES RIGHT? AND REGARDING THE USA AMID MASS ARRESTS FOR BEING ON HRT OR OUT AS TRANS IN STATES WHERE THAT IS NOW ILLEGAL, DO YOU KNOW WHAT V-CODING IS? DO YOU KNOW WHAT PRISONS DO TO TRANS WOMEN IN THE USA? AND THIS IS WHAT YOU DO INSTEAD OF BOTHERING TO AT LEAST VOTE FOR SOMEONE WHO GIVES A SHIT ABOUT US OR DONATE MUTUAL AID TO ACTUAL TRANS PEOPLE INCLUDE PEOPLE IN THE SEX WORK INDUSTRY? You haven't read Gender as Accumulation Strategy by Kay Gabriel which goes over how trans people, trans women, left with nothing and sexually commodified and exiled by society made use of sex work to build up resources, support each other, and fight for liberation. Frag you. Sweet Solus, frag you.

For our part, posting trans transformers stuff is something that doesn't get as much attention tumblr interaction-wise (after releasing our essay and the whole thing with polls a while back it was very clear that are a number of people who do pay attention to this stuff but dont interact directly which is understandable there's no shame in that especially with all the shit going on right now and we just want to say to those who follow our stuff we appreciate you, salute you, and hope the best for you) and we don't bother with actually using the transformers tag here much to search for things but it does hurt.

Again, what we hate most about this is that the backlash by staff and mass reporting will likely result in actual trans people whether sex workers or not losing their accounts. Dear fellow trans and gender expansive people, we are in this together, be kind to each other, we will only survive with solidarity to one another and to all issues of oppression and not on trans liberation alone. We definitely agree with Kay Gabriel on that

[asexual-means-no-attraction]

so do you just think all nonbinary people are cis people pretending to be trans, or...? it genuinely makes no sense to me how you can conflate the entire nonbinary community with "people who perpetuate gender roles" when the vast majority directly criticize the existence of gender roles. there's barely a "nonbinary community" anyway because there are so many different ways to be nonbinary, the experiences of these people will vary. i highly suggest reading books/memoirs about gender being more complicated than "you're either a man or a woman" instead of just making generalizations and assumptions about nb people and their intentions

I'm assuming your coming with the best intentions here. So I'm gonna come back with a very simple-- please reread what I've said or leave. Cuz you didn't understand it fully.

There's a million and one ways to be trans, to be gay, to be literally any group thats only dependant one a single factor about yourself that you can't change. We still have communities. Likewise, there is still a nonbinary community.

The nonbinary community as a whole criticizes gender roles while further enforcing them. Another reason why I genuinely want to be supportive but find myself unable to. In the same vein that I hear "women shouldn't have to wear makeup/men don't have to be strong" I will hear "I don't feel female because I don't want makeup/I don't feel male because I like my emotions." That's not actually progressive and it's honesty just sexist. It's conflating womenhood to feminine things and manhood to masculine things on why they identify as nonbinary. When in actually there is no such thing as femininity or masculinity as they are made up gender roles. <- this does end up pushing transphobic, sexist, and even homophobic ideas.

And for the record, which I have already mentioned, this information is coming from talking irl and online with people, reading books, articles, and memoirs, researching things as much as I possible could. It's not from personal experience nor based on the nonbinary people I've met irl. I consistently find the community conflating women with feminine and man with masculine. Stating things that are very clearly gender roles and then saying it's gender itself.

As for what I think they actually are??? I just think their people. I will not claim they are trans, cis, or something else cuz I don't know them. I can give ideas on what they might be. Similar to how I've given ideas to people who aren't sure if their trans/gay/bi. But that's just me saying "if this is what's making you feel a certain way, maybe try going in this direction. If that doesn't work, try this, etc etc." Cuz as I've said a million times. It's your personal journey and only you can make the determination of how to define yourself. Its your right as a human to be respected and called according to your wishes within reason (ie. It doesn't cause harm or is disrespectful).

And for a last little clarification. Your relationship to gender can be complicated-- this could be dysphoria, how gender roles type into your experiences, etc. But gender itself is very very simple. And people try to take it way more seriously than it is. I find this both within the nonbinary and the trans communities. And I really think we'd benefit from people actually separating gender from gender roles. Cuz you'll find a lot more people blurring the lines between what we know to be feminine and masculine while still just being their gender. Which I find great.

[nothorses]

how do i, as a stealth transmasc, misdirect people who call me a (transfem) egg without coming off as transphobic? often they think of me as an egg because i care "just a little too much" about trans issues and trans hcs, and/or because im very gnc and gay. i want to project the vision of a cis binary gay man that's very comfortable in his gender but respects trans rights, but i don't know how to make people respect my gender without either sounding like i would NEVER consider the idea of being transfem, or without them coming away from the interaction still thinking of me as a "potential girl". i should clarify that most people do not outright call me an egg, but that seems to be the impression i get from a lot of trans people that i interact with online, and some have even told me "if you're not trans now, you will be later".... for now ive resorted to the excuse that i have trans friends and family members (which is true) and that for a time i did actually question my gender as a transfem and decided i was not one (which is not). but its frustrating that i have to lie and explain myself like that for people to leave me and my gender alone. it sometimes feels like being stealth on this website is harder than just presenting as trans.

I don't know if I really have The Correct Advice for you, because I think there's really only so much anyone can do to dissuade nosy internet strangers from being way the hell too in your business (from personal experience and observation, lol).

But something you might try is leaning into the gay aspect of your identity, and the historical connection and solidarity between gnc gay folks and trans people; the idea of gay men's gender as Different from straight men's gender, even if both are men, and the nuances of that relationship to maleness under patriarchy.

Maybe also just, like, expressing discomfort with that interpretation of you through that lens- which I'm sure you've done, but some extra questions to try asking might be: Why do gay men need to Actually Be Women? Why can't they be gay? Why do men who care about trans people need to Actually Be Women- why are we setting the expectation that cis men are actually incapable of trans solidarity? Why can't cis gay men have nuanced and well-considered relationships to maleness that are different from straight men's, without Actually Being Women?

I mean even aside from the fact that their perception of you as "potential girl" is nosey and invasive and invalidating (not to mention condescending), it's also genuinely ignoring a lot of historical context, and nuances in the gay community & gay identity. Our communities are more related than they want to think, and it's reductive and binary to insist that gnc gay men can't be the way they are and still be men. Even if you're coming at it from a Support Trans Women angle, it's still just "gay men aren't real men" in a trans hat.

(Which of course isn't to say that a lot of folks do start their journey that way; as "gnc gay men who care a lot about trans rights" to transfemmes. That's a common path, and for good reason. I'm not invalidating that. But jesus, not every horse girl turns out to be a trans guy, and not every gnc gay turns out to be a trans girl.)

Idk!! I'm sorry you're dealing with this, and I really hope you find a way to get people off your back about it. I can imagine how invalidating it must feel to be perceived that way.

[lesbianamalvada]

What resources is an actress stealing from the community?

Also I found this quote looking it up.

She then asked if being a lesbian means “you are ONLY” attracted to cis women and if being attracted to trans men, trans women, and nonbinary people makes you pansexual.

And it seems to stem from confusion, not any kind of maliciousness. I can see how someone who spent time in the feminism or lesbian tags would walk away confused with this same opinion because of how TERFs are trying to redefine women and lesbians.

Additionally, she uses both labels, not saying pan lesbian as one label like you made it seem.

They seem to be someone who, with a quick Google, is just confused, learning, and exploring. And you're being really hostile about it for no reason.

That said, if she thinks she's a lesbian is it stealing? If she ends up being lesbian after a few more years, is it stealing just because she didn't know that now?

I think people like you are why it takes so long for people to find identities. You make it unsafe to explore when that's half the reason the queer community exists. Because more than just straight, cishet ppl exist and we should be normalizing that.

So again, do you have a link for these stolen resources, cuz I can't find anything online.

i never said they stole resources. you are making a strawman. there isn't that many resources just for lesbians to begin with. they do steal our communities, spaces, and conversations. they scold us for not being "inclusive" enough. I'm all for people experimenting and if you identify as bi and then are gay or vice versa it is whatever. but when you try to change the definition of lesbianism, and say that men can be lesbians and we can be attracted to men, and then furthermore shame us for not being attracted to them or for our identities not being inclusive enough, i cannot support you. it is the same homophobia we experience from cishet ppl with a rainbow polish. you have made our own community a hostile environment for us. and we cannot vent about how alienating and degrading it is without people like you scolding us, saying our boundaries make others "unsafe" or how we are using bigoted dog whistles and we are the reason conservatives are winning etc etc.

we can all acknowledge that being bisexual, asexual, trans, a drag queen, etc comes with unique experiences and that they shouldn't be erased or overlooked. yet when it comes to lesbians we are not allowed to say the same? if someone is only attracted to one gender they are not bisexual so they shouldn't talk over bisexuals, police them, invade their spaces, or try to change the definition of bisexual. I just believe the same is true for lesbians.

Also someone using a contradictory label like "pansexual lesbian" and being questioned on it is not them being unsafe. they are not in any harm. what is unsafe is teaching young kids who are homosexual that they could emotionally like the other gender just not physically, hearts not parts, everyone is a little bi, the genitals don't matter that much and caring about them is weird, your sexuality should be inclusive etc. All of which I have seen happen in online queer spaces that champion the notion of mspec gays and lesbians.

It also doesn't surprise me that the only sexuality that excludes men is the one a large section of the queer community will use their dying breath to center men in. "lesbians can be men, lesbians can have sex with men, lesbians and men are best friends" it is always non-lesbians saying this. And then we push back and get comments like this. Lesbians with boundaries are the reason so many people have hard time finding their identities. Gtfo of here. Other people's feelings and journeys or whatever are not more important than our lived reality. We are the only group that is surveilled like this.

[moonshine-aqua]

wait how are you actually gonna recommend "i am a transwoman. i am in the closet. i am not coming out" as like a useful pro-trans guide?

the author of that piece is very clearly extremely misogynistic, and recommending that cis women read it is probably not a good idea, because if they are told that this is how trans women think of them they will likely start to distrust trans women. and frankly i couldn't blame them for it lol.

did you actually read the piece? if not you should, it's very dehumanizing towards women while very empathetic towards men. it essentially confirms every transphobic woman's fears of what trans women really think of them. it's not a good idea to recommend cis women read it, or to imply that it accurately demonstrates how trans women think

Reply:

I would have loved to be able to reply to you personally because I think we got some really different things out of that 'article' and I don't think broadcasting your ask is the best way to respond.

But I do feel like I should respond in case this was in good faith.

I didn't consider the (less of an article, more of a diary entry) as a guide at all. It's an experience. I think it's important to read people's experiences even (or especially) when they don't match up with a general consensus. Especially this one, because it exposed flaws in the way I've thought and acted in the past, which is why I recommended it. I'm unsure where you read it as being dehumanizing towards women since I didn't get that at all. I'd love to hear your perspective because without getting to engage with you in dialogue there is just no knowing.

The general sentiment of the post rings true to me. Things like 'men and boys are not inherently Bad, actually'. Or 'the writer's statements and ideas wouldn't be more true if she came out as a trans woman'. But because they present as male they do not get to be taken seriously or listened to and I think that's wrong. I think it's a fine line because many men do speak over people without engaging deep enough and/or are trolls (which the writer admits and discusses as well). But in close friendships I think it's important to let men speak, to listen to them and challenge when (you believe) they are wrong- but in a way that is compassionate and not dismissive. In a way where they get to question you, too. I also agree with the writer that putting masculinity and femininity as opposite forces that cannot support one another and instead cancel each other out is a really damaging idea that the writer of the post rightfully pushes back on. I agree with them also that making fun of and shaming people for any physical trait is wrong and it doesn't suddenly become okay because the target is a man or the feature is generally found in men specifically.

To me the post reads as a perspective of what it's like to be on the 'other side'. It's a peek into the problems with telling men they need to shut up and listen. That's not to say that it can't be necessary to do sometimes, but I think it's important to keep the nuance in mind. Not all people you view as men actually are. Not all women telling men to shut up and listen actually care whether they are a closeted queer person because they wouldn't welcome them anyway. Besides- men also live in this world and thus have experiences with and opinions on concepts connected to the human experience like 'femininity' and those thoughts and opinions are not inherently bad or not worth listening to, in my opinion. The post struck me as a very personal story of someone sharing what it's like to be lectured about your own lived experience because the other person doesn't even consider it might be yours. In a way that got to me and I felt it was worth sharing.

I'm very curious which parts of the article gave you such a different impression than me. Genuinely. Maybe I missed something. Maybe I interpreted things differently. It's hard to reply to you since you sent me this ask anonymously and I'm not sure what you expected me to do. Re-reading my tags I also don't think I implied this single post is 'how trans women think'. I would be very uncomfortable doing so because, like any group of people, they are not a monolith. I kindof trust that people reading the post can remember that for themselves.

If the blog post makes anyone distrust trans women then I don't think the post is the problem. If any single person's experience makes anyone dismiss a whole group of people I would argue that maybe they need to take a step back. Being empathetic towards men is not bad. Sharing a negative experience with cis women (women this person cares about and is close friends with) is not misogynist in and of itself.

Implying otherwise is a bit of a red flag to me. And assuming you're genuine I'd ask you why you are so preoccupied with whether or not transphobes will get more transphobic from reading a single trans woman's experience. Just because- what? it doesn't fall into a narrow definition of what a trans person is allowed to be? That doesn't sound right to me, either.

Link to the post in question, if anyone is curious.

[ultrasofts]

Yeah let's put women with fully developed 6'2 male body structures to compete with 5'9 women who have much smaller shoulders and wider hips etc which are definitely not disadvantages, especially not in swimming, not at all. Absolutely nothing wrong with that right.

i had no intention of replying to this, because you've clearly not come here with good faith of any kind, and i don't want to give air time to people like you.

but i like to think you might be open to actually hearing something. i'm sure you know how to use google so i'll leave it to you to actually engage with the topic, there's plenty of writing on recent stuff by people like katelyn burns, a columnist for msnbc who writes about a lot of trans issues, or the women of the Burn It All Down podcast, who cover women's sports, or katie barnes who writes largely for espn.

what i'll say is, at the end of the day, trans women are simply not taking over elite sport in droves. it's simply not happening. the current panic around trans athletes is being stoked by the conservative machine that desperately wants to get trans people out of every part of society.

last year we got the first ever trans woman weightlifter competing at the olympics. she came last in her category. we've had scraps of progress that are now being clawed back by people who want to legislate trans people out of existence. the backlash against a trans woman, for the first time ever, winning an elite level race in swimming has been swift, ugly, and incredibly cruel. these institutions - fina, usa swimming, governing bodies in essentially all sports - already had policies regarding trans women's eligiblibilty to compete. a blanket ban on trans women is unnecessary, ugly and, i cannot stress this enough, unscientific.

(also, dude, you know cis women can also be 6'2'' right?)

(on the topic of the fina ban specifically, banning anyone who has gone through """male puberty""" in an atmosphere where there is a escalating pressure around gender affirming healthcare for children is abhorrent. it, like so many policies, will disproportionately exclude girls who couldn't access the healthcare they needed, whether because they live somewhere because it's literally illegal, they didn't have parental support, or they simply couldn't afford it.)

cis women who think this has nothing to do with them are deluding themselves. the people who want to police trans women's bodies want to police yours too. everyone loses when biological essentialism wins. besides which, plenty of sports already have policies in place that define who is "woman enough" to compete in certain sports, in certain events, that do exclude cis women too. the treatment of caster semenya is well-known at this point, but that doesn't make it less horrifying. grow a sense of solidarity for god's sake.

and as for jamie.

even the most charitable reading of her comments suggests that she hasn't done any real thinking on the topic. which, in my opinion, is completely indefensible when 1) you're as high profile as jamie (deservedly, in my opinion) is, 2) you're driving for a race team owned by a trans woman who holds extremely harmful opinions on trans athletes (and lots and LOTS of other things, caitlyn jenner is trash), and 3) we're in the middle of a huge anti-trans panic, with conservative politicians in the us, the uk, and other places actively working to roll trans rights back, and to exclude trans people, in particular trans girls, from sport at all levels. sport is for everyone. end of story.

i understand that jamie's in a difficult position, but no one forced her to race for caitlyn jenner. these questions were going to come up. the least she could do is reckon with them honestly, and not hide behind "it's not my job to decide these things thankfully".

if success for women in sport means success for cis women only, means throwing trans women and girls under the bus, i genuinely wholeheartedly don't want any part of it. fuck that.

[genderkoolaid]

A bit of an odd question, I know you've ranted in the past about people thinking nonbinary people aren't attractive w/o binary alignment, anyways the point is: what are your thoughts on terms like "ceterosexual" and "skoliosexual"?

Personally I like them.

The thing about exorsexism is that it's ingrained in our language and culture. We lack the language to describe being non/abinary/genderqueer because our culture enforces a binary. So I generally support any efforts to improve exorsexism in language, even if I personally wouldn't use it.

It's true that "nonbinary" does not refer to one single gender. But I would argue that "woman" and "man" are vaster categories than we give them credit for. There are people who are attracted to certain kinds of man/womanhood performance but not others, especially when it comes to queerness & ethnic cultures. Not every lesbian is necessarily attracted to the same womanhood performance, and the same goes for gay men & straight men & straight women.

And "woman" and "man" are also not synonymous with presentation. You cannot tell how someone identifies by how they present themselves. But we do use gender coding to call on cultural associations & send a message of what gender stuff we wanna be associated with. A gay trans man may dress much differently than a straight trans man, because he is trying to perform gay manhood. Similarly, an agender person may also perform things associated with gay manhood even if they don't identify at all as a man, because they want queer men to notice them. But the same things could also be done by a straight man who just enjoys things traditionally associated with gay manhood And, going off that, there are ways that nonbinary/genderqueer people signal ourselves as NB/GQ as well. Someone with brightly dyed hair, wearing lipstick with a mustache, in a skirt with a dress shirt, is performing a genderfuck-hood that can signal genderqueerness to others. Personally, I like presenting in a purposefully genderqueer way so that other queer people recognize me as "family" and will be attracted to me because of my genderqueer performance.

So, considering all that... I appreciate language that let's us express love and attraction and appreciation for genderqueerness and non/abinarity. Arguments against ceterosexuality/skoliosexuality tends to go back to "nonbinary isn't a third gender, and some nonbinary people are okay being aligned with a gender, so anything that ever centers nonbinary people and recognizes abinarity is transphobic!!!" which always leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I've seen some people say you can use them but only Ina t4t way, which I also dislike; I am t4t and gq4gq but I don't like the idea that people who are cis aren't "allowed" to express attraction towards abinarity/genderqueerness because they must be chasers.

Also, I have the theory that genderqueer language always faces more stigma and is held to a higher standard than binary language. Partially because it's newer, but also because being genderqueer/nonbinary is viewed by transphobic society as unserious and ridiculous, and has also been associated with people assigned female & "weird femininity," which brings in misogyny (even moreso than transphobia already does). This is not to say people who personally don't want to use genderqueer language are doing anything wrong– but I feel like everytime someone comes up with a term to improve the lack of nonbinary visibility in language, it is immediately lambasted for being "cringe" and "infantilizing" and "just call me a slur" which I feel, on some level, comes from the association of binary things with normality & neutrality & adulthood, and nonbinary things with childishness & queerness.

The end goal of exorsexism is to smother any sign of sex/gender transgression it finds. I feel like the criticisms of nonbinary/genderqueer-focused sexuality are just another expression of this, but done in a "progressive" way. The underlying message is that nonbinary/genderqueer gender isn't as real as binary gender; our validity as people only comes from our identification with binary systems on some level; NB/GQ people always confirm to binary gender performance and we have no ways of communicating our genderqueerness on purpose; attraction to NB/GQ people must be dirty and objectifying and it can only be expressed via the language of binary attraction, even if the object of your affection is hurt by that.

[tryst-art-archive]

Context: Demographics

Let's start with how you might define me on a census, for some high level context.

Gender I'm a trans man, but I didn't discover this about myself until I was 30. I lived the first 29 years of my life fully believing I was a cis girl/woman, but I spent a chunk of 2020 identifying as agender before socially transitioning into being Trystan in 2021.

In a super technical sense, "nonbinary" or "genderqueer" apply to me. While I don't want to be misgendered, I also don't want to be mistaken for a cis man; I refuse to relinquish the experience of the first third of my life. I also refuse to relinquish my high heels.

Sexuality I've been struggling with sexuality labels for years. When I was 14, I identified as bi, but when I was 16 I reneged on that in a panic and began identifying as straight... despite the fact that I was sleeping with a girl and continued to do so for another year.

I've wrangled with whether or not to call myself "bi" on and off ever since. I think it's technically true, but my hit rate on attraction to women and femme-presenting people is so low that advertising as bi is functionally false advertising.

At present, I identify as a gay trans man, but all in all I feel the most at home with queer.

Race I'm a white American of primarily Irish and Italian descent. A fact I find very uncomfortable but interesting is that my mum's traced some of my ancestors back to early colonial America (1600s).

Religion I was raised Roman Catholic, but I stopped believing when I was 7. I went along with Catholic traditions and asks until I was 16, at which point I dipped out of the pretense, refusing Confirmation and desisting with any tradition that couldn't be secularized.

I definitely have baggage related to religion, though not as heavy as some folks'. I'm very, very leery and critical of Christianity, and I tend to be wary of organized religion in general. When I was younger, my attitude around religion was very harsh. Nowadays, I'm more aware of my baggage as being such and have mellowed out.

Family Background I'm an only child, so I grew up with my parents (hetero) and our cats. I have a cousin the same age as me, and we often were babysat together at our grandparents' house.

I wouldn't depict any side of my family as close. Our familial culture is predicated on intuiting what people want you to do or say and expressing emotion genuinely is generally not on the table, despite statements to the contrary. I learned to people please and bottle up quite young.

Financially, my parents both come from low income families, but, like many Baby Boomers, they achieved middle class themselves, and that was how I grew up.

We lived in the suburbs; for my adolescence, we were in the precise suburb my parents had both grown up in, making us townies. Kids of other townie families would often refer to me as "Flipper's daughter," referencing my dad's nickname from when he was in elementary school.

From the queer perspective, I'm one of the lucky ones in that being disowned was never a concern. On the other hand, it was obvious that being queer was never going to be welcomed. "Tolerant" is probably the best descriptor for the majority of the family; they'll do the name and pronouns, still love and support you, but they'll also doubt that you're correct about yourself and receive the news like it's a bad thing while voting for the politicians who want you to die.

Health My physical health has historically been fine, but my mental health not so much.

I have persistent depressive disorder (PDD, sometimes called dysthymia). It's decades-old, though pinning exactly when it started is pretty impossible at this point. I suspect the onset was when I was quite young, however, based on a recollection my dad has of my laugh changing to be quieter and less joyous.

I began experiencing suicidal thoughts when I was 11. For a long time, I thought this was the result of loneliness, but with the power of hindsight and an archive that shows the things I didn't remember, I'm now convinced that the gender dysphoria was the trigger.

I still have suicidal thoughts to this day. I categorize them into "habitual" and "real," though. If you think "I want to die" every day, multiple times a day, for all of your formative years, you wind up with a version of that thought that just comes up even when you don't mean it. Fortunately(?), I have a lot of practice and experience not caving to either form of suicidal ideation.

I experienced emotional abuse from friends of mine (always girls my age that I was especially close to) three times, and each occasion left some kind of damage behind. I don't have any kind of PTSD diagnosis, but I've absolutely had trauma responses created by those experiences. Those experiences are now very old, though, and a lot of the edge has come off, even when a trigger does appear.

Quite recently, it's become apparent that I have ADHD. By its nature, it's always been there, and I see the evidence of it throughout the archive. So, while it's never discussed directly in the pieces I'm resurfacing, it's absolutely affecting them.

Education & Career I was an A and B student throughout all my years of education because the way school was structured align with the way I personally tend to recall and retain information. My procrastination is also responsive to urgency, and I had an overdeveloped sense of guilt and shame, so keeping up with homework was possible.

In short: school was easy, and I never had to try to get As in Honors classes.

Despite that, I hated school from top to bottom. I hated being there, I hated being taken away from things that interested me, and I didn't like most of the people.

I went to college because I felt obligated to, and I got a BFA in Writing, Literature, and Publishing with a minor in Photography. I again did very well in school, which meant I still didn't know how to try to do stuff when I entered the workforce.

My earliest jobs were cashier at a refreshment stand, mailroom clerk, and copy shop employee. I also had a graphic design internship at a company making hobbyist magazines.

In 2014, I quit a full-time job to take a one-month contract as a QA Tester at a game studio, and QA became my career. I managed to secure a full time position, became a QA Lead, and eventually wound up as a QA department head making a team from the ground up. I still work QA in game dev to this day.

[ellavaday]

sparksnotes version of this hugaceo interview

instead of 36 this time it's 40 min and in a true show of mentally ill behavior i translated it (and then proceeded to not want to even look at the thing for a solid week because it's really hard to translate someone that doesn't like to talk in complete sentences and have it make sense, I'm still not sure I managed). Anyway. Here's the summary:

Instead of being sequestered in hotel rooms they had all of the dres1 girls in a giant house, each of them had their own rooms but they'd spend time together in the common areas which was kind of a godsent because they could vent and support each other on the most stressful times. They'd talk all their conspiracy theories about why production did what and not feel so alone.

There wasn't a lot of interaction with the judges away from the runway because production wanted the reactions to be genuine on camera when they saw them walk with their looks but it was cordial and they'd nod or say hello whenever possible.

all of the cast insisted on production not to do like they usually do in all the other versions in which the eliminated queens come for a second to the front and wave, they were like please let us walk on the runway because they all looked beautiful and wanted to show off

Hugaceo's family is from a town in Madrid and they and their boyfriend just recently moved back to the city but ofc won't stop visiting Valencia. They in fact visited it little ago because a casal faller made a ninot inspired by hugaceo's hometown look. More on that here and here bc i don't feel like writing about it again

To prepare for the show they started designing looks and sketch ideas hoping that they'd work for whenever they got the list of looks and they're friends with Choriza who gave them the same advice Blu Hydrangea gave her which was to start with the looks they knew they'd need for sure: An entrance look because they can wear whatever they want, the finale look because all of the contestants are supposed to be in the final episode, 2 or 3 snatch game, the makeover and a couple of dance looks because there's always more than one dancing challenge ((speaking of Choriza, the same interviewer has another interview with her and apparently she was talking with both the production of DRES and UK3 to be cast but UK3 started filming first which is why she is on that season))

The first season of the Spanish version of the show was a bit chaotic to make because they had no presedent on how things had to be done but they think it gave the show certain freshness that is probably not as apparent in other versions and it was done ridiculously fast. The show was announced in November, casting closed by December and in February it was announced to have finished production (i am sorry there's not enough i could say about how truly insane that production schedule is, the MtQ were already out by March, that's literally nuts)

They can't confirm nor deny about the dres2 girls having more time to prepare this time around but they think that production has got to have fixed things that ofc couldn't have been issues they could prevent since nobody on production had worked with drag queens before. Dumb things like "hey you need to wear something you are capable to sit in for this challenge".

They talk about that moment on dres where they realize there's a few NBs in the cast and how cool it was. They mention that apparently people from the cast of UK1 wanted to talk about it too but it didn't get aired and about RuPaul not being immune to the passage of time and that maybe it's gotten him a while to open the show for people of other gender identities (trans women, a cis woman and a straight man) but he's getting there slowly but at least he did start. They hope we get to see drag kings sometime soon.

They're not looking down on people that join the show and can't sew because they can't either but they do think that there's a pattern in the last few years in which you kind of feel like the show is now really a competition on who spends the most money and works with the best designers and that you can tell which designers work with who and that everyone has started to look the same because they don't participate much in the design process of the clothes they wear for the show.

They also don't love that it's been normalized to spend a small fortune to go on the show. They're never going to get rid of the falla look because it's like a museum piece for them but what in the world would they do with it after the show? It's bulky and heavy and they love it but they also know they're never going to wear it again. This is in relation to Arantxa getting a lot (a lot) of online hate for her runways and drag aesthetic being called cheap ((guys i could go on and on about this, it was fucking intense, for a moment i did think Arantxa was going to go suicidal over how bad the hate was)).

They also talk about how a lot of people have a perception of drag solely informed by drag race and that it shows because as soon as you leave the beauty canons of the show, you're suddenly the absolute worst which is what happened to Arantxa and how unfair it was.

There's a bit of a controversy about why the production company that has the rights for dres didn't put the show on open broadcast but behind a subscription based streaming platform (since the production company owns two flagship open broadcast channels on tv here) and if Spain is actually ready for a drag show on open broadcast. Hugaceo thinks it might start controversy but that maybe it would have been worth it and both they and the interviewer hypothesize that maybe the freedom of not being in an open broadcast channel is what allowed the cast to talk so freely about the non binary identity experience unlike the UK1 gals on the BBC

During filming the cast would daydream about going on tour together when they were at the shared house, assuming the show did good enough and the fact that it happened? Amazing. They say they've been a bit overwhelmed by all the love they've gotten from the public and the tour doing so well they sold out the biggest concert venue of Madrid for their closing show still sounds made-up and that all the stress and lack of sleep were worth it.

Hugaceo usually describes their drag as being art and uses the expression "vaya cuadro" (lit. what a painting) as a slogan. In spanish from spain it's an expression that is usually used to express shock at someone looking slovenly or very out of the norm, but ofc they mean it more in the literal sense of being literally like a painting because for Hugaceo, drag is art first and foremost.

Hugaceo was the subject of a painting for the 2021 edition of the Madrid Contemporary Art Fair. The name of the painting is Echinosis by Jean Carlos Puerto and it was supposed to be exhibited before the plague but it got postponed because. You know. Plague. They talk about how they met the artist in Miami and became friends because Hugaceo and him were both exhibiting art pieces and Hugaceo decided to go one day in full drag just because.

Their dad's from Argentina so they get specially happy when the Argentinian fans talk to them. Gigi wrote to them and a few other dres1 girls to say "welcome to the drag race family" and raja has told them to come visit them in LA.

Hugaceo says that apparently they're a bit too intimidating so they've not been bothered by fans flirting with them (or by fans in general actually). They say the fandom in general has been very decent to them. They did think it was hilarious that there's aranceo fanfiction but it's like amusing more than anything else because it reminds them of 1D fanfiction they saw on tumblr.

They absolutely singled out a HS AU fanfiction, which, whoever wrote it, please don't fret lol, they thought it was all rather sweet.

Hugaceo doesn't know why they're only taking Carmen to DragCon from the entire cast and they're not a fan lmao. They feel like their season is treated a bit like the ugly stepchild because it's the only one in which RuPaul hasn't even showed up on video despite being one of the best rated seasons by the fans.

Now that Hugaceo's moved back to Madrid, they're planning on retaking plastic arts and they're working on more than a couple of projects with Arantxa and says that they love working together and that the public and employers love them working together as well. The interviewer calls them the team rocket and Hugaceo agrees lmao.

They'd rather die than release music and for a good reason i love hugaceo's but their singing is terrible but they might if only bc they would love to direct their own music video so never say never. They've been in music videos of various other people's but not their own. They've been in one of Lola Indigo's, one of Choriza's and one of Monica Naranjo's. The interviewer asks them about the experience of working with Monica Naranjo bc she is a spanish gay icon and she talks about it being great (and a bit of luck, because they're friends with javier visori, the fashion designer that was the stylist of that music video and the S1 cast tour was in town at the same time the music video was shooting, the same fashion designer was the main designer they worked with to make looks for the show).

[thenookienostradamus]

Not-queer people CAN write queer characters

A fed-up rant by an old, angry, non-cis, non-het bitch.

Since apparently the usual horseshit about "cishet authors can't ever write queer characters" is making the rounds yet again, I offer those loudly declaiming thus only this advice:

Shut your entitled yap for a single fucking second.

And listen.

First off, you are not doing the written word some Noble Moral Service by attacking people who are not queer for writing queer characters—in fanfiction or otherwise. There are a number of reasons why this is so, and why you should step off your high horse accordingly.

Rant below the cut.

1. The queer character paradox. Most of the proponents of this approach (when it comes to queerness) trap cishet writers in what I call the "queer characters paradox." Which is to say: you encourage them to at least write queer supporting characters and advise them to talk to queer people to get a better understanding of perspective...and then you turn around and attack them for doing that exact thing, shrieking "we shouldn't have to educate you!" I realize that there are nuances to these interactions. If someone who isn't queer is coming at you with only stereotypes and preconceptions about queer folks and the intent to write a heartbreaking story about a closeted boy in the 1950s, you have every right to tell them to fuck off and do some basic research. But you're shooting yourself right in the foot by going off on a cishet author who says, "Gosh I would like to have my MC interact with a trans person or an ace person in this story."

2. Stop "othering" queerness. Do you know how queer people fall in love? How we deal with grief? How we fight, how we get tired, how we shop for fucking groceries? Literally just like straight people. Again, there are nuances, and in many places it is still more difficult to be queer than it is to be (or present as) cishet. The fact remains, whether you as a writer are queer or not, you should write queer characters as human beings. Because we are human beings. The claim that "only queer people should ever touch queer things!" casts us (yourself included, if you're queer) as fucking aliens or zoo animals—which is exactly what we're trying to avoid.

3. Don't assume all queer experiences are the same. I'm gonna guess the most vocal proponents of this idiocy are, maybe, 25 years old tops. I pause this rant to say that you are, I'm sure, wonderful and world-changing. But you don't know shit about the experiences of older queer people. Many of you don't live in a place or time where fear, secrecy, shame, and ostracism are a constant presence. Some of you do, and I acknowledge that. But I am begging you to speak to older members of the queer community before you decide you can speak for all of us. I didn't come out until I was 39. I didn't figure out gender until 41. Why? Good question! It wasn't because of overt oppression or attacks. It was because I simply wasn't aware way back when that it was "okay" and that other people feel this way. You will probably laugh, but I was pretty convinced because of heteronormativity that "straight girls" just occasionally have sex with hot women...I dunno, because that's what they do. (It's not.) And yeah, it seems really stupid now. But it wasn't stupid to people of my generation and earlier. Many of us didn't have the free flow of information and the built-in communities the internet provides.

So, without rambling further, do not presume to give people the old "write what you know" adage interpreted in the narrowest sense when you don't even know what you don't know.

[epicene-humanoid]

some trans Jeff thoughts:

he realized he was trans in elementary school and just went fuck it I'll just start introducing myself as Jeffery and see if anyone decides to stop me (as we know, jeff winger can get away with almost anything)

he got top surgery the second he could afford it (around the same time he started at his law firm), and probably bribed someone to keep it a secret

"I'm jeff winger and i would rather look at myself naked than the women I sleep with" are the words of a man proud of his transition

he's really insecure about his fashion sense, which is why he mostly dresses like the douchey guys at his firm in the start of the show, he thought you can't go wrong with the sleazy lawyer look

he will never admit it but he feels super good about the dean hitting on him, because the dean is a (cis) guy, acknowledging that Jeff is more manly than him

i think he starts out stealth and comes out to everyone one by one, probably starting with abed because he knows abed won't judge him and will probably just see it as an interesting backstory.

abed just says it's cool and maybe worth a prequel exploring Jeff's transition, and jeff asks him to predict how all of the members of the group will react to him coming out.

abed's predictions:

britta will be over-the-top supportive and do a ton of research about trans history, probably put together a slideshow just to prove how progressive she is, and jeff will be a little bit weirded out, but also touched that she did all that for him, though he would never let her know that

shirley will be confused, because she doesn't know how someone she trusts and knows so well could be part of a group she was raised to hate, but ultimately realizes that there's nothing actually against the lgbtq people in the bible, and, as a cool character development arch, starts to advocate against use of the bible to justify bigotry

troy will just think it over and decide that Jeff's physique and coolness are even awesomer knowing how much work he'd had to put in to be like that, and respects Jeff's manliness even more

annie will give him a hug, say something sweet about how she'll always love him, and worry about his health, because even she read somewhere that taking testosterone makes you more likely to have a heart attack, jeff will explain that the risk is still only as high a cis guy, and she'll be the one to always remind him to take his shots

peirce will say at best say "jeff winger used to be a chick?" and at worst call him a slur, either way there's sure to be a lot of misgendering from him, and pestering to know Jeff's deadname (needless to say, Jeff just doesn't tell peirce)

the whole group goes out of their way to keep their beach trips a secret from pierce (the girls don't want him there anyways, he's too liable to be creepy) even though jeff knows that even if pierce saw his scars, all he would have to do is make up a story about some childhood accident and pierce would never question it

sorry this ended up being super long. can I hear some of your headcanons for him?

YES ALL THIS!!! yes yes i’m fully accepting this as canon oh my god

i’m about to type a whole ass ESSAY at midnight because i have been DYING to talk about this for months ajfdksljk,,, this is going to be obscenely long and i might end up adding even more to it as i continue to rewatch the show because there is truly no shortage of trans jeff content (especially when you’re trans and see transness in every little thing ajdkslfkjs)

spoiler warning for literally everything about this show under the cut <3

i 100% agree, i feel like he realized he was trans super young, especially since in the show we see him as a little kid a couple of times. 

like look at little jeff with the oversized sweatshirt and little ponytail!! that’s childhood trans fashion. not to be dramatic but part of me thinks that jeff’s dad left before he fully came out to his family (which gives him even more angst about it, because until that one Thanksgiving episode, he’s never able to prove to his dad that he’s a better man), but part of me thinks that his dad left after he came out (which adds that spicy i-should-have-stayed-in-the-closet guilt that he has to work through). 

either way, because his dad wasn’t there, he had to base his concept of masculinity on something else, which was becoming a lawyer!! there’s some line that’s like “after the dust and divorce papers were settled the only man i looked up to was [the lawyer guy]”. like, replacing your father figure in your mind with the concept of “a job where you can talk your way in and out of anything and distort other people’s concept of reality”? that’s trans.

 and the fucking THANKSGIVING EPISODE... i struggle to watch it without crying hehe <3 yeowch! the dichotomy of willy jr. being the “wrong” kind of man because he’s “too soft” but jeff also not being enough despite adhering to all the social standards of masculinity... fuck!! this whole scene of him telling his dad “i am Not well adjusted” and talking about how he gave himself an “appendix surgery scar” when he was a kid and he still keeps the get-well-soon letters from his classmates under his bed? oh my god. the implication of people loving him not despite his scars but because of them?? trans. i can’t think about this episode for too long or i’ll start yelling.

OH and this scene? where he talks about how his mom got him a girl costume for halloween?? and everyone said “what a cute little girl” and after a few houses he stopped correcting them?? and “once the shame and the fear wore off, i was just glad they thought i was pretty”?? THAT’S TRANS... the man needs validation oh my god... and then in all the halloween episodes we see he has these ultra-masculine costumes (a cowboy, David Beckham, one of the fast and furious guys even though he never watched the movies, a boxer with his DAD’S boxing gloves... god) costumes are about becoming something else and he always chooses to be hypermasculine and that is trans.

THE PHYSICAL EDUCATION EPISODE!!!!!!! being uncomfortable during P.E. is a queer experience. period. but him being specifically uncomfortable in the clothes someone else is assigning to him? trans. “are we gonna talk about clothes like a girl? or use tapered sticks to hit balls around a cushioned mat like a man?” TRANS. and him eventually stripping in public? celebration of transness. and the fact that he eventually becomes comfortable in both the uniform and his own style!! trans!! god i love this episode. 

AND AND AND!!! the gay dean coming out episode!!! where it’s the three of them discussing the best way for the dean to come out as gay despite not entirely identifying with that label!! so we have both frankie and the dean who are sort of ambiguously queer, and jeff who’s a stealth trans man who’s probably only out to only the study group at this point. this scene where the dean and jeff have this like eyebrow communication while frankie is talking is just so cute. queer-to-queer communication. “I am so curious” “oh?” “intellectually.” “oh...” ajfdksljfk this scene just screams high school GSA to me and i love it so much.

and SPEAKING of the dean!! i totally see you on that. i feel like jeff has some internalized homophobia/biphobia (like he’d throw punches over someone else, but when it comes to himself he has a lot of shame). and also seeing the dean so confident in all his different outfits/costumes has a weird affect on him bc it’s like “okay, the dean, a cis guy, can do that, but i as a trans guy could Not because that’s Breaking the Rules”. which, like, throwback to the halloween thing. of course there’s no right way to be masculine, but mr. winger does not know that.

another thing!! the episode where their emails get leaked? that includes his emails with his therapist. fuck!! he was outed to the whole world in that episode!! no wonder he was so fucking angry!! this whole episode (and really any time he mentions his therapist) is so interesting when you think about them as a person he talks to about his transition. OH which adds to the thing with the dean!! “and you told your therapist you wanted to be alone this weekend” and “not you jeff, i know you’ll be visiting your dad” ”I told you to stop reading my emails”. luckily his study group has his back and just makes fun of him for emailing astronauts lmao

and WHO can forget “they’re giving out an award for most handsome young man!!!!” what else is there to say about this line besides: he’s trans. you know he didn’t get awarded enough for being a handsome young man when he was a kid, and no amount of compliments when he’s fully-grown can really make up for that. some people crash a kid’s bar mitzvah to cope with the fact that they struggled to be seen as themselves when they were a teenager <3

also his weird relationship with pierce? where he kind of hates him (understandably lmao) but at times has this almost-friends-almost-father-son relationship with him? especially in this episode where he’s forced to bond with him and ends up having a good time by accident (at a barber shop no less, the perfect place to Be A Man with your Man Friend). idk what to say about him besides the fact that pierce says his mom wanted a girl when he was born and made him dress like a girl (and his middle name is anastasia!) so if they’re gonna do any bonding over transness it’s gonna be that. 

okay one last thing and then i’ll shut up for the night. this episode kills me (and almost kills jeff hahahahelpi’mcrying). it’s a very Trans thing to not be able to visualize your future self, it just is. growing up trans at the time he did? i don’t know what kind of future he saw for himself, but i’m so happy that he ended up with a group of friends who became his family and love him the way they all do. i’m so emotional over this asshole it’s ridiculous. 

in conclusion:

they’re trans, your honor <3

[arcadejohn127-9]

if I haven't stated this before - I am trans. I'm a transmale, he/him pronouns and I am already aware of how dodgy this community can be towards LGBT/trans topics despite being having a fandom full of mostly LGBTQ+ people and the having a gender neutral protag In game

An artist got hate and unfollowed for saying the obey me brothers were trans

The dames event people HATED the idea of men dressing up as women and just immediately were going in for it being the boys turned into females even though it was made clear that wasn't the case

(my point for this one, people would only accept cis women and not crossdressing or men presenting fem which can link to trans issues but in general it's pretty nasty to hate the idea of men being gender nonconforming)

And of course an anon has been running around calling an obey me blogger transphobic - turns out they were right but they're not the "trans people should be burned and ARGH!!!! Trans! Bad!>:[!!"

Though a commenter did leave a comment on one of their posts saying that they left a comment telling that commenter that they need Jesus for being trans, the commenter wanted only share this proof through DM with the person - I tried to look for this comment again for proof but the comment or the post it was under seems to be missing

(I blocked them after rechecking their page to see if they responded to a comment I said and I found that comment, I didn't think and didn't screenshot it and blocked them again but then realized when writing this I needed the proof and went back but now it's gone - ugh)

It's just pure ignorance that harms the community because they can't support trans people due to their religion. Personally, I'd never be apart of a religion that isn't accepting of all people. That is just harmful and using religion as an excuse is just bullshit, you are more than your religion and so should your opinions. Yes it'll influence them but come on- seriously?!

I commented on their post but by now the post has been deleted and they're only responding to anons giving them support

I never got to see if they responded

But the point is, being nondiscriminative to a community or types of people is just common decency. Excusing your inability to support said group due to religion is just veiled transphobia and saying "it's okay I have trans aunt and I love her! She gave me a pin and owo" whatever the rest of the early Responses to this situation was

It's just- ugh it rubs me all the wrong way

They are a minor so I don't condone bullying or sending threats - I don't condone that for anyone unless they are a threat to people (e.g cannibals, predators, ect) and a disgusting person but that's my belief - you're trash? Get trashed

But while they are a minor, we need to be educating them and not trying to tell them it's okay to have such a harmful mindset. It isn't just a difference in opinion, it's harmful and an excuse - because opinions can be so impactful to how you view people and the world and they respond back to you - people have bad opinions on the LGBTQ+ community and so there are laws against us

If you know who this person is and are reading this; don't attack them, just educate and if they ignore you? Block them. Or if you're a friend - please listen to trans voices and decide with you support them or not