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[Transcript] Season 6, Episode 4. The Last of Us Season 2 Spoiler Review

The Last of Us Season 2 went in unexpected directions. In the latest Stereo Geeks episode, Ron and Mon discuss what they enjoyed about the show, how the characters shaped up this season, and what they're hoping for in Season 3. Join us for a spoiler-filled review.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Mon: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks. Today, we’re chatting about the show The Last of Us. I’m Mon. 

Ron: And I’m Ron. This is going to be a spoiler-filled review, so if you haven’t caught up with both seasons of The Last of Us, then please do so and then come back to us. 

Mon: Before we start our episode, we would like to acknowledge that the land we are recording on is the traditional territory of many nations, including the Mississaugas of the Credit, the Anishnabeg, the Chippewa, the Haudenosaunee and the Wendat peoples. It is now home to many diverse First Nations, Inuit and Métis peoples. We also acknowledge that Toronto is covered by Treaty 13 with the Mississaugas of the Credit.

Ron: While we are making this land acknowledgement, we understand that this is not enough and that positive action is required by the people of Canada to make substantive change for the Indigenous nations and communities whose lands we now reside on.

[Music]

Mon: So, The Last of Us. We were late to this party. 

Ron: Yes, but with good reason. We’d seen screenshots of the clickers and cordyceps, and we were like, yeah, this is not happening. 

Mon: I was not prepared to be grossed out by the creatures, but I knew we were missing out on something big. I’m glad we finally decided to give it a try.

Ron: With the hype around Season 2 starting up, we couldn’t ignore the show any more. I’m glad we powered through.

Mon: The monsters aren’t all that bad. In the show at least. I don’t think I could stomach the game though. 

Ron: Yeah, that’s a no. I’m so tempted to get the game, but I’m not brave enough. It’s widely known as one of the scariest games ever. I’m not going to tangle with that. The show, however, is another story. What did you think about the first two seasons? 

Mon: First season was outstanding. That was just something else.

Ron: I didn’t know what to expect from Season 1. Alongside Shogun, The Last of Us was being hailed as the return of great television. People highly praised Pedro Pascal and Bella Ramsay, as well as the storytelling. Could it live up to the hype? Yes, it could.

Mon: The first episode has one of the best car sequences ever. Nothing in the show is ever going to live up to that. And, of course, there was EP 3, which is still one of the most outstandingly romantic and heart-warming episodes of TV I’ve ever seen. 

Ron: I was hooked from episode 1. Pedro and Gabriel Luna as brothers Joel and Tommy Miller, are little dimwits. But they’re an adorable family with Joel’s daughter Sarah, played by Nico Parker. And then, bam, infections, people acting weird and scary. And of course, by the end of the pilot, Sarah has been killed and Joel and Tommy are utterly destroyed. I agree that episode 3 of the first season sealed the deal for me. I fell in love with the storytelling.

Mon: While I wasn’t overly concerned about Season 2, I can say it doesn’t quite have the cohesiveness and impact of Season 1. I could feel the struggle to keep the mystery alive, while adding in characters and plot.

Ron: Oh wow. That is not how I feel about Season 2. It feels like the first season did all the heavy lifting of building the world and the impact the cordyceps have had on humanity. And Season 2 took it to a whole new level with the characters. We already know this world, so here’s some more danger. You think the infected are scary? No, how about real people and the monsters they are? That’s what I loved about Season 2.

Mon: Before we go deep into Season 2, let’s briefly go over what happens here. 

Joel and Ellie are safely ensconced in Jackson, Wyoming

Tommy and Maria are the leaders of the town

We meet Dina, played by Isabela Merced, Ellie’s love interest

Dina has an on-again-off-again relationship with Jesse, played by Young Mazino

Things get worse though, because peril is everywhere

You wanna chat about the perils?

Ron: Yep. There’s a lot happening this season.

The cordyceps have evolved. There are now stalkers, and full-on armies to battle

They’re also air-borne and growing in Jackson

The Wolves – a faction of the Firelies in Seattle – are at war with a cult-ish group called the Seraphites. Both groups are horrifying and violent

And, a rogue group of Wolves, lead by Kaitlyn Dever’s Abby, are out to get Joel for what he did at the end of Season 1.

Mon: Speaking of Joel, we should talk about the central relationship of the show, aka, Ellie and Joel. Their evolution during the first season into becoming a daughter and father powered the narrative.

Ron: Yeah, but Joel and Ellie aren’t on talking terms when the season opens. And we don’t know till the penultimate episode what that’s all about. 

Mon: Oh yeah. That’s a huge departure from where they were in Season 1. Especially at the end when Ellie is so trusting of Joel. She takes his promise about what happened to the Fireflies as truth. We knew that would unravel in this season, but it plays out very differently than we expected.

Ron: Absolutely. They didn’t exactly get along in Season 1 but Ellie was infectiously adorable–pardon the pun. She broke through Joel’s cold, hard exterior. And honestly, Season 1 was so relentlessly depressing, Ellie was always such a breath of fresh air.

Ron: Starting the second season with them on the outs put a real dampener on the situation. But Ellie still manages to be vivacious and funny and charming. 

Mon: Yeah, even after EP 2, when Abby fulfils her promise, and literally beats Joel to death, Ellie keeps that spark alive. 

Ron: She’s dealing with such a great loss–her only parent figure brutally murdered right in front of her–and she still manages to be a delight. And thank goodness for that–without Bella Ramsay’s enthusiasm, this season would be horrific and intolerable to watch.

Mon: But wait, let’s not skip over that major twist in EP 2. I did not expect them to kill off Joel in EP 2. I knew he wasn’t gonna make it through the season – I haven’t played the game, but I figured as much – but EP 2? Really?

Ron: People who’ve played the games knew to expect that Joel would die this season. But most of the time, a major character’s death happens at the end of the season. But not with this show. Episode 2, whack, Joel’s dead. It’s a very clever storytelling decision. We spent all of the first season loving Joel and Ellie and their bond. And then Joel’s gone when we’ve hardly managed to get used to being back with him. The suddenness of it all also makes Ellie’s actions easier to understand. We don’t condone them, but we understand them.

Mon: Joel dying does give Ellie and Dina more screen time. Which is great, because I think Dina’s great. She’s flighty, and trope-y, and still unique.

Ron: Do we think Dina’s trope-y? I really like her. She’s got a solid head on her shoulders but still knows when to lighten up.

Mon: She’s initially written as trope-y, but that’s deliberate. The pretty girl who our protagonist is in love with. The one who’s indecisive, and always dangling the carrot of possibilities. But Dina is more than that. She’s resilient, and smart. And kind. 

Ron: True. I really enjoyed watching them.

Mon: But the other characters got short shrift – like they ran out of budget to give everyone enough screen time. I also think they – I guess the studio heads – wanted to keep stuff for Season 3, and that may have stretched things a bit thin in Season 2.

Ron: There I have to agree. It was the Ellie and Dina show, and I cannot say I mind that. Their love story is a joy to behold.

Mon: Look, I love that we got to spend so much time with Dina and Ellie, and seeing their relationship blossom. They’re wonderful.

Ron: The scene with Ellie singing Take On Me? Tears! I couldn’t even understand why I was crying. But then I saw Dina was crying too, and I was like, you know what, Ellie serenading us is worth a few tears.

Mon: Oh yeah, totally. Probably my favourite moment this season. 

Ron: Also the penultimate episode with Ellie and Joel. The birthdays that they celebrate together, those were precious. Joel taking her to the museum with the dinosaur and the shuttle? This is why I’m really enjoying Bella Ramsay as Ellie. They have such an infectious joy to them and yet they capture the malice and hatred Ellie has for Abby. It’s a duality that would be hard or corny to pull off but they do a fantastic job.  

Mon: The early birthday scenes. Awwwww.  They were so adorable. I was like, gosh Joel is such an amazing Dad. And Ellie is such a sweet kid.

Ron: Yes! He makes the most of those second chances that he was denied with Sarah. That entire sequence was wonderful and I couldn’t stop smiling. Of course, it all goes pear-shaped. 

Mon: Yeah, it doesn’t last long. Ellie grows up, she becomes older than Sarah had ever been. And Joel struggles with that. I almost wanted a little more of that ‘cause they do skip a birthday. 

Ron: Yes! There’s not much joy in the The Last of Us universe so yes, I wanted them to eke out every birthday. 

Mon: Them falling out is because of a few things. It festers in Ellie before blowing up because Joel kills one of their companions who got bit. 

Ron: Eugene, played by Joe Pantoliano. He was the husband of Gail, played by Catherine O’Hara, Jackson’s resident psychologist. We learn in the first episode of this season that Joel killed Eugene but we had to wait to find out what that was all about. And it’s the downfall of the relationship between Ellie and Joel—how easily he could lie to her about something as horrible as killing a man before he could say goodbye to his wife. 

Mon: Yeah, the tension between them makes sense after the penultimate episode. And it boils down to the little things. It’s the blatant lying that angers Ellie, but for Joel, he can’t see beyond keeping Ellie safe. It’s so sweet, if also quite horrific. 

Ron: But even after their falling out, that bond between them is so strong. At the end of Season 1, we kept wondering, what will Ellie do when she finds out what Joel did to the Fireflies. And the decision by the storytellers, of the game and the show, was so unexpected. Ellie chooses to forgive Joel. It was kind of a relief to know that Joel didn’t die while they were still fighting, but they kept us on tenterhooks for a while. In the game, that scene between Ellie and Joel happens at the very end! Mercifully, we did not have to wait that long. 

Mon: Joel and Ellie get incredible moments this season. But what about the others? Because Jesse’s dead by the end of the season, and we knew nothing about him. Tommy’s so amazing, and Maria’s a rock, but they get no screen time. It’s such a waste of these amazing characters and actors. 

Ron: I didn’t get nearly enough of Tommy, Maria, and Jesse. By the end of the season, I really wanted to know more about the people of Jackson and their lives. 

Ron: We should probably add that we don’t just love Tommy the character. We’ve been fond of Gabriel Luna since he was Robbie Reyes, the Ghost Rider, on Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. And we met him a couple of years ago at Gotham Central, and he was a darling. So, yeah, we want to see more of Tommy!

Mon: Yep, he’s a huge draw for us for those reasons, but also because Tommy’s a sweetie, and we want to see him being a leader. 

Ron: Yes, the Latino lads are a big attraction in The Last of Us - Pedro, Gabriel, and now Danny Ramirez, aka the new Falcon in Marvel.

Mon: Yeah, so little of Ramirez too. But I’m expecting there to be a ton more in Season 3, especially if it’s the Abby show.  

Ron: Abby’s entire crew got short shrift this season. They’re almost all known faces, at least to me. Tati Gabrielle, I’ve seen her in Sabrina. Ariela Barer was in Runaways. Then there’s Ramirez. The only person I haven’t seen is Spencer Lord. I couldn’t figure out why they were given so little screentime until the end of this season. The upcoming season will be Abby’s story and we’ll get more time with her group.

Ron: Instead of waiting for the next season, though, we could have got more bottle episodes about these characters in Season 2. I honestly really missed the bottle episodes of Season 1 this time around. 

Mon: Yes! The bottle episodes were so amazing. They filled out the world that wasn’t directly tied to what Joel and Ellie were doing. We desperately needed that this season. Like those few bits with the Seraphites and Isaac – who are these people? I wanted to spend time with them when they weren’t being, you know, evil beyond measure. 

Ron: The Seraphites and Isaac are probably going to have a bigger role in the next season. Which is a little bit terrifying because these two groups are very gory. I prefer the cordyceps to them.

Mon: I also wish we’d seen more of the cordyceps this season of The Last of Us. 

Ron: Which is a crazy thing to say because they are so creepy!

Mon: Yeah, the stalkers are so creepy and cool. But we kinda forget about them being the biggest deal after the big showdown in EP 2. I get that the real bads are the evil humans, but I want to not stress about the awfulness of humanity for an episode or two. 

Ron: We had some excellent moments with the cordyceps, though. That scene in Episode 2 where Abby is getting crushed by the gates with all those cordyceps attacking her. Claustrophobic and terrifying. Even that chase scene just before. Ufff. The adrenaline was through the roof.

Mon: For sure. The stalkers showing up in Seattle too. Amazing and scary. 

Ron: I love and hate the stalkers. The camerawork for the stalkers was excellent, especially in, I believe Episode 5 of this season. The way they’re in shadow and then they’re running towards the camera. Got me hiding under the blankets!

Mon: Yeah, but they’re totally absent in the finale.

Ron: Yes, because Season 2 is about Ellie’s revenge. The stalkers and the other cordyceps are essentially getting in her way. Abby is the villain of this season. And who knows who’ll be the villain next season.

Mon: My question to you is, post Season 2 finale, how do we feel? I’m a little gutted to be honest. I felt like this after the first season finale too, but more so after Season 2. Joel and Ellie massacre people to save the people they love. It’s indiscriminate, and heartless. And I’m like, I don’t think I like them very much, any more. 

Ron: You’re not supposed to. The Last of Us is an awful world to be living in. Joel and Ellie are doing awful things throughout these two seasons to supposedly protect or avenge those they love. But that just makes them as awful as everyone and everything else. Joel died because of his actions. Did he deserve to die that way? No. But he had it coming. If it wasn’t Abby, it would be some other poor soul who’s loved one he murdered.

Mon: Ok, that’s fair. That makes me feel better. It’s just tough, because they’re our protagonists, and we love them. But then they do these unthinkable acts, and I’m like I can’t like you any more. I’m glad the story also shows us that what Joel did was wrong. But what about Ellie?

Ron: Ellie is where Joel’s real failure lies. Yes, he loved her. She wasn’t just a daughter, she was a second chance. She was his redemption. He mucked it up by killing all those Fireflies. But worse, he showed Ellie that revenge and death was the only way of life for them. So Ellie went out and got revenge and she hurt people; she killed poor Mel who was heavily pregnant. Just after Ellie finds out she’s going to be a dad with Dina! This is a terrible lesson for her to learn. And it’s Joel’s fault. I’m sorry to say.

Mon: Right. We’ll get to see the other side of the story in the next season. Ellie should be rightfully demonized, but it’s quite sad that, well, she’s turned into a villain.

Ron: Yes, indeed. That’s the whole point of this season. It reiterates that revenge is not healthy. Nobody wins when everyone wants vengeance. Joel wanted to save Ellie but he killed so many in the process. And as a result, he set Abby and her troupe on a mission of revenge. Abby succeeded–she got her revenge by killing Joel. But that set Ellie on a path to revenge. And now she’s gone and killed practically all of Abby’s group. And as a result, Jesse’s dead! Look at how much death there is–and it’s all because Joel wanted to save Ellie.

Mon: Wow, that’s just great. It’s the wild west out there in The Last of Us. It’s horrid, but does make for more complicated storytelling than we’re used to. 

Ron: We don’t even know Tommy’s side of the story yet. He wanted to go and hunt down Abby with Ellie, but he decided to abide by the decision of the Jackson people and stay back. But then, why was he sniping all those Wolves in Seattle?

Mon: So, apparently, in the game Tommy has a more intertwined role with the story. But they scrapped that — or changed it on the show. I don’t know why though.

Ron: I believe some people are upset about that. And as we’ve said, we would have loved to see more of Tommy. But if we’re going to essentially have a new protagonist every season, the focus on Ellie in Season 2 really makes sense. Having said that, if we’d got 9 episodes instead of 7, like we did this time, we may have had more room for scenes with the people of Jackson, like Maria, Tommy, and Jesse. 

Mon: I really like The Last of Us, but with Season 2, I really wanted more of the characters. And I wanted more layers to the storytelling. Do you think we’ll get that in Season 3?

Ron: We probably will, but with Abby’s group and the Wolves. Which is going to be interesting because we’ll see more of Isaac and the Seraphites. I’m a bit terrified of what that’s going to entail but I’m intrigued.

Mon: This show is a definite much-watch. The creatures aren’t too horrid-looking, and the characters are so engrossing. Yeah, Season 2 was not as polished as the first, but let’s see what the next one has in store for us.Ron: I can’t wait to see what happens next. This world is fascinating and horrifying, yet there are moments of such beauty and joy. I’m really loving The Last of Us!

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 6, Episode 3. Thunderbolts* Review

In the latest episode of Stereo Geeks, Ron and Mon review Thunderbolts*. This non-spoiler episode dives into the characters, arguably, the biggest draw for the film, why we loved the action, and how this film compares to the MCU films that have come before. Tune in to hear our review. 

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Ron: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks! Today we’re talking about Thunderbolts*. I’m Ron.

Mon: And I’m Mon. This is a spoiler-free review of the film, so you’re in for a treat. 

Ron: Before we start our episode, we would like to acknowledge that the land we are recording on is the traditional territory of many nations, including the Mississaugas of the Credit, the Anishnabeg, the Chippewa, the Haudenosaunee and the Wendat peoples. It is now home to many diverse First Nations, Inuit and Métis peoples. We also acknowledge that Toronto is covered by Treaty 13 with the Mississaugas of the Credit.

Mon: While we are making this land acknowledgement, we understand that this is not enough and that positive action is required by the people of Canada to make substantive change for the Indigenous nations and communities whose lands we now reside on.

[Music]

About the film

Ron: Thunderbolts*, and note the star at the end of the title, brings together a rag-tag group of anti-heroes to fight a political threat. This is, I believe, the 36th film in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, and is part of Phase 5. It follows 2025’s Captain America: Brave New World and the 2021 Disney+ show The Falcon and the Winter Soldier. There are also connections to Ant-Man and the Wasp, and of course Black Widow. 

Ron: In the film, we’ve got Yelena Belova, played by Florence Pugh. Sebastian Stan returns as Bucky Barnes or the Winter Soldier. Wyatt Russell is back as John Walker, aka the US Agent. Hannah John-Kamen plays Ava Starr, aka Ghost. David Harbour reprises his role as Alexei Shostakov, the Red Guardian. And finally, Olga Kurylenko as Antonia Dreykov, aka Taskmaster. But can they get out of their own way long enough to be a team? Because they’re going up against Julia Louis-Dreyfus’ Valentina Allegra De Fontaine, and her right-hand person, Mel, played by Geraldine Viswanathan.

Mon: That’s a large cast of returning characters. And, of course, we also have a brand new character in this film – Bob Reynolds, played by Lewis Pullman.

Ron: Tell us about Bob, sis.

Mon: So, Bob, he’s a pretty unassuming fellow. All the promo pics of Bob show him looking dishevelled, in jammies. He doesn’t look like a superhero. But in the comics, Bob is a big deal. That’s if the characters can remember him – Bob faces a similar situation as Peter Parker post-Spider-Man: No Way Home. 

Bob is the superhero named Sentry – the Golden Guardian of Good. Yes, it’s a mouthful. Sentry, the comic book character, was a fascinating PR stunt conjured by Paul Jenkins and Jae Lee in 2000. They did this whole thing where they suggested that Stan Lee had thought up a superhero before he made Marvel’s first family, the Fantastic Four. Sentry was then retroactively incorporated into Marvel’s history. It was all very clever, and it’s the kind of narrative we’ve seen meted out in other comics since. 

Sentry’s story is obviously a little different in Thunderbolts* – but I really love how the film plays with Bob’s comic introduction, adapting it for the MCU, while hitting the beats of the comic’s story. 

Thoughts on the Film

Ron: Now that we’ve established the cast, let’s discuss the film itself. Obviously, no spoilers. I have to say, I don’t know how to feel. I enjoyed the film, yes. It had some absolutely outrageous laugh-out-loud moments. I was surprised that John Walker of all people made me guffaw, but he did.

Ron: The first act was very strong. It’s the meeting of the Thunderbolts section and I got almost Defenders vibes from it. That was fun. The primary villain is sympathetic. The effects for the villain’s powers? Excellent! The story is solid, but it doesn’t feel like it’s doing anything new. That’s not a bad thing but Thunderbolts* could have explored a lot of different angles with its cast. I think it was afraid to delve into the horrors of its characters’ lives.

What about you? 

Mon: Yeah, the film left me feeling confused. It’s actually so much harder to talk about Thunderbolts* because of that confusion. I like that it isn’t necessarily trying to be like other films. But at the same time, visually, it felt derivative at times. 

Mon: And yet, the film isn’t just a by-the-numbers action flick. It wants to go deeper by exploring the darker aspects of these characters’ lives. And it’s funny without punching down. I enjoyed myself. I laughed. I love these characters (some more than others), but there were so many missed opportunities here that I still kind of felt deflated at the end. I wanted more.

Ron: Yeah. More of the characters, right? This film is essentially Black Widow 2. And I kinda wish we’d known that going in. Because, I was expecting an ensemble film, and this is decidedly not an ensemble film. It’s a Yelena Belova movie. Not a bad thing, by any means. I absolutely adore Yelena. I needed Yelena as our protagonist and I am delighted that she is. But the marketing for the film positioned it as an ensemble. Despite us avoiding the trailers, that’s the message we got. But it’s not realised in the execution.

Mon: Nope, this isn’t an ensemble. And that’s the biggest missed opportunity for me. Most of these characters have been part of the Thunderbolts in the comics in some form or the other. Now, they may have done that because of the film, or the film had these characters because of the comics – I don’t know how the cards were stacked. But, Bucky has led the Thunderbolts in a few runs. Not gonna lie, I was under the impression that Bucky would be leading. He does not. 

Mon: Listen, I’m down with Yelena getting the spotlight – the ladies of the MCU have been sidelined so often. But, here too, Yelena’s spotlight does come at the cost of the other superhero ladies. 

Mon: I like that this movie is a ton of fun. And it’s really different, tonally and formula-wise, from most other MCU films. But the characters are its biggest draw and we don’t get to delve deep enough into most of their arcs here. 

The Characters

Ron: I don’t know about anybody else but I was excited for Thunderbolts* primarily because of the ladies. And Bucky, of course, because he’s our guy. But the ladies were the biggest draw for me. I didn’t expect to love Yelena as much as I did when I watched Black Widow, but she absolutely stole my heart, and kept it in Hawkeye. I got more than what I wanted from Yelena in this film. I am delighted to have spent so much time with her.

Mon: Yelena is a great character. And she’s so well-rounded in this film. She has such a deep arc. We learn more about Yelena – we laugh with her, cry with her. That was truly amazing. Of course, it shouldn’t be a surprise that Yelena gets so much development because one of the two writers of Thunderbolts* is Eric Pearson. He co-wrote the Black Widow film. So, obviously Yelena is the main character here. 

Ron: I have loved and missed Ava Starr since the second Ant-Man movie. I was partial to her because of the show Killjoys but Ava was such a sympathetic villain. I have been waiting impatiently to see her again. She’s a character who lives with chronic pain and I was hopeful that this film would lean into that and really explore, in a fantastical sense, how chronic pain impacts a person’s life. Unfortunately, I set my expectations too high. Ava has a much smaller role in Thunderbolts* and her perspective isn’t explored at all. She’s wonderful to watch but so underserved. I’m a bit upset about that.

Mon: Disappointed, mate. Disappointed. I kept looking for Ava because Hannah John-Kamen is such a striking actor. She’s so measured and cocky, but carries layers. Also, not gonna lie, she looked gorgeous in this film. But she didn’t get more backstory; she didn’t develop any dynamics with the other characters, that left me gutted. She’s not a fully-formed character. Just a plot device.

Ron: But the character that I really wanted to see and I am so disappointed about is Taskmaster. She was such a cool villain in Black Widow, nigh unstoppable. Her ability to copy any moves she observed made for incredible action scenes. I definitely wanted to see that again. But more than that. By the end of Black Widow, Natasha Romanoff was able to save Taskmaster. And I was so excited to see her again. This physically and emotionally scarred woman who’d been through hell and had found her way back. You don’t get to see female characters with scars on the big screen. I needed that. And that’s where Thunderbolts* completely let us down. I’m devastated. I needed to see Taskmaster live a full life and this film crushed my hopes.

Mon: Yeah, I am actually angry about how Taskmaster is treated in this film. I completely agree with you – seeing a female character like her on screen get a full character arc would have been a game changer. But once again, she’s just another plot device. This gave me Doctor Strange and the Multiverse of Madness vibes, and how Sam Raimi completely misunderstood Wanda’s character development. 

Marvel has so many different people working on different projects – I think they fail to share the emotional weight of the characters’ backstories from one project to another. That’s how it felt with Ghost, and definitely with Taskmaster. I’m gutted. 

Partnerships

Ron: That’s a good point. Though not as egregious, but was it just me, or did we not get to see Bucky bond with any other characters? I can’t help but compare Thunderbolts* to Brave New World where we got these incredible relationships for Sam Wilson, with his sidekick Joaquin Torres, his mentor, Isaiah Bradley, and his friend, Leila Taylor. Bucky doesn’t get any of that in this film! And maybe it’s unfair to compare the two since these two films are nothing like each other, but Sam and Bucky are two sides of a coin for me, forever connected by their love for Steve Rogers. I’m upset Bucky doesn’t get to make new friends.

Mon: Yep, you’re taking the words right out of my mouth here. Bucky’s very much an outsider in this film. He’s almost shoe-horned in, like the studio were like, oh yeah, that guy Sebastian Stan, we owe him a project. When Bucky’s on screen, he’s cool and all, but who’s his person here? And more importantly, why doesn’t he get a person?

Mon: Considering that amazing bromantic episode in What If…? Season 3, where Bucky and Alexei become buddies, I was expecting something of a bond or rivalry between the two in Thunderbolts*. After all, Alexei was convinced he was greater than Captain America. Bucky was Captain America’s best friend. Surely, this was a golden opportunity for them to partner up. 

Ron: I agree. I think watching What If…? Season 3 spoiled us for Bucky’s potential as a partner and friend to people who aren’t Steve and Sam. Not just Alexei, but pretty much anyone in this film could have been a foil to Bucky. He’s got history with Walker. He could have bonded with Yelena about their Russian connection. Or with Ava about living a life that others controlled. But we don’t get any of that. Bucky’s seriously short-changed here. And dare I say it, but I feel like Red Guardian got a bigger role than Bucky. Which is pretty sad considering it’s Bucky!

Mon: For sure, mate. Alexei definitely got more development and screen time than Bucky. I didn’t mind Bucky being a silly dork, but also a cool-as-hell action hero, but he goes where the wind takes him. I couldn’t figure out what Bucky’s deal was here. Also, we still don’t know why Bucky went in to politics!

Ron: That mystery continues. But it’s tied to Valentina. Who we should probably talk about. First up, Julia Louis-Dreyfus is clearly having the best time with this character. The hair, the smirk, the condescension. She’s used to being the winner in every room and she doesn’t like that position being threatened. I love her performance. She’s great. Valentina herself? I don’t know what to make of her.

Mon: Am I the only person who is completely uninterested in Valentina as a character? Can she just be and leave the storylines to the other characters? Does she have to be a thing? 

Ron: Yeah, where are we going with Valentina? She’s been in a TV show and a couple of movies and she’s not grown at all. I see her as the anti-Nick Fury but we know a fair amount about Fury. I don’t know anything about Valentina except that she was married to Everett Ross for some bizarre reason. What’s her deal?

Mon: We get a scene about her past in this film, and it, honestly, irritated me. Because there’s that urge by creators to try to make us sympathize with female characters – as if women can’t just be power-hungry monsters. I wish that flashback had been given to someone else, and Valentina had just been left to herself. 

Ron: Let women be monsters! Because that’s what John Walker gets to be. That man is a jerk. Everyone tells him he’s a jerk. Yet he keeps being a jerk. I was worried about meeting John again after his unconscionable behaviour in The Falcon and the Winter Soldier. But somehow, he’s managed to make an even worse life for himself. Dude is an epic disaster but has gaslit himself into believing otherwise. He needs so much therapy. I really would have loved to see more scenes of him and Bucky. And Bucky just rips him a new one every time John opens his mouth. I would have loved that. But alas, they barely get a few seconds together.

Mon: I was worried about John too, but I kinda dug his smug self getting his comeuppance, and his hero moments in this film. He doesn’t get an arc either, and very little development, but he gets more action and screen time than Bucky. Hmmm… I guess I really just wanted more Bucky in this film.

Ron: Everybody wanted more Bucky in this film. We need more Bucky in our lives.

Ron: I do want to give a quick shoutout to Geraldine Vishwanathan, who does a solid job in this film. Her role isn’t very large but she’s one of those actors who brings a very lived-in feeling to her characters. So you always feel like you’re getting a character who’s been around in the world longer than you’ve seen her. 

Real World Parallels

Mon: While Thunderbolts* is funny and action-packed, it does deal with some heavy subject matter. Some of the characters are clearly suffering from depression. There’s some mention of self-harm. And addiction plays a huge part in the storylines for some of the characters. It can be distressing to watch.

Ron: There was so much dialogue in Thunderbolts*, particularly from Yelena, that spoke to me. Or rather, it felt like the dialogue was plucked from my brain. Yelena really goes through it in this film. She’s struggling. She’s alone. She’s in a dark place that she can’t punch her way out of. Damn, did I feel all that.

Mon: True. But the film doesn’t lean into any of those aspects enough for the other characters. All these people are troubled, and in pain – emotionally, if not also physically. A true ensemble would have explored all their pain, brought them together through that. 

Ron: I know we explored a lot of this dark stuff for Bucky in The Falcon and the Winter Soldier, but it would have been really helpful for him to impart some knowledge to the team. He’s been living with PTSD for a very long time. He could have shared some tips with the new crew.

Mon: Bucky got therapy, and Bucky got a friend. A friend Marvel refuses to let him hang out with, but you get the point. He could have been the glue that binds these hurting people together. It was right there – the chance for them to do something unique to represent broken souls, lonely people, mental illness, physical suffering, found family. They missed taking advantage of that and making Thunderbolts* a really grounded film.

Mon: Ok, the person representing many of those issues is Bob. So, dude, we have to talk about Bob. What did you think of Lewis Pullman’s performance?

Ron: I have never seen this man in my life. Although apparently we have. We saw him in Top Gun: Maverick. But his casting wasn’t an easy process. Steven Yeun was cast as Bob earlier but had scheduling conflicts because of the SAG-AFTRA strike. 

Mon: Oh man, I just remembered. Steven Yeun had been fancast as Sentry for eons. And they went with Pullman. Hmmmm…

Ron: This film would’ve been quite different with Yeun in it. I could’ve seen him playing a version of his Nope character. He would have been amazing. Pullman is very sweet and makes Bob quite endearing. So I like him. Is it anything new? No. But I liked him.

Mon: I was very skeptical about this casting. As you said, we’ve apparently seen Pullman in Top Gun: Maverick, and I remember him, not at all. So when I saw the promos, I was like, what is happening? But you know what? I thought Pullman was great. He plays the silly, dork who needs saving. He carries off playing an arrogant, powerful person. And he hit the emotional beats of his character beautifully. Honestly, I’m impressed. 

Action Scenes

Ron: We’ve obviously got to talk about the action scenes because there are plenty. I would say the action isn’t as visceral as Black Widow, which has some of the best in the MCU. It’s not as technically complicated as Brave New World, which had so much stunt and flying work, but was well-accomplished. But we did get lots of hand-to-hand combat and a variety of fighting styles which was very fun to watch. The Thunderbolts* fighting each other made for a lot of entertainment. When they have to fight the big bad while saving people? Chef’s kiss. Loved that sequence so damn much!

Mon: Yeah, the action was fun. It’s definitely not out of this world, but it’s made to be enjoyed, and I can’t argue that these scenes, especially among the characters, were super enjoyable to watch. 

Major Criticisms

Mon: Having said that, my major criticism, aside from all the character issues mentioned before, is the pacing. Look, I love me some action. I also love me some quieter character moments. But there has to be a balance and a cadence to both. The action needs to get your heart pumping, and have you leap out of your seat with adrenaline. And then you calm down with touching moments between the characters. We get that here but some bits are too repetitive, and the action is not that fluid.

This isn’t a total surprise – the director, Jake Schreier, is a comedy and character guy, not an action person. The action isn’t that bad, it’s pretty good. The trouble is the balance. There were times the film slowed to a halt. We lost time with some characters because we kept coming back to the same characters, but the story beats weren’t moving. There’s not as much exposition-dumping as expected, but some of it was sloooooow. It was annoying. 

Ron: That’s so interesting that you didn’t like the pacing. It didn’t bother me as much as it did you. I thought the first half handled the action well and the ending had some great moments. But the middle bit, I agree, could have been tightened up a bit more. Or we could have been given a few more perspectives. That’s probably what was lacking in Thunderbolts* the most. The lack of multiple character perspectives. And that’s why it can’t be called an ensemble film. We only really see the story from Yelena, Valentina’s and Bucky’s POVs, and sometimes Bob’s. It would have been so much richer if we’d got to see the world through Ava’s eyes, for instance.

Best Moments

Mon: Some of the best moments of the film were Bucky’s hair, and also Bucky’s hair. Hoo boy, that hair is memorable. 

Ron: Oh, you’re too funny. Bucky’s hair is spectacular though. Actually, every moment Bucky was on screen made me happy. He was lovely and sardonic yet heroic. I wanted more of that.

Mon: I can always do with more Bucky. 

Mon: I also really loved some of the effects in the climactic battle. I can’t talk about it, but ufffff… One moment actually made me gasp out loud. Loved it!

Ron: Yes. Speaking of other best moments, Yelena has a couple of great action scenes and I loved her scenes with her dad. Alexei is such a disaster but he loves his children. It was really sweet. Of course, my favourite moment is a massive spoiler so I can’t talk about it. I will say, I saw that coming, but it was very heartfelt nonetheless.

Mon: I didn’t see it coming, and I loved it. I was internally going ‘awwww’, it was so cute. I needed more of those cute moments. 

Humour

Ron: There’s a lot of humour in this film and I was expecting it. In fact, I was a bit worried that the promos I couldn’t avoid had lied to me. That this film would turn out to be too dark and not funny at all. But it’s hilarious! Even some of the serious moments are hilarious. You’re half-terrified your favourite character will die but also laughing at the way they’re being killed.

Mon: This film is ridiculously funny. The combo of director Jake Schreier and writers Eric Pearson and Joanna Calo brings the laughs to the fore. They do a great job of weaving in the humour during some of the darker scenes, without undermining the emotional heft of it. At other times, they just lean into the laughs. I’m so glad we got a somewhat happy film to spend time with in the MCU.

Final Thoughts

Ron: I’m still confused about my feelings for the film. I got a Yelena movie and I’m still pumped about that. But I didn’t get enough Ava, Taskmaster, or Bucky, and I love all of them too much not to feel disappointed about it. While the film is very enjoyable, I wanted the chemistry between the characters to really pop. And it doesn’t. The reason why the Avengers films worked was because the chemistry was insane. Hell, Bucky’s here because Sebastian Stan had ridiculous amounts of chemistry with Chris Evans and Anthony Mackie. These characters are fun together but they aren’t electric!

Mon: I had a lot of fun watching Thunderbolts* – the humour is great, the action is nice. I loved seeing these characters on screen after they’d been missing for so long. But there were missteps that dampened my complete enjoyment of the film. I ached for more of some of the characters; I needed better pacing. I was also left confused because Thunderbolts* isn’t trying to say anything – it’s a story in a franchise and it’s advancing the narrative of that franchise. Not much happens in the way of sending a message. I kinda like that. We can just have fun with Thunderbolts*. And we do. If only they’d taken advantage of the gravity the characters brought with them. Ugh, what a miss. Ron: True. We wanted more character moments. Like in The Eternals. But it was still a fun film. And Bucky’s amazing hair is a winner in my book.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 6, Episode 2. Andor Season 2 Review

In the latest episode of Stereo Geeks, Ron and Mon head back to their favourite universe, Star Wars, to review the second season Andor. While the first season was critically-acclaimed, the Stereo Geeks had many issues with the writing. Does Season 2 redeem the show, or make it worse? Does Cassian Andor finally get his due? And what about the rest of the characters? Listen now to find out in this spoiler-free episode. 

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Mon: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks. Today, we return to Star Wars and review Andor season 2. I’m Mon. 

Ron: And I’m Ron. While we won’t spoil any details from the second season, we will discuss spoilers from season one. So if you haven’t watched that yet, check it out and return here. 

Mon: Before we start our episode, we would like to acknowledge that the land we are recording on is the traditional territory of many nations, including the Mississaugas of the Credit, the Anishnabeg, the Chippewa, the Haudenosaunee and the Wendat peoples. It is now home to many diverse First Nations, Inuit and Métis peoples. We also acknowledge that Toronto is covered by Treaty 13 with the Mississaugas of the Credit.

Ron: While we are making this land acknowledgement, we understand that this is not enough and that positive action is required by the people of Canada to make substantive change for the Indigenous nations and communities whose lands we now reside on.

[Music]

Mon: Where did we leave off in Season 1?

Ron: The major plot points were:

Cassian’s adoptive mum Maarva died and left a rallying cry for their home planet, Ferrix, to fight the Empire

Senator Mon Mothma had to make an uncomfortable pact with a thug to ensure she had the funds to feed her foundation 

Said pact was to, essentially, marry off her teenage daughter to the thug’s son

Disgraced Imperial officer Syril Karn saved ISB go-getter Dedra Meero and now she was indebted to him

Brasso, B2 and Wilmon took off to parts unknown with a traumatized Bix

Cassian joined Luthen’s secret rebellion 

Mon: That’s a lot. We kick off Season 2 a year later. Like the first season, this one is also broken up into four chapters. Each chapter has three episodes that are around an hour-long. And there are time jumps between each chapter. 

Mon: This time, however, Disney is releasing each chapter weekly, instead of each episode weekly. 

Ron: In a way, that makes sense. It’s like watching four mini movies. And that’s presumably to help maintain the continuity. 

Ron: But the problem is, are the chapters good enough for you to trudge through nearly three hours of them per week? Unfortunately, this season does a time-jump with every story arc which not only makes it hard to get invested in the stories, but there is also no continuity. Stories are just thrown at the audience. 

Mon: Look, you and I had issues with season 1. And even on the rewatch, we still had problems with it. 

Ron: By problems do you mean that the show is called Andor, and yet, Andor himself is hardly in it?

Mon: Your sarcasm isn’t lost on me. And yes, you and I have really struggled with this issue. We have a hero, a character so beloved, fans manifested a show for him, and he…sits in the backseat doing nothing. A lot. 

Ron: I felt that even more in Season 2. There is so much screen time given to swathes of new characters and Cassian is literally in the background somewhere. But why are we spending time with these characters? Are they aiding the narrative? Because to me, they felt like empty fillers and distractions.

Mon: Cassian doesn’t feel like a protagonist. He’s more like a thread stitching together the stories. He’s like War Horse, tying all these disparate people and places together. But that means we’re not getting to know him. Which was the primary reason for watching the show.

Ron: Not even that. As the season wears on, Cassian feels more like an NPC, a non-playable character. 

Mon: Even the characters who do get long arcs, like Mon Mothma. Why is her arc about her domestic life? Would they have done this if it was for Luther Rael? He gets to be the secret sauce of the Alliance and that’s completely undermined Mothma. 

Ron: Luthen’s storyline belonged to Mon Mothma and I will die mad about it. The whole Mon Mothma storyline has been regressive. In fact, everything to do with the women characters is regressive and reductive. Mothma is defined by her nonsensical family life and her world’s traditions. Bix is a damsel in distress throughout. Dedra literally becomes involved with an incel. And Eedy is the world’s most overbearing mum. 

Mon: This show, especially the second season, feels like it never understood the established characters. I felt this way during the first 12 episodes, and this time around, I feel like I entered the Upside Down, no one makes sense and all we knew about these people is turned on its head. Did no one care about continuity when making this show?

Ron: Yes, the canon has well and truly been forgotten. Are the fanboys going to complain about that—or does it not matter because it’s a woman and a Latino hero being ruined?

Mon: I know right? Mon Mothma is not the boss behind the Rebellion—suddenly it’s some white dude named Luthen. And Cassian, he’s a hypocrite. The show posits that everything he told Jyn in Rogue One was a lie. Why? Why did they write him this way? It’s so unfair. 

Ron: They took everything that made Cassian so exciting and interesting away from him. Even one of his lines of dialogue that so many of us love. Watching this season was an insult. 

Mon: I don’t mean to belabour the point but how did they turn the apparent protagonist of the show into a nothing character? Cassian is not a person, he’s just a piece on a board being moved from one square to the next. 

Ron: How did the creative team watch Rogue One and decide this was the angle they’d take with Andor? Just how?

Mon: As if the character assassinations aren’t bad enough, the precision of season 1 is torpedoed in season 2. Every scene drags on so much longer than it needs to. And we’re stuck in place the entire time. Nothing moves. It was exhausting watching season 2. 

Ron: Season 1 might as well not have happened. Aside from establishing a few characters, none of the plot points from the first season are picked up in this season. In fact, throughout the show, there are so many plots, sub-plots, and characters that appear and then promptly disappear without resolution. It is frankly ridiculous. And with the time jumps this season, the most interesting stories end up happening between episodes, off-screen. 

Ron: What’s really upset me is that I actively don’t want to watch Star Wars right now. I know it’s ridiculous to be angry about this, but the world is on fire and we deserve to have something to escape into. Star Wars has always been that for us. Aside from when we saw The Last Jedi, which seemed to hate every character that wasn’t Kylo Ren, this season is the only time that I’ve felt I need a break from this franchise. Especially coming off the back of The Acolyte’s unceremonious cancellation, I’m wondering how to love Star Wars again. 

Mon: The studio has to believe in engaging an audience that isn’t the loud bigoted kind, right? But that’s not happening, and it’s going to get worse under the new regime. So, really, I…have my doubts whether we’ll ever be able to love Star Wars the same way again.

Ron: I mean, this season needs content warnings for rape and intimate partner violence. That’s lazy writing. And it sign posts that this franchise isn’t for certain demographics. Star Wars has never only belonged to cis white straight men. But boy do they keep getting to own it. 

Mon: For a franchise that was made possible by women in front of and behind the camera, who were then systematically erased from its history, I guess we shouldn’t be surprised that we can now add attempted sexual assault to things that happen to women in Star Wars. 

Ron: Some might say it’s not different than what happened to Leia in Return of the Jedi. Trust me, femme and women viewers didn’t like it back then, either.

Mon: You and I are not strangers to shedding a few tears when watching films and television. But this is the first time in our lives that we’ve wept because something is so atrocious. 

Ron: The greatest problem with Andor Season 2 is that every time the writing team had to make a decision, they made the wrong one. The directing and the editing could only do so much when the core story was too thin, over-bloated, and poorly executed. It might actually be the worst writing I’ve ever seen on TV. 

Mon: We hate ending an episode on such a downer, but wow, Andor, especially season 2, was a disaster, with not a single redeeming quality. Ok the costumes were nice. But that’s literally set dressing. Which is what our favourite Rebel hero turned out to be. This is…upsetting. There’s no hope left for our favourite galaxy. But you know what, if this show can pretend the rest of Star Wars isn’t canon, we can pretend it isn’t canon. 

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 6, Episode 1. Toronto Game Expo 2025 Recap

We kick off Season 6 of Stereo Geeks with a recap of Toronto Game Expo 2025. Ron and Mon indulged their gaming selves to the max during their first visit to the game expo. Who knew the co-hosts were just waiting to play arcade games? Hear about their experiences at the expo, what retro games gave them life, and the indie Canadian games they can't wait for the world to see.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Introduction

Ron: Hello and welcome to Season 6 of Stereo Geeks. We attended Toronto Game Expo 2025 and had so much fun, we had to do a recap episode. I’m Ron.

Mon: And I’m Mon. 

Ron: Before we start our episode, we would like to acknowledge that the land we are recording on is the traditional territory of many nations, including the Mississaugas of the Credit, the Anishnabeg, the Chippewa, the Haudenosaunee and the Wendat peoples. It is now home to many diverse First Nations, Inuit and Métis peoples. We also acknowledge that Toronto is covered by Treaty 13 with the Mississaugas of the Credit.

Mon: While we are making this land acknowledgement, we understand that this is not enough and that positive action is required by the people of Canada to make substantive change for the Indigenous nations and communities whose lands we now reside on.

[Music]

Thoughts on the show

Ron: This is the first time we’ve attended Toronto Game Expo, though they have been around a while. 

Mon: I’d not heard about the show, but I’m glad we got to go. I’ll admit, it’s always hairy covering a new event. We don’t know where the venue is, what the setup will be like, how we, the press, will be treated.

Ron: Yes, well, that was an issue for us. Media check-in started at 9am. After a particularly long work week, we weren’t really looking forward to getting up so early on Saturday, even for a game expo. We couldn’t find direct public transport so decided to cab it. And found that we were nowhere near the media entrance. Utter chaos, while it was bitterly cold and raining on our heads.

Mon: Running around like headless chickens trying to figure out where we were versus where we were supposed to be was a terrible start to our Expo experience.

Ron: One of the biggest issues with Toronto is how reliant people are on cars. If you don’t have a car, it can be hard to get to some spots. Toronto Game Expo’s loading bay entrance is definitely on that list.

Mon: Yeah. And not a sign in sight, nor a staff member around indicating where we should go. Very frustrating.

Ron: Once we got there, we had to join the line for exhibitors and vendors. Which was slow to move because only one desk was open for check-in. I must admit, I was confused because our accreditation emails told us there would be two dedicated desks just for media sign-in.

Mon: It ran smoother than I expected despite there being one line to rule them all. I noticed that VIP guests were escorted in–anyone actually working that day were on their own and had to get in line. 

Ron: But the moment we were in the doors, everything was much better. We could take our soggy jackets off and the line moved quickly. We got our media badges and got to wander about. But the 9am media start was a bit strange. Most exhibitors were still setting up, so we got to see a lot of blank cardboard.

Mon: Yeah, we got some confused looks from the artists. One artist point-blank asked us if the event was actually open, and I had to explain that the Expo has staggered start times, so some of us were there, while others weren’t. But she was confused because she’d set up her table while so many others hadn’t.

Ron: A plus side to going that early was how empty it was. Those aisles seemed so wide and easy to walk through. There’s no way that we would have been able to navigate it so easily once the crowds began at 11am.

The Games

Mon: None of the gaming areas were open when we arrived. So, really, what was the point of inviting us so early? The whole point was to beat the crowds. 

Ron: Yes, we saw the claw machines, which apparently you’re a huge fan of. But there was nobody there to operate them, or explain to us how we could get coins. The arcade games were also being set up when we first arrived. But we did get to play some games eventually. 

Mon: Yep. I had my heart set on trying the arcade games. As soon as I read that we could play them for free, I was like, this has to be for me. 

Ron: I didn’t know you were so hellbent on playing all the arcade games. 

Mon: Are you kidding? I love arcade games! 

Ron: We didn’t get much of an opportunity to play them growing up in India. I can only think of one evening when we had access to some arcade games. I have no clue what happened to that place after that.

Mon: I’m sad there were no free pinball machines at the Expo. Trust me, I’d still be there if there was pinball. 

Ron: There technically were pinball machines at the TGE but I couldn’t figure out how we could get to them.

Mon: Now I’m sad again.

Ron: Ah, sorry about that, sis. 

Mon: Nah, it’s fine. We finally got to play Mortal Kombat. How cool was that!

Ron: It was so much fun! I played first as Sub-Zero and then Liu Kang. I dominated both games! It was amazing.

Mon: I played as Scorpion, and then as Raiden. I’m so bad at games. I think I lost both times, but ooooo I had fun!

Ron: I don’t think it helped that the sunlight was shining on the screen. You could barely see the characters. But yes, the button mashing was fun. You do have to be strategic though.

Mon: Yeah. There are combo moves that we may have accidentally done.

Ron: Those combo moves culminated in some violent actions. Oofff. But so fun.

Mon: Especially when one character was close to death and the game announced “Finish Him!”

Ron: Iconic! And we finally got to experience it in real life.

Mon: What did we do next? 

Ron: We tried Guitar Freaks, but couldn’t get it to work at all.

Mon: Oh yeah. How did we miss every single beat? 

Ron: There comes a time in your life when you need to acknowledge that you’re not very good at certain things. Music-related games are on the top of that list.

Mon: Aye, that’s fair. I tried Jubeat right after that. I thought I was killing it with the beats, but then it said FAILED in big, bold letters. Like how? How did I go so wrong?

Ron: Tell me how you lost Jubeat? I was recording you and you were hitting those buttons at the right time. They kept lighting up green! That game is rigged.

Mon: So true. I keep forgetting we had a gala time playing that car game. I really loved the two-player games. I got to play with you, which is my favourite thing to do. 

Ron: Yes! It was called Steering Champ. There were multiple stages and each stage was like a whole different game. We had a wheel and a pedal each to play with.

Mon: Too many stages. But I liked the stage where we were grabbing gold coins. Noice!

Ron: I made an ill-advised run at Donkey Kong and Ms Pac Man. I was terrible at both of them. Or maybe I was a bit tired by then?

Mon: Oh yeah! Let’s go with that theory, boo.

Ron: We ended our arcade games with House of the Dead II.

Mon: Gory, gruesome, but jolly good fun.

Ron: That game we were pretty good at. Except for the two… incidents. 

Mon: We don’t talk about that.

Ron: If we had tried to include a disclaimer saying that no innocents were hurt during the playing of this game, that would have been a lie. Those poor civilians. We swear, we thought you were zombies.

Ron: Elsewhere, we tried our hands at nerf guns!

Mon: First time handling nerf guns. Mine was jammed for the longest time, and I was like, ok, this is just how I roll. 

Ron: Mine was not and I was still a disaster at it. The GameStop team was very fun though. And they took cute pictures for us.

Mon: Awwww. They were amazing. So friendly and energetic. When my nerf gun finally unjammed, I got one duck. One! Not a real duck, people. 

Indie Developers

Ron: Aside from the arcade games, we wanted to check out the game developers who were showcasing their own work. There were some independent Canadian developers who we got to meet. That was the biggest highlight for me.

Mon: Absolutely. The first indie game we stopped at was Kitten Cup Studio’s adorable cat game, Pekoe. The game had such a cute display, we stopped to take a picture but then developer Len Predko invited us to play the game. Of course, I took a seat. It’s such a calming game. Basically, you own a tea shop and make tea for your customers, who happen to be cats. There was also very soothing music to listen to, and I was given cat-ear headphones to experience the music.

Mon: I started off only having cinnamon flavouring for the tea but the customer loved it. Then I made the tragic mistake of telling my cat customer I liked swimming. She was not happy!

Ron: What a hilarious way to end your time with the game. I understand Pekoe is already available on Steam. So that’s what we’ll be getting next.

Mon: We then landed up at the table for Galactic Shogun. The art was gorgeous and the cards were so fetching with the steel backing.

Ron: But the developer, Peter Luo, explained to us that those were the fancy versions of the cards. The regular versions aren’t as shiny. Still beautiful though.

Mon: I’m afraid poor Peter had his work cut out with us.

Ron: Yes. We didn’t know what a social deduction game was. We’ve never played Mafia, which he compared Galactic Shogun to. He had to explain the whole concept from scratch. I can’t say I completely understand it.

Mon: No, me neither. There’s some subterfuge involved and some people are helping others, while some characters are out to get you. But the mechanics were lost on me.

Ron: We stopped at Angry Peasants’ table next. The co-founder, Wurst, told us about the game Bunker Down! with art created by Alejandra Laria. We got to see a prototype of the game so it wasn’t the final art. But the game itself has a hilarious concept. 

Mon: While most fantasy games are about playing the powerful dwarf, or wizard, in Bunker Down! you play the hapless villagers who are trying to live through the magical people’s nonsense. 

Ron: That’s so hilarious to me. But I’ve never been very good at dice games and role-playing games still feel alien to me. Cool concept though.

Mon: We made a few stops in between to play some PS5 games. 

Ron: I got needlessly excited thinking one of the consoles was playing the PS5 game Stray. No luck.

Mon: But you did get to play a TMNT game.

Ron: Well, play is a strong word. There was a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles game and I was playing as Leo. I died 10 seconds into the game. I don’t even know how.

Mon: I couldn’t even get the practice session to work for Tekken 8.

Ron: All the tables said to reach out to staff if we were having a problem. Only I couldn’t see any staff. And what were we going to tell them? Please help us ensure Leonardo doesn’t die again?

Mon: Tekken was stuck or glitching, though.

Ron: Okay, true. We made one more stop at an indie game. It was called Ranita, and that is so insanely close to my name that I had to go check it out.

Mon: Indeed. Our real names are hard to find out in the wild.

Ron: Exactly. So I told the developer, Erick Moros Letondeur, about my name and he thought it was super amusing because Ranita means Little Frog in Spanish. And your name means Little Monkey. This is hilarious and I feel they’re very apt for our personalities.

Mon: Well, I wouldn’t go that far but those meanings of our names are definitely cute.

Ron: The game itself was like Mario. The little frog has to jump up to platforms without touching anything that can cause instant death. Here’s the kicker, everything causes instant death. This frog is such a lightweight.

Mon: Very funny. Erick shared a few more details about how he made the game. And unfortunately, that made me less-enthused to play the game. Erick explained that he couldn’t get coders to commit to developing the game. They would quit after a while because they were volunteers. But that meant the game wasn’t being completed. So, Erick used generative AI to teach himself to code and build the game.

Ron: I cannot believe I share a name with an AI game! I’m crushed.

Mon: Erick was very proud of himself for this accomplishment but genAI is terrible in every way. Bad for the environment. Thievery. And taking away jobs from actual people.

Ron: Erick was so sweet but this was a huge downer for us. We want games made by real people, not AI.

Highlights

Mon: Let’s look at the positives. There were quite a few highlights from our time at the Expo. Tell me one of yours.

Ron: All the amazing art that we saw. Since it wasn’t too crowded, we got to appreciate the art, instead of being jostled about. 

Mon: Yes, so many gorgeous art styles. Also, plenty of handicrafts. Oh, one of the crafts I was absolutely cooing over were those porcelain ghost decorations.

Ron: Oh, they were just too cute! The ones with the pizza! And there were a few who had gaming accessories. If we had space in our display cabinet, I’d have brought them home.

Mon: Adorbs. And speaking of cute things, let’s talk about the special guest.

Ron: Ok, so I’d seen on the Expo website that Leonidas, the cosplaying cat, was going to be there. I was looking for him, but I got swept away with all the other stuff. We were almost out the door when I noticed a small container on a table. I was so confused, like what is that? And why is there a tiny bed inside it? And then, I saw him. Leonidas. And he was dressed as a Jedi. He even had a little lightsaber. It was so cute. I melted.

Mon: When you pointed him out to me, I thought I was looking at a stuffed toy. And then he moved. I lost my mind. 

Ron: Who wouldn’t? Such a cutie.

Mon: I hope we see Leonidas again someday. What a treat.

Ron: So, it wouldn’t be a Game Expo without gaming vendors. It was fabulous to see so many vendors. We spent a lot of time browsing through their stacks of games. 

Mon: Yeah, and we got some loot as well. 

Ron: Yes, but we were on a mission. One we knew could only be accomplished at the Game Expo. If not here, then nowhere else.

Mon: We finally, finally, found the PlayStation Portable game X-Men Legends II: Rise of Apocalypse. 7 years ago, as we were packing to move to Canada, we realised that someone had stolen a bunch of PSP games from our home. One of the stolen games was Rise of Apocalypse, the greatest game ever made. We were crushed. Our parents were crushed. The universe was unbalanced. We have been searching for it ever since and now, it’s in our hands again!

Ron: Missions accomplished, we said goodbye to a fun day out. Despite the wretched, cold, wet start, the day itself was excellent. I’m really looking forward to the next one. 

Mon: Me too. Onto the next Toronto Game Expo.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 11. Toronto Comicon 2025 Recap

The Stereo Geeks were back at Toronto Comicon this year. In this special bonus episode, they share some of the highlights and lowlights from the annual 3-day fan event. 

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Mon: Hello and welcome to a bonus episode of Stereo Geeks! You know spring is near when Toronto Comicon comes around. 

Ron: So to celebrate, we’re recording a quick recap of our time at the convention. I’m Ron.

Mon: And, I’m Mon.

Ron: We always look forward to getting our geek on at Toronto Comicon. This year’s event was a strange one – the programming focused almost exclusively on The Boys and Supernatural. I’m sure there are lots of geeks out there who aren’t interested in either of these shows. Not sure what they would have got out of it.

Mon: Yeah, totally. And this was probably the first time since we’ve been to Toronto Comicon that the con and March break have coincided. So, really, more fandoms should have been considered in the programming. Despite that, Friday was far busier than usual.

Ron: We had a few sessions that we wanted to attend on Friday, but really the draw for us was looking through the vendors and the Artists Alley. 

Mon: The artists are always the best part. And you never know who you’ll find there. 

Mon: We chanced upon George Buza, the voice of X-Men’s Hank McCoy/Beast. We knew he’d be at the con – he was replacing X-Men ‘92 creator Larry Huston, who wasn’t able to attend this year. 

Ron: We fangirled so hard when we met Larry Huston last year, so it was a bit of a bummer he couldn’t come this year.

Mon: Yeah, but we had such a lovely chat with George Buza. I mean, you were wearing your X-Men ‘97 shirt, so it’s not like he couldn’t tell we were fans!

Ron: That t-shirt got so many comments on Friday. It was fun.

Mon: It was. We were gushing about how we like George’s version of Beast because he’s most similar to the early Beast, the one you and I know best. He seemed to love hearing that. He also scoffed at what they’ve done to Beast in the comics, and said he hoped the show doesn’t go down the same route. 

Ron: I hope we can hang on to nice Beast, too. I told him as much. 

Mon: George also reminded us that he, and the majority of the X-Men voice cast, live in Toronto, so really, X-Men is like a local show. But despite that, when it comes to conventions, the creative team gets relegated to the Artists Alley instead of being treated like stars. That sucks. 

Ron: I remember we were confused about Larry Huston being in the Artists Alley last year, but now George Buza is too? I mean, he’s a voice actor – actors usually get a whole different section. It’s a bizarre choice. And how are people meant to know where to find him?

Mon: The entertainment industry is really strange. 

Ron: Having checked out the show floor, we were able to attend the Roger Christian talk. Christian was the set director for Star Wars: A New Hope and he won an Oscar for it. I’ve written about Roger Christian’s experiences making the first lightsaber over at FlickSided.

Mon: I’m so glad we attended that session. It was so great to hear how one of our favourite sci-fi universes came to life. 

Ron: The final session of Friday was Comic Writers Unite with Jim Zub, Fred Kennedy, Michael Schwartz, and Cecil Castellucci. It was a very interesting panel about being a comic writer. Lots of discussion about the importance of independent work and how it builds the drive for creativity, as well as a longing to complete something. 

Ron: But indie work should be done without the hope for becoming something bigger—finding a creative outlet is its own goal. 

Mon: In other words, don’t go into a creative field hoping to get big. That’s… not how the arts work, unfortunately. 

Ron: When talking about IP versus creator-owned work, the consensus was that IP has far more constraints due to crossover events and tie-ins, which makes it a difficult process. 

Mon: Ok, so we’re both writers, but you’re studying screen-writing right now. How surprised were you to hear that creating a comic script is wildly different from writing a screenplay?

Ron: That took me by surprise. Turns out comic scripts are a whole different format. Michael Schwartz described the job of a comic writer as being the writer and the director of the comic. 

Mon: Fred Kennedy shared a great note he’d heard from Scott McCloud - writers tell the story to artists; artists tell the story to readers. That’s a great takeaway for any budding comic creators out there. 

Ron: While the session was informative, I’m still confused as to how one writes a comic. How do you know you can write the comic in 22 pages? At what point have you written enough to reach the page turn? I wanted more technical details and perhaps that was beyond the scope of the session. 

Mon: Agreed. I guess that info would be at a workshop.

Mon: Before we get to our Saturday recap, we can’t forget to mention the Disney+ Daredevil: Born Again installation at Toronto Comicon. We found out about this installation like everyone else – on Instagram. Which, to be honest, is super-weird because we’re press. We go as press. We’ve been getting press invites to these installations for a couple of years now. And now suddenly, no invite?

Ron: Yeah, and the installation wasn’t open to the public or the press when we arrived on Friday. But there were some people already lined up and going in. We can only assume…

Mon: That they were influencers? Yeah totally. Which is so frustrating. But let’s move on to the installation. This time around, the Marvel people realized the line was taking too long to move, so they gave out coupons. That was a better system, because we would have missed out on sessions, shopping, and eating, if we’d had to stand in line. In all honesty, I doubt we would have stood in line for more than 20 minutes. That’s not what a con is for. 

Ron: Agreed. That was a good decision, but when we eventually made it back to the installation two hours later, we still stood in line for ages. They had asked us to return in 30 minutes. So we’d have stood in line that entire time?

Mon: That line was still so slow. And we realized why. 

Ron: The installation involved guests digitally spray painting Hell’s Kitchen. It not only took forever to share the instructions, but then to actually do the painting, and then take pics of the installation, and then pick up the t-shirt with the spray painting on it. I mean, it was fun, but goodness, it took soooo long!

Mon: Listen, I love these hands-on, experiential installations that end with us getting a free goodie…

Ron: Hang on a second. No, we don’t. I want to get in, take a picture, and leave. I don’t want to waste time. 

Mon: Speak for yourself. I love this stuff. I absolutely adore our resin Rings of Power rings from last year’s Fan Expo Canada. And I know we’re going to dig the spray-painted Daredevil t-shirts. But, yeah, things should be faster.

Ron: As fruitful as Friday was, Saturday of Toronto Comicon 2025 didn’t go at all as planned. Despite reaching well in time for the Supernatural session with Ruth Connell, Jim Beaver, and Alexander Calvert, a bunch of people in the queue, including us, were told that there was no capacity left in the room. Not even standing room. A couple of people were let in after that announcement but there was clearly no chance for us once the session had begun. 

Mon: We were a bit shocked that we couldn’t even get into the room. That’s never happened to us before. But we did hear the con staff saying they’d never seen the room that full before.

Ron: We were disappointed but a few other people in the queue were positively devastated. We were all wondering why the con hadn’t used the massive rooms on the lower ground level. You realized why that was. 

Mon: Yes. There was a whole corporate shindig happening on that level and those huge rooms were taken. It’s probably the first time we’ve seen the Comicon share space with another event. 

Ron: It put paid to our plans and our aching feet. We ended up having to sit on the floor and rest our feet. The lack of seating around the con has been a problem. Even the food area has no seating. That’s bonkers. People are on their feet all day; they should get some place to rest. Especially cosplayers. Some of them have such painful shoes on!

Mon: But the lost opportunity at the Supernatural session did free us up to attend our first-ever comic artist sketch duel. It was between Jesus Merino and Pasqual Ferry. We’ve always meant to go for a sketch duel but they usually end up clashing with other events. 

Ron: The sketch duel was great! I’m so glad we got to attend. We were all handed raffle tickets before going in for the chance to win the sketches. That’s fun. The duel started with the audience giving the artists ideas for sketches. Some of them clearly threw the artists for a loop. They didn’t know some of the characters the audience mentioned. Also, both artists are native Spanish speakers from Spain so if the audience wasn’t completely clear in their diction, the artists got confused. 

Mon: There were so many ideas to choose from but the artists weren’t daunted. When it was time to start drawing, they immediately got to work. While they were drawing, the moderator, JM Clark, also asked them questions about their life and work, as well as their origin stories in comics. Both the artists had experienced poorly-created Spanish comics as children and they wanted to make their own as they grew older.

Ron: I was really fascinated by their experiences with American versus European comics. American comic books are more action-heavy and dynamic, they’re fast-paced. But European comics are practically cerebral in comparison, and they want to live in the little moments. That was the shared experience of both artists.

Mon: It was very interesting listening to them talk about their work, all while they were drawing. At the 45-minute mark, they were done. Ferry sketched a stunning OG Iron Man and Merino drew SpongeBob as Batman. The girl behind us who had suggested the prompt was crying happy tears.

Ron: Of course, come raffle time, neither of us won anything. Good on the winners who did get to take those gorgeous sketches home. We have got to attend more sketch duels in the future.

Mon: We ended our curtailed second day of the con at George Buza’s session. Buza is the iconic voice of Beast on the X-Men animated series and X-Men ‘97. We’d met him on Friday but it was great to attend his session. His passion for playing Beast is palpable. He was an X-Men fan from the beginning and his delight at being part of the universe comes through.

Ron: I really enjoyed listening to Buza talk about Beast’s philosophy of life, how he’s a man of intellect rather than violence because his appearance evokes the latter. But Buza did wonder out loud if the events in Genosha in the first season might change Beast in some way. Is that a hint about season two of the show?

Mon: Obviously, Buza can’t give any spoilers but it’s something for fans to surmise about. Speaking of fans, Buza was so grateful to the fans. The voice actors were never informed about the enormous support the show had. They just went and did their job but it was only after the ‘92 show ended that they learned about the ceiling-high fanmail they’d been receiving.

Ron: Yeah, what an odd thing to hide from the actors. And Buza also said that they were kept on tenterhooks about whether the show would be renewed each season. Considering how popular the show is, it’s hard to imagine why the creative and acting teams were put through the wringer like that.

Mon: You can read more about what Buza said in my session recap at Bam Smack Pow.

Ron: The frustrations of Saturday didn’t end with that day. We thought we’d arrived to relative calm on Sunday. We found out we were wrong, very soon. We joined what we were told was the line for Mark Sheppard and Jared Padalecki’s Supernatural talk. There were already a few people before us. No problem. 

Ron: Then! Staff members arrive and ask the line what we’re doing there because nobody was supposed to be outside the room. There were already two queues upstairs just to get into this room. But nobody had told the queue we were in about that. Not even the volunteer queue managers. Absolutely bonkers. People yelling. And everybody wondering what exactly we were meant to do now.

Mon: Toronto Comicon has been going on for how long now? How is it that every single year, there’s absolute chaos around lines? Where to stand? When to stand? Every time?

Ron: Can I just add that this was at 9am for a 10:30am session and people had been queuing for an hour before. What?

Mon: I get that the volunteer staff change every year, but don’t they have staff who can manage these things better? We’ve been on the other side of putting on a huge event, they have got to figure out a way to be more polite to the audience. And they really need to figure out how to manage things better. 

Ron: A lot of people got yelled at for apparently being in the wrong place. But we were all following instructions.

Mon: Yeah. Don’t yell at people. They paid to be here. This is a once-in-a-lifetime experience for most of us. If the staff and security can’t get their act together then be polite and remorseful over the mess-up.

Ron: Once we were in the room, the vibe was completely different. I’d say this is the first time we’ve truly experienced being a part of the Supernatural Family. Everyone was so friendly, we were all trading stories about queue management drama. Which was apparently even worse upstairs! We got a great picture with the queue’s loudest advocate, Jessica. She was incredible. She made sure we weren’t penalized for the bad management. And she’s got an Indian connection! Love it. 

Mon: Yeah, shout out to Jessica and the gentleman in the Scooby-Doo shirt for fighting for the audience. Once the tension died down, everyone was so chatty. I can’t say we’ve faced that in any other fandom. Maybe the drama brought us together, or maybe it was just how the SPN family rolls. 

Ron: Also shoutout to moderator Victor Dandridge for keeping the crowd calm and entertained. He was very funny and played with the crowd. Last year, at the X-Men ‘97 activation, we got chatting to him and he was lovely even then. He brings the energy and is clearly one of the fans. 

Mon: Yep. He’s the one moderator at these Toronto shows who works the crowd. The others just turn up and leave for the most part. 

Ron: The session itself was lovely. But it felt so short! 

Mon: Dude, it was short. It was 35 minutes long. 

Ron: What! No way! 

Mon: Yes. 10:35 to 11:10. 

Ron: Dang. Anyway, Victor had wonderful questions for Jared and Mark, who were equally funny and insightful. I first saw Mark Sheppard in 2011 at the Middle East Film and Comic Con. Back then, he was sharing lots of anecdotes from behind the scenes and how Jensen Ackles was called the ‘short one’ because Jared is so tall. And he really is. At 6 feet 4 inches, he fills the stage. This time, I found Mark Sheppard so philosophical and he really wanted to applaud the audience, the Supernatural Family, for being such an important part of the journey. 

Mon: You could feel the love for the fans from Jared and Mark. Much like how we felt it with George Buza. But more than that, I like that both actors talked about the why of Supernatural’s success. It’s fun to get behind-the-scenes stories, but much more interesting when the creative teams attempt to dissect why we love the show.

Ron: I loved the love in that room. So much cheering from the crowd and both Mark and Jared just thanking the fans so much. It’s so interesting that Mark didn’t want to use the term fans for us. Because fanaticism has such a negative connotation. He talked about how the SPN viewers were always there for each other and supporting each other, as well as the creatives on the show. They weren’t fans; they’re a family. And that’s where the term SPN Family came from. Because the group of people who are brought together through Supernatural aren’t fans, they’re a family to each other. And we definitely felt that in the room. 

Mon: For me, it was most fascinating when Mark explained what kept fans coming back, and why fans enjoy the characters of Castiel and Crowley. We love the brothers — Sam and Dean. But so do Castiel and Crowley. They’re like the audience stand-ins; as he said, the audience are living vicariously through Cas and Crowley. That was mind-blowing to me. I’ve always known we stuck with Supernatural through thick and thin because of the brothers, but I didn’t always understand why we found Cas and Crowley compelling as well. Now we know.

Mon: Jared also made a point about the distance between the audience when watching a film in a theatre, versus how we consumed Supernatural – it was a TV show, so we’re watching it in our homes.

Ron: Yes, so that proximity makes the TV characters feel closer, more like a family. That’s not a feeling you get from being at the movie theatre. Because, you need to buy the tickets and transport yourself there and back. But the TV is at home, with you. It was funny that Jared thought movie tickets were $10. I loudly informed him that that was not the case in Toronto!

Mon: Poor guy. He’s a bit out of it with Canadian prices.

Ron: Yes. In general, I thought Mark was so insightful about the show and the people involved in it. And Jared was all emotion. He did get emotional at one point!

Mon: Yeah, Jared teared up talking about the series finale. Can you believe that was 5 years ago?

Ron: Where does time fly? We aren’t even having fun. I kid. I kid. Despite the extremely early start in the morning and the weirdness with the trains and all that drama with the queues, the session was lovely and seeing Jared in person made me a very happy person. My teenage self would be stoked.

Mon: Jared and Misha Collins have been cast in the final season of The Boys, which is also an Eric Kripke show. Several SPN cast members have been on that show, and Jensen Ackles had a big role as well. The three of them will be sharing a scene together on The Boys, so the crowd obviously went wild over that. But Jared also mentioned that he wants Supernatural to come back in some way. I’m not sure how though.

Ron: Yeah, the door seems firmly shut on Supernatural. Dean died. Castiel died. Crowley died. Sam died of old age. God destroyed the multiverse. But it’s sweet that Jared still wants the show to continue in some way.

Mon: The next session we attended was Manny Jacinto’s talk. I lined up for that almost immediately after the Supernatural panel. And there were already people ahead of me.

Ron: My plan was to attend the Doctor Who session, hosted by the Doctor Who Society of Toronto. We have only attended one talk by them before and that was after the first season with Jodie Whittaker. We hated the entire talk and left furious. They were so dismissive of the historical stories that the season focused on. Which was the reason we started watching it, because ‘Demons of the Punjab’ was about the Partition of India. I wanted to know if the society had educated themselves since Ncuti Gatwa took over the role of the Doctor. Anyway, that didn’t happen. Because while I was lined up for that talk, you called me frantically, telling me the line for Manny was already moving. So I raced over to you and managed to join you just as you were entering the room. An hour and 10 minutes before the start of the talk!

Mon: It’s quite ridiculous to miss out on so much of the con because we need to stand in line. But, at least we were able to get into the session. 

Mon: One last complaint, and this issue was corroborated by the photographer sitting next to me. The lighting on the Main Stage was terrible. Jared and Manny were totally in shadow. It was a terrible decision not to put some overhead lights on to light them. The photographer said she’d have to work on fixing all the pictures in post because they were so dark. 

Ron: Wow, you really brought a friendly vibe to this con. Who didn’t chat with you on Sunday? But yes, agreed. The green and purple lights were great for mood lighting, but absolutely terrible for the speakers.

Ron: Moving on to the session. I can’t say we know Manny Jacinto’s entire filmography but we were there to represent all fans of The Acolyte. There were definitely other Acolyte fans in that room but the vast majority were there for The Good Place, a show we haven’t yet watched. But we may finally have to give it a shot. Since we don’t mind comedies so much anymore. 

Mon: We will see. But we were here for The Stranger, and Manny delivered. 

Ron: Manny did talk about The Acolyte and specifically how much he enjoyed being able to do the switch between goofy Qimir and the stoic and deadly Stranger. He kind of did the opposite in The Good Place, and at that time, neither he nor the creative team were sure if he was right for the role. Because he had never done comedy before. But he pulled it off very well, playing out the duality of his characters across two shows. 

Mon: Manny also talked about doing as many of his own stunts as possible on The Acolyte, because he isn’t getting any younger. He also mentioned how his dance skills played a huge part in being able to perform the fight scenes. 

Ron: Yes. The Stranger’s helmet didn’t have much visibility, he said. He was bumping into things all the time. They made three versions — each with larger eye lines — but for the most part, Manny was relying on muscle memory to fight. 

Mon: Manny also mentioned two disparate roles that got him this Star Wars gig. Leslye Headland, showrunner of The Acolyte, watched The Good Place, where Manny demonstrated his comedy skills, and Nine Perfect Strangers, where his character was very stoic. Which is how she realized that Manny was her guy to play Qimir and The Stranger. 

Mon: Should we talk about the Murderville snafu?

Ron: We should but it was very cringe. So, apparently, nowadays at the Comicon, they’ve stopped doing live Q&As at panels. Something happened at another con somewhere. Instead, fans now need to pre-submit questions. Where? How? No one knows. So really, more disastrous management at work.

Mon: There we are at the Manny Jacinto panel, and the moderator asks one of the pre-submitted questions about Manny’s work and experience on the Will Arnett improv show Murderville. And Manny looks so confused. 

Ron: Yeah. And the moderator totally missed Manny’s confusion, because he went right ahead and asked this extremely long question about Murderville. 

Mon: And guess what, y’all. Manny wasn’t even on Murderville! Yikes!

Ron: That was so embarrassing!

Mon: The moderator played it off well in the end. But sheesh, shouldn’t someone vet this stuff beforehand? A real fan question could have been asked in that time.

Ron: Manny took the Murderville thing well and even joked about it right up until the end. But that was how our Toronto Comicon 2025 came to an end. This was probably the least satisfactory con experience of our lives. It was a really frustrating time. 

Mon: Agreed. I’ve never felt so tired after one of these cons, even when they’ve been super hectic or busy. But this one just tired me out. The line-up was depressing, the management was terrible. The experience just wasn’t great. 

Ron: I’m hoping they take all the feedback and make Fan Expo Canada extraordinary, because we can’t do with a repeat of this.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 10. 2025 Academy Awards Reaction

In this special season 5 finale, the Stereo Geeks chat about the 2025 Oscars! What were Ron and Mon’s reactions to the awards? Who were our favourites? Who won, and how did we feel about those wins? Tune in to find out.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Ron: Hello and welcome to a surprise episode of Stereo Geeks. We’re still thinking about the 2025 Oscars, so here we are chatting about it. I’m Ron.

Mon: And I’m Mon. 

Mon: While we will be talking about the Oscar-winning films, we won’t spoil anything about the films we’re discussing. 

Thoughts on the show

Ron: The 97th Academy Awards were described as the most open of recent years. There didn’t seem to be a clear winner by the time the Oscars came around. This entire awards season has been unpredictable except for maybe a handful of categories. I liked that the show started off with music but the musical interludes for the rest of the show could have been more engaging.

Ron: Conan O’Brien wasn’t the worst host but I wish he’d sped up that introduction. And I really needed a warning for those body horror scenes from The Substance. While Anora’s wins caught me by surprise, there were some good moments during the night. Paul Tazewell was the first Black man to win the costume design Oscar. He won it for Wicked. No Other Land won the best Documentary Feature Oscar. The film was directed by two Palestinians and two Israelis about the destruction and ethnic cleansing of Palestine. Their speech was heartfelt and powerful. One of the most important moments of the night, in my opinion. 

Mon: I agree with you about that. 

Mon: After a long time, I tuned into an Oscar’s evening with very little interest or excitement. Conan O’ Brien made some funny jokes. But there were some really weird choices. The song about not wasting time, which did waste time. The James Bond interlude, that was topped off with a bizarre, lacklustre dance performance and two boring renditions of Bond themes. Doja Cat was great though. But the night finished in less than four hours, which was great. This must be a record. 

Best Supporting Actors

Mon: Moving onto the categories. Kieran Culkin won for Supporting Actor. I wasn’t invested in any one winning, but he seemed to be exactly like his character? So he really did get an Oscar for playing himself? Bizarre. 

Ron: This category didn’t feel as heavily-contested as last year’s. Culkin seemed to be a shoe-in. I would have picked between Jeremy Strong and Guy Pearce. They really disappeared into their roles. Culkin was great to watch in the film but everyone’s saying that he’s basically playing himself.

Ron: Zoe Saldaña had been winning this category at some of the other award shows so it wasn’t that surprising that she won the Oscar. She’s the only Dominican to win an Oscar and she talked about being the child of immigrants in America. But I do wish she’d mentioned what’s happening to the trans community in the US. None of the Emilia Pérez winners mentioned trans people even once and it’s a film where the protagonist is trans! 

Mon: And it’s central to the story. Saldaña winning was somewhat of a surprise since I wasn’t expecting Emilia Pérez to win anything at all. But not a real surprise considering Saldaña’s been sweeping it this season.

Ron: This wasn’t a hotly-contested category either. I mean, The Brutalist is probably Felicity Jones’ worst performance ever and she got nominated. Isabella Rossellini was nominated for less than 8 minutes onscreen. It looked like they were grasping at straws for this one.

Best Animated Film

Mon: Flow won Best Animated Film. 

Ron: I can’t believe we managed to catch all the animated films. I thought the box office hits The Wild Robot or Inside Out 2 would have had a good chance. But I was 100% onboard for Flow and I’m delighted that this independent film from Latvia won. I loved that film. It was gorgeous, it was stressful, it had the cutest cat protagonist. It does so much without a bit of dialogue. How it was nominated alongside Wallace & Gromit, I can’t say.

Mon: Hey, Wallace & Gromit was kinda fun. But I’m so happy that Flow won. 

Best Original Screenplay

Mon: Anora winning Original Screenplay seems ridiculous to me.

Mon: You know which film was missing from this category? The Fire Inside. You watched it at TIFF last year and wouldn’t stop talking about it. I finally got to see it and I’m gutted it wasn’t recognized at the Oscars. 

Ron: This category did nothing for me. I didn’t want any of them to win. The best original screenplay should’ve gone to The Fire Inside.

Best Adapted Screenplay

Mon: So Conclave won Adapted Screenplay. How do we feel about that?

Ron: Conclave was good and tense but how did it win this category? I was torn between Nickel Boys and Sing Sing because they were two of my favourite nominees. They were gorgeous films and I cannot wait to read their screenplays. Particularly Nickel Boys; that’ll be educational for screenwriters.

Mon: How is The Piano Lesson not on here? I don’t get it. But, to be honest, Conclave is an interesting win. Coming at a time when the US is aggressively turning to Christian nationalism, anger, hate and discrimination, Conclave makes some interesting points. Not that the awful people in the US will watch it. 

Best Director

Mon: Sean Baker won Best Director for Anora. Yeah, I don’t know how to feel about all these Anora wins. Because I hated the film so much. It was unfunny, uninteresting, not unique, and, honestly, disgustingly gratuitous and exploitative. Apparently Mikey Madison was comfortable enough to refuse an intimacy coordinator, but it still came across as kinda gross. The ending undermined any message of ingenuity it had. Really not a fan. 

Ron: I think I should’ve watched Anora but it’s impossible to catch everything. We have day jobs. I also wish I could know how they choose the directors? There can only ever be one woman, if any. None of these directors were my choice.

Mon: Why were James Mangold and Sean Baker here, but RaMell Ross, who directed Nickel Boys, wasn’t? Please explain this to me!

Ron: I thought Nickel Boys was so creatively directed. But no nomination for the director? The only reason starts with an ‘r’ and ends with an ‘m’. Racism.

Mon: No other reason. 

Best Lead Actors

Ron: Adrien Brody won the Best Actor Oscar and I’m disappointed. He was winning throughout so it shouldn’t have been a shock but I wanted an upset. I don’t think this was a good performance. He was indecipherable half the time and was over-acting. I didn’t like this movie, so that doesn’t help. 

Mon: Am I right in saying that we were both rooting for Coman Domingo? 

Ron: Colman Domingo was my choice because Sing Sing was incredible on every level. But you know what, Sebastian Stan was ridiculously good as Trump in The Apprentice. He’s a great actor and I hope he’s recognized one day for another more deserving performance. 

Mon: Yeah, Stan is a really good actor. Contrary to popular opinion, just because someone’s in Marvel movies doesn’t mean they can’t act. Honestly, Brody plays the same kind of broken, tortured character in every role we’ve seen him in. I thought all the other performances were so much stronger.

Ron: Mikey Madison winning Best Actor was a surprise. I thought at least Demi Moore would win.

Mon: The Oscars tend to give it to young women actors in this category. That’s what it always seems like when I tune in, though I know a lot of stalwart actresses have got the prize. Madison isn’t bad in the role—she has to do a whole different accent than her regular one. But does the performance move the dial? Frankly, a lot of Best Actress performances don’t. 

Ron: Really thought it would be Demi Moore’s year. 

Mon: I honestly don’t think enough Academy members watched The Substance. 

Ron: I still can’t believe Pamela Anderson wasn’t nominated for The Last Showgirl. She was phenomenal even if the film itself didn’t work for me. She brought more to her character than the story did. But I would have nominated the entire cast of Piano Lesson. Danielle Deadwyler was extraordinary. John David Washington was equal parts driven and annoying. Everyone in that film was incredible.

Mon: Well, one of the best performances of last year didn’t even get nominated. There must have been a reason why The Fire Inside wasn’t selected. I mean, other than blatant racism. Ryan Destiny and Brian Tyree Henry should have been amongst the nominees.

Best Picture

Ron: I didn’t have mixed feelings for most of this year’s Best Picture nominees; I had no feelings. Many of them I wouldn’t have cared to watch. But I was actually hoping for a shock win for Wicked. I had no interest in it at all but when we eventually watched it, the film won me over. Absolutely gorgeous visuals, a couple of songs you could bop to, believable chemistry between the actors. And the message about being true to yourself especially when you’re different. I loved it and celebrated the few wins they did get.

Mon: Personally, I was rooting for Nickel Boys. It was one of the more inventive directing efforts out there, with a heartfelt and heart-rending story at its core. 

Mon: Half the Best Picture nominees lacked a cohesive storyline. Like The Brutalist, Dune: Part Two, and A Complete Unknown. They felt a lot like a bunch of plot points thrown at the screen. But they got nominated. Weird choices. 

Ron: In the end, Anora won Best Picture. I didn’t watch it but it seems like an odd choice. It is an independent film so maybe we should be happy that a relatively small budget film won such a major award?

Mon: I’m all for indie films getting kudos. But this one? By the end of the night, we knew Anora was going to win. It had swept the other big categories it had been nominated in. I’m just… disappointed. That’s the word of the night. Like, I’m not seeing what’s so extraordinary about this film. Maybe I’m just being curmudgeonly. It was so irritating to watch! 

Ron: The scenes they showed during the Oscars made me cringe. I don’t think I could sit through the entire film. 

Mon: Oh, they were! And you know this just means we’re going to now get a stream of seemingly prestige movies about strippers and sex workers and they’re all going to be horrendous. I mean, this movie had the chance to push boundaries, but all of the dancers were conventionally sized and most of them were white. And now we’re going to be inundated with non-inclusive movies about an already exploitative industry. Remember Hustlers? That movie had a much stronger, important and universal story about women. That got so little love at the Oscars. Yet Anora wins. 

Ron: And you know those movies will never hire actual sex workers and give them a career. We’re unlikely to see diverse bodies and races in those films. 

Mon: So right. 

Final thoughts

Mon: I feel deflated after this Oscars. I know I shouldn’t, but after the promise of an inventive, creative film like Everything Everywhere All at Once winning a couple of years ago, it seems the Academy has gone back to its default of selecting and awarding relatively safe films in the major categories. By safe I mean the ones that appeal to old, white dudes. It’s just disheartening. What are these wins telling us? Yes. I’m aware an indie won big this year, but it wasn’t inclusive or body positive, so, really, I can’t get behind the Anora win at all. 

Ron: This wasn’t an exciting Oscars season for me. I wasn’t that invested in the films. The ones I fell in love with, like The Fire Inside, Piano Lesson, Sing Sing and Nickel Boys didn’t get the recognition they deserved. The Oscars still aren’t as diverse as they should be. With what’s happening in the US right now, I don’t even know what the next four years will look like for Hollywood.

Mon: That’s our Oscars 2025 round-up. We would have liked to get through all the categories but that would have been a much longer episode than we have time for.

Ron: And with that, we bid adieu to Season 5 of Stereo Geeks. We’re going to take a short break and be back in April with Season 6. See you then.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 9. Daredevil: Born Again First Reactions

The Devil of Hell’s Kitchen is back! Now officially part of the Marvel Cinematic Universe, Charlie Cox reprises his role as Daredevil, and Vincent D’Onofrio is back as Wilson Fisk, in the Disney+ series, Daredevil: Born Again. What did the Stereo Geeks make of this show? How much do new viewers need to know before going in? And most importantly, does the show live up to the hype? Listen to our first reactions in this episode.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Mon: Hello and thanks for tuning into Stereo Geeks! Today we’re discussing Daredevil: Born Again. I’m Mon.

Ron: And I’m Ron. While we’ve seen the entire first season of this MCU show, we will mainly be discussing the first two episodes. So this is a spoiler-free zone.

About the show

Mon: We’re back in New York, but no longer in Hell’s Kitchen. Matt Murdock, played once again by Charlie Cox, has moved up and on in life, but hoo boy, do things go down first! You are not ready for what happens in the first episode. 

Ron: There has to be a reason why the show is called Daredevil: Born Again. Things need to change significantly in Matt Murdock’s life for him to experience a rebirth. Some of them will be good but since this is a gritty superhero show, a lot of those things will be bad. People are going to have very strong reactions to the events of the first episode. I’m not sure I’m 100% happy with the decisions made but it’s a hell of a way to breathe new life into a character.

Mon: And Matt is only one part of the story in this series. There are a couple of rebirths happening here – the other one is Wilson Fisk. He’s been the Kingpin; a bad guy; a scary guy; a mentor gone wrong. But here, in Daredevil: Born Again, he has a whole new mission. Brought to life by Vincent D’Onofrio once again, Fisk is a complicated character. He keeps Matt, and the viewer, off kilter throughout. 

Ron: I’ve got to say, I came into this show with more knowledge of Fisk than Murdock. I was captivated by Fisk in both Hawkeye and Echo. It’s hard not to be fascinated by this horrifying man who takes people’s heads off with car doors…

Mon: How do I not remember Fisk doing that? Maybe I looked away. 

Ron: I can’t forget it! Especially when on the opposite side is Daredevil the do-gooder. The dichotomy between the two of them is set up right from the start of this show and plays out both in the plot and often visually.

Ron: But there are other storylines here. There’s a running theme of bringing down vigilantes. Which obviously Fisk is a proponent of. There’s the political plotline - one that we can’t help but compare to the very real situation in the US right now. Power imbalances are another running theme that I found thought-provoking. 

Background

Mon: Netflix’s Daredevil was a huge hit. It was supposed to be the start of the more grounded era of Marvel properties. But then the studio couldn’t make up its mind if the Netflix shows were part of the universe or not. And eventually, that part of the franchise fizzled out. 

Ron: But fans’ love for the characters – or rather of Daredevil – never waned. And now he’s back as part of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. 

Mon: The return of Charlie Cox as Matt Murdock has been teased for a few properties now. Our curiosity was piqued in Spider-Man: No Way Home, and then he had memorable cameos on She-Hulk: Attorney at Law…

Ron: Probably my favourite rendition of Daredevil so far. 

Mon: Likewise. And he also appeared in an episode of the underrated Echo. Do you remember how much of the OG show you watched?

Ron: Dude, I fell asleep in episode 4, maybe 6? And never watched another episode again. The Daredevil I know is the lovesick softie in The Defenders show. I love that show. And then I saw him again as the romantic foil in She-Hulk. 

Mon: Oooo boy. Well this is going to be an interesting chat then. I watched the first two seasons, but I’ll be honest, I only paid attention to the first three quarters of season one. I completely lost interest in the show after he got his supersuit. 

Mon: I can’t explain it. But he went from being an everyman doing good, to something unattainable. We can’t be Daredevil, because we can’t get that suit. I don’t know why the bubble burst, but it did. And then I just went through the motions of watching it, but nothing stuck. I never went back to season 3.

Ron: So, neither of us has a thorough understanding of the guy we’re meeting in Born Again?

Mon: Unfortunately, no. But people love Daredevil, and they loved the show. They manifested his return. 

Ron: Which is why we’re here talking about it.

Initial Thoughts

Mon: I am always worried about new Marvel stuff. Because I love this franchise so much, and because there’s endless discourse around it. It’s never-ending, and it’s hard to enjoy. I also don’t know much about Daredevil and his world. I’ve read a little of him, but not this particular comic series that Born Again is inspired by. But, you know what, I really dug the first two episodes. 

Ron: I have not been concerned about this show. For all the hate that the diverse properties in the MCU have received, it’s always been the complete opposite for Daredevil. Which is so odd because it’s the only one of the Netflix shows that bored me to tears. 

Mon: You’re very right. My concern was more about whether you and I would enjoy it. This show was always going to be a success, irrespective of its quality or central message.

Ron: I think it helps that we weren’t super-invested. People have been desperate for Daredevil’s return but it’s not been a huge concern for me. So I felt like I could go into this show with no stakes. The fact that the first two episodes ended up being so engaging is a huge plus. 

Mon: The show starts off with a really different tone and vibe from the other Marvel properties. That’s what I’ve really enjoyed about the Marvel shows. They’re all so different. They’re different genres. Different tones, styles. You never know what’ll take your fancy.

Ron: The Disney+ TV shows have worked for me especially because they’re so unlike the movies, and each other. With this show, it’s not just gritty, it’s on the ground with the people. 

Mon: I would never have guessed a silly sitcom about a lady lawyer was going to be one of my top favourite Marvel shows, but here I am still pining for She-Hulk. And now we’ve got Born Again – it’s kind of like a legal procedural. Kinda grassroots. A character study. And yeah, this is, apparently, also my jam.

Ron: The music in the first two episodes was excellent, and that continues through this first season. I love the orchestral version of the Daredevil theme and the visuals of the opening credits strongly symbolize destruction and rebirth. Beautiful and memorable. But all the song choices have been excellent so far. ‘Future Starts Slow’ was a poignant choice, and full of foreshadowing. That needle drop of ‘Get Free’ by The Vines, especially after that brutal action scene? I’m very into this. 

Mon: Agreed. Great music choices. Question for you – as someone with very little background on Daredevil, especially the screen version, how lost, or not lost, were you watching the show? 

Ron: A little lost. But not so much with Daredevil himself. Maybe because I love The Defenders so much and that show filled up some gaps. Vanessa Fisk, played by Ayelet Zurer, was the one character I felt a bit lost about. The episodes of the original show that I watched, she hadn’t married Fisk yet. They were courting. So how is she in the position she’s in now? What’s the dynamic between them?

Mon: First up, I want to complain about something. Daredevil: Born Again has nine episodes which are each around an hour-long. And yet, they go straight into the story. No filling in details. No ‘previously in Marvel’ montage. Just, bam, here’s a bunch of people, they all got history, follow them. But Echo, which only had five episodes, most of which were around the 30-minute mark, had to waste most of the first episode filling in the details about the characters. Why?

Ron: That was a sore point for a lot of fans of Echo. Her story got cut short because it was assumed that nobody would have watched Hawkeye to know who she was. They did the same thing with The Marvels because apparently nobody would have watched Ms Marvel. I don’t know how these executive decisions are made but people are watching these shows with diverse characters. Give us more story and less background. 

Mon: And I knew this would happen. They didn’t give much background in Deadpool & Wolverine either. And they don’t for Daredevil: Born Again. They just assume that since these are the popular white guy heroes, that everyone will have already seen their stuff. But, when The Marvels or Echo come along, they need to have minuscule run times and most of it is filling in gaps. And truth be told, you do need a ton of background to understand several of the dynamics in Born Again. This show needs you to do homework.

Ron: Yes. Like I don’t know what Fisk’s beef with the commissioner is. I don’t know who the five families are that Vanessa is handling. I don’t even know who all those people in the bar were in the first episode. But I’m going to keep watching because I’m interested. Why does everyone assume that if it’s a woman or a person of colour in the lead, they shouldn’t get that same grace?

Mon: This really, really annoys me. Because, neither of us knows all the history of the characters on this show. So, yeah, I could do with some context. But am I going to complain there isn’t any? No! Because I get that the story is going to build and let us know what we need to know. That same grace, however, is not meted out to women and characters of colour in other Marvel properties.

Overall Impressions

Ron: Having said that, what were our overall impressions of the show? I really enjoyed the show even though I didn’t expect to. I couldn’t stop watching. Daredevil: Born Again has a very down-to-earth vibe, and often doesn’t even feel like a superhero show. More like a legal procedural. And those were the episodes I enjoyed the most. It also feels prescient of the times we’re living in, especially for people in the US. I did think it took a bit too long to set up the central premise. While I enjoyed the episodic stories, the connective tissue, beyond the protagonist, was missing for me.

Mon: I was surprised how compelling I found Daredevil: Born Again. It balances out the serialized storyline with more episodic plots. It’s well-written, and mostly beautifully-directed. The show is interested in studying the two main characters. That’s good and bad. We are drawn into figuring out Matt and Fisk; what do their actions really mean? What’s their motivation? Do we trust them? That’s great. But all this character development comes at the cost of world-building. There’s very little of that. We’re told a lot of what’s happening outside the universes of Matt and Fisk. But considering both characters’ are so enmeshed with their city, New York, itself, gets lost in the milieu. Especially in the latter half of the season when Matt and Fisk’s actions impact the city. So that’s something to consider when watching this season. Also - blood, gore, and violence. Please be warned. But overall, this was an engrossing watch.

The Characters

Mon: Speaking of character studies. I find Matt intriguing, but he’s not quite as riveting as Fisk. Is he good; is he bad? What’s his agenda?

Ron: We can’t get into spoiler territory here but there are a few new characters introduced in Daredevil: Born Again. I can’t say I’m crazy about anyone yet. I liked Matt Murdock initially, of course, and I like all the details about how he navigates the world around him. Matt putting his fingers under the cup so he can feel the table; the way he uses his fingers to guide the food onto his fork, those moments made him feel more real, like an actual person that we could connect with. Of course, reminder that Charlie Cox isn’t visually-impaired. How interesting would it be if Daredevil was played by an actor with the same abilities?

Mon: Yes, that’s a sticking point about the casting, for sure. I’m a little frustrated that Matt’s thrust into a romance almost from the get-go. Maybe that’s from the source material, I don’t know. 

Ron: Yes, but he’s always in a relationship onscreen, it seems? Having only seen Matt in Defenders and She-Hulk, he seems like a casanova. But that’s also why I really struggled with him in the back half of the season. I’m sorry to say but he is an absolute jerk and an awful boyfriend. I couldn’t stand him by the end of the season and really wanted to save Matt’s new love interest from him.

Mon: Matt really grated on me by the end of the show as well. 

Ron: To that point, I can’t figure out when this show takes place. It’s after Echo for obvious reasons. But why is Matt with this new lady? What happened to Jennifer Walters?

Mon: Mate, the creators of this show have completely disregarded She-Hulk: Attorney at Law. That show was not in consideration when making this. Because, as usual, the powers-that-be just don’t care about the properties featuring non-dudes, or non-white people. They’re always getting erased. It’s so frustrating.

Ron: Oh no! Please don’t say that. I thought maybe this show took place before Matt met Jennifer?

Mon: The showrunner literally said that, mate. Check CBR.

Mon: Anyway. The new romance undermines any chance of Matt growing as a character. Is this person going to be anything other than a prop? 

Ron: Considering the position that Matt is in now, the romance feels a bit forced. Like the writers needed to add some jeopardy for Matt.

Mon: That’s my concern. The romance also suppresses some other genuine emotions and emotional arcs we’d rather see Matt navigating. Or he should be navigating. I was hoping it would make more sense after the first two episodes but it doesn’t really, does it? And perhaps those familiar with the source material already understand why Matt isn’t dealing with the issues he really needs to.

Ron: Men being sad in a superhero show? Never. They only have two emotions - angry and aggressively romantic. 

Mon: I’m pretty sure Matt Murdock has had more relationships than all the other Marvel heroes combined. Like, jeez! It was very tedious in the OG show, but we’re right back at it again here. 

Ron: I thought his true love was Elektra. Why isn’t he looking for her?

Mon: Please don’t ask me. I wish I knew.

Ron: Fingers crossed we see Elodie Yung again. We already got Jennifer Garner back for one movie. Now let’s have Elodie kick butt on screen again.

Mon: In general, though, there are some interesting character moments, enough to keep you immersed and guessing. It is a little weird to go back to watching something that has a much larger all-white cast. We’re unused to that. Or maybe, I’m still riding that high of Captain America: Brave New World. But, at least Born Again does have some people of colour in the supporting roles.

Ron: Yes, the characters of colour have interesting positions in this story. A few of them are voices of reason and they ground the story with their very real reactions to insane events.

Mon: But the supporting cast doesn’t have a big role. The one guy who does is a serious weak link. 

The Action

Mon: Now, this is a superhero show, so we need to talk about the action. I’ll state here that viewers expecting a fight scene every other scene are not going to get it. The original Daredevil show didn’t have that, and this one steers clear of being just a conglomeration of fights. 

Mon: The OG popularized hallway fight scenes. What was once seen as the sole prerogative of the Old Boy film, now seemed possible for everyone. We’ve seen tons now, of varying degrees. How did the action in Born Again hold up?

Ron: The first episode has a very long one-take action scene. I understand that this is what people expect from Daredevil. It’s not as slick as I thought it would be though. Kinda rough, the characters were moving a bit slowly. But I was impressed at how real it felt. Like this is how real life costumed people would try to fight each other. 

Mon: I really liked that one-take scene as well. But, am I nuts or was there way too much CGI background and smoke in there? It really ruined the intense feeling of the scene. And that scene is super-intense. But I couldn’t see past how wonky the CGI looked.

Ron: It didn’t bother me as much but I agree that it is noticeable enough to be distracting. 

Mon: It’s not evident in the first two episodes as much, but things get very gory, eh? You mentioned that the creative team ramped up the violence and got no notes from the powers-that-be. Some of the gore was hard to stomach.

Ron: The creative team has said that there was no obstruction to how much violence they included in this show. So yes, we did have to avert our eyes a few times.

Major Criticisms

Mon: This is going to sound so petty, but I’m so annoyed Marvel didn’t space out the release of Captain America: Brave New World and Born Again. I mean, they couldn’t give our first Black Captain America a whole month to bask in some glory? Seriously?

Ron: You know what, good point. I guess with 2024 having seen such a dearth of MCU fare, they’re trying to get as much out in a steady fashion. But the optics of giving Brave New World so little alone time with the fan base isn’t great. 

Mon: Shall we turn to criticisms of the show. For me, the CGI was a sore point. Not just during that long action scene in episode one, but later too, with some backgrounds and some aerial shots. What was that about? Anything bother you?

Ron: The CGI wasn’t really bothering me. It was a distraction but it wasn’t as bad as say Multiverse of Madness or Quantumania. My only criticism so far is that, as the audience, we’re given a bit too much plot-related information. I want to be more in Matt’s shoes. There’s a character that Matt implicitly believes but why is that when he didn’t see what we did? I think a crucial scene should have been cut so we had exactly the amount of information that Matt did. However, that was a solid action scene so I’m glad it’s there. Plot-wise, though, not the best choice. 

Mon: I don’t necessarily agree with that argument. We’re spending plenty of time with the characters. And, Matt’s super-hearing gives him insights that we wouldn’t have. 

Ron: Okay, I do have a criticism. The super-hearing is way too convenient. I may not have watched the OG show but was it always this powerful? He can hear things from blocks away!

Mon: Good point, and I don’t know if it was that powerful before. I will say that, in the first episode, his super-hearing is to his detriment, and I freaking loved how they turned the tables on him. But after that, yeah, it makes things too easy. 

Mon: I didn’t have much against the storytelling, especially in the first two episodes, and then the next two or three. But around the half-way mark, I got frustrated that it still wasn’t clear where the story was headed. Or what the message was. And, we saw very little of the world outside of Fisk and Matt’s circles. 

Ron: Circles that are sometimes concentric, and sometimes, they overlap.

Mon: Oooooo. Nice imagery. There’s a lot of telling in the latter half, not much showing. It’s like they ran out of budget to shoot in the streets with large groups of people. My worry was where it was going or what it would eventually tell us. Well, guess what – they don’t actually tell us why they’re juxtaposing these two characters. It’s a bunch of scenes which are great to watch, but what’s the through-line? We’ve been burned by Marvel stuff before – things are looking great, and then they cop out on the messaging and the cohesion. It’s not so bad with Born Again, but I certainly felt the lack of cohesion in this season.

Mon: Ok, so we’ve danced around something. It’s a big spoiler so we won’t go into details. But I am annoyed – even though I’m not attached to these characters – that the creatives are using some characters as bait to get people to watch the show. I hate it when they do that!

Ron: For superheroes, the people around them are crucial to making them who they are. It’s okay to take them out of their comfort zone from time to time; it makes for good character growth. 

Mon: Like in Captain America: Brave New World, where Sam Wilson isn’t with the person he knows best, but there are other relationships to explore.

Ron: Yes, as much as we missed Sam’s usual group, he had strong enough connections with the new cast for it to be worthwhile. But when the show is titled and positioned as a sequel to the OG, one would expect the protagonist to have the same cast of characters around him. I am struggling with the fact that that is not the case in this show. I don’t know how well people will react to Matt’s change in circumstances. 

Tone

Mon: Speaking of only the first two episodes, Daredevil: Born Again only just touches the surface of gore. This show gets much more violent and gory soon after – you can feel that without even watching the rest of the show. 

Mon: But, I like that there’s still a touch of humour. And there are a ton of vibrant daylight scenes and well-lit buildings. Plus, we have those candid interviews that break the monotony of the story. Not that Born Again is monotonous. I like that it feels realistic in so many ways.

Ron: I expected this to be the tone so I’m not at all surprised. But I’m a bit sad not to have the lighter, kinder version of Matt that we got in The Defenders and She-Hulk. Matt the jerk is not my favourite.

Final Thoughts

Ron: Despite Matt being annoying, would you watch more? They’ve already been picked up for a second season.

Mon: I’m in, for sure. They leave you wanting more, so I like that. I was riveted throughout the series, especially the first five episodes. I liked that they decided to make the story a procedural and that it’s about the characters not the plot.

Ron: The first season isn’t a standalone. It’s meant to be watched as a precursor to another season. I do wish we’d known that because I’m quite used to Marvel shows having a complete arc every season.

Mon: I already knew they’d been picked up, so that didn’t bother me. However, I did feel that they started to lose cohesion near the end of the season. At episode six, I started wondering what the show was really about. And what it was trying to tell us. You should have some direction halfway through the season, and I felt it never got there. 

Mon: The show is married to the premise that the Kingpin and Daredevil are connected—but simply juxtaposing their actions isn’t enough to demonstrate that idea. It looks amazing, sure—all those visual refrains and callbacks to each character, looks great. But what is it trying to say? And, is the show asking the right questions? Or, simply asking them to get the answers it wants?

Ron: This season uses match cuts quite a bit to show Kingpin and Daredevil as two sides to the same coin. But that metaphor doesn’t pan out on the story level. Will we get a conclusion to that in the next season? We’ll have to wait and see.

Mon: I did find it a little bloody and gory near the end. Fair warning to anyone averse to such things.

Ron: Oh yeah. I had to close my eyes and look away. One episode got so bloody, I needed a break. Do not watch this show during dinner, people.

Mon: I also felt they reel us in with one premise, and then turn the tables. It’s a very Marvel thing to do. I didn’t dislike it, but I preferred the vibe of the first half of the season. 

Ron: Also, all those cameos! Some of them felt like they were being used just to hook Marvel fans in. I don’t know how people will react to that. Again, I’m not that deeply connected to Daredevil and his crew so I wasn’t that bothered. But how will the Daredevil fans feel?

Mon: Yeah, I wonder too. 

Mon: I’m definitely invested in watching season 2. I just hope Matt Murdock is written better, because I began to dislike him by the end of this season.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 8. Captain America: Brave New World Spoiler Review

"Who’s strong and brave? Here to save the American Way?" It's Captain America! In a Brave New World. The Stereo Geeks have been waiting forever to see Sam Wilson back in action with the red, white, and blue shield. What did Ron and Mon think of his first solo outing? How does Harrison Ford fit in the MCU? What are the political ramifications of a Black Captain America in the world we live in today? We dive in to discuss all this and more in our spoiler-filled review of the first Marvel film of 2025.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Non-Spoiler section

Mon: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks! Today we’re talking about Captain America: Brave New World. I’m Mon.

Ron: And I’m Ron. As usual, we have a lot of thoughts, but we’ll break them up into spoiler-free and spoiler-filled sections. 

About the film

Ron: Captain America: Brave New World sees Sam Wilson once again having to fight to prove himself worthy of the shield. After a daring mission to extract a mysterious package, Sam is on top of the world. America loves its new Captain. He’s got an excellent sidekick in Joaquin Torres as the new Falcon. Although the lad does talk a lot. Sam is also now in a position to ensure that Isaiah Bradley, the forgotten Captain America, is given his due.

Ron: But when the President of the United States of America is Thaddeus “Thunderbolt” Ross, things aren’t going to be easy. Ross isn’t just the father of Betty Ross, a critical plot point in this film, but he’s also a well-known hater of Hulks and super beings. This is the guy Sam Wilson needs to work with? The guy who threw Sam and his fellow Avengers in the Raft for not signing the Sokovia Accords?

Mon: Unsurprisingly, when the going gets tough for Ross and the US, they immediately turn on Sam. For all of Ross’ posturing about being a new man—in this case, quite literally, since Harrison Ford has taken over the role from the late William Hurt—Ross falls back on the same principles that made him so unlikeable in the first place. If it isn’t Ross’ way, it’s the highway.

Mon: Well, Captain America isn’t afraid to take the highway. So begins a tale unlike many Marvel films. Brave New World feels like an homage to old espionage films much like Captain America: The Winter Soldier did. And as in Steve Rogers’ second solo outing, Sam is pretty much on his own, with the able support of Joaquin, of course.

Background

Ron: Captain America: Brave New World is directed by Julius Onah, a Nigerian-American filmmaker who also has acting experience. Onah may not be a familiar name to Marvel fans but I found out he directed Cloverfield: Paradox, one of the more unusual and underrated sci-fi films of the 21st century. It really isn’t surprising how well the action scenes were executed in this film. If you’ve made a space film with all the gravity-defying aspects of space travel, Captain America and Falcon flying through the air should be no trouble at all.

Mon: Ok, so this explains so much about the general feel of the film. I loooove Cloverfield: Paradox. Not going to lie, I’ve watched that film like 3 or 4 times. It’s not perfect, but I love it so much. And that’s because of the character dynamics. 

So much makes sense now. The action is one thing, but Brave New World is filled with so many touching, emotional, and funny character moments. That’s what made me love Cloverfield. Love the connection here. 

Ron: There were quite a few writers involved in this film. Aside from Onah, who also worked on the screenplay, there is Rob Edwards, a Disney mainstay who’s worked on shows such as Full House, In Living Colour, and The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air. The Falcon and the Winter Soldier showrunner Malcolm Spellman and writer Daniel Musson were expectedly part of the writing team here. And the group was rounded off with Peter Glanz, whose mainly written short films. A bit disappointing not to see any women involved in the writing.

Mon: Yeah, the lack of female writers could be felt in how one-dimensional the two women in the film were. But the wealth and variety of writing experience certainly leant itself to a different-feeling Marvel film.

Controversies

Ron: I suppose in this background section we should address some of the controversies around the film. 

Mon: Yeah. Captain America: Brave New World has had a rocky road to release. Remember that time it was called Captain America: New World Order? Yeah, not a good look. 

Ron: It’s a term that has very anti-semitic connotations. The decision was thankfully made to change that.

Ron: Another issue with the film, and one that continues, is the character of Ruth Bat-Seraph. In the comics, she’s a mutant named Sabra who works for Mossad. Considering the horrifying ongoing war between Israel and Palestine, having a Mossad agent in a Captain America film has been viewed as sending an anti-Palestine message. Looks like Marvel also reacted to this criticism and Bat-Seraph is no longer called Sabra, nor is she a Mossad agent. It’s mentioned that she was born in Israel but her Israeli uniform doesn’t really appear in the film. I believe the changes to Bat-Seraph may have led to some reshoots. However, as many Palestine protestors have mentioned, it’s not just the character, but the actor, that is an issue. Shira Haas, who plays Bat-Seraph, volunteered for the Israeli Defense Forces theatre department, despite getting a medical exemption for being a cancer-survivor. The IDF has massacred tens of thousands of Palestinians just since 2023. This is… not a good look for Marvel and Disney.

Mon: Ok, wow. I didn’t know that background about the actor. That’s truly disappointing.

Ron: Yes, it is. 

Mon: And to top it all, there’s a new insider report going around about the tumultuous filming and reshoots. So, this film is… I don’t know, doomed, I guess. 

It’s the gloating about this film’s apparent failure that I can’t stand. Because, once again, you and I feel differently about this film than a lot of other people. 

Ron: Yeah. So far, we’ve talked about everything but the film. What were our initial thoughts about Brave New World?

Initial Thoughts

Mon: Going in, I was very concerned about the final product. Especially after all these issues. I was apathetic for the longest time. But, not gonna lie, as more promos came up of Anthony Mackie and the film, and I’d speed by to avoid spoilers, I started getting those old butterflies in my stomach. I felt like a kid again, waiting for the film to arrive. 

Ron: Look, the days of me being excited for Marvel films is past me. The discourse is awful and it starts well before the film is even released. I can understand boycotting the film for it’s ties to attempted genocide. But for films with diverse casts, discourse from a small but vocal band of racist and sexist losers tends to be horrific. The pressure on diverse genre films to be beyond outstanding is huge. Yet they’re rarely given a fair chance. So there’s a great deal of trepidation going into superhero films nowadays.

Mon: We went for an early press screening, and there was such an air of dismissal around this film. It was like Brave New World had been written off before it even had the chance to show us what it had. 

Ron: The press screening was also 95% white men, which is such a frustrating statement about the state of entertainment media. No wonder diverse films don’t get a chance – look at who’s getting a first look at them?

Ron: But despite who we were surrounded by, nothing could shake my love for Sam Wilson. From that first moment we saw him jogging around the Washington Monument in Winter Soldier, I wanted to see more of him. When I realized that we were going to get his Falcon in the same film, I was ecstatic. I wanted nothing more than to see him become an Avenger. Sam becoming Captain America was never on my radar. It had taken so long to get Black Panther and Captain Marvel, how could we dare hope for anything more? But the final scene of Endgame surprised me, and probably many others, with Steve choosing Sam.

Mon: I know Steve’s first choice in the comics was Bucky, but the MCU isn’t a direct adaptation. And Bucky is so messed up—even after the help from the Wakandans—how could Sam not be Captain America? And this film goes out of its way to prove just why Steve chose Sam, and why Sam has always been worthy. 

Ron: Endgame was released in 2019. We had The Falcon and the Winter Soldier limited series in 2021 that further cemented Sam as Captain America. Yet in 2025, there are still moronic Marvel fans screaming about how Sam Wilson isn’t Captain America because Steve Rogers is their Captain America. Even now. Let’s translate that sentence. For some people, Sam Wilson can’t be Captain America because he isn’t a white man. As if only a white man could be Cap!

Mon: I just can’t with these people. People just want the same thing over and over again. It’s so tiring. But, weirdly enough, people’s reluctance to accept Sam Wilson as Cap provides a lot of fodder for the story, and our reading of the film.

Ron: I can’t help but evoke Kendrick Lamar’s phenomenal Super Bowl performance. America, North America, was built on the broken backs of people stolen from Africa, the Caribbean. As well as the Indians, the Chinese, the Japanese, who came here. The Indigenous people whose lands were taken away and these colonies built on. And somehow, only a white colonizer can be the face of America? What history books are these people reading? Imagine thinking something this stupid during Black History Month in 2025? When we have so many resources to educate ourselves at our fingertips.

Mon: I want to bring up Ta-Nehisi Coates’ book The Message here. He explains in one section of his book just how much of America’s dark history is being eroded to ease the supposed discomfort of some people. And how that impacts current and future generations. 

Ron: Yes! The USA had all the resources to be knowledgeable once. And now with the 47th president in charge, it’s going to be erased, perhaps completely. 

Thoughts on the film

Ron: In spite of all my rage at the world, I loved the film. Captain America: Brave New World harkens back to what we loved about Winter Soldier and Black Widow. It doesn’t feel like a formulaic Marvel film. It’s more like an espionage thriller, like The Hunt for Red October. Anthony Mackie continues to be excellent and brings so much warmth to Sam Wilson. I can definitely see his Captain America leading the Avengers. Danny Ramirez is a pure joy to watch. I would have loved for Giancarlo Esposito and Carl Lumbly to have bigger roles though. They were marvellous in their scenes. Harrison Ford is a wonderful addition to the MCU. He brings a lot of heart to Ross. And, of course, this film has excellent action scenes, especially the aerial combat scenes.

Mon: I thoroughly enjoyed myself. After two viewings, I’m still in love with this film. I was so worried, and Cap reminded me I needn’t have been. I love the characters – Anthony Mackie as Sam Wilson is the best version of Captain America, with a giant caring heart, and life experience that resonates with so many of us. And Danny Ramirez, what a ray of sunshine he is. The action is visceral. The emotions are intense. 

One downer is that the political message is, unfortunately, very muddled. But the overall film is an intriguing departure from the regular Marvel fare. It’s got those Marvel landmarks in it, but they play around with those elements. 

The Characters

Mon: Speaking of the characters, I’m going to start with the negative. The weakest link was Shira Haas as Ruth Bat-Seraph. Oh my gawd — probably the worst performance I’ve ever seen in a Marvel movie. Like that first scene where she’s trying to be angry and indignant at Sam, the awkward blinking and breathing — I couldn’t take her seriously after that. Every time she came on screen I was like “Urghhhh”. Please, we cannot have any more of her in the MCU. While I’m glad they dropped her problematic background from the comics, she brought nothing to the film. 

Ron: She was better when we watched it a second time but, how do we still have a waifu in 2025? Aren’t we over this? Where are the big, strong women to play superheroes?

Mon: Yeah, so tired of Marvel’s myopic view of what women look like. On the other hand, Xosha Roquemore as Leila Taylor was great. It’s an underplayed role but she goes toe to toe with Sam and Ross intellectually. I liken her to Danai Gurira’s Okoye in the Black Panther films. Leila is a woman whose job is to do the job, irrespective of who she’s working for. That’s good and bad. 

Ron: I agree. Roquemore was great to watch. As Leila Taylor, she’s got that secret service vibe down pat. Leila knows who she’s working for and that Ross isn’t the best choice for President. But she’s also sure she can make an impact from within. That doesn’t work out for Sam, but it’s the path Leila believes will work.

Mon: I liked Harrison Ford in this — but I don’t think he was perfect. This isn’t Ford throwing his best at the wall. That’s fine. He comes alive during the emotional moments, and I wish I’d seen more of that. He does a good job as Red Hulk, whatever facial movements were needed worked. I don’t think he’s at his evil and nastiest best, I wish he’d leaned into that more.

Ron: Really? I thought Harrison Ford did exactly what was needed for Ross in this film. Not the Ross we saw in Civil War, who had no emotion. We’re seeing a different Ross now. He has changed but not as much as he thinks he has. I think Ford was a great choice. He’s giving Ross the humanity and emotional intelligence that is crucial for a redemption arc. Assuming that’s where they want to go. I don’t know much about Red Hulk.

Mon: The standout performance in this film for me was Carl Lumbly. Look, I don’t know what he does, or how, but he had me in tears during a particular confrontation. The way he makes his face crumble from emotion. My gawd. I just couldn’t take it. It was so heart-breaking. But, I’ll also say it’s the writing. The creative team took a fantastical incident and made it real with the reactions and dialogue. And then Lumbly just knocks it out of the park with his performance. I’m still reeling from watching such fabulous acting. 

Ron: Lumbly is always good, no matter the role. But he was so heartbreaking in Falcon and Winter Soldier and he’s equally as heartbreaking here. We should have got more of his Isaiah Bradley, honestly. Such a layered, tortured character, and the one who tells Sam the hard truths about the country they both serve.

Mon: Agreed. I almost wish that Isaiah and Sam had more time to delve into their political differences. But more on that later.

Mon: I’m so delighted to see Anthony Mackie back as Sam Wilson/ Captain America. And this time he’s finally leading an MCU property solo. He deserves it. And he’s great. Mackie carries the burden and weight of taking up the mantle of Cap both as an actor and as the character. I love that we see how much harder Sam has to work to be Cap — he has to be so much better. Why? Because he’s a Black man taking on the shield. But also because he’s a human being sans a superhuman serum fighting people and systems much bigger than him. We see Sam straining in a fight. He’s not as fluid. We see him sweating. We see him hurting and aching. And we see him getting back up. If that’s not Captain America, then what is? 

Ron: I feel like we’ve been waiting for an eternity to see Sam Wilson’s Captain America movie. 3 years is a pretty long time. But Anthony Mackie makes it feel like no time has gone by at all. It is frustrating though that it’s taken this long for his solo film to get released, thank the reshoots for that, I guess. For me, Sam Wilson feels right as Captain America. I told you ages ago, that when they announced who would be playing Captain America, I was disappointed that Chris Evans had got the role. I love Chris Evans and his Steve Rogers but I couldn’t imagine anyone but Will Smith playing Captain America. Because, at that time, before we came to North America, the United States was exemplified by Will Smith. I know, nowadays, he’s not the flavour of the month, but way back in the 2010s, he was. It’s taken 15 long years, but it’s good to see someone who looks like Will Smith carry the shield.

Mon: Gosh, I didn’t realize you felt so strongly about the casting choice back then. But I 100% agree with you on that. 

Mon: Sam’s Captain America is also much more than a soldier. He brings his time as a counsellor to his interactions with the people he knows and loves. When he appeals to someone’s better angels, he’s bringing a wealth of psychological understanding and experience to the fray. Sam is of the people – hence, he’s taken the time to learn other languages, which he sprinkles in throughout the film. The way Sam is written, it effortlessly shows just how much more he – and any Black person – needs to accomplish to win the same prize as his white counterpart. And it also shows how similarly one can approach a situation and yet get treated differently when your identity and lived experience is not that of a white person. 

Ron: I love those nods to Sam’s counselling experience. And when he speaks to people, presidents and prime ministers, in their language, it goes to show how personable Sam is. The thing about Steve was that, as much as we all love him, he was not a people-person. He had very few people skills. He tried to be a counsellor during the Blip but he was bald-faced lying to people to make them feel better. Sam would have never done that! He knows people need the truth, no matter how bad it is. Like I said, Sam just fits as Captain America.

Mon: And from one Falcon to the next. I love love love Danny Ramirez. I have been dying to see him back as Joaquin Torres ever since we first saw him in Falcon and the Winter Soldier. He brings such a refreshing new vibe and feel to the franchise. He’s young, but he’s a working professional. He has skills that go beyond just being able to fight. Yes he’s foolhardy, but he’s got a lot of enthusiasm. Ramirez is so obviously enjoying his time with this character. He’s lithe and energetic. He’s a smartass but cool. But Ramirez is also really natural. Be it when he’s being a gregarious youngster and teasing the olds, or when he’s seriously emotional, I felt like he wasn’t even acting. I can’t wait to see more of him.

Ron: Danny Ramirez looked like he was having the time of his life in this film and I am all for it. I love watching actors just enjoy themselves. I was hoping to see Joaquin Torres in the MCU again and this film gave us some incredible moments. He is such a happy, jolly, funny character. We need more Joaquin!

The Bromance

Mon: I was not expecting to find a bromance in this film, but voila. We have it. 

Sam and Joaquin are master and apprentice, which is a very different dynamic from the other relationships we’ve seen Sam in. But there’s less of a mentorship angle here, which I appreciated, because I didn’t want to see another repeat of the Tony Stark and Peter Parker dynamic. Here, Sam has a capable sidekick in Joaquin. He is Sam’s partner-in-crimefighting and he speaks his language as a former military person. But Joaquin hasn’t reached the “friend stage” yet. Joaquin isn’t Bucky, and I like that Sam has accepted that but is still learning what he is to Joaquin. 

What really works for Sam and Joaquin is the amazing chemistry between Mackie and Ramirez. It’s a different kind of chemistry than the one Mackie had with Chris Evans and what he has with Sebastian Stan. It doesn’t sizzle, but it is magnetic. Director Julius Onah leans into that chemistry, with the way he shoots these two together. There’s a poetry to how Sam and Joaquin look and work together. 

Ron: The chemistry was there in Falcon and the Winter Soldier and this film amps it up. You get the eager-beaver vibe from Joaquin but not the way Peter was with Tony. Joaquin’s had his own experiences and he’s been in the military. He’s already at the top of his game. Now he just needs to get on the same level as Sam. They have such an easy chemistry in the film and it makes the whole movie so much more watchable. What I really enjoyed was that they know when to work together and when to fight separately. They’re in-sync. Until they’re not, of course.

The Politics

Mon: The politics of this film were always going to be front and centre. When the original Captain America trilogy came out, the world was different — for one, most of us still had a modicum of faith left in humanity. That’s well and truly gone now. We also live in a world where the masks are off and the true motivations and thinking of the major powers in the world are bared for all to see. We’re living in a world where we know so much more about the atrocities and hideousness that have been committed under the radar of global newscasts, yet nothing is done about them. We are, in a word, cynical. And that cynicism seeps into how we view and consume our entertainment. 

Mon: At the press screening we went for, I heard a lot of chatter basically dismissing this film before it had even started. I’m aware that the trailers, which we haven’t watched, may not have given audiences the best impression of the film. But, why is the world of entertainment media writing always so quick to dismiss and demean a film that stars people of colour, Black stories, and women? 

Mon: Captain America: Brave New World is headlined by a Black actor, a Latino second-in-command, with a Black director and some Black writers, and it’s grounded in the lived experience of the Black community. The act of getting a film like this off the ground and out in the world is an act of political rebellion itself. Even in 2025, or should I say especially in 2025. 

Ron: And let’s not forget that Captain America: Brave New World has been released during Black History Month. Poignant.

Mon: That being said, the political messaging of the film is mixed and muddled, especially given it comes out so soon after the inauguration of the orange person’s second term. The world is scared, angry and confused. The people in America who do not fall into the tiny niche of acceptable, are scared, angry and confused. So a film that keeps telling us that we must see the good in the other side, give them a chance to say their piece and to find their way, is landing completely differently than it would have under a different administration. 

Mon: Is it wrong to have faith in the other side? In our hearts, we know it isn’t. But reality tells us differently. Because waiting for the other side to be better has led us to a world that just keeps getting worse. So, I’m sorry, Cap. Just because you’re a good man, doesn’t mean other people are.

Ron: That’s not the message I got. I took it as Sam thinking he could make a difference from within and he learns pretty quickly that that was never an option. He was always going to be treated as an ‘other’, as the not-Steve Rogers. Whatever chances he gives people to let them speak always come back to bite him. In the end, the only way that Captain America can save people is by holding them accountable.

Mon: But that makes the messaging even more muddled. Because the film also underlines the importance of our political figures needing to take accountability and responsibility for their wrongs. And that someone has to hold them to that. And yet, the US happily elected a twice-impeached, many-times-over felon to their highest office. So, really, this film feels like a cathartic fantasy. It was obviously created in a time of hope, but there’s no hope left. 

Ron: That’s not a helpful way of looking at the world. It does look hopeless but that doesn’t mean we stop fighting. That’s what this film tries to show us. That’s the message of Captain America, whether it’s Steve Rogers, Sam Wilson, or Peggy Carter. No matter how many times you get beat down, you stand up, you keep standing up. Because if Captain America gives up, everyone gives up. And then where does the hope come from?

Mon: Ok, wow. You are way more optimistic than I am. But I appreciate your take on this. You’re not wrong – Cap is about not giving up. I shouldn’t lose sight of that. 

Ron: I wouldn’t say I’m optimistic. The world is in a depressing state right now. The easy thing to do is give up because it’s so bleak. But that’s how the bad guys win.

Action Scenes

Ron: Before this episode gets any more depressing, let’s talk about something we really enjoyed. The action scenes! We won’t go too much into the aerial fight scene, because that’s spoiler territory but the flying scenes are gorgeous in this film. And they look effortless. Which is quite the feat because there must have been a ton of wire-work involved for the actors and stunt people. But none of that effort is visible.

Mon: The aerial scenes are Top Gun-esque in my view. And I’m so glad Marvel doesn’t use – or is better at using – that hideous selfie camera that DC uses for their aerial shots of the characters. It’s so silly looking. Cap and Falcon never look silly in this film. 

The fight scenes in general were fabulous. Visceral is the word that comes to mind. You feel every hit and punch, because that’s what the character’s are feeling. The film really does feel like a spiritual successor to Winter Soldier especially when it comes to the fight scenes, because they’re so raw. It helps that they don’t rely on action to propel the story, so the set pieces are few and far between. And there’s a ton of hand-to-hand combat scenes mixed in with the aerial stuff. Loved it!

Ron: I was actively wincing during the film. Because, let’s not forget, Sam and Joaquin, they’re human. They’re trained by the military, sure, but they don’t have super-soldier serum making them stronger or healing them. When they get hit, punched, stabbed, shocked, those weapons are going through normal human skin. Talk about ouch!

Spoiler section

Mon: It’s spoiler time. I’m dying to talk about the spoilers!

Major Criticisms

Mon: Let’s start with the bad. While I like that there’s a huge focus on character and, of course, the systemic racism, what this film needed was more world building. We hear a lot about the US being divided and scared. The world teetering. We can intuit that this is because of the Snap—and it is also a reflection of the world today as well. But how do the people of this film fit in? This wasn’t covered that thoroughly in Falcon and the Winter Soldier, so we needed that here. Especially to feel the stakes. Ross keeps freaking out about a treaty falling through and it takes us forever to find out just what he’s talking about and what it means. I would have also liked a little bit more of the Japanese Prime Minister drilling down on how the US loves to take other people’s property, including celestial Adamantium. Those connections needed to be made more clearly to build the tension of the film. 

What do you think? 

Ron: For the most part, I agree. I think the reason they took so long to explain the significance of the treaty was to increase the dramatic stakes. The writers didn’t want to show all their cards early on. It didn’t bother me as much. Especially the discontentment in the US. It felt weirdly similar to real life. People are unhappy with something that is beyond their control so they’ve chosen a dodgy person to lead them. In the MCU, it’s the Snap. In our real world, it’s the cost of living crisis. Either way, people are making terrible decisions about leadership and everyone else is suffering the consequences.

Mon: That makes a lot of sense. 

Mon: One big grouse for me was the climactic fight scene between Red Hulk and Sam. It was going great. Lots of destruction, Sam being beat and getting back up. And then, suddenly, it was the worst CGI background ever? And it got wrapped up in a couple of lines? What happened?

Ron: Dodgy CGI aside, that was the only way to end the fight. When has a fight with a Hulk ever been won through sheer brute force? Attacks make the Hulk more angry. Sam tried the traditional way to fight the bad guy and when he realised that that had not worked, he decided the non-traditional route. The best way to calm down a Hulk is to appeal to their heart. That’s the only thing that works. Of course, real human people aren’t Hulks and many don’t have a heart. But we’re talking about a movie, not politics.

Mon: Yeah, but Sam tried the Betty angle earlier and it didn’t work. But then later it did. 

Ron: When we watched the film a second time I saw why the Betty plea worked later. Red Hulk had already got quite a beating. He was hurt enough to not get more angry and sustain the gamma effects. At that point, Red Hulk was actively able to listen to Sam which is how Sam’s pleas got through to Ross. 

Mon: Right. On second viewing, it wasn’t as abrupt as I’d thought it was, but it still wasn’t enough. I guess I needed more time for Sam to appeal to Red Hulk. Maybe I just needed more Sam time. 

Mon: One final criticism from me is that Giancarlo Esposito was underutilized and kind of wasted. 

Ron: Yes, well that’s because he was only brought in for the reshoots. If I’m not wrong, Haas was presumably meant to have a larger role in the initial version, but given all the controversy and that it was simply terrible optics to side with attempted genocide, they brought in the Sidewinder character, played by Esposito. Problem is, when you see Giancarlo Esposito, you expect to see a lot of Giancarlo Esposito.

Mon: Thanks for the explainer. 

Best Moments

Mon: My favourite moment is at the end of the film, so I’m going to keep it to the end of this episode. Also, you’re champing at the bit to talk about your fav, so let’s get into it.

Ron: I have to talk about my favourite sequence from the film. The assassination attempt on Thaddeus Ross. That’s when I knew I would love this film. The lead-up to that sequence was so joyful, I knew things were going to go wrong. Sam, Joaquin, and Isaiah were in their beautiful suits. They got the limo ride to the White House, had some expensive bubbly on the way. Joaquin took that cute picture of the three of them. Even Sam and Ross were able to come to an agreement.

Mon: An agreement about a new Avengers program, too. Which Sam would be leading.

Ron: It was all so happy and hopeful. And then, when everyone’s guard was down, and they were all sitting and watching Ross’ presentation. Bam, literally. Gunshots at Ross, and from whom? Isaiah. There’s so much tumult after that. Isaiah’s not the only one shooting. Others are. And obviously, we knew something was up because we heard that incongruous song. The editing in this scene, the pacing of it, got my heart racing. I knew we were in for an exciting watch.

Mon: I’m gonna put it out there that the assassination attempt came out of nowhere for me. I was expecting a long-winded exposition scene. Really dig how this film subverts expectations.

Ron: Exactly. There’s no inkling that mind control is going to be an issue here. And that’s how it goes throughout the film. Sam and Joaquin are so often in the dark because that’s exactly how the villain has planned it out. Plus, Ross is contributing to the confusion by obfuscating facts for his own benefit.

Isaiah Bradley

Ron: That scene ends so heartbreakingly. Isaiah comes out of the mind control and is totally lost. The way Carl Lumbly says he can’t go back to prison. I cried.

Mon: I was so moved. But what got me the hardest was when Isaiah pleaded with them not to mess with his suit. It was the suit he got married to his late wife in. He has so little left, and he wanted to hold on to it. Ugh, I tell you, head in my hands moment. I cried a lot. 

Ron: Isaiah was the first Captain America and he was imprisoned for 30 years by the very government he fought for. It’s the indignity that this dignified man has to suffer again and again at the hands of a government that does not give a damn about him. That’s what hurts most watching this film. I believe this is the first inkling Sam gets that he can’t make meaningful change from within. It’s just too corrupt. 

Ron: If you want to know more of Isaiah’s story, you have to check out the comic series Captain America: Truth: Red, White, and Blue by Robert Morales and Kyle Baker. It gives you much-needed context as to why Isaiah was forgotten and the consequences of the US government’s actions in the Marvel Comics. The book also draws from very real incidents which will absolutely break your heart. 

Mon: Yeah. That’s why I do wish we’d had Sam and Isaiah duke it out – figuratively speaking – about Sam’s connection to the government. Sam does see the error of his ways, but I don’t know, concretely, if he acts on it by the end of the film. Heroes and governments don’t go together. Steve would never have been the hero he was if he’d listened to the government. Bucky wouldn’t be alive if Steve had listened to the man. Sam learns this too, the hard way. Steve was mostly given a pass for bucking orders to save Bucky – for three films, I might add. But when Sam tries to help Isaiah by working within the system, Ross pretty much tells Sam he won’t get the same grace because he’s not Steve Rogers. I mean, I don’t want to say Ross is racist, but the system is. The same system that hurt Isaiah for decades. I needed this to be a bigger discussion, a fight, a moment, between Sam and Isaiah. Maybe in the next film?

Ron: Fingers crossed.

Humour

Ron: Captain America: Brave New World has some delightfully funny moments. A lot of them from Joaquin. I could tell he’d be the funny guy when he pulled off the plastic cover on Isaiah’s phone. Carl Lumbly’s annoyed face. That was too real.

Mon: I love the humour in this film. It’s not intrusive, or, like in the early Avengers films, ruining the tension of a scene. Joaquin’s the comic relief, but he’s not in-your-face about it. I loved that silly dance move he pulls after his first mission in this film. It’s not just the dance but the fact that he’s a performer – and there’s no one there to witness his moves. 

Ron: Even though we, the audience, did actually see Joaquin’s awesome moves! Nice meta moment there.

Mon: But my favourite moment was in the Camp Echo lab. I feel a little bad for finding this funny, but when Samuel Sterns reveals his gamma-irradiated form to Joaquin and Sam, the way the two of them take a step back – it was just so freaking hilarious. It’s the way they did it so perfectly in tandem that gets me.

Ron: It was even funnier second time around! And there are lots of humorous moments sprinkled throughout the film, and they’re all very well-timed.

Mon: Exactly. I like that they’re scattered throughout, and most of the characters get to be funny at some point. And yet, it’s well within their characterizations. I would love to go into more of the comedy, but we’ll be here forever if we do. 

Parallels to Winter Soldier

Mon: I need to talk about the parallels and homages to the original Captain America film trilogy. I think that was intentional. 

Ron: I need to hear this. I saw some parallels but you’ve been ruminating over this for a while.

Mon: There’s a few that stood out to me, especially the bit where Sam and Joaquin are in the car, driving to an ‘abandoned’ military camp base. Sound familiar? 

Ron: Yes! Like in Winter Soldier when Steve and Natasha are travelling to Camp Lehigh.

Mon: Right? I like that they’re showing us how Sam and Joaquin have a trusting relationship too. They’re partners, there for each other. There’s an ease to their camaraderie that Steve and Natasha didn’t have at that time, but finally got to.

Ron: Exactly. Except, Steve and Natasha still had to explain things to each other but Sam and Joaquin are much more comfortable with each other. And less awkward, as people.

Mon: So well put. Sam and Joaquin have lived lives, Steve and Natasha didn’t get to do that.

Ron: Is it an Easter Egg that Sam’s SUV is attacked in this film, just like Nick Fury’s was attacked in Winter Soldier? I feel like that’s an Easter Egg. 

Mon: Yep, absolutely. I was quite taken with that parallel. Just shows the resilience of these heroes, plus their smarts.

Ron: Also, their gear. It’s made to keep them safe.

Mon: Another parallel is Sam watching Joaquin in the operating theatre. Not a happy parallel. But they had us worried, thinking it was another Nick Fury situation. Would Joaquin die?

Ron: Oh yes! Just like Steve and Natasha watching Fury die. Joaquin doesn’t die, or fake die, like Fury. He does recover. But we get that moment between Sam and Bucky as Joaquin is being operated on.

Mon: My favourite parallel, however, was the scene between Sam and Joaquin in the hospital. Very similar to Steve waking up to find Sam caring for him. 

Ron: Sam wasn’t on Joaquin’s left though. Things have changed!

Mon: It was so cute. Sam’s always caring for someone. He’s just the best.

Ron: He’s the reliable Captain America. He isn’t going to leave his people and go live in the past. I do love Steve Rogers, but seriously, he didn’t even tell Sam he was leaving!

Mon: Oh my gawd. Don’t you start. I wrote a whole piece about that at WWAC, in case anyone’s interested. 

Ron: We can link to it in the show notes.

Cameos

Ron: Can we talk about the Bucky cameo?

Mon: Yes! Bucky! I knew he’d show up, you know. And when they weren’t showing the person, I was like, “This is Buck. This has to be Buck.”

Ron: Oh, I didn’t expect to see him or anyone else, actually. But it was a sweet moment. Sam and Bucky have a weird friendship, Steve was the reason they were ‘friends’ at all. But looks like they’re getting along a lot better? It’s still not as easy as it is for Sam and Joaquin.

Mon: Really? You think so? Sam and Bucky know exactly where they’re at with each other. Sam and Joaquin aren’t on that level yet. Joaquin looks up to Sam, and Sam trusts Joaquin, but he doesn’t love him. Nah, Sam and Bucky, they’ve got a special bond. 

Ron: Yes, the bond’s name was Steve Rogers.

Mon: Hilarious! They’ve moved on, ok. They’re not pining for Steve any more. 

Ron: They literally talked about Steve the entire conversation. He’s their only connection. What do they even talk about otherwise?

Mon: I mean… you’re not wrong. Maybe that’s what makes their friendship work? They spend all their time talking about Steve. But still, they’re over him. They’re friends now. 

Ron: What would have helped was something, anything, in the last three years about Sam and Bucky, and Sam and Joaquin. Because apparently, Bucky is a Congressman now? I literally asked out loud in the press screening, when did this happen?

Mon: Yes. So loud, the girl in front of us asked us about it. Also, he’s going to be a future Congressman. Please don’t ask me how that’s possible. Bucky doesn’t even speak, and now he has speech writers. Jeez. And, I was about to say, Bucky’s killed so many people, and now he’s running for Congress? He used to be a villain. How? But then… I remembered. Truth is stranger than fiction.

Ron: Unfortunately, you’re right. I’d rather have Bucky as a Congressman in the US than what’s happening now. Anyhoo! I’m beginning to wonder if the reshoots for Brave New World pushed its release and affected the other Marvel films? And we were supposed to get an inkling about Bucky’s career some other way?

Mon: Ohhhh. That might explain things. I’m still so confused by this Bucky development. 

Mon: And before I forget, Bucky and Sam’s meeting ends with Bucky saying ‘I love you, buddy’. That’s so adorable. But also, this is growth for Marvel. The studio is so homophobic, they went into a right tizzy when the Captain America films garnered a lot of attention because of the chemistry between the male leads. We all remember how the studio queerbaited the fans by talking up the Steve and Bucky relationship in Civil War, and then totally derailed it in the actual film. So hearing Bucky actually acknowledge his brotherly love for Sam was astounding. 

Ron: That was a sweet moment. But then that was it. There weren’t any other cameos in this film. Which is sad because it makes Captain America feel like he’s outside the MCU? Am I being too harsh? It feels like Brave New World is connected to the MCU films that people don’t talk about, like The Incredible Hulk and Eternals, a film that you and I still love. How I wished we’d got to see an Eternal in this film.

Mon: First of all. That’s not true. We had the glorious experience of seeing Liv Tyler back as Betty Ross. If it’s not obvious, that was sarcasm. There’s Harrison Ford looking like he’s actually meeting his long-estranged daughter and his heart is bursting with happiness, and then there’s Liv Tyler whose face doesn’t move and she acts and delivers lines with utmost vapidity. Crikey!

Ron: Reminder that Harrison Ford is an exceptionally good actor so it isn’t that surprising that he sold that scene. And that Liv Tyler’s face has never moved.

Mon: Hilarious. I’ll also mention that there was a time when one cameo was all we needed in an MCU film to connect the dots. Bucky is all we needed to complete Sam’s arc here. And we got it. Any more, and we wouldn’t get enough Sam, and Joaquin.

Ron: I’m not saying we need to fill MCU movies with cameos. But it’s hard to connect these characters to the larger universe these days. What I really want is some confirmation that we’ll see the characters that I love once again. Not that I’m expecting Captain America to do it, but the MCU as a whole. Get it together!

Mon: Agree to disagree! But, also, you need to stop holding out hope for the Eternals coming back. It’s not going to happen. The racists won, mate.

Ron: You’ve missed the whole point of this movie. It’s all about having hope. The racists can’t take my hope of seeing the Eternals away. Never!

MCU Connections

Mon: Ok, ok. Fine, I’m filled with hope. 

Now, speaking of MCU connections, I’m pretty sure people are going to—if they aren’t already— complain that Brave New World needs you to do a fair amount of studying before watching this film. 

Ron: Do you, though?

Mon: I was just getting to that. Marvel is very good at filling in the gaps diegetically. And I think they did that with Brave New World. You don’t have to have seen The Incredible Hulk to know that Ross did something bad once, and is now atoning for his sins, and still not getting his daughter back. And also, a weird thing appeared in the middle of nowhere and it’s filled with an awesome new mineral called… adamantium. Right?

Ron: Mic drop. Everyone’s excited. We’ve got adamantium in the MCU. Bring on the X-Men. But also, people watching this film will be like, what is this huge thing in the Indian Ocean, and then they’ll have to watch Eternals to find out. I win. Suck it, racists.

Mon: Oh my gawd. You’re too funny. Also, everyone, please watch Eternals. 

Back to Brave New World. I don’t think people will miss out without the study aspect, but you know the argument by the haters is going to be, ‘oh, they’re all interconnected and it makes no sense. Why won’t they think of me?”

Ron: Noticeably, they don’t say that when they have to watch 10 Wolverine movies to understand Deadpool & Wolverine.

Mon: Urgh. Why remind me and make me mad? I don’t care about the haters. I thought the film was exquisitely clever in filling the massive plot hole of how The Incredible Hulk fits into the MCU, and where the gamma-irradiated man went. And it’s less about the big revelations and more about the impact of the revelations.

Ron: Agreed. It’s not a big deal if you figure out that the villain is Samuel Sterns, played by Tim Blake Nelson. I figured it out in the intro scene but it’s okay if others didn’t. What matters is what Sterns is doing in Brave New World.

Mon: We’re not surprised that Ross continues to be an idiot. We’re more surprised that his idiocy has ruined his relationship with his daughter, and how that’s emotionally taking a toll on him. And, that Ross, just like anyone else, just wants to live long enough to see her again. Dang, who thought I’d feel bad for Ross? 

Ron: That’s what I’m saying. Harrison Ford brings those feels. William Hurt wasn’t playing Ross in that way. Ford, however, is playing the sad dad more than he’s playing a useless President here.

Mon: Yes, well, I did say I liked the emotional bits, I just wish Ford had been a bit more nasty and evil as well. 

Ron: No, no, no. Ford’s Ross is not supposed to be nasty. He’s an idiot, but he’s shedding his horrible side. He’s doing a really bad job of it though, because look at how badly he treats Sam after the assassination attempt. You’d think Sam pulled the trigger!

Mon: Ohhhhh. Wow. I misread that totally. Good point. 

Final Thoughts

Ron: My final thoughts. Captain America: Brave New World is an ode to political spy thrillers dressed as a Marvel film. It has amazing action scenes that have to be enjoyed on the big screen. Anthony Mackie and Danny Ramirez are going to be everybody’s new favourite MCU duo. This film is a lot of fun, and has a ton of heart. It’s also got a message to the people in charge of the US right now—you have got to see the best in people who aren’t like you!

Mon: I love the final scene of the film (before the post-credits). Sam and Joaquin have a heart-to-heart, and it’s really touching because they’re both struggling to be like the superheroes who have come before. Both Sam and Joaquin see other superheroes, anyone but themselves, as these flawless beings who’ve never made a mistake, who’ve never got hurt, who’ve never lost anyone, who always win. Now, we know that’s not true. But explain that to a couple of guys who, in the film and also in the real world, are fighting an uphill battle to be accepted as superheroes in their own right. That’s the core theme of the film, and that’s what makes it even more unique. 

Mon: And that final scene essentially closes the loop on what Bucky said to Sam – Sam didn’t take the serum, and he’s still killing it as Captain America. Steve was someone to believe in, Sam is someone people can aspire to be. Joaquin literally says he aspires to be Sam. And that Joaquin is even willing to take on the pain of responsibility and pressure, because that’s what Sam does. Joaquin sees Sam as that perfect superhero. And bam, the film ends and goes into Kendrick Lamar’s ‘i’, a song from 10 years ago that features the line ‘I love myself’. Wow, Sam, Joaquin and even Kendrick’s telling you to love yourself. Just do it! We love you, buddy!

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 7. Star Trek: Section 31 Spoiler Review

Red alert! There's a new Star Trek film and the Stereo Geeks are reporting for duty. Star Trek: Section 31 has been in the making for a long time but it's finally here, with Michelle Yeoh back in the role of Emperor Georgiou. What did Ron and Mon think of the film? Do they want more? Listen to our spoiler-filled review to find out.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Intro

Ron: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks, and the first of 2025. We’re reviewing the new Star Trek film, Star Trek: Section 31. I’m Ron.

Mon: And I’m Mon.

Mon: Star Trek: Section 31 is currently streaming on Paramount+, so we’ll break this review up into two parts - part one is the general background and our thoughts about the film. Part two is spoiler territory. We’ll let you know when the spoilers are coming.

Background

Mon: Previously, on Star Trek. Section 31 has been in the making for… Kahless knows how long. I don’t think the studio knew just how popular Michelle Yeoh was going to be as Philippa Georgiou, and especially as Emperor Georgiou. But Yeoh was a tour de force, and we all wanted more of her. 

Mon: After a four-year hiatus from the Star Trek universe, Yeoh is finally back as Emperor Georgiou in this seemingly stand-alone film.

Ron: But maybe not standalone? Dare we hope for more?

Mon: Who knows. Section 31 sees the return of Emperor Georgiou, now disguised as the head of a recreational facility outside Federation space. She’s suddenly pulled into action by Section 31. Can she be trusted to join this dangerous mission? Will she fight alongside a crew she doesn’t even know? And, will her past, once again, return to bite her?

Ron: Along the way, we meet her new crew members from Section 31. And they’re certainly an eclectic group. Led by Omari Hardwick’s Alok Sahar, a man with a lot of demons, there’s also the Starfleet plant, Rachel Garrett, a familiar name to fans, played by Kacey Rohl. Then there’s Quasi, played humorously by Sam Richardson, mech-head Zeph, played by Robert Kazinsky. Fuzz, played by Sven Ruygrok, is a… well, you’ll find out. And finally there’s Melle, a Deltan, played by Humberly González. The crew are held together by Sahar’s firm hand and determination, because without him, they’d either all get killed or be at each other’s throats. Let’s just say, Section 31 doesn’t get the pick of the best in the galaxy. But it does make for an entertaining watch.

Non-spoiler review

Mon: So what are our general feelings about Section 31?

Ron: I came here to watch Michelle Yeoh kick butt, and kick butt, she did. So, I got my money’s worth. I love Georgiou, the good and the bad versions, so being able to see her again was a delight. I still miss Star Trek: Discovery so spending some time with Michael Burnham’s mentor/mother figure was a joy.

Mon: I enjoyed the film. The production design and aesthetics gave it a 90s/early noughties sci-fi film vibe, which I seriously loved. It also felt closer to the look and feel of the last season of Star Trek: Discovery, which was a nice connection to Georgiou’s origins.

Ron: I loved the production design. Loved the sets, the costumes, the character designs. It felt like I was seeing more of the Star Trek universe and its people than just Starfleet.

Mon: Now, did I love the film? No. Is it spectacular and memorable? Also no. Is it bad? Definitely not. It’s a middling entry in the Star Trek pantheon. Yeoh and Georgiou deserve better - something more crisp, and exciting. Less exposition, more character dynamics and political machinations. It’s fun, and funny. But there’s simply not enough time to fill out the story. 

Ron: Bit harsh. I had fun watching the film. I know Section 31 is already being panned but considering it’s got a female lead and people of colour, I’m going to take the bad reviews with a pinch of salt. It’s not the best film but it’s enjoyable and visually, it was a treat.

Mon: Ugh, these people and their racism. Stay out of Star Trek if you can’t handle equality. Section 31 isn’t a terrible film. It’s a fun, little romp. And, considering the world we live in right now, a fun, little romp is desperately needed. 

Ron: Now, Apparently Section 31 was slated to be a series. But when Yeoh won the best actor award for Everything Everywhere All At Once, it was reimagined as a film.

Mon: I mean, that makes sense. Let the Oscar-winner headline a franchise film. But, uh, that plan makes no sense if you just drop it surreptitiously, with little to no marketing, on a streaming platform that most countries can’t even access! Paramount made the wrong move here. 

Ron: When I heard Section 31 was going to be a film, I was preparing to put my snow boots on and head to the cinema. But it’s not playing in theatres, which is massively unfair to Yeoh and the whole cast. Why, when we have a diverse cast of characters, is the Star Trek film dropped on Paramount+?

Mon: I can’t even.

Ron: In my opinion, Star Trek is always stronger as a series. Among the films, both the Prime and Kelvin timelines, the only one that really stands out as a good film is First Contact. I enjoyed Section 31, but I think it would’ve been better as a series.

Mon: I’m with you there. Star Trek needs the breathing space of a series. You feel the constraints of 100 minutes with Section 31 - we don’t get to settle in with the characters, and end up with a lot of exposition. So much stuff is added to the lore, and I want more of that. If there’s a major criticism of Section 31, it’s that we don’t get enough. Another criticism is that some of the editing, especially in the climactic fight scene, could have been tighter and clearer.

Ron: I’d also say that my only faults with Section 31 could have been rectified by making it a series. There were key character moments that were compressed because of the 1 hour 40 minute runtime. In a series, we would have at least 8-10 episodes to see them come to those conclusions about themselves.

Mon: I totally agree with you. 

Mon: Let’s chat about the characters. 

I loved hanging out with Georgiou, and watching her being devious, and cunning. I liked that the film closes the loop on what happened to Georgiou after Star Trek: Discovery. She hasn’t lost her edge, but she’s itching for more. Georgiou is still a bit naughty, and terribly full of it. I’m glad the filmmakers didn’t try to soften her sharp edges or make it about her path to redemption. Yeoh slips into the character of Georgiou like she fits into these superb costumes. She was made to play Georgiou. 

Of the new characters, Hardwick’s Alok Sahar is my favourite. You need at least one silent, brooding type with a dark past to reel you in. But Sahar’s backstory also helps him connect to Georgiou. 

Ron: Obviously, we were going to love Georgiou. But aside from her, I liked the new characters. Hardwick and Yeoh had a ton of chemistry – from the get-go, you can tell that they’re in sync because of the lives they’ve led. Every captain needs a commander, and Hardwick was perfect as Yeoh’s first officer. I would love to see more of his character.

Mon: I found Robert Kazinsky as Zeph a quintessential dimwit, and we got the right amount of that in this film.

Ron: Agreed. Zeph was used well, not too much or he’d get irritating, but just enough for viewers to get attached.

Mon: I wasn’t the biggest fan of Sven Ruygrok as Fuzz. Of all the performances, I felt his was the weakest - he was hamming it up. 

Ron: Fuzz made me think of the stock comic characters of 80s and 90s sci-fi films. Really out there with the humour and expressions. Gratingly in your face. Considering how large a role Fuzz has, it needed a stronger performance. I think Ruygrok got a bit lost in the accent. 

Ron: It’s weird how new Trek likes actors playing multiple roles with different accents, isn’t it? Santiago Cabrera played multiple characters with different accents, and apparently people didn’t like that. I thought they were fun. Now people don’t like Fuzz and his accents. Maybe Star Trek should let people just use their regular accents.

Mon: Ruygrok’s Fuzz reminded me of Santiago, but like he was trying too hard to emulate Santiago, and failing at it. Disappointing. 

Ron: Richardson’s Quasi was the comic relief but he also has necessary skills for the team. I got really strong Neelix vibes from him. Like there’s so much more to this character’s past than we’ve seen.

Mon: Yes, I kept wondering why I dug Quasi so much. I mean Richardson is awesome, and I have enjoyed his performances in everything I’ve seen of him, but his take on Quasi, yep, the Neelix vibes certainly helped.

Mon: I’m curious to hear what you thought of Kacey Rohl as Rachel Garrett. I thought we were in for some kind ingenue-type character, and was about to roll my eyes. She’s inconsistently written in this film, but she was fun to watch.

Ron: I didn’t get ingenue from her, but I did get the misfit vibe, and that’s eventually what the film leaned into. Her character development comes through exposition though, which was a drawback for her. Garrett is the stick-in-the-mud Starfleet officer who’s thrown into chaos – if we’d got a series, we could have seen her learn how to embrace the non-Starfleet way of working a problem. 

Mon: Fair points.

Spoiler-filled review

Ron: Shall we warp into some spoilers now?

Mon: Ok, so the film starts off in spectacular fashion - young Georgiou returns to her family after fighting out a battle royale. She has to make one last sacrifice - to kill her family. I saw it coming, but it was still so sad. And it gets worse, because she then has to enslave her fellow competitor, and romantic partner, San. What a beginning. Were you worried this was going to turn out to be a love story?

Ron: Not really. The moment young Georgiou, played by Miku Martineau, makes the decision to murder her entire family, I knew we were going to get something different. I didn’t think San’s chances of surviving were high after that. But I was wrong there. Georgiou doesn’t kill him – she does worse. She not only physically hurts him but emotionally, she pulls the rug out from under him. James Huang plays young San and does a solid job of showing that deep betrayal. He really thought Georgiou could love people more than power. Only Michael Burnham brought Georgiou around to that!

Mon: I’m glad they didn’t turn it into a romance, or worse, something silly like Georgiou having a secret family, or some such. 

Ron: Indeed. I didn’t think they’d go that route because we’ve already seen Georgiou embrace two versions of her foster daughter. In the Terran Empire, Burnham was going to be her heir, and in the Prime timeline, Burnham became the realest thing to an actual daughter. 

Mon: Older San, played by James Hiroyuki Liao, has a relatively small role, despite being an integral part of the story. My takeaway about San is that he’s lost his humanity (in the Prime universe sense of the term) because he watched Georgiou lose hers. The story - and again, in a series, we’d have been able to flesh this out - was less about Georgiou finding herself, and more about righting one wrong. That being San heading towards dictatorship. 

Ron: A series would have given us more time with San, and we could have seen how he goes from hating everything Georgiou has become to following in her footsteps. Georgiou learns the hard way that there’s no such thing as a benevolent dictator. But San truly seems to believe that he can be one because he doesn’t want power the way Georgiou did. Of course, he’s completely wrong. His first act is literally to destroy billions of lives. But Georgiou and San come from a universe that knows only violence. Obviously, they can’t see any better way to be. Unlike San, though, Georgiou did get a new perspective by living on Discovery.

Mon: I wish they’d threaded that theme in more. We get a brief sense of the film’s theme through Sahar, who talks about being turned into an Augment and being made to do horrible things by his master, Giri the Marked, who eventually died. Georgiou comments that Giri was lucky she died and didn’t have to grow a conscious. Love that. So much character development in that one line. We needed more. 

Mon: Maybe I wanted more commentary on Georgiou’s past as a dictator, and San’s wish to be a ‘benevolent dictator’ because of the current state of the world. That’s what Star Trek is about, reflecting reality and making it better.

Ron: I would have loved more about humans being monsters, as well. That whole idea of ruling for the betterment of people, but it’s one person’s way or the highway. I mean, we watched this film the week that the US presidential inauguration happened. So many people in our neighbouring country voted for someone they think will be a benevolent dictator. There is no such thing. Violence begets violence. It always has and always will.

Mon: Yasss! That kind of reflection was needed. We got some of that commentary on Discovery, but Section 31 would have been a great vehicle to explore that concept.

Ron: If it had been a series, we would have got much more.

Mon: Thoughts on plot? Too simple, too convoluted? It didn’t feel overly Star Trek to me, which I genuinely don’t mind. Nice to have something a little different. But the 100-minute run time was burdened with a lot - introduce all these new characters, their backstories, Easter eggs, Georgiou and her past, and a plot line. I liked the overall plot, but it needed more layers. 

Ron: The plot itself felt like Star Trek but the execution felt more like quintessential Hollywood sci-fi. There wasn’t much technobabble, which makes the film accessible for new audiences, but hey, I love technobabble. Tell me all about the EPS manifolds and the annular confinement beam. 

Mon: I liked that there’s a bunch of mysteries at the centre of the story. Who’s the baddie, what’s the MacGuffin. Who’s the mole? I really enjoyed the ‘can’t trust anyone’ angle.

Ron: There’s also multiple baddies. And in general, you can’t trust anyone. I like that you’re worried about getting attached to people but you also can’t help it. Maybe I’m saying that because Sahar comes through unscathed and I really like him.

Mon: Yes. Sahar was really cool.

Ron: There is a scene that I want to discuss with you. It’s the final fight between Georgiou and San. He’s close to killing Georgiou and right at the end, she manages to kick the sword away. But it flies back and slices San’s neck, killing him. Do you think that was intentional?

Mon: Nope, not at all. That was not the best edited scene, and it was a too-neat way to wrap up the fight and the story. 

Ron: The reason I ask is because apparently, people read it as intentional and can’t understand why Georgiou said she didn’t want this to happen. 

Mon: People… have lost the ability to read between the lines. Maybe the editing didn’t help, but it was obviously an accident. Georgiou was up against it, she was in pain from a sword trying to impale her, she lashed out, and San got hurt. Read the context clues, folks. Sheesh!

Ron: Exactly! I read it as an accident, as well. Georgiou was trying to save herself, and she accidentally killed the man she had once loved. Maybe she believed they could have loved each other again. 

Mon: It’s a double whammy of sadness for her - losing San and losing any future with San. A very classic, old-fashioned way to end a story. It’s also the universe’s way to make Georgiou pay for her crimes. 

Ron: For me, this scene actually worked very well to show how much Georgiou has grown, because she actively doesn’t want to kill him. Everyone keeps teasing her about being such a murderer, but she’s a new person now. We saw that when she was last on Discovery. Her redemption doesn’t erase her crimes or her violent legacy, but it does show that if the Terran Emperor, of all people, can find her humanity, anyone can. We live in hope for our very real world.

Mon: We keep talking about Georgiou, which I guess is a sign the film did her justice as the lead. I was worried she’d become a passenger in her own film. 

Ron: Wow, you are always worried about that. Remember how you felt the same way about Spider-Man: Across the Spiderverse?

Mon: We’ve been burned before!

Ron: True, true. But Section 31 is Georgiou’s film, with plenty of memorable moments with the other characters.

Mon: Plenty? There were some highlights. Hardwick’s coolness and pathos, that was great. Loved his chemistry with Yeoh. It wasn’t electric, but it was smooth.

Ron: Yes, I’ve got to go back to Sahar here, especially when he was talking about monsters and people. And I absolutely loved the chemistry between him and Georgiou. I like that it’s not romantic, they don’t go there in this film. But it could very well be. Almost like a Janeway-Chakotay thing – never real but always felt. Really feeling the Voyager vibes from this film.

Mon: Yeah. I get that. There’s certainly something going on between Georgiou and Sahar at the end, though. 

Ron: But the mole scene. Quasi absolutely losing his mind accusing everyone. That was incredible. Richardson played it so well. I was doubting everyone including Quasi!

Mon: Absolutely brilliant work. Threw us off kilter. 

Ron: The mole subplot worked well for me. Because, until Georgiou figured it out, I really was suspecting anyone and everyone. We knew the only person who wouldn’t be the mole was Georgiou herself. But everyone else was fair game. And there were so many breadcrumbs! Loved it.

Mon: Now, I may be in the minority here, but I was hoping for some glimpse, or mention, or connection to Ash Tyler. Last we saw of him, he was inducted into Section 31. I wish they’d brought Shazad Latif back as the leader, or maybe even for one scene. 

Ron: Oh, I 100% wanted Ash Tyler back! But I guess he’s on a different mission with Section 31? When I first heard about this show, now film, I thought it would be about Georgiou and Ash, and a couple of new folks. I was totally expecting them to bond over their love for Michael Burnham. But alas, it is not to be.

Mon: Sad face.

Ron: Despite the lack of Ash Tyler, talking about this film is actually making me like it even more than when I watched it. And the teaser ending gives viewers hope for a sequel. Of course, after what went down with The Acolyte last year, I’m going to accept that this is the last we’ll see of these characters.

Mon: We won’t get a sequel. We need to make peace with that. But the story will continue - be it in our imaginations, or within the pages of books. Yeoh is most likely too busy to continue in the franchise. Section 31 felt like it needed to be done because the studio had said they’d do it. 

Ron: Ah yes, contractual commitments. 

Mon: I’m glad we got the film, but don’t hope for more, not on screen anyway. 

Ron: Where are my Star Trek fanfiction writers at? Get to work, people! 

Mon: Well, we enjoyed Section 31. It’s not perfect but it was definitely entertaining. What did you think of the film? Are you hoping for a sequel? Until next time!

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 6. Agatha All Along Spoiler Review

Down, down, down the road, down the Witches' Road we go! The Stereo Geeks were surprised and awed by Agatha All Along, the spin-off of WandaVision. What did Ron and Mon love about the show? What would they have liked to see? Who were their favourite witches? Tune in to this spoiler-filled review as we travel through many miles of tricks and trials.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Intro

Mon: Hello and welcome to a witchy episode of Stereo Geeks. We’re reviewing Marvel’s Agatha All Along. I’m Mon.

Ron: And I’m Ron.

Ron: This episode is full of spoilers. So, please, watch Agatha All Along and come back to listen to our episode.

Mon: We’ll also break up this episode in two parts. The main section is about the first 7 episodes. And then we’ll dig into the two-part finale. 

Background

Ron: Agatha All Along is the 2024 spin-off of Marvel’s hit Disney+ show, WandaVision. Agatha Harkness, played by Kathryn Hahn, was introduced in WandaVision as Wanda and Vision’s quirky neighbour, Agnes. Near the end of the series, Agnes was revealed to be Agatha Harkness, a powerful witch and custodian of the only other copy of the Darkhold. Full disclosure, I had to do some quick research to figure out the Darkhold stuff because I remember we encountered it in the Ghost Rider season of Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Anyhoo! Back to Agatha. To our immense surprise, the song ‘Agatha All Along’ got so popular that Marvel announced a spin-off series soon after.

Mon: I was shocked and surprised that people were calling for an Agatha show. Partly because I’m not all that into witches and occult lore. But also, I couldn’t figure out what the Agatha show could be about. A prequel set before WandaVision could turn her into a one-dimensional villain. One set after? She’s depowered, what’s the point of that?

I was sceptical about this interest. And even more so when Marvel announced the show was definitely happening. I was least interested in watching Agatha All Along. But, this is Marvel, so I was definitely going to check it out.

Ron: I was listening to something which reminded me that it’s been three years since the show’s announcement. Honestly, I forgot it was even going to happen. The turmoil at Marvel and Disney? Seeing so many promising projects cancelled for no reason? There was no reason to think this show was going to get a chance. Especially not if it was set to focus on female characters.

Mon: Yeah. It fell off my radar, as well. And then I heard about the 2024 Fan Expo Canada surprise panel about Agatha All Along. Followed by an invite from the Disney PR team to attend the activation at the event. 

Ron and I have written about how meh the activation was over at WWAC. That didn’t enthuse me to the show, but I began to feel that familiar pull of intrigue and excitement. Listen, this is the MCU – this is our childhood dream come true. Superheroes every year, every week? You know I’m down for it. So, my spidey-senses were tingling well before we attended the panel.

The Agatha All Along panel recap is also at WWAC. It was at the panel that my interest was piqued.

Ron: Agreed. The activation at Fan Expo didn’t really excite me. It was three outfits and we could barely see them because of the dark lighting. The witchy volunteer who surprised us was the most fun part of it. But the panel started to change my mind. Jac Schaeffer and Kathryn Hahn talked about the othering of witches by the patriarchy and how Agatha All Along will see the coven reclaim witchiness. Feminism. Witches? I was definitely intrigued.

Expectations

Ron: Agatha All Along picks up three years after the events of WandaVision which left Agatha powerless and living out a fantasy in Westview. The pilot episode of the show sees Agatha living out a true crime parody of Mare of Easttown. Agatha is able to break out of the fantasy with the help of Teen, played by Joe Locke. He’s not actually called Teen, but his identity is hidden by a sigil so nobody can hear him say his name.

Ron: Teen wants to travel the Witches Road to get power and guess who else doesn’t have power? Agatha! They team up to access the road, they’ll need a coven with specific witchy abilities. Agatha is the powerless Spirit Witch. Among her reluctant recruits are the Divination Witch Lilia, played by Broadway legend Patti LuPone. Then there’s Powerless Potions Witch, Jennifer Kale, played by Sasheer Zamata. Next, Protection Witch, Alice Wu-Gulliver, played by Ali Ahn. And randomly Mrs Sharon Davis, aka Mrs Hart, played once again by Debra Jo Rupp. Mrs Davis is recruited as the Green Witch, although she is not a witch, but a regular Westview citizen.

Ron: That’s an amazing cast. And it’s rounded off by Aubrey Plaza’s Rio Vidal, the actual Green Witch of the coven, who has a ton of history with Agatha. That history is romantic and bloody. Teen also gets to go as part of the coven but not as a witch. He accesses the road as Agatha’s familiar. This is how I find out humans can be familiars. How fascinating.

Mon: I know nothing about witchy terminology. So I’m fascinated by everything.

Ron: I had no idea what to expect from Agatha All Along and I really wasn’t as invested in this show as so many Marvel fans. But that first episode was so entertaining, I was instantly in love. Though I am a bit sad that the first episode confirms that Wanda Maximoff is dead. Boo to Multiverse of Madness for killing Wanda like that.

Mon: Ufff, do not talk to me about Multiverse of Madness! As mentioned, I was not sure about the show at all. But that first episode was like… what am I in? Because I love it and I want more. I love that Agatha All Along continues the same theme of WandaVision – each episode is a different genre of television. I didn’t expect that on Agatha, but it’s a great way to tie the two properties together. And showrunner Jac Schaeffer makes the genre changes on both shows make sense.

Ron: The best thing about getting different genres every episode is that we also get different sets, different costumes, and a whole new vibe. 

Mon: This show looks so good. The sets and costumes, my word. Love, love, love the look of this show. After all the boring CGI Marvel’s been throwing at us, Agatha All Along is a nice change of scenery. 

Ron: Not to mention, this show was basically an adventure-of-the-week show. I don’t know why we don’t have stories like that on our screen anymore. I love adventure stories. Between Agatha All Along and the new Tomb Raider show on Netflix, I finally felt like someone had got the memo that adventure stories are the best.

Mon: See, this is what I like about Agatha, and it was a huge reason why we all loved WandaVision. These are serialized stories, but told in an episodic fashion. So you get that half-hour of fun, while knowing there’s more to be revealed later. 

Mon: And, I want to point out that one thing I loved about Agatha was how each episode stuck the landing. You ended on a high. This has become a huge problem in today’s streaming age. Studios want tv to be one long movie, so they don’t know how to make short-form stories that have an ending or a cliffhanger. Disney is particularly guilty of this. Like, I love The Acolyte – best Star Wars show out there, in my opinion – but that show has to be watched all at once, not weekly. 

Agatha, on the other hand, even if the episode had some slower moments, it knew how to get you excited while the credits rolled. What do you mean Agatha doesn’t know who Sharon is? Wait, is the whole coven dead? Is Teen a witch? You’re left asking so many questions. And you’re pumped. That’s how you end an episode – or seven.

Ron: You’ve hit the nail on the head. WandaVision and Agatha All Along know they’re TV shows. Each episode needs to tell an entire story while also giving you teasers for future stories and arcs to come. We got cliffhangers every week and that made me desperate for every Wednesday. And with every episode, I was satisfied and exhilarated.

Disappointments

Mon: My one big disappointment in Agatha is that I wish the show had been more obvious and direct about why women have been condemned and cast out as witches. Now, in the universe of the show, witches are real. But, keeping that in mind, why were they hunted, mistreated, killed? Jac Schaeffer had hinted the real-life vendettas against women declared to be witches informs the show. It’s there in the show, but doesn’t play a big part. 

After all, women who have broken the so-called norms of society have always been punished. The coven in Agatha has as well. I wanted to see more of a through-line between reality and fiction.

Ron: I agree with you. And I think I know why we didn’t get to see these backstories of the witches. The show is only nine episodes long. If it was a 22-episode series, we could have delved deep into the coven’s lives before this show. We could have seen how they were wronged by their societies, communities, and the patriarchy. But in nine episodes? There just isn’t time.

Mon: That being said, I’m glad they didn’t show us a ton of violence against the ladies. We didn’t need that to understand what they’d been through.

Ron: Yes. Just listening to Jennifer Kale talk about how her powers were taken by a man she’d trusted as her mentor? That was enough to make me squeamish.

Favourite moments

Mon: There were so many great moments in this series but what are our favourites?

Ron: Am I going to sound insane for saying I loved watching the witches fly on broomsticks. 

Mon: Not going to lie, despite the janky CGI during the flying scene, I loved that moment of profound joy the ladies were having. 

Ron: The coven was being rather disparaging about having to ride sticks but that shot of them flying across the moon on their brooms warmed my heart. For the witches in the MCU, that’s become a derogatory image because witches have been so maligned. But they get to reclaim the power of flight and pay homage to their true witchy selves. It was quite an empowering moment. Also, I really need to see someone, anyone, reclaim the witches from that TERF in the UK.

Mon: Absolutely! 

Ron: Also, I really loved the part of episode six where we see Teen’s point of view of his meeting with Agatha. It was so funny. 

Mon: So dang good. Like, this is what I love about the show – it’s unpredictable, but so perfectly acted. And executed. Black hearts everywhere. 

Ron: Also, so eminently rewatchable. I already can’t wait to rewatch this show because of episodes 1 and 6, but also episode 7, and all the easter eggs that we have most definitely not clocked.

Mon: Oh, Agatha demands a rewatch.

Ron: There were also some characters moments that I can’t stop thinking about. Like Jennifer shoving everyone out of the way to escape the first trial. Every witch for themselves! 

Mon: Oh, Jennifer’s so much fun to watch. That woman’s a survivor for a reason. Get out of her way. 

Jennifer also gets some really funny lines. Like in Episode 7 when Lilia goes, ‘we are not cool, teenager’ and Jennifer retorts ‘ooo, using the full name’—the dialogue delivery, the expression, the line. Jennifer’s memorable. 

Ron: And, this shouldn’t be a funny moment, but when Teen announces that Sharon Davis is dead, Agatha’s only comment is ‘who’s Sharon’? That was hilarious! It’s supposed to be a sad moment. We’ve lost a coven member and someone that Wanda meanly tortured for no reason. But Agatha just has to be Agatha and straight up forgets Sharon’s name. The entire coven calls Sharon Mrs Hart for so long. I love a good running gag and this one worked for me.

Mon: Oh, Agatha. You are the worst. We love you.

Mephisto

Ron: I feel like we need to talk about Easter eggs. But there are so many we’ve missed. We need to rewatch it. Obviously, the biggest one is Mephisto. I don’t know what the obsession is with Mephisto but MCU fans have been predicting Mephisto’s appearance for years. So many people thought he’d be the big bad in WandaVision. People were greatly disappointed and are now very excited that Agatha All Along has confirmed his presence. I don’t really care about Mephisto but he’s apparently such a big deal to fans that I had to mention him.

Mon: This Mephisto thing is so annoying. I get it; he’s an integral part of the boys’ history. But these shows and stories about female superheroes – like WandaVision, She-Hulk and Agatha All Along – they aren’t just vehicles to introduce dude characters from the comics. It frustrates me that people will tune into watch these amazing ladies and their fabulous stories, just to find out which man is going to swoop in to steal the show. 

Of course, I’m about to eat my words, aren’t I? I want to be mad at all the people invested in Agatha All Along because of Joe Locke’s addition and the identity of his character. The show was much more than that, but they were right. 

Teen

Ron: We should probably talk about Teen’s real identity. In a way, we all knew Teen would turn out to be Billy Maximoff because of the amount of speculation online. Sometimes I wish people would share their theories with their friends’ groups instead. Literally the moment Joe Locke was cast, everyone was screaming he was Billy. It probably doesn’t help that there are so few gay characters in Marvel that casting an out gay actor was a dead giveaway. But having said that, until Teen’s spotlight episode, I was still unsure. He could’ve been Nicolas Scratch, Agatha’s son. But Rio was pretty categorical when she told Agatha that Teen wasn’t hers.

Mon: Yeah, they set up the mystery of his identity well, but all the speculation ruined it. It’s a no-win situation. If you make a story assuming everyone knows who he is, you’ve lost a sense of mystique around Teen’s appearance. But, they went with all mystery, and well, so much for that. 

Mon: Despite the lack of a surprise, I must say, Joe Locke has been impressive. His performance is superb—he’s the right amount of campy, adorable, and emotional. 

It’s rare to see a film or show with a bunch of adult and older ladies with one young dude, so I was intrigued by how Agatha All Along would work that dynamic. Unlike a property where the genders are reversed, there is no ewwww or creepy factor to Billy being a young man amidst a bunch of ladies. He’s also not automatically mothered by the ladies — he has a different relationship with all of them. 

I have genuinely enjoyed watching Locke on the show. Which is a relief because it’s obvious that Marvel is setting up the formation of the Young Avengers. 

We have a solid group of characters played by a mostly great cast of actors. Now, if they can strike the right balance of introducing a young generation of characters without alienating us older fans, that would be amazing. 

Let’s talk about Agatha

Mon: So, the grande dame herself. What do we think of Agatha Harkness?

Ron: She’s a bad guy. And she’s the best! I cannot believe how much I’m loving Agatha. Hahn was fun as Agnes in WandaVision but in this show, incredible. Agatha is mean and she isn’t afraid to lean into the meanness. The way she refuses to call Sharon by her name but the fake Mrs Hart name she got used to in Wanda’s hex. And she’s dripping with sarcasm, which I’m pretty sure is her way of hiding her vulnerability. That scene in episode two when she’s hallucinating her child’s cradle. There’s deep pain and loss and trauma in Agatha. And she’s hiding it all under layers of sarcasm and caustic wit. Just shows you how tough the witches of the MCU have to be, I guess.

Mon: I’ll start with one big criticism—what’s up with Marvel screen adaptations turning old, white-haired ladies into younger brunettes? I said this about Madame Web, and Cassandra Nova in Deadpool & Wolverine, and now I need to say it again about Agatha. Don’t get me wrong, Kathryn Hahn is amazing, but I wish Hollywood would cast older women in roles that are literally made for them. Notice how the ‘comic-accurate’ crowd never complain when a younger, hot lady is cast in the place of an old woman? Oh, but try and make comics more inclusive, and everyone loses their minds! 

Ron: Yes. That’s a good point. Agatha in the comics is much older. She’s also kinda stoic which is not like the MCU Agatha, who is hilarious. That’s what you get when you cast a seasoned comedic actor like Hahn. The expressions. The comedic timing. You get everything with Agatha. And she’s delightfully queer! Now that Marvel has cast a younger Agatha, that just means we should be getting more Agatha stories till Hahn is 90. 

Mon: I agree. We could definitely do with more of Hahn’s Agatha. I genuinely never thought I’d be saying that. She was fun on WandaVision, but Hahn gets to flex her evil side here on Agatha All Along. What I love about Agatha is that she’s good with being bad. She’s mean, and nasty. But she’s not cruel. Agatha is looking out for herself, which is what all the witches in the coven are doing. I found her compelling to watch; especially because she’s a baddie. 

Best episode

Ron: Let’s talk about favourite episodes. What’s my favourite? Can I say all of them? How can you make me choose? Oh wait, I’m the one making us choose. 

Mon: You’re so dramatic! Oddly enough, the episode that confounded me the most is also my favourite – it’s got to be Episode 7, “Death's Hand in Mine��. 

Ron: I love Lilia’s episode. I might cry. It was so beautiful.

Mon: Yes, it was the one episode that made me super emotional. The melancholia of losing oneself, of trying to find oneself. And Patti LuPone is a legend for a reason. She carries that discombobulation so well. The way the episode was edited and structured, we feel lost like Lilia, but we also feel rewarded for having gone on this journey with her. 

Ron: I mentioned this to you while watching Lilia’s episode but it made me think of the first season of Castle Rock. The seventh episode of that season gave viewers the point of view of a character with dementia. And the episode fills in all the moments that the character had been losing through the show. It was heartbreakingly beautiful. Sissy Spacek got a lot of accolades for her performance and I hope Patti Lupone gets the same. She was so stunning in Agatha but Lilia’s spotlight episode was everything.

Mon: Episode 7 there too? 

Ron: What a coincidence, right? I must check whether there’s a connection between these two shows. I learned that the reason Agatha All Along’s first episode was a parody of Mare of Easttown was because the showrunners of the two shows are good friends. And they both have an Evan Peters connection.

Mon: Interesting. I was reminded of the fifth episode of The Haunting of Bly Manor. In that episode we also follow a character losing time and place. And we experience a similar sense of melancholy and loss as we do with Lilia.

Ron: Also, I don’t know much about Tarot, but the way Lilia’s episode leaned into tarot was really interesting. I love the way the Tarot deck tied up so many plot threads from earlier episodes. What a treat. Lilia stole my heart in that episode. But who is your favourite witch?

Favourite witch

Mon: ALICE! I love her so much. I’m so predictable, eh? Give me a silent, brooding morally-ambiguous protagonist with a bleeding heart and heart-breaking backstory, and she’s my queen. I’m still angry at Agatha for killing Alice. And Ali Ahn portrays Alice with so much pathos – I couldn’t stop watching her. Plus, Alice is the only one in the coven who’s looking out for someone else. Alice is protective of Teen, but not in the usual maternal way. She’s a kind person; she’s been burned before. She’s been a cop, and she’s literally the Protection witch. Of all the coven, Alice seemed the least selfish. The friendship she and Teen formed was adorable. I could have watched more of that. New fav. Unlocked.

Ron: I really loved Jennifer Kale. Maybe I’m biased because I’ve been listening to Sasheer Zamata for a while on the Best Friends podcast she does with Nicole Byer. But I was pretty hyperfocused on Jennifer in this show. She’s sarcastic, she doesn’t take Agatha’s nonsense. She’s on this quest for herself but she takes the time to warn Teen about how dangerous Agatha can be. Zamata has such a wonderfully expressive face. I loved watching her react to Agatha and the coven’s general weirdness. So fun.

Horror

Ron: Nobody warned us this show would be scary. Like, hoo boy, jump cuts, unnaturally-moving characters, straight up demons and demonic possessions. What a ride! I love that this show had just the right level of terrifying. Enough to make you recoil in fear but not enough to keep you up at night. Though, now that I think about it, I don’t think our parents would be able to watch it? They don’t like horror and the scary moments in Agatha are pretty scary.

Mon: There are definitely a few ‘keep the lights on at night’ jump scares in this show. And it starts from the first episode. I love that. I wish we had more of it.

Queerness

Ron: I don’t know when this happened, but Aubrey Plaza is incredibly hot and queer. I used to find her too quirky but I loved her in Happiest Season. I still think Kristen Stewart’s character should have ended up with Plaza’s character in that film. 

Mon: Not gonna lie, Aubrey Plaza in Happiest Season is super hot. I still can’t get over it. And in Agatha All Along, sizzle!!!! Loved her here. Needed more of her.

Ron: In Agatha All Along, Plaza is deliciously queer and hot. It was obvious from the trailer that she would be naughty and fun, but I really loved her in this. And her chemistry with Hahn is insane. I was screaming ‘kiss already’ everytime they were in the same frame. Also, nothing like queer longing and betrayal to get one excited, eh?

Mon: The MCU began in 2008, but Agatha All Along is the first property where we have multiple out gay protagonists. It’s the first one where two women are very obviously into each other and, at least in the first seven episodes, go in for an aborted kiss. It’s only the second MCU property where we have a gay romance between two gay lads. It’s 2024, nearly two decades after the franchise started. And we’re only now catching up with the fact that gay people exist! I mean, poor Valkyrie is dying to be her bi self in the Thor movies, but Marvel didn’t let her. An absolute shame.

Mon: Now, alongside The Eternals, the Netflix Marvel shows did have gay characters, romance and kisses. But aside from Daredevil, I don’t know if those shows are part of the MCU or not. So,some of those firsts still stand.

Ron: What’s canon and what isn’t? It’s all a mystery. But here’s the thing, is Agatha All Along going to be considered pure MCU? Since it’s a TV show? Are we getting into discourse? Okay. Let’s get into discourse.

Discourse

Ron: Have you heard all the discourse online? Particularly the discourse around who Billy should have wanted to bring back?

Mon: Eh? Agatha discourse has completely passed me by, mate. Enlighten me. 

Ron: First up, I completely missed all the hate the show was getting from dudebros. They can go suck it. But there was some weird talk online about when Billy comes to life, and why was he looking for Tommy? A lot of people were wondering why Billy wouldn’t first want Wanda back. Now look, we love Wanda. I don’t think anyone who watches Marvel films dislikes her. MCU-Wanda is universally loved in a way comics-Wanda has never been allowed to. I get the disappointment of losing Wanda in Doctor Strange 2. I hate it, as well. I want Wanda back. I’ve loved her in the comics, I love her in the MCU.

Ron: Having said all that, people saying Billy should have wanted his mother back before Tommy shows a fundamental misunderstanding of these two characters and Wanda and Pietro. I haven’t read much of Billy and Tommy, but whenever I’ve encountered them, it’s obvious that they’re very close twins, like their mom and uncle. The Wanda, Pietro and Vision trifecta is basically recreated in the next generation with Billy, Tommy, and Billy’s boyfriend, Hulkling. How can anybody expect Billy to find life and not immediately go looking for his twin?

Mon: Wait a ruddy second here. You’re telling me people are confused that Billy wants Tommy back and not Wanda? Have they met any twins in their life? Do they not understand story and characterization? Billy and Tommy are two halves of the same coin. They’re inseparable whenever we’ve seen them in the MCU. Of course, Billy wants Tommy back. 

But, aside from that, from a narrative standpoint, Tommy as Speed needs to enter the MCU to kickstart the next phase of the franchise. The Young Avengers aren’t coming; they’re here. We’re waiting for them to fill in the blanks now. People have absolutely no media literacy. Thank goodness I didn’t read this silliness. 

Finale

Mon: Ok. So the two-part finale. The show takes a complete turn here. The last trial looks very different from the others. And Jenn discovers that Agatha was the one who bound her and left her powerless — though, and it’s not clear — Agatha may have done so on the behest of the patriarchy. It’s all a convenient ploy to give Jenn her power back. 

Then we move onto Billy who asks Agatha for help to find Tommy. Or rather, they need to find a newly dead boy who can become Tommy. In the end, Agatha is left to grow life in a dead space and that’s how she accomplishes the trial. 

Ron: Except, Agatha’s trial has only just begun. We learnt in the previous episode that Rio was actually Death. Agatha makes a deal to give up Billy to save herself. But Billy has to be willing to do it. Because if he dies otherwise, he can just reincarnate and the next time, Death won’t be able to find him. 

Mon: Yeah. And Agatha is clever. She almost succeeds in her plan to sacrifice Billy. But then he reminds her of her son and Agatha makes the sacrifice play instead. Sealing the deal with a pretty hot kiss with Rio. Took them long enough. 

Ron: Can’t deny that I was waiting with bated breath for the finale. But Marvel did its Marvel thing and didn’t quite stick the landing. The two part finale was a great length but way too much exposition. And I also didn’t feel the performances were as layered as previous episodes. Like the almost-kiss scene had me thinking the best of Agatha. But in this episode, things just happen and there’s no sleight of hand to keep you on your toes.

Mon: It’s really weird how the show stuck the landing throughout the first 7 episodes and then completely fell away in the two-part finale. 

Mon: Tonally the two finales were different from the rest of the show. And you could feel them changing the protagonist — from Agatha to Billy.

Ron: Technically it wasn’t Agatha all along. More like Billy all along, eh? 

Mon: You’re not wrong. I was concerned the show was just a vehicle for Billy to enter the MCU. But, the first 7 episodes kept proving me wrong. And I was like, yes, we have a show with all these awesome ladies in it. Yay. And then the finales happened, and yup, the show was indeed just a vehicle for Billy. You cottoned on pretty quick during the finale that Billy reality-warped the whole witches’ road. 

Ron: It never even occurred to me that Billy’s presence in this show would be a distraction from Agatha. And the first seven episodes, it wasn’t. I think some of my disappointment about this finale is that the show was basically an illusion. Not exactly Lost levels of “it was a dream”, but close enough. Having said that, I did like the twist that Billy created the Witches Road purely from his desire to get his brother back. It’s a great callback to Wanda creating the hex on Westview to have a family. 

Ron: I wonder now, wouldn’t it have been interesting to swap the finales? Have us see Agatha’s journey with Nicholas and then see her make the sacrifice play to save Billy. 

Mon: So, the whole Agatha and Nicholas thing — I think they went too hard on that. The overreliance on the maternal aspect of female characters in the MCU is a problem. I thought WandaVision handled it well before Multiverse of Madness made it an obsession. And we see that here in Agatha as well. She can have a dark past with a dead child without that having to be the only humanizing aspect to her. Actually, why does she need to be humanized? Let her be evil. 

Ron: Yep. I agree wholeheartedly. Do we need such a long part of the episode dedicated to a mother’s love? It would have been more interesting to see why she enjoyed killing witches despite having so much love for her son. 

Mon: Like, seriously. In the final episode, we see Agatha and Nicholas’s life together. And honestly, it’s a drag. I thought the con artist part was interesting but the mother-son connection wasn’t strong at all. She was using Nicholas. 

Ron: We should have seen the other cons Agatha made Nicholas do with her. I like the con artist-witch angle. 

Mon: And their only bond was singing iterations of what would become the Witches’ Road song. That’s not layered storytelling. 

Ron: Question: did Nicholas make up that witches road song on his own? Or was that an existing melody he co-opted? Because it starts off as wandering road and then becomes winding road, before finally landing on witches road, aka Agatha’s centuries’ long opportunity to scam and kill witches. That I liked. A lot!

Mon: See, the problem with the finales is this — everything that’s special about these ladies is the boys in this story. And the bad stuff is the ladies fighting each other. The finales totally undermine everything that was awesome about the previous episodes. 

Ron: That’s a bit harsh. 

Mon: I know. But I’m disappointed. 

Ron: I think Agatha and Rio were connected by more than just Nicolas and his death. 

Mon: Was that on screen? No. 

At the very least, I would rather have known why Agatha kills witches and steals their power. What does she get out of it?

Ron: Nicholas even asks her to stop doing it and she just brushes it off. Lean into that. Agatha being a grieving mother isn’t new or unusual. Her insistence on taking lives is!

Ron: Of course, I would have loved to see how Rio and Agatha got together. Rio is literal death and she falls so deeply in love with Agatha? Where was that story?

Mon: Totally! Where was the romance between these two?

Ron: I had really enjoyed the queer yearning, mostly from Rio in the earlier episodes. But by the finale, it was just hate from Agatha. Is Rio’s love for her purely because Agatha keeps her in business with all those witches she kills?

Mon: The layers and depth to the characters disappeared in the finales. I think that’s what I’m struggling with the most. 

Ron: Yes, and I’m feeling that lack of a 22-episode season even more. We get a short scene of Alice being taken by Death and she really doesn’t want to go. But what does it mean for her? Does she get to be with her mother? Did she really live in fear of a curse her whole life just to die for a boy and coven she met a few days ago? 

Mon: So many questions. You’re right to ask them because we’re never going to get these answers. The story has moved on from the coven. It’s on to the Young Avengers now. Agatha is a ghost with white hair and she’s a bit player again. She’s Billy’s guide. He’s running the show.  

Ron: This is such an issue with the Marvel shows. There are all these nuggets but then it’s all wrapped up with an untidy bow. We’re never going to see more of Jake Lockley from Moon Knight and now I’m not sure where Jenn Kale’s life is going to go. I’m glad she got her happy ending. Jenn going ballistic at Agatha for binding her. Agatha really is the worst. But that’s why we’ve grown to love her!

Mon: Ok, so in the end, Agatha and the coven were simply the catalyst for Billy to become a witch. Is that the takeaway from the show then?

Ron: I want to say that’s reductive. Because it wasn’t just about Billy. This show was about Jenn getting her power back from the patriarchy and an agent of that patriarchy, aka Agatha. Lilia also got a happy-ish ending. She got the answer as to why she lived her life out of order and she got to save her coven in the process. And it was about Agatha finding the kindness in her own black heart to give her life instead of taking lives. Why Sharon and Alice had to die, I can’t tell you. 

Mon: You are kinder than I am. They should have closed the loop with Alice and said she’s going to be with her mom. Missed opportunity there. And Sharon — yeah, that was bad luck, I guess. 

Mon: Overall feelings about Agatha All Along? 

Ron: I loved disappearing into this show every week. It definitely had the energy and intrigue of WandaVision and was just as unpredictable. I loved the characters. The witches were all so layered and had incredible backstories that I would have loved to explore. 

Mon: The first seven episodes were a blast and I want to rewatch them. Even when some of the moments slowed, I was invested in this group of complicated and flamboyant witches. I loved a lot of the production design and the character dynamics. More than anything, I’m so glad we finally have more out and proud queer characters in the MCU. 

Ron: As much as I don’t like that this show ended up being a tool to introduce Billy to the MCU, he’s also a fascinating character that I’m feeling quite invested in. I want to see where he goes and I desperately want him to find Tommy. 

Mon: Agreed. At least Joe Locke is compelling to watch and Billy is already a conflicted character. That’s something to look forward to with the Young Avengers. 

Ron: Onwards to the Young Avengers indeed. But until then, we’re going to be singing the Witches Road song so much.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 5. Empire Waist Review

Empire Waist is a teen comedy-drama about loving yourself and your fat body, just the way your are. The Stereo Geeks fell head over heels in love with the empowering and heartfelt film. In this non-spoiler review, Ron and Mon share their thoughts on the film, why a film like Empire Waist is so needed, and what it means to see yourself represented onscreen.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Still from Empire Waist.

Ron: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks. Today, we’re reviewing the young adult comedy-drama, Empire Waist. I’m Ron. 

Mon: And I’m Mon.

Ron: This review will not contain any spoilers so feel free to listen and then watch the film. Because you’re going to love it! Empire Waist is written and directed by Claire Ayoub. The film follows Lenore Miller, played by Mia Kaplan, a fat teenager who has been told all her life to shrink herself and be invisible. But when she meets Kayla, played by Jemima Yevu, a fellow student who is proudly fat and fabulous, Lenore’s world is turned upside down, as is her confidence.

Mon: So, I had not even heard of Empire Waist till the team at Kino reached out to me, inviting me to the Digital Premiere of the film. I’ve also not heard of Kino, which is an app for streaming premiere events that include cast chats. It took one quick skim of the synopsis for me to be like, oh yeah, I need to check this out. 

Ron: I’ve been looking forward to Empire Waist since I first heard about it from fat activists I follow online. But I didn’t even know this film had already been screening in theatres. The last couple of months have been super busy but where on earth was the marketing? I thought it was going to be out later in the year. If I had missed this film, I would have been really upset. It’s still so rare to see fat characters on screen. To have a film that’s about being fat and taking joy in one’s fat body? I would have hated missing it. I’m so glad Kino reached out to you so we knew this film was available to watch.

Mon: Yeah, me too. I’m wary of high school films because it’s so far in the past for us, but what a lot of films and stories about any demographic gets wrong is that the story and feelings and growth should still feel universal. It should resonate with anyone and everyone watching. Empire Waist certainly does that. The focus may be on these teenagers finding themselves and getting over the hurdles high school, aka the world, throws at them, but their experiences are a microcosm of what we all have faced and do face. 

Mon: So, in the film, we’re introduced to Lenore through her closet of hidden clothing – clothing that she’s made. We learn along the way why these clothes are hidden and how important designing is, not only to her, but to the people who are about to be pulled into her orbit. 

Ok, let me rephrase that – once Kayla enters Lenore’s world, she’s like the freaking sun pulling people in. Kayla’s amazing. I love this character. But more than that, I love how Jemima Yevu plays the character. She’s loud, rambunctious, funny, sweet. If Yevu does not have this skyrocketing career in comedy and romance, I will be upset!

Ron: Jemima gives Kayla many memorable moments but there’s one that I absolutely adored. A fool tries to bully Kayla about her weight and Kayla does this incredible fake-crying-shocked face and is all astounded that she’s being called ‘fat’. I swear, the number of times I’ve wanted to have this exact reaction when someone comes up to us to talk about our weight. Do people honestly think fat people don’t know they’re fat? Like this fool is the first person to bring it to our attention? Making them feel small by overacting to that degree is exactly what they deserve.

Mon: That’s what I call a power fantasy!

Mon: And I want to talk about Ms Hall, played by Jolene Purdy. I mean, how can you not love this woman? First of all, she’s cute as a button with the best dress sense, but she’s so kind and invested in Lenore’s happiness. But, Ms. Hall is invested in a non-creepy way – she doesn’t push Lenore’s boundaries, she’s there to encourage her and be supportive. I love this character so much. 

Ron: Yes! I love Ms Hall. May we all get a Ms Hall in our lives. She’s so understanding and she just wants to build friendships among her students. She’s not at all pushy but she does tell the bullies off. Jolene Purdy was such a delight to watch in this film.

Mon: I gotta say, I can’t believe Mia Kaplan, the main actor (though in reality Jemima Yevu as Kayla is the star of this film), revealed that they’re an extrovert in real life. That does not come across in this film, and that’s down to some superb acting. Kaplan perfectly captures the brokenness of someone who hates themselves and wants to disappear. And you see how Lenore is changing with her voice and smile becoming bigger and more confident. Wow, what a way to carry a film. 

Ron: I think a lot of fat people will see themselves in Mia’s performance of Lenore. Kayla is very aspirational – she’s the fat person we’d all like to be, except for one horrible incident near the end of the film. But Lenore is how a lot of us went through life. The dark clothes, head down, no eye contact, introverted, terrified to express ourselves. I’m also surprised that Kaplan revealed they’re an extrovert. They captured introversion perfectly!

Mon: Yep, yep. And this is why you need more than one character representing an entire community in a story. No community is a monolith, and this film shows that. 

Ron: Watching Empire Waist made me realise why I had so little interest in teen films when we were teens. There was a dearth of characters who looked like us. So the stories we were being shown had nothing to do with our experiences or journeys. But this film, and excuse me for being corny, it made me feel seen. I heard dialogue in this film that I’ve heard my brain say to itself. I saw character arcs that reflected so much of my lived experience. I went through a journey watching this film that, as a fat person, we go through regularly. Loving yourself, hating yourself, wanting to be thin, accepting that fat is a body type that doesn’t deserve hate.

Mon: I love the central message of the film – about loving oneself as you are. We have dealt with that kind of message in a few other stories, but the people saying them… well, they’re usually these Hollywood types, with conventional shapes and looks. Now, I understand that anybody and everybody can feel insecure in themselves, especially in a society that is created to break you down, but there’s privilege in looking a certain way, and if only those people get to enjoy loving themselves as they are, then the message is still the same – you need to look a certain way to deserve to love yourself.

Ron: Let’s dig into that. Insecurity is built in, especially for women. Societal expectations of how women should look, act, do, and how much space they should take up? We all experience that. But the degrees to which we experience those expectations are wildly different when you inhabit a fat body. So many people in the world are trying so hard to fight against hate but it often feels like fat bodies are still acceptable to hate, to punish, to laugh at. Now, I’m not saying that the world is perfect for everyone else. But fatphobia is accepted, even encouraged, by many people. Even, maybe especially, in the medical community. Somebody who’s thin, or even mid-sized, doesn’t have to fear going to the doctor as much as fat people do. It’s these experiences that make insecurities as a fat woman so different than those experienced by straight-sized or even small-fat people.

Mon: Yes, and the cast mentioned that, especially Jolene Purdy, in the after-screening talk. Purdy has dealt with that bullying, but so has her daughter, from people and the medical community. Fascinating to hear that from someone who is on our screens – I mean, Purdy was in a huge show like WandaVision – yet, she still has to fight for her daughter’s rights as a fat child. Ridiculous. 

Ron: Another thing that I want to mention here, and I love how subtly the film addresses it, is that some people are just fat. Fatness is attributed to a moral failing, a lack of discipline, which is why it continues to be a bastion of hate. But human bodies are different. Some people’s bodies are thin, no matter what they eat or how little they exercise. Other bodies are fat, no matter how many small salads they eat or how often they exercise.

Mon: Yes, so it’s super interesting that the two main characters, Lenore and Kayla, who are both fat, mention that they gained a ton of weight as tweens – basically, they hit puberty and got fat. This is so important for people to see and hear. I don’t know what causes this to happen, but puberty, hormones, poly-cystic ovarian syndrome, all that strikes around 11-13. And it strikes female bodies. Nothing one does seems to get the weight off, and nothing keeps it off permanently. It’s a constant struggle, and there’s no shame in giving up, as both Lenore and Kayla do, because you’re doing more damage physically and mentally with the dieting and exercise, than not. 

Ron: Lenore and Kayla come from straight-sized families – they’re the only people who are fat in their families. And it’s impossible for their parents to understand their experiences because if you haven’t gone through the world as a fat person, your imagination can’t even begin to fill in the gaps of that existence.

Ron: One of the most interesting subplots in Empire Waist is the mother-daughter relationship. Lenore’s mother, Rachel, played by Missi Pyle, is a thin woman. She’s constantly working out. She has a strict diet and she controls Lenore’s food. As the film progresses, we get to understand where Rachel is coming from with this control – she’s basically doing to Lenore what her mother did to her. Except for Rachel, whatever she tried to do worked. Rachel is thin. She hates working out and diets but it’s worked for her. For Lenore, and so many fat people, it doesn’t work. And for Rachel, that’s not just Lenore’s failure, it’s hers.

Mon: Diet culture, man, the worst. Writer-director Claire Ayoub mentioned at the cast panel after the screening how early dieting leads to a lot of eating disorders for people. That’s what’s unhealthy. 

Ron: During the pandemic, I found a few fat podcasts that have really helped me come to terms with fat bodies and loving my body. Sadly, a lot of them have gone off air, but their episodes can still be found. I highly recommend Maintenance Phase, which is still going, but also Fatties Talk Back, a short-lived but excellent podcast about fatness and disability. One of the podcasts that is no longer on air was She’s All Fat. In a later episode, one of the hosts invited her mom to have a frank conversation about dieting when the host was a teenager. And the mother mentioned how she was just trying to adhere to the conventional wisdom of the time to stop her daughter becoming fat. But that caused a lot of pain. Empire Waist captured that very real story through Rachel and Lenore’s relationship.

Ron: I also want to mention the dad character. Rainn Wilson plays Mark, Lenore’s dad. He’s her champion. He’s the reason Lenore loves designing. He doesn’t want to restrict her eating or force her to work out. But he’s also unable to stand up to his wife. For all his love and affection for his daughter, he doesn’t intervene on her behalf. He still wants to be the fun parent – let Rachel be the bad guy. But it’s not a great way for a child to grow up – she’s getting mixed messages.

Mon: One thing I noticed was that the dude characters in this film, they’re kinda cowardly, right? They’re scared to stand up for anything, that was an interesting choice.

Ron: Lenore’s love interest, Charlie, played by Aric Floyd, is probably the only man with a backbone in this film. He makes some mistakes but he never causes hurt.

Mon: Yeah, Charlie’s mistakes are cute – he’s not offensive, he’s just a smitten kid.

Ron: Charlie also isn’t in positions where he has to stand up for Lenore or Kayla or their group. He’s by their side but there’s no active fighting involved. The other men though, when they’re asked to fight for the fat ladies, turn out to be complete disappointments.

Mon: Yeah, totally.

Mon: While watching this film I was thinking about the Rebel Wilson-directed film I watched at TIFF this year, The Deb. 

Ron: Yes, I wanted to see how you would compare Empire Waist to The Deb. I haven’t seen that yet.

Mon: I reviewed The Deb at WWAC – there are some similarities between the two. The Deb is also about young adults, bullying, dressing beautifully and loving oneself, but my issue with that film had been that we only had the one plus-sized character; everyone else was really thin or slim. I’d argue that Empire Waist is a step above so many other stories dealing with body positivity because the film intentionally casts multiple fat people as fat characters. I love that about this film. I mean, we meet Lenore in the first scene, but you and I literally gasped out loud when Kayla blasts through the classroom door, because, a) she’s the polar opposite of Lenore’s shy, cowed self, and b) because we weren’t expecting a story about a fat teenager to include… get this, two fat teenagers! 

Ron: Yes. Two fat teens in one film? And the Earth’s still spinning? Say it isn’t so! Jokes aside, when Kayla appeared, and yes, we gasped out loud, but how can you not? The confidence. The fabulousness. The beauty. We all wish we could be Kayla. But in all honesty, I wish we’d had a Kayla when we were in school. In a way, as you said while watching this film, we were lucky to have each other. I can’t imagine going through school as the only fat girl.

Mon: When you watch a film like Empire Waist, which has three fat characters wearing a range of amazing clothing and being very different people, and you’re like, wait, why isn’t this the norm? It’s so easy to have these plus-size people in the film. While Lenore and Kayla’s storylines are connected to being fat, their teacher Ms. Hall’s story has nothing to do with her body shape. She’s an amazing person and super-kind, and she just happens to be fat. We should have that all the time. 

Ron: We should talk about the clothes. After all, that’s the driving force of this film.

Mon: We should. A lot of them we wouldn’t wear, because there were a lot of dresses on here. But of course, that’s just us. We’re pants people – for the Brits listening, we mean trousers. But the colours and cuts, can’t argue with that. I’m not a fashion person, but we have always always always struggled to find nice clothes to wear, so this film is like a fantasy – your own personal tailor making you amazing clothes to fit your body. 

Ron: Yes. Show me a fat person, or a person with a disability who hasn’t struggled to find clothes. I’ve accompanied non-fat friends as they’ve gone shopping and have marveled at their ability to walk into any store to buy clothes. All they have to worry about is the design of the clothes and the price –  other than that, the clothing world is their oyster. Us? One store in the entire city. And the prices are through the roof. It’s like living on a different planet.

Ron: Watching Lenore make these beautiful, colourful clothes that perfectly fit her friends’ diverse bodies, it was cathartic. As fat teenagers, our clothing choices mostly were black and baggy, or the alternate choice, brown and baggy. We thought huge denim shirts were a godsend for the longest time! Colourful, figure-hugging clothes? Who could imagine such a thing?

Mon: I’m so glad our wardrobes have improved, but it’s an uphill, and annoyingly expensive, battle to fill our closets, even now. 

Mon: I keep trying to dig around for some criticisms of this film, and I’m blanking. Like, I loved Empire Waist so much.

Ron: I tried to put my critical thinking cap on. And I’m usually able to do that, whether I love a film or not. But with Empire Waist, I can’t think of anything I’d change. The dialogue is smooth, hilarious, heart-felt, and real. The chemistry between the cast is believable and enjoyable. I awww-ed so many times seeing Lenore and Kayla’s friendship blossom on screen. I think I finally realise why so many people are uncritical of films. When the majority of films are catering to your lived experience, you don’t need to be critical.

Mon: So true. I’m so glad we got to watch Empire Waist. But this isn’t enough. One movie that’s got hardly any marketing isn’t enough to showcase how important a story about plus-size people, especially women and girls, is. We need more – and we need more fat people in stories that have nothing to do with their fatness. It’s like that one episode of The Mandalorian that had fat people in it, and they weren’t hideous bad guys. I wrote about the importance of that episode for Huffpost, but there hasn’t been much change when it comes to fat representation in sci-fi and fantasy since that episode came out. I’d really love for films and tv to normalize fat bodies, because they exist and live and just go about enjoying life. Show that to people, because that’s the only way to humanize the invisible.

Ron: Go watch Empire Waist. It doesn’t matter what size you are, you’re going to get a lot from this film. But if you’re a fat person, you’re really going to love its message of empowerment and loving yourself just the way you are. Because you’re fat and you’re beautiful.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 4. TIFF 2024 Round-Up, Part II

In the second part of the Stereo Geeks' 2024 Toronto International Film Festival round-up, Mon reviews the documentary Vice Is Broke and the film The Luckiest Man in America. Ron discusses We Live in Time and The Salt Path.

For more TIFF film recommendations, find Ron and Mon's reviews at womenwriteaboutcomics.com

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Image credit: Courtesy of TIFF

RON: Welcome back to Stereo Geeks. Today’s our second round-up episode of films we saw at the Toronto International Film Festival. I’m Ron.

MON: And I’m Mon. Today, I’m reviewing the documentary Vice Is Broke and the film The Luckiest Man in America. 

RON: And I’m chatting about We Live in Time and The Salt Path. 

MON: Vice Is Broke is a documentary by Edward Huang, a former creator for Vice who was affected by the company going bankrupt. 

While I, like many others, have consumed articles and media by Vice, I didn’t know anything about its origins, its rise to being a formidable media company, and its eventual demise. So this was an insightful documentary for me to understand how Vice was so influential, and where it went wrong. 

RON: That sounds scary. 

MON: Honestly, a lot of this documentary made me see red. It explained how and why the US is in the mess it’s in now, though I don’t think that was the intention of the film. 

From the sounds of it, Vice was like The Wolf of Wall Street on steroids, especially in the early days. And then it got caught in the usual capitalism cycle, so, unless a person was a big gun they could literally work for years without the credit they deserved. 

I question some of the choices Huang made in the doc. He kept cutting to these random shots of the talking heads’ shoes or gestures. He also kept in shots of himself, I don’t know, it was like he was thinking or listening? They were incongruous. I’ve seen this being done in other docs or news items — but a lot of times these are just in there as fillers. Maybe the creators have another meaning for them, but they didn't mean much to me as a viewer. 

Huang also keeps harping on about how Vice was like Xavier’s School for Mutants — from the X-Men comics — because it was a place for freaks to be themselves. But he doesn’t take the analogy far enough to say that the school, while flawed, also has rules, regulations and a deep need to do the right thing. Vice, from what Huang suggests in Vice Is Broke, was just a place for dudes and ignorant people to be their worst selves and never get called out for it. 

The big problem with this doc is that Huang does an interview with Gavin McInnes, who was the founder of Vice before being ousted. Eventually, McInnes went on to found the far-right white nationalist hate group the Proud Boys. And this guy, he comes into the documentary with figurative guns blazing. He’s a disgusting, racist and incendiary man. I was literally cursing at the screen at the footage they showed of him. No wonder the US is messed up! 

So, when Huang is talking to McInnes, this guy purposely obfuscates everything Huang asks him about his beliefs. Now, mind you, the interview for Vice Is Broke is not about white nationalism, but there’s a throughline from the edgelord, lowest common denominator stuff that Vice peddled over the years, and the formation of the Proud Boys. You’d expect Huang to probe McInnes more, or at the very least, berate and belittle him for his ludicrous claims. Huang does not. It’s frustrating. 

But what’s worse is that, Huang, I felt, misunderstands how the likes of McInnes and eventual owner of Vice, Shane Smith, think. One doesn’t need to know them personally to know what leads to someone creating a bloodthirsty hate group, nor how their colleague pockets a yearly income of $100 million for a company that eventually dies and leaves its creators unpaid. They are greedy and crave power. That’s it. It’s not rocket science. I wish Huang had dealt with the insidiousness of this element of corporate greed and collapse more. 

Honestly, seeing some of the things I did in this documentary, I get why the US has such a warped view of itself and the rest of the world. Vice Is Broke put into perspective American media for me. It may just be one company, but if everyone wanted to be like Vice, it explains how their media has done a brilliant job of painting all the prejudiced nutters inside their borders as the cool outsiders and everyone outside their country as a gun-toting, drug-addled cannibal. I get it now. But it’s so scary to think that their people have been consuming these perspectives for years and now it’s too late to change it. 

Huang has a personal stake in bringing this story to light, but I also believe this story needs to be told, and who better than someone who was on the inside? 

Vice Is Broke is more of a foundational crash course into understanding how such a well-known and influential company imploded, and how the signs were there well before the plug was pulled. I hope there will be more investigations into the company, especially how its mostly-white executives purposely manipulated their coverage of other countries to make them look horrible and scary. Shameful company, and it’s probably just the tip of the iceberg.

RON: Yikes! Well, that’s eye-opening. Let’s go to a completely unrelated, but equally exasperating viewing experience, We Live in Time.

One of the reasons I wanted to watch this movie was because of the absolutely bonkers poster featuring the main cast and a wide-eyed terrifying carousel horse. Watching the film, I was shocked, shocked I say, that the horse had nary an appearance in the film. When it did finally show up, it was hidden by lens glare.

MON: That’s outrageous! The horse wuz robbed!

RON: The film itself is a charming love story about a couple and their life together. Except, it’s told out of order. Andrew Garfield plays Tobias, who works in marketing at Weetabix. The brand is name-dropped several times during the film. Florence Pugh plays Almut, a chef who’s also participated in several cooking competitions. 

Because the story is told out of order, we first see them already living in a comfortable routine with their daughter. Then we find out that Almut has cancer and it’s the second time she’s had it. The film hops between their journey through the tough decisions they need to make around her diagnosis and how they first met and fall in love. 

The chemistry between Garfield and Pugh is off the charts. This film would not work if they didn’t have chemistry but fortunately it’s so strong that they make for a believable couple. 

We don’t get to see much of Tobias’ work but we do get to see Almut being a chef and a competition she joins. These were my favourite parts. As with The Bear, I love watching fictional depictions of cooking. The food in this film is gorgeous to look at. 

So far so good, right? Wrong! 

MON: Oh no. Why, what happens? 

RON: If there is one thing I cannot stand in films is when characters act unnaturally. Unfortunately, this film has the characters end up in far too many unlikely situations, and they make the weirdest choices. Some of them just don’t make sense.

Look, I know that by dint of this being a film, it’s going to be contrived. It’s not real. But my suspension of disbelief can only go so far. Just as Almut is having contractions, they find that their teeny car has been blocked in by both sides. It turns out to be a false alarm, but when Almut is actually ready to give birth, they end up in a traffic jam and she has to deliver at a gas station. At one point, Tobias crashes someone’s baby shower to make a grand apology to Almut. Come on now! People don’t do things like that. 

MON: Yeah, this Hollywood trope of women always being in peril during labour is ridiculous. Eden had a really outrageous scene in it, but that might actually have happened. Who knows. 

RON: Yeah. Annoying. Almut also makes some wild decisions while undergoing cancer treatment which, honestly, leaves one to wonder if she ever felt appreciated in her professional ambitions. Like, my goodness, if you have to go behind your partner’s back for this stuff, what is happening in the relationship?

But what really put me off this film was some of the disturbing messages around motherhood. We already know that they have a daughter. Later in the film we see them as they’re first dating and Almut says she doesn’t want kids whereas Tobias does. They have a row but decide to continue the relationship and obviously they do have a child. 

Now this really bothered me because this is the constant narrative that’s shoved onto women. No matter how a woman feels about not having kids, people always say that she’ll change her mind. Because all women are just dying to have kids, right? When do we get to see the inverse? When do we get to see a female character saying she doesn’t want to have kids and then not having them?

MON: I can think of Starbuck in Battlestar Galactica, but yeah, that’s a frustrating trope. 

RON: This film somehow makes it worse. Almut used to have a female partner and they broke up because Almut didn’t want children but her partner did. And then she ends up wanting to have a child with Tobias. It’s literally that awful line that a woman will change her mind about kids if she meets the right man. Good grief!

Even worse, by choosing to ensure she can conceive a child in the future, Almut leaves herself open to a cancer relapse. So a woman should put her health and life in danger for the future possibility of conception?

Then, right at the end of the film, there seemed to be this undertone of women giving up their professional dreams to put the needs of their family first. Which was just the cherry on top of this horrible motherhood is supreme cake.

MON: Wowza! I am so glad I didn’t bother watching this film. That sounds yugh!!!! No thanks. You know it’s going to win all the acting awards right?

RON: Ugh, please. I don’t want to think about this film any more. 

MON: Not to worry, I’m here to distract you with The Luckiest Man in America! 

I was quite excited to watch this film. I love game shows, and I like films about game shows. Unfortunately The Luckiest Man in America turned out to be seriously disappointing.

The film is based on the true story of a man named Michael Larson, who was on a show called Press Your Luck and got on a record-breaking winning streak. Who is this man, how did he get on the show, and how was he this lucky? The film ekes out this information slowly as the episode shooting continues. 

Paul Walter Hauser plays Michael, who is in awe of the show’s co-creator Bill Carruthers, played by David Strathairn. Bill brings Michael onto the show despite his casting director Chuck (played by Shamier Anderson) warning him that something’s off about Michael. Other characters of note are game show host Peter Tomarken, played by Walton Goggins, and Sylvia, the runner/PA, played by Maisie Williams. 

My problem with the film was that most of the information was left out — it felt a lot like the creators took a ‘if you know you know’ approach to the storytelling. As someone who did not know, I was lost about the rules of the game or who the players in the story were. Without knowing who the characters were, I couldn’t understand their motivations or the stakes for them either. 

I wish they’d been clearer about how much of the shooting made it on screen. Is it one episode or several? Those technicalities tripped up the storytelling. 

RON: Oh man, that sucks. You were so excited for this film. 

MON: The film is on cruise control. It’s like the creators know what the ending is so they don’t attempt to ramp up the tension at all. The narrative has no rhythm and that’s where this film falls flat. 

Another weird grouse is that none of the wigs looked right. At first I thought it was just the one for Anderson and I was going to rage about the hair and makeup department not knowing how to treat their Black actors properly, but no, all the wigs looked bad. 

RON: That’s just bizarre. Tell me there was something good about this film?

MON: Yeah, all the performances are good, so it’s a real shame the film isn’t that exciting. Paul Walter Hauser is great as Michael. He gives Michael a standoffish and intense vibe without adding annoying affectations. But, Michael does have a particular way of playing the game, and Hauser manages to capture that affectation every single time. That can’t have been easy, but he was splendid in this.

Shamier Anderson is outstanding in The Luckiest Man in America. He has a smallish role, but he’s excellent. And he has such a striking screen presence. We need more of this man in Hollywood.

I’m so disappointed in The Luckiest Man in America. I’d have preferred a bad film over a disappointing one. 

RON: I couldn’t agree more. On a more positive note, let me end our round-up with The Salt Path.

Based on a true story, The Salt Path follows Raynor and Moth Winn, played by Gillian Anderson and Jason Isaacs, a couple who owned a farm and then lost everything. With their children away at university, the Winns make the impromptu decision to walk the Salt Path.

They have very little money to live of off—essentially, they get a £40 tax credit every month. And that’s meant to cover their food and camping needs, as well as any emergency shelter they may need. 

Neither of them has done much hiking in a while, and Moth has a degenerative disease that requires that he rest, not really possible when they’re hiking. But they persevere through the hardships and inclement weather, as well as the pain that Moth is constantly suffering, to find a kind of freedom and peace in nature that they hadn’t realized they wanted. 

They also realise how much they love each other when all the trappings of life are stripped away. 

MON: Awww. That sounds sweet. 

RON: Yeah, this was quite a wholesome film and absolutely beautiful to look at. There are so many shots of the ocean behind them as they’re walking up these steep cliffs. They find themselves in these verdant forests and fields. So much beautiful green. It really kicked my wanderlust into gear. There was one point when I wanted to jump into the film, the landscape was gorgeous. 

MON: Yeah, I feel you. 

RON: But nothing in this film made me want to go hiking and camping. Nope. I want to see beautiful nature but not if I have to deal with eating spaghetti all the time and not having access to facilities. 

MON: I’m with you there. 

RON: The Salt Path works well because the central couple have plenty of chemistry. Never in a million years would I have imagined Anderson and Isaacs in a film together but they capture the vibe of an old married couple. 

Ray is very much the pragmatist, checking their finances constantly, deciding what snacks they should and shouldn’t buy. She’s the cake police among the two of them. 

Moth is an optimist. He’s sure everything will work out. Or that they’ll figure out how to make it work. He refuses to be a fatalist. Even when he’s talking about death, especially his impending death, according to doctors, he’s not fatalistic about it. Things will work out. 

I’m still not sure why their house got repossessed. They mention something about an investment and having to take on someone else’s debt. Moth’s friend appears to have been the one who led them to this situation. But I’m not sure about the specifics. Doesn’t really matter but I was curious about it.

One part that did bother me was when Moth stops taking his medication. After some nasty withdrawals, he feels much better. He says his mind is clearer and his mobility and pain improves as well. I’m glad things worked out for Moth. That walking and the hiking diet helped him. But I wish there had been some message or at least a dialogue saying, don’t do this at home. Other people with this disease might be tempted to forgo their doctor’s orders and chuck their medication away. But that may not work out for everyone. It’s a dangerous message to share in a film. 

This film made me think about Nomadland. Because it’s a somewhat similar situation. Older people without a home or livelihood because of circumstances beyond their control. Far too many countries have no plans for their older populations. Either you have a ton of savings and a great pension, or you’re out in the street. It’s absolutely terrifying and enraging, despite this film ending on a very hopeful note. 

There is one funny part that I want to highlight. While Ray and Moth are hiking, people keep calling him Simon. They’re so confused about it. Then they ask him about his writing, and they’re even more confused. Eventually it’s revealed that the poet Simon Armitage is doing the same journey and people just assumed Moth was him. This was really funny because we had a poetry reading by Armitage back in Dubai talking about this journey. Felt very full circle to me.

MON: Wow, that’s certainly a blast from the past for us. I’m glad The Salt Path was a good experience. Sounds interesting.And that’s it for our two-parter of TIFF 2024 round-up reviews. We enjoyed our time at TIFF, and if you’re looking for more recommendations or opinions about this year’s TIFF films, head on over to womenwriteaboutcomics.com for the rest of our film reviews. Until then, see you next time.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 3. TIFF 2024 Round-Up, Part I

Greetings film lovers. The Stereo Geeks were recently at the 2024 Toronto International Film Festival, and they have some reviews to share in Part 1 of their TIFF round-up.

Mon chats about All We Imagine as Light and Aberdeen, while Ron takes on Jane Austen Wrecked My Life and The Listeners.

For more TIFF film recommendations, find Ron and Mon's reviews at womenwriteaboutcomics.com

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Aberdeen premiere at Toronto International Film Festival 2024.

MON: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks. I’m Mon.

RON: And, I’m Ron.

MON: In today’s episode, we’re reviewing a few films that we caught at the 2024 Toronto International Film Festival. 

RON: Yeah, we watched a bunch of films, and one pilot episode. We’ve reviewed them at Women Write About Comics and we’re doing a few reviews here. 

MON: We’ll have two episodes on the round-ups, and this is episode one. I’ll also mention that the reviews are spoiler-free, because, good, bad, or ugly, we don’t want to ruin your viewing experience.

RON: So, what are you reviewing today?

MON: I’ll be chatting about All We Imagine as Light and Aberdeen.

RON: Sounds great! I’ll be chatting about Jane Austen Wrecked My Life and The Listeners.

MON: All We Imagine as Light is based in Mumbai. The film focuses on three women — nurses and roommates Prabha, played by Kani Kusruti and Anu, Divya Prabha, as well as Prabha’s friend and colleague Parvaty, played by Chhaya Kadam. 

I’ll start off by saying that I completely misread the synopsis and went in with very different expectations for this film. The way the synopsis puts it, it seemed like All We Imagine as Light was a story about secret romantic love between women. That’s definitely not what it’s about! Imagine my disappointment. That doesn’t mean the film is bad — I was engaged through most of it, but then it lost the plot. 

RON: Oh no! I’m the one who recommended it to you. 

MON: Yeah, but it wasn’t all bad. Each character has a distinct personality and character arc. Some make more sense than others — Parvaty is full of righteous indignation and rage over being evicted from her home. Chhaya Kadam is a particular delight to watch as Parvaty in this film. 

Anu is young and grates against the confines of the life she’s stuck in. Plus, she’s pursuing a clandestine relationship that is unfortunately frowned upon among many in India. That relationship crosses religious lines, and this issue has got a lot worse in the past few years. I like that the film doesn’t lean into tropes of hate crimes, though.

Prabha was the one character whose story was a little too abstract. I mostly got it — it’s about being apart from a loved one and what happens when distance seems to destroy a relationship. Unfortunately, I couldn’t gauge what her arc was supposed to be — she was central to connecting different parts of the story but seemed less of a character herself. 

One thing I particularly enjoyed was the acting in All We Imagine as Light. It’s so natural. And I love that the director and editor Payal Kapadia and Clément Pinteaux, let the actors perform without unnecessary cuts and edits, or overlong gimmicky oners. You feel like you’re in the room with these characters because the actors make their characters’ actions so believable. Yes, the cook is going to keep cleaning while she’s talking, but she will stop and gesticulate wildly when she’s venting. Yes, Prabha will keep her eyes on the fish so it doesn’t burn, but can’t help but stop and look at her roommate who’s made a frustrating request of her. I absolutely love that about this film. It’s so easy to get lost in the story because you are part of the story. 

RON: Yes, this reminds me of how I felt about another Indian film at this year’s TIFF, Superboys of Malegaon – the acting was so natural. I’ve written about it at WWAC.

MON: And, the cinematography by Ranabir Das is stunning as well. You can feel the heat and sweat from the crowds in Mumbai. You see the dark dinginess of the unkempt buildings. But, when the story moves to the seaside village in the final act, the camera perfectly captures the verdant forests, the dark caves and the beautiful beach side. And yet, it doesn’t forget to showcase that India is mostly a hot country, and with it comes flies and insects. 

RON: It doesn’t sound too bad. Where did it go wrong?

MON: Two-thirds of All We Imagine as Light was riveting to watch but the third act dragged on for way too long, and honestly, I felt it didn’t know how to end. The ending posits solutions that aren’t sustainable beyond the credits of this film. After spending nearly two hours immersed in such a gritty and realistic reality set to the languid pace of real life, the contrivances in the third act take away from that immersive experience. So my lingering impression of the film is that it was a suspenseless and tedious watch, even though most of it did a wonderful job of capturing the everyday life of these three women.

This is a mostly accomplished film and I love that Indian films are spotlighting everyday women and their needs and wants and desires. All We Imagine as Light is not perfect but it’s still nice to see stories with multi-dimensional female characters. 

RON: Well, from one disappointment to another. I was looking forward to watching Jane Austen Wrecked My Life. This sounded like such a sweet film. A disenchanted woman failing to find romance because of the influence of Jane Austen novels. 

Agathe, played by Camille Rutherford, runs a book shop in France but hasn’t been able to find her own Mr Darcy. When her best friend of ten years, Felix, played by Pablo Pauly, enrols her in the Jane Austen Residency in the UK, Agathe reluctantly agrees to go in the hopes of kickstarting her novel. And just as she’s leaving, she has a romantic moment with Felix. 

But at the residency, Agathe meets Oliver, a descendant of Austen. He’s played by Charlie Anson. They don’t hit it off at all and chafe against each other’s existence until they don’t. 

United by their ineptitude at life—Agathe calls herself the Palme d’Or of losers—they fall in love. Classic love triangle.

MON: Ooook. This sounds complicated. 

RON: Tell me about it. I really liked the first twenty minutes of this film. The characters were interesting and the dynamics between Agathe and Felix, as well her sister who she lives with, felt very strong and believable. Then Agathe and Felix kiss and the vibe just changed.

Yes there were funny moments after but I was so confused by what direction the film wanted to go. Agathe and Felix are the embodiment of the best friends-to-lovers trope and the first act spends a fair amount of time setting up why they’re great friends and could possibly be great partners. There’s such an easy camaraderie between them and they have a thorough understanding of each other. 

Felix is a commitment-phobe and Agathe is living in fantasy land and they both get it. But then Felix is gone for the majority of the film and that connection fizzles out. 

Agathe tries and fails to write at the residency, all the while trying to navigate her complicated feelings for Oliver and Felix. I wish the film had picked a lane—either the best friend becomes the romantic partner or the dark brooding stranger who is basically Darcy brought-to-life fulfils Agathe’s fantasy. Having both muddled the story and made it feel like the movie was just trying to get to its plot milestones without setting the groundwork for those moments.

MON: Booo! I was really excited for this film. 

RON: I know you were and that’s why I was. I also felt let down by a couple of plot points just being dropped. Agathe has trauma from her past but it’s mentioned a couple of times and that’s it. If it doesn’t inform her actions in the rest of the film, why have it in there at all? 

I also got very confused by the timelines. The trauma Agathe suffered was six years ago but she’s been having romantic difficulties for two years. So are those two events connected or not? And when and how did Agathe realise that Jane Austen was the reason for her unfulfilled fantasies?

I was left disappointed in this film. Especially when the end basically wrapped everything up in a neat bow. The ending felt rushed and underserved the characters.

MON: Yikes! Well, I’m happy to report I’m about to discuss a film that didn’t disappoint. Aberdeen is not a film about Scotland. It’s a wonderful, hard-hitting story about navigating life as an Indigenous person in Canada, and the film, rightfully, received a standing ovation at its premiere at TIFF. 

In the film, Aberdeen is a Peguis First Nation woman who's having a seriously rough time. She’s played by the truly phenomenal Gail Maurice. Ron, you may remember her from Night Raiders, which was at TIFF a few years ago, and still one of my favourite TIFF films.

RON: That’s amazing. I love Night Raiders. Tell me more about Aberdeen. 

MON: We meet our protagonist when she’s asleep in a drunken stupor on a park bench. The police treat her as less than human when they try and wake her up. She’s arrested almost immediately for being drunk and disorderly, and while she’s rambunctious and nonchalant, this latest arrest hits her hard 

Her brother, Boyd, played by Ryan Black, wants to wash his hands off her, especially as he’s struggling with some bad news and he’s had to give up the care of his great niblings due to his personal issues. 

But Aberdeen’s struggles have only just begun — she’s lost her IDs and most of the film is a crushingly painful look at the unfair and unjust hoops that people from Indigenous communities and nations have to jump through to prove who they are and where they come from to a bunch of white bureaucrats. 

It’s a heartbreaking and heart-wrenching story about just how much colonialism has continued to affect Indigenous communities in Canada. The bureaucracy of having to prove who you are to the people who stole your land is… horrifying. 

The film employs humour but never lets you forget that the situation that Aberdeen is facing is anything but amusing. The story and dialogue did feel stilted at times, but it’s telling the real struggles of people who’re quashed under the boot of colonialism, so if it wants to be pointed and on-the-nose, then let it!

Aberdeen ends on a note of hope, but unfortunately, also a message that you have to play the game and work within the system even when you’re angry. It’s an unfair battle, but that’s the battle you’re stuck with. 

RON: Wow. This sounds like a must-watch.

MON: It is. Co-writer and co-director Ryan Cooper wrote Aberdeen 10 years ago, and he based a lot of the film on his own experiences and those of people he knew. At the premiere screening I attended, Cooper even talked about what hell it was when he lost his IDs once. 

I wasn’t surprised to hear that all their first-choice actors signed on to act in the film. I love that veteran actor Billy Merasty, who plays Aberdeen’s friend Alfred in the film, said in the post-screening Q&A that he loved how utterly gay his role was and how being gay in Winnipeg is not as big of a deal now as it was before. I’m delighted to hear that!

Merasty also said that all the characters in the film are named after streets! That’s a nice bit of trivia for everyone. 

I’m so glad I went to the world premiere of Aberdeen. The standing ovation and emotions in the crowd had to be felt. Listening to the directors and cast get emotional about how their own experiences informed their performances was not something I would have wanted to miss. 

I hope people throughout Canada watch this and learn just how unjust the settler society is to the people whose land Canada was made on. 

Ron: That’s amazing. I hope I get to see it. Turning to a very different topic, I caught the first episode of The Listeners at TIFF. It was a press screening. When I came haring in looking for a seat at the screening, I was unsure if this was even a real thing. I couldn’t find it on the internet. There’s another film called The Listener which also has Rebecca Hall, but it wasn’t the same story. So, I was relieved when I found a line of people waiting for it. 

The Listeners is about a schoolteacher, Claire, played by Rebecca Hall, who starts hearing a distracting humming noise. Nobody else can hear it and people don’t believe her. Her husband, Paul, played by Prasanna Puwanarajah, is understanding but he can’t quite get it because there’s no evidence. Then Claire finds that someone else also hears the sound and that connection brings her solace but also begins to unravel her life.

MON: Sounds like a strange premise. What did you think about it?

RON: I really enjoyed this! I’m looking forward to watching more if it comes to Canadian television. I’m pretty sure I had read about people in a small town or village in England who were hearing a humming sound that others couldn’t. Not sure if that was a hoax or if this show is based on that story but I like the concept. 

The first episode has these undertones about the medical community and not believing women. It’s not a huge part of the story but it did strike me. Claire has to advocate for herself quite a bit to get the tests she needs. But what does a person do when they know something is different, even wrong, about them but they have nothing to back up their feeling? And there are physical manifestations from this hum—Claire gets headaches and nose bleeds, and she can’t sleep because of it. Since nobody can understand what she’s going through, that obviously makes her cranky at school and with her friends and family. 

I feel like the show kind of captures what people with chronic illnesses or chronic pain go through. Nobody else really knows that something is always hurting so you have to keep living your life but sometimes it gets too much and you can’t keep being on your best behaviour. I don’t know if I’m reading too much into the episode or if all these layers were intentionally woven in. If it’s the latter, kudos to the creative team because I got all of that. 

Of course, because it’s a British production, the story doesn’t go in any of the expected directions. For most of the episode, one student is a real thorn in Claire’s side, Kyle, played by Ollie West. He’s got his headphones on in class, he keeps falling asleep. He’s a nuisance. 

So guess who’s the only other person in town who can hear the hum? Kyle!

What I found really interesting is that Kyle has been on this journey for longer and he’s already been doing his own investigations. He’s as relieved as Claire is to find a fellow listener. But Claire immediately shuts down any connection because she’s his teacher and they cannot engage with each other outside of class. 

Eventually they do because they’re looking for answers but I liked that the show reflects society as it is now—it’s weird for teachers and students to hang out beyond the boundaries of school because so many teachers over the years have done absolutely horrid things. I can see this particular plot point going places in upcoming episodes. We got a short preview of the rest of the season and Claire trying to solve this mystery with Kyle is going to bite her, for sure.

And I hope to see what happens next. Fingers crossed the show comes to a channel or service I can access!

MON: Well, that was truly unexpected. 

And that’s all for Part 1 of our TIFF 2024 round-up. See you next time with more TIFF reviews.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 2. The Acolyte Eulogy

In crushing news, The Acolyte has been unceremoniously cancelled after only one season. The Stereo Geeks present to you their eulogy for this Star Wars show that was arguably their favourite in the live-action pantheon. But, Ron and Mon don't always agree about what makes the show great.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Ron: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks.

Mon: Today’s episode is a eulogy to the short-lived Star Wars show, The Acolyte.

Ron: We barely knew you! But we will never forget you. I’m Ron.

Mon: And, I’m Mon.

Ron: I’m going to start us off by saying that I’m really angry The Acolyte has been canceled. I’m upset, yes, but I’m mostly furious. This show deserved a second season. People of colour and women deserve to see more entertainment that centres them.

Mon: I don’t know how to feel, to be honest. I feel like we’ve been robbed of a show that’s so smart and so achingly clever, as well as being effortlessly diverse. But, I had my reservations about a second season – I definitely wanted the show to continue, but I had mixed feelings because my favourite characters would likely not be there. 

Ron: Am I the only one on this planet who straight up didn’t notice that the show was “diverse”? I just saw a show with interesting characters. 

Mon: I didn’t think about the diversity either, especially not while watching it. But I couldn’t not notice it when I began writing my review for WWAC, which will be out soon.

Ron: The diversity is impressive! The only people who could have a problem with it are problematic, narrow-minded morons. But more on that later.

Ron: You've mentioned that you weren’t sure about a season two. A lot of amazing characters were lost in season one, but I honestly think another season would have given us even more Jedi to love.

Mon: That’s a positive way to look at things. I guess I really miss the characters, so I am not ready to move on from them. But I know I would have had we got another season. 

Mon: We’re going to head into spoiler territory right now, so if you haven’t seen the show, this is it, this is your chance. 

Plot

Ron: By now, most people probably know the story. I’ll share my first impressions. I was hooked from the opening scene. Carrie Anne Moss as Jedi Master Indara exemplified cool. She is completely at ease against her unknown assailant, dodging every move, predicting the next step. It’s only when she sees who the assailant is that she’s stumped and that’s the end of her. 

The rest of the premiere follows the Jedi as they try to uncover the truth behind Master Indara’s murder. A Jedi murder mystery. How absolutely amazing is that? I was in love. 

Ron: I will say that the entire show wasn’t a Jedi murder mystery. But that wasn’t a bad thing. The Acolyte introduced a ton of lore and built so much more of the Star Wars universe. We got to see the Witches, progenitors of the Night Sisters. The power of two theory plays a huge part in this story, and we’ve seen how Force dyads work throughout the films.

Mon: It took me a minute to warm to the show, mostly because the first episode is one of the weakest, directorially speaking. It’s not paced well, and it promises a setup that it abandons pretty quickly. The story that it abandons the mystery for is really gripping, but I wouldn’t have minded a murder mystery. 

Ron: That’s so bonkers that the first episode felt weak to you. I was enraptured! 

Mon: Wow. We’re usually of the same mind. This is so weird.

Ron: And, I actually do think the murder mystery angle paid off. But the show takes a very long-winded way to solve the mystery, and along with it, we get this whole other story about a Sith lord looking for an acolyte.

Mon: Yeah, that makes sense. Things picked up from the second episode, which is really well done barring the final duel, which again, isn’t well-paced. 

Ron: Wait a second. Why didn’t the episode two duel work for you? 

Mon: The duel says a lot about the characters, but it lacks an urgency that the story suggests should be there. 

Ron: Perhaps I was so taken with the show, the pacing didn’t bother me. I liked that the pacing gave us time to observe and feel the moment.

Mon: So, it’s funny, but, the pacing really bothered me when I first watched it, but the issue was practically non-existent when I rewatched it. This show, and I don’t really know whom to blame, is not made for a weekly rollout; it’s made for a marathon-watch. The structure of the story doesn’t take the ebbs and flows of weekly viewing into account. If you’re on a high from the previous week, you’re going to need something mind-blowing the week after. That’s not how The Acolyte was made, which, I think, may have worked against it. But, when you watch it as a whole, I swear, this is the best thing I have ever watched!

Ron: Fascinating! I do feel like a lot of TV shows are crafted like that. Or, rather, they’re designed as a film that’s cut up into shorter episodes. Hence they make for better marathon viewing and you get episodes where seemingly nothing happens. I didn’t mind, but the crybabies on the internet couldn’t handle it.

Mon: Well, Disney is obsessed with tv shows being one long movie, so the pacing goes awry when you make it that way and then cut it up for a weekly feed. That being said though, even in the episodes of The Acolyte where nothing happens, so much happens. It’s outstanding. The writing on this show is unbelievably good.

Ron: It doesn’t help that people have no patience and get annoyed with a show because they have to wait a week or more to get their answers. An episode like “Teach/Corrupt” feels meaningless to certain viewers but it’s actually packed with character dynamics that set up the remainder of the plot. But you’ve got to have at least a modicum of intelligence to understand that.

Mon: You’re not wrong. How dumb are people that they don’t realize the answers to their questions will arrive in the next episode. This show brought out the worst in people. 

Ron: For me, The Acolyte captured that feeling of watching WandaVision. So many mysteries to solve. So many Easter eggs to find. We’d watch the episode and go online and people would be losing their minds at the newest reveals or a shocking death. That’s what television is all about.

Mon: The intricate details of this show – not taking into account the Easter eggs and references – are so brilliant. The way the clues to the story are littered throughout the show, and how someone is reacting or doing something plays out is really extraordinary. 

Ron: Exactly! Everything matters in this show. The way Sol looks at something. The confusion on Yord’s face. Vernestra not reacting to information. It all matters in the end. But you’ve gotta watch the damn thing for answers!

Fan Reaction

Ron: So, I guess we might as well get the horrid part out of the way. The so-called fan reaction to the show.

Mon: There’s no such thing as a Star Wars fan. They’re just bigoted, racist, sexist AHs. I cannot stand the discourse around anything to do with Star Wars. You and I love Star Wars, but there’s no point in calling ourselves fans, because that is the most toxic group of disgusting luddites that anyone can encounter. 

Mon: I cannot, for the life of me, understand the blatant hate for this show from the first episode onwards. It makes no sense other than the obvious – which is misogyny. It makes me want to scream. Yes, The Acolyte has issues, but this is the best Star Wars live-action show out there, it’s better than Andor, a show that everyone loves, but one I felt really underserved its protagonist, who happens to be Mexican. 

Ron: It’s racism and misogyny. We see it over and over again and it’s unbearable. For us to see a Star Wars show full of people of colour and women. We feel seen for the first time. But despite there being a plethora of tv shows and films with white men in the lead, the fact that there is one show with people of colour evinces this much hate.

Mon: But this hate is causing real damage – we are constantly losing entertainment where the story doesn’t focus on cis white able-bodied dudes. We’re stuck in a cycle that will not be broken because the biggest entertainment companies in the world, like Disney and Warner Bros., will cave to the stupidest common denominator. I just can’t….

Characters

Ron: Enough about those awful excuses for humanity. The Acolyte was filled to the brim with characters that I instantly fell in love with. I want to talk about everyone!

Mon: I wasn’t sure what we were getting into with these characters, but they piqued our interest with little hints to their personalities and their histories. And the writing was well-matched with a lot of great performances that got us invested in these characters. 

Ron: Yord-Horde, what’s up! The instantaneous love for Charlie Barnett’s Yord Fandar gave me life. This Jedi Knight is such a stickler for the rules, he even steams his Jedi robes. What is not to love? I appreciate how quick Disney was to share BTS videos of Barnett talking about Yord and his goofiness. They really made us fall in love with Yord.

Mon: Love Yord. He’s certainly a stickler for rules, and that makes him seem boring, but he gets the job done. On the rewatch, I realized he has a chip on his shoulder – it seems that he hasn’t conquered his fears yet, and the other characters remark on that. It’s the layers to this character that really leave us wanting more. 

Ron: I missed that about Yord’s fear. A Jedi whose afraid? Dang, no wonder he’s so stuck up.

Ron: The character who stole my heart was Jecki Lon, played by Dafne Keen. I was excited to see her again after her incredible breakout role as Laura Kinney in Logan. And she was excellent on His Dark Materials. But Jecki is just a sarcastic ray of sunshine in this show. Every scene, she’s a delight to watch. She’s so mean to Yord, and their relationship was hilarious to watch. But she’s got a soft side to her. The way she talked about becoming one with the Force, it was so wise and comforting. And those lightsaber moves! We’ll talk about the duels in a bit.

Mon: I love Jecki! She’s snarky, but she’s so kind to Osha. I was certain they were setting up a romance between Jecki and Osha – those two had amazing chemistry, and like… Osha takes the time to watch Jecki train before saying goodbye. So adorable! 

Ron: I would have loved a romance between Jecki and Osha. The chemistry was palpable.

Mon: And Jecki had the best fight scenes. That energy, those smarts. I could have watched Jecki in combat forever!

Ron: We have to talk about Osha. And Mae, of course. You go first because I believe we’re going to disagree.

Mon: So… I really struggled with Amandla Stenberg’s performances as Osha and Mae. I felt they were unable to bring any emotion or expression to their characters, and that left me unable to understand who these characters were or how they actually felt. 

Ron: Okay. We’re going to disagree. Do you remember when Arrow Season 1 was out? Everyone went after Stephen Amell because his Oliver Queen was too wooden. And I never felt that because I understood why Ollie lacked emotion.

Mon: Should have known you’d bring that up. I never had an issue with Amell’s performance in Season 1 of Arrow, because it was obvious he was restrained and, honestly, just didn’t know how to fit back into his old life. But that’s the key – it was intentional, or at least came across that way. Here, with Stenberg, I think they’re going for restrained, but they’re all over the place, and they don’t react to anything that’s happening to them. 

Ron: That’s exactly it though. I think Stenberg’s performances are intentional. They’re a huge Star Wars fan and they’ve particularly shared a long-standing fondness for Anakin Skywalker. I believe Stenberg knew when to emote and when not to. It was subtle but there is a very distinct change in physicality between Osha and Mae. I was so impressed by it because the first time we meet Osha, it’s just after Mae’s murdered Master Indara. And I immediately knew this was a different person than the murderer. Osha holds herself so differently than Mae does.

Mon: We’re going to have to agree to disagree here, because I felt that they missed the mark. I’ve watched the show twice now, and they don’t convey their characters’ emotions at all.

Ron: Oh no. I don’t want us to disagree! I really freaking loved Stenberg’s performances. Osha’s far more emotive than Mae is but she’s got that restraint that comes with Jedi training. But Mae’s primary emotion is anger so we don’t get to see her emote anything else.

Mon: Wow! How am I missing this? What is happening? There is a divergence in the Force and it ain’t good!

Ron: Hahahahaha. I think it becomes even more clear as we’re getting to the end of the show. When Osha and Mae switch places, by that point, they’re both questioning their past and their understanding of what happened. And the physicality starts to change but also the way they express themselves. By the final scene, Mae is relaxed and emotional, and she’s crying. But Osha is holding herself up and taut, refusing to let her emotions slip out. It’s like she’s unburdened her lightness into Mae and taken the dark side on. It’s so clever! But perhaps it was just too subtle?

Mon: Subtlety is not lost on me. I just don’t think they did a good job. But you know who did? Lee Jung-jae!

Ron: I think Master Sol, played by Lee Jung-jae, might be one of my favourite characters in all of Star Wars. In just 8 episodes, we got to see this extremely nuanced, flawed, deeply empathetic Jedi master who did something very wrong with the very best of intentions. The kindness on his face when he sees his padawan, Osha, I knew right then that I was going to love this character. He brought the serenity that we associate with Qui-Gon Jinn but with the pathos of Anakin Skywalker. Even knowing what he did, and it’s unforgivable, absolutely, I still love this character. He had an incredible arc. That final scene, when Osha is force choking him and he lets her, he accepts his fate, it was so emotional and moving.

Ron: Lee Jung-jae was phenomenal in this role. He learned English in just four months so he could play this character. To emote so beautifully and effectively in a foreign language. You can see how much he loves this universe!

Mon: Lee Jung-jae is so amazing that words cannot describe how wonderful he is in this role. He carries so much knowledge about his character’s past, present and future in his expressions from the very first episode onwards. It’s honestly mind-boggling. Sol in the first two episodes is written and performed to make you fall in love with him. He is a master like no other. He is a person so kind, so caring, it’s like, why can’t we have such loveliness in our real world? 

Mon: And then the other Mynock drops, and you learn the truth about Sol. 

Ron: There was so much foreshadowing! But I still hoped the truth wouldn’t be as bad. It was worse.

Ron: There are a lot of people who were upset that their new favourite character turned out to be a bad guy. But I think that’s a reductive reading of Sol. Everything he does in the present is to make up for his mistakes in the past on Brendok. He’s constantly working to redeem himself, and that’s what makes him a Jedi, not a Sith. I mean, Anakin Skywalker murdered Sandpeople and Jedi younglings and he still got redeemed.

Mon: What Sol did was wrong, but only because we saw the story from his victims’ points of view first. If we were following the Sandpeople, Anakin is probably the boogie man they tell their kids about all the time. But that’s not the angle we got; with Sol, Indara, et all, creator Leslye Headlund, intentionally wanted to give us a different point of view from the Jedi’s.

Ron: What a clever story decision. To show us the Witches’ way of life, the love that Aniseya has for her daughters and then to show us what the Jedi did to them.

Mon: Over at Soundsphere, I wrote about how the show challenges how we perceive the Jedi, but it doesn’t change our knowledge of them. It’s bizarre that so many people took umbrage to how The Acolyte depicted the workings of the Jedi, when we’ve witnessed, several times, that they have been taking Force-sensitive children away from their families forever, that they have an almost cult-like need for their followers to stay in line, or else they’re seen as a problem. The Jedi are hardly perfect, but while genocide isn’t in their mandate, it’s not like they’re not known to commit atrocities – either as part of the Clone Wars, or when their people go rogue, like Anakin did with the Sandpeople. 

Lightsaber duels

Ron: Unfortunately true. The Jedi are only the heroes of their own stories. But we can all agree that the coolest thing about the Jedi are their lightsabers, right? And that The Acolyte had the best lightsaber duels since the prequels. The energy, the speed, the range of techniques, the ferocity. This is lightsaber duelling!

Ron: Look, I know a lot of Star Wars fans want to move away from the Jedi. We got nine films in the Skywalker trilogy. It’s a bit weird for the fate of an entire galaxy to be tied to one dynasty, whether they’re blood-related or not. Which is why people wanted to move away from lightsaber-wielding Force-users. Then you get films like Rogue One which are mind-blowingly relatable, political and impactful, and there’s not a Jedi in sight. The Mandalorian and Andor also didn’t have Jedi in them – that’s changed for Mando, of course.

But I don’t think the problem is seeing more Jedi. We just need different Jedi, different eras. That’s exactly what The Acolyte gets right. We go a century into the past, the High Republic era, the Jedi reign supreme, no Sith in sight. And bam, now you’ve got Jedi at the top of their game, with skill levels that wowed us during the prequels.

Mon: People are never happy. Lightsaber duels are the best – when done well. We need more! I would love to see more Jedi. And we need a variety of personalities, like we had on The Acolyte. They can be a cult of emotionless monks, and still be interesting. Three trilogies and a bunch of animated shows already proved that was possible. 

Ron: What more proof do people need? But the lightsaber duels in this show are truly to die for. See what I did there? Maybe the fight between Sol and Mae wasn’t as well-paced, but when the Jedi go up against the Stranger? That’s edge-of-your-seat stuff. Jecki’s moves, her quick-thinking. You just know she would have risen up the ranks of the Jedi in no time had her life not been cut short.

Mon: Episode 5 is when I sat up and took notice of this show. I was like, okay, these people are not messing around. They’re doing something different here. They’re making an entire episode one long fight scene. They’re not scared to kill off our main heroes. They mean business!

Ron: What really impressed me is that Star Wars is over fifty years old. And yet, we get The Stranger, with his creepy-as-hell mask, made of Cortosis that shorts out lightsabers, and his moves are unlike anything the Jedi have ever seen. Considering this is the High Republic era where the Sith are basically unheard of, the Jedi must have felt like they were meeting a nightmare.

Mon: Sol even says to the Stranger that you’re using a Jedi weapon but you’re not a Jedi. These are Jedi who’ve mostly known peace, a killer like the Stranger is unfathomable to them. 

Ron: I got chills when Sol said that! And it got me thinking about something. We as the audience know about the Sith, but the Jedi in the show don’t. It’s really difficult to keep up the suspense and the stakes when the audience knows more than the characters. I spoke about this in a previous episode of Stereo Geeks about Dark Matter, the Apple TV show. There’s a reveal to the audience in the first episode that the characters take up to episode three to work out and it was painful to watch. The Acolyte worked from the same playbook but managed to ramp up the tension and build an atmosphere of fear for its protagonists. We keep saying it but this show is so clever. By the way, Dark Matter has been given a second season. But not The Acolyte.

Mon: Where’s the justice!

Twists

Ron: Speaking of the Stranger, what was a bigger twist? That Qimir was the Stranger? Or that he killed the wonderful Jecki Lon?

Mon: Jecki being killed was a bummer for me, so not much of a twist. But Qimir being the Stranger was like whaaaat! And it was so freaking clever, because I remember, we were watching the episode the first time, and I had just asked you if Qimir was still stuck hanging upside down and then pow, he’s the Stranger. I thought to myself, no way!

Mon: Part of me was like, but of course! Why would they cast Manny Jacinto and give him the role of a smarmy supplier? I mean, that can’t be it! Give me a break. They were smart. I didn’t see it coming though. My jaw dropped!

Ron: But Star Wars has cast big names in tiny roles before. Poe Dameron was going to die after two scenes until JJ Abrams realised he was too hot to die. 

Mon: Wait, is that true about Oscar? He was too hot to die? Because he totally was. 

Ron: Okay, so I may be embellishing a bit. But that’s totally what happened. Too hot to die. Yord, sadly, did not get that same treatment.

Mon: I feel you. Yeah, I do wish Yord and Jecki and Sol and Indara had survived. I love these guys so much. Yord and Jecki live on in a YA book. Indara too. Not sure when we’ll see Sol again. 

Ron: After they killed Jecki, I thought to myself, you’re going to let Yord live, surely? We deserve one of them to live. But nope! Yord’s neck saw the wrong end of the chiropractor’s twist.

Mon: Funny. That’s Yord humour, I’m sure of it.

Ron: Thank you. I aim to make him proud. Well, Sol doesn’t make it to the end of the season either. He gets killed by Osha. And Vernestra puts the blame on him for everything. The ignominy!

Mon: By the finale I figured that Sol wouldn’t make it. It was the final blow because I somehow still wanted him to. But, again, the showrunners know that you know what’s going to happen, so the finale is not about his death – it’s about us seeing the bleeding of a kyber crystal, and it’s about the Jedi protecting themselves, to such an extent they’ll drag one of their own through the mud. This show is gut-wrenchingly smart. 

Ron: Was anybody else squealing when the kyber bleeding happened? Because that was such a cool visual. I’ve always wondered about Sith blades, because I like Sith lightsabers, so this was a spiritual moment for me.

Mon: I did not know seeing a bleeding kyber was something that was so important to me, but apparently it was. Apparently, a stolen Jedi weapon is the only way a Sith can own a lightsaber – they must bleed the stolen kyber crystal to wield it. 

Ron: Ooooh, I love these details!

Ron: I will say, I really wanted Sol to live. Not just because he’s my new favourite character but also because I wanted to see him pay for his crimes. That would have been interesting to see. What does Jedi justice look like? Because in all of Star Wars, we’ve seen a lot of justice dispensed via lightsabers.

Mon: That’s such a good point. I agree.

Score and song

Ron: We do mention this a lot but we love listening to film and TV scores. I couldn’t wait to dig into The Acolyte’s score. Mostly because that Power of Two song by Victoria Monét was stellar!

Mon: I love that Power of Two song. When I did my rewatch, that was the one post-credits episode that I watched all the way through so I could listen to the full song. I need to add it to all my playlists. 

Mon: I haven’t heard the score. Just a tune here and there. Is it good? 

Ron: The Power of Two is such an addictive song. But the score itself is lovely. There are some throwbacks to familiar Star Wars tunes but for the most part, Michael Abels has constructed a new score. Part one of the score, episodes 1-4 had a lot of outstanding pieces. ‘Teacher and Student’, ‘An Acolyte’, obviously, ‘Combat in the Courtyard’, and my favourite is ‘Under the Bunta Tree’. I can’t wait for you to listen to this score!

Mon: I’ll give it a listen soon. 

Cancellation 

Ron: Obviously we’re upset by the cancellation because it’s a Star Wars show and we love to spend time in that universe. But for me, while I was watching it, I was so amazed that this show with this story and cast of characters existed in my lifetime. That I got to see it unfold every week for eight weeks and share in the joy and surprise of it with you and other fans. The fact that we won’t get another season, and if the loudmouths have their way, anything else like it, is what makes me feel so gutted. Life is tough and entertainment is our only escape. But that escape is being denied to only select groups, while others have so much made just for them. I know I sound bitter, but that’s how I feel right now.

Mon: I feel you. As I said, I wasn’t sure how I’d approach a second season, because I wasn’t all that invested in the characters who were left, but I was dying to get back in this world. I am so annoyed that anything slightly different from the norm gets squashed. And why? Because the loudest idiots don’t know how a weekly television show works and that women and people of colour love and can create art that’s smarter than these loudmouths? Man, I just don’t have the words for this nonsense. 

Favourite Moments

Ron: Instead of wallowing in sadness, let’s relive some of our favourite moments from the show.

Mon: Some of my favourite moments… honestly, it’s tough, because there are some detailed hints to what’s happening or going to happen, that take this show to another level. But, a few things I loved were:

Sol in the first two episodes - absolutely the kindest, loveliest human being. He will steal your heart.

The Stranger reveal - devastating as we’re still reeling from the murder of Jecki. And the Stranger’s catty comment about Sol bringing a child to a fight that eventually led to her death, gutwrenching. 

The two-part episode directed by Kogonada. It’s divided into episodes 3 and 7, and my word, they are so perfectly directed to give you two completely different storylines. Truly brilliant work. 

Ron: I’m not sure if it counts as a favourite moment but it’s the moment I knew this show would be so much better than I had hoped. When Master Indara was killed. I was sorry to see the end of her but her demise signalled that nothing was as it seemed. I knew I was going to love this show from that very moment.

Mon: Fascinating. Expect the unexpected with this one.

Ron: Other favourite moments would be every time Yord and Jecki were in a scene together. You could see how much they hated each other’s guts. Hilarious. That dynamic would have been a joy to see more of. But we are getting a YA novel, which I’m going to nab the moment I see it.

Ron: So, I mean, I don’t mean to be horny on main here, but the Stranger dipping into the pool while Osha is watching. That’s a universal favourite moment, right? I said it so you don’t have to. But we’re all thinking it.

Mon: You’re hilarious. But you’re not wrong. 

Ron: Would I be cheating if I said all of the finale? Because the entire finale is a favourite of mine. Every single second is incredible, unexpected, and a gut-punch. Love it to the moon and back.

Mon: That’s high praise coming from you. 

Ron: It had everything! Sol’s death, the lightsaber bleeding, the sisters coming together and then deciding to part ways. Vernestra being the worst and putting all the blame on Sol. And we haven’t even mentioned David Harewood’s Senator Rayencourt, who was taking the Jedi to task about their mysterious ways. That scene between the Senator and Vernestra was such an indictment of the Jedi way. I didn’t expect it and I was honestly, blown away by the tension. Also, David Harewood owns every scene he’s in.

Mon: I’m not the biggest fan of Vernestra, but she’s got a good PR brain. Can’t fault that woman’s crisis communications abilities, even if it means throwing her dead friend under the bus. 

What we would have loved to see in a season 2

Mon: Had we got a second season, I would have loved to see more of the Jedi. Maybe some actual investigations and mysteries? I would also have loved to see them veer away from a boring hetero romance between the Stranger and Osha – because, I could not see that, they had no chemistry. Plus he’s toxic and she’s lost – we’ve seen this dynamic before, in the Reylo stuff. That’s a no for me. 

I think the show would have actually been gay if we’d got a second season, as well. But so much for that. 

Ron: A second season would have seen Rayencourt tearing the Jedi to shreds on the senate floor. And then he would mysteriously disappear and it would somehow be Sol’s fault. 

Mon: Yes. Yes. I see it. 

Ron: Also, Master Yoda would be implicated in the cover-up, which would explain why he’s been straight up lying to the Jedi for another 100 years.

Mon: Can you imagine having to remember this many details for 100 years? I’m pretty sure Yoda just deleted this hiccup in his history. 

Ron: Yeah, you’re probably not wrong. 50 years from now he’s like, Vernestra who? What is this Sith you speak of?

Mon: Don’t we know it!

Ron: Okay, I think we lightened the mood, despite the crushing disappointment we feel. I’m going to be happy that we got one season. We got incredible, multi-dimensional characters who made us feel all the emotions and whom we’re going to miss. I can’t remember the last time I fell so instantly in love with new characters. I’m so glad The Acolyte exists and that we got to see it. Bring on the extended universe literature.

Mon: The Acolyte is my favourite live-action Star Wars show, so yeah, this sucks. But at least we have this one season, and hopefully some tie-ins that we can enjoy.

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 5, Episode 1. Deadpool & Wolverine - Spoiler Review

The Stereo Geeks are back with Season 5. And we've got a big review this time: Deadpool & Wolverine. Ron and Mon had mixed feelings about the film. There's a lot of fun to be had but this film isn't nearly as good as it could have been.

In this spoiler-filled episode, we discuss the moments we enjoyed, areas where the film could have been improved and what we think this film means for the future of the MCU.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Ron: Hello and welcome to Season 5 of Stereo Geeks. We’re kicking off this season with one of the most highly-anticipated films of the year: Deadpool & Wolverine. I’m Ron.

Mon: And I’m Mon.

Mon: For our review of Deadpool & Wolverine, we’re going to start with a non-spoiler review and then move into spoilers. We’ll let you know when the spoilers are coming. 

Ron: Shall we open with our anticipation levels for this film? I was filled with trepidation.

Mon: I was stoked. I mean, I knew what I was getting into — R-rated, lowbrow humour, a lot of gore, generally silly stuff, but I guess I was really missing seeing a Marvel movie on the big screen for this long, so I was excited!

Ron: I’ve found that over the last few years, I just don’t have the stomach for certain kinds of humour. I will turn it off. I found the humour in Deadpool 2 so cringe and the jokes dragged on for so long, it was honestly frustrating. I was concerned that this film would do the same, hence the trepidation.

Mon: I feel you. Deadpool 2 was bad. It was dull and boring, and the humour didn’t work. So, that was a concern going into Deadpool & Wolverine. Also, Ryan Reynolds now has so much clout that I had a feeling it would impact the quality of the end product. 

Ron: True. Reynolds does get in his own way. Having said that! I really, really, really, really wanted to see Wolverine. Especially in that gorgeous yellow suit. I rewatched all the X-Men films last year, except the Deadpool films, and I finally saw the appeal of Wolverine. Wolvie starts off as this gruff man with no interest in connections, and he slowly transforms into a man who cares too much—about Jean, Storm, Charles, Rogue, even Scott in some way. I don’t think I appreciated that before because I was more interested in everyone else but Wolverine. But yes, by the time I finished Logan, I was a certified fan and completely in my feels. The thought of seeing Wolverine again after so many years, I honestly couldn’t wait.

Mon: I really should have re-watched the X-Men films, because I think the moment’s gone now, especially with X-Men ‘97 Season 1 stealing my heart. I was interested in seeing Hugh Jackman back as Wolverine, for sure — maybe not as excited as you though.

Ron: Right. I don’t think anything X-Men-related has captivated us like X-Men ‘97 has. But did Deadpool & Wolverine meet your expectations, if not your hopes?

Mon: Yes and no. As I said, I knew I was going into an irreverent film with lots of bawdy humour and violent action. That’s what we got. But I expected to bawl my eyes out at the sight of any X-Men, and that didn’t happen. That’s on me, why did I think a Deadpool film would make me cry?

Ron: Ohhhh. I didn’t expect that at all so I saved myself that disappointment. It wasn’t like watching Days of Future Past where I was losing my mind every other second. It didn’t help that I found the first half of this film so very slow. It dragged, honestly. There were so many scenes that felt overlong—the same problem that I had with the second film! The whole focus of this film was to get to Wolverine but it took so long to get there. The moment Wolverine appeared, the dynamic of the film changed. There was an energy to it and Deadpool finally had someone to riff off of who wasn’t going to take his nonsense.

Mon: I’m sure there was more improv in this film than they’re letting on, because my word, every joke started off ok and then was dragged to death, which not only kills the humour, but brought the pace to a stuttering halt.

Ron: Agreed. At numerous points, I was like, please just get on with it. Or, we get it, you’re trying to make this joke. There’s repetition for humour, and there’s repetition because you’ve run out of ideas. This film thought it was doing the first, but kept doing the latter.

Mon: Any momentum the action scenes gave us just disappeared because of the extended stand-up routines interrupting them. And like, the action here is brilliant! It’s some of the best we’ve seen in the MCU in a long time. Slick and sexy — great camera angles, perfectly edited, and they conveyed a lot about the characters’ personalities despite essentially being a gore fest. 

Ron: The action was amazing in this film. It starts off with a huge action scene. I know Deadpool 1 did that, and really set the tone for that film. I can’t, for the life of me, remember if the second film did the same. Also, Deadpool dancing during the opening fight scene made me very happy. I love dancing and somehow seeing a superhero dance warmed my heart.

Mon: I love the opening credits fight scene. It’s definitely a thing in the trilogy, but this one looked particularly fantastic. And Deadpool’s suit — chef’s kiss to the design team!

Ron: Good point. I’m so in love with Wolvie’s suit, I didn’t even think to mention that Deadpool’s suit looks stunning.

Ron: One more thing to add about the opening sequence. Do we all remember the vitriol about She-Hulk dancing? Do you recall people responding, saying if Deadpool was doing this, people would be claiming it as the best thing since sliced bread? That’s exactly what’s happening! People are loving Deadpool dancing. I want to give Marvel credit and believe that they added it in just to highlight this dichotomy in reactions but I don’t think that’s what’s happened. But the sexism amongst fans is just infuriating.

Mon: She-Hulk does everything that Deadpool does but without the gore. But because she’s a female character who was introduced later in the franchise, she is criticized instead of lauded. It’s sexism and misogyny plain and simple. Fact is, She-Hulk broke the fourth wall in comics before Deadpool was even a thing. It doesn’t help that she was highly sexualized — because dudes created her — so she didn’t find her audience properly till later on.  

Ron: True. True. We’ve probably got to mention that Deadpool & Wolverine is extremely gory. Like, whoa, from the opening scene, it’s just blood and guts everywhere. 

Mon: Too much gore. 

Ron: Did the gore bother you?

Mon: Uh… not to the extent that I had to look away. Because I was expecting it. I get gratuitous violence is the thing that Deadpool fans are looking for, but I wouldn’t have minded them toning it down a tad bit. 

Ron: Right. I expected it to be much worse than it turned out to be. I tell ya, some of the preview trailers before the movie started grossing me out, which is probably why Deadpool & Wolverine didn’t bother me. 

Mon: Ah! You were inured to the actual film by then, huh?

Ron: You could say that! Also, I’ve spent this year watching stuff like Shogun; I should be used to gory scenes by now.

Mon: You know what actually annoyed me? The dick jokes. Ufff… that was really too much. Like, get over it, man! Enough with the butt shots and the butt slapping, etc. Who in this film wasn’t making some weird joke? At least, they could have varied the types of jokes. You can tell that 5 dudes wrote this film. There are a lot of in-jokes and references, but other than that, it’s a 12-year-old boy’s idea of being edgy. 

Ron: I know we’re expecting Deadpool to be foul-mouthed, but this movie pushed the limits for me.

Ron: But speaking of dick jokes, this film leans into homoeroticism. Lots of scenes with Deadpool and Wolverine physically close together. Male and female characters show romantic interest in both Deadpool and Wolverine. What did you think about that?

Mon: I clean forgot about the homoeroticism. It’s again, very much in the vein of hint-hint-wink-wink, we’re being naughty because we can, and very little to do with actually appealing to queer audiences. 

Ron: Yes. Despite Deadpool being hailed as a pansexual character, he’s really not been great representation for the queer community.

Mon: Exactly. So, what did you really like about this film? 

Ron: Wolverine. I’m very distracted by his presence. But if I look past Wolverine I think I liked that this movie reiterates that people can be better than their worst day. It’s the one bad day idea from Batman, isn’t it? Joker has one really bad day and becomes a villain. Bruce Wayne has one bad day and he becomes Gotham’s hero. It’s similar here. Wolvie had a bad day and made a terrible decision but that doesn’t mean he can’t be a hero. It’s about the choice to do good.

Mon: Yeah. I really liked the theme of the story — it’s not about what a hero is or wants, but why a hero is. I loved that. It gave Deadpool a roundedness that I didn’t know I wanted to see. I also loved how the film uses the ending of Logan as a foundation for telling the story, as well as saying goodbye to pre-/non-Disney Marvel films.

Ron: I realise I wasn’t concentrating on Deadpool at all. I’m going to have to go with your summation. 

Mon: I really loved Hugh Jackman stepping into the role of Wolverine like he’d never left. He loves this character and we love him playing Logan. I did feel he wasn’t moving as well as before, which is expected since he’s a lot older, but man, the pathos, the burden, the complicated tragedy of being Wolverine in any world, but especially his world, it all came across with little to no context. The writing and acting shine when it’s centred on Wolvie. 

Ron: Not moving as well? What? He was great. He looked great. He fought well. I know he’s been working out like a mad man. And he’s going through a divorce. None of that came across. He was great! The lovable grumpus to Deadpool’s sometimes annoying goofiness. Standard roadtrip fare except with spandex. 

Mon: There were definitely one or two scenes where Jackman wasn’t moving that well so we can agree to disagree. My last thought on this is — it takes a lot to keep a straight face and look grumpy when you’re in a goofy movie with a goofy co-star, and Hugh is so dang good at doing that in this film. 

Mon: Before we start on spoilers, do you have a one-line review that audiences should consider before heading into this film? 

Ron: Go for Wolverine, patiently wait for Wolverine, enjoy watching Wolverine.

Mon: For me, I felt like there was a perfect film about what makes a hero hiding beneath the surface of Deadpool & Wolverine, one that got drowned out by the terrible quip-fest created by the egos involved. 

Ron: Wow, we went for completely different vibes with our one-line reviews.

Ron: Anyway. Let’s move into the spoiler section of this review! If you haven’t seen the film yet, please watch it now because we will spoil everything!

Mon: Deadpool & Wolverine is about Deadpool trying to save his world from temporal annihilation and he needs to find Wolverine, any Wolverine, to ensure his world’s survival.

Ron: Please explain to me why we’re following Deadpool from Earth 10005? There’s no Deadpool on Earth 616? And who is his Wolverine? Not the one from Logan, right? I got confused because I thought the TVA was after Deadpool because he went back in time to change his past and save Vanessa, played by Morena Baccarin in a tiny, thankless role again. But that’s not why the TVA wants Deadpool; it’s so that he can save the anchor person, a new concept introduced in this film.

Mon: Ok, so it seems that the Fox X-Men franchise (and the rest of the 20th Century Fox superhero movies) are set in Earth-10005. Hence, Deadpool is from that universe. Logan is also set in that universe, so Deadpool’s universe is disappearing because of Wolvie’s sacrifice. But, Mr. Paradox, played by Matthew Macfadyen, wants to speed up the destruction of Earth-10005 and hence he brings in Deadpool. 

Mon: There’s understandable confusion about where Deadpool is from because early on in the movie he’s on Earth-616, talking to Happy Hogan about joining the Avengers. It seems like he used Cable’s time-traveling device to get to the Sacred Timeline. Time travel and dimension-hopping aren’t one and the same, and I don’t remember exactly what rules the previous film established about the device, but we do know that Deadpool came to our Earth, in the past, and shot Ryan Reynolds in the head so he wouldn’t make Green Lantern — so we know he can dimension hop. Now, how he knew about 616 and the Avengers, I don’t know. This is more a nod to Deadpool idolizing Steve Rogers in the comics than a fleshed out story idea. 

Ron: Thanks for the explanation! But I am confused about one other thing. Deadpool and Wolverine get sent to the Void by Mr Paradox, who uses a time stick to disintegrate them. We’d been to the Void before, in Loki Season 1.

Mon: Yeah, that’s odd for me too. Because, wouldn’t that mean a lot of dead people in the Loki show are actually alive and wandering the Void aimlessly? 

Ron: Exactly. And why are so many mutants there? Cassandra Nova apparently was kept there since childhood, but Psylocke, Toad, Deathstryke, Sabretooth? What did mutants do to deserve this?

Mon: Variants, mate. Notice how most of these mutants/Morlocks don’t look like the ones we’ve met in the films before. 

Mon: There are some aberrations in the mutants, obviously, like Dafne Keen’s Laura, Aaron Stanford’s Pyro and Tyler Mane’s Sabretooth. 

Ron: Yes, exactly! That’s what confused me. I was also wondering about Johnny Storm. He mentions that Reed had a theory about the Void, so did the 2005 cast get yeeted to the void when Fan4stic came out?

Mon: I didn’t think of that, but that makes so much sense. 

Mon: Essentially, the creative team are telling us that these people, especially the ones we recognize, are part of worlds that no longer exist — because the Fox era has now ended. That’s also the same for the unproduced and finally cancelled Gambit film, so we see Channing Tatum here, and the wish fulfillment one like the Cavrilline with Henry Cavill. It’s all symbolic, mate. 

Ron: Okay, that makes so much more sense now. I couldn’t figure out why these characters had been banished to the Void. Please explain the Cavillrine to me. What the hell is this?

Mon: So, the Cavillrine — you know how the internet latches on to good-looking white guys who they feel have been hard done by? Well, Henry Cavill is one such guy. Look, he’s been through the wringer with Warner Bros. He was Superman in some of the worst Superman films out there. Then the whole Snyderverse nonsense that heralded the end of the DCU. But then he showed up in Black Adam and it seemed like he was back. Except, he wasn’t. It must have been pretty humiliating for him to announce his return as Superman, only for the rug to be pulled from beneath him. Sure enough, the moment the DC door closed on him, the internet fancast Cavill as every single superhero you could think of — one that caught some steam was Henry as Wolverine. Till this movie, I couldn’t see it, but you know what, Henry looked kinda cool as Wolverine here. But it only works as a two-second gimmick, I don’t think he could carry a franchise as Wolvie. 

Mon: Did you figure out who it was before he turned? I knew it wasn’t Hugh Jackman, because we initially only saw him from the back, but I really couldn’t have guessed who it was till I saw Henry. 

Ron: No, absolutely not. It looked like Wolverine from Origins, especially with the bike. So I was wondering what Deadpool was making such a fuss about. And then he said ‘Henry’, and when Cavillrine turned around, I realised who it was. But I had no idea that Cavill as Wolvie had been on anybody’s wishlist so it was just an odd moment for me. Also, the editing was weird because they were trying to drag out the moment.

Mon: Yo, let’s not skip over Channing Tatum as Gambit. Can we talk about it? I was so disappointed to see Tatum, I thought it was Taylor Kitsch reprising his role from X-Men Origins: Wolverine, but it turned out to be Tatum. Booo. I don’t think he did a bad job — he works as a joke. But this isn’t our Gambit, is it?

Ron: I don’t really know what to say about Tatum as Gambit. It was a joke. It was meant to be a joke but I don’t understand how a film can have a Gambit, any Gambit, and not give him some level of pathos. Such a strange choice. Moving on!

Mon: Let’s also talk about the anchor being concept. Was it even needed? Some people are getting upset about this concept because it means that some lives are more important than others. This is a completely new thing introduced in this film — while I don’t know if we can take it seriously because this is a Deadpool film, some people are saying it’s already been hinted at being used in the next phase of the MCU. 

Mon: Either way, here’s my thought. Don’t take things so literally, people. The concept is introduced as symbolism for how Fox pinned their hopes on Wolverine launching a franchise, and for a bit it worked. Bad writing, bad studio decisions, then took it all down. 

Even beyond that, the idea that the universe is rigged so that the majority are doomed because of one white guy is… hilariously on point and a reflection of the real world. In truth, some lives are treated as more important than others and it’s horribly unfair. I don’t think the film is trying to be that deep, but it sure feels that way. 

And finally, the main reason for Earth-10005 dying is that Logan was never supposed to die. He acted against type, against nature, and that’s why things changed. We explore a similar theme in Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse, but there it’s the canon events, and it’s more personal. This isn’t a hugely original idea, but it certainly works for the symbolism of this film. 

And it’s very clever to bring in the TVA and have B-15 from the Loki show connect to the events of the Loki finale. It’s utterly poetic — Loki, a villain, makes a heroic sacrifice which saves the multiverse, here we learn that a hero, Wolverine, makes a heroic sacrifice that leads to the destruction of his universe. And a hero and villain combined then save it. It’s wonderful! 

Ron: Thank you for tackling the anchor being idea. I was not bothered by it but I guess others were.

Mon: I know we’ve critiqued the pacing already, but I need to emphasise just how disappointing the pacing in this film makes the viewing experience. 

Ron: But somehow The Marvels was the end for all women in superhero films? I can’t help but compare this film with the ones that we loved and were vilified. People complained about Eternals being slow and full of exposition, to the point where we will never see those characters again, apparently. But this film is packed with exposition and nobody’s complaining about that!

Mon: Oh, I agree with you. Seems like the MCU dies every time a non-white non-male person comes near it, but it’s saved when the white dudes are involved. Quality be damned.

Third act

Mon: Let’s chat about the third act of the film because I think this is the best part of the film — good execution, pacing, and some surprising heartfelt moments. It’s not all perfect, there’s still way too much unnecessary silliness, and yes, it’s super gory, but it was also riveting. 

Mon: That denouement, especially, really got me. They really play with your emotions because we think Wolvie is going to make the big sacrifice play, which makes sense for him having lost everyone, but then Deadpool decided to be the better man and swaps places with Wolvie so he can finally matter. And then, Wolvie joins Deadpool, because Deadpool didn’t think things through and couldn’t reach the other MacGuffin. I mean, I loved it.

Ron: I don’t mean to be a spoilsport but the denouement felt silly to me. 

Mon: This is an outrage. How are we not aligned on this film?

Ron: I agree with everything you’ve said, I just don’t think the film had to go there. Obviously there was only going to be one way to save Deadpool’s universe and he had to be the one to do it because this movie is called Deadpool & Wolverine, not the other way around. So why not make the sacrifice play together in the beginning? Cement the relationship that we’ve spent two hours watching unfold.

Mon: You make a really good point. They were trying to up the drama. 

Ron: Indeed. But again, my struggle with this film and the second film was that it kept adding in extra beats that weren’t necessary. Destroys the emotional heft and slows the pace.

Ron: Now, you and I have always had our ears out for film scores. The last few years, the scores have left us wanting. There might be a theme or two that stands out but the entire album? Not so much. I did like some of the score for Deadpool & Wolverine, though. Deadpool has a new theme which sounds epic, though I’m confused about the cat screech in between. There are no cats in this film.

Mon: I didn’t clock much of the score while watching the film, except the end credits music which sounded cool. I’ve heard the score album now, and I kinda dig it. Though the cat screech still gives me pause.

Ron: What about the soundtrack? I know you have thoughts!

Mon: Most of the song choices seemed totally incongruous to me. Some of them are such meta jokes, that it’s lost on the average viewer. For example, there’s apparently a song from The Greatest Showman in here, which is an obvious nod to Hugh’s role in the film, but  I don’t know how many people would even recognize it. The first fight scene between Deadpool and Logan in the Void is set against AC/DC, and I’m like AC/DC, again? Give me a ruddy break. They’ve been done to death in the MCU, look for someone new. I mean, look at the number of awesome songs and artists we’ve learnt about and listen to because the music supervisors on Black Panther and Birds of Prey looked beyond the usual.

Ron: Lets not forget the soundtracks of the Spider-Verse films. Those are incredible.

Mon: How could I forget the Spider-Verse films. I play those albums on loop. 

It wasn’t all bad with Deadpool & Wolverine, but I didn’t find the soundtrack all that memorable. The one song choice I did like was Bye Bye Bye by *NSYNC. I do enjoy the song, but this is another meta joke. In X2: X-Men United, when Wolverine is rescuing Rogue, Iceman and Pyro, Pyro puts the car radio on and it blasts Bye Bye Bye. It’s a hilarious moment that cuts the tension and solidified my love for the song. So, of course a film re-introducing Pyro should have that song. Except, they don’t play the song in relation to Pyro. Like, why? Imagine if Pyro had driven in with this ruddy song playing? Oh my word, we would be on fire! This film, I swear, is so frustrating. 

Ron: Madonna’s Like A Prayer playing over Logan’s abs though. That was perfection. 

Mon: Music aside, you can feel the too-many-cooks-in-the-kitchen feeling whenever Dogpool shows up, or the fact that Dogpool showed up at all. What is Dogpool trying to show us here? It’s just a funny bit. That time could have been spent with Wolverine and Laura, because if you want us to see that Logan’s walls are coming down, him opening up to Laura and coming to fight by her side would have done a much better job of that than a dang dog. 

Ron: I could have done without the dog. 

Favourite Cameos

Ron: We’ve got to talk about all those cameos because Deadpool & Wolverine was packed with them. For me, the numerous Logans were great to see. The brown and yellow suit Wolverine, I would’ve loved to see more of him.

Mon: I did not know that Deadpool & Wolverine was Fanservice: The Movie, but I loved seeing the different versions of Wolverine. Honestly, could have done with a few more of those variants — I don’t think that would have been overlong. I loved that they included Age of Apocalypse Wolverine, but I wish he’d been a tad more sinister. 

Ron: You know who wasn’t a cameo in this film? Taylor Swift as Dazzler. That is the only thing I’ve heard about for months and it didn’t even happen.

Mon: Thank Uatu! I don’t think I could have dealt with that. 

Ron: The survivors of the Void were probably the biggest cameos for me. Seeing Jennifer Garner as Elektra and Wesley Snipes as Blade, unbelievable that they came back for this movie. Which is essentially a farewell to these versions of the characters. I’m assuming we’ll get to see Elodie Yung’s Elektra in the MCU. No idea about Mahershala Ali as Blade because Marvel would rather give 80 million bucks to RDJ than make a Blade movie apparently.

Mon: Yeah, and Wesley Snipes says in this film that there will only ever be one Blade, so I’m guessing Mahershala Ali’s chance is gone. Why don’t they just announce it and leave him be. Marvel’s pulling a DC on Mahershalla. 

Mon: Ok, please explain why we didn’t get any other X-Men characters from the Fox films? Someone, anyone would have done. Worst Wolverine has this heartbreaking flashback, and he’s next to memorials with no names, he’s talking about incidents we can’t see. Listen, Hugh sells it, I’m not saying he doesn’t, but given that the film was packed with cameos, some utterly useless ones, Wolvie interacting with the people he loved would have taken the emotions to the next level! 

Ron: I know! Halle Berry is right there. Especially during those emotional scenes from Worst Wolverine. We should have got a flashback to him seeing the X-Men.

Ron: I guess we should mention Johnny Storm. Or rather Chris Evans. Because that was not Johnny in the film. It was Chris Evans with flame powers. Ever since Endgame, I’ve felt that Evans has struggled with his acting. Ghosted was funny but terrible. You watched that film at TIFF last year where you couldn’t tell if it was the character or Chris Evans you were watching.

Mon: Yeah, Chris Evans is forgetting how not to be Chris Evans, which is not great. The TIFF film, for our listeners, is Pain Hustlers, and it’s not a good film. Chris Evans’ acting is the least of its problems.

But, on to Johnny Storm. I 100% knew Evans was going to show up. I didn’t know before the film, of course, I wasn’t expecting any cameos in the film. But, when Deadpool is shown the Avengers highlights reels by Mr. Paradox, there was a lot of Steve Rogers in there. Now, this is a nod to comic book Deadpool’s love for Steve, but as soon as I saw them playing that much Evans footage, I was like, he’s going to show up.

Ron: When the hooded figure showed up and Deadpool was talking about he was the hero of all heroes, I was so lost. Who is this? Definitely not Captain America. And then Evans shows up. But as Johnny. The bait and switch wasn’t bad but Evans acting didn’t work for me.

Mon: It didn’t? But he was so fun! You can tell Evans is having the time of his life with this take on Johnny Storm. I genuinely did not realise the Human Torch, of all characters, would be resurrected. He was incredibly fun to watch. I loved seeing Evans back in the MCU, even if it was for a brief minute.

Ron: Not resurrected for long, sadly. While we’re talking cameos, which characters deserved better in Deadpool & Wolverine? Shatterstar, surely? Why can’t Hollywood give Lewis Tan better roles. He has no lines in this film! And Shatterstar is such a fan-favourite character.

Mon: Shatterstar! I love him. I can’t believe Lewis Tan was dragged back to sit in the background. He deserves so much better than Hollywood will ever give him. But, you know what, after the dumb dig about how the X-Force team not testing well (apparently), I was glad to see Shatterstar, even for a little bit.

Ron: And why did Cable get the blame for Deadpool 2 not working out? He wasn’t the problem! Deadpool was the problem. Sheesh. 

Mon: Please, I’m glad we didn’t have Cable in this film, but why did Domino get short shrift? 

Ron: What’s worse, though? Domino sitting in the background somewhere with no lines, like Shatterstar, or us imagining she’s living her best life without Deadpool in it?

Mon: You have a point. I also wish the main franchise cast had been involved in the main story more. Negasonic, Yukio, Vanessa, Dopinder, CGI Collussus, Blind Al, why were they forgotten? This was Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania all over again. Like literally - Deadpool is even stuck in a different world like in that film and forms different teams. The MCU is running in place, mate!

Ron: Yes. Agreed. You can’t just drop the core cast you’ve been building up for a trilogy. I’d also say I was expecting more Pyro in this film. Aaron Stanford was clearly excited to be back and he’s been posting about it. He’s in the opening credits as well. But Pyro’s role was so small! And I’m not entirely convinced this wasn’t James Cole with the ability to control fire. 

Mon: Pyro! I thought I’d cry when I saw Pyro, but I didn’t. And then it turned out he was again a double-crossing baddie? Again, everything about the writing in the MCU, especially by majority white creatives, is running in place. Imagine Pyro getting a heroic sacrifice here? Considering we see no one else from the Fox films, I feel like the treatment of Pyro is a testament to Marvel Studios basically dunking on the original franchise.

Ron: Pyro being a turncoat isn’t a big surprise. Stanford sold it well. He was quite amusing in his final scene.

Ron: But what about Cassandra Nova, the actual villain of this story? First of all, where were the women in this film? We got a bit of Elektra and Laura but wow, this movie is just screaming that it’s only for dudes. Wolverine is probably as popular as he is because of female viewers, but this movie clearly doesn’t want to acknowledge that. 

Mon: But this lack of regard for the female characters and heroes from the Marvel films is signposted from the start. Happy Hogan’s office is filled with Avengers memorabilia, as long as the memorabilia belongs to Iron Man and Captain America. Is there more? Can’t see it because the camera doesn’t focus on them. Let’s be honest, Marvel doesn’t care about the ladies, they never have, and it’s little more than lip-service nowadays, irrespective of how wonderful the stories about the ladies are, they’ll be forgotten by the powers-that-be.

Ron: Yes. The only meaty non-dude role was Cassandra Nova. I thought Emma Corrin turned out to be a great choice. I felt like I could almost see Charles Xavier in Cassandra.

Mon: I know nothing about Cassandra Nova, and I was concerned about them casting such a young actor to play the character. Isn’t Nova elderly? 

Ron: Nova is Charles’ twin but she’s… there’s some weird stuff about her birth, or lack thereof. So she’s quite wrinkled but not elderly. She’s definitely not as beautiful as Emma Corrin. 

Mon: Ah. Kinda weird how all these films keep turning wrinkled ladies into gorgeous women – Madame Web, Cassandra Nova. 

Ron: How can dudes have an ugly woman in their film? The more we’re talking about this film, the more annoyed I’m getting.

Mon: Anyway, Corrin did great. They channeled both Patrick Stewart and James McAvoy to make us believe that Nova is indeed Xavier’s twin. I loved that they had a binder on and got to proudly show it off. And the binder also gives their outfit an X shape, which is a nice nod to Nova’s X-Men connection.

Ron: Yes. I did like the nod to Corrin’s non-binary identity in Cassandra’s uniform. Underneath her signature long coat, Cassandra wears a binder. And it’s not hidden. Emma Corrin has spoken about the importance of visible identity and has taken intimate portraits of themself in a binder. So that was a great nod.

Mon: We’ve talked about a lot but was Deadpool & Wolverine a good farewell to the franchise that introduced us to the Marvel world of superheroes? 

Ron: Good question! It’s making me remember something. When we first got into the X-Men comics, we absolutely despised the Avengers. They were always awful to the X-Men. The fact that we enjoyed the Avengers films at all is a miracle. But here’s the problem. The MCU is driven by the Avengers. Are they going to have the understanding, the compassion that comes from loving the X-Men? We’ve got X-Men ‘97 that’s such a love letter to mutantkind. It isn’t afraid to lean into the fears of life as a mutant and the intense bigotry that mutants face. Is the MCU going to understand that? Or are mutants going to be the punching bag of the MCU?

Mon: So, where are we going with the mutants? Let’s look at the future of the MCU now. Will the over-reliance on multiverse plots and meta-stories end? Will we ever escape the need for cameos? Will we get creators who aren’t white men behind-the-scenes to build our future?

None of this will happen soon. They need to get these gimmicks and novelties out of their system — it’s fun, I do like it, but I’m missing meaningful stories and storytelling. We see what shows like X-Men ‘97 and The Acolyte can do because they ground their stories in real-world issues and dynamics. The MCU has become very much about pandering and fan-service. Again, that’s not to say I don’t revel in that charm, but we need more!

Apparently Ryan Reynolds first approached Jordan Peele to work on the film but he couldn’t fit it isn’t his schedule. I wonder what that would have been like — what layers Peele would have brought to something that’s so much in his wheelhouse. In another universe, perhaps. 

Ron: A Jordan Peele-MCU film? I would like to see that. You know, we’ve had quite a few hints now that the mutants are in the Marvel Cinematic Universe. Kamala Khan, aka Ms Marvel, has been deemed a mutant. Monica Rambeau is in a universe with Beast and Binary. Wolverine is in this film. So, when are we getting an X-Men film? And are we going to see any of the incredible female mutants who are honestly carrying the comics franchise?

Mon: The best X-Men are women, yeah? But, that’s the problem isn’t it? Marvel is going backwards in its thinking. Are we going to see the Marvels again and the universe Binary is in? Are we going to see any ladies leading? Any people of colour writing and directing? I don’t know, man. The best we’re going to get with the Avengers films is to bring back the Russos and McFeely? Deadpool & Wolverine could hardly contain its fat-shaming but it kept it to the minimum. Are we going to now double down on it with the Infinity War and Endgame people back in the saddle? Are we going to sideline the characters of colour because the white directors don’t understand how meaningful these heroes are to an underrepresented demographic? 

Ron: You’re talking about Black Panther and Captain Marvel being underused in the latter part of the MCU Phase 3. The Russo brothers et al apparently didn’t expect these two characters to be popular. Because I guess they forgot people of colour and women exist, let alone watch movies?

Mon: Yes. It’s infuriating. Because what happens now? Are we going to kill off the last few female heroes because otherwise the plot won’t move? I can’t deal with that — and yet we’re stuck. Feige and team have only heard the loudest and worst of the criticism and taken it to mean the white guys must be our saviours, no one else will do. 

Ron: I don’t think watching this film following the SDCC announcements has endeared me to Deadpool & Wolverine or the next phases of the MCU much. Because Marvel seems to be saying this is what we’re going to get more of. We tried ladies in the lead and people of colour in the lead. But that didn’t work (because a small group of loud sexists and racists said so) after generations of not trying it anyway. So let’s just go back to the status quo. They’re pandering to the lowest common denominators, again, and giving us the white dude superheroes who make dick jokes. This is a really dour note to end the review on but I’m not feeling hopeful for the MCU. It doesn’t look like it’s interested in us as audiences anymore. 

Mon: I agree. As much as we enjoyed parts of Deadpool & Wolverine, it gives us little hope for the future of the MCU. It’s not saved, it just refuses to move forward.

Ron: You’re right. You know what, let’s go rewatch The Marvels.

[Continuum by Audionautix plays]

Mon: You can find us on social media @Stereo_Geeks. Or send us an email stereogeekspodcast@gmail.com. 

Mon: The Stereo Geeks logo was created using Canva. The music for our podcast comes courtesy Audionautix.

Ron: Don’t forget to rate and review us wherever you listen to podcasts. See you next time. 

[Continuum by Audionautix plays]

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 4, Episode 9. Anne Rice's Interview With the Vampire

One of the best shows on television right now is Interview With the Vampire. The Stereo Geeks review the first two seasons and share their hopes for season 3. Spoilers ahead

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Ron: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks. Today we’re reviewing Anne Rice’s Interview with the Vampire. 

I’m Ron.

Mon: And I’m Mon.

Ron: We will be discussing both seasons of Interview with the Vampire so beware of spoilers. 

Mon: We have a long connection with the Vampire Chronicles. We heard about them when we became fans of the Aussie band Savage Garden, their name was taken from this series. We decided to give the first book a read and even watched the rightfully panned film adaptation. I’ve gone on to read several more of the books. 

Ron: I did learn from my WWAC colleagues that the movie was a box office success in North America. That’s not what we heard in our part of the world!

Mon: Oh interesting. Let’s call it a critical failure then. 

The books are an… acquired taste. They’ve certainly gone places–they’re weird, and sometimes problematic, but the appeal, for the few of us who’ve read them, has been the expansive, complicated world filled with characters who are not defined by labels. 

When I heard they were adapting the series into a TV show, I’ll admit, I was concerned. What exactly would they adapt? It’s easy to fall into the traps and tropes of a vampire story featuring two male, immortal leads–the film is there as proof. Would the show head the same way?

Season 1 thoughts 

Mon: I started watching the first season from a hyper-critical point of view. I was so immersed in everything that I thought I didn’t like that I clean forgot to enjoy the first few episodes.

In fact, I didn’t relax until you started watching it, Ron. And then I saw the show from a completely different angle–this is not a show that cares about your comfort. It’s a show about larger-than-life, extraordinary characters desperately trying to be normal. But what is normal when you’re an ancient vampire?

Ron: What made you so tense about the show? I remember asking you if I should watch it and you were so unsure!

Mon: The violence, gore, and depravity–these are not stylistic elements that I like to engage in in my entertainment, and Interview has a lot of that. So, I convinced myself that I didn’t like this show. It was a guilty watch, and maybe a guilty pleasure. But I was wrong–it’s not a guilty anything, it’s art; it’s storytelling. Interview is very direct about the pain and suffering these characters face and cause. This show made me realize something about myself, I don’t like being uncomfortable, and these characters make you uncomfortable. Deal with it. And now I’m ok enough to deal with it that we’re doing a whole episode on the show. 

Ron: Okay wow. I also don’t like being uncomfortable or cringey but those were the exact elements that took this show through the stratosphere for me. I loved the first season. I didn’t know what to expect from it but it was a fascinating character study, and an examination of relationships. It wasn’t afraid of being camp and queer because that’s what the people of the time didn’t want to see but Louis and Lestat were shoving the campness in their faces. And it really leaned into the unbearable discomfort of unhappy relationships. 

Ron: The race swap for Louis de Pointe du Lac, played by Jacob Anderson, was a stroke of genius. As was setting the start of the story in the early 1900s. It really complicates the story world and Louis’ relationship with Lestat de Lioncourt, played by Sam Reid.

Mon: You never know what brilliance will emerge from one change, but race-swapping Louis gives the show, at least in the first season, a whole new dynamic. I wrote about why this change elevated the story at Collider.com. We’ve linked to the piece in our show notes. 

Ron: Season 1 took us into Louis’ world. He’s a Black man making his way in a New Orleans that is very white and segregated. He’s still treated like a second class citizen even by the people who are regular patrons at his establishment. But among his own people, he’s terrified of being his true queer self. Lestat gave him a way to transcend the social norms of heterosexuality and race. But then Lestat is the one who becomes such a danger to Louis. We get a few episodes of the two of them just being happy together and then when they find Claudia, played by Bailey Bass in season 1, they’re this happy little family. Of course everything goes to hell. And so much of that is down to the toxic dynamic between Lestat, Louis and Claudia. 

Mon: The main reason the raceswap works, along with setting the story during the Jim Crow era, is that it becomes more than just a vampire story. Now it’s a story about race and discrimination, retribution and justice. Louis is white in the books, has plantation connections, which means he would have had slaves. Even if it was never addressed in the show, how much would we like, let alone, love him, in the show? 

Ron: I’m going to interject here to recommend a very good YouTube video by Princess Weekes about the numerous confederate vampire stories out there. We’ll link to it in the show notes. 

Mon: My favourite thing about the raceswap is that it gives new meaning to Louis and Lestat’s relationship. Suddenly the story isn’t just about lust and longing, it’s about saving and belonging. 

Ron: I am very impressed by the direction they went with for Daniel Molloy, played by Eric Bogosian. He is not afraid to call Louis out for creating this fantasy version of Lestat in his head for his memoirs. He’s also the one who puts into words that Louis and Lestat’s relationship was abusive.

Mon: The role of the interviewer in a story can be such a thankless and boring choice for an actor, and yet, Daniel Molloy, is as much a character in the story as Louis and the rest of the vampires. I was initially concerned with the choice to age-up Daniel that much, but there’s a whole new dimension to his and Louis’ interactions knowing that this is part 2 of their interview, and not their first meeting.

Ron: Speaking of the change to Daniel, I haven’t read the books. How faithful is this series to the books you read?

Mon: The show differs from the books quite a bit. Daniel being older is one thing, and this is, essentially, a re-write of how Louis told his story before. 

Claudia having a two-season arc is only possible because they fill out her role so much. And it’s for the better as well. I don’t remember Antoinette in the books–Lestat did not have a romantic paramour to make Louis jealous, not one I recall, anyway. He was just mean. The timelines are off, which isn’t a bad thing, but it’s hard to keep track of where I am in the adaptation. It’s small fry. The creators are using beats from the books to tell their story, not necessarily the same story as the books. 

Ron: So things like that reveal in the season 1 finale with Louis declaring Armand, his greatest love. That wasn’t in the movie so it was a surprise that got me. Especially since Armand, played by Assad Zaman, had been pretending to be Louis’ housekeeper Rashid all season. What a way to get us excited for season two. 

Mon: I loved that reveal. Did not see it coming. And I especially like that we get a Spaniard of Indian origin. Europeans of colour do not often show up on screen in a significant way. And it made perfect sense too–because, in the books, Louis and Armand are together.

Season 2 thoughts 

Ron: The second season has a very different tone and style than season 1. It’s very focused on the Théâtre des Vampires and there are extensive scenes of the rehearsals and plays the vampires put on. There’s a lot we see of a new character, Santiago, who is played by Ben Daniels.

Mon: Yeah, Season 2 is vicious, and stressful. This show does not ease up. And the tensions within tensions of who’s playing whom are diabolical. Plus, the threads that Daniel, and the viewer, keep trying to pull at about Louis’ story and Armand’s hand in everything that happened to Claudia make this riveting viewing. 

Mon: I don’t remember the Théâtre des Vampires having such a large role in the books, it was probably just one section. This is a significant change in the show, but gives Louis and Claudia the screen time needed to develop their relationship, not to mention we get to see Louis and Armand’s romance grow.

For some reason, I can’t remember Santiago from the books, even though I know he plays an important part in the story. I’ve just blanked him out. The show’s version is super memorable though.

Ron: The expanded world of vampires that we’re introduced to is interesting and grotesque. The first few episodes see Louis and Claudia travelling Europe during World War II looking for vampires and instead they keep running into the worst of humanity, because you know, war. And when they finally meet vampires in Romania, it’s an absolute horror show. They’re starved and near death and being led by this vampire who’s too old and too frail. It’s only in France that the coven finds them and for Claudia especially, this is such an amazing experience because she gets to be with vampires who aren’t abusive, like Lestat, or monsters, like Bruce from season one. But that doesn’t pan out either! By the end of season 2, the vampires are openly admitting to their monstrousness, but it’s just so unfair to Claudia, who got to see so little good in her human and vampiric life. 

Mon: See, this is why I’m so glad you decided to watch the show despite my apprehension. You’re watching this like a character study, which is exactly what it is. I don’t know what I was doing, but I’m so glad I get to chat with you about this show. 

Ron: Gee thanks. I’m super surprised by your apprehension. We’ve had such a long association with this story that I honestly couldn’t wait to see it. I didn’t expect it to be a character study but from the moment Louis appeared on screen, I knew this wasn’t going to be a salacious, surface-level plot about vampires killing people. 

Ron: The first season was really a study of the three main characters and their dynamic. In the second season there isn’t as much Louis but the world became so much richer, that I didn’t mind it as much. Lestat spends most of this season as Dreamstat, this idealized version of the real person in Louis’ head.  

Mon: Dreamstat is a cool nickname. 

Ron: I can’t take credit; the internet named him that. 

Mon: Funny that you felt there wasn’t enough Louis in Season 2. I was surprised at how little Lestat there was. It makes sense, of course, the first book doesn’t have much Lestat, but I didn’t think the show would sideline the main white guy. I’m very cynical. But Lestat taking a step back meant Claudia and Armand took centre stage, and I’m all for that. 

Ron: Delainey Hayles takes over as Claudia in the second season. Excellent choice. The casting change felt surprisingly seamless for me. 

Mon: Absolutely seamless casting. She matched Bass’s energy, but brought so much more anger and pathos. Plus, she spouted so much dialogue in so many different languages. 

Ron: Hayles managed to follow in Bass’ footsteps while making the role completely her own. Her screen time is expanded this season and that is for the betterment of the show. We get a proper sense of just how hard it is to be her, a grown woman trapped in the body of a child for all eternity. What was essentially a selfless act to save a child’s life has turned into a cruel and selfish decision that Louis and Lestat made on Claudia’s behalf. 

Acting

Ron: Jacob Anderson is remarkable. I love watching him. He’s so expressive but knows when to hold back. That scene in the 70s when he’s absolutely tearing into Armand, calling him boring, all while this fake blood is plastered on his face, it was so incredible to watch. The loving father-daughter bond between Louis and Claudia, Anderson absolutely sells it. In season two they’re more brother and sister because of Claudia’s insistence on it but one can see that Louis loves her like a daughter. And yet! Louis struggles to deal with the harsher side of being a parent. Learning the truth about what Bruce did to Claudia, Louis sits in his coffin and cries quietly. And the whole time I’m yelling to the screen, to Louis, to go and hug his child. 

Mon: BT dubs, there’s no Bruce in the books. 

Ron: Oh interesting. 

That final two-parter in season 2 when Lestat finally admits to having hurt Louis, and his apology, Anderson’s acting was sublime. Without a single word, just with his expressions, he tells the audience how little he thinks of Lestat’s apology. It’s a masterpiece. 

Mon: He’s stellar. Where’s he been all this time?

Let’s talk about Assad Zaman as well. He’s British of Bangladeshi origin. In Interview, we learn that Armand was originally Arun from India (which Bangladesh would have been part of during that period), sold to slavery and taken to Spain, where Marius found him, renamed him Amadeo, and then turned him into a vampire. He’s so good at playing this tragic character, a reluctant hero and leader, but also so devious. I’m just floored by the layers of his performance. He can convey so much by just sitting in place with his head cocked to one side. 

Ron: Assad was a delight to watch. Even with those contact lenses, you could always tell when Armand was being his true self, when he was hiding something, and when he was truly sorry about something that had gone down. I’m so glad he got such a large role here. It made up for the lack of Lestat. 

Mon: And let’s not forget the Brat Prince himself, Lestat. Sam Reid is so good at stepping away from the spotlight and then stealing it when needed. He plays Lestat’s narcissism so well; he’s cruel and mean and yet he knows how to convey his heart break. In Season 2, he has so little to do and yet he commands the camera so well. 

Ron: I did not know Lestat was called the Brat Prince. What a hilarious name. I feel like Sam Reid had a really tough task. Tom Cruise has such a massive fan base and people still love his Lestat. Even Stuart Townsend got some fans for his performance. But Reid makes Lestat his own. It helps that he has insane chemistry with Jacob Anderson. Their Louis and Lestat are very believable as a couple. Reid does a good job of playing up the charm when Lestat wants something, and he’s downright terrifying when things aren’t going his way. But I like that he can still bring pathos to Lestat. He’s not just over the top—Lestat is trying to live his best life when he no longer understands what living is meant to be. What’s life to an immortal? And somehow Reid manages to make that a relevant existential question for us mortals. 

Ron: Both Bass and Hayles were excellent as Claudia but Hayles got to be a lot of different versions of Claudia. Hayles brings a great deal of rage and frustration to Claudia because she is so much older by season 2, yet she’s still being treated like a child. And that awful show she has to put on for the theatre. I love how committed the actors are to these characters and this story because, after all, vampires aren’t real, and immortality isn’t a problem for us, but they demonstrate the pathos of their characters’ situations to make it seem like reality. 

Mon: Bass and Hayles are stars in the making. I hope they get fantastic opportunities. You don’t bring that level of energy and complexity and only get a season to flaunt it. 

Queerness

Ron: This show is so unapologetically queer. Straight people? Never heard of them! Well, not really, but the central romantic triangle is these three men from three very different parts of the world. The scene in the finale when Louis declares to Lestat that he’s going to spend his life with Armand, that’s the epitome of queerness in this show. But it really sucks that Louis thinks he can only be with these two awful men. He keeps seesawing between them and they both suck!

Mon: The books are very gay, but sometimes too vague about it, which annoys me. The show is clearer and gayer, which I really like. I was worried about that going in because Anne Rice had a whole homophobe stage of her life���don’t ask me—but she walked it back, I guess, seeing as she and her son had a hand in getting this series off the ground, and the show is not shy about being queer. 

Mon: The Season 2 finale comes down to one thing–this is a love story. It’s about a man, Louis, desperate for love. He’s known it with Lestat and Armand, and they’re both devils, but they’re safe and known devils. It’s cute in the most dramatically violent way. You can’t blame Louis for his poor choices in men—he had to hide his sexuality for a long time and he struggles with being a vampire, at least in the past, so vampires who love him back, even if they’re toxic, is perhaps comforting to him. 

Ron: And then Claudia gets a romance with Madeleine which isn’t in the books, is it? 

Mon: Is it a romance here? Or is it a companionship? Claudia’s an old soul in a child’s body, so can Madeleine love her romantically? I like that they leave it vague. 

Ron: In the book, Madeleine and Claudia had a mother-daughter relationship but that doesn’t work in the show’s story. Claudia wants to be an equal so she wouldn’t have wanted a mother. But it’s so tricky with Claudia being 14 forever—how do they give her a partner who isn’t immediately suspect for wanting to be with a 14 year old. I like how they built up the friendship between Claudia and Madeleine, laid the groundwork for Madeleine understanding what Claudia is, and they only get together after Madeleine is turned into a vampire. It worked for me. Of course, now they’re both dead so… I guess we don’t have to think about it anymore. 

Hopes for season 3

Ron: The show has now been renewed for a third season and it’s set to be following Lestat’s music career. The finale of season 2 sets that up very subtly! I would love to spend more time in that world but I’m worried about where Louis might fit in.

Mon: Lestat starting his rockstar career is going to be wild. But who he’s starting it with is even wilder, because the characters mentioned in the Season 3 summary weren’t in the band in the books.

Mon: The show is now so different from the books, that I can’t predict what a Season 3 will look like. I mean, they mention space in the Season 3 summary. Space! Dude, it’s too soon for this space stuff.

Ron: So I’m trying to avoid all this information about season 3 but space huh?

Mon: Yep, space. Let’s leave it at that.

The fact that Lestat has Akasha’s blood in the past is a huge change in the timeline. Akasha and Enkil are the original vampires, from whom all vampires are born. That’s been retconned, somewhat in recent books, but let’s not get into that. Lestat having Akasha’s blood is the reason he’s virtually unkillable. It explains why he survived Season 1, but this throwaway line in the finale makes it tricky for them to adapt the storylines from Queen of the Damned onwards.

Anyway, back to Louis. Louis’ fate is with Armand or Lestat. In the books, Louis is with Armand. Them breaking up in Season 2 is a big deviation. Who’s he going to end up with finally, especially since Lestat has other lovers from the books who could be introduced. 

Ron: I’d also love to see more of Daniel Molloy. He’s a vampire now. Who turned him? Is it Armand? How does he feel about being an older vampire? I want to see the world through vampire-Daniel’s eyes. And I would really like to explore his relationship with Louis. They’re clearly fond of each other. 

Mon: In the books, Armand turned Daniel. And Louis seems to suggest the same in the finale, but who knows. They’re always surprising us. 

Mon: I’m intrigued by the introduction of the Talamasca in Season 2, and I understand there’s a show coming as well. The Talamasca are a secret society, kinda like the X-Files but for occult creatures. How interesting will that be? I’m not sure. I watched the first season of the other AMC show, Mayfair Witches. That’s also adapted from a series in the same Immortal Universe, and Lestat popped up in the books a couple of times. I could not get into that show at all. Not enough gay people. Hehehehehehe.

Ron: The queerness of Interview is such a highlight for me. It’s hard to watch straight shows now. Haha. 

Mon: But, honestly, I think we’re invested in Interview because Lestat and Louis have been a part of our lives for a really long time, and the creators have made a show that’s not just about them being vampires. It’s about people, and the messiness that comes with it. I didn’t find that in Mayfair. So, what’s the Talamasca show going to have? Lestat’s long-time partner, David Talbot is/was part of the Talamasca. He’s not joined Interview yet, so that’s a possible connection to interest us.

Speaking of David, I don’t know if they’ll be able to introduce him, or if Daniel will take over that role. I say that because Daniel has met Raglan James–the Talamasca dude in the sushi bar in Season 2, and David enters the books when Lestat encounters Raglan. I’ll admit, I’m gutted that Raglan seems to be an old white guy on the show. He’s a body snatcher in the books, and when Lestat meets him, he’s in the body of an Anglo-Indian man. I think, in a way, the creators tried to appease us by making Armand Indian instead. 

All to say, I haven’t a clue what to expect next. There are so many books to be adapted, but Louis’ not in them much, if at all. If they pivot to Lestat being the main character, I worry that they’ll lose the viewers, many of whom have tuned in specifically because Louis is Black and has a certain lived experience. But I want more seasons, and I have hope that the creators will make the right choices in telling the stories needed.

Ron: I want to add that this show has such a fan following. Two podcasts I’ve been listening to did entire series on this show because they became so obsessed with it. I’ve had random people I follow on Twitter regularly calling on more people to watch the show because it is literal perfection. I can’t think of anything I would change. I’m desperate to get my hands on some of the scripts because it’s going to help me become a better a writer. And some of the direction for this second season especially, that scene when the Theatres abduct Louis, Claudia and Madeleine and the background actors are frozen, or rather acting frozen, they really knew how to ratchet up the suspense. 

Mon: This show is literally art–there are screengrabs from this show that are homages to artworks. We need more of that. And we need more shows that effortlessly include queer stories and feature characters from different races and ethnicities. This show has done that for two seasons. It could do so much more if the seasons continue.

Season 1 was about racial dynamics and interpersonal relationships in a world that doesn’t accept queer people. Season 2 was about autonomy, especially bodily autonomy, and monstrosity—what it really means when applied to people, be they vampire or human. The show can examine anything and everything and wrap it around a glorious romance. I’d love to see that. 

[stereogeekspodcast]

[Transcript] Season 4, Episode 8. We've Been Busy With... Nightwing, Lore Olympus, Madame Web, Godzilla Minus One, and more

The Stereo Geeks discuss the TV shows and films they've been watching, and the books they've been reading.

Listen to the episode on Spotify.

Mon: Hello and welcome to a new episode of Stereo Geeks. We’re doing things a little differently today. We’ll be discussing a bunch of stuff we’ve been watching, listening to and reading recently.

I’m Mon.

Ron: And I’m Ron.

Mon: Tom Taylor, Bruno Redondo, and a team of artists brought Dick Grayson/Nightwing back to himself in the Eisner Award-winning series, Nightwing Volumes 1-4. I’m behind on this series, but I intend to get back into it because of these four volumes. 

There was a lot of controversy surrounding what happened to Dick Grayson in Batman #55 way back in 2018. 

Ron: Was it that long ago? 

Mon: Yeah, I’m still processing that. 

I kept reading the Nightwing books after that, but those were a tough read. Dick wasn’t himself, so these new volumes were a welcome change. 

Ron: I haven’t read the latest volumes. I barely got through the Ric Grayson nonsense. What’s our favourite pretty bird been up to?

Mon: Well, Dick is back as Nightwing, but he’s reeling from losing his memory and himself, and his home of Blüdhaven is worse off since his absence. 

What I liked about this section of the series is that Dick returns and he wants to do so much more for his city than just punch bad guys. I like that the creators addressed the fact that Bruce Wayne could have done so much more with his money, and Dick is hoping to course correct in Blüdhaven.

The story had a lot of emotional beats, and the ones concerning Alfred got me in the feels. Who knew I’d get teary over Dick and Alfred’s relationship, but here we are. I do love how newer renditions of the Bat-universe comics really lean into the notion of them being a family who love and loathe each other, just like any other family. There’s so much love in the writing, it makes it such a joy to read these stories.

I loved the art and colours—for most of the volumes Redondo is leading the art team, so the character art is especially beautiful, giving the Bat-family distinct and gorgeous faces. Good art, especially art that flatters the characters I love, helps me become more invested in the story.

After eons of Dick being touted as the next big thing, he finally feels like he’s taking on that mantle. I believe he’s become a big deal in the DC Comics universe. I need to read more of the current stuff to know for sure. 

Volumes 1-3 are particularly solid. 4 is a little more gruesome, so I didn’t like it that much. I also hate it when the art changes during a volume or a run. I know it happens, but it’s so frustrating, especially when you start off with the kind of art you love and then it changes. Sigh.

Highly recommend these volumes for Nightwing fans. I really hope what comes after is just as excellent.

Ron: Lore Olympus by Rachel Smythe is a retelling of Greek mythology in Webtoon form, now available across several paperbacks as well.

Mon: Greek gods in Webtoon form. Tell me more!

Ron: It’s essentially about the romance between Persephone and Hades but pretty much every Greek god and goddess makes an appearance. The story started fairly small but expanded to encompass so much of the mythos. It was such a rich world and I found it a very immersive reading experience.

Smythe has been writing this series since 2018. I only started reading Lore Olympus during the pandemic and then I ended up taking a break from Webtoons for a long while. But I went back to it this year and I couldn’t stop reading. I ended up racing through to the end. I was a bit bereft when I’d come to the end of the 280 episodes.

The story is engaging but what captivated me at first was the art. I love the way Smythe uses colours to differentiate the characters and the different realms. There’s a lot of detail in her art that had me lingering on sections of the story. But she also uses colours to display emotions which I found very moving. Lore Olympus goes to some pretty dark places at times and I appreciated her putting content warnings for those episodes.

My only criticism was that the final volume both dragged and felt rushed. We had too many episodes that were stuck on one plot point and then the entire story was wrapped up in just two episodes. Having said that, 280 episodes is a massive commitment from a writer and artist. It was a riveting story and I loved the modern incarnations of the gods and goddesses. Highly recommended.

Mon: Wow, I’ll add it to my list. 

Mon: Anyone who’s read Marvel comics is going to tell you that the What If…? series of books is the coolest part of being a comic reader. Alternate takes on what would have happened to our favourite characters are always fun to read. My guess is, Marvel, seeing that the What If…? animated show got some traction, decided to venture into new territory–YA What If…? novels. So we have Marvel: What If...Loki Was Worthy? by Madeleine Roux.

Look, I love Loki as much as the next person, and I’ll admit, at the start I was itching to get to the book whenever I was away from it. At one point, the book mentions a Marvel character who I’m fond of, and I got so excited I decided to ‘save’ the book and read it at my own pace.

Ron: Just for that cameo, I want to read this book now. Should I?

Mon: No. Taking a break was actually a dumb idea because this is a library book and it got snatched away. I’m back to reading it now, haven’t finished it yet, but the magic’s gone. I’m struggling to read this. The writing is so slow, the descriptions are overlong and unnecessary. They don’t just bring the pace to a halt, they grind it backward. I’m literally screaming in my head for the story to move forward, but nope, we need to describe every single room in this tiny trailer with the utmost detail. 

And here’s the thing, I don’t hate descriptions. I used to love Thomas Hardy’s books, so I can’t complain about descriptions. But my issue is the descriptions are given more importance than what Loki goes through. I’m sorry, but I am way more interested in knowing how he coped with a certain live-changing event than his bloody lizard!

And don’t get me started on Tony Stark. Crikey–what is with the overly sentimental histrionics? And why are they three chapters long? 

I’m halfway through, and I think things are picking up. At this point, I just want the book to be over. I don’t care if Loki was worthy, I just know I’m unworthy of this suffering. 

Ron: Well, that takes us to more comics-related suffering. This is something I’ve been dying to talk about. The Krakoa-era of X-Men! I have so many thoughts and I don’t know if I’ll be able to cover it all but I’m going to try.

Ron: For the longest time, I just couldn’t find a way back into the X-Men comics. I found that so frustrating because they are our favourite comics team. But with the House of X/Powers of X series in 2019, I finally got a way in. We read that series for our comic book club and I stayed with it.

Mon: I never read past Hox/PoX, which we covered on this podcast, by the way. So I’m all ears.

Ron: At first, I really enjoyed the Krakoa comics. After decades of being despised, hunted, killed, just for being born different, the mutants had a safe home on Krakoa, the living island. I loved reading about the way they were setting up their lives, how Krakoa would give them whatever they needed to thrive. And the resurrection protocols ensured the mutants couldn’t die. The Five, consisting of Tempus, Proteus, Hope Summers, Elixir, and Egg, combined their mutant powers with Xavier to resurrect dead X-Men. All the mutants who lost their powers in House of M, or died on Genosha, they were all being brought back. That wasn’t all. Mutants had created a medicine that was going to help humans fight diseases. I was so enjoying reading about this mutant Utopia.

Mon: That sounds awesome. I love my X-Men being happy.

Ron: Not so fast. Things weren’t all that rosy on Krakoa. The Quiet Council, the governing body of the island, was made up of past villains with their own agendas, like Mr Sinister, Sebastian Shaw, and Apocalypse, who seemed to have turned over a new leaf at least. Cyclops and Jean were so annoyed with Xavier and Magneto keeping secrets from them that they both abandoned the Quiet Council. Xavier and Magneto also made Mystique’s life miserable; they put her on the council but refused to resurrect her wife, Destiny, for absolutely no good reason. Honestly, the internal politics of the Quiet Council were to die for. I loved the drama, the tension, the subterfuge. Who was betraying whom? Who had their own plan for world domination? Who knew who’s secrets. This is what had me picking up issue after issue.

Mon: Wait, so you liked that part?

Ron: Very much so! But alas, Marvel comics got in their own way. Instead of giving us these self-contained stories about mutant intrigue, Marvel introduced fantastical elements like the Arakki, an ancient mutant civilization to which Apocalypse belonged to. 

Mon: The ruddy Arakki. How many times have I heard you complain about the Arakki?

Ron: I know I go on about it, but I cannot stress enough how much I despise the Arakki. The moment they appeared on the comic page, the mutants I wanted to read about went right out the window. Practically every single issue became focused on the Arakki. They were a warring race so we got plenty of mindless action and no character development. They didn’t want to fit in on Krakoa, so the mutants terraformed Mars and made it Arakko and the Arakki were still fighting. Worse, Storm and Magneto were appointed leaders of the Arakki so the entirety of their story in X-Men: Red was just them quelling fights between the Arakki. It was so boring!

Ron: And let me not start on Avalon and the Braddocks. I don’t know Betsy Braddock very well but her constant tussle with Saturnyne which went on and on and on made me dislike them both and all of Avalon so much. Betsy was in a group with Jubilee, Rogue, Gambit, and Rictor, all of them much more interesting than her. Yet every Excalibur book was about Betsy and only Betsy. I was so glad when she shattered into glass pieces but alas, she got better and even more insufferable.

Mon: Wow, that sounds… not great. A book featuring your favs Rogue and Gambit, and it’s about neither of them? I don’t know how you persevered. 

Ron: I didn’t. I gave up on Excalibur when Rogue fell into a coma.

Mon: You have got to be kidding me. 

Ron: Nope! However, I did get to hang out with some very cool characters on Krakoa. Mystique and Destiny, who was eventually resurrected behind Xavier’s back, haha, take that sucker. They were such an amazing couple. They were so conniving, so smart, so in love, I enjoyed every moment I got to read them. Laura Kinney got a few incredible story arcs. She and Synch, a mutant I’d never met before, had this incredible storyline of living many lives to fight a terrifying enemy. It was a sad ending for them but Synch has become one of my favourite mutants now. He’s got the ability to use any superpowers that he’s been near but because of his experiences, his powers are killing him. And yet, he keeps fighting to save mutantkind.

Mon: I’d really like to meet Synch one day in the comics. 

Ron: Don’t hold your breath; he’s not slated for any new books.

Ron: There were lots of little moments that I enjoyed from Krakoa, as well. Scott, Jean, Logan, and Emma Frost becoming a happy quadrangle. Logan even lives on the Moon in the Summers home. Almost everyone getting their families back. Jean and Scott have Cable and Rachel. Logan has all his kids, Akihiro, Laura, Gabby. Krakoa was very queer-friendly. Lots of the lads wore gorgeous dresses to the Hellfire Gala. Northstar’s husband, Kyle, who’s human, got to live on Krakoa. Then there’s Ms Marvel becoming a mutant and adapting to her multiple identities, which was a great addition–she’s an absolute natural as a mutant even though her powers haven’t appeared yet. Seeing Captain America step up and lead the mutant resistance, considering the Avengers have historically been absolutely awful to the X-Men. The political machinations of the Quiet Council and how mutants like Emma Frost managed to get the upper hand over their rivals was so thrilling! And nothing will surpass the shock of Orchis murdering all the mutants at the Hellfire Gala just as the new X-Men team was announced.

But it’s been downhill for a while. The focus on the Arakki, the overlong Dominion plotline that fizzled out, quite literally, with the return of Dark Phoenix. Sidelining characters I love, like Storm and Iceman. I had such high hopes for Krakoa and now I’m just happy it’s ending. I really felt like they’d lost their way. Now we’ve got the Fall of the X-Men that’s spread over some 13 series, and you have to read each issue from each series sequentially. It’s bonkers. I am so going to miss the hope and joy I thought Krakoa would bring. Not to me, my X-Men.

Mon: Dang, that sucks. I’m hoping for good things with the new series. But, you never know.

Mon: Anyway. So, I like listening to podcasts, but my podcast habits are pretty standard–I’m either listening to reviews or news. But I heard ads for the BBC and CBC podcast Hollywood Exiles, which is about the Red Scare in the US and J.Edgar Hoover’s apparent obsession with taking down Charlie Chaplin. 

The podcast is hosted and narrated by Chaplin’s granddaughter Oona. Oona is an actress, so she has a great voice for podcasting–very soothing and measured. We, of course, know about the Red Scare and the witch-hunts for supposed communists, but it was really interesting to hear about the rise of Hoover and the impact of these trials on Hollywood. 

Apparently, Hoover started a file on Charlie Chaplin–one that grew to over 1000 pages–as early as the 1920s. Chaplin, was, according to the podcast, one of the earliest targets of the Bureau for un-American activities. Chaplin was an immigrant from Britain–he never got American citizenship, and was openly ‘anti-authoritarian’, if you can call it that, in his work. That immediately drew a target on his back even though he wasn’t part of the Communist Party in the US–or so he said, anyway. 

Listening to this podcast, it’s really heart-breaking. Chaplin was older, secure in his career, and rich. Life got tough, he upped and offed to England. But other writers and creators, they went through hell and back and lost their jobs. Some left the US, forever, others eventually returned. But they couldn’t return to their old jobs because they were put on the “Hollywood blacklist”. Man, that sucked to hear. The adult children of those exiles talking about how life changed for their families, was so sad. And over what? Fear-mongering.

And listening to it now, when the US is so divisive and so quick to judge and cancel–all the wrong people, of course–just made me so angry. It hits worse now that we’re in North America.

My one grouse with the podcast was that, because it’s hosted by Chaplin’s kin, Oona sort of brushes off Chaplin's less-than-stellar inclinations. The dude had a penchant for really young women, and even if the women were of consenting age, the power dynamic between Chaplin and anyone else is off. Oona Chaplin never really deals with that in the podcast. I think the producers at the BBC and CBC should have stepped in to contextualize the problematic side of Chaplin.

But this podcast is worth a listen to understand how and why Hollywood was so embroiled in the Red Scare. 

Ron: I’ve been hearing a lot of talk about a mind-bendy thriller called Dark Matter on Apple TV+ so I decided to check it out. You and I loved Netflix’s Dark, and I adored the other sci-fi show called Dark Matter so why not? It’s based on a book by Blake Crouch and the premise is around alternate universes. I love alternate universes so I was very excited when I realised that was what the show was about.

My enthusiasm was waning partway through episode one, of what I believe is a 10-episode series. Joel Edgerton plays Jason Dessen, a science professor. 

Mon: I’m sorry–that’s a name choice.

Ron: Hehe. His wife Daniela, played by Jennifer Connelly, works in an art gallery. The two of them gave up their dreams of being a scientist and an artist to raise their son. First up, how cliche, the dude is the scientist, the lady is an artist. Why don’t we swap it around and really make things interesting? Anyway!

Then they waste the first three episodes with this setup about Jason being kidnapped and left in an alternate reality. And he’s wondering who could’ve done it. When we already know the answer in episode one. Why would you spend three episodes with the characters not knowing something the audience has already been told?

Also, I tuned in to see alternate universes. Those really only appear from episode 4. And I don’t know if it’s a budget issue, but the characters rarely interact with the alternate universes. They’re mostly green screen. How very boring.

But the premise of the story is so dull. Jason loves his wife and wants to go back to her. That’s literally all there is to this man. Nothing else. Every single episode he keeps going on about how much he loves his wife. But I don’t understand what they’re on about because, honestly, Jason and Daniela’s life looks awful. There’s no excitement. They have no hobbies. The show has to keep telling us they love each other when it really looks like they’ve just settled for this existence.

Also, I cannot stand when characters make stupid decisions. We all do dumb things sometimes, sure. But nobody looks at a snowstorm and willingly runs into it. There’s this pandemic world they go to, and you will not believe it, Jason, after being told that the virus on this world is spread through fluids, he handles a vial that Daniela was holding after she was wiping her tears away. Dude, two seconds ago, they told you not to do that!

The show is really held back by the central romance between Jason and Daniela, because I just don’t see that love. Companionship, sure. Love? Whatever. Just show me the cool alternate worlds.

Mon: Yikes. Giving that a miss then.

Mon: On to some stuff we’ve been watching together. 

I think a lot more people have heard about Madame Web the film, than actually seen it. It’s a running joke at this point–another Sony Marvel movie that bombed, haha. 

We only recently caught up with it. I had no hopes for the film. I’d heard nothing but outrage at how bad it was, so my only expectation was to be mildly entertained. 

But you know what, now that I’ve watched it, I’m really annoyed. I’m annoyed with people, especially the people who said don’t even bother watching this film because it’s dead on arrival. Like, if you’re a fan of superhero stuff, this film was worth one viewing at least.

Ron: This is the same nonsense that happened to The Marvels. People kept saying don’t watch it because it’s bad but since you and I got a preview screening, we were completely confused because we knew The Marvels was incredibly fun. I wish we’d got to give Madame Web a chance because it was also fun, in a very different way.

Mon: Madame Web is not great. The CGI is so janky, I can’t believe they let it out in public like that. And then there’s the first scene, which is atrociously acted. Yikes! But if you stick around, you get this really wholesome road trip, sorority sisters sticking together vibe. I kinda liked it. It was, I don’t know, adorable? 

Ron: Here’s the thing though, the CGI was janky in Doctor Strange and the Multiverse of Madness and Guardians of the Galaxy 3 but people were still raving about those!

Mon: Yep. 

None of the performances are great, but it’s like everyone had a bit and they stuck to it. The whole film does feel, a little, like everyone involved is on cruise control, but again, it didn’t make me hate it. It was a surprisingly pleasant experience to hang out with these characters and this film. I mean, I liked this film more than the second and third volumes of Guardians of the Galaxy and Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania, which isn’t saying much, because those were awful entries. But they made money and aren’t as openly mocked as this women-led and directed film. I wonder why. #sarcasm

Ron: I really liked the characters in Madame Web. Cassie Web is relatable. That scene where the kid hands her a drawing and she’s like, what do I do with this? Relatable! That entire subway section with her and the three teenagers and they’re sure this woman is kidnapping them, was hilarious. This movie was genuinely so funny. All the emotion that Guardians 3 was forcing on its script and actors, this film did it organically. I found myself so moved when Cassie had that revelation about her mother. Now I’ve just made myself sad again.

Mon: The characters were the best part of the film–truly surprising, but that’s what annoys me more about people being so mean about this film.

Mon: Two things about this film I’m not sure about–they made it like this was a one-and-done. These people will be superheroes, even though we don’t know how. We see them in costume, but it’s not in the present. That was a weird choice, and it seals the deal on there being no future for these characters.

Ron: There could easily have been a sequel that shows us how this group gets to that point. I mean, Venom seemed like a one and done film and it’s got two sequels!

Mon: The first Venom was so bad. How do people like it more than this film?

The other thing that weirded me out about Madame Web was the ending. I’m still trying to process what they were trying to say with that ending. This goes back to the film being on cruise control. A character needed to be a certain way to reflect their comic book persona, so even though they go through a life-altering experience, everyone’s super-chill about it because… that’s destiny? It was really weird. I wonder if that put critics off. I mean, this film does not hold up to criticism, but man, it does not deserve the hate. This felt like The Marvels all over again–though that film is objectively much better made and really fun. 

Ron: I actually really liked the ending. Life-altering injuries are always treated like the end of the world in stories but I like that this film had this character accept it as part of her journey. A sequel could have explored it more. 

Ron: With the crazy backlash against The Marvels, and before that, the vitriol against She-Hulk, which was such a fun, enjoyable, relatable show, and now Madame Web, Marvel’s not going to have any female superheroes headlining films or shows. These stories are hated on to the point where they lose box office sales and that’s it, we never get to see these characters again. But Starlord will return! I’m so angry.

Mon: Booooooooo!

Ron: Moving on, I guess. We didn’t catch Godzilla Minus One in theatres because going to the movies is expensive, you guys! We had to wait quite a while but eventually it arrived on Netflix Canada and we duly watched it. I was expecting standard monster fare. People screaming. Monsters destroying buildings. Lots of action and great VFX, because the film won the Oscar for VFX. But hoo boy, we got so much more!

Mon: Sitting down to watch Godzilla Minus One was worrying. I was certain this wouldn’t live up to the hype. Well, I was wrong. The film is riveting–but not because it’s about a monster called Godzilla, it’s because it’s a character study of people, and who the monsters really are. I know some people were annoyed that the film doesn’t touch on the atrocities that Japan committed during the war–there are other stories that deal with that, but I don’t know how this film would have included that as well. I mean, we all know there are no saints in a war; I don’t think this film tries to paint things any differently. 

Ron: The movie does touch on the fact that Japan made some terrible choices in the second World War.

Mon: It does. Godzilla is merely a catalyst to tell a deeper story about governmental and systemic failure, the devastation of war, the real cost of the atomic bombs, and most importantly, the connections among people. This isn’t the first Godzilla film to tap into these themes, but it’s the first one that I’ve seen do this. 

Ron: Godzilla was created in response to the nuclear bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. To have this movie set during and just after the second World War, drives home the devastation that those bombs caused.

Mon: The American Godzilla movies are always the same–monster fights. They’re so dull. And then you have this one, with these complicated characters who have so many layers to them. And the special effects. The VFX team won the Oscar for a reason. Godzilla looks so real! It’s scary.

Ron: True. Godzilla Minus One was so much more than the action. Protagonist Shikishima is a failed Kamikaze pilot. And then he’s one of only two survivors of Godzilla’s attack on a small island refuelling station. Not only that, but he returns home to find his civilian parents died in the war. It’s just survivor’s guilt upon survivor’s guilt for Shikishima! Ryunosuke Kamiki, who plays Shikishima, carries the film on his shoulders and he manages to portray the unimaginable burden of surviving so much really well. It’s a shame the international awards didn’t recognise his acting.

Mon: My only criticism is that I wish our leading lady Noriko had a larger role in the story, and that there were more ladies in the story. I know that Japan can be very patriarchal, and would have probably been even more conservative in the 1940s, but I wish they’d figured out a way to bring more women into the story.

Ron: 100%. Noriko is the amusing heart of the story. She’s the reason why Shikishima ends up with the world’s most bizarre but loving family unit. Noriko’s really the one who makes them work as a family. She had some incredible scenes and was played with a lot of sensitivity by Minami Hamabe. I was impressed by how much love Shikishima and Noriko had for each other without there being long monologues about it, just quiet moments and a shared look. And that’s down to the acting.

Mon: This film is worth a watch whether you like or care for Godzilla. It’s outstanding. Who knew you could get emotional during a Godzilla movie!

Mon: Everyone has been decrying the end of the world because The Fall Guy failed at the box office. Us plebs who refuse to go to the cinema all the time are the worst of humanity, don’t you know? How dare we not spend every dollar on passively absorbing every single film that comes out instead of trying to buy groceries and, you know, survive. 

Mon: I’m sorry, did I go on a diatribe? I did. The way the online space made it out, it seemed like The Fall Guy was the best film ever to have been made. Listen, I was going to watch it anyway, just not in the theatre. We have to pick and choose when we spend money and where we go. We used to love going to the cinema every week, but that’s just not possible now–money isn’t even the biggest issue, for us at least, it’s that you have to be wise about which indoor spaces you want to be in.

Ron: When cinema tickets are $26 per person, before taxes, you’ve got to choose the groceries. I’m afraid The Fall Guy isn’t the kind of movie I’m spending that much money on. Sorry.

Mon: Anyway, on to the film. The Fall Guy is just meh. I was kinda disappointed, honestly. I was expecting something spectacular. This isn’t it. The opening scene? Yeah, sign me up. Awesome direction. That was, wow. And the way it ends, holy moly. That was incredible stuff. 

Ron: That one-take opening scene was so well-executed and then you have that unexpected ending. I couldn’t wait to see what happened next.

Mon: But the film goes downhill after that. The pacing is off. It tries so hard to be funny, but it keeps falling flat. There’s some really slick directing, but the action scenes were badly paced.

I also didn’t like that Ryan Gosling’s the only one with any significant screen time. There’s this cast of amazing actors, Winston Duke, Stephanie Hsu, and Aaron Taylor-Johnson, and they don’t get their due. Taylor-Johnson has more to do than Duke and Hsu though.

Ron: Aaron Taylor-Johnson is so freaking funny and he absolutely owns this douchebag role. But he disappears for three quarters of the movie! And don’t get me started on Stephanie Hsu getting only two scenes.

Mon: And Emily Blunt is totally wasted in this. What the hell! Useless, tiresome role. So boring. At least Gosling can finally act though. I swear, till before Barbie, he was as wooden as a doll, and now he can actually emote.

Ron: Ken has changed Gosling so much. I actually understand the appeal now!

Mon: I have to strain to remember that I watched this film because it was so meh. I cannot believe the vitriol the average movie-goer faced because they didn’t support this film. People need to live a little.

Ron: Well, we’ve definitely been busy being entertained this year. Have you been watching or reading something you’d recommend? Let us know in the comments. Until next time.