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renegadewangs · 3 years

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Van Zieks - the Examination, part 9

Warnings: SPOILERS for The Great Ace Attorney: Chronicles. Additional warning for racist sentiments uttered by fictional characters (and screencaps to show these sentiments).

Disclaimer: (see Part 1 for the more detailed disclaimer.) - These posts are not meant to be taken as fact. Everything I’m outlining stems from my own views and experiences. If you believe that I’ve missed or misinterpreted something, please let me know so I can edit the post accordingly. -The purpose of these posts is an analysis, nothing more. Please do not come into these posts expecting me to either defend Barok van Zieks from haters, nor expecting me to encourage the hatred. - I’m using the Western release of The Great Ace Attorney Chronicles for these posts, but may refer to the original Japanese dialogue of Dai Gyakuten Saiban if needed to compare what’s said. This also means I’m using the localized names and localized romanization of the names to stay consistent. -It doesn’t matter one bit to me whether you like Barok van Zieks or dislike him. However, I will ask that everyone who comments refrains from attacking real, actual people.

Part 1 Part 2 Part 3 Part 4 Part 5 Part 6 Part 7 Part 8

How the turnabouts have turned! It's time for Twisted Karma and His Last Bow!

Episode 2-4: Twisted Karma and His Last Bow

With Van Zieks's tragic backstory (…) exposed, it's time to head on into waters we've charted before, waaay back in the very first Ace Attorney game: The Prosecutor becomes the Defendant. It all starts off with some shenanigans which appear to have very little to do with Van Zieks (the arrival of Mikotoba and Jigoku, the Red-headed League, a missing prison warder, etc.).. Ryu does still run into Van Zieks very briefly in Stronghart's office, with Susato noting that there appears to be an awful lot of tension in the air. I expect Van Zieks is questioning that decision to leave Genshin Asogi's son in his care, but even so, he's very civil towards Stronghart. Susato also notes that Van Zieks gives Ryu a cold stare as he leaves, with Ryu wondering what he's done to earn that. This may also be a result of him being besties with Kazuma, since Van Zieks had already buried the hatchet towards Ryu for the most part. When Ryu asks about the decision to leave Kazuma in Van Zieks's care, Stronghart explains it was to best keep an eye on this 'mysterious amnesiac with no identifying papers'. Well OK then. Stronghart also explains he made Kazuma wear a mask because he didn't want to “burden Van Zieks with tiresome explanations about why he had an Eastern appearance.” … I would assume the very simple explanation is that it's because he's of Eastern descent, Stronghart. Regardless, the Lord Chief Justice has high hopes for Kazuma's future and isn't at all bothered by the fact that the guy has gone missing for a little bit.

Things take a turn later when Gina Lestrade comes barging into 221B with some pretty shocking news. Inspector Gregson was murdered. Yes, THAT Inspector Gregson. The suspect has already been arrested:

It's true that to the average civilian like Gina, Van Zieks's name is pretty much synonymous to the Reaper (of the Old Bailey). Even so, to have her outright calling him by that title adds a sort of emotional distance that's really striking. Gina explains they caught him at the scene and there were several witnesses, but Ryu thinks to himself that there's no way Van Zieks would have taken Gregson's life. So naturally, we owe it to our good pal Gregson (who actually was just coming around and being nicer to Ryu) to find the truth. Time to go have a talk with Van Zieks in prison!

… Okay that's funny. Don't worry, Barok, one day we'll all look back on this and laugh. Anyway, Van Zieks says he's in the last place on earth he'd want to be, with the last person on earth he'd want to see. And this line can easily be misinterpreted as Van Zieks saying he hates Ryu more than anyone else in the world, but what he's actually saying is that Ryu is the last person he wishes would see him in this troublesome situation. Ryu says he couldn't very well not come, but Van Zieks tells him to go home since it has nothing to do with him. Susato interjects, pointing out that Gregson has helped them out on numerous occasions and so, they're indebted to him. She pleads for Van Zieks's help with the investigation and he's silent for a moment, only to say: “There's really nothing I can tell you.” Which I suppose means he doesn't think he has anything helpful to say. Ryu asks about what Van Zieks was reading when they came in and assumes it to be a case report. Van Zieks says the Yard wouldn't share case details with a suspect (keep that one in mind) and explains it's a letter from Albert. Dear Professor Harebrayne has arrived in Germany safely! Ryu notes that Van Zieks usually never minces his words, but they seem to have less bite than usual now. No wonder, really, since he's in prison for the murder of an old friend. Van Zieks asks how much they already know about the case, so the two of them go through the facts and Van Zieks says they're well-informed. He's got nothing to add, because... Well.

Oh, this is going to be another one of those cases, huh. Susato asks what Van Zieks was doing at the crime scene in the first place, but Van Zieks points out he doesn't need to answer that, as they aren't representing him. When asked who is representing him in court, he says it'd be anyone other than Ryu. That said, he doesn't actually have any representation because of his reputation as the Reaper. Sixteen people he's prosecuted have mysteriously died and now that he's actually been apprehended for a murder, that whole Reaper ordeal is sure to be thoroughly examined.

BOY, have we got news for you! When it's pointed out that Van Zieks didn't actually have anything to do with those mysterious deaths (right???), he replies that no one wants to know the true identity of that killer more than he does, but it seems things may come to a head before he can uncover the truth. Van Zieks basically tells Ryu to leave, but being the kind-hearted gentleman that he is, Ryu offers to advocate for him in court. Van Zieks asks whether Ryu trusts him, which is a pretty fair question to ask. He's built up so many racist scumbag points and has such a bad reputation in town, it would be weird for Ryu to trust him unconditionally. Luckily, Ryu has been paying attention just as much as I have; he's heard Van Zieks speak in court and seen the way he treats people (uhh, English citizens, anyway), so he doesn't believe this 'Reaper' has it in him to take a life. Unfortunately, Ryu also has to acknowledge that feelings can't be used as evidence in court. Van Zieks considers the offer gracious, but...

“Not the police, not the judiciary... And not you Nipponese.”

One more scumbag point for putting “you Nipponese” in its own category for no reason. Either way, this man has built up such high defensive walls, you could see them from three galaxies away. Trusting no one is a pretty drastic way of living. Ryu thinks to himself that there's a chasm between the two of them that's 'just too wide and too deep'.

As a sidenote, presenting the attorney armband doesn't lead to any interesting conversation this time, but we can also present the Red-headed League advertisement! Van Zieks surmises that if it were a Black-headed League, Ryu would join without delay, which Ryu then confirms. Van Zieks says that sadly, his hair is neither black nor red. He goes into a most curious identity crisis of sorts, where he looks quite anguished as he wonders which coloured league he should join instead. There have been several debates over his hair color, actually, from lavender to purple to grey. Regardless, Susato points out that “people are troubled by the most unexpected problems at times.” It is unexpected, since Van Zieks needs neither the money nor the company that he would get from joining any such league. It's just the principle of the matter, I suppose.

Over by the crime scene in Fresno Street, Gina gets a little razzled when she suspects Ryu is thinking of defending “that Reaper bloke”. Susato points out that if “Lord van Zieks” really is responsible for the crime, he'll be judged fairly in court. This gets Gina to calm down again, because she really wants to know the truth of what happened and much like Van Zieks, she must know that getting the truth is what Ryu does best. A bit of conversation later, Gina points out one more interesting thing; Gregson apparently held a lot of respect for 'the Reaper'. “I take my hat off to that fella,” were his exact words, apparently. Ryu is skeptical, as am I, because I've seen the way Gregson talks about Van Zieks behind his back.

Gina explains that's exactly why he respected Van Zieks. That's... a little weird and ambiguous. So either he respected Van Zieks's ability to stand tall despite all the public scorn, or he respected the fear he struck into people's hearts. There's one more option; Gina keeps talking about the Reaper instead of Van Zieks, so it's possible that Gregson was talking about the actual Reaper. This seems unlikely, though, since he didn't seem to enjoy being part of the Reaper organization.

And now that we know Van Zieks is the defendant, one might be wondering: Who is the prosecutor? Who is the antagonistic force who will try to stop Ryu from uncovering the truth? Well, we find him over in Stronghart's office. Apparently he took an express train back to London from wherever it was he's been these past few days.

YOOOOUUUU!!! Though before we can address his presence properly, we need to discuss the new case. Stronghart wastes no time asking Ryu and Susato whether they've heard “the sickening news about the Reaper's latest devilry.” Which stands out, to say the least, since Stronghart has always been a strong supporter of Van Zieks up until this point. When Susato points out that surely he doesn't believe it, Stronghart says he believes only in facts, which all point to the unavoidable accusal of Lord van Zieks. Someone sure had a quick turnaround when it comes to his number one prosecutor, geez... Stronghart points out the irony that there's no salvation for anyone prosecuted by the Reaper of the Bailey, and now the Reaper himself must stand in the dock. Just as Van Zieks had already alluded to, Stronghart now claims the public will want answers about those mysterious deaths. Ryu and Susato both point out that which had been rubbed into our faces several times already; Van Zieks denies any involvement, and also there have been several investigations into whether he had anything to do with it. Stronghart kind of brushes this off, though. Turns out, Van Zieks is being traded in for a newer model number one prosecutor: Kazuma Asogi! Which seems weird at first glance, since Kazuma is a defense attorney, but Stronghart considers that a bonus:

“A devastation combination, wouldn't you agree?”

I do agree. Granted, it seems Van Zieks had already figured out the defense's strategies too, he just never actively used them to his own advantage. It also turns out that Kazuma personally requested the prosecutor position for this trial. Susato thinks it's pretty unprecedented to grant a newcomer exchange student such a request, but Stronghart offers some petty excuse about how this way, it won't look like the judiciary are closing ranks. Kazuma, who assumes his friend will take on the defense, says he'll see how Ryu's skills have been honed after practicing law in England for so many months. (Uhh. Actually, bestie, it was only about two months of being a defense attorney and six months of disbarment.) Ryu notes that Kazuma is being hostile towards him and wonders why. On a final note, when asking Stronghart about the gun found at the crime scene, we're told that it's issued to all members of law enforcement, including prosecutors. Van Zieks claims to have lost his. That's a troubling claim indeed, because it's difficult to prove or disprove. GOSH, if only fingerprints were allowed in court.

As Ryu and Susato turn to leave, Kazuma stops them. He once again states he wants Ryu to witness this trial as the defense counsel, to “see how it ends”. Since Kazuma has a very distinct vision for how he wants it to end, I guess this means he intends to confront Ryu with Van Zieks's guilt and have his bestie see that a man like him is unworthy of his trust. Either that, or he expects Ryu to use this trial to find the truth of what really happened with the Professor ten years ago, just as he used Albert's trial to dig into that incident. Still though, this reads as pretty scummy to me, because it means he wants Ryu to lose a trial and lose some of his belief in his clients. In the trial itself, it seems to me that Kazuma desperately believes Van Zieks to be a horrible person deserving of the guilty verdict. Therefore, he in no way can hold hope that Ryu will prove him wrong (unlike what went down in case 2-3 with Albert). Anyway, Ryu says that Van Zieks would never put his fate in his hands.

“... It's not easy to see behind the facade sometimes.”

Case 2-3 already told us this, but it's nice to have it confirmed by someone who was closer to Van Zieks. Because remember, Kazuma spent three months by Van Zieks's side (and even fighting by his side), so of course he would know more about his personality than we do. Kazuma hands over a photograph of Barok when he was younger and

GOOD LORD, HE CAN SMILE. Or he could when he was younger, anyway. Kazuma states the picture was displayed in Gregson's office. What he's 'trying to say' is that if Ryu really thinks he can trust “the Reaper” (distancing choice of words again), he might find that some straight talking will change his view. I got the impression we've been straight talking Van Zieks ever since we first met him, but okay. Let's take the picture and back to the gaol we go! Van Zieks is once again reading from some paper and Ryu points out that either he's an incredibly slow reader or it's an incredibly long letter, but either way, Ryu might even be able to read English faster than him. Naturally, this was said loud enough for Van Zieks to overhear.

Scumbag point for hypocrisy, but also a scumbag point for “Nipponese”. When Ryu asks whether it's still Albert's letter he's reading, Van Zieks says he had the case report brought to him in secret. So wait, the Yard does share case details with its suspect? Hilarious. Once again, Van Zieks insists the situation has nothing to do with Ryu, up until the prosecutor's name is revealed to him. And so, the masked cardboard cutout student has become the master! Ryu notes that all the color drained from Van Zieks's face, which is pretty impressive when there's barely any color there to begin with. Ryu has the opportunity now to thrust the photograph into his face, so let's do that. He's immediately alarmed, since he assumed it to be lost and would never have expected Gregson to have it. When Ryu says that Gregson had a deep respect for him, he dismisses that as nonsense, only to correct himself. “There was a time things were like that.”

Van Zieks thanks Ryu for that nice glimpse into the past, and Ryu thinks to himself that there was a glimmer in Van Zieks's eyes- a brief twinkle. He considers that “an insight into the true nature of this man known to all as the stone-cold Reaper of the Bailey”, with “the true nature” being highlighted as orange. So this right here is undeniable; this is what the narrative is illustrating to us now. The true nature of Barok van Zieks is that of someone who was hopeful and jovial; kind-hearted, as Albert knew him. What we see now, that harsh exterior full of harsh words, is not his nature at all.

Van Zieks is more willing to talk now. He once again speaks of Klint, rehashing the same story we've heard several times already. Van Zieks claims there's not a single day where he doesn't curse the name Asogi. He considers it a cruel twist of fate that the man's son intends to crucify him in 'some kangaroo court'. Clearly, he doesn't think highly of the upcoming trial if he refers to it as a kangaroo court, but that's likely because he knows he isn't the real killer. When Ryu points out that he still doesn't understand why Stronghart apprenticed Kazuma to Van Zieks, the explanation is that “it's what he does”. Van Zieks believes that Stronghart knew Kazuma's true identity from the outset, but still provides no real explanation as to why Stronghart 'did what he did' and even assigned Kazuma as the prosecutor this time. Van Zieks goes on to contemplate the name Asogi some more and calls it 'the epitome of his bane'.

I've talked before about how utterly flawed it is that Van Zieks attributes Genshin's crime to his race and/or cultural upbringing and proceeds to tar every single Japanese person with the same brush. There's no need to go into this again; we all know it's wrong. Turns out, even Van Zieks knows it's wrong, but we'll get back to that momentarily. First, Van Zieks needs to talk about Klint even more. (good lord...) He explains that Klint van Zieks was hunting down a mass murderer and “assigned to the investigation as his partner was a certain visiting student dispatched by the Yard.” This was Genshin, of course, and I believe this is the first time it's said that he too was looking into the Professor case. So Van Zieks already mentioned in the previous case that the Japanese students had left a deep impact on him, and also that he once toasted friendship with a Japanese person, but now we have this:

“But none of us saw the true nature of the man.”

True nature is once again in orange here, but this time as a red herring. Van Zieks believes that the Professor murders were Genshin's true nature, when it isn't quite true at all. Regardless, since Van Zieks was still in university at the time the exchange students were in the country, I don't think he would've had that much contact with Genshin. I expect he encountered the man on rare occasion while Klint associated most with him. Every meeting was enough to foster this respect and friendship, though, so it's clear that young Van Zieks was easily influenced and had a very open mind towards a foreign exchange student. But then, that's what makes the next portion of the story all the more damaging.

“My esteemed brother... The people I believed in... And any semblance of right prevailing over wrong!”

As Van Zieks also already alluded to in the previous case, he found himself in a very dark place. That isn't surprising. Every positive thing Van Zieks knew in his life, from his family to his closest friends, was ripped away from him in extremely close succession. What must've been the final nail in the coffin was Genshin outright admitting to his crimes. It erased all doubt that perhaps there was some sort of misunderstanding or a frame job. Going over everything Van Zieks has said so far, it seems he didn't just blame Genshin for the tremendous loss he suffered; he blamed himself. He must believe that his trust in Genshin blinded him to this supposed 'true nature', just as it must've also blinded Klint, and that the whole tragedy could've been prevented if only he'd been more cautious. So now, in present day, he no longer trusts anyone. He outright says so.

Van Zieks goes on to talk about how he was the one who prosecuted the Professor. Since he'd only just graduated, such a thing usually wouldn't be allowed, but he “beleaguered the ascribed prosecutor until he consented.” This person was Mael Stronghart, who back then was apparently still no more than a prosecutor. A highly accomplished one, but a prosecutor nonetheless. Since Klint was the Director of Prosecutions (or Chief Prosecutor???) at the time, that means he actually ranked above Stronghart. Interesting. Regardless, since Stronghart agreed to let Van Zieks lead the prosecution and instead only acted as an advisor, Van Zieks now feels indebted to him. That certainly explains why he's usually so good about following Stronghart's orders and not asking questions.

“And, of all things, as a lawyer.”

Ahhh, this is the part where Ryu enters the chronology. Our protagonist points out that he's felt Van Zieks's animosity since the first time he faced him in the courtroom; his obvious deep loathing of Japanese people. And here comes perhaps one of the most important, yet most overlooked lines Van Zieks will ever utter in these games:

“But for so many years, that hatred had festered inside me, I could no longer control it.”

So here, Van Zieks admits to two things. First of all, he admits that he was wrong to hold such deep loathing and by extension, to give that loathing a voice. He's a man of logic, after all. To cling to something which he refers to as illogical is about as wrong as one could get. Not only that, he admits that this was an unstoppable force he should have controlled, but was too weak to do so. The hatred overpowered him and did away with common sense. He behaved stupidly and irrationally because for ten years, hatred and negativity was all he knew. But what's even more striking here is Ryu's answer, which is also often overlooked:

Ryu, bless his heart, doesn't blame Van Zieks for succumbing to this weakness. Bear in mind, he's the victim here. Van Zieks wouldn't have encountered many other Japanese people in those ten years, if at all. This means the first person he lashed out against was Ryu. Naturally, Ryu can't speak for Susato or Soseki, who received their own verbal assaults and might have different opinions on the matter. Ryu is just one man, but in our narrative, he's the main protagonist and the main target of these outbursts. Is it misleading and perhaps even problematic in the grand scheme of things to have the protagonist sympathize with such motivation? Well, that depends on many different factors. There's no easy answer for this because it's a nuanced, cultural sort of thing. Personally, I was a bit bothered by it, but not to the point that it ruined the experience for me.

Van Zieks admits that just as the Japanese were the bane of his life, Kazuma Asogi must believe Van Zieks to be the bane of his. He is, after all, the Reaper who sent his father to the gallows. Van Zieks thinks that Kazuma intends to take revenge in court and... Really, this is true.

There's a quick bit of conversation about Gregson now. Turns out, the only reason the Professor was caught at all was because Gregson forced an autopsy on Klint despite it being considered the highest taboo at the time. Van Zieks says that as a result of Gregson's powerful conviction, he could avenge his brother's death. He looks quite torn, a bit pained. He must believe he owes Gregson something for this. The conversation then moves on to Van Zieks's revolver, which he claims to have misplaced an undetermined amount of time ago. “I must have stowed it somewhere, I suppose. Or left it somewhere, perhaps.” Van Zieks clearly doesn't think highly of firearms as a weapon, since he's constantly carrying a sword around instead. Susato points out that Ryu has a talent for misplacing things in common with Van Zieks, which leads to one more scumbag outburst.

… Dude. Come on. You just admitted it was illogical. You came so far! Scumbag point for you. Still, as the conversation rounds to a close, Van Zieks utters the words “Mister... Naruhodo”, much to Ryu's surprise. This is the first time he's actually said Ryu's name! Van Zieks once again reiterates that he's lost all confidence in England's judiciary system. He doesn't trust the police, the judiciary or lawyers. Even so, there's still one thing he's willing to believe in.

“That which you see in the eyes of another across the courtroom: a simple determination to know the truth. From the very first time we clashed in the Bailey almost a year ago now... I couldn't deny it, even though I dearly wished I could. 'Here is a loathsome Japanese... who has absolute integrity as a lawyer.' There are only two other men I've known with that same look in their eyes: my brother, Klint. … And Genshin Asogi.”

This is interesting. So at first when he saw that look in Ryu's eyes, he must've been reminded of Genshin. And again, this is why he directed such hatred towards Ryu; he saw someone who wasn't alive anymore. But now he recalls that Klint also had that same gaze, and so he wants to believe that Ryu is not similar to a deceitful murderer, he's instead similar to his beloved brother. (Boy is he going to have to reevaluate how he judges people when he finds out that his beloved brother was the deceitful murderer.) Van Zieks says that when he saw the photograph, he was reminded of a time when he could laugh, free of the shackles of mistrust which plague him now. This is very relevant since Van Zieks indeed can't laugh anymore. We never see him do it. He can't even smile.

“But at times the mire into which I've sunk makes it almost impossible to breathe.”

Someone please get this man to a professional therapist. If he means that in a more literal sense and he does occasionally feel like he can't breathe, that's telltale signs of panic attacks. It could just be, of course, that he's being overdramatic and the “impossible to breathe” bit is just fanciful wordplay to go with the mire analogy. Still though, considering he's also mentioned being in a dark place and that he's willing to die so long as it serves a useful purpose, and that he drinks his wine to stave off tedium... He's clearly depressed. But then, he seems to know it. He acknowledges that the way he is now is not the way things should be, and that he needs to fight to overcome it. And so:

“... In tomorrow's trial... Will you advocate for me?”

Boom. Swallowed his pride and turned to Ryu for help because he knows it's what's best for him. He no longer trusts anyone, but he's willing to trust Ryu because once he starts opening up again and has that trust repaid, then perhaps things can gradually go back to the way things were when he was younger. Mind, he still hasn't apologized for his actions, but that doesn't change that Ryu at least is willing to extend a hand to Van Zieks. It's a little sad that Susato doesn't properly form her own opinion on this and instead just goes along with whatever Ryu says. I would've liked to know just how she feels about Van Zieks's attitude and whether or not he deserves to be helped. She doesn't object to it, at least, and since Susato usually always speaks her mind, I can only assume she genuinely agrees with Ryu's sentiments.

The next day, in the defendant's lobby, it's remarked there's a 'menacing tension' in the air and Ryu surmises out loud it's the result of the menacing appearance of the defendant. Well-deserved, that remark. Touché. Van Zieks asks him for a little more courtesy in a polite enough manner, but considering the lack of courtesy he's shown Ryu over the past 8 months, that's hypocritical. He informs Ryu that this is a closed trial without a jury, which bums me out because it means no more Summation Examination. I would've liked to see Asogi react to that. (S)Holmes comes in and has the weirdest little banter with Van Zieks that I honestly can't... really decipher. There's several things about it that really strike me as being off:

- “And I you. I see London's celebrated great detective is as active as ever.”

- “Oh, you exaggerate, my dear fellow. Compared to my paltry engagements with a few trivial cases... The Reaper's overbearing presence is a far greater deterrent to the black roots of crime in our capital. And whilst I may not agree with your methods... There is at least one point on which I would readily commend you.”

- “What an honour. And that would be...?”

- “Your eye for a good lawyer, sir. […] Behind this lawyer there is a very great mind. My own.”

Alright, so... First of all, we know (S)Holmes is super arrogant and would never refer to his past cases as “trivial” in all sincerity. Plus, it's established that he's very weird with compliments, such as referring to Gregson as “the best of those blunderers of the Yard”, so complimenting Van Zieks directly on the effect he has on crime feels off. Aside from that, (S)Holmes addresses Van Zieks as the Reaper and continues to talk about 'his methods', when it's already been established (S)Holmes doesn't believe Van Zieks has anything to do with the Reaper killings. Taking all that into account, I can only really assume that the first half of this above conversation is (S)Holmes being weirdly passive aggressive towards Van Zieks, with Van Zieks being passive aggressive in turn. It really, truly feels as if there was some sort of backstory between these two that they had to scrap at the last second. Regardless, the exchange ends with (S)Holmes warning Van Zieks that this will be “quite a trial”.

Gina Lestrade shows up with Yujin Mikotoba (….. when did they meet???), saying they intend to watch the trial, and I am very impressed with how (S)Holmes manages to disappear from the scene and not say a word when his old partner arrives. Anyway, Gina looks Ryu square in the eye and asks him why he agreed to take Van Zieks on. Everyone's saying it was him who killed Gregson. Considering everyone was saying it was her who killed Pop Windibank six months ago, you'd think she might want to tone down her attitude, but she's clearly in mourning and lashing out. See? People who are hurting can say insensitive things. Ryu insists he doesn't believe it to be true, but Gina demands to know that if it wasn't him, then who?

“An' if it turns out it was 'im wot killed the boss... Then God 'elp 'im!”

It's interesting to remember that during The Unspeakable Story, Gina wasn't afraid of Van Zieks for his Reaper reputation. She didn't believe in the curse and didn't think she would end up like the other defendants. Now, she absolutely no longer gives a damn whether Van Zieks is the mysterious Reaper or not. She only thinks he might be a murderer who took away her mentor and that's what has her judge him so fiercely. Van Zieks remarks on her fiery eyes and tells her that the culprit does indeed deserve every inch of her loathing. “At least that may be some solace to the deceased.” So here, in a roundabout way, it rather looks as if Van Zieks is sympathizing with Gina's anger. At the very least, he's condoning it, just not towards himself.

Entering the courtroom, it becomes clear very fast just how serious this trial will become. Just as was alluded to before, the judge confirms that the 'Reaper of the Old Bailey' has been undermining Her Majesty's justice system and therefore, the people will demand answers on this matter. Ryu thinks to himself the trial will be a lot more far-reaching than just Gregson's murder. Sure enough, Kazuma is at the prosecutor's bench and ready to get that vengeance Van Zieks referred to in jail. Shockingly, the first witness he summons is actually Van Zieks himself. The judge is surprised, but Kazuma explains that as a prosecutor, Van Zieks believes in the oath of office he's taken; he'll be compelled to tell the truth. Because contrary to what happened in Memoirs of the Clouded Kokoro, Van Zieks is against perjury! (I WILL NEVER GET OVER WHAT HAPPENED WITH SHAMSPEARE!) Sure enough, he takes the stand and Kazuma says the court would like to hear him explain some things away.

He really is just brutally honest, isn't he? Both in his courtroom methods and in how he shows his emotions. He doesn't sugarcoat, he doesn't beat around the bush, he definitely doesn't lie... At most, he may withhold some information. Unfortunately, his testimony is mostly useless. The judge remarks that he didn't want to imagine this day would come, but ever since Van Zieks became known as the Reaper, he's been dreading it. The judge, our neutral ground, seems to be convinced that Van Zieks may have actually done the deed. That's not good. Kazuma acts all smug, saying that Van Zieks indeed hasn't explained anything away and that his testimony barely qualifies as an excuse. Van Zieks notes that his 'mute apprentice' has a way with words. Meanwhile, Ryu thinks to himself that Kazuma isn't behaving like himself, which is a sentiment they'll keep repeating throughout the case. … I gotta be honest here, I didn't notice all that much of a difference between this Kazuma and the one from the very first case of the game. I mean, come on, he sliced a man's hair off and cursed his descendants just for insulting Ryu. He's slightly more arrogant here, maybe, but since he was only the assistant there and is a leading counsel here, it makes sense for him to be more proactive and confident in his methods. Then again, I'm not a Kazuma expert; maybe there's something I'm missing.

In his testimony, Van Zieks revealed that he was investigating Gregson, but when pressed on it he won't admit the exact reason for it. He only says he'd identified a distinct possibility Gregson was involved in a case he was investigating. When asked how he even knew where Gregson would be, he openly admits to having stolen into his office and consulted his diary. (“Dear Diary, today I dropped my fish 'n chips on the way to Fresno Street-”) When told that illegally entering Gregson's office would warrant serious consequences, Van Zieks says he was aware of that risk.

The rest of the testimony is pressed without further hitches, though what did strike me as interesting is that at one point, Ryu suggests the gunshot might've originated from outside the room, but Van Zieks immediately says it's out of the question. He shoots the possibility down with evidence only he could have experienced (the bang sounded inside the room and he could smell gunpowder), and in doing so, only implicates himself further. Detrimentally honest, this one. Not only that, but he picked the gun up.

NO KIDDING that was carelessness. Is he related to Miles Edgeworth after all? Kazuma talks about how three street peddlers overheard the bang and burst through the door with some force. Van Zieks states they almost gave him a heart attack in the process (omg) and Ryu thinks to himself: “(But you're supposed to be the Reaper...)” C'mon Ryu, haven't you seen enough of this man by now to know he gets jarred easily?

When the testimony rounds to a close, things get interesting. Kazuma uses his defense attorney skills, as promised. He uses evidence from the Court Record to point out contradictions in Van Zieks's testimony, thereby 'proving he's lying'. Hey, what happened to Van Zieks believing in the oath of office and being compelled to tell the truth? Did Kazuma call Van Zieks to the stand just to expose him as a liar? He wins the judge over quite easily by illustrating these contradictions and casting doubt on Van Zieks's integrity. Tragic, because as Van Zieks says:

Van Zieks steps down from the stand and disappears for the remainder of the trial day. He doesn't even show up during intermission in the defendant's lobby. Characters do still talk about him, though!

I mean... He ain't lyin'. At one point, Kazuma utters the words “the defence is fated to lose. And the prosecution to win,” which once again confirms that Kazuma basically asked Ryu to take part in an 'unwinnable' trial. Which, y'know, is technically fine. Losing a trial isn't the end of the world, especially when the defendant (in Kazuma's eyes) is actually guilty. Still though, personally asking Ryu to take on Van Zieks just so he can watch the man be exposed as a killer is kind of... Kazuma, sir, are you also unable to control your hatred and having it lash out in illogical ways? Is that a parallel with Van Zieks I spy?

The rest of the trial isn't directly related to Van Zieks. It's just a whole bunch of roundabout arguing with street peddlers, red-headed scammers and the revelation that one of those peddlers is actually Daley Vigil, the missing former prison warder. Despite knowing of the dangers, Kazuma asks Ryu to help him forcefully break some of the man's black psyche-locks (c'mon, we all know that's what's impeding his memories) and they send the man to the hospital as a result. Welp. Unveiling the truth is becoming increasingly dangerous in this game and that's really upping the stakes for us.

Into the next investigation day we go! Ryu surmises that it's clear now “Van Zieks definitely didn't do it.” Even so, there are some unanswered questions about the man. What was he even doing at the crime scene and what's with that investigation into Gregson he didn't want to talk about in court? Heading on over to the Chief Justice's office, we overhear him pressuring Kazuma into 'continuing the trial as instructed'. Once he takes note of Ryu and the others, he tells them that he wanted Van Zieks's trial concluded that day and blames 'Asogi's unwelcome inquiries' for it taking longer than necessary. Stronghart's becoming increasingly ominous, here... I don't know for certain why he doesn't just go the extra mile to have Van Zieks proven innocent so he can keep using his Reaper tool to intimidate the masses. I suppose it's because with Gregson dead, he's lost his most important strategist in the killings and the tool of the Reaper's curse can't be used as easily anymore. Assassins probably come a dime a dozen, so Shinn can be replaced, but Gregson... Not so much. Ryu asks Stronghart whether Kazuma truly believes Van Zieks to be the Reaper, but Stronghart says he wouldn't know. He once again talks about the history of the Reaper with its very long run of coincidental deaths and tells us nothing new or interesting.

To prison we go, to visit Van Zieks himself! He's reading a book now, but we're never told what it is. He tries to ignore the visitors, but just as always, eventually comes up to the bars to talk.

YOU FREAKIN- I CAN'T- WHY- How many more times must we teach you this lesson, old man?!!! Thankfully, even Ryu is fed up at this point.

Finally. He spoke up. I've seen a lot of people criticize the fact that Ryu never properly confronts Van Zieks with the damage he's been doing, and on the one hand I would agree. Calling people out on their bullshit is a very useful step in having them notice their mistakes. However, I'd be remiss if I didn't point out that is also a very Western view. It's very easy for us to think that Ryu should stand up for himself and call Van Zieks a prejudiced little tosser who needs to think before he speaks, but that simply isn't part of his character. There may be several reasons to explain why he doesn't confront Van Zieks more firmly, but I'd like to focus on just two. The first is that Ryu is an exchange student who came to England as a 'guest' and is facing not just one racist. Not even five or ten. Everywhere he goes, he's surrounded by people just like Van Zieks. We've seen it in the judge, we've seen it in the jurors, we've seen it in Gregson and in witnesses... Ryu is a minority in a very literal sense, since there's only one other Japanese person (two if we count Soseki) we know of in this entire city. There's a very natural, very understandable defense mechanism which may kick in when surrounded by potentially dangerous individuals, and that is to withdraw; to be as quiet as possible and to attract as little trouble as possible, since 'they outnumber you'. Bonus points for the extreme difference in social standing between Ryu and Van Zieks.

There's one other thing which adds to the above. Ryu was written to be your everyday Japanese person, and their view on confrontation is quite different from our own. I remembered this from a job interview I once had with a Japanese company and looked into it again to refresh my memory: Japanese people are non-confrontational. It's very important for them to maintain a sort of harmony during conversation and therefore, they'll rarely utter negative sentiments, such as criticism, in a way that will cause embarrassment to the person they're addressing. Instead, they employ something often referred to as indirect communication. “The pattern of Japanese indirect communication uses far less words to convey intent in a more subtle manner. Indirect communication uses expression, posture, and tone of voice of the speaker to draw meaning from the actual conversation.” This is very deeply ingrained into the Japanese culture and, if the sources I reviewed are correct, it goes all the way back to the feudal days. Mind, this attitude isn't even limited to Japan. I've been told there's several other countries who adopt that very same attitude and if you cause someone else to lose face, it can have some very severe repercussions for you. Kazuma is a bit more outspoken than Ryu, for example when they face Jezail, but this makes sense also, since Asogi was written to be more progressive. It seems to me that Ryu has been using indirect communication quite often already and, since Van Zieks is woefully unequipped to read this type of communication, Ryu has now finally resorted to something more direct. It's still not a sharp call-out, but rather, the above line reads to me as something in-between direct and indirect communication. And it works.

HELL FROZE OVER! We've done it, lads! Or, as Iris puts it:

So even the rest of the cast is acknowledging this is a big deal and we've made tremendous progress. Could someone else have confronted Van Zieks in a more direct, more Western way before this point? Sure. But would he have listened? The judge has already snarked at him several times during trials and it's always been brushed off as nothing. The only person he might've listened to would've been Albert, but what is the narrative significance of having a side character confront Van Zieks? There isn't one. This was a very impactful moment where Ryu himself resorted to a more Western tactic to get his point across and Van Zieks, in turn, finally uttered an apology. So now we get to have an earnest conversation with the man at last. Van Zieks says he was impressed; not by Ryu but by Kazuma. On first glance, this seems like a mean thing to say, but... Van Zieks is already intimately familiar with Ryu's performance in the courtroom. Why would he still be impressed by that? Kazuma, however, he's never seen in action before. Van Zieks thinks it's all rather “sardonic”.

It's called a cruel irony, Barok. A common tool in storytelling. He himself considers it “retribution for having played the part of the Reaper all these years”. So once again it's discussed how the Reaper minimizes the amount of crime in the capital and since that's a goal Van Zieks is committed to, he never said anything to disprove the rumors. Ryu insists that someone else is profiting off Van Zieks's silence on the matter and is basically using him as a scapegoat. As it turns out, Van Zieks wasn't quite as passive about the matter as he's led us to believe.

Hm. Alright, so he thinks it's good the Reaper's curse is reducing crime in London, but clearly he wants the Reaper organization brought to justice. In a way, he's profiting off these 'accidental deaths' since the fear that comes from them aligns with his goal of crime reduction, but he doesn't actively condone the Reaper murders and wants them halted. Since there's so much accurate information about the accused used in the killings, Van Zieks surmised a while ago that someone from Scotland Yard must've been involved in the killings. It's taken him “many years” to identify the central figure in the organization: Tobias Gregson. Naturally, everyone is shocked. We knew Gregson! And sure, he wasn't exactly a kind person, but he certainly didn't appear to be a killer. He was very rough around the edges, but from what we'd been led to believe, he had a good heart. … A decent heart. Mediocre, one might say. Ryu asks whether the reason Van Zieks was investigating Gregson was to expose him as the Reaper, but Van Zieks repeats the notion that the Reaper is not a single person. He doesn't have a doubt, though, that Gregson was a key member of the organization who did all of the planning. Believe it or not, Gregson was the brains behind the killings; the tactician who investigated and plotted, then left the dirty work to an assassin by the name of Asa Shinn. (LOCALIZATION WHY)

So now that we have this information, we can come to a very interesting conclusion. Both Gregson and Shinn are dead now, so by Van Zieks's reasoning, the Reaper is dead. You'd think this is good, but it does in fact make it very difficult to find the truth. Rather, Van Zieks believes that the truth died with Gregson (he hinted as much twice already) and while the seasoned Ace Attorney player knows it won't be impossible to expose a dead person as a killer, it'd be a hectic ordeal. The seasoned Great Ace Attorney player will know the Reaper hierarchy extends just a bit higher and the two who died are only pawns, but... Y'know. Approaching this from a first-time-player point of view, you'll know things will get troublesome.

There's another topic of conversation where Van Zieks once again addresses how sharp Kazuma is in court. He didn't miss a thing.

OUCH. So when Ryu first arrived, Van Zieks saw Genshin whenever he looked at him, not only due to his roots but due to 'the look in his eyes when searching for the truth'. Now, he sees Genshin in Kazuma, which surely makes a lot more sense. Van Zieks goes on to say that it's true some of the aristocracy from 10 years ago were problematic and abusing their power. “In a way, Asogi was carving out a canker from society that we British couldn't deal with ourselves.” So here, he sounds almost complimentary of the Professor's actions- specifically Asogi's actions. As if it would've all been well and good, were it not for the Professor's final victim. “But that's precisely why it makes no sense. Klint van Zieks was a noble and upstanding man. He wasn't corrupt.”

Remember way back in The Unspeakable Story when I surmised that Van Zieks boiled Genshin's actions down to his race in order to avoid the belief that there might've been a reason his brother was killed? We see it here again. Van Zieks is in doubt. He may say vocally that “it makes no sense”, but that line in itself is already telling. The fact that he acknowledges it and draws it into question implies to us that he's skeptical of the story. Deep down, he knows something is amiss. He knows there's some sort of explanation he's missing, but if he were to dig too deeply into it, he'd have to acknowledge that perhaps his brother was corrupt. And this still isn't all of it. There's one more thing Van Zieks has to discuss before we can round this conversation to a close. Ten years ago, shortly after Klint died, Genshin saved his life.

There's that phrasing again. “True nature”. It's not in orange this time, but it's there all the same. Van Zieks is convinced that Genshin is the one who had a hidden true nature. In this story, we learn that 'the scum of London' had already targeted him several times even before he became known as the Reaper, simply because of who he was and who his brother was. JEESH. Harsh. So on the night in question, a couple of thugs also tried to kill him (allegedly) but Genshin stepped in to protect him. Genshin became lightly wounded as a result. This is the part where I would have expected them to explain Van Zieks's scars, but he never mentions being wounded himself, so we can't be sure this is when it happened. Curious. This was the perfect opportunity and they let it slide. So anyway, two days after that incident, Genshin was arrested.

Some more telling lines here. Van Zieks thinks he'd never recount the story to anyone; not because there's no need to tell it. It's because it must be difficult to talk about. On its own, that might be a farfetched conclusion I wouldn't make, but Ryu confirms it with his follow-up line: “Thank you... for confiding in me.” We can take this line to mean exactly what it says; Van Zieks confided something painful. He let down some more walls. Growth!

So with all this out of the way, there's a whole load more investigation to do before this case is over. Most of it has to do with Genshin's will, a mysterious trunk belonging to Gregson, the missing time of death on the autopsy report... Nothing too relevant to Van Zieks's character. However, if we go into the prosecutor's office and examine things while Kazuma is there, we do get some fun tidbits about how Van Zieks wouldn't trust anyone else to touch his things and would rearrange it all himself whenever needed. From the sound of it, Van Zieks is very meticulous and a loner, which aligns with what we know about him. Some more conversation later, we reach the topic of the Reaper with Kazuma. He agrees that Gregson was definitely involved in the Reaper organization, but there's one thing that's more important. “Who's been giving orders to the Inspector?” In my eyes, it's a bit of a stretch to assume with certainty anyone was giving orders; Gregson might've just taken up the vigilante justice by himself and found some way to pay Shinn enough money to get in on it. Kazuma insists, though, that Van Zieks is 'the real Reaper'. We as the audience already know that's nonsense, we know Kazuma is wrong. Or perhaps we might think that if somehow Van Zieks pulled the wool over our eyes and Kazuma is correct, that'd be one heck of a wild twist. Kazuma gives no real reason why he believes this, he only goes on to say that ten years ago, it was Van Zieks who 'decided his father must be a mass murderer'. Shockingly, Susato is the one to jump in here and outright say to Kazuma that he's wrong; that Van Zieks only saw that 'justice was done as the law dictates' and he wasn't to blame for Genshin's execution. Kazuma insists that people condemn people and the law is just a tool they use for it. So I suppose that's exactly what he's doing right now. He's condemning Van Zieks, just as Van Zieks once condemned Genshin. We're cycling! And my main question now is this: If Stronghart had been the prosecutor in the Professor's trial instead, would Kazuma be just as vengeful towards him? Because remember, it's people who condemn people. This implies that anyone who had taken on the job of prosecutor at that time is the one who 'decided that Genshin must've been a murderer' and would need to take responsibility in Kazuma's eyes. Kazuma's beef isn't with Van Zieks personally, it's with the prosecutor who used that tool of the law and also evidence.

HAHAHAAA! HAH! If you align this screenshot next to the “Klint van Zieks was a noble and upstanding man” line, you get a wonderful parallel. These two prosecutors are both dead wrong about their beloved family, and they're about to find out in the worst way possible.

One murder mystery spread out over two episodes? You bet! Stay tuned for the last case, The Resolve of Ryunosuke Naruhodo!

#dgs #dgs spoilers #tgaa #tgaa spoilers #barok van zieks #I can't believe I managed to cram it all into one post #phew #but this was a big one

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musclesandhammering · 3 years

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Loki (2021) Positivity from an Anti

Ok so all of my mutuals know I’m extremely anti-Loki (2021), anti-sylki, and anti-sylvie. But at a certain point, even we antis get tired of all the negativity. So! Here’s some Loki series commentary in the opposite direction! This is a list of all the things about the show that I loved :)

Also adding a disclaimer that all of this is just my opinion and some of my fellow antis (or even people who liked the show) might disagree, and that’s fine! I’ve been planning this post for awhile. I always say in my other posts that I don’t entirely hate the show and I wanted to be a little more specific about what I think are its good aspects. Feel free to leave your thoughts!

• Mobius is a gem (Owen Wilson owns my whole heart) and his relationship with Loki is so so great. He’s not one-dimensional at all, he has conflicted loyalty and is morally complex, and he has the tragic backstory- which makes him a perfect choice for eventually becoming Loki’s first genuine friend.

• The casting was really really great. Lots of women and people of color. Most of the female actresses (as well as the males) are over 30, which isn’t very common and is fantastic!

• Superb acting all around. I can’t think of a single scene where the actors under or oversold it.

• Beautiful set design, incredible cgi, and gorgeous cinematography overall. It looked more like a movie than a tv show, which is really good.

• Kang being the big bad was a huge plus for me. Johnathan Majors was perfect in the role, his vibes were immaculate, and I was honestly pretty worried that the man behind the curtain would end up being another Loki variant, which imo would’ve been boring and predictable and counter-productive, so it was a big relief when that didn’t happen.

• I like that it sets up a bunch of future marvel movies, rather than being contained to its own little world. It gives it more importance and (hopefully) will encourage writers to not just toss Loki’s character aside in future projects.

• All the Loki variants were delightful. All of them except Sylvie. Kid Loki has my heart. Boastful Loki is a fashion icon. Alligator Loki is a savage. President Loki is the superior variant. Classic Loki became my fav character in less than half an episode.

• It showed some more variety in Loki’s magic. A lot of his powers we’ve seen before, but it feels like they were portrayed a bit more blatantly in the show. The energy blasts, the telekinesis, the teleportation… Outstanding.

• It also implied that Loki has the potential to be waaaay more powerful than he knows he is right now, which? Yes.

• Some of the quotes- and the themes behind them- are just profound as hell. Such as:

“I think we’re stronger than we realise.”

“It’s never too late to change.”

“You can be whoever you wanna be, even someone good.”

“We’re Lokis. We survive. It’s what we do.”

“Loki, God of Outcasts.”

“The universe wants to break free, that’s why it manifests chaos.”

• Technically Loki was Marvel’s first canon lgbt (bi) character, which is a win. His genderfluidity is also technically canon, even if it wasn’t really acknowledged on-screen.

• There were a lot of throwback references to Thor 1, Avengers, and Thor The Dark World. Which I loved.

• Sylvie’s so pretty. Her hair and makeup and costume were all perfect.

• Big fan of Loki finally getting Laevateinn.

• Sufficiently slutty imagery, courtesy of a female director (Loki in a collar, kneeling to Sif, President Loki looking down into the bunker, the hair flips)

• The music was Excellent Wonderful and Superb.

• I love that Loki being a good singer is now canon.

• I love that Asgardians having their own language is now canon (even if it’s basically just Icelandic).

• I also love that they disproved all of those “Loki was a shy nerdy wallflower pre-canon” theories in Episode 3. The drinking/eating/singing scene was fun, if a bit wacky.

• There’s a million different reasons why Loki does what he does, especially in regards to the New York attack (I’m literally writing a huge meta on them), but somehow I never considered that Loki being desperate for control was one of them. It makes a lot of sense, and I always love getting new insights into his motivations.

• I love that Loki finally outright acknowledged that he doesn’t enjoy hurting people. We Been Knew™️ but it’s still nice to hear it out loud from his own mouth.

• The TVA outfit wasn’t as hideous as some people make it out to be. It could’ve been A Look, even. You know, if he’d just accessorised a little better. And kept the jacket on. And not gotten sweaty. And not gotten dirty. And maybe had at least one other costume change… But it had potential, though!!

• Even though I despise the Obvious One, I did actually like some of the other romance crumbs they tossed us (sifki, Loki x the flight attendant).

• The whole DB Cooper thing was iconic idc idc.

• Loki’s hyper sort of overly excited puppy attitude in episode 2 was actually pretty refreshing and funny (for awhile). And now I can headcanon him as adhd, yeehaw.

• “We’re all villains here.” That quote was iconic, my favourite one in the show. And the entire theme that it summarised was really great as well. When you think about it, every single main character in this series has been the villain at one point or another. I mean, I know all marvel characters do bad things etc, but none of the Heroes are ever narratively categorised as Bad. This show did just that with all of them, though. . Loki was framed as the psychopath that attacked New York. Sylvie was framed as the murderous fugitive. The TVA/Ravonna/Mobius were framed as the murderous fascists. Kang was framed as the crazy totalitarian. It’s made clear that all the Loki variants were the villains of their stories.

However, every single main character in the series is also framed as the Hero at a certain point. Loki is framed as the main protagonist who throws a wrench in the TVA’s dastardly plans. Sylvie is framed as the persevering freedom fighter who wants to take down the fascists. The TVA/Mobius/Ravonna are framed as the ones who maintain order for the greater good. Kang is framed as the weird but ultimately benevolent wise man who’s just trying to prevent something worse from happening. The Loki variants are framed as generous allies who befriend the main character and help him on his journey.

Everyone in this equation is openly acknowledged by the narrative to be morally corrupt, but not entirely morally bankrupt. There are no Straightforward Hero Figures (like the Avengers) in this entire scenario at all, and that makes for a super interesting dynamic that marvel has never done before. So yes: “We’re all villains here.” But also: “No one bad is ever truly bad, and no one good is ever truly good.” I loved that.

• Even if it wasn’t really enough imo, I still treasure the crumbs we got of Loki being competent and capable (him putting the collar on B-15, him figuring out Sylvie’s hiding place, him teaching himself to enchant on the fly while fighting a giant cloud beast of eldritch proportions).

• I love that B-15 was the one who stepped in and saved the day in Episode 4, when we all thought it was gonna be Mobius. What a queen.

• Marvel usually has a bit of a problem with creating compelling and memorable side characters. But aside from Sylvie, I genuinely got attached to every single character in this show. Like Casey, C-20? I was seriously emotionally invested in them and they were only in like 2 episodes. Wtf.

• Introducing the TVA storyline in the Loki series specifically was a really good move. I’m not saying they executed it well, just that it had a ton of potential. A lot of people have wondered why marvel even thought to put those two (the TVA and Loki) together, when they had literally nothing to do with each other, nothing in common, and essentially no connection at all. But when you think about it, it’s a really interesting twist on both of those stories. Forcing the embodiment of destructive chaos and the pillar of rigid order to interact could make for some seriously entertaining and compelling television. And as far as meshing these two completely unrelated entities together goes, I thought they did it pretty well- at least just the bare bones of the story (loki being arrested by the TVA and being one of their most common variants).

So that’s it! If you guys (fellow antis) wanna add stuff you liked, feel free. If anyone wants to discuss (or debate) my list, feel free to do that too!

#loki series 2021 #loki laufeyson #anti sylvie #loki meta #loki odinson #loki #loki series

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kaminohana · 3 years

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the meme man full analysis

Yeehaw here we go. Analysis of Mikoto Kayano’s video and song, along with some theories about the many themes and symbols in the video. Note: If there’s any other supplemental material for him out there, I haven’t read it. This is just an analysis with the music video we were given. If I happen to miss stuff that was mentioned before, I may talk about it in another post lmao

I was SUPER invested in this video as I watched it and soon realized “Oh shit, I think Mikoto’s plural”. Cuz, you know, I’m plural too (not disclosing what kind) and it felt SO good to see some actual parallels to stuff I go through- though of course not to Mikoto’s degree.

That said, I feel I should make a disclaimer in passing: yes, portraying your only plural character as homicidal ain’t the best representation. But, you know, we’ve seen other cases like that in Milgram so I’m just gonna leave it at that. Personally, I’m not that offended because the execution is SO top-notch. Though, hey, I totally understand how this can be very frustrating to other systems to see plurality depicted in such an unhealthy light- if it’s not for you, it’s not for you.

Keep in mind the point of the Milgram series is to make you uncomfortable in so quickly incriminating someone; if you’re hesitating to determine someone as guilty, hey, that’s probably intended and good! It’s about personal decision, so I’m not going to judge you one way or the other in voting. I just find it fascinating how these videos can put us in such conflict. This is all just my own perspective, BTW, so if you disagree with some of these points, good! I’m just hoping to share my thoughts since I can make a lot of connections. I’m by no means an expert in plurality or tarot, I just have some background in both and decided to try my hand at this analysis, so I really don’t the final say on what’s going on in the video.

Now, onto the actual video analysis.

I’m sticking with the basic idea that Mikoto is split into two parts; his more loveable, gentler side, which I referred to in another post as Softboy Mikoto, and the more violent side which may be acting as a catharsis to his frustrations. I referred to this side previously as the Devil alter, as he is depicted with the Devil major arcana tarot card. I can see how this could be taken badly, so for now I’m just going to refer to him as the shadow alter. There are many themes of duality in the video, most commonly with the symbol of the half moon which appears so many times. Shadow of the moon etc etc. I’ll be bringing this up several times as I analyze the lyrics. I’ll be breaking down the lyrics as evidence to support the idea that Mikoto is plural, and to show how softboy Mikoto (and shadow alter Mikoto) view this particular relationship and how this culminates in murder. Sometimes I refer to Mikoto (as a whole), softboy Mikoto, or shadow alter Mikoto depending on what I’m trying to describe in the below.

First piece: the title. MeMe. Me x2. A dead giveaway, like Umbilical. Also, it can be a meme, which is interesting taking the definition of the word meme in this context: “an element of a culture or system of behavior passed from one individual to another by imitation or other nongenetic means” (Oxford Dictionaries). HMMMM. I know memes are generally within the context of a community, but I think it’s interesting to actually apply this to Mikoto. What exactly is being passed on? Could we argue that Mikoto’s frustrations from one of his parts is being passed on to the other? Interesting to think about, though it may not be relevant.

Going into the lyrics:

So from here I’m guessing there was a point in Mikoto’s life where his plurality was not an issue; or, potentially, there was a time before his split. These were the good times.

Playing dead vs. being alive – representing duality. May refer to how, when one side has their way, the other is locked away in the headspace with no control, thus feeling like being dead. In the context of “if only”, perhaps he’s wishing that he just didn’t do anything if only to prevent things from getting this far.

“If” I could end- I believe Mikoto (particularly softboy Mikoto) is saying “Hey, I have no control over my other side. If I did, would things still be the same? Would I still be ‘letting’ this happen?”

“Keep it” and “hide it away” I feel like are both representative of his shadow alter and of the desires that alter represents. Many words related to destruction are tied to this alter, so it could be seen as Mikoto trying to hide those urges as well.

“’I’ will save ‘me’”- this is a very interesting line that I think very well encapsulates the shadow alter’s initial motives; he’s saying “hey, I’m going to take care of us,” I believe to try and convince softboy Mikoto to let him out. As far as if softboy Mikoto can actually “let” him out is TOTALLY up for debate.

Part of the reason I refer to the other alter as softboy Mikoto is because there are softer words I notice used by him in the song; here’s I’m seeing “snuggle”, so I think this side of him is more vulnerable and soft.

SWITCH, shake up that brain- wow couldn’t be any more obvious here

This is where the chorus starts. This I think is from softboy Mikoto’s perspective, PARTICULARLY when he’s trapped in the headspace. There are many forms of plurality IRL in which alters cannot simultaneously front, so one or more are “pushed” back into the headspace. This very act occurs several times throughout the song in the weird minimalist vaporwave shadow realm room, where the tarot cards are. During this time, we can assume that is when the shadow alter is fronting. Softboy Mikoto slowly starts to become more helpless and fearful in this space as the song goes on, and this is where he makes his celtic cross tarot spread that quite frankly defines the whole song. I discussed that in my other post.

Another facet of plurality that is applied here is amnesia, which is common, especially when alters are pushed back to the headspace. Within the headspace, there may be a lack of awareness to the outside world, which Mikoto seems to express in his confused sentiments like the above (in the video, he is also scratching his head, which as a gesture can represent being confused). “Why am I here?” can act as a double entendre, both referring to “Why have I suddenly been pushed to this headspace?” as well as the whole point of Milgram- “Why am I in prison?”. He may not be aware of exactly what he did, hence why he feels it’s a mistake. He may be experiencing amnesia of what his shadow alter is doing, so he doesn’t even know what crime he committed. However, he at least has enough awareness to tell someone else is present in his body doing things, so he begs the viewer “Hey, just watch whatever my body is doing and it’ll all eventually make sense. I don’t have access to this information, but you do.” I thought this was an interesting fourth wall break.

The truth revealing itself could also be the truth coming to light from the particular tarot reading he does in the headspace; note that the cards only seem to be appear in this place and not in the outside world. So softboy Mikoto is trying to figure out what’s going on this way. If he can’t figure it out himself, maybe the cards can give him some direction.

Another duality- “I won’t forgive you if you reveal the truth” vs. “However I know I’m right when I say I’m innocent”. Or he could be right about something else.

I’m wondering if the breaking here is just reflecting the shadow alter or is softboy Mikoto actually wishing he could end the shadow alter. He at least wants things to change; the way things are right now is not something he’s okay with. Though, it sounds like he isn’t getting help with this and has no idea if he can even arrest full control again. It seems at this point, this has been going on for a while so he’s stopped trying.

In the video, the shadow alter is doing a GREAT job hiding the evidence; while of course probably just trying to not get caught, the shadow alter may also be trying to hide his crime from softboy Mikoto so he’s none the wiser.

He’s hoping he can be rid of the shadow alter side, but I think he also is dumping all his difficult feelings onto the shadow alter. Maybe he feels its some sort of release, even if he can’t control it, so he feels a lot of guilt over the shadow alter’s existence, even though that alter is serving a purpose as a conduit for those emotions.

I really really think though that there IS some connection between softboy Mikoto and shadow alter Mikoto. Maybe they are both truly aware of each other, hence the scene where they are viewing each other through the mirror. I think here, softboy Mikoto might be admitting that it feels good to let the shadow alter out, like a hug. The “minus energy” probably refers to the shadow alter.

“Maybe it’s okay that we’re separated like this?” he wonders. There seems to be a sense of feeling alive at least that is conveyed through the shadow alter.

SPLIT IN HALF- yeah, again, pretty encompassing.

In the video, I think this is when we have a switch, as Mikoto’s expression changes in the outside world mirror.

The chorus again, softboy Mikoto is shoved into the vaporwave shadow realm headspace. He’s asking the audience to investigate him here, but I also like to joke that he’s like “uwu look at me I could never harm anybody, pwease let me out”, which may be true only so far as softboy Mikoto is out.

I wonder if in “I will NEVER forgive you if this is happening to me” is directed at the shadow alter instead of the audience? Like softboy Mikoto is saying “I swear to god if you murdered someone im gonna be so pissed, but I also already kinda know it’s happening.” Just another take.

In the video, softboy Mikoto is THROWN into the headspace, where he is gifted with just one hint of what’s going on: The Devil tarot card.

You DARE accuse Miette of murder? Oh! 1000 years jail for Milgram viewer!

Now the vaporwave space starts to turn into a bloody mess; perhaps now softboy Mikoto is starting to put two and two together.

“Hurting it, holding it down, it doesn’t change anything, does it”- I definitely understand this being plural, like if your alters are causing problems, you may try and chastise them, or you may try and lock them away deep inside, but that often doesn’t stop them from existing. It’s really cool how that idea is present here. Like YES that’s how it is quite often. So even if softboy Mikoto TRIES to smother or accuse his shadow alter, that’s not going to change anything.

It being the same anywhere he goes makes me think he’s been putting up with this for a long time, that it’s not about what environment he’s in because his shadow alter is with him everywhere he goes.

“It’s like what’s wrong isn’t wrong”- may be referring to multiple things:

-the shadow alter having a different morality (hence why murder is okay for him, his indulgence in smokes and…redbull/alcohol, etc)

-OR, how softboy Mikoto’s amnesia isn’t letting him understand the full picture so everything is okay when he’s out fronting (shadow alter cleaned the place up and stuff, perhaps hiding all evidence of murder)

-“I’m already the fake one”- a very common sentiment for plural folks, worrying if you as an alter aren’t “the original” or if you’re not actually split and it’s something you’re making up, etc. I think softboy Mikoto is having these feelings. Poor boy, wish we could get you some therapy instead :/ (all of Milgram would be very different if only most of these people could get therapy, let’s be honest)

Now, what’s special here is that BOTH alters are in the headpace, with shadow alter Mikoto looming ominously behind softboy Mikoto.

During this next instrumental, just a side note: we see what’s going on through security footage. The security cameras reflecting a third person perspective is kind of neat in context of pluralism, where someone else fronting can feel like a third person awareness to another alter. I may be thinking too much into this one, but it’s a fun connection.

Another thing many plural folk go through: DISSOCIATION FROM REALITY. Ah yes, my good friend dissociation. Especially like in Mikoto’s case, where the consequences of being split have drastic consequences, he could be running away from the truth which may always be partially concealed to him. Something’s VERY wrong, he knows this for sure, and it may be at this point he really realizes “Oh shit. I just committed murder.” But instead of taking responsibility in any way, he’s trying to imagine that it’s a fabricated reality. I’m not going to say if this makes him bad or not, but it is a known coping mechanism.

I know I mention that the bad habits of smoking and drinking may be the shadow alters habits, but they could also be softboy Mikoto’s own methods of escapism, which definitely fits with the above lyrics. “I need to wake up soon”- but he still realizes that he’s going to have to face the harsh truth of reality soon.

Now this point indicates a marked change in softboy Mikoto and shadow alter Mikoto’s relationship: I believe there may be a time when softboy Mikoto expects to come back out to the front, but now the shadow alter is starting to take over fully and keep softboy Mikoto locked inside. This is supported by the Outcome card in his celtic cross spread being The Devil. Not only does this card have its own meanings, but here it may mean that the more violent side of him takes over.

Again, don’t know if he’s talking to the audience or his shadow alter in never forgiving this outcome. I believe softboy Mikoto does have a clearer morality in that murder is NOT okay, and if he were to fully acknowledge that he as a whole was capable of that, I think he’d break down. So he’s like “it better NOT be true” because he doesn’t know how he’d be able to deal with that.

Interesting in the video is when Mikoto snaps and the headspace turns red again; I would think this is when the shadow alter is entering the scene and taking over. The snap here is symbolic of the switch.

Now presumably softboy Mikoto is like “PWEASE WET ME OUT MISTEW OBAMA”, which, again with the double meaning, can refer to letting him out of the vaporwave shadow realm headspace OR letting him out of prison. Both apply.

“That it’s a lie

That I’m right”- a nice duality here. Mikoto is having difficulty separating the truth from reality.

Also NOW he is forgiving. Forgiveness vs not forgiveness (grudge)

I think it’s gotten so bad that he’s like “okay fine. Fine if I committed murder, fine if you’re accusing me of murder, but please help me understand what’s going on. Let me out”. Maybe he’ll forgive the shadow alter if only he fesses up to the murder.

Of note for the scene however is that shadow alter Mikoto is holding up The Fool card, which represents softboy Mikoto in this case. “I’m right” may be the shadow alter’s sentiment.

-THE CARDS AT THE END-

Then, all the cards show up in more detail, all depicting weapons instead of the standard minor arcana that you might see in your standard Rider Waite tarot deck (which these are based off of). The Wands are baseball bats, the Swords are kitchen knives, the Cups are…poison cans? Acid? The Pentacles are….records but I can see these being rotary saws if you squint. The Wheel of Fortune has car wheels with a snake….GTA time baby (the snake being hidden danger, the devil’s temptation, etc). The chariot is a really weird motorcycle death machine. I was thinking how like, people would drag people along behind them while driving a vehicle as a method of torture so there is that.

Now we see some cards not in the original spread- I think this represents shadow alter Mikoto inserting himself into the headspace and changing things to fit his goals. We see a couple placed in the original spread, but some don’t and are just free-floating, but you’ll see below we have enough context to decipher their meaning.

First, it’s the Page of Pentacles, which has taken over the position of the 7 of swords as the current challenge affecting the issue. This card indicates “Manifestation, financial opportunity, skill development”. I think this means the shadow alter is finally learning to take full control.

Then we see the reverse 2 of swords, which represents “Indecision, confusion, information overload, stalemate”. This could probably represent softboy Mikoto not suddenly understanding why the shadow alter is ALSO in the headspace. Maybe his dual presence in the outside world AND the headspace is indicative of exactly when he learned to take full control. This was NOT in Mikoto’s original spread.

Wheel of Fortune again, which was in the original spread. “Bad luck, negative external forces, out of control”. Yup, that confirms it.

Next, the Five of Swords from the original spread comes up. “Conflict, tension, loss.png, defeat, win at all costs, betrayal”. Softboy Mikoto is now being completely taken over. There is a facedown card on the chair. This might be the one that reads as Death later, so it may be that softboy Mikoto is…KILLED OFF?

Cup of Ace, “Love, compassion, creativity, overwhelming emotion”. I think this one is also meant to represent softboy Mikoto, but it could be that the shadow alter sees it as an act of mercy to take full control for softboy Mikoto. Maybe he feels his alter can’t handle reality and he’s going to take over full time. Or more likely he just has ulterior motives.

Reverse King of Cups. “emotional manipulation, moodiness, volatility”. Softboy Mikoto was lead along, thinking it was okay to leave things to the shadow alter or to exist alongside him. Now we see that isn’t a viable solution.

Reverse Five of Wands. “conflict avoidance, diversity, agreeing to disagree”. I went over this more in the other post.

Chariot is the last one, WHICH ALSO WAS NOT IN THE ORIGINAL SPREAD. “Control, willpower, success, action, determination”. The shadow alter Mikoto has taken full control. Which is very quickly followed by…

Shadow alter Mikoto drawing Death. Also not in the original spread. Perhaps effectively “killing off” softboy Mikoto and betraying him.

Concluding Thoughts.

Now, I understand I do take most of these lyrics from softboy Mikoto’s perspective, but I’m sure there’s a layer of deception added on by his shadow alter. The Challenge card of the 7 of swords did represent betrayal. So softboy Mikoto’s only context into what’s going on outside may be his headspace tarot reading. If you want to question some of the lyrics, or even think one of the alters is lying, that would add SO much to the complexity of the situation, and I wouldn’t put it past the Milgram team to add something like that.

Common Themes/Symbols:

The mirror, both in the headspace and in the outside world bathroom

The Hanged Man- in a painting in the headspace and on Mikoto’s shirt. Indicative of being wrongly accused or martyred. Softboy Mikoto is likely represented with this, as well as The Fool. The Fool painting probably is there to show that he doesn’t know any better, that he is without the knowledge of what his shadow alter is doing (or doesn’t believe he’s doing anything wrong)

The Half Moon- a light side and a dark side. Pretty self-explanatory. Symbolically, it can also represent life and death. NICE.

Sorry if the conclusions end up being kind of vague. That’s the way a lot of this video is; what’s really going on, as it usually is, is up to viewer interpretation at this stage. I was just hoping to provide a bit of context into the images in the video, plural life, and narrator interpretation. I just really love this video and after this full analysis hope others can at least appreciate the work that went into it.

#milgram #MeMe (milgram)#mikoto kayano #kayano mikoto

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omegawolverine · 4 years

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Plesse tell me about queerness in the get down!!

okay okay queerness in the get down let's fuckn goooo

disclaimer: I havent watched this show in full for like 5 months at least, probably gonna get something wrong and/or forget some more important bits. also this wasnt proof read I just word vomited

tws: period typical homophobia, abuse mention, f slur use, bury your gays trope, overdose mention, mention of a creepy possible age gap (the age gap hasnt been confirmed so that's why its possible), cops

going from least to most prominent queer characters, let's start with mylene cruz!

so, from the beginning of this show she has an established romantic relationship with ezekiel (although the status of their actual relationship changes frequently throughout the show) and though this was a relationship she was hesitant to pursue, it is clear that she does have romantic feelings for him and if not for them both having growing careers in very different music genres (zeke specifically working in a genre that she repeatedly labels as bad because she thinks they're ruining records + that it isnt real music because they're using someone elses piece and rapping over it, that's not really important here tho lol) they probably wouldve had a much healthier, smooth sailing romance. that being said theres a few things that happen in the show that, while not explicitly clear, or even really good coding at that—to the point where you wont catch if you really arent looking for it (and trust me, I always look for coding, hers was just so little that it flew over my head until I saw someone else mention it)—are still cool to think about!

so, for starters, I wanna mention the toy box performance, which was performed by mylene and regina, who are best friends. that's all cool and shit, and you dont really think much about it...until you hear about the fact that the show runners purposely colored a lot of the scenes in that performance with the bi colors. like. the writers after the show ended basically said "oh yeah there was plans to make her coding more explicit, but our shit got cancelled soooo" and then dropped the fact that she was gonna be bi (or at least implies bi) in the series, which puts a new twist on a few things.

now, besides the bi coloring in the background of the toy box performance (which was mostly on scenes with her and regina, which involved a lot of uh,, lowkey lewd dancing. with each other. in very revealing outfits. wooooo), there's her music! I dont tend to read too much into this one bc, like I said before, her coding is fucking light and the writers themselves said they didnt really get to do much with it, but I think some stuff with her music is interesting. specifically how her, yolanda and regina's song set me free blew up because dizzee, resident (lowkey enby coded) bicon, got their song played in a queer club. also that the song was majorly important to dizzee and started playing literally right as he kissed a boy for the first time and realized "oh shit I like boys that's bonkers". also that the song can be taken in a gay way since literally the entire thing is about becoming your true self, fully and unapologetically, which is what both dizzee and mylene's entire character arcs are about. dizzee (and a lot of other queer people, apparently), heard this song about being set free and it resonated with them so much that they got that shit most of its popularity.

speaking of dizzee and mylene, they parallel each other a lot in the way that their arcs are about them realizing who they are, coming into themselves and no longer just letting people treat them like shit in a sense (dizzee starting to tell people essentially that they can call him weird all they want, they can make fun of how he acts, what he likes, how he dresses, etc. but he likes how he is and quite literally saying "it's okay to be an alien" as he has consistently compared himself to one throughout the show vs mylene learning that if she wants to be a disco singer she needs to put her foot down, not let anyone, not even the love of her life, not even her abusive father, stop her from achieving her dreams, etc. and continuing to pursue her career with or without their support). one more little parallel that I think is interesting is during I think s2 towards the end of the show is when dizzee and thor are shown together having fun with each other, painting all over the building and each other and are basically just being happy and in love together and then they have these clips of them being interspersed with clips of mylene at a party where she is starting to realize that if she wants to get anywhere she needs to be her own main priority and that she needs to put her career and her dream, which is what makes her the happiest, above all else if she wants to succeed. idk I just think how the show made these two into a weird parallel, accidental or not, is neat. maybe not an explicitly queer parallel, but I think at least how her music and whatnot helped dizzee, the main queer character in this show, blossom, is important.

moving on we got shaolin fantastic also known as "oh no your internalized homophobia is showing-"

so, heres a quick list of...interesting shao facts:

Consistently referred to as fag/faggot (shaolin fanfaggot is my personal favorite); he gets really defensive about this despite nobody actually thinking he's queer, it's just people being assholes to be assholes, and he is the only character consistently referred to using a slur, especially a homophobic one, especially for a "straight" character. dizzee, a canonically queer character, is called a fag less than shaolin is even though dizzee actively goes to gay clubs, has a not so secret dude he "hangs out with" and wont let anyone properly meet, paints his nails, wears less than straight clothes even by the 70s standards and is just all around the definition of fucking queer (and I mean like in the weird way, not the gay way). in fact theres only like once I can remember him being called a fag and it had nothing to do with him actually being gay it was literally just like thrown out there the same way you would call someone a bitch.

Has only shown sexual interest in women, yet refuses to have deeper relationships with women in general (possibly because of trauma but who knows) but takes his relationships with his "brothers", specifically zeke, very seriously

Tells zeke and zeke ONLY his real name when zeke was planning to stop being his friend bc shao more or less got boo boo, a like 14 year old black kid, arrested for selling hard drugs; he was clearly scared and trying to do anything to keep zeke around, literally chasing him down the street and hounding him until he got zeke to stop and argue with him

Kept threatening to beat up zeke in the end but couldn't actually bring himself to do so, instead saying that zeke is "fucking lucky" before walking away

Let's zeke get away with things that nobody else can, in general just has a weird soft spot for ezekiel that he shows with nobody else

when shao found dizzee with thor in a vaguely compromising situation (like they were just shirtless covered in paint sleeping next to each other but shao had also seen everything they painted on the walls ((which some of it was sus)), it was clear they had painted on each others bodies and dizzee had been routinely disappearing with this guy for weeks now yet not producing nearly as much art, at least, as far as we audience members know) he didnt judge him but instead, waited for him to get cleaned up and then told him something along the lines of "theres a reason why im so secretive blah blah blah [not everyone needs to know everything about me]", which, in context, kinda implies that he might be a lil. a lil homiesexual. jus a lil.

whenever even the possibility of zeke leaving him comes up he absolutely loses it. he has literally cost ezekiel life changing opportunities because he thought zeke would just up and leave him for them. this could be abandonment issues bc he's a severely traumatized character, and that probably does contribute to it, but it also is just not a reaction he has to any of their other friends just randomly dipping in and out of his life soooooo

generally speaking, this mfer has got either bisexual with a big hard on for zeke coding or homosexual with terrible internalized homophobia and still a hard on for zeke coding. either fucking way, that nigga gay. he gay as hell. gay as fuck man. there wasn't really much to analyze here tbh bc the coding is just so fucking obvious if you look for it or you are/have been a gay person who's dealt with at least a little bit of internalized homophobia.

also, just a sidenote, idk how fucking old shao, but I'm praying hes like at max 19 bc I'm pretty sure zeke is a minor in this show and shao definetly is not so the whole him being heavily implied to have a crush on ezekiel thing is kinda. oof. not oof if zeke is like 17 but any younger than that? OOF.

edit: apparently the characters are only supposed to be a year apart in age but i had no clue about that before writing this post and since shaos age was never actually stated in the show i naturally assumed he was an adult since his actor Looks Like An Adult. this is definetly on me to a certain extent, but i also never saw anything about this when trying to find our their ages so 🤷‍♀️ maybe i just didnt look deep enough, sorry!

now moving on to the main event...marcus dizzee kipling :]

so, first things first, let's talk enby coding bc him being bisexual was already confirmed!

um, to start off, I just wanna say I dont think this enby coding was intentional or even really coding, it's just moreso me being a dizzee kin on main and knowing as a transmasc enby he has very transmasc enby vibes. for example:

cool, gender neutral nickname that everyone calls him

paints nails various different colors

the whole wardrobe is just a transmasc enby heaven...fishnet shirts, jean overalls, jackets and cuffed pants galore, the big colorful pins, etc

gender neutral hairstyle (when I had my fro it was very sexy and made it easy to transition between hyper masc and vaguely fem, which is pog)

comparing himself to/representing himself consistently with an alien character (though this is meant to represent his sexuality, it could also double as a gender thing too, not neccesarily bc of the whole nonbinary alien trope but bc an enby who likes aliens might heavily identify or compare themselves to whatever their idea of an alien is, whether that just be a genderless entity or a motherfucker with fly style and no need to be perceived as anything other Wacky As Hell)

moving on from there, let's talk about how his queerness is presented to us and how, while it may be a really good piece of representation, especially coming from netflix, it still lacks in A Lot of places.

so, let's start with good things!

i personally really like the get down's queer rep with dizzee bc it's (for the most part) nonsexualized and very very soft, about dizzee figuring himself out and realizing there is a place where he fits in, and about two teenagers in the 70s falling in love over their shared passion for street art. it also features an interracial couple where both boys challenge stereotypes both about queer men and men of color, which is epic poggers and very sexy. this piece of rep specifically is very important to me bc I am a queer black person and even tho interracial relationships are mostly normalized now, I've still had people give me shit for primarily dating white people in a town that is...primarily white lol

mm anyways, I can also appreciate how in the get down, dizzee being represented by rumi the alien is not a thing specifically related to gender (as it often is) and instead is about his sexuality and just in general weirdness and how it has led to him being alienated amongst his peers, poc or otherwise. him seeing himself as an alien is not about just his queerness, which is important, it is about him being a queer black man who talks different, acts different, dresses different and is "soft"—he isnt a walking black male stereotype and he wouldnt have been seen as masculine back in the 70s by any stretch of the imagination. this can be relatable to a wide spectrum of queer poc, from queer black men currently who still have to deal with this shit or to people like myself who are afab neurodivergent mixed race enbies that have always been signaled out as weird and alienated for it. dizzee is god rep bc while he has a small part in this show, his parts are very impactful, hard hitting and show queer poc of all ages that they arent alone and that it's okay to "weird", you just need to embrace it because somebody will love you for you, as thor did for dizzee.

that being said theres um. some minor problemas here,,,

namely:

dizzee and thors first kiss

the lack of development this pairing got

the way dizzee was confirmed bisexual off screen, he never said the words himself, just showed interest in both genders

the way dizzee and thor were never even confirmed boyfriends or just fwb so most of the fandom just calls them boyfriends bc Why Not

dizzee was implied fucking DEAD??? AT THE END OF THE SERIES?????? AND THOR WAS IMPLIED ARRESTED?????????????

now, these might have been things that wouldve been fine had the show been given it's full run but it wasnt which is why we are now left with probelms.

so, from the top, let's go over these: dizzee and thor's first (and only "on screen") kiss was one that was shown in a montage of other queer people making over and doing other vaguely romantic/sexual things, one of those things being a whole ass naked titty being mouthed at, but the actual kiss...was just not shown? like they really did just say "yes they kissed <3 you know this from the context clues of it being in a montage with kissing, hickey giving and titty sucking <3 but no we will not show it <3" LIKE HELLO? I SAW A NAKED BOOBIE BUT NOT TWO MEN KISS??? HUH????????

also, dizzee and thor were both fucking high as hell during this bit like this isnt a terrible thing but it's also like sometimes you do shit when you're high that you wouldnt do sober and they just never kissed again on screen so like?? like idk that's not that bad but it does kinda irk me since they deadass got no other on screen intimacy after that unless you including painting on eacher other or sleeping next to each other on a shitty mattress but not touching at all during it bc they were both at opposite ends of the mattress like half way off it

so yeah, that was trash. then we got lack of development, which kinda goes with the "dizzee being a bisexual but he never says it in canon" thing cause like...okay dizzee was already sort of a side character from the get go like he wasnt the mc by any means, but he became way more of a background character as things continued until we basically only saw him for performances or when he was with thor, yet they got no fucking development as a pairing other than "dizzee realize he gay, he like thor, he and thor spend time together and ig probably do some gay stuff but we dont really know bc we only ever see them do graffiti together now" like?? tf am I supposed to do with that shit. answer. quickly. and then theres dizzee not being confirmed bisexual, which is just a running problem with shows literally doing everything to say a character is bi except for having the character just...say they're bi? which would be so easy? like a good way dizzee and thor couldve had some development is by thor teaching dizzee things about the queer community that he didnt even know existed, thor couldve helped him understand what being bi meant and helped him label himself and whatnot but instead we got an off screen confirmation that the writers had bisexual in mind when writing him. which is garbagé.

the whole thor and dizzee never having a confirmed relationship status is also a development problem cause like literally nobody knows if they were just friends who made out, maybe fucked, who knows, or if they were dating bc dizzee does give a love confession but a love confession doesn't mean there is a relationship, especially since thor didn't say he was in love either (as far as I remember, I could be wrong, plus whether or not that really happened or was apart of dizzee literally overdosing during a performance is unclear so 🤪)

and now for the biggest issue...bury your gays trope.

during the season 2 finale, dizzee and thor are chased by cops after they are found doing graffiti, one of the cops is able to catch thor while the other chases dizzee into a train tunnel and there is a train seen headed straight for him before the show cuts to black on a train horn. the show writers claim that if they had gotten another season, dizzee wouldve been alive but since they didnt and since that's essentially super fan trivia knowledge, most people dont fucking know that and instead had to watch a black queer teenager chose death over being fucking arrested by a white cop. on top of that, thor didnt see any of that shit because he was caught and the cop started hauling him off while dizzee was still being chased so thor literally has no clue where his friend/possible boyfriend fucking is or that he's likely dead in a goddamn tunnel all alone, unless you count the fucking pig that chased him in there who wouldve died too. this shows rep was so fucking good as far as most shows go on not having major fucking problems, on not being toxic and over sexualized, etc, etc. and then they just. killed a black queer teenager for no fucking reason. like it was literally the last episode ever, it would add nothing to the plot, it would just devastate fans and devastate it fucking did. I dont cry easy but seeing a character I identified with, who I had hyperfixated on, die because he'd rather that than be arrested is terrible. it fucking sucked.

so yeah. that's my all too extensive thoughts/analysis on the get down's queerness. theres definitely stuff I missed, or misinterpreted, or looked too much into, etc, etc., but this was a fun thing to spend time writing sooo yeah!! thanks for the ask anon, sorry this was just a big rambley info dump, but hopefully you get some enjoyment out of it since it took like 3 hours at least 😭😭 feel free to ask clarifying questions lol

#shit self #asks #the get down #mylene cruz #shaolin fantastic #dizzee kipling #long post #analysis #info dump #idk if anon has seen tgd or is just being nice so i tried givinh background to things #kinz #bangerz #discourse

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alyblacklist · 4 years

Text

Ressler & Liz and the “light”

There’s been a lot of discussion/debate both here and on Twitter about JB’s recent end-of-season interview where he discussed that final Ressler/Liz scene of “Brothers” and said:

The original break of the story, [Ressler] did call Red and – and that’s what the original move – that’s what the move is, you know, and with where we were going in mind, it felt like maybe we need to – you know, it needs to be her that he calls and that’s actually my favorite scene in the whole episode. I thought she was fantastic and – and, um, their sort of relationship this season has been very unusual and – and as she’s sort of drifting away and - or closer to, you know, whatever is this sort of organic, you know, DNA part of her, he’s this like light that is – represents good and the Boy Scout and all the stuff and, and um, I think that’s why he’s sort of become more interesting to her, uh, more special in a way, because of the contrast, you know, that juxtaposition. I think it’s interesting, their relationship’s interesting.

Below are my thoughts on Jon’s reference to Ressler as a source of “light” for Liz and why I was happy to hear him say it and felt it was consistent both with the evolution of those characters and their relationship over the seasons. I welcome constructive discussion (and criticism), but it’s no secret that I am a Ressler fan, and a Keenler shipper, so if you absolutely hate one or both of those things, you probably won’t like this post (also fair warning - it’s a long post).

The show continually draws on the classic literary themes of light and dark, in which “light” typically represents good, positivity, happiness, hope etc. while “dark” typically represents bad, negativity, sadness, despair, etc. Each of the main characters have struggled internally with balancing the light and dark over the seasons but for purposes of this post, I am focusing on Liz and Ressler.

In Mako Tanida (1x16) when Ressler was hell-bent on revenge for Audrey’s death, Red warned him:

“Agent Ressler. Once you cross over, there are things in the darkness that can keep your heart from ever feeling the light again.”

In the back half of Season 5, when Liz was basically in the same situation that Ressler was in back in S1, Red similarly cautioned her in Ruin (5x09):

Red: I want you to promise me something. Liz: What? Red: That you’ll grieve. Liz: Of course I’ll grieve. What is this that you think I’m doing? Red: I think you’re running away from your problems when you should be facing them. I’m sure it feels like you’re staring into an abyss, but until you mourn, you won’t be able to cross it. Liz: What’s so great about crossing it? What’s on the other side? Peace? Tranquility? Red: Some. Liz: I prefer revenge. Red: That’s what I’m afraid of. Liz: Really? ‘Cause imagining what I’m gonna do to Tom’s killers is the only thing that gets me out of bed in the morning. Red: Don’t just go off and hide in the dark. Wherever you go, look for some light.

Red knows this struggle all too well, because he has already gone down that path. He’s already landed in the darkness, as he explained so eloquently to Liz in Luther Braxton (2x09):

Red: It may be hard for you to imagine, but I once had a relatively normal life– bills to pay, playdates, family, some friends, people to care about. Lost all that. Liz: Lost how? Red: In Mexico, there are these fish that have colonized the freshwater caves along Sierra del Abra.They were lost. They found themselves living in complete darkness. But they didn’t die. Instead, they thrived. They adapted. They lost their pigmentation, their sight, eventually even their eyes. With survival, they became hideous. I’ve rarely thought about what I once was. But I wonder if a ray of light were to make it into the cave, would I be able to see it? Or feel it? Would I gravitate to its warmth? And if I did, would I become less hideous?

These themes of light and dark also intersect with the themes of forgiveness, salvation and redemption. As Red explains to Liz in Tom Connolly (2x22):

I’m a sin eater. I absorb the misdeeds of others, darkening my soul to keep theirs pure.

And in The Kilgannon Corporation (5x07), Red explains to Liz how Dembe tries to save Red’s soul from the darkness:

Red: You ever wonder why Dembe stays with me? Why anyone so decent would spend his days at the side of someone so indecent? Liz: You saved him. He owes you his life. He protects you because you protected him. Red: No, Elizabeth. Dembe didn’t stay with me because he saw me as his savior. He stayed with me because he saw me for the man I really was – a man surrounded by darkness. No friends who could be trusted, no faith that loyalty or love could ever truly exist. I was– Well, I was younger then. Angrier. Dembe connected his life with mine to show me, that day and every day, that the world is not what I fear it to be. He is the light in the darkness. Living proof that there is another way, that life can be good, that people can be kind, that a man like me might one day dream of becoming a man like him. He pledged his life, offered it up as evidence that I was wrong about this world. Dembe guards my life because he’s determined to save my soul.

At the end of Ruin, Liz returns from Alaska and admits to Red that she’s still in a dark place:

Liz: I tried. I really did. I didn’t go looking for trouble. But it found me. And I’m glad it did. Red: What happened? Liz: I killed some men. Doesn’t matter that they were bad. That it was them or me. What matters is that I did it and I was good at it. And I didn’t lose any sleep over it. Red: You will. One of these nights you will. It’s just a matter of when. Liz: Maybe. Later. After I’ve crossed the abyss. But from the side I’m on now, all that matters is that I’m healed and – I’m back. And I’m coming for Tom’s killers. Like I said, I couldn’t keep my promise. Can you forgive me? Red: Yes. Will you be able to forgive yourself?

And in the next episode, The Informant, as Ressler is struggling with how to handle Prescott, Red also discusses forgiveness:

Forgiveness doesn’t mean accepting what you’ve done, Donald. It means understanding that the line dividing good and evil cuts through the hearts of all of us.

This is important for Ressler, who has struggled to accept that mixture of each, both in himself and in others. But by the end of the episode, Ressler is ready to choose the light, to do the right thing, to try to pull himself out of the darkness he’s been living in:

Red: You were preoccupied. Ressler: I was crazed. And convinced I should kill the man who shot her. Do you remember what you told me to do? Red: I told you to go home. You didn’t. Ressler: You said that once you cross over, there are things in the darkness that can keep your heart from ever feeling the light again. I didn’t go home, but I never crossed over. I never thanked you for that. Red: Nor should you. Your circumspection afforded me the opportunity to take care of Audrey’s killer myself. It was a win-win. Ressler: I didn’t want Prescott’s real name so that I could kill him. I wanted it so I could arrest him. Red: He goes to prison, so will you. Ressler: I know, but I’m in the darkness, and doing the right thing is the only way I’ll ever feel the light again.

Against Ressler’s wishes, Red acts as sin eater again (as does Cooper in accepting Ressler’s confession but refusing to pass it through the proper channels). Because in Red’s view:

Sins should be buried like the dead. Not that they may be forgotten, but that we may remember them and find our way forward nonetheless.

In Season 7, in Brothers (7x17), we learn that Ressler has an even larger skeleton in his closet. Once again, he is concerned about doing the “right thing,” because he can’t live with the secret hanging over him any longer. This is his way forward, back into the light.

Ressler: Well, say you agree with me about how we should handle this. I mean, we arrest those bastards who took the car – for theft, for extortion, for all the other poison they pump into the city. And then after that – my brother and I come clean about what we’ve done. Liz: I don’t know that I do agree. After the story you told me, after what you’ve been through – both of you– Ressler: No, we have to do the right thing. It’s important. Liz: Of course, yes, I will help you. I just want to make sure you’re prepared to face the consequences when the FBI gets their hands on that vehicle and that body. Because if we go in and arrest those people, eventually, the FBI’s gonna open up that trunk. Ressler: And find Tommy Markin. I know. Liz: Are you really okay with dealing with the consequences of that? Ressler: I’ve been running from this my whole life. I need it to be done. We both need it to be done.

This time, Liz acts as his sin-eater and makes the body disappear. So how does this all fit together in terms of Ressler and Liz and their relationship?

Liz has always seen Ressler as a good person, as someone on the side of light rather than dark. Even when he was hunting her as a fugitive in Season 3, she still defended him in Eli Matchett (3x03) after Red questioned why she reached out to Ressler for help:

Red: Ressler is a law-enforcement robot. The FBI winds him up– Liz: That’s not true. He’s a person. He’s a good person. Red: Look at me. You need to let that go, Lizzy. I have survived for a very long time now, and I assure you, I didn’t do it by relying on the goodness in people.

At the same time, she’s questioning whether she herself is still a good person.

Liz: I shot a cop. Red: Yes, you did. Liz: And killed the Attorney General of the United States. Red: Yes. And when you did that you crossed a threshold, leaving your world, entering mine. Bad things are gonna find you now, Lizzy. This life has a mind and a momentum of its own. That’s a reality you need to accept. Bad things happen to good people. Liz: Am I a good person? I’m not so sure anymore.

By the time we get to Season 7, and Brothers, Ressler is the one calling Liz the better person as he prepares to turn himself in:

You know, Keen– I didn’t like you when we first met. I was wrong. You’re a good agent. You’re the kind of agent that – people join the FBI to try to become. But you’re also a good person. Much better person than I am. So, whatever happens out there today, the Task Force is gonna be in good hands with you.

But she doesn’t let him - as she explains later, for herself, not for him, because she needs the peace and stability that he provides in her life, she needs that “tiny island of calm,” amidst the dark forces that surround her.

Liz: Have you looked at my life? I’m a widow and a single mom. A marionette – with a high-functioning sociopath pulling my strings. My grandfather tried to murder my mother, and my mother is a legendarily lethal Russian spy – who moved in next door without even telling me who she was. I mean it. Have you looked at my life? I mean, really taken a close look. Because it’s like I’m in the middle of a monsoon that’s constantly threatening to drown me in bad news. And somewhere in the middle of that FEMA disaster of a life– Somewhere is just – a tiny island of calm. And if that weren’t there, I would be swept out to sea. Ressler: No, that’s never gonna happen– Liz: It would if you weren’t here. Ressler: But I am. And it won’t. Come here. It’s never gonna happen. Not on my watch.

Ressler has consistently represented peace and calm and stability to Liz amidst the chaos. It’s there from the very beginning when she clings to him after the Stewmaker ordeal at the end of 1x04, it’s there again when they hug in Mato 4x02 after he shows up at the Summer Palace, it’s there in Dr. Bodgan Krilov (4x19) when she envisions a peaceful future for Ressler watching the sunset from his lake house while Hitchin goes to jail:

Liz: I didn’t do it for you. I did it for him. Hitchin: Fair enough, but you did it, and for that, I’m grateful. Liz: Donald Ressler represents what’s best about this country. He’s loyal and honest, and he believes that no one – no one – is above the law. And I believe that one day, you’ll be the one being dragged off in handcuffs. And he’ll be walking into his lake house to watch the sunset.

It’s there in Season 5, the first episode that they share a meaningful scene together after Ruin, and The Informant, when Ressler is talking about “silver linings,” in the Capricorn Killer (5x16) as he wraps his arm around her.

So for me, Jon calling Ressler a "light that is – represents good and the Boy Scout and all the stuff” is completely consistent with all of that has come before between these two characters and isn’t something Jon just made up out of whole cloth. More importantly, the fact that he characterizes Ressler as “more interesting” to Liz now because of the contrast, and the juxtaposition between her darkness and his “light” is also encouraging to me insofar as I don’t want to see the show end violently - I want to see it end with Red and Liz at peace and with Liz achieving the calm, normal life she’s always wanted (and which Red has promised her for seasons now she will have in the end). So the fact that she’s still interested in light and peace and calm, despite her step further into the darkness at the end of 7.19, is an encouraging sign to me that Liz is not entirely lost.

Back in Season 3, in a midseason interview with The Blacklist Exposed between episodes 3x08 and 3x09, Jon said that Liz “is definitely on a dark path...and I think she will continue to be,” and that “it’s a battle for her soul, it’s a battle for can she survive going through this process.”

There’s a conversation between Ressler and Cooper in the comics (The Arsonist, #6) that illustrates that Ressler’s concern back then wasn’t just preventing Liz from being physically killed, or “beating” Red, but more a fear of losing her to Red’s world - that the darkness would overtake her.

Ressler: I want to bring her in while she’s still...her. Every second she’s out there Reddington’s turning her into someone else. Cooper: That may be, but it’s your job to catch her Donald. It’s not your job to save her.

Four seasons later, I think it’s still a battle for Liz’s soul, but an internal battle that has never really gone away. The battle is not Reddington turning her into someone else, but rather own struggle against her dark impulses, her own struggle to fight for some light, some peace, some calm in her life amidst the chaos. And for that, I think she needs someone to help pull her back from the brink before she takes that step too far, someone to remind her that there is another way.

I hope going forward into next season, that will be Ressler, who will draw on his own experience battling his own demons and help prevent Liz from slipping into the abyss. Does that mean that Keenler will end up a romantic couple in the end? Not necessarily (though personally I hope so). But I take Jon’s comments as a positive sign that Ressler will be a positive force in her life as she steps into yet another battle.

Wine for all those who made it this far!

#the blacklist #donald ressler #elizabeth keen #keenler #jon bokenkamp #theories #long post #really long post #I resisted gifs and images to try to keep it shorter

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skybird13 · 5 years

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A Selective Rewrite of Episode 12

Hey all! I know I’ve been pretty quiet the last couple of weeks, at least as far as my own posts have been concerned. I sort of allowed my school work to get away from me and had some catching up to do (*cough* still not caught up *cough*). But considering we still have yet to get a satisfying explanation for the creative decisions made throughout volume 7 for Qrow and Clover (especially in episode 12) I thought I’d put this one out here today.

Full disclosure, this post was supposed to come at the end of my “What Went Wrong” series, but the ideas for it keep rattling around in my brain and I need to get this out. (Also, sincere apologies for being so late on Part II of that series. It is coming, I promise. Writing up something like that takes a lot of time and effort.)

The whole point of the “What Went Wrong” series was to tweak the writing in episodes 1-11 so that episode 12 felt less detached from the rest of the volume.

The point of this rewrite is the opposite, in that I want to showcase one way in which episode 12 could have been written while maintaining the integrity of the writing in the rest of volume 7. With that in mind, here are my goals for it:

Avoid character assassination (i.e. keep everyone in character throughout the situation)

Maintain the relationship between Qrow and Clover

Acknowledge the “Lawful or Good” arc Clover was set up for throughout the volume

Still have it end with Clover’s death. I do this under the desperate assumption that Clover’s death is absolutely necessary plot reasons in volume 8.

A few things to note before I get started.

Firstly, I will be focusing exclusively on the events between Clover, Qrow, Robyn, and Tyrian. I had very few qualms with the rest of the episode.

Secondly, I have some very little experience writing screenplays, but keeping to the strict format of one would be absolute hell on this site. I’m going to do my best to encase character action, scene notes, etc. in [brackets] and character dialogue will be indented in quotations, but that’s about as formal as it’s going to get. So don’t look at this as a model for a professional screenplay. It won’t be and my own voice will probably creep in now and again for commentary or what have you.

Thirdly, not a lot of changes in the first part of the scene. Apart from a few tweaks, I thought it was fine. But the alterations will become far more noticeable as things progress and the ending, even with Clover’s death, will be drastically different.

[The scene opens the same way it does in canon with the black screen and Ruby’s VO repeating the lines about Ironwood abandoning Mantle. Then we’re in the transport ship with Clover, Qrow, Robyn, and Tyrian. For continuity’s sake, though, the camera work from the end of episode 11 is somewhat mirrored. Ruby gets cut off, within that wide-angle shot in episode 12 Robyn and Qrow look up at Clover, and then the camera cuts to Clover alone. We get to revisit his shell-shocked expression and the camera lingers on him while Robyn delivers her line.]

Robyn: Declaring martial law? We cannot let him do this. (oisl = original in-show line)

[With the camera still on Clover, we get to see him make the conscious effort to close himself off. The conflict in him gets pushed aside and his expression hardens. It’s clear here that he’s going to fall back on his loyalty to James, at least at first. This bit in the show was fine. I had no problem thinking that would be his initial response.]

Clover: Ms. Hill, I’m sure the General understands the enormity of his-- (oisl)

[Clover’s scroll beeps and cuts him off. He pulls it out, looks at it, and sees the orders to arrest Qrow. A shot of his face shows a flicker of emotion, something hesitant and sad. When he stands, his movements are heavy. Qrow sees him, and his own expression shifts into one of concern and confusion.]

Qrow: Clover? (oisl)

[Clover sighs and hesitates only slightly before approaching him. He doesn’t look happy but he does keep eye contact with Qrow and his posture is stiff.]

Clover (resigned, shut down): Qrow, I have orders to bring you in.

Tyrian (laughing): A free ride and a show. (oisl)

Clover: There’s also an alert out for Team RWBY’s arrest. (oisl)

Qrow (worried, scared): What? Has James lost his mind? (oisl)

Robyn: He’s trying to stop anybody who might get in the way of his inhumane plan. (oisl)

[Robyn stands and approaches Clover, engaging her weapon and pointing it at him. I also didn’t have much of a problem with this. At least Robyn had the precedent of being a bit impulsive.]

Robyn: Looks like he underestimated me. Again. (oisl)

Clover: Only Qrow is under arrest. After everything we’ve been through tonight, please don’t make me arrest you, too. (oisl)

[Robyn’s face hardens and she readies an arrow. Clover looks sad and disappointed, but he does still pull out Kingfisher. Qrow stands and gets in between them.]

Qrow: Knock it off, both of you! We’re not doing this. Not with him here.

[Qrow points at Tyrian who is sitting on the bench grinning at them. Robyn and Clover seem to remember exactly where they are and they lower their weapons.]

Qrow (to Robyn): Let’s get up to Atlas and we can talk to James personally. Maybe there’s something we’re missing.

[Robyn does not look happy about that. Qrow turns to Clover, expression hurt. He holds out his hands and takes a step towards him.]

Qrow: I’m not resisting.

[Clover doesn’t move right away. His resolve visibly cracks, giving us another glimpse at his internal conflict. He puts Kingfisher away, his hand shifting to the bolas on his hip, though he doesn’t actually make any move to put them on Qrow. Instead, he looks painfully torn.]

Clover: I don’t want to do this.

Qrow: Then don’t.

[A tense moment passes between them where neither of them moves and we’re not entirely sure what’s going to happen. Then, with the camera focused on Qrow, Robyn shifts back into the scene over his shoulder. She moves towards the door on the side of the ship.]

Robyn: If you want to hand yourself over, that’s fine. I’m going back to Mantle.

Clover: Ms. Hill, if you leave this transport, I can’t guarantee that someone will--

Robyn (vicious): I’m not asking for your guarantees. I should have known better than to trust you. You never cared about Mantle.

Clover (moving towards her): Robyn--

[Robyn lifts her weapon again and points it at him. Clover stops.]

Robyn: Back off, Clover. I won’t ask again.

[She reaches back for the door latch and pulls it to open it, but at that moment, the ship lurches. They all look up to the front of the ship to see Tyrian with the pilot’s hat on, laughing maniacally and clearly trying to crash the plane. Clover pulls Kingfisher out and launches the hook at him, but a bit of bad luck comes into play and it misses him, piercing the ship’s console or the windshield instead. Tyrian laughs, throws the plane into a nosedive, and all four of them are inside when it hits the ground.

Clover comes to first. He is lying in the pile of snow that got pushed in through the open side of the plane. Kingfisher is next to him but it’s broken, the line and hook having been ripped out of it by the force of the crash. He looks around and spots Qrow at the back of the ship, unconscious.

Placing a broken Kingfisher back on his hip, he crawls over to Qrow and checks his pulse. He lets out a small sigh of relief when he finds it.]

Clover (gently): Qrow. Can you hear me? I need you to wake up. Come on, wake up.

[After a beat, Qrow moans. His eyes flutter open and his face contorts in pain. Clover is visibly relieved.]

Clover: Are you hurt anywhere?

Qrow (voice tight with pain): My side.

[Clover quickly lifts his shirt and checks him, and basically has an “oh shit” reaction. There is deep bruising on Qrow’s side, suggesting some internal injury.]

Clover: Your aura’s broken.

Qrow (has his own oh shit reaction and then looks at Clover): Are you--

Clover: I’m fine.

Qrow (looking around the wreckage): Where’s Robyn?

Clover (darkly): Where’s Callows?

[They share a look that says they both know this is very bad. Clover sits back on his knees and Qrow tries to push himself up to recline against the wall of the ship, one arm wrapped around his middle. Clover reaches up to activate his earpiece.]

Clover: This is Clover requesting immediate emergency aid. Our ship went down and at least one of our party requires medical attention. (pause for a beat). Callows is unaccounted for.

[Several beats pass and Clover’s hand falls heavily back into his lap, implying a lack of verbal response.]

Qrow: Do you think they got it?

Clover: I don’t know.

[Clover stands and rifles through an overhead compartment in the ship. He shakes out a blanket and wraps Qrow in it. With a broken aura, Qrow has no defense against the cold. Then Clover looks around until he finds Harbinger near the front of the plane. He gets it and brings it back to Qrow, setting it beside him.]

Clover: I’m going to go look for Robyn. If Callows comes, shoot him.

[Qrow laughs a little and lays Harbinger across his lap. Clover takes the bolas off his belt and Qrow gives him a disbelieving look, thinking they’re for him.]

Qrow (flatly): Are you serious right now?

Clover (sets the bolas down in Qrow’s lap with a small smirk): In case shooting him doesn’t work.

[Clover stands and turns to go. Qrow catches his hand, prompting Clover to look back at him. This moment is weighted and intimate, expressions conveying concern for one another.]

Qrow (serious): Be careful.

Clover (reassuring): I’ll be right back.

[They let go of one another and Clover leaves. Qrow changes Harbinger into its shotgun form in preparation.

Scene change to outside. Clover climbs out of the ship and looks around the tundra. The shot establishes how far away they are from Mantle, how isolated they are, and finally pans over to some wreckage a little ways from the main part of the ship. Clover runs over and finds Robyn in the debris. He checks her pulse and is again relieved to find one.]

Tyrian (from behind): Well, well. That worked out better than I thought.

[Clover stands and pulls Kingfisher out, extending it to its full length. The camera makes sure to focus somehow on the warped end and frayed line. Tyrian notices the damage to the weapon and grins.]

Tyrian (sing-songy voice): Divide and conquer, as my Goddess says. There were three. And now there’s just you.

Clover: Tyrian Callows, surrender now and things will go much easier for you.

Tyrian (with a sinsiter laugh): Oh, I have something much more fun in mind.

[He engages his weapons, but instead of going for Clover, he runs for the rest of the ship. Clover’s expression shifts into one of pure panic.]

Clover: Qrow!

[Scene change to Qrow in the ship just as Tyrian runs through the door. Qrow is somewhat ready for him. He throws the bolas at Tyrian’s legs. Tyrian dodges but the bolas do force him to change his trajectory so he can’t land a direct hit on Qrow. Qrow shoots at him and manages to fend him off long enough for Clover to get there.

I’m not overly good with detailing fight scenes, so I’ll just try to give the broad strokes here.

Clover gets Tyrian out of the ship and engages him out in the open. Qrow drags himself to his feet and goes to the opening of the ship where he focuses on taking shots at Tyrian whenever Clover is far enough away from him to do so. Clover holds his own against Tyrian, but with Kingfisher broken, he’s at a severe disadvantage. He eventually takes a hard hit that shatters his aura. Tyrian is about to close in on him when Qrow takes another shot, having moved much closer. Tyrian turns and goes after Qrow instead. The altercation is extremely brief. With Qrow’s aura broken and his injury, Tyrian only has to land a single hit to get him to go down. Harbinger gets knocked from his hand in the process. Off to the side, Clover gets back to his feet. Qrow tries to reach for Harbinger but Tyrian gets to him and steps on his wrist, putting a blade to his throat. Qrow glares up at him, defiant. A moment passes in which Tyrian grins at him and Qrow’s expression shifts from defiant to confused to horrified. Just as Qrow begins to comprehend Tyrian’s plan, Clover comes up behind Tyrian to attack him. Tyrian turns, blocks with his wrist weapon things, while simultaneously grabbing Harbinger with his tail (it’s been established that his tail is that dextrous) and using it to kill Clover.]

Qrow: No!

[Clover falls to the ground. Qrow’s expression is one of horror. He tries to stand but can’t quite get to his feet.]

Qrow (to Tyrian): I’ll kill you! (oisl)

Tyrian: You mean like you just killed Clover? (oisl)

[Overhead, the ships that Clover called for are arriving. Tyrian grins and throws Harbinger a few feet away.]

Tyrian: I’d love to stay and watch, but you know my history with the authorities. Until next time, Qrow.

[Tyrian turns and sprints back towards Mantle. Qrow watches him go for a moment, furious, and then he crawls over to Clover. Maybe he even takes off his cape and tries to staunch the bleeding.]

Clover: Qrow...

Qrow: I’m here. The ships are coming. All you have to do is hold on.

Clover: I’m so sorry.

Qrow: Don’t. Don’t do that. Just... Stop talking. You’re not dying out here.

Clover (gently): Qrow.

Qrow (fierce): No!

[Qrow visibly struggles to hold himself together.]

Qrow (pleading): Please stay.

Clover (softly): I wish I could.

[Qrow breaks and starts to cry. Clover looks over and sees the sun rising. Then he looks back to Qrow and smiles.]

Clover: I’m glad I met you. (If you want to be cheesy, you could even go with “I’m lucky I met you.”)

[The light fades out of his eyes and he’s gone. Qrow screams in agony.

End scene.]

There you have it. The only thing missing is Qrow’s promise to get vengeance on James, but that motivation could easily have been communicated in episode 13 with little more than some strategic camera shots, the fact that Qrow has Clover’s pin, and Qrow’s expression turning from one of sorrow to one of rage as they approach Atlas. Seriously. He could have looked out the front window, seen Atlas Academy, closed his hand around the pin, and gone from looking numb to looking pissed. That’s all that would have been needed.

No one had to step out of character for this to happen. The relationship that CRWBY worked so hard to build between Clover and Qrow throughout the volume, whether you saw it as romantic or not, would have been maintained. And the end result is still the same: Clover is dead and Qrow is framed for it.

Really not that hard.

#fair game #rwby #rwby7 #clover deserved better #episode 12 rewrite #I'm exhausted #tw: clover death

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misterbitches · 3 years

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Hello! @flootweed replying to the post from before. the long format was killing me. why does tumblr look like this...

I haven’t watched episode 8 yet...or have I? If it’s the most recent one. No.

Is the hornbill a bird? It probably is but I have a terrible memory and I’m dumb so. I skipped the last few weeks because I’m scawwed. How are you liking it? I did see someone say that the hornbill makes sense (without knowing what it is...at all) bc heart transplant patients only live like 5-15 years after but someone in those comments pointed out that he was so young when he got his and that’s pretty rare so he has a higher likelihood of survival. Frankly, this is the only way I will proceed. Since when did shows ever care about the heart transplant health? Never and it needs to stay that way!

What did we think of ep 6? LMAO. I need opinions! And omg it makes me feel special when I can point things out to people because I so...rarely get to LOL. Editing is like one of my favorite things ever so I can be super particular about it but I try to do the thing you do when you’re supposed to see if it works within its context. I’d like to go in with scissors and glue but alas.

THe mic covering....the rustling....it’s like guys...please. Ironically the audio today wasn’t great. I don’t know why. IDK if you watch c-dramas but I am not even sure what’s worse between them because they dub their dramas. But actually no it’s best to have the dubbing because even tho it is painful they have to put a lot of effort into it. LOL.

Right? @ Aey! It’s just weird if they would show us more about what he’s done instead of saying he’s done sth bad and not even explaining that....like you could even do some shitty exposition. I think if he is to be a true villain then we really need to be privvy. All the warnings make it seem like he’s a fuckin’ serial killer so when we get the scene of him at home it’s like....actually this is really serious? Maybe his pain is like...for a reason. Althought you won’t even TELL US WHAT HE’S DONE WRONG BESIDES BE JUST FUCKING WEIRD AND ANNOYING! So from what we have it’s just a realllllllll fucked up sad person lol. god i forgot about the dinner! and i totally agree. he really needs them to succeed. i like your theory because it would make the scene where he like blocks the twitter user make more sense. he also says they dont really know each other etc so it’s realllllyyyyy probable that he just sees it as a way out. if not then we shall pretend u wrote it :)

god yea i wouldnt say it is art but i also guess we technically have to since it is technically. in the way that technically performance artists are artists but mostly i uh technically ignore them. Also one of my fav BLs is called the best twins. If you do not know what it is I will not elaborate further.t

i want to know more abt poli sci majors lmao but they sound DRAMATIC/ hopefully most ppl in ur cohort arent losers!

hahahha i understand. there was just a thing on twitter about DSA and then the day before about reading discourse. the same thiings. over. and over. and over. and over. we are our own worst enemies but also our own best friends? but i hate tankies and that wont change. but hasan’s a decent guy. he said sth abt black ppl during biden’s primaries in GA or whatever and i was like chill. but he’s insecure and has adhd which means ur more open to being wrong and changing otherwise u will suffocate and die.

and totally about hiding fuck ups. i’ve tried really hard bc of organizing IRL to like...be honest, question, etc but also like...approach it naturally? because if you’re trying to be perfect and so worried you’ll fuck up you don’t realize that puts more stress on you, makes you seem like a robot, and could potentially not make you realize the mistkaes you made. also if we’re privileged in certain spaces there is just no possible way we won’t get something wrong. im light and i know that honestly any way to speak up on colorism is going to be difficult and that’s a space where i have power so i just have to figure it out. we should be uncomfortable because we have to sit with unpleasant feelings and sort through our own whatever. that just makes the next time even better and people can trust u more. i think some people sweat it sooo much or maybe they think their personal life and what theyve been through is more the norm? on the other hand people can be sf reactionary in the worst way and idk what their issue is. there was also a user who said sth very inch arresting about tankies which i thoroughly enjoyed (how like violent lefitsts or tankies / ppl who are like ooh a gun whatever just want to be violent in another space so they have shit tendencies from jump and nothing of substance which i think i agree with tbh fo ra lottttt of ppl. like their anger is actually like “no im about to beat that ass” instead of what we actually want to get done)

sort of in the same vein re: taking it easy...we coudl all be more understanding too. to slow it down like you mentioned about not being privvy to fucking eveyrthing and saying anything on our mind. i saw this person talk about y2k which was a huge deal while happening bc it was the turn of the millenium (bruh were u even alive?) but this twitter user grew up in a super super SUPER religious household and was like why do ppl make jokes about Y2K it was insanely traumatizing? though my first instinct was confused ive tried hard to like look more before i judge especially thanks to a friend of mine. turns out that with the further reading the more we found out he was just really traumatized; it was very common in religious households to be afraid of 2000. so we could have come at him with no understanding and he could have thought that everyone had the same experience with that year that he did. his feelings sit precedent though but i think it was just very hard for him to fathom.

i didnt reply bc he didnt need that and what could i have said? he’ll see what the truth is with exposure and unfortunately this was something he really did go through.

and that’s what makes most people think others could be over the top. because it sounded ridiculous but then it was this huge traumatic thing that we could have never known about. so maybe when someone sounds like actually crazy they have an explanation? of course some ppl are just batshit or annoying but that’s anywhere not just leftists it’ just means more i guess when a ~~librul is annoyed~ but it can be easy to want to make fun of ppl too. lmao. basically what i am saying is the internet? especially twitter? for leftists? in this economy? bitch it’s the wild west out here.

i am 29! idk if i said it or not. i am OLD u probably werent even born in the year i was talking about wah. i know not old-old or old at all but compared to you i’m due for a colonoscopy.

omg i hope u can get vaxxed soon! are you wfh rn? i hope ur also not in a bad state as in state state not state as in ur being :| bleh what a fucking time. it sucks that you have to fucking do work. well unless u like school. which i hope u do. i just assume everyone hates it cos i did lmao

was it the lindsay ellis drama? that bitch is dumb. if there was other drama oh wait the drama i was referring to it all happened on the same day. idk book twitter that well but i saw something from someone who was abt that shit and wowie! the american people are not that.....intelligent to put it lightly.

i’ll get better. ppl tell me they miss me and im like aw. i have insanellllyyy bad insomnia and a lot of stuff happened this year HOWEVER I SLEPT FOR TWO DAYS FOR 8 HOURS AT A REASONABLE TIME. im a new woman. anyways you too! i hope ur not too burnt out with school. we just dont know when the burnout is or we just dont know we are burnt out until we are. the panaramiciccici hit and all the things i was ignoring kind of just fell on me and sooo much happened at once. and frankly it’s hard to take care of ourselves. lord.

Like if you aren’t interested in expanding on the issue in a way that hasn’t been done before all you gotta do it like… spread resources and donate if you can. I dont see the point in having to say something about every issue especially if you (not at you specifically just in general) aren’t immediately impacted by the issue. Like is the 14 yr old white marxist named sarah on twitter really gonna have meaningful insight on anti-asian violence ?

this is part of why i cannot telecommunicate. i dont want to do shit on the internet. i am able bodied so i know that this time has been of such ease for other people. but mentally i just can’t. i don’t have a comment on hand like that and i hvae no desire to engage with ppl that way. i am a super super super solitary person but thats bc it’s MY time so when it’s like all this effort with other people i dont ever want to be alone. it’s the same with the way i approach filmmaking. it isnt a sole thing so i hate it not together. that’s part of how u can get so sucked in and repeat doom scrolling. i was in this webinar last may after [redacted] and this black woman prof said “read with a community and talk” because otherwise she said we are torturing ourselves. you can’t carry that weight all on your own. unfortunately i hate zoom, discord, slack, signal, whatsapp, facetime. you name it this panera has made it evi.. L

you make a really excellent point. i think the young young gen zers are really really just interesting because it’s like this whole new world for them with leftist politics and they just can’t grasp the horrors of the world and the kind of freedom being a leftist can bring. and so many people don’t grow out of it. those people so happen to be the “least productive” in terms of how much time they spend IRL withe these issues. naturally, younger kids are gonna have a harder time. they are not as mobile as well so the internet becomes this place. but then it’s this echo chamber. and many times just things posted without sources. and social media NEEDS that to exist.

i think of the irony of leftist kids on tik tok and while i am happy it’s reaching them it’s just....different. very different. the growth of social media is so good but also so fucking sad, it’s too much! i think the point about not writing everything is major. even i have to do this which is part of the disappearing.y ou need to detach and make sure your head is on straight again. but when you think eveyrone has to be privvy to every thought and you can’t just sit back....which twitter and social media doesn’t encourage. you have to join in. that’s often why when i have something to say it is dense because i don’t feel like repeating it. ever. lmao ust ever. i cant pay attn. social media is a fucking minefield for my brain u can get so lost in it and absorb it but once u start talking you may not be able to stop.

i think a big part of that is it not being a leisurely thing but sort of just in our lives always. this sounds like a grandpa rant but ykwim. We dont have to see the same thing over and over again. And eventually it gets sincerely diluted or its diluted bc of capitalism or whatever. Or if theyre very young or maybe they don’t have like the greatest way of sharing the knowledge? then it can be butchered. I hope this is making sense...i’m talking beyoond the boring surface-level milquetoast shit. i see really ahistorical stuff on there from leftists (like this thing about NK + africa and it being a beneficial rship as opposed to a um not beneficial one. and it isn’t. beneficial but this young black girl was talking abt it and noname rtd and i was like it’s just too complex. there’s no good/bad here just bc it’s not america. dont get me started on this.)

but Lol that was kinda off topic but I think what I meant in my last reply about not turning off the voice in my head is about when I consume media, not necessarily when I’m online talking about. Even if I have criticism for something, I’m usually pretty chill when consuming fandom content bc I think being serious online all the time is kinda boring. Like sometimes I’m analyzing theme and shit but really most of the time im memeing.

exactly.........gotta laugh. thats why sometimes im like i cant think lmao. unfrotunately i have been ARGUING with ppl on the internet for rly no reason when i could have replied to ur very nice fun wholesome message. i love torture. i miss memes.

“ i think the people who get the least enjoyment out of that are those so obsessed with getting upset with anyone thinking outside of their lines as if it equates to them “ EXACTLYYYYY

kekekekeke im glad u got it. it’s like with conservatives throwing around snowflake. now im beginning to question who the real complainers are.

LMAO exactlyyyy. i posted a screenshot of this writer from twitter saying that exact thing. Like first of all, I’m...an adult? and if you are as well uh? i’m sorry for you but are we 12? But how is it affecting u this viscerally? And if it does why dont u...do...research? pihgofuaipoajghou but honestly everything u said. we’re trained to go into it with nothing. i was only around ur age when i started to get more serious about this stuff but you’re like lightyears ahead of where i was at 21. did i say this but i’m in iww and literally i can tell u in 2016 i did not think 2019 me would be in a union bc i told my friend in a train station that we don’t need unions. i was 23...but the thing is i didnt know what i was talking about. at all. and i knew i didnt know and she knew i didnt know and now i am the clown.

also yes at critical engagement. i had to learn so much through experience and this is tuff that i coudlnt be shielded from. there’s an empathy you kinda have to develop and this understanding that you move through the world as this person who is “nowhere and everywhere; nothing and everything” so i’ve always had to think about things differently just to survive. that’s also what can drag a lot of people towards it like theres so many black kpop fans bc i think a lot of the pain in SK can be mirrored (sort of) through our history. and theres currently a history now but it had to be forged. uh what was my point oh yea however i wouldnt have been able to move further if i didnt have my background to go off of bc i knew something was off when i started getting into all these things (ill give u a hint) but if i had no prior knowledge and didnt have to think about it then the critical approach is either stale or stupid.

i had to research but i dont understand how ppl are so bold with little to no research and understanding? thhey just inherently know with also like ZERO experience in what they need experience in. engaging critically means “how i see the world” with dashes of trying to be open adn understanding or whatever. actually that’s another thing like being afraid of criticizing things bc theyre foreign to you so u give it a pass (like we discussed) but it doesnt hAVE TO BEEEE JUST REAAAAAD and then take all the info ur teensy brain and apply it. be a normal human being and dont be fucking rude and racist. thats it! u can complain abt literally anything without being a dick.

as we start with LW and end with LW.....what do we think (i asked this already) omg please share wbl thoughts i THINK i know what ur talking about. well it could be two things; their rship when they came back and the physicality and then pei shou yi. i almost dont even want to use my brain to fucking look at that. i think wbl can get away with more bc of visual~*~*~* reasons (like literally, the look of the show. there’s more space to get lost in the frames. many thai dramas are a lot more literal? this isn’t the right word but it’s very heavily character focused particularly bc of $ i think) though good production also underscores flaws so i am also wrong. but like do u know what i mean? u have to kinda focus on it? or maybe it’s just cos like.....ur so used to it in thai bl idek. i’ve seen tw bl ofc.

look i swear i will justify this forever bc there are some things we miss right but if u feel like someone’s a bad actor....theyre bad. it’s about tone movement etc etc etc and since most thai bl productions have 0 interest in that....well. they take these newbies and put them in these situations. we dont understand thai but if we see them and we’re like “wow this is really bad” then they’re bad lmao. IDC i will never be like cos idk what theyre saying NO WHY HE LOOK LIKE A ROBOT???????? DOES HE EMOTE? why is he CRYING WITH NO TEARS? and it’s not even a total requisite to cry with tears(i mean for me it is) but it’s just like what is happening on ur face right now young man????????

painful.

the inflection stuff is very valid ooh good point tho but that’s only a part of the piece. plus we get used to the way they communicate. like the ppl from sotus were prtty bad. i dont like that show but thats an ex of ppl liing the actors and the person i thought was better other ppl dont think that? well apparently hes a shitty guy but. um. so when theres decent acting its so glaring.

although i must say even tho i dont care for 2gether anymore and would never like to be reminded about its existence (only bc i just cringe lol) i honestly....didnt think bright was a bad actor? but people keep saying he is and i am much more inclined to believe them than myself. though i am not often dickmatized that could have been it. until he opened his mouth and ruined it and then i stopped paying attn.

although honestly i’m so much more critical than i could be positive. i have ben stumped for the last day about how i wasnt mad at his acting in the show. is it me? is it him? who’s......the wrong one.....(me)

oh shit they have been denied? i haven’t been paying attn to whats been going on recently. i just got into it on MDL because of snowdrop. sometimes i literally cannot engage bc ill just be like alright well im black so this power button in my head is going off when ppl talk abt that shit. back in the day when kpop jawns were saying some real outta pocket anti black shit (now everyone is slick with it) it’d always be THEY DONT HAVE GOOGLE THEYVE NEVER SEEN A BLACK PERSON but really it’s like no...maybe they are just racist? that’s ok too.

also the past 2 weeks have been um atrocious bc how fucking easily people fell into the pit of white supremacy and started to turn their ire towards black people and making a competition between our groups just like they wanted. it’s not about the women who are dead anymore, who were sex workers, their womanhood, being asian, being poor anymore. it’s about how much black people get attention and why people only pay attn to us. i am not feeling very generous this week for ppl to excuse that hsit.

on a lighter note, ppl say that abt the whole husband and wife thing. i dont know how to explain how angry that shit makes me but maybe it’s because i do not want to think of my body in relation to a fucking penis at all hours of the day. if bls could kindly not do that it would be nice lmao

yes there are a lot of those. who are only there to gawk lmao. and just idk worship bc of the cult of personality thing bc of how weird and open they have to be as actors. some of the others are people who /think/ theyre really smart (i think im asmart but i also think i am very dumb and i have adhd to prove that MEDICALLY!!!) but are actually not? or their observations arent great? or idk if they are they arent interesting? but i think well..........we have more refined palettes :P

jk also theres just different personalities. you and i mesh more bc we have a lot of the same beliefs and are coming from the same place. that makes it easier to understand as well. i really try to remember that but some people are really weird so. again just...the perception of certain things even down to acting skills. but i also dont like.......believe this genre can really do anything at all. on one hand i want them to do it right bc it’s a piece of work so they should. be proud of it. cos most things arent advancing us bc representation and culturalism are a lie bla bla. it’s just that when the depictions are negative or not done well it adds to the problem as opposed to the things that are well done are fairly benign and can’t really pull us back (perf example is the black panther film. i woudl definitely not say it was transgressive as a literal work but visually it’s just stunning. and it’s sad that it’s stunning and surprising but still with basically an all black cast of mostly dark people abd like what it means in the zeitgeist yes. it’s also just a good movie. but it’s still imperialist prop and unfortunately and this is fucking pathetic to say it “opened eyes” in other countries where they hate black ppl and ignore their own racialized minorities HENNYWAYSSSS a better ex is moonlight except moonlight isnt mainstream and is indie tho...still thru a funnel of capital bc a24 but who cares bleed the fuckers dry is my motto. my point is moonlight is both a great work and doesnt bring any failures to the table and its existence helps in ways outside of art but they arent the defining things giving us material advancement sooooo i mean it’s complex (this is my conclusion to everything um guys it’s complex)

er i had one more point in conjunction to above. oh yea so i like dont need all these extra things to make it progressive. like people really want more women in the show and i am honestly like i really dont. i dont want them to actively do this. if they cant do it naturally then let someone else do it. i am not asking for more bc i dont want it from them. when something comes along i embrace it but i do not see why women should be represented when the genre RELIES on patriarchy. there is no complete satisfying existence for the women in these series. i dont want it. i dont ask people to show us~*~* or respect~* like fuck no the people who make it make it and hopefully more will make it in the future but i will not beg bc THEY DONT WANT TO DO IT SO WOULD FORCING IT MAKE IT BETTER? just fucking leave them out entirely. that’s the answer if theyre gonna make nasty female characters then those bitches can geaux. we have other plcaes to be. booked. and. BUSY!

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pilferingapples · 4 years

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Having just rewatched the 1935 Les Mis --

(under the cut for an unpositive post, and for discussion of the usual Les Mis-related triggers; major character death, suicide,etc)

While it is a terrible adaptation of Les Mis-- I’m not going to get into the blow-by-blow, but any adaptation that features a call for Law and Order, rigid penalties for the convicted and stricter control of crime, along with the depressingly common scenes of Valjean being explicitly romantically interested in Cosette, AND triumphant music playing over Javert’s suicide while not only Valjean , but a whole group of onlookers just sort of amble over to check out a man dying like it’s an interesting billboard, and that’s the Happy Ending, is a bad adaptation of Les Mis-- all that aside

I am struck by how much it’s also just a really bad movie??

The pacing is extremely wonky-- the beginning scenes are incredibly leisurely for a film that isn’t even two hours long, with the Valjean’s Soliloquy moment coming almost 30 minutes in , and the post-convent scenes not starting until after an hour , the Paris side of the storyline is bound to be rushed, but it didn’t have to be utterly incoherent, especially given that the movie does cut out Valjean’s final separation and death. (And everything else after Javert’s death, which again is presented like the Triumphant Defeat of the Villain for some reason, which doesn’t make sense even in this because he never remotely attains villain status in this version? He’s barely even a Problem! He doesn’t even arrest Fantine!) .

The...whatever group Marius is part of , doesn’t ever articulate a clear purpose or structure ,the not-barricades are a plotless mosh pit sequence . No one except Valjean gets anything like a character arc-- certainly not Marius or Cosette , and not even Javert, who pretty much goes from “ The Law To The Letter, Good Bad or Indifferent” (seriously that’s his catchphrase here) to “ Welp time to Seine myself” with roughly the same amount of internal agonizing that I use when choosing a soda from a vending machine. Eponine, who is suddenly an independent, adult woman and Marius’ secretary, falls into the Tragic Love interest role--but that’s all she does, she doesn’t have time or room to grow into that or away from it.

I like a lot of 30s-era films; I’ve probably seen more B&W era films than post-70s stuff (neuro reasons, not some kind of Artistic Point, aside, I suppose , from a Deep Artistic Belief that I shouldn’t have to have a damn seizure while watching movies). This isn’t an “ oh it’s old so it’s bad” rant; this thing is just Not Good within its own style. Which is confusing, because I have often seen it hailed as a Classic? but heck if I could ever tell you why. The actors do their best and some of the shots are nice, but the story and pacing are just a mess and the characters barely have time to exist in the sheer rush of Happening Things.

The coach chase scene blessed by Jesus is pretty funny though:P

#Other Adaptations #Les Mis 1935 #adaptational review

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pidayforpi · 4 years

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Rigmor of Cyrodiil is a wasted golden opportunity

(I should probably only post this on reddit, where people will understand. But...I feel like posting this here as well. Probably no one will understand.)

TL;DR, I give this mod a 60/100.

This is a review of the Skyrim mod Rigmor of Cyrodiil. This is the first time I have written a review for a mod. I thought of whether I should do it (let alone post it online), but since Rigmor of Cyrodiil (let’s call it RoC, not Republic of China) has a special place in my heart, I will do it just for this mod.

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First off, disclaimer. I...

...haven’t played the prequel Rigmor of Bruma. I will probably play it, but not soon because I need a rest.

...also haven’t played the sequel “Dragonchild”.

...don’t really care about the “lore” aspect. Skyrim is the only Elder Scrolls game I have played, so I can’t say I am familiar with the ES lore myself.

...also don’t really care about time-sensitivity. I am talking about modern slangs used in the mod. It just doesn’t bother me.

...don’t care about character stereotypes. It’s not easy to think of unique character settings all of the time. Cliché and a bit boring they may be, character tropes are hard to be avoided.

...don’t care about my character being forced to be the character the mod intents for me to be. I play a male/khajiit/friend-type character in my playthrough. I also haven’t touched the Skyrim main quest, so I am technically not a Dragonborn. I know many people get bothered by the limited choices/forced role-play aspect of the mod. But in my opinion, my character is just a character I lend to the mod. The mod is the story. The mod author is the storyteller. I don’t and don’t need to have any say about my character. I am just here to listen to the story.

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Overview (spoilers, of course)

RoC, as I see it, is a romance/politics/adventure genre of story. A quick description of the story:

The first part of the story revolves around Rigmor being forced to sign a legal document due to her noble status of her hometown Bruma. Being a free spirit, Rigmor just wants to sign the document, leave, and continue her carefree adventure with her boyfriend Bobby.

However, when she is in the capital, she is framed to be a traitor, as she is supposed to be the legal queen of the empire due to her family history. Thus, the current “bandit king” (who took the throne by force) and the queen Morag want to get rid of Rigmor to protect their own power.

You (the MC) has to rescue Rigmor from exile, and during the journey on Roscrea (?), you both learn that Morag is behind all of this conspiracy, including bribing Akaviri vampires and Tsaesci samurai with human flesh, and the reason behind her immortality is that she (1) is a vampire -> (2) is Molag Bal (I think?) -> (3) is relying on a soul gem powered by the souls of children.

Back home in Bruma (with the help of a pirate old friend and his crew), Bobby (who betrays Rigmor) and his men are attacking Bruma along with the central imperial government. You fight back, and capture Bobby.

After briefly settling the attacks on Bruma, you start your attack on Morag. To destroy her, you travel through the mountains to a ruins, along with a girl with the power to destroy the soul gem with her arrow. You raid the ruins, destroy Morag (Molag Bal), and go back to the base camp.

You suddenly fall into a near-death situation due to Morag’s curse, but is later saved by the goddess Alessia. When you wake up, war has already begun between Bruma and the imperial government. You, Rigmor and the protectors of Bruma launch a counterattack, successfully driving the imperial soldiers away and winning the war.

At the ending, you and Rigmor march into the imperial palace once again (the place where Rigmor sign the document), and kill the illegal bandit king (who fakes an armistice to assassinate you and Rigmor). You and Rigmor thus become the king and queen of Cyrodiil, when Rigmor announces she is pregnant with the next Dragonborn. The story ends.

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Obviously this is a very brief run-through of the plot of RoC. I omit many small encounters both intentionally and unintentionally, because that would be a lot (examples include...

-Rigmor falling sick on Roscrea

-The battle between locals of Roscrea and Akaviri

-The battle between the pirate crew and Akaviri

-The chancellor asking for peace between Bruma and the capital

-A mysterious old priest

-A wood elf general offering help to Rigmor, who hates elves due to her father being murdered by elves (I think it has something to do with Rigmor of Bruma the prequel?)

There are probably a lot more of these things in RoC, but I just can’t remember, nor will I list them all out.)

At first, RoC gives me a very good first impression.

Actually, in general, RoC is pretty enjoyable in its first quarter (not first half, mind you). That is, the first 2-3 hours of gameplay. I will say what I like about RoC in the next section, where I list what I like and don’t like in RoC.

I first started the mod last year in April. However, I stopped at the ship ride sequence back to Bruma due to study. I wanted to marathon the mod, but it was taking up too much time.

After finishing my public exam, I started the mod again (from the beginning) this year in July. I think it took me...2 weeks to complete it (to be fair, I have other things to do).

Even after finishing it, RoC still is a gem in my eye. Unlike any other Skyrim (story) mod I have played, RoC caught my eye. I have never been hyped by a mod. It’s just a shame how it progressed towards the end. It started with a pretty good image, but kept going downhill as I played it.

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Things I like about RoC

1.Thing I like the most about RoC: Beautiful.

And I mean that on multiple layers (so that probably concludes most of the things I like about RoC).

Assets: The world of Cyrodiil is beautiful. I use no ENB, only a weathers mod (that has some reshade I think), and it’s still beautiful. I took a lot of screenshots throughout my gameplay, because the scenery is just so wonderful. Be it the wilderness on the Table Mountain, or the bustling Imperial City...It’s crazy. The only mod (I have played) that beats RoC in terms of aesthetics is Malsea.

(Yes I know (some of) the assets are borrowed from Beyond Skyrim. But that doesn’t stop them from being beautiful.)

Screenplay: The scenes of RoC are beautiful. This is actually what caught my attention when I first played RoC. The signature scenes are overlooking Cyrodiil with Rigmor on top of a tree, and Rigmor devastated with her fate in front of her childhood “secret base”. These two scenes are crazy powerful. I have never seen such powerful, sentimental scenes in a video game, let alone a Skyrim mod. Even without playing RoB, I could feel the emotions: Only because she’s born to a noble family, Rigmor has to endure all of those matters. Later, it’s even found out that not only is she chosen by mortals, but she is also chosen by the gods. Sometimes, perhaps, Rigmor may even prefer the wandering, dangerous life in Skyrim to the boring, controlled life in Bruma.

Also beautiful are some of the dialogues written. Example is when the Chancellor Blackwell describes Rigmor being tortured when she’s arrested. When her hair is cut, when her clothes are torn...I could picture the whole scene and feel the sadness of Rigmor.

Characters: Rigmor is beautiful. No, I don’t mean her physical appearance. Rigmor actually reminds me of Princess Garnet from FF9 (you can call me a Zidane): A princess yearning for freedom but caught in a destined tragedy. On the other hand, her personality makes me think of Tifa Lockhart from FF7: A seemingly strong, yet emotional young woman. That’s why I think RoC is a tragedy and its ending is a sad one. Rigmor just wants freedom, but throughout the story she’s pushed around by others (arrested, forced to save the country, bare a child, only due to her family history and fate). In the end, she’s trapped in an even harsher cage: As the queen of Cyrodiil, how can she possibly run away? The story of RoC destroys the life of Rigmor, forcing her to accept the fate bestowed upon her. Her life is a tragedy, a beautiful tragedy.

Also brilliant is the voice-acting. Most of the main characters are professionally voiced. Rigmor, Bobby and Morag Sethius (?) are my favourite. I don’t find many mods that are voiced, let alone professionally voiced.

Story: The story (to a certain extent) is beautiful. RoC is a story-oriented mod and we all know it. The story is extremely detailed. Almost all side characters have character development to a certain extent. There are many dialogue scenes for character developments, such as Rigmor and you talking about the past, as a comparison to the sad present life you are experiencing now. Side characters have backstories, such as the orc warrior and her partner from the Burma Fighters’ Guild. Old, recurring characters have (I assume from RoB?) stories that detailed why they are in the position they are in now (such as a character becoming a Jarl in Skyrim). That fills up many plot holes, to the point of developing the holes to hills.

(Mind you, detail is also a problem in itself. I will discuss it later.)

The story is rather unique and not very lore-heavy (in its first quarter, at least). A pet peeve of mine when finding Skyrim story mods is the massive amount of lore in these mods. Stories that revolve around Dwermer, Daedra (etc.) immediately put a slightly bad taste in my mouth. In my opinion, lores are unnecessary, complicated and boring. I don’t care about a non-lore-friendly story. I just want a story that connects to me in a personal level, talking about issues that we, as real-life modern human beings, can relate to.

That’s why RoC’s story gave me a breath of fresh air when I first played it. Rigmor’s story is extremely relatable at first: Being forced to do something you have been running away from. You strongly want to continue running away, but you know the problem will come back to bite you, or others will suffer the consequences for you. Should you run? Or face it? I think many of us have, unfortunately, experienced this dilemma in real life.

Relatability is a very important aspect in storytelling. You have to let the readers relate to the main character on a personal level, so that readers can feel the emotions themselves. We don’t face celestial invasions or supernatural disasters in our everyday lives, so Skyrim lore-friendly story mods are more often than not non-relatable.

That’s what makes Rigmor’s story stand out (initially, I will talk about how the story goes on later).

2.Effort.

No matter you like the mod or not, you have to admit a lot of effort is put into the mod. A lot. RoC is very long, almost like an official DLC, or even a brand new video game. We have a huge map. We have many locations. We have many cutscenes. We have voiced characters. We have composed music. The programming alone is crazy effort. We have to give applause to the team making RoC (and RoB). They really put a lot of time and sweat into making a free Skyrim story mod.

Also give a big hand to the voice actress of Rigmor. She has voiced thousands of lines for one character. And the writers, as well. Millions of lines written in books, notes, dialogues.

All these efforts are not lost on me.

I can never make a Skyrim mod myself, so I admire all modders in the community. For team Rigmor, you surely deserve a seat as one of the most important modders of Skyrim.

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Things I don’t like about RoC

1.Thing I don’t like the most about RoC: Long. Too long.

The problem is not the mod duration. The problem stems from the awkward pacing and tension.

I would like to make a comparison between two video games to demonstrate this problem: Okami and Persona 5. For people who have played these two games, you may understand my opinion better. I assume most have not, so I will not spoil...much.

(ok there will be spoilers i will keep it as small as possible)

(you can skip this section if you just want to see the mod look for the “Back to RoC...” subtitle)

(also for people who have played and loved okami please don’t kill me i know a lot of people love that game)

(also i’m aware that is a kid’s game, but i’m judging it in terms of story pacing)

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Both games are of similar length, mind you. I used a year to complete Persona 5 (with school and study, of course), but I lose count of how long I used to finish Okami (I finished it this May).

This is because Okami was...sadly, getting boring. And this is due to its unbalanced pacing.

Games, or long stories in general, should have an ascending pacing and atmosphere up until the climax. The actions should get faster and faster. The missions should get more and more important. Little exception.

For Okami, I feel like the story was loosely planned. As if the story was being forced to extend when the developers realised the story was not long enough.

From the start, it is stated that Orochi is the main menace of the world. Then you would assume Orochi to be the final boss, or at least the second final boss, right?

The part up to Orochi is great. You save a local village, another village, and proceed to the capital of Japan. Neat.

Then the showdown comes down between you and Orochi. The battle is epic. Very dramatic (though a bit stupid for comic relief). I thought the game finale was at hand, given the fast pacing and the tense atmosphere.

But no, there are still at least 3 bosses until the final boss.

Then what is the tension all about?

The next boss (Kyuubi/Ninetails) also has a pretty good buildup. It leads to the deaths of two rather major characters, and you have to destroy it in its lair. Awesome.

But it’s still not the second final boss.

I stopped after the attack on Kyuubi, because it’s getting too long and boring. I felt like the story was never ending, and my patience was running dry. You kept giving me high tension, only for it to be a fraud. Similar to how the goal of the marathon keeps shifting backwards.

When you give me something that wows me, I will beg for more wows, stronger wows, until the finale.

It’s like competition. You try a 10km marathon, you then want to try another, and the next one will be a 15km.

You try a 15km marathon, you then want to try another, and the next one will be a 25km.

You win your friends in a chess game, you want to win the community.

You win the community, you want to win the country.

You win the country, you want to win the world.

Stories and games are like this too. If you give me cheap fast-food steak after I have tried a prime angus beef steak, I feel nothing. If you continue to do so, I will feel bored. Until you give me something better (or, at least equal).

That’s also why I think the ending of Okami is rather...simple. The tension before is too high, that the ending feels like it was rushed. There isn’t any buildup between the second final boss and the final boss. I beat both bosses in one day. You just...go.

I believe Persona 5 is no shorter in length than Okami. Then what made me so intrigued in Persona 5 that I followed it nonstop for a year? Pacing and atmosphere done right.

The first boss (basically a tutorial one) is a school teacher. Okay.

The second boss is a nation-famous artist. Great.

The third boss is a crime lord/gangster boss. Awesome.

The fourth boss is your future teammate. Cool.

The fifth boss is a world-famous entrepreneur. Magnificent.

Just from the status, do you see an ascending importance from each boss to each boss? From a nobody to someone everyone knows. You are evolving from a local hero to a world hero.

Although the fourth (and sixth) boss is a nobody again, they are linked to you personally. If you don’t do something, you will be in trouble. You face direct danger.

The seventh boss is the second final boss. They are the person the game hypes to be close to the final boss (similar to Orochi in Okami), and right after beating them, the final boss is at hand.

Not to mention the increasing linkage and pacing between the bosses.

Linkage-wise, in Okami, every boss is a separate monster. No linkage otherwise.

In Persona 5, the first boss has nothing to do with the main plot other than facilitating your awakening and forming your cool team (not really a spoiler the trailer shows it).

The second boss and third boss also have little to no importance to the main plot other than making you a greater hero (this is, however, a part of the main plot).

The fourth boss’ mother investigated the power you are using to beat bosses, and died because of her investigation.

The fifth and sixth boss are parts of the conspiracy of the seventh boss. And the seventh boss is your destined arch-enemy as shown by the game.

The final boss is the reason behind every boss you have beaten.

The linkage grows stronger and stronger from each boss to each boss, making you want to continue playing to find out the mastermind behind.

The pacing does a good thing to keep you focused as well. From first to fifth bosses, there are celebrations and fillers between the bosses. But from the sixth to final, no chit-chat whatsoever. One boss, onto the next. The breaks from first to fifth bosses are also really just breaks. Short and simple. One event per intermission. These breaks also give clues to future events, such as you seeing your future waifu teammate while watching fireworks after the third boss.

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Back to RoC...

Now you know the importance of pacing and tension, let’s discuss about RoC as a case study.

I believe (from many reviews online) that the unbalanced pacing is the reason why many players do not enjoy RoC. The weird pacing hurts the enjoyment of RoC a lot (I will say a -25 point goes to that).

There are many occasions where the tension is broken and the pacing halts to a crawl, mostly using dialogues. For example, the excessive use of military strategic conferences. These conferences are boring, whenever they are placed. When you put these conferences in between battles, it feels weird and extra boring. I know it is realistic for conferences to be held to discuss what to do next, but these conferences are just too long.

Times I think RoC has had weird pacing and tension (in terms of chronological order, of course including but not limited to):

-The escape on Roscrea. There are many times you both take a breather and chat. I get that it is used for the character development of Rigmor, but that’s just too much.

-Rigmor falling sick. This whole section feels unnecessary. I get they want to include Alessia (the witch-doctor of Rigmor) as part of a foreshadowing, but with you needing to gather ingredients for the Alessia and listening to her (fake?) backstory, it takes up a lot of time.

-Sabotaging the supply of Akaviri vampires and saving human slaves (on the way home to Bruma on the pirate ship). I get that they want to include that in a realistic, strategic sense, as well as show the kindness of Rigmor to save the innocent, but again, it’s not really that important, yet takes you a lot of time.

-Military conference back at Bruma, and the meeting with Chancellor Blackwell. Bruma is under attack. The tension is high. I recommend just get to the fighting part. More dialogues hurt the pacing in such a dire situation.

-Rigmor (and Blackwell) meeting with an imprisoned Bobby. I get that is for Rigmor to officially cut ties with Bobby, but in times of war, doing that slows down the pacing.

-During the expedition (to destroy Morag Sethius), too many breaks.

-After destroying Morag Sethius, any sequential military meetings (or human problems, except wars) seem boring. You just slain a Daedra. There’s nothing more exciting than that.

-Character developments for the Fighters’ Guild side characters right before the finale...? (I don’t want to be mean but I hate that)

These unnecessary (or unnecessarily long) interactions before or in a high tension situation harm the story very much. I don’t feel anything for these interactions. If you give me more of these, I will only feel bored. Until you give me something that wows me.

I think one of the general problems with the pacing of RoC is that a very high tension event is placed in the first half of the story. I am talking about the rescue of Rigmor. Rigmor is in a life-and-death situation, either she will be killed by men or demons. Saving Rigmor, bringing her home is (at least, to me) very important and put me on the edge of the seat. Therefore, after that, I assume the story will pick up its pace, and the ending is coming soon. But that is not the case. There are still 10+ hours of playthrough, not to mention the story slowing down multiple times with the aforementioned “breaks”.

I will feel bored, until you give me immense danger again like you did with the rescue of Rigmor. Putting the Rigmor rescue arc in the near beginning forces you to pick up the pace and end the story quickly.

Another problem with the awkward pacing is a logical one. A significant example is the expedition arc. I don’t want to be mean, but aren’t you saving the world? Why are you always taking a rest? Even have time for Rigmor to take a bath? Another example is right before the finale. You have the empire at your mercy. Why do you still have time to ask a side character about her backstory? Don’t you want to get the war done? Aren’t you afraid the empire will launch a counterattack?

2.The Ending.

The problem is not that the ending is a sad one. The problem is of atmosphere and logic.

Although, having a sad ending will undoubtedly decrease enjoyability. After all, who doesn’t like a feel-good ending? With the already low enjoyability of RoC, having a sad ending surely add salt to the wound.

Atmosphere-wise, unless you really investigate the story, the ending doesn’t seem like a sad one. You don’t see Rigmor devastated with being forced to be the queen. The ending is progressed quickly without much buildup. The credit scene uses a...very epic remix of the Dragonborn theme. It looks...awkward. Similar to if Thanos snapped half of your favourite superheroes to oblivion, they and the other half are emotionless. No tears. No anger. No awesome, encouraging last words.

Logic-wise, I think neither you nor Rigmor would accept the ending. Both you (through dialogue choices) and Rigmor have always showed immense disgust with fate forcing them to do what they don’t want to. There are many occasions where both of you are like “screw the rules and prophecies”, even right before the finale. Then why would you two suddenly become so submissive and accept fate? You become the empire, while Rigmor becomes the queen and bears the Dragonchild.

You can say you both “mature” (even though I personally don’t think accepting whatever life puts onto you is being “mature”), but this is not shown. Rigmor and you, up to the ending, still refuse to accept fate. But the moment you enter the palace, you both suddenly mature and accept the thrones. This transition feels extremely sudden and weird.

3.Technical Problems

I seldom find technical problems the bane of my enjoyment. But when the problems are game-breaking, that is a problem (a famous example being Sonic ‘06).

Bugs: There are quite a number of bugs in RoC, either guaranteed or easily encountered. A significant example of guaranteed bugs is the Mara shrine scene. Again, I don’t want to be rude, but this is the first time a (serious mod, not joke) mod requires me to use console command to solve a bug. Immersion-breaking is not the problem. The problem is that if I did not know how to solve it, I couldn’t continue. I didn’t even know the command “TIM” (Toggle Immortal Mode) before I looked up on how to solve the Mara shrine bug (“TGM” doesn’t work for that situation).

Easily-encountered bugs are a lot in RoC. These bugs can break your quest, making you unable to continue your story. Examples include:

-Running from the trolls and giants on Roscrea. I think the game wants you to guide them through thin ice, so that the monsters will fall. But it just didn’t work for me. In the end I had to manually kill all the monsters (because Rigmor kept fighting/being attacked by the monsters).

-The meeting with Mr Bear. Because the meeting is placed right after a battle scene, Mr Bear will often be still in its “battle mode”, making you unable to interact with it. Worse if you (accidentally) past through the cave before the cutscene between Rigmor and Mr Bear (due to the lack of directions). I encountered this bug where Rigmor was on the other side of the mountain, yet the cutscene with Mr Bear still hadn’t finished. I had to use two third-party mods to solve this bug (by literally carrying Rigmor over the mountain).

-The battles on the sea. Did the mod team test-run the mod, or invite beta testers to test-run the mod before releasing? Given the narrow battle area and large amount of enemies, people going overboard (falling off the ship into the sea) is extremely easy. Worse when Rigmor or any quest characters have fallen overboard. I had to, again, use console command (“kill”) and a third-party mod (unlimited jumping) to kill every enemy that went overboard and get back onto the ship.

-Rigmor dying. I’m serious, this is possible. There should be an option where you can toggle her essentiality (?), but the option had to be unlocked through console command (at least for me). “Resurrect” console command will break Rigmor. A quest-given shout that should be used to resurrect Rigmor doesn’t work. Why don’t we just make Rigmor essential in the first place?

-Technically not a bug, but the game is sometimes too clueless for you. I’m okay with handholding, but not with no handholding at all. Lack of quest markers, vague directions, no signs that a cutscene is continuing...All these sometimes make me clueless as to what I should do. And it hurts the gameplay enjoyment. The large amount of flags (conditions you need to fulfil before the quest can continue) also lead to a lot of bugs, as you can easily miss those flags (such as talking to a certain person).

My recommendation for anyone who wants to try the mod is to save frequently. Not quicksave. Save. Especially before any battle scenes.

Difficulty: The mod is just too difficult. I play on Adept (default difficulty) because I want to experience the difficulty mod authors intend for you to have, but even that is too difficult for me.

Whenever there is a battle, it is almost always a large-scale one. Having a ton of enemies rushing at you makes surviving extremely difficult, let alone eliminating all enemies. I had to use a third-party (rather) OP spell to eliminate the enemies, or I would have to use whosyourdaddy God Mode. Unless you have a powerful character, or you play at a lower difficulty, legit combat is near impossible. Again, did the team test-run the mod at least once? Or is the mod supposed to be played at a lower difficult/with a very strong character?

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That’s all I have to say about Rigmor of Cyrodiil. It will always have a special place in my Skyrim gaming experience. The concept is great and unique, but the problems in execution just hurt the overall enjoyment of the mod. I will not advise against playing the mod. If you have time, please experience it for yourself, if story-oriented mod is your cup of tea.

This is the first non-fiction passage/review I have written (well, outside of school and exams). Thank you for reading!

(16-7-2020 ~ 17-7-2020)

#i still dont know why I post it here #skyrim #rigmor of cyrodiil #skyrim mod #skyrim mod review #other stuff #i dont know what else i can put here #im sorry

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