#plato's theory of forms

[penhive]

Apologetics and Philosophy

Apologetics is a philosophy to defend Christian faith through the exegesis of philosophical texts. Here, I would like to take up worldly philosophies and use apologetics as a lens to reinterpret it.

Plato and Christianity

Here I would like to take Plato’s theory of forms. Plato said: there is cave populated by men and it’s all dark and from the boundary of the cave men can see a beam of light and what Plato meant in this theory was beside the world of the senses there is an ideal world of forms.  Let’s take Plato’s allegory from a Christian point of view: the cave represents temptation and sin and the light is the Messiah Christ who came to this world and died on the cross for the remission of sins so that all in Christ can enjoy eternity in Heaven.

Hegel and the Master Slave Dialectic

It was the philosopher who proposed the idea of the Master and the Slave dialectic. Both of them have an interrelationship one being the dominant and the other being the submissive. From a Christian perspective: the relationship that Jesus has is one of being a friend and guide. And there is a free choice of surrender or apostasy. The Master Friend dialectic is one of camaraderie and essence fulfillment. It’s an intimacy based on the forgiving and eternal love of Christ.

Nietzsche and God is dead and Dionysian and Apollonian

Nietzsche’s statement that God is dead was an iconic one and turned the tables upside down into the world of despair and doom and ushered into a Philosophy of nihilism. What I would like to say is Nietzsche’s Death of God can be compared to Christ’s crucifixion which gave all humans the will to life in eternity. Nietzsche’s Dionysian and the Apollonian as Dionysian being rhythm and beat and Apollonian being melody and harmony can be reinterpreted as Dionysian being the prodigal complex (a tendency to sin lead a profligate life) and the Apollonian (being the tendency of the Father to give the freedom of choice for either yielding to the father or being in a state of apostasy where forgiveness is guaranteed with repentance

Existentialism

Here I would like to rewrite the Philosophies of Sartre and Camus from a Christian apologetics point of view. Camus based his philosophy on the Myth of Sisyphus where Sisyphus is condemned by the Gods to roll a boulder all the way up hill only to his madness it rolls down and he is forced to do this meaningless task. From this Camus said his iconic statement that life is absurd, meaningless, monotonous, repetitive and chaotic. Looking at it from a Christian point of view: I quote Christ’s words: ‘I came to give life abundantly.’ From a postmodern Christian existentialist point of view: Life is the celebration of meaning.

Sartre’s two core philosophies are: man is condemned to be free: and hell is the other. I rewrite Sartre by saying in Christ we are privileged to be free.  The other for me is Heaven as a relationship of love, empathy, and camaraderie.

Deconstruction and Reconstruction

It was the Philosopher Derrida who introduced deconstruction and in  it a text is analyzed as presence and absence. From Deconstruction, I have developed a Philosophy of Reconstruction from a Christian apologetic point of view: and it is a text with the celebration of presence and the privilege and forgiveness as absence. In the text there is always a chance for the prodigal apostate to return back to the father and be embraced with love, compassion and mercy. The God of presence is a kind and merciful God and he harbors no grievance.

Kant’s Transcendental Idealism

In this Kant talks about a not-knowable-world or the noumena (spirit). Here I would like to bifurcate Kant’s transcendental idealism into transcendental realism. Kant’s transcendental idealism stands for the Father God the supreme and Kant’s transcendental realism stands for a knowable God as Christ the Messiah who came into the world: to proselytize and save people from their sins and died on the cross so that we can share an eternity with him.

[adharastarlight]

when i started taking philosophy, I never imagined I'd be having a breakdown over fucking apples

[idylls-of-the-divine-romance]

"Humans are totally depraved" "Humans are totally good" What if humans are inherently moral? It would explain why people are obsessed with this question. What do we truly desire if not to know and possess The Good? To have the definition of "good" and "bad".

What if this desire leads to us defining it on our own terms? What if my definition of "good" and "bad" is different from your definition of "good" and "bad"? What if there is no "good" or "bad"? What if we are horrifyingly free - abandoned by god - to define "good" and "bad"?

What if this redefining of good and evil on our own terms is the origin of all human failure?

[garadinervi]

Plato, Phaedrus, 265D[-E], in Christopher Alexander, Notes on the Synthesis of Form, Harvard University Press, Cambridge, MA, 1964

«First, the taking in of scattered particulars under one Idea, so that everyone understands what is being talked about… Second, the separation of the Idea into parts, by dividing it at the joints, as nature directs, not breaking any limb in half as a bad carver might.» – Plato, Phaedrus, 265D[-E]

[nerium-aquifolium]

“Platonic sun”

“I thought I knew what I was, now I feel made up, I’m a parody!

You wake me up.

Oh, what you are is hard to find, you could teach the deaf, or you could lead the blind

Just by the shock of your touch, yeah I know how it feels

Or the knife in your stare, and the way that it peels me…

Over and over till’ I’m skinned to the core!, I found a hole in my heart that wasn’t there before.

I’m just a pale little boy, looking out for myself, but I start shaking for you and nobody else.

I’d like to be just simple and dry, but it rains like a storm and I can’t fight the sky.

If you know what it’s best for your friends and yourself, you will sit still and shut your mouth”.

- Winter; Yabadum

[creature-wizard]

At this point I'm starting to think that one of the worst forms of metaphysical reasoning is, "if I can imagine it in my head, then it must be possible in physical reality." Friend, your brain is designed to get up to some pretty wild abstract shenanigans. Just because you can imagine something like "heat" or "light" as an abstract entity, doesn't mean it can actually exist that way in the real world. Your brain doesn't care about how physics actually works; your brain cares about processing, sorting, and recombining ideas. (This is another reason why Plato's theory of forms is stupid - the fucker's literally mistaking his brain's abstractions for a higher form reality.)

[tunaafishyy]

Genshin & Plato: Master Thread

I’ll use this post to organize my links on possible connections to Plato’s Theory of Forms (ToF) in Genshin, as well as some of my ramble / brain dump posts on general Plato connections 🙃

Genshin & Theory of Forms (ToF)

All theories for the ToF threads are independent. Parts 1 through 3 are intended to introduce the basics for ToF and some ways they can be applied, and are not intended as in-depth theories.

Part 1: Intro to ToF (brought to you by 🟣 + Ei & her puppet family)

An intro into some of the core concepts for theory of forms, and how Ei’s first story quest was actually teaching us ToF basics.

Part 2: Extended Intro to ToF, the art edition (Ei & her puppet family, but mostly Scaramouche)

An intro on art’s role in ToF and how it could apply to Scaramouche

Part 3: The Last Part of this Super Extended Intro to ToF, Sacred Sakura & Enkanomiya edition

A brief coverage on more abstract concepts — memory, space time, knowledge — and examples from Ei’s 2nd story quest on how they could potentially apply

Extras that didn’t make the 1-3 threads

Genshin & Plato (Junk Posts)

IN WORK

Sophistry

[tmarshconnors]

"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something."

Plato was an ancient Greek philosopher born in Athens during the Classical period in Ancient Greece. In Athens, Plato founded the Academy, a philosophical school where he taught the philosophical doctrines that would later become known as Platonism

[themoonweaversden]

All 179-244 (or so) codes that were found so far (no spoilers)

#

3466554

29121239168518

333 Sundapple Lane Cozy Creek IL 60714-94611

A

ABUELITA

ADASTRAPERASPERA

ALEX HIRSCH / ALEX / HIRSCH

AM I BLANCHIN

ANSWER

AUDIOLOG (Knob) (Sell your soul to Bill First)

AXOLOTL

B

BAAAA

BABY / BABY BILL / LALALALALA / MOMMY / DADDY

BILL / BILL CIPHER / CIPHER / ILLB / LLIB REHPIC / REHPIC

BLACK SHEEP

BLANCHIN / BLANCHING / BLANCH

BLENDIN

BLIND EYE

BOOBERRY

BUBBLES (knob) (Sell your soul to Bill First)

BURN SIDE

BURNED INSIDE

BYE GOLD

C

CAESAR ATBASH VIGENERE / MULTILEVELMARK

CARD

CARYN

CIPHERTOLOGY

CLEAR (knob) (Sell your soul to Bill First)

CLONE / TYRONE / PAPER JAM

CONSPIRACY

CONTRACT (Knob) (Sell your soul to Bill first)

CRAY CRAY

CRYPTOGRAM CODEX

CURSE WITTEBANE

CURSED

D

DEATH

DEER TEETH

DESTRUCTION IS A FORM OF CREATION

DIONARAP

DIPPER

DIPPY FRESH

DISCO GIRL / BABBA

DISNEY / MICKEYMOUSE

DISPENSE MY TREAT

DIVORCE / BREAKUP

DORITO / NACHO / CHIP

DUCHESS APPROVES / THE DUCHESS APPROVES

DUCKTECTIVE

E

EASTER EGG

EMMALINE BUTTERNUBBINS

EUCLID / SCALENE / SCRIMBLES

EUCLYDIA

EVEN HIS LIES ARE LIES

F

FAMILY MATTERS

FBI / CIA / NSA

FILBRICK

FIXINIT1

FORD / SIXER / STANFORD

FORDTRAMARINE

FORGET THE PAST

FUCK / SHIT / BITCH / SLUT / SEX

FUCK YOU ALEX

G

GIDEON

GIFFANY

GLASS SHARD BEACH

GLOBNAR

GOD / HELP ME / SAVE ME / FRILLIAM

GOODNIGHT SALLY

GRAVITY FALLS

GREBLEY HEMBERDRECK

GUN / THE GUN

H

HAROLDS RAMBLINGS

HECTORING

HEY NERD

HISTORY

HOLOGRAM

HORROR / CREEPYPASTA / ANALOG HORROR

HOTXOLOTL

HOW WILL I DIE / WHEN WILL I DIE

I

IM STILL ON YOUR MIND

IRREGULAR

IS HELL REAL

IS THERE AN AFTERLIFE

J

JOURNAL 1

JOURNAL 2

JOURNAL 3

JUST BLEND IN

JUST FIT IN

K

KINGS OF NEW JERSEY

KOOK

KUBRICK

L

L IS REAL 2401

LIAR LYRE

LIES

LIFE

LOVE / BOYFRIEND / LONELY

LOVE YA BRO

M

MABEL

MASON

MATH / GREECE / SHAPES / GREEK / PLATO / GEOMETRY

MCGUCKET / FIDDLEFORD / OLD MAN MCGUCKET

MEOW / MEOW WOW

MONSTER

MORALITY

MOUNTAIN DONT

MYSTERY

MYSTERY SHACK

N

NAITSUAF

NO

NOT A PHASE

NOTHING

O

OCCURREMUS ITERUM

OH YES THEY BOTH

ONE EYED KING

OROBOROUS

OWL TROWEL

P

PACIFICA

PAPER IS BOOK SKIN

PEAK

PINATA

PINES

PLATINUM PAZ

PORTAL

Q

QUESTION

R

R34LITY

RAT

REALITY

RIDDLE

ROBBIE

RUBBERHOSE

S

SCARY / SPOOKEMUPS / SPOOKY

SCIENTOLOGY

SEASON 1 / SEASON -1

SEASON 2

SEASON 3

SEVEN EYES

SEVERAL TIMES

SHAVE YOUR GRANDMA

SKELETON

SKIBIDI / FORTNITE / ELON / CRYPTO / DOGE / GYATT / RIZZ

Small (knob) (Sell your soul to Bill first)

SOMETHING

SOOS

SORRY

STAN / STANLEY PINES / STAN PINES / STANLEY

STOD EHT TCENNOC

SUCK IT MERLIN

T

TAD STRANGE

TANTRUM

THE BOOK OF BILL / BOOK OF BILL

THE DUCHESS APPROVES

THEORY / MATPAT

THERAPRISM

THEYLL SEE / THEYLL ALL SEE / I SEE

TINSEL SNAKE

TITANS BLOOD

TJECKLEBURG

TOBY DETERMINED

TORTURE MENTALLY

TOURIST TRAP

TRIANGLE

TRIGONOMETRY

U

UNIONMADE

UNIVERSE

UNREALITY

V

VALLIS CINERIS

VIRUS

W

WADDLES

WEIRD

WEIRDMAGEDDON

WELL WELL WELLBEING

WENDY

WHICH RELIGION IS RIGHT

WHO ARE YOU

X

XGQRTHX

XYLER / CRAZ

Y

YES

YOU CANT KILL AN IDEA

YOURE INSANE

Will update if more are found

[penhive]

Assorted

Plato and Christ

Plato is a philosopher who brought forth  the idea of forms. In his theory of forms behind everything in nature there is a corollary of an ideal world. His doctrine can be applied into Christian Philosophy. God made man  in the likeness of his image and so the ideal man is with God. So too God became flesh and lived as a man and beyond the physical Christ, there existed an ideal God and the Holy Spirit.

Sephiroth

Sephiroth in mystical Kabblah refers to the 10 emanations of God and they can be applied to God Christ as

1 Love

2 Kindness

3 Mercy

4 Compassion

5 Joy

6 Peace

7 Forgiveness

8 Tolerance

9 Providence

10 Prosperity

[overthegardenwirtt]

the imane khelif stuff is so crazy because the real reason she is upsetting so many people is because she is a person in the public light who is actually showing that sex is not as binary and biologically determined as terfs/transphobes like to pretend.

like forever the argument has been there are 2 sexes: biological woman (XX, Vagina) and biological man (XY, Penis). but that is not and has never been the case. so now these people have to try to pick apart the things that they THINK make u one biological sex, plato's theory of forms-style, and they can't find a black and white answer and it drives them insane

does testosterone make u a man? does estrogen make u a woman? what about people with PCOS who produce more testosterone? what about men who get their testes removed because of cancer and no longer naturally produce testosterone? what about men going on finasteride? what about people with klinefelter syndrome who have XXY? when we really get down to it, biological sex can become just as fluid as gender sometimes and that is scary to a lot of people

[littleguysdaily]

could you clarify the meanings of each of the CESSBM categories?

Of Course!

Chuckability: A Little Guy's aptitude for being chucked. (Aptitude for being chucked does not corollate with desire to be chucked)

Engaging: Does a Little Guy engage you? Do *I* engage you? Do you think we have a future together?

Squishiness: The amount that a Little Guy can be squished before they violently rupture.

Splorpability: Are you familiar with Plato's Theory of Forms? Think of Splorpability as being nothing like that.

Bones: How good are a Little Guy's bones at being bones?

Media Literacy: It's exactly what it says on the tin.

I hope you found this helpful! I can’t explain further, unfortunately, I’m in too deep.

[garadinervi]

Platone, Fedro, 265 d-e, in Christopher Alexander, (1964), Note sulla sintesi della forma, «Struttura e forma urbana», Il Saggiatore, Milano, 1967

«La prima operazione, per mezzo d'uno sguardo d'insieme, implica la capacità d'addurre a una sola idea l'indefinita dispersa molteplicità; cosi, la singola unità specifica, esattamente definita, potrà dimostrar chiaro l'argomento sul quale si svolge la dimostrazione. […] [La seconda è] l'operazione contraria; capacità cioè di poter suddividere per mezzo di specie minori, secondo i punti delle naturali articolazioni. E stare attenti di non spezzar malamente nessuna parte, come farebbe un cuoco inesperto.» – Platone, Fedro, 265 d-e

[kusanagihaku]

just googled the concept of kyklos (name of mc's anomaly) and it seems like there are two main referents for it?

the first one is in reference to the epic cycle in greek cyclic poetry. kyklos can be used to denote the concept of uniformity and continuity in epic poems - each poem begins with a link to the end of the last poem in the series. i think this is fairly in line with what edward told mc re: how she's going to turn into the anomaly at the end of her curse. we started with meeting the kyklos and we'll end with becoming the kyklos.

it can be used to "express an early notion of circularity inherent in the events of world history or human fate" - meaning life is cyclical etc., but also that everything repeats itself. which !!! is exciting because it's very much in line with the taiga timeloop theory (see: taiga in the sinostra chapter saying something about the mc giving up on the future in this timeline too?)!

it also makes sense with the opening scene (after you choose your ghoul) - the entire story starts epic poem style, opening with a scene depicting the end. you fail to save your ghoul in this loop, they plummet into the fire, the story restarts. everything repeats itself.

but even more exciting to me !!!! is the fact that some classic greek philosophers (see: plato, aristotle) use it to refer to the cycle of governments. in short, a society will cycle through different forms of governments - as each type becomes corrupt, the society will go through an upheaval to re-form the way it is run.

so many ghouls are displeased with darkwick. coupled with the way ep7 is beginning to pit us against administration and the institute, naming the mc kyklos might be hinting that either the mc or her transformation will incite some sort of upheaval? maybe her position as a neutral party between all the houses will result in her piecing together bits of information to reveal an ugly truth, or maybe their eventual treatment of her (killing her after she turns into the kyklos) will anger the ghouls so much they'll start something?

[creature-wizard]

Looks like it's time to talk about starseeds and the New Age movement again.

Since I'm seeing more starseed content being posted, I'm gonna make another post on why the whole starseed thing and the surrounding New Age belief system are... not good.

So for those who don't know, New Age mythology is essentially a hodgepodge of cherrypicked and distorted myths from various cultures, racist pseudohistory, and far right conspiracy theories. To put it very briefly, starseeds are supposedly here to help Earth resist the reptilians, a race of politics-manipulating, war-starting, media-controlling blood-drinking aliens. For those who don't recognize the tropes here, these are basically all antisemitic canards. The reptilian alien myth as most know it today comes from David Icke, who ultimately cribbed a bunch of his material from The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion, a Russian hoax created to justify violence against Jews. He was also influenced by the work of people like Fritz Springmeier, a hateful crank who based much of his work on other hateful cranks.

(David Icke, by the way, also claims that transgender is an evil reptilian conspiracy. You'll never find just one form of bigotry with these people.)

There are supposedly numerous alien races out there, and one of the most prominent among them are the Pleiadians, AKA Nordics. While modern depictions of the Pleiadians give them more variety in skintone, there's no denying that older Pleiadian mythology basically pictured them as Aryans In Space, even associating them with the swastika.

You see what's going on here? "Good" swastika-loving Aryan aliens versus "evil" Jewish aliens? Sound familiar?

Racism isn't just a tangential part of the starseed myth, either. It lies at its very core. It's inextricably tied in with the ancient astronaut hypothesis, which has a history of racist motivation behind it. The TL;DR is that a bunch of white people couldn't believe that non-white people had built a bunch of things they couldn't figure out how to build themselves (EG, the Great Pyramids), so they proposed that the real builders were anyone from Atlanteans to aliens. (Atlantis, by the way, never existed; it was a literary device created by Plato.)

One supposed purpose of starseeds is to help the world "wake up to the truth," which basically just means "convert people to New Age spirituality." New Age believes that world peace is contingent on a majority of the world being converted to New Age belief, and that resistance against their belief system is ultimately the work of the aforementioned reptilian aliens.

To put it another way, New Agers think they understand other cultures' spiritual traditions better than the actual members of said cultures, and think that anyone who disagrees with them is being manipulated by the conspiracy, or is an agent of the conspiracy. This includes Indigenous cultures which are already endangered from white Christian colonialism.

Essentially, endangered cultures cannot speak up for themselves and resist New Agers' efforts at cultural assimilation without being labeled a problem and an enemy. It's basically white Christian colonialism repackaged as "spiritual, not religious."

Again - if you heard from these people that some ancient text or myth describes extraterrestrial beings visiting our planet for one reason or another, you heard misinformation. They twist and misrepresent literally every myth and text they get their hands on. For example, you may have heard that the vimanas from Hindu traditions were actually alien spacecraft. They were no such thing. Or maybe you heard that the Book of Enoch describes aliens performing genetic experimentation on humans. It literally does not. At best, all of the stories they cite just kind of sound like aliens if you ignore most of their content and pay no attention to their cultural contexts.

The starseed movement preys on alienated people, especially autistic people and people with ADHD. You can look up nearly any list of signs that you're supposedly a starseed, and many of them will align perfectly with characteristics associated with autism and/or ADHD, or that people with these conditions commonly report. Some people within the movement even go so far as to claim that ADHD and autism don't even exist, but were actually made up by the conspiracy as a cover to suppress and control starseeds, which is some yikes-as-hell ableism.

So basically, people are being told that if they have these certain characteristics or symptoms, that means it's their job to spread New Age spirituality to defeat the conspiracy and help others ascend to the fifth density.

And what's the fifth density, you might ask? It's supposedly humanity's next evolutionary level, because New Age is also based on biological misconceptions. Supposedly once everyone's DNA "upgrades," they'll essentially morph into an aetheric form. Supposedly, this is preceded by a number of "ascension symptoms," including depression, headache, gastrointestinal issues, and any number of other symptoms that could indicate almost anything, including stress.

What many of these people don't realize is, this prediction has already failed. Back in the 2000s and 2010s, experiencing "ascension symptoms" was supposed to precede ascension to 5D beginning December 21, 2012. One lady, Denise Le Fay, was convinced that the hair loss she was experiencing in 2008 was an ascension symptom. As we can see by looking her up, she's very much still with us on the 3D plane these days, repeating the same tired old scripts New Agers recycle endlessly.

By the way, everything you near New Agers saying today about old systems being dismantled, dark forces being arrested or kicked off the planet, and new economic systems on the horizon? They've been recycling these scripts for years now. Take a look at this page written back in 2012. You got stuff about the complete dismantling of an enormous network of sinister forces," "the arrest and removal of a world-wide cabal," and a "new economic system."

("Cabal," by the way, is a dogwhistle term for "Jews.")

Furthermore, people in this movement are often encouraged to try and access past life memories through dreams or hypnosis, which makes the whole thing feel even more real to them. But the thing is, you can have incredibly vivid experiences about literally anything you put your mind to - the people in the reality shifting having vivid experiences of living another life in the Harry Potter universe are a great example of this. Just because you have vivid experiences, doesn't mean they have any bearing on anything happening in this reality.

So yeah, the starseed movement and the larger New Age movement are both extremely harmful. They promote racist pseudohistory, medically-irresponsible pseudoscience, conspiracy theories that target numerous marginalized groups, and functionally target aliened people with ADHD and autism to convince them that spreading its beliefs is their job.

[onlycosmere]

Spun Lines: We’ve seen Shallan’s drawings appear to make people into “better versions of themselves.” But we also see her draw Yalb surviving the shipwreck, and later find out he did. Is she actually seeing the future in which she just happens to inspire people to be better?

If so, this would make Wit’s warning to her in Oathbringer more concerning.

Brandon Sanderson: As will all sort of future sight/foretelling in the cosmere, it is not necessarily telling the future so much as seeing possibilities. And Shallan has… we’ll get into this in Book Five. Shallan’s a little extra good at this, for Spiritual mumbo jumbo. (It’s not necessarily just Spiritual mumbo jumbo, 17th Shard.) In this case, we have a very distinct reason why this is happening with Shallan that you might be able to put together. It’s pretty obvious. But you should be able to see these things with Shallan very early in the books.

As early as Words of Radiance, I was sticking in little nods to this. She is able to grab glimpses of the Spiritual Realm in ways that even other Lightweavers can’t do. Lightweaving always has a bit of this, right? And this comes back to what’s going on with the Realmatic Theory and Plato’s Theory of the Forms as kind of a foundational text that helped me develop this in my mind. You’re seeing more perfect versions of who you could be. When she’s doing a sketch, she’s sometimes sketching not who you are, but who you could be.