#recovering persecutor

[abyss-boxes]

[TEXT ID 1-2: “This (programmed) alter is a recovering persecutor”]

[TEXT ID 3: “Everyone is proud of how far this alter has come”]

Discord req!

[mg-system]

This blog is persecutor safe!

This blog supports persecutors who are doing their best

This blog supports persecutors who mess up sometimes. Nothing is linear

This blog supports angry fuckers

This blog supports persecutors who just want to protect their system

This blog supports persecutors who don't present in traditional ways

Life is a hectic thing and we wouldn't be where we are today if it wasn't for the persecutors we've had. Two of them are the hosts now! One of which is our main protector. We love and appreciate all of them even if they haven't always been the healthiest individuals. Even if they still aren't the healthiest individuals (spoiler, none of us are)

We fight against the stereotype of "evil dangerous alters"

We support persecutors' ability to vent about their systems, vent about life, vent about themselves. All of us talk shit sometimes so it would be hypocritical of us to say they're excluded from that.

One of the best decisions we ever personally made for our individual system was to give them a chance, even if it was terrifying, even if we had to have alters to "babysit" just in case. And I'm glad they also (begrudgingly) accepted that it wasn't an insult to them.

-???

[clowncarfullofrats]

I love being an "evil alter" like fuck yea im an evil gay bastard. Persecutor faggotry. I'm a bitchhh and I'll throw a brick at you

[ill-be-your-hero-just-hold-on]

✨ Pluto Watts ✨

Pronouns: He/Him Role/Function: protector, recovering persecutor. Age (Approximate/Mental): 40 Source: James Ironwood from RWBY.

Personality Overview:

I'd like to think I'm a very relaxed individual, but I do become violently overprotective of my family and friends when the need arises.

Likes:

Space, Stars, Greek Mythology, The Dragon Prince.

Dislikes:

Being compared to source and being treated like/harassed or excluded for source.

Good Triggers (Positive Fronting Triggers):

Hero, Space, Ares from Greek Mythology, My family, including my son, Maron, and my husbands, Arthur and Aaravos Watts. ("What in the crackship," you might be thinking, and the answer is yes.)

Bad Triggers (Negative Fronting Triggers):

(Private Information.)

Fronting Behaviors/Characteristics:

I might speak/type in a formal manner.

Things To Know:

I'm not mad, just formal.

Visual/Aesthetic:

I look like James Ironwood from source, with minimal differences. Some members in the system say I look older than in source; however, not as old as Iron (another James Ironwood introject) looks. I can change my appearance as I see fit, though. Sometimes I wear rather casual attire, just a white t-shirt and jeans.

Face Claim:

Profile picture by thornsnfeathers on tumblr. Message for removal.

DNI:

Fakeclaimers and anyone intending to compare me to / harass me for my source. If you're neither of those things, assume you're welcome on my blog.

Bonus:

You Can't Tell Me this Doesn't Look Gay Out Of Context.

[dreamergraveyard]

Being a "recovered" persecutor will never not feel odd. I look at other persecutors in the system and feel so much sympathy towards them, yet I know that they feel no such thing towards me. I know that I've come so far, and I want them to do the same, but for now, they're either badly coping, traumatized, or, like I was, incorrectly protecting the system. I hope they choose to pursue healing one day, too. Even if for some it will take therapy or more extensive help to do so. One day. Hopefully.

~ Sirena 🖤

[lanafemme]

the evolution of my self-perception over the course of a year…. this has been a HUGE part of recovery for me!

“i cant look like my body, i have to look ‘perfect’ and have zero identifiably jewish features” —> “its ok if i look like my body but only how i looked before i transitioned” —> “there is nothing wrong with my current body and i like living in it because it is mine!”

i wouldnt say that i have a separate “internal appearance” at all at this point, i just dont think of myself as “looking different” or having a separate form from my own body at all. i just live here! ofc i still have my personal style and wishes but i no longer divorce my concept of self from my body. i also finally finally feel my own real age, no longer permanently “stuck” at the age i was abused

[healingpolyphony]

Got the fucking Urges lads

[syscest]

I loooooove persecutors… recovered ones and the ones that are downright awful mean “im the evil alter” guys… recovered ones because its aw? You used to hurt your headmates? But now you dont because you care about them? That is soooooo adorable. And the mean scary ones because SJSBHDKASBSH HOT HOT HOT!!!!!! Hehe. I have problems. Our friend sys’ persecutor fronted to tell me to “mind your own fucking business” when i asked the host who he represents and >////< !!!!! Yessir minding my own fucking business now! Youre so scary…

I don't even need to add anything this is a great syscest post already we have such similar tone to our tastes fjdkfkd

[mg-system]

I'm scared to question my gender because then I'd have to accept that the identity I've been proud of and held onto for so long is no longer me. The one facet of who I am as an alter, as a person, that doesn't have a.. problematic history. The part of me that helped us realize we were trans. I was the big brother the ex host wish he had growing up.

I've been proud of who is am as a gay man for so long.

I caused so much pain in my past, but the part of me that meant something will "suddenly" be different, and that's terrifying..

-co-host/main protector

(note: I am aware that I do not have to change my sexuality or whatever and don't plan to, but the two have always been tied together and it's uncomfortable to think about it)

[angel---eater]

This is an asshole thing to do and I am Not Doing It.

Hey oomfs AITA for being petty enough to secretly camp on the Horse Race Tests person's twitter and watch the lastest vids before my best friend streams them with us and our friends because said best friend has let their BPD put a bitchy fuckin' wedge between us and freaked the fuck out and started yelling 'NO I DON'T WANT CORVID TO WIN, NO THEY CAN'T WIN' genuinely angerly, in voice call, when I predicted the winning honse twice in a row by complete chance? Possibly. But they were petty enough let themselves do that first, and to let their (unmanaged, very intense) BPD splitting affect our relationship.

Further context: All of our friends except for one also has BPD and my best friend has been acting like they're an island with a burden we couldn't possibly understand about it. It's not like I don't split on people in my life, too. Of course I do, I have BPD. The difference is that I don't let my BPD affect my relationships and I don't let my agression during a split escape containment (venting to my partner privately until it's over, we untangle it, and then it's fine). We were playing with fuckin' toys. Like gettin' that pressed is embarrassing, bro. Writing this long of a post about it also lowkey embarrassing but they keep making themselves a problem and really starting to hurt our feelings. Also, we have already had multiple conversations with them to touch base mental health-ways and 80% of the time, things are okay. They're going through a lot, I'm going through a lot, we both have pretty antisocial mental health problems, its just that this shit keeps happening right in front of me.

[syscultureis]

"Recovering" persecutor culture is, I have recognized my behavior is harmful. Quite honestly, I don't care about that part. But I have also recognized that said behavior was over-the-top and unnecessary. That, I do care about. So I have elected to stop engaging in said behavior because I find it pointless and unproductive, not because I've harmed others. No, host, stop insisting I'm becoming a better person, I'm simply adapting to my environment. How dare you suggest otherwise.

.

[nichelink]

Morality Pet Nichelink: an All-Ages nichelink relationship/relationship dynamic where one person is the "morality pet" and the other/s are a "villain".

morality pet is a media trope where a villain character gains a friendship with an innocent/child character, and the villain becomes softer and more empathetic, stable, and less villainous over time due to their friendship. here is the page on tv tropes for examples from media.

this may include, but isn't limited to:

the villain being a recovering r*dqueer who wants to become less mean/toxic/rude instead of encouraging it like the rqc did, and the morality pet helping them by being positive and kind to them

the villain being kin/introject/alterhuman of a villain character and still behaving very "villainous" but wanting the morality pet to help them do that less

the villain being a persecutor alter of some kind and knowingly using this relationship to become less antagonistic/harmful to others/themself

the villain having a heavily stigmatized disorder and identifying with/reclaiming "evil" "villain" related words/tropes

the morality pet being an age regressor, chronosian, a dissodic youth-related term or a young alter who likes the idea of a villain as their caretaker/parental figure

familial, alterous, tutelary or other teritary attraction

i hope it's obvious, but for the persecutor alter example i gave, that's only for a persecutor who is okay being called a "villain". that won't be comfortable or even healthy for everyone.

nichelink carrd

tagging: @radiomogai | @everythingarchive | @mogai-transcriber | @horrormogai ? | @plurality-faq | @plurchive | @pluralterms | @n-tcat | @kiruliom

flag inspirations:

a character from my favorite childhood anime who was my first example of this trope

dissogreymoral and dissoamoral

[mournfall-syscourse]

Persecutors are Smoke Alarms/Detectors

We've seen some talk about persecutors in systems, or similar stuff, lately, both on Tumblr and in some Discord spaces. Alters/parts/headmates/etc. that do harmful things within and/or external to the system/collective, typically for maladaptive and trauma-influenced reasons (though figuring out those reasons is easier said than done).

For simplicity, I'll be (typically) referring to these kinds of alters as 'persecutors', the behaviour as 'persecutorial', and so on, within this post. If that's not a label you like personally, consider inserting a more comfortable (but still fitting) label in place of the word, as you read. Though perhaps this post may shift your perspective on the label in general.

Persecutors as a topic is one that is rather close to our heart, as a system that is frankly quite heavily built on them. For the majority of our knowledge of being a system (including what we know from before our syscovery), we have had persecutor hosts (our current primary host is not, but a lot of our system in general still are). Realisation of this, early on in our syscovery, resulted in us having a bit of a soft spot for persecutors, both within our own system and within those of other systems we've known. We've always tried to treat persecutors with compassion, and as little judgment as possible. We've made mistakes along the way, especially with our own persecutors - we're not perfect - but we do our best. But the importance of persecutors to us is part of why we're making this post in the first place.

This is, of course, our own opinions and related to our own experiences on the topic. Maybe some of this will be helpful to you, reading this, maybe other parts won't be. Take what's useful, and leave the rest. Maybe some of this will challenge your views - it can be a good thing for those views to be challenged. Either they'll be changed, hopefully for the better, or you'll reinforce those views through that challenge. Either way, I hope that it helps you to read this. We are a CDD (specifically DID) system, so this will be from the perspective of that - I don't know how much of this will be relevant to systems that do not have trauma influencing any part of their systemhood, but maybe it'll still be insightful.

To avoid this being a massive wall of text in the tags or dashboard, the rest of the post will be below the cut:

The main things related to this topic that we want to address or talk about are:

Stigmatisation and demonisation of persecutors

Shame around persecutors specifically, but also how it relates to shame around any "imperfect" behaviour that comes about due to mental health issues, and the damage it can cause for actually recovering or improving

System responsibility with regards to persecutors and other alters who do harmful things, as well as responsibility with regards to mental health in general

Approaches to persecutors that we've tried (or heard about from other systems), and in general our own experiences (past and present) with persecutors in our own system.

Labelling in general, and how many alters or behaviours are mis-labelled as persecutors when that doesn't necessarily fit

Definitions of persecutor/persecutorial behaviour, and the ways that the system community has shaped that, and the good and bad parts of that - as well as how we typically define persecutors (and their behaviour) for ourselves

A lot of these things are rather intertwined, so rather than discuss them entirely one at a time, they'll generally be interspersed within the post, though some may be focused more than others at different parts. The post is long, so I'll include some kind of heading for different sections, to make it less of a giant wall of text.

Stigmatisation & Demonisation of Persecutors, and the Impact of Shame

I do want to kick things off with the stigmatisation and demonisation of persecutors. It's a really, really common thing to see in system communities of treating persecutors as "evil" or "irredeemable". That they're just abusive, or terrible. That they should be locked away or gotten rid of. This is a massive problem. It pisses us off, frankly. It's also just harmful to everyone in the vicinity that has a persecutor in their system. Yes, even you.

And I get it. I get why persecutors are treated this way, especially when people aren't informed of why persecutors tend to happen. Why they do the things they do. People see them as a problem, someone hurting them or their friends, maybe even using their own body or voice to do it, etc. depending on how things manifest. It's a knee-jerk reaction. The problem comes about when things never progress past that knee-jerk reaction, though. When people just label persecutors as bad and that's that. When it's all about shame and hurt. When the compassion is completely left to the wayside.

I think this problem varies in different parts of the community. In our experience, it's been more common in communities that focus more on alters/headmates as individual, separate people - especially those where system responsibility between alters is not as strongly encouraged. Now, to be clear, I'm not saying that treating alters/headmates as individual separate people is a bad thing - our system started out exclusively with that viewpoint, and it's one we've remained comfortable with, while also adopting a parts-based viewpoint simultaneously (the two viewpoints don't actually conflict) - I'm just pointing out that the problem is more common within communities that have that focus. I've seen this problem occur in parts-focused communities, too, it's just less common, in our experience. I could probably make a whole other post about the thoughts we have on this on its own, but that's for another day.

So why is it harmful to just say that persecutors are evil or irredeemable and that's that? It puts up a wall. A roadblock. It shuts down any potential for recovery, as long as that wall remains. It disregards why persecutors happen, why they do what they do. It treats the symptom as the problem, instead of actually dealing with the problem that's causing it in the first place. It also disregards the possibility that the persecutor is actually helping the system. It shames the persecutor for existing, for being the way they are. It shames the system for having the persecutor. It's counter-productive.

Shame, as a whole, is a stopping force. It shuts things down. Pushes people into silence. Into hiding. Into stopping a behaviour. It's built on fear and rejection. There are situations where shame is a beneficial thing, though I think that's far rarer than the situations where it is actively harmful. How often has shame stopped you from speaking up about something? From seeking help? From talking about what's hurting you or how you're suffering? From feeling like it's okay to make mistakes, to be imperfect? How often has shame made you beat yourself for messing up, for hurting someone accidentally?

This can apply to not just systems, here, though it definitely does apply to them, too. Think about how many mental health conditions are stigmatised, demonised. Ones people feel like you can't talk about, that you have to keep hidden. That people will judge you for having it, for having any kind of symptoms be noticeable. Will make assumptions about you if they know. How crushingly alone that can make you feel. Even with just being a system, disordered or otherwise, this happens.

Shame often results in a persecutor being even less cooperative. Trying to be louder, or more destructive. It's like trying to bottle up a problem. It might work for a time, but eventually that bottle is going to build up too much pressure and explode, and you'll have an even bigger mess on your hands.

Approaching Persecutors with Compassion and Understanding, and Taking (System) Responsibility

Why are we shaming each other, and ourselves, when we're hurting? What if we treated each other and ourselves with compassion and understanding, instead? The painful, 'ugly' parts of ourselves, the things we don't want others to see. Alters/headmates/parts that are persecutors, or who have persecutorial tendencies and behaviours sometimes. Why not try to treat them kindly? To understand where they're coming from, why they're doing what they're doing.

Now, this isn't easy. And I'm also not saying to just let them walk all over you and hurt you with no repercussions or without protecting yourself. If a persecutor is hurting you, do what you can to protect yourself and the others in your system. You also need to take responsibility for their actions. They're in your system. Whether you view them as an entirely separate person, or a part of you, or somewhere in between, you have to take responsibility for their actions. Yes, it hurts. You might be a victim of their actions, too. And it's not even necessarily your fault that they're doing what they're doing. But it is your responsibility. This is one of the ways that I think parts-focused viewpoints for systems can help, with having system responsibility come more easily.

This goes for all trauma and mental health conditions, and related behaviours that can come about because of them. Something triggers a fight response from you and you lash out at someone? You have a responsibility to manage that situation. Make amends with the person you lashed out at. Try to repair. Try to work on ways to manage the trigger and your trauma responses. What happened to you is not your fault. Your responses that you can't control are not your fault. But they are your responsibility to manage, to find ways to bring under control. And if you choose to not take responsibility for those, then your responses will become your fault, as a collective, through that choice. You have control over whether or not you will work on things, and how you go about it.

Remember that the persecutor is like you, too. A person, or a part, or both, or however you view those within your system. It's actually one of the ways that I think that people-focused viewpoints for systems can help quite a bit: Seeing a persecutor as a person. Someone who is hurting. Lashing out. Or maybe seeing a problem and trying to solve it in the only way they know how. Someone who is scared, or angry, tired. Yes, it sucks that they're hurting you, or the people around you. So, how can you help them? How can you ease their pain? Help them cope better? Work with them to find a better solution to the problem they're seeing. Maybe even help them see that the problem they're seeing isn't actually there. Persecutors are so varied in how they can be, why they are. Each one might need a different approach. For trauma that originates in childhood, especially,

For us, we've had persecutors that have held individual problems, related to trauma they hold or that is strongly influencing them, that is causing them to lash out or react in certain ways, or to hurt us; others have been created in response to a wider problem in the system, that they're the brain's way of trying to manage the problem. Sometimes they're aware of this, and don't want to do what they're doing but don't know how to manage things otherwise, or they lose themselves to their emotions. Other times they've been unaware that they're doing anything wrong in the first place. It varies. It's also not always easy to figure out which is which, so trying different approaches and seeing what works, can be a good starting point.

For things that are related to something the persecutor themself holds, trying to talk to them can help. Trying to understand them. If they're not willing to talk (to you or anyone else), then analysing their behaviours, looking for patterns. Getting a read of their emotions, where that might be coming from. Sharing a brain and body can help with some of that. Trying to figure out what the underlying issue is, and working out ways to manage it in a healthier way. You may not be able to solve it fully, especially not right away. You might need professional help, or simply time and effort. Take it step by step. Try to find ways for the alter to have an outlet that doesn't cause harm to others, or at least causes minimal harm. If it's a misconception caused by trauma, then helping them see how things really are, in reality, can also help.

For things that are more about a greater problem that the persecutor was formed to try and manage, then it's a similar approach. What is the problem they're acting on? Is it actually a problem, or is it something that trauma is making the system/persecutor believe is a problem? If it's actually a problem, what can you do to work on the problem? Are there alternatives to what the persecutor is doing to try and manage the problem, that could be done instead? Maybe degrees of solutions. Even analysing if the behaviour of the persecutor technically helps a bit with the problem - having it as a backup, just-in-case way of managing it, while you try other solutions. Sometimes the persecutor themself isn't actually helping the problem at all (even if they think they are), but serve instead to point out the problem in the first place, through their actions. If it's not actually a problem, then how can you work on teaching your brain that? Maybe you need to convince the persecutor themself, or maybe you need to help the system/brain as a whole learn that what you're doing that it's reacting to is actually okay.

We've had plenty of different types of persecutors, ourselves, though we tend to almost exclusively have internal-acting ones. It's been a long time since we had external-acting ones, those that would lash out at others.

Some of our current persecutors are capable of acting outwardly in a persecutorial manner, but we're aware of them and are trying to avoid potentially activating those tendencies. It's complicated - one of them is a part that would try and isolate us from everyone we know, if they felt it was needed, for our safety. The other is more inclined to prevent the rest of us from being able to talk to someone in our life that they deemed to be a threat to our well-being emotionally, restricting access, while discussing the problem (and not really being particularly kind about it) and working out if the people that they view as a threat are going to fix their behaviour.

As for our internal-acting persecutors, the host we had at the time of our syscovery, was quite internal-focused. She held a deep sense of self-hatred, in part so the rest of the system wouldn't have to. But it resulted in her being self-destructive. Hurting herself, making decisions that weren't safe. Self-harming behaviour, less obvious on the outside, that was indirectly hurting the rest of us. Self-sabotage, and the like. We helped her to find better outlets for her pain, and also to not keep it entirely to herself all the time, to share some of what she was holding with the rest of us, so that it wasn't so heavy on her shoulders.

Other internal-acting persecutors, like some that are currently still around, have taken rather aggressive methods to force us to deal with certain problems they've seen. Hurting us internally, quite drastically, to achieve that goal. Initially, they were incredibly secretive about it (and still are, at times), not really giving us an idea of why they were targeting certain parts, what they were trying to achieve outside of just hurting us. Over time, they came to realise that we wanted to work with them if we could, to try and find better solutions, so we now know why they do what they do, and have strategies for trying to mitigate the issue in a way that we can. They tell us who's in their crosshairs, with enough time to try and work on things before they feel like they have to act, and if we don't deal with things properly, then they'll still do what they do, as a back-up. Their method has helped, in a twisted way. It hurts, and it's not healthy, but it ultimately does the job, in a pinch.

Some of our persecutors, we still don't really get along with. They're hurting us, and aren't willing to talk about things to find any kind of resolution, and we also can't stop them from doing what they're doing, either. Maybe they will someday. Maybe we need help from our therapist. For now, it's something we need to manage the fallout from, it's all we can do, right now. Managing how we act in the emotional states that their behaviours leave us in. Oddly enough, some other persecutors are actually helpful in managing those, albeit in a maladaptive way.

And then, some persecutors do something we call "system-sanctioned" persecutor activity (not our idea to call it that, but it's what we use nowadays) - which is when they feel compelled by the system/brain to act in harmful ways, even if they don't agree with what they're doing. Sometimes this feels like them watching themself do something, their body moving on their own, internally. Other times, in the moment, their mindset shifts to suit what they're being made to do, only to return to clarity afterwards. Both scenarios typically result in the persecutor in question feeling an immense amount of guilt for it once they're in control of themself or have returned to their senses.

We could have done so much harm to our recovery, and the state of our persecutors, if we'd treated them the way we were told to treat them by people we once knew. People who, like some parts of the community now, treat persecutors horribly. Who push for the locking up, or "killing", of persecutors. We've seen those approaches go very badly. Sometimes they're necessary, we've done those before, to manage certain persecutors, but it's not a decision to be made lightly.

Locking up a persecutor is something that we think can be done in a good way. In the past, we've had a location in the headspace where we would confine certain persecutors to limit their influence. They'd be comfortable, and they'd still be able to front, to communicate, but their ability to cause harm would be far more limited. In some ways, it forced them to communicate more, as they knew they wouldn't get out if they didn't. We didn't do it to hurt them; it was simply a protective measure for the rest of us. Some of our persecutors went into it willingly, especially those who didn't like their persecutorial nature and wanted to improve, while others we did have to force into it, though we still did that carefully, and only when we felt it was absolutely necessary.

Labels are Tools, and Our Definition of 'Persecutor'

As far as the label of 'persecutor' itself goes, we view it as a constructive label, one to be used with compassion and care, a tool and a utility, instead of one of shame or to put an alter in a box. We don't do it to label someone in the system as a "problem".

Now, labels in general are a tool. They're something to be used if it helps you. People use labels all the time, for identity, for instance. It's a way to find community, people who are similar to you, who can relate to you. So, looking at the label of 'persecutor', does it help you to use it? What do you associate with it? If you associate being a persecutor with being a problem, something to be ashamed of, or any number of things that make you feel awful for being one, then the label isn't helping you. You could find a different label, if you want to, or you could change your perceptions and associations of the label. You don't have to use a label at all if you don't think it'll help.

For us, we view being a persecutor as an alter that acts on trauma in a maladaptive way, uses maladaptive coping mechanisms, that cause harm to the system or the people around it. Some may do it intentionally, others may not. Sometimes it's consistent behaviour, other times it's only occasional. Typically, the behaviour is destructive, but it may not be entirely so. Persecutors, through this behaviour, can often serve as detectors for problems, highlighting issues that the system needs to work on. Sometimes that's a specific issue that the persecutor holds within their part that needs to be dealt with, that can't just be kept behind a barrier untouched. Sometimes that's a wider issue that the persecutor was formed to try and deal with, to manage, or to shine a light on, so that the system can do something about it. Persecutors are smoke or carbon monoxide detectors. They detect 'smoke' or 'harmful gas' in the system - i.e. problems that need dealing with, often ones that have slipped under the radar or would be difficult to notice otherwise until it's too late - and when they do, they do so in a rather loud, disruptive, perhaps painful (to one's ears, to continue the analogy) way, often resulting in quite a headache. Sometimes they have false alarms or don't work quite right (like when a detector's batteries die, or when you burnt toast by accident - the house isn't on fire but the detector still goes off sometimes and you wish it wouldn't), maybe they've been calibrated incorrectly, but they're trying their best. There's frankly more nuance that could be included in this, that I don't fully know how to put into words, but that's the gist, and I kinda like the analogy/metaphor I came up with.

Sometimes people attribute being a persecutor incorrectly, as well. Whether or not an alter actually fits the label, really depends on the system and the alter, how you view the label, the situation you're in, etc.

For instance, a system that is overly non-confrontational (likely due to trauma, and may typically fawn) might view any alter that sets firm boundaries as being persecutorial, especially if that viewpoint is reinforced by people external to the system getting upset or angry, or even punishing the system, in response to this boundary-setting. However, this alter is more likely to be a protector, under normal circumstances. Perhaps 'persecutor' fits, temporarily, as the system isn't in a safe place to exhibit certain protective behaviours yet. Where something that would be healthy normally is actually harmful in the moment, due to the situation the system is in. If the system has left that unsafe environment, they may still mistakenly attribute setting boundaries as being persecutorial, when it's now healthy and safe to be able to do that, it's not maladaptive. At this point, the fawn response that kept the system safe might be more accurate to be considered as being persecutorial. A now-maladaptive coping mechanism that, while helpful in the past, is preventing the system from moving forward, or is maybe getting the system hurt again, either by people who take advantage of it, or by people who don't even realise they're hurting the system because the fawn response meant that things weren't communicated.

In the above scenario, if the alter that sets boundaries forms (or surfaces) after the system has gotten out of the unsafe environment, they still might be mislabelled as a persecutor. Trauma can make it difficult to feel like we're allowed to self-advocate, to stand up for ourselves. For many, setting boundaries can feel like we're being mean or hurtful to people around us, so often we avoid doing so, and this can lead to labelling an alter that sets boundaries for the system as being a persecutor when they're actually just being a protector. They don't even have to be a protector, they could just be an alter setting their own boundaries for themself, not struggling with the feelings around that. (As such, persecutor isn't the only label that can be misattributed or given incorrectly.)

System roles are things that can change, too. Not every persecutor is going to stay a persecutor forever. Alters can become persecutors when they weren't initially. These roles, these labels, come and go, and there's nothing wrong with that. Alters can and often do have multiple roles at the same time, too. Many of ours do - we have caretakers who are also persecutors, protectors who are also trauma holders, and so on. It varies a lot. Use the labels that are useful to you. Make up new ones if that works better for you.

Conclusion

This was a long post, longer than we really intended to write. I probably rambled quite a bit, but we have a lot of thoughts and feelings on this topic. It's important to us, and there's a lot to go over about it.

I hope it was helpful, enjoyable, or insightful to read. If it challenged your views and beliefs, remember that's not a bad thing, and it doesn't even mean you have to change your beliefs or views, either. It means that it got you thinking.

Please feel free to respond in the comments or in reblogs, or even in DMs or in our ask box, if that's more comfortable - I'd love to discuss this further with anyone who wants to. Share your own experiences, or ask questions. Debate with me if you like, too, if you disagree with something I've said - calmly and respectfully, please. Maybe you can challenge my views on something, as well.

[plurapony]

helpful tips for recovery with did!

over the last 11 months since we found out we had did we have done a lot of trial and error in order to recover and make our collective life thrive! remember recovery is personal and will differ from individual to individual but we thought we'd share some things that have helped us!

trust: trust that every part exists for a reason and even persecutors are there to help. it can be super scary to let go and let parts you don't know that well take over, but you need to trust that they'll take care of your collective self.

let others know: i know how anxiety inducing it can be to let your school/work know about your disorder but you need to remember they can't help you if they don't know. this isn't a disorder that you can handle alone and you need others who you trust to support you when you can't support yourself. my wife has been the biggest help in our recovery and we genuinely wouldn't be here without her.

set goals and pace yourself: recovery isn't instant and if you go too fast you're gonna burn out. similarly when updating things like simplyplural it can be a heavy task as doing too many parts profiles can induce heavy dissociation. it's not a race and you should go at the pace you can handle.

communication: this goes hand in hand with trust but you need to communicate with your parts and remember you're gonna work best when you work together. on days where i'm feeling off i communicate to my other parts and so they are ready if they need to take over for work and our other responsibilities.

compromise: especially when you have as many parts as we do you learn pretty quickly that you can't do everything that your parts want. we all had dreams of separate careers but instead chose one together that was something we all want. alternate days of fronting, make a schedule of different activities to do, make a part wishlist of things your parts want.

respect: respect yourself and respect your parts. if you're heavily dissociated and you had plans with someone else, it's okay to ditch those plans and go to bed early. it's okay to put yourself first even when sometimes that is at the detriment of others. and make sure your parts know they are heard and a respected part of the system because they are!

relax: you can't listen to your parts or people around you that care if you're too caught up in panicking. i know this disorder is rough, i know it's scary but you'll get through it. you need to remember that when you're calm and relaxed you'll be able to listen and you'll be able to make some progress.

it's your recovery: your recovery belongs to you and no one else. people online can never objectively dictate what is and isn't anti recovery for your personal journey. people online don't know you and they don't know what you go through. listen to your personal therapist and do what you feel is going to help you. don't let fakeclaimers get to you and don't let anyone else dictate your recovery.

[syscourse-shmiscourse]

Alright this is the ONLY thing I'm going to say about the BAH drama that is apparently STILL going on. It all boils down to this:

YOU are responsible to curate YOUR own internet experiences. It is ONLY your responsibility and NO ONE ELSE'S.

It is no one's job but yours to make sure that your internet experience is as safe as it can be for you. No one else. We are not your parents. We are not your therapist or doctor. It's not our problem, frankly. Persecutors will find a way to harm the system regardless of what's out there and what you come across. Trust me, we've been there.

Additionally, complaining that tumblr isn't a safe space is completely laughable. It's the piss on the poor site. There are porn bots and pity scams galore. This place was NEVER safe. It is YOUR job to curate your experience and block blogs that may harm you. It is ALSO your responsibility to understand that you WILL be triggered at one point or another and it is ALSO your responsibility to put plans in place to make sure you can cope and recover to the best of your ability.

Stop pushing the idea that we are all responsible for everyone else's mental health and trauma recovery. We're not. We're all here struggling to survive and healing from our horrors. Stop putting YOUR horrors on the rest of us, we're dealing with our own.

[frankingsteinery]

i mentioned victor's delusions in brief previously (here), but because of the inherent complexity (and almost contradictory aspect) of their nature i decided it warranted its own post!

victor, alongside other psychotic symptoms, experiences delusions of guilt and persecution. a delusion is an involuntary belief that isn't rooted in logic or evidence; a person experiencing a delusion is fixed in their belief, and they can't stop believing it even if they know it isn't true and/or despite contrary evidence.

while victor's delusions–specifically regarding those that revolve around the creature–by in large turn out to actually be true, i.e. the creature actually harmed his family and victor by extension, during the point in the novel when he was experiencing them, he has no evidence to suggest that this was the case, and within the context of the rest of his symptoms, they'd still be considered delusional ideas.

for a variety of reasons, i'm still on the fence on whether i'd categorize victor's mania and grandiosity during the creation process as constituting delusions of grandeur. and to what extent is this sense of grandiosity justified, because he DID discover the secret of life itself… does that not almost warrant the feeling of being superiorly intelligent, this sense of infallibly, and the belief that they should be lauded for their achievements, in almost anyone who could have made the same discovery? it's tricky because i’m not sure if i just have an aversion to the "victor had grandiose delusions during the creation process" take simply because the vast, vast majority of those who make that argument also make the argument that delusion of grandeur = arrogance = evil = victor sucks (and that line of thinking is a whole separate can of worms in of itself…), or if i actually don’t wholly agree with it; for this reason i won’t touch on this here yet

with that out of the way–

like i’ve stated before, victor’s psychotic breaks are either triggered by the stress of the creation process or the death of one of his loved ones. this results in delusions of persecution, which is defined as when the affected person believes that harm is going to occur to oneself or those close to them by a persecutor, in this case the creature, despite a clear lack of evidence. initially, this starts with paranoia:

“Every night I was oppressed by a slow fever, and I became nervous to a most painful degree; the fall of a leaf startled me, and I shunned my fellow creatures as if I had been guilty of a crime. Sometimes I grew alarmed at the wreck I perceived that I had become…”

“With an anxiety that almost amounted to agony, I collected the instruments of life around me, that I might infuse a spark of being into the lifeless thing that lay at my feet”

this paranoia develops into a delusion as victor’s belief that the creature means him harm, despite having nothing to support this idea, becomes fixed. this comes to a head after the creature’s animation: 

“I beheld the wretch…He might have spoken, but I did not hear; one hand was stretched out, seemingly to detain me, but I escaped and rushed downstairs…where I remained during the rest of the night, walking up and down in the greatest agitation, listening attentively, catching and fearing each sound as if it were to announce the approach of the demoniacal corpse to which I had so miserably given life”

“I issued into the streets, pacing them with quick steps, as if I sought to avoid the wretch whom I feared every turning of the street would present to my view. I did not dare return to the apartment which I inhabited, but felt impelled to hurry on”

delusions can often feel like a sudden truth (the false belief) has been revealed to you. victor himself notes this sudden, extreme shift in perspective within himself:

“...dreams that had been my food and pleasant rest for so long a space were now become a hell to me; and the change was so rapid, the overthrow so complete!”

as victor recovers physically, this delusion becomes less present as the acute phase ends, and victor’s fears regarding the creature fade into the background as he enters the recovery phase. he stays in this manner until psychosis is again triggered by the stressor of william’s murder–then, victor’s delusion of persecution returns. however, this time, he believes the creature is not only going to harm himself, but was the murderer of william. once more, this starts with paranoia:

“Fear overcame me; I dared no advance, dreading a thousand nameless evils that made me tremble, although I was unable to define them…The picture appeared a vast and dim scene of evil, and I foresaw obscurely that I was destined to become the most wretched of human beings.”

and then develops into a fixed belief:

“I perceived in the gloom a figure which stole from behind a clump of trees near me; I stood fixed, gazing intently: I could not be mistaken. A flash of lightning illuminated the object, and discovered its shape plainly to me; its gigantic stature, and the deformity of its aspect more hideous than belongs to humanity, instantly informed me that it was the wretch…Could he be (I shuddered at the conception) the murderer of my brother? No sooner did that idea cross my imagination, than I became convinced of its truth… He was the murderer! I could not doubt it. The mere presence of the idea was an irresistible proof of the fact.”

while it turned out that he was actually correct in this assumption, what’s important to emphasize here is that victor has absolutely ZERO proof that the creature was involved with the murder of william, apart from seeing a shady-looking outline outside of geneva after walking in the rain all night. victor is not thinking clearly here, which he himself acknowledges in a phenomenon known as double book-keeping. double book-keeping refers to a mental process where an individual maintains two conflicting beliefs or realities simultaneously--where a person might experience delusions or hallucinations while still having moments of awareness that these perceptions are not grounded in reality. here, victor holds two realities (believing in a delusion while being aware that this belief would not be shared by others):

” My first thought was to discover what I knew of the murderer, and cause instant pursuit to be made. But I paused when I reflected on the story that I had to tell. A being whom I myself had formed, and endued with life, had met me at midnight among the precipices of an inaccessible mountain. I remembered also the nervous fever with which I had been seized just at the time that I dated my creation, and which would give an air of delirium to a tale otherwise so utterly improbable. I well knew that if any other had communicated such a relation to me, I should have looked upon it as the ravings of insanity…”

and, in fact, the only evidence he has is (seemingly) proof to the contrary i.e. the locket found in justine’s pocket. yet victor holds this belief with the intense conviction characteristic of delusions, as well as the incorrigibility of a delusion, as he’s continually resistant to his family’s logical counterarguments, as ernest recounts the events to victor upon his return home:

“This was a strange tale, but it did not shake my faith; and I replied earnestly, “You are all mistaken; I know the murderer. Justine, poor, good Justine, is innocent.”

he goes on to make the same assertion to his father and elizabeth, without once questioning the validity of his previous belief. 

victor develops delusions of guilt surrounding the trial of justine, the delusional belief of one's personal guilt for an event, real or imagined–it is an extreme and unwarranted feeling of remorse or guilt that someone has done something terrible. people with delusions of guilt may also believe they are "evil" or have committed an "unpardonable" sin and deserve to be punished forever. despite having no hand in the results of the trial, and again, no proof that the creature was even involved, victor is convinced of his guilt to the point of agony. for example:

”My own agitation and anguish was extreme during the whole trial. I believed in her innocence; I knew it. Could the dæmon who had (I did not for a minute doubt) murdered my brother also in his hellish sport have betrayed the innocent to death and ignominy? … The tortures of the accused did not equal mine; she was sustained by innocence, but the fangs of remorse tore my bosom and would not forgo their hold.”

”During this conversation I had retired to a corner of the prison room, where I could conceal the horrid anguish that possessed me. Despair! Who dared talk of that? The poor victim, who on the morrow was to pass the awful boundary between life and death, felt not, as I did, such deep and bitter agony…But I, the true murderer, felt the never-dying worm alive in my bosom, which allowed of no hope or consolation.”

  The blood flowed freely in my veins, but a weight of despair and remorse pressed on my heart which nothing could remove. Sleep fled from my eyes; I wandered like an evil spirit, for I had committed deeds of mischief beyond description horrible, and more, much more (I persuaded myself) was yet behind… I was seized by remorse and the sense of guilt, which hurried me away to a hell of intense tortures such as no language can describe.

delusions of guilt are often accompanied by low self-esteem, depression, and sometimes suicide (attempts); victor experiences all of these following the trial. this delusion is maintained throughout the rest of the novel.

lastly, during the chase at the arctic and on walton’s ship, victor experiences delusions surrounding his family. in his final attempt to hold onto those he lost, victor becomse unable to distinguish between reality and the delusions that sustain him:

"During the day I was sustained and inspirited by the hope of night, for in sleep I saw my friends, my wife, and my beloved country… I persuaded myself that I was dreaming until night should come and that I should then enjoy reality in the arms of my dearest friends. What agonising fondness did I feel for them! How did I cling to their dear forms, as sometimes they haunted even my waking hours, and persuade myself that they still lived!...I pursued my path towards the destruction of the dæmon more as a task enjoined by heaven, as the mechanical impulse of some power of which I was unconscious, than as the ardent desire of my soul."

Yet he enjoys one comfort, the offspring of solitude and delirium; he believes that when in dreams he holds converse with his friends and derives from that communion consolation for his miseries or excitements to his vengeance, that they are not the creations of his fancy, but the beings themselves who visit him from the regions of a remote world."

ultimately victor's delusions evolve throughout the novel; what starts as paranoia becomes a fixed belief that the creature means to harm him and his family, which eventually develops into a certainty that he's responsible for the deaths of his loved ones. by the time he reaches the arctic, he clings to delusions of his family still being alive and that they're talking to him.

i'll probably make yet another post dissecting what this all means in context, i.e. like avo said; the implications of the treatment of victor as a character due to these symptoms of a "weird" "scary" illness... buuuut. again. another time!