#exclusionist rhetoric
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Anyway. Bi and Mspec Lesbians aren't a hotly "debated" topic or even new to queer culture, it's just the newest thing that bullies who REALLY want to be homophobic and even racist use to justify harassing gay people they don't like.
It's the thinnest possible veneer of progressive language wrapped around TERF and reactionary rhetoric so that they can feel righteous for forming an angry mob against vulnerable targets. If you're gullible enough to fall for the newest wave of bigotry within the queer community, and turn on your allies because they're "confusing" or "invading your spaces," the SAME way they turned on bi/pan labels, trans people, xenogenders, neopronouns, and aroace people before this, then get lost.
#No patience. Wither and rot.#These motherfuckers dogpiled the legend who leaked the no fly list because it identified as the wrong type of lesbian.#They will attack the people doing DIRECT ACTION over dumbfuck label discourse. Deeply unserious people.#Embarrassing to think that there are rubes out there who keep falling for this#For ALL our sakes I hope this is literally their first rodeos and they really haven't fallen for this bullshit twice.#But unfortunately I'm too old to be that hopeful.#I didn't get to see the big ''public block list'' made for us dirty queers who support or are bi/mspec lesbians but I hope I was on it#If a man is best judged by his enemies then exclusionists who echo terf rhetoric are the ones I WANT to have.#And ''public lesbian block list'' is in quotes because if you REALLY thought that such a thing wasn't a ''GO HARASS THESE PEOPLE'' charter-#--then you have a black mold where your brain used to be and it's rapidly eating into the bathroom tile you call a skull#Unironically you should not have a platform if you are THAT stupid or malicious to think it was anything BUT a harassment charter#I hope they're ashamed.#Context for those unaware: a flesh-eating amoeba created a public blocklist for people who supported bi lesbians#Minors and extremely small creators without big platforms were on that list#People got harassed but the most namely was Lockandkeyhyena who had people raiding his server with racial slurs and death threats.#I hope everyone involved sees who their ''allies'' are when they spread that sentiment.#A bunch of people ACTUALLY 'invading someone's space' to post the n-word and suicidebait.#THAT is who you appeal to. Sit with that.
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yknow. one of the biggest pieces of bullshit to me is people trying to make the label gay "nonwomen who love nonwomen". and i think what rlly grinds my gears about that is some women will identify as gay specifically because these same people will make the lesbian label so restrictive, so they may identify as gay because even though these women are very primarily attracted to women and prioritize them, they could possibly be attracted to a man. And these exclusionists say they couldn't be a lesbian then. So then these women identify as gay instead, and then they're told they can't do that either! Like can we stop telling people what to identify as please!! Gay has ALWAYS been for EVERYONE!!! Who are YOU to tell others they can't use it!!!! What the hell!!!
#of course generalizing massively and more binary language to make it simple but as a gay man this shit pisses me off so much#gay was never just our word#and I LIKE and PREFER that its shared#and we do NOT have ANY right to claim it as JUST ours just because we are the most associated with it#ranting#exclusionist rhetoric#transphobia#exorsexism#z
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what it feels like when you see "MEN DNI!11!!! LESBIAN MEANS NON MEN LOVING NON MEN!!!11!" in a post
#milo talks#im a bi lesbian and i don't consider myself a lesboy but “MEN DNI” annoys the fuck out of me#like tell me you're an exclusionist without saying that directly#also “MEN DNI” reeks of terf rhetoric#bi lesbian#lesbian#mspec lesbian#lesboy
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Transmasc Person: "I am a straight guy, since I am a guy who loves women."
Toxic Queer People™: "Ew, straight guys are all predators, since only non-queer people are straight! Anyways, discrimination against straight men isn't real, even when they're a minority."
Transmasc Person: "Okay, I am a lesbian, since even if I'm not a woman, I still have a connection to womanhood."
Toxic Queer People™: "Lesbian is woman-only! If you are in any way a man or not a woman, you are not a lesbian! Transmascs can never be lesbians or have a connection to womanhood/a lack of manhood! Stop invading the lesbian community!"
I dare you to make it make sense.
#transhet#transmasc lesbian#transmasc#trans mlw#trans man#anti radical feminism#anti exclusionist#radinclus#critinclus#transandrophobia#let trans people define their own relation with gendered terms ffs#trans people need to be allowed to define their own relationship with gendered terms#even if it means that they may be using the “incorrect” word for their orientation#no I do not advocate for calling trans MLW overall lesbians#but if that is the term a trans man uses to describe himself he should not be forbidden from using it#it's 2023#we need to stop with the “men sneaking into the LGBTQ+ community” radfem rhetoric#q word#tw discourse
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I really love and appreciate how the majority of the bi community has made an effort to root out transphobia for the most part and I think that’s fantastic but I also automatically do not trust you if you insist that the bi community has never ever had an issue with transphobia
#i see this kind of rhetoric a lot amongst anti pan/other mspec identity groups#and it’s sketchy af#mod erin#just exclusionist things
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Funny how just about everyone on here who says "don’t use the q slur around me" ends up being either biphobic or transphobic. It’s almost as if being against the term queer was something the rad fems pushed. Oh, wait, they did.
#but some of y’all are more focused on separating the community than all the rad fem rhetoric that is being pushed#fuck TERFs#fuck radfems#queer#lgbtqia#lgbtq#transphobia#biphobia#monosexism#mspec#fuck exclusionists
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yeah see i'd love to jump on bullying and harassing this new microlabel or identity or whatever but unfortunately i was asexual online around the year 2016 (kinda just sucks the joy out of it)
#gained immunity to the siren call internet exclusion discourse by virtue of being an ace teenager#that rhetoric gets REAL easy to recognize and it's always the same 😭#'whoa that's crazy! sounds just like what people said to me and people like me for—' (checks notes) 'uh. being alive'#putting this in the ace exclusion/discourse tags cause it seems like nature has healed in there by now <3#i think that's probably where the target audience for this is haha#and maybe to get a little anon hate. just to feel something#sooo funny i tagged a post as ace discourse like two years ago and got anon hate in my inbox overnight#like babe what were you doing as an exclusionist in that tag all those years past the major shitshow... do you not have a life??? laughable#anyway. i love u aces kiss kiss#asexual#asexuality#ace discourse#ace exclusion
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When people try to distinguish p*n from bi by doing that whole obvious "gender blindness" posturing shit, I just-
#like just say you think being bi is being binary and exclusionist with your chest....#i swear to god you would think people with fluid attraction who dont id as bi would stop shitting on it#on top of misinforming other people about it by now but nah....#like its really not hard to be secure in your identity without perpetuating biphobic rhetoric TRULY
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getting to the point where i've gotten a bit wary of those posts along the lines of 'this pride month let's stop focusing on meaningless discourse and talk about actual real problems facing the queer community' because it's not always obvious whether they mean 'meaningless discourse' as in 'don't worry about other people's labels and let queer people live' or is it 'this discourse is fake and stupid and meaningless and doesn't matter at all'?
it's like the way people will reduce acephobia to "discourse", this attitude of trivializing actual bigotry and acting like it's not a big deal or a real problem in queer spaces when it very much is!
#and every time i see people in the notes of those posts agreeing and also spouting exclusionist bullshit#like yeah on some level arguing about whether bi lesbians exist doesn't matter bc it's not gonna change the fact that they do#and also that it's not anyone else's business HOWEVER it does matter on some level bc that 'discourse' actively hurts queer people#and i can't articulate this well rn bc i'm home with a migraine but i just...it kinda reminds me of how terfs will talk#like guys come on stop talking about this *redirecting away from their own bigotry*#like i've seen it. also any kind of exclusionist rhetoric WILL lead you down the radfem pipeline eventually so#win rambles
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"queer is a violent slur!" mate it's 2024 i think it's time to get off the exclusie ride
#rory yells at cloud#genuinely just saw that in someone's bio and i'm appalled LMAO imagine waking up every day and deciding to be like this#i think we need to mock people like this more. make them feel embarrassed about spouting exclusionist rhetoric from like 2017#if your 'lgbt community' doesn't include queer people then it's meaningless + what the fuck are you even doing
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wow this person is a fucking asshole lmao.
#queer is a slur and has power in its reclaimation... because it's a slur#also imagine being like 'i dont want to debate this' all theyre doing is tagging the post#'95% of anti queer rhetoric is pushed by terfs and exclusionists' okay untrue but even if it was#what about the other 5% of us who grew up being called queer in violence#q slur
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Sometimes I wonder if I'm too online but then a DNI banner passes me by full of madeup words and and I realise I've got a fine amount of offline hobbies, actually
#what is a rad inclusionist what is a rad exclusionist and if you want neither of those people to interact then who's even left#(if the answer involves pointless internet infighting then that question is rhetorical I don't need to know)
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It’s annoying how many ppl here ignore someone being low key enbyphobic & aphobic as long as they don’t outright hate them and make good fan art
#like someone continuously saying exclusionist rhetoric about the lgbt community not meaning anything anymore#because of all the queer people that don’t fit into those 4 letters perfectly (or at all)#and continuesly insinuating they don’t think they’re queer enough but they have nothing against them because they are still allies#like if you constantly vaguely complain and invalidate certain members in the community you do not actually support them#you’re just tired of being called out for it#and I’m tired of people letting it slide just because someone says ‘we’re allies’#any way I’m not gonna talk about this with anyone I’m just venting#because tumblr blocking doesn’t stop me from seeing it on my dash#and pleading for people to stop ignoring these things if they have noticed them in any fan content creators they follow#(or anyone for that matter but I’m talking about aa)#(seriously don’t ask me about this I’m not naming names I don’t feel like risking that)
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This will probably get looks from performative and ultimately harmful non-transfems despite my being transfem but-
Some y'alls only interaction with feminist history and theories, radical feminism regardless of its intersectionality and really any feminism deeper and louder and meaner than blatant choice feminism like the barbie movie and whatever TF taylor swift thinks shes got going on is through your occasional and short interactions with terfs and it shows. You call vagina art terfy and it fucking isnt. Its feminist art. Your brainrot is making you a fucking mra. The fact y'all think talking about the man vs bear situation is about/started/ran by terfs (and encouraged some really questionable other transfems shitting on it despite it clearly just being about women's safety and yes all men, not transphobia.), everything from questioning wether certain groups belong in our community to thinking a word is a slur or having a lesbian icon (I have sources don't test me) or not to not liking a certain band has been called "terf rhetoric". I'm all for us Transmascs talking about how terfs affect us cause they absolutely do and their harm to the transmasc community can not be understated but like.... Y'all are not allowed to call Jack shit terf rhetoric anymore. Like nothing. You don't know what it means, you litterally call transmedicalism and sysmedicalism terf rhetoric. Do you mean exclusionist? Say exclusionist. Terfs are not the end all be all hate group. They have a very specific complex mindset that affects so many people in specific ways. Someone hating Neopronouns is not fucking terf rhetoric. It's nbphobia. Holy fuck. Learn what words mean.
(intersectional trans radfems exist, radical feminism isn't terfs and swerfs and historical radfems would laugh in their faces for their idiocy)
#clover speaks#clover vents#hating bi lesbians is not terf rhetoric vagina art is not terf rhetoric medical sexism is not a terf topic#everytime you call some form or bigotry or some form of deep cut feminism you dont know shit about terf rhetoric#another trans person loses their wings#terfs harm people via certain avenues in specific ways#you've turned it into a fucking meaningless buzzword to decribe everything from opinions you dont like to actual bigotry#its basically gotten the exclusionist radical regressive gatekeep gaslight terreatmemt#words that mean very specific real things but gets so overused it means fuck all now#if your explanation for why something is supposed terf rhetoric is just something something splitting the community#something something exclusionary something something heard one say it once then you dont have the authority to fucking talk about it#I've been in the trenches fighting terfs and learning about their veiws and mindsets to accurately fight and rehabilite them#the hell they've actively put me and many other trans people through can not be understated#one called you a name one sent you a hate anon and sudeenly your the master of knowledge? gtfo#the specifics and deep rooted hate and history of that group is serious and every time you call some fucking#meaningless community discourse about if some inane insult is a slur like stupid or freak and call it terf rhetoric#you give terfs more fog to hide in you obscure the enemy that much more#you make it harder to find real actual terfs and their nazi friends when you call a fucking antikin a terf for being antikin#stop comparing other groups to terfs and heres a quick ajd easy way to identify if something is actually fucking terf rhetoric#dose the topic specifically talk about terfs or terfism or transmysogny/transandrophobia in the context of exclusionary radical feminism?#if the answer is yes then their might KEY WORD MIGHT be terf rhetoric involved.#if the answer is no then its not fucking terf rhetoric plain and fucking simple#find another buzzword milo because transmedicalism by definition cant BE FUCKING TRANS EXCLUSIONARY RADICAL FEMINIST RHETORIC#God this fucking community sometimes is so fucking exhausting#reminding me yet again that its mostly young and mostly people who lose their minds when i bring up terfs and racism#and yes you perisex afab trans person who thinks this isnt about you and the random shit youve false flagged as terfy#this is about you and your misusage of a serious allegation and association to falsely claim some terminally online take is terfy#You just make me hold my head in my hands and sigh really loud and try not to send you to the shadow realm#Not everything an alleged terf believes makes something terfism or terfy#please actually learn what words mean before you use them and make an ass of yourself called some tranfem exclusionist a fucking terf psyop
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the tme/tma discourse just reminds me of that one "no bro this time my exclusionism is good" post, like. idk.
#half the time it reads like word-search-replaced terf rhetoric#same as so many other exclusionist stuff#especially the stuff rooted in second-wave feminism
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just throwing it out here because I'm also petty but anyone who identifies as literally anything is welcome here because I'm not an exclusionist <3 y'all are valid ilysm /p
#aint no reason to be parroting exclusionist rhetoric and hide behind a lesbian label fuck you genuinely#yes this is targeted#discourse?#lgbt#literally as long as you're not a creep ur welcome. come here pals bring it in
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