#monosexism

[posting-stuffies]

Original | Exclu comments

Exclus went full circle.

"I'm attracted to one gender" -> "I am bisexual". Lolgic!

[queerasf4ck]

People will be like, "I’m not transphobic; I just think that the terms for different sexualities should be so heavily policed that they exclude nonbinary and multigender people or force them into a new binary 🙂

[pet-shop-of-horror-fan]

"Non-men loving non-men" definition of lesbianism gets a lot of flack and it should honestly get more of it.

Because including genderqueerness, unless it's the "wrong kind," makes the phrase sounds less like an inclusive definition of lesbianism and more like lesbian separatists trying to be progressiveTM.

[chickenleafs-world]

The masculine urge to rant about how dating sims, despite being commonly made for wish fulfillment, have a culture of cisheteronormativity, amatanormativity, colorism, monosexism, and all kinds of other weird biases that don’t actually improve the wish fulfillment of some people but *do* hurt the wish fulfillment of others. I love Otome games and the like but also it gets on my nerves sometimes.

Like how most dating sims are aimed at straight people, with only on gender option and an assumed gender for the player. Or how even in games with multiple gender routes like Mystic Messenger, the queer routes are left ambiguous or friendships, despite the fact that most people choosing that route on a dating sim are probably aware it might be romantic. Games with “cookie cutter” protagonists or self inserts almost always using a white/pale/white passing default model for art. Most games using the “route” system, which forces monogamy in most cases. Games without the forced monogamy (like Obey Me) making the characters possessive and jealous with the expectation that the player chose one to be monogamous, or shame the player for choosing more than one option.

I could go on for days about the weird and unnecessary assumptions so many dating sim devs have, but we’d be here all day.

[rjalker]

when people go "I LOVE and SUPPORT trans lesbians!!!!! oh but if you're an mspec lesbian I hate you you're disgusting you're evil and vile and evil and disgusting and not a real lesbian, GTFO!!!! disgusting fake lesbians are gross and invading our community. anyways I love trans lesbians <3"

Like, bitch, I hate to break it to you, but most mspec lesbians are literally trans. Which you would know if you'd stop being transmisic for the five fucking seconds it takes to listen to them.

Anyways, don't forget to mark people who hate mspec lesbians red in Shinigami Eyes. You aren't safe for any trans people unless you're safe for all of us.

[matan4il]

Sometimes I really wish we’d stop saying that bisexuals fall in love with a person, not a gender. As a gay woman, sincerely, so do I. My brain might work differently in terms of which pool of people holds a potential for me to fall in love with, but within that pool, I still fall in love with a person. A whole person. Not a gender.

It’s the same reason why we might find it offensive when some straight people just set up the two gay men they happen to know without taking any further info into account. Yes, they’re both men attracted to other men. No, that’s not enough, they also have to be compatible as people.

Bisexuals are beautiful and deserve all the love and support, just like every other part of the queer community, just like every human being deserves basic respect and dignity as a human. I get that when this slogan was first used, it was meant to empower bisexuals, who had too often been misunderstood and mistreated both by homophobic straights and by ignorant members of the queer community. I’m all here for that! But there has to be a way we can celebrate bisexuals that isn’t reductive to how monosexuals fall in love.

[oh-my-im-ply]

This is another post which isn't completely ply focused, but I want to take a second to point out the overlap between people who are transmisic and people who exclude/invalidate mspec lesbians.

Last week, I made a post where I mentioned being a polysexual lesbian, and I made a few mspec lesbian pride flags. Yesterday, someone asked if I was polysexual or a lesbian.

On this blog, we have rules for interaction, as well as rules for mods to follow. At the very top, we have a rule against exclusion and invalidation towards good faith identities, and a rule against bigotry and dogwhistles. However, we will answer questions when they may have been asked in good faith.

So, I answered with this:

Both. I'm attracted to many genders, but not binary men, so I find that polysexual and lesbian both describe my orientation well. Other people may identify as a polysexual lesbian for other reasons.

After I answered, the mask came off, and they started being transmisogynistic and nonbinary-exclusionary, and weaponized the existence of bimisia against me. I deleted their comments and blocked them last night, so I can't copy what they said word for word, but I will repeat their key notes under the cut.

CW: bi erasure, exorsexism/nonbinary-erasure, transmisogyny, mentions of genitalia

"This is what people mean when they talk about bi erasure. You're erasing bi people."

This is a complete misunderstanding of what bi erasure even means. Bi erasure is when you ignore (the existence of) bi people, or outright deny their existence. These are some examples of bi erasure:

Erasing or ignoring bi history.

Saying that bi people need to just "pick a side."

Saying that bi people are secretly straight/secretly gay.

Saying that bi is just "a transitional orientation" or "a phase."

Redefining the broad definition of bisexuality without the consent of the bi community, especially with the intent of telling people that they "aren't really bisexual" or replacing the bi label.

Saying that "everyone is a little bit bisexual," especially with the intent of erasing bisexuality as a distinct category. This can also be a form of erasure against people who aren't bisexual.

Note that "identifying as something other than bi" is not a form of bi erasure, even if you might "technically" fit the definition... Because that is a matter of personal identity.

But do you know what is a form of bi erasure? Erasing bi history. Mspec lesbians (particularly bi lesbians), have existed for decades. It is not a new identity, and bi women and enbies have a right to identify their attractions to women as lesbian attraction if they wish to. The exclusion of bi people from the lesbian label began as a form of bi erasure. It happened because of separatism and political lesbianism, and an idea that attraction to men "tainted" people, or was a "betrayal" to feminism. It happened because of bimisia.

The word "lesbian" has served as an umbrella term synonymous to "sapphic" for over half a century. You want sources? Here you go.

Miller, Trish. Lavender Woman, Vol. 2, No. 5. Lavender Woman Magazine, 1973. "What is a lesbian? To me, a lesbian is a woman-oriented woman; bisexuals can be lesbians. A lesbian does not have to be exclusively woman-oriented, she does not have to prove herself in bed, she does not have to hate men, she does not have to be sexually active at all times, she does not have to be a radical feminist." Ferguson, Ann. Patriarchy, Sexual Identity, and the Sexual Revolution. Signs: Journal of Women in Culture and Society, 1981. "Lesbian is a woman who has sexual and erotic-emotional ties primarily with women or who sees herself as centrally involved with a community of self-identified lesbians whose sexual and erotic-emotional ties are primarily with women; and who is herself a self-identified lesbian."....."[My definition] defines both bisexual and celibate women as lesbians as long as they identify themselves as such and have their primary emotional identification with a community of self-defined lesbians." Kafele, Dajenya Shoshanna (1991). Bisexual Lesbian. Archived from the original on July 25, 2022. Queen, Carol A.. Strangers at Home: Bisexuals in the queer movement,. 1992. "A great many bisexual women, particularly those who are feminist and lesbian-identified, have felt both personally and politically rejected and judged by the separatist sisters." Kafele, Dajenya Shoshanna. "Which Part of Me Deserves to Be Free?". Bisexual Politics: Theories, Queries, & Visions. New York : Haworth Press, 1995. ISBN 9781560249504. "Personally, I am unable to separate out the various ways that I am oppressed (as a woman, as an African American, as a bisexual lesbian, as an impoverished single mother) and say that one oppression is worse than the other, or that I desire one form of liberation more than another." Wyeth, Amy. "Don't Assume Anything". Bi Women: The Newsletter of the Boston Bisexual Women's Network. Vol. 5, No. 2, 1995. "Unfortunately, many of my experiences as a lesbian-identified bisexual woman have said to me that having an appearance or demeanor that diverges from the expected means I will not be accepted as truly belonging in the lesbian community. Despite my attendance at gay pride parades, dollars spent at gay resorts and in support of gay causes, and numerous attempts to participate in gay and/or lesbian groups and volunteer events, I have often felt unaccepted by this community." Holleb, Morgan Lev Edward. The A-Z of Gender and Sexuality. Jessica Kingsley Publishers, 2019. ISBN 9781784506636. "LESBIAN — A woman who is sexually or romantically attracted to women. Lesbian can mean women who are attracted exclusively to other women, but it is also a broader term for women and femmes who are attracted to other women and femmes. This includes bisexual and pansexual women, asexual women who are romantically attracted to women, and non-binary people who identify with womanhood." Lesbian. The Trans Language Primer. Archived from the original on October 22, 2021.

Does this mean bi people have to identify as lesbians, or "aren't actually" bi, or can't just identify as bi? Obviously not, and I never said that was the case. That would be bi erasure, because that's policing bi people's identities and forcing them under labels that they may not want to be included under. But in the circumstance that a bi person also identifies as a lesbian, they have every right to do so. Bi-inclusive definitions of lesbianism have existed for at least 51 years, and still exist today.

"Attraction to men, binary or not, means you're not a lesbian."

See above for why the lesbian identity is not always dependent on a lack of attraction to men, binary or not. But lets focus on the nonbinary part specifically:

Nonbinary people can people included in lesbianism and lesbian attraction if they want to be. Yes, that includes all nonbinary genders. Even if attraction to men inherently disqualified a person from lesbianism, nonbinary genders cannot be confined to binary gender rules (even when they're aligned with binary genders) because they're nonbinary. Treating nonbinary genders like they're "functionally the same as binary genders" is a form of nonbinary erasure, regardless of gender alignment.

Whether nonbinary people are included in lesbianism or not is entirely up to each individual nonbinary person regarding their own identity. It is not dependent on the gender label used; it is dependent on how each nonbinary person feels about it on an individual level.

The implication that manhood inherently dominates and erases the rest of a person's identity is also troubling. If you accept that nonbinary people can be included in lesbianism, you must also accept that nonbinary men can be included in lesbianism. A nonbinary man is still nonbinary; their manhood doesn't erase that.

As a pangender lesbian, I've had to deal with the experience of people not only erasing my enbyhood, but my womanhood as well, because they think my manhood is the only relevant aspect of my identity. This is misogynistic and exorsexist, plain and simple, and people use this misogyny/exorsexism to tell me that I'm not a lesbian.

With all of that said, nonbinary people (of any gender alignment) are not always comfortable being included in lesbianism. This is why I describe myself as both polysexual and a lesbian; the polysexual part of my orientation acknowledges that my attraction to enbies can't always be described with my more binary-aligned labels.

And funnily enough, while some people tell me that I can't be a lesbian and can only be polysexual, other people tell me the opposite. So clearly, there isn't a consensus on which label is "correct" for me.

"If it has a dick, you can't be a lesbian."

This is just blatant mask off transmisogyny, and it's the main reason I blocked them. Do I even need to explain what's wrong with this? Even under a strictly monosexual definition of lesbianism, this statement is just false. Being attracted to people with penises does not equal being attracted to men. If a lesbian is exclusively attracted to women, including women with penises, that lesbian is attracted to only one gender and is not bisexual or mspec.

Any gender can have a dick. Lesbians can have dicks. Women can have dicks. The presence of a penis or lack thereof is not a defining trait of lesbianism, nor monosexuality. And for fuck's sake, maybe don't call your hypothetical trans woman "it"??

"Mspec lesbian" does not mean "lesbian who is attracted to vaginas and penises," and if you think that's what it means, you need to educate yourself. Yes, this includes any people who might identify as an mspec lesbian because of that transmisogynistic definition.

This blog is an inclusive space. If you come in here to spew bigoted or exclusionary nonsense, expect to be blocked. Think before you speak, and please read our rules.

[transfagfemme]

As a bisexual I have always felt solidarity with aroaces / aspecs bcuz I feel like we both experience what it's like to be hated and excluded by other queers. I feel like our experiences are really similar, and I think aroaces / aspecs (particularly those who don't experience attraction) experience / understand monosexism too. Monosexism (the idea that everyone should be attracted to one gender) affects aroaces bcuz they aren't attracted to ANY gender, just like it affects bisexuals because we are attracted to ALL genders. We both sit out of the binary of what monosexual attraction looks like.

I've honestly never seen biphobia from (non-monosexual) aroaces literally ever. Unfortunately I have seen aphobia from bisexuals though, which sucks, because aphobia is truly so bad and ignored in queer spaces. Imagine being BISEXUAL and shitting on aroaces, as if we are not both different sides of the same coin. I feel any bisexual who shits on aspec attraction and experiences is one of those "pick me" bisexuals who doesn't know anything abt bi history and monosexism.

[turtrose]

Honestly, I find it also quite telling that it is always demanded of mspec lesbians to historically prove their right to exist as their identity. I just feel like, with all the stuff about "transgenderism is a modern trend" and "xenogenders & neopronouns are a modern trend", and all of us always needing to prove with history that we exist, it becomes quite obvious what lesbian exclusionism and lesbian separatism is: just another form of denying people their identities.

The moment you demand someone to prove their identity based on whether it is "new" and "modern" or actually historically documented, you are a shithead, because 1) no one has to prove their identity to you 2) no one's identity has to be around for a longer time to be valid 3) a lot of queer history has been erased, so there's that 4) a lot of queer history is very normative and focused on binarist views on queerness

I am radically inclusionist, because I am convinced that it helps no one if we exclude people based on prescriptivist definitions of labels. The "radical" has been assigned to me by people who wanted the good sound of "inclusionist", but didn't feel like committing to actually including everyone. Yet still, I will take that term with pride, because in our anti-queer society as well as a very policing queer community, yes, it seems to be a radical act to not exclude.

And that is also why those going against me hate the idea of "including all good-faith identities", because it is a pure principle that you can either commit to, or not. The moment you start making exceptions is when you betray that principle. Which is also why there are no "inclusionists" who exclude mspec lesbians. Because they are, as result of their exclusionist stance, exclusionists.

Even less surprising then is the entire force that is used against the word "queer". Its usage as liberating term exceeds by far the use it allegedly found as a "slur". Heck, people use "gay" ten times more as a slur, especially nowadays, and I don't see people going against the reclamation of that term. No, the people taking issue with "queer" that I have encountered so far were, by majority... too young to even have experienced the alleged great usage of it as a "slur". They take issue with the word, because unlike acronyms like LGBTQIA+, it also conveys a stance - that we are weird, yes. By which is meant, yes, we go against norms. We go against regulations of a gendered heteronormative patriarchal society. Our identities may fall in line with their views here and there, but we don't adhere to them, because we are who we are without bending ourselves to what others want us to be. This spirit goes against everything exclusionists and separatists try to do. This spirit is much more common here on tumblr, so no wonder Twitter exclusionists don't feel welcome here at all (and they shouldn't!).

The only reason why history is brought into this entire matter in the first place is that they've tried to use history against us. They've tried to use revisionist radfem history to exclude us just like lesbian separatism has done in the past. Only for them to be proven wrong by those who managed to dig deep enough into the history of the lesbian label. And yet, still, we don't need that history to prove our validity. Because we are here, we are queer, and proud of all that we are, not giving up any of our identities to please others.

[bisexual-femme]

online queer communities are so grossly bimisic and i'm tired of pretending that they're not.

they blame bi people for transmisia when the majority of trans people are bi. they harass us for using terms that we've always been allowed to use. they call us things like halfbians and bihets and then get mad when we reclaim those terms. they blame bi people for men harassing lesbians and trans people instead of.. you know.. the men themselves. they defend lesbian separatism and spew bullshit about how bi lesbians were actually supported by terfs and that we should be grateful that lesbian separatism let bi people have their own communities. they NEVER acknowledge the fact that terfs want to drop the B as well as the T. they're so fucking weird about bi women who date men and bi men who date women, especially the former because they are misogynistic as fuck. they expect bi people to be doormats for mono lesbians and gays, they expect us to be the perfect allies who never defend ourselves when they spread bullshit about our history, but they've never supported us for a day in their life.

we could give y'all a whole fruit platter and you'd get mad at us for co-opting the word "fruity."

[bidyke]

PSA: Biphobia is not a coherent theory but a collection of disperse arguments meant to symbolically obliterate bisexuality in different contexts. The arguments change according to what sounds better, not what's consistent.

[queerasf4ck]

If you think lesbians can be attracted to nonbinary and multigender people but can’t be mspec, you’re transphobic. It’s pretty simple.

[pet-shop-of-horror-fan]

"Sure, terfs hate trans men (and afab non-binary people), but they don't want them dead, they want to save them from themselves!"

Yeah, no. The problem is you are listing to what radfems say without paying attention to what they do.

Newsflash assholes, they hate cis women. They hate cis women who are bi, they hate cis women who choose to do sex work, and they hate trans people they misgender as cis women.

They say they want to save women who face domestic abuse but they victim blame bi women because bi women face high DA rates. They say they want to save sex workers but when a sex worker does not agree with them, out come the death threats and sexual harassment. They say they want to save "trans-identified females" from "gender ideology" but when they can't "save" them, they want them dead.

Radfems don't love cis women and they really don't love trans men or non-binary people of any kind.

If you don't thread the radfem needle, they hate you. Them thinking you are a woman does not save you from that because they hate cis women.

These people cuddle up to right-wingers to hurt trans people, other queer people, and sex workers, even though they know it hurts cis women.

If you think they care about "trans-identified females" you have no idea what you are talking about, no one should be taking your words seriously, and you need to shut the fuck up.

[rjalker]

Absolutely vile how people go

"lesbians, specifically, are banned from using the split attraction model, and if they even think about using it to describe their experiences I will threaten to kill them"

and think that this is...not violently lesbimisic.

Especially when they claim to be doing this in the name of "protecting trans lesbians"...when the lesbians they are sending death threats and suicide baiting to...are trans lesbians...

And then they'll have the gall to put "TERFs DNI", as though they aren't...repeating the same exact shit TERFs say.

It's 2023. Stop violently hating mspec lesbians and then pretending you're an ally to trans people or lesbians. You literally cannot do both.

[soong-type-notinuse]

"if i fell for a bi person i'd go for it but if i had the choice my ideal partner would not be bi" cool. so you're still bimisic.

[oh-my-im-ply]

Recently was told that being attracted to women and enbies "doesn't count as attraction to multiple genders," and that if you're attracted to women and enbies, you "should just identify as lesbian or straight."

As if nonbinary people are just an extension of women. As if nonbinary genders aren't real genders. As if enbian attraction is just an extension of sapphic or romeric attraction instead of a valid and beautiful experience in its own right.

And the person who told me this shit was also nonbinary.

I'm so tired.