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iwritenarrativesandstuff · 1 year

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I just saw the excellent post about Chuuya's loyalty and 1) how he hasn't questioned his philosophy and 2) "In a world where a "path" typically involves challenging the characters' philosophies and forcing them to reevaluate, what the hell is going to have to happen to get Chuuya to do the same?" (quoting you)

Chuuya is always used by others. He's not the only BSD character whose been taken advantage of, but it does seem to be reoccurring with him? First by the government who intended to use him as a super weapon, then by the Sheep who used him for his ability, then by mafia/Mori (getting him to join in exchange for sparing the sheep, keeping his past from him and giving him incentive to become an executive and stay in the organization). He's constantly used for his power.

Please tell me if I'm misinterpreting what you all said, but it seems (to me) that Chuuya ignores the mafia's/Mori's manipulation because they have helped him and given him a home+family, so he's instead loyal to them.

Because even though Mori has not and is using him for his power, he still allows it/goes along with it because they've helped him in the past and earned his loyalty.

So Chuuya tolerates being used.

He's now being used again, obviously, in part, because of his power. We have Fyodor referring to him as just his ability and bragging about how he can "use" him better than Dazai ("doesn't that mean you're unfit to USE a gravity manipulator")

Do you think it's possible that just being vamped and used again will cause him to reflect on his mentality? He's once again being used (but be it in far more blatant way: literal mind control. Also reminds me of Verlaine+his creator). Reflecting on how he's been used in the past and no longer accepting being used by others anymore?

Or do you think it might have the opposite affect and push him deeper into the mafia somehow

Also it's interesting that Fyodor is using him but hasn't earned his loyalty (like the sheep+mafia) and how that'll affect Chuuya

I'll get to the second ask in a bit but I'm combining these because they're related.

About the first ask: I mean, yeah, you're right about this. I don't know that I'd consider it so much "ignoring" though as "the benefits outweigh the costs so whatever", and I do want to state that I'm pretty sure Mori is genuinely at least a little fond of Chuuya (see: their conversation about leadership at the end of Fifteen), and his Mafia colleagues do respect him.

But yeah, you are absolutely right to say that there is a pattern of people who want Chuuya for his ability and his loyalty, and/or reduced him down to these traits. Playing hot potato with the escaped military lab experiment and the Mafia won (<-simplification for the funnies but still).

But here's the thing: if this was the end of it, we might expect to see some resentment mixed in there from Chuuya. He was blackmailed with the Sheep's lives. His past was intentionally locked away from him until he worked his way up to executive. That's... not great.

But instead we find pretty much only gratitude from him. Why?

Well, see, there's a reason I put the return of Chuuya's screwed up self-concept in the tags on that post, because it's kind of at the heart of his impressive loyalty. Chuuya believes that since he is the one with the strongest power, that makes him responsible for protecting everyone else, which means that he rationalizes any concern or protection directed at him as something "above and beyond", and worthy of recognition and repayment. Remember that he genuinely felt like just a vessel for power and nothing else for apparently quite a bit of his childhood, and the Sheep emphasizing that he owed them for taking him in probably did not help.

When it comes to having his back, the Mafia did this for him in a way no one else did. They protect their own, a value that aligns closely with Chuuya's own personal philosophy. The Mafia is also relatively safe from external threat, if we recall Dazai's pitch to Odasaku in Day I Picked Up Dazai - Odasaku is being targeted, but no one in their right mind would challenge the Mafia just to get to him. So, the Mafia has provided Chuuya with protection, comradery, and relative safety, which in my mind all condenses into a central need that takes precedence over everything else to him.

Chuuya's core need is actually stability.

And this makes quite a bit of sense. He started off as a kid with no memories and a whole lot of trauma he couldn't remember the roots of. One's past is a source of stability, but that had been taken from him. His position as leader of the Sheep was shaky. Even his identity as a human being was called into question. Chuuya as a kid and teen was largely untethered, separate from everyone else with no way to ground himself. Under those circumstances, something that originated as a chain could easily become a safety rope.

And once Chuuya found this stability, there was really no need for him to change anything. So he didn't. He settled into his new role and became really, really good at it, and didn't bother to re-evaluate beyond that. Why would he? That minimal core need has been met, despite the rocky beginning.

Which brings me to this second ask because it's actually incredibly relevant. Yes, Chuuya and Sigma are alike. You are not losing it anon.

Let's run a list, shall we? They both awoke with no memories and a missing history, and had their humanity called into question. They were used and blackmailed repeatedly, which they were, fortunately and unfortunately, consciously aware of. When they find something that matters to them, they become violently defensive of it. They both operate on principles of reciprocity and transaction because that is what they believe to be normal in relationships (Sigma's ability even is quite literally a transaction!). They both have pretty low standards for their assistance (Sigma hearing one (1) single person (Atsushi) be kind to him in what he thought were his last moments, Chuuya "You have helped Chuuya! Chuuya will now kill and die for you!" Nakahara).

Above all else, they are looking for stability. They are looking for a home.

As of yet, Sigma hasn't found a true home, but it seems we may be building up to him joining the ADA. The key part is Sigma's realization that the Agency doesn't rely solely on transaction. Dazai is not using the Agency, the Agency is not using Dazai. The Agency members are all helping each other. They care about each other.

Meanwhile, Chuuya has already found a place that provides his core need, but there's one caveat about the Mafia that should be clarified here - as Odasaku says in Dark Era, people within its ranks don't talk about personal matters and feelings with each other, and everyone instead keeps to themselves. If you don't talk about your issues or air them out, relations tend to stay personally shallow and dictated almost entirely by the demands and positions of the organization. This is not a conducive environment for reappraisal or self-exploration.

Unfortunately, this is ideal for Mr. Chuuya "I'll keep all my emotions right here and then one day I'll die" Nakahara.

Chuuya has found some measure of stability - solace in his own self-defined identity in spite of the initial ambiguity as to his humanity. "This is who I am", "Till those flames die down, I can't just do whatever I want", "I'm gonna do what I need to do", etc. But importantly, this identity is entangled in whichever group he happens to be a part of, which in this case is the Mafia. This kind of self-identity cannot exist without the structure of an organization. It relies on the reciprocity of a group.

Moreover, it relies on Chuuya showing very little vulnerability. Compartmentalize, and move on. He expects that of himself.

So, we've established that Chuuya has his core need for stability met by the Mafia - a relatively secure place that runs on transaction, which is familiar to him - yet it also doesn't push him out of his comfort zone with respect to emotional vulnerability and openness. What this means is that, in the Mafia, Chuuya is practically invincible, both physically (his ability, his martial arts prowess) and emotionally (personal life kept hidden and guarded as a Mafia expectation).

Unfortunately, this means Chuuya also remains stagnant as a character, which finally, finally brings me back to your original question anon.

No, I don't think the vampirism is enough to trigger change in Chuuya's character. Chuuya has some standards, and treating him like a tool (and Dazai's tool, no less) is going to seriously piss him off, but that's anger at Fyodor, and it doesn't impact his stability with the Mafia any which way. If Chuuya had've been forced to activate Corruption to escape the drowning then maybe he would've been angry with Dazai enough for something to shift (activation being his own choice is a huge theme with them), but since he didn't, I expect Chuuya will unfortunately just shrug it off and roll with it. Probably yell at him for a bit, but nothing that would have far-reaching consequences for his character unless there is something about his current situation we don't yet know.

I think for Chuuya to grow and change as a character, he needs something major to shift in his life - the threat has to come from within his place of security. He needs to be destabilized. Something needs to happen that specifically targets his tethers and his self-concept.

Personally, my money's on the destabilization of his bond with Mori, who he has the most respect for, because that might trigger development related to leadership and goals, but I guess we'll see. I think it'll probably be incredibly heart wrenching and hurt us all severely, whatever it is.

Huh. I wrote a lot. Congrats for making it to the end! I'm going to sleep now. :D

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Edited by removing the entire middle section because it was absolute garbage and probably should’ve been its own post. I hope the rest of this holds up. That’s what I get for writing things at 2 in the morning I guess.

#i hope this answered everything ok! i wanted to be thorough #your ask is so neatly organized omg.#thanks for the ask!#bsd #bsd chuuya #bsd analysis #bsd meta #bsd sigma #i hope what i'm trying to say came across properly #storyrambles #every time i think i've said all i can about chuuya i go on another deranged ramble about him. incredible.#chuuya's screwed up self-concept my beloved #(except not actually beloved it's kind of sad honestly)#also i think the flags' influence on chuuya's loyalty cannot be understated #by killing them verlaine i think actually assured chuuya would stay - he has to make their sacrifice worth it. he holds onto their memories #the entire rest of the story. and well after it too.

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bardicious · 7 months

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Sudden thought, I wonder if Erik is actually not aware of Charles’ limitations. Erik meets Charles as the latter jumps into the ocean to save him. Charles is calm all through out. Seemingly not afraid to sacrifice OR knows he will not need to sacrifice anything to meet Erik down below.

Charles tells Erik he knows everything about him. To some extent maybe, but not really. Charles gets the gist of people around him. Goes in enough to know who’s a threat, who can be trusted, but he asks Erik’s permission in finding that sweet memory of Erik and his mom. Charles didn’t know about it beforehand.

Erik didn’t even think Charles would feel Shaw’s death, nor the people on the boats. He assumes Charles has the option to not feel it, presumably. Or doesn’t know how bad it could be.

Erik leaves Charles on the beach before Charles learns he can’t feel his legs, he doesn’t see Charles’ breakdown and Charles keeps himself together admirably beforehand. Reigning in what must be extreme amounts of pain.

When Erik sees Charles again, Erik presumes that Charles could and would use his powers on Erik, stop him whenever he wants, because they’re enemies now. When he realizes Charles can’t do that, it is still unfathomable to him. And on the plane it all suddenly makes sense. Charles valued his ability to walk more than his powers, Charles chose to remove his powers. Charles abandoned them all to pretend at being normal.

Not for a second does Erik believe Charles is anything but all put together, all knowing. Presumably naive, Erik knows better how cruel the world is. Has experienced real hardship while Charles, as much as Erik loves him, lived a pampered one. It makes sense to Erik that Charles would pick being human.

Not once does Erik think Charles may have been abused by a step father and a step brother. Suffered an alcoholic mother who possibly drank herself to death long before 1962. Charles simply doesn’t say anything and quite honestly prefers to move on from them, because they don’t matter. Raven and Erik matter tho. His little team of mutants mattered, and every single one he’s met at first year of school and through cerebro matter.

Charles is strong enough to help the mutants in need, guide them, and if he were just willing to see Erik’s point of view, fight the good fight against the humans. Because Charles doesn’t make mistakes, Charles doesn’t have failures, but he fails the rest of them.

Charles, unfortunately, isn’t seen as a fallible person to even Erik. More akin to a god, that Erik needs to protect his mind from, because otherwise, his god will exact judgment and punishment. Take his free will away from him because Erik has disobeyed him. To Erik, while Charles and him are equals, both god figures in their own right, with his helmet he levels out a playing field Charles doesn’t even see.

Of course, this is not unlike everyone else in Charles’ life, though where Erik sees a godly figure, everyone else sees Charles as a parent figure, placing him on a similar high pedestal. Seemingly everyone will tend to ignore Charles’ possible emotional instability or fallibility, the way a child might expect their parent to be all knowing. Charles’ wrongs become grander because surely he knows better. So why did Charles’ let this, whatever this is, happen?

#X-men #cherik #X-men first class #x men: days of future past #x men apocalypse #xmen dark phoenix #charles xavier #erik lensherr #basically everyone is up their own ass when it comes to Charles #like damn hoes - mutant and proud my ass #only convenient when it’s not a scary telepath huh?#also insane cause like Charles has only ever skimmed people’s thoughts #though granted - he has frozen people and easily incapacitates enemies #I’m not gonna think too hard about how Charles could have stopped like all the hellfire club except for Shaw #lmao it’s honestly hard to write things for all powerful characters #maybe he couldn’t control that many people tho?#and Shaw was for sure hard to keep frozen #so there’s lots of limitations we’re not privy to either #anyway - Charles got screwed with some stank ass family and friends #like these hoes are so self absorbed omg #can’t convince Charles isn’t a fuckin saint #(I DO NOT SEE YOU DARK PHOENIX YOU ARE LITERALLY THE WORST)

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