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youremyheaven · 4 months

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Saturnian Women: Bad Girls to Trad Girls? 👀😲👩‍🏫

Saturn is the planet of discipline, restriction and rules. Saturn is considered a "strict teacher" who uses discipline, difficulties, delay, duties, dealings, and denials at times to ensure that the student really imbibes their lessons.

There has been much discourse lately on Saturn mahadashas and tbh, I would say to not worry about it too much. Saturn punishes but it also rewards, so if you stay true to its teachings, i.e, keep your head down, do the work and stay firm but humble, Saturn will give you success in proportion to your efforts.

Jennie, Vishaka Moon, finished her 19yr Saturn mahadasha in 2019 and you can clearly see the many themes of Saturn that played out in her life. She spent 5yr living overseas by herself as a child with another family (Saturn deprives you, to some extent, of your family's love and support) and after she moved back to Seoul, she began living at the YG dorm and trained for 5 years and 11 months, which is one of the longest training periods among popular idols today. She has talked about how she's never lived at home or had the experience of living with her family until she was 18-19 and she's always sounded bittersweet about it but all her hard work paid off. Today she's the face of K-pop, one of the most successful idols of all time, an icon and an it girl. She gets torrential amounts of hate over her "attitude" for the supposed partiality that YG had towards her and yes for being "lazy". This is Saturn's harsh energies coming through. Are Jennie's performances lacking from time to time? Yes but is she the only idol whose performances feel meh/"lazy"? No. Is she the only one who gets brutally called out for it? Largely, yes. Saturn does not allow you to get away with your skimping and most definitely does not let you take shortcuts.

The reason most people suffer during this mahadasha is because its human nature to want instant gratification and choose the "easier" option. But yk who does not like that? SATURN. This planet is all about being principled and doing things the "right way". You cannot do something immoral and expect to get away with it during this mahadasha but another thing about Saturn's influence is that it often makes natives deliberately "rebel" or step out of line because they internally crave punishment and want to be disciplined. Think of Saturn like the dom in a BDSM relationship and yourself as the bratty sub who's always asking to be punished. Its kinda like that. I've noticed this with many Saturnians as well as people experiencing Saturn dashas, they have no intention of being "bad" or doing the "wrong things" but they do anyway?? because they want Saturn to discipline them and put them in their place. Often times these natives choose the "harder" path subconsciously by forgoing many chances to choose from other options. They really want to prove themselves "worthy" and "deserving", sometimes to their own detriment.

Karina from Aespa, Punarvasu Moon is also currently undergoing her Saturn mahadasha and so is Wonyoung, Purvabhadrapada Moon (they'll both finish their Saturn mahadashas at around the same ish period of 2031-2032). They're both incredibly successful so if you're experiencing this dasha, dw about Saturn depriving you of success bc its not true. You just have to work hard.

Wonyoung started training at 12yrs of age when she was a few years into her Saturn MD and Karina also started training during her Saturn MD (she was 16 tho). They both spent yearsss training and became massively popular upon their debut (Saturn rewarding hard work) but often got unwarranted hate for absolutely nothing because Saturn "punishes" you to keep you humble in the face of massive success. With Wonyoung, I feel like her Magha Sun (leo rashi) works in her detriment in this dasha because she can be very self indulgent, come across as pompous or bratty or arrogant and Saturn does not like those things 😬with Karina, she received hate initially but things were cleared up and it was understood that those rumours of her being a highschool bully were fabricated along with those fake screenshots and some of her old classmates spoke up about her virtuous character and how kind and sweet she actually was. This is again, Saturn's karma coming thru. Good karma will help you out of tough places in life. Karina has kept her head down and worked hard, people criticized her initially for being a bad dancer but now she's known for her stage presence and x factor.

She's now known for her kind, humble and goofy personality because that is who she really is. Saturn rewards those who remain down to earth and humble and all the love Karina receives now (she is the most followed 4th gen female kpop idol surpassing Wonyoung in less than a year) is part of Saturn's rewards. However, she still faces challenges, like with her dating scandal or with her Chinese boycott last year but again, its her willingness to stay focused and power through that has helped her navigate those situations with grace. She hasn't been dragged the way Jennie or Wonyoung has been. I also think her having Mercury & Venus in UBP (a Saturn ruled nak) has helped her embrace Saturnian principles easier than the other two but she also does have a debilitated Saturn so ://

I think Jennie has had it especially tough because she's Uttarashada Sun and Sun & Saturn are enemies so she's struggled to be as grounded and docile as Saturn wants its natives to be.

If you think about it, there is a reason why all the Kpop it girls have Jupiter ruled Moon and experience Saturn mahadasha at the height of their fame. For starters, the Korean music industry is very "restrictive" in nature and idols are very tightly monitored and controlled (all Saturnian themes) and those who thrive the most in this system are Jupitereans who are undergoing their Saturn MD. They learn to channel the expansiveness of Jupiter through the restrictions of Saturn. Think about how Jennie, Wonyoung and Karina have all been deprived of creative freedom, how their labels pick and choose their endorsements and limit their interactions and in general, despite being young, rich and famous, they live like blue collar workers in some ways?? This is all Saturn's effects. It makes you work hard, rewards you for it but does not let you indulge too much in it.

There is a reason why Jupiter moon is soooo common among popstars. Performing in front of packed stadiums with 50,000 fans is an experience only few get to have in this world and to get that, you have to toil day and night through punishing schedules and constant travel where you dont enjoy yourself materially. This is a very blatant manifestation of Saturn restricting pleasure and enjoyment. (Jupiter ruled Moon natives experience Jupiter dashas first and then its followed by Saturn mahadasha, so usually at their peak, they're undergoing their Saturn MD)

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Now, I want to mention something Claire Nakti mentioned in her Saturn men video, she said that Saturnian men are often extremely rebellious when they're younger and deliberately "act out" because they crave the punishment and discipline that Saturn imposes on them. They subconsciously want to be put in their place. This sounds hella masochistic but I think its helpful to think of it in terms of BDSM dynamics (dont laugh lmao). To an average person, its confusing as to why someone would want to be spanked or tied up or hurt or be in "pain" or be submissive but some people genuinely derive pleasure from being in that position, that's what's fun for them. They "ask for punishment" bc they enjoy being "punished". I dont want to say Saturnian individuals are kinky masochists who deliberately do things that will lead to terrible consequences and harsh punishment but tbh, there is no other explanation for their behaviour. I suggest watching Claire's video where she cites manyyy examples of Saturnian men "acting out".

In Claire Nakti's video about Saturnian women, she mentions how these women are more at ease with following traditions and submitting to them than others because they find it 'freeing' to obey.

But tbh, although women internalise their qualities more in general, I think Saturnian women are just as likely to have an "unruly/rebellious phase" before they embrace the rule abiding nature of Saturn because the truth is limitations are what gives us true freedom. Saturn teaches us that if you have "too much", you can feel confused and lost. it's more important to have "enough".

Hwasa, Pushya Sun

Hwasa is a great example of Saturnian natives and their need to both rebel and conform. Hwasa belongs to the group Mamamoo and although they're all talented, they weren't as successful as other Kpop groups in the mid to late 2010s, esp since they also came from a smaller company. In 2018 at the MAMA awards, she performed in this red latex bodysuit and went instantly viral and her performance became vvv controversial since its practically unheard of for a kpop idol to reveal this much skin or put on a performance that is very sexually provocative. she received a LOT of flak for it, people bodyshamed her, slut shamed her etc but this also brought a lot of attention to her and her group and people started taking more notice of them.

Hwasa was on the cover of Cosmopolitan later that year (you have to be a pretty big deal to land mag covers in Korea esp when you have sooo much competition from sooo many idols/actors etc, Hwasa was up until then just an idol from a smaller company whom others often criticized for not being "pretty enough").

Hwasa continued to "rebel" by posing semi nude, appearing on the cover in what Koreans considered "immodest" clothing etc. But some of the criticism subsided bc as more and more people discovered her music, her talent as a singer and performer stood out so they started praising her for her talent & hard work (Saturn rewarding hard work).

she continued to receive a lot of flak for her outfit choices and Hwasa it seemed was almost hell bent on pissing Koreans off by doing exactly those things that they shunned. She was criticized for this look as her bra is visible through a sheer top and what did she do next?

she went to the airport in a white top and no bra 😂😂needless to say K-netizens were PISSED OFF. but at the same time she started making appearances on variety shows where she gained praise for her humility and lack of pretence. (Saturn punishes but rewards)

this is an excerpt from her 2020 interview with Cosmo (the Cosmo cover above is from her 2019 cover), here we can see Hwasa admitting that "one year ago I was more daring because I felt like I had to be that way no matter what" which reflects on how many Saturnians are rebels without a cause. She then says that "As I go on, I feel like I'm being more strict with myself" showing the progression from the rebellious, unruly phase to one that embraces strictness and discipline. This does not mean becoming a doormat, it means you become more gentle and patient. Its through suffering (which Saturn def brings about) that we learn grace.

I think Hwasa has described it well.

Saturn is considered the most aggressive and cruel in Indian astrology. It symbolizes karma and rewards or punishes based on one's deeds.

Selena Gomez, Pushya Stellium (including Sun & Rising)

When her Revival album came out in 2015, Selena was 23 and trying her best to shed her Disney girl image. So she did what most child star turned popstars do, she posed nude. This was very out of character for a girl who wore a purity ring until she was 18 years old and was generally perceived as the "sweet innocent" one among all Disney stars.

During a roundtable interview in 2022, she said

"I actually did an album cover and I was really ashamed after I did it," Gomez said. "I had to work through those feelings because I realized it was attached to something deeper that was going on. And it was a choice that I wasn't necessarily happy that I made, but I think that I've done my best, at least I try to be myself. And I'm not an overly sexual person, sometimes I like to feel sexy, but that doesn't mean it's for somebody else. It can be for me. Now I understand that there are certain boundaries that I need to set for myself, and I respect and adore so many people, but I’ve got to do what’s best for me."

Obviously the need to "rebel" against her Disney sweetheart image was imbedded in her by the people who work with her, like her management team but Saturn's most powerful tool is regret. You do things without much thought or act out or act rebelliously and through regret or after suffering its consequences, you learn to draw boundaries and impose limitations upon yourself. Just because you can do certain things does not mean you should do them. Saturn teaches us this by limiting freedom.

Miley Cyrus, Anuradha Sun & Mercury

We cannot talk about Disney stars gone wild without mentioning Miley lol

She was the biggest Disney girl of her time and worked vvv hard, doing world tours starting from her early teens and then filming the show, girlie basically never had a minute to spare. Once the show was up, she was in a hurry to shed her Disney image and lets just say... she embodied Saturnian rebelliousness to its extreme.

Miley lost her virginity to Liam when she was 16 and by the time she was 19, she was engaged to get married to the only guy she ever seriously dated. She definitely was embracing "tradition" etc so her "rebel" era was a sharp left turn. She went from being a teen bride to twerking in nude latex on stage. For the next couple of years, Miley smoked weed, embraced a hip-hop sound, wore little clothing and "rebelled". Her rebel era marked the end of her relationship with Liam and interestingly enough, the end of her rebel era was marked by her renewed relationship with Liam.

She entered her soft girl era and started to shed her "rebellious image" and found balance

“I carried some guilt and shame around myself for years because of how much controversy and upset I really caused,” she says. “Now that I’m an adult, I realise how harshly I was judged. I was harshly judged as a child by adults and now, as an adult, I realise that I would never harshly judge a child.”- Miley said in her British Vogue interview

Miranda Kerr, Pushya Rising

If you watch her interviews from the late 2000s and early 2010s, she's super flirty and now she's more mature and ladylike which is kind of a superficial evolution of Saturnian influence.

Miranda is rumoured to have been the world's most expensive yacht girl at one point in time. She accepted $8.1 million worth of jewellery from fraud Malaysian billionaire Jho Low. All these gifts were seized by the government later on bc Saturn does not let you keep things you obtained illegally or in unprincipled ways.

In 2014 during an interview for British GQ (these pics are from the shoot) Miranda said:

"The older I get, the more confident I am about asking for things I enjoy," she said. "One thing I've noticed is now that I'm having less sex my body isn't as toned. The more sex I have, the more defined my arms and stomach get. Orlando and I always had great chemistry. One-night stands aren't my thing. I made Orlando wait for six months until I even kissed him… I always ask for a critique on my performance. I always want to better myself in every way."

She also said,

"Let's put it this way, I've had an orgasm in the air before. Alone. And together." 😲😲

This is sooo remarkably TMI for a woman who now presents herself as so poised and ladylike??

After she started dating her now husband Evan Spiegel, CEO of Snapchat, they remained celibate for the 2years they dated prior to marriage and Miranda said they're "very traditional".

Interviews of Miranda now make her sound like one of those femininity coaches on YouTube.

"My grandma taught me that men are visual and you need to make a little effort," the model said in an interview with The Edit. "So when [Evan] comes home, I make sure to have a nice dress on and the candles lit. We make time to have a nice dinner together. At work, I'm like, 'We need to do this!' and, 'This needs to happen!' But at home, I slip into my feminine and empower Evan to be in his masculine."

In another interview, she said:

"Don't feel like you have to do and be everything. Let the man do some things for you, because if he cares for you, he will want to. When I get home, I'm not the boss like I am at work — I slip into a more feminine role. I take everything off and put on my Stella McCartney silk robe. I'll put on a red lip or red nails, and it lifts my mood. Sexy underwear also gives you a spark. I collect underwear from my travels. Lace, lingerie, bodysuits ... they're like souvenirs."

And in yet another interview, she said:

"He would rather me hug him than give him foot massages. He's like, 'Can you just come and cuddle up? Can we just snuggle? I don't need a foot massage.' I'm like, 'Come on, it's good for you!' … He's very loving like that. I'm a very lucky girl."

She went from being a "rebel" to living like a trad wife.

Eva Mendes, Pushya Moon

She's yet another Saturnian who had a rebellious early career ("rebellious" for a woman basically means capitalizing on your sex appeal) and then embraced a more "traditional" life.

In 2020, she said:

"You can’t do sweatpants,” she said on Extra while promoting her makeup line, Circa. “Ladies, number one cause of divorce in America, sweatpants, no!”

This is again an example of a "femininity" minded person who thinks women have to "ladylike" (Saturn embracing traditional gender roles).

She took a 10yr break from acting to focus on being a mother and said that if she returns to acting she wont do "violence" or "sexuality" which she did do prior to her marriage and motherhood. She also got married later in life and had this to say:

“When I was 40, it was a big deal for people when I was pregnant, and it wasn’t for me,” Mendes said. “And then I was 42 and I was pregnant with my second one and people were like, ‘Oh my God, you’re going to be so tired. That’s why people have kids in their 20s.’ I was like, that’s the most sorry, asinine thing I’ve ever heard.”

She continued, explaining of parenting, “It takes more patience. In my 20s, I shouldn’t have even been around a child. I was just foul-mouthed and smoking. I could not have raised kids in any other era of my life but now, for sure.”

She's indirectly referring to a more "rebellious" phase of her life and how now she has the patience to be a mom. one thing Saturn teaches you is patience, thats for sureee.

Saturn influence also causes delayed marriage.

Madhuri Dixit, Pushya Moon was 32 years old when she got married (in 90s India this was ancient and not as "normal" as it is now).

Salma Hayek, UBP Moon

there isn't enough dirt on Salma to show that she had some "bad girl" past to move beyond but she struggled for many many years. her life really exemplifies the delayed success of Saturn bc saturn truly rewards patience

Rani Mukerji, UBP Moon

She got married when she was 36yrs old and is married to one of the biggest film producers in India.

The themes of Saturn delaying marriage but ultimately pointing to marrying into wealth has been true in the lives of many of these women, including Salma who is married to a billionaire.

Ellen Pompeo- Anuradha Moon

She was 38 when she got married. Another thing I've noticed with many Saturnian women is how they struggle to conceive or have issues with their fertility (usually caused by the delay in marriage as they're older when they become mothers).

Salma has talked about how she struggled with gestational diabetes when she was pregnant and how she wishes she could have had more children. Rani Mukerji has spoken about her struggles with fertility and how she lost her second baby to a miscarriage, 2/3 of Ellen Pompeo's kids were carried by a surrogate.

Monica Bellucci, Pushya Moon

She was 35 when she married Vincent Cassel and had her daughters in her 40s.

Hillary Swank, Pushya Sun

She was 44 when she married her current husband. (She did get married at 23 and was married for 10yrs , which means they separated after her Saturn return)

Jennifer Lopez, Pushya stellium

She married Ben Affleck when she was 53

She was 35 when she married Marc Anthony with whom she has 2 kids and was married to for a decade. All her other marriages were brief and short lived, pointing to how Saturn makes you get rid of anything that isn't "right" for you

Usually whenever Saturnians get married young, they end up getting a divorce. This is a massive generalization and obvs wont apply to every Saturnian but I've seen this with many people, even Miranda Kerr who married Orlando Bloom in her 20s ended up getting divorced after her Saturn return.

Sophie Turner, UBP Moon

Sophie started dating Joe when she was 19 and married him when she was 21 and he was 28. According to rumours she felt really trapped in the marriage and felt like she hadn't experienced much life. She went from being on a TV show for 10yrs and missing out on normal teen experiences to being a wife and a mom. Many have accused Joe of grooming her as well. They've ended up getting a bitter divorce as well.

Mariah Carey, UBP Sun

She was 23 when she married the CEO of her label who was 20yrs older than her. He had known her since she was a teenager 🤮🤢🤢Mariah has, like Sophie described feeling "trapped" in her marriage and how she had "no freedom". Tommy is famously controlling and kept her under lock and key pretty much. He is now married to Mexican pop star Thalia who was once a huge name in Latin music and is now virtually absent from public life. So his tendency to keep his wives locked up wasn't limited to Mariah, I guess.

Mariah divorced Tommy when she was 29 during her Saturn return as well and he made her life hell for the next few years (do not marry and divorce your CEO kids)

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All throughout this post I made mentions of how Saturnians "rebel" and then "embrace tradition" but what is "traditional" isn't always "right". These two things aren't synonymous. Hwasa went against tradition by dressing sexy. Would that be considered scandalous in say, America? No. She went against the tradition of her culture. But it did not make her actions "wrong".

But sometimes this tendency to obey traditions can manifest in more extreme ways and make someone have very right wing esque or conservative views, even.

JK Rowling, Pushya Sun, Saturn in 1h (in Purva bhadrapada)

Rowling was once a beloved author who was known for her highly inspirational rags to riches journey. She became the first writer to become a billionaire. But now, she's known as a transphobe and many of her former friends and allies have distanced themselves from her. Its crazy bc she almost exclusively tweets about trans people and has made it her life's mission to talk about who is a "real" woman and who isn't (Saturn's desire to conform to traditional gender roles) but her transphobic era seems to be her rebellious Saturn phase where she is seeking punishment. It literally makes no sense as to why out of the blue one day she started to tweet and say these things and why she's sooo insistent on her views but its like she's digging her own grave.

Saturnians often do bizarre things that seem like obviously bad ideas to others and suffer terrible consequences for it because they crave Saturn's harshness. She could've never written another book after Harry Potter, fucked off into oblivion with all her money and farmed strawberries for the rest of her life with her legacy intact but Saturn has stripped her of it. I wont be surprised if in another 10yrs or something, she comes forward to talk about how embarrassed and ashamed she is of whatever she's doing now as this is also a pattern among Saturnians to feel guilt and remorse for their past and apologize for it.

Oprah Winfrey- Anuradha Moon

Oprah hasn't been fully exposed and cancelled yet but I hope she gets what Ellen got because she's such a vile, toxic hateful person.

Oprah has a long history of platforming some incredibly toxic people, leading to a lot of pain and suffering. The relevant one right now is Dr. Oz who used his Oprah-given influence to sell scam miracle cures and other supplements.

Worse (in my opinion) is Dr. Phil, who has used his Oprah-provided stage to send children to “reform schools” in exchange for kickbacks. Many (included the infamous catch me outside girl) have claimed that these institutions are hot beds of physical and sexual abuse. There are also allegations that Dr. Phil actively aims to make guests on his show appear less well adjusted so that he can yell at them. Famously, a winner of the show survivor who was struggling with alcoholism claimed that Dr. Phil’s staff gave him a bottle of vodka to drink before the show so that he would be drunk and look like shit to justify Dr. Phil berating him.

Oprah also dedicated two shows to a man known as John of God, heavily implying that he may actually be able to heal sickness through faith in God. He was, obviously, a grifter who would perform dangerous surgical procedures (and would cut people’s eyes with sharp objects) on people without a license. He was also a serial rapist, and several women have claimed they traveled across the world to meet John of God due to Oprah’s show only to be raped.

This example is more fitting of the traits I explored in part 1 of my Saturn dominance post where I talked about how many Saturnians seem to be scammers and liars.

Grimes, UBP Sun

for an edgy alternative indie artist, Grimes has surprisngly trad views

In one interview, she said:

"I kind of like the patriarchy, I like the supply chain, food, Uber, roads... umm, civilization, you know there's a lot of good things that came from it. I think it's sort of oppressive and overly dominant, and if you don't include women in things they can easily become toxic, you know."

she was married to elon musk so im not too surprised that her worldviews are...weird... (she likes the patriarchy bc it gave her uber,,, gotcha...lol)

Sometimes honestly, esp in today's world where everybody has more social freedom esp in America and can do whatever they want, a lot of people "rebel" by embracing tradition. Grimes is actually deploying Saturn's need to rebel against the order by peddling her faux trad views.

The current tradfem movement (that I predicted 2 years ago😌) is a reflection of how each generation rebels differently. You give someone a lot of freedom and they do whatever they want with it but soon enough fatigue sets in and you desperately crave structure and order, so you discipline yourself and restrict yourself. in an era where dating has become so toxic and loveless, a section of society embraces a 1950s type tradwife lifestyle to go against the norm.

there will be a part 3 that expands on Saturn's manifestations further but this is it for this post<333 tysm for reading<33

#saturn #uttarabhadrapada #anuradha #pushya #vedic astro notes #astrology notes #sidereal astrology #astro notes #astrology observations #astroblr #astrology #vedic astrology #nakshatras #astro observations

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