#without the whole Jedi have to fully change narrative

[lauransoverthinking]

Ahhh! Help, I’m back on my shit again!

No O66 AUs where Ahsoka wants to return to the Jedi but is still working through all of the feelings of betrayal, hurt, abandonment.

They love to focus on Ahsoka lashing out, blaming, being angry. Which is fair. I think to say she wouldn’t is disingenuous to her character, especially during this time period. She is flawed (this is another gripe about all fanon characterization - leave your favs flawed, they are better this way).

But what they never do is have someone from the order (who isn’t Anakin) say they understand why she feels this way.

They never tell her they understand why she hurts and doesn’t trust and is angry. It’s always “it’s because she’s young”.

And yeah, that contributes, but whether they had an option or not (they did not - fucking senate, fucking Tarkin, fucking insidious bastard), her family kicks her out and she is almost executed. That is justifiable trauma, and I would argue it would be traumatic for anyone, regardless of age.

I understand Plo apologies on behalf of the council before she leaves, but there is a difference between “we are sorry” and “we see you and your emotions are valid.”

Anyways, this is my way of saying I love when Ahsoka is messy about the Jedi and has to work through those issues, but some of you treat her being upset about her expulsion and near execution the same as my five-year-old throwing a tantrum when I take away a toy.

Attributing it to age and Anakin’s influence is too simple. There are actual issues here, and you can be pro Jedi and pro council and pro Obi-wan and still admit she has a reason to be upset.

[imfromthemiddlekingdom]

I love how stanikins bend over backwards to attempt to make Obi-Wan and the Jedi look callous and uncaring when all evidence points otherwise.

Obi-Wan is too harsh on him after he endangers his men and Ashoka to save a droid with confidential information on it which he didn’t wipe purposefully, oh no!!! He’s abusive!!!

Obi-Wan putting the good of the Galaxy above the ones he love because it’s his duty and philosophy to put the good of the collective above the good of the few he loves. Oh no!!!! He’s heartless!!! He should’ve let Anakin jump off the moving vehicle to save padme because muh love story!!!! He should’ve known that Anakin’s dreams about his mother dying was a vision and not a dream!!! Definitely not like Anakin told him it was a vision, “just a dream” verbatim from Anakin himself!!! Like if we take legends into consideration then Obi-Wan, someone who is strong in the Unifying force, would definitely have done shit if Anakin told him outright it was a vision but how was he supposed to know when Anakin himself 1) never had a vision before this and 2) never told his master what occurred in said vision?

Obi-Wan would’ve made Anakin fess up to the Tusken massacre if Anakin told him!!! He should’ve been a safe space for Anakin and been accepting like Padme and covered this horrendous miscarriage of justice out of love!!! He didn’t provide a safe space for a mass murderer therefore he deserves blame for it!!!!

The council didn’t want to admit a very clearly traumatized slave child who’s recently been freed because he would not be able to fully commit to their philosophy of non-attachment due to his experience and asking him to change how he viewed the world so shortly after being separated from his one support in life would be cruel so they denied him, therefore he was right to hate them!!! Especially Mace Windu because, checks notes, he was mean (???) to him (???) in the first act of the phantom menace???? Like have y’all not watched TCW and how Mace interacted with him????

Stanikins literally have every excuse under the sun to justify his every atrocity without giving him any agency in his own choice. His story is a tragedy!!! Let it be a tragedy!!! He was a slave boy with godly powers and traumatized beyond imagination! He could’ve been great if the circumstances were different, if one thing changed he would’ve been the greatest Jedi there were, but because he is literally doomed by the narrative, we cannot see him be the person he could be. He has great capacity for kindness of selflessness but because of his experience fear wins out and he desperately holds onto all the affection and love he could because his time as a slave taught him to do so. It’s a disservice to take away his agency, to make all his bad and disastrous decisions the fault of someone else, is to make him one dimensional. Let him be the villain he is and mourn the child he was and the person he could’ve been if he wasn’t doomed by the narrative before the prequels even came out. Let him be tragic. Let his decisions be tragic and doomed and unavoidable. Let him be sucked into villainy the moment he decided that his revenge is worth more than the lives of those that did not participate in the murder and torture of his mother. Let him be utterly unredeemable because of his actions. Let him doomed by his own actions as well as the narrative. Let him be himself instead of woobifying him into a victim of everyone else’s actions but his own.

He choose to massacre the Tuskens. He choose to massacre the Jedi. He choose to hunt any remaining Jedi left in the Galaxy for 20 years. He choose to put the life of his wife above the people who raised him and took him into their culture. He choose to do that himself. And it is tragic. It is sad. But it is no one’s fault but his own. His formative years shaped him into one who jealously hordes all forms of affection form those he loved most as a trauma response. He understands Jedi teachings (literally a whole arc in TCW where he teaches Ashoka what it means to be a Padawan and Jedi) he just doesn’t internalize it because of his trauma. He takes no one’s council but his own (showcased when he went to Yoda to ask for a method of cheating death and Yoda’s advice was sound if he were talking to any other Jedi other than Anakin).

Star Wars may be a a story of hope but it is also a tragedy. It’s about a boy how could’ve been great, it’s about a boy who was so full of hope and dooming himself because he’s too afraid and refuses to let the fear go so it turns into anger and hate. Taking away Anakins agency and blaming his actions on other people takes away the tragedy that is having someone great fall. A boy who was bad cannot fall and be doomed. It’s only those that have the potential to be great that falls the hardest and by taking away his own culpability in bringing in a genocidal empire (one he wished to rule no less) takes away the inherent tragedy of seeing someone so bright fall so low.

[oreolesbian]

Let’s discuss two clips taken from a scene in Return of the Jedi.

The first thing to establish is the metatextual disclaimer that ROTJ was released in 1983. The prequel trilogy was released in 1999, 2002 and 2005 respectively. Because of this, it is important to note that most of the lore about the Jedi Order we know from newer canon does not apply when talking about this film in isolation. In an in-canon context discussion, this is irrelevant, but here I want to discuss specifically the themes and pivotal points to the characterization of Luke Skywalker as established by the original trilogy as a whole.

The entire ROTJ Dagobah sequence as it sits in the narrative is a direct response to the events of the ending of Empire Strikes Back, where Luke disobeyed Ben and Yoda’s instructions and abandoned his training to confront Vader and save his friends before he was ready. That scene in ESB on its own already establishes a rift between Luke’s values and the values of Ben and Yoda. However, it is heavily implied that Luke was wrong to do this because he loses to Vader on Bespin and nearly dies, just as Ben and Yoda feared. However, the revelation of Vader being Luke’s father changes the scenario drastically.

In the scene above and the scene prior to it (Yoda’s death), Luke directly confronts both of his teachers on being lied to about Vader’s true identity. Because up to this point, Luke knows he has been training to eventually kill Vader (and the Emperor). Not bring him to justice - kill him.

Luke, having idolized his father since childhood (as A New Hope establishes), is realistically troubled by the news that he now has to kill his father. So troubled, that he asks Yoda, “Is Vader my father?” just so he can be sure. Luke is visibly angry in this scene when Yoda insists that he knowing would have only made him act more irrationally and emotionally. That he wasn’t ready for the truth. But the underlying question remains, did Yoda or Ben ever really plan to tell Luke the truth? After all, Yoda is disappointed that Luke found out, because he knew it would create resistance.

Yoda and Ben are fearful of another Vader, and it’s why Yoda was reluctant to train Luke in the first place.

After this, Luke confronts Ben with the same question, upsetly saying, “You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father.”

So now we have a second scene of Luke directly doubting his mentors’ motives. Whichever character you agree with being in the right as an audience member, however, is irrelevant, because in terms of character, Luke believes he is right, Ben believes he is right, Yoda believes he is right, etc. And instead of Luke blindly following the wills of his teachers, he truly starts to question whether being a Jedi for him is directly what Yoda and Ben want from him.

Ben laments in the scene above that Luke is their only hope and that Luke’s refusal to kill his own father without at least attempting to find the man he used to be is a doomed scenario. Ben and Yoda have every right to think this - they have seen Vader in both forms and have effectively lost hope in him. Luke, who has only seen a dark side of Vader, has more room for optimism to reclaim the Jedi Knight his father once was.

Not only this, but as a scene, Luke turning against Ben and Yoda’s wishes directly leads an audience to think: ‘Hmm. Vader went against the teachings of Ben and Yoda. Now Luke is doing it too. Is this his path to the Dark Side?’ Which is another narrative point to the scene. All of ROTJ is pushing this ‘what if’ now that we know Luke and Vader are related — all which builds to the ultimate climax of Luke’s decision in the final throne room fight.

“You cannot escape your destiny,” is what Ben says to Luke. But this is what Luke does.

He proves Ben and Yoda wrong.

He proudly proclaims that he’s still a Jedi, but in a way he believes in.

And it’s not even to say that he fully disagrees with Yoda and Ben, because he clearly respects them as his mentors. But Luke changes from ANH to ROTJ. He starts to form his own ideas about what a Jedi is to him, rather than what he’s supposed to do for the good of the galaxy. He makes a decision that he alone can stop Vader without killing him. That he’d rather lay down his life and die a Jedi than do what Yoda and Ben asked him to do (and ironically, what Palpatine also wanted him to do) and live as something he doesn’t believe in.

“Bury your feelings deep down, Luke. They do you credit, but they could be made to serve the Emperor.”

For full context, Ben says this immediately after revealing Leia’s true identity to Luke - which leads us to believe that Luke’s care for his sister is something that could be used against him (as we see in the throne room fight when Vader threatens Leia). Luke cares for Leia and Han immensely, hence why he risks everything to rescue them on Bespin. And ultimately his fear of losing Leia is what makes him snap in his fight on the Second Death Star (which we later learn in the prequels, of course, as a direct parallel, is that Anakin’s fear of loss is what drove him to the Dark as well - so it matches up that Lucas is focused on fear as the emotion Jedi must control above all else, and interestingly enough, fear is driving Yoda and Ben throughout the duration of the OT). His feelings served what the Emperor wanted from him - to kill Vader and take his place.

But Ben also says - “[your feelings] do you credit.”

A simple acknowledgment that maybe, maybe Luke’s endless compassion and determination could change something. For the audience, who is fearful that Luke may fall Dark, and for Ben, whose last bit of hope is left lingering on a sentence. “You were our last hope.”

Luke Skywalker is hope. He’s hope. He’s Ben’s hope. He’s Padmé’s hope. He’s Anakin’s hope. He’s Han and Leia’s hope. He’s the Rebellion’s hope. He’s the Jedi’s hope. He’s the universe’s hope. He’s a New Hope.

He represents all of that in this film - in this few seconds, we get so much character.

And this - quintessentially - is why ROTJ is the perfect blueprint for understanding Luke’s character. How he interprets the Jedi way, how he has complicated emotions that both serve him well and lead him astray, and how he triumphs through hope.

So in full — Luke redefines what being a Jedi is for himself. In ANH, he expects it to be a whimsical adventure (it is not). In ESB, he expects it to be whatever Yoda and Ben have planned for him (it is not). And in ROTJ, he doesn’t know what to expect anymore, but embracing what he feels is the right thing to do is what pushes him forward.

He claims the Jedi title in a way that is fully earned and does not need the approval of his mentors nor the standard training (that he would never get in his era anyway). The Jedi return because of Luke - but they come back different. And not in a direct ‘the Jedi of old were all bad’ way, but in a ‘looking towards the future’ way. Because Luke believes in and values the idea of making your own destiny and the flexibility of the Force’s will. An idea which would inevitably pass to his students (who would then have their own personal interpretations of the Jedi way or even the Force in general).

So yes — writing Luke in a way where he teaches exactly the way the old Code would’ve gone without critical thought, or having him lose faith in a student over a single bad feeling, or disregarding him (meta-textually) as a Jedi, or presenting him as sticking to a very strict and specific set of rules for how training is supposed to work, etc., is all directly contrasting to the arc we are presented in the original trilogy.

[perseidlion]

This is probably gonna rub some people the wrong way but...I think two things are true, re: The Acolyte:

Some Star Wars fans were hostile to The Acolyte because it starred a woman and most of the supporting cast were women and/or POC so they were never going to support it.

AND

The Acolyte was not a very good show.

SPOILERS BELOW.

If the show had starred a white man and had more nostalgia bait, it probably would have been renewed, let's be honest. But that doesn't mean it was a good show or it would have been better with those changes. It just would have meant the hardcore complainers would have supported it just because it was Star Wars.

A lot of Star Wars stuff is getting multiple seasons when the shows themselves are lacklustre. And don't get me wrong...this isn't necessarily a bad thing. I think the networks cancel shows WAAAAAY too fast these days. How many great shows can we think of that had kinda shitty first, second, and even third seasons that went on to be classics and huge hits? So when I say the show wasn't great, that doesn't mean I think it deserved to get cancelled. But also we aren't stuck between a binary of "a great show got cancelled unfairly" and "an awful show got deservedly cancelled." There's nuance here.

Full disclosure: I am an extremely casual Star Wars fan. So on the surface, I was the perfect potential audience member for The Acolyte. It was a show that tried to stand on its own merits without a dozen callbacks and references that only appeal to hardcore fans/fans with nostalgia feels. I was fully willing to accept it as just a solid science fantasy show that happened to be set in the Star Wars universe.

Frankly, I was bored through most of it. I like Amandla Stenberg, but I don't think she did a very good job differentiating Osha/Mae and she didn't do a great job getting us to root for her.

The show also set up tension only to immediately diffuse it, or the tension they teased all season turned out to be no tension at all. The mystery of what the Jedi did on Brendok should have been central to the story. It should have been kept secret and concealed. And it should have been darker than it actually turned out to be. That's what had to happen for that to work. Like, the Jedi were ordered by a corrupt high council member to purge the coven or something. THAT would have been interesting and worth the narrative stakes. Instead, an accident, impossible choices, and bad circumstances were at the heart of the whole show.

The show also wants us to root for Mae after she straight-up murdered a bunch of Jedi masters in cold blood in the first few episodes. That's a hard thing to ask Star Wars fans to come back from, especially when the Jedi's "crimes" were revealed, which for most of them ended up being "were present when an injustice occurred."

Qimir had so much potential as a villain and Manny Jacinto's performance almost justified the whole show's existence. Unfortunately, his introduction was fumbled. Everyone figured out very quickly that he was the mysterious master. Again, zero narrative tension.

There are a lot of good ideas in The Acolyte, and a lot of potential. Unfortunately, it fumbled a lot of those ideas and the whole thing just ended up being a mess. It is a shame because if a certain segment of the SW fandom hadn't been so hostile to it for even daring to exist, we might have seen those problems ironed out in a second season and beyond. But it'll never get that chance, and that's a shame.

I would LOVE to see more exploration of the hypocrisy of the Jedi and the imperfect nature of their philosophy. I think that's something baked into the DNA of Star Wars, especially from the prequels onward. It's a rich bit of story fuel, and it was refreshing to see a show that wasn't just crammed full of stuff to make you do the Leo point at the screen or go "I got that reference."

Two more things are also true:

The Acolyte was not a very good show

AND

It deserved the support of Star Wars fans and a second season to try and do better.

[eriexplosion]

5 6 7 10 for Star Wars violence 👀

OKAY TIME FOR THE VIOLENCE (I don't know how actually violent these opinions are but pretend I am Very Vicious)

5. Worst blorboficiation?

sdfsdifj REGRETTABLY... OBI-WAN.... I love the man but fandom characterizations definitely show some Popular Guy Character Syndrome where it's all about how sad and tormented he is and while I respect that as a lover of tormented men, it is certainly an experience when you're like, reading a CodyWan fic and Cody is comforting Obi-Wan through his tragic past like he's never gone through anything difficult in his life. Also some of Obi-Wan's fun edges are sanded off, he's more generically sassy but considerate of others feelings and kind, etc, and like. He's not UNkind. But this is a man that faked his death and did not tell his emotionally unstable best friend like that was going to do anything but drive Anakin absolutely batshit insane. He watched like ten clones in a row die without a reaction and then the instant a Jedi died they all had to stop for a funeral. He tried to get Luke to kill Vader WITHOUT telling him who he was. He's kind of an idiot and can be kind of an asshole. Let him hurt people's feelings! Let him be socially inept! He is a dipshit not a harmless weep blob!

(This ties in with my desire to see CodyWan fic where they straight up get in a fight but is not ENTIRELY connected to that)

6. Opinion on canon and/or fanon use of the secret child trope? Discuss.

It works for Luke and Leia and I think it should have stayed at that. I'm not a big fan of the Palpatine reveal for Rey but I didn't want her to be a Skywalker either, sometimes you want a main that is Just Some Guy, doesn't need to be a secret child of anyone. In fanon I just REALLY do not like it, partially because it's plugging in a blood relation where it doesn't need to be. The other part is that I have mostly seen it for Obi-Wan and Satine with that Korkie kid and with how utterly repressed those two are at each other I refuse to believe they ever successfully fucked.

7. What is the weakest piece of canon writing?

It feels like cheating to say the sequel trilogy mostly because I never finished it so a thing that I definitely finished and loved but makes no sense - AOC is not the strongest movie but ROTS was like, fully just a series of cool scenes stitched together to approximate a movie. And don't get me wrong, I adore the prequels. But the only one that I think succeeds as a Movie is TPM. ANAKIN'S FALL ESPECIALLY IS NONSENSICAL AS SHIT. Like the underlying motivations are there but they were not pieced into anything resembling a coherent narrative. You have a start point, an end point, and everything in between just kind of jumps around with I think the weakest point being the Tusken Massacre - it's treated more like a sign of Anakin's potential darkness than anything when like. That's a whole village. He killed a whole village and it never comes up again! Lucas apparently didn't consider it that big a deal!

It's to a point where I actually think the massacre can't be addressed from a fully in universe perspective, because there's no actual way to twist it around so that it makes sense for that not to be enough to Make Anakin Fall without breaking the already very loose rules of the universe. Most other Star Wars points I can figure out some kind of justification for how it works in world, but to explain how Anakin wouldn't fall here you just have to kind of confront that Lucas is both not a very good writer and also approached the Tuskens with an incredibly racist viewpoint given that he doesn't appear to see their deaths as fully Counting, unlike the Jedi younglings in ROTS. It's a plot choice that, if treated with the full weight it would narratively deserve, completely unravels the entire rest of the series, the only way to make the storyline of everything else WORK is to take it out or change it so much as to be an entirely different scenario, and I can't think of any other things that fuck it up THAT bad.

10. What’s a ship you've unwillingly come around to?

I think 'unwillingly' is overstating it (but then I rarely DISLIKE a ship, so there's usually not much Unwillingly about it) but I thought Tech/Phee was cute at most until everyone started being Like That about them. Now I want them to kiss and get married onscreen. I hope that she hits that every night. Phee deserves whatever she wants.

Also Anakin/Padme probably counts because I did not actually go into the clone wars watch WANTING to love Anakin but Whoops. WHOOPS. So that meant I got An Affection for the two of them in all their messy stupid as shit glory.

[smhalltheurlsaretaken]

Do you have any thoughts about the clones situation? I only mostly hear about it from anti-Jedi people and how "being nice slavers doesn't change the fact that they are slavers", so I was wondering if you have anything to say or any post to recommend?

There's a perfect post by @trickytricky1 but I want to say a few more things. This thread right here is also pretty good.

The issue with the Clones is that it's pretty much impossible to examine their in-universe treatment without taking the irl writing decisions into account: namely, that most of what we know to be very, very wrong with the Clones' situation is barely acknowledged by the creative team, to the point we can pretty much assume they just don't care beyond what's convenient for a plotline. I mean, beside a few select characters Filoni is particularly fond of, the majority of the Clones are narrative props: they're here to be killed off to heighten the tension, to be comic relief, or to highlight a particular trait of the Jedi they're serving under - and of course, they're here to execute Order 66. I love them to bits and it often annoys me, but it's true. Just look at how little anybody irl seems to care about Cody, arguably the second most important clone in the franchise and the most important clone within the army: he barely got any screentime in TCW and was instantly sidelined out of the one arc where he had a chance to be the lead, he didn't appear in Rebels, and he wasn't even mentioned in TBB s1 despite his role in the squad's creation. Or consider how the Clones being overgrown children who should look only 20-ish and behave very differently from normal adults is never properly brought up - not even in Rebels where Rex is treated like a old geezer instead of the 30 year old he is, or in TBB, or with Cut whose adopted children are maybe five years younger than he is. We have to face it: the story never was and never will be about the Clones, and so the writers don't seem to think much about their condition a lot of the time.

Hence why I feel like when characters don't behave like they ought to regarding the Clones, it's often not so much that the narrative is telling us there's an issue, and more like the writers couldn't be bothered to explore that particular theme. I'm not just saying that in relation to the Jedi: Suu Lawquane marrying a 12 year old (who is supposed to look 24 but really look 50 because of the animation) is not framed as insanely wrong on all levels, for example. Also, we don't ever see Bail and Padmé speaking up for Clone rights. Realistically, given what we know of their personalities, would they have? Probably, yes! Their silence very likely has nothing to do with a moral failure that the audience is supposed to recognize, and everything to do with nobody irl thinking that would be a good storyline.

As for the Jedi's relationship with the Clones, what I always got from it is this: the Jedi were drafted along with the Clones, couldn't do a lot about the whole situation, befriended them just so Order 66 could be extra heartbreaking, and we weren't meant to dig too deep and find loopholes or what-could-have-beens or alternate ways it could have gone down, because Order 66 was pretty much written in stone. The Jedi were always going to die, as far back as ANH, before there were even Clones in the Clone Wars - and they were going to be friends with the Clones before the Clones were even fully people (think about all the nice interactions between Obi-Wan and Oddball or Obi-Wan and Cody in RotS, back when the Clones obeying Order 66 was that they really had very little will of their own). The more and more messed-up implications of the slave army came along the more the Clones got humanized for the sake of angst, but the beats of the store were already there.

I already went a bit into this tension between what we see onscreen and the issues the writers didn't feel like exploring here (on a post about Obi-Wan's behavior on the Citadel).

Now, forgetting all the irl stuff, are the Jedi actually slavers? I'd argue that they aren't. The Senate voted to have an army - it's a big plot point in AotC. The Sith paid the Kaminoans and fabricated the war. Jango sold his DNA. The Senate drafted the Jedi. ("A lot of people say, “What good is a lightsaber against a tank?” The Jedi weren’t meant to fight wars. That’s the big issue in the prequels. They got drafted into service, which is exactly what Palpatine wanted." - George Lucas)

That particular dead horse has already been beaten, but what were the Jedi supposed to do beside fight side by side with the Clones? Not fight? So Sidious could declare them traitors to the Republic ahead of schedule? Fight and petition for Clone rights (which, again, is an issue never touched upon in canon one way or another after Slick - whom I'll get to later - so we simply can't say that they never tried)? Like Sidious was ever going to let legislation hindering his plans pass? They were caught between a rock and a hard place, which was always the point of the war. Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

What's more, the majority of the Clones don't think the Jedi are slavers (see first posts linked and posts linked below), with the notable exception of Slick. The majority of the Clones we see love the Jedi, and we know it's not a case of blind hero-worship, because they are very quickly suspicious of Krell and don't hesitate to take him down.

I feel like Slick was a bit of a red herring, because he came along very, very early (s1ep16) - way before we had any indication of that the chips would be a thing. He feels a lot like a reminder that 'hey, this story is going to end badly' because the Clones will turn on the Jedi and kill them all rather than an actual exploration of the messed up slave army deal - because Slick is unequivocally characterized as a villain. He killed a lot of his own brothers, didn't deny that Ventress had offered him money, tried to frame a member of his own squad for his actions, and was perfectly ready to kill Rex and Cody for all his talk of loving his brothers. The post I linked goes into a bit more, but he's not a desperate innocent.

Finally, there's the problem that the majority of the Clones we see want to fight for the Republic. The cadets from Boba's Death Trap episode (s2ep20) are excited to meet Jedi and get to fight. 99 wants nothing more than to be a good soldier. The Domino Squad want to pass, and their episodes present them going off to the front like a victory - even when we already know they're marching to their death. Choosing to fight is Rex's whole arc in the Deserter episode (s2ep10):

CUT: Come on, Rex, admit it. You've thought about what your life could look like if you were to also leave the army, choose the life you want. REX: What if I am choosing the life I want? What if I'm staying in the army because it's meaningful to me? CUT: And how is it meaningful? REX: Because I'm part of the most pivotal moment in the history of the Republic. If we fail, then our children and their children could be forced to live under an evil I can't well imagine. CUT: If you were to have children, of course. But that would be against the rules, wouldn't it? Isn't that what somebody programmed you to believe, Captain? REX: No, Cut, it's simply what I believe. It doesn't matter if it's my children or other people's children. Does that meet with your approval?

Yes, it's incredibly karked from our perspective - you have millions of boys who were spoon fed propaganda about a Republic that doesn't care about them and that they barely know, and in the end their sacrifices amounted to very little... But - and I'm genuinely asking here - wouldn't denying them the right to find their identity in their role as protectors be demeaning too? Obviously they deserve so, so much better, but TCW still treats their choice to fight proudly as meaningful. And in the end, it wasn't entirely for nothing either: the Jedi and the Clones did save billions of people according to Hera.

What we were supposed to take away from the Jedi-Clones interactions in the Prequels imo isn't 'the Jedi were nice slavers' but really that they were the Clones' best and only friends.

Mace spends a lot of his screentime protecting them. We see most of the Council protecting or saving Clones at least once each. Really, the Jedi are constantly shown saving the Clones or caring about them: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. Again, @trickytricky1 has some of the best content: this compilation vid is particularly great. I'm pretty sure Sidious gave the Jedi the Clone army (and not the droid army) because he counted on the Jedi's compassion towards the Clones and their eventual trust in them to work in his advantage (see this thread) - and heartbreakingly enough, he was right.

Imo, TCW and later Rebels - and even, to a lesser extent, RotS - always portrayed the Jedi and the Clones as close friends and the karked up circumstances don't change that. They don't have a 'nice slavers & their slaves' dynamic, they are friends.

There's a reason why the first TCW episode was about Yoda telling three Clones how unique and important they all are (see here or here). There's a reason why we see the Clones being so protective of their Generals (see Boil and Obi-Wan here). There's a reason why Obi-Wan so passionately condemned Grievous for having an army with no loyalty and no spirit (here). There's a reason we got this:

They were best friends. The entirety of Star Wars failing to address enough just how terribly the Republic treated the Clones doesn't take away from that.

That makes the whole Jedi-Clone story a whole other level of tragic, where the Jedi genuinely tried to know and care for their men because there really wasn't anything else to do, and the Clones were grateful for that, and in the end both the Order and the Clones were used and destroyed. No matter how badly some themes and plotlines might have been handled, I genuinely can't ever believe that we were meant to see the Jedi as slavers in this situation, as opposed to victims - albeit in a different way than the Clones - who were doing their best.

[gch1995]

Hey, fun fact! The word isn't "attachment" in those Eastern beliefs, that is the closest English equivalent that could be had one of the dozens of times it's been grossly on trend to appropriate the shit out of numerous non-Christian religions in Western societies. It was an exceptionally poor choice on Lucas' part to not come up with an in-universe word/phrase or keep it to fully stating "selfish attachments." As it was an exceptionally poor to show us parallel stories of how to raise an emotionally healthy human and how to do exactly the opposite, while giving us a Jedi Order that explicitly states and demonstrates exactly what it means by "attachments," which is any manner of emotional attachment as any such attachment can become negative, and more importantly (something found in so many religions), will always come before the group's well being. Human beings with attachments that are emotionally and biologically normal will always put their loved ones before institutions, ideologies, and ideals. This is exactly why so many religions have always had their priests, priestesses, monks, warriors, etc. be committed only to the belief system and community, not allowing marriage and children and sometimes requiring removal from family, friends, and original community. Just, you know, in societies that have an awareness of healthy development in children, protective laws regarding children, that generally look down on cults, and know what adult agency is, we stopped thinking it was appropriate to remove children for lifelong induction into orders and it's got to be an adult decision that one can change their mind on without experiencing exile or execution.

It was shortsighted and tastes a bit like unintentional appropriation, but at least in justification of the former, it was meant to be a narrative understood by children. We see that love wins and that there is good love and unhealthy love, and it's literally that simple and that complex. It's that badly told, that well told, and that unintentionally well backed up in its own material in how both happened. By turning it into "well, ACTUALLY, you just don't know that Lucas meant..." and having every primary character he created drastically changed to justify that, all that's accomplished is giving a message that is contrary as hell to the one we were given.

I mean, is it shocking that they kept shitting on Luke? No. For one thing, this guy has to end up being disney's Luke in the ST, that's his trajectory. For another, look what they did to Han Solo, a guy whose whole arc in the OT had to be obliterated to make Kylo possible. That did not bode well for anyone. They're going to do whatever they retroactively need to do in order to make their own shit make sense and to "fix" the things that weren't loved about Lucas' saga.

Yep, Lucas definitely engaged in some cultural appropriation of Eastern religion with the Jedi Code. However, regardless of his intentions, what we got was a story in which healthy love in a normal human being can easily be morphed into unhealthy love in their adulthood when their natural healthy emotional development as children is suddenly disrupted by a religious soldier cult who tells them ambition, anger, close attachments, love, family, and individuality is “dangerous,” “greedy,” “selfish,” and “wrong” over and over again throughout their formative years, and refuse to give them that healthy emotional support and freedom they once had as children when they try to reach out for it.

Then, in the OT movies, we see that Luke Skywalker had a full, healthy, safe, and normal childhood before getting involved with the Jedi, so he’s not afraid to stand up for himself, and he knows how to form healthy attachments, which allow for him to be able to save the day for love of family and friends.

While Anakin does hold responsibility for his crimes as an adult, he was selfish, and no one forced him to turned on the Jedi in that moment in Revenge of the Sith, I always thought diminished responsibility was more appropriate than just holding him entirely accountable because, yeah, his sanity of mind is not all there. His agency is deeply compromised to ever feel safe doing better. He has every symptom of poorly treated/severely neglected C-PTSD, OCD, and several of BPD. He genuinely doesn’t believe he has much of a choice but to obey Sidious and all these corrupt and abusive authority figures throughout his life because they essentially do hold his and/or his loved ones lives in their hands. Anakin’s been conditioned to be obedient to corrupt authority his whole life. He’s been a soldier in battle for over thirty consecutive years of his life, and thinks the only way to be safe is by being a good weapon, a good protector, or a good tool for others. At least in the original canon.

Anakin’s options for healthy support and safe escape from the living hell that is his life of abuse, manipulation, oppression, and warfare generally come down to decisions between right vs wrong with him having to pick between life or death and danger or safety of self and/or loved ones. Yes, he became a coward, but there also was never a safe option for him to do better. Killing and war crimes become like a unhealthy compulsion for him to survive Sidious by taking his orders, as a release for anxiety, and release for other negative emotions in the moment. It’s not presented as this long-term or premeditated thing on his part that he recognize the horror with full clarity of mind. While he knows that doing these awful things ultimately doesn’t make him feel any better in the long run, he does keep getting taught throughout his life by these corrupt authority figures that committing these acts of abuse, warfare, and murder are “necessary” to survive. His views of right vs wrong are being manipulated by abusive and corrupt authority figures in these two space cults most of his life from which escape is highly risky, so his moral judgement is skewed.

Yet, Anakin also is still guilty because he did pretty much give up trying after he went dark until Luke came along, and he did have a conscience. While his agency was compromised, his love for Padme did absolutely become selfish when he went dark. Thus, he still had to pay for his crimes. He doesn’t get the happily ever after with his wife and kids after going dark and hurting his wife in a blind rage as punishment. He doesn’t get to make it up to the entire galaxy for being a mass murderer and war criminal against them over the past 23 years at the end of RotJ, just Luke, who he dies saving because he realized his love for his son was greater than his fear of Sidious.

Disney was trying to recreate that same sort of tragic backstory with Ben Solo/Kylo Ren of villain with compromised agency to feel safe doing better, but, in my opinion, they forced it too much and made it feel unbelievable. It’s not realistic. Palpatine has to be brought back from the dead, and his interest in corrupting Ben Solo for the dark side is so great that he infiltrates his mind? What? Anakin’s agency was severely compromised to feel safe ever doing better, but the narrative also made it clear that he still had a choice to do better, even if he didn’t believe he had and/or deserved one after being groomed for years by abusive and oppressive corrupt authority figures and feeling too afraid to do the right thing. Thus, he is still held as responsible for his crimes. Anakin’s actions and choices were his own, regardless of the poor emotional/mental stability, the force being a metaphor for a drug addiction, lifelong oppression of abusive authority, lack of safe opportunity for escape to anything better, and limited to nonexistent healthy support. His agency was deeply compromised, and his motivations understandable. However, ultimately the Jedi Order and Palpatine didn’t force him to commit mass murder against them in Revenge of The Sith, and, while there was no safe escape, Anakin also is guilty for giving up on trying to fight the dark side after going dark.

With Ben Solo/Kylo Ren, his family and friends treated him well, he came from a wealthy and famous family, and Luke didn’t stop him from seeing his parents. However, the narrative wants me to buy that it’s not at all his fault he became an asshole since Palpatine infiltrated his mind, influencing his actions and thoughts from childhood, and Palpatine told him he deserved more kindness and power from his family and friends, even though he was already getting it from them on the light side? Too much agency is taken away from Kylo, and his family and friends are too good to him for me to believe that he would actually fall for Palpatine’s lies of them trying to “hold him back” or “make him weak.”

While he was wrong to commit murder of the Jedi Order for Palpatine in his desperation to avoid abandonment and getting hurt, Anakin wasn’t wrong to grow to distrust and resent Obi Wan and the Jedi Council because they genuinely were moral hypocrites who treated him like crap. Yoda ran the Order like an emotionally abusive/oppressive cult. Obi-Wan was an emotionally negligent, misguided, and toxic guardian, friend, and mentor who usually sucked up to Yoda to try to get on the Council, even if that meant throwing people he cared about under the bus and living in total denial to do it. The Council was using Anakin as a pawn to commit treason against the Chancellor when they suspected he was a Sith without the entire Chamber’s consent or knowledge. Yoda, Obi-Wan and the other Jedi adults he grew up with were enabling and perpetuating the biddings of a classist, corrupt, and hypocritical Republic head of government that enabled and supported slavery and oppression on the outer rims, while blindly claiming to support “democracy,” so they were going down either way.

Yeah, Palpatine deceived and manipulated Anakin, but he also was influenced to turn on the Jedi Order and Republic because the way they were running genuinely did suck. They genuinely did compromise his agency to feel safe doing better. It doesn’t mean they deserved for Anakin to participate in murdering the whole Order for Palpatine, nor are they directly responsible for his actions and choices as an adult, but you can tell the Obi Wan and the Council did heavily contribute to Anakin’s fall to the dark side. They did give him valid reasons to distrust and resent them and feel afraid by being emotionally/psychologically abusive, manipulative, and oppressive.

There is no real evidence that Ben Solo has of his uncle, his parents, and the other Jedi being awful. It’s just Sidious’s lies, which makes for a far less compelling and relatable motivation. It makes it seem like he’s just a delusional and entitled brat who wants power for shits and giggles.

Why is Palpatine suddenly so intent on fucking up the Skywalker family? Yeah, Anakin was a good weapon for him, who perpetrated his crimes, but he still wasn’t really necessary for his rise in the long run. He was just an added bonus and opportunity for him to be lazy. Not to mention that there’s not much organic or realistic lead up to Ben Solo being an asshole, or a compelling motivation like there is with Anakin.

The Kylo Ren we are introduced in TFA is an entitled, narcissistic, and self-aggrandizing manchild with no redeeming qualities. He was his uncle’s favorite student. He got to keep in touch with his family back home after going to train as a Jedi. He’s upset about being overindulged by his uncle because he thinks that means he’s not really earned his place as a Jedi, even though he’s made a lot of friends in the temple. How is it even possible for Sidious to be back from the dead? Also, why does Rey ever suddenly like this asshole at all? They spend most of their time fighting, and Kylo Ren was just abusing, torturing, and stalking Rey the whole time. Most of the time it’s abusive and in the end it feels forced.

As for Luke, he is really out of character in the ST movies, but especially in The Book of Boba Fett. Lucas intended for him to be the guy who broke the toxic cycle of his predecessors with that whole “no attachment” bs. No one expected for his new Jedi Order to be perfect, but Luke actually enforcing that “no attachment” bs rule that he knows helped fuck up his dad and the last Jedi Order is entirely out of character. This is the same man who grew up with healthy attachments to family and friends and learned the importance of having personal agency to make free choices without being pressured. The stuff that is now labeled Legends material is more true to his original characterization.

Of course, there are still many fans trying to defend this OOCness of Luke, Anakin, Obi Wan, Leia, and Han in Disney Star Wars, the old Jedi “no attachment” rule, and all the other retcons. It’s not what Lucas actually intended, but since when have any of these Disney SW fans ever respected GL’s original story? They wanted a a story of simplistic good vs evil tropes between the Jedi and the Sith that the original Star Wars saga never fit, and Disney is trying to give them that, and recycle all of Lucas’s original stories.

[inky-duchess]

Writing Theory: Character Arcs

What is a Character Arc?

A character arc is the personal change and the journey that a character goes through through the run of the plot. A character should change within the narrative from the moment they step onto the page to the end of the story. They have to be impacted by the story's events no matter how small a change.

Types of Character Arc

1. Change/transformation arc

This character arc is transformative, utterly changing your character from something they were to something else, usually a better and stronger person. This arc is most common for heroes and protagonists, turning them from an ordinary Joe into a saviour or hero especially in fantasy works. As the story goes on, the character will find strength in themselves with a power or a fortitude they didn't know they possessed and becomes another kind of person thanks to it. The whole trick to this arc is the lie. Your character begins the story and their arc with a lie they believe either about themselves or their world. Your character will take hold of the truth and change because of it. For example:

Kaz Brekker from Six of Crows becomes the tough and morally grey criminal mastermind he is due to a childhood trauma. His backstory has him starting as a wide-eyed idealist child who gets betrayed after trusting a con man, losing his brother and everything he has. Kaz grows into somebody more closed off and ruthless than before.

Luke Skywalker starts his story as a farm boy wanting nothing more than to leave home for adventure. After losing his home and his family and discovering his heritage, Luke becomes a Jedi Knight.

2. Growth

Like the arc above, the character changes but unlike the arc above, they don't change fully but grow as a person. By story's end, they are still themselves but with a changed outlook on life, opinion or place in the world. Growth arcs are less base breaking than transformative arcs, leaving much of the person intact with a few improvements.

Liesel Meminger from The Book Thief begins her story as a child who follows the mania of the Hitler Youth and the belief that she is stupid. Through the trials of war, kindness of her foster parents and meeting Max, a Jewish stowaway, she changes into a more tolerant, brave and confident young woman.

Jamie Lannister in ASOIAF changes over the course of his story. After his defeat by Robb Stark, imprisonment, loss of his hand and journey back home with Brienne, he changes from a confident, hard-shelled and morally remiss knight, Jaime begins to become a Knight worthy of the name and more ashamed of his actions. Though at heart he remains a proud Lannister, he's not the person he started his story out as.

3. Fall Arc

Not all arcs are positive. Sometimes a character becomes something darker, eventually falling into their ill-fated destiny. The fall arc usually ends negatively for a character leading to death, madness or corruption- without any remedy or redemption. The character begins to change for the worst through their journey, turning toward ruin.

Jon Connington (JonCon) of ASOIAF is seemingly becoming this. He begins his arc as an idealist, a proud Lord of Westeros seeking glory. After being defeated and ecmxiled from his lands and losing Prince Rhaegar, he quickly turns bitter and hellbent on returning to Westeros to place a Targaryen claimaint on the throne. And we all know what direction his story is headed. (alexa play the Light of the Seven)

Hamlet in Hamlet, Prince of Denmark he begins the story as a melodramatic Prince sad about his dad dying. Over the course of the play, he gets more irrational and perhaps a little more crazier than he's pretending to be before ending up dead along with most the cast.

Flat Arcs

However, there remains the exception to the Arc rule, a narrative tool just to show a certain character's outlook on life. Flat character arcs involve no signs of change or growth within the character. The character is exactly the same from beginning to end. The flat arc is often given to minor characters who aren't effected by the story's events but it is not always just the minor characters that go through the arc. Sherlock Holmes perhaps the most prolific example. He never effected by any event in the and nor does he grow.

[animatedminds]

Star Wars: Visions - Episode 5: The Ninth Jedi

Here we go. The one everyone’s talking about. The one reviewer tend to agree is one of the series’ best, if not the best.

This one is another one that’s almost impossible to talk about without SPOILERS. I’ll try to keep it to a minimum, but SPOILERS just in case. We are, of course, talking about...

Episode 5: The Ninth Jedi Developed By: Production IG Directed By: Kenji Kamiyana

The first short to have intro narration, in a style clearly meant to audibly call to mind the narrative text that opens most Star Wars films. And this drop of classical Star Wars reminiscence sets the stage for the whole

Set in an indeterminate period where the Jedi are all but extinct and have been for “generations,” no one has seen a lightsaber in many people’s living memory, and the Sith run rampant hunting down any resistance to their rule, an elusive recluse sends a message out to the galaxy for any Jedi still able to hear: come to his star system, and he will provide you with that weapon from a more civilized time, in an effort to rebuild the Jedi Order.

The status quo for the Jedi here are interesting. They exist, but are scattered, and the initial focus character assumes that any Jedi he meets would be master-less and self taught. They desperately need the skills of a smith who can make lightsabers, desperately need the unity that this recluse - known as The Margrave - offers, and so assemble at his doorstep even though they know it could easily be a trap. The last arrival, Ethan, is an bright eyed youth who is eager to find solidarity, but the wait will be long.

Meanwhile, the saber smith and his daughter just about finish the last touches on the order of lightsabers for the Margrave. His chipper daughter, whose connection to the force is starting to develop, is happy to take the order to their employer when suddenly a group of dark, mysterious strangers arrive asking questions...

This is a great set up for a great narrative. It’s a strong story that is going to be a point of reference for me as a writer in the future, on how to write misdirections and fakeouts without taking away from the narrative experience: twists run the real risk of taking the audience out of the experience, especially when they’re twists just for the sake of having them, which can make people give the concept a bum wrap it doesn’t inherently deserve. This story is proof positive that twists are not a bad thing, as the story is all about misdirection but executes this in a way where every shocking serve feels like a turn you have already been prepared for, just didn’t know about yet, another thread that needs to weave into the story for it to feel complete: You think the meat of the story is going to be with those Jedi waiting for the Margrave, but then the plot instead centers around the sabers and the daughter’s desperate attempt to deliver them as the Jedi Hunters attack - because of course, these are the very things they are waiting for, not the Margrave itself. You start to realize that some of the assembled Jedi are not who they seem (there’s one in particular, who is so obviously going to be a twist villain that you can imagine Kamiyama’s tongue well in cheek when designing him), while our host - the Margrave - features a lot of traditionally “evil” design traits (not the least being glowing red eyes), but he starts to clearly be shown to be what we initially expect him to be, and the enormity of the answer to “where are the Sith” manages to be shocking even if you were genre savvy enough to be catching on. The character you think might be the protagonists aren’t, and the ones you think might be the antagonists are really your last hope.

And that’s not even getting into the visuals. Lightsabers are portrayed even more as an extension of the characters’ wielding it, in a way I liked a lot better than the “Anakin’s saber is Excalibur” idea from the ST. Not just the color, but the glow and visual presence of a lightsaber directly ties to the characters’ sense of purpose, there’s a point where the color of a character’s saber changes mid-fight as they finally find their resolve: it’s a beautiful visual representation. The fight at the end is a delight as well. Probably the most violent scrap since The Duel (though not as hardcore as that), while there’s no blood characters do get visibly chopped up and burned in this one, and the battle feels all the more ruthless for it. The Sith are interesting here - they outnumber our heroes, yet by the end of it they almost feel like the underdogs, only able to watch as their fully pissed off opponent executes their allies one by one. But the fact that others in the fight are much less experienced, and the fact that we know the Sith have done one particularly nasty thing over the course of the plot, keeps the sympathy away from them for much of it.

This, like The Twins, is another that intentionally and wholly adopts a classic Star Wars trope - though unlike that it is not a short built on being entirely referential and tributary, but rather it’s own crafted narrative. Still, the Jedi must always be underdogs. They must always be hunted, always be seeking out ways to bring peace back to a lost galaxy. But the implication here that they are building something where there was one nothing gives this take on the idea a strength and permanence that I very much enjoyed: rather than another story about a ragtag band of Jedi, this felt like I was watching the beginning of something. As I said, the time frame is indeterminate, but I could almost see this as the beginning of the old Jedi Order as we know it.

This was definitely a wonderful episode, and among my favorites. It had I think the best ensemble of protagonists thus far: not that the protagonists previously were poor, but as I noted in my Tatooine Rhapsody review, once you get off of the main protag in some of the shorts the supporting characters drop off some (though the previous episode, The Village Bride, was also great with minor character characterization). Here, everyone - even the Sith - get at least a little characterization to endear them, and all the main characters are well defined and endearing. I could easily see more of any of these characters. Heck, I’d even watch a series just about the pilot droid that’s only in there for a very rare spot of humor. Great episode, is what I’m saying. And lastly, as I always do, I’m going to look at this one additionally in terms of canon potential. All of the Visions short films are noncanon, but like with many studio or franchise if there is enough support (and if they actually fit into the setting) for any of these characters there is always a chance that the studio could choose to revisit them and officially incorporate them. But with that in mind, I’m going to look whether this does actually fit into the setting.

Reminding the reader that this is a wholly separate question from “how amazing is this episode” (for which the answer is “very.”), I’d only give this one maybe Okay Chances, but more likely Not So Good Chances. The premise of this one necessarily requires a very major status quo: that of a period where the Sith take over the galaxy and the Jedi are nigh wiped out. This means that this would either have to set in stone a big part of the backstory of the series, or hard-set the far future of the series, both things that LucasFilm very likely doesn’t want rigidly defined. You might have heard of the KOTOR remake by now: that’s not confirmed canon and probably won’t be, and I’ve been presuming that its for the same reason: they don’t want to definitively say “this is how it all started” right now, and even moreso they definitely won’t want to say “this is what eventually happens” either. The concept would have to wait in the wings for when a time comes that they have an idea in mind that they can incorporate it into. But that doesn’t diminish the experience of watching this for the first time. Heck, the final shot of the short - a visual assurance that the will and power of the Jedi is never going anywhere - that’s still giving me goosebumps. And it makes me wish I had a lightsaber of my own...

[duelofthefatesmp3]

i DO actually wanna know how youd make kotor 3 !!!!!

this ask has been sitting on my inbox for so long on PURPOSE! i wanted some time to re read the revan book + watch some swtor gameplays so i could give a concrete answer about why the book and swtor arent satisfactory and what i would do instead (im not like. a storytelling god so i this is just my PERSONAL idea). under the cut!

to begin with, what's wrong with revan the book and swtor, mai?

i am very fond of swtor i think it was such a nice idea to have an "open" world game set in star wars old republic time. but ultimately, it was not a good conclusion to revan and meetra's storyline! now, i don't really know what happened in the development of the third kotor game (if there ever was a plan for one) but it's clear they dropped the ball on that and decided to start a whole different project. i don't think we can blame disney for that one, because it was announced on 2008, launched in 2011, and disney had just bought star wars that year. so who knows.

the thing is that it's painfully evident that a bunch of the story that was gonna be in the third game, ended up in the book + misc parts of swtor. much of the book feels like a gameplay.

now, it was clear when the book was planned that they wanted to keep revan's story open so when the game came out, they could have a cool Revan storyline so he could make a cool villain appearence and draw in some of that kotor nostalgia. which ehhhhhh. uh. i don't really think did any favors for revan's character. he didn't have a satisfactory arc (I'm not saying "a happy ending" because good arcs aren't always happy) but at least some closure?

revan went through many big events in his life. we didnt need to keep his ass in stasis for his fun villain moments 300 years later. we already had what we wanted from him: jedi turned sith turned jedi again to defeat a terrible threat. that was it we could have let it there and it would have been cool! but then they decided to drag and drag his story just to leave him right where he was before. he just suffered a little more in the in-between.

you could say he finally redeemed himself of all of his crimes this way, but wasn't that the whole purpose of the first kotor game (and would have been the purpose of the 3rd?)

swtor does not centre revan in his own narrative. he's a side character for the player to experience. and look, i get it, we've had a different protag on each game, why not have another one in this one. well, because the protagonist has no personal relationship with revan. meetra was one of his closest friends, and fought with him. there is a connection that can be exploited. but the swtor protagonist is just some guy 300 years in the future who happens to stumble into revan and his life. not even his descendants get to fully interact with revan.

also, there is the fact that revan is not the centre of the game itself, only of a particular storyline. and it's weird, because swtor could have happened without revan's involvement.

ms. meetra surik, ms. bastila shan, women of the world I'm sorry

so it's no news that star wars is misogynistic as fuck right. cause it is.

so you decide to make your gender neutral protagonist a guy. then you decide to make your other gender neutral protagonist a woman. cool. now let's guess who gets underdeveloped, turned into a plot device without reason, and promptly fridged in the most unceremoniously fashion just to fullfil some manpain moments. which one do you think got that treatment.

i know the revan book is supposed to be about revan, but why make meetra go through a whole arc just to undermine her character and turn her into the faithful servant of the guy? she leaves everything behind for him, sacrifices herself for him, hell not even dead is she not serving the guy. and she was the second game’s protagonist! she beat up a bunch of powerful people and now she’s just meh, there? she had so many interesting ways to interact with revan (meeting kreia, revan’s first master, encountering another force consuming entity, etc.)

meetra went through a whole arc about dealing with the guilt of doing something horrible and having the consequences of it cut her from the force. we see her broken, then slowly come back to the world and reconnect herself with the force, then stop running and face the consequences of her role in the war. thats such a cool character with tons of potential! and nothing happened!

then we got bastila who is. a whole deal. so you make her go through a “promising jedi who defeated revan, to questioning reluctant companion, to fell into the dark side, to was redeemed thanks to her bond to revan, who helped her come back because he’d been through the same experience” arc, and then you decide to push her to the side to have a baby?? which is... its clear that the writer didnt know what to do with her (or with the other characters outside of canderous) so hey, lets get her to marry revan and have a baby.

my ideal kotor 3

to preface, im not a game developer, so some of my choices could be stunted by what a kotor rpg can do lol. of course, it would follow the same mechanics and have the same format as the first two, because consistency!

the fun way to start the game, would be from scourge’s perspective. we get to play as a sith! i’d even say you get to change scourge’s name and gender and looks (i know sith have different looks)

in scourge’s storyline, we get from his arrival to normound kaas, to his talks with nissyris, to his missions working for her. in some of these, we can make scourge lean into the dark or the light side! fun! plus we get some exposition with dialogue options. it all continues untill we get to nissirys story about the emperor. we get a fucked up cutscene of his childhood and then BOOM when its over, we see revan waking up from a nightmare and their pov starts.

ok, as for revan’s story, since we’d have to pick it up from where kotor ended, i’d have a little cutscene of revan back into the ebon hawk, with bastila, and them telling the crew to take them to courascant. then cut to a council meeting where revan and bastila get scolded in private, then rewarded by the republic. i would also like to see some revan mournink malak’s death mayhaps. since he was their childhood friend and all.

i would 100% scrape the marriage and two years passed part. as the book said, the council had no use for revan aside from the legend(tm), so why would they stay in courascant. revan was very alienated from the jedi at that point, despite being back in the “light side”

then like, to revan asking around for meetra and other jedi from the mandalorian wars, we can cash in that atris cameo, then revan starts to have these visions about the sith emperor, and maybe we could get a playable dream sequence about revan’s fight with mandalore the ultimate (I KNOW I WOULD LIKE TO SEE IT.) and we get the whole exposition to mandalore telling revan that the sith are behind it all. i believe we should get a bunch of these flashback/dream sequences of revan’s past doing shit. cut to revan burying the mask in a planet, then back to the present. we see a bunch of mission and juhani scenes trying to reach him, but he keeps pushing them away. revan and bastila meet canderous, travel to the ice planet, meet clan ordo (god i love clan ordo) you get the whole quest, you decide weather to spare veela or not, maybe you get a cheeky mandalorian companion (force sensitive mando oh?) and leave canderous behind.

we can visit like, a couple more planets searching for clues maybe, etc. then when reaching nathema, you are forced to go alone as revan, get to explore nathema a bit (raiding ancient location yay) nathema as a location can be so fun because you can have it weaken you hp bar and also you cant use the force (which, in game is pretty cool)

then we get to scourge and nyssiris arriving to the planet, they fight but since theres two of them and revan doesn’t have the force, they beat the shit out of them, and while running away, they get in a fight with bastila and the companions in the ebon hawk (ebon hawk shooting game my hated). bastila manages to get a glimpse of revan’s thoughts before they take them away. but the ebon is so ruined it takes bastila, t3 and the mandalorian a while to fix it, and they get stuck into the unknown regions for a while. the ebon hawk is left in an outer rim planet with t3 fixing it, bastila and the mandalorian run back to the jedi council, only to get caught in the middle of the jedi civil war. we can have bastila choosing to hide in courascant and trying to make sense of what she saw, reading texts about the sith empire, trying to plot a course to where they took revan (more atris! but shes pissed at her now)

cutscene to meetra’s pov, leaving malachor v behind, getting calls from everyone at the hawk (atton my beloved) but just as she’s leaving she gets a force message from revan, calling for her to find him and sending visions of normound kaas. then, through her force bond with visas, she tells her not to go because they’re gay and in love and whatnot.

then boom, she gets intercepted by bastila’s ship, with the mandalore and the other mandalorian (yes i do love having a bunch of mandos on board) and they go on their way to find revan.

now i want there to be an underlying message of “we can’t take our friends with us because we have to do this ALONE we’re powerful JEDI we don’t need our FRIENDS.” meetra gets asked if she wants to bring any friends and she’s like “no. we have to do this alone.” along the game you get constantly contacted by other game characters, you get the chance to talk to them or ignore them.

so, we get back to nathema, and meetra has a whole “holy shit this is just like darth nihilus but ten times worse. but i beat darth nihilus. i can do this!” then she finds peace in this place without the force, we get a whole speech about how the odds arent against them, they find a way to normound kaas, and get going.

in normound kaas i thought about them getting a whole mission about how to infiltrate the citadel, only to get helped by scourge. he joins the party, we get a little flashback of all the years he spent trying to make revan remember and they storm the citadel. we get to fight the dark council members, fun! then we get to free revan and the game switches povs. bastila hands the mask to revan and he has a cool “yes im revan im pretty cool” then a nice heartfelt yet rushed reunion with everyone.

then have a small CONVERSATION WITH MEETRA where she talks about the sith triumvirate she defeated and revan is impressed with her and is like “we are the last hope of the jedi, we’ve learned to walk between light and dark, we’ve done horrors but we can still make things right, our experience has made us more powerful etc.

then they fight the imperial guard, ALL OF THEM, meetra revan and scourge make it into the throne room, they all fight the emperor. meetra shows the emperor that she has seen the void, she has cut herself from the force, and she’s not afraid of him, revan supports her, talks about redemption and hope  and NOW.

NOW. how the alternate endings could go:

if you decide to take scourge through the light side, he manages to form a forcebond with meetra and revan since they’ve both teached something about the duality of the force, they get 100% stronger, but its still not enough. UNTIL. a bunch of ships (jedi and mandalorian, even non republic ships) arrive to dormound kaas, the gangs from each game storm the room and together they make the emperor and his guard a bunch of punching bags. they beat him! (unknow to them, this was a backup body because the emperor can do weird shit like that, and has only debilitated his plan, but he’ll come back dont worry). then they fly back to the republic, to tell the chancellor about the sith threat, and preparations for the war begin. meetra and revan get to live happily ever after for a while, then they die away from the jedi or the sith (waaah im thinking about them helping canderous rebuild the mandalorians, and them doing it since they killed so many mandos in the war)

BECAUSE IN THE END KOTOR IS ABOUT LEARNING TO PROCESS TRAUMA AND RECOGNIZE YOUR MISTAKES AND LIVE WITH THE GUILT WHILST TRYING TO FIX THE MISTAKES YOU MADE ALONG THE WAY. AND ALSO TO HEAL FROM TRAUMA YOU NEED A SUPPORT SYSTEM SO EVEN THOUGH IT MAKES SENSE TO YOU YOU SHOULDNT PUSH PEOPLE WHO LOVE YOU AWAY. AND THINGS AREN’T BLACK AND WHITE ITS COMPLICATED SO YOU DONT END UP BACK ON SQUARE ONE YOURE A CHANGED PERSON.

or

if you decide to dark side scourge further, he betrays revan and meetra, they all die, and the emperor unleashes his angry lightning or whatever on everyone + a bunch of visions of all the enemies of past mocking them, and their loved ones suffering. and since you’ve had that “im not calling my friends bullshit” no one comes, you die there, and the emperor is only stalled for a few years. swtor ensues. scourge becomes the emperor’s hand.

now you could of course bring revan and meetra up in swtor, but maybe only as force ghost guides, or have some of the other characters of the game have relevance (visas tries to heal the miraluka planet 2021)

WELL THAT WAS A LOT OF WORDS. HOPE THIS IS SATISFYING ENOUGH

[frumfrumfroo]

I see so many stupid takes on what a “revised” ST storyline would look like. Granted, almost all of these are still better than the dumpster fire that is TROS. But a lot of these still don’t make sense because a lot of people still miss what I think you articulate so well in many of your metas: that the ST is about the Skywalker family, the unresolved trauma, and with Ben Solo as the heir and person who should tie up all the loose ends (I can’t put it as elegantly as you do, but the whole thing you have repeatedly said about him living and having children, reconciliation of Anakin and the Skywalker “name” to society, repairing the unresolved issues Leia had with her father, etc etc). I just saw another stupid take where Rey is Obi Wan’s secret daughter who has been abandoned (wow way to go shitting on Obi Wan’s character) and therefore has anger issues, hates the Jedi and worships Vader, Ben is not force sensitive and grows up a diplomat learning from Leia, Finn is a Jedi randomly, Poe is a pilot for no reason I can think of or why he even exists, and Rey needs to be saved by Ben (how? Why? Why not by Finn if Finn is the Jedi and Ben is doing just fine in life.) Oh and the dyad is created by Obi and Anakin’s ghosts, and also Rey is asexual bc she is too angry—I support asexual character representation but not if it is a manifestation of maladaptive behaviors rather than a healthy state of being). I mean, all of that could be interesting, maybe in an Obi Wan family saga spinoff series, but I fail to see how this is about the Skywalkers or ties in thematically to the central characters of OT/PT. Like why should we care? I suppose if we learned that Leia did reconcile with her father, and the galaxy at large knew of Anakin’s redemption, and Ben didn’t grow up with this fear of fatalism, fine I can see perhaps that storyline “working” but again...it wouldn’t really be about the Skywalkers anymore, who in that version seem to all be well adjustsd, happy fufilled functional people. But why not then just call that story a complete new series instead of a sequel...(and btw that “version” has almost no mention of Luke, and most OG fans are interested in seeing where their original heros ended up etc etc). I fail to see why Rey even needs to be around in these “alternate” versions. Just make a completely new story set in SW world but not a “sequel” then, that would be fine. Anyway, every time I see stuff like this, I come to your blog to re-read your metas because you are one of the very few people who GETS the story. Please preach some more to the choir (if inspiration strikes). I need to be reminded that there actual people in the fandom who cares about Ben, the Skywalkers, thematic coherence, and GOOD STORYTELLLING. Anyway thank you so much for your detailed and insightful analyses. They are truly a delight and a balm. If it’s not too much trouble, could you by chance link to some of your own fave metas you’ve written, or that you think are the most important to understanding the ST and Ben etc? Do you recommend any other bloggers whose metas on Ben and ST you feel are good and enjoy? Thank you!

Thank-you so much, anon! 🥰

Yes, the problem with so many ‘fix-it’ ideas or ideas of what the ST ‘should’ have been is that they have nothing to do with the Skywalker Saga or its themes. If you just want to write about new characters in the GFFA and not meaningfully continue the same narrative about the family and the question the Skywalkers exist to ask, then it’s not part of the same story. Which is fine, but it’s not a sequel. You can’t unpick the end of RotJ and destroy the resolution of the original character arcs if you’re then going to make them glorified cameos to give your unrelated newbies a pep talk without providing a fuller and more complete statement of the original message and the original arcs. That’s an either/or choice. Either actually make a sequel and deal with the implications of that or don’t.

The most stark contrast between TLJ and TFA/TROS is that TLJ is written as a fully equal and living part of the story, it treats the characters as characters and takes for granted that it is part of the saga not just a tribute to it. There are elements that are meta, it does comment, but it doesn’t approach the OT heroes as icons frozen in amber incapable of change or allow its new characters to act like fans of the films rather than people who live in the universe. And this is why it’s so much better and so much more memorable. It’s an actual story which stands on its own two feet.

Probably my most key posts on SW’s themes and worldview are in the tags space crime and punishment and the legacy. My Ben tag covers a lot those two miss and also has reblogs from other people whose meta I would really recommend (especially benperorsolo). This is a round up I did mostly about Rey’s arc/place in the story, but it’s pre-tros and missing some links. Her tag has more on sw protagonists and why I think none of the ‘alternatives’ people offer for Rey Nobody and Reylo work.

I think I linked most of my individual favourite posts in this answer lol.

[where-dreamers-go]

“Nothing More” Ben Solo x f!Reader

(A/N: Requested by @mykyloren-addiction. Thank you for the request!

So….including fluff was not specified and I went all out Star Wars brain. Also I tweaked it a little. More avoidance. Ben Solo is back and wants to reconcile with an old friend, Reader, but is Reader willing to even look at him?

Warnings: Angst.

Word Count: 2,870 words)

The roaring podracing engine rumbled loudly next door between the joined chatter of travelers. Sitting outside of Docking Bay 7 was never too quiet. Yet it was a doable tradeoff from your racing and invasive thoughts. You needed a few moments to rest your feet and not actively having to check over your shoulder for a patrolling stormtrooper. An old structure wall of sorts shielded your back and one side. Strong meaty scents came upon a breeze from the neighboring Ronto Roasters. It was a place to get away without completely leaving.

Black Spire Outpost had a little bit and a lot of everything. Busy storefronts, unique travelers, varying landscapes, and all sorts of possibilities. That was one reason the Resistance made camp on Batuu. Another reason was to rebuild the Resistance while the First Order was extremely close by. It was unnerving, however not the most surprising.

A little over a week ago, you had returned to camp one day to the buzzing of information revolving around Ben Solo and Rey. It was shocking when you stayed to hear more. Ben found Rey and through learning he left the Dark Side as well as The First Order, she let him join the Resistance. General Leia was reportedly happy, however not planetside. It was a load to grasp onto mentally. No sooner had you heard the news, you avoided the camp and in turn Ben as much as physically possible. Helping batuuans and helping to spread the Resistance’s purpose took up most of your day.

As it should, you thought.

Even as you ventured through the Outpost, Rey had lead the former Kylo Ren into the Resistance encampment. Tensions had been high for at least the first forty-eight hours. Having a former leader of The First Order so close did that.

Yet keeping busy and out of sight didn’t seem to do much good with Force sensitives around. You were surprised when Rey had approached you and asked if you’d speak with Ben. She had learned that yourself and Ben had known one another prior to him donning a new name. Something you weren’t too keen on thinking about.

Yet, here we go.

You let out a long heavy sigh. It had been a long while since you had really thought about your life prior to joining the fight to save the galaxy. You were not the first to do so, but you truly hoped you would be among the last.

You had family in the New Republic’s political system. Some of which were currently on the First Order’s radar. You and Ben had met in a senate building. Family busy with their job and duties. You remembered a time when you would jump at the opportunity to join whichever family member had a senatorial meeting. Back then, you had an entertaining friendship with the young Ben Solo. The two of you would share both bizarre and mundane stories from across the galaxy. Between visits, meetings, and comm conversations, the friendship had grown into something more. There were feelings that were blatant mutual, however never spoken.

Your feelings had changed. Time and experience made you stronger and more aware.

Things change. People change. Some more than others.

Back then, after hearing what happened to Ben—him actually contacting you and asking you to support The First Order—quickly lead into a heated conversation before you just shut off the call on him and threw yourself into fully supporting the Resistance by joining. There was such a heavy rock-feeling in your heart then. One you used to and turned into a fire to help the Resistance.

I don’t want to see his face, you thought. Sitting back on the bench, you stretched out your legs. Didn’t think I’d be disappointed or annoyed with seeing Rey though. Sometimes she’s too kind for her own good. But no. No. She’s not getting me to speak with…him. No. How many times do I have to tell her ‘no’? He can be here all he likes. I’m busy. The Resistance is busy. I don’t need to see him.

The usual stress of being a Resistance member had tripled on top of growing frustration. That was no way to live. You needed air. You needed space. And you needed to venture to other communities on Batuu. A perfect escape.

An escape?

Grumbling lowly, your eyes scanned over the populace. No sign of of Resistance members. Two stormtroopers on patrol, citizens walking between other citizens, and possibly a handful of scoundrels. A typical day.

. . .

Double checking you hadn’t forgotten your credits, you peeked out of your tent. Looking left, right, and back again—the area was free of Ben. As far as you were concerned, you didn’t need to speak to him. You didn’t really want to anyway.

Things to do, food to eat, people to help. Can’t spend my whole day like this. Again. No one’s up this early anyway.

. . .

“I don’t know about this.” Finn murmured to Poe as the two waited for Rey outside.

“I just want to see if (Y/N) uses a blaster on him.” Poe said as he crossed his arms and rose his eyebrows to his friend. “I really wouldn’t be surprised. But I’m hoping.”

“Hey. Rey really wants them to talk it out.”

“If she pushes (Y/N) any farther, there’s going to be a shoot out. Very little talking.”

“Don’t say that.”

“Why not? Let him try something.”

“He wouldn’t dare.” Finn crossed his arms as well.

The two Force sensitives came into view from behind a line of foliage and storage crates. One tall and confident, the other tall and guilty.

“Guess we’ll find out.” Poe leaned his weight to the side.

“Have you kept an eye on her?” Rey asked as she reached the pair.

“She left her tent about ten minutes ago.” Finn said calmly. The calm tone only a thin layer over his wariness. “She headed towards the ships about a minute ago.”

“Good. She couldn’t have gotten too far.” She smiled and turned to Ben. “You two will be able to talk this time. I know you will.”

Ben Solo simply nodded, but a small hint of a smile graced his features. Rey’s smiles were sometimes hard to not share. He hoped she was right.

“Yeah, no. Why don’t we—you two—leave (Y/N) alone. She doesn’t want to see him.” Poe gestured to Ben. “Don’t encourage this. Whatever the hell it is.”

“They were friends.” Rey said, standing firmly.

“Exactly. ‘Were friends’.”

“Why don’t we let (Y/N) decide.”

“Fine.”

Finn sighed quietly to himself. He had no idea how any of this was going to turn out. Holding out hope that everyone he cared about would keep their heads, he walked with the group towards the ships.

It didn’t take long for them to hear the familiar sound of a ship’s engine. The sound only fueled the group to rush over to an A-Wing still grounded. The pilot? You, of course.

Ben swallowed thickly as he made eye contact with you. The recognization in your face only resulted in a heavy curse word easily read on your lips. He could sense your distaste from where he stood. It only added to his vulnerability. He had not expected to be opening up to his past in this way. It frightened him. Would you still have any hidden feelings for him?

. . .

If you did not care or work on your ship, you would had hit a panel with your fist. Reluctantly, you left the sanctuary of your A-Wing and trudged your way across the sand to the group staring at you. There was no way you were going to risk Rey keeping your ship down using the Force when it would hopefully be easier to just get one conversation over with.

I hate this already.

You stopped about two paces from the group. There was no need to guess what they wanted. It was only a matter of time before they tried a different tactic to get you to talk with Ben.

“Hi.” You said flatly, arms crossed under your chest.

Poe and Finn stood off to the side, both pairs of eyes checking on Ben every few seconds.

“You were leaving?” Rey asked, eyebrows raised slightly. She stood next to Ben who still wore dark tones and a guarded expression.

“Yes.”

“Can you stay long enough to talk?”

“I have some time.”

Everyone stood rooted in their spot. The breeze coming through the trees gave noise to the break in conversation.

Here we go, I guess. Remain calm. There is nothing to get entirely aggravated about. Just breathe and listen.

Rey turned to Ben for a moment before saying, “Ben would like to talk with you.”

You nodded.

“It’s…uh…,” Ben began speaking to you. “It’s been a while. You look well.”

Your eyebrows rose on their own accord.

Wow.

Again, you nodded. “Hi.”

“Hi.”

From his side, Rey gave him an encouraging head gesture. Ben’s hands hung loosely at his sides.

“Look, I know that I’ve done terrible things, but I left all of it. I’m not a part of it any more. I want to help.” He said, his tone somewhere between calm and persuasive.

“So you joined the Resistance.” You added to whatever narrative he was saying.

“I did…and I didn’t know you had joined. If I’d had known that I…maybe things would be different.”

“I joined right after we last talked.” You pursed your lips and soon the words started tumbling out. “I’d think that me telling you that I wouldn’t join the First Order would had told you something.” Keeping your voice calm was all you needed to focus on.

Don’t let him get to you.

Ben’s frame deflated, shoulders falling.

“There’s a lot that’s changed over the years. No doubting that. Is there something….else that you wanted to talk about?” You asked. Being taken through memory lane with Ben Solo was not what you had in mind. Especially when those memories brought up were the last ones you had when he decided to join the First Order and he left his Jedi training up in flames.

“I want to be your friend again.”

“What?” The word slipped out from you before you could stop yourself.

“I miss you,” Ben’s voice lowered, almost hushed as the words seemed to tug their way out of him. “I want to be your friend again. I miss spending time with you.”

The kriff?

“I’m sorry for all of the terrible things that I’ve done. I can’t change the past. But I can do what I can now.”

You shook your head.

Dark eyebrows knitted together. It looked as if he had taken a hit to the gut.

“I—wow… Look, I can not promise that I’ll be your friend again. I’m just being realistic here. A true friend would not have done…would not have asked me what you did years ago. I don’t…,” you sighed and uncrossed your arms. “I don’t trust you.”

Ben’s mouth hung open as he stared at you. A strong amount of hurt and confusion colored on his fair face.

Keeping your ground was what you intended to do from the start and you would. There had been too many nights, too many days where his choices effected more than simply him. Forgiveness did not always have to be given. It had taken you so long to forgive yourself for things you never did, for feelings your had for him, and things you had considered doing. What Ben did, you were not obligated to forgive him in any amount.

“(Y/N).” Ben said quietly.

“No.”

No. Can’t do it. I’ve already been through this.

You looked away from him and to the other two men. Poe and Finn. Two people you did trust, especially at that moment. Neither one said a word in favor of either you nor Ben. In fact, Finn looked to be observing from a more calm stand point whereas Poe had his arms firmly crossed across his chest. If there was someone who truly did not like the conversation happening, other than you, it was Poe.

Are we finished now?

Boots shifted the sand as Ben took a more wide stance.

“I’m here now. I’m trying to help.” Ben urged. “If you’d just forgive me, we can start over. I didn’t do anything to you. I’ve said things and asked you to join the First Order when I had, but I never went after you. I would never do that.”

You squared your shoulders. There was only so much a person could take.

Calm. Calm, you thought as you breathed through your nose.

“You made a choice, Ben. You ran off to Snoke instead of your parents. To your mother who would protect you from anyone and anything. You chose The First Order instead of your own family. What the hell for? You are not and were not limited in your choices. You’ve done unspeakable things in The First Order. You hurt Poe, Finn, and Rey.” Your breath came out as hot air through your nose. “Did you really just ask me to forgive you?”

Ben’s throated bopped, “Yes.”

The kriffing hell. He just—

“I cannot pretend that you weren’t Kylo Ren. Words aren’t enough.”

“Ben is with us now.” Rey interjected. “He left The First Order.”

You returned your gaze to Ben’s dark brown eyes. “Did you do anything to help dismantle them? Sabotage their plans besides leaving?”

“(Y/N),” Rey said. “You’re asking too much of him. Give him a chance.”

“I did. Years ago before I dropped the call. The call where he asked me to join the kriffing First Order. No.”

Poe and Finn shifted uncomfortably.

“If what you all want is for me to give him a chance in the Resistance, fine. That’s technically not my call. It’s a group effort. But,” You looked Ben hard in the eyes. “If you’re asking more from me…don’t expect anything.”

His dark eyebrows curved up, a look of hurt returning twice over.

“Wait…,” Poe started to lean closer. “What more could he want?”

Your silent answer and unmasked facial expression gave cause to Poe’s reaction.

“Oh, come on…You can’t be serious.” The pilot groaned.

Ben sent a narrowed gaze to the other man.

“We’re not talking about what never happened.” You added more calmly.

“All in favor of ending this conversation?” Poe asked as he could no longer make eye contact with anyone around him. “Because it needs to.”

“(Y/N),” Ben took a step closer. “I’ll do all that I can to help stop the First Order.”

“That’s what we’re all here doing,” Poe added dryly.

“Finn. Poe.” Rey said in a direct and calm manner. “Let’s give them a moment.”

Both men looked over with incredulous looks.

“Come on,” she gestured with her head as she turned and started walking away.

Finn made eye contact with you and said, “Let us know if you need anything.”

You nodded.

Poe Dameron on the other hand cleared his throat and unmistakably patted the weapon in his holster. Thankfully his messages were never subtle.

The moment that the others were out of earshot, you turned your attention to Ben once more.

“Anything else you’d like to say?”

“Are any of my ‘sorry’s enough?”

“There needs to be action to match. Help us. Show that you changed.”

“My feelings haven’t changed.”

A heavy exhale left you.

“You don’t feel the same?” He asked.

“No. Not for a long time.”

It was easy to recognize the genuine hurt in Ben’s eyes. Yes, you felt empathy, however you no longer held romantic feelings for Ben Solo. There was nothing for you to do.

“I have to get back to work.” You said, giving a general gesture behind you. “We have a Resistance to rebuild.”

“I understand.”

“Best of luck, Ben.”

“…Thanks.”

Giving an awkward wave, you pivoted on the spot and headed back to your A-Wing. A weight was lifted from your shoulders and the need to check your surroundings in a safe area had drastically dwindled down. At least your mind would be in a better place while you went out to other communities.

There was limited choice in how you would be interacting near the newest Resistance member. You would learn to work alongside Ben because saving the galaxy from the overpowering use of the Dark Side did not stop for ruined relationships. One day he might even become a nice partner to have when having to go out in your ship. Ben was a great pilot. Yet, only time would tell. Only the Force knew about what was to come.

You would not stray to far from camp, however you would keep a firm eye on Ben to protect the ones you cared about. You did not have to forgive him and you did not think you ever would at that point. The First Order was still a threat and they were scrapping many corners of Batuu to find their base.

It was time to go to work.

~~~

Best wishes and happy reading.)

(If you love my writings and want to support me, I have a Ko-Fi where you can buy me a coffee. I would be eternally grateful.

coffee

~~~~~

DreamerDragon Tags: @cubedtriangle

Star Wars: @darkenwolfy

**Let me know if you would like to be tagged in insert readers, either through replies, ask, or message.**

[darth-schism]

Evidence to Suggest that Luke was NOT all that he seemed in TLJ

Luke Skywalker may have isolated himself because of his guilt/depression. But I also believe he did it for practical reasons, and that his “totally given up” act, was just that, an act. Evidence for this Head-cannon/interpretive take:

1. He made a map to his location

Not only that, but it was so specific, it was literally called “The Map to Skywalker.” The only way it would have gotten a name as tailored as that is if someone else had found him before Rey, or, if he told people about it himself. In any event, to whatever varying degree, Luke wanted to be found and/or influence the galaxy around him.

One piece of the map was  tossed around to all sorts of corners of the galaxy, while the rest of it was entrusted to R2D2. 

2. This was a deliberate combo to serve two different purposes

          - Keep Snoke distracted: The entirety of TFA was Kylo and Snoke obsessing over Luke’s location. Their preoccupation with it was evident and, instead of letting them focus on relentlessly attacking the New Republic, Luke gave them a reason to go on wild goose chases. Consider that Snoke doesn’t go ‘all in’ on trying to destroy the Resistance until after he realizes he lost the race to get to Skywalker. Which shows just how much stock he had put into that singular Jedi. What’s more, even if they had succeeded, they’d only have a useless fraction with no reference as to where in the galaxy Luke’s secret location actually was.      

          - Meanwhile, R2D2 would also play the role of a “given up/powered down” hero: But we see that, soon as the coast is clear, and some plot heroes arrive with the map, he assessed the situation, turned on, and sent them right to Skywalker. I think it’s safe to say that R2D2 was merely in ‘sleep mode,’ as opposed to ‘shut down.’ However, despite all this, the element of being powered down/unassuming was still crucial because... 

3. Snoke made it abundantly clear that when he found Skywalker, he’d blow up the entire landmass he was found, or even theorized to be, on

Luke would never put a population of innocents at risk of complete annihilation just because someone might to recognize him at a local market. So it’s no wonder he chose a place as isolated as he did (On top of that, considering his critical stance towards the Jedi Order by 28ish ABY, it wouldn’t necessarily be a heartbreak to him if the island did end up getting destroyed, or one to anyone else really, because of how obscure/unknown it was...or so he convinced himself).

4. He was picking his battles

If Luke Skywalker wanted to be found. Then why was he so dismissive of Rey? There’s no solid evidence here (aside from the whole existence of the map scheme), but I think there’s good reason to believe that Luke’s instant stand-offish behavior is one of caution and assessment not dissimilar how how Yoda and Kenobi put up an initial façade when they were discovered in exile (but more on that later). In any event, this approach would give him the means to offer personalized help to those who ended up on his doorstep. It honestly didn’t take Luke long to go from tossing his father’s lightsaber, to offering Rey the three lessons she needed to understand the force better. Although I believe Rey’s visit to Luke was far different than what others had probably been but (again) more on that later.

5. He was able leave anytime he wanted

The very clear image of Luke’s submerged X-Wing in the ocean painted a picture of cut ties, and a “no going back” stance. However, it wasn’t the first time that starfighter had been at the bottom of a water bed, and clearly it wasn’t the last. I’m inclined to believe that this is another part of Luke’s deliberate presentation of a hero who had lost all hope. But all speculation aside, there was nothing to physically stop Luke from leaving that island whenever he wanted. There’s nothing to say that he didn’t break form/character operate to find a way to undermine Snoke further.

6. He was actively protecting others close to him

There was a reason Luke getting Grogu at the end of Season 2 of The Mandalorian caused such a stir in Disney, and caused Kennedy to go for Faverau’s throat. All “who’s idea was who’s” arguments aside. At the end of the day it created two possible outcomes for this element of the Star Wars franchise: Either Grogu died in Kylo’s attack. Or there were survivors. Since killing the money making Baby Yoda isn’t necessarily on Disney’s to do list, it’s a reasonable bet that he survives the slaughter (unless he’s returned to Din’s side before Kylo goes ballistic, in which case he avoids it all together). But even if that does happen, this theory still holds a little water). Luke lying low, and operating in secret may have been the only way he was keeping himself, the galaxies citizens, and his few remaining students from getting hit with an orbital strike. 

7. He was never fully disconnected from the force.

Perhaps, somewhat disconnected, but it’s clear that Luke hasn’t cut himself off from the force as much as he, perhaps, wanted to admit. Luke is still able to effortlessly summon a weapon, keep control of the duel between himself and Rey, and gently lower his body to the ground when he loses his footing. Despite his stance on using/taking ownership of the force in TLJ, it seems as though Luke kept just enough around so that he could still fight. This theory is more optimistically minded than some of the others, but I still can’t help but think that Luke kept these reserves of power ready, because he already had to use them more than once during his supposed isolation.

8. Rey’s visit was different than the others who had come before.

“You went straight into the Dark. It offered you something you needed, and you didn’t even try to stop yourself.” 

“I've seen this raw strength only once before, in Ben Solo. It didn't scare me enough then. It does now.”

Other plot heroes/adventurers may have come, gone, or even convinced Luke to help them in secret. So assuming all, or even some, of the above is true, then that means Luke wasn’t just pushing to dismiss Rey, but also disillusion her. I think this is because Rey wasn’t there to get help with a specific mission, rescue, etc, but there to have Luke become the public symbol of hope again. And we’ve already listed the reasons why this couldn’t happen. On top of that, this push was done in a way that directly conflicted with all the “none theorized” reasons Luke had isolated himself. Luke knew he couldn’t accommodate this. He sensed the darkness in Rey. He sensed her connection to Kylo. In many ways his lessons also doubled as a means to properly evaluate Rey, and confirm his suspicions. In any event, all of this brought up an element of his isolation that no one else knew. He already had the, half truth, story as to what happened to his temple well rehearsed. But it was Rey’s visit that dragged out his greatest regret, which was his near attempt to take Ben’s life, due to both the mind bending fear Snoke had manipulated into palce, and the hypocritical, and self destructive Jedi philosophies that had been drilled in to his head. This was the final straw that made him want to destroy the Jedi texts. But it was also the push he needed to find inner peace, and think of the means to make one last public appearance, without endangering anyone.  

9. In no interpretation is Luke an attempt child killer 

This is more of a bonus point in nature. I think so many people were caught off guard by the narrative choice Luke undertook in this part of the film, that it painted the whole ordeal in a far more unfavorable light than it actually was. For starters: Ben was no child. He was 23 years old when he fell to the darkside. Luke was saw the images of planetary destruction, and the deaths of friends and family alike at the hands of an adult. But even at that, Luke’s ligthsaber had already lowered, and his face expressing that of shame and sadness, when Ben glances over, and decides to take up his lightsaber, and make the first strike. Luke doesn’t even ignite his lightsaber in response until after Ben swings it. The influence Snoke had over Ben, and the mental attack he lured Luke into suffering, to make this moment come to pass cannot be understated.   

 - This also means that Luke’s isolation lasted only 7 years. Not twenty, not even 10. Just 7. Which is less than half the time both Yoda and Obi Wan imposed on themselves.

10. He was following in the footsteps of his masters

I think Luke’s response to trauma is a little unfair in some ways. Obi Wan and Yoda witnessed genocide, and imposed exile on themselves for twenty years. Now, in film, we know that Obi Wan, while playing the part of a delusional hermit, worked to protect Luke as he grew up on Tatooine, and that Yoda, playing the part of a silly swamp kook, did...something...on Dagobah (?), waited for Luke to grow up so he could train him for a few weeks at most (?). 

Those are two pretty limited things, and yet they don’t catch near as much flack for “abandoning the galaxy to the Empire” as TLJ Luke does, after he also witnessed slaughter, and went into isolation for only 7 years. But, of course, we know Obi Wan did more during his time in the desert, and that Yoda did more during his time in the swamp. So why can’t Luke have also done more while on his island? Everything about the parallels here point to Luke, despite his own misgivings, applying what he learned from his master. All three Jedi isolated themselves because of their personal tragedies. All three greatly reduced their presence in the galaxy. But all three had no choice, and all three still did what they could despite their circumstances.    

11. Luke may have been overcome with grief. But he hadn’t truly changed

Now, I fully admit that this is a very optimistic way of looking at things. But some of these points also have more weight to them than others. I also cannot stress enough that even though I think some of what Luke was doing was an act, I also know it was equally proportional to the very real, emotional reasons, and struggles he faced. I also definitely do NOT think Kennedy/Johnson meant for any of these possible theories to have any validity to them. But with how they are presented, they also can’t be disproven. 

If Favreau doesn’t formally put the sequels in it’s own little pocket universe, then I really hope he takes the opportunity to make something like ^the above^ happen. It could easily be established in one to two episodes in a live action show. Lots of things could be done to make the sequels a more bearable set of movies to watch. And as much as I’m worried that hoping for this is simply too optimistic, at least now there is a justifiable interpretive take that has both in film evidence to support, and a lack of otherwise to refute.  

At the end of the day (and as usual) the important part here is to see that Luke hadn’t given up. Struggling, disillusioned, forced into a tough spot, willingly keeping himself scarce, etc. All bearable. But knowing he hadn’t given up is super important to the character and fanbase, so hopefully we get something that makes that cannon. In any facet really.  

AND IT WOULD GET MARK HAMILL BACK ON SET GODAMNIT! XD

*Reblogged with new gifs and information

[gffa]

Hi!  I went through a similar phase as several of you--I never really connected the dots between my own aro/ace qualities and my gravitating towards the Jedi culture until someone else pointed it out and then everything just sort of clicked together in my head in a way that made so much sense. And I think it can be really useful to view the Jedi through this lens of aro/ace culture, not because people are obligated to agree to this interpretation (they absolutely are not obligated to do so!) but because it provides a framework of reference for why not being drawn to romance and/or sex is not a foundational flaw in characters.  That there might even be an entire group of people who find that to be really satisfying and fulfilling--I mean, look at how many people gravitated to this discussion (or were already here) in just one day on one person’s blog on one social media platform.  It’s not hard at all for me to think, yeah, I’m looking at us building aro/ace culture of our own, it’d be easy for an in-universe group of people to do the same, and the lack of romance and/or sex wouldn’t be them suppressing their feelings or lacking something fundamental about the human condition, either. That’s part of why the Jedi mean a lot to me--there are other things as well, I greatly value their “face the shit within yourself, acknowledge that shit, and then let that shit go, because holding onto it is poison that will hurt you”, as someone who came to the same conclusions long before I was ever a Star Wars fan.  I love the worldbuilding, I love the psychic space wizards aspects, I love how goddamned extra they are about everything, etc. But a culture that not only doesn’t prioritize romance/sex, but actively values other things and finds meaning in those things?  That we see they have friendships and connections all over the place, that they find joy and meaning in teaching their students (and learning from their students, just as much as they teach them), that they find joy in helping others and protecting others, that they love through different ways, that they love the galaxy around them, they love their brothers and sisters in the Force, that they love their community and their culture?  That they just don’t seem to really want love and romance? Even those that do feel romantic feelings (setting Anakin aside, of course) still find the Jedi path to be a fulfilling one.  Obi-Wan may have had romantic feelings for Satine (which was apparently fine, it’s about his commitment and where he places it, I’m pretty sure that was the whole point of the Obi-Wan/Satine relationship, to be a narrative foil for Anakin/Padme, where Anakin does prioritize his feelings for Padme over his morals and judgement, which results in disaster of epic proportions) but he is a fully realized character without them.  He loves--we see that with Qui-Gon, Ahsoka, Luke, Anakin--that he cares deeply, that he’s a compassionate person, that he lives a life that he considers satisfying.  He becomes a Force Ghost and we can see him looking out over Endor, at the things that have finally been set back to rights, and he’s happy. Even within canon, the Jedi that feel restless and like something is wrong in this galaxy, they’re not restless because they want romance/sex, but because they want to do more as Jedi.  They want to help more people, they want to do more good in the galaxy, and do you know how much that means to me?  That even those who are dissatisfied (setting aside those that leave the Jedi Order because they want to have romantic relationships, which are treated warmly by the Order and by the people who left, like Tula’s grandmother) don’t have to be shoved back into the same box so many mainstream properties shove the characters into?  That it’s not about how, oh, they want traditional nuclear families, but instead that they want MORE of what the Jedi are--more love as shown through service to others, more love as shown through helping others. Do you know what a relief it is to have a group of people who find fulfillment in the same kind of things that I do?  Friendships and helping others and learning/teaching about the galaxy around them and self-reflection/understanding and accomplishments the like?  That these are treated, not just as valuable, not even just as valuable, but more valuable to these specific people?  Without demonizing that they’re totally cool with other people wanting romantic love?  DO YOU KNOW HOW MUCH THAT MEANS TO ME? DO YOU KNOW HOW MUCH IT MEANS THAT THE JEDI DON’T REALLY SEEM INTERESTED IN ROMANCE OR SEX AND INSTEAD FIND SATISFACTION IN OTHER THINGS?  THAT IT’S NOT ABOUT SUPPRESSING YOURSELF, BUT THAT PEOPLE SOMETIMES JUST REALLY DON’T CARE ABOUT THOSE THINGS.  SOMETIMES EVEN LARGE GROUPS OF PEOPLE. That the Jedi aren’t just “hey, this one Jedi can be read as aro/ace, that’s neat” but instead the Jedi said, “Hey, how about an ENTIRE CULTURE that vibes hard with aro/ace culture?”  That it’s the one mainstream culture that I can think of that really can be interpreted to say, “You’re not just an outlier, but YOU’RE THE NORM in this fictional society.”  Do you know what kind of value that has to me, as someone who only has the tiniest scraps of representation for this character or that character who maybe might be like me, but are rarely confirmed and are almost always The Different One?  Do you know what kind of value it has to me that it’s not just one or two of them, but that THE CULTURE ITSELF is where I would fit in?  That they built an entire society where nearly all of them seem to be Like Me? AN ENTIRE SOCIETY OF PEOPLE I WOULD FIT IN WITH? Which isn’t even getting into the worldbuilding specifics that are so much fun to play with--like, can you imagine what it would be like to have this psychic connection to this vast field of energy in the cosmos?  To be able to sense the feelings of others around you, to feel their presence even when they’re halfway across the galaxy, to just know what they’re feeling?  To be constantly surrounded by the lights of those souls that are gently nudging up against your own?  The warmth and peace of the Jedi Temple that isn’t just what you see/hear/touch, but also what permeates your very thoughts, the soothing balm on your soul that it would be? Can you imagine what it would be like to have this in your head all the time?

A familiar sense of warmth, of belonging, of finding himself part of an endless lattice of connections that held him and everything else, each fixed in its proper place.  A Force. Romance and sex can be wonderful.  But they are not the sole defining qualities of what it means to be sentient or what it means to be fulfilled.  The Force being described as an endless lattice of connections and warmth, that sounds incredibly wonderful and human to me, that sounds incredibly fulfilling and like everything I could possibly want. That is what the Jedi seek and have found.  That is the foundation of their culture.  That is the culmination of their lives. This is why their relationships are so wonderful and I’m so glad that the iconic Jedi relationships, whether we as fans turn towards shipping them or not, whether we joke about how much you can read into them or not, are ones that are all about other aspects that are just as epic and important. Obi-Wan’s most iconic relationships are with Luke, Anakin, Qui-Gon, Ahsoka.  They’re all incredible ones and it’s not to disparage his feelings for Satine (I love them as a pairing, too!), but that his character is defined more by familial and platonic relationships being just as galaxy-shaking as romantic ones might have been in another story?  That means a lot to me. Anakin is, of course, driven by his romantic relationship with Padme, but think about how important his relationships with Obi-Wan and Ahsoka are, ones that don’t have to be seen through the lens of romance.  That the ultimate climax of the prequels was Anakin’s fight with Obi-Wan, a familial connection.  That the ultimate climax of TCW was about Ahsoka’s relationship with Anakin, another familial/platonic connection. Ahsoka is a rising star in the SW franchise and her most iconic connections are with Anakin and Rex, both of which do not have to be interpreted through the romantic/sexual lens, that are complete just as they are presented.  That even when she can no longer be a Jedi, even when that possibility is stolen from her, she still doesn’t need to be defined through romance or sex. Yoda has many important, iconic relationships and is such a central character to the mythos and mythology of Star Wars.  His relationship with Luke is one of the most foundational of the OT, his relationship with Obi-Wan is important when you dig further into the supplementary material, his relationship with Anakin creates some of the most memorable scenes of the prequels.  All without ever having him desire a girlfriend.  Hell, the movies had Yaddle right there and you know what?  She wasn’t Yoda’s girlfriend, he wasn’t her boyfriend, that’s not what they were to each other, because they didn’t really seem to have any desire for that. THAT’S ONE OF THE REASONS I LOVE THE JEDI.  They show compassion and care and love all over the place, but they do it through George Lucas’ views on how people should strive to be, and they do it not through romance, but through friendship and helping others and seeking greater understanding of self-knowledge and artistry through the Force, and none of that should ever make them lesser, just as aromantic and asexual people seeking those same things does not make them lesser. We are people who love just as much as anyone else, we have fulfilling and wonderful lives, I don’t know any aro/ace person who would really even want to change themselves, we find ourselves to be perfectly fantastic the way we are.  I don’t feel some part of me is missing, I don’t feel I’m less interesting because I’m aro/ace, I love being the way I am.  I love how much my friends and family mean to me, I love how much joy I get out of caring for animals or helping other people or even simply yelling about Star Wars with them.  My connections to people are just as wonderful as anyone else’s, regardless of how they’re not in the romantic/sexual category. And, so too are the Jedi.

[kateeorg]

How The Mandalorian Season 2 Expertly Navigated Two of Its Biggest Shakeups

Spoilers up to the finale of Season 2 below cut.

When looking at Season 2, there are two big things the creators knew going in fans would have difficulty swallowing:

1. The reveal of The Child’s name, since Baby Yoda had become such a prominent fan nickname in spite of the team’s best efforts.

2. The Child and Din’s separation.

Now, while there’s certainly been a... mixed reaction to both these points (particularly the latter), I do think the team generally did a good job delivering on these plot points in the best way possible, given the circumstances.

Let’s start with Grogu

Grogu vs Baby Yoda

Let’s be honest- no name was going to come close to the fan nicknames in terms of popularity. But unlike in Doctor Who, our little jedi couldn’t just be called “The Child” forever. 

But there could have been a significantly bigger amount of backlash and/or mockery than we ended up getting, and I think that’s for two reasons:

The way the name was designed

The way the name is introduced

The Child’s reaction to the name

“Grogu” bares some similarities to “Yoda” - the two syllables, that “oh” sound at the beginning. But they’re different enough to not be derivative. (It also sounds a little like “googoo,” which... let’s be honest, is how most fans react to the Child in general, so it works. It’s cute without being obviously cute)

Second, they have fan-favorite character Ahsoka Tano reveal the name, attached to a bittersweet backstory connecting to the prequel trilogy era. 

As for the reaction, I thought this was brilliant. By having Grogu react to his name, particularly when Din repeats it in the next episode during the cockpit scene, the creators basically banked on The Child’s cuteness to sell the name. Basically, the reasoning is “Hey, if The Child likes the name, I like it too!” And it worked! I couldn’t help but draw comparisons to my dog, who perks up at his name. 

That plus the backstory connected to the name help to flesh out this strange, silent character.

It will never surpass “Baby Yoda,” and I don’t think it was necessarily meant to. But the true name has at least been accepted alongside it.

The Separation

This one is still very contentious, I must admit. But compared to the level of vitriol we’ve seen from pissed off Star Wars fans in the past? This could have been so much worse.

(SO much worse.)

So given that the creators probably knew this was going to be a hard sell for fans of the show’s central relationship, how did they soften the blow?

They preface it with arguably one of the most badass moments in Star Wars history that had fans screaming and crying over the awesomeness.

They use two of the franchise’s oldest, dearest, and most trustworthy characters to bridge the gap.

They establish that this is a mutual choice by both parties (unlike the encounter with Ahsoka, where Grogu wasn’t ready to let go of Din yet).

They built up why Grogu needs to do this.

Let me just expand on those last two points quick:

These last few episodes, from Grogu’s kidnapping to the end, really hammer home how much danger this kid is in while he’s still untrained and traveling with Din. It’s easy to forget in the euphoria and sadness of the moment, but if it hadn’t been for Luke’s appearance, the rescue mission would have failed and Moff Gideon would have won. Not to mention, Din has already nearly lost the kid more than a few times, and wasn’t able to save him himself.

We also know the whole point of the trip to Tython was to give Grogu the choice of whether to stay or go, as well as who to train with. Where Ahsoka was sort of forced on him, though they did connect at first, Grogu was excited to see Luke through the monitor. And after seeing what a fully-trained Jedi can do against the remnants of the Empire, how could Din pass up that chance to make sure Grogu could protect himself?

Yes, the timing of it kind of sucks. But this was Din’s mission all along. And the fact that Grogu went willingly, asking for permission, is a big change from his attitude with Ahsoka. 

Perhaps he senses that Luke has less baggage than Ahsoka. That Luke better understands rather than fears what happened with Vader (at least at this stage of the game) and will not treat attachment or emotion as bad. Perhaps, after being trapped by the Empire and watching his father almost get killed by Moffat Gideon, Grogu himself realizes why he needs to train. 

Of course most people wanted them to find a way to stay together. But in this narrative of father- and son-figures that Stars Wars has always been, since the original film, separation is a part of the cycle. But with Din still alive, I do have hope that, unlike in many of the franchise’s other examples, it won’t be for forever.

[kyluxtrashpit]

TROS Review

Okay here is my extremely long (almost 4k words >.>) review of tros. And that’s without the 2k meta on redemption arcs I also have filed away lmao. First off: I am not leaving the kylux fandom. It’s not a good enough movie to warrant that. Second: I might make a post of things I wished we’d gotten later, but this is already WAY too long lmao. Warnings for spoilers, opinions, and general negativity

EXPLICIT RISE OF SKYWALKER SPOILERS BEYOND THIS POINT

So. I have watched the thing. I went in knowing the spoilers and oh boy, am I glad I did. Still, overall this movie was… not great lmao. It’s messy and the pacing is off and there are some very weird and straight up Bad moments, but I’m not actually upset about it anymore. It’s more like ‘there’s a lot to unpack here’ except we’re not going to unpack it or even throw away the whole thing, it’s just gonna become that one box that’s still packed and untouched from when you moved 3 years ago. It’s there, but you rarely think about it beyond the occasional ‘maybe I should finally unpack that? Nah, too much effort’

I see a lot of people writing fix it fic and that’s totally valid but tbh… I don’t think it’s worth the effort for me. I think I’m just going to pretend it never happened and write my kylux the way I always have. Maybe I’ll do something with tros at some point, maybe some mean!Hux + redeemed!Ben because I’m awful lmao but for now, it hasn’t changed my plans at all. Which is actually a good thing tbh

Anyway. I’ll start with the good simply because there’s less of it lmao. Best thing about the movie? Everyone in it is looking like a fucking snack. It’s great. These people have always been hot, but this movie really nailed that. Also the trio stuff was fun and felt genuine. I LOVED the hints that Finn is Force sensitive, and I liked him in this movie even though I wish he got more story/time. I enjoyed Rey at the beginning, but her actions and plotline made less and less sense as the movie went on. Kylo was fun; I had gotten worried after that interview that said he’s calm now but he wasn’t lmao, like at all, so that was good. Also I didn’t like how Hux died but I’m endlessly grateful Kylo wasn’t the one to kill him. That might’ve actually ruined the ship for me

The visuals were excellent (save that strobing near the beginning; I’m not epileptic, but I had to close my eyes because it was too much). Some of the jokes hit will, as did some of the emotional bits (Chewie’s “death” was very well-executed and Rey’s scream broke my heart). Weirdly enough, C-3PO is kind of the heart of the movie, which I did not expect at all. Lando’s appearances were too brief but good. I also loved D-O a lot and he’s very cute. I liked seeing a bunch of new planets and environments, however briefly. The acting was also really great throughout on most accounts. I really enjoyed 2 of the Hux scenes (when he’s sitting in that board meeting making a face like he’s mentally eviscerating everyone in the room and when he gets so excited to finally get to blow something up and then Kylo shuts him up with the Force BUT WITHOUT HARMING HIM!!!)

That’s kind of it tbh. The movie overall is really messy. I’ve seen people say it feels like a fever dream and it really does. I’ve seen descriptions of people dreaming the plot of tros and they’re less weird. The pacing in the first chunk is way too fast and there’s way too much to take in. Then things get weird in the middle. Then, well, that ending. It feels like it’s trying too hard to be liked. It’s ‘joke’, ‘reference to past movie’, ‘joke’, ‘reference to past movie’, ‘mention of hope without showing it’, etc. etc. on and on throughout it. Some of those are fun, but it got tiring very quickly. And it made it impossible for me to suspend disbelief long enough to actually get into it

I also saw a lot of reviews saying if you didn’t like tlj, you would like this one. That was not correct. I disliked this for many of same reasons I disliked tlj, but it also managed to hold tfa’s weaknesses as well. Honestly, tros feels like the worst aspects of tlj mixed with the worst aspects of tfa, mixed with way too much nostalgia and then blended up with a good heaping of mania and desperation to keep it going. It tried so hard, wanted to be liked so badly, and you can feel that watching it. It doesn’t feel genuine

It also feels like every single movie in the ST was actually from a different trilogy. None of the 3 connect to each other. You can’t say tros is a successor to tlj or tfa; it’s totally on a different path, which I’m honestly not sure how they managed that. As much as I felt tlj wasn’t a true continuation of tfa, tros feels like its own trilogy mashed into one movie. There wasn’t one consistent plot or character thread to follow between all 3 movies

I think bringing palpatine back was the first fundamental mistake. It didn’t fit. And after creating Kylo and Snoke to be very specifically Not Sith, why bring the Sith back all of a sudden? Palpatine has had his day and he didn’t need this. No one did. Much as he was creepy as hell and that was well done, it didn’t feel right to have him there. Also, I really don’t like the implication he procreated at any point skdfjskldjk

As for Rey… I know I’m in the minority here, but I never found here to be a good narrative foil for Kylo. The connection between the two doesn’t really interest me at all (and this was one of the reasons I didn’t like tlj). It worked better if they were related, which was the biggest reason I was a proponent of Rey Skywalker, but that didn’t happen. The commonalities they have are just: 1) can use the Force, 2) have been lonely. The contrasts are: 1) light vs dark (sort of; this is less explicit in tfa and I miss that greyer view of the Force) and 2) had a family vs didn’t. And that’s pretty much it. In order for 2 characters to contrast and hit the ‘complimentary opposites’ sweet spot, you need much, much more than that. Finn has and always will be a better foil for Kylo and it’s a damn shame they abandoned that in tlj and even more so in tros. I have more thoughts on her that I’ll get to later too

I did like Rey in the beginning, but the longer it went on, the less I could rationalize her actions. Why is she doing that? Why is she trying to ditch her friends all the time? Why does she heal the cave snake? Why does she stab Kylo when he’s just become a non-combatant? Why does she heal him after? Why is she trying to reach out to the spirits of past jedi? Why did she Do That after she wakes up in the end? Why did she then seem to not even care that Kylo died right after? None of this is explained. Show, don’t tell, is great, but you can’t just make massive leaps like that. I didn’t get it. None of this felt like the character I’ve gotten to know over the last few years, nor did it feel consistent within the movie itself

That said, I want to discount one complaint I’ve seen: I got no impression she’s exiling herself on Tatooine at the end. It’s very clear she’s just doing a quick funeral ritual for Luke and Leia. The Falcon is still there, ready for when she’s done. I don’t get where the ‘she’s all alone in the desert again forever and ever’ comes from because it’s clear she’s not. It’s just a private ceremony (plus obvious fanservice). That’s it

For Finn: I liked that his character got to be a lot cooler here. I’m sad that he didn’t get half the attention and plot he deserved, but at least he wasn’t treated as a joke and a coward. My tlj complaint for Finn was that he went through the exact same arc he did in tfa over again; here, he doesn’t. He’s clearly grown into himself. That I liked. But damn, he was supposed to be a main character and he really got sidelined hard. It’s also very clear finnrey was planned at some point but didn’t end up in the final cut. The tease with that felt cruel tbh. He deserved to get to tell Rey he loved her on screen

And Poe: Poe was okay in this one. He felt to me like a different character in tfa and tlj, but this one managed to mesh the two characterizations well. He’s a bit of a hothead who doesn’t think (tlj), but he also really cares about people and is trying his best to lead (tfa). That was very successfully done. However. Poe is the one character with the most backstory. He’s got novels, comics, all of it. Where in the fuck is this history of being a spice runner in all that??? Sketchy as hell to make your one Latino character being a drug runner but you know. It also felt like a HUGE retcon of the one character that actually has fully revealed backstory. Also his thing with Zori was just weird and forced and exhaustingly heterosexual. Completely pointless tbh

As I was rereading this, I realized I forgot Rose but really, that’s because she does pretty much nothing. She has very few lines, never comes along. It’s like they forgot she was there. Or just didn’t care. It was really sad and a huge disrespect to everything KMT has gone through. Both her and her character deserved more

For Hux: I liked the 2 scenes I mentioned above, but other than that I was disappointed. I said this on twitter already, but the biggest crime they committed was getting rid of his fanaticism. Tlj may have turned him into a joke, but at least he was still a zealot. Here, it’s clear he gave up his last fuck like a year ago. It’s 9 am and he’s had 6 glasses of wine because he’s lost the will to live and it’s all pointless. Might as well fuck around and give the Resistance info that might lead to the end of everything he’s worked for his entire life because nothing matters and at least Kylo will lose. That’s dumb and violently ooc. I get him being a traitor to Kylo, I am DOWN for that, but not to the FO. He cares about the FO. He is fanatically devoted to the FO. That was ridiculous and wildly out of character. Also the FO is just gone in favour of Palpatine’s fleet as soon as Hux dies? What happened to them? Are they still out there? Who even knows? WHAT A FUCKING WASTE

Also Pryde? Fuck that guy and fuck JJ/LF/Disney for thinking it’s okay to have an old imperial kill Hux. Especially since the visual dictionary today confirmed Pryde knew Brendol and our Hux had known him for years. The possible implications are gross as fuck. If anyone was going to kill Hux one on one, it should have been Finn (with a wonderful stormtrooper rebellion arc involved) for the sake of both characters. I’m personally going to choose to believe Hux was wearing a blaster proof vest (thank you, Delilah Dawson, for putting those into Black Spire as canon) and faked his death. He’s living in blissful exile with Millie now or rebuilding the actual FO and ready to take over as the Emperor he deserves to be

Oh and Leia’s scenes did feel weird. I appreciate them trying to incorporate her, but it didn’t quite work. I feel like having her be offscreen yet present would’ve worked better than most of what they used. Some worked better than others though. I also have some Thoughts about her death but I’m about to get into the second half of the movie stuff and I’ll cover that there

Now Kylo. My darling, sweet, disaster boy. So. Okay. I knew no matter what happened his end would be controversial. And I have a lot of feelings on redemption arcs that can be distilled into one thing: if they’re written well, I like them, no matter how much bad the character has done; however, they are almost never written well enough. One of the first things I said coming out of tfa back in 2015 is ‘that’s going to be a disappointing redemption arc in a few years’. It was never about what ending I wanted (I actually favour something more grey than simply ‘oh he’s good now’ or ‘dies evil’, but that was way too ambitious for them to attempt so I never bothered to hope for it), because I knew it was coming. So this didn’t really bother me beyond the fact that it was too sudden. I do blame that partially on tlj, because it took Kylo from conflicted and torn apart to ‘yeah, I’m in charge now’, but I still think this was not the way to do it. Anyway. I have a 2k word rant somewhere about redemption arcs and when they work and when they don’t that I never posted and this is the much, much shorter version of that

Also. Okay. One more thing on this. So I usually don’t like redemption arcs because they’re written badly, but my least favourite redemption arcs are those that end in death. The only one I can think of that actually worked was Vader’s, but it doesn’t work as well with Kylo. Why? Because redemption is about making amends, not being punished. It’s about choosing to stop doing bad shit and instead to do good things to make up for what you’ve done. In self-sacrifice, not only does it send the message that the only path to redemption is death, but also it means you do literally one thing and then die. That’s it. One good deed, die, you’re done. That’s too fucking easy. True redemption is waking up every single day, for the rest of your life, and continuing to choose to do good. You know that evil is easier, feels better; you’ve done it. But you’re making the choice to keep doing good and to make amends instead. And you do that for years. Decades, even. That is SO MUCH harder to do than just one good thing and then immediately dying without showing if that change is lasting or not. That is how redemption is achieved: in making that choice not once, but again and again and again. So yeah. I didn’t like that. Death redemptions aren’t convincing to me because one choice is easy; consistently making that choice over the rest of your life is much, much harder

End of point: if they were going to redeem Kylo, he needed to live and work to make up for his past mistakes in order to make it impactful. It’s a damn shame he didn’t

Also: having Leia die for the sake of a man, son or not? FUCK THAT. And, even worse, if we follow the movie’s logic: Leia died trying to reach and save her son. Which lead to… him dying anyway?! Which means Leia’s death is meaningless and she died for literally nothing. Fuck that. FUCK THAT. What the fuck. That’s bullshit

Again on the redemption: Kylo just… kills his good friends the KOR without a shred of hesitation? Also the KOR literally never speak? And Kylo says literally one word (‘ow’) after the redemption? I admit, it was fun watching him fight and also watching him get hurt. If I ignore the context of it, watching him crawl out of the pit, scrabbling on the ground, so hurt he can’t even stand up? Fuck. That was good shit tbh. Also those big, desperate puppy eyes. They’re even worse with him as Ben instead of Kylo. Bravo to Adam for playing such a convincing sad boy. I hate that his scar got healed though; I liked it

Now. The whole ending and the plot stuff. Rey being a palpatine is… okay. Fine. I don’t like it but whatever. Seems like an unnecessary excuse to bring him back. Also Luke and Leia knowing? How? Luke knew Rey for literally 1 day. And how would Leia know? And why not tell Rey, who was so desperate for answers to her past when they thought Palpatine was dead? It makes no sense. It’s just very unnecessary. Not to mention the line “you’re a palpatine” is not a thing any real human being would ever say, jfc that was clumsy and unrealistic dialogue. I don’t mind Rey going a bit dark for some time, but this was not the way to do it. Also I was really hoping for a resolution beyond ‘dark siders dead, light sider alive’ because the dichotomous nature of the Force MAKES NO SENSE. Balance is needed. Leaving the only Force user alive a light sider means something dark will come again for the sake of it – Rey should’ve gone grey and tbh tfa made me hope this trilogy would end with all surviving Force users grey. So that was disappointing

Now. The kiss. Straight up: I do not ship it. I don’t mind if other people do, but I do get touchy when they go out of their way to prove there’s nothing inherently problematic about it. I ship kylux; it’s problematic as hell. That’s a good part of why I like it. So I’m fine with r*ylo shippers as long as they do the same. Problem is: most don’t and go around insisting it’s actually the highest romance possible while leaning on incredibly misogynistic and racist tropes to prop up that argument rather than accept their ship has some questionable parts to it (like kyluxers do). It’s more a problem with the fandom for me than it is the ship in theory. Still, I don’t like it and that’s what matters for this

The fact of the matter is it felt extremely sudden and out of place. The entire first half of the movie is Kylo being an aggressive, creepy asshole to Rey. I can theoretically entertain the idea of Kylo having feelings for her (though I don’t), but I cannot see the other way around, not when Rey has so many kind, wonderful people around her. Which is why this feels so weird. There was not enough build to it. I saw a cam clip off reddit before I went in, so I had accepted it was happening but I expected a lot more lead up to it to make it not seem so sudden. None of that was there. There was no build up or reaching of understanding so it reads exactly like those versions of it I dislike: there is nothing wrong with a man berating you and insulting you and attacking you and you should love him for it. That is not enemies to lovers. That’s just abusive bullshit

And then the death. Both of them. Rey dies from… what exactly? It’s never shown at all. And same with Kylo. The leaks said it was Force exhaustion, which a) why? And b) that’s not clear in the damn movie. You need to explain things!!!! And also that means Leia, Luke, Kylo, and Rey all died (even if one didn’t stick) from using the Force too hard. Meanwhile Darth Maul survives getting cut in half and Palpatine survives falling down a shaft in a space station that explodes 2 minutes later (and, you know, all the wacky Force shit he did in this movie too). The fuck? It’s dumb. I hate it

Also the dyad thing was weird. I know the early leaks had it more explained, then the leaks said they cut it, but now it looks like they left in 3 lines of dialogue with it and cut the rest. Again, explanations people! This is not a thing in previous canon! Maybe in the EU, but that’s not canon anymore! The fuck!!!! The idea is dumb and forced to begin with, but the execution made it worse

And now for the final, largest criticism I have. A confession: I am not a star wars fan by nature. I’ve always liked them, but I preferred other sci-fi more. I’m more of an invasive species who forcibly carved my way into this fandom ecological niche because I really loved Kylo lmao. But if there is one thing star wars is defined by, I don’t think it’s love or family or any of those common themes people say. It’s hope. That’s the thing star wars does well. Even when things are darkest, it keeps the hope alive and it makes you feel that. Good will triumph. There is reason to believe in heroes, even when they stumble

This movie is not hopeful. Rogue One, a masterful tragedy, still manages a message of hope despite every single lead character dying. This one doesn’t. And tbh, I think tlj missed on this a bit too (a lot of talk about having hope, not a lot of showing us reasons to be hopeful), but it was still there. Tros does not feel hopeful. The Skywalkers are all dead. Rey has decided to download the legacy (why? No idea! The whole message was ‘don’t be afraid of who you are’ and she just then decided to become someone else? Makes no sense!!!). Anakin’s sacrifice meant nothing because Palpatine came back (and it is CRIMINAL we never got an Anakin and Kylo scene). Han and Leia’s and even Luke’s (a bit) deaths meant nothing because yeah, Kylo turned back in the end, but then he died anyway. They all gave their lives to save him and it was all for nothing. He’s still dead. Palpatine is gone and so is his fleet, but what about the FO fleet? Are they still out there? Are there brainwashed stormtroopers still trapped in its clutches (also, they were so close with Jannah and Finn to adding depth here, but nope, the stormtroopers are still cannon fodder in every fight scene even though they’re literally slaves!!!!)? Who knows!

This movie only feels conclusive in that so many characters we love are dead. That’s it. There’s more questions than answers and so much left unresolved. There’s no sense of hope in it. There’s barely a sense of victory. It’s not satisfying. Even the celebration at the end feels weird and like it’s trying to force you to be happy. The jedistormpilot hug was good, but the lesbian kiss was such a cheap attempt at trying to appease people calling for representation. The moment with Lando and Jannah at the end was probably the most hopeful part of the movie and neither of them are lead characters

Idk. I know this is pretty negative. But I didn’t really enjoy this movie. Some parts were fun, or funny, or exciting, or emotional. But overall? No. This was not a satisfying conclusion for any of these characters, either the new or the old. They missed. Hard. Not one character was truly done justice. And it’s disappointing. But it’s over now and I have no intentions of letting it dictate my fandom activities. I’m just going to pretend it didn’t happen and call it a day