#headmate structure

[amorality-flagz]

Schrödibased refers to a system and/or headmate based around schrödinger's cat, either metaphorically and/or literally. But this is not inherently an origin. Schrödinger's cat theory could affect system functions, headspace, headmates, their roles, or other parts of how the system functions. In simple terms, it is a base that could be one thing and another thing at the same time until observed otherwise.

[quoigenicfromhell]

Can we have the conversation about the culture within certain system communities about how it's accepted that a system host is basically godking/life manager for their other headmates

[starlit-paws]

wasn’t gonna but important for others to see i think

[multiplicity-positivity]

hello there... It has taken a long while to find myself in the right position to send this ask, apologies if it's very disorganized. i feel I have a very complicated relationship with plurality, being apart of a very small (~3) system. we also are all consistently co conscious and it's as though there's 3 people seeing out one set of eyes. there's no fronting or switching, etc. we just work homogenously as a multi-conscious being. two of us are human and one of us (me) is an animal. i guess an actual question I have is if there's a word for this, and if you have any advice for finding independence within the same body? feeling like 3 people at once with seemingly transient levels of "identity disturbances" is complicated. I wish we were more separate as people. hope this makes sense

all hyperlinks in this post head to relevant pluralpedia entries.

hey, so we can’t say for sure what your system is experiencing, but you all might be somewhere between monoconscious (where all headmates share a consciousness and awareness) and polyconscious (where headmates experience different consciousness and awareness). pluralpedia has a few different entries for different forms of consciousness, so if neither of these feel right, you can check out their list here.

consciousness structures aside, your system might be median or perhaps mediple, if you exist somewhere between multiple and singlet. y’all also may benefit from the term specutien, which refers to a system with a frontstuck host. we’re not sure if there’s a term for a system where every member is always fronting together, but there really should be. if not maybe you all could call yourselves collectively specutien?

okay, terminology aside, there may be things your system can do to gain independence, or maybe not. it’s all going to depend on how your system functions. sometimes systems are able to change ways in which they function, but this isn’t always the case. a few of us wrote a post yesterday on finding identity and individuality as headmate, so we’ll go ahead and include it here in case it might help y’all.

not sure how useful that post ^ will be since it’s more about finding individuality rather than independence… but maybe something there will be helpful. often times independence and agency can be gained through finding identity.

good luck to you all with figuring this out. our apologies if this response isn’t particularly beneficial, but we’re wishing y’all the very best going forward.

[nexus-nebulae]

oh my god. that one "oc" we wrote who had DID that we came up with before our syscovery. that was not an oc. oh my god cody and blake why did you take five years to make yourselves known to us-

[thegodoflightning]

Hey. Why do I have to sort out all the SimplyPlural stuff. I don't know how this shit works, besties 😭

[girldraki]

being plural is so funny. we have no idea at which point we can officially declare ourselves as a collective entity furries

[onemashedbraincell]

since apparently it’s Valentine’s Day, system appreciation post!

You’re valid if you’re endogenic

2. You’re valid if you’re traumagenic.

3. You’re valid if you’re mixed origins. 4. You’re valid if you don’t know or care about your system origins. 5. You’re valid if you are a median. 6. You’re valid if you are polyfragmented. 7. You’re valid if you’re mostly blurry. 8. You’re valid if your parts are clear and distinct. 9. You’re valid if you don’t experience co-consciousness. 10. You’re valid if you experience co-consciousness. 11. You’re valid if you experience co-fronting. 12. You’re valid if you don’t experience co-fronting. 13. You’re valid if you hate being a system. 14. You’re valid if you love being a system. 15. You’re valid if you don’t know how to feel about being a system. 16. You’re valid if your trauma doesn’t fit the ‘typical norm’ or expected experience. 17. You’re valid if you have factives/fictives/fucktives/songtives, etc 18. You’re valid if you have hundreds of thousands of headmates. 19. You’re valid if you only have a few headmates. 20. You’re valid if you are looking for final fusion. 21. You’re valid if you are looking for functional multiplicity. 22. You’re valid if you’re a tulpa. 23. You’re valid if you’re an introject who doesn’t want to be like their source. 24. You’re valid if you’re an Introject who does want to be like their source. 25. You’re valid if your system isn’t very active. 26. You’re valid if your system is extremely active. 27. You’re valid if you have a core. 28. You’re valid if you don’t have a core. 29. You’re valid if you have a host. 30. You’re valid if you’re hostless. 31. You’re valid if you have a headspace. 32. You’re valid if you don’t have a headspace. 33. You’re valid if you have a relationship with another headmate. 34. You’re valid if you’re a bodily minor OR adult system. 35. You’re valid if you don’t like some/all of your headmates. 36. You’re valid if you love all your headmates. 37. You’re valid if you’re a disordered system. 38. You’re valid if you’re a non-disordered system. 39. You’re valid if you’re introject heavy. 40. You’re valid if you’re brain-made heavy. 41. You’re valid if you’re non-human heavy. 42. You’re valid if you’re covert. 43. You’re valid if you’re overt. 45. You’re valid if you’re an age regressor. 46. You’re valid if you’re a pet regressor. 47. You’re valid if you don’t identify with the body. 48. You’re valid if you do identify with the body. 49. You’re valid for feeling angry about those who hurt you. 50. You’re valid if you have a lot of control over your system. 51. You’re valid if you experience little to no control over your system. 52. You’re valid if your system structure is complex. 54. You’re valid if your system structure is simple. 55. You’re valid if you’re mono conscious. 56. You’re valid if you’re biconscious or triconscious. 57. You’re valid no matter your conscious term. 58. You’re valid if you want labels about your experiences. 59. You’re valid if you don’t want labels for your experiences. 60. You’re valid for having source trauma. 61. You’re valid for not having source trauma. 62. You’re valid for having alters split due to other alters either negatively or positively. 63. You are valid if you split for no reason, or a reason you can’t identify. 64. You’re valid for being different from the norm. 65. It’s okay to be wrong about your identity. Even if you aren’t plural, it’s what fit you at the time. Identity shifts. We’re always learning about ourselves. You made a mistake is all, you’re not a monster for making a mistake.

I could go on and on for days, but I think you get the jist.

YOU ARE VALID. NO MATTER YOUR EXPERIENCE. YOUR EXPERIENCES ARE REAL. YOU DONT NEED TO FIT INTO THE CONFINED BOX OF REQUIREMENTS TO BE CONSIDERED PLURAL.

Happy Valentines Days, everyone. <3

[possessed-pack]

Anti-endos commenting on my post about loving systemmates with "oh of course youre endo safe makes sense"--when will these people stop perpetuating the ableist idea that people with disorders have to live in misery 24/7? When will these people stop acting like a system is the absolute worst thing you can be and only results in eternal suffering? How do their headmates feel knowing these opinions? How do they use their unwillingness to treat any aspect of their disorder as positive to the point where it's a weapon they use to call anyone who has any positive experience about it a faker? How do they not see that this is the same sentiments that ableists use against all disabled people to devalue them or say we should be put out of our misery? How is this healing? How does this help?

Like yeah, you expect a hate group to act with hate but I genuinely worry for some of these people because it just seems like they're not even led to believe they have the ability to heal in any capacity. The way anti-endos are structured leads anyone who sides with them to go down this path of "systems are never fun or happy and life is suffering and pain and will be forever". It really isn't. There can be suffering, there can be pain, but joy and safety are just as real and just as achieveable. We're a DID system, shit sucks sometimes but we're healing--everyone can heal. Everyone can find silver linings. You need to know that you're not doomed. It can take time, but loving your system, the people in it, or the fact that it might have helped you to survive the worst days of your life, is NOT a sign that you are fake. Healing is not a sign of faking.

[syllvarin]

Non-traumagenic plurality: How could it be possible?

First off, let's start with what some anti-endo folk mean versus what they don't mean with traumagenic plurality

They mean systems caused by/as a response to trauma and traumatic events, and those who are still affetced by them, aka systems who are disordered, DID/OSDD/UDD.

What they don't mean is systems who have trauma in their origin along with other causes. They do not believe a system can very well be traumagenic but function smoothlessly due to recovering, or have multiple origins.

Note: We are a diagnosed DID system with mixed (trauma/ramcoa/neuro/para) origins. Yes, we know what we are talking about. No, that doesn't mean we can't do mistakes, but we will try our best to be as accurate as possible. We will include scientific articles, DSM-5 DID checklist, and many more in this post.

How can that be possible?

1st: Brains are quite complicated. Research on brain functions is far from being complete, it is a long road that we are still at the very beginning of. We still don't know how brain exactly works let alone how it can form seperate conscious identities and work them together. We do know headmates exist based on brain MRI's ( link here ) That proves us that systems indeed, exist.

2nd point i want to make is that science is not done in a linear fashion. We are studying to be neuroscientists ourselves and the very core of what makes science doable is MONEY. Yes, in this capitalist system even the most seemingly basic research requires funding, money, and a goal that can be monetized to get done. Reseaches on female autonomy, rare disorders and "demonized" disorders such as DID is therefore not often as it is not easily capitalized and funded.

Therefore we do not have enough research to prove or disprove that the only way of becoming a system is through childhood.

And that brings me to my 3rd point, where we will take a look at what DSM-5 (The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fifth Edition) says about diagnostic crietria of DID. We will see how it is a dissocative disorder, not a trauma disorder.

Found under dissociative disorders (not trauma disorders!), checklist for DID is as follows:

See how none of those checklist include trauma as checklist? Yes DID is commonly caused by trauma but not always. Yes it commonly is created during childhood but not always. Those arent in diagnostic criteria.

Definitive feature is not trauma, it is distinct personality states or experience of possession.

DID is associated with traumatic events, does not mean it requires it.

DID can manifest at almost any age (DSM-5 is saying that, folks)

What's more is OSDD doesnt even have a definitive checklist like DID. it is found under differential diagnosis, with other disorders. PDID (partial DID where one part is frontstuck a majority of the time) is also up to psychiatrist's evaluation rather than a concrete checklist.

4th point is : What about Structural Dissociaton Theory?

This theory is as it goes: The theory of Structural Dissociation works off of the assumption that everyone is born with different ego states that later merge in life. Those different ego states operate for different actions in life, that later integrate into one person during ages of 4-6. Trauma disrupts that integration and causes ANP (apparently normal parts) and EP (Emotional parts). EP's are stuck in the trauma while ANP's are not.

source: The Haunted Self: Structural Dissociation and the Treatment of Chronic Traumatization" by Onno van der Hart, Ellert Nijenhuis, and Kathy Steele. 

Yes, theory. Theories are not concrete. They can be disapproved, they can change, they may not fit every experience. Structural dissociation only explains how DID can manifest at childhood, but we already know by now that DID can manifest at almost any age.

So I personally think basing everything on a theory about how DID might've been caused (which doesn't even perfectly explain every possible way) is not as fault-proof as one might think it is.

Point 5: experiences of "multiple identities" exist for so long into history (people who are possessed, talk to themselves, act weird at times, are very different at times, etc), way before any DID/OSDD terms were created. And actually, how can we know how many people in history have had this experience when the very society we are in is very scared of them? It is fair to say only the disruptive cases must've been noticed, and majority of them probably were either deemed as crazy or exorcised as they believed those people were possessed by spirits. Just because your experience does not fit with others and just because science hasnt done anything to back them up, doesn't mean people's lived experiences are false. Why would so many people tell that they are a system when they are not? We are not living in a place where being a system is happy or fun, we are not in a society where its profitable or anything. It literally gives a person zero + points for being plural if they arent. It would be a nonstop roleplay they have to keep up throughout every aspect of their life; and at that point, it must be either impossible or that person is already plural and not roleplaying when no one is looking at them.

Creating headmates is on the same basket. A person with DID can create headmates in blink of an eye (we know from oursleves) sometimes splitting threshold is so low you may split off multiple people at once. You cannot know what is going in a person's mind, and what mechanisms work for creating a headmate. If they claim they did, it is very much no chance they are faking being different people 24/7. It *is* a real chance that they actually did develop a headmate. If you do not believe them; ask them about their experiences. I am %100 positive that if you actually listen to them, you will see those people are only trying to live their life.

Also, if you think healthy systems cannot exist and only way to be a system is through dissociation and dysfunction; then why would DID systems try to heal anyway? Wouldn't that just be sanist and ableist to expect all of them to turn into singlets because healthy multiplicity isnt a thing?But no, it is a thing, and healthy multiplicity and recovery is possible for systems. DID and other disordered forms of plurality do indeed exist, and they are indeed, treatabe in multiple ways according to what a person feels comfortable with. That is also a system's right to heal however they please. They don't owe anyone their right to stay as plural or become a singlet.

6th point I want to make is about: Why do we even care?

If a person says they have multiple people in their head, why do we care and tell them they are faking? They are not claiming to have a diagnosis, even if they did; if their situation is causing a distress to them, then they ARE diagnosable and that therefore is none of our business, again.

Last point I want to make is how endogenic DID is possible. yes, possible. remember how trauma is not in diagnostic criteria and DID can happen at any age? If endogenic plurals can happen, they can also form DID at later in life. They can also become disordered due to an event in their life. They can lose harmony and become so dysfunctional they need professional help. That doesn't mean they are no longer endogenic or some other origin, that simply means their state is different than what it was and they need help.

End of our post. Thank you for reading.

[radically-therian]

tfw you get reminded why personal connections between headmates are so hard for you to manage with your system!!!

that face when

[the-indigo-symphony]

Actually you know what. Since I brought it up somewhat recently, here's some average + common polyfrag experiences we've experienced and heard about from other polyfrag systems:

Gaining new members really easily or often

Co-fronting most or all of the time

Some headmates taking a very long time to front again after finally switching out, but without going dormant in the time that they're "away"

Complicated system structure; sidesystems, subsystems, layers, structure in general...

Experiencing blurriness or other identity confusion more often compared to other systems

Very expansive innerworlds

Complexity of their system + dissociation meaning that – if they're disordered – their disorder appears more as a crossover or mix of several dissociative disorders than only one (really wish there was more discussion about this one)

It's fine to not relate to typical system narratives as a polyfrag system (or large + complicated system in general); our systems tend to work differently than what's considered an "average" or "typical" system. Really, it's perfectly fine to just be yourself/ves. You don't need to stress about it.

[sophieinwonderland]

Here's Ableist AspenFrostEN Trying To Pack as Much Misinformation and Ableism As She Can Into One Minute:

This sentence is, perhaps, the one and only true thing in this entire video.

Oh, please do enlighten me, Aspen!

I mean, sure, created systems are a thing. Tulpas are the main example of this and the ones that have been studied the most. But there are created systems that aren't tulpas, such as in daemonism.

Also, plenty of traumagenic DID systems have intentionally created alters too, so it's weird to make "people who believe that you can force yourself to have alters" an endogenic system thing.

ALSO, basically no tulpagenic system I know actually uses the word "alter" to describe their headmates.

While most endogenic systems are plural without a disorder, it's bizarre to use this as your definition instead of just "an endogenic systems is plural without trauma" as it's actually defined.

Founded entirely on Tumblr???

Aspen, dear...

Are you... capable of reading? Here's the paragraphs you're looking at. Notice how it says natural system predated the word endogenic?

Yes, the word endogenic was first used on Tumblr... as a replacement of "natural system" or "natural multiple" that dated back to the 90s, before you were even born!

Here's one site mentioning natural multiples in their glossary in 2003:

And here's the origin in a page dated for 1998:

You clearly know NOTHING about the plural history that you're rambling on about.

And how am I only 20 second into this???

What do you consider a medical consensus again?

The World Health Organization's ICD-11, the diagnostic handbook used around the world, explicitly states that you can experience multiple "distinct personality states," the characterizing feature of DID according to it, without having a mental disorder:

That's the World Health Organization's official handbook!!!

I'm not sure what more of a consensus you need.

But I'll add that Tulpamancy is acknowledged as a real psychological phenomenon by Dr. Samuel Veissiere, psychiatry professor at McGill University.

And Dr Eric Yarbough, Distinguished Fellow of the American Psychiatric Association has stated that you can be plural without trauma or a disorder in a book reviewed and published by the American Psychiatric Association.

And these claims are undisputed. There is no peer reviewed paper by any psychiatrist that has claimed you need trauma or a mental disorder to be plural.

Now, onto the next round of misinformation!

I recognize that page! That's DID-research! A glorified blog that convinced an entire generation that OSDD-1a and OSDD-1b were actual medical terms for disorders they could be diagnosed with!

(Spoiler: The aren't!)

Is that so?

It would probably be really inconvenient for this narrative if the creators of the theory of structural dissociation ALSO have said it may be possible people to form self-conscious dissociative parts of the personality without trauma, huh?

I mean, something like that would just completely destroy everything you're trying to sell and make you look even more like a hack who has no idea what she's talking about, wouldn't it?

...

...

...

This paper is by two of the authors of the Haunted Self, which I probably shouldn't need to tell you since you're so knowledgeable about plurality, is the book that created the theory of structural dissociation of the personality.

Even the creators of the theory you're citing are saying plurality could have other causes.

Wouldn't that require you to actually know what endogenic systems actually believe? Or, you know, literally anything about plural history? Or anything at all? 🤔

Now we're back to ableist Aspen having no idea what Schizophrenia is and using it as an insult. 🙄

Aspen is not hiding her intent. Her goal is to spread hate, to come into our communities and bully us.

Aspen is a liar, a bully and an abuser.

But I hope I've also demonstrated pretty thoroughly that on top of that, she also incredibly ignorant.

She's ignorant of psychiatry. She's ignorant of plural history.

Every word out of her mouth on this topic is a lie she made up, and hopes her followers will be gullible enough to swallow, because while she may act confident in her misinformation, the fact is that she doesn't know anything about what she's talking about.

[syscest]

I feel like i want to explore being plural but i also dont feel like i understand it enough and i live in constant fear that im disrespectful, misunderstanding, and just faking it to feel special.

I do feel like there is a disconnect in who i am at different times, the most jarring between me being ace and slightly sex repulsed normally and then suddenly just moments of extreme horniness. But i also just dont feel like i have continuity of character at all, like every version of me before and after Right Now This Moment is an entirely different person

many many many systems are made to feel like they're "just faking things for attention". plural imposter syndrome is so common i don't think i know a single system who hasn't had to work thru it to some degree.

you cannot disrespect other plural systems by exploring a potential plural explanation for your own experiences - it helps to be conscious of the variety of plural experiences out there and not expect everyone else's experience to be the same as yours, but that only matters for your interactions with other systems.

if you're worried about misunderstanding plurality it always helps to listen to a variety of other systems' experiences, as usual plural respect is a good starting point but there's a lot to be gained from just hearing other systems' personal experiences too.

splits between "very horny part of the system" and "not at all horny part of the system" are pretty common! plenty of systems have some headmates who are very dtf and others who want that shit kept far away from them. it's not unheard of as a kind of fluctuating asexuality either, but that doesn't mean you can't explore both possibilities.

and yeah uhhhh. been there with the feeling like you don't have a stable continuous identity thing. for us plurality helped resolve a lot of that, both via providing more identity structure for us to glom onto and by helping identify patterns of identity that were already there. I can't guarantee it's what will work for you and plurality certainly isn't the answer to all identity problems. but like,

these are all fairly common experiences for plural systems. i think it's worth exploring the possibility, especially if that's something you already want to do.

[creepybah]

hi! could i get a headspace?

appearance: one or multiple rooms, no outside, but seeing things through windows is okay

environment: cozy & comfortable, a good space for littles and traumaholders. big enough for many alters to be there at once.

structures: a main hallway leading into it (from our main headspace)

biomes/weather/daylight cycle n/a

no npcs please

if it helps, we like extra cozy spaces and warm lighting, it's be nice if there were small spaces available for autism nesting, and it'd be nice if there was a variety of places to congregate

thank you if you can get to this, but no pressure if not

HEADSPACE PACK FOR @polytrichumsystem !!

sorry if this isnt what you wanted AT ALL :') this is our first time making a headspace pack (as far as i remember ?)

-

HALLWAY

a hallway leading from the main headspace. the hallway is very spacious, comfortable, and has fairy lights as decoration. on both sides, there are many doors leading to different rooms within the headspace, but the door at the end, with the small staircase, leads to the main room.

MAIN ROOM

this room is very large, with lots of seats, chairs, bean bags, hammocks, and other places for headmates to be. this is the main space for headmates to have meetings, hang out together, have congregations, etc.

ROOMS

other rooms that, while not as large as the main space, are still quite big and can be used for smaller and more focused meetings, hang outs, sleep overs, congregations, etc

AUTUMN NESTS

these are small, cozy rooms littered throughout that are perfect for autumn nesting.

(note : we didnt really know what you meant by autumn nesting, so sorry if this section isnt what you wanted / meant !!)