#I'm not calling him bi because they didn't label him

[kqluckity]

okay i have a pale vriskat humanstuck au idea but I'll maybe share it in the morning if I still feel like it or maybe I'll put it in the tags of this here post idk

[tizeline]

Happy pride month and all!

I figured now was a good time to ask, but do you have any thoughts about the sexuality of the characters in your Sep AU?

Sorry if you’ve been asked already, and the answer can definitely be no, I’m just curious :)

Happy pride!! ✨

Here's the thing about headcanons about queer identities, I personally prefer to not get too stuck on specific labels. While there are exceptions, I generally try to remain flexible if that makes sense? As in I like having multiple different interpritation about characters' identities so deciding on One Particular Label can feel limiting to me.

I mentioned it before, but I do plan on making Capril an established relationship in the AU sooner or later, so April and Casey are definitely sapphic. But more specific than that? Are they lesbian or bi or pan or whatever?? I dunno!! It's not really relevant to the story so I might as well leave that up to interpretation.

My approach to creating stories is that I'll usually only decide on specific labels if it is plot relevant, Schrödingers Identity if you will, lol, it can be anything if you don't decide on it beforehand. Again, there are exceptions, Leo is gay 100% like duh I can't interpret him any other way XD. Splinter is a Bi-Icon and I will STAND BY THAT!

Raph, Donnie and Mikey? Man who knows, canon Donnie seems to be into girls at least so it's the same in the AU, but more specific than that I dunno, I'm not planning on the story really focusing on romance (aside from a little capril because every story needs sapphics that's like the law)

Actually, you know what I find fun? World building! I honestly tend to be more interested in how queer identities are viewed and treated in a story's world as a whole as opposed to induvidual character's identities. Human society in rottmnt seems to be mostly the same as our IRL society, but what about Yōkai society!? With how diverse yōkai are I think it'd be fun if people in The Hidden City just... didn't care about who you loved or what you identified as. As a result of that, I don't think yōkai would care that much about terminology and labels, you just kinda loved whoever you loved.

It'd be honestly be kinda interesting if Donnie and April used terminology that related to queer stuff and Raph, Leo and Mikey are just really confused. Like for example, April is complaining about one of her classmates who's homophobic and the The Drax Bros are just like "Home-phobic??? They're afraid of homes??" cuz the concept of discriminating against someone based on which gender they're attracted to is completely foreign to them. Actually, Leo might be more knowledgable about human queer culture considering he's interested in human cultures in general. He calls himself gay at one point and Draxum is all like "you're happy? good for you?" and he'd just be wondering why Leo is using such an old-timey word considering Leo doesn't exactly have the most advanced vocabulary.

[karenandhenwillson]

About Coming Out

I've seen some discussion about "how disrespectful and misogynistic it was of Buck to come out at his sister's wedding". And at first I laughed about that take, but after some consideration, I became pretty sad. Because I feel this is one of the most queerphobic takes I've seen in this whole fandom discourse taking place since May.

What does this take imply about being queer and coming out? It tells us that coming out is a big thing. Something that you need to do with great care and put a lot of attention to, that you need to expect everyone else to put a lot of attention to. But not because people might react poorly and it's a decision a queer person needs to make carefully for their own safety's sake (which is the very reality for most queer people in any given situation) and instead because everyone else has the right to make a big deal about it and demand to talk about it and fully concentrate on it no matter what else is going on.

Coming out should not be big thing. It should not even be necessary.

That it is necessary to tell people "hey, you know, I'm not straight" or "hey, you know, I'm not cis" or any other thing people assume about others is a problem of our society. We are living in a heteronormative world. People complain about children being exposed to queer themes, but at the same time the toddlers in the sandpit--one a boy the other a girl--getting along great for the afternoon they are playing together, are called boyfriend and girlfriend. And then they are teased about their "crushes" (at least as long as it's a crush of the oposite gender, of course. In any other case they just really close friends and isn't nice to see such close friendships?).

No one should assume about any real person they see on the street, or in class, or at work, or on the news, or on TV what or who they are. But in the end all of us, the queer community just as much as everyone else, assume about people they don't know that they are straight and cis. Or they assume just by their appearances that they are decidedly not straight or not cis. (I just recently saw a meme: A picture of Christina Aguilera on a stage, and a comment beneath about "the horrors of men dressing as women" or something along those lines. That’s sad for so many reasons, but I think it very much showed the mindset of many people about how their perception is more important than anything else.)

It shouldn't matter. But sadly, it does. We live in a society where I was nervous at 16 when I told my mom "I like girls more than boys at the moment" because I had a horrible crush on a girl in my class when she asked me about dating boys (to then be told by my mother that it was a phase and would go away eventually. I haven't told her yet that it wasn't a phase but that I do use another label now). We live in a society where I used a friend's struggle with her family concerning her girlfriend to very carefully see how my dad would react to me talking about this at 21 and then blurted out "I know how my friend feels because Mom was horrible when I told her I'm bi" (to then break down in tears when my dad just shrugged, said I hadn't told him anything new about myself or my mom and if my friend and her girlfriend needed any help).

I wish we lived in a world where sitting at a café with a relatively new friend and just mentioning "this woman I once dated" without it interrupting the conversation at all was normal. And where it is just as normal that this friend shared a little while later "that's why I mostly dated women before meeting my husband" again without it interrupting our conversation in any way. Our hug when we said goodbye might have been a little bit longer and a little bit tighter than is usual, but other than that it was not a big deal coming out to each other at all. I, for my part, didn't even think about it being a big thing because I feel comfortable and secure with this friend.

I wish we lived in a world where coming out wasn't even necessary.

I wish we lived in a world where others wouldn't make assumptions based on what others look like under their closes, or about who they love, or about who they find attractive, or about who they fuck. Where people wouldn't judge how people style themselves and how they look and what the scale might show about their weight. I wish we lived in a world where none of that mattered. I wish we lived in a world where a man showing up with a boyfriend or showing up single to any event would be as much talked about as a man showing up with a girlfriend: that there would be no talk about it at all.

We don't live in such a world. And when I look at people saying Buck was disrespectful and misogynistic (really, what??? Are people once more just throwing around random words to see which of them will stick?) by coming out at his sister's wedding, I know my nieces and nephews and probably even my grand-nieces and grand-nephews won't ever experience such a world. Because instead of working to normalize being queer, people are doing exactly the opposite. (And then of course the anti-queer laws we are seeing pop up again at the moment, but that's another topic.)

All that despite 9-1-1 showing us at least a glimpse of that world I wish we could live in.

We saw Buck struggle with some internalized homophobia, of course. Because I think that's exactly what his nervousness during the first date and his panic when Eddie showed up was about. We know that Buck isn't homophobic in the slightest. We have seen him interact with enough queer people in the course of the show to know that about him. But clearly, there was a tiny voice in his head--and I'd bet money it sounded very much like Margaret Buckley's voice--telling him it was shameful to date a man. He worked through it very quickly and I think that's a testament of how much he did work through the bullshit his parents planted in his head in therapy. And it might also be a sign of how much he really likes Tommy and wants to be with him that he managed to work through that hateful voice in his head in just a couple of days.

But then we also saw that coming out is very much not a big deal at all at the wedding. I fully believe Buck knew about the soot on his face (Come on guys, he's been a firefighter for over seven years. He worked in a forest fire at least once. Buck knows exactly how soot travels and how difficult it is to get rid of it again.) He chose to have the soot all over his face to show everyone how he had greeted Tommy. He dragged Tommy into the room holding his hand. He took that slight breath to prepare himself for any reaction and then beamed over his whole face. There was no spoken announcement, but it could still not have been louder. I'm sure, if everything had gone according to plan (and Tommy hadn't been stuck fighting a fire) there wouldn't have been any big announcement then either. They'd just have danced among all the other couples dancing at the wedding and let everyone else make their assumptions about it.

And everyone else just reacted like I wish it would always go: They smiled, happy to see Buck happy, and turned back to the main event. No one talked about Buck and Tommy. No one asked Buck and Tommy any questions. No one turned to Buck and said "But you've always liked women!" or asked "Were you hurt by a woman? Is that the reason you are turning to men now?" or accused "You should have told us an age ago! Why didn't you tell us? How dare you not to tell us!".

It was such a fucking beautiful coming-out scene. Because it was full of acceptance and support. And at the same time, it also showed that coming out really isn't a big thing. It showed to beautifully that it doesn't matter who he loves or who he dates.

Buck coming out to the rest of his friends and family was not noteworthy at all among all the events of that day. Because he's found great friends and a great family in LA and all that matters for them is that he is happy with the person he is dating.

So, I would like to ask those people who say that Buck should have gone around and come out to everyone before the wedding because doing it the way he did was stealing his sister's big day (and why only his sisters, anyway? Why not also Chimney's big day?) something: If Buck had brought a new girlfriend, should he have gone around to everyone to inform them about that first? Maddie knew about Tommy, I think Chimney might have known before getting sick. Aren't those the two important people on that day and the only ones who need to know, at least that he was bringing a date?

And also: Should have Hen and Karen gone around to all the guests who don't know them and come out to them? Which includes the Buckley parents. If Josh brought a date, should he have gone to everyone and inform them first about bringing a man as his date? Or to take his one ridiculous step further: Should have Athena and Bobby gone around to everyone who doesn't know them closely to tell them they are an interracial couple? (Because there are people who would still find that scandalous and could have made a scene! No matter that they are currently attending the wedding of another interracial couple.) Why have these couples the right to assume that no one will talk about their relationship when the focus should be on the bride and groom, but Buck and Tommy don't have that right? Just because it's new for Buck? Rally?

(And I'm aware that the people who I'm asking this question probably quit reading this text after the first 100 words or so. They probably didn't get 1.7k words into my essay to get to these questions. And that might just be another problem in this fandom discourse: Certain people are just not open to take the time and energy to openly and honestly deal with opinions that don't agree with their own opinion. Because that could mean having to change their own opinion, right?)

[purpurussy]

I feel like the "dan is bi" anon is trolling but just in case they're genuinely confused: yes dan said in BIG that he loved and felt attracted to his high school gf (although he also made it pretty clear that they did not have sex so idk where anon is getting the idea that he has slept with "multiple women" 💀), and he alluded to his attraction not being confined to a specific gender in the part where he talked about labels, but you're completely taking all of that wildly out of context and missing the point of the whole video by calling him bi. I feel like this is probably the part that's frying their brain:

(shoutout to the legend @goldenpinof for this transcript!)

But firstly, imo it was very clear from BIG, as well as other stuff he's said over the years, that he just doesn't like labels. Which I find very valid, it took me a long time to figure out how to label myself. I still don't know what my gender is lmao but I started saying "bi" for my sexuality because it's a widely-used term that gets the point across. And I think that's the thing here: he came to the conclusion that the labels "gay" and "queer" are the best descriptors of his identity, which do the most accurate job of approximating something extremely psychologically complex and multilayered and nuanced in a simple everyday term that gets the point across to other people.

Obviously words mean things and it doesn't make sense to just pick a label at random (like for example it wouldn't make sense for me to identify as a lesbian, since I definitely feel attraction to men as well as women and everything outside the binary, and am interested in acting on that attraction at times, so I wouldn't be conveying accurate information to other people if I used the label lesbian for myself) but a label is just supposed to serve the task of conveying relevant information to other people (if a lesbian feels some kind of abstract attraction to dan and phil, that doesn't mean that the alphabet council needs to immediately revoke their lesbian card!! Since the word "lesbian" still does a perfectly good job of conveying relevant information to other people. Likewise if a straight dude has a fun little gay dalliance with his college roommate, but has absolutely 0 interest in men beyond that incident, it wouldn't be remotely necessary for him to start calling himself bi if he didn't want to, because what would be the point in that if he's only interested in women? Like if he told a gay dude who found him attractive that he's bi, only to backtrack... Do you see what I'm saying here?). It's perfectly valid for Dan to use "gay" and "queer" as umbrella terms that in his opinion do the best job of describing him, out of the language that's available. If he's like essentially a kinsey >5 and decided to just round it off to a 6 at this point, who are you to tell him he can't lmao

(shoutout to the legend @goldenpinof for this transcript!

Human sexuality is often way too complicated to boil it down to a single label in a way that doesn't erase any of its nuance, and I feel like this is something he's struggled with in the past, especially with him being a public figure. He's mentioned multiple times that feeling like he had to choose a label was a factor that prolonged his decision to come out.

And this is not even getting into the impact that his trauma from his childhood and also from spending a chunk of his formative years in the public eye probably had on the way he identifies or the way he chooses to label himself. It clearly took so much courage and strength for him to finally be able to call himself gay/queer please have some respect for our brave troops

Ultimately the point is that he uses the labels "gay" and "queer", not "bi", and it really shouldn't be difficult to respect that. It's also not biphobic for him to choose not use the label "bi" (again speaking as someone who uses that label). It's just that he feels "gay"/"queer" are better descriptors for him and nobody gets to determine that except him!! :) He wants people to know he's gay so he calls himself gay and that's that on that.

There are definitely people on here who are way smarter and more well-educated than me who would've done a much better job eloquently discussing this topic without rambling all over the place but that's my take (if anyone would like to add to this please do so, I'm always open to learn more about topics like this. And I'm also not saying that the way I see it is the only objectively correct opinion, but anon is definitely wrong so 💀). Thank you for coming to my ted talk

[buddiebeginz]

Why does it feel like people ship B/T out of obligation? Not because they actually like the ship, but because it’s canon queer representation that they have to support otherwise you get labeled as ‘homophobic’ or not supportive of bi! Buck. They care more about what the ship represents and not at all with how it’s written.

Because that's the reality. For some people they don't care what kind of representation we get for queer characters/ships so long as there is canon representation. Let me tell you as someone who is a little older and has been watching queer media for a long time shitty or minimal representation is not better than no representation. Not for me anyway.

I want so much to see more people like me in media especially considering that I'm bi and there are so few canon bi characters. I will always be grateful to 911 for them making Buck (who I relate to a lot btw) a canon bi character. But at the same time they haven't handled his bi journey all that great and they've handled his first relationship with a man even worse.

Personally I don't care for T*mmy as a character and mostly I just think Buck deserves better. There is so little substance to that relationship. Buck and T*mmy barely even talked through most of s7 and when they did I didn't like how T*mmy treated Buck. I didn't like how dismissive and sometimes down right snappy he was with Buck. Plus we saw how much T*mmy went out of his way multiple times for Eddie but we never saw him do the same for Buck he couldn't even be bothered to dress up for the bachelor party.

I also didn't like that we really didn't get to know how Buck feels about T*mmy and that relationship by the end of s7. You can say we saw some of that during the dinner scene or when he talked to Bobby but it was really Bobby doing most of the talking in the locker room scene and the date only made me dislike T*mmy more. Buck was being vulnerable and T*mmy was made to seem like he didn't really care again. It would have been nice to have a scene where Buck talked about how he felt having been dating a guy for a little bit and what he really thought about T*mmy at this point but we really haven't gotten any insight on that.

All that aside though no one has to like any ship and it certainly isn't homophobic/biphobic to dislike a pairing (unless your reasoning is you don't want to see two people of the same sex together). I actually haven't cared for any of Buck's love interests for one reason or another but here's the thing if you have an otp for a show you don't need a reason to dislike it when the characters you ship are with other people. You can simply say I don't like them with that other person I want to see the ship I love together.

B*mmys will come up with all kinds of reasons as to why they've decided it's not okay for you to dislike their ship but it's all a bunch of bs. I heard similar stuff when Buck and Taylor were together. That it was misogynistic because I didn't like Taylor and them together (mainly because I've never liked Taylor after what she did to Bobby). But whether it's B*mmy's calling us homophobic or Buck/Taylor's calling us misogynistic it's all the same kind of stuff. They're just looking for a reason to make us feel bad for not agreeing with them. You don't have to like the same kinds of things as anyone else and you don't have to see the show the same as anyone else.

[mamawasatesttube]

tim for the ask game? :-)

Headcanon A:  realistic

part of the reason he keeps his hair longer later is that he has a pretty significant burn scar on the back of his neck after the explosion he's caught in late in robin '93. he's not too self-conscious about it or anything, but he hates when people stare or ask about it.

Headcanon B: while it may not be realistic it is hilarious

when he was going through his dad's stuff after his death, he found a box of his own baby teeth that his parents apparently just... kept. which he had feelings about for sure, but also like... he didn't really want to keep a little box of his own teeth. that feels weird. but also throwing them away when they clearly had significant value to his parents feels BAD.

solution: he makes sure the box is clearly labeled (there's a tiny paper that says "tim's baby teeth <3" in his mom's handwriting in the lid; he goes over it with sharpie because it's kind of faded) and then just leaves it in a drawer in dick's apartment. dick you want these right? for emotional attachment or whatever? yeah cool.

dick finds them like two weeks after tim just places them there and goes hm. considers calling tim like hey why is there a box of your teeth in the drawer under my tv? but then he's like eh you know what, my life is weird enough. this may as well happen. so he just leaves them there and forgets about them again. tim considers this a job well done.

Headcanon C: heart-crushing and awful, but fun to inflict on friends

he has a boatload of internalized homophobia to work through before he can even admit to himself that he's bi, thanks in large part to jack drake. he's also trans, and jack's acceptance of that hinged on tim being able to play the part of the classic ~all-star american boy~ so well. as a result, after jack is dead, tim has a lot of issues allowing himself to stray from what he knows his dad would've wanted him to be. it's not a simple easy said-and-done journey. it takes him years; he's the last one of core four to come out.

he also doesn't just like. tell people. his sexuality and his relationships are on a need-to-know basis. he's a very private person he's not going like oh i'm queer? i need to inform everyone i know. it's like... partly because he is just a private person, but also because it takes him a looong time to work through the shame around his sexuality that his dad left behind.

Headcanon D: unrealistic, but I will disregard canon about it because I reject canon reality and substitute my own.

he and zoanne are still friends. or they reconnect when tim eventually goes to college to get an engineering degree. specifically i think he just goes "well i'm great at tinkering and shit so how hard can this be?" and then once again has to struggle with juggling vigilanteism and having a normal life and doing homework. and zoanne is there going jeez your eyebags!!! are you good?? and tim's like no i want to sleep for a week :( why did charaxes show up last night when i have an 8:30 am lecture on tues/thurs >:( except he can't say that because secret identities. the point being tim gets to continue exploring his Themes and Issues re: identities and ALSO zoanne wilkins is there.

[virgo-dream]

heard u need some headcanons!! much love bc this time of year is ROUGH 🫂

Hob got really into the queer liberation movement and has gone on to be the resident bisexual professor that all the students know is a safe person to go to and helps out with the LGBT clubs on campus.

He gets really excited to share this with Dream, who is a little confused about why it's so important (having missed much of the fight) but immediately takes interest because omg Hob is into more than ladies??

Hob hosts the club at the New Inn and Dream shows up and all the students just Know by the way those two look at each other and spend the night trying to get them to admit it to each other.

Look. LOOK. I'M. I'm very NORMAL ABOUT THIS. Did you know the bi flag was unveiled in December 5th of 1988? Did you know HOB DIDN'T MEET DREAM IN JULY 7TH OF 1989 ANYWAY HAVE A FIC

Dream doesn't get it at first. He never really did get it, but only attributed it to the need humanity had for labels, for packing things into boxes and saying this goes here and that goes there. Sometimes, it led to this goes to heaven and you go to hell. It seemed to be a very common one, too. He was beyond that; his name said it all, Dream was endless. Not he nor she, not man nor creature, he was all there was to be and the nothingness beyond it. Gender and sexuality need not apply.

Still, it meant so much to Hob, that he'd have dreams about it. Nightmares too, for nights on end, and even if Dream begged Hob to allow him to take them away, Hob always declined, always braved through them. "If you take them, I'll forget how much it all means. I'll forget why I'm still fighting."

They sat at the New Inn one afternoon, while Hob graded papers and Dream had a cup of chamomile tea, but his eyes couldn't help but focus on a shiny pin on Hob's jumper shaped like a flag, the shades of pink, purple and blue a spot of proud colour in Hob's otherwise earthy colour palette.

"It's the bisexual pride flag."

"Hm?" Dream's eyes dart up to meet Hob's, tilting his head slightly. He wasn't sure if he should feel bad for being caught, because he wasn't sure what he was looking at in the first place.

"The pin. I wear it for my students, but also for myself. The kids feel safer I guess, knowing they have at least one of their own in the faculty. Can't say it doesn't make me feel good too."

Hob has a particular tone to his voice that makes Dream's heart sing in tune to its melody. It's a fuller sense of self, maybe more than Dream ever had in regards to his own identity. "...one of their own?"

"Oh, I– Sorry, those are pretty recent." Hob straightened himself up (ha) on the chair, his lecturing posture taking over. Dream liked when he did that. He liked to hear Hob speak of things he had deep knowledge of and passion for. "This one was created in 1988 by a queer activist called Michael Page. Had the pleasure of being there when it was first unveiled, but clearly it took a long time until I was able to wear something like this out in public and not be decked by some bloody homophobe."

It was starting to sink in.

"...I'm afraid I was not present for these developments." Dream saw the look on Hob's face, like he was ready to apologise. He raised a had to stop him, waving his concern away. "As far as I can remember, queer was not a form of self identification, but only a way to shun out those outside the established norm."

"Ah, yes. We reclaimed it, though. Or are reclaiming it. The 80s were crazy. All of them were, for me." Hob smiled at Dream, at their shared secret and at their years of now reestablished friendship.

"I think you're lonely."

Could it have been....? Could he have meant...?

"What does it mean for you, then?" Dream asks in a way he hopes sounds inconspicuous, pointing at the pin. He was hesitant to ask, afraid to be getting it all wrong.

"For me? It means I love whoever I love. Man, woman, either or neither."

The pride coming from Hob's words filled Dream with hope, something he had not felt in a long, long time. The look in his face then shifted onto something else, something he didn't quite understand. "...what about you? That is, if you're okay with talking about that. I don't want to overstep. Last thing I want is for you to walk out–"

"I won't, Hob." Dream knew Hob had reason for feeling that way. "I don't believe the terminology you have could define my experience. I have laid with mortals and gods alike, and have wore many faces and names. It is beyond human comprehension."

Hob seems takes a moment to think about what he'd just heard. Dream feels like he might have thrown too much at his human friend. "...I think I get it. But, and tell me to bugger off I'm wrong, do you prefer to be a particular way? To be with a particular sort of being?"

Dream. Didn't have an answer.

He never thought of what he preferred. He'd never felt in need of any sort of outside validation, but. That was a lie. He needed it. He just never cared to look for it.

Hob's smile was what broke him out of the spell of his own self doubt. "It's okay if you don't have an answer, you know. It takes people a loooong time to get it, it took me nearly 600 years, you know? Ah! You know what? I've got an idea–" He reached inside his brown messenger bag, pulling out a colourful piece of paper, handing it over to Dream. A pamphlet for a meeting. "We're having a meeting for the uni's LGBT clubs here at the Inn. I want this to be a safe space for the kids, and to get them to connect with other folks in the community, share their experiences. It's tomorrow, and I'd love it if you could make it. I'm sure they would too."

Dream took the pamphlet in hands, looking at the bright colours and bold fonts, taking in every bit of information Hob was giving him and trying to fill in the gaps of the questions he wouldn't dare ask. After a moment, he looked up at Hob, allowing himself a small smile. "I shall be in attendance, then."

[butch-culture-is]

some bitches hear my opinions on mspec lesbians and assume I'm a women hating white boy who's never met a non white queer irl <- yes I've been told almost exactly that.

I'm bigay if you want an explanation on why I'm happy to give one. I think anyone can label themselves as bi or gay regardless of their attraction.

if someone else is gay and to them that means being a mam who's only attracted to men that doesn't make me or anyone else who doesn't perfectly fit that description less gay it just means we hold a different meaning to being gay.

someone who uses he/him pronouns or calls themselves a lesboy could be a masculine cis woman or a trans women, there are so many nuances and reasons someone could use an identity you don't agree with and I didn't even mention the SAM. (split attraction model)

"oh why do i hear so much about how anyone can be a lesbian but not about being gay/bi/ect" maybe because people aren't constantly saying mspec gays or gay girls aren't valid.

for the race thing I'm mixed (Irish and Pakistani if that matters to you). my closest irl friend is native. and I'm an active member of the south Asian community in my city.

for the 'hating women' thing i held a three day protest against the dress code in elementary school because it was sexist if that's worth anything.

all of that to say not all people who support mspec mono labels are white women haters out to get lesbians. being a lesbian can mean whatever you want it to mean to you. But you can't decide what it mans for other people

[thebroccolination]

Make Sure to Double-Check Labels

I've seen this phenomenon a lot in Thai BL fandom over the years, so I just wanted to make a very gentle post to encourage people to always check their sources before using a sexuality label for anyone.

If someone hasn't given a label, I think it's best to respect that. Please don't give them one.

If your favorite actor is a cis man who presents himself with a feminine flair and has previously dated men, you may see people referring to him as gay. But before you follow suit, please look into whether he's actually used that label for himself.

There's a very fine line you can walk thinking, "Oh, but I can tell," before you jazz-hands yourself into the world of stereotyping.

My go-to example for this is Earth ("Cooheart"). My information might be out of date, but the only label I've ever heard directly from him was on an Instagram live where, if I'm remembering correctly, someone asked if he's gay. He said he's "LGBT." Yet, there are scores of fans who have been casually calling him "gay" for years ever since before I joined the fandom. Maybe he is, maybe he isn't. Maybe he used that term at some point. But as far as I know, he hasn't, so I just call him queer. (And that's only because calling a person all four letters of "LGBT" isn't something we do in English. It's more commonly used in Thai as a loan word to mean "queer" from what I've been told by friends who speak Thai.)

A more recent example is Supanut. In an interview, he said he dated a girl he met online when he was about thirteen or so, then he dated a boy when he realized boys could feel attraction to each other, and then later a man. Supanut didn't use a label for himself, and yet people have started calling him "Bi King." There are plenty of gay people who have dated other genders for various reasons, there are ace and aro people who realized their orientations later. The point is, unless Supanut himself gives a label, the fact that he dated a girl, a boy, and a man only means that he dated a girl, a boy, and a man.

On the other side of the labeling, Krist is called straight pretty universally, likely because he blew up on an IG story once and denied being gay after people kept harassing him to come out as Singto's boyfriend. However, as far as I or any of the long-term fans I've spoken with about it know, Krist has never used any label for his sexuality. The closest I've seen are when he answers "what's your type of girl" questions and the time he said something like, "If I ever date a man, I'll be open about it because I want my fans to know that part of my life," so he seems openminded more than anything specific.

Then you've got Prem who once said in an interview (paraphrasing) that he never thought of dating men before he worked in BL, but now he doesn't care about gender when considering romantic partners. But, as far as I know, he's never used a label.

I've noticed that a lot of Thai actors are private about the labels they use—if they use any! There are a fair number of queer actors, and friends living in Thailand have said that that information is more commonly known among domestic fans, but whether or not it becomes information for the global public to have is up to each individual actor to decide.

Years ago, Fluke Natouch used the label "gay" for himself in an interview about his casting in Until We Meet Again. If I'm remembering correctly, he asked New (the director) if him being openly gay would be an issue when promoting the series. Presumably he was concerned because the agency he'd just left wanted him to be more discreet about his sexuality, and he's been independent ever since.

Even now, sexuality is still a very difficult thing to navigate, especially if you're young or in the spotlight or part of a widely conservative culture. The internet is rife with misinformation, so always, always make sure to check your sources. Unfortunately, we can't just trust that everyone is doing their due diligence, and I think it's an act of true kindness and deep respect to make sure your facts about people are in order before you speak of them. Especially when you're in someone else's cultural backyard, and especially when their safety and mental health can be so easily compromised by what people say about and to them.

NOTE: I used the above examples based on what I know. It's entirely likely there's additional nuance and context in every case, so if you have additional resources, please link them! It can be difficult to stay on top of things in a language you're still in the very beginning stages of learning, so if we can help each other, we'll be better off than trying to keep up-to-date on our own.

[httyddragonfox]

Proof of Sexuality

I've noticed something quite recently (I know, I'm an idiot), but to display someone's sexuality, you usually need some form of proof.

Let us look at two liberal displays of the LGBTQA+: Hellaverse and The Owl House.

To display that Luz was bisexual she displayed interest in both boys and girls, Eda talked about ex-boyfriends and has an old flame in a trans/non-binary person. Other than that we have word of god for the unclear stuff.

In Hellaverse (Hazbin hotel and Helluva boss) we have Moxxie who is married to a woman and has an ex-boyfriend, Blitz is interested in both Moxxie and Millie, having sexual relationships with a man, a childhood guy friend he had a crush on, and an ex-girlfriend. Someone in Hazbin declared Alastor as Ace and he has no interest in sexual relations, and Charlie is a relationship with Vaggie as well as the fact she has an ex-boyfriend.

Why haven't I mentioned Amity and Angeldust, it's because they're freaking obvious. The proof of homosexuals is just not showing interest in the other gender.

When it comes to hetero or homo-sexuals, the identity can be seen very early: Straight is pretty normal and Homosexuals only get crushes on their gender.

When it comes to all the other sexualities that identity gets identified in the teenage and early adult years. Here are a few personal examples:

Asexuality is a distinct lack of proof of striaghtness: For me, it was not understanding the whole sexual feelings thing, and then realizing normal people actually have that. That I discovered in early university.

For Bi-sexuality or Pan-sexuality (very similar) you need proof of liking the other gender or more than one: My friend discovered she was Bi after high-school. I asked her how she knew (She was dating a man who she eventually married, she dated boys in the past), technically I asked her if she was attracted to any girls. She said she found one girl attractive, so I took her word for it.

A classmate I knew of complained on how she wasn't allowed to be gay, but she ended up having a baby and dating guys. I think maybe she didn't know bi was a thing.

As for my grey romanticism: I've had only a few (three) genuine crushes in my life whilst my sister had enough crushes to count with two hands.

In fiction: homosexuals are obvious (only interest in one gender), bisexuals need proof (attraction or exes), other than that you're straight.

Asexuals are hard to label, usually it requires Word of God. Lillith is Aroace, because she never gets a partner and Dana said so, but without Word of God, we don't know she's ace, she might just be married to her work. Alastor is AroAce according to Word of God. Before episode seven of Hazbin Hotel that's all we had, and his distinct lack of sexual interest. That didn't stop the shippers who said, "he might not like sex, but romance isn't off the table." Those who didn't hear word of god must be thinking, "He might not like sex, but he'll do it with the one he loves." In episode seven, Rosie specifically calls him an "Ace in the hole," joking about a relationship with Charlie. So that would mean that sex and romance are off the table, but "she just said ace, not Aro." Word of God, you can't stop the shippers.

Another Word of God instance is Hunter and Willow's sexulaities ("Hunter is Bi and Willow is Pan"). Hunter has only liked one person in his life, and that's Willow, we don't have proof on screen that he had interest in other genders. Willow ever only showed interest in Hunter in the show (Maybe Luz, that's up for debate). People are upset that there is no proof of their Word of God sexualities in the show, because it looks like a straight ship and Dana's placating. Meanwhile, some people are happy with the LGBTQA ship that looks straight because those exist. Others wish to ship their homo ships, others wish to ship Lunter (even though when they met she already had interest in Amity), and other people complain that Huntlow is forced together just to have a straight ship and pair the spares and all their other complaints.

Without the proof of Hunter and Willow liking other genders, they might as well be straight, and that makes people upset. Fanfic writers try to remedy this by writing instances where they realize they like more than one gender, but that just goes to show...

In order to identify as this sexuality, you need the proof of liking what they dictate, or people won't believe the claims.

[beanghostprincess]

was thinking about my asl bros headcanons and started laughing when i realized ace is the only allo one (bi with a preference for men, luffy is aroace and sabo demi and only really interested in koala btw)

HEY!!! WE HAVE THE SAME HEADCANONS!!!

Idk if Luffy would, but Sabo definitely makes fun of Ace for being allo. He wouldn't let anyone else do it, though, he's the only one allowed to slut-shame his brother.

And you didn't ask but these are my ASL headcanons (+ Uta) because we have basically the same thoughts:

Ace: Bisexual. Bi. Bibibi. Would sleep with anybody, probably. Definitely. The preference for men is so real too. Going insane. I luv him. Also you didn't mention gender headcanons but I feel the need to say he's the most transmasc character I've ever seen. But this is a fact already, so.

Luffy: Aroace. Always. I think it changes depending on my mood tho??? Like for me it's either Aroace or Demi but tbh his feelings when it comes to my ships with Luffy transcend romance so calling him Demi would be an understatement. But yeah. Whatever. Aroaspec. And also he's transmasc. And demi-boy. Don't ask me why I think this it's just the vibes.

Sabo: I'VE BEEN SAYING SABO IS DEMI SINCE DAY 1 HE HAS THE FACE OF A DEMI PERSON I SWEAR HE'S SO-- It started as a joke to me bc I was like "haha his clothes look like the gay flag haha and Koala's look like the lesbian flag haha" and I ended up saying "what if they're both demiaroace with a preference for their own gender but at the end of the day it doesn't matter bc they're married". You know the whole "She's A Lesbian, He's Gay, And Their 33-Year Marriage Will Change Your Perception Of Love"? That's Saboala to me. Also Sabo doesn't look like somebody who'd use labels at all so his gender is unknown to mankind.

Uta: Lesbian. Just lesbian. Her gender is also lesbian. Idk how that works but yes. Also she's dating Perona. I'm a firm Perouta believer. Let's go lesbians!! She's also dating me, specifically.

This pics are so fucking stupid but I'm sick and bored so please have the stupid siblings saying stupid things with their pride flags

[our-aroace-experience]

Hi! I was on the asexual tag saw this blog and just wanted to see if anyone else who is aspec can relate to my ramblings. Rambling tldr: not claiming a label despite that label actually relating to my experiences because it just doesn't fit perfect enough and because it doesn't fit perfect enough in my mind I don't think I want to use it.

Now, back in 2020 I claimed being 'asexual' by name and then a couple of months later claimed being aroflux which eventually changed to 'greyaro' over a year later. And those two terms fit me the best, grey aro ace is me. However, because I'm greyaro I still feel romantic attraction though it is rare but its still present enough in my mind to continually be wondering about what label to put it as. For the most part, I don't have a label even when the attraction - romantic/sensual/alterous/aesthetic - arises. Which again doesn't rise often, but I daydream about it a lot or reminisce about old crushes - particularly the one about a girl way back in high school days. (Let me tell you that was a wild time in my mind). Back then I was thinking I was bisexual only to cancel it out because I didn't want to have sex with her. However I never questioned if I wanted to have sex with boys (I just assumed I would, thanks heteroallonormativity). But the romantic feelings I had for her were the same like the boy crushes (which came up every few years). And for a timeline purposes, before her my last crush (boy) was in the 7th grade, she was the 11th grade, and my last crush currently was senior year of undergrad college (the best one honestly I could actually talk to him and not be overly ridden with anxiety and embarrassment). And despite so many years passing I always wonder - does the bi label fit? Was that with her an bi experience? I know its whatever I feel like it was but also I'm wondering if my hesitation is because deep down having that bi label attached makes the 'im not straight' thought more permanent? If that makes sense? Like 'im not straight' in any way, not even hetero aro/ace? And maybe that thought just makes my head spin a little. I thought about the pan label too; but when I read the definition to see the differences between bi and pan I realized that pan definition doesn't connect the closest but bi does. However I still can't always make it fit. It's like when I was going by aroflux despite the fact it did not fit for me, it was clunky in my brain calling myself that. But then I read about grey-aromantic and it fit perfect! But not my romantic orientation is still in murky waters; I ID as a girl so for the most part of my life boys have been what I've been romantically attracted to, however hetero isn't me. I usually just go as fluid for all my attraction titles which I do like but that opens up more discussion of "okay, but who, what gender?" So in that case I guess bi would be the correct answer...despite the fact gender doesn't play a part (hence fluid label I go with and or queer) but it isn't all genders I fall for, I lean in some directions more than others. So it kind of does, doesn't it? But again I'm like "....meh it just doesn't fit/doesn't fit the way I want." And I am one of those people who agree that you don't have to use every label or any label including micro (for example, aegosexual I can relate to but I don't feel the need to have two microlabels) however, once I start thinking in depth I start to question myself as I do because I'm a thinker. And I think a lot because in real life I'm not in the space where I can speak about this openly with the people in my life.

Wonder if anyone else has had something like this on and off throughout their life too?

Thanks for listening~

you can be bi and greyromantic at the same time, if that helps! but not wanting labels is totally valid and if that feels best then go for it!

[jinjinranran]

Mari x Saeyoung ❤️

So in this case it's CANON that Saeyoung is a bi/pan king ✌️ both fit him so I did 2 versions since I'm indecisive, tho I usually call him bi bcs it can be used as an umbrella term and bcs I hc Saeran as bi as well 🌸

Additional pieces:

I couldn't get that "someone you know is Italian... maybe even someone you love" meme out of my head and since Mari is half Italian, it fits okay 😂😭

Other characters: 💛 💜 🧡 💗 ❤️ 💚 💙 🤍 🤎

Mari's story under the cut ✨️

❤️ Mari Oh ♡ she/her ♡ 21 yo ♡ demisexual

Mari didn't have a label for her for a long time. She didn't honestly think much of it - until a friend of hers brought up a topic about different sexualities, and when she learned about demisexuality, she went oh, that kinda fits and explains a lot 😮

She had lots of celebrity and fictional crushes and can get quite... imaginative, but the thought of being intimate with a real and attainable person without being super close? Far from appealing. The whole concept of dating before getting to really know each other, blind dates, people meeting to just "hook up" or pursuing someone only because you want to sleep with them? Separating friendship and relationship and even treating the former as something less? It all put her off and confused her. Do really most people operate that way? For her, the perfect idea of a relationship is friends-to lovers trope and that's what she wished for in her own life.

She considered being demiromantic as well, but she had romantic feelings for people she wasn't close with (very few, but still); they did go away fairly quickly tho, as opposed to crushes formed after friendship.

Regarding her potential partner's gender, she has slight preference for masculinity but honestly, doesn't care much. She doesn't label her preference nor romantic attraction.

She doesn't really talk about her sexuality much unless it's with someone really close and it's revelant to the conversation.

You can bet tho that this living meme made a big deal to "come out" as Italian at some point 💀

With Saeyoung, they clicked instantly, both sharing the same sense of humor and chaotic energy (to other members of the rfa and Saeran's displeasure sometimes 😂). But it wasn't just those funny moments that made her really connect with him. She adored the dorky Seven, and she loved the hurt, broken Saeyoung. She knew she met her soulmate, her best friend with whom she wants to spend the rest of her life with.

[fuckthisshitimin]

This slurs & labels discourse is particularly pissing me off today because I sat down with a friend who told me she didn't want to call herself bi because that would hurt "real" bi people which she isn't because she never dated a girl???? And when I told her she could call herself whatever the fuck she wants she almost cried???? And people are still out there thinking gatekeeping words does us good????

If a cis guy calls himself a tranny I'm kissing him on the mouth btw. With tongue.

[bumblingbabooshka]

hi it's me coming back with my bi-monthly little guy bullshit. rewatched meld with the besties for the yaoi of it all and was sitting there like there's something really funny (negative to neutral connotation) about (some) of the other maquis members being interviewed about suder in the ep & b'elanna being like "yeah he was just some guy ig we all did what we had to do lol" and chakotay being like "he was a fucking freak animal. unsettling little thing" . MEAN TO HIM?

I don't perceive Chakotay as being unfairly cruel in his talking about Suder? Chakotay isn't a violent person and though being in the Maquis required violence he didn't relish in it so he viewed Suder's (admitted) bloodlust to be disturbing. To Chakotay, fighting and killing was necessary but not something he wanted to do - very different from Suder who seems to not really care about the Maquis' mission (He only references the Maquis to call Tuvok a traitor and say he doesn't like Starfleet, giving me the impression that he joined just to be in an environment where violence could be used without it standing out rather than actually caring about the Maquis' mission). If anything Chakotay is demonstrating an interesting perceptiveness and willingness to extend olive branches to those he doesn't necessarily like/agree with in this moment. B'Elanna seems to have noticed (or been told of) Suder's penchant for violence, saying "He did what he had to do a little too well." but Chakotay has obviously had multiple personal moments with Suder where he encountered Suder's bloodlust firsthand. He states that these encounters (multiple) scared him and made him think of Suder as a potentially dangerous individual. Despite this, he still neglects to put this on Suder's record because he doesn't want to cause unnecessary hardship for Suder or any member of his crew which he already knows will likely be looked down on and distrusted by the Starfleet members of Voyager as "a bunch of criminals". It could be argued that his encounters with Suder constitute more than a "bad feeling" as it seems he saw evidence of the man being excessively violent and felt threatened himself but Chakotay still hesitates to label Suder as a bad or dangerous person in his crew evaluations. That's interesting! I don't feel that's something any other character on VOY would have done! It also feeds into something I wish was highlighted more about Chakotay which is his willingness to give people who he doesn't like or agree with second chances. He seems like he'd be the most able on the command team to sympathize with people who others dismiss as lost causes or 'bad' and I wonder if part of that comes from his father who never gave up on him even when Chakotay continually pushed him away. It reminds me of how he was willing to lay down his life for that Kazon kid even though he was rude and tried to kill him and Chakotay obviously didn't agree with his values - and that doesn't mean Chakotay is a pushover or naive, just willing to give people chances. Even his friendship with Janeway is something that's only possible because he's willing to listen to others and try to see things from their point of view. Janeway is able to do this to a Starfleet extent but you can bet that if she, say, ended up on a Maquis ship - she wouldn't be integrating herself into that crew's way of thinking. She'd be trying to get them onto her side because she's a person who thinks (sometimes implicitly) that she is Correct. She's much more 'aggressive' or black-and-white in her morality than Chakotay. Which again doesn't mean that Chakotay doesn't stand for anything or is wholly passive (he does and isn't, as we see in episodes like Maneuvers) but that he's just more open-minded and not as certain that he has all the answers. Anyway! I hope this was a good response. I'm sorry if you were making a joke and I responded too earnestly to it - that happens sometimes v_v

[takocreep]

yo you seem actually sane and a good level of aggro so i'm asking you. i'm a detrans woman i was a "gay" TIF for about 10 years and would have insisted i was ONLY into men. However had almost no attraction to real men, only fictional characters. and i'd sex-change all the fictional men into tall, huge-breasted and small waist big-hips and thighs women. with makeup and long hair. Still calling them he/hims. think like jessica rabbit. was on gay dating apps too, looking for fellow "gay trans men" who hadn't and didn't want to transition and who preferably were femme with big round tits and lipgloss. never caught any (surprise). when i used to watch porn it was women in wet white t-shirts bouncing. then i did have sex with two actual males and it was like, tolerable, not bad not fantastic. only been "in love with" one person, a male instagram model i never met or talked to. used to be delulu and think he MIGHT be trans, preferred the thought of him with a pussy. Now i am detransed. Still a bit attracted to men, but no longer the same to female bodies cos i can't he-him them and BELIEVE it anymore. Do you think i was a cooked hetero? or am i bisexual and cooked? people are so fucking up their ass about the correct labels on this site and i don't even know if i should say i'm bi. like just because i was getting off to my tall busty female oc... i was he-him ing that one though so am i fucking hetero

LOL

well, you're definitely bi. don't overthink it - you're attracted to males and females. bisexuals are often into both sexes for different reasons and at differing and even alternating levels. i think you just had some variety of genderbending fetish going on - also common for bisexuals. don't sweat it.