Tumgik
#its so interesting to see the way that character development happens in this show because it really does flow so naturally
Text
I think there’s a mentality in the Stranger Things fandom, or certainly outside of Byler spaces, that Byler is just another m/m ship.
What do I mean by “just another” m/m ship?
We all know there’s a long history of shipping male characters together when the show they were in clearly had no intentional romantic subplot.
M/m shipping has existed since the days of Star Trek - and it’s existed for many different reasons. But over time, it’s developed a bad reputation because fans of those ships were reading into things way too much and had so much hope that something might happen to those characters, only for them to end up incredibly upset and frustrated by the end.
There has also been a lot of accusations of fetishisation.
Some of this is also because especially in the early 2000s/ 2010s, these shows used to play on those hopes and have a lot of fun exploring “bromances”, where the writing would be intentionally stirring the pot, but not crossing the line enough for there to be any real plan to take things further.
What’s really important here is that Byler are NOT that kind of ship.
There would never be this much animosity if Will was Mike’s female best friend from childhood.
Yes, there would be a Byler vs. Milkvan war. That would never change - but the excuses as to why Byler have no possible chance of being together would be entirely different. Because yes, their arguments can currently include that Mike’s in a long term relationship, or that the 1980s environment would make it difficult for them to be together, but that’s about as realistic as the arguments have been.
Compare the circumstances to other canonical unrequited love stories
Take away all of the analysis about why Mike might be gay or Bi or even interested in Will in the first place, and just look at the plot in its bare bones state.
Will is canonically in love with Will, and Mike is canonically unaware of this and in a relationship with El.
There are SO MANY examples of this sort of love triangle in fiction, and most importantly there are more scenarios than there aren’t of this love becoming requited. It’s so normal for an audience to see a scenario like this and wonder if this is going to be one of those stories.
What’s happening instead is a lot of heteronormativity.
And that’s either down to the environment that Stranger Things fans find themselves in (people still live very unexposed lives) or they are just generally ignorant about anything that isn’t really in their face or what they want to see.
So there’s a heck of a lot of fans who didn’t even recognise that Will is gay, or just disregarded their assumptions and played up the “slow to grow up” narrative because they were more comfortable with that kind of story, or could relate to it more.
And so from their point of view, because they didn’t see anything, it couldn’t possibly exist. Bylers were seeing things and making them up. Now, after the Duffers and Noah confirmed things, they’re finding a lot of comfort in instead taking some of this fandoms bigger reaches (don’t mean to offend here, sorry) and using them as ammunition instead, e.g. Finn glancing at Noah’s lips for a millisecond during a take.
But the main point I’m getting at is that people who are dismissing Byler are not recognising that this is a traditional love triangle premise.
Now compare the canonical story to previous m/m ships
So because there are some similar activities happening in this fandom to what has been seen in those previous famous m/m ship fandoms, many Stranger Things fans are dismissing Byler as an imagined ship.
But how many of those old ships were able to boast about actual confirmed feelings, albeit one sided, with time left to explore things further?
There is absolutely no reason why the Byler ship resembles any of those “bromances” or queer baiting storylines in previous franchises and fiction.
This isn’t me saying that Byler will 100% become a couple
What I’m saying is that if nothing happens between them in season 5, that doesn’t undo the fact that Byler are a legitimate ship. It doesn’t undo the fact that Will’s feelings for Mike are canonical and that their storyline follows the premise of a traditional love triangle story.
There are people out there who are already trying to make Bylers feel stupid or ashamed for even exploring the potential of the ship, and all they’re doing is showing us how incredibly ignorant they are.
But that’s not to say that lessons can’t be learned from those previous m/m ship disasters
The one thing you should take from them is that people did get really attached, and so being let down by the show really hurt. It’s fine to speculate about Byler, but please don’t set your heart on them and let it break.
If we start to get legit info or confirmation that the ship won’t be requited, please don’t let yourself fall down the rabbit hole of conspiracy and set yourself up for disappointment.
But we have no legitimate reason to rule out Byler right now
The set up is there, the filming looks positive and the Duffers haven’t said anything to dispute the ship’s potential. Speculation is more than allowed - it’s normal and an inevitable result of season 4. So let’s have as much fun as we can and know that we’re doing nothing “deluded” or wrong.
23 notes · View notes
arolesbianism · 5 months
Text
Yet another beautiful day to have the Maxwel tag blocked (can't see half of the posts in the Wendy tags)
#rat rambles#starve posting#maxwell posters have lost any semblance of tolerance from me ages ago Ive yet to meet a maxwell fan who's just like a normal person#and to clarify I actually do like maxwel as I am the number one just some asshole whos in too deep enjoyer#but dear god are ppl just absolutely incapable of being normal abt this man and everyone around him#and even beyond that ppl just do not get this man like please he is indeed interesting but not because of some 'retconed redemption'#like pls we can live in a world where he is not an irridemable monster and is in fact just some guy while also still being a flawed person#like the fact that he is so deeply flawed in ways that he never actually properly adressed and challenged is the interesting thing to me#like look at me. he went through horrible shit he didnt deserve. that didnt inherently make him a better or worse person#it just made him a more miserable person#and he didnt escape because of some change of heart or character development#and afterwards he teamed up with wilson because of necessity#I do think on some level he genuinely cares abt the other survivors and he does have genuine regret for how things turned out#but again those things dont inherently mean he moved past the flaws that got him here it just means he has the ability to recognize that#shit sucks and that he wish none of it happened#its why encore is one of my favorite animations from a character perspective because it shows some juicy charlie and maxwell stuff#mainly it shows both that charlie has not forgiven his ass and is manipulating him and that maxwell is still susceptible to it#which isnt a sigh of them rolling back development it's just a sign that maxwell is easy to manipulate with the right cards#which adds up considering his past and his present very well in my opinion#this is a man whos historically always ran away from his problems and is always on the hunt for a sense of control#and charlie tapped into both that and his ever present guilt#its in fact very unsurprising and not out of place for him to fall for that sort of manipulation#and it also makes for a great set up for the inevitable betrayal from charlie as maxwell is hit by the harsh reality of his situation#and that whole situation would lead to some yummy tasty parallels when charlie inevitably gets betrayed herself (I hope)#the ways charlie and maxwel are so similar yet so different facinates me deeply I love how much charlie doesnt realize shes kinda fucked#I want her to be betrayed so hard and left in the dust with no ground to stand on I want the rug pulled out from under her feet#her composition comes from her confidence in the necessity of her actions and the moral superiority she feels over maxwell#so having her sense of superiority be revoked would make for a super fascinating dynamic as she tries to justify the situation in her head#I wanna see her siral and then maybe change her pronouns idk
2 notes · View notes
aro-aizawa · 2 years
Text
i will forever be fascinated with doctor who, i hope that never changes
3 notes · View notes
Text
Writing Notes: Plot Method
The Save the Cat! Beat Sheet was originally developed by Blake Snyder to help screenwriters plot movies, but it works just as well with novels.
It breaks down the 3-act structure into small, specific sections (sometimes just one scene long).
Each section pushes your story forward in its own way.
The exact word count/page count of each section depends on how long your novel is and what type of story you’re telling, but you can use the colored chart below and the percentages in the instructions as a guide. 
Context Note: This method is based on the concept of the Three Act Structure, which is an inherently Western approach to plot. It can be a useful way to tell a story, but it is by no means the only one.
Tumblr media
ACT 1
Opening Image (0-1%)
Show a “before” snapshot of your protagonist and their world.
What is life like before the adventure begins?
It represents the struggle & tone of the story.
Set-up (1-10%)
Expand on the “before” snapshot.
Explore your protagonist’s life, including the internal flaws and external challenges they’ll have to overcome in order to change for the better by the end of the story.
Present the main character’s world as it is, and what is missing in their life.
Also introduce important supporting characters.
Theme Stated (happens during the Set-up)
What your story is about; the message, the truth.
Usually, it is spoken to the main character or in their presence, but they don’t understand the truth/lesson…not until later, when they have some personal experience and context to support it.
Thus, include a scene where a character says something that hints at what the protagonist’s big life lesson will be - how they’ll have to change and grow by the end of the story.
Catalyst (10%)
The moment where life as it is changes.
Examples: It is the telegram, the act of catching your loved-one cheating, allowing a monster onboard the ship, meeting the true love of your life, etc.
There’s no going back to the “before” world from here… What is the inciting incident that pushes the protagonist into the next phase of the story?
Debate (11-20%)
But change is scary and for a moment, or a brief number of moments, the main character doubts the journey they must take.
Show the protagonist questioning themselves and resisting the path ahead - wondering whether they have what it takes, or whether or they should just run home and hide under the bed.
“Should I just…?” “I really shouldn’t because…” “But what about…” Can I face this challenge? Do I have what it takes? Should I go at all?
It is the last chance for the hero to chicken out.
ACT 2
Break Into 2 (20%; Choosing Act Two)
The main character makes a choice and the journey begins.
We leave the “Thesis” world and enter the upside-down, opposite world of Act 2.
They make the choice to begin their adventure/transformation/journey/new thing.
Show your protagonist deciding to plunge into Act 2.
The Promise of the Premise (21-50%)
This is when the reader thinks “Ah, now we’re getting to the good stuff they hinted at on the back cover of this book!”
It’s also one of the longest sections in your book.
Show your protagonist getting used to their new world - loving it, hating it, making mistakes or doing well, meeting new people (see more below) and keeping the reader entertained.
This is when the main character explores the new world and the audience is entertained by the premise they have been promised.
B Story (happens during The Promise of the Premise)
This is when there’s a discussion about the Theme – the nugget of truth.
Usually, this discussion is between the main character and the love interest.
So, the B Story is usually called the “love story”.
Introduce a new character or characters who will eventually help the protagonist learn their life lesson.
Friends? Mentors? Love interests? Nemeses (nemesi?)? Who are they? How will they help?
Midpoint (50%)
This moment is when everything seems “great” or everything seems “awful,” depending on your story.
The main character either gets everything they think they want (“great”) or doesn’t get what they think they want at all (“awful”).
Either the Fun and Games section has lead to a false victory for your protagonist (they think they’ve been doing great so far) or a false defeat (they’ve been having a hard time so far).
What happens in this moment, halfway between beginning and end?
But not everything we think we want is what we actually need in the end.
Bad Guys Close In (51-75%)
Get ready for a bumpy ride. If your Midpoint was a false victory, now things start to go wrong for your protagonist.
If the Midpoint was a false defeat, well, things seem to be looking up, but the bad guys are getting closer and will have something to say.
Note: Bad guys can be actual physical enemies, but they can also be emotional enemies, like doubt or jealousy or fear.
Doubt, jealousy, fear, foes both physical and emotional regroup to defeat the main character’s goal, and the main character’s “great”/“awful” situation disintegrates.
Show the protagonist’s newly-built world beginning to unravel.
This will also be one of the longer sections in your novel.
All is Lost (75%)
This is when something happens to make your character hit rock bottom.
It’s the absolute lowest part of your novel.
Maybe someone or something dies (either literally or figuratively).
The initial goal now looks even more impossible than before. And here, something or someone dies.
It can be physical or emotional, but the death of something old makes way for something new to be born.
What does this moment look like for your protagonist?
Dark Night of the Soul (76-80%)
Your protagonist now has time to react to their “All is lost” moment, to mourn what they lost and wallow in hopelessness.
They’re worse off than they were at the beginning of the novel.
Show how low things have gotten.
Mourning the loss of what has “died” – the dream, the goal, the mentor character, the love of your life, etc.
But, you must fall completely before you can pick yourself back up and try again.
ACT 3
Break Into 3 (80%; Choosing Act Three)
The “aha!” moment; the “lift yourself up and try again” moment.
Show the protagonist realizing what they need to do in order to tackle their problems, both external and internal.
Thanks to a fresh idea, new inspiration, or last-minute Thematic advice from the B Story (usually the love interest), the main character chooses to try again.
Finale (81-99%)
The protagonist does what they decided to do in the Break Intro 3 beat, and (because of all the learning/growing they’ve done and the support or insight from the B Story), their plan works.
This time around, the main character incorporates the Theme – the nugget of truth that now makes sense to them – into their fight for the goal because they have experience from the A Story and context from the B Story.
The Bad Guys are defeated, the world is changed for the better.
What are the battles? How will the protagonist triumph (or not)?
This is another longer section, so you’ve got the space to make things dramatic and intense.
Act Three is about Synthesis.
Final Image (99-100%)
This is the opposite of the Opening Image, the “after” snapshot instead of the “before.”
Show the reader how the protagonist and their world have changed.
THE END
Sources: 1 2
572 notes · View notes
centrally-unplanned · 10 months
Text
The thing about morality is that it only matters when it's real. Discussions of rules or norms for what is right or wrong are almost always, at some level, illusions, approximating reality and guiding decisions in an uncertain world - which does not make them useless, just contextual. Profaning god in your bedroom can never be “wrong” - there is no one to hear you, no one to be hurt by it. You can only show something is really wrong from the intentions of the actions and their results.
So with that out of the way, lets talk about Knives Chau - and specifically, how the comic vs the anime handled that part of the story.
Scott Pilgrim vs The Reification of Dating a High Schooler
There is an extremely pervasive meme in Scott Pilgrim discourse that our titular Scott is a scumbag. Our returning whipping boy the Kotaku article loves this idea, describing Scott’s “detestable behavior” and wondering “was it too subtle the first time about Scott being an absolute shitbag?”. There is this viral headline screenshot from an interview floating around right now riding that same line:
Tumblr media
Which is, of course, pretty much false. Its up to you in the end, “shitbag” is a subjective description, but the story just isn’t about events that would be described that way. Its the story of a guy getting over an awful ex, hurting some people, then meeting a new person, and realizing step-by-step what it takes to be their partner and levelling up as a person each time he does. He starts off broken, and Ramona of course is just as broken - getting better is their mutual arc. And its fundamentally about relationship drama - those stakes don’t make you a scumbag lol, just clueless, unless you are terminally online and don’t know what real stakes are.
I will let O’Malley get the last word in with his quote the writer of that interview is hilariously trying to torture into his headline:
There's a bit of, like, young people see Scott Pilgrim a certain way, and, you know, there's a lot of, like, 18-19-year-old fans that are really judgmental of the character. They're like, "Oh, he's a bad person. I would never do that." But I always tell them, like, get back to me when you're 25 or 30, tell me how your 20s went. Were you a bad person? Everyone has to make choices and do things in life that maybe they're not going to be proud of later.
Scott is a scumbag the way everyone is - you yourself will likely commit similar sins; that at least seems to be the authorial intent, and I agree with it.
So how does dating Knives Chau slot into this?
Despite the memes, age, in fact, is just a number - two consenting people dating does not a sin make. The reason dating underage people is bad is because of its consequences, not the categorical imperative. So what are the consequences of dating Knives Chau in the comic?
Knives is, as a consequence of dating a guy who is simply via his age able to appear so much cooler than her peers to her, absolutely obsessed with Scott. She worships his band:
Tumblr media
She starts aping his taste in music and interests; she slots herself into his circle of friends, who don’t relate to her, even after their breakup (often drinking her way through it):
Tumblr media
She totally spirals after he cheats on her and leaves her, blaming everyone but him; she is wounded and hurt for months, a year, over a relationship that lasted weeks:
Tumblr media
Knives Chau is a literal poster child for why you should not date a high schooler. She is, at every turn, emotionally not ready to date someone who is not at her own level of social development, and is deeply affected by it. It is, sometimes, played for laughs - that is the nature of the comic, everything is played for laughs, but I would have given it a bit more dramatic space myself - but over the course of the story Scott himself realizes how much of an ass he was to her, and how he didn’t take what happened seriously.
The reason I view this with charity is what Scott did to lead to this - he met a cute girl on the bus! He was deeply hurt and kind of numb in life, and found someone who was safe and easy to talk to. He never attempts to kiss her (she starts trying to kiss him which he repeatedly rejects) they don’t even hold hands, and it lasted a few weeks. He knew deep down, pretty much immediately, it was fake:
Tumblr media
Then he met an actual person he liked, and with some browbeating from Wallace agreed to break up with her, but chickened out for a day. Then the next day he decides to break up with her, and she drops the L bomb before he can, so he instantly ends it. It is really awkward for everyone involved.
Pushing off an awkward and uncomfortable conversation resulting from a dumb decision you made on a whim for a week - god I relate to that, that’s everyone! If you think it isn’t you I think you're lying. Its why this relationship is so interesting in the comic - Scott is always one step removed from it, putting it at abeyance, and the fact that something so minor to him is so destructive to her is a really good portrait of how these kinds of things happen. Its so easy to hurt someone when you don’t even know what the stakes are, and when its coming not from malice, but from weakness. Its a very good portrayal of a bad relationship because its bad in a relatable way, even if as a story is a bit more dramatic than is typical. And its a great portrayal of how fraught age gaps can be - this bad relationship is part of what makes the comic a good story.
But its 2023, we don’t give a shit about any of that anymore!
O’Malley in the same interview discusses the cultural shift around these kind of relationships:
I felt like in this day and age, I had to provide clarity on that [relationship]. Because when I wrote the first books, I took it for granted that people would understand that dating a high schooler was a bad thing. But on the internet, in this day and age, people are like, "He's dating a high schooler. That's terrible!" Like, that's pretty much what I say on page 1 of the book. But I try to spell it out a little bit more this time.
He isn’t telling the full story though - it was bad in 2004, but not bad the way it is today. Its dubiousness was mitigated by its frequency; people were doing this kind of shit all the time. Scott Pilgrim is a bass guitarist in an indie band; fucking groupies is like built into the cover charge. Half the problem Scott has in dating Knives is that she is the wrong kind of 17-year-old - had Scott met her at 1 am in the aftermath of a Born Ruffian’s concert at the Whippet Lounge knocking down shots off the back of her fake ID, no one would have even noticed. Hell, no one does notice; there is someone who actually makes out with a drunk 17-year-old Knives Chau in the comic Scott Pilgrim, and isn’t Scott Pilgrim:
Tumblr media
No one cares about Kim’s inebriated petting session here; that is 10% because she is a Girl and Girls Can’t Be Predators, 40% because she isn’t the main character, and 50% because Kim Pine’s dating history is not a useful proxy battleground for GamerGate-adjacent nerd culture wars in ~2014; but that is road that goes directly to hell, so let's veer back.
The point, of course, is that in 2004 this is a crime flecked with normality, something your friend would do and you would maybe just cock an eyebrow at:
Tumblr media
Its not that in discourse today - it is radically more condemned. It is not a contextual sin, but an original sin. It underwent a process I am calling reification - where it goes from being just a shifting descriptor of reality, to a thing in itself, with a defined (reified) meaning. And to be clear, that is in a lot ways on net a good thing? The reality is that, despite everyone’s protestations, there are today thousands of 17-year-olds taking the L line out to a gig at the Brooklyn Steel and going down on a 25-year-old guy they just met in a back alley off Frost St who swears he’s a “drummer in a sick new band” that played here “just last week”, he promises, and she is having a great time, bragging to her friends about how hot his tattoo was, and then shipping herself off to Cornell next year to start on her pre-med track with barely a memory. But for every dozen of those, there is at least one person who is deeply, deeply hurt, a Knives Chau who never deserved this. The rest can have a slightly worse time, its probably worth it.
That does not make it a categorical imperative, though - the reification has masked that truth. The crime comes from the context - those other girls aren’t victims, they would laugh at you for suggesting they were. But in 2023, Scott Pilgrim Takes Off is no longer concerned with context. It is telling you, right to your face, that Scott is a bad dude. Over and over and over - jokes from the Evil League about “wow, I thought we were evil”, its not subtle.
Yet meanwhile, Knives Chau is, like, fine? She dates Scott, is totally into him, and then literally in the middle of his funeral forgets about him for Envy crashing it:
Tumblr media
Picks up the bass and has yuri-inflected playtime with Kim the literal next day:
Tumblr media
And less than a week later is pitching an off-broadway musical adaption of Scott’s life to a billionaire Matthew Patel - I can’t explain that okay, I’m as confused as you are.
She is mad at Scott, sure, but she is over it in a matter of days. Hell, notice how she was already a fan of the Clash at Demonhead now? There is no scene of Scott introducing her to his kind of music. He didn’t change her. By the end she is a member of his band and they are totally chill:
Tumblr media
This is, again, about a week or two later.
Knives is not an important character in this show, way less than in the original, this is no grand sin. But I still find it very interesting: O’Malley is wrong. He “spells it out” way less in this version when it comes to the actual consequences of Scott’s actions. Everyone’s verbal condemnations are substitutes to replace the real damage his actions dealt in the comic. Scott is a better person this time, in a world that has universally agreed he is worse (still not a good move ofc). Even Scott’s moment of apology to Knives about their dating is so tepid its almost Straussian:
Tumblr media
Its ‘frowned upon’…which is not the same thing as saying it was wrong! I don’t think this is intentional, its just funny, but its a nice capstone nevertheless.
And it had to be this way, not just for media in general, but for Scott Pilgrim in particular. Not only are sexual crimes far more reified today, but Scott Pilgrim’s sin of dating a high schooler is reified as well - its the first piece of discourse everyone encounters about it. Its the ur-debate of the franchise. The idea of actively engaging on this point, and digging deeper into it…its too hot, too controversial. Way better to shy away from it, disown it. The discourse wrote this part of the script over the course of a decade; its not something the creatives had any say in.
Honestly they should have just gone all the way - just make Knives 19. Then how tepid it is wouldn’t be a distraction anymore. Scott can just be an asshole for cheating on her, that would work fine. If you aren’t going to commit to the reality of these things, you shouldn’t bother with it at all.
817 notes · View notes
shut-up-danny-kun · 5 months
Text
I've read hundreds of Star Trek TOS fics by now and it never ceases to amuse me how many different ways there are to fuck up Spock's characterization...now hold on just a minute - this post has a more interesting point than “fanfic writers stupid”, I promise you.
Every time, it's a spin on the massacre wheel. It's kind of amazing. Will he be overly emotional to the point where he's not himself anymore? Will he be so cold it's unpleasant and kind of hard to understand how he's lived to this point? Will he be extremely horny for no good reason? Will he speak in a way that sounds complety wrong?
I chuckle and shake my head. Of course, I KNOW what Spock is like, and MY interpretation of him is the most perfect and correct one. Obviously. He's just a very nuanced character, formed by many people in an unconventional way, with traits that seem to contradict each other at first but ultimately form a rich and unique character that so many people fell in love with specifically because he's so complicated...
Or...is he?
Let's entertain the idea that there isn't one correct interpretation of Spock, that all of these messy bits of characterization are not part of a bigger picture, but...just what they are: a product of many people with starkly different visions, working on a show that refuses to properly develop its characters. What then? Well, then Spock is a Rorschach test. Each viewer connects the random dots in their own way, and ignores the ones they don't like.
Let's use an example: me! In my interpretation of Spock (the most correct one, of course) he is, first of all, gay and on the asexual spectrum, reserved, largely uninterested in casual flirting or sex. When he is interested in the aforementioned things, he tends to be quite ashamed of it.
Makes sense, right? I can show you plenty of evidence for why that could be true. However, in the beginning of the first bloody season, Uhura sings a song about how Spock is actually kind of a heartthrob who likes to drive women insane with how hot he is, and Spock smiles. He smiles at her, as if agreeing and being very amused by all this! This interaction goes against pretty much everything I think about Spock. So what do I do? I explain it away in the most bizzare fucking way possible. See, Uhura and Spock are friends (there is no evidence for this), and Uhura knows everything I've just told you about him (through telepathy I guess? Not like he'd ever tell her!) and she's just trolling him (why would she do that? That is NOTHING like Uhura!). I need to do some Olympics-level mental gymnastics here, the opposite of Occam's razor.
“But Danny,” I hear you say, “it's just the start of the show! They hadn't figured out his character yet!”
To which I say: you can say that about anything! You can blame it all on a bad writer for that episode, and ignore virtually any scene that doesn't jive with your headcanons. It's there, and I can't ignore it.
So...how am I different from the people that want Spock to be thar heartthrob Uhura is singing about? That evidence is as much a part of canon as my favorite lines. Well, I'm not any different, that's the thing. And all those writers I complained about also have a point.
It's kind of a nihilistic take, I know, but maybe the reason Spock is such a cultural icon is because he is...whatever you want him to be: just concrete enough to spur on your imagination, yet vague and contradictory enough to let your brain fill in the gaps.
Don't get me wrong: I absolutely do not believe in this. In my mind, it just so happens that I'm one of the, like, 5 people ever who truly understood Spock (and one of them is Jim Kirk himself). But I still think it's something worth thinking about next time you're mad at a fic.
266 notes · View notes
forevermore05 · 5 months
Text
Zuko and his protectiveness over Katara backfired on the show
I think we're all quite aware of the fact that Zuko is canonically very protective over Katara
Exhibit A
When he saves Katara from falling rubble in the Western air temple.
Exhibit B
When he protects Katara from flames in that same episode when she is about to blood bend that fire nation soldier.
Exhibit C
The famous Agni Kai where he take lightning for Katara
Now why are these so significant? I think these are big gestures are to show Zuko's efforts to make amends after what he did to Katara. It could be argued these are very extreme ways of making it up to her because these came at the cost of his life. But this also goes to show his character development, as he is willing to protect Katara from danger. For me, one of the reasons why I ship them is because of his protectiveness. It's refreshing to see a character that has always been there to help and to be a support system to others be protected by someone else. I think it can be very fulfilling as a viewer. This effort that was made to write their relationship was so genuine, and it felt so heartfelt as the viewer, that it just made their dynamic one of the strongest in the show. Whether that be romantically or just platonically, their dynamic is probably one of the best in my opinion.
Now, with all that his protectiveness towards Katara immediately evaporate after the last Agni Kai which was pretty shocking, as they didn't get time to be able to talk about what happened. I feel like it removes a piece of genuineness from the show that the characters care for each other. And of course I know a reason why this could have happened is because, well, Kataang and Maiko exist. I think what made their dynamics so strong is because of their protectiveness for one another. Especially, Zuko's protectiveness over Katara. When it was removed in the comics, it felt like a bond had been destroyed because a big part of their dynamic was protecting each other and being there for each other, and having that level of communication. They were protecting each other through their communication and through their support for one another.
How I feel like it backfired on the show is that it created a bit of an emptiness in both of the characters. Especially when they interacted, it felt more distant in the comics, and it felt as if they were strangers. Zuko's writing, which leads to him being protective over her, is so poignant in their relationship that once it is removed it creates a hole in a way it makes his character feel more hollow in his relationship with Katara. It feels like an effort to create a divide and an erasure of their past and how significant his taking lightning for her was. A show that is built of meaningful character relationships took a piece of its own heart out and of its own show and stabbed it in front of all of us when it came to the erasure of Zutara. So they could push the canon ships. They were willing to remove that important element of character relationships for 2 poorly written couples.
I think it creates a level of ingenuity in this show. That is not shocking as many of Katara's other love interests met the same fate of ingenuity, whether that be Jet or Haru. Where she's never able to show her feelings about these people. Which I find quite strange seeing how the show aims to create depth and talk about feelings that actually provoke feelings in you. They don't actually go in-depth with what the leading lady's thoughts are about other people. For all the sake of keeping the focus on Kataang it costs the good writing for Katara to be able to feel complex emotions about the other male interests in her life. And it leads to a rough ending for a strong dynamic like Zuko and Katara that shows their desperation for Kataang at the cost of good writing especially for Katara.
206 notes · View notes
Note
Which dorm arc do you think was the best written? I liked the ignihyde arc the most if I have to be honest
Tumblr media
This might be unfair to the other books (since most of them have fewer parts/less time for their stories + book 7 isn't even complete yet for me to judge), but I think the writing in book 6 is the strongest (as in, "most interesting" and "most narratively sound") so far. What gives book 6 a massive leg up over other books is that the conflicts addressed in book 6 were foreshadowed WAY in advance through other content like voice lines, vignettes (I believe Ortho's Precision Gear), and events (like Wish Upon a Star). It was sooo satisfying to see all of the payoff (and Idia breaking down)!!
I don't think the other books are bad by any means except for book 2, sorry not sorry Leona, I just feel that 6 had a lot of space to touch on more characters and their development than only the Ignihyde boys; I loved catching up with characters we've already met and seeing how they've grown or changed, even in little ways. Additionally, I personally prefer stories with "high stakes" and family-oriented drama involved in them, so they biases me quite a bit toward book 6. The high stakes and family drama angle is also true of book 7, but again, it's not out in its entirety yet so I'm going to reserve my judgment until it has.
Something that's unique to book 7 (and that I wish previous books did, even if it elongates them significantly) is actually deepening our understanding of every character within the dorm. I would have been so bored if book 7 focused solely on Malleus. I loved getting to learn more about what makes Lilia tick, and seeing how Sebek and Silver develop from their experiences. I feel like I didn't get a significant enough of a look into many of the other boys during the main story campaign... Instead, we're often told about things that happened without truly witnessing it for ourselves. I know, I know, that's the whole point of a visual novel--expecting a lot of reading. I still would have preferred like... more flashbacks and scenes demonstrating what we're being told rather than the dialogue doing it for us. Show me how Riddle's relationship with Chenya and Trey has changed since their childhood! Show me young Jack being inspired by Leona's play and wanting to be in the same team as him! Etc., etc., etc. I could always look to vignettes and event stories for more lore on each character, but those are always portrayed as "AUs", whereas the main story is what is 'canon" so it's sort of sad to see that we never get to look any closer at most of the supporting cast upon that bigger stage.
It’s exciting that we now get to see more of the boys since we’re now dream hopping for book 7; I’m just going to hold my judgment for now since I found the pacing uneven and a little quick for what we’ve seen of Pomefiore so far, especially when compared to the longer Lilia dream segment. Again, I find book 6 stronger in this regard but that could be because its scale is slightly smaller and it has fewer characters to juggle. I guess we’ll have to wait and see how book 7 wraps up—maybe it’ll completely win me over!
111 notes · View notes
lookingforhappy · 1 month
Text
TUA wasn't "always meant to end like this" nor did it build up to a tragic everybody dies ending in any way
sorry this is long and rambly but im noticing a lot of people coming out of the woodworks saying that the ending wasnt even bad actually and i just.. its not a redeemable ending to me and yes it does ruin the rest of the show for me and i wish i had the strength to make it not so but im stuck rn.. anyway:
i don't think i can forgive the ending, more than anything that happened in the final season
they had interesting character points, in an interesting setting.
and yeah they didnt tie up anything, and several people were out of character this season but thats nothing new in this fandom
eudora was forgotten, diego and luthers personalities didnt develop they were altered to be more palatable for the audience, grace and pogo became cameo characters instead of finishing their arcs or development in a meaningful way, reginalds plan has made less and less sense as the seasons go on, the commission was entirely changed from its set up in s1 and then forgotten.
thats all forgivable as long as the season is self contained and satisfys the tone and story.
s4 did none of these things - its not self contained as it leaves jennifer and abigail severely underexplained, and then flips the tone and message of the entire series on its head.
people have already noted that the theme of the show is that recovery from abuse haunts you into adulthood but with love and hard work and perserverance you can overcome it. the apocalypse has always been a metaphor for the cycle of abuse and how it continues to harm people after its been done, and how allowing it to dictate your life will end up in it imploding in your face etc.
but theres also just the general tone of the show.
the final season tries to make out that the siblings are themselves responsible for the apocalypses and only their death can prevent more apocalypses (twisting the meaning to be that of "if you have trauma then you should kill yourself" which like.. clearly bad, no explanation needed)
but to pull through on this ending the previous seasons need to have ended in tragedy too, or hinted towards it tonally. they never do.
the obvious way to do this would be to write each season ending/apocalypse to be sad/tragic. have the focus be on the people dying horribly in pain, show the remorse of the siblings, punish them by making it personal, show that they killed everyone and they know it.
the only season that even slightly does this is s1 as patch is killed because of diego, pogo and grace are killed because of luther and viktor, and the rest of the supporting cast is killed due to viktor.
but even season 1 isnt framed as a tragedy or a story leading up tot a tragedy.
its a story of hope. the siblings arent upset by the apocalypse because they can survive and prevent it and theres hope for the future and more specifically for THEIR future. nothing else remains from this timeline other than them because the whole show is centred as their recovery story. their hope.
if this was ever going to be presented as a hopeless tragedy then we needed to see characters like claire killed brutally. we needed to actually see Grace's lifeless body. we needed to see the consequences and see that nothing they did was fixing anything by having these consequences follow them and not just in a "this happened and im sad" but in everyone around them and them becoming worse as time goes by.
if they wanted the whole "we cant exist" ending to work then we needed to frame s1 and all subsequent seasons to actually show that it was their actions that caused the apocalypses.
viktor causes the first apocalypse because of reginald's abuse.
the US government causes the second apocalypse because they tortured an innocent to the brink of death and then got upset and aggressive when that had consequences (viktors powers overspilling and destroying the fbi building). like sorry that apocalypse was never viktors fault - its like false confession under torture, it doesnt count as real because he only did it to make torture stop.
the 3rd apocalypse is caused by Harlan accidentally killing their mothers, which again is not even his fault. he didnt want to kill them he just lost control and he had no idea that it would end the world (logically it shouldnt because this apocalypse defies the laws of time that they themselves established for the show).
the final apocalypse isnt even caused by them its caused by abigail and reginald. as are, technically, all of the apocalypses as abigail created the marigold and reginald released it and created the broken timeline by allowing it to travel with him to the umbrellas world.
in s2 the apocalypse has no consequences because they prevent it. ray and sissy and harlan get to live. klaus' cult memeber get to live. they even punctuate this ending by showing that theyre moving on and progressing in their healing because ben is finally allowed to move on with his afterlife, and he is no longer kept there, stalling their recovery from his death. even five's integration into the family again in s1 showed growth and recovery and HOPE.
in s3 the world is saved, and luther is brought back to life and five and diegos limbs are returned. everyone who was erased/died like lilas family and reginald are brought back to life because there is HOPE.
if they wanted to sell a tragedy and sell it well then we needed to see consequences. allison should have died in s1. five should have given up and returned to the commission in s2. luther should have stayed dead in s3. their families should have died and caused them pain.
nothing about this ending followed through on the theme of hope.
there are ways to do it. and its been done well.
romeo and juliet works because they are remembered. star wars prequels are loved because its a doomed from the beginning story that ends with hope in the form of luke saving his fathers soul and returning the jedi to their true state - protectors and peace keepers. frodo and bilbo return from their journeys ill and grieving and forever changed, and they and the magic beings of middle earth have to pass on before their time because of the harm of their stories. macbeth dies in the end because his story was one of a hero becoming a villain.
theres so many good examples of tragic endings but s4 wasnt one of them.
91 notes · View notes
starry-bi-sky · 6 months
Note
I am absolutely loving your Danyal Al Ghul au. While I have a soft spot for the whole plotline of Danny becoming his canon personality almost right after breaking away from the LOA all because of Jazz, I'm just as much for your take in which he goes through the same character development as Damian.
Now I'm curious. You already tackled his relationship with Dani, will you eventually take a stab at when he, Sam, and Tucker meet Gregor? Given that it's one of my hated episodes as I couldn't stand Sam's infuriatingly hypocritical attitude to Danny's suspicions of him, I'd kill to see your spin on it.
Aw, thank you! Danyal Al Ghul aus are what got me into DPDC first, so I have a major soft spot for them. That being said, uh, its exactly that soft spot that causes me to have Many Opinions about the trope you just mentioned. Like the trope is all fine and dandy, i don't blindly hate it, my main issue with it is that most aus i've seen treat his backstory as an ex-assassin more like a pretty cosmetic accessory rather than something that actually should have had an impact on him. Especially if he remembers being in the league.
Like i cannot stress enough the fact that being in an ecofascist assassin cult (regardless of his standing in it) should've left him, in some way or another, screwed up morally and psychologically because that's just how development works. Nature vs. Nurture is like a game of tug-o-war that never ends, where they are constantly fighting against each other and one side usually has the upper hand or greater influence. Children model the behaviors of the adults around them (ex: bobo the clown doll experiment), and what impacts them in childhood can stick with them permanently.
Like how my psychology professor put it: a baby's brain is like wet cement; if you slap your hand on it, it leaves an imprint, and the cement dries that way. The same rings true for small children.
I could go on, but I frankly have so many thoughts on that alone that I would end up completely derailing from the second half of your ask, and I don't want to be more critical than I already have. Especially since you just mentioned you have a soft spot for the trope.
[Okay, hold onto your hats because this is long. Naturally lmao.]
Gregor! Man, I'll admit I last watched the show back in middle school on a dodgy illegal website (it had surprisingly good audio and visual graphics, and full episodes. But really annoying porn ads.) but I only made it to like season 1 before my hyperfixation faded and I lost interest. So I never actually saw the Gregor episode.
But... it is relatively easy to find free websites that stream Danny Phantom :), so finding the episode took me like. Thirty seconds. Plus the Tv.Tropes recap page because my damn earbuds just died and im out in public as of rn.
I'm not sure if I'll write something for the gregor episode like I did with Dani, since Dani's a bit of a special case in that she's a clone and tends to be a reoccurring presence in DPDC, and I thought the new dynamic with Danyal would be interesting.
Plus, I'm not a big amethyst ocean shipper for the pure reason of I'm just not all that interested in it; its kinda bland to me. I'll admit I've entertained the thought in this au due to the whole balcony scene i wrote, but I would've entertained the thought anyways if it was Tucker in that position instead. Big multishipper, me.
But, if I had to make it official? Danyal is not interested romantically in Sam when the Gregor episode happens, regardless of his relationship with Valerie. Who, speaking of I'm trying to think about how that would go, and I'm torn between including him almost-dating Valerie or not.
Because on one hand it helps point out Sam's hypocrisy (and i love her but i am always happy to point out her flaws and address them in au) in this episode in terms of Danny spying on them, but on the other hand I'll want to include a lot of set up in order to make Gray Ghost work in this au and wow will that take a while.
Especially with the Flirting with Disaster episode because it happens due to Technus' meddling, and Danny is, well, the son of the Batman? A trained assassin? An ex-assassin nonetheless, but still an assassin? A prodigy child in this au? He might not have needed to use most of his skills in the last few years, but like... there's just a bunch of 'what if' and 'well technically...' and 'would he? he could, but would he?' things that is getting in the way of my thought process and making my head spin.
.
Mmm. Okay. Flirting with Disaster occurs relatively the same as canon with a few exceptions; like Danyal noticing the strange coincidences, and he might take the idea into proper consideration because Sam has a point it is strange, especially out of nowhere.
However,,, he really enjoys Valerie's company, and he does really like her. He's been adjusting to civilian life for the last four years and while he's made a lot of progress, he's still. an ex-assassin child living like a wolf amongst sheep. This is normal, typical teenager stuff, and usually his friends like to encourage him doing normal teenager stuff.
So he's stubbornly holding out on the thought that this is normal, that ghost stuff isn't interfering here. He's a little hurt that his friends are discouraging this, he's not bothered by the fact that Valerie is a ghost hunter and he a ghost -- his mother is an assassin, and his father is Batman, and they still had a relationship. (Granted, he's not gonna tell them that)
If anything, being diametrically opposed to each other but still being in love is part of the family! Granted, usually both parties are aware of said opposition to each other, but he'll make a special exception this time around.
(And man now that i'm thinking about gray ghost, im now thinking about various like. scenes i could write between the two of them. maybe in a reblog.)
Anyways uhhh things relatively go the same as canon. Yeah. I think Sam still has a crush on Danny and still spies out of jealousy with Tucker.
.
Now, the Gregor episode! With that out of the way; the TVTropes recap for this episode isn't the best because it doesn't go into detail about the entire episode like it does with Flirting With Disaster and Shades of Gray.
(which i looked at earlier because I made a section of this post talking briefly about what changes I'd make to the Shades of Gray episode to help set up Gray Ghost, but ended up deleting because it was kinda irrelevant for the matter at hand.)
So I'm taking in bits of the episode clips at a time, I'll try not to get too nitpicky about how each scene goes because then it's gonna take me a longer time to write this.
But! First thing's first; since Danny is not romantically interested in Sam, he is also not jealous of Gregor. He is however, a bit eyebrow-raisey at him in their first introduction, but that's because Gregor is coming off as obnoxious.
Danny thinks he's kinda annoying, and it doesn't take a genius to see that Gregor is trying to impress Sam. But since they've only known him for five minutes he takes the good faith assumption and assumes that Gregor is genuinely trying to show interest in Sam's interests too because he likes her, so he keeps mum. The fake hungarian accent is weird, but it's overall harmless, so he doesn't point it out.
He does do the spying thing when he starts suspecting that Gregor might be working for the GIW. The episode only has this happen twice, but for the au this happens a handful of more times over the course of the week, with Danyal's suspicion steadily rising more and more each time.
Hah, when he brings up wanting to spy on Sam and Gregor because of this reason, Tucker still does his "woah! you wanna spy on Sam?" thing.
Danny immediately turns to him, completely unimpressed, and crosses his arms. "Tucker," he says, deadpan, "you and Sam spied on me and Valerie."
He uses a combination of his ghost powers and his regular stealth ability to spy on them. He's hiding in a tree when they're skipping rocks, close enough that he can use his powers to hear them talk but far enough away that he has a good view of their surroundings.
He's invisible in the cinema, but doesn't accidentally get in front of the projector. He checks the inside of the room for the GIW, and then waits outside the actual room itself, keeping an eye on the area and occasionally flying in to watch the movie out of boredom. It reminds him of being back on a recon mission with the League, but it doesn't end with him orchestrating someone's death.
Then when they're at the mall he stays in human form, blending in with the crowd. He runs into the GIW there, but realizes that they're not there because of Gregor; they're just shopping. They didn't show up at either of the last two locations, and he follows them to make sure they're not also trying to blend in. But they're literally just there for shopping.
Danny is rather pleased with this turnout; so far Gregor isn't a spy, he's just annoying. The next day at lunch he asks Sam how her date with Gregor went, and that's how she figures out he spied on them, because well, she didn't tell him that.
"Have you been spying on me?"
Danny messes with his food a little bit, and Tucker is sinking into his seat with embarrassment. He frowns, "Only last night. Those incompetent government dodos--"
His lip curls up; he gets all 'Shakespeare-y' (as Sam and Tucker put it) when he's insulting someone, "--kept appearing whenever Gregor did. I followed you and him last night to make sure he wasn't a spy."
A roundabout way of saying, "I was worried".
Sam is, as canon, furious. Danny understands why, he knows generally speaking that people don't like being spied on. But he's confused on just how angry she is, and is a little irritated by it.
"Why would you do that!" She exclaims, "That's way out of line, Danny."
"How? You spied on me when I was going on dates with Valerie." He narrows his eyes, and points his fork at her, "I'm not blind, I noticed."
"That's different, we told you why we were suspicious. And we don't have ghost powers like you do."
"I don't need ghost powers to sneak around, Sam, you've seen this firsthand. And I just told you why I followed you, I thought he was working with the guys in white--"
"So you think someone can only be interested in me if they're after you?" (this is a paraphrased quote, folks ;D)
"No! If that was the case I would have voiced my concern the moment I thought it. I don't get why you're so angry, you spied too."
Iiits.... a mess. Sam storms off with Gregor, Tucker tags along because okay, yeah, maybe Gregor isn't with the GIW, or maybe last night was a fluke. Either way he ends up tagging along. Danny overhears that conversation between the GIW and Mr. Lancer, and maybe he's right, maybe he's wrong; but something is up.
I've gotten to that scene in the locker room where Gregor tells Danny that he knows he doesn't like him, and I've paused at Danny's reply to say this: Danyal doesn't even bother trying to deny it.
"I know you do not like me."
"You're right; I don't."
"Ah, let me finish. I know you do not like me because you want to protect your friend, Sam, and I respect that."
"...That's correct."
"Good! Because I am going to ask her out."
"I had a feeling you'd say that," he stands up, claps his hand tight on Gregor's shoulder, and leans close to him with a threatening smile, "so you understand me when i say; if you break my best friend's heart, you're as good as dead, right?"
"Ah,, yes. I am so glad we got that cleared out of the way, and now I hope after we can.. how you Americans put it, hang out?"
In the episode he hugs Danny and gives him a la bise (which is that french greeting where you kiss someone on the cheek two or more times) after they end their conversation. But here, when he goes to do that to Danyal, Danny leans away, points an accusatory finger at him, and says; "Absolutely not; we are not close."
The next scene after that is like, end of day. Sam, Tucker, and Gregor walking away. Sam looks over her shoulder to glare at Danny, then gets forlorn. Tucker looks back and just looks forlorn.
(When did I start narrating each scene?? Eh, I'm writing this in brief spurts of time throughout the day. Don't fix what's not broke)
After that there's this whole scene with the two GIW agents that have been chasing Phantom all episode. They're there because they have Tucker's PDA that Skulker took, and it's got the information of their purple backed gorilla assignment on it. They've been going around seeing who Tucker associates with in hopes of catching Phantom.
Uhh ahaha and that is where this gets a little interesting imo, and also allows me to mention that im retconning Danyal's (already) redesigned ghost form. Which I've wanted to retcon even before this moment bc it was just too busy. I'll get to that in a moment.
The GIW suspect Gregor for being the Phantom because of his white hair and green eyes, which is all fine and dandy until you remember: Danyal (and by extension Phantom) has that very noticeable, rather identifiable facial scar that goes across the middle of his fucking face. The GIW could easily suspect that Phantom hides his scar with makeup if he's in disguise, but if they meet a kid with a seemingly identical facial scar and similar disposition? Hoo boy.
Solution? I've got two: Gregor is canonically a kid from Michigan who faked everything to impress Sam. Considering he knows she's gothic and knows that she's ultra-recyclo vegetarian? He probably watched her from afar or got information on her somehow. His hair is dyed, his eyes might just naturally be green, but if he notices that she's got a crush on either Danyal or Phantom? A little sfx makeup could help him recreate a similar looking scar.
My second solution that's gonna happen anyways bc its that suit redesign; Danyal does hide his face as Phantom. Ghosts are emotional creatures and its a popular headcanon that their interests, ambitions, etc, influence the way they look as a ghost, not just their death. A big reoccurring theme of my au is that Danyal did not leave the League unscathed, and that being an assassin is an important part of his identity.
So i'm discarding the hazmat suit look entirely and leaning into the 'assassin' thing. But the general (stylized) feel is like, white ribbon/cloth vambraces that he has used as a garrote at some point, a hood, a gaiter scarf-type thing. I'm keeping the cape. I did a doodle a few days back that's not the official redesign, but a redesign for Phantom. I may reblog this post with that attached because it's got the general feel down. There's very little white involved, but the inside of his cape flares out and looks like the night sky.
Now, the hood and gaiter scarf gets rid of most of the problem, but Danny's hood doesn't stay on all the time, so the GIW have likely seen the upper half of the scar. :] Gregor's own drawn-on scar doesn't have to be 1:1, but it looks close enough, right? A small scar cutting through the edge of his brow and ends right below the corner of his eye. A 'cool, badass' one opposed to Danny's 'garish' scar.
But! Back to the episode scene. Canon Danny gets written off as being 'too prepubescent' to be Phantom, and honestly it'd be hilarious if Danyal was written off for the same reason (he's calling them idiots in his head if they do). But instead -- leaning into the GIW's incompetence here -- he gets written off as being too mature or too talkative. Or something equally as absurd.
Sam breaks up with Gregor for canon reasons, but when Gregor does his "i really like you, but, come on-!" and gestures to tucker, he adds on "and that scary friend of yours too, seriously!"
Things go relatively the same as canon after that. Danny does end up apologizing for spying, however. Sam does it first. Sorrows, prayers, all that.
.
Things usually end up changed or different when I actually write it down, so I'd likely add more or adjust different scenes according to the flow of the oneshot. This is just like, a general vibe of how things would go, and where some of the more obvious changes would be if I did write this oneshot.
Hope you enjoyed! Thanks for the ask :]
#dp x dc#dpxdc#dpxdc crossover#danyal al ghul au#danyal al ghul#i dont even mind the trope that danny becomes like his canon self i just want *some* kind of impact on him. but as it stands most aus i've#seen lowkey treat his assassin background as an accessory. like dyeing your hair or piercing your ears. that being said its also a silly#au where they're brothers and are related to each other and thus doesn't have to be that deep at all! im just bored of seeing the same thin#all the time. especially considering danny is usually depicted as the paler/whiter passing twin and being the 'kinder. more compassionate'#one between the two of them. give me danny who suffered crises of morality! danny whose morally darker than a cloud#morally orange and blue danny who sooner understands 'dont litter' than 'dont murder'. arrogant danny! he dotes on the people he loves but#is an utter bitch to everyone else and thus has to learn to be kinder. danny discovering himself outside being an assassin#his brother remembers a kind and compassionate older brother because thats how danny interacted with him. But danny had no qualms turning#around and slicing the tendons of one of the other assassins because of smth they did that displeased him.#he can still be like his canon self but shouldn't there be something that stays behind? Lingering like a blast shadow?#danny who carries weapons on him always even though he knows he doesn't need it but it makes him feel safer.#danny who spits out the oddest. most foreboding shit sometimes and his friends just stare at him and go 'bro what the fuck??'#idk if i can share the website where i found the episodes bc of risk of copyright. but just search up#'where can i watch danny phantom for free' and look for a reddit post with that question. the comments give website options.#i keep thinking about gray ghost now. valerie finds herself becoming a member of the 'danny fenton protection squad' with sam and tucker#danny takes a page from his beloved mother's book and calls his partners 'beloved' and equally sappy pet names.#he also throws the BIGGEST shitstorm of the century when he finds out about what Axion Labs did to the dogs. hoo boy.
203 notes · View notes
machinesonix · 6 months
Text
Somehow I have made it this long without realizing that none of the screen adoptions of Dune so much as mention the Butlerian Jihad. Like I guess it's burned into my brain so hard I sort of assumed it was part and parcel of the universe. Don't get me wrong, I think that's probably the first thing you learn if you want to dive deeper into the setting, but it still hits me like if the LotR movies showed us the big flaming eyeball tower and was like ‘Oh, that's why there are bad things, but don't worry, that's just background stuff.’ Yeah, you can understand the movie, but if the story is just like Frodo vs. The Witch King you are losing out on any of the conversation about the corruptive allure of power or theological undertones. So without further ado let's pretend this is for the benefit of interested new fans roped in by the movies and not part of my desperate attempt to silence the howling specters of literary analysis that live in my blood.
The Butlerian Jihad is an event set ~10k years prior to the events of Dune in which humanity won their freedom from the machines that they had enslaved themselves to. As a result, it is a religious taboo to create a machine that thinks like a human. That's frankly the bulk of the information presented by Frank Herbert in the text without dipping into books 7+, but whether or not those are canon is frankly an enormous can of worms, which really makes sense when you consider the size of the worms. But boy howdy, Frank loved his subtext and parallelism. Everyone has a foil character, every theme is hit from multiple angles, and Villinueve has been doing an excellent job of capturing a lot of that in repeated imagery and dialogue. The Butlerian Jihad happens off camera, but it's themes are absolutely critical to the big picture.
The Butlerian Jihad was a holy war. It was not merely a rebellion against the machines, it was a crusade against them. The prohibition against thinking machines isn't just a law, it's in the pan-universal Bible. Absolute psychopath Pieter DeVries himself claps back at the Baron for insinuating he might have a use for a computer, and this is a guy who has been hired specifically for his preternatural absence of morals. Let's hold onto that idea for a minute. 
Probably my favorite scene in the first book is the one where planetologist Liet-Kynes is dying out in the desert. As the last of his strength fades to dehydration he hallucinates conversations he had with his father concerning terraforming Arakkis for human habitability. He's told that the means are not complicated. There is already enough water on the planet, the Little Makers just have it all trapped deep underground as part of the sandworm reproductive cycle. You just need to isolate enough water to start irrigating plant life, and once it's established that'll keep the water on the surface on its own. The hard part is making sure everyone on the planet is environmentally conscious enough to foster a developing ecosystem. Nobody can drink any of that water while it's being collected, because they'll just introduce it back into the water cycle where the Little Makers are. It's going to take generations, so that sort of water discipline is going to have to go above and beyond a social convention. People need to be willing to die before they'll take a sip and compromise the plan. Ghost Dad Kynes concludes that the only mechanism in the human experience to enforce this consensus is religion. 
In the context of this whole parallelism thing, you have probably noticed that the Butlerian Jihad is not the only holy war in the narrative. Paul sees a new jihad as the only way of creating a future where humans can flourish. Now you might be saying ‘Wait now, Machines. I thought the point of Paul’s holy war was to avenge Leto and disempower established power structures by taking away the control of the spice!’ And you’d be right. The thing is, without getting into spoiler territory, Dune Messiah is not going to be about how everything just gets so much better now that Paul has destroyed the economy, government, and untold billions of human lives. This isn’t the endgame. Dude can see the future and the way he does it involves looking into the past. Paul lives in a society defined by a holy war and his goal is to redefine society. 
Putting it all together you can see what I mean about the Butlerian Jihad being essential to the themes even though the story never shows us a thinking machine or a narrative beat where the absence of computers changes the outcome. It helps us see the big picture. I’ve seen a lot of dialogue lately on whether Paul is a tragic hero or a consummate villain and I’m not here to answer that, but I am here to underline the critical detail. Paul intends to be seen as a tyrant. Just like Kynes’ hallucination says, religion is the lever to make a value stick around forever. He wants to traumatize humanity to hate chosen ones and emperors the same way the machines traumatized humanity to change them forever. The Water of Life ritual doesn’t invert his values, it lets him realize these visions of war are the means, not the ends. He is absolutely not happy about it, but this is Paul’s terrible purpose. 
155 notes · View notes
kafus · 22 days
Text
ever since liko lost in her battle against chili back in HZ056 i've been pretty passionate about wanting liko to win her future battle against grusha, partially because i just love her and want to see her win after such a heart-wrenching defeat, but also because i thought it would be good character writing - she loses, but learns to be passionate about battling in the process, and then she can apply that to her next major fight and win as a result. that was my thought process.
as HZ063 drew closer however, i started feeling like that maybe isn't what would happen - the way episodes have panned out, she hasn't really had any major battle training since her loss against chili (her joining roy with "awesome training" does not count LOL), and that massive cetitan and the type disadvantage started to really loom over the whole thing. but i still wasn't sure and by the time HZ063 came out this weekend, i genuinely had no clue what to expect, i just hoped the character writing payoff would be good, win or lose.
AND IT WAS!!! thank fucking god i love liko so much i need more really good liko episodes. i'm eating this up
first off: liko REALLY shows off what she learned from battling chili. honestly an absolute treat to watch. her level of increased confidence and focus honestly made me feel spoiled as a fan. never once did she take her eyes off the battle, she was not distracted by grusha being a hardass, and she's able to think through being pinned into a corner to turn the tides despite the odds stacked against her.
Tumblr media Tumblr media
everything from the strategic switch to tebrim, to firing off magical leaf into huljukira's mouth, to grabbing tyltalis by the tail/feet... she's actually a really crafty and thoughtful battler when she sets her mind to it, which makes sense because her battle preferences are more to do with her mind than raw strength. even roy remarks "nice control" because she has notable precise control over her pokemon's actions. point is the payoff for her character development in her battle against chili was still present... despite her loss.
Tumblr media
and man does this loss sting like a bitch after watching her perform so well... AND on top of that grusha is a complete asshole about it. like UGH it just hurts to watch. and frankly there's no excuse as someone in grusha's position to be treating students that way... but there is a reason. and the reason makes this episode super fucking interesting. i really like how it was handled, actually.
Tumblr media
pretty much directly after a scene where grusha interrupts the trio having fun sledding with the arukujira, we're presented with grusha's backstory about why and how he quit snowboarding. the writing is essentially saying, here's grusha being a no-fun, shitty person, and here's why he's like that. (notably, the trio was doing something similar to snowboarding and had to dodge being injured themselves...)
what's important, though, is that we also find out that grusha didn't quit snowboarding because he was too seriously injured to ever do it again, just that it would be harder for him to achieve the same results he used to. he made a conscious, emotionally fueled decision to quit, because like the man says: he's harsh on everyone, himself included.
Tumblr media Tumblr media Tumblr media Tumblr media
at this point, he is basically the opposite of liko, and to the general themes of most stories in pokemon. he is not an incredible pokemon trainer because of passion, in fact he only became a trainer after his snowboarding accident just so he'd have something to succeed at again. he is not an incredible pokemon trainer because of friends or adventure or any other reason than a desperation to reach the same artificial "success" heights that he did before his accident. not to say that he's inhuman - forgiving the arukujira that caused his injury, patting it on the head, and becoming its trainer, signals a sense of personal guilt over the situation, and the arukujira in question obviously likes him despite his behavior. but it's a very strong contrast to what liko learned in HZ056, with being connected with her pokemon through battle, and enjoying fighting tough opponents even though she could lose.
Tumblr media Tumblr media
and it's important to note that even as far back as HZ056 itself, grusha was framed as a contrast to liko. he approaches her and his coldness (no pun intended) immediately slices into the atmosphere of the scene and liko's improved mood, and he implies that liko is weak for being happy after losing, because all he personally cares about is winning and being on top.
Tumblr media
all of this is to say that grusha is in the wrong to fail liko, he's in the wrong to talk down to her the way that he does. and this is made clear by the writing! when liko loses and grows from it, grusha's there to say something negative about it. when liko is having fun with her pokemon and her friends, he sarcastically remarks that she must be "pretty confident" if she has time to "goof off." the man in the gym says that he could have kept snowboarding, but he quit, as opposed to liko who gets back up again. everyone thinks he's harsh and offputting.
and at the end when grusha fails her, even dot and roy are like, no, maybe he'll pass you or give you a second chance! because they (rightly) experienced those things and were able to grow from those experiences, so surely the same would be the case for liko? but no! and it's a shock to everyone!
Tumblr media
the sound effect paired with liko's surprised face clearly indicates that this is supposed to shock the viewer just as much as it shocks liko and her friends.
Tumblr media Tumblr media
and her friends are so surprised that they even try to argue with grusha about it!! it is unfair and wrong! and that's so fucking interesting!!! grusha is a flawed adult character, he's not part of the explorers but he's still treating liko wrongly as opposed to with the support that most of the adults in her life have given her, and he has a reason which makes him compelling, but not an excuse. for the type of show this is i am continually surprised by the complexity of some of the character writing, and this hits particularly well. liko's loss feels meaningful... and like setup for something.
to me, this episode seamlessly bridges off of liko's character development set in motion in HZ056, and also makes her character more clear through her contrast with grusha. i definitely don't think this is truly the end of this plot thread - whether or not liko actually gets to fight grusha again sometime in the future or something else, i definitely think liko will get to prove herself in some way, that pokemon battles aren't just about winning or losing and that grusha was indeed in the wrong. and i do hope she gets to fight grusha again or grusha gets to see her prove herself in the future, because it seems like the guy needs to learn to loosen up and have fun and be passionate, too.
Tumblr media
i feel even more sure of this because amethio is in the upcoming episode (thank god, i missed him) and grusha parallels amethio in a lot of ways - they both work very hard to be stronger, but just because of a desperation to succeed, and they're both absolutely miserable and irritable as people because of it, though of course amethio's motivations for being this way are very different. i won't speculate too much about the next episode right now but i am hoping that this will be pointed out by the narrative in some way - an amethio episode coming right after this feels... intentional to say the least lol.
the intentional nature of horizons' character writing and its ability to follow through on things it sets up episodes ago never fails to impress me tbh. really good episode. i fucking love liko
74 notes · View notes
mal3vol3nt · 5 months
Text
the reason people get mad and upset over aang not killing ozai is because they can’t or are unwilling to understand what it really meant for him to be the last airbender
a lot of people don’t truly acknowledge what aang went through when they talk about him. it was a genocide. an ethnic cleansing. a GENOCIDE. and i think that’s because so many people are just incapable or unwilling to wrap their heads around how tragic and isolating and unchangeable something like that is.
i’ve seen countless people say they wish aang had found other airbenders hiding away somewhere. and while i totally get wanting that to happen for the happiness of the character (hell, even i have thought about how heart wrenching that utter relief would feel for him), i’ve also seen those takes associated with people saying they just find it hard to believe that none of the airbenders survived. that none of them were able to escape.
and that’s the thing that annoys me because genocide is a real fucking thing that has happened and IS currently happening in the world (just look at palestine, congo, sudan). it shouldn’t be so hard for people to suspend their belief into thinking it could happen in a fictional piece of media. this disbelief that a genocide can be real results in people being unable to fully sympathize with a character who is stated several times to be the definite, unchangeable sole survivor of his people’s genocide. and i’m not saying it’s wrong to want there to be airbenders who lived, but in canon it’s clear that none of them did. and the ones who did canonically escape were hunted and lured by the fire nation to their demise. and if we’re going to discuss characters and the intents behind their actions, aang’s character development is heavily, heavily heavily guided by his guilt and grief over his lost culture and people. but a lot of people still can’t wrap their heads around the canonical genocide he survived, meaning they can’t fully comprehend why aang would choose peace over a violent end. and considering atla is a western show with a largely western audience, its even more evident that this gap in people’s ability to understand and sympathize with aang is emphasized by their western intrigue toward violence. people don’t just misunderstand aang’s dilemma—they wanted him to kill ozai because seeing him do that would have been cool and interesting and satisfying.
but aang’s decision to spare ozai’s life was made due to his status as the last airbender. prior to meeting the lion turtle, i think it’s safe to say that he had resigned to what he had to do. that is to say, he was likely going to kill ozai despite the pain that was going to cause him. he was going to give up a part of himself, his humanity and the last remainings of his culture, to be the avatar the world needed. but he was then gifted the ability to energy bend, offering him, but not cementing, another option. aang still had the choice, and we saw in the fight that aang was so very close to killing ozai even with this new ability. but he couldn’t. because although killing ozai would have been a pretty justifiable thing to do, it would have fully finished off the air nomads. aang was the only living human who held onto their beliefs. if he were to push those values aside to end the war, the war would have ended the same way it started: with the death of the air nomads. and it may sound “cheesy” or overly dramatic or whatever to some people, but aang’s entire story arc has, arguably, been him trying to fit in a world that seemingly has no more room for the air nomads. not only is he 100 years in the future, but this future has none of his people around and war is everywhere. violence is basically required to survive. death is everywhere. greed has corrupted nations. everything the air nomads stood against made up this world, and aang, as the avatar, had no choice but to save it. for him to have given in to what everyone expected of him—violence—he would have ultimately eliminated air nomad values from the world. and the world would have not cared. aang’s victory would have been celebrated, but aang would have felt even more grief than before. he would have let himself and his people down. and balance would have never been achieved because the air nomads mattered. they were part of what kept the world going round. no matter how much the current world he was fighting for called for violence and death to achieve an end, the air nomads still had a voice through aang. they were still around because of aang. aang’s existence and dedication and love for his culture kept the genocide from being official.
and in my opinion, air nomadic values coming out victorious in a war that nearly wiped them clean (except for aang) is much more of a meaningful and satisfying ending than violence ending with violence.
and if you wanna call aang’s decision selfish, then fine. but i personally think it’s more selfish to expect a survivor of genocide to keep giving and giving and giving for a war that took his people from him until he has nothing left of himself to give. i think that is far more selfish. aang may be the avatar but he is also human. just as much human as his people were, and the leaders he was fighting against, and the millions of people he ended up saving, and just as deserving of having some sort of agency in the decisions he makes. call me crazy ig
113 notes · View notes
roz-ani · 8 months
Text
I think that rushing the plot is Hazbin's biggest flaw so far. Certainly, one we can already see. We've only got 4 episodes, and so much has happened already. It might just be my personal interest in the overlords etc., but I kinda feel like we're not focusing that much on, we'll, the show's title. The Hotel.
Tumblr media Tumblr media
Episode 3 shows it pretty well, because what can you tell me about Carmilla? I mean, what you knew about her character that wasn't presented in the episode. Same with Vaggie. I thought this episode's plot was about her learning how to trust people other than Charlie. That's how we started, then she had a rushed identity crisis related to being useful in her girlfriend's plan, and somehow she came to the conclusion she should start working on her trust issues. Only one thing was hinted at in the pilot. Vaggie and Carmilla shared a song in episode 3, and I can say with all confidence that it was unnecessary. Telling a character's story through a song doesn't mean they progress faster. Not in the way this show intends to. They did manage to do that with Angel in the next episode. I suppose they could've given the song to Vaggie and postponed the Carmilla reveal. After all, why should we focus so much on her while having so many Hotel residents?
Tumblr media
When it comes to Alastor, for example, I believe it's much easier to enjoy his character because we don't really know what his deal is. We have yet to find out why he was gone, we can watch out for his rivalry with Vox and how he's gonna use the information about the exterminator's death. I don't know if it's the pressure, but it seems like we're expected to already know everything about the characters and just enjoy whatever the creators promised they'd do with them. And this is only the first season. There's a reason why these are used for establishing certain aspects of the created world and let the characters develop later. Like, I sincerely hope we're not done with Angel Dust's story arc because the 4th episode basically told us what his problem is and made him change his mind about his situation.
The show certainly suffers due to its format - 8 episodes and roughly 20 minutes per one. It seems like it's not enough for what they've planned, or, perhaps, the other way around. We have half of the season left, and it doesn't seem like the show will have time to improve on its pacing. We can only have hopes for a better-planned season 2.
245 notes · View notes
Text
What “It’s Written Like a Fanfic” actually means as a criticism—
Lately, I’ve seen a lot of people use “it’s written like fan fiction” as a negative critique of stories that are poorly written.
I’ve especially seen this criticism talked about in regards to Hazbin Hotel, and honestly, it’s a criticism I agree with.
But I wanted to talk specifically about what that means, because I think there are people who hear that criticism and take it to mean that ALL fan fiction is terrible and poorly written.
I need to make it REALLY CLEAR that I am not saying all fan fiction is “bad”.
I’ve written (probably bad) fan fiction! I’m an avid reader of fan fiction! Some of my favorite stories are fan fiction or are derived from fan fiction.
So. How can I use “it’s written like a fanfic” as a negative criticism if I like it so much? Because—
To me, a story being “written like a fanfiction” is only a problem when the writers approach the characters and world of their story as if everything has been pre-established.
The reason fan fiction works, the reason it can be so deeply beloved and celebrated, is usually because fanfiction writers and audiences have already fallen in love with an existing world and characters.
For example, I really love Batman, specifically Batman: The Animated Series. When I read fan fiction about Batman, I don’t always want to, or need to, read about Bruce Wayne’s backstory and his reasons and motives for becoming Batman. That’s something that can be explored and elaborated on in many interesting ways in fan fiction, but it’s not really something I need a beat by beat explanation on.
And, in this scenario, the writer of the fic doesn’t need to spend time establishing Batman’s basic characterization and relationships. There’s an assumption that the audience and readers already have an idea of those subjects. That’s why they’re seeking out fan fic—because they’ve already delved into the source material, and want to see more of those characters and that world.
That’s not to say one CAN’T write fan fiction about origin stories and establishing lore and all that, or that those stories will always be poorly written. But it’s not necessary for someone who’s already a fan to understand what’s going on if the writer wants to elaborate on an already established character or story.
In fan fiction, the heavy lifting of establishing character relationships, backstories, and basic relationships, etc. has usually already been done by the source material.
The reason someone seeks out fan fiction is (almost always) because they already know and enjoy the characters and setting, and want to hear more stories about those characters.
However, if you’re writing your own story, you need to take the time to establish your story’s basic tone, plot, characters and so on, before you can get to the exciting and more gripping or engaging parts of your narrative.
Hazbin Hotel (the Amazon series) is very guilty of skipping over a lot of the work of building up and establishing its characters and world and how they mesh with the plot and narrative.
The most egregious examples I can think of is when (v)Aggie throws the crew into the turf war, we don’t get to SEE any of the bonding the Hazbin crew have, and are then told afterwards that they’re closer and we see them reminiscing about the fight.
The same thing happens when Husk tells everyone what their personal “issues” are because he’s the bartender and can “see through them” because of that. It would be actually nice if we got to SEE how he learned those things, but instead he just lists off characteristics that people who are already fans of the show know from following the shows development.
Brand new audiences just have a bunch of character traits told to them all at once, and don’t actually get to SEE these characterization happen naturally.
I think the main reason Hazbin is written like this is mostly because the creators publicly developed the story online over many, many years.
Anyone who was already a fan of Hazbin’s creators’ previous work probably followed Hazbin’s 10 year development. And as a result, they probably listened to a lot of livestreams, read some of the supplemental comics, went to Q/A streams, and read the creator’s blog. Due to that, they already KNOW a lot about the story and world and characters, and so they don’t notice if those basic world-building and character development ARENT in the show itself.
And obviously, this is all just my opinion, but it very much seems to me like this slow and public development of Hazbin’s characters and story may have had the negative side affect of the creator and writers forgetting that they still have to build up and develop these things in the actual show itself.
Long time fans of the story when it was just a bunch of loose concepts and early characterizations can watch the finalized series of “Hazbin Hotel”, and are able to bridge gaps in the story and characterization because they’ve probably been reading blogs about Hazbin for at least 5 years.
But when someone completely new to the series watches it, there’s a chance they’re going to find the story rushed and disjointed, because they don’t have the background information on the story’s development.
This is a problem specifically because, to write an engaging and competent story, you HAVE to take the time to establish basic things first, and then you have to take the time to BUILD UP to deeper characterization, plot points, character relationships and so on.
Hazbin Hotel the show feels like “a bad fan fic” because it’s, in my opinion, written for people who are already fans, and written by people who want to skip straight to the “fun” parts of their story. But the writers still recognize that the story needs to be accessible to people who are not familiar with it, and to compensate they have to cram in as many explanations and justifications to try and make their story make sense.
The result is that Hazbin Hotel has tons of bland exposition, rushed character arcs and introductions, tonal inconsistencies and confusing lore, and a world and characters that are half-formed and fall flat.
That’s what I personally think the criticism “written like a bad fan fic” means. That the narrative feels like it is based on a preexisting piece of media, and therefore is missing the building blocks needed to make the narrative feel like a believable and fully formed story.
As a side note—I don’t think it’s like. Objectively terrible to develop your story and characters openly. But I DO think it can end up biting you in the ass like I detailed above.
When you already know how your characters behave and where your story is going, and you share that and start to have a following that’s with you every step of the way, I think it’s easy to forget that your story still needs to be accessible to people outside of your fan base.
I mean. I guess it doesn’t NEED to. But like. That’s usually the goal. Funnily enough, that also kind of makes me think of fanfic writing.
Fan fic doesn’t need to be accessible to a general audience b/c it’s often written for the the author’s own gratification and for the gratification of a pre-existing fan base.
Interestingly, I personally don’t think the “fan fiction” criticism applies to the first season of Spindlehorse’s other show, Helluva Boss, because the story and characters were (mostly) thought out first, and the narrative took time to gradually develop the characters and story at a slower pace.
And then season 2 came out and changed the characterization so drastically from what was already established that now it does feel like a fan fiction of itself. lol.
That’s really all I have to say about that. There are other things too that show up a lot in fan fiction and have like…become their own fan fiction tropes that people sometimes expect or mock, and those play a role too. But to me this is the BIGGEST thing that makes a story feel like a bad fan fic. If it’s written as if it’s borrowing from an already established story.
Again! These are just my opinions! I know the sin of sharing one’s opinions online can never be forgiven, but I wanted to examine the reason people use that phrase as a negative criticism.
79 notes · View notes
ari-the-arotistic · 10 months
Text
So I was thinking about pirates of the Caribbean, and each characters unique moral code and way of approaching life, as one does, when I remembered a particular scene about our beloved James Norrington... the very first scene in which Jack and James meet. Now, as a long time Sparrington shipper, I adore the Sparrington fandoms adopted head canon of Jack's compass pointing directly at Jack when James is holding it as having a romantic connotation too it, but this is Disney we're talking about, and a Disney from 20 years ago at that, so it is of course just a head canon. And while it is a beloved head canon, I will always be a writer before a shipper, and what that scene says about Norrington from a writer's perspective is far too juicy not to share... So buckle up for a very long meta post about who James Norrington is as a person, and how it was set up in this scene(and later reinforced in the second and third movie). This is my first real meta post, and I'm very excited for it, so let's jump right in.
First of all, the compass scene.
Tumblr media
As we can clearly see in the image above, since the red line that points to the object of the holder's desires is no where to be seen, its relatively easy to conclude that it's hidden from our view by the sun dial in the middle, and thusly is pointing directly at Jack. Elizabeth is off to James's right, and no one is standing behind Jack, so unless the compass was pointing at something in the far off distance that just so happened to be in Jack's general direction(unlikely) its pretty clear what(or who) the compass is pointing at. For most potc fans, this is fairly standard knowledge. But it's what this fact says about Norrington's character that I'd like to focus on. After all, what does it say about a man that a compass that shows you what you desire most is pointing at a pirate, and the very face of piracy at that, instead of your canonical love interest, when you're a Commodore of the Navy? As stated above, Sparrington shippers often point at this scene as proof that James has a bit of a pash on the ruggedly handsome pirate, or at the very least, a thing for men. But from a writer's perspective, this just simply isn't the case, and not because the writer's in this instance are the notoriously homophobic corporation we call Disney. The reason why this is so unlikely from a writing perspective is because given the context clues, we as an audience are meant to draw the conclusion that this is the first time that they meet(I have heard rumors of them meeting as children in the books, but having never read them, and focusing only on the movies, I'm not including that in this post). And since this is the first time they've met, it's highly unlikely that the compass is pointing at Jack because James has a bit of a thing for him. Even if James has heard of Jack's many exploits, he does not truly know the man behind the legend, so having romantic feelings for the pirate at this point in time just isn't believable. And even if James was a closeted gay/bi man, it's still unlikely that the compass would be pointing at Jack of all the men around the Commodore(of which there is a lot, some of whom he is incredibly close with) seeing as Jack is the poster boy of piracy, and at this point in the movie it's made abundantly clear that James vehemently detests the notion and all who practice it. If James were to be holding the compass in Jack's vicinity in later movies and it still pointed at the pirate, an argument could definitely be made that it was because he had developed feelings for Jack, but for their first meeting, it's just not realistic. So it's much more likely that the reason the compass is pointing at Jack is because of James's desire to send every pirate he meets to "a quick drop and a sudden stop" as he so eloquently put it to a young Elizabeth. This is further reinforced in the third movie when it is revealed that Beckett's desire to have Jack dead at his feet would prevent him from using the compass to find Shipwreck Cove if the pirate was not already at the aforementioned location, or, well, dead. This is again, relatively common knowledge. But like I said before, it's what this fact says about James that is the whole point of this post... and that is that James cares more about his career than anything else, even the woman he claims to love. Now for some, that statement alone might seem like a pretty obvious conclusion, but it's how this scene subtlety sets up this core aspect of Norrington's character before we even truly get to know who he is, and how it's brought to it's full height in the second movie, and the core aspect of his redemption and subsequent death in the third that I'd really like to talk about. Which brings us to the next segment of this post...
How James lost his commission to the navy...
Tumblr media
And how he got it back
Tumblr media
So let's start off with how James lost his commission... it's a story we all know pretty well, and one he tells to Gibbs in the scene shown above, when he plans to either join Jack's crew or get revenge on the man that(he believes) ruined his life. After Jack's escape in the first movie, James grew obsessed with capturing the pirate, so much so that he foolishly followed the Black Pearl into a hurricane, resulting in the sinking of the Dauntless, and the loss of countless lives that had been aboard the vessel. It's unclear aside from James himself who had been on the ship at the time, and who did or did not survive, but the death toll was heavy, with most, if not everyone who wasn't James, having perished in the storm. While it is not the most extreme example(which we'll get too in just a bit), this is a pretty clear example of James prioritizing his career above everything else, even reason and logic. And all just to capture a singular pirate, even at the cost of his own ship and crew, and rather ironically, the very career that he had been so desperately trying to hold onto in the first place. Which brings us to the next scene I'd like to discuss... James stealing the heart of Davy Jones. This moment is the absolute peak of this part of James's character. This is the moment where James takes his obsessive need for his career to the max. This is the moment where James truly prioritizes his career above everything else, even the woman he claims to love(and for Sparrington shippers, above the man he's reluctantly come to care about). At this point in time, when James decides to take the heart for himself to regain his old station, he's been on the Black Pearl long enough to know the full situation. That Jack is in some kind of trouble with Davy Jones, and that if Jack doesn't use the heart to bargain for his freedom, then the Kraken will hunt Jack, and subsequently the Black Pearl, down until he and everyone aboard are dead. And that includes Elizabeth. And yet, despite knowing that stealing the heart would basically mean sealing Elizabeth's death, he still decided to do so. Sure, the argument could be made that he thought Elizabeth would be able to escape somehow, but the chances of her dying at sea, or some other terrible fate befalling her before she could safely make it back to civilization would have been highly likely. Of course we as an audience know that this isn't the case, but James does not. So essentially, James was so obsessed with his career, and maintaining the image of the honorable Commodore that he didn't even truly register that he was putting Elizabeth, the woman he loves and has been trying so desperately to woo for the past two movies, in danger. And he won't fully realize the consequences of his actions until the third movie, in a deleted scene no less(I swear when I find whoever decided to delete some of the most important scenes to James's character...), when Davy Jones informs Governor Swann of his daughters untimely demise on the Black Pearl. Of course, almost immediately afterwards, Beckett retcons that statement by informing the Governor that Elizabeth was recently seen in Singapore, but for a few minutes, James has to sit with the fact that Elizabeth was dead, and it was his fault. And even after learning that she was in fact still alive, James has now finally come to the realization that if she had still been on the Black Pearl when it sank with its Captain, he would've been the one to send her to her death. And for Sparrington shippers, James has to sit with the unavoidable fact that he was the reason Jack had died(even if the pirate does come back), despite the fact that it was Elizabeth's betrayal that was the final nail in Jack's coffin, since she wouldn't have had to do that if the Kraken wasn't after them in the first place. Which brings us to the final scene I'd like to discuss...
James choosing a side, and paying the price
Tumblr media
Now, before we fully delve into this scene, I'd like to take a moment to talk about James's own perception of himself, and his relationship with honor and integrity. From the very first scene in which we meet James Norrington, we are made aware that he has a strong moral compass. He firmly believes piracy is evil, and that all who partake in piracy deserve a swift end. He perceives his Commodore persona as being the paragon of honor and integrity, and the sole arbiter of justice. We can infer from the line "By remembering that I serve others, Sparrow, not just myself" that James does have honorable intentions when ridding the world of pirates, that being protecting the innocent citizens under his care, but as seen once again in the first time James and Jack meet, wherein James adamantly tries to arrest Jack despite the fact the fact that pirate had just saved Elizabeth's life, his actions to achieve that goal are not always quite as honorable as his intentions are. This is especially highlighted once again when James gave Beckett the heart of Davy Jones. James's intentions here were once again rooted in honor and integrity - he believes that the only way to keep people safe from pirates is too return to his old station, to the image of honor and integrity he had built around the title of Commodore, and the only way to return to his old station is to give Beckett the heart. But the action itself was far from honorable, seeing as James had to betray the woman he loved just to obtain the heart, and that he was now putting it into the hands of a dangerously unstable individual who planned on using it to commit mass genocide.
And now, we finally get to the scene above... Of course, it's made clear throughout his scenes in the third movie leading up to this one that James is already starting to regret giving Beckett the heart after seeing the damage being caused, but since Beckett is targeting pirates specifically(although we as an audience know that Beckett's definition of pirate is very loose) James figures that the ends justify the means, as he often does in situations regarding piracy. It is not until his reunion with Elizabeth, where he learns that Governor Swann is dead, and that Beckett lied to him about the Governor's whereabouts, that James truly realizes the enormity of his mistake. It is in this moment that James has a sudden realization that fundamentally shakes him to his core, and is the reason behind his change of heart later on. He realizes that the honorable Commodore persona that he had tried to cultivate and keep a hold of for so long had never been truly honorable at all, and that by giving Beckett the heart of Davy Jones, he had effectively tied the noose around the neck of his own honor and integrity, as well as the necks of hundreds, if not thousands of innocent people, with his own hands. And as that one vine goes, this was the moment James knew, he fucked up. Which leads to his decision to change sides in an attempt to redeem himself, and his subsequent death in the process. Of course, part of James's reason for helping Elizabeth escape was that he does care for her, but given everything I've detailed about him so far, I think it's safe to say the main reason that James decided to help Elizabeth and her crew was because he wanted to undo the damage he had done, and he had faith that Elizabeth, Will, and Jack would have some sort of plan to defeat Beckett, and stop any further damage to come from his mistake. And now, for his death scene itself... As much as I love the idea of James surviving and joining the pirates(whether at Elizabeth's side or Jack's is unimportant), I firmly believe that his death was a necessary end of this part of his character arc, and that if he were to survive he would still have to go through a major ego death for this part of his character arc to end properly. Because as Bill turner drives that wooden pike into James's gut, it's not just the physical death of his body, but also the metaphorical death of Admiral James Norrington, and the ideals that James had used to build the persona out of. So even if James survived, the Admiral would still have to meet his metaphorical end, thusly causing James to lose a core part of himself that had been guiding most his decisions so far, in the process, which would start the next part of his character arc, where he would have to deal with the loss of a key part of his personality, and rebuild himself from the ground up to finally, truly become the image of honor and integrity he had envisioned from the beginning.
And that concludes this very long post. I could probably wax enough poetics about this aspect of James's character to write a short novel, but I've said everything important to this post, and if I go on any longer, I'm likely to start repeating myself lol. Thank you for reading, and feel free to share your thoughts in the comments or a reblog! I will always love hearing more about our polished peacock <3
243 notes · View notes