#i will never understand why people are so angry about fanon?

[mharw]

I don't know why "[insert creepypasta character] wouldn't treat you like that, they'd abuse you!" Is even an argument in the first place? Like yeah sure, maybe, but I like imagining otherwise?? Let people be, a lot of people in this fandom have been seeing them as their comfort characters since they were like nine, why do you care?

[bazpire]

People complain about fanon darlin being "overly aggressive" and stufff, but honestly, I understand your point from that reblog you made. They are traumatised and untrusting. They've been hurt so much, especially if you believe they had a shitty childhood; volence is all they know.

Not all trauma victims are sensitive and afraid. Sure, darlin probably is afraid, but they cope with what they know best. Violence, anger, etc. They have been hurt and betrayed. They never fit into the pack they grew up around. They've probably felt so lonely for most of their life, so angry at the way things turned out for them. Anger would almost be like a comfort to them. (?)

Honestly, it all depends on how you view them and their character and storyline, but in my eyes, they're reckless and violent from trauma. It's how their brain is wired. Sam has positively impacted them, definitely, but why do so many people ignore what led up to them being the way they are?

Their story, even if up to our imagination, is one I love no matter how many people complain about the storyline, their actions, etc. They are a human, a traumatised one. All they really ever wanted is to be loved, and instead, they got the opposite throughout their entire life - abuse and isolation. Judgement.

Sorry for my rant, haha. I saw your tags in that one reblog you made and I've been thinking about it since. I totally agree. Trauma victims aren't always kicked puppies. For example, victims who kill their abusers. Darlin wants to kill Quinn. They should get to.

yes yES YES

Ex-fucking-actly

Plus, people forget that Darlin isn't a character. They're a listener. At the end of the day, they're created for you to project yourself in them, to have your own view of them. So, if your view is more violent than others, that is absolutely alright.

Thanks for the ask, anon!

[micia-posts-stuff]

Spoilers for Spy x Family chapter 96

(Part 2) Now let's talk about the dance and the thing.

Damian blushing hard is always funny and adorable, look at him! The poor boy doesn't know what to do with all these feelings! Also it's interesting that we get yet another instant of Anya shivering when she perceives his feelings towards her. We saw it happen first very early on, in the chapter where she had to apologize for punching him, and we saw it recently in chapter 88 when they were in Henderson's office. It's a recurring thing at this point, wich makes me think she'll understand what it is in the future, not any time soon, but for now she still perceives that something is there.

This is so cute, the boy is having a whole flashback to them holding hands (there is also the light novel but it's not included in the events of the manga sadly). He was so nervous of being so near her and holding hands, he wants to dance with her but he's also totally panicked, so precious!!!

Yesss goofy dancing!

THIS PANEL ALSO KILLED ME. I'm double dead!

Look at his expression!!!!! The little smile when he thinks of Anya's family! The yearning for something similar and the hint of sadness because he knows he can't have it. SOMEONE GIVE THIS KID A HUG. HE'S SO SAD. And the way he opens up to her! Like tell me they're not friends! Tell me he would say that to anyone! You can't! This closeness they have, even tho it's unconventional, it's so important to him. This is very similar to the scene after the bus hijacking. Anya has officially been established as someone he opens up to. Even though he still thinks Anya is after his family (and he's right), he also understand there is something different from other people. And even after he denies what he just said telling her "he totally wins because he learned from a pro" Anya understands he was being sincere before and that was just a way to cover up how he really feels. And it would have been sooo easy for Endo to just make her be angry at that comment, but he didn't and I'm so happy, because this moment is very important. Because it's an honest moment between them, where they really open up to each other, wich bring us to...

Listen. Being a Damianya shipper, I was obviously looking forward to this chapter. But no amount of hype could have prepared me for THIS. I'd never have imagined we would get one of THE reveals, but I'm totally here for it. First of all I KNEW IT WAS GONNA BE HIM YESSSS

Second the fact that happened not only during their dance BUT DURING THE CASQUÈ, chef kiss, straight out of of fanon, amazing, incredibile, show-stopping. (Also on a two pages panel!!!!!)

Third and most important, the fact that it happened. As people pointed out this doesn't help Anya's mission in the slightest, in fact it puts it in danger. Anya has tried to hide this secret from anyone. But NOW she tells HIM. This is not a high stake moment, a moment where she confesses out of necessity. No, she tells him now because she saw he was being honest with her, because he was showing her his feelings, because he really touched her. And she told HIM because she knows he would be able to understand her, because she saw through his facade. She has been starting to see how similar they are a while ago, but it was highlighted particularly during the bus hijacking. Not only, as underlined in the quiz, they both love their fathers and are doing everything to impress them and for them to love them, but she also can relate to his loneliness, because of her life before the Forger family. When he said "your family...sounds nice" She saw in him the same thing she felt back then. That's why she decided to tell him, because she knows he won't reject her, like she's afraid other people would. And in these months she was also able to see his true self underneath the facade and yes they always end up fighting, but she is clever enough to recognize his sincerity when it really matters. She has learned to know him and decided to trust him with her biggest secret.

And Damian obviously doesn't believe her ahah. I mean I don't think anyone was expecting otherwise, it's only logical. BUT a couple of things. First of all the first expression he made, he maybe didn't believed her after thinking it over, but for a moment the thought was there, the suspicion has definitely been planted in his head. Second, this wasn't just a slip-up by Anya, it may have come out naturally in the moment, but she definitely ment to tell him. If it was a slip-up she could have easily played along with Damian and say something like "yeah I was joking, it was a line from my cartoons" But no she doubled down! She got angry that he didn't believed her and called her dummy, she definitely wants him to know! This is important because from now on she can act with the notion that she told Damian. Like if she needs him to know that someone thought about something, she can tell him! Even if he doesn't believe it, she told him already so it's just a matter of having him trust her. I don't know if she'll try to convince him or if something will come up later where they'll need to work together using her mind reading abilities, but I hope he'll believe her sooner rather than later because it would be so interesting! Imagine all the shenanigans they can go through together if he knows of her mind reading abilities! Imagine the struggle of hiding his crush once Damian finally admits his feelings to himself! It would be such a cool dynamic! I do understand Spy x family has the tendency to always return to the status quo and that's fine, it's a slow burn, but now something major has ctually happened! It would be kinda lame for this massive thing to change nothing about the story and be swept under the rug. Like it's fine if some little moments don't change things too much but this is THE MIND POWERS REVEAL! It needs to have an impact.

Now I'm really interested in seeing their povs. I want to see if Anya will regret telling him, since she was so worried that people might discover her powers. Maybe this could finally lead into Anya's backstory. And I really really want Damian's pov, because as soon as we see him seriously thinking about it he will have to realize it's true. He already had his suspicions and there are not many other explanations about the knowledge Anya has. Plus if he doesn't realize it now based on the past, he'll have to realize it in the future when Anya relies a bit too much on her powers, wich is something that happens fairly often. Like if something like old maid happens again, there's no way he won't think about what she told him.

And last but not least

Endo usually uses these little boxes to show us the actual progress of the mission. He has put friendship to ??? before, so he could have left it ambiguous if he wanted to, but he didn't. He confirmed this was an important progress in their friendship, despite Damian not believing her and them arguing at the end. Wich makes me a bit more hopeful that something will come from this.

[pineappleciders]

Could we get headcanons for how would it be being Team Craig beloved adopted child? Like- idk- reader is this sweet kid who wants everyone to be happy and then Craig and Those guys are like- the protective parents while Clyde is reader's adorkable big brother 😱

craig and those guys adopting a sweet reader who acts like their kid/little sibling; platonic headcanons

includes: craig, clyde, tolkien, jimmy, and tweek

A/N: i know tweek technically isn't apart of catg, but since he often is in fanon i decided to add him!! people r always debating whether jimmy or tweek is in craigs gang but why not both!!!!!!

personally i see tweek as the butters of catg. like he's there sometimes but not all the time ykwim

whenever craig and tweek get into a dispute it's like watching your parents argue

despite you being the same age as tolkien, your parents often leave you with him as your babysitter (your parents love him to death) and you two always end up playing games and eating snacks

they're kind of. confused about you. like craig might treat you like butters at first but gets berated by the rest for it once they all realized ur actually cool and not stuck-up

jimmy ruffles your hair and treats you like you're his little sibling, and goes 'oooooo' and asks constant questions if you have a crush on someone

if you're shorter than tweek he leans on your shoulder or head, because he knows it pisses you off. then he giggles deviously about it

craig is kind of. always trying to get your evil side out. like he's completely convinced you're not 100% angel and he tries to annoy you to get you to get angry

u and clyde hang out a lot. like you're always at each other's houses, people at school started to actually think you two were related

lots of video game nights. you all come to someones house (usually tolkiens because he's loaded) and play video games on the couch and in his room all night long. also lots of sleepovers

i feel like when ur choosing teams for a sport or a game, some of them are begging for you on their team and some of them are begging that you aren't on their team

jimmy, tolkien, and clyde want u on their team. craig does not. he doesn't because he thinks u suck (he doesn't mean it, he just wants to be a dick. unless you actually do suck)

with tweek it depends. like he might agree with craig and he might not. it really depends on what the thing you're doing is

clyde leans on your shoulder when you two are standing in the halls with a smug look on his face (he wants to embarrass you)

tolkien (and sometimes jimmy) always help you with studying and homework. like they'll teach you the entire subject and make sure you're prepared for the test

jimmy cracks (un)funny jokes to embarrass you in front of your friends

they get all pissy if someones annoying you. craig in particular is not afraid to get physical if you're getting bullied or something. he'll never admit it though

tweek likes to annoy you, but he's also probably one of the more sentimental ones (next to tolkien and jimmy). like he'll be there for you emotionally and stuff, even though he isn't always the best with feelings

jimmy is very encouraging. like if you're down or anxious about something he'll listen intently and give you the most motivational pep talk you've ever heard. he cares a lot and shows it with quality time and just being there!!!

tolkien is very good at listening. he might not understand everything you're going through, but he tries very hard to hear you out and give advice. he also reassures you that he's always there for you

craig isn't the best at showing his own emotions in the first place, so he's kinda. panicky if you're sad. he's learned a lot from tweek though, and will listen closely and try to validate what you say.

clyde doesn't always understand, but he tries. he'll listen to you talk and gives shitty advice, and is generally kinda knuckle-headed. he genuinely cares though

craig tells you about his silly little interests, and like forces you to play with stripe. he also rants to you about space and shit and you always fall asleep to it

whenever everyone falls asleep in the living room while playing video games, you're the one left awake, and you can't help but feel immense happiness at how peaceful they look.

[rottenpumpkin13]

I think CC had a huuuge problem with fleshing out Genesis and Angeal to be honest. I feel like the personalities they’ve been given by the fandom are mostly fanon and don’t have that much substantiation in canon because AG were both largely used as plot devices- which again I think is a big problem because it doesn’t make you feel or understand either of the characters or why they behave the way they do. By the end of CC I felt really bad for Sephiroth, was ambivalent toward Angeal but still felt a twinge of sadness because of how sad Zack was over him, and absolutely loathed Genesis. I’m still not Genesis’ biggest fan but the canon characterization has made him a bit more endearing, though when I go back to canon and see him I’m left disliking him all over again. Unless you really dig into CC lore you have no idea how Genesis felt about Sephiroth, it just comes off like he was always jealous of him and that the relationship was painfully one-sided with Sephiroth practically begging for his friendship. It doesn’t help that 80% of Genesis’ dialogue is Loveless quotes and the other 20% is him being angry and hateful. I guess it’s justified, but unlike with Sephiroth and Angeal you never see Genesis being anything but hateful. With the other two I found myself sympathizing and mourning the loss of the people they were prior to realizing the truth, but with Genesis I wished he’d just shut up and go away already. The training room scene also doesn’t help his case, because first it starts out with Genesis being cocky and wanting to take Sephiroth alone- despite Angeal’s warning- and then later on blasts his best friend in the face with a fire ball all while talking about being a hero. He purposefully escalates the fight, then when Sephiroth gets serious Genesis gets injured and crap really hits the fan- and all this could’ve been avoided if Genesis hadn’t had an inferiority complex the size of the moon. I also find it hard to excuse this whole sequence of events because this was prior to his degradation, and while it’s unclear whether it had started even before his injury, I’m going to say he was still mostly in his right state of mind and he still behaves like he has no care for his friends, even his childhood friend who was trying to keep the spar friendly and prevent it from turning into a fight to the death.

Sorry about the rant, but that other anon talking about Genesis also brought back my thoughts about him and I felt like sharing since I’ve never really written them out.

Canon vs fanon aside, there's a lot of context and nuance often lost when adapting Japanese dialogue to fit English contexts. My biggest gripe with the training room scene in english is how Genesis proclaims "The world needs a new hero" right before he fights Sephiroth, suggesting he wants to take Sephiroth's place/ be better than him. But then you look at translations like this one and that scene gains a whole new meaning. Genesis instead says "I too would like to become a hero." And rather than the cocky "That's no way to talk to a hero," before he blasts Angeal in the face with a fire ball, he states "All I want is to be a hero."

The training room scene is a lost cause, because it's easy to place the blame on any one of them, or on whoever decided to go in there that day, or even on the fight itself, but accidents happen. But in the end, no one is truly to blame because none of them asked for Jenova cells or to be part of the Jenova Project, and the truth is that if it hadn't been the training room incident, something else would have triggered the degradation, or the conflict as a whole, and they would have been doomed regardless.

And that's why Genesis is so angry, and why he's so desperate for the cure that he keeps reciting what (in his mind) is the answer to the cure. I guess the reason we never see him be anything but reactive to the situation he's in because when we're introduced to him, shit has already hit the fan. He's deserted already. The first scene we see in Crisis Core literally has Angeal answer the phone and get the news that Genesis left. The only crumb of pre-degradation Genesis we get is the training room scene which—as mentioned above—got mistranslated in English, so of course we're going to think Genesis was hot-headed and envious (which in all honesty he could've just as well have been).

It's easier to sympathize with Angeal and Sephiroth because everything that's happening is happening because Genesis revolted against Shinra, and I get that. But what makes me sympathize with Genesis (and this is coming from someone who used to hate him) is the degradation and his motives. He wants a cure. He wants to live, and it's hard to live when your body is working against you and literally degrading because of something completely out of your control. On top of that, the people after you, the organization you've always aspired to be a part of because of your childhood hero, your friends including that hero, are on the side of those who did this to you.

Don't know if this makes any sense because I'm literally trying not to fall asleep writing this out asfshsjska

[bibibbon]

What fails in MHA: gags/jokes

As well all know gags and jokes are everywhere in shonen but they are rarely done well in my opinion especially in MHA. There isn't a problem with having a bit of comedy in your manga but when the gag or joke either harms the characters development or just is offensive it tends to just fall flat at best and ruin the story at worst.

There are many common and multiple gags hori uses which I HATE:

Izuku/the midoriya family are crybabies. This is one that was VERY PRESENT during the earlier seasons which in my opinion ruined the show and many peoples view of izuku as a character. It makes sense why izuku would cry more then a regular shonen type of MC considering that he is supposed to be a "normal" teenager and he shows some very clear signs of anxiety. I understand when people get annoyed at how much he cries especially because it's very over exaggerated a lot of the time and just depicts him crying a waterfall when you could of just shown him tearing up. It's a bit more excusable for inko but it really doesn't shine a good look on her especially knowing that she is quite emotionally dependent on her son .

Katsuki being mean towards literally anyone and anything. We know that bakugo is a character who is going through a redemption arc to change and become a better person so we shouldn't see him be so aggressive and angry if he is trying to change especially if it's a joke. A gag like that really ruins his development and to me its the reason why I don't think he really changed his attitude or way of thinking towards izuku as much as people like to believe he has ( CANON BAKUGO AND FANON BAKUGO AREN'T THE SAME )

Perverted characters like mineta or sir nighteye .Yes, this is definitely targeted towards mineta and night eye because Iam still very disgusted by the scene of bubble girl and night eye and mineta just gives me the absolute CREEPS. honestly, idk what it is with hori and giving us these type of stuff it's honestly disturbing and disgusting I don't think I would mind if it were done to criticise or lambast something about hero societies pedophilic undertones and the way it loves to sexualise female characters but it's just there as a horrible gag.

Dumbing down denki and making him seem stupid. This is more of making UA look bad because Denki could of been seriously hurt in the usj because of the whole dumbing him down gag and while it isn't the worst gag in the show it kinda falls flat in my opinion and just makes ua look bad. It's also double standards in my opinion because he would be useless in battle if he were to overuse his quirk just like izuku.

The interview scene with mount lady. I don't understand why izuku was ridiculed for his lack of control when it came to blackwhip and it doesn't help that some of the characters where DEFINITELY ACTING OUT OF CHARACTER when they all had the same reaction.

There are some 50/50 gags that still failed due to horikoshi not letting them go or not handling them well.

Izuku's everlasting fanboyism of heroes especially all might. Look this one isn't that bad but like I just don't like the fact that he never grew out of it. I personally like to think that izuku was a big all might fanboy is because he saw all might as the only person who actually believed in him and gave him words of encouragement even if it was through a screen and even if those words where directed towards anyone not only him. As the story progresses izuku should grow to realise that all might is a flawed individual who has cared for him but harmed him at the same time.

Horikoshis perception of izuku being "too intense". This could of easily been incorporated into Izuku's character as an actual character trait that could be used as a gag from time to time. For example we see izuku over think everything or hyper analyse so many small things like fuyumi's cooking. There are moments where izuku seems to come off as weird to other characters and I feel like that shouldn't happen or it should be handled in a better way. I mean how is it that someone doing something so simple as looking at a video intensely will freak/weird you out compared to someone who has a weird quirk or a passerby doing something weird

There are definitely A LOT MORE THAT IAM PROBABLY FORGETTING.

However, hori does have some good gags/ jokes in my opinion, yes they are rare but they do indeed exist like:

Kirishima's manliness. A lot of the time this actually promotes positive masculinity which is something that is definitely needed and it also helps develop kiris character a whole lot more

This one interaction between jiro and tokoyami. I really liked it, it didn't come out as sexual which is something I really enjoyed and you can clearly tell it's just two classmates vibing and trying not to die

Tokoyami and his whole darkness persona. Idk I guess this is me but I like it, it adds a lot to tokoyami while also not being overused .

This one Iam 50/50 with and it's yuuga and his whole I like cheese and I can't stop twinkling persona. I think it adds more depth to his character and foreshadows his role as the traitor to a certain extent but I also find it a bit stereotypical considering the fact that he is french and yuuga will just end up speaking in basic french words and then Japanese

Hawks favourite food ironically being chicken wings. It's simple but it also makes us closer to hawks and can make him a bit more relatable to people

Izuku, iida and shotos hand crusher joke. That has to be my favourite joke in the series it literally didn't end up mocking anyone and cemented one of the best MHA trios

Overall, hori sucks at making truly enjoyable gags and has a lot that harm characters developments especially surrounding his MC Izuku but he can sometimes actually provide enjoyable ones.

[givemewallywestorgivemedeath]

Logically I always feel like we're supposed to hate Rudy more but goddamn, Mary has always made my skin crawl. I mean there were a LOT of reasons why I could never get into the YJ cartoon but I specifically remember seeing the way it portrays Wally's parents and something about it just felt icky and wrong

Rudy on some level is just so cartoony of a villain.

Like, the fanon version of Rudy is this bumbling angry alcoholic who hits his son because he needs someone smaller than him to take out his aggression on and that version of Rudy is very real. I think that's why fanon tends to view him that way. Because it's a more realistic characterization and it's easier for them to understand and portray.

But the truth of the matter is that Rudy is cold, calm and calculating. He's smart. And he doesn't care. Not about Wally and definitely not about Mary. Rudy doesn't see them as a family, he sees them as a long con. A get rich scheme in the making. Wally is supposed to be powerful so Rudy tries to 'shape' him. The abuse isn't out of anger, it's Rudy's misguided attempts to make him stronger.

Rudy also tries to bond with Wally. He knows he needs a good relationship with Wally to keep Wally in line when he gets older. That's why you see things like Rudy poisoning the little league coach to let Wally play and letting the air out of the other team's tires so Wally's team wins.

He was really fucking bad at it but he was attempting to make Wally an ultimate weapon that only listened to him. What he did instead was push his son away and teach him what not to do.

But that kind of calculated, off-the-wall mentality is so foreign. It's bad and we can recognize it but it's like something out of Criminal Minds. It's hard to see any part of that in our daily lives.

But Mary? Mary is something else. Mary is little comments about Wally's outfits. Mary is guilt tripping her son into spending time with her. Mary is being confidently incorrect about her son's wants and needs. Mary is discouraging comments when you just need a hug. Mary is so real it hurts.

So yeah, I can absolutely agree with you. Rudy is on another fucking level and he objectively does worse things (like murder and child labor camps and cult stuff). But Mary is so real in her abuse. She genuinely horrifies me.

Also, yeah I can agree about the YJ thing. Rudy and Mary being terrible has been a central part of Wally's story since the beginning. (and before people say "but Walls, the Wests were so kind in their first appearance!" they were literally only in a few panels and Rudy didn't even have a name yet. Also it was a Titans comic and not the Flash comic, ofc the characterization would be off) It's definitely a disservice to the character to write the West's as good/normal parents in any capacity. Especially because the excuse was that all the other members of the team had bad home lives/childhoods so they wanted Wally to be 'normal'. Bruh. Hate to break it to you but the kids in suburbia with the white picket fences can also suffer abuse behind closed doors. It's unfortunately a very common and 'normal' thing.

[oscconfessions]

i fucking hate the "why cabby's arc is lesbophobic, misogynistic, ableist, etc etc" post so so much. like okay listen i usually don't care about bad takes it's whatever, the ii fandom usually has terrible ones, but that post specifically has so much misinformation about cabby and takes things that aren't canon as canon (such as, cabby only "caring about fem-enby characters", when a lot of her friendships are with masc characters and she generally cares about people, or that she was treated badly because she "wasn't of help for any male character", when like, no, she was treated badly because she wasn't the best person at the start of s3 and people also forget that, etc) + she was like. actively not the greatest person due to the fact that taylor was in charge of her storyline, and when he was fired, they changed everything completely, and also, cabby's arc being lesbophobic's only proof being her VA doing Cabby's lines with a sapphic intent, which, 1- sapphic doesn't mean lesbian necessarily, there are mspec sapphic people and 2- whatever the vas do or say doesn't meant that it's canon to ii 3- again, it's literally not canon, please don't consider headcanons/ideas the rest of the crew has as canon (since justin did specificy back then that, unless if established by the three of them, it's not canon, or something along the lines of that, it's like saying that cake/brunch's hcs are canon just because he's part of the crew but like, no, they are not)

and meanwhile i can agree that cabby's portrayal of disability is not the best, and could've been better, i think that what people often forget is that. treating issues such as ableism on media doesn't mean that the creators themselves condone those. like yeah the characters (mostly silver and test tube) were assholes to cabby because of her disability, but AE never glorified it nor did they intend for others to feel like it was like that. hell, even the bot and cabby thing, people immediately assumed that it was an intentionally ableist (which, i get it, it could've been executed better) but like. People also forgot that Bot was going through severe identity issues and was strongly struggling with being written down as one thing (because 1, they were made to be the replica of someone. they were LITERALLY written down to act like someone. 2, they recognized that they were terribly attached to test tube and that's why their view on cabby was so complicated. 3. bot immediately recognized that what they did was wrong, and didn't intentionally want to hurt cabby, again. they ARE going through their own troubles as well. AND 4, in the next episode, bot immediately apologizes when given the chance and gives cabby a file they made themselves, because they understand cabby and don't want her to struggle.)

i specifically hate that post so much because it made people be insufferable regarding iii and also made people worse when it came to AE. It is filled with so much misinformation on general and I could break it down completely, but the person who made it just has terrible takes and it feels like they don't even like II and just like the fanon versions of it (and also i refuse to look at it again fully because it is genuinely just. so so weird). also it did make people be worse about Cabby, to which her treatment in the fandom fucking sucks already. like it actively made the fandom worse and it sucks so much.

i shouldn't be this angry about something this dumb because it is kind of stupid but like. oh my god that IS a terrible analysis AND a terrible post that did horrendous damage to the fandom. going on anon because i am too scared to go main. 👍

- 💛🎤 anon

.

[ilikekidsshows]

About you being harassed by Marinette fans. I don't know if me doing this is weird, but you being open bout that makes me want to open up more too. I've send you 4 anons by now (u probably could already tell they were from one person) because I don't have a miraculous Blog anymore since the hiatus before Destruction because Marinette fans found one of my posts criticizing Marinette's treatment of Cat Noir and her leadership and they went after me for i think almost an entire week. I ended up deleting my blog in panic and fear of it getting worse the more traffic it got amongst Mari stans.

I followed the show and Fandom til now from afar to see if any of my Marinette problems were getting the fixes everyone screamed about season 5 would deliver but I can't say that happened. I wholeheartedly agree that with alot of other people that it only got worse with the doubling down and her gettin less heroic underneath the surface.

So I'm still here and upset that I was bullied out of this fandom for things I was apparently right about to degrees I didn't even knew back then how right I'd end up being....

I found a couple of blogs to follow that share my opinions and you guys have been interwoven alot now so I thought sending anons to dip my toe back into being part of the discourse is a good idea. I hope I didn't cause any Mari stans getting angry at you for it, I've been worried bout that ngl.

I would like to ask bout one of the topics Marinette fans cyberbullied me for but I still think I'm right for questioning:

How much value does Marinette see in being friends with her love interests?

Oc im not doubting that she sees at least some worth in it, but it feels very shallow. Fandom is working the lion's share to take what little canon gives and run with it til they think their fanon is real.

Marinette values friendship, sure, but Zoe is the only love interest of hers for whom that feels right to say

Marinette in Canon has said many times that for her being friends with the one she loves is the worst thing she could possibly imagine. E. g. Psycomedian. And she was rewarded with Adrien being her devoted and desperate prince for her doing probably the most friendship related thing she did in all season 4. She had a basic little convo with him about understanding to have problems and that's where it ended. Where did Marinette ever even try to be rlly Adrien's friend? She said 500x that she's finally gonna put her romance feelings aside for a bit to focus on her job (which I hoped would mean she'd work on her weaknesses in the platonic Ladynoir team dynamic too... Silly me... )

But that never goes anywhere? Weren't Adrien and Kagami the ones literally having been created out of the feeling love or to love someone in particular and even THEY could overwrite their senti programming better than Marinette ever could get over her normal ass feelings for a week? Adrien and Kagami value the friendship with the one they love deeply, is that the difference? That Marinette can't ever move one from loving someone because friendship feels like an awful downgrade and torture to her so she stays the same? What does that say bout her?

Or that Luka and Cat Noir never caused her stalker paranoia to break out that Derision claims she does to protect herself. Why does it only apply to Adrien? And not even Cat Noir, too? In my other anons I brought up how awful I think it is that Marinette seemingly has no interest in leaning anything rlly about the boy underneath Cat Noir's mask, now she barely acts like she remembers that he's real and that they'll one day reveal where he'll then find out how many times she deliberately deceived him with her civilian identity in very hurtful ways.

How does that correspond to her being in love and more important for my question, what does that level of refusal to treat someone like a real person say about her willingness to be Cat's friend? Cause I can't see friendship in Ladynoir anymore. Marinette was the one who killed that in season 4 and then season 5 didn't improve her in much. Friends don't treat each other the way Marinette so easily uses, hurts ignores, silences and deceives Cat Noir without batting an eye.

The only effort she really made was before Kwamis choice. When she thought he was still in love with her and expected that s4 magically caused no damage to his feelings for her. she seemingly thought she could just allow him to dedicate himself to her for an overall easy way to sweep everything under the rug and make him "happy" again without her ever having to really try and do better herself because that was the comfort she was seeking at that time (shoutout to Familyagrestefanblog and erisluna35. I've been paraphrasing them alot and wanted mention that too. Didn't get to write out my own opinion in a while and I agree with them x})

This refusal to face her hurtful actions of s4 quickly developed into her craving for him to give her his easy love and not wanting to take anything less than precisely the endless devotion she wanted from him now. No matter what the price. No matter how much it put him too in danger (what even meant Cat Blanc?), and yet, still no interest in him as a person.

Once she had to take the no, she left and then she never again made a genuine effort in Ladynoir. Any effort to better herself was romance related. Determination may have been the episode where she rlly noticed her changed feelings for him, but she did try earlier than that. But it fully stopped with his no as did her changed feelings vanish as quickly as they showed up. So what does that say about her and how she views their "friendship"?

Season 4 has her already show that she doesn't want Ladynoir to be an actual friendship since she treats him barely better than a magical pet she rarely ever thinks about, which caught her off guard over and over that she isn't being the kindest and adoring person of all time to him. She treats him so much worse than her actual friends and in s5 she isn't trying to build a real connection beyond wanting him to shower her in his devotion and love.

What season 5 shows bout Marinette's view of the Ladynoir friendship is in my most generous reading her not getting to hide behind any romantic feelings from either side that she doesn't know how to be his friend, after she had to learn in season 4 that she was a really really bad one. But even with that generous reading, it would still mean that Marinette then went on prioritizing not having to feel any further discomfort or having to owe up for her actual mistakes in their bond over her finally being the friend she SHOULD think Cat Noir deserves. A friend he desperately needed but never got cause she called it a day with her personal needs being met my having her best friend Alya with her.

Friends don't do that. Marinette denied him any genuine friendship he obviously truly needed as Cat Noir because she personally didn't need it from him anymore cause of Alya. And he rejected her desire to now be adored by him so there was no purpose left anymore for him to fulfill in her life besides the easy partner she made clear cant ask shit from her.

That is so unbelievably selfish... How on earth is that supposed to be FRIENDSHIP?

Srry, for this being long. Last point.

Luka of course needs to be mentioned too. Sure, the show says they are friends. But are they really? Their friendship is built on him being her platonic therapist back-up boyfriend who doesn't ask shit of her either. This is still the same pattern as with Catrien. Luka does all the emotional labor and Marinette just takes and takes and that's what makes her so comfortable around him but she isn't interested in him either beyond what she sees day to day in front of her.

That doesn't count as friendship in my book. For Adrigami you can still feel their friendship after their breakup. But Lukanette is Luka being a platonic therapist boyfriend and Marinette being just as disinterested in him as with Cat Noir while being just as comfortable getting showered in emotional labor that she's unwilling to work on giving back the way she should.

How is that friendship? What value has friendship for Marinette once any romantic feelings are involved from either side and it isn't Zoé (feels like a homophobic backhanded compliment lmao)

That was very long, I apologize. But thanks to writing in anon I started becoming more comfortable with the idea of joining the Fandom discourse again. I've got alot I wanna say after all that time in silence but I'm not sure yet if I should put myself out there again with a blog. With how season 5 ended Marinette stans are gonna be vicious beasts to any criticism they come across and I don't want that to happen again :(

---

I hope this isn't a case of speak of the devil and he shall appear but lately things have been really quiet on the Marinette stan front. The worst I’ve gotten was this really unhinged one, but they were so unpleasant they didn't have any friends so the harassment was very one-note and stopped pretty quickly since they had to run it alone. It could be that now that season 5 confirmed that season 4 wasn't an outlier, that the show’s writing has gotten incredibly sloppy and nasty, the critical side of the fandom has become unified and we add to each other’s posts and kind of back each other up. It's harder for Marinette stans to target us one by one, and their preferred tactic is dogpiling a single blog. A lot of the Marinette stans protesting my posts now shut up right quick when they see more people agreeing with me adding to the reblog chain.

As for the question, I agree with your assessment. It really does appear that Marinette hates the idea of being friends with a love interest. She whined about Adrien seeing her as just a friend all the way back in Riposte. Adrien sung her praises to Kagami, while she spied on them, and she had the gall to whine that the boy she “loves” thinks so highly of her because it wasn't the kind of thinking she wanted.

There was this one thing I said in a previous post that I think is accurate: Marinette part-times being Cat Noir's friend. Even the part of time she acts as his friend, she ignores his feelings, insults him, pushes him away, refuses to give him emotional support in any way and lies to him about anything she possibly can. She only approaches him as Marinette when she wants to complain about Adrien not coming to the date he didn't know was a date, when she thinks she can score a date with him or so that she can practice confessing to Adrien on him. Marinette's “friendship” with Cat Noir is all take with no give when she isn't outright ignoring his existence.

She also ignores boys who have feelings for her in her civilian life. Nathaniel is very suspicious of her in Reverser, having to be convinced that she wasn't planning to humiliate him, implying he isn't part of her friend group since he doesn't know her well enough to know she only humiliates people when they're in her way of getting at Adrien. (Alix makes it sound like she wouldn't do that period, but we know the truth by now.) She also refused to come to Juleka and Luka's shared birthday party if Luka was present after they broke up. I bet if you tried to tell Marinette, or her writers, that your romantic partner should also be your best friend to make a healthy relationship, they just wouldn't compute. 

I don't want to say Marinette doesn't hold friendship in high regard period, because the amount of exceptions she makes for Alya shows that she at least values Alya’s friendship. I think she just doesn't value friendship with boys. I feel like Marinette is the kind of person who doesn't think boys and girls can really be friends, which would explain why she thinks Adrien considering her a friend is worse than anything else. If boys can't really be friends with girls, Adrien using the word “friends” means they aren't even that.

Consider this: how often does Marinette hang out with her guy classmates when it isn't 1) a whole-class outing or 2) more likely that Marinette just wanted to hang out with his girlfriend? Like, in Animan, Marinette had no idea Nino had a crush on her, but she still acted like an outing with him at the zoo was the worst thing ever. I get that she was disappointed Adrien wasn't there, but Nino is one of Marinette’s oldest classmates, yet she doesn't want to spend time with him, unless she's planning to use him to get closer to Adrien, since he's Adrien’s best friend.

Of course, she doesn't really value the time with her other friends for its own sake outside of Alya either. It seems like the only times they hang out together is to plot or participate in her get Adrien quick schemes. The only times the girls do something not Marinette related is when Marinette hasn't called them together, like when they were going to the pool in Gorizilla, something Marinette completely forgot until Alya called her. Marinette has poor memory but, despite her knowing she has poor memory, she apparently gave herself no reminder to hang out with her friends. You bet I write down every occasion I’ve agreed to see my friends specifically because I have bad memory as well.

It seems like, unless you're Alya, Marinette only cares about you for how able and willing you are to help her catch Adrien's attention. I keep saying Marinette treats her Adrien romancing problems as the most important thing going on at any given moment, and it's true for all areas of her life. Maybe that's the reason we didn't see Socqueline for four seasons despite her supposedly being such an important friend to Marinette, and why she never joined the friend group proper; Socqueline couldn't help her get with Adrien so she wasn't worth Marinette’s time.

This is a yet another thing where Miraculous is actually pretty sexist; girls and boys can't ever just be friends and girls care more about getting guys than they do about their friends. Another thing of course is this idea that boys just don't have as in-depth feelings as girls or should bury their feelings and never ask for emotional support, which is why all of Marinette's love interests are her emotional support dispensers whose opinions on anything don’t matter when their job is to simply mindlessly worship Marinette while their feelings are devalued by the narrative every time they dare to try to ask Marinette for some support back. Luka gets Akumatized which convinces him to break up with Marinette when he had emotional needs she wasn't willing to fulfill. Meanwhile Adrien goes through the travesty that is Kuro Neko

“Power of love always so strong” but only when it's Marinette's toxic idea of love and when it isn't platonic love. Unless you're Alya, I guess.

[nordickies]

one thing about sufin that I've noticed is that sweden is not allowed to be angry/irritated at finland (fanon), he is always portrayed as this perfect ✨husband✨ Do the fandom really think that Finland never ever does something wrong? I'm just imagining sufin planning their anniversary, and then finland ends up staying out late forgetting he was supposed to come home to sweden, and when he does come home being like "I'm sooooorryyy but estonia insisted we take another round of shots!" and sweden is just;😑

THIS!!! YOU'RE SO RIGHT

I literally can't name a single negative trait people have collectively assigned Finland in the fanon. Granted, Finland is a boring character with not much going on with him. So he's not particularly interesting to explore. Though the fandom portrays him as having bloodlust or murderous intent, it's always just played for laughs. But that could be an interesting flaw to give him; commit to the bit! Make him fucked-up or even capable of violence if he's provoked. Finland should be way more awful than he is portrayed as. I want him to be self-centered, stubborn, and just painful to work with at times. He's petty and unpredictable.

But true. I don't feel like it's solely SuFin issue though. I feel like people never let Sweden be mad at anything. Or the only time he's allowed to be mad is at Denmark. Maybe it conflicts with his stoic/mysterious persona, but I feel like he'd be so easily angered, especially when he gets overwhelmed? We don't even see him annoyed or provoked!

If I had to guess as to why that is, it probably stems from the fact that in the canon, for a good portion of their screen time, Finland is either scared or nervous around Sweden. He's always wondering if he has offended him (needless to say, I don't like this). That sort of nervousness, combined with their power dynamic probably just makes people overcompensate to make Sweden the perfect person, a gentle giant who could never do anything wrong.

So, I get where it comes from and I can totally understand it. And it's not like everyone has to make their favs super fleshed out and realistic, and have equal amounts of positives and negatives. Sweden especially is a comfort character for many people in this fandom. But I personally like nuance, and I love shitty characters. And I love when the past comes to haunt them about it <3 Just torturing my fictional dolls, don't mind me

But I'm seriously interested to hear, especially from writers, how do you handle this issue! What kind of bad traits do you give Sweden and Finland? When do they have conflicts? Believe me, I have a long list, so I'd love to hear yours! I'm especially interested in Nationverse character-building

[hauntsthenarrative]

1, 8 and 10 for yellowjackets 👀

HEY MOOTIEEEE okok;

The character everyone gets wrong - I feel like people misunderstand so many of the characters (as an ex Misty hater who didn't understand the mechanics of a black box I have been guilty of this), but I think the main one is Natalie. I've seen a lot of people complain about how her character is largely based around Travis, but the whole point of it is to demonstrate her trauma-bonding habits and how she EVENTUALLY GROWS OUT OF THAT. While we didn't get a chance to see healed Nat apart from the S2 finale, the show explores how you have this loner girl, who's included with the team and her two friends but at the same time reclusive, with a horrific family life that prevents her from truly connecting with others (ex. Kevin, who she probably never invited over to her house to bond or otherwise EVER again), and a sex life with men who have only used her for her body. You bring her into this situation where she's stranded with the only girls who truly notice her and a guy - Travis, who has an asshole dad who is just lost. Travis keeps people at arm's length, he's got this turmoil inside of him, he's angry and isn't afraid to show it. And Nat is drawn to him because she NEVER gets to be angry- she had to be careful around her dad and take care of her mom. And she sees her inner thoughts in this guy so much. Natalie wants to be there for him in the same way that no one could ever be there for her, and it's someone she can connect with on a personal level, not someone who wants her for her body, not someone who will never understand her, not someone who will idealize her and see her for her beauty. And just as suddenly she's taking bullets FROM this guy and she's falling into the same pattern as her mother, even becoming her. But she stays with Travis for so long, because she doesn't see her father, she sees herself. And so she bonds with him, she sticks with him, she destroys him just as much as he destroys her because she wants to punish herself, and Travis, in many ways, IS her. But the problem is that Travis is also her dad, and she wants so badly to love and hate herself, that she doesn't know he's the one holding all the cards. When she loses him, she loses herself, her other half, her purpose in life, and then he dies and she will never have him in her life again. So in S2, this man who she has projected herself onto, it turns out, really isn't a part of her at all. They are 2 separate puzzle pieces painfully glued together, but they can be separated. That's why Natalie isn't with Travis on the plane to her death. She's with her younger self. Because all along, it wasn't Travis that she truly loved and accepted, and who loved and accepted her. It was the parts of her she had lost and had finally gained back.

Jesus I yapped on the first one so I'm gonna make the next one shorter. For number 8, I think people are wrong about Ben. Do I think it was awful he lit the cabin on fire? Yes, obviously that's fucked up. But this is a man who needs more food than the rest and hasn't eaten for literal weeks at this point. He is anxious, schizophrenic, and totally anti-cannibalism. He just witnessed his only 'friend' (Nat) let a CHILD die in her place and be crowned a fucked up cult leader queen for a group of insane women (and Travis). He is horrified. He is scared. He is on his last leg. Like I said, lighting the cabin on fire was horrific, but whose to say he was next? So I think it can be justified a bit in many extents.

Finally, for number 10, I'm sorry to all my Van loving mutuals, but i genuinely HATE her. I know she's starving and unreasonable but I feel like her character got really fucked up towards the ends of season 1 and the entirety of season 2. Fanon acts like she's the greatest ever but she literally told a guy whose brother she had JUST LET DIE that he was being selfish, and that she didn't regret letting a little boy die when there was a USELESS, CULTISH, HALF DEAD BITCH who was WILLING AND READY to be consumed if necessary that was offering herself up for food. Javi's whole death was fucking bullshit and literally horrific. They let Jackie sleep outside and consumed her dead body but couldn't allow an ailing Lottie to just die when she was already injured? And Van EXCUSING that behavior and on top of that TAUNTING a fellow survivor about the fact they were going to fucking eat his little brother? I feel sick. All the girls are fucked, but Van is especially shitty, and fanon needs to stop making her out to be a fucking perfect angel.

[separatist-apologist]

The fandom is so lucky to have you! We appreciate having you here and all that you contribute to it ❤️❤️

1. What brought you into the fandom?

2. What character(s) do you feel the most connected to and why?

3. Out of all of SJM’s books, which one means the most to you and why?

4. Out of all of the SJM couples (fanon, canon, endgame, etc) which one means the most to you and why?

Keep doing you ❤️

Don't lie to me- the fandom is probably just fine without me.

For six straight years, I lived, breathed, and ate academia. And then, when I decided I was done once I had my masters, it was like...what do I do with myself? I hadn't read anything for fun in YEARS. I had a standing brunch with some girlfriends and my friend had the first three ACOTAR books in her trunk. She was like, read these, you'll like them. I didn't like ACOTAR at first- I thought Feyre was miserable and the romance between her and Tamlin was so stilted and awkward. I did like Lucien, though.

And then I just kept going- the end was a lot more interesting than the beginning. I REALLY liked ACOWAR, and I like Lucien a lot. I didn't have strong feelings about any of the ships when I first came into the fandom, and spent a little time poking around. I leaned vassien for a good deal of time until I really nasty encounter with someone adjacent to that ship made me certain I never wanted to create content for them. At the same time, I read a fic I didn't particularly care for, development wise, and thought that maybe I could do it better.

Houseofhurricane left me a REALLY positive review- I think she was my first one, actually. So the rest was history.

2. I really like Nesta, honestly. I think her and I handle things similarly. I get pretty defensive and angry and I keep things in, too. I was surprised so many people hated her, and I still am, because Nesta is a pretty accurate look at how a LOT of people process trauma. It's not always pretty or nice- I'm not saying that you're excused from harming people, but I understand and appreciate where she's coming from.

3. ACOWAR is forever my favorite. Again, coming in, I was surprised by how many people found it contentious or outright hate it. I personally loved Feyre and Lucien in spring- I think I re-read that section like, 100 times in the beginning. I was a destruction of spring expert back then.

4. Feysand, probably. I do really like the whole "girl no one loves finally finds love" thing. Their romance just hits.

[burst-of-iridescent]

i've been re-reading the hunger games in preparation for the tbosas movie, and having last read the trilogy over eight years ago, i didn't realize how much i'd bought into the fanon interpretation of gale. it's pretty well-established that gale and peeta (to put it a little simplistically) represent war and peace, respectively. but the way gale is discussed and presented in fandom seems to act like he was always that way, that he never had a chance, and i realized upon reread that that's just not true.

On other days, deep in the woods, I've listened to him rant about how the tesserae are just another tool to cause misery in our district. A way to plant hatred between the starving workers of the Seam and those who can generally count on supper and thereby ensure we will never trust one another. "It's to the Capitol's advantage to have us divided among ourselves," he might say if there were no ears to hear but mine.

this passage is taken from the very first chapter of the first book, and it's evident from this that gale knows who the real enemy is, at least in theory. but that doesn't stop him from being angry at madge, from being able to dehumanize the other tributes in a way katniss never does. then he doesn't understand why katniss is outraged by the treatment of her prep team in 13, and and that turns into being willing to sacrifice the miners left in the nut in mockingjay, until finally, he designs weapons that take advantage of compassion and empathy and the desire to help fellow human beings.

gale takes human connection - the very thing he recognized the capitol was trying to destroy because of the innate challenge it posed to authoritarian rule - and deliberately uses it against itself to wreak destruction, and in doing so becomes exactly what he once despised and condemned so thoroughly.

and i think that perfectly illustrates the point suzanne collins was trying to make, that holding onto your humanity in the midst of war and suffering and brutality is a choice. war is inherently, fundamentally dehumanizing. it has to be, in order to justify itself, and no one is immune to falling into that trap, not even good people.

in recognizing the value of human life, in refusing to pay that price needlessly, in choosing to connect with others over and over again simply on the basis of their humanity, peeta and katniss go against everything war demands of them. they make the choice to hold onto their humanity by refusing to lose sight of the humanity of others.

and that's a path that was always available to gale, even if he lacked the innate compassion and goodwill for others that peeta and katniss share. though the seeds have been sown, the gale that katniss talks about in that paragraph is not yet the boy who would end up complicit in the slaughter of innocents. he isn't doomed to walk down the path that he eventually does. he still has a chance to be different, to choose different.

but it's a choice he doesn't make (is likely no longer able to make by the end), though he once might have, and to me that is the real tragedy of gale's character.

[wolveria]

To the anon that sent another message about this ask:

There is no misunderstanding. I knew what you were trying to say, and I answered accordingly.

Acknowledging your discomfort was the first thing I did. It was also one of the last things I addressed. But I also said feelings aren't an indicator of truth or reality, which can be a harsh thing to hear. But it doesn't mean I don't care about what you said.

You've repeatedly said you're upset about how aroace identities are treated in fandom, and I think it would be helpful to examine why.

I hope you read this post in its entirety, because I feel what I have to say is important and might provide some insight as an older aroace.

To put it bluntly, I think you're defensive and protective of aroace characters, because you feel your own identity is being dismissed and threatened in fandom spaces.

What you said here tells me that this isn't actually about fictional characters. This is about how you feel as an aroace in the queer community.

I completely understand. Aphobia is real, it's pervasive and insidious, and it can feel like we're outsiders in the queer community. Unfortunately, this isn't uncommon, and we're not the only ones to get that exclusionary treatment.

But it's important to understand aphobia isn't caused by what fans do with fictional characters. Nor is it an indicator of any actual aphobic thoughts or beliefs.

If fans are already hostile towards aroace people, you would assume they would also be shitty towards aroace characters, right?

That's a dangerous assumption. You would be surprised how many racist bigots are much more tolerant of characters of color than they would be of a real person of color standing in front of them.

Continued below (tw for mention of rape fantasies):

And then take me, someone on the aroace spectrum. My most abused characters are my aroace ones. I have absolutely horrific fantasies and stories of them. I will put them in the most fucked up sexual situations, including corrective rape scenarios. I'm an absolute monster to them.

Am I erasing their aroace identity? You could argue I am. I would say it's the least problematic thing I'm doing to them, in the grand scheme, but the question is: Do you think I'm a part of the problem? Or is it okay because I'm also aroace? Why are my fantasies acceptable, when a non-aroace having the same fantasies isn't?

And that's what all of this is: fantasy. A fan taking a canonically aroace character and treating them as cishet is their fantasy.

(And that's not even acknowledging that you can never truly know if that's what's happening. An aroace character can display romantic behavior, have sex, and do all the things that would make them pass as cishet. That doesn't make them any less aroace, does it?)

But for argument's sake, lets say that this hypothetical fan truly is making them straight as an arrow.

So what? Why is that any more harmful than my rape fantasies? Why do my fantasies get a free pass, but their fantasies can be labeled as aphobic?

My argument is, there is no moral difference between my fantasies and anyone else's.

Because how someone treats fictional characters can never be an accurate indicator of how they will treat real people.

Aroace character treatment in fandom isn't a source, or a sign, of aphobia. Only actions against actual people are.

Again, this is not addressing media representation. I can't tell you how many times I've seen an asexual-coded character be forced into a weird, awkward, heteronormative situation, and it's made me feel angry and erased. But I focus that anger at the responsible party, the people who got paid to make these choices. I try not to aim my hostility at fans for doing the same thing. Because one is a play fantasy, and the other is a decision with millions of dollars behind it. They are not the same.

Fanon interpretation can go away with a block button. Aphobia in media is a lot harder to contend with, and being upset with fans won't address the core issue. It's a larger problem that doesn't have an easy solution, and sometimes, being angry at other fans can feel like a way of hitting back.

It isn't. You're only lashing out at people as powerless as you.

I'm sorry for upsetting you, that you believe I'm not being sympathetic to other aroaces, but I just don't have the bandwidth to give a shit about fictional people.

I care about real people, including you, Anon, so I hope you have a support system that can help you feel validated in your identity. Because from some of the things you said, it sounds like people are being aphobic toward you. And that's a real problem that can and should be addressed.

Fandom can be a very hostile place for anyone, especially aroace people, and I hope you find other, kinder spaces for validation and safety in your identity.

[zeroducks-2]

CW: me complaining about comicbook takes and being generally a bitch.

I have no problem with "bad comicbook takes" in the sense that I'm all for leaving the interpretation of what happened to the readers. That's part of why I tend not to argue with people that say shit like that Jason is wrong to be angry at Bruce. Like, ok. I disagree with you, and I will roll my eyes back into my skull, but that's still just an opinion you know?

Like imagine tomorrow someone said that Joker was right for killing Jason and maiming Barbara because Jay and Babs are annoying, and they deserved it anyway. It would be a batshit nonsense take but still someone's opinion, and I don't... Really argue with opinions? Or anyway I try not to. Think what you will, I have my bonkers opinion on things as well so yeah I get it. There is no "correct way" to experience a story anyway.

What really gets me is when someone reads a comics in which Thing happens, and then will go around saying that "actually Thing did not happen yall are just stupid lol lmao".

You want an example, I know you do.

"Dick is not the person who made Damian Robin, so Tim should not be angry at Dick for that. He should actually be angry at Alfred."

Do you are have stupid. What in the reading comprehension why is this something people are saying. I genuinely don't understand if everyone's just trolling or what.

Yes, Alfred very gently suggests that Damian should be Robin. But:

1 Alfred does not make decisions for the "family", he never has, that's not his role. Alfred exists to babysit and provide a wise word of advice to Batman (and Dick at that point in time IS BATMAN). Alfred has no decisional power over who gets to wear this or that mantle, that's Batman's decision when it comes to his sidekicks (save some exceptions of people doing whatever the fuck they wanted to like Steph or Red Hood Jason, but they still had to fight Batman's autorithy anyway).

2: Alfred suggests this and then Dick is the one who agrees, implements and enforces it. Dick takes away Robin from Tim, because it's on him as Batman to rule over these things. If Dick didn't want to do this he would have simply said "no Alfred the kid can't be Robin" and left everything as it was, but Dick instead heard the suggestion and decided to follow it.

ALFRED DID NOT MAKE DAMIAN ROBIN AND I CANNOT BELIEVE THIS NEEDS TO BE SAID.

"Tim's parents are not abusive, it's a fanon thing"

Okay this partially goes into the opinion category but it needs to be said. Tim's parents were absent for the most part of Tim's life, and that is pretty fucking abusive. Tim wasn't beaten down within an inch of his life by his father or whatever, but dude still ignored him, squandered the family money and then demanded to have a relationship with his son where Tim was emotionally open and available to his father, only then he found a new partner and went back to treating Tim like shit and ignoring him.

All of this is hella abusive and yall need to learn that abuse doesn't only mean beating someone up. Stop fucking say Tim's father was an angel I am going to set shit on fire.

[thepurplewombat]

For the violence ask game, can I request your answers to numbers 3, 10, 14, 21 and 22?

ooooh lovely choices here!

3: screenshot or description of the worst take you’ve seen on tumblr

Oh, god, there are so many. But I think the worst and most frustrating ones are related to Jin Guangyao and Mo Xuanyu. I've seen a number of people say things about the whole thing being a lie from JGY's end to discredit MXY, and I've even seen some that called JGY a groomer, and tbh, it makes me sick on multiple levels. Allow me to explain:

So first of all, denying that MXY really did what he was kicked out of JLT for completely ignores some of the only things that we know about him from his own words (filtered through WWX of course, but isn't everything?). On Page 19 of Volume 1, WWX is reading MXY's demented scribblings and comes across the part where he is talking about having been kicked out of JLT. It is never mentioned that he feels resentment for this, or that it was all a lie - and if there is anywhere that it would say outright that MXY was angry because he was falsely accused, wouldn't it be in the private ramblings hidden in his own room?

Second of all, if JGY had really fabricated rumors that MXY had harassed him in order to get him kicked out, he would have had his own wound on WWX's arm. Which, let me be clear, he does not. We're talking novel canon here, and in the novel, all the wounds close once the Mo family are dead.

Third of all, I find it sickening because it is part of a pattern of placing JGY at fault for sexual and other violence committed against him. He was harassed by his own brother to the point of forcing him to expel him from the clan, he ended up married to his own sister - neither of those were his fault, but people tend to look at these situations and have just the most absolutely dumpster-fire rancid takes, like JGY committing sexual assault against Qin Su (he didn't - once he knew about their relationship he never slept with her again, and while yes, he should have told her the truth about why, his reasoning is completely understandable), or being into incest etc.

Actually also a lot of takes wrt JGY and sex are pretty rancid, but I think the MXY thing is the worst, and it keeps coming up and make me want to set the whole tag on fucking fire.

10 - worst part of fanon

There are a lot of fanon takes that annoy me - WWX is good at diplomacy, NMJ is a fluffy cuddlebear, LXC is a himbo, but none of them quite make me want to Hulk Out as bad as fanon JGY, who is essentially just JGS in a funny hat.

You want an uncomplicatedly and unrepentantly evil villain to pin your hate on? JGS is right there.

You want a rapist who never shows an ounce of regret? JGS is right there.

You want a monster who ordered human experimentation with resentful energy to be done? JGS is right there.

You want the author of all of WWX's post-Sunshot misery? Jin Guangshan is RIGHT FUCKING THERE!

But no, we're gonna go ahead and pin all of JGY's father's crimes on him.

ugh.

14 -that one thing you see in fics all the time

oh god, if I could have a penny for every time I have seen surprise villainYao in a fic tagged with xiyao I would be so rich. It's especially frustrating when it's in a modern AU, when a lot of the pressures that caused JGY to do the shit he did just didn't exist. With a lot of modern AUs you can't even say 'cool motive, still murder' (a valid take on JGY tbh) because 90% of the time he doesn't even have a motive? He's just out there killing people for shits and giggles and I'm like, 'You're thinking of Xue Yang. This isn't JGY, this is Xue Yang in a funny goddamn hat.'

21 - part of canon you think is overhyped

I've been sitting here for ten minutes trying to think of a specific part of canon that's overhyped and not just annoying to me personally, and I can't really think of anything? Like, there's this perception in fandom that LWJ is a loving and caring brother who did a lot for LXC, and that pisses me off because he is the worst didi in a work full of bad didis - JGY killed his elder brother, and still managed to not be as terrible a little brother as Lan 'abandon my brother who's just killed his best friend of twenty years with his own two hands to go fuck Wei Wuxian under a bush' Wangji. But that's annoying because it's wrong, not because it's overhyped, so I'm just gonna go with a big old 🤷‍♀️here.

22 - your favorite part of canon that everyone else ignores

I mean, I don't think it's ignored necessarily, but I would love for more people to pay attention to the fact that WWX literally made Wen Chao eat his own flesh, and that was really gross and horrible but also very sexy of him.

Because like, a part of the appeal of WWX is that he is legitimately monstrous. He does absolutely monstrous things during the Sunshot campaign, and people are right to be afraid of this extremely powerful and unpredictable person who commands the goddamn dead. But WWX is like an example of how you can be a monster but also try to be a good person, and a lot of people strip a lot of the complexity out of him by making him a Manic Pixie Dream Necromancer who's like, a little quirky but ultimately cool, and no, fuck that noise.

Wei Wuxian was a monster. He became a monster in response to the pressures of the war and his massive pile of untreated PTSD, but he was so terrifying that for a moment while I was reading the rescue of the Wen, I wasn't sure that they were going to go with him. And I wouldn't have blamed them for a second because this is the man who nearly single-handedly destroyed their clan, slaughtered their friends and families, and then commanded their corpses to slaughter even more. That's fucked up and villain behaviour, and nobody would have blamed the Wen for preferring the ordinary human torture and death and murder over whatever Wei Wuxian might choose to do to them. At least once the guards killed you the torment was over.

But a monster isn't all he is. He tries to do the right thing, he tries to be good, and while it doesn't solve the situation, it does mean something. Wei Wuxian's story is the story of a man who covered himself in blood to save his own life and the lives of others, and then found out that sometimes you don't get to go home. Sometimes the blood doesn't wash off and you spend the rest of your days with the shadows of your past hanging over you.

But he still tried! He still tried, and in the very end of the story, he is free, and happy, and loved.

But removing his darkest moments takes so much away from the light at the end, renders it so much less meaningful without the contrast of his darkest times.

Thank you for playing, sorry that my answers are so damn long, but apparently I get wordy sometimes!