#no gender and agab is inherently bad

[warmhugs4pugs]

Just softblocked someone who was following me cause I’m not sure if they were serious or not but friendly reminder misandrists are not allowed here in fact we very much love men in this house ❤️

[northern-passage]

it's in the lgbt tag but people are mad that it's lgbt??? what do they expect

i think in IF when people see it labelled/tagged as lgbt they just assume it depends on the player. there are a lot of games that use the gender selection mechanic and the characters are "playersexual", so some players can play whole games without ever encountering any kind of lgbt content, despite the game being advertised that way. and i don't think that's necessarily bad, gender selection is like a very significant mechanic and why a lot of people like IF, and is exactly why there are a lot of lgbt readers to begin with. but it definitely blurs the line and can be disingenuous sometimes.

[spacelazarwolf]

Hi, I was going through some of your old posts and wanted to clarify something. Do you think transfems can have internalized misogyny? Are they in your experience especially prone to sexism from having grown up as someone assigned male at birth?

weird vibes from this ask, i can’t tell if you’re trying to bait me or genuinely curious. if it’s bait, get fucked. in case it’s not, here’s my answer:

i think anyone can struggle with internalized misogyny or internalized patriarchy, especially women or people who are expected to be women. and, as the name would suggest, trans women are women. when a woman is told by society that her worth is in her appearance, and she internalizes that and starts judging herself based on those patriarchal expectations, that’s internalized misogyny. this is especially compounded for trans women and trans femmes, whose identity is already questioned by society. they face extremely intense scrutiny to look or act a certain way, to hold a certain societal role to “prove” their womanhood or femininity, so it’s not surprising that many struggle with internalized misogyny and judging themselves on the patriarchal norms that are violently forced on them. so yeah not only do i think they can have internalized misogyny, i think it’s inevitable for them to struggle with at some point on their transition journey simply because of how inescapable misogyny is in our society.

in terms of “socialization” based on agab, i think the entire concept is flawed. we’re all socialized to act a certain way based on our upbringing and environment, and very often our agab influences that, but there is no universal “afab/amab experience” and simply being raised as a boy or a girl doesn’t make you inherently more or less prone to sexism. i’ve known cis men who are staunch feminists because of their upbringing, who always work to dismantle patriarchal norms in the spaces they’re in. i’ve also known cis women who were deeply misogynistic and deeply harmed the people in their lives because of their insistence on forcing patriarchal norms onto them.

i’m not going to pretend i haven’t had bad experiences with individual trans women being sexist or misogynistic, but that’s because trans women are in fact people and people aren’t perfect. i have experienced misogyny from many different kinds of people, and the thing it always has in common is an attempt to make sure everyone’s staying in their patriarchy-prescribed box. we’ve all grown up in a sexist and misogynistic society that impresses on us how important it is to stay in our box and make sure others stay in their box.

we all have things to unlearn, including trans people. being trans doesn’t magically absolve us of doing that work. unfortunately that means there are going to be instances where trans people, including trans women and trans femmes, perpetuate misogynistic or sexist rhetoric. but i have found that offline the vast majority of my conversations with trans women and trans femmes about my experiences with misogyny and sexism go something like this:

“i face this as a trans man.”

“woah i had no idea, thanks for telling me. i relate to this tangentially because of the way trans people often have multiple gender roles forced on us at once.”

“wow i love connecting with other trans people through common experiences even if they might not be 1:1.”

[transgymbro]

Ok, probably a bad idea for me to get into this during midterms week but I've been seeing a lot of (really bad) misinterpretations of what transandrophobia is and I feel the need to get this off my chest.

Transandrophobia is NOT

A way to excuse or mock transmisogyny

"Run of the mill" transphobia

"Run of the mill" misogyny

A tool to oppress or speak over women of any kind

The same thing as "men's rights"

Thing is: I'm not saying that transmascs cannot ever be misogynistic or transmisogynistic, what I'm saying is that the idea of transandrophobia is not that. Transmisogyny is a real problem, and I do not deny that my trans sisters suffer from it. If you genuinely believe I am being transmisogynistic and point out specifically where, I am willing to listen and correct myself.

But I am also asking that you do the same for us. Just as transmisogyny is a word to describe the unique type of discrimination experienced by transfems, transandrophobia is a word to describe the unique type of discrimination experienced by transmascs. And again, it's not just misogyny + transphobia, it's being invisible, condescended to, having our identity dismissed in the context of reproductive healthcare, being excluded from discussions around reproductive healthcare, and much more. Some of these may overlap with what transfems and nonbinary people face, and some may not.

There's also the myth going around that transmascs, especially trans men, are privileged because it's "easier" for us to pass. That's far from true. I am a binary trans man who has been on T for 2+ years and I pass insanely easily. BUT I AM ONE OF THE RARE LUCKY ONES. And even if my experience was common or guaranteed, any male privilege I have is CONDITIONAL ON PASSING. "Choosing" to be a man in spite of my birth circumstances does not make me privileged. Privilege does not get handed to you if you are changing your identity away from your AGAB, regardless of what gender you're changing to or from. (This is without touching on how me being east Asian may factor in)

And while I'm at it: MEN OF ANY SORT ARE NEITHER INHERENTLY EVIL NOR INHERENTLY BIGOTS. SIMILARLY, WOMEN ARE NOT INHERENTLY GOOD OR SAFE. Neither one's birth sex nor their chosen gender have any weight on whether they are a good or bad person. It is the individual's actions and only the individual's actions that matter.

This is getting long and rambly, but to reiterate the main point one last time:

TRANSANDROPHOBIA AND TRANSMISOGYNY ARE BOTH IMPORTANT WORDS THAT ADDRESS IMPORTANT PROBLEMS/TYPES OF OPPRESSION, AND IT IS IMPERATIVE THAT THEY COEXIST

[this-is-exorsexism]

I just saw a post about how transmasc and transfem aren't labels you can "opt out of," how if you transition like this then you ARE transmasc and if you transition like that then you ARE transfem, whether you like it or not. Because it's just a "fact" about your transition, not an identity.

And it just made me so sad. I'm transneutral. Sure, my transition might look binary to an outside observer. Yeah, people might look at me now and see me as far more masculine than I was before I transitioned. But that's other people. Not me.

Does this count as exorsexism? I feel like it does but I'm also worried that they're right, and maybe my identity is offensive and maybe I AM lying for not calling myself transmasc. I don't know. I just feel really bad and insecure right now.

this is exorsexism.

through and through.

i'm assuming this post was by a trans person, because cis people tend to be less educated about trans terminology in the first place, and will often just parrot whatever is popular but not think of it any further.

a lot of trans people, even some nonbinary people, seem to be really invested in upholding the gender binary in its various forms. "these are the two options you have, and you cannot be neither" is just gender binary 2.0.

people want to group especially nonbinary people by our AGAB, because a lot of people can't handle the fact that us simply saying "i'm nonbinary" doesn't give them any information about our AGAB, about "where we came from" the way that "trans woman" or "trans man" does. never mind the fact that some intersex people who were (c)afab are trans women and some intersex people who were (c)amab are trans men, but these people usually aren't just exorsexist, they're intersexist too. if the term "trans woman" doesn't necessarily tell you what gender someone was assigned at birth anymore, apparently the term loses all its meaning, since everything hinges on AGAB... somehow. but i digress.

and people have definitely started using transmasculine and transfeminine as "acceptable" shorthands for AGAB language, whether they admit it or not. if you were afab, your only options are cis woman, trans man or transmasculine nonbinary, and if you're transmasculine nonbinary we treat you like a man anyway, and vice versa for amab folk.

bonus points if it all hinges on transition steps, i.e. if you were amab and take oestrogen, you're automatically transfem regardless of how you identify (and if you don't take enough transition steps you're basically cis anyway - their line of thinking, not mine).

because we're definitely dismantling cissexism by still acting as if hormones are inherently masculine or feminine. we're definitely deconstructing the gender binary by just changing the words from male and female to transmasc and transfem. (heavy sarcasm)

so much of it goes back to people really just upholding cissexism and the binary, probably without even realising it. by saying it's about "what we were born as" or about how we transition, people are just using the same violence on nonbinary people as cis people use on all trans people. just because cis people assume you're masculine, trans people somehow think it's what you want and do it as well.

transmasc and transfem nonbinary people obviously exist. it's part of many people's identity. others actually do just use the term as a shorthand to what they're transitioning from, where they're transitioning to, how they're transitioning, certain experiences of transmisia, etc. and that's fine - if you use it like that for yourself and don't force it onto others.

and people also love framing words that have a heavy nonbinary association as somehow offensive, dirty or otherwise bad. people will go so far to avoid saying the word "nonbinary", they hate the word "enby", in fact, they hate when we have any term that is more specific than nonbinary, and they also hate our trans- terms, be it transneutral, transandrogynous or the many others. they really hate when we're actually somewhat equal.

[fierceawakening]

Because it’s on my mind , I wanted to talk a bit about what I remember of baeddelism when I’d was going around.

Full disclaimer I am not a trans woman, nor am I doing research on the era. So I neither claim to be unbiased nor do I claim to accurately remember everything. I just want to set down what I remember so I have it.

My recollection of how it started was that a trans woman user on tumblr noticed an etymological chart on I think Wikipedia, which said that the English word bad is related to an Old Norse word baedle, which was a term for an effeminate male. In that culture such people were seen as evil or creepy for doing woman things, and their doing so was associated with what we might call black magic.

A group of trans women on tumblr really liked this, and embraced the insulting ancient term in a similar way to how many people embrace queer. “You call me bad for being AMAB and a woman, I call that fine with me.” Baeddel started popping up in lots of trans women’s usernames.

(I do not know if the etymology is accurate. Nor do I know if the ancient term referred to people considered feminine men, considered gender confused, considered to have women’s temperaments or souls, etc.)

What you also saw with this group, though, was an emphasis on being assigned male (as they phrased it, CAMAB for Coercively Assigned Male At Birth, a phrase that has been criticized as ripped off from the intersex community, where people are recognized as physically ambiguous at birth by doctors but a binary assignment is picked anyway.) This was a little surprising at least to me, as the movement I was seeing was away from terms like MTF or FTM that emphasized assigned sex.

So you started seeing the mocking trans men phrased as mocking AFAB people. “Theyfabs” was popular, the idea being that trans masculine people say we don’t fully identify as men because we don’t want to get kicked out of women’s spaces, a neat trick we get to do that trans lesbians don’t.

But our AGAB is fixed. It’s something a doctor says and that gets put on a birth certificate. Once you have it, it doesn’t change.

Which leads to seeing people as inherently evil or inherently good. If you’re (C)AMAB you’re a victim, doomed to be mislabeled a predator. If you’re (C)AFAB you’re privileged, destined to get all the pussy be accepted by lesbians.

But whenever people make a trait destiny, the lends itself to Manicheanism.

So how do you get from “we trans women are cursed to never be accepted” to “we must be put first?”

Well, there’s already an echo of that in leftism anyway, and most gay and trans USians are leftists.

Leftists really like (for good reason imo, I count myself somewhere between “pretty lefty Dem” and “less extreme progressive”) the idea that a lot of social inequality is about certain groups being left out of the discussions and events that shape policy and culture, so the thing to do is listen to those voices first.

Couple that with “around birth you’re sorted and that sorting matters, but for us trans folks that sorting is wrong and painful, and you get, from virtuous to vicious:

Transfem: assigned male, rejects patriarchy/opts out. Most virtuous.

Cis woman: assigned female, oppressed by pstrarchy. Fights oppression but not by leaving high social starts behind. Pretty mid, unless they’re a TERF.

Cis man: assigned male, benefits from patriarchy. Doesn’t reject it, as he’s got a fairly cushy deal and why meds with that. Kind of gross, as shown by unwillingness to refuse the system.

Trans man: assigned female. Opprsssed by patriarchy. Deals with it by doing everything possible to reject assignment. Essentially begging for status and not caring who knows ir. Selfishness incarnate. Pretty fuckin evil.

Some people might think this couldn’t possibly be how any transfem person thinks—isn’t being trans about internal feelings, not relationship to patriarchy?

Usually, yes! But I think the emphasis on ASAB, coupled with the (correct) idea floating around that you don’t need dysphoria to be trans, led these people to focus less on internal sense and more on politics.

My evidence for this belief is that you started to see a lot of posts by these particular transfems saying things like “Ever wanted to be a girl? You can just be one! No particular internal states required!” You started to see a lot of talk by these blogs about trying to look for and crack eggs, talked about less like “I’m going to go look for nominally cis men who seem unhappy and tell them transition is possible” and more like “I’m going to plaster this everywhere to recruit.”

As I see it, the reason everyone is suddenly so chatty about transmisandry is not that we just made it up. It’s that these people had a stranglehold on discourse for a long time, and transmascs who saw it could either openly reject it and be labeled MRAs, silently ignore it and not be heard, or believe it and internalize that choosing not to just live with our dysphoria (when transfems get to have HRT for theirs!) makes us literally evil and selfish.

It often takes a while, when someone is no longer being abused, for them to come up with language to describe what happened. The reaction can be immediate, but can sometimes be a few years delayed. That’s what I think happened here. You’re seeing us talk about transmisandry now because we’re feeling safer to say “no, that’s fucked up, we aren’t just sex gods at the dyke bar, listen to us.”

Do I think that everyone around currently who thinks “transmisandry as a term implies misandry is systemic, and we shouldn’t do that” ascribes to this weird valence flipped “assigned male good, assigned female bad” gender essentialism?

No, but I think it’s reasonable to wonder if someone might, and thus reasonable to say “don’t tell people to stop using that word. Replace it in your head with ‘transphobia,’ shrug, and find another hill to die on.

[an-eldritch-peredhel]

I’d love to hear your thoughts on what Eldritch peredhel entail

-@@outofangband

Sorry this took so long @outofangband and thank you for asking this I am! Delighted! And am preemptively putting a read more down because I cannot shut up about they <3

alright I'm just gonna put stuff and headcanons down as they occur to me so expect low-moderate levels of coherency

shapeshifting is an obvious one (gets weaker down the generations) but because my brain is Like This I have caveats!

thanks to my whole peredhil things=gender allegory that my brain spit out without my permission I've long struggled against my inherent feeling that while they can shapeshift they don't like it

but because I'm now aware of my brain's reasoning I can say it's because of ✨fantasy dysphoria✨

that's oversimplifying, obviously, but peredhil already have so much issues with working through who and what they are and compromising between body and mind and spirit that actively choosing to change into/present as something/someone who They Are Not is. Not usually their cup of tea.

As a whole they tend to have specific forms that they prefer as being closer to themselves, and distinct enough that it doesn't feel like they're faking something they're not

(changing to look like a different person, or a edited version of themself is Very Very not fun unless either explicitly for disguise or shenanigans)

(the exception to this is that Luthien can make herself look almost perfectly human without any real issue. she doesn't do it often but especially as she ages she likes to catch glimpses of her reflection and get both excited and sappy. this is in contrast to making herself look almost perfectly like an elf which makes her feel like her skin is on fire.)

(Also I'm pretty sure all of them can flip their agab presentation while only feeling varying degrees of off, and even then it's a different feeling than the shapeshifting dysphoria. Dior and Elwing are the two who I think mind it the most)

They all have the (agonizing to write) trait of feeling very distinct relationships to their species in their body vs soul/mind vs spirit/fea and they all feel it very differently! This isn't exclusive to Luthien's line but the maia blood does make it worse.

Oh! This is a new headcanon of mine actually but!

They all have faces that are very very hard to capture in image. They are the bane of portrait artists (and, to a degree, sculptors) everywhere because the art never looks accurate to life

It's not blatantly off it's just. missing something? Or something was added? maybe it's a little too wide, or narrow, or long, or short, in one place or another

It's not unrecognizable but if you've ever seen the subject in real life you can just tell

It's especially bad with Luthien (and Daeron) and Dior (to a lesser extent) because everyone literally sees them differently, as in their features will be slightly different depending on what each person finds attractive/aesthetically appealing and beautiful

(not a lot, again, it's not unrecognizable, but there has never and will never be any accurate depiction of Luthien as she was as a person)

(as a concept, though, as the most beautiful creature to have ever existed in Arda, a little of her image exists in every portrait lovingly made of a beloved spouse, every child's drawing of their family, in biological sketches of songbirds and field mice, in a sculpture of a stranger's face. Daeron remembers his sister perfectly, but he collects these regardless)

(Arwen, Luthien come again, isn't described as such by her grandparents. Galadriel and Celeborn both knew Luthien, and while Arwen and her father both look as closely to her as genetically possible, to those who actually know them both it's nothing more than uncanny family resemblance. Luthien was to most a concept personified, Arwen is a person with concepts imposed on her.)

The list of people who have seen Luthien how she actually, physically, defaultly is, essentially consists of Melian, Daeron, Beren, and Dior

Beren doesn't see her as she is right away because he doesn't know her right away, but they learn about each other and she shows herself and he sees her and by the time she rescues him from Tol-im-Gaurhoth there are no echoes on her face

(He's always a little bit haunted that he nearly died without realizing he'd never quite seen the truth of her before)

Neither Thingol or Beren can quite see their own features on their children's faces. They clearly take after their mothers, after all!

(This leads to much affectionate eye-rolling on Melian and Luthien's part)

Hair stuff!

It's alive! kinda! it's definitely not normal hair!

It moves a lot on its own. Sometimes like a breeze is blowing where there isn't one. Sometimes more like tentacles. It depends on its mood.

They've got some very pretty traditional cosmic horror vibes swirling around on their heads. It's very sparkly and colorful but in a Forbidden Shrimp Colors that your brain is unable to comprehend way so it reads as iridescent black mostly, or holographic white, where applicable

Luthien's hair actually is a glimpse into space, Daeron's is a glance at a star

(Luthien's magic hair cloak survives, I think, into the 4th age and beyond, though if anyone/anything has found it they certainly don't know the origins of the beautifully intricate living star map. It has seen the reign of countless north stars, yet the lines always point to the same coordinates- where the ancient, sunken, ruined remains of what once was Tol-im-Gaurhoth lay)

Speed round!

Fangs and talons and horns oh my! Are they tooth and keratin and bone, or are they petrified wood and gem and stone? Yes!

They all smell a little like ozone and a lot like petrichor, flowers, and Green. If you've smelled green you know what I'm talking about. Also, unfortunately, like bird. Birds don't smell great, especially wet bird.

Weird Foresight Powers++

(Most of them don't have actual foresight, but all of them are more in-tune with the Song than is natural for an incarnate)

Their eyes glow, most notably in the dark, unless the irises turn black as they sometimes do. They are also all unnaturally bright versions of the less-spooky parent's- Dior's are gold, Elwing's are blue-green like a tropical sea (Elured and Elurin split the color between them- ultramarine and emerald), Elrond and Elros have pale star-gold, Elladan, Elrohir, and Arwen all have silver.

(Daeron and Luthien being the exception again, because I decided they have Melian's eyes before I decided this, and I don't know what color eyes Thingol has. Watsonianly: Melian's spooky genes overwrite a lot. Luthien's genotype is probably much closer to his than her magically overwritten phenotype)

Their sclerae turn black and their pupils white, on occasion, usually when using powers

They don't bleed right. It's a little too red for an elf, a little too light for a human, and it shines strange as it beads like quicksilver on the skin

They have very shiny, cool skin. Luthien looked like her's was silver plate under a stretched stocking, the rest toned it down from there but it's still noticeable.

The Song is. Attached to them. They are all very much Main Characters. Their lives have a clear story arc with symbolism and narrative parallels. They are all subconsciously aware that their lives are a fairytale, whether tragic or no, and yes this has many Implications and affects. They are not the only ones like this, but they are the only ones who, to some level, know they are in a story.

This is the fundamental separation between them and everyone else.

The difference in how they perceive themselves between heart soul and spirit is very difficult to explain and understand, but not impossible to someone who knows them and is willing to put in the work.

The life-long knowledge that they are Important to the Song and their every choice and event they experience and their mere existence serves a greater purpose in a way that most other people simply do not- that's very, very isolating.

No one else can understand how they see the world. Very very few people are willing to try, and even fewer in a way that's not frustrating. There is a reason most of them find only one person to latch on to outside of their family, and a reason they hold on through hell and high water.

(This is about being neurodivergent)

[skinks]

the fact that the sheer concept of socialisation is now being widely circulated on this website as a “terf dogwhistle” and not just. A way to talk about the differences by which boys and girls are conditioned under patriarchy in order to perpetuate patriarchy is why we’re fucking backsliding into widespread open misogyny even in previously feminist-positive spaces like tumblr you fucking losers. Why can’t we talk about male socialisation? You think men (and women! and everyone!) just become casually sexist out of thin air? Is it inherent? Socialisation doesn’t exist? Are you arguing FOR gender essentialism? girls are born feminine and boys are born masculine? come tf on. the pressure of socialisation based on our agab is a massive REASON so many of us fucking struggle with the gender roles forced upon us in the first place, how is this suddenly controversial. as feminists. jesus christ. what phrase is acceptable to tumblr for me to be able to discuss something as basic as my brother being praised for eating large portions while I was shamed for the exact same behaviour? you wanna just pretend this shit happens for no goddamn reason? if you assume bad faith and transphobia about anyone discussing male socialisation then we’re never getting out of here

[sorin-sunchild]

Wait whats the issue with saying tma/tme?

Similar to what happened to AGAB terms, people have started to use TMA/TME to just mean 'Binary AMAB trans woman/binary AFAB trans man' occasionally parcelling it out to nonbinary people as well based strictly on your AGAB/SAB or perceived AGAB/SAB. The creation of a new binary isn't a good thing, especially one defined by a specific type of oppression/bigotry that is not black and white in it's real life execution. It will always involve ignoring, excluding and erasing the experiences of those who don't fit that strict binary but still experience what it's talking about.

*AMAB trans women are the most effected by systemic transmisogyny (after all they are the intended target of it). They are the most affected and the worse affected group. The way others can be affected is not equal but it's also not acceptable and it still happens - circumstantially or otherwise. 'Exempt' means immune to, free from, never experiencing or having to experience X *ever*. Bigots aren't kind and are well known for simply lashing out at anyone with any resemblance to a group they hate.

The line especially gets blurry if one is intersex. An AFAB intersex person, after all, could have gone through a masculinising puberty and be affected by transmisogny for simply looking 'masculine/like a man' in the transphobes eyes. Bigots rarely give a shit about what your personal identity and actual AGAB is. If they want to be transmisogynistic towards you, they will. In this way you will not be 'exempt' simply for not being AMAB and in some way trans feminine. There are people who will *never* experience even a lick of transmisogny but it's not strictly based on one's AGAB or gender.

Considering point 1 and how many people use TMA/TME alone to describe someone's identity e.g. 'TMA so-and-so' ...don't you think it's a bit weird referring to trans women specifically by the oppression they face? Not as women, or trans women, or trans femmes but basically 'victim of transmisogny'. It's like referring to your ssa friend as 'lesbophobia affected' instead of 'a lesbian'. It's just strange to centre the persons oppression and not their gender/actual identity to me I dunno. Trans women deserve better than to be constantly reminded or told of their inherent 'inescapable victimhood' to the point where it becomes how they're identified as trans women.

People are using it to basically assess whether a person is or isn't allowed to talk about how transmisogyny or transphobia in general affects anyone of any group. Again this is needlessly exclusionary. Reminds me of how 'no uterus no opinion' was/is used with the intention of telling cis men to back off discussion of cis women's reproductive rights etc but also excludes trans men by assuming their lack of a uterus based on gender and excludes trans women from talking about issues affecting people of their gender simply due to assumedly not having a certain body part.

I don't think people who use it often consider the wider implications and you aren't bad necessarily just for using it. I'm sure some do find it useful, but it's not useful on a wider scale. If it's useful to you then use it for you but maybe we can back off using it for others based on assumptions?

There's many areas of grey when it comes to how transmisogny affects people. People who aren't trans women saying they are affected by transmisogny isn't because they all want to be victims so bad or talk over trans women. It's because they know what they experienced and they don't want to be shoved into another binary box and have their experiences silenced because a bunch of strangers online have black and white thinking. This has never nor will it ever be a good thing to do to someone.

Do I think I've ever been personally affected by transmisogny? No. But that doesn't mean that other trans masc NB people haven't and never will or can. Trans women and trans femmes, especially AMAB ones are always always ALWAYS going to be the most affected and the most vulnerable to it and the ones who have the most to gain from it being fought but that does not and will not ever mean that everyone else is miraculously never affected at all i.e. exempt. That's my personal issue with the TMA/TME dictonomy.

*In light of recent events, I would like to express that my usage of 'AMAB trans woman' here was to acknowledge my understanding that transmisogyny is more often aimed at and greatly used to oppress any person who is not a man but was assigned male at birth and undertakes transition towards being seen as a woman/woman-aligned by society. It was not used to call trans women men or male and I did not intend to overly highlight the type of trans woman I was talking about - hence my dropping of AGAB terminology when it wasn't necessary to the point. I have altered one use of the phrase to deemphasize the usage that upset someone. However, I still maintain that if you are rude to someone online they don't owe you any kind of civility back either.

[genderqueerdykes]

TW transphobia

Ok I'm honestly terrified. I'm terrified of.. T*rfs.

Yes. I feel like they will never ever see me as my gender (I don't even want to say what gender I am because I'm aware that they can see this) and what if they are right?? Why if Im just very disordered so is my own thinking?

Also I feel like they always know what it's your agab..

I don't want to be trans if this is how other people perceive me. I feel like I'm pretend to be *this* gender while my true self is what my agab is.

And I'm wrong about who I am.

Even my biggest gender euphoria can dissappear just like that if I see something what they are saying about people like me.

hey i just wanted to say thanks for taking the time to send this message because i think this is an important thing to address!

that's what they want you to think, but it's not true. if you take a look at posts where these people attempt to "analyze" pictures of strangers and celebrities to figure out their agab, they will always be wrong and make transphobic assumptions about cis people.

terfs are not smart! they want you to think they are, but they're very far from it. they are making incorrect assumptions about biology when they point out who they think they know is trans. they don't even understand what intersex people are, or the fact that we exist! they don't even understand that someone could look the way a trans person does without ever having touched hormones, themselves. they don't understand that any type of person can have a uterus- strangers cannot ascertain your agab magically just by looking at you. that is your most close guarded secret and nobody can "tell" just by looking at you

trans and intersex people have shown and proven time and time again that you don't know what someone's biology is for sure unless you are that person and their medical professionals. these people want you to think that they're these big scary investigators who are smarter than you, but they're bullies who react to the smallest deviation from what THEY consider to be the norm

you are not in danger of these people if you block and move on accordingly: terfs only have the illusion of power online because they are hiding behind the shield of relative anonymity to bully oppressed people. they're not smarter than you or me or anyone- they're just aggressive, mean, and targeting vulnerable people. they don't know anything about you inherently just by looking for you- they don't have tranny vision. they think they do, but they can't tell a rock from a diamond

they want to scare you because they're scared. they want to seem scary, but they're too afraid to show their faces or voice themselves in a way that extends beyond bullying teenagers online. they are weak. they aren't activists. they aren't helping anyone. you know yourself better than anyone else, you know who you are. you are the arbiter of your lived experience and no matter what someone guesses about you, they'll never be right. it's a guess, not an objective truth. they don't live in your head

hope that helps a bit! they're big dumb bullies who think making minors and trans people feel bad about themselves will somehow help women. it's not worth your time, i know it sucks to think about, but they are not as scary as they make themselves seen. worry about you, you do you. you got this. take care, stay safe, good luck out there

[ramenheim]

About prev reblogs: I have never seen TME used to complain about & demarcate cis men's behaviours.

Despite the term ostensibly lumping together *almost any gender configuration that isn't binarily trans woman*, the only times it's used recently is to complain about (trans) ppl that get lumped in with cis women (as intersex ppl trans or otherwise are *never* factored into this dichotomy anyways), including cis women themselves.

I have never once seen it used to delineate trans women from cis men, even as it gets used to delineate cis women's experiences from trans women's experiences. I have only seen /haphazard/ acknowledgement of non-binary experiences included in TMA, but only really as an afterthought or when it's framed as the precursor to 'fully realizing trans womanhood'. I've only seen intersex folks brought up if they elect to use the terms TME/TMA for themselves, with bizarro interrogations into 'how' they were raised/had their genitals 'corrected' only once they individually disagreed with the terminology or had a confounding opinion in a public discussion.

It is regularly used to delineate trans men from trans women; but its users almost uniformly deride any attempt by trans men to coin a term to describe their own unique combinatory transphobia that isn't TME; again despite TME literally just supposing to mean 'transmisogyny-exempt'.... so why would it be used to discuss trans men's *unique* experiences with hatred directed at the fact that they either "are/aren't (real) men" by anyone who wants them to suffer?

It's been *changed* into hastily recycled AGAB terminology bc of wider recognition of the flaws with /that/ but without the driving flaws of that **tool for analysis** ever being fully addressed; and therefore has gotten subsumed into the 'new euphemism' for the Innie vs Outie false dichotomy as its usage became more widespread.

I think it still is a useful discussion tool ONLY when it's viewed *as a tool* and not some inherent marker of identity. It is DEFINITELY just bigotry when used as a NOUN that has negative behaviours ascribed to it, esp in the context of complaining about trans men** as a whole homogenized group, instead of highlighting individual behaviours/belief systems for the harm they contribute to against TMA trans/nb ppl.

Young queers really need to stop swallowing the tradcath radfem juice of "Women Pure + Good & Men Bad + Evil" [**that tumblr feminism has always had a problem with] and acting like you aren't being a transphobic shitheel by adding the word Trans in front of it-- & This is ESPECIALLY a problem when non-trans "Allies" do this, as it sets up trans women for failure whenever they make a mistake/can be reframed as 'being a cause-traitor' since women are punished more harshly for any percieved failure of Righteousness, AND allows them further to enact their unbridled transphobia onto trans men (& enbys/genderqweirdos) and pass it off as 'being an ally to trans women'..... despite them just being extremely transphobic (+ misogynistic + homphobic + intersexist) & then hiding behind """"TMAs"""" as a negative PR meatshield.

TL;DR if you are using TME to mean (nc)AFAB in vent posts, just have the guts to fucking use that as the word & see how it reads then.

(**since transmasc & transfem do not imply either a 'starting' or 'finalized' gender state; they are personal adjectives in and of themselves. Please do not warp them into new innie vs outie binary divides).

[**see related: the raw ass treatment of 'AMAB enbys' on here and in similar online/irl "feminist" environments. (Which was one of the driving factors behind the original TMA/TME coinage & is where I still find useful inter-trans discussions utilizing it as a term; importantly I don't think the term should stop being used altogether!!)]

[the-delta-quadrant]

happy trans week, happy trans week to trans activists and allies who actually ally with nonbinary people as who we are rather than an oversimplified shell. happy fuck you to people who see transmasc and transfem as political groups to forcibly assign to people rather than real identities. not recognising nonbinary people for who we are and erasing transmasc and transfem as identities is not trans liberation. happy fuck you to trans people who misgender nonbinary people for politics simplicity sake and think we should suck it up. happy fuck you to political categories that are inherently misgendering. happy trans week to people who acknowledge exorsexism everywhere. happy trans week to people who recognise that "nonbinary" is good enough and we don't owe anyone transmasculinity or transfemininity. happy trans week to people who don't subscribe to the new trans gender binary. happy trans week to people who try and succeed in including nonbinary people in conversations that affect us. happy trans week to people who aren't only trans allies, but nonbinary allies too. happy fuck you to people who think being misgendered as the opposite of your agab is less bad, or being misgendered by trans people is less bad, or being misgendered when you're nonbinary is less bad.

happy trans week to burning down misgendering political categories that expect nonbinary people to sacrifice their real identities.

[angelthingy]

the thing is i think that like. afab and amab as terms arent like. a bad thing?? like if you're talking about urself and ur assigned gender happens to be relevant and is preferrable to another descriptor (eg if ur dysphoric abt ur body to some it may be easier to say ur agab rather than describing ur features) or describing a situation where thats relevant then like. sure! its just like any other word u just use it cus it makes sense- (note this only applies if YOU'RE using the term when you're talking about YOURSELF)

the problem is that when other people use or ask for someone's agab there's some kind of weird implication that it somehow changes how you behave, and that based on that you can put people into a new binary which shouldnt exist and negatively effects all trans people

people ask if you're amab expecting that to mean you're inherently more patriarchal, dangerous, "masculine" - and if you're afab expecting that to mean you're inherently more quiet, sweet, "feminine" - and BOTH of these fucking suck!!

[intersex-questions]

it's really stressful for me ask and i feel weird. if it's possible, tell if my words are intersexist. also i will use vague terms or censorship sometimes, because some words are extremely uncomfortable for me (but it's not because i see them as slurs or bad words overall).

CWs: gender dysphoria, AGAB terms, intersexism (?), went (?), long post

i have a pcos. (or... i have had pcos?)

and... it's both dysphoric and not.

i feel like the word "intersex" is really me, but i feel guilty using it. like i'm not intersex enough. like i'm not intersex at all. like i'm stealing something from actually intersex people.

also my condition reminds me that is so-called "AFAB" intersex variation. and i feel extremely dysphoric people knowing i am so-called "AFAB". i hate people knowing about some of my traits that are connected with it. i hate mentioning what i was like when i was born. i hate "AGAB" terms overall. i hate i can't use AIAB (not because of someone, but because of moral block of some kind).

i've started to treat some of my uh... "painful results" of having pcos, but it increase some of my traits i consider dysphoric. so now i'm in the middle of nowhere. (oh my god it is so vague, i'm sorry)

and for some reason... posts like "trans-intersex people will never be intersex, you will always be p_____x/d____c, you was born not intersex" make me want to cry. i might even say... it is triggering me. calling myself d____c or p____ex feels painful.

and it feels so bad. i know intersex people have a right to say it. and non-intersex people should know these boundaries. but at the same time... i can't really engage with intersex related posts safely. (i feel like i'm trying to silence you right now.)

in the end, i can't use "intersex" towards myself now due to my... guilt. and i can't use p___sex or dy___c either, because I'd rather die. i can't even call myself "questioning". because i know i have (or i had? if i'm not on meds now?) pcos. i can't use "altersex" because i see too many (useful and needed in fact) posts about difference between altersex and intersex.

i'm sorry.

Hi there,

You have nothing to be sorry for. I hear your pain and I am sorry (sympathy) that you have had to endure all of this. That is awful and no one should have to deal with that.

There are a few things I'd like to say. First, my primary perspective is that you are intersex, no matter what. PCOS is an inherently intersex condition in mine and many other intersex people's beliefs. This is an inclusionist perspective intersex blog, so keep in mind that yes, there are more exclusionary intersex people who will disagree. But you will also find many, many intersex people view PCOS as inherently intersex. And, especially in the ways you describe, it seems like it definitely affects you in a way that is relevant to being intersex.

It is really hard sometimes to work through that guilt. I know when I first started using the term intersex and realizing I was, I felt like I was faking it. I felt like I was taking a term from a community I wasn't part of and that I was just desperate to feel included or be part of something or check off a "diversity" point and many other sentiments that can from internalized homophobia (as in the whole community) and internalized intersexism.

I know that personally, I also have really struggled because going on HRT for trans+ reasons has made many of my intersex traits seem like something that's just "normal" because they kind of blend in with typical results from the HRT I'm on. But that doesn't erase the experiences I've had my whole life. That doesn't erase how my body naturally is. I don't owe anything to anyone else about my body. I do not owe justifications, reasonings, or explanations as to why I am intersex. It is no one else's business how I am intersex other than my own.

If people ever ask you how or why you're intersex, you do not know them that explanation. Even if they are intersex themselves. To me, it is akin to asking a trans person if they're on HRT, what surgeries they've had, etc. It's a personal invasive question that's not their business unless you want to share with them.

Trans intersex people are just as intersex as cisgender intersex people, and honestly, those kinds of sentiments are deeply confusing as part of the point of the intersex community and definition of it is to break down binaries and rigid boxes like sex, rather than reinforce them by reinforcing something like being cisgender or transgender. Intersex people do NOT have a right to be transphobic just because they are intersex. They do NOT have a right to be exclusionary and gatekeeping just because they are intersex.

PCOS in itself is a condition that can't be cured. Even if you showed no symptoms of it, you would still have PCOS. And even if somehow you WERE cured, it would not erase the experiences you had had with it before. You would still have lived an intersex life. Someone with hyperandrogenism going on testosterone for trans+ reasons does not erase their lived experience they had before going on testosterone.

I hope I managed to cover and address most of what you sent in. I wish you the best and again, I'm so sorry you've had to endure that all. You are absolutely welcome in the intersex community and you are completely allowed to use the intersex label. You are also allowed to use altersex if you want! They are not mutually exclusive. I identify as both intersex and altersex personally.

[queerasaurus-rexx]

it makes me laugh that some terfs think superheroes would be terfs like

wonder woman was sculpted from clay, i don't think she gives a flying fuck about your agab

wanda maximoff is married to a sexless android that presents as male

like if you see female superheroes and miss the inherent gender fuckery in all of their stories you are

really bad at media literacy

[kirlianradio]

Love the inherent distrust I’ll always have to have of cis queer men as a gaytrans man. /s

Head over heels for this dude in my class but the back of my mind won’t let me relax abt how we rlly only started talking more after I talked abt being trans.

I wanna let myself like him so bad, I rlly don’t often feel this much for someone. But the back of my mind will always have that doubt of what if he’s only interested because of me being trans. I keep having these breakdowns of panic because I’m so scared all the time.

Scared I’ll only ever be viewed as an “experience” scared i’ll only ever be reduced to my genitals. Scared no one will ever truly take my gender seriously and view me as a guy.

I’m happy other transmascs are confident in their body parts. but I get nervous sometimes with how many peoples only thoughts on transmascs seem to revolve around their genitals or femininity.

I feel like I’ll never get to escape the confines of my agab. Even around other queer ppl it feels as if there’s this layer of “yeah but ur not FULLY a guy”

Ughgh