#danny phantom negativity

[far-from-fran]

Violence ask game!! 7. what character did you begin to hate not because of canon but because how how the fandom acts about them?

Ooh, this is a good one!😈

I'm gonna start with the funnier ones, then get to the more serious ones.

I don't currently hate any of these characters. I've pretty much gotten over it, but these are the first ones that came to mind.

Ok, I'm putting this under a cut as a warning to people in these fandoms. I'm going to be bitching and moaning. Probably about your favs. So, read the tags and:

🚨 DON'T LIKE, DON'T READ! 🚨

Anyway…

Danny Phantom

I don't have anything against Danny. I actually really like him. I just got tired of seeing him all over AO3. Almost every time I searched for a fic, even in fandoms that had nothing to do with him, I'd have to filter out a bunch of DP stuff. It got to the point where I was filtering out more DP tags than tags I actually wanted to filter out. It was annoying for a while, but I took a break from AO3, and now I just find it funny.

Dr. Emile Picani (Cartoon Therapy)

This is a general pet peeve sort of thing, but I just don't like how “uwu babyboy” people make him. He's a geeky therapist with a sensitive side, but people act like he's a softboi who's never done anything bad. (He has. I actually have big problems with his debut episode. The second episode is a lot better, imo.)

It's the same issue with Patton from Sanders Sides. They take a grown man and turn him into a tiny, wittle babyboi. It's mad annoying.

Also, I hate Emile in a skirt. I just don't think he'd ever wear one, so I wrinkle my nose whenever people talk about him in one. Honestly, the “fandom is afraid of masculinity” sentiment I've seen here and there is a completely different can of worms. But I'm starting to agree with it. Nothing against men in skirts in general/irl, though. Just to be clear.

But, anyway, fanon Emile is becoming indistinguishable from fanon Patton, and I hate that. Hell, canon Emile is becoming indistinguishable from canon Patton. Like, seriously. Since when has Emile ever had to “earmuff” because someone was cursing? (Mixed feelings about the Remy/Thomas therapy video.) Let Emile be an interesting character, please. And not just “Baby softboi, but he's wearing pink this time™”.

Virgil (Sanders Sides)

My feelings toward Virgil tend to fluctuate. Most of the time, I love him, but sometimes I can't stand him. (Mostly by his own doing.) But, the way the fandom treats him like the second coming of Christ in a purple plaid hoodie is so fucking annoying. Especially with the way people woobify him.

In canon, he started as a big jerk, realized he was a big jerk, and decided to be a little jerk. It's not like he's a little uwu baby who's never done anything wrong. The Halloween ep is even sort of about not woobifying Virgil. (It's more about taking anxiety seriously.) Like. I get it, but it's still really annoying.

Of course, there's the other side of the fandom that treats him like he's the devil. Which can also be annoying, but at least they actually call him out for stuff.

The most annoying thing, however, is how the other sides will be villainized to make Virgil look better. It's nuts. Like, yeah, Janus and Virgil have beef, but neither one of them is evil, so.🙄

Aang (Avatar: The Last Airbender)

Speaking of people treating a character like they're the second coming of Christ…!

In all seriousness, I never really had problems with Aang until toxic Kataang shippers started harassing Zutara shippers. They held the ship, and Aang, to such a high stature that I couldn't like either anymore. Especially since zutara shippers were (and still are) accused of being shallow, at best, and… checks notes supporting genocide????? at worst. And, the brunt of that was when I was, like, 12, so.

Obviously, I don't blame all kataang shippers. Most of them are pretty cool. And, zutara shippers can also be toxic. I'm a zutara shipper, and I've seen some of the toxicity firsthand. But, that experience really made fandom shitty for me.

However, I've watched the show recently and remembered that I really like Aang. Despite how much he can annoy me. So, there's always a bright side.

But, yeah. Thanks for the ask, @msnihilist!😊 Sorry if I got a little heated.😅 That wasn't directed at you, lol.

[im-totally-not-an-alien-2]

Danny did his best to ignore the person trying to wake him, but they were annoyingly persistent. After a wave of "Hey"s, "Get up"s, "You can't be here"s and one muttered, "How did you get in here?" Danny finally opened his eyes to see a boy about the same age as him staring while holding up the lid to Danny's casket.

He had thought he was done being woken up after he successfully escaped his superhero responsibilities by running away from Amity, "Am I just not allowed to rest in peace?"

"Not when it's in our attic."

The ghost boy scoffed, "Shouldn't have a casket in here if you didn't want to risk something crawling in."

The guy stared at him for a long moment before Danny decided he had enough and yanked the casket closed again, this time making sure to seal it shut with ice on the inside.

"Hey!"

The ghost rolled over with a huff, determined to ignore him.

Unfortunately, he underestimated how nosey this family could be...

[stars-obsession-pit]

Tim has found his soulmate (not a soulmate AU, just in the like “i think we’re totally meant to be together” way). Well, okay, it’s entirely one-sided so far, but he’s sure SpecterNova will reciprocate once they’re in proper contact.

He’s already found everything he publicly can on the youtuber, but he’s still digging deeper. It’s weirdly difficult—his love must like his privacy!—but he’s making headway.

On the other end, Danny is getting nervous about the dedication of his new internet stalker. Even with Tucker’s help in setting up his online security and the scrambling effects of ectoplasm, they can tell that the person is still making progress. They don’t seem like they’re a part of the GIW, but that doesn’t mean their search can’t harm him in some other way.

He really hopes he doesn’t have to change identities again. Having to do it the first time to flee the GIW was bad enough, and he’s been liking his current life.

[stealingyourbones]

everyone and their mother has written Jason being some flavor of half a or liminal because he was brought back from the dead.

Y’all know Superman died and was revived to? It was a Big thing in comic book history. Unsure how long he was dead but the general consensus is 2-4 months before he was resurrected.

My favorite and most important question, how long does it take Supes to realize his new ghostly abilities are ghostly in origin and not a repeat of his already consistently used powers.

[chizelkreq]

I feel like there could be very interesting interactions between Danny and Negative Man, whether it be confusion over his powers not involving a ghost (it's radiation and/or electricity depending on your source) or Negative Man finding out he's a halfa (should you decide his powers *do* involve a ghost) and Danny being freaked out that this halfa leaves his body behind as an empty husk when he "goes ghost"

[lilianade-comics]

I know most fans have a positive opinion of this episode, and that's totally fine, but D-Stabilized is a TERRIBLE sequel to Kindred Spirits and it raises my blood pressure an unhealthy degree just thinking about it. (Valerie obviously excluded from my ire), It's the dullest thematic follow up possible. It does nothing with the halfas narratively that KS didn't already do and just repeats character beats while simultaneously making them worse, it doubles down on Dani's victim status with the high cost of the most egregious character assassination Vlad ever suffered and whatever characterization SHE could have had if the writers weren't hellbent on making the worst possible decisions with them, it deus ex machina-ed away Dani's destabilization which wasn't earned & felt pointless because it's not like they were going to keep her around at the end, AND it had the sheer gall, the unmitigated AUDACITY to be Valerie's ONLY season 3 appearance.

[necrotic-nephilim]

@profandomhopper i was going to reblog the original post this comment was left on but i felt it divorced itself from the original topic so much, you get your own post for giving me delightful permission to ramble about this. buckle in people this is long.

so, DC is a big fandom that expanses a lot of different types of content, and like anything, is subject to crossovers. the obvious ones like Marvel are for the reason of being a similar and equally popular superhero world, so it's easy to transpose the worlds onto each other and overlap the characters. both of these worlds deal with multiverses and endless, endless heroes. it makes sense and there's no real stretch to think Batman and Spider-Man could co-exist. i mean, there have been canon crossover comics. and even some more random crossovers like White Collar have pretty easy to trace origins, being an actor in WC was a popular Dick fancast back in the day so there was some bleeding over that led to a well-loved niche crossover space.

but Danny Phantom and Miraculous Ladybug are where it gets interesting. because at a surface, MLB sort of makes sense. it's a superhero world, you're following a teen girl superhero and sure the mechanics are pretty contained, but the crossover should make sense. but when you compare it to the crossover numbers of other superhero media like say My Hero Academia, Ladybug takes the *crown* with such a bizarre popularity. and of course, DP feels like it makes even less sense. sure, you *could* lump it into at the very least, superhero-adjacent media, but it's not a true hero world like MLB or DC is.

but, the thing to always understand about DC, *especially* the Batfamily (which is where the crossover content propagates the most) is this: a *very* good chunk of fans don't interact with the comics. i would venture to say even most Batfamily fans don't read the comics and actively talk about it. we've all read a very fandom big Batfam fanfic where the author's note mentions the writer has never touched a comic in their life. typically, these fans are either cobbling together their understanding from fandom content, or by frankensteining unrelated DC adaptations to understand each character. you take Bruce from Batman: TAS, you take Dick from the animated Young Justice, you take Jason from Batman: Under The Red Hood animated movie, you take Damian from the DCAMU Batman vs Robin, and you read some fandom metas to fill in the rest and well, you've got some sort of an understanding of these characters. read enough incorrect quotes, some genfic, a couple of character metas, and boom, you understand the Batfamily fandom enough to start creating your own content. and of course now. now you have Wayne Family Adventures so it's even *easier*. a pretty easy to pick up webtoon that's filling in all the gaps for you. but i've been in this fandom long enough to remember before we had WFA and even then, this was still a common, if not the most popular way, to ween yourself into the DC fandom space. you cherry-picked the canon you liked and then plunged into the depths of fanon.

i'm not here to make in depth commentary on if i think this is a good or bad thing. trust me i have that commentary in my head, but that would need it's own post. i'm very split on it and my feelings are complicated. my feelings on WFA are even *more* complicated. because oftentimes, the attitude expressed by these fans who are frankensteining this version of the Batfamily/DC world they have in their head is they don't *want* to read the comics. the comics don't contain the content they're after. and to an extent, i understand that. if you're looking for light-hearted vibes of the Batfamily all getting along and having the occasional hurt/comfort moments but in the end, they hug and make up, you're right. largely, you won't find that in canon. of course there are so many comics to recommend for Batfamily interactions, but you have to get specific. you'll find them interacting in small groups, Tim and Dick bonding here, Duke and Cass bonding there, but largely, the comics don't care to balance the ridiculously large cast they've given themselves. but fandom does. it's easy to toss them all in a blender and ignore the parts you don't like. the default argument to ignoring the comics or writing something OOC is always "well the comics are OOC and inconsistent too" which, while a flawed argument that massively misunderstand how comics work as a medium, isn't an entirely incorrect one. you could serve on a silver platter to these fans, an easy and accessible way to get into comics and they wouldn't be interested. it's not what they're here for. fandom is always character-driven above all else. it's driven by character relationships and dynamics. if someone wants to consume content where Tim idolized and stalked Jason as 'his Robin' and now is trying to help him rehabilitate and they're super complicated but have this long epic forgiveness arc, why *would* they read the comics? because they're sure as shit not going to find that dynamic in the comics. it's laughably OOC and not canon at all, but that doesn't matter. what matters is the sandbox. most Batfamily fans care *far* more about the sandbox canon gives them than the actual canon itself. feel how you feel about that, this really isn't being negative toward that attitude, but it is a common attitude.

so, you have Batfamily fans playing in the sandbox and building their own narrative. common fandom headcanons are so common, you could practically write a guide on how the fanon Batfamily works with how consistent people are about it. or you could just read WFA, which is practically the new manifesto of it. even now, with this sudden spike in people talking about canon accuracy and "actually this happening in the comics", they don't actually care about the comics, just what they can cherry-pick for fodder. (even if they rob it of so much context they're just as OOC as they were before. see specifically: the recent phenomena with Tim Drake going from the woobified weakest member of the Batfam who everyone needs to save constantly and he's the smart boy but he's also the one with a sad tragic neglectful past who gets overlooked being the way Batfamily fandom played with Tim for years. but recently, people seem to be pushing this idea of a ridiculously badass Tim, Tim who *totally* has a kill count because of his actions in RR (2009) if you take them completely out of context, Tim who bested Ra's and is even more badass than Jason and he's the 17 yr old CEO of Wayne Industries being cool and flawless it becoming the new fandom zeitgeist. neither of these versions of Tim are canon, and the second fundamentally misunderstands his arc in RR (2009) but the shift has undeniably happened and it's been fascinating to watch. the same thing happened with people suddenly deciding Jason isn't the "angry violent Robin", he was a sunshine sweet boy who was perfect as Robin. neither of these are true, but the second feels more transgressive and new to fandom from cherry-picked panels.) the point is largely, Batfamily fans would rather build their own canon than play with the actual canon.

and then, you have Danny Phantom. i'm not into DP and have no interest to get into it, but what i know about it via fandom osmosis is this: DP fans sort of also don't give a fuck about canon. once again, the canon of DP is a sandbox, not a rulebook. the concepts and the characters are the draw, not the plot itself. i've seen DP posts explaining characters who are essentially OCs, but have become so dominant in the fandom via fandom osmosis. there are concepts and ideas about how Danny's powers work and potential concepts with his ghost nature that either aren't in canon or only happened once in canon and fans decided to expand on that and doesn't care about it's own in-universe logic. i've seen a lot of DP fans also express they haven't seen the show and they don't have plans to see the show. because the show is just some children's cartoon with some inconsistencies and a simple plot, as you'd expect from CN. the show isn't the point. no one cares about it's plot, they care about it's characters. they care about pushing the concept of half ghost boy to a logical extreme and seeing what you can get out of that. can you make it weird and fucked up. how much can you highlight on his trauma and body horror. what identity crisis can you give him and how can you build his interactions with other characters in his world around that and also make those characters fun and unique on their own. sure, the skeleton of canon is there, but the meat lies all in the fanon.

Miraculous Ladybug also exists in this similar vein. the characters, the concepts, those hold intrigue. and not even mentioning the fact the original concept for this show was supposed to be aimed to an older audience, so you can see the bones of something a bit more mature and nuanced under this typical, villain of the week magical girl transformation show. the show itself is a bit shallow and that's not a *bad* thing, it's just the medium it exists within being aimed towards children. but the concepts of a teen girl who's basically a sort of chosen one, a boy who doesn't know his father is the big bad of the show, and their weird identity porn love... square thing. those dynamics are *so* complicated and such a fun sandbox to play in with character-driven fandom.

so, at the core, you have three fandoms that care more about the culturally accepted fanon than the canon, with a good chunk of people often not even consuming the original canon content. and well, DC is an *easy* world to transpose just about anything onto. a boy who's half ghost and fighting supernatural threats? that makes sense, DC has ghost heroes like Deadman already. a girl who has this magical item that gives her animal themed superpowers? i mean that's practically the same thing as Vixen's Totem so that one makes sense too. they fit in pretty easy, no needing to change the world to accommodate them. and of course, if you're a fan of *one* fandom where you don't care for the canon content and only like the fandom sandbox, chances are, you'll get drawn in pretty easily to another fandom with similar mechanics. if you can teach yourself the DP fandom rules/concepts, you can teach yourself the Batfamily fandom rules/concepts. and well, since there's so much crossover in fandom members, why not write the fanfiction? crossover fics will always exist, but with such a shared member base, you have a really big boom.

it's why the characters you see DP interact with in DC are *always* characters who are far more driven by fanon than canon. Danny and John Constantine is a *massive* concept. for people who don't read Hellblazer comics. my poor partner, @divine-dominion has lamented to me pretty often about finding DP content in the Hellblazer tag that is essentially turning Constantine into an OC. because whatever version of Constantine is being written about isn't one bit comics accurate, and really, isn't trying to be. and the same thing happens with Shazam. you watch Young Justice and understand him well enough, you get drawn in by the character concept that you just run with it. people put their favorite blorbos in the same place because hey, wouldn't ghost boy be pretty cool in a city like *Gotham*. how would Batman even react to him. and then, the shipping. because ages for the Batfamily can be easily hand-waved and moved around based on where you plop Danny into the timeline, you have your pick of the litter with him, and same with Ladybug. of course there are the most popular ships but largely, the world is your oyster.

i don't think this is the worst thing in the world for either fandom. it's not hard to filter out the crossover tags and scroll past content i don't like. and sure, i see the appeal of making your blorbos from two different places meet. i've got my drafts *full* of DC/MHA crossover ideas because well, i like them both and think that would be cool. i think my only gripe with it is when DP or MLB crossover content seeps it's way into the wrong tags. using the above example, if you're writing about Danny and Constantine but there's zero content of the actual Hellblazer comics, i don't think you need the Hellblazer tag, just the Constantine character tag. tbh i wish this extended onto Ao3 and people utilized fandom tags better. if you're writing Batfamily fanfiction that is very clearly and obviously WFA driven in characterization and concepts, i would far prefer those fics be tagged with the WFA fandom tag rather than the Batman (comics) fandom tag. because well, you're not writing about the Batman comics. and there's nothing wrong with that, but it helps if you don't confuse yourself for content striving to interact with canon more. (this especially extends to Young Justice, by the way. if you're writing for the Young Justice tv show please, please stop using the Young Justice (comics) fandom tag. i'm at my wit's end- /lh)

the whole thing is fascinating. i've got zero interest in entering DP or MLB as fandoms because that's not my speed, but witnessing it as an outsider is my favorite pastime. i see a *lot* of posts going around the DC x DP space that are helping explain to people who's who, what's what, and understanding the canon/fanon of both of these properties so others can better enter the space. which is not something you'd need in a fandom driven only by it's canon content, but it is sweet watching others try to help newbies enter the space. it's a very inviting fandom space, i think, whether you lament it's existence or not. they're just sitting in their corner with their blorbos, and i gotta respect that. the posts explaining the Batfamily to DP fans are always fun for me to read, even if i disagree with some of the characterizations in them because it helps shine a light on what the fans of this crossover regard as "important" enough about each fandom to be worth including those sorts of primers. very fascinating stuff.

[hello-eden]

dcxdp #39

Danny is Jason's pit madness

[aspiring--cryptid]

I was going to add this to the post I just reblogged, but it was running away from me so now it's this.

I think there's a specific fandom cultural difference between DC and DP that makes the crossover fandom kind of fascinating.

Because the DP fandom?

Is out here making shit up wholecloth. Ask a dp fan who wes weston is and you'll get generally the same answer: he's a ginger conspiracy theorist who knows Danny is Phantom and is trying to convince people of that, but nobody believes him. The thing is?

HE DOESN'T EXIST

Wesley "Wes" Weston is a character the fandom made up in his entirely. He has a categorized a03 tag! With 726 works! And he's entirely fanon!

That's the sort of thing that the DP fandom is entirely used to. Which makes our (because I'm definitely more of a DP fan than I am a DC one) relationship with canon VERY different from most fandoms.

You take what you want from canon and ignore the rest.

The vast majority of DP fandom tropes like obsessions, the details of ghost cores, the vivisection thing, hell, even the fact that the ghosts ARE GHOSTS, either only have roots in canon or directly fly in the face of canon.

Canon is at best the walls of the sandbox and even then that's debateable. Whereas the DC fandom seems...a bit more attached to canon.

It feels like it's something I see not clicking with DC fans talking about the DPxDC thing, especially when people talk about it from a broader fandom perspective or. You know. Complain about seeing DP stuff.

[twetterbirdy]

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[neganium]

Hey there! Want one of these? You can hit me up and I'll do you two for the price of one! Check the post's replies for details.

[new-revenant]

During patrol Nightwing found a handmade doll that resembled his hero persona, this wouldn't be so weird if it weren't for the fact that he finds dolls resembling the other members of the batfam's hero personas scattered in odd spots throughout Gotham and Bludhaven. The weirdest thing happens when one night he finds a doll of someone he doesn't recognize. It's a pale teen with white hair and bright green button eyes wearing what looks like a black and white hazmat suit. Nightwing picks it up and the doll immediately bursts into Lazarus green flames. Nightwing finally decided to tell the fam about the dolls not knowing that Phantom, who was sealed in a sarcophagus by treacherous observents several years prior, was now awake. The problem is that the sarcophagus is in the batcave as a trophy, needless to say everyone was surprised when the lid suddenly blew off and out stepped a teenager. Danny is a mix of anger and confusion because this definitely isn't Amity Park

You know. This is almost the exact plot of another, non-dp-related-AU I’ve seen. It’s @/ovegakart doll AU, it’s an AU of Linked Universe, which is itself a LoZ AU where a bunch of Links have come together across time because reasons I won’t get into. In the second ever LoZ game, Adventure of Link, there are these dolls that are scattered across the map. They give you an extra life. So, in ovegakart’s AU, the Link from the first game and AoL(it the same link)finds dolls of himself and the other Links while in his own time. Then, in a well, he finds a doll of a Link none of them have ever seen before. He picks it up and it bursts into flames. I checked, that’s what happened, here is a link to the page. Oh, and Nightwing not telling his family about the dolls until he gets Danny’s? The same thing happened in this AU, where AoL Link doesn’t tell the other Links about the dolls until he comes across the mysterious Link doll. That mystery Link is the First Hero btw, he’s from the Skyward Sword manga.

I would’ve liked it if you, I dunno, credited the idea? Or at least make it not so obvious by changing the doll into something else? Or make it so that Nightwing only finds a Danny doll? Maybe have it melt into ectoplasm even? I have a couple posts already about how I’m a LU fan on here, and if you’ve seen that before, then did you think I didn’t follow ovegakart, one of the biggest LU/LoZ creators? Listen, I’m not mad at you, I’m just confused at your thought process here. This AU idea wasn’t made for dpxdc, it doesn’t even make much sense for it. Yeah yeah, people can do whatever they want, whatever, but at least credit it my god. Or change it up to suit dpxdc more, or both.

How many other people have just taken AU ideas from others and pawned it off as their own, thinking that no one would find out since they’re from another fandom? It makes me feel gross. Please, just credit the idea. If I just posted this with some writing adding onto this, not knowing about this idea coming from another fandom and another person. I think I might need to close my asks for a bit, I don’t feel great, sorry.

[stars-obsession-pit]

Decimation

Some members of one of the GIW’s top-secret research facilities have made an earth-shattering discovery.

They’ve found a way to make half-ghosts.

The failure rate is high. For every subject they successfully convert, many more are left burnt-out corpses—or worse, as rabid undead that must be put down with force.

It didn’t matter. The test subjects were cheap, worthless. Their countless deaths were an acceptable sacrifice in the name of progress.

Their operative’ deaths when they begin the full plan… those will matter more. Their warped agents may be more dangerous than normal humans in combat, but legions of foot soldiers still have their place. It would be foolish to leave themself solely in the hands of ectoplasmic entities, even if they’re allies and still partially human. Recruiting and training enough replacements to recover the losses would take time.

But it will all be worth it.

Finally, they will have control of a strong enough army to bring their goals to fruition. Those inhuman wraiths will be eradicated, ensuring the safety of the real, living humans and opening up a whole new dimension of untapped resources.

[stealingyourbones]

Short DPXDC Prompts #1005

the entire town of Amity suffers from lead poisoning (contaminated drinking water. Oddly for them, this also makes them harder to detect via Kryptonian senses.

[accursedvoid]

[o-kaythislooksbad]

eight ecto nights 8: spirit