#debate discourse

[incohearent]

Charlie Kirk Puts Vegan On The Spot! by Danny Ishay on Youtube

[anqueerism]

I think it's about time that we put away the "chewsday" and "bo'ol o' wa'ah" jokes.

It's frankly quite an overused and tired joke, but not only that, it's incredibly classist.

In the UK, accents are and always have been very heavily entwined with the country's class system. There is an extremely long and storied history of certain accents (such as the popularly-mocked cockney) being brutally ridiculed, suppressed in the public sector, and even banned from media and broadcasting while others like RP were promoted and even required.

This has lessened over time, but it still holds pretty true: Your accent is one of the main indicators of your class and your breeding, and will directly impact the way that people treat you.

These are historically marginalised and oppressed accents in the UK, so when you mock them— especially as someone who does not live in the UK— you are, in fact, directly mocking those people to whom the accent belongs.

Personally, I have a very sensitive history surrounding my accent. I was born into a working-class family, but my father was a social climber and intensely embarrassed about his own status. Because of this, he had an intense fixation with ensuring that I fit every classist mould of an upper-class child. I was heavily abused by my teachers as a child into speaking in a Received Pronunciation accent (which they regarded as the "proper" way to speak), and was physically beaten into learning to write in an "educated style."

It took me until I was about sixteen or seventeen to even begin feeling comfortable to speak in my natural accent in the comfort of my own home. When in groups or in front of crowds, I still revert to a softer RP accent. I still have chronic pain in my hands from the beatings I received, and I still refuse to write on paper because it causes PTSD flashbacks.

All this to say: As an American, or generally anyone from outside of the UK, you do not have the right to mock historically marginalised British accents. It is not funny. You are pressing on a bruise that is not yours to press on, and then mocking people when they tell you that you pressing on that bruise hurts.

If you want to mock an English accent, mock RP. Traditional, Broadcasting, Aristocratic, or Modern. Those are historically upper-class accents, which (for most people) have no heavy history attached to them. I would say it's fair game.

But when you mock the accents of the poor working class who have been unequivocally brutalised in this country for centuries and then go on to mock us when we try to tell you why we don't like you doing it, you just sound like a complete and utter asshole.

[screamingfrenchfries]

anyways i cant belive ford CANONICALLY was in a Love Triangle with fiddleford and....... ironically.... a Triangle

[fixing-bad-posts]

I need to stop getting into arguments with people online, but there’s always part of me that hopes they’ll listen to reason.

I’ve been in an argument with a TERF since yesterday, and it’s just draining how her vendetta against men extends to the point where she seems to think merely being born a man means you’re perpetuating male privilege.

yyyeah, you should stop that, babes. i know you mean well—and i feel the same about wanting to reason with hateful people! but arguing online with strangers is not going to change anyone's mind. in fact, debating people with wack bigoted viewpoints only gets them to defensively double down. especially in the case of TERFs and radfems, many of their beliefs stem from real and terrible traumas—arguing with them only gives them fuel to feed their victimhood fire.

the hard truth is that the way we legitimately deradicalize people & change minds is by showing radical compassion. when people feel that they are safe, not under attack, & being understood, they are more likely to change their beliefs and admit they were wrong. if you cannot devote the time + energy to being patient & kind with a toxic person online, it's best to block and move on.

[kosherkept]

the amount of people online who readily admit they lie and say "oh i read it in an article" when they actually mean "i saw a random, unqualified person post on social media" is fucking horrifying btw

[idzinski]

What confuses me greatly in the jayvik debate (yes i will keep talking about it sorry not sorry) is christian linke's statements. If I understand him correctly, he sees viktor as ace representation and kinda acts like thats the reason why jayvik cannot be canon.

Which, even if motivated by a sincere intent of representing a minority, comes off pretty ignorant and misrepresents the ace community. Obviously, not only is asexuality a spectrum, but it doesnt mean a person cannot feel romantic attraction or enjoy being intimate with a partner.

Tldr; ace viktor and jayvik can both be true at the same time, and one shouldnt be used to undermine the other

[glitter-stained]

Ngl it really peeves me when the debate about Jason's ethics regarding killing in the batfam mixes up the question of him being a moral character in regards to sticking to his own philosophy (aka compromising with what he thinks is right to salvage relationships, but also exploding trains to evade capture, killing random goons in a gang war, etc) and the question of him being a moral character in regards to whether his philosophy is right. And even with regards to his philosophy there is his philosophy on politics, crime control and harm reduction, and his ethical philosophy itself (utilitarianism, aka focusing on intended positive consequences of actions for the greater good rather than the action being fundamentally moral or immoral in itself). Those are different things. Those require different debates and should not be conflated together. I'm not even saying Jason is right! I think utilitarianism and deontology both suck and fail at providing sufficient guidelines for moral behaviour. ("Everybody still loses" like the nihilist clown says. The symbolism of that one scene is pretty cool on that regard.)

And I think some people at dc would very much like for you to make the connection that because Jason is harming civilians/killing unnamed goons, he is a bad person, and as such you don't need to examine the way his stance on moral philosophy (utilitarianism) opposes Batman's. But that's not right, they don't get to wiggle out of the fact that utilitarianism vs deontology is a complicated debate that has been going on for ages, that there is no clear-cut answer where Batman fundamentally comes out on top, they don't get to use the fact that Jason (in the era currently discussed) is a villain to saddle us with a false dichotomy of "well jason is wrong about stuff so batman has to be right" to avoid addressing the actual question. The traits of the people being tied on the tracks do not change the shape of the trolley problem. The traits of the person deciding to pull the lever do not change the shape of the trolley problem. It's still one lever, three people tied on one track, one on the other, do you pull the lever. That's it. Yes, bending the metaphor to address other questions (such as "who keeps tying people to the tracks" to question systemic violence or "how does my bias, my prejudice and empathy impact my decision to pull the lever depending on who is on the tracks") are interesting but that's not what the debate is about. If I wrote an essay about the trolley problem in high school and focused primarily on the nature of the people being tied on the tracks, I'd get a big fat zero with "off-topic" written in red all over my essay, so I'm not inclined to allow DC comics to get away with it.

[faelapis]

alright so re: my greg/pearl “discourse” post, i need to say another thing. calling out biphobia is important, yes... but apparently, i really should have stressed more how non-canon this is. like. i keep seeing people on twitter being like “wow, i had no idea pearl was canonically bi the whole time” or similar sentiments, and i’m like… no? she’s not? not as far as we know?

guys. random crew doodles are not… canon… 😭 there’s crew art of young greg, rose and 13-year-old STEVEN hanging out. which is impossible for several reasons.

i have yet to see anyone react to those whatever doodles with this response of “wow… this made me reconsider their relationship… it really Makes You Think.”

if a new SU spinoff/sequel came out, and pearl was openly like “i am bisexual and also in love with greg”, sure. i would get why people would have feelings about that. THEN we could discourse about biphobia vs lesbian representation.

but that… hasn’t happened. literally nothing canon-altering has occurred. at MOST, this was an earlier idea that got scrapped. that appears to be the story. but that’s about it.

calling out biphobia is important... but facts also matter? this is a non-story. yet people are out here writing essays about how this is Reframing All of Canon. 😭

this is crew art! by hilary florido!

so again, i ask you: where are my discourse essays about how greg is secretly still in his 20s, his balding is a lie, rose is alive AND they're both hanging out with steven? in alone at sea, of all episodes?

[valyrfia]

i have to say the disconnect between the traditional media and the actual fan sentiment is absolutely wild in F1 at the moment. take oscar's overtake on lando in turn 1 in monza. every single fan that i've spoken to irl or seen online thinks it was the best move ever, super exciting to watch, and all in all just good racing whereas every single journalist immediately got on air and cried about it (looking at you will buxton) and chose into the baku weekend to continue to villainise oscar to hell for not just acting as second driver (even though there were no team orders to do so).

[luckthebard]

I just had a lightbulb moment where I realized that a huge part of what never ended up fully clicking for me about the story in C3 is it kept telling me things without effectively showing them.

[clowtisms]

I made this

[sarcastic-clapping]

i just know that the gabrielle de lioncourt discourse on this website is going to be fucking catastrophic

[edenfenixblogs]

Well Drawfee is officially no longer safe media for me :(

Karina liked multiple tweets conflating a PSA for antisemitism with Israeli propaganda and claiming that Israel planned its assault to coincide with the superbowl…

Julia liked posts claiming that the war isn’t a war. Nobody has liked anything about antisemitism or even acknowledging Jews are in danger right now.

TBH I’m devastated.

I have Drawfee art all over my home. I was actually gonna become a patron this year. I’d literally been saving to make it feasible. This is crushing. I feel sick.

[cassettedude]

a happy family

[anqueerism]

I'll never get over how fucking condescending the transandrophobe crowd often are to transmascs that they interact with. Why are you talking to a grown man like he's five. Do you not think that has some disturbing implications about the kind of person you are and perhaps the beliefs that you hold. Food for thought perhaps!