#fanon discourse

[clartidk123]

Sometimes im like "Im a horrible person for liking fanon" then i remember "You are a fucking minor what the fuck you fucking piece of shit overthinking bitch"

[phantasm-masquerade]

reblog for a bigger sample size if you feel like it

[andrielmpreglovechild]

If I see one more person say "but in canon-" to someone talking about a headcanon or fanon ship I am JUMPING through their phone and strangling them 🥰

[spop-romanticizes-abuse]

the way this is catra word for word LMAO

[cute-little-fly]

I didn’t want to reblog this but I am so annoyed.

I think we agree that this is stupid and even offensive mischaracterization to Blitzo’s character. (It also doesn’t make sense that Stella wants to talk to him either).

I won’t even attempt to impede them to do that because is fanon, like, I don’t care. They are the ones that have decided not to enjoy this series and have their own bad faith interpretation about it, so, stay in your hate bubble and have this art if that makes you feel better I guess???

I imagine the first Stella and Blitzø interaction being Blitzø yelling at her, if he already knows everything.

Wow...I never thought there could be a piece of fanart that makes Blitzø look unlikeable, but Stolas-haters always finds a way 🫤

Like, Blitzø would be such an asshole for doing this. Calling Stolas cuckoo for feeling invalidated. Laughing together with Stolas abuser. Blitzø is my favorite character of ALL TIME. And of course he had every right to feel angry and betrayed by Stolas. Hell, if I had to choose, I would probably choose Blitzø's side beacuse I can realate to him more. But, it's not all black and white like the Stolas-antis think it is. Like, if Blitzø would do something like this, I don't think I would be able to forgive his character. Like, he would definitely be pushed down a bunch of pegs on my favorite list at least. Like, art with mischaracterization like this makes me very sad. I mean, if it makes YOU feel better, I guess, go for it(?) But just know, Blitzø would never do this! He's not written to be a heartless asshole! And this is supposed to be a pro-Blitzø art?! This is character assassination of the century, I swear🤦‍♀️ But, like always, what do you guys think?

[thejolteonmastertj]

I really need ppl to understand 99% of the reason why Rulie's portrayed the way he is in fanfics is a combination of two factors:

1.) Jojo actively encouraged the fandom to write fanfic long before she even decided to make an actual long-form comic of her own.

2.) During this time period, & for quite a while after that, the majority of what the fandom had to work off of for Rulie's personality is from this doodle page, & this description for his personality literally straight frm Jojo herself.

... 2.5.) It should also be noted Jojo hadn't played Adventure Of Link until about halfway through the Sunset arc, as evidenced by this post (we know this is Jojo's sister b/c the official LU tumblr credited her for one of the goofy Sky panels).

Now, since then the way Jojo portrays Rulie didn't change drastically overnight, the Magic Sword comic did happen beforehand for instance... but I do think the level to which Jojo plans to focus on particular traits from Rulie's original design has evolved over the course of development for the comic.

More recent (and, uh, mostly discord-exclusive, so I can't give too many details here) commentary from Jojo indeed emphasizes plans to highlight Rulie's determination above all else, quite contrary to how she used to describe his character (it hasn't changed, probably, it's just a matter of plot-driven emphasis).

Fanfic writers aren't stupid, we're literally just working with what we have-AND, Rulie himself, as a very nuanced & layered character, is going to be portrayed in wildly different manners depending on context & genre.

If you want to see more of Rulie's sassy side,

1.) Read more recent fics (Alas you will likely have to search by recently updated, as the first wave of popular fanfic tends to get enshrined forever at the top of the list when searching by kudos & comments.)

2.) Don't read angst (Sorry not sorry but angst & vent fics are going to make up the majority of works in any fandom, & in these fics a character's vulnerable side tends to get spotlighted. Don’t like don’t read.)

3.) Respectfully Ask for recs instead of barging in & just straight up telling fanfic authors what to do. That's rude.

[adhdevankinard]

Sorry for the discourse but even if they did make Bddie canon… why would I want to ship them? Like, in canon, what we’ve seen on screen, that’s not set up for a romantic relationship.

In this episode alone we had Eddie tell Buck again how he is making everything about himself. After Bobby died. Eddie didn’t even try to comfort him or talk to him about how he was feeling. Yes, Eddie is grieving too, but come on. And he didn’t even apologize to Buck. What did he do? He brought in other people to fix his mistakes. Again.

I know this is not a show for in-depth storytelling but, in canon, there is no way I would want to ship them.

[justcallmemrslupin]

🐺💥 Canon vs Fanon: Remadora vs W*lfstar 💥🐺

Someone on TikTok commented under a post about Tonks: “I hated her relationship with Remus. W*lfstar made much more sense.”

Hmmm... More sense? Really??!

How can a fanon ship built entirely on projection make ���more sense” than a canon relationship that showed emotional growth, mutual sacrifice, and real consequences?

Ok, let's brake this down:

Canon Sirius never gave much thought to Remus’ well-being.

- In Prisoner of Azkaban, we learn that Sirius literally used Remus as a weapon against Snape. That wasn’t a joke. If Remus had attacked Snape, he wouldn’t just have been expelled. He could have been executed. Sirius didn’t care.

- Sirius openly wished for a full moon when he was bored in Order of the Phoenix. Remus answered him dryly, because Sirius was being inconsiderate again.

- Sirius didn’t even trust Remus during the war.

He advised James to make Peter the Secret Keeper instead, specifically because he didn’t trust Remus. He says so himself in Book 3, and he even apologizes for it later (so no, it's not a headcanon that he didn't trust him, it's canon, it's his own words).

- Sirius left Remus nothing in his will.

Not a thing. Remus was poor, homeless, grieving, and Sirius — supposedly his best friend — didn’t leave him so much as a spare room in Grimmauld Place. That doesn’t scream “deep emotional connection” to me.

And the go-to argument?

"But Sirius became an Animagus to help Remus!"

So did James. So did Peter. They were teenagers, it was exciting, and for Sirius, it was probably more about doing whatever James was doing than any grand act of loyalty. Sure, Remus saw it as a huge act of friendship, but Remus was a lonely kid with no friends. Of course he idealized them. Even JKR says in his official bio that his biggest flaw was cutting his friends far too much slack because he was afraid of losing them.

Meanwhile, Tonks:

- Lost her powers and her Patronus changed because Remus tried to protect her by pushing her away.

- Fought for his love despite prejudice, danger, and family disapproval.

- Was nearly killed multiple times because she chose to be with Remus — Bellatrix targeted her because she married him. Guess what? Yes, Tonks actually DIED because she married Remus!

- Left her newborn baby behind to go fight beside him, because she 'couldn’t bear not knowing" (her words) if he was okay.

JKR’s own canon bio for Remus confirms: he had never fallen in love before Tonks. As for Sirius? He always got the women.

And don’t get me started on fandom reaching:

• “Remus was living with Sirius!” — So were a dozen other Order members. Including Tonks.

• “Remus looked at Sirius for 40 lines!” — Because Sirius was unstable, and Remus was bracing to intervene. Which he did. Like the responsible adult he was.

Remadora is not just canon. It’s about unconditional love in the face of prejudice. About two people who chose each other even when the world said they shouldn’t.

And for the record? I’m not even a hardcore Remadora shipper. I’ve always written Remus with my OC, before Remadora was even a thing. But saying "Wolfstar makes more sense" is not only ignoring canon. It’s ignoring character dynamics, consequences, and context.

Ship whoever you want. Really. But don’t pretend fanon is more "logical" than the canon story about love, sacrifice, and growth.

[vonaliencode]

I'm asking in genuine curiosity; is Twitter just behind the curve or is there a real rise in anti-crackship sentiment? I mean I've talked to people who just prefer to ship whatever's canon so long as it's not an actual crime, but... it just feels so boring.

Actually, please repost this with your favorite ship regardless of canonical merit and explain why you enjoy it---I'm curious and crave dopamine.

Only fair to trade, mine at the moment is Artistic Musing.

[roystartt]

My controversial 911 take is that the show needs to stop caring about the fandom.

Let me explain - We all know that as a whole the show writes and caters towards the general audience and not necessarily the fandom. And what I mean by the fandom are the people who watch the show and then engage with it in online spaces, creates fanworks, discuss theories etc etc and not just watch the show and then move on until the next week.

But sometimes the show does a little nod to the fandom, or they take something that feels very heavily inspired by fandom discussions/fanworks. And they always end up being either the most awful of takes (this season in particular im thinking of the buck-abby-tommy scenario specifically here) or completely miss their intended endgoal and end up having the direct opposite effect (again for this season I'm thinking of them having Buck directly say 'I'm not in love with Eddie).

Honestly, the show just needs to plan their story arcs out for the season and write the episodes how they intend to tell their story. Because fandom is going to fandom, and you're never gonna please a whole fan base. There's a reason we have fanfiction, we don't need to read it in canon.

[cdroloisms]

always absolutely fucking hilarious when sbiers in their self-righteous need to assert themselves as better than everyone else in the same way they've done since 2020 even when they're apparently 'out of the fandom' and consider the whole thing cringe and dead (skill issue, methinks) go all um acktually no one cared abt any of the lore except for c!sbi. like well for one thing i don't know of a c!sbi personally speaking i'd like for you to point out to me where character sleepy boys inc ever like, existed, because it certainly wasn't in any dream smp i watched like is there even a single moment where the four of them interact together alone??? and secondly, it's always reeeeeeally obvious when they mean this as a diss on The Other Side Of The Fandom (read, dream team and co) when two-thirds of the dream team just did nawt have any interest in being part of the 'main characters' in the first place and would much rather do their own thing and roleplay in ways that wouldn't get picked apart for ages on twitter dot com, and the other member of the dream team played a character so integral to the lore that even c!inniters will often name him before they name their own goddamn guy because they cannot keep his name out of their mouths (see, the meme i saw like literally just yesterday that boiled down to me, after learning the dream smp lore: i need to kill c!dream). like bro yall are c!inniters you're not fooling anyone you think that the entire story revolves around this one teenager being abused and then completely ignore the months of abuse that was shown on screen for us before exile. "c!sbi" like cmon now guys the ao3 pages are like, right there, we all know who ends up being the villain for ur sbi fanfic that has its foundations in a dynamic that literally never existed in canon.

like "no one cared about anyone's lore except for wilbur and tommy--" well yes they were in fact some of the main fucking characters. imagine someone going up to you and going "well no one cared about the lore in the star wars original trilogy except for luke and leia" like damn really?? (now imagine this same person trying to convince you that darth vader's role was unimportant, actually.) like yeah the dream smp involved a lot of separate storylines and each of those storylines might've had their own "main cast" of characters but i'm also not blind bro, the story that started at the start of the fucking server and the start of the fucking lore was ABSOLUTELY the "wilbur-dream-tommy" triangle that is, in fact, the story that the l'manburg revolution was built on and the story that remains the throughline literally until tommy and dream have their confrontation with a nuke coming down over their heads, something that the characters themselves acknowledge with the repetition of the idea of tommy and tubbo against dream. LIKE ALKJSDFKJSADF yeah bro there were main characters in the tommy-dream-wilbur story an that's also the story that people tended to be invested in in the beginning, to the point where even other self-contained stories in the dream smp absolutely referenced and emulated it (cough cough, las nevadas). like, why are we acting like it's at all groundbreaking for people to be invested in THEEE fucking story the one that first started to exist because at the time basically no one else was part of The Roleplaying Trio and then slowly got padded out and developed as the server developed more and more into the lore server?

and it's the fact that none of these people, too, would deny that they care about ex. c!schlatt in manberg, right, or c!quackity in relation to c!wilbur's deal, etc etc whatever. like breaking news you gaf about The Story as a dream smp fan wow am i supposed to be like, surprised. do you want a medal. LIKE LKJASDJF

[glitter-stained]

I do think it bears repeating, fanfic writers can write whatever the fuck they want. It's not their responsibility to introduce readers to the canon because they are not writing canon they are writing fanwork!

If someone reads a fic about a coffeeshop and they assume the characters are coffeeshop part-timers, and it causes them issues in fan spaces because the characters in the source material are assassins, that is 100% on the reader for assuming that the hurt/comfort coffee-shop no cape AU was a fair representation of the source material. It's not supposed to be. Fanfic writers have no obligation to be canon-compliant.

If someone reads a fic that is not canon compliant, that is not the writer trying to convince you of their interpretation of canon. You should not assume that every fic is a character study with the same identical relationship dynamics as in canon because most fanworks are not an extension of canon nor are they obligated to be. And yes, even if the trope in question is popular fanon, even if other people will see it as gospel and not engage with source material and yk what, even if the trope itself, in the context of the actual source material, does a disservice to the character's arc. Because fanfics are not just fandom work, though it's very important that they are, they are also stories in and of themselves, works that have value proper to itself and writers do not owe you canon compliancy.

I've written a fic with many fanon elements, including pit rage, and you know what, I like this fic. I wrote it because I wanted to write about a depressive episode with psychotic characteristics and I thought Jason -and elements from fanon Jason- would be interesting to explore that idea with, and I wrote about pit rage because I wanted to write about catharsis, and the pessimism that comes with growing up in fear of the idea of the cycle of violence and how internalized psychophobia (and classism but that wasn't explicit) feeds into that fear, and how the addition of an element like the Pit, which literally makes feeling emotions dangerous, in the context of a severe depressive episode, would fuck into that interplay, and screw Jason's priorities enough to trigger the switch from passive to active suicidality. There are other examples of fanon tropes I found interesting to explore in that fic, but I'm focusing on the pit rage thing in this example because it shows up a lot in this discourse.

I have read the damn comics. I mostly see late-onset Pit Madness as patchwork to salvage late post-crisis Jason, which I'm not often interested in as I don't often acknowledge those stories (especially with all the retcons and maybe retcons established since then), and I think using it in the context of Under the Hood is a disservice to his character. But just because that trope can be a disservice to an analysis of his character in canon, doesn't mean it can't be good for in the story I am telling right now, which holds value in and of itself, because it has helped me process feelings and others have told me it has helped them and I do not owe anybody canon compliancy.

So when some little fucker commented a long ass paragraph on my fic about how it was one of the worst fics he'd ever read because everyone was OOC and condescendingly explained to me that my fic was way too nice to the batfam and none of them would do that- yk, I was angry. Because that fic was 5 chapters long and they commented on chapter 5. They had all the opportunity to stop, or at least not comment on their hate-read (which is a practice I've never understood). And most importantly, they assumed shit about my knowledge of canon based on their inability to view my work as anything but an extension of the canon they consume. They very clearly wanted something out of my jason-centric jason & batfam members fic that the tags should have told them they would not find there and instead of, I don't know, reading fucking Task Force Z, they decided that it was on me. But their inability to view my writing in its context, recognize my work for its own worth and stop assuming things about people they don't know for five fucking minutes was actually the problem. And it's, frankly, insulting as fuck.

I very rarely get hate comments, and that one was a long time ago -actually now that I think about it, it was almost an entire year ago. Readers are usually very nice to me and honestly, after how stressed I was of getting hate for the horse movie fic, I can't emphasize enough how much I love you guys and how lovely you've been.

However, I see takes on this website that shove the responsibility of "fanon" and people not engaging with the source material onto fanfic writers all the time and that annoys me so much. Canon is plural, self-contradictory, often OOC, has a multitude of problematic takes and honestly in the context of the batfam specifically, it's very depressing: I struggle to imagine them ever actually getting to the happy ending as a family together. So if Dick and Jason's relationship wrt Bruce makes me sad and I want to write or read fics in which Dick stands up to Bruce and protects his little brother, or I need the catharsis of a story about pit rage, or I'm mad at dc for glazing tim at the expense of other robins or at tim for being rude to a character i like, and i retaliate by putting tim into jason fanboy jail, that's just fine actually. That's a non-issue.

This essay has become way longer than I thought considering how simple the idea is, so here's the TLDR:

#1: Don't like, don't read.

#2: Fic writers do not owe you canon compliancy.

#3: Fic writers are not responsible for whatever fanon belief you're mad at.

#4: Stop assuming shit about fic writers based on what they write, you do not actually know these people.

#5: Fanfic is not just an extension of canon those are stories of their own merit.

#6: You have to respect fic writers even when you don't like their fic.

Or, to be even more concise:

Just don't be a dick.

[karenandhenwilson]

Yes, Eddie is grieving. Yes, people are overwhelmed with all kinds of irrational emotions when grieving. Yes, people lash out. And we've seen Eddie lash out violently (verbally and physically) in the past. At the beginning of season 3 after Shannon's death, when he learned that his Army buddies were all dead, etc pp.

You know who else is grieving and has been shown to lash out based on irrational emotions in the past? Athena.

We have seen her lash out in anger and use her uniform to stalk the girl who bullied May. We have seen her go after Amir on a hunch when it turned out he hadn't done anything.

But Athena has learned from those experiences. This time, she is aware of her irrational anger and takes precautions to not aim that anger at Chimney. Because she knows that would be a mistake and unfair to Chimney.

Eddie, on the other hand, makes the same fucked up stupid decisions again and again and again and never learns. And of course, that's a decision of the writers. But in the universe of our blorbos, that's still Eddie's decisions and Eddie's actions. Eddie doesn't grow. And in-universe, it's his decision not to grow and his decision to stagnate in that toxic mindset he grew up with.

[weewoo911]

Every time I see people confidently stating that Tommy was “after Eddie first” I’m here like

[thesulkycroissant]

So there's this saying that the only time you see the middle of the road is when you're going from ditch to ditch, and that most of the time is how I feel about the canon v fanon debate.

Genuinely, I feel like people get so stagnanted in this idea that something isn't canon - which, what is comic canon anyway? I strain to unravel the mystery of which comics get to "count" and which do not - and focus on it so much that they miss any aspect of nuance.

Tim's parents are a great example. Tim's parents exist in the way they do for a simple out-of-universe reason: the writers wanted to avoid the mistakes they made with Jason by both differentiating him from Dick (making him not an orphan) and giving him a "buy-in" with Dick (something to connect them -> the circus). (Their logic was that Dick was the key to getting readers to like Tim, and that neglecting his buy-in was their misstep with Jason.) At the same time, Tim having parents is a problem because what parent is not going to notice their kid being gone all the time playing midnight vigilante? Solution: absentee parents. But now the shift to in-universe happens. Tim's parents are gone all the time, but it's not malicious; they're just kind of clueless. They love Tim. Tim loves them. But they are not around. And this out-of-universe choice, once you enter into the universe, logically can - maybe even should, if you're taking the characters seriously - effect how a character reads.

Tim's parents are gone all the time. There's every probability that would cause trauma. Unintentional, but fun to explore! The comics do a very little. I think fandoms can often make the mistake of believing subtle abuse (like neglect) is not sufficient, so it gets elevated to something physical. But your parents loving you and also causing you trauma is a relatable experience, I think. Even your parents doing their best and still causing you trauma is.

Jason being the angry Robin is another rough one. Because yeah, I agree, Scott Lobdell did some wacky and unkind things to Jason's backstory. But Jason, even going back to his original (not original, but his original non-just-Dick-but-blond) backstory, is a traumatized orphan willing to take the risk and steal tires from the Batmobile as a means of survival (in Gotham! In Crime Alley!). Why can't Jason be angry? In the throes of adolescence, at a time when he feels safe with Bruce, doesn't it make sense for his trauma to find its way out in anger? Can't he both believe Robin is magic and be angry? Can't he be sweet and angry both?

Dickie and anger. Yeah, anger plays a role in certain story arcs of his. In NTT, and in the first 80s Nightwing run, the stories take pains to show that the anger is triggered by something and channeled into brutal focus. And that it does not serve him. Dick's relationship with Kory in NTT nearly falls apart because of his anger. He treats her very poorly. I see a lot of people saying they want Dick to be angry, but not allowing Dick to learn how to control his anger is not giving the character his dues either.

And Damian. Shoot. Reading the One Bad Day comic for Ra's al Ghul kinda ruined me a bit because of how much Ra's obviously loves and respects animals, and how can you not see the echo of that in Damian's love of animals? Damian's League trauma is such a thing worth exploring, and I think the value of exploring it only goes up when you add in the complicated factor of the fact that Talia and Ra's do love him, and he does see them when he looks in the mirror, and every day Damian has to decide which parts of his family - his whole family - are good to keep and which are not.

Anyway. There's probably more, but this post is already pretty long lol. Nuance is cool, that's all.

[epiphainie]

literally struggling writing anything canon related bt bc i just don't see how i can make buck feel reassured and comforted by tommy when tommy left him so unsure by pulling the rug out from under him and constantly dismissed what he says. like anytime i open up the doc for this cock worship fic i wanted to write since october im like i dont want buck to worship tommy. i want buck to be trusted and not get his words scoffed at but thats just not canon tommy. canon tommy repeatedly let his insecurities take priority over buck asking to be together and buck asking clarity about what changed his mind and in my mind it's like i need to write a 50k fixit before i can write this smut fic set slightly in the future